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Season 3, Episode 13 - Andrea Roach
106 Plays2 years ago
Sharing her strengths as a 2nd grade teacher, Andrea Roach also discusses PBIS, behavior interventions, and her time as a self-contained teacher in Texas. It is an episode that goes in many places yet circles back to a thought about entitlement. She is an excellent teacher that parents adore, who strives to be #1, and never stops reflecting on how to get better. Enjoy!
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Transcript
Introduction of Andrea Roach
00:00:14
Speaker
Good afternoon and welcome back. My guest today has a slight part in my book. It's all about perspective, where I
00:00:23
Speaker
really get frustrated about the process of hiring people in Clark County. And she is really the first person that I ever really had problems getting into the school. I'll let her tell you the story because it's quite interesting. And then we'll see where it goes from there because Ms. Andrea Roach and I, we just never know what's gonna come out of our mouths when we're talking. So Andrea, thank you for being here. I appreciate your time. Well, thank you for having me. I appreciate it.
00:00:53
Speaker
So like, so a quick backstory. This is actually a crazy story. I met your sister at jury duty. She was the only normal person in there besides me. I found out that- That's what you two said. Yeah, yeah, so we, or maybe we weren't the normal ones. And then she said, my sister's a teacher and pretty much sent all of your info to me without even asking. And lo and behold, then you moved to Texas.
00:01:21
Speaker
And I kept saying, are you coming back? Are you coming back? Are you coming back? Because I needed teachers all the time. And finally, I don't have the need for a teacher. And you email me. And you said, I'm coming back. And so then magically, it worked out. But that's not the main part of the story.
Challenges with Licensing and Fingerprinting
00:01:39
Speaker
When you got hired to come and teach at my last school, you had just renewed your license in Nevada a year before, I believe.
00:01:48
Speaker
And when you got hired, in order to do that, you had to get fingerprinted. When you got hired back into CCSD, then you had to get fingerprinted again. And we had to wait the usual six to eight weeks for those to go through, even though you just got fingerprinted a year before.
00:02:08
Speaker
Can you just run through that a little bit and how frustrating that is as a teacher who's trying to get a job in Clark County?
Transition Back to Nevada
00:02:14
Speaker
Because even though that was what, like six years ago, it still happens today.
00:02:19
Speaker
Yeah, so to make a long story short, I was living in Texas at the time. My family, we moved there for my husband's work and I was teaching in Texas. My Nevada license was due to expire and I thought it would be a good idea to renew it because you just never know what's going to happen if I needed to come back. So I believe that was 2018.
00:02:45
Speaker
is when I renewed my Nevada license. Yes, that sounds right. Fast forward a year, we had to make an abrupt move back to Nevada. And I was so thankful that I had gotten my license renewed. I went through the whole process. I had my fingerprints done in Texas. And then I reached out to you and I'm like, hey, guess what? I'm officially coming back. And you didn't like have a position for me right away, but you made that work out.
00:03:14
Speaker
And then I had given you all my information. Everything was already cleared through the, you know, Nevada Department of Education. And when I finally got back to Nevada, I had to go through a fingerprint process again, which I don't understand because your fingerprints don't
Fingerprinting Frustrations
00:03:32
Speaker
change. That's why I wanted to start with this story because I've complained about this for years. I get frustrated. I'm rubbing my face right now. That's what happens when I get frustrated.
00:03:44
Speaker
If you're a criminal, you're already in jail, your fingerprints don't change. So why is it just for money? It's gotta be just for money. It's gotta be like a slush fund somehow. And who gets the money?
00:03:57
Speaker
Yeah. But yeah, like you had to jump through this hoop just to get back into the classroom, even though so the state said you were good, but the district needs the same
Stress of Moving and Starting New Job
00:04:05
Speaker
prince. I've talked about this for years, but it's just like part of the frustrate. I mean, there's so many things in Clark County, but why, why, why? Like from your standpoint, that has to be just frustrating.
00:04:17
Speaker
It was absolutely frustrating because I had to up and move within two weeks to get back. It was at the end of July. School started, what, second week of August? Yeah. So I was frantic trying to get myself, my family back from Texas and then get myself into a classroom when
Teaching Dynamics: Texas vs. Nevada
00:04:36
Speaker
the department held me up saying, it's in process. It's in process. Go back and do your
00:04:43
Speaker
your fingerprints again, which of course is more money and it takes time and it's just this huge headache. I was already licensed because I had already renewed a year before, so I don't understand why they made me go through that again. As you know, I missed the first whole week of orientation for new teachers, I say in a quote because the district didn't give me back my seniority, but that's a whole another issue.
00:05:12
Speaker
And so I had to literally just sit out and wait until I got the green light that I was fully certified and then I was moving in pretty much the weekend before school started.
00:05:25
Speaker
Yeah. So like, I mean, they just made it so stressful and I'm sure there's some kind of legal ease. I don't understand, but that's six years ago and that's been a problem for so long. I guess like one of my things is why aren't, well, we can get into politics. I don't know how that'll go. I don't know how your viewers are going to like that. I don't understand though. Yeah. Yeah. Well, you admitted it, but, um,
00:05:52
Speaker
I just frustrated. So all right, so let's let's just take let's just get away from that topic because we're frustrated with it. What's it? It all turned out okay. It did. In the classroom and it all worked itself out, but it just took forever. And you've been stuck with me ever since. Ever since. Or vice versa. Okay, so what's it like to work in Texas versus working in Las Vegas?
