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One Drop. A Million Ideas
3 Playsin 4 hours
“From very early on, we all agreed that we would play to our strengths.”
More than a thousand brewing companies have come and, in many cases, gone since the craft beer era began in Australia, but there’s never been one quite like One Drop.
The Botany-based operation make cracking “normal” beers yet have become a byword for the wild and WTF, the experimental and eccentric. They weren’t the first brewery to make smoothie sours, for example, but they’ve taken such beers – and myriad other styles – to new places others wouldn’t have conceived, let alone dared, creating beers that defy the odds and just work.
James joined them at their brewery earlier in the year for a chat about their storming of the GABS Hottest 100 with We Jammin’, the serendipitous way brewer Nick Calder-Scholes was discovered by founders Meg Barbic and Clay Grant, their approach to brewing, “contained chaos”, being “collectively creative”, and moving craft beer away from “pale, male and stale”.
If you’re wondering why this episode is running so late after the recording, it’s due to technical issues. It was the first recording with a new setup and somehow James was capturing video at such high quality it filled his laptop’s entire hard drive before the chat was over, leaving us with a corrupted file. So lovely was the backdrop for the guests, he was determined to rescue it, but despite many attempts it wasn’t to be. That said, the chat is colourful enough to paint vivid pictures with words.
There’s one of our longer intros this week, as Will and James reflect on the imminent closures of Wayward’s taproom and White Bay Brewery following various mergers and acquisitions. We also discuss the news that Coles and Endeavour Group will be making it clearer which beer brands they own – and issue a shout out to anyone who has been de-ranged by the big two retailers (hit up will@craftypint.com if that's you).
Other stories from the past week include Guy Southern’s wonderful interview with new Feral head brewer Charlotte Freeston and the second part of Benedict Kennedy-Cox’s tour of Tasmania’s north, while the show also features the latest winner in our Have You Done A Rallings? campaign highlighting the country’s good beer citizens.
Start of segments:
- 20:18 – One Drop Part 1
- 42:25 – Have You Done A Rallings?
- 47:31 – One Drop Part 2
To find out more about featuring on The Crafty Pint Podcast or otherwise partnering with The Crafty Pint, contact craig@craftypint.com.
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Transcript
Introduction from Mataranka
00:00:05
Speaker
Hello and welcome to the Crafty Pine Podcast. I'm Will. I'm James. Joining you here from ah sunny and getting quite steamy Mataranka.
Journey to Mataranka and Brewer Encounters
00:00:15
Speaker
Where's that, James? I feel like the Australian beer drinkers and and beer industry are following, travelling along with you. So tell us a little bit more about where it is.
00:00:25
Speaker
Yeah, well, Mataranka is more than a thousand k's north of the last brewery I went to, which was in Alice Springs a few days ago. had an overnighter there, called in to see Kyle. um and met his new head brewer, which is Dave Henderson, one of the founders of the Western Ridge Brewing Collective, moved up there ah just over a week ago to join the team.
Road Trip Highlights and Airstrip Camping
00:00:42
Speaker
And funny enough, Jim Ryan, who was there the head brewer there we did a feature on a couple of years ago, turns out he's back in town playing the odd gig in the beer garden there. doing a few rockstar brewer shifts, becoming their FIFO brewer for um the recently rebranded Port Lincoln Brewing.
00:00:57
Speaker
But yeah, we just did two two hard days of driving, stayed in some fascinating places. You'd have loved our last stop before we got to Mataranka, which is the Northern Territory.
00:01:09
Speaker
We drove about two or three Ks down a dirt track off the side of the Stuart Highway onto a World War II airstrip, um which was really quite fantastic. You could imagine like, ah you know, air con, what's it?
00:01:20
Speaker
what was the Nick Cage movie in 80s, air con, or some sort of you know Vietnamese war um re-enaction movie taking place and seeing some sort of play, or even Paolo Escobar planes coming in and bringing tons of cocaine down this this sort of slightly hidden airstrips. That was pretty cool.
Sydney Brewery Closures and Brewing Industry Challenges
00:01:40
Speaker
While you were there or this is more historic we're talking about? This this oh this this was in my mind. oh I was envisaging it. It's just this amazing, long, open, like really red sort of gravel tarmac. It obviously was so well laid back in the 30s or 40s that there's not and not a single blade of grass or weed coming through it.
00:01:58
Speaker
um And so just now it's just ah you get a number of sort of camper vans and caravans, stop alongside every night, have a fire. move on um which is pretty cool and now i'm at a yeah the little roper stock camp any families that say this is the best place to stop in maturanga um i've hidden right down the end though because there's kids running around with snakes and lizards and and sheep and or whatever is going on over there so i'm keeping well away from them while we while we get this recorded Fantastic. Thank you.
00:02:24
Speaker
And while you were hitting up those K's, there was quite a bit of news in the second half of last week. So two Sydney brewery venues are to shut, although there's still a future of them. So White Bay will ah close the production brewery and its tap room, although the team at The social drinks group say they're looking for a new location for it, smaller by the sounds of things, potentially without any brewing with all of the brewing heading to Hawkers, which has been part of their group since the start of this year.
00:02:58
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. I was say um i have to say I've been thankful for the long drives and Starlink, being able to keep them on top of all this stuff with you over the last week or so since and we we susan we left Melbourne. But um yeah, it's interesting. I know when we spoke to the team when the Social Drinks group was formed last year, they felt there was great synergies between the brands and also the production breweries and the potentially Hawkers would be used for the bigger production runs. And then White Bay would be great for smaller batches, and limited releases and what have you.
00:03:23
Speaker
I guess over time, they probably looked at the figures and you know looked at the setup and just gone, you know what? Especially, I think it's a very high rent um for White Bay, which would you know but which is um another issue with what we will talk about in a minute or two.
00:03:37
Speaker
And I think they've since been gone you know it actually makes very little sense you know in the current environment to keep these two spaces going. um So, yeah, I mean, hopeful hopefully White Bay do find a new home. It was a pretty unique space out there on the Balmain Peninsula, one of the few places where you could get that sort of you know that sort of offering.
00:03:51
Speaker
um We did a past industry drink shout there. um so yeah, it'd be interesting see how that pans out. And, you know, clearly it hasn't gone quite as they were thinking when they formed the merger last year. But presumably, I think this is the the best way of keeping both brands um sort of viable and strong into the future.
00:04:07
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. um I remain a bit of a skeptic of how you negotiate multiple brands under one banner. I think it's hard work and I'd love to see people who crack it. And i think a different approach that's been taken obviously is with Powder Monkey Group.
00:04:21
Speaker
ah they've They've sort of formulized their purchase of Akasha and Wayward. And in that news is also the fact that the Wayward Taproom actually won't be continuing. Yeah, well, I think that was that that was sort of, we we broke the news about the Powered Monkey acquiring Akasha and, you know, way we, I guess, had merged or sort of fold and folded into Akasha a while ago.
00:04:42
Speaker
um And, you know, at at the time, there was, you know, they confirmed this was going to happen. We were just waiting for this, I guess, the the signing, dotting of I's and crossing of T's. um And then when we got the media release, you were like, oh, yeah.
00:04:54
Speaker
There's no mention of Wayward in here um and took a little bit of ah pushing, I think, to to get that confirmed. But yeah, it's really sad.
Retailer Influence on Beer and Wine Markets
00:05:00
Speaker
I mean, that Wayward tap room is a really unique space, so very beautiful space. and Again, I'd imagine it probably comes down to looking at what they've got and looking on paper going, and the rent there is ridiculous, you know, or, you know, it's so high just down to the, you know, the unique nature of the space and where it is.
00:05:15
Speaker
um I'm sure there'll be a lot of people sad to see it go. It was a generally a very well visited and very popular um tap room. um And I'm sure Pete Phillip, you know, founder of Wayward will be um a sad day for him mid-August when they had their closing weekend, which I believe they're planning to make a massive one on August 16th, 17th. If any Wayward fans out there would like to get down and help send them off in style.
00:05:38
Speaker
Yeah, definitely. And um obviously with Powder Monkey, they've got, I guess, the spiritual home of of that brand coming in Camden in Sydney's outer Southwest. So they'll have that, Willie the Boatman, Akasha's main production site, which is kind of the main production site of Powder Monkey, and then the Barrel Room by Akasha as well. So they're the ven venue. So you are looking at a kind of multi-venue taproom location hospitality brewing group uh with with all these different um outposts in sydney yeah and it seems to be a similar approach to the the setup that powder monkey are taking in the the uk which is where they're based um that was the other thing i guess you you picked up one with the article because it's now an you know uk owned business a majority uk and business um these uh the brewery is no longer part of
00:06:27
Speaker
the IBA, but they have said they'll continue operating, you know, the manner of independence, um which I guess is a nice sort of segue into a story that um we picked up on last week, thanks to a bit of a tip off from a reader um who pointed us in the direction of a that a report the federal government had or MP carried out with Wine Australia.
