Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
Season 3, Episode 7 - Madison McConnell
105 Plays2 years ago
One of the most energetic and beloved teachers in CCSD, Madison McConnell enters the podcast to discuss many thoughts about the job. She has the "perspective" of having been a specialist and is now in 5th grade, and has also spent time at lower SES schools which enhanced her view of the job. She is full of fun and it is a great discussion about what it is like being a teacher in today's world.
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction to Madison McConnell
00:00:10
Speaker
Madison McConnell, how are you? Great. Thank you so much for having me. I'm very excited. You said you're nervous. You're not excited.
00:00:21
Speaker
I'm both. I can be both. You definitely can. So thank you for joining me. I appreciate it.
Learning Journey and Data Utilization
00:00:28
Speaker
And and I know that you are your time is valuable because you have so many things you're learning this year. But I yeah. So would you like to talk about those? What? Let's just go into that. What?
00:00:41
Speaker
What do you think, what have you learned this year that you think is useful because you are a great teacher and especially in math, you're fantastic in math. But what, what do you feel like you have started using this year that's been good or is there anything yet? Um, so far, well, I've learned a lot about myself, which is very interesting. I am a
00:01:08
Speaker
you know, I'm a data focused person. And so I really enjoy using the data to help the kids grow, which I think is what I know we'll talk about this, but what helped but what I struggled with last year was I wasn't get or there was a lot of data, like almost overwhelming. And so I really couldn't hit the things I wanted to hit because there was just such a range of
00:01:33
Speaker
kids, there was 500 something kids, I couldn't hit all of them and get what they needed. But I really enjoy finding those little pieces that the kids want to work on and that the gaps so I can fill them and they're more successful moving forward. So I'm really happy that that's happening this year because I do have such a range in my class. And I'm excited to kind of fill in those gaps and plug in the holes and all of that.
00:01:57
Speaker
Yeah, you're great
Transition to Fifth Grade
00:01:58
Speaker
at that. So for the listeners, Maddie is in fifth grade. I convinced her to teach fifth grade this year. I don't know if I convinced you as much, but why? I was the one who was gonna say no. Okay. Shockingly enough. Yeah. Because they terrified me last year. Well, I really thought it would be Dakota.
00:02:17
Speaker
Yeah, she was on it. Yeah, she was. She was. But what entreats you about fifth? How did I convince you to teach fifth? Tell me because I might need to convince other people someday. For real. I please.
00:02:29
Speaker
I have always enjoyed upper elementary, which is kind of interesting. A student taught in kindergarten and I was like, yes, this is my place. I want to be a kindergarten teacher so bad. And so after I finished student teaching right before we went into my first year, I was like a substitute teacher at a preschool.
00:02:52
Speaker
And that was wild. Bless preschool teachers because that is a different jungle that I am not equipped with or for. And so I thought,
STEM Specialist Challenges
00:03:03
Speaker
okay, kindergarten's where I'm at. But at the school I was at at the time, there wasn't enough kindergartners coming in for me to take on a position. But there was a surplus of third graders. So I ended up being a third grade teacher being placed there in October, which was interesting. Finding out.
00:03:20
Speaker
It was very interesting. But it was really fun. I loved that first group. It was such a learning experience. And I was like, oh, third grade's where I'm at. I'm going to retire in third grade. That's the best. And then you get the itch. You need to change something. Something needs to happen. I'm too comfortable. I'm not learning. I'm not growing. And so then I decided to do STEM for a year, which
00:03:45
Speaker
was very much fun, but very overwhelming and more difficult than I could have ever assumed it would be. And I graciously asked, and then you graciously accepted that I'd be back third, right? And then we needed fifth grade teachers. So here I am, repping the team. Yeah. And thank you. You really, you all saved me. I think you saved me. Yes. Wow.
00:04:11
Speaker
We can look at it that way. What was so hard about being a specialist for you? Like when Ally was on here, Ally is music. Music is life. And when Sarah left, you were like, I want to teach them. You were right there. Like you came in and closed the door. I want this job.
