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Does Born Primitive Make The Best Layering System – Mike Herne
252 Plays1 month ago
This week Drew has Mike Herne from Born Primitive Outdoor on the Tricer Podcast. Drew and Mike talk in depth about the Born Primitive Outdoor layering system. Mike explains the simplicity of the system and how it is broken up into four very functional layers. These guys also discuss the origins of Born Primitive, when they hit the outdoor space and the huge support Born Primitive provides to Military, Law Enforcement and First Responders.
MIKE HERNE
Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/mike_herne/
BORN PRIMITIVE OUTDOOR
Website - https://www.bornprimitiveoutdoor.com
Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/bornprimitiveoutdoor/
TRICER USA
Website – https://tricerusa.com/
Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/tricerusa/
Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/tricerusa/
YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@tricer6985
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Transcript
Introduction to the Tricer Podcast
00:00:01
Speaker
You are listening to the Tricer Podcast, where we talk all things hunting, gear, and the great outdoors. Before we begin,
Opening Prayer and Dedication
00:00:07
Speaker
let's start things out right and put God first. Lord Jesus, I thank you for Tricer, and I ask that you can use this podcast as a way to bring joy to all of our listeners. We lay Tricer and this podcast at your feet. Amen.
Introducing Mike Hearn
00:00:23
Speaker
All right, excited this morning to have my buddy Mike Hearn on. If ah you don't know who Mike Hearn is, he's like ah everyone's favorite guy in the industry. Is that true? I've never found somebody who doesn't like Mike Hearn. Mike, how you doing? Good, buddy. How are you? Doing great, man. um
Mike's Journey into the Hunting Industry
00:00:41
Speaker
I guess a little bit about you, right? um I feel like you're everywhere. like How are you everywhere? How did you get in the hunting industry? you Tell me about Mike.
00:00:48
Speaker
ah so it's it's ah It's a long story. It's not really that long of a story. ah I knew I wanted to work in the hunting industry, um but i didn't I knew I also didn't want to be like a talking head on the internet. um That's my job. the guy well the guys Well, you own a brand. It's different when you own a brand, but like I didn't want to be like an influencer.
00:01:10
Speaker
So I started writing and sending like cold calling, uh, like publications. I was like, I like writing. I like gear. I'll write about gear. I'll write about hunting tips, whatever.
Collaborations with Black Rifle Coffee and Born Primitive
00:01:22
Speaker
And then, uh, black rifle coffee right about that time was when they were starting to get into hunting. That was when Matt best and Evan Hafer, and then we're like starting to starting to hunt. And they were like, this is pretty awesome. And seeing like the, the, the comparison between military and like,
00:01:37
Speaker
army and military operations and and hunting. So ah the the editor was like, Hey, we want to put I didn't know you could get paid. I thought they just I didn't know you got paid for that stuff. So oh yeah at the time, like that's how naive I was. But the editor was like, Hey, not only do we want to publish this, but we want to pay you blah, blah, blah. And I was like, Oh, well, I have i have more I've written.
00:01:57
Speaker
I've written more. I just thought this one was the only one probably worth the crap. and so so I wrote for them for two years for their publication Coffee or Die. and Then when they started Free Range American, which was like the where all the hunting and gear and adventure verticals kind of move, Coffee or Die stay went back to doing traditional like military news, government politics, stuff like that.
00:02:21
Speaker
and and then it just helped me build a really awesome network through like for companies. and That's kind of how I got set up with Born Primitive. I was already really good friends with Aaron Snyder and and I helped them when the when the outdoor line launched. I did a ah full i tested all the gear when at first I got it before it came out and wore it on a couple of hunts and then wrote an article about it. and then um Fast forward now and I do their community marketing.
00:02:53
Speaker
Gotcha. so that's That's at this point in this podcast, so we're going to talk about born primitive. Is it born primitive gear or born primitive? Born primitive outdoor. Outdoors. so so What is born primitive? Give us a little background on this thing. because so yeah It's crazy how many people in the hunting world don't know about born primitive. Born primitive was started in 2014 by Bear Handlin and Mallory Riley, who both worked at the company still. Bear was Bear was a collegiate, I think he played he played football at Yale. So he's a collegiate football player.
00:03:28
Speaker
And then graduated football, went on to work for ah Red Bull in marketing and then wasn't find a fulfillment in that. And he was like, well, I always wanted to join the military. I always wanted to do something like hard. So he went and joined the Navy and went to SEAL training and became a, became a Navy SEAL. And that was around the time that he was kicking born primitive off and then born primitive started to grow some legs.
00:03:53
Speaker
And so when the company started, they'd made a pair of snatch shorts. um So if there's any Olympic lifters on there, like these snatch shorts, are they have compression on the inside and a little bit of padding on um where your pelvic bone is. So when you're thrusting the bar up, ah you you you're not getting your pelvic bone beat up, you know, and your hips, but ah That's how the company
Born Primitive's Approach to Clothing Design
00:04:19
Speaker
started. They were selling it like out of the truck of their car at CrossFit events, and that and then made enough money, and then they got one of the pop-ups that had a logo on it, right and then just kind of kept going. so The company, really cool origin of the company has been bootstrapped from the beginning by Bayer, and now it's grown to what it is. I think they have over 70 employees. ah The headquarters is in Virginia Beach.
00:04:43
Speaker
um And they they they kind of went from making a really specialized fitness item to now there's a full fit list fitness line. ah Two years ago, they brought Outdoor in the mix. They partnered with Aaron Snyder. He helped design some some outdoor clothing with the goal of making ah simple but effective clothing. Like you look at all these clothing companies and they have 30 different pants for 30 different activities. We're like, we want to make a ah simplified, like really good quality Western hunting line. That's also affordable. Uh, cause some of the, some of the prices on these pants now are outrageous. Um, and then like technical clothing, rain gear, that stuff's going to be a little bit more expensive because of the materials. But, uh, and now we have, we're coming up on a year of having the tactical line as well, which the tactical line is absolutely crushing.
00:05:39
Speaker
So I like the idea of taking, going from like, they're making like a really good functional fitness clothing, right? Like yeah CrossFit style, like not your typical, which people don't understand. Like you go and go buy your basketball shorts, which everyone used to wear, right? The big difference between wearing a pair of basketball shorts and like wearing an actual, like a functional pair of like functional fitness clothing. Like I don't do CrossFit.
00:06:02
Speaker
um I do like a, like I call it functional fitness, circuit training, similar to CrossFit, more of a powerlifting. I do like a hybrid, like powerlifting, circuit training, CrossFit type workout. right whatever I do it four or five days a week. And there's a big difference between wearing good clothes and just gym shorts, right? Yeah. So in that same thread that has now evolved into this hunting line, right?
00:06:25
Speaker
um and you're creating a pant that could be an ever used pant, which I think like for me, I haven't wore your pants yet. I'm going to get a pair of your pants. We talked about that before this podcast. I want to try them because I am a gear junkie. Forever I wore the Pawn of Zions for everything. Weren't even a hunting line. I would not wear ... Dude, I tried ... I don't want to name brands. I've tried all the brands. The Pawn of Zion was my pant. For me, with layering systems, are you guys doing base layers? Yeah, we do base layers. You have like zip offs? They're coming.
00:06:58
Speaker
They're coming. Okay, good. Yeah. Zip offs are like this. When, when zip offs came out, like I basically just threw away all my heavy pants and just went straight to like running a Zion, like anywhere I was going, right? Like I do have a cold pair of like thicker pants for if I'm going to be like, like I knew I was going to be in Colorado. I knew it was going to be.
00:07:13
Speaker
you know 20 degrees the whole time, i'm like I wore a thicker pant, right? And then I can wear that pant the whole time and be fine with it.
Functional Fitness Clothing vs. Traditional Gym Attire
00:07:19
Speaker
But typically, even on a hunt like that, I'm just running like a thin, um functional pant that I can just layer underneath. And yeah and that's kind of what you guys went through with this pant. But you guys, from my my understanding of the pant, I actually talked to me yesterday who was just like, you got to talk to Mike about these pants because they're awesome. They're my favorite pants.