00:06:48
Speaker
Yeah. So Craig Emerson, uh, since late last year has been, make reviewing the wine industry, looking at market failure. Primarily there's, there's a lot of stuff in there about grape, grape growers, what rather than winemakers and the relationships between that, that agriculture and, people who make wine and obviously there's a lot of integration there because a lot of winemakers grow their own grapes but then also the the dominance of um the the oligopoly of the retail situation where you're talking about Coles and Endeavor controlling about 60 percent of the wine retail market and then you add in uh Metcash which is your sort of IGA and you add in Aldi and you're getting uh upwards more like uh 80 percent
00:07:30
Speaker
Cool. So um um what have the reports said and and um what does it mean for the beer industry then? Well, the big thing in that is through the doing the report, MSN got the major retailers, Endeavour, who won't stand in BWS, and Coles to agree to put their own name on wine that they sell. Obviously, there was this big Four Corners investigation last year at the time when people were really pretty upset with supermarkets and... um They also took a look at the sort of control of suppliers and issues around supplies with the big retailers. and And one of the big concerns is, as we know, in the beer industry is that these companies do have quite a few of their own brand products that aren't very easy to tell that they own
Tasmania Beer Travel Guide and Festival News
00:08:13
Speaker
them. So Coles, obviously, in beer, the big ones, Tinnies, Tinnies.
00:08:18
Speaker
Endeavor sort of maybe immediately post COVID or during post COVID did a whole lot of them. Suddenly there was a lot of of their own brands and and this includes, you know, um Colossal Brewing is probably their most, so I would say, maybe craft looking with the stylation of it.
00:08:36
Speaker
And um they've got the golden pipes and they work with, Yeah. So there's a lot of them that they have seemed to have shrunk the number that they're doing at the moment, but they're still on the shelves and that kind of thing. and And they've also said that they will do that for beer, which I guess was my line of inquiry. It's like, well, if you're doing this for wine, what does that mean for the beer industry? Because it has been something the beer industry has called for for quite a long time. A lot of brewers have been I think pretty keen to see it change. So i argue that consumers you might want to know can, can understand where the beer comes from. Of course, the problem is, does the average person working into Dan's know what Endeavor drinks group is or the Endeavor group? It, um,
00:09:23
Speaker
You know, but maybe some people who do care will, it will be easier to say. And I think transparency is important. And the other thing that sort of appeared for me was when I was sort of thinking about and asking questions, their websites have far less information on them than ah the cans do. So it's the...
00:09:41
Speaker
Endeavour cans have long said Pinnacle. They'll now say Pinnacle and Endeavour, but you go and you buy that same beer from the Dan Murphy's website and it just says Colossal Brewing. So I also wanted to get confirmation ah that that would happen too, which Endeavour said is happening. ah Coles, I asked them the same question in several different ways over several different days and they couldn't quite seem to answer that one, but which is unfortunate.
00:10:09
Speaker
You know, it's it's it's really interesting, and I guess, you know, a big case of wait and see what happens ah and when it when it happens. um And I guess that that issue of who and who who cares and how much is almost the eternal question around that people like the Independent Brewers Association are always dealing with as well.
00:10:25
Speaker
Yeah, definitely. And, you know, all this comes in a backdrop of, we have heard a lot, ah well, from a lot of people that there's a fair bit of deranging going on at the moment. Coles, obviously Coles Liquor is in the process of really rationalizing its own business where it's getting rid of ah vintage sellers and first choice and focusing on liquor land. So that's definitely caught a lot of breweries out. And then just in general,
00:10:49
Speaker
While there might be local ranging, the sort of local ranging is smaller than it has been at certain stores or it's much harder to get Victorian base sales and all these kind of things. it's It's an area we're looking into at the moment. So if, you know, it's an experience you've had and you wanted to talk about it, ah please just shoot me an email at will at craftypint.com and I'd love to chat.
00:11:12
Speaker
Yeah, good stuff. um And in terms of other news, I guess rather sort of less curly, we published the second part of and Benny's Beer Travel Guide to um Tasmania, which this time covered sort the northeast and the east coast, um which has yeah made me, but even though I'm up here enjoying the warmth, going, I should get back to Tassie at some point and and and get back on the road down that way. um So that was that was a lot of fun. and um And one last week, um I guess, you know, Ferrell is another business that's been through much change since 2017 when um what one of the original founders, Brendan Varis, sold it to Coke. um That was then acquired by Beer Farm and and Nail last year.
00:11:51
Speaker
um They've also been going through a lot of work. There's a new rebrand about to be unveiled. um They wouldn't give us any more than a teaser on that front, but they did put Guy in in touch with Charlotte Freeston, the new British head brewer who'd been at Beer Farm beforehand.
00:12:04
Speaker
um And I have to say, if only every person we interviewed spoke like Charlotte, we'd we'd probably be up to some sort of, you know, Pulitzer Prize for literary because me yeah every pretty much every word that sort of um fell from her lips to Guy was just like worthy of but using as a pull quote for the article and talking about how she's, you know, her but her background in art, but how she's now, you know,
00:12:26
Speaker
Yeah, just looking to, i guess, recapture what the essence of Feral is about and taking a new direction and talking about outsiders and inside, you know, just a really beautiful, what you know, really deeply thought about chat about, you know, you know what branding can mean and and what they're going to do with the business.
00:12:43
Speaker
Yeah, it was really good to um to read. I knew this story was coming, but I didn't actually know that Charlotte, who I've met a few times, was ah the new head brewer. So I was stoked when all of a sudden I saw the pictures of her and her quotes and I was like, oh, wow, this is a lovely read. And it's great to see her go from ah strength to strength in the in the beer industry too.
00:13:01
Speaker
Yeah, 100%. And talking people who give great copy. And when we were about to start recording this intro, um I had a missed call from Stu
Interview: One Drop Brewing's Success and Strategy
00:13:09
Speaker
Whitecross at Voyager. And while I was off applying some sunscreen, you took took the call from him. So he had a bit of an update on Grainstock, the the festival and conference that we're partnering with them on later in the year.
00:13:20
Speaker
Yeah, definitely. So they ah by the time you hear this, they will have released tickets to Grain Stock. You can get them at grainstock.com.au. ah They're available now. ah you and There's the option to obviously just buy tickets, but brewers who want to come along, there's um there's a sort of means to donate some beer for the consumer-facing beer festival.
00:13:40
Speaker
and get yourself a free free ride on a bus from one of the major cities to get, which would be which would be a great time. i think we probably have to go up too early, so I won't be able to be on one of these buses, but maybe I'll see if I can catch one home.
00:13:55
Speaker
grains stock have beer wheel travel um yeah know we we'll We'll update our event listing on the website as well. And we'll also, obviously, it I and think we mentioned before, we sat down with Stu and but Brad, the two fans of Voyager at the Whitton Malthouse a few weeks ago.
00:14:08
Speaker
So we'll run that podcast chat with them and which has a lot more about information on the back background to grain stock and what their and and their hopes are for it. So we'll run that in the next couple of weeks as well. Which brings us to this week's guest. And this was a very nearly a ah ah lost episode. it would have been our first lost podcast recording.
00:14:26
Speaker
There was a couple of issues when you sat down with the team at One Drop early in the year, James. Yes, yes. um ah yeah yeah You admittedly, i have to hold my hands You said it several weeks ago. You were like, I think we just have to run this as audio only. i think I said it the week ah of. i'm um I tend to give up pretty easily though.
00:14:43
Speaker
um yeah I sat down with them in the upstairs and this is the gin bar at their at at their brewery in Botany. um It was one of the most lovely backdrops I've had for any video we've shot, but it was it was it' the first time ah we'd use a new setup of the the two two new cameras.
00:14:58
Speaker
two mics, I didn't have the producer there. All seemed to go lovely, apart from the fact one of the settings was on some crazy settings, so was recording such high definition that the chat actually filled my entire laptop's hard drive, and we didn't realize, but we actually lost the last, I think, three minutes of video, which meant I had a corrupted file.
00:15:15
Speaker
I tried to find ways of recovering it. I did actually ah did actually recover it at one stage, but instead of paying the $140 to get it then, we thought we'd bring it back to Melbourne and do it through ah podcast producer's subscription. And then we've never got it to work since.
00:15:27
Speaker
We've taken the file into a studio, thats podcast studio, run it for 15 hours through a program to try and fix it, um and eventually decided you know it's just not going to happen. um However, we we still had the the full audio from it. There was a little bit of work to be done to tidy up the last couple of minutes of audio because of what it had done to my...