00:04:29
Speaker
Well, and then you told me like about September, you're like, I don't like this. So tell us why. There might be some people that want to be specialists out there hinging on what you say right now. Well, let me be the bearer of some news. You can take it how you want. But I have to commend all specialists. I, as an outsider, you don't realize how
00:04:57
Speaker
much work it actually is and how much management you really need. You need to have such a strong sense of like classroom management because you have so many different personalities coming in and out of your class all day, especially with STEM as well. Like specifically,
Comparing Grade Levels
00:05:15
Speaker
there's so much prepping. There's so much creativity that goes into it. It kind of drains
00:05:21
Speaker
your brain and then planning these really fun activities and then having a kid come in and I mean everybody has their bad days and just have a bad day. It throws everything off and then you took all this time to plan and but they are true heroes. I like kind of like special ed teachers. They're angels on earth. It's not for me but I found that out which is excellent.
00:05:48
Speaker
Well, yeah, it's like last year, our fifth graders were interesting. So I didn't know based upon the I think the thing that saved me was the fact that you taught you taught this year's fifth graders in third grade. So you knew that you had a decent group coming up. Which one would you choose? Would you choose third or fifth? Um, that's such a tricky question.
00:06:13
Speaker
because I truly enjoy the level of conversation that fifth graders can have. We're getting into class discussions right now and I just kind of let them talk it out and it's incredible. They have such insight and they're much more in tune with reality or they're like humans. They have a sense of outside of the school or the house and I think that's really interesting and the perspectives that they can bring in that way.
00:06:41
Speaker
But third grade has my heart. There's just such pros and cons to both. Third grade material I'm obsessed with or like content because it's the foundation for what they're going to learn for the rest of their lives, which I personally really enjoy. And it's such a switch from that second grade brain to the third grade brain.
00:07:02
Speaker
from learning to read to reading to learn. And all those fun switches are really cool to see happen in kids. And those light bulb moments are more on it. For fifth grade, it's like, no, you need to know this because in algebra, I have to set them up for middle school and high school because this is the foundation that they're going to be using
00:07:25
Speaker
forever. Like this is my it's so funny because some of the kids math I'm like still can't understand. So I'm still learning. But I will sometimes text pictures to my husband who's an accountant. Hey, what the heck does standard deviation mean? So it's stuff like that. That's just kind of funny. But I'm also like it because it's a challenge. And I'm learning so much and growing so much. So I'm really appreciative of that. So I think I know the answer. But what's your favorite thing to teach him? Why?
00:07:55
Speaker
I really like my ass.
00:07:57
Speaker
I don't know why though, because you are you are great and you're humble, but you're great at math. So it's gonna be a tough call this year, because the math of fifth grade, fifth grade, when I was in fifth grade, that was the year that my fifth grade teacher actually suggested that I go to a tutor, she's like, you're gonna need to do this. And so it's kind of funny coming back into and being like, Oh, yeah, I remember doing this with my tutor. And so it's kind of funny in that sense. But
Teaching Passion and Pathway
00:08:26
Speaker
In third grade math, the routines are there. It's so structured.
00:08:32
Speaker
There's not a lot of free, free time. I don't mean to cut you off, but that's a lot of your strength, though. You said the routines are there and it's structured, but you also have an ability to structure routines and make them part of your day. And I think that's definitely just due to your personality and how you are. You're fun and you're upbeat, but you have to give yourself some credit sometime, Maddie. Thank you. I appreciate it. Yeah.
00:09:01
Speaker
But yeah, the math is going to be interesting this year. When did you know you want to be a teacher?
00:09:09
Speaker
Actually, I didn't know until college when you had to pick what you wanted to be. And I was like, mm, summer's off. That's terrible. That's a terrible thing to say, but it's true. That's what drew me in. I was like, oh, you know, summer's off would be pretty cool. And I was a dance teacher at the time. I'd been a dance teacher for seven years. So I had already had experience working with kids. I was like, oh, kids are so fun. They're funny. I can't imagine myself sitting at a desk all day just typing my life away or
00:09:39
Speaker
I'm speaking in front of crowds of adults who don't care what I have to say. So I'm like, oh, I'll make kids, I'll make them care what I have to say. And so I was in, it was the summer before college and I was like, you know what, I'll just do this. If I don't like it, I can always find something else to do. And I actually wanted to be a science, high school science teacher, which is what I originally went into. And then organic, organic chemistry,
00:10:09
Speaker
snapped me right in the face back to reality. And I said, oh, elementary sounds really good. I'll go there. So that's how that happened. Cool.
Broader Teaching Perspectives
00:10:19
Speaker
When you were a STEM teacher last year, we had a talk. I don't know if you remember this or not. I'm sure you do. But you got a more global perspective of school. And I think we had the talk that they can't all be like you. When you think back to that now, what do you think about?