Special Education Insights
00:06:16
Speaker
Oh, that's a good question. So, you know, CCSD was the only school district I ever knew because it's the only one here. So I went to a very small
00:06:27
Speaker
district in Texas, Flugerville Independent School District, total students 18,000. So just being smaller, I felt that it, the dynamic worked a lot better. They had more things in place. They had, you know, less, I want to say, associate admin, if that makes sense. So let's break this down. Sorry. Because if you get going off again, so you said they had more things in place.
00:06:56
Speaker
Yes. When you say that, what do you mean? So their special ed and their RTI process was like rock solid.
00:07:05
Speaker
Okay. They had just been doing it from the very beginning and they had very strategic steps on how they conducted that. And I did appreciate that being that I was in, you know, I did special education there. So I just felt RTI ran smoothly, nothing against the RTI that we're doing now or at Smith. But in previous schools that I been in here in CCSD, it just, I don't know, it
00:07:31
Speaker
It didn't run as smooth as it did in Texas. OK, so then you said there's not as many associate superintendents or things like that. Is Texas like Washington State where I'm from, where every small town has their own school district?
00:07:47
Speaker
Oh, yeah, because where I was at, there were five or six other districts around. So salary was competitive because if you did want to work in Flugerville Independent School District, you could go to Round Rock or you could go to Austin ISD or Georgetown ISD. So there were many options within the district or in the district that you could branch out and the salary was very competitive because they're trying to attain good teachers. OK, so that makes sense.
00:08:17
Speaker
What else? Like what else is, what, is there anything worse about Texas than Las Vegas? Well, well, no, I know. Um, what I didn't, I didn't agree with was in Texas, they had very few self contained programs. Okay. So all students,
00:08:42
Speaker
high functioning autism, low functioning autism, severe behaviors, they were all pushed in full time within the general education classroom. So the only kids that were in self contained were your nonverbal kids, non ambulatory kids and unable to feed themselves. So it was like very severe disabilities. Other than that,
00:09:06
Speaker
everybody is pushed in with support. And I didn't agree with that. Yeah, I was just gonna say, I mean, you and I, we, you know, we laugh because we don't agree on a lot of things, but we agree on a lot of things as well. I think you and I would agree that that would be very difficult for the gen ed teacher if you had someone in the, in your gen ed class without supports who clearly has a disability that keeps them from accessing education in the right way.
00:09:36
Speaker
100% because when I was there, I was the behavior interventionist. So I went in and supported those kids, the kids with special needs, and I helped support the general education kids too. But when I tell you that we had severe behaviors in the general education classroom, it was a disruption to the other kids. I can't tell you how many times we had to do a room clear because a student was physically violent.
00:10:04
Speaker
So what do you think people should know about being a self-contained teacher and knowing all of that stuff? Because I did a podcast a while ago. I don't know if you listened to it with Jeff Granger, where I talked about my day, which included spending a lot of time with self-contained kids. And I don't know that many people in the Gen A classroom, like your colleagues, know all of the things that happen behind the scenes with self-contained. Right.
00:10:31
Speaker
Well, I did self-contained for five years. So within self-contained, again, it all depends too on what program you were in. I did SLD.
00:10:42
Speaker
And at that time, I don't know if it's the case now, but it was very much like a dumping ground. You don't know what kind of student it is. The kid can't really function in Gen Ed, but they're not quite that severe. They don't have behavior, so we'll put them in SLD. Or they have severe behaviors. They're high functioning, so we'll put them in SLD. So it was just kind of a melting pot of every kind of kid with kids with autism, kids with behaviors, kids that were just
00:11:09
Speaker
truly LD that just needed that academic support. And of course, my classes were always maxed out. I think I had 16 kids each year. And so a self-contained classroom is, it's challenging. I mean, we, we as Gen Ed teachers talk about the gaps that we see in our kids now. I mean, just think about the gaps that are in the SLD because that's saying that that student cannot function in a general education
00:11:37
Speaker
classroom because they are two years or more below where they need to be. So you've got everything going on academically in there. And of course, you've got to teach behaviors before you can teach academics. So it's hard. So people that don't understand self-contained need to know that it's a hard job.
00:11:57
Speaker
It is, it is. So I was just thinking one of our colleagues at Thompson the other day, you know, right now, October was hard for people at Thompson because we're just so busy. And I hear it all the time. Well, morale so low. Well, I think you're just tired. But also, I think morale would pick up if they had to go spend a day in a self contained room and really face
Teacher Morale and Relationships
00:12:20
Speaker
those challenges. Also to
00:12:23
Speaker
I'm a veteran teacher. I've been doing this 16 years. I've worked at really great schools with really great principals and I've worked at really great schools with crappy principals. I see the benefit at working at Thompson. Yeah, there's a lot going on. I get it. I'm exhausted too.
00:12:46
Speaker
I just, if you haven't worked with another admin, I kind of wonder, well, what if you went and worked with somewhere else? It's not gonna be like what you get at Thompson. So I am thankful, truly thankful every day because the things that you make me do and don't make me do. So I think it's all about perspective on whether morale is low.
00:13:13
Speaker
That's true. You make a good point, but I think, you know, one of the things I worry about is just everybody. Well, almost everybody. I mean, like, you want everybody to just be happy and do the best they can. What do you love about second grade? Oh, I love second grade. Well, I'll get my next question. Go ahead. What do you love about second grade?
00:13:34
Speaker
When I reached out to you and said, hey, do you have a special ed position? You're like, no, how about second grade? I'm like, oh, I've never taught general ed. So you're like, you'll be fine. I'm like, okay. And I've never looked back. I love that they have this transition from first to second where they have a real joy and love for reading. As you know, AR is my favorite time of day.