00:15:45
Speaker
my laptop um and yeah so you had to mentally put yourself back into sort of i guess february march time when we did the interview um because we the reason why this chat is that i was in sydney but also it was on the back of the gab's hottest 100 they just landed we jamming in the top 10 which is a pretty amazing result so there's lot of chat about um that beer their approach to brewing you know their their their shock ah when and when one of the various beaches they were on, they they heard they broke in the top 10.
00:16:14
Speaker
um But again, they they're the people that they just talk so well. They talk about contained chaos. They talk about being collectively creative, like, even though even Even the way the three of them came together, which I won't reveal now, is so serendipitous. like It's such a beautiful story.
00:16:29
Speaker
um and I think it it just really feels i like that these these three people were meant to work together. um and they they just just You can look at what they do in terms of the beers they put out there, the frequency of beers, the type of beers, and go...
00:16:42
Speaker
is crazy and how do you do it? But once you actually hear them talk through it, it's like, oh, well, that's that's kind of all they could ever do. That's what that's what they have to do. And I guess that's why it works so well for them because it is actually a genuine representation of who they are as as people and as a collective.
00:16:58
Speaker
Yeah, definitely. I only got to actually listen to it this week and it was ah fascinating to hear those aspects of the story and and tip as well, the yeah the way they come together to make beers. ah you You never know how these things work from the outside. So it's really interesting to hear them yeah go through it. And yes, I think it starts with you talking to them in Nick's old apartment, which he also lived above the brewery, which is very unsurprising given he lived in the UK for a long time.
00:17:23
Speaker
Yeah, yeah know they've made it into this lovely looking gin bar. I think it looks so lovely. That's why I was holding on going, I will recover this video somehow. But yeah, he he lived up there for a period period of time. And once they started the brewery, like you know Clay and Megan sold their house to fund the business. like It's a pretty and amazing tale. And our producer done a pretty good job of tidying up the brewery.
00:17:43
Speaker
audio audio as well. There was a few coughs along the way. Clay was actually really, really sick at the time and didn't really want to come in to do it, but thankfully did because I think having that three-way sort of synergy between them was fantastic.
00:17:54
Speaker
i'm So, yeah, so no video this time around, but it is it's a really great chat. I think for anyone who wants any idea how they do what they do, it becomes very, very apparent, you know, through through the chat.
00:18:05
Speaker
um And also, you know, and how they... feel that what they do and what other people are doing was kind of needed to sort of change up um the way that craft beer had been going and how it had been sort of pigeonholed as pale male and stale and how they're very much not that. So yeah, it's really great chat, um I think. um Just a shame it's taken such a long time to to get it to people. But, you know, hopefully these things are timeless in a way.
00:18:28
Speaker
Yes, definitely. ah They're a great brewery. And if you'd like to shout out a great brewery, then why don't you let us know via Bluestone Yeast ah Brewery of the Month. If there's a brewery you love for any reason, whether it's the beers, the gin bar, the location or anything like that, or just the people behind us, then you can let us know at craftybind.com slash bluestone.
00:18:49
Speaker
Yeah, and I've updated that page in the last few days as well. So now you can see we've got a Hall of Fame on there of all the previous winners. So if you want some inspiration to see what past winners have been nominated for, you can jump on there to get a few ideas.
00:19:01
Speaker
Yes, and if you'd like to shout out some good beer citizens, then do so too through our Have You Done A Rowlings campaign, which you'll hear one of during the yeah middle of this podcast. Sounds good. Excellent. Well, um before we go to the break and then come back with Nick and Clay and Meg, Will?
00:19:19
Speaker
Yes, Will, you might have a favourite brewery and a favourite beer person. And if you have a favourite beer podcast, make sure you leave us a ah review, a comment or like and subscribe. Cheers.
00:19:30
Speaker
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00:19:45
Speaker
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00:19:57
Speaker
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00:20:19
Speaker
Vic, Meg Clay, thanks for joining us. Thank for having me here at One Drop. Not in the brewery, where are we at this moment in time? We're upstairs in the gin bar. Formerly my house. Formerly your house, know yeah, see yeah. Pretty fancy. Didn't look like this back in the day.
00:20:35
Speaker
No, no, so this what this wasn't all your sort of home decor, no? i' Not in the air con, no. But maybe the dartboard. Yeah, maybe the dartboard. Well, I figured we'd even though I want to go into your backstory at some point, i maybe start with like the present. So just a few weeks ago, you guys landed the top 10 in the GAPS Potence 100 with a beer that doesn't normally sort of appear that high up in the in the um in the countdown. So how how was that? yeah I'm assuming maybe you've given up on the beer actually appearing in the in the top 100 by the time you got to the Top 20 or the top 10? Pretty much. i was kind of confused because I thought, well, how could it slip so hard from last year's 40? So I was a bit confused. Hopeful.
00:21:15
Speaker
Still hopeful. But then, yeah, it started to think, no, top 10, no way. No, I'd given up hope after 20, think. Me too. I was just like, no. I had just this little kind of confused feeling from the teens.
00:21:26
Speaker
was like, where where are we, you know? Yeah. Because we put out a campaign, well, campaign, couple of posts. Yeah. And we asked. Bad video. Yeah. And we're just asking people, like, in general, if you like what we do, it's so hard to put every SKU up for the whole year. because it Yeah, can please vote for these 140 bits.
00:21:43
Speaker
but So we thought, you know what, if you just like what we do in general, we jammin's it. If you want to vote for us, just vote for we jammin'. It's a smoothie sale. We do those. you like any of them this year and you want to vote for one, just, you know, a I mean, myself and Meg were sitting at the beach in the swim, listening to the live broadcast.
00:22:03
Speaker
It was our wedding anniversary. no we don ice We could hear the shock in your voice when it came up. so Well, we were sort of, we we're not giving like full insight, I've given like the 100 bit, not in any order, so we didn't know when stuff's coming in.
00:22:15
Speaker
and i was like And I was like, they can't have given us the right... list because like the old beer hadn't appeared. I was like, there's no way double fruit smoothie sour is coming in the top 10. I was like, we're going to have to like, you know, we're go have to scramble here. And then when it came in, it was like, whoa. you text my So I was at the beach too. And I was like, All right, whatever. Top 20 ever. Let's go back to the brewery for pizza.
00:22:38
Speaker
And then i was waiting in line and then one of the girls ah behind the bar came over and she goes, Nick, did you see? And I was like, no, we didn't get in. She's like, no, no, we got in. I turned around because we were playing it on the TV. a It was like,
00:22:50
Speaker
10 weird jam and was like holy fuck and then you text me straight like is there anything you'd like to say? Yeah it's just a list of expletives basically. I know you just cut it in now, edited it in but yeah pretty much like holy fuck. Yeah yeah yeah it was it was cool it was like you know and like Seeker getting in at 19 or whatever like it was a really it was nice for us the first time we did the countdown to have so many smaller breweries and like cool beers get in there it felt the last few years it had been kind of the same things just shuffling around a little bit so Yeah, pretty cool.
00:23:16
Speaker
I mean, in terms like pushing that, know, one thing I was thinking about is that a lot of the breweries tend to tell people to vote for their biggest seller or their flagship beer. you're obviously exciting down a different route. Like what was the thinking behind that? Is that because, you know... don't really do like volume in the sense of the biggest seller. I think we all agreed that Wee Jammin was just the one that we had. It was our first smoothie sour. It's the OG smoothie sour. Yeah, was the first, first smoothie sour that we had done when it was just the weirdest thing to do. And we liked it and we just kept bringing it back and I had the most demand just to bring back rather than like a volume pull. It definitely picked up a bit of a following in the last couple years. How often do you brew it? Is it pretty much year-round? Just whenever we can sample it. How many times year was two or three times last year? Three times last year. We dropped it down to 375 as well last year. redesigned it.
00:24:07
Speaker
It looks great. Sharp as. Yeah, I'm happy with it. yeah i mean I guess that was the first of you fruited, crazy smoothie sours. Do you have any idea how many of beers of that ilk you've made since? Hundreds. yeah Hundreds. It's got to be. It's got to be. yeah That style, so lactose and fruit, however want put a label on the front of what it is, at least 50% of the beers would be. Yeah.
00:24:30
Speaker
yeah Because how many what's your average output like limited releases a week? Is it two, three, four, five? Four, five, six a fortnight. Okay. Minimum four. And then up to eight, even in December last year, we put out eight in a fortnight for December.
00:24:43
Speaker
And how does that go? Because like the team obviously isn't huge. like You're still a pretty small brewery. is the trick. Yeah. Right. And then most people you know out there have been doing less limited releases because of the way the market's going. And a few you know still put a lot out, but you must do it at least up yeah up there with Rocky Ridge or whatever like in in terms of the most. And there must be a huge workload involved in you know designing each recipe, coming up with a name, label design, packaging. like Can you give us some sort of insight into how much does go into maintaining that? Because it sounds pretty well exhausting from the outside.