00:10:39
Speaker
Um, it really did open my eyes to a lot of things, you know, as being enclosed in your little classroom, you only see yourself and maybe your teammates and maybe the people down the hall. You don't really get to see what else is going on. And you kind of assume that everybody's doing it the same way you are.
00:10:59
Speaker
because in your mind, you're like, this is the best way to do it. Like, why wouldn't you do it this way? At least that's what happens in my mind. I'm like, this is the easiest. It's every teacher's mind. This is the best way to do it. Why aren't they doing it my way? Exactly. And so it kind of, that's one thing I really appreciate appreciated about the STEM position was I could look at what other people were doing and say, Oh, I really like that bit. Or, Oh, I don't know if that's my style. Um, I'm going to kind of stay away from that. And then I also had to catch myself being like,
00:11:29
Speaker
It's okay if they don't do it the way I want them to do it. I just have to have them code switch in my class once you enter. This is the standard. This is how we do things. But it's also very interesting to see the way that people do things. And it's kind of odd. You just want to look at them and be like, what makes you think this is a good idea? Sometimes I'm like, why would you do that?
00:11:59
Speaker
But I think it works for them. It works for them. But does it? Yeah, it's it's hard because I was talking to Shauna, who's the AP, and I was telling her we're talking. We've been talking about we actually got to talk today, which is great. And it's such a challenge because we believe I think when we're when we're first starting out and I think I've adjusted over the years, but
00:12:27
Speaker
Even maybe not, you believe that the way you taught, or some of the things that you did are the best way. But not everybody can be like Madison or Dakota or whoever. And so you have to do the best your way. But the hard part for people such as yourself is to think, well,
00:12:48
Speaker
Why would they ever do it that way? But honestly, I mean, you know people. They don't have your energy or your routines or your structures or do things your way. So it's just a whole different world. Teachers are just a different thing. One thing that really opened my eyes was the use of small groups. I am a small group junkie. Like if I could do the whole day in small groups, I absolutely would. And I think I'm going to. Loki, there's a switch coming up.
00:13:18
Speaker
I trust you. But when I heard that some people don't do it at all. It's amazing, isn't it? It just really does blow my mind because I'm like, how do you how do you know, first of all, how do you know where your kids are at? How do you know specifically how to help them? And how do you know how they're going to progress? Like, what's the next step? So it's very interesting that that was something that was like, wait a minute, people don't do small groups. How how
Teaching in Low SES Schools
00:13:46
Speaker
is that possible?
00:13:47
Speaker
So yeah, that's one of the challenges is getting well, it makes me think like, okay, so who taught you to do things your way? Oh, that's a really good question. You know, my first school, I got to give a lot of credit to the team I was on my very first team ever.
00:14:04
Speaker
They were some strong headed ladies and they didn't back down for anything and their way was the way they were going to do it. And they taught me how to stand up from what I think and what I need in my classroom. And they were the ones who were like, no, we're doing small groups.
00:14:22
Speaker
They had we had an IE block, like it was very structured, very scheduled. And they were very vigilant in watching me as a new teacher and making sure that I was pulling small groups or I had an instructional coach come in and being like, this is how you would take your data, split it up.
00:14:39
Speaker
make your groups in that sense. And I thought that was really cool. And so I've done it that way ever since, but it's kind of interesting because not everybody has the strong cohesive group and they don't have a strong coach to come in and be like, this is how you take your data and you split it up. This is how you make your groups. And they don't have that kind of mentorship, which I was very fortunate to have in my first team. And so I think that's really where that stemmed from.
00:15:08
Speaker
Your team did a great job. They were, they're awesome and they're still crazy. Like they're at the, the schools you showed for the data last year.
00:15:17
Speaker
They were they're at Stevens. So and they're fifth grade teachers. I know they're crushing it over there. Yeah. Well, I think that's what, you know, we try to one of my I mean, so people know I was sitting at Panda Express and we needed four fifth grade teachers. What am I going to do? Nobody's applying. No one's going to apply. And that's when like the light bulb went off because for better or worse, we we try to put people who we know can grow kids in.
00:15:47
Speaker
in fourth and fifth, honestly. So it doesn't surprise me that those teachers are there. When you talk about your previous school, they had some challenges that are different than ours. I actually started at your previous school in 1999, many years ago. It's just different. So what are some challenges that you faced there that you don't necessarily face at Thompson?