00:13:55
Speaker
And I love just watching kids love to read. So I love their little personalities. They're still sweet and cute. They still love on you. They're still easy to scare at times when you have to crack down. But it's just a really good age and I do love the curriculum. But see you say that and I know because we just talked about this other day. You said you really don't like teaching phonics though.
00:14:20
Speaker
I don't. Why not? Me personally, I find phonics boring, but again, it's primary. Well, now is that a teacher problem or a phonics problem, Roach?
00:14:31
Speaker
Oh, that's me, dude, it's boring. I find phonics boring. Cat, cat, okay, great. It's not my favorite thing to do, but I do have students that require it. I know, you know, kinder and first grade teachers, they have that love for it, and it's real foundational in, you know, K1, to kind of coming out of it a little bit, but it's just, yeah, I'm not a fan of explicitly teaching phonics.
00:14:59
Speaker
But why not? Would you rather, is it, I mean, do you agree that they need phonics? Oh, 100%. You just don't like teaching it. I just don't like teaching it. Okay. All right. But see, I think also I might have jaded you a little bit because you always get mad at me when I use the example
00:15:20
Speaker
if i walk in the room and everybody's using oar during phonics it drives me crazy and you're like yeah i always picking on second grade you're beating a dead horse no i i understand where you come up with that example is it
00:15:35
Speaker
I wouldn't have changed my way if it wasn't for your feedback, which I appreciated. Was I pissed off about it? Sure. Yeah. But as I self-reflect, I'm like, okay, does every kid need a whole group all the time? No. So because of that year after year, I have been able to tweak my lessons to
00:16:02
Speaker
Small groups when needed whole groups when needed and it's I think it's been working out math has been really great with small groups we're able to get into groups by you know skill level and just kind of knock it out so that's been really great a ours already differentiated by their there's EPD and they're reading instruction level so yeah I
00:16:25
Speaker
From that, I was able to take that feedback. I appreciate it, but yeah. I know. As you know, my job is to get you thinking sometimes that's not fun, which is, I mean, it is what it is. Why do you think people do not like accelerated reader or for us it's reading Trailblazers?
Impact of Accelerated Reader
00:16:45
Speaker
Um, that's a, that's a good question. It's hard for me to, you know,
00:16:52
Speaker
speculate on that because I love it so much and I use it daily. I don't know, maybe people don't think they're not getting the best bang for their buck in it. Maybe they don't feel like they're going to touch on the standards that are needed in there, but if you do it the way that it's intended to be done, you are knocking out different skills, multiple skills throughout your read aloud. It's just
00:17:16
Speaker
Again, like I said, it's my favorite time. And I love watching the kids get so excited about their read aloud, being able to use accountable talk with each other and bounce ideas. They get to turn and talk and make predictions. It's just, it's my favorite thing to watch. And it's been beneficial. I mean, my data is pretty good usually when it comes to reading. Yeah, it's not bad. It's all right. I mean, you know, you can do better.
00:17:49
Speaker
for those that are listening. Yeah, you wanna cast some of that right now. I know you do. I bet I wanna drop a bomb, but I'm trying to begin. No, it's all right. Your strength, I mean, yes, you're a great teacher, but your strength is relationships with families and kids.
Building Relationships with Students and Parents
00:18:07
Speaker
Can you please tell everybody all that you do to establish relationships with kids and families? Okay, well, it started during COVID.
00:18:17
Speaker
Obviously that was a really hard time for us teachers. So I made it a point to go to each student's house and visit with them during that time, since we weren't able to have that connection within the classroom. And just from there, I make sure every year, the first day of school, I call every single parent that night and ask them how their kid's first day was. They seem to appreciate that. I make house visits.
00:18:47
Speaker
I'll just surprise a kid. I surprised two kids the other week, just drove by, went in and wanted to check on one. One had been ill for a while, so I checked in on him. And then one lived across the street, so I just kind of moseyed on over and we talked for like a good hour. I just talk to parents all the time. I just feel like
00:19:14
Speaker
You have to have a relationship not only with the student, but the parent. If the parent trusts you and feels comfortable with you, if there's something that does go wrong, I feel that'll be a lot smoother.
00:19:27
Speaker
So you're doing it for a positive, but also it's kind of like me. So we're similar in this way is I will try to call and tell something good to a parent knowing full well, there's going to come a time when I'm up to call and say something bad. And you're trying to get you trying to get them on the good side before you've got to, you know, say something bad. Does that make sense?
00:19:51
Speaker
Oh yeah, because let's think about that. In the past, the only time teachers would call home is if something was wrong.
00:20:00
Speaker
I call all the time and I, and like every time they hear me, they're like, what'd they do? And I constantly, I constantly say, no, no, no, it's not a bad thing. I know it's traumatizing when you hear my voice, but you're like, I mean, you're right though. I think just society has maybe, especially with the students that tend to struggle a little bit, they probably, parents are probably used to getting difficult, uh, phone calls. Yeah. Well, you know, back when we were in school in the eighties, dare I say, um,
00:20:29
Speaker
Teachers never called home unless there was a serious issue. For sure. Yeah. Yeah. I'll just, I'll call. There's one particular parent who we both know that I love. I picked up the phone the other day. She's like, Oh my God, what did he do? I said nothing. I just wanted to let you know that he had a really good day today. So, um, I think that's no, I just say it's a stigma. When teachers call, there's a, it's a bad stigma.
00:20:57
Speaker
Yeah, and I know there's so many perspectives that we've got to change about education.