00:25:16
Speaker
Very early on, I think we all agreed that we would play to our strengths. And um where you saw a lot of breweries who started around the same time as us who were doing limited releases started to like really push a call and a like can i you know like committed to that volume yeah kind of game, we were just like,
00:25:36
Speaker
That's that. We wouldn't even know where to, like, that's not our strength. Yeah. So. The beers, the cold beers are good though. No, they're great. But at that time, just wasn't what we felt excited by. Yeah. We didn't know history in sales. We didn't know, we didn't know how to talk them. None of our strengths is that sales side. And we had a lot of fun with,
00:25:58
Speaker
coming up with these new beers and creating really great experiences for each different one from the copy on the back like we really had a good time doing it so if you just take like one new beer or one like series of new beers how does the process work then is it case of you going I want to do this I mean like it's interesting that today you've got to cashew fruit salad going on downstairs, you know, yeah a lot of the ideas of like, I think, play on that last question to like, we're very creative people. and So like, yes, it's high workload. But it's also like something we love doing to like the creative aspect is something that's obviously a strength of ours. And that's now part of what we do. yeah
00:26:36
Speaker
um So new beers, like we have a general idea of what we're making over the year. But what we're actually in social, we're going to make a sour of this day, but we'll the three of us decide what goes in it. and yeah you know The cashew fruit wine we're doing today was Meg lived in Brazil for a while, right?
00:26:53
Speaker
Yeah, was there about six months when I was 20 years old and I was just shocked that every cashew nut had a whole fruit attached to it. It's one nut per fruit, isn't it? It's very good. It's any wonder they're expensive compared to salted peanuts. And at that time, the juice was going around. It a really common breakfast drink. Also, there's a bit that editors use regularly because you never see cashew fruit stuff. Exactly. So I got little bit obsessed with it because it was something that I'd just never seen before. went to the largest cashew tree, all of that. So it was just this juice that I remembered when were talking about it because it has quite a high acidity naturally.
00:27:34
Speaker
So we talked about it and we thought, you know what, let's experiment with it. We've experimented with so many crazy fruits. So that was just one that we thought, let's try it. So this specific one is a mixture of this fruit.
00:27:45
Speaker
but I never heard all the names. Are you gotta fucking try it? We got a sample from our fruit dealer. And I was like, oh, that's pretty yum. But the second half of the fun there is like asking our fruit guy to go and find this really obscure fruit, which we've done multiple times. And he's like,
00:27:58
Speaker
All right. So you don't hear from him for like two months yeah about it. And he's like, I've got a pellet ready. And I was like, what? A ton cashew fruit. it's juiced? Or are you having to juice it yourself? So how our fruit guy works is he'll either source the processed fruit already or he'll source the base fruit and a local processor nearby. And then he does the logistics of those three things. So gets the fruit through the process. It gets processed. Juice, concentrate, puree. Usually a puree.
00:28:24
Speaker
And then ships it here with, because he's shipping from around the world, he just chuck it in there. and Yeah. Thank you. Yeah, so we've done stuff out of Brazil and out of Thailand and you say it's not even just like the recipes and the the name of the beer or whatever. It's like there's all this other shit going on in the background, you know, to to make it all happen as well. Yeah.
00:28:41
Speaker
Yeah. Everyone, including like all the supplies, work pretty hard in terms of putting that final product together. Yeah, for sure. Like, would you know, the hops we go on source or even the guys we get our malt off in New Zealand, like, because we're not just buying from a storefront like, you know, our suppliers pretty intimately now yeah because we're very Picky. And let's say once you've got the stuff for here and the beers made, like where's the naming coming from? Who's doing the graphic design? like Who's doing the cop copy and everything? so um We've got a like in the beginning, it was all quite frantic because we're just, you know, creativity can be really messy. yeah
00:29:14
Speaker
But we've found a really good kind of vibe. So um each of us is in charge of certain things and then we all contribute together. um You know, sometimes...
00:29:25
Speaker
I'll be like, oh, i don't know what to do for this can. And and then I'll get some ideas from the guys or like what fruits. And then like it's just a it's a tidy process, but we're all kind of in and out of each other's realm.
00:29:38
Speaker
Yeah. eight which Which is great because you're collectively creative, which is part of the core of what we do. Yeah. And do you have like a ah design that's just, was going to ask about what your favourite beer is, but, you know, in terms of a favourite design over the years or a favourite name for a beer that really sort of stands out from the 5,000 you've put out in six years? No, I can't think of anything that I can. I mean, I like the, I don't know. What tastes go on was the beer we named the IPA?
00:30:07
Speaker
We didn't can it. Oh, no, it's still going on about it. That was like the first IPO we put on tap. Didn't count. It was on the bar. It was on the bar. Maybe it was on holiday. and Clay named the beer. Alpha Kenny one.
00:30:19
Speaker
There you go. It was like, Alpha Kenny one. And everyone was like. People coming up to the bar saying, I'll get an Alpha Kenny one, please. Yeah, yeah. if you say that real fast, it sounds a bit. Yeah, yeah. Didn't make it onto a can though. No.
00:30:31
Speaker
Boys will be boys. Great IPO though. Yeah. um And i was say one of the questions I'd said over it was like, you know did you feel you made a rod for your own bat with this limited release schedule? But it sounds like you do actually thrive on it. This is this is like who you are kind of thing.
00:30:45
Speaker
pushed it six months out now. yeah So it's not that it's messy. It's lot easier working now. We're working month to month at one point, week to week. Week to week. And now we've found a decent groove. So it comes pretty natural, I think, for the three of us. Contained. Contained chaos. Yeah, yeah. Contained man. Yeah. I think that's the way that most people seem to operate in this industry. I'm definitely, don't know if I'm contained, though. think I'm just chaos. Yeah.
00:31:10
Speaker
But you play for your strengths, right? Yeah. there You have to. yeah yeah Yeah. I think you have to be chaotic just to get get through in this this current year as well. And maybe aside from the fruits, you obviously work a lot with lactose. there' Are there other sort of unusual ingredients that you've worked with outside of you know all the fruits and stuff like that? you know Is there anything you've sort of gone, ah maybe we can make a beer with this and no one's sort of tried that? Yeah, we'll be using coconut.
00:31:34
Speaker
powder like coconut cream powder recently and a few of our kind of more smoothier creamier beers which you would have seen come out since what Gads probably yeah that's been a really annoying product challenging product to play with and so when one of these beers does come up the guys the brewers are like yeah In terms of challenging and what's getting stuck in the brewery. You get it dissolved promptly without clumps and then like it's naturally thick and then getting that to melt with the beer to not split. Yes, you've just got some lumps like when almond milk doesn't work well in your coffee or something. I can't drink that. So we've played with that. It's like happening States quite a bit too. and these
00:32:15
Speaker
kind of products we use come and go. yeah So they, you know, we use them. There was a point where we were trying to like how much lactose can we fit the beer? And all right, we've reached that li bit. Now it's pulled back. and We know how to use it. yeah I think the same was with the fruit. I think the same with the acid culture we use. So there always been new ingredients that we're playing with on the side that don't make it into a beer or onto the side of the can.
00:32:37
Speaker
And there's some that make it through and we have a play with for a couple of months and then it kind of dives off. So we're always looking and exploring for like those innovative and different products. And if you had to like custom like redesign the brewery or refit stuff along the way to be able to, you know, do some of this stuff? Funny story. ah there When we order new equipment, there is always something that goes into it about that customization process because of we know what.
00:33:03
Speaker
works now or what could work in the future. So the centrifuge and how we operate that that's been that clean fusion dry hopping process came from. yeah um and then we got some new fermenters 18 months ago, and they have a few more designs on it allow us to mix the tank better and stuff. So yeah, as we grow into what we're making, which we know now, and future equipment will reflect that.
00:33:25
Speaker
And how how's you sort of got to that point as well? Because you know, there's been so many times that where I've tried to be all in just been getting the beers and you just like reading the label going, there's just no way i can see how that'll work and be that I'll enjoy it. And then you have it. It's like, like it like it all really works well together. And like, had is that something that's come over time from experimenting? Or do you think it's just something that you you have within your brain or your you know innately that you kind of ah know how these things we'll work together or what volumes to use like we I think we all love food. Yeah. So the three of us as well as like the rest of the team.
00:33:59
Speaker
So like we're constantly talking about that. Where do we eat? What do we cook? And we make a home. So I think we've all got a pellet for that kind of thing. Yeah. But when it comes to these crazy concoctions, if you come into the one drop brand now, and you really can you're like, what the is going on. If you rewind back to where we had an alpha Kenny one on tap, we were like, there was like a blueberry sour a passion fruit, Sarah.
00:34:21
Speaker
So but we've had six years of building on the shoulders of working with other ingredients. And so we know how those ingredients work in beer. So we can make like an 85% guest amount of, all right, let's combine those. And then we'll throw a wild card in there and see what happened.