00:16:11
Speaker
Well, my very first school was Lake Elementary. That's right. I forgot about that. I was. Yeah, I forgot about
Current School Challenges
00:16:17
Speaker
that one. You even take Lake like that's still way different than Thompson. Yeah, no way different. I honestly, in my personal opinion, if I was a superintendent, I would make
00:16:30
Speaker
Every single new teacher at least three years work at a low SES school because I learned so much, so much about management, about parent communication or noncommunication, about teaching the ranges because you do have such a range and behaviors. You have, I would say personally about elevated behaviors and just things like that.
00:16:59
Speaker
It was so beneficial to have my first three years because now I'm like, Oh my gosh, you're, you're rolling your eyes at me. Please leave. I'm not worried about that. But the kid that I had who was running around my classroom trying to stab me with scissors, that's a different story. You know, so you have like those extreme kind of instances versus what you see now or what I personally see now. It's like night and day. I'm like, whatever. I can handle that. Anything that's thrown my way.
00:17:26
Speaker
But it is very different. The parent involvement is much lower if they speak English at all, which is I've learned Spanish to try to communicate with them or I'm still currently trying to learn. And then the kids
00:17:43
Speaker
just have a different perspective. They don't really see academics as front, front runner in their lives. They see survival as front runner in their lives. And I can't blame them for that. Like even my husband sometimes he will joke and he'll say, Oh, we used to buy food for the kids in
00:18:01
Speaker
your old schools and now we're just buying pencils, we can do that, stuff like that. It's definitely different. It's just a different need. You still have to grow them, but it's like Maslow's hierarchy. Michelle Stanley, who was our school last year, she just believed, I got to feed these babies first. I got to feed them. It's just not the same.
00:18:28
Speaker
same demographics, but they still are kids and they still need to have that care. What challenges
Importance of Student Relationships
00:18:36
Speaker
do you face at our school? It's not much, which is kind of interesting. I would say that the challenge at our school is finding things that are relevant, which I mean, I think it's almost a challenge at any school, but finding things that are relevant to the kids in your classroom. So like, why would I talk about soccer if they're really into
00:18:57
Speaker
lacrosse, I don't know, like, yeah, finding those kinds of things. And then the parents are much more on it. So you have to make sure grades are updated. And at a timely manner, you have to make sure you're communicating with them or else they're, you know, gonna not know what their child needs help with. And how are they going to do that? So that's the parents are one giant thing. And honestly, I will take our Thompson parents over any other parents that I've ever taught. No offense. Sorry about that. But they just
00:19:25
Speaker
love the communication and I love having them on my team. So I want to communicate with them as much as I can and give them all the information, kind of overload them with information and then take what they want. Yeah, but you have to do again, you have to take some credit though, you love them because they love you because of what you do. You know, if you're not communicating with them, then they're communicating with me. And so I guess thank you.
00:19:50
Speaker
You said something in a book study once that changed our whole trajectory. We're in a book study and you said, it's amazing, but I can still hear what you said. I just wish everybody knew that relationships matter more than anything. It's true. Explain that. Oh my gosh. It goes down to behaviors.
00:20:18
Speaker
that mainly this is not even, but it starts there. So if you know a child inside and out, you know what their next move is going to be. You know
00:20:29
Speaker
what's their favorite color is. You ask them questions about their football game last weekend. And when is their next one? And how are they practicing? Just asking them questions. They know you care. And when kids know you care, they're going to go to the moon and back for you because you're going to the moon and back for them. And that's how they feel. And so if a child, if you know a child is going to like their triggers,
00:20:57
Speaker
then you can stop it before it even begins. A lot of kids just need a positive adult in their life, and they just want somebody to believe in them. And if you can be that person by asking simple questions like, oh, what do you eat for breakfast? Oh, what's your dog's name? Oh, you have a pet lizard? That's awesome. So does blah, blah, blah. Just connecting them in that sense, it's going to change your world.
00:21:23
Speaker
at work because they know you care and that's the bottom line. What's that Rita Pearson quote? She says kids just need a champion or kids don't learn from people they don't like.