Teacher Entitlement and Societal Impacts
00:21:04
Speaker
And I think we're trying to do that. I mean, that's the whole point of the podcast and Thompson and the book. What is one thing that you, one stigma about teachers that really just pisses you off?
00:21:19
Speaker
Oh God, I hope I'm not hated for this. I feel lots of teachers, not all. We can edit it out if we need to, so you're okay. I feel teachers sometimes live in a bubble, like an entitlement bubble, almost. Like I'm a teacher. Explain that, expand upon that, elaborate, describe.
00:21:43
Speaker
I'm trying to figure out how to describe that because this has been my thing forever. And I call it the entitlement bubble. Teachers feel like, what are you going to do for me? And again, at this point right now, we kind of feel that. Again, around the district morale is down for obvious reasons. But I don't know. It's like teachers have this sense of entitlement of, what are you going to do for me? Or what am I going to get out of it?
00:22:11
Speaker
Do you feel like that is a societal problem due to some of your beliefs? Or do you feel like that is a Robert problem? Because I often think that my system where I basically give you guys everything that I possibly can so you could do your job. Do you think that entitlement is caused by society or by my system or both?
00:22:39
Speaker
No, and I don't see that happening on our campus. I'm thinking about it more from my past experiences and just being a teacher who's kind of been around for a long time. Yeah, a lot of it is society. Teachers are heroes one moment and the next moment they're hated. They're not looked at as professional. And a lot of times, do teachers always act professionally? No.
00:23:08
Speaker
Exactly. So again, well, and I'm, you know, I'm not the best either. I've had my issues. I've had my moments. We all have. I am very confrontational, as you know. But I would just say, I don't know if confrontation was the right word. I think you just, you're, well, you're really good about starting the conversation, but you don't, you're, I would say like, you
00:23:32
Speaker
This is probably fair to say. You're great at addressing the problem, but then you also think about it forever. And you can't just let things go. Yeah, no, you're right on that. I perseverate on the bad. And I'm constantly thinking, oh, should I have done that? Should I have said that? Because I have no problem. You know, I have diarrhea of the mouth sometimes. And then I have to.
00:24:02
Speaker
What? Violent diarrhea. Violent diarrhea of the mouth. And it comes back to haunt me sometimes. I'm trying to be better at it. Again, really, we've talked about this. You've done a great job. I think, again, you just try to get to the root of the problem, but sometimes things don't go the way that you think they're going to.
00:24:24
Speaker
Right, and so, you know, I get- There's a lot of teachers out there though that I always say, and you're kind of the example of this, even though sometimes it goes sideways, is if you, if someone, let's see, I'm gonna use Steph's name because she's your colleague in second grade and your closest colleague in second grade.
Conflict Resolution with Colleagues
00:24:42
Speaker
Shout out to Rosenthal. What's up, Rosenthal? If Steph said, Andrea, I really don't like that you did that.
00:24:50
Speaker
I think that's gonna hurt you more than Robert saying, Andrea, I really don't like that you did that. And so I think admin should wish for more people like you in the fact that you will go and talk to someone about something that bugs you. Rather than creating, letting the drama just fester and it getting bigger.
00:25:13
Speaker
No, no, if there's an issue with another colleague, let's say, I will go directly to them before I take it up the chain of command because I want to see if I can handle it with that other person before we get admin involved. And honestly, you shouldn't be involved unless it's something, you know, pretty big. Yeah, I mean, like, my whole thought process is like, you guys can live in the drama if you want to. If it gets to my door, then I'll then I'll deal with it.
00:25:39
Speaker
We've been a drama free grade level this year. Yes. Bless your hearts in second grade. I don't worry about second grade. One of the hardest things I have struggled with, our oldest children, no, I'm sorry, my twins are the same age as your oldest son, has been them going to middle school.
00:26:01
Speaker
and having teachers maybe not as passionate as you or maybe not as knowledgeable as you. Have you had any of those experiences? With my son's middle school teachers? Yeah. It's so hard because you
00:26:18
Speaker
You try and ask your kids about their day and their teachers and there's not a whole lot of information they share in middle school nowadays. Um, I do know some of the teachers because I do sit on the SOT over at their school. So I have had the privilege of meeting them and the ones that I have met and talked to have been wonderful. Like I love that middle school. It's been great, but of course they have a secondary mind, right?
00:26:46
Speaker
So they see 150 plus kids a day. They don't get to make the relationships with their kids like we do in elementary, you know? So I do, it hurts my heart a little bit that as they get older, they're just going to have less and less of that. But hopefully there'll be a teacher that they can just kind of latch onto and make
00:27:11
Speaker
have a memory about it. Obviously, I have a memory of a high school teacher that I had. Yes, you do. He was the best government teacher in the world. He was so great, I married him. That's a whole bunch of great friends who said that.
00:27:32
Speaker
It was after you were out of high school. It was well after. Well after we were adults. He was in his 30s. It was after college too. Exactly. I was in my teens. Just kidding. I was in my 20s. It was way after graduation. So yeah, it was just funny because I always like to tell that story and Mark gets really upset about me because he tells the people, it's really not as creepy as it sounds, I promise, but I just think it's funny. So hopefully my kids will have a long lasting
00:28:00
Speaker
teacher that they can look back and remember, hopefully not, you know, Mary, but, you know, at least have somebody that they look, they look up to and be like, you know what, I really, really liked my ninth grade science teacher. He was wonderful. Yeah. I mean, sometimes it only takes one teacher to get them to come to school so they can see that, that one person. And they seem to enjoy going every day. And they, like I said, they like their teachers, their, their grades are,
00:28:28
Speaker
Really good. Emily is a different story, but she's hanging in there. She's just Emily. Oh, she's Emily. She is. Where do you see yourself going?