00:34:35
Speaker
We'll put a small amount out it. And if it works, then we, then you can up it. and and So if you come in and have one drop now, yeah, you're asking questions that you just asked. How the fuck do you know that all this is going to work? But it's, yeah it's, we're standing on the shoulders of six years of R&D. Yeah. so And there seems to be a few sort of, you know, in jokes along the way as well, like the 420 grams of fruit. Are there any any other other things that you sort of keep sort of, you know,
00:34:57
Speaker
You've got to keep an eye out for them, man. There's drinks everywhere. But I guess it is like that must be part of what keeps entertaining for you guys as well. it's Obviously, you know the beers and the i guess the feedback you're getting, but is that part of it as well? like Just keeping humour within the brand as well? For sure.
00:35:13
Speaker
Yeah, differently. Yeah. It's fun. It's playful. It's not bears, not serious. This isn't a serious thing. Yeah. And what about the, was it something that started at Gab's the first time like the the slushy, you know, and the ice cream beers and stuff like that? How did that all sort of come about?
00:35:29
Speaker
ah COVID. i I remember closing your minds. That's cool. I found an ice cream machine. no one was like party shop, right? No one's using them because it's No one's having a party. Well, they shouldn't be.
00:35:41
Speaker
And there were a few guys in Europe doing these ice cream beers. And so just said, like, cool this place up. And they're like, you know, we charge you out 180 bucks a day. I was like, how about I give you 180 bucks a fortnight? Cause it's just sitting there doing nothing. So we got an ice cream machine and call these guys up. was like, can we get an cream machine fuck around? Like we're not doing anything. tax are half full, blah, blah.
00:36:02
Speaker
And then way we spent ages getting that right, what beers work in that and what we have to do in the beers. And we got to a point where we didn't have to do much or if anything, and we were able to kind of serve on this ice cream machine. What is the process to actually get the beer working in the ice cream? For our beers? Just pour it in. And what's the basis? Use the most like it like just, I guess, simple flavor or whatever of ice cream and just let the beer...
00:36:29
Speaker
No, no, no. We just pour beer. Oh, you pour it in out and that just turns to freeze it. Okay. in this ah r and d like In this process during COVID, we don't do these a lot. Yeah, so there's so there's no like additional thing. I guess you have to pick the right beer to do it. so We do it by design, right? So we're not putting every beer through ice cream machine. The lager hasn't gone through. No, not yet. Not yet. What a bit of bitter malty ice cream, anyone?
00:36:51
Speaker
ah Yeah, we we, by design, we you go, all right, cool. We don't have, like, we're running over the next beer to put in the ice cream machine. So when we come up with another one, we're designing that in the back end to be poured straight in, which is part of the whole R&D COVID process. Yeah.
00:37:06
Speaker
And does that, and does that sort of cause issues as well? Like, does the ice cream machine need taking apart regularly to, you know, it up? We're back it away for the winter. It's it's a challenge to, you know, not clog it up and,
00:37:18
Speaker
yeah Overheat it with all the random stuff we put through it. But yeah, we pack it away over wintertime and then bring it back to the summer. Fair enough. And then talking of challenges and clogging things up, what have been like, have there been any real major issues that you faced in the brewery when you have tried something or, you know, put some ingredient through that just didn't want to didn't want to be in beer, didn't want to be in a tank?
00:37:39
Speaker
we We burnt a bunch of white nectary when we decided to do one of our, because we've got 50 heads downstairs, to do one of our large batches of slushy beer. And that was so fucking gross. Like I couldn't turn that, none of us could turn that around.
00:37:55
Speaker
We dumped all that. out That wasn't great. The rest the years, it was like some Fajola. It was quite sandy. it's kind of like fused that like four times, which is fun. It's interesting. I think back to maybe sort of 10, 12 years ago when people started to do a bit of lactobacillus sours or sort of a bit of bread. are freaking out going, if you do this, it's going to destroy the whole brewery for anything else. And you guys, I guess, there hasn't really been anything that you haven't put through. So I mean, I guess it was just careful management or whatever. Yeah.
00:38:24
Speaker
and like he's an ingredient and you realize that's not how he use that and you call around or we do it beforehand and ask others like again the industry is on the shovels of the generation for us exterior so it's cool up the phone and go have you guys used cocoa nibs them boil before here or whatever right and a lot of people are now asking us about that because we're noticing a lot more people making smoothie salads or these big pastry styles and stuff. So we're getting we're feeling a lot of fun calls for that too. Like, hey, how do I use ingredients?
00:38:52
Speaker
Learn yourself. imagine that yeah yeah So yeah, there's always challenges with those newer ingredients. Yeah, we've got a way of doing it here.
00:39:03
Speaker
That works for us. and And of all the beers you have made over the time, is there that's close to each of your hearts? like Is it just like your lager or your pale or or is that is it one of the, you know, just eat you in turn like one beer that I'm not saying it's the one you want to drink all the time, but the one that you just love every time it's around.
00:39:23
Speaker
things was more style based. Yeah, it's reflected on what we made. We've always kind of picked four styles that like Nick really loves the lagers and clays into the hoppy IPAs. And I've always been about fruited sours from the beginning. So between the three of us, we also like the pastry and period stats as well. So you like double take, like the biggest of the fruited sours or is that where you sit now? Just all of it. Just all of it. I don't actually drink the IPAs in the lagers.
00:39:53
Speaker
and What about your favourite IPA? Because what what was the one of the early Clean Fusion ones that went on to win the gold? i I mean, I took them back over to the UK. You gave me a few when the first Clean Fusion came out.
00:40:04
Speaker
And there was a double IPA that was just so it was it not twisted. What was it? There was one that was just so and faded. Yeah, it could have been. Yeah, it was just such a we used to do that. And then we did one with clean fusion. Right. Can't remember.
00:40:14
Speaker
Yeah. I remember one of the early ones. So yeah, banging. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. um That. Yeah. we we We try to do that process more often than not now, which is great. Sometimes it cool out in the can. Sometimes you don't. yeah we've had some some international breweries that really love and using that concept yeah push it around so it's cool it seems to have some legs so yeah so despite the fact that you are the brewer behind all this like crazy willie wonka stuff as well lagers your thing big time yeah yeah full circle Yeah, it's so on our equipment, I mean, most equipment, I would say it's the hardest to make or here anyway. Yeah. So yeah, kick out that the challenge of making a really, really nice lager but and you prefer the more traditional ones or this, know, the more contemporary like West Coast sort of stuff. Bohemian style. yeah Yeah, yeah. So around like,
00:41:03
Speaker
Yeah, ah Germany, Czech Republic, Central European. You made like an Adriatic or something like last year or something. it was just It was like, I couldn't drink that any quicker if I tried. It was just like so well balanced and so delicious. So yeah, we've got r RO water so we can play with the water profile and we can that's what we play with in the water.
00:41:22
Speaker
like How can you make a lot of fun? yeah How do you make a lot of fun and actually and get people to buy it? So, yeah, we played with water profiles from different parts of the world and then themed these lagers and pilsners from like, you know, originally Italy or a place in Croatia.
00:41:38
Speaker
Greece, Fiji. I it was the Croatia one was thinking of. Jamaica, Spain. um So that's cool for a brewer's perspective. It's like there was like talk to or like people in the machine like geek out about like, you know, this shouldn't work on a water profile, but it does.
00:41:54
Speaker
um So like the Italian pills that we did, but the last three have been far more traditional. So we had the chosen one, which was probably my favorite so far. I think King's side, which is what we're drinking, which is our birthday.
00:42:05
Speaker
Bohemian Lager with Vyman, which was like a dream collab to try and get and it was incredible. But yeah, that's definitely where my passion lies in the lager. For sure. Yeah, there we go.
00:42:16
Speaker
Now we'll, um, let's go. We'll take a quick break now and then come back around to chat about the background to the One Drop story and maybe where you're heading. Cool. It's time for Have You Done A Rowlings?
00:42:28
Speaker
Proudly presented by the legends at Rowlings labels. For the very best digitally printed cans and cartons with no MOQ, visit rowlingsprint.com.au and chat to Brad and Paul today.
00:42:43
Speaker
Okay, it's time for another one of our Have You Done A Rallying celebrations of the country's good beer citizens. We've got a couple of crackers for you this month as well. um First up, Honourable Mention comes from Craig Maiden, a.k.a. Beers Illustrated, based in Queensland.
00:42:58
Speaker
Will, who is he nominated? Yeah, I mean, Craig is someone that will be known to a lot of people in the Queensland beer industry and further afield. And these two people that he's nominated, it will certainly lead to be known, I reckon to almost everyone and maybe beer lovers across the country too.