00:21:32
Speaker
She does kind of a little bit of both. There's two different ones. But ultimately, the one that catches me usually is that kids don't want to learn from someone they don't like. Yeah, and it's so true. If you're not giving them the time of day, they're not going to give you the time of day. And so that's basically what it comes down to. Yeah, so true. With the
Celebrating Teaching Successes
00:21:49
Speaker
more difficult kids in school, I know them better. But then I also know more about them. And sometimes it works. Sometimes it doesn't. But you have to know people. And I think, too, like,
00:22:03
Speaker
I don't understand why many people don't understand that relationships really are the most important thing. And like I saw you in the hallway day, I'm like, Hey, how are you? This is the first time I've been upstairs all week. What's going on up here? Is everything good? And you're like, Yeah, and it's not the conversation I want to have. But I still was like, Okay, are you good?
00:22:28
Speaker
And I don't know why people don't understand that. It's just, it's just a weird phenomenon to me. I don't know why. Or having trust and knowing that with that relationship, if there was an issue or if there was something that would arise or came up, I would reach out and say, Oh no, I need your help with this, this, and this. Like when my AC, the AC. Yeah, that's true.
00:22:52
Speaker
Yeah, I was in the in the middle of something, but I found someone else to go get get with the key to go get the other teacher. Yeah, that's a mess. It was it was awesome. And it's worked ever since knock on wood. So yeah, well, it'll be out tomorrow morning. No, no. Oops. Where do you see yourself going? You're not going to teach fifth grade forever. Oh, this question. So we did that purpose this at the beginning of the year. And this question.
00:23:22
Speaker
the one where it's, what's your future look like? And I left my blank because I currently don't have a trajectory. When I came to Thompson, I was gung ho. I was like,
00:23:33
Speaker
I'm going to be a strategist. That's what I want to do. I want to be a strategist. I want to be specifically a math strategist. And I want to do this, this, and this. I had big plans. And then I became a STEM teacher and got a much more broad view of everything else going on. And I realized quickly that I don't think I have the type of personality that would work well. Well, maybe. But why not, though?
00:24:03
Speaker
Um, uh, it goes back to like, why don't you just do this? Why, why wouldn't you just try this? So I've seen you like, eventually you're kind of like me where eventually you're just the volcano. It's just going to come out. It's just to come out and I apologize. But here we go. We're jumping into this. Yeah.
00:24:22
Speaker
Why? Why aren't you doing this? And I think that's really what it came down to was I started getting frustrated at people not doing things effectively. And I said, Oh, yep, can't do that because I will get upset and not make friends and people need to like a strategist and want to go to them. I think that's something that I'm working on.
00:24:43
Speaker
currently as well, being more approachable. Well, I mean, you're approachable if it's the right thing. I don't want people don't give people the impression that they can't walk in your room and ask you a question. Oh, yeah, you can always come in but
00:24:57
Speaker
Maybe not me giving advice in that sense where I have to seek you out, like come to me and we'll talk. But I have to go seek you out. I don't know how well that's going to... Yeah. But you made me think like maybe... So I've talked a lot about how educators don't share
00:25:14
Speaker
in a lot of ways, and maybe it's just a personality thing. I think a lot might be okay with you coming into my room, but I'm not gonna go, you know, like Angie Brown, she's gonna go check on everybody. That's who she is. And Maddie's doing great, but Maddie's just gonna stay in her bubble in her room and dominate. And maybe it's a personality thing as to why teachers don't go be out there more. Maybe, maybe. I feel like
00:25:41
Speaker
Um, it could be an intimidation thing too. But yeah, I think it's a mix of both. I mean, at my old school, not not before, but at Lake, if you did anything outside of the box, really, it was kind of judged. And I think that's pretty much across the board at every school, there's always some some judgers and people who will sneer at the things you're trying. And that's intimidating. And that just makes you want to kind of close your doors and be like, you know what, I'm going to do what I'm going to do in here.
00:26:10
Speaker
whatever you think out there, you can think out there, but I know what I'm doing is best for my class. And I think that is really carrying over into even like our environment at Thompson, it's a very open community. However, there's still those reservations from previous, it's like, it's like PTSD, reservations from people sneering and snickering at what you're doing. And
00:26:32
Speaker
instead of sharing that wealth with everybody, it's kind of like, well, are they really going to understand what I'm doing? Or are they going to laugh or talk behind my back about what we're going to do? Even though it might not be the case, it's still that like interfere where I don't know, I don't want to be judged. I just want to do what I want to do and make it best for me kind of situation. It's just one of my things I
Career Reflections and Leadership
00:26:54
Speaker
struggle with so much is
00:26:55
Speaker
When someone's doing something great, why can't we just celebrate and just say, great job, Maddie. That's amazing. I just don't get it. But some teachers, not so much at Thompson anymore, but some teachers are just like, oh, look at her doing that again.