Future Career Considerations
00:28:43
Speaker
You're always bugging me for a behavior interventionist job. I know. As much as I value you, I don't see us ever needing that.
00:28:55
Speaker
I understand that. I know you do. Ideally, if you had one or one that came up in the future, I would love to do that and help support special ed and gen ed kids on campus. But I've got what, 14 more years left? Do I think I'm going to spend all 14 years in the classroom? I don't know if I can do that. But right now, I'm happy being in the classroom. Do I want to move grade levels?
00:29:24
Speaker
I don't know. That's for another time and place. I'm happy in second grade. I love my coworkers. You know, Rosenthal and Anderson have, you know, and I love them all. They're just, they've been my group and we just work well together. I don't know, maybe something for CPD or. Well, yeah, not, not till I'm done though. That's not allowed. No, no, no, no. I, I, well, my first.
00:29:50
Speaker
thing is that I want to retire. But of course, you and Mark won't let me retire yet. So I will stick it on the classroom until you retire and then I'll reevaluate there. Sounds excellent. Okay, so off the top here, let's do it. Let's, let's, let's get controversial somehow. You and I do not politically see eye to eye on much.
00:30:16
Speaker
at all, I would say. Much at all, which is okay. Some social, we said social. Social stuff, we're okay. Yeah, physical stuff. Fiscal stuff, it's a little different. But I think we are, why do you, let's see. It does not affect our personal relationship. No, it's been fine.
00:30:40
Speaker
Yeah, well, that's just because I walk away. Well, you got a little, you got a little bit rough there, obviously. A little feisty. A little bit, a little bit. What, what is something, can you think of anything off the top of your head that we can, we can share different perspectives on right now? That's school related or politically related? I mean, well, school, so. Um, okay.
00:31:11
Speaker
I think I love the Ron Clark model, obviously. I've modeled a lot of my stuff from that because it was just such an amazing experience. Ron Clark has the engagement going for them. Ron Clark has the academics and they have the behavior part of it. They're able to do that. So I think maybe we might disagree a little bit on how we structure that.
Support for PBIS
00:31:40
Speaker
at the school, we have engagement, we have academics, but again, me being a behavior person, I would like to see maybe some more behavior interventions to help out teachers. So expand upon that. I would love to have a PBIS team.
00:31:59
Speaker
Um, uh, because I am, I am anti-PVIS. Okay. Well then there we go. Okay. You're anti, I am pro. I think as a special education teacher, I know behavior has to be dealt with first before you can teach. So if we had a behavior school wide matrix that we do, you just don't want to follow it.
00:32:24
Speaker
Where, show me, where is it? I have a behavior plan. It's got tears on my head. Is it in your head? No, it's shared with you. You just don't read. Oh, Jesus. I'll share it with you. You gotta share it with me after this. Okay, so anyways. Well, if I didn't know about it, then how many other teachers don't know about it? Well, I don't know. Are you the only one that doesn't read what I send out? When your emails pop through, I'm like, oh shit, skip.
00:32:55
Speaker
Probably like most people okay, so PBIS PBIS I will make the argument I Will make the argument that the Thompson 10 and the house system is our PBIS So is it being enforced with Fidelity no because fidelity sucks and you know that I
00:33:22
Speaker
But you see what I'm saying? Okay, so here's my anyway.
Addressing Behavioral Issues
00:33:24
Speaker
Okay. If you want to go PBIS, to what degree do you want to do it? Because some schools say, okay, every time a kid says shit, you need to put that in the computer. We ain't got time for that. No, and you have to triage your behavior. Like if a kid is saying, you know, I have a special friend who likes to drop the F bomb, is that the worst thing in the world? No, we handle it.
00:33:49
Speaker
Right, but we're talking about more of the serious infractions. Such as? Hitting, disruption in class, destruction of property, bullying. So do you, okay, this is great. So do you feel like it is mandatory minimum, so to speak, for certain behaviors?
00:34:12
Speaker
Or should every kid be treated differently based upon their background, their day, whatever's going on? It's a case by case basis, I think. I agree. I'm a believer if you put your hands on another student, your ass needs to go home. Okay, so let's argue about that. Or not argue. Let's just discuss it. Let's do it. Okay.
00:34:35
Speaker
Let's, okay, let's think of the, let's think of a young man in your class. We both knew who I'm already talking about. And he pushes, pushes one of our favorite kids in your class of one of our favorite parents. You think that kid should go home and miss school with Andrea Roach. And you think that that's going to change his behavior tomorrow.
00:35:01
Speaker
Okay, this might be controversial like this, but I don't think it's about inconveniencing the kid. I think it's inconveniencing the parent. I think parents need to be inconvenienced when they have kids that have maladaptive behaviors. So is it necessarily should I send him home and he misses instruction because he's already so far behind?