00:43:13
Speaker
He's nominated Josh and Matt from Hopon Brewery Tours. Anyone who's met those two know just how passionate they are about the local beer industry. Their tours are awesome. ah This is all me editorialising here. But Craig said that On top of everything they do to get feet in the door of tap rooms in South East Queensland, Joss's work with the Queensland Royal Beer Awards as head steward has been tremendous.
00:43:36
Speaker
Yeah, we did a feature on stewarding at beer awards and Joss was our our main star of that feature couple of years back as well. And yeah it's It's rare that you would go to any sort of major beer event, whether it's consumer facing or industry facing around Australia and not see one or both of Joss and Matt there um getting fully involved. um Yeah, they'd they'd be as as good supporters of um beer in Australia as anyone you could find.
00:44:01
Speaker
Yeah, definitely. They often, um I saw they brought the team from Matic down to Bendigo on the Hop, where they even organized everything just so the busy brewery owners wouldn't have to, you know, stress about all those.
00:44:11
Speaker
They just it turned up and were like people on their Hop on Brewery tours, were just sort of chauffeured around the the beautiful beer venues and breweries. would love Yes. So it's to take quite something to to top Joss and Matt, but the ah winner chosen this month for the Have You Done a Rallyings was nominated by Ian Miller.
00:44:34
Speaker
um So who who's he put forward then, Will? Yeah, um Ian Miller, by the way, he's ah from the the Australian Rod Builder Company. He makes some very good fishing rods. I gave him a Google last night.
00:44:47
Speaker
So if you want a fishing rod, maybe reach out to Ian as well. ah He nominated Damien Martin of Dangerous Ales. He said, you probably know Damo, but probably don't know how many good deeds he's done for so many people.
00:44:58
Speaker
This includes helping other local breweries with advice and hands-on help with issues and problems they have. um He's invested in the local community and hospitality businesses. He's also happy to pass on his wealth of brewing knowledge to anyone else.
00:45:10
Speaker
And Ian says he's watched him help a homebrew in the pub recently and he gifted the guy with a bag of ingredients as well. ah The guy was a complete stranger and didn't even realise he was talking to the boss of the brewery. His chef training as well holds him in great stead when it comes to understanding flavours and tastes.
00:45:26
Speaker
and has helped many understand better with welcome advice, including EM himself. um So yeah, you never hear it out of him, but Damo is a very modest person who does great work. I think that's definitely true. He's a pretty chilled out guy, Damo, coming from a bodyboarding background.
00:45:42
Speaker
Yeah, yeah um ah guess yeah. Everything that he's been doing, like, you know, i think we've talked about it before, whether on here or whether in articles, you know, we we like the the the uniqueness of the branding that they've they've done, um the quality of the beers, like winning back to back Indies trophies in the same category with different beers. um You know, I love the fact that when I first met him, and we sat down to have a glass of k Crispy Boy, his like flagship lager, which I'd never had up until that point.
00:46:06
Speaker
And I was like, oh, it's like Napstein, like this one of those wonderful lost beers of Australia is this lager that Lyon used to make the Clare Valley. um And this beer, I was like, must have Nelson Soba in it. And it did. And he goes, what's Napstein? I'm like, oh, my God, you basically recreated one of these incredible beers.
00:46:24
Speaker
that so many people miss having, you know and you didn didn't even know it existed. you did He goes, I was just trying to make the lager that I want to drink. i was like, well, you've just made one of these, you know, essentially a recreation of this phenomenal beer that, you know, was was knocked on the head by Lion a while back. But yeah, really, really lovely guy, i'm surrounded by a bunch of good people. um And yeah, so a very worthy winner. um So we'll pass the details on to ah the legends at Rallings we'll sort him out with a voucher um to spend as he would like to um on any of the labels printing stickers i wonder if he can get stickers for his surfboards or something like that yeah maybe maybe um but I think yeah two wonderful nominations there always looking for more so if you'd like to put forward a good beer citizen um doesn't have to be someone working in the industry could be someone just around the industry who's doing something great in the community then all you have to do is jump online to craftypint.com slash Rallings cheers back to the show
00:47:19
Speaker
Need something printed, but it's only a short run? Talk to Rallings. Whether it's cans, cartons or coasters, Rallings has a solution for you. Visit rallingsprint.com.au today.
00:47:31
Speaker
All right, well, welcome back, everyone. Good to be back. Yeah, I think having started the present, would be great to go back to, I guess, before One Drop. um I mean, yeah what were you guys doing beforehand and how did you sort of get into beer and then end up here? Yeah.
00:47:45
Speaker
good We're going way back now. It's a whole other life. I can't remember it. Yeah. I was working in construction. meg was. was working for a tech company. Yeah. We had three kids, three young kids at the time. Yeah.
00:47:58
Speaker
And we decided that, well, yeah, we decided to quit our jobs at one point. um just go all in on ourselves do a bit of do a bit of work yeah um i started a small sort of food trucking business yeah and one of my first gigs was at batch barrenco so i went there i was like fuck this is pretty cool hung out for the day did a pig on the spurt all the punters enjoyed it came to make that that night and i was like i reckon we should build a brewery in botany
00:48:31
Speaker
but so So are you living here? Because you're you're from here. Yeah, I'm from here. We were living here at the time. we had three young kids, big dog. but What can we do to make our lives a bit harder? And then he um he comes home with a lot of ideas. yeah But that one, i don't know, I liked it. I was like, yeah, you know what, you're right because there's...
00:48:49
Speaker
you know, heaps of pubs and pokies and just didn't... It was just not... There were still tits and snuts back then. Yeah, there were still topless waitressing down the corner. Wow. It was just in... Yeah, just in... And it was not kind of family-friendly creative. Like, being from Botany, I was just...
00:49:08
Speaker
I don't know, there was nothing that was being created here that people were like, oh, I'm from Botany, that's where such and such is from. Yeah, and it's like it's only a world out, isn't You're sort of out on a sort of... Yeah. It's like Botany's out on a spit, isn't it? From the rest of Sydney kind of thing, yeah. It's a bit of pig sometimes. We just thought it would be a good idea that it would be good for the local area to start with and then it would give us a creative outlet because we weren't really getting that in the work that we were doing at the time, so... Yeah.
00:49:36
Speaker
Yeah, and we actually wanted to work together. So that was a project that we were quite excited to That's good hear. wife's like, would never, ever work with you. Tough enough living with you. So that's nice. That's good. Yeah, that was the start of it. And then we realised very quickly that neither of us had experience. And if we wanted to pay for this thing and get funding for it, we'd have to back it ourselves. So we sold our house pretty much to take it to the next level. And we...
00:50:03
Speaker
I think we were signing a 20-year lease and we didn't even have brewer. And we were like, you know what? Before we just like go all in on the hardest project of our life, yeah how about we take a bit of this cash and go on our dream holiday now. Oh, nice.
00:50:16
Speaker
Yeah. Let's go on our dream holiday now with our kids in case all this ghost hits up. At least we had our dream holiday, you So we took the kids to Europe, to Croatia, where my family are from.
00:50:28
Speaker
And we spent nine weeks there with no plan and just travelled around. And we ended up in Prague and Italy, and germany Germany. And then our last stop was in Zagreb. Mm-hmm.
00:50:41
Speaker
And Clay showed me this Instagram profile of some brewery in the arse end of nowhere in Zagreb. was like, that looks pretty cool. Let's just spend a Sunday there with friends. So we turned up.
00:50:53
Speaker
And as soon as the bar guys, that brewery, saw that Clay was wearing a greenstone, was like, oh, you've got to come back. I had brewers, a kiwi like you. You've got a medium. And I was like,
00:51:04
Speaker
We're in Croatia and there's ah one other Kiwi in the country right now. launch And he's a brewer. We've got to meet him. And Clay did go back the next day. i was in the apartment with the kids and he came back after meeting Nick and he said, I've just met our head brewer. He doesn't know it yet.
00:51:22
Speaker
yeah but he's that he brought the seed planted and um and then it turned out to be true so fast forward and how long have you been at garden brewery but three h about three years yeah and was that your first uh brewing gig or you been i've been in london so i was working under american brewer making american beer in england yeah so it's kind of cool uh we're the first get a candlelight etc but that was my first head brewer slash consulting gig. So I helped build the brew and build it up, train the staff. So it's kind of like a cool project.
00:51:54
Speaker
And then after about three years, Clay came in and he's like, can you have look around the brewery? job i starting to bery in sydney I was like, yeah, like fucking everyone else. He looked there and he was like, yeah, everyone's starting to brew.
00:52:08
Speaker
Don't worry. It's the end thing right now. Were you sending beer? Beer was coming from Garden to Australia. what That that i started as I was leaving. okay yeah So the export market started to up quite a bit. And we were doing...