00:07:36
Speaker
is you took that same kind of pant, but you shorted up where you need to be shorted up, right? And you made it better. So talk about the pants first. I know that's like everyone's favorite thing right now. Yeah. So the pants are definitely the flagship options or the flagship products. So we have the Frontier Standard Pant, which is a heavier weight pant, and then we have the Frontier Light Pant. So we make a light pant for early season elk hunting. I stayed in the Frontier Lights through all of early season and the frontier heavies. ah My mountain goat tag started in September, but we were up at 12,000 feet getting snowed on. And those pants are were perfect from, they're they're they're perfect without anything layered underneath, albeit like later season hunts. So you do have to have a couple of options, but but ah the pants are definitely like, they're ah They're my favorite pant on the market, just because of the way like Aaron put a lot of thought with the design team into where the pocket layout is. ah Both the lights and the heavies have hip vents. Some people prefer the hip vents to just open up, kind of like ah like a fall raven, I think, so or could you make some pants that open up? And there's we have mesh in ours. And we get some complaints. on I'm like, well, if you don't like the mesh, just cut it out.
00:08:53
Speaker
Just cut it out cut it out. I personally, I like having the mesh in there because I don't want sticks and like sticks and twigs finding their way into my pants somehow anyways when I'm out there because I'm living in the dirt. you know but um so I like the mesh, but it's easy to cut out. but yeah so on the On the mesh, on the let's talk about the vent thing real quick. cause like I'm still torn because like I have a pair of pants that have a giant bed on the side. And I love those pants, but at the same time, like every time I get it, I have to throw so many pictures away. Cause I feel like I'm freaking on like only fans like with my things so big and open. So like, I'm like, Oh, you can't use that picture. Cause I look like a tool cause I got like a zipper from my hip all the way to my knee. Um, but, I do like the mesh too, but and you can't just cut it out. All I guys just do it. Um, it doesn't, I mean, honestly, it doesn't really affect me having the mesh. And there's, I think I'm more of a mesh guy. Like I was like, Oh, I don't want the mesh. And then now that I'm, cause I do run into that. Like say you're hunting through.
00:09:46
Speaker
um like scrub oaks and manzanilla in Utah. Dude, I get so much crap down with this other pants. cause I always zip them down. like I love it. like The first year I ran those pants, the first year I ran a pant with a zipper, because everyone's doing it now. right Everyone's putting the zipper on the side. right um I was on an Oregon late season hunt and it was it was more like a winter pant.
00:10:06
Speaker
And it was cold, but then we'd just start hiking and you start sweating. And dude, like, I remember zipping those things down. My partner, Paul, like getting angry at me because he didn't have that option. yeah like Like he doesn't have it. And he's like, this is such bull crap. over And it's like, he's cause he's sweating so bad. And the zippers are so nice. Then you can rip them right back up once you're sitting in glasses. So yeah, it works really well. but And is that a long zipper? Like you have is a long one or it's fine. I would call it like a medium length. It comes from like the the the midway down your butt cheek down to like midway down or three core almost to your knee, but not like a 16 inch, like a 16 inch zipper on the side, which I think is good. I like that. Yeah. It's not, it's not super long. Um, cause then you deal, then you deal with like the way the pants fit and rub and yeah like the fit of the pant changes almost. Whereas this, you get a little bit more room in your thighs when you drop the zippers, but that's about it. So.
00:11:04
Speaker
Um, but on top of that, just the pockets make sense. It's functional. Uh, the, we, we came out with a version one. It did well. It was, we liked it, but we won't, we're after like beating the crap out of it. Customers beating the crap out of it. We, we came out with a version two. So it's a frontier 2.0, uh, heavy and light. And, and those are, I mean, the materials super comfortable. They dry super fast. I've gotten soaked in both the heavies and the lights and they dry quick.
00:11:34
Speaker
And then the other thing um that we offer that a lot of a lot of companies don't offer, I'm a short fella. I'm only five foot five, right? ah they We offer a pretty good size range. so And that's that's something I never looked at from a marketing perspective in the hunting world, like when i when I was a writer. But if I try on my pants from other companies, the size range is they A lot of them, they fit me around the waist, but they don't. the There's a lot of bunching at the bottom because of the inseam length. I tailor pants all the time. I order like super long ones, bring them get tailored. Yeah. and it's It's like a damned if you do damned if you don't. right because I understand it from a business perspective. They have to order so many of every size when they have them made. right so If they're not selling, like they're they're sitting on those pants and and that that is what it is. but
00:12:27
Speaker
But that is something that that Born Primitive has done well. So we offer three different inseam sizes on our pants. Really? We've got 30, 33, and 36. So there's kind of a range for everybody. And then our our waist size goes up in increments of two. So we start out, I think some pants start out at 28, but 28, 30, 32. It goes up in increments of two, and then we have a ah Velcro um waistband I was gonna ask you about so you have an adjustable so I don't have to because I'm not a big kind of worn a belt when I hunt me either I hate um so I don't like pants like I the pants would run this year I really like don't have that option but I like the pants I'm wearing about more like a nylon rope belt but um
00:13:11
Speaker
So like the worries are like the Zions is you can just pull that strap and like it's tight and I don't have to wear a belt ever with them. yeah um And so you guys have that option where you can just. Yeah, we have that option. Well, we would then it's on the version to the the Frontier 2.0. And it's because after you go into the backcountry for a week. You lose weight, dude. Your pants fit different. You lose weight, dude. And they stretch out. They just. Yeah, you're eating dehydrated food. You're not wanting to eat as much food. Like you're you're you're you lose weight pretty quick. I dropped, around I went down. It's so frustrating. I know you're like a super healthy guy and you work out a lot and like, it's, it's, it's weird. Cause like you train to hunt, right? Like we train to hunt, right? Like I can tell you, like I've literally a train to like go hunting.
00:13:57
Speaker
But then, and you get like, by the start of time you're getting jacked, you know, I'm putting on muscle, looking great. And then you hit a hunting season, dude, I dropped like 15 pounds. I looked like an Ethiopian coming out of the backcountry, but I was in the field for like 60 days, dude. I'm like, so excuse. Now I'm like back in the gym every day, like trying to gain it back before. Well, it's funny. That stuff gets periodized. Have you heard of Mountain Tough Fitness? Yeah. I'm a big fan of their programs because they periodize the workout. Right now, I'm in a program that's called post-season strength. It's all about getting your strengths back.
00:14:29
Speaker
Yeah, I can carry an elk quarter. We were talking about this with my roommate and I the other night. Elk hunting is a lot of zone two or backpack hunting in general. It's a lot of zone two. There's a time or two where you're going to get up into like zone three or four heart rate wise, but then you're sitting on your butt again or you're just cutting up an elk and then you're packing it out.
00:14:50
Speaker
And they, even that's like
Technical Aspects of Born Primitive Gear
00:14:51
Speaker
it's zone two with a few short bursts of so three or four because you're hiking up a mountain with a quarter. But other than that, you're, you're lumbering along, just suffering, right? So, um, you do, you lose like, I come out and like doing pushups is hard. I'm like, I get like 20 pushups. yeah got it Holy cow. I have no upper body strength. My weight, my weight went, that's what things, but dude, like I could, by the time I got to like,
00:15:14
Speaker
October, I could out hike anybody. du I was like heart rate was like staying low. I'm just freaking just pounding ridges, but I get to the gym and I'm like, I'm benching like 30% less than I was benching in September. and like As a dude who likes, like I don't know, it's like there's this weird balance where you can't have both. You cannot have like you can't miss two weeks a month from the gym and still stay like you know jacked. yeah yeah And you're in, you're in a fit part of the world. Everybody out there's got, they at least have the show muscles, whether or not they can do anything with those muscles, different story, but, yeah but, but yeah, so, um,
00:15:52
Speaker
Yeah, it's a, it's an interesting, it's an interesting thing to manage, but I'm the same way I train all year for it. So yeah, I go out there and I get emaciated and I look like Ethiopian coming out of the woods. Like I always call it, I always equate it to like ranger school. Um, army ranger school is like 64 days. If you make it straight through, they don't feed you. You don't sleep. Like you come out of there, like your cheeks are sunken in the same thing with like a good long hunting season. You look very simple.
00:16:20
Speaker
So um back to the pants. i like so i'm I'm a fan of the zipper already. I'm a fan of the waistband, um fan of the lengths. Now, what are where are we shoring these pants up? What are they made out of? Do we have like and an over patch on the knees, on the butt? What are we doing? um so The knees and the butt are double reinforced, so basically double layered the material. Not a lot of people are doing. we started Well, we started with we started with a ballistic nylon.