00:35:23
Speaker
No, that's not the intention, but the intention would be get mom in, get dad in, get a grownup in to talk about the severity of behavior. That could help change the course of his behavior. It may not, but I think if we don't get the grownups involved, then it's gonna continue to happen. So what I hear you say is that you have a student that pushes a kid, and then I send him home and he gets to play Xbox all day,
00:35:53
Speaker
that he's going to come back and magically he's going to be reformed and ready to go tomorrow. No, not necessarily, but do we know? When you talk about your matrix, what are you talking about? Well, again, I just think physical aggression is a serious thing. And again, it's case by case basis. So maybe sitting in the office
00:36:15
Speaker
crying with snot coming down his nose and an apology is all that he needs. But again, maybe it could be different with another student. We have some students on campus that would benefit from an RPC having those parents come in. Again, it really does depend on the student and the student situation. With a behavior matrix, I just feel if we had something
00:36:37
Speaker
in writing that I've actually seen and helped create. I'm going to share it with you right when we're done with this. Actually, I'm not because Google is still down, but I'll start with you tomorrow. It would be good to have just kind of a flowchart. If this happens in your classroom, do you call for admin? Yes. Or does this happen? I'm going to share it with you. I'm going to share it with you.
00:37:00
Speaker
and share it, dude. But again, if I haven't seen it, how many other people have not have just kind of like glanced over it, and it hasn't been talked about, it hasn't really been, you know, talked. So would you say that that's so important? Would you say that that people are unprofessional by not reading what I send out? And therefore, when Andrea wants me to RPC a kid for pushing someone, that I would come back and be like, No, it's not following the matrix I sent out.
00:37:30
Speaker
and I push back and it becomes your problem. Well, again, teachers need to handle their behaviors in class. Now, if I came to you and said, this kid needs to go home, have I ever asked you to do that? No. I don't think so. But if I come to you and say, this kid needs to go home, I would hope that Mr. H would send this kid home. What do you think I would say if you brought a kid up and you said, this kid needs to go home?
00:37:57
Speaker
You can be honest. It's a million dollar question. What did he do? Who did he upset? That's right. I would get the details. And then perhaps I have the background about mom or dad or, or R.G. or stuff like that. Right. But I'd hope you would trust in your, your teachers to use a professional judgment based on whether or not I have done it frequently in the past or not at all.
Trusting Teachers' Judgment
00:38:24
Speaker
Of course I'm going to tell you what happened.
00:38:26
Speaker
But I would hope that you would support teachers in that endeavor. So I think it goes back to relationships because you and I, you can come up and you can say, I need to send this kid home. And I'm going to say, OK, why? And then you're going to tell me probably a bunch of valid reasons. But then you're going to respectfully listen to the other side. And then you and I are going to decide what's right for the kid. And if it's going home, great. But if it's not, you are going to be willing to say, OK, I understand that.
00:38:56
Speaker
Yeah, I would as long as a lot of teachers can't do that. They're sending them home. Well, why? I know his ass beat by his parents again for the third time.
00:39:06
Speaker
But there should be some kind of consequence up in the if they are going to sit in the office, you know, sitting in a quiet room by themselves or, you know, with somebody obviously with eyes on. But I don't feel that kids should get to go to the office and sit and listen to the adults have a conversation. So I appreciate to play around up there. I appreciate what you're saying. There's so much, I think,
00:39:32
Speaker
Sometimes. I'm not saying that any of mine have done that or that happens, I'm just saying. You're fine. You see those funny memes where a kid goes to the office and they come back and they're back to skills. Yeah, I don't, well, yeah, no skills are bad. I think, you know, this goes back to, I don't know how to say it. I think already this year I've sent more kids home than I have in a long time. Why do you think that is? Why is that what? Why do you think that is?
00:40:02
Speaker
The severity of what they do is so much so. Like if you get up in the middle of the lunchroom and you go attack someone and start beating them up, I don't have time for you today. Nope. Yeah, no, I agree with you on that. Right. But see, then this goes back to I think a lot of the times you all are so busy teaching that you don't see a lot of the stuff that goes on on the other side with other classrooms and things.
00:40:27
Speaker
We don't because we're in our own bubble in our room. This is fun. Yeah. So this is fun. So let's take a student you had last year that got moved. Okay. John Doe. Okay. John Doe. John Doe. He got us at home last year at least once or twice, but didn't change any of the behaviors.
00:40:54
Speaker
I'm trying to think the half semester I had him if he went home. He may have. I don't recall. No, his behaviors are the exact same and I can even argue that they have escalated this year. So if we had PBIS in place, what potential difference might we see? So with my thought process in PBIS, it would be having a team.
00:41:18
Speaker
that can go through situations with teachers that might feel frustrated that need that extra support. So maybe we have
00:41:27
Speaker
a teacher that needs to meet once a month or something. And they bring to the table, I've got this kid and they're doing XYZ. PBIS could just be there to support and help with strategies within the classroom before maybe moving to something a little bit more challenging. Or maybe we can do, make sure that they have done a tier one intervention behaviorally. Then they can go to tier two intervention.
00:41:54
Speaker
So I'm holding I'm having a PD in two weeks in my room. I know for teachers. I know are struggling to Honestly intrigued on one of my not complaints one of my frustrations from our staff and if they're listening that's fine is They do not ask for help. They are very independent You have Tracy you have Angie they can go talk to you and
00:42:24
Speaker
They can come and talk to Shana or me, but many times they won't. Right. But it also depends on what they need help with. Valid, valid, valid. You're not going to go to, you're not going to go to, you know, Tracy about a severe behavior if she doesn't have obviously the background, not saying I love Tracy. As an example, you might not go to her specifically for behavior support. Maybe, maybe. Maybe, maybe not. Yeah. Yeah. So I think, um,
00:42:55
Speaker
I don't know how to say this, but I'm going to be interested to see how many people come to your classroom to get ideas. And that's all I really want to do. Yeah. I support you. I try to go in and do that because I have my student teacher right now. And I've been trying to get into classrooms. I've been trying to take data and just help with some positive behavior intervention strategies for some of the teachers that have come to me for help. So that's all I want to do is get them
00:43:25
Speaker
And again, it's a lot of work. I get it to establish like a token board or a first then chart or a visual schedule. I get it. I know it's hard. It's time consuming, but I can tell you right now, I have two students right now. I have one that's on a first then chart and I've got another kid on a visual schedule. Yeah. And you know what? It works for them. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. So you, you know, you, uh,
00:43:48
Speaker
Again, you email me, I said, sure, go ahead. We'll see what happens. I'm not against you. It can only make us better. One of the challenges I face is the difference between building capacity and going back to the word entitlement.