00:52:20
Speaker
We have a pretty big R&D program here too. So love sales and stouts and stuff. So we can play around, which is cool. Yeah. um But yeah. yeah Yeah, was that was it. 2018 you came, I think, September? yes so yeah Yeah, so we had already started the bones construction. And then we're like, oh, we've got this empty space upstairs. We'll just turn it into an apartment and give you like ah a year just to get on your feet. And so this was his house. This was it. Because Croatia pays very poorly. Yeah. that's how i was going arrive beautiful country in sydney i'll just jump straight into a place yeah yeah so that yeah it served its purpose for a year yeah so how long were you um you sort the three of you working on this project before you open things you opened jan 2019 yeah which was nice being botanese to you know 2019 postcode all all very neat nice and neat but as that back story is the fact that you're from go out courgette visiting you know your home country and kiwis meet up or whatever
00:53:16
Speaker
But I guess how long was we over here still with the three you get getting it all ready to go. I signed up. I signed. on say April 2018 and then worked from afar because Kreish was going to its summer. So it's like peak production.
00:53:31
Speaker
So I kind of worked on the project from a distance and you guys are already been, what, two years in before that? June, June 23rd, 2018, we got the keys this place. We just fucking started coming out. Prior to that, Clay and I were working on it since like start of 2017 or the end of 2016, really. We had a couple of warehouses for fruit fall through. yeah yeah We've lost a lot of money.
00:53:54
Speaker
Just the typical heartbreak with all the big start-ups, the you know council pushing back. Like he was on the flight going, oh, okay, I'm just boarding my flight to move my whole life to this project. And we just have council approved. We just got to know. yeah Got to know.
00:54:09
Speaker
Well, yes, just come. Do it do we tell him? Just don't say anything. Just don't say anything.
00:54:15
Speaker
with patients and time. We just, you know, really kind of proved our case. Just persevered. Persevered. Just yeah went for First in the area, first for anything. It's going to always be difficult. so back then, it was there was no hint of anything. I remember i remember calling Richard Adamson. Yes.
00:54:33
Speaker
and asking him for a bit of advice and he goes are you the first in your council I said yeah he goes good luck is that yeah that's all I can give you sorry yeah because he had he had his full starts with young Henry's didn't he trying to get out of the line for a few years yeah yeah and one drop the names it's a music reference so where who's that come from Yes, that's ah that's the reggae beat, basically the one drop beat. Big reggae fan.
00:55:02
Speaker
sir It's all about community, creates ripple effects when you have one drop and hopefully brings everyone in. And that's something I'm the opposite. want to ask a well about your audience. I guess for a lot of the more out there, bit be it is you're selling them all over the country and overseas. And I'd imagine the sort thing that most people just buy one or two.
00:55:23
Speaker
but I remember when the first time I came in and it came in here, probably in 2019, you talked about the importance of community. And is that something that you've really fostered here within Botany? And is that more around the lagers and your XPA and IPAs and stuff like that? Or what's your audience ended up being over the years? there is fair I mean, it's grown. Yes, we have our lovely local community that, you know, week in, week out, they're here, they come with a kiss. Like we've seen babies born, wedding of the heads, then kids come back, they're already in school. Like we've seen yeah we've seen it all, you know.
00:55:56
Speaker
And then as we've grown our styles and, per you know, really like persevered with new styles, um yeah, we've got a really great following of people you know, sour beer drinkers, lager lovers, big stouts, like people kind of know these four core styles that we do. And then around each style, we've got these real lovers of that style.
00:56:21
Speaker
I mean, we get people who just fly in for the day. Yeah. Get pissed and then cruise on. Like, I've had people turn up like flights straight off, straight off a flight from China. Yeah. Talking about how they've been wanting to come. Wow. You know, and it's just so humbling. It's so cool. I think after COVID, where and a lot of people went digital, like, yeah, we have, as mixs as we have our community here and even like wider scenario, but I think a lot of our community is online and too, especially what we make and we engage with them and, um,
00:56:49
Speaker
I think we do a good job of that. And yeah, like Meg said, we've got this online community that people know about us. We're slowly bringing exporting products out to those markets. i mean, people coming from China or Taiwan or being straight here, grab a case or two and then... ah so So they've tried your beers, you know, from a craft beer at retail whatever, wherever they are in the world. And it's like, this is just... so or i It's worth flying halfway across the planet yeah just to go and see them at the source. We've found that our beer, like people will take it to parties.
00:57:20
Speaker
someone won't just take a can for themselves they'll share it with friends and they'll have something to talk about you know it's like a real cool conversation starter it's like oh check this beer out look at the artwork or read the back can you believe what's in it yeah and from that it really is old school word of mouth too people will really something to talk about and we've found that it spreads within a community pretty quickly if There's something interesting to talk about and they're really wowed by it. So it'll just flow on from there.
00:57:49
Speaker
Yeah, and people, I know you're obviously little bit sort of it out on your own in terms of the suburb. Like people regularly travelling across some other parts are seeking to come out here just to sort of... make a david over here or i guess now you've got a bit of a circuit i guess with the other i mean you know you look around there's zero walking traffic around here that's definitely a destination if you're coming to this part of botany you're definitely come we flying in around yeah you're flying flying around because it's so close yeah In terms of when you launched, I um i remember you had like, you know, Lager, XPA, Pale Ale, pretty much all of them picked up gold medals at Ava's straight away. And it's, you know, you could, I remember noticing that and going, oh, these guys know what they're doing making beer. You've got a good memory. Great memory. um But um i did you sort of think, well, that's the way we're going to go? We're going a community venue? Or did you think you'd ever be like you are now, like, you know, six years on and't fit where you sit? I don't think we ever put a box on it.
00:58:40
Speaker
No, but those was there were little yeah looking back now, though there were hints as to where we'd end up. Like I remember when we first started, you know, this core range, but there had to be a sour on there because I wasn't i love sour. I realised it wasn't that I didn't like beer. I just didn't know the style I liked.
00:59:00
Speaker
And sours weren't a thing until I tried one. Yeah. And then I was like, this is my style. And I went to every brewery around to try and get the best. And I always felt like, you're telling me there's hibiscus in here. Amazing. And then ah kind of felt like can't taste it.
00:59:16
Speaker
And then it was like always around the 3%. And I was like, okay, cool. I'm drinking like a couple, but now I just feel like full and I'm not getting anything out of that. hug in that yeah and then um And then we were talking about doing a sour and Nick's like, yeah, I'm working on this.
00:59:32
Speaker
passion fruit sour and I'm like, yeah, make sure it tastes like passion fruit. It's like challenge accepted, pouring all this passion fruit in there. And then ABV kind of jumped up to 6.2 and he was like, oh, that's a bit high. I'm like, oh, I don't know. You're like, no, no. What's wrong with it? And then I loved it. tasted like passion fruit. It had a good ABV on and that was it. big vibrant colour. So you're really the one that's responsible for all these insane high A.P. intruded beers for one drop. Maybe. I just always, like people, some of our beers very polarising. People will pick up a beer, they'll pour it, they'll drink it.
01:00:08
Speaker
Some people hate it. yeah But no one has ever said it doesn't do what it says it'll do on the can. yeah And that's a big thing for us. We're never going to put something on the can and say it's going to taste like this, this and this and this.
01:00:21
Speaker
but then you try it and it doesn't deliver at all. It always delivers whether you like it or not, yeah that's gonna be to to debate, right? Great that you've tried something new, but no one's ever said, it doesn't taste like that.
01:00:35
Speaker
They always say, okay, look, I don't like it, but it definitely does what it says in the can. So that's important. And is that sort of part of your thing, okay, if this is what I've got to I've got to make sure I push everything to the nth degree.
01:00:47
Speaker
No, that's just a Nick thing. I agree with Meg. Like when I arrived and you guys showed me around Sydney, like this is the best scene in Australia. Cause it's been like four years, five years since I'd left it. And I was in Perth. So it was like, we were still behind there anyway. Yeah. Apart from sort of feral and the two others, there wasn't much going. Yeah.
01:01:04
Speaker
Yeah. And, um, You know, I remember having distinctly remember having we had a raspberry, Sarah, one of the breweries and blueberries must have been in blueberry one another. And it was like this color slightly hazy.
01:01:15
Speaker
I'm sorry, this color slightly hazy. I'm like, I had a tangerine or tangible. I'm drinking. I'm like, yeah, okay. Like, because I'm in the industry industry, like industry I can taste the background. though But if I was a punter walking in to try a new brewery and you told me this had blueberry in it, but well it looks like you put little of cordial in the middle. So I agree me.
01:01:35
Speaker
we're designing a beer where and the boys are executing it downstairs it needs to like be exactly what we're trying none of this franklin spring water essence of you know that fruit so you know if it's a smoothie blueberry sour it's thick and it's got a bit of sweetness to it and a bit of vanilla and then like heaps of blueberry on the nose when you look at it's blurry you smell it's brewing you taste it's blueberry it's like Back to the last thing we do about some experience in a can is all we talk about in office like we don't want you filling your fridge with this as a fridge filling. We want you to go and find something else. And then talk take a can of Toodle Party and just be like gee have this crazy ass thing I've got.