00:16:52
Speaker
um and the ballistic nylon just but when it worked well but it didn't stretch enough so we were having some some issues with the seams staying together because that ballistic nylon on your knee and on your butt like if you're taking a knee You're, you need that material to stretch too. And that ballistic nylon wasn't stretching. So we just, we doubled up the the material that we're made out of. Uh, and I got to look, I think it's a nylon polyester blend is what it is. I'm 99.9% sure it's a nylon poly blend, but, and then we kinda with the 2.0 is we changed the, the, um, what's the word I'm looking for here. We changed the composition, the amount of nylon versus poly.
00:17:38
Speaker
And that that made them softer, quieter, and then made them, they're just, they're they're more durable than the 1.0s, which I don't even, I don't know how many, of them I don't think we have a ton of 1.0s left. Okay. And it seems like it's been taken off pretty good. People are really into them. People are buying them. I mean, I've had multiple told me they're their favorite pant hands down.
00:17:58
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, we're doing I think we're we're getting a pretty good foothold in the honey space for being a clothing brand. And it's I think that's a ah testament to to both the quality of the product that we're making and kind of the the So you you look at a lot of companies, there's a lot of smoke and mirrors. There's a lot of videos in a lab and like, for like we're making pants here, guys. We're yeah we're not making anything like, you don't we're we're not we're not smoking up the mirrors. We're not throwing like crazy numbers at people. We're just, we make a product that works. And once people try it and use it, they're they're they're impressed by it. So they come back for more.
00:18:38
Speaker
um I get it, dude. I get people get so bad in because they're like, what's the what's the um how many pounds can this tripod hold? and I'm like 85 millimeter spotter for my heads. right like yeah I do it like that and they're like, what what's the weight? I'm like, what does it matter? you know i mean like I've never done, like we've done stuff right like 15 pounds on the BP head. but i'm like but it's great for a BTX. right like it's how That's how I look at it. like what What do I need to know the scientific crap about this? How does it work? What rifle does it hold? Can I shoot off it? like That's what I need to know, not like what the science says, because screw science, scientists suck. you know i mean like they I want i want to field the field testing answers, but some people didn't just want that. like out like I had to look this up. so Our pants are a 40D, 92% poly, 8% spandex. Gotcha. Four-way stretch.
00:19:28
Speaker
um But yeah, so we shirt up the knees. We have knee pad inserts in there. Oh, you do? Yeah, we have inserts for knee pads. And our knee pads, we don't have any knee pads in stock right now. We're kind of we're kind of tweaking us some things on our knee pads, but our knee pads are ah super, they're they're comfortable and they move with you and they're they're good knee pads. So once those hit the website again, I think those will pick up as well. but um We do have a knee pad. We don't send knee pads out with ah with the pants like some companies do just because we're our knee pad. They're not like a cheap foam knee pad. They're rubberized. They got flex points in the right spots. So they're they're a little bit of a... they
00:20:13
Speaker
we we put some design and thought into them so it's an additional purchase but the knee pads do kick ass and once they come back in stock I'm gonna order like a pair for every pair of pants so I don't forget they're there. really so you you wear um in the pant don't even care don't even care no i So I field tested, I didn't, I, I, we field tested these pants at the, the SIG archery rifle competition. And what you guys won, didn't you guys win that? We won it. i'm wherem I'm wearing, I'm wearing, I'm repping, I'm repping the hoodie right here. and I heard you guys just smoked, go hunt. Uh, we, we did well. We did well. Um, we, we put a pretty cool, we put an awesome team together. So you did. I heard you guys just went out there and crushed.
00:20:54
Speaker
We, we could shoot. I can't shoot a pistol to save my life. I drugged the team down. I drugged the team out down on the, on the pistol shooting. They picked up my slack, but then I definitely, there were areas where like there was a, there was a couple of points where I definitely helped the team. Archery and the long gun stuff is easy for me.
00:21:14
Speaker
Um, but, but wearing them out there, it was hot. It was June in Montana. Like you're running, jumping, crawling. Uh, there was an event, there was an event where they had three shooting positions set up on a Rocky, like basically just a Rocky top. Right. And.
00:21:33
Speaker
You had to run 100 yards to a bucket, grab one round for your rifle, run back to your bolt gun, load the round, and then there was targets out to 600 yards, and each target was worth a different number of points. And that that that you had, us sir, I think it was like 10 minutes.
00:21:50
Speaker
to to shoot for as many points as you could. So we, like, we beat the crap out of those pants and and the knee pads and and everything. I was, I was impressed. Like, yeah, your knees get a little hotter, obviously, if you got a knee pad in there, but it was not like overbearing. Like, Oh my God, I need to get these off of me.
00:22:09
Speaker
you know Yeah, I asked because like I've carried like this year I carried like a cheap pair of like foam knee pads from Home Depot and I never wore them like dude like I never wear knee pads so I asked because like I feel like if it's not in in my pant I'm probably not gonna put it on right like yeah even with like bringing like I don't bring like extra shoes to stockings. It's like, I'm just never gonna wear, I'm just gonna go. No, yeah, i don' just don't either i'm in I'm in the same boat. like i just don't i don't know There's definitely times where and most of my hunts like antelope hunting, I probably definitely bring knee pads. I'm gonna have knee pads in the pants all the time. So it's nice to be able to leave them in there and or take them out.
00:22:42
Speaker
Well, honestly, in like Arizona, like you're in so much cactus. like That's where they'd be nice to have, but I just never grab them or I forget them in my backpack or I don't... even in my yeah I forget in my house. like They're in my closet somewhere right now with all my gear. I just forget them and I'm on my knee pads. That's why I ask if we can run them and not care about them. Sweet. The pants are awesome. ah You guys also picked up... I mean, now it's public knowledge, right? He's officially... Aaron Schneider is full-time born primitive.
00:23:10
Speaker
Aaron Snyder is full-time born primitive. He's the director of outdoor. So ah we got a lot of we got a lot of stuff in the works with that. We have the born primitive outdoor podcast, which I need to link you to up so you guys can chat about Tricer on there. But we have the born primitive outdoor podcast and we're working. Aaron and I have taught classes over the years together, like the people's thirst for knowledge and to lower their learning curve. is it's It's amazing to me because in the military, I'm a non-commissioned officer, so my job is a trainer. you know My job is to teach coach a mentor um and and dealing with soldiers versus like hunters that are passionate about it and want to learn. It's ah it's a different demographic. like it's it's
00:23:57
Speaker
it's It's pretty awesome. So we're coming out with a full blown. We're going to launch the Born Primitive Academy this this spring slash summer. We don't have dates quite yet. We're finalizing all the stuff. We're finalizing the the the course material, but we're going to do in-person classes. we'll cover We've done a couple of glassing camps, which definitely want to talk to you guys about getting involved in. We've done a couple of glassing camps in the past, but this is going to be owned by Born Primitive now with Aaron coming on board. ah Because Aaron also, he's very similar to me, likes teaching. like That's why he spends time answering people's questions on the internet and then gives away his cell phone number. and Then when he goes into the field and comes out of the field, he's got five million notifications on his phone. I was like, Aaron, I don't know how you do that, but he's he's passionate about teaching people. With the Outdoor Academy, we do well'll we're going to do glassing camps. We're going to do
00:24:54
Speaker
um long range shooting, archery, ah land navigation, full blown land navigation, like crawl, walk, run, classroom, practical work on a map, and get them to the point where they can actually go out into the woods and navigate from point A to point B with a map, a protractor, and a compass. That sounds fun. like I really wish I understood topo better. like I feel like I'm always like i'm always like looking at something like, oh, that's going down, not up. You know what I mean? like yeah yeah and I like what you're saying with like people want to learn because like I do personally. like I'm taking hunting courses all the time. i'm doing you know on I'm doing a shooting school. I'm going to shooting school for two days in January because I'm doing PRS. I might go to do some stuff in New Mexico this year. like I want to learn. I'm going to do some elk courses this year, some bear courses because I feel like it's something that if you're passionate about it, you can learn from it. so I think it's a good good niche to be in. and Then you got someone like Aaron who is
00:25:51
Speaker
probably one of the most respected people in the industry when it comes to gear and knowledge. right like like The proof's in the pudding with Aaron. right like It's funny because I guess Aaron would be an influencer, sort of, but yeah he's like an influencer that like no one's going to question whether the guy can kill something or not. you know Yeah. yeah there I mean, there is no question. i and Guys that usually make it to Aaron's point in the world and and kind of one of the reasons I love and respect him and one of the things I love and respect him for is he's always stayed true to who he is. right like he
00:26:22
Speaker
he just spent Before he came and helped me on my mountain goat hunt, he was he was in Northern British Columbia guiding mountain goat and and stone sheep hunts. He doesn't have to do that, he does but that he lives for that shit. he Yeah, he's still a guy. That's one thing I saw. Getting flown in on a bush plane, dropped off on a pond.