Building Teacher Capacity
00:44:09
Speaker
At some point in time, I think you have to let people figure certain things out by themselves.
00:44:17
Speaker
That's how you grow. You grow when you're uncomfortable. If we had you as a behavior strategist and you came in there and you did everything for them, they're not going to build capacity. They're going to become entitled for your help. Right. Yeah. It's important for them to be able, me model it for them because they're the ones that have to do it on a daily basis. Sure. You just opened up a whole other can of worms.
00:44:43
Speaker
Not every this is one of my core beliefs is that you are different than Stephanie which is different than Amy Which is different than Gloria in second grade second grade is six different individuals So you can give them the tools? But they have to actually use them or make them theirs Agreed. I
00:45:05
Speaker
And for that, they have to essentially see a need for it, a want for it, and then have a desire to get it done. I don't think some people, I think a lot of people, again, comes back to one of my statements, a lot of people want to be part of the end, the end outcome, but not the process to get there. Right. And when it comes down to it, it's just like anything else.
00:45:33
Speaker
Programs that need to be implemented, you know other things that you that come well, I find Sorry to catch out I find it so Interesting that you are such a huge PBIS person, but you are anti program to the max Well, I love in vision That's it gins all You don't you don't follow with fidelity though, I don't I
00:46:04
Speaker
No, but you have allowed us to be autonomous within our classroom. So you don't... So if I made everybody do PBIS, how would that go over with the people I used to...
00:46:19
Speaker
That would just be like a committee, and I know you're anti-committee. I am. Everything is, oh, just everything. We can't agree on shit. Well, let's go into committees, okay? You have a committee, let's just say. Listen, but it's voluntary. If you want to be part of this, we can just collaborate. It's like your book studies. Come and join and collaborate. Okay, fair enough. We could be like that. We could have a PBIS book study.
00:46:47
Speaker
where people choose, again, I think you just have to get people to come and choose. They have to want to choose. Like, like, I don't, I mean this in the nicest way for anybody listening, but sometimes with people we can lead them to water, but we can even stick their head under the water and they'll keep their mouth shut. Like that's so that's like a frustration. And I,
00:47:13
Speaker
Again, I think people have to just hit rock bottom, so to speak, before they will open their mouth and drink what we're trying to sell them. Unless that... I don't know. It's hard. Everybody's different. One of the hardest things about being me, or Shauna, is trying to get all 45 of you or so to basically drink the water that we're trying to give you to drink. But that's not going to happen. Right.
00:47:40
Speaker
Right. So you just have to be okay with it not happening for everybody. I mean, there's the other conundrum because if the other people don't do it and Andrea is doing it and then Andrea gets a kid that they didn't do it, she's then like, why didn't they do that? Yes. And I've experienced that. Um,
00:48:07
Speaker
But again, I am trying to be more open and realize that everybody teaches differently. Everybody is different. There are certain things that are mandatory. Yes, we get it. I don't know. I just you've been willing to allow us to be free and creative with in our own rooms. And it works for I would say most of us, but the ones that it doesn't work for, maybe there it needs to be different. Or perhaps their heads underwater and you guys don't know about it and we're waiting for them to drink.
00:48:37
Speaker
I know. And again, I've been doing this a long time. I still ask for help. I've asked Angie for lots of help with phonics.
00:48:46
Speaker
materials for intervention, because again, it's been a while since I've had to explicitly teach it. You know, I go to people that I need for help above me, below me. Right. But that's what makes you great. That's what makes you great. But do you think that's because of your I mean, because of our experience in life and we're like, hey, we need help. Or like, why are you willing to isn't a personality thing where I need help?
00:49:14
Speaker
Yeah. And it could be the personality age. I don't know. People are not willing to ask for help. I don't know why. I feel within our grade level, we're constantly going in each other's rooms and asking questions and we share, we share everything. We don't hold anything back. Like we'll create a document or we'll, you know, buy something not from TPT. Um, and we, we share it because we want everybody to be successful.
00:49:43
Speaker
Why do you think? Okay, so why do my frustration too? Sorry, I'm taking your whole. This is what happens when you and I get talking. You grew up playing sports. Yes, my whole life. You understand the sports mentality that I have or second sucks. And, you know, like I play lots of sports videos or analogies and things like that. You understand that.
00:50:08
Speaker
I'm very competitive. Yes. Yes, extremely. So why why are people okay being average in your opinion? Maybe they don't know that they have the ability to be above average. So is that a personal problem or a leadership problem to not show them they can do it? It could be both. It really depends on the school. You know, you go to a school where principals have
00:50:36
Speaker
teachers that have to be on the same lesson, the same page, walking in from one to another, I think that's gonna stifle somebody's ability to be an amazing teacher. So maybe they just don't know yet that they have the capability of doing it, or maybe they just don't care.