00:27:11
Speaker
Why? If Maddie dominates, it helps all of us. It's just a struggle for me. I don't understand. Using tide lifts all ships. Yes, don't be the seesaw. Be the elevator. On a seesaw, you push yourself up by putting someone else down. I don't understand that at all. Your canvas is blank, so you're just going to roll till you're tired of fifth grade or till I'm like, hey, what do you think about this?
00:27:37
Speaker
Pretty much. I'm rolling with the flow. Going with the flow at this point. We'll see what's going to happen. I'm pretty comfy where I'm at. I don't want to move rooms ever again. I don't want to.
00:27:49
Speaker
Yeah, I mean moving three times and two times in two years, I guess. Well, this year teaching and I've moved seven times. Well, yeah, no, they're staying fifth, please. I beg you. I beg you. Don't make me move. I know. I know when there's a good thing. So you said, so you had, I just from your answer, you have no desire to ever be an admin at all. Um, I've thought about it and no, I don't.
00:28:18
Speaker
But so what I found with most teachers is the reason they like most teachers like you are leaders and great at what you do. They don't want to deal with adults, and that's why they don't want to go into Advent. Is that the same?
00:28:32
Speaker
Oh yeah, 100%. It's, it's the, I mean, I'm thinking fifth grade is the highest we go. So that's the oldest type of kid I've ever interacted with in a school. And so I'm thinking, okay, if these kids can, we'll talk back and be sassy. Can you imagine?
00:28:50
Speaker
an adult you're trying to tell them how to make things better and they come at you like no that's not what i'm gonna do what what do you say to that like oh okay like all right sounds good as as you know it's it's a good time to be in a in a in a interesting conversation and it's it's so hard though because
00:29:10
Speaker
when you're like me to really direct people who are really just firm and I am the boss and this is the way it is you know that's just different I'm just not I'm just trying to get kumbaya like why can't we just get along I don't understand this I don't get it but I think like that's why you know you and so many leaders at Thompson don't want to go into admin as they don't want to deal with adults mm-hmm we see what you got to go through
00:29:38
Speaker
You could
Improving Education
00:29:39
Speaker
do it though, you'd be great. If you were governor, what would you change about education? What would you change? This is a good one. I'm sure you got some opinions. It's one giant flaw that I see in CCSD, specifically because this is the only district I've ever worked in, is that they will tell the teachers to differentiate for their students, right?
00:30:08
Speaker
They will tell them that, oh, if Bob needs this, then you need to give them this. Or if J and then J needs this, you need to give them this. But when it comes to what they give us, it's a one size fits all. And that kind of irritates me because it's almost like you're punishing the good because of the bad.
00:30:28
Speaker
And so with all of these new programs, lovely, lovely programs that are our most favorite thing in the whole wide world are coming in thrown at us. They are saying you have to do this, but what about those teachers who are getting the results, who are doing the things that need to be done without a program? You're kind of blanketing, putting the blanket on the fire of their passion and their, their want to do this. And so when you strip that away, then that's why all of these teachers are leaving. So that's one thing that I would do is,
00:30:58
Speaker
Is make sure that there is a better evaluation system for teachers and It actually it's kind of like the kids it actually comes down to the data the points like what are you getting? Or how are you doing this? What's the growth and then from there? Just distribute what needs to be distributed in that sense So that's what if I were a governor that would be my first here superintendent
00:31:27
Speaker
I don't know if
Teacher Voices in Decision-Making
00:31:28
Speaker
that's OK. I mean, before you get to your next one, because you just look like you have a next one. I agree with you. One of my frustrations is when I go to a meeting and they say everybody is going to write, write teacher clarity and other stuff on the board. Everybody's got to do this. It doesn't matter who. I get so angry at that because I my.
00:31:54
Speaker
pet peeve is I don't like when people who've never been in a classroom on our campus tell us what to do in classrooms on campus. Yes, or in a classroom at all. Yeah, well, yeah, for a long time. Yeah, for a long time. Yeah. So I agree with you on that. But that it's just hard. But I think like, we have to as
00:32:17
Speaker
admin or leaders differentiate as much as possible for each person. And that's where it kind of goes back to what you're saying is everybody does things a different way. They do everything different way, but we don't want you to do it a different way. We want you to do it this way. Yes. And that's even though you might be Ben Stein and just go down or you can be Maddie who's all, you know, all going on.