00:26:44
Speaker
and then hiking and living out of his backpack. like That's not an easy life. That's not an easy job and and like he lives for it. so he's He's stayed true to who he is and and what he loves. and and i mean He still hunts elk on public land pretty much every year. He didn't hunt elk this year because he was gone during elk season guiding, but like he still hunts elk on public land. like I'm sure if someone offered him to go to the Deseret to kill a bull, he wouldn't say no, but on keys these he's still got like he's still doing backpack hunts. like He was on a public land mountain go home with me in Colorado, like getting his ass kicked.
00:27:23
Speaker
so so he he stays he He's stayed true to who he is over the years. So what else are you guys doing with the the technical? cloth What are you guys doing for uppers? Are you guys doing any poly nylon stuff or is it all merino? What are you guys doing? oh so maro So our base layers are are my favorite by far.
Advantages of Merino-Polyester Blend Base Layers
00:27:42
Speaker
ah Our base layers, we do we have ah we have synthetic now, but our our flagship base layers, our Ridgeline series and our Ridgeline series is a merino polyester blend. So okay similar to like the, not mine keep going.
00:27:58
Speaker
i don't yeah I don't know if it's similar to anybody's I think we kind of when we came out with it, I don't i don't know that there was a lot of people doing a merino poly blend. I didn't notice merino poly blends popping up until ours came out. I'm not saying we were the first by any means but um we We do a merino poly blend and i I started, when I started Western hunting, I started out with with first light and merino and I stayed wet longer and merino stretches. And that merino poly blend, like it's the best of both worlds. It keeps you, if you're if you're wearing the lightweight stuff, it keeps you cool when you're in the field, it dries super fast and it it maintains its shape.
00:28:44
Speaker
after like if you're packing out or or climbing a mountain, like you soak your top. like I remember soaking just a straight merino top. oh yeah du Just hanging off of me. you know And then it stayed wet for so long. I was like, all right, I'm going to go back to synthetic and start wearing synthetic base layers. And this the merino poly blend that we have, it doesn't stretch. like It maintains its shape even when you sweat in it. And then it it dries so much faster than the merino I used to wear. i't I don't know if it's the other products on the market have gotten better, but ourss ours is pretty awesome. So we make a heavy and a light.
00:29:23
Speaker
Like a 15250? ah ah like ah I'm looking at a heavy right now, it's a 220 GSM. Okay. um and Then the light, let's see, level look at the light. ah The light would be a 150.
00:29:40
Speaker
150. Yeah, that's like what my go to now is like a merino poly blend top or a poly top long sleeve hooded with a zip. I like that's like kind of I love that set up. Oh, we make the we make one with a hood. That's a 150. I'm a hood guy too. I love hoods on everything. So I just spent so much time in the sun to like being from San Diego, like I know I'm gonna have skin cancer at some point here. Yeah. And like I spent when you go out and you spend I was wearing shirts forever and I'd come back, dude, and I'd have the gnarliest farmer stand on my, dude, I'm not wearing sunscreen. I've got us wearing a long shirt. So like some of those 150 poly blends or um merino blends, you can just put it on, like cover your head up, you can cut get out of the sun. And like, so I just kind of went to that now and exclusively, I don't wear short sleeves much anymore at all in the field.
00:30:28
Speaker
Yeah, we make and we make a sun shirt that's that's poly spandex blended. And it's, ah it's got an oversized hood for the sun. um And that, that's got we put we wash like UPF 30 into them. So they've got some some sun blocking properties in there. But yeah, I have to have a hood to even being in Colorado, like your ah Even in the high country, when it's 30 degrees out and soon as the sun comes out, you're 12,000 feet closer to it, right? Yeah. yeah it's just Honestly, with with the right 150, 150 is my base layer. i mean Hands down, like whether I'm in 90 degrees in New Mexico this year or I was in 20 degrees in Colorado, like I'm wearing that 150 hooded base layer shirt now and I can run it
00:31:14
Speaker
it just keeps it those the clue about the merino is it just it works in both environments and that's why I like that like that shirt right is you can have you know in the hot or cold weather it's just a great layer it's a layer that's always on me yep we uh and with ours we're coming out so our our initial shirt we did kind of a ah dual color shirt. It's like a black and gray, and then it's a green and gray. And so we're coming out with solid shirts this year and that. So I think people just didn't like the ah the dual color. like I just don't think it it did as well because it's it's my apps one of my absolute favorite products is our our half zip hoodie, the Ridgeline half zip, which is exactly what you said it is. It's ah it's a 150 weight.
00:32:04
Speaker
ah hood zipper like I'm elk hunting in 90 degrees packing out a bowl I can dump that zipper all the way down have my chest hair hanging out looking good you know and it's a it's a frickin it's an it's an awesome top so typically I'm a 150 a 150 top and then I'm like some sort of a mid layer like a 250 mid layer and then like like I ran like a hybrid kind of Puffy this year, ah Puffy, it's a sicko one. It's like a Puffy slash, I don't know what what they call it it. I love it. I try to keep it as minimal as possible on my layers, like three, maybe four layers. That's it for my upper, right? yeah um And you guys are doing like a 250, like a hooded as well.
00:32:48
Speaker
We do a 250. It doesn't have a hood though. Okay 250. That's perfect though. For me like I'd run that on top of it and like most of them I can get away with that for most of my hunt and then we're gonna sit down and throw something over top of that. But then also when you get into like the the intermediate insulation pieces which I because I consider the 150 a base layer right? Yeah. 250 would be an intermediate like a thicker. I'm always gonna wear that 150 just like you. Yeah all the time. It's on you all day long.
00:33:14
Speaker
Because if it if it does get hot, I want to have the ability to to dump all the other stuff and still not be getting stabbed by manzanita and cat claw and all that good stuff. um So I'll takeck but typically wear the 150 and then we are other in the kind of the intermediate insulation pieces we have, ah we make ah a grid fleece, we call it. That's like a mid-grid fleece? like Yeah, we've got a grid fleece and the grid fleece is is um I mean, we've used it in the military so much, like grid fleece. are so much It's so simple, yet there's so much science
Technology and Benefits of Grid Fleece
00:33:50
Speaker
behind it. like the so The whole point is a grid fleece. If you look at a ah grid fleece, top doesn't matter if it's ours or somebody else's. um The whole point of it is you have those low spots that that are wicking sweat away from your body. They transfer it to the flat.
00:34:05
Speaker
outer layer right the outside of the garment to dry. So those low spots pick up that sweat and then you can still, you can still dump it still dumps heat really well because you have those those grid lines in between the low spots and the high spots. You have those ah ditches if you will in there when you flip it inside out. um So it still transfers heat well, still cools you down well like it's ah it's a really, really good, like whoever had the idea to come up with that is genius.
00:34:33
Speaker
How does it fit? So one of my issues with some of the grip pieces that they have, like I love the piece once I have it on and fitting, but I feel like I'm putting on like a wet paper bag and I have to like pull the thing out like, you know, over my layers. I don't think we we don't really have that issue with ours. Like a lot of our stuff. You know what I'm talking about, right? Yeah, I know exactly. Where you're like having to like fight this thing back to like fit when you get it on. Yeah, you got to like get the show to get it off. We don't really have that issue with ours. It's ah it's also ah it's a half zip hoodie. So it's got it on it.
00:35:00
Speaker
ah zipper and a hood. And so we have a we have a snorkel collar that comes up. I'm normally wearing that thing around the house like I live in those frickin good places but um it's got a snorkel collar that comes up and then the hood that goes around the snorkel collar so you'll have the collar on the inside. But it's a half zip you don't I never have any issues getting that thing to just come on and fit right out the gate.