00:50:56
Speaker
They just are okay being average. Me, I want to be the best damn teacher in the school. I strive for that. When I am very competitive, I look at my data. When I'm not the highest, it bothers me. But I still love that my colleagues are doing so well. Like the star data that you just sent out, I think we did pretty good in reading and math. Would I have liked to have been higher? Absolutely.
00:51:22
Speaker
But again, I just have to self-reflect on that and fix what I can. Last question. You're involved. You know what's going on. How do you feel about the contract? Just give me your general thoughts on all this contract madness.
Contract Negotiations and Leadership Issues
00:51:42
Speaker
And you're married to a lawyer. I am. So I'm sure you've talked about this. Give me your thoughts on it.
00:51:51
Speaker
I think both sides have had fault for sure. I don't think CCEA has done a good job with their narrative.
00:52:03
Speaker
To be honest, they need to pretty much say, hey, the legislature, there's money there. They have the money to give. It's JARA that's not doing it. So they're going to play each other. I just think on both sides, it's just done piss poorly. CCEA is doing what they can, but I just think their narrative could have been done a lot better. And CCSD, I don't even know. I don't even care
00:52:28
Speaker
to be honest anymore. It's so tiring. I just try to get in, do my job, and go home. I think you have the attitude of a lot of teachers to where they don't care about CCSD.
00:52:44
Speaker
at the top. They don't care. They care about their school, their classroom. Most care about their school and their classroom, but they don't care about CCSD at all. And I think that's a sad state to be in. It is. And I'll be honest, I couldn't care less about CCSD right now. Yes, they are my employer, but you're my evaluator.
00:53:08
Speaker
and Shauna. I care about what you two think and my colleagues think. I don't care what's going on with CCSD right now with the board. I mean, the board is a hot dumpster fire. Dr. Jara, there's stuff going on there. It's becoming too much to wear.
00:53:33
Speaker
I don't want it to be a weight on my shoulder anymore. When we get our raise, I'll be excited. But I'm not going to dwell on it right now. Well, that's a smart move, I think, because you can't control it. I can't. I can't control it. They're not paying me more. Yeah. Yeah. So let's say, hypothetically, that all teachers end up getting 18%. OK. I make the argument that you, Andrea, are going to work just as hard
00:54:02
Speaker
than as you do now? Yeah, nothing's going to change in my instruction. I mean, I'm the first teacher in the parking lot most days. You are. You are. I saw you polling this morning when I was there. Let's just go with this. OK, last question for real. Sorry. I'm just saying, I work my butt off. It doesn't matter about the pay. I mean, yes, do I want to get paid more than $60,000 a year?
00:54:28
Speaker
Yeah, that would be nice, but it's not going to change my instruction or the love and care that I have for my students.
00:54:35
Speaker
So let's say hypothetically, you get 18% over the next two years. You, I mean, again, I strive to give you everything you need at school, even free snacks. You can even get a massage in the massage chair if you want to. Try to get some more white paper, by the way. Thanks. Absolutely. Just see me tomorrow. No problem. We will, we will get that for you. We are not one of the places that, that does not give what you need. You have amazing grade level. Second grade is awesome.
00:55:07
Speaker
Let's just say CCSD does all this stuff. And Governor Lombardo said, I'm giving you money, which he did, he was totally for us. But I want accountability. So now Andrea is making 20% more, she's got everything she needs, she's got a grade level that she loves, at a school that she loves, she likes her boss. And let's say, a little, let's say that Thompson and CCSD, the scores are stagnant.
00:55:37
Speaker
What do we do then? I mean, again, if I were to have crappy test scores, cause it's probably, it's going to happen eventually. I think I, I don't know. Like what more can a teacher do? But again, is every teacher putting forth a thousand percent? I would argue no. And I think that's my, that's my whole,
00:56:04
Speaker
conundrum because I want you guys to get every dollar. I mean, I really do. You deserve it, or at least the ones that I work with you. There's plenty out there, the OCCSD money. But I fear that it's not going to make the difference that the public or that the district thinks it's going to make. It's not going to make a difference in the classroom, I think, but for their personal life, it's probably going to make a huge difference for many of them. But we're in the business of kids, not
00:56:34
Speaker
But if you don't have to worry about money, so to speak, and you know that you're going to feed your own kids and you can pay your mortgage, are you going to be happier at work and less stressed? Maybe. Maybe some. Or there's going to be people who'll be out there like, well, I'm still not making enough. I'm still not going to do whatever. And again, I'm very fortunate enough that I don't
00:56:58
Speaker
the raise is not going to affect me, you know, in the classroom or personally, you know, my husband does decent. So that's, that's not an issue. I just go in to teach when a teacher can physically just teach in a classroom. It all comes together. Like today behaviors were great. I was able to just teach and that's what teachers want to do. They just want to freaking teach.
00:57:25
Speaker
They don't want to have to keep stopping and starting again and being interrupted and have to do this or check their email and do that. We just want to do what we all went to school for, to teach. I agree.
00:57:38
Speaker
Well, you know, I appreciate you. Even when you drive me crazy, even during election season. Let's not communicate between June of 2024 and January of 2020. See, I think you're even thinking about, I think you're even questioning, especially with what's going on. I think you're questioning a lot of things, or I'm going to help you.
00:58:03
Speaker
Well, yeah, I mean, again, we can agree that, you know, what's going on in the Middle East is very sad for my people. Yeah, yeah, it is. But you know, I mean, like, even, you know, no matter what, I mean, you still we argue, but it's all I thought I love. And I am grateful for your time. I took up an hour of your day. And I'm thankful for all you do for the kids and the teachers of Thompson. And I appreciate that. But you know, that no matter where you stand on all the issues in the end, it's all