00:32:42
Speaker
Now here's there. So I agree with you, but next keep going. Yeah. Um, another thing. Oh, shoot. I just had it and now it's gone, but I would do that differentiation. And then the, I look at the whole scale as like a business, a business model. So you have your, uh, CEO, which is the superintendent. You have your, um, VPs.
00:33:12
Speaker
Then you have your controllers and then you have, and we, the people who do the grunt work, the ground, the runners on the ground, the feet on the ground, we get the least amount of input. So I feel like we, if I were the governor, I would ask from the bottom up instead of the top down because the bottom up is what they know what they're talking about. These are the experts currently in the classroom and they know what is going on and what is needed. But again, it goes back to that,
00:33:42
Speaker
one bad apple spoils the bunch. So if there's
Rewarding Teacher Effectiveness
00:33:45
Speaker
one person who they go to, and they're like, Oh, this, this, this, it's not going to work in that effective sense. So something like that. Yeah, there's actually a model out there where I don't know, I don't think it's education, but where if hypothetically, Madison said, Hey, if we try this, it'll be great. And then we try and it works, then you get rewarded. Oh,
00:34:06
Speaker
So, you know, like if you said, hey, let's do X, Y, Z, and then we implement X, Y, Z. Next thing you know, Maddie gets a couple, you know, more K's on her check. That was the other thing I was going to say. I was going to say, I think this is going to, this is going to ruffle some feathers and I'm so sorry about it. But I think that people should be paid for their test scores. And I understand. Let me, let me base it out real quick. No, I love it. That's why we're here.
00:34:35
Speaker
I understand why that's such a controversial topic because yes, kids do have bad days. Yes, adults do have bad days and maybe that day they don't do their best, but why can't they redo it when they're having a good day? Anyways, but I think that that would be such a motivator for teachers to actually
00:34:53
Speaker
differentiate, actually get into the data, actually see where those holes are that their kids have, fill them in, make a strong foundation, set them up for success in the future. And then that way they're good all the way up. And then I want people, this is probably pretty selfish, but I want people in Gundersen for next year to be like, Oh my gosh, you were in McConnell's class. Awesome. I know you're going to be successful. So here's what we're going to do. And so things like that. And I think that if we're going to work hard and look for growth in that sense,
00:35:22
Speaker
then we need to be rewarded for that said growth, not just a, a four on an eval, even though it's appreciated, but we want, I mean, like, so you, you make a great, great point now. I mean, everybody that listens, which, you know, it's not going to be like, I mean, you have so many followers. It might be times, but I wonder how many of your followers are like, yeah, Maddie, or they're like, Oh no.
00:35:48
Speaker
No, I know I'm swimming on this one. I'm swimming by myself on this one. But maybe not as much, though. I wish we could somehow reward schools for growth. Yes. Because I don't like the current star system, which I'm going to get into next week. Because basically, the star system really helps out schools where kids come in reading.
00:36:15
Speaker
Yeah, not so much. There's no growth to I mean, there's growth, they call it growth, but it's apples to oranges, really. Anyway, I think if we that's why I've said this for years is to get the teachers at Thompson to think growth wise, because I really think someday it will go to that. Yeah, we won't have the s back side.
00:36:35
Speaker
But then you're going to have the how do you, you know, just some just some things for you to think about with your ideas. How do you how do you determine growth in PE in music and things like that? And then, well, I got all the high kids in fifth grade, I have to now teach sixth, seventh, eighth grade math. I don't know what that is. Well, I got all the low kids in fifth grade. Why can't they not see then again here I'm at here I am with
00:37:02
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, that's who you're like, why can't it be? That's one thing I love about you, like an idea. Well, yeah, we can do that. Even though it's like they might be crazy or you're like, nah, that's not going to happen. But I agree with you. There has to be some there's there's too much mediocrity that's that's being rewarded. Yes, exactly. I used to work with a teacher and it she would honestly just give PDFs like packets to her students.
00:37:31
Speaker
but she was getting paid the same that I was even though, or more honestly. Yeah. Because she might've been teaching longer than I was. And I'm putting in all this effort and trying to make it fun and engaging. How come she can get the same that I can get when I'm putting in all this effort and they're not doing anything. I mean, it just doesn't seem fair in that sense. My husband, he gets bonuses from his work.