00:35:22
Speaker
and for Honestly, for most hunts, if you're listening to this, you probably can get away with that 150, this grid fleece on like one puffy um yes on both your hunts, dude. like Early season, early season, that's all I'm taking. Even on that mountain goat hunt, that's all I had. I had ah i had our heavyweight puffy jacket, our Tundra 2.0. I had our quiver grid fleece, and then actually on the mountain goat hunt, I forewent the merino, the ridgeline half zip.
00:35:50
Speaker
and and wore the sun shirt because I was 12,000 feet again. just i I wanted a big... like ah The hood on the 150 is good, but I wanted a big oversized hood because there's no trees up there. Well, dude, honestly, 2024, you could have just wore a t-shirt the whole year because it was 90 degrees in every unit across the West till today. Yeah. so yeah I had one cold hunt all year. I literally ran. It was so hot all year. That's what people don't realize with technical clothing. If you do it right, I think what you're saying too, that grid please, a base, and then just that puffy, I can get away with anything. I have a bunch of hard shells that I have. I wear them around the house. I don't want them in my pack. I don't want them in my pack. I want a very simple system.
00:36:37
Speaker
that you know I'll hike in. When I hike, dude, if it's 20 degrees, ah I'm in my base layer. It doesn't matter. I'm going base layer, 150, hike in with that. um I sit down. I'll probably drop my vinyl harness, sit there for a minute, throw on. I pretty much instantly throw on a mid layer, right? Just kind of suck up some of that sweat. and Then then like me know within 10, 15 minutes, I'm probably throwing the puffy on, then I'm good to go.
00:37:01
Speaker
Yup. Yup. Same. And you don't need to go crazy. Even when it's like super, unless I'm white tail hunting, like if I'm Western hunting and I'm going to be moving, I rarely ever wear a base layer on my legs. Yeah. You're going to regret it. Like you're going to like, like it's like, I did a guy this year and I'm like,
00:37:21
Speaker
get cold. like What do you mean? I'm like, dude, get cold before you hike, get cold. like you're going to Your body just heats up, man. like you can't You're going to sweat, you're going to get cold. um and I do think like the one thing about Merino's and like even like a good um micro fleece like you're saying or grid fleece is what kind of soak that sweat up to I feel like you know what I mean like you throw a the grid fleece over your merino because you know you're sweating you just did two miles and you know even though it's 20 degrees you sweat it through your backpack uh the microwave is kind of I feel like it kind of absorbs some of that sweat off you and dries you out real quick it does yeah that's exactly that's grid fleece was designed like that's its purpose and it works like I'm a geek about this stuff dude that's just simple me too it's such a simple but it's such a simple but effective
00:38:04
Speaker
material for for someone to wear. And that's why there's like, ah we have a strong military culture and military history in the company. So that's kind of like grid fleece was a no brainer for us because we've used pretty much everybody's used it in combat. Yeah. What I wore for years was stuff from the freaking military surplus grid fleece. Absolutely. You know, I can go down there and buy that brown, you know, that, you know, that, like that, uh, that brown grid fleece, you know, some of it even had like Marine in the back of it, you know, like it was Marines, like, cause it just works, man. Like, you know,
00:38:34
Speaker
ah dumb 1,000%. That's why I like you guys pick up Aaron, because I'm such a simple hunter. People like ask me all the time, what do you do? What about this gear? with this because I'm a gear junkie, but I just simplify my kit so much. You spend so much time doing it. You know you kind of learn what you need. like Everyone thinks I use like the craziest tripods. Literally, I'm an AD and LP guy. I want to feel like I'm like a simple, simple dude, um and the same thing with goes with my gear. ah What are you guys doing for? like You guys doing the ah puffy, the hard shell, the hybrid? What do you guys got going on?
00:39:02
Speaker
I was talking about this in the beginning. much
Born Primitive's Layering System
00:39:05
Speaker
Much like the military, right, we kind of broke down our system in an easy to understand, in an easy to understand layering system. So we have, we have a four level layering system, right? Level one is your base layer. So that's your, that's your sun shirt. That's your ridgeline series. That's the merino polyester blend, blend ah tops and bottoms. And then level two is your mid layer, right? So it's it's worn over the base layer. It's it's that intermediate fleece layer, right? Level three is your out layer. So that's going to be your pants and your puffy's. Like that's going to be the stuff that is most often in the elements, right? And then level four is your shell layer, right? So that's, that's given you the protection from wind, rain,
00:39:54
Speaker
anything that you would need a shell for. So that's how we kind of we simplified it. We didn't need to have like a tawny layering. This is Born Prudent's tawny layering system. And here's what you know what I mean. So we four layers, simple, next to skin, intermediate fleece, insulation pieces, um outwear pants, puffy jackets, and then and then shell layers, which Right now, we've got two products in that. That's our our um barrier jacket and our our Mission Flex rain gear. so ah Level three, we kind of naturally went through all the layers already, which I love. um so Level three is our puffy jackets and and our our pants.
00:40:35
Speaker
so We make a tundra puffy jacket. it's It's a good, it's a warm puffy. I like it. It's got hip vents so you can dump heat um in the heavyweight version. So we make a light and a heavy puffy jacket. ah And then we make a vest now too. with ah you're so I was going to ask you about vests because like, dude, like I want to use them. And like I wore one this week when I was quail hunting. I was like, I'll throw this on because it's kind of nice to have like that layer, especially in San Diego, like in the morning, and throw a vest on. It's kind of, you know, dude, I never bring my vest with me.
00:41:07
Speaker
and I know i owe a couple. I don't use them, dude. I want to. I want to be into it and I'm just not. If I'm if i'm back back hunting, I'm not bringing a vest, but like that elk hunt, I just went on. We were kind of hunting out of a base camp and and had side-by-sides and stuff.
00:41:21
Speaker
so that hunt like I had the best because it was Arizona's 30 degrees in the morning and then it'd be at 60 by 10 o'clock. So I would kind of, I had all the layer, I wear the vest, I would wear ah my base layer and then my quiver, my grid fleece, then the vest over that and then the puffy jacket over that. yeah I was able to just kind of downgrade as the day went on because it was a lot of just sitting on top of a hill looking for elk.
00:41:50
Speaker
um So so it it worked really well. But yeah, the vest, the vest like there's people that love them. And I definitely, I saw the use case for it when I was in Arizona, but on a lot of backpack hunts, I'm definitely not packing a vest in, but ah it's good for white kale. You're making a puffy vest or a hard shell vest? Puffy vest. It's a puffy. I definitely don't have a puffy vest. I've never done that.
00:42:13
Speaker
Yeah, so it's it's a puffy vest, yep. But, but yeah. You're making, your puffy's are, you have two puffy's or one puffy, like a heavy and a light. Cause I have a, I have a butuffy big, I have a furnace, like first light one, which is a phenomenal puffy, but you cannot walk more than 10 feet without sweating. So it's, I love it for like, if it's cold, I got that one. I didn't even run it this year. Like I said, I kind of got fell in love with a different, different top, but, um.
00:42:40
Speaker
I always, pretty much always have, even in San Diego, a puffy. They're so light and it just covers you up. As long as it's not going to be raining out, I guess throw a puffy on. Yeah. We have a heavy and a lightweight puffy. Our puffy, and it's called the Tundra 2.0 now because we've come out with the Tundra 2.0 version and improved on the original design.
00:43:04
Speaker
But it's 200 gram, the heavy's a 200 gram fill, 100% polyester, and then the lining's 100% nylon. ah And then the faces, it's DWR coated. And then we have, again, in the heavy, you have hip vents and the light, you don't. so And I can tell you the specs on the light. I kind of like the idea of the vents, because I don't have vents in any of my puffy's. I like that. Yeah, and then the Tundra light is... um for the fill 60 grams. so and Either goose down or these are hybrid down? like po No, synthetic. They're polyester. Synthetic down? Okay. yeah so and Then the lining is 100% nylon, 50 denier. It's a little bit more durable. It's a 50 denier face on it. so It's a rip stop polyester. so and so I like the puffy. so Now, I almost never run my hardship. I do have, like I'll run like a light rain gear. like I have some heavier rain gear stuff. like If I were to go to like
00:44:05
Speaker
I'm going to north of this territory. I don't have any rain all the time. I have a behavior set I wear, but I do carry a hard shell. My hard shell is always just going to be rain gear now. um And I always generally what I do. Dude, I only put it on once this year for, I put it on even hiking. I was wearing, and I didn't, it was so hot that it was raining. I was in Colorado and I was over there and I just, I wore just my freaking Reno shirt and just got wet. I didn't care, but ah I like having it for wind. You know, it's nice to have it there. i So I do the exact same thing. I wear my rain gear. My rain gear becomes my outer shell, outer necessity. Like guys like John Barklow.