01:02:16
Speaker
And you know that I think we're the products we make it for everybody. You know we're not pigeonholing to beer geeks or anything. It's like anyone can share anyone who drinkspose or drink eats for eats for drinks or drinks fruit.
01:02:29
Speaker
can explain have an awesome fun experiential times experience yeah and I mean I guess one thing listening to you know emphasizing how hard do you go with ingredients stuff like how do you actually make any money off these beers because it sounds Like it's just like there's no holds barred on what the lengths you'll go to to source ingredients, the amount of each ingredient you put in there. And like I know the, you know the tall boy cans are like, you know, you pay a premium for them, but it's not crazy. It's not like people were paying for like barrel-aged, you know, bolts that a few years ago. so I think it comes down to a really good team, really good teamwork and good process. yeah
01:03:07
Speaker
You can save a lot of cash in like fat, I guess. yeah We've learned that. we let Look, we learned... We learned how over the years where, you know, there's a cost to the chaos and there's a cost to not having really strong boundaries. So I think we're in a, yeah, I think we're really refined. That's when you added the containment to the chaos. Yeah, we started to like really give it some. Just putting of process in place and making sure that it followed it and everyone. Sounds like such a boring thing, doesn't it? But a few years ago was like, I need to put some process. I was like, oh, this is method. Right. It really is. It really is a good idea. mental health, wow. Exactly. Yeah, yeah. And I guess coming back to Boston, you know, when you opened, they just say it was like tits and schnitz, and now you've got like Slowlo not far from here and Beer Fontaine.
01:03:56
Speaker
Has it changed? Have you sort of helped change the wider suburb as well? or Okay, so it's sort of yeah changed a bit of the culture here as well? Yeah, yeah, absolutely. it's ah Yeah, it's just a – um I've seen a lot more younger families and young people move into the area. Yeah. um People who enjoy going out, spending a little bit of money on a nice beer and hanging out and in a different environment. that doesn't It's not you just your normal sort of working pub. Yeah. Yeah, we don't get people come down to one drop to get absolutely shit-faced on a Friday. He's the fourth team member making an appearance. He's been hiding for a very long time, so it's nice to have him out. He's only just started to make friends. Oh, there you go. Yeah.
01:04:37
Speaker
He attacked one of our bus staff. Yeah.
Community and Socializing in the Beer Scene
01:04:39
Speaker
I can't. Well, no, it wasn't that he attacked him. He just felt a little bit threatened. Yeah. So what says, people come down a Friday sort of for the experience of trying new stuff or the experience of being around, like the good food trucks or the music whatever you want. Yeah, a bit that. I mean, we run meat raffles for charities and stuff on a Friday afternoon.
01:04:58
Speaker
can we do a happy hour. We keep it real local. So, yeah, they'd we get a few people down, just come and hang out, socialise with their buddies, um yeah it's not which is yeah what you wanted from the start i guess so exactly yes all the other stuff's come along the way well it's been happening yeah the story i love telling um is when we all everyone did everything and start so we all worked the bar and everyone came and checked us out and started the mechanics remember this day when the mechanics came down and So we can actually add the old guy, old guys who run it, you got the middle tier in and the other the apprentices, right? So I've come down for years like, yeah, you know, what is everyone? All right, seven Bonnet Bay lagers. And what do you want, mate? And it's like the young, the young guy. And he's like, Oh, no, I'll try one of those blueberry salads.
01:05:41
Speaker
Right? i All right. Cool. Pay for it. Seven lagers come on the bar and then that this bright purple pint with a big pink head. And you know, like, don't what you can say in this podcast, but like, you know, this is what they say. Quite i quite like, yeah, poof there. Like, yeah, you know, you're drinking this.
01:05:55
Speaker
Blueberry thing, whatever. And then they're off drinking and hanging out. Like, all right, what's this new craft beer thing about? Four or five rounds later, old boys back up the bar and say, give me seven blueberry saupers and one lager. And you're like these have been drinking whatever for the last 40 years. And I've come down here and I've had this...
01:06:14
Speaker
they even know it was beer they this experience with a product to the point where they like to order it for everyone yeah and that was kind of seeing that and what those that can do you sometimes hear about those sort of conversions over a few weeks or months but to have it happen in the space of five beers this tower in we had a whole group of harley black Riders?
01:06:35
Speaker
Bikeys? Motorcycles. Motorcycles. They all turned up on a Sunday for lunch. There was about 30 of them. And they were ordering, it was the was like that oreo orange Oreo smoothie salad that we had done. Butterscotch. Butterscotch one. Butterlove. Butterlove. And there was like one guy ordered it. Everyone mocked him.
01:06:54
Speaker
By the end, everyone was drinking it. Like they were getting rounds, like 30-point trays of it. Like burly boys. And it was just, yeah, it was just funny. And, you know, they're not, I'm not going take that home and fill the fridge with them. No, no, no. Have a really awesome time here with that. And there'll be a time some down the line where they go, remember that thing we had? We should go back there one day and just see what else they're doing, you know? Yeah.
01:07:14
Speaker
And that's the thing. Every two. Well, they'll see stuff and they'll go to a bottle shop and they might see someone else's crazy salad beer and they'll try that because they've had an experience with, you know what I mean? It's not just VB or you can't draft or.
01:07:26
Speaker
Yeah. Definitely isn't either of those. No. Imagine that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And every two weeks we've just got an endless tap list. It's always different. You'll never come to one job after a month or two and it'll be the same. There'll be a different food truck.
01:07:41
Speaker
There'll be different beers on tap. It'll just be a whole new... I'm measuring it like that everywhere these days though. I bought a brewery and stuff. I'm not everywhere. I can all people have like have rained things in a bit more recently just, you know, with the
Creativity and Quality in Brewing
01:07:55
Speaker
way things are. Whereas you guys are going, no, no, foot to the floor. Come on, how far can we take this thing?
01:08:01
Speaker
we've run we've We've rained things in in other ways behind the scenes. yeah We have absolutely rained things in behind the scenes. But what we've... not reined in on and what we can't rein in on because it's just not part of is the ethos is being really creative, trying new things, seeing what's out there and just making things better all the time.
01:08:19
Speaker
yeah Yeah, that's great. Anyway, so yeah, past, present, future. So if there was like one thing you wish you'd known back in, whether it was 17, 18, 19, whatever, starting out, what would what would that be? No, we've learned pretty well from all the mistakes. So everything's been quite...
01:08:33
Speaker
I mean, if we were to build another brewery, yeah about it would be fucking way different to this. Okay. In what sense? just Just all the finer details like the plumbing, the flooring. Just things that you wish you knew, but then you kind of work around it. Surely that was Nick's job to turn up and tell you all that stuff. I didn't think we'd get this big, to be honest. We'd build as much contingency as we could. Saying that too, like...
01:09:00
Speaker
um who was his name who came yesterday justin justin came yesterday and he sort of alluded to like you know it's really cool how you can walk through the whole place and you're in the brewery and we get people comment on that you know because they'll come on a Thursday and Friday Wednesday afternoon and you've got the brewers who are running around in and out and and now and you like you can see them. You can see what's happening and what's going on. We sort of hidden yeah we always did have a vision of the place to be like that.
01:09:29
Speaker
Nothing to hide. so yeah Everything was kind of out. Yeah, with everything having gone so wonderfully well over the six years and counting, you had, if you have one piece of advice for someone getting into brewing now, which I guess is a weird question to ask the wider market. And a lot of creativity.
01:09:50
Speaker
yeah deeppos but and a lot of creativity yeah more more any good work good work eic more is a lot of I said one. least of a hundred. I would say, well, mine is the obvious one, but I would say authenticity. You have to do something that is aligned to you. You can't really go, oh, that's what that person's doing. I'll just do the same yeah because it will never work. That's definitely something that served us over the years is not looking outside to what everyone else is doing, but just to focus on what we want to do. We want to achieve what works. And from the beginning, it was.
Inclusivity and Future of Craft Beer
01:10:24
Speaker
quality like quality was number one yeah so we want to use the best ingredients we want to put out the best idea we possibly can want to look good we want to taste good yeah yeah that's sound when you read it yeah yeah that was interesting we sat down with um your mates banks last week and that was kind of their ethos it was just like that was it it's like quality and always be better always trying to improve over time yeah um had a good little story about you as well that we might use as the real to launch their podcast but anyway wait see we put it out there if i'll send it to you yeah and then i guess your hope for beer in the future whether that's for you guys or for sydney or for australia is like the one thing you'd love to see you know for the beer world well we saw when we started that people who live around our immediate where we are are actually really proud that we're here now like they're like oh yeah i'm from monday and people are like oh
01:11:15
Speaker