00:37:56
Speaker
And so I was trying to think, okay, what would be a bonus system for teachers? Like, how could teachers get bonuses? And that would be a way to get bonuses. That's unobjective. That's, or it's very subjective. It's very like decisive. It has data numbers. Those are the things that are needed, in my opinion, to show these types of
00:38:19
Speaker
accept a growth this type of information that's needed to get dad or to get like your idea I like your base salary and then you know if your growth if your median growth percentiles above 80 you get XYZ but your problem is there's two problems as I see it one is if your median growth percentiles like below the 20th we can't take the money back
00:38:40
Speaker
Right, because you're actually based. Yeah, you're actually hurting kids. Another thing I think that people would fear, though, is, well, Maddie wants to buy a car, so I'm going to tell that kid that the answer is B. Right. See, so sad that that's what the world is, though. I agree. I agree. But hopefully there will. Yeah. I mean, what would you do for that? I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I mean, it's a great idea.
Future of Education Concerns
00:39:07
Speaker
So
00:39:09
Speaker
As a teacher, how do you feel about the contract and all this madness? It is, you know, honestly, I am not well versed in the contract world. I sign it every year just because I need a job. I'm like, yes, I will be here. This is what I enjoy doing. Yes, sure. Why not? So I really don't have an opinion about it currently. The more hype it gets, the more I'm kind of listening.
00:39:38
Speaker
I mean, more money would be awesome. I think that we do deserve that because I was looking at this chart a while ago and it showed the difference between a house in like 1980 versus now and then it showed a teacher salary in 1980 versus now and the house or the housing market has grown exponentially. And then the teacher salary has grown maybe $10,000, which is
00:40:04
Speaker
wild. How am I supposed to afford a $500,000 house on 50 grand a year? You know, it's just not going to be feasible any longer. And I mean, a lot of people are I personally saw that the new teachers coming in are making more than I am currently, which is wild. No offense. I mean, they deserve also money as well. But I mean, money because they went through student teaching
00:40:31
Speaker
Well, no, I heard they get grants this year. Student teachers got started getting paid last year, I believe. Oh, yeah. I'm really jealous about that. But now they're making more than me. What the heck? That's true. I guess if you look at it that way, you're absolutely right there. I mean, so I believe don't quote me on this. I guess I could ask tomorrow. I believe they got eight thousand dollars for student teaching. Yes. And at least Hannah said it was divvied out in like a monthly
00:41:00
Speaker
So they got a paycheck. Yeah, so I think that. That's just the state that we're in. I mean, there's there. I worry five years from now where we're going to be. I just do I don't. Yeah, I mean, I I don't worry so much about Thompson, but as a district in a state in a country, no, I told like an alley was like saying nobody's going to be a music teacher.
00:41:29
Speaker
No, and it's so sad that's so important. Those things are so important. Yeah, so like when we don't have teachers, what do we do? Well, now we have to pay student teachers because we don't want, you know, we can't have free labor, which I understand. But you know, like there's. Was that knowledge? Yes, yes. You know, I don't know, like the future of education scares me greatly. Yeah, and I don't understand what the thought process is of
00:41:59
Speaker
I mean, I guess I do. They're pulling new teachers in, but why not take care of the people who are, have been in the trenches for far longer.
00:42:09
Speaker
put in far more hours, they're just telling them, we don't care about you, go ahead and skedaddle on out and peace out. You don't matter as much as these new people coming in, which is- Yeah, I don't understand. I don't get why are we not taking care of the people who are taking care of the clients. I don't understand that. Right, exactly. Yeah, but I wish I knew. Yeah.
00:42:33
Speaker
Well, Madison, you are fantastic. You know, I appreciate you greatly. And I thank you for your evening. And I'm glad that you're enjoying fifth grade. Thank you. It's shocking. What was that? It's shocking. Now, you guys are still mad at me because you like fifth grade so much. Exactly. We're so mad at you. I remember that first day I was like, oh, I'm so mad at him because I actually like it. No, I can't like it. That's rude. We'll see if you like it when the hormones and the smellings kick in.
00:43:04
Speaker
They came in from recess the other day and were like, why does it smell like sweaty kids? I said, look around. What do you see? I see sweaty kids everywhere. What are you talking about? Yeah. Well, then we get into growth and development there and you'll. No, I'm not looking forward to that. Just from what was said last year, after growth and development, I'm terrified. Yeah. Well, just make Dakota do it. You'll be all right. Exactly.
00:43:32
Speaker
Well, I appreciate it. And in the end, just remember. It's all about perspective. Thanks, Maddie. Thank you.