00:44:37
Speaker
will tell you that rain gear is not a windproof layer, but it bucks the wind enough for me and it's already in my I don't want to have to carry an extra.
00:44:50
Speaker
an extra jacket, like our rain jacket, top, large is 1.18 pounds, right? So ah or our windproof layer, which I do like for specific hunts, but backpack hunting, I'm generally- It takes up too much space, dude. yeah It's not the weight, it's the space.
00:45:08
Speaker
Yeah. and like they just like like hard shells just like I'll wear a hard shell. Say I'm going to Mexico, like I'll probably wear a hard shell as just my only jacket. like It's fine. like I'm going to Mexico, we're hunting, come out we're going side by side, we're going to get out hike a mile. I can bust brush and it's great. But if I have to have a layered system in my backpack, I just don't have a hard shell in there. just It just never makes my backpack anymore because i just it just takes up too much space. I do the same thing with with three layers, and ah you know the the base, the mid, and the and the puffy.
00:45:34
Speaker
And then if the wind picks up, you can throw the rain, throw the jacket on. And I ah do it like, even with, so now with more technologies with pants now, like unless I'm going to downpour rainstorm, I almost never wear rain pants. I'll throw a rain jacket on, but I'll just leave my synthetic pants on. And I'm like, they're not going to get wet anyways. I'm not like I'm sitting, if I was like laying in the rain, yeah, I'll throw rain pants on. yeah But generally I have a tarp with me anyways. So I i don't, I can't even remember. Take that back.
00:45:59
Speaker
um Rain pants are nice when it snows. and i I got hypothermic last year because I didn't wear rain pants, I wore gaiters. It snowed but it was still hot and the rain melted off on me and I got soaked. so like I can't say like if it's if it's if it does snow, I'll put rain pants on when I'm walking through snow because I don't want to get wet. Yeah, there I mean, and there's there's use cases for all of that stuff, right? But it it really it comes down to what you like your skill level, your comfort. um Like, if if I'm on a backpack hunt, and I don't bring rain pants, and it starts to dump and downpour or snow, you're gonna wish you had them like oh, fuck the They're always in my pack. like like like They are always in my pack. you're If you hunt any sort of mountain terrain, even in August, you're going to get rained on. yeah You could count on an ATA hunt, getting some hail, getting some snow, or getting some rain on any time of year for the hills. yep Yeah.
Introduction of Stretchy Rain Gear
00:46:53
Speaker
But our rain gear our ring gear is is is a little different. we
00:46:59
Speaker
We made a stretchy rain gear, which is freaking, it's awesome. It moves with you. The face material is a little bit quieter. You're not, I mean, you're probably, it's still not like white tailor trad bow quiet. These people keep asking like, are these pants trad bow quiet? And I'm like, I don't know, man. Like they're, they're quiet enough. You can kill stuff in them. You can kill plenty of things.
00:47:21
Speaker
people get People get really wrapped around the axle on how quiet. You tell them they come in rainbow? Yeah. yeah um But it's a 75D four-way stretch. We partnered with the Event to make that. So Event makes some really good technical, ah both like rain gear, windproof material. ah event My first exposure to Event, the the stuff sacks I use to keep stuff dry in my pack,
00:47:47
Speaker
are all Sea to Summit stuff sacks in their event. like I generally carry a ah down sleeping bag and put it in a waterproof compression sack that is made with event. so Super happy with how that performs out there though.
00:48:03
Speaker
And it's got a pretty good, it's got a pretty good, the waterproof rating is 15,000. And the breathability rating is also 15,000. So it's got a pretty good waterproof to breathable ratio. Obviously, I don't think any rain gear is like truly breathable, but but um the the times I've worn it, I'm i'm super happy with it.
00:48:26
Speaker
Yeah, you never want to hike in rain gear. Sometimes you have to, and you're just like, uh, that sucks, dude. It's just so you're just keeps everything. It's like a humidity. Like you're going into a freaking sauna, you know? Yeah. Are those zip off dancers? Does they have a zipper on the side or no? They do have a zipper on the side, but it doesn't go all the way up the waist. So it goes up. You can get them over your boot. Yeah. Yeah. That's the biggest thing for me. It's like, I don't care what the auto waste, but I want to be able to get it over my boot. I don't want to have to take my boots off when it's raining.
00:48:52
Speaker
Yeah. you know on so I like that. And honestly, I don't like zipping them all the way off because it's a pain in the freaking butt to get them back on. I like that. Just the basics. So the zipper goes all the way up to the elastic band at the top.
00:49:04
Speaker
Okay, cool. But but very like an unlike other rain gear, it's a little bit it's more comfortable to wear. Like I found myself putting that on quite a bit during the mountain go because I was like, man, this is like actually, it's not like all crinkly sound any like typical rain gear because of that that stretch that face fabric is it's almost like a brushed face. It's not a brushed face, but it's it's a it's a quieter face fabric. So it's, it's a little bit more comfortable to wear. So is the waistband a stretch waistband?
00:49:34
Speaker
Uh, on the pants. Yes. Yeah. Really? Yeah. So it's like almost like the, like your gym shorts. Uh, not, not quite like that. Uh, it's not an elastic waistband. It's, it's got a elastic on the inside and then it's got a a small belt, kind of like your main gear, that that little plastic belt that goes in there. Okay.
00:49:54
Speaker
No, I like that. Honestly, if I'm going to put them on, I just want to throw them all over my stuff and put it on. Not always worry about, I have some rain gear where it's an actual pant and it doesn't fit right over my other pants. Yeah. I like that. I'm a gear junkie coming on here. I love this stuff. I live for this stuff, right? That's what we're talking about. I think that's the thing that we could probably close with is the difference between us and a lot of the brands that are out there now. I'm not saying they're not, but i I don't know who the CEO of a lot of these other clothing companies are. You can see our CEO, like the dude was just faster open out of a Blackhawk with an AR strap to his chest. like the things that The things that we're passionate about and the things that we're making clothing for,
00:50:40
Speaker
doesn't matter if it's the athletic line, the tactical line and or the the hunting line, like we have the right people on the bus. Because we have people that actually do it, they rely on that gear, that gear needs to perform for those people. Our vice president Bruno Fallon, he's the vice president of outdoor and tactical. um Bruno's done just about, if you look at a military recruiting video and you see cool shit happening, Bruno's done all Right? Like Bruno started out in the 75th ranger regiment. Uh, then he, he, uh, he was a green beret. So he's a, he was a special forces guy. And then he, and then he ended up flying helicopters, uh, in the one 60th, which is the the special operations aviation side of, of doing it. So he's done all the cool stuff. He's, he's slid down ropes out of helicopters. He's flown helicopters like he's done.
00:51:32
Speaker
all of the the cool jobs you can do in the military, so to speak like so we and he's been in the military for I think he did a 30 year career in the military. So in 40 years total of service working with some some other things when he got out of the military.
00:51:49
Speaker
um but like so so the like He's the vice president of the outdoor and tactical line, and I'm right under him there in Snyder. right so like We do this stuff for a living. We have done this stuff for a living. so it's not It's not just you know like, oh, hey, the hunting industry has some money to be made. We want to make some money there. like We want to make products that actually work. Which people don't see, but so much. like That's where Tricia's been so successful is I'm using the stuff I'm making.
00:52:17
Speaker
thousand yes A lot of the hunting industry is venture capitalists coming in, buying these companies up and bottom line numbers. and That's where we're seeing some of these brands like kind of fall off now that we're doing so well. is You're losing the vision and then when the brands lose the vision, like they kind of lose.
00:52:33
Speaker
you know They don't stay up to date because it's like, well, we're not making money. If somebody bought Trisha, they'd be like, oh, we're already making the AD and LP. You're selling this many of them. Just do that. That's it. That's all you need to do. Why make more stuff? Just focus. Oh, it's just pounding some people's throats. I like the guys have innovation. The guys are actually using it and doing it. That's good to hear. Yeah. I mean, and we're the end users, right? Like Aaron spent two months in ah in the back country of British Columbia. I've spent most of September and in the woods. you know so it's not not like It's not like we're ah just making the products and then sitting back and getting fat. like we're We're coming out with these products and we're the ones using them in the field. so If we don't like them, we know our customer is not going to like them. you know so um it is It's a little bit different. Then the other the other thing I would touch on is like we we stay true to our roots. right like we just did
00:53:28
Speaker
We just did Veterans Day. We do a big Veterans Day campaign every year. This year, we raised on Veterans Day weekend, we we donated 100% of profits to pay off $5 million worth of veteran medical care debt. like We do things like There's a lot of companies that offer a military discount out there or say they support the military, but they they like it's it's just another it's just another marketing thing. like We actually take action to to support the men and women in uniform and the first responders law enforcement. like we're we're we're We're big on that stuff. like that is that That's where we came from and and that's who our customers are now. um and and so we're We're big on giving back to those communities.
00:54:16
Speaker
That's awesome. A couple of things I want to touch on. I want talk to touch on new products that are coming out. But I also want to note, you guys don't do any camo, right? Not yet. You're going to do camo. You work on some camo because you are going to have camo. Even though I don't wear it. I know a lot of guys want to wear it. Makes you feel good. Same. It keeps you very concealed in the side by side. Same. So you are going to make a camo pattern. your own I'm sure it's going to be your own pattern. Nope. Nope. We are. We're doing mossy oak bottom land. Okay. So we kind of went back and forth on it and
00:54:55
Speaker
every Every Western hunting clothing company has a camo pattern. They have their own, right? And in you have to sell that camo pattern. Now you don't have to sell your pants, you have to sell your pants and why it has the weird squiggly lines on it.
00:55:13
Speaker
um Mossy Oak Bottomland, in my opinion, is one of the most legendary historical camo patterns in in in the space, and it works just about anywhere. like it It will meet my needs, whether I'm on a mountain goat hunt or an elk hunt in the timber. like It's going to work to break up my outline, and that's the basics of camo anyways. like You want it to break up your outline.
00:55:38
Speaker
And so instead of reinventing the wheel and coming up with our own camo pattern, we we reached out to Mossy Oak and talked to them like, hey, we want to make some really quality technical clothing in your camo pattern. so Um, in sometime in 2025, we don't have exact dates yet. Uh, we're still like doing all the lab dips and, and making sure that it'll work with our material. We're going to start, we'll have our pants, our quiver, which is our grid fleece and our sun shirt and Mossy Oak. We're still working to figure out how to get our Merino, how, how to get the camel pattern to take on the Merino, but, uh,
00:56:15
Speaker
that that'll be coming later later down the line, but those are those are gonna be our three. So that way people do have a camo option because whether or not you wear a camo or not, or you're against camo or for camo, hunters like to wear a camo. So we're gonna offer that for camo.
00:56:33
Speaker
You gotta get dressed up, man. It's part of it. You gotta get dressed up. You gotta look good. you know and like There's some times where I'll definitely wear a camel top when I'm turkey hunting. Turkey season's right around the corner now, which is crazy because it feels like elk season just ended. but um We just got to survive show season and then we can turkey hunt. toha kind of It's but like There's a use case for
Upcoming Camo Patterns and Product Developments
00:56:59
Speaker
camo. I always have a camo top. du Honestly, coyotes too. like A lot of times, i mean yesterday I didn't wear a camo yesterday, but all where a lot of times I'll throw a freaking leafy flush over my shirt as I'll wear that, just the top. you know and so The do coyotes, it helps with that, face mask.
00:57:16
Speaker
um Then what's new? i you guys are Are you guys already doing, are you guys doing a gator yet or anything that's going to make some gators? ah We're not doing a gator yet. It's definitely one of the products we talked about. I would have to dig in and see what what's new. we don't we don't have like We completed the line this year when we dropped our gear and our barrier jacket, so our outer shell and our rain gear basically.
00:57:42
Speaker
um So right now we're just kind of working on refining products, but we do have some new stuff coming down the pipe. I just don't know if I'm a allowed to talk about them yet. So. Okay. But like we're. Make some gloves, maybe some neck gators, maybe some stuff like that. Nothing like that. That stuff's, I mean, you can get that stuff anyway. So you're not going to do gloves. i can are We talked about gloves. ah They're definitely on the list, but I don't know if they're going to be a priority for 25. We're going to come out with a top, a jacket that will be,
00:58:14
Speaker
make whitetail hunters happy. um ah it's It's just going to be quiet, something they can throw on on top of everything to quiet. like If they're wearing a puffy jacket, they can throw that jacket on and and quiet things down and and buck the wind a little bit. so we're We're coming out with that, but there's not. We're trying to- You don't need to have a million pieces. You need a simple system, dude, and lots of people don't understand. like like you don't need like I don't know why I feel like my system is perfect, right? Obviously, but um like i I could get you in the backcountry with like five pieces. That's it. I'm going to overthink it, man. And you know, with all this so much stuff, listeners, your listeners that you buy, it you never wear again. Like you just don't use it. Like you're going to find like, I got a bin full of clothing in my basement right now. You just keep it simple. Like go as simple as you can with it. And then, you know, it's just, you don't need to have all this different stuff, all this different. It's, I don't want to say it's a gimmick. It's not a gimmick. People make gear.
00:59:11
Speaker
but a simple kit, you'll be happy with it. Yeah, a thousand percent. So we do we've got we've got some products coming. I just don't know how much I'm allowed to talk about them. so All right. Well, we'll do that. All right, dude, we always wrap up with a hunting story. I heard you like might have shot a goat this year. Want to tell some stories? Want to tell us to give us a hunting story? Yeah. what
Mike's Mountain Goat Hunt Adventure
00:59:31
Speaker
What do you want to know about the goat hunt? It was treacherous. Just give us to go give us the campfire story of this goat, dude. Well, no shit. There I was. I was actually turkey hunting last year and I got an email. I was turkey hunting in Nebraska and I got an email from Colorado Parks and Wildlife.
00:59:49
Speaker
that I drew a mountain goat tag, which I about shit my pants because I only had five points for goat. Oh, no way. Yeah. In Colorado, you have to have three points. You have to have three weighted points before you're eligible to even draw a tag. And then as those weighted points, every point after that is weight. I think it's three preference points every point after that's a weighted point. I said that a little backwards.
01:00:17
Speaker
um So so i I was pretty shocked. I literally went through the Parks and Wildlife brochure and just put in for the unit that had the most points, which happened to be the Maroon Bells. And I've been in the Maroon Bells a time or two, but nothing nothing crazy. so Getting up there, after that hunt's over and and in that hunt, I was like, I fully understand why they call this the deadly bells. like Everything was steep, everything was high, everything. It was it was an adventure hunt. so We took horses in, it took us 10 days to find and and finally kill a goat.
01:00:56
Speaker
um We went into an area that just didn't have a ton of goats in it, but that is where Aaron had seen like the biggest goat he's ever seen in Colorado. So we went back to that spot and just didn't find anything, spent five days back there, got packed out by the horses, got packed into a new area by the horses after doing a little research and talking to some former tag holders. And then again, just weren't finding goats. And then finally, finally found goats.
01:01:22
Speaker
and found what we thought was a, was a Billy, like not a sub mature Billy, but he he was, a he was a mature Billy, but on the young side. And then by the time we, we'd killed it, it ended up being a, it was an old dry nanny. So she had broken off on one side, like broken part of her tip off on one side. So it was worked out. I wanted to kill a Billy, but after, after 10 days of getting my ass kicked, I was super stoked to take like a,
01:01:50
Speaker
a good animal off the landscape. one I mean, they're all spikes, dude. Yeah, they are asked by all spikes there spikes. Some of their spikes are thicker and longer than others, but dude, that hunt was like there there was a number of times. I jumped out of airplanes in the military. I've been shot at. I've done a lot of things that I even told Aaron. I was like, I don't think I've been this afraid for my life since Afghanistan, like circa 2012.
01:02:19
Speaker
i like I don't know if I'm a pussy or what, but did the steepness and like the terrain scared the shit out of me. I'll do one misstep and you're done. and You're just going for a ride, dude. Done. ah Camera guy almost killed me. We climbed down this this rock slide. We climbed up it and I was climbing up it on all fours, like finding handholds to get up it. and Aaron's like i was like, well, we could go down this side and walk around and Aaron's like, look He's like, in these mountains, I'm going to stick with the devil I know, which is, I just came up that. I know what that is. I don't know what cliffs are over that way. I don't know what's flood over that way. Because I was just looking at the contour lines on the map, trying to find the least deep spot, which there's no such thing in the maroon bells. So we ended up going down it. And we were going down one at a time. The camera guy thought I was at the bottom. I was only about halfway down. So he started going down. No way. Boulder, the size of the stop sign.
01:03:18
Speaker
And so I didn't, I didn't even hear it or see it cause I'm like trying not to die. Just walking down the thing in there and it's like, Mike, run. And I look up and I see rocks coming. I'm like, oh shit. So I ran down it. I don't know how I didn't break a leg, but.
01:03:32
Speaker
I made it down to the bottom and then up the other side of a rock slide. So none of the rocks would hit me. And then a boulder. I ate shit on the way down, like lost my footing and my my feet slid out from under me and about the same spot where I ate shit on the way down. Um, when I got up the other side is where that stop sign size boulder stopped. So maroon cells definitely. And.
01:03:57
Speaker
Aaron told me before I went in there, he's like, I sent a guy in there to kill a mountain goat and he died. He died packing his goat off the mountain. And then I ran into a guy while I was elk hunting who had that same tag a few years before he fell off a cliff and dislocated his shoulder. And I'm like, holy cow, this unit is chewing hunters up. He had to hit the beacon on his in reach. But we got it done. We got out of there pretty safe.
01:04:23
Speaker
It all worked out. The Marmot ate my mountain goat cape, so I'm probably just going to Euro mount it. You filmed a lot? We did. Yeah, we did. I think Bagar is going to produce some stuff around it. Bagar rifles, so we'll we'll see what comes of it. I don't know if there's going to be a film coming out about it or not.
01:04:48
Speaker
Okay, so that's not a – it wasn't a more primitive hunt than it was a kafaru hunt and then you know like Aaron parted ways with those guys, so I don't think they're going to – they weren't going to publish a video with with him and I in it. So I think he just – they passed it off to Bagara, so Bagara's going to do some some editing and and put something together. Yep. Are you shooting Bagara rifles? Yeah. Oh, yeah. Okay.
01:05:16
Speaker
What account were you shooting? 6.5 PR, honestly, I've got a 7 PRC that I just haven't sighted in, but 6.5 PRC, it's it's been a, it's been, it's the MG micro light and it's been an absolute hammer this year. I killed my belt goat with it.
01:05:35
Speaker
My girlfriend killed her first bull with it at 540, made two freaking awesome shots. um And then when we went down to Arizona, my buddy shot, he killed his bull, which is a good bull. It's like a 320 bull. He killed his bull at 580 with it. Because before I left for Arizona, I was like himming and honking. Because I was like, man, these are going to be longer shots. I don't know if 6.5 PRC quite has the ass to get it done.
01:06:00
Speaker
All right, my roommate, he was a sniper in the special forces world. And I was like, my overthinking this. He was like, yeah, dude, just go put bullets in elk. I was like, okay. So my buddy killed his bull with it at 880 yards.
Young Hunter's Elk Hunt Success
01:06:16
Speaker
Took him three rounds, but I mean, put him down. And then we actually ended up running into Ryan Bader out there and I just hadn't seen I hadn't seen any elk I wanted to kill. i was um i was holding I was fully prepared to eat that tag because I've already got two bulls in my freezer. yeah I didn't want to kill an elk, just a notch of tag. so I was looking for some 340 or bigger and we just hadn't found anything that that caliber, but we found a great, probably like a 315 bull.
01:06:47
Speaker
um So we took Ryan Bader's 12-year-old kid and and hiked him out to this terrible spot. Probably shouldn't have taken a 12-year-old there to kill an elk, but we did. And everyone survived, so it's awesome.
01:06:58
Speaker
hu looking back at it, like getting, we were getting clipped out. It was, it was just as dangerous as my mountain goat hunt. That's where they live, dude. Like those late season bulls, like that's where they live, man. They go into the nasty and they stay there. I love it. so But his kid killed his, but we put three rounds in that bowl. He would have died after the first round, but I was like, he's still... Typically how it is, if they die on their feet, there's so much blood on those things, man. like i've shot My kid shot a cow last year, dumped it, dude, 300 yards, 308, 168, big, big bullet, dumps it, laying there. Also, the thing stands back up, shoots it again and dumps it again because they just like...
01:07:46
Speaker
Some animals just have a will to survive. It's not necessarily just because it's an elk. It's just some animals are just tougher than other animals. They just don't want to die. My kid hammered that deer this year and a thing just took a step forward and stood there. It was dead on its feet, man. Perfect shot. Shot it again and dumped it. All the time, just take two. With elk, just freaking shoot them, shoot them, shoot them. I don't care.
01:08:12
Speaker
What's the first one's in it? I don't care where you're hitting it, just keep shooting that L, get bullets in it until something's on the ground, because they can move. Yeah, they can. And that's what that's what I was worried about. I hit it, and they're like, oh, yeah, he's going down. I was like, rack another round, put another bullet in him, and he put another one in him. And then the third round, he next shot it, and just dropped it. You can't overkill him. No, you can't. so But it was awesome. It was cool to see a 12-year-old kid kill.
01:08:40
Speaker
big bull, like that's other than my one archery bull, that bull's bigger than all the other bulls I've killed in my bow. so So, yeah.
Where to Find Born Primitive Gear
01:08:50
Speaker
Cool, dude. So, where where we find you guys, how do we, how do we buy your gear? Are you guys in stores? You guys only on the internet? what are we going to We are in shields. So, if you want to go touch, feel, and try our stuff on, I know the outdoor line is in the Meridian, Idaho and the Colorado Springs, Colorado shields.
01:09:05
Speaker
ah But you can direct a consumer, buy online born primitive outdoor.com. And then you can, we have a free exchange program. So if if stuff doesn't fit, we can send it back to us. We'll get you to the next size. So we're our customer services. ah that That would be the other thing I would would touch on is our customer service team absolutely kills it. So um if you don't like what you bought, hit up customer service. They'll help get you taken care of.
Upcoming Events and Online Classes
01:09:36
Speaker
and You guys would be, I'm assuming you'll be at sheep show. You'll be at Western hunt. You'll be at. We're only going to be a Western hunt this year. Sheep shows on the list for next year, but Western hunt was all we, we just, there's so much going on all the time. That's just how we make it to the show. So we'll be a Western hunt this year. Um, and then I would just, I would urge everyone to keep an eye out for those classes that we're going to start dropping that should, should start.
01:10:02
Speaker
some marketing stuff should come out around it in the next probably 90 days or so. and Then on top of those classes, we're going to do in-person classes, but for people that can't travel, ah can't afford the the fee to to come to the courses like the actual in-person courses, we are going to run like a Patreon-esque online university as well. So all the same stuff we're teaching, you just don't get as much of the hands-on practical work with with an instructor right there helping you.
01:10:32
Speaker
Gotcha. That sounds
Promotion and Social Media Follow-Up
01:10:33
Speaker
awesome, man. I'm kind of interested. Be fun. Yeah. We'll have to get you out to some. So go ah go check out Born Primitive, you guys. I'm going to be running some of their stuff this year. They're making good stuff, and they've got you know some of the best guys in the industry behind it. So definitely interested in it. Thanks, Mike. That was awesome. Yeah, brother. Thank you.
01:10:51
Speaker
Thank you for listening to the Tricer Podcast. Do us a favor and like and subscribe on whatever platform you are listening on.
Closing Remarks and Call to Action
01:10:57
Speaker
Give us a follow on Instagram and Facebook at TricerUSA and go and check out all of our innovative gear at www.tricerusa.com. Until next time, shoot straight, have fun, and always put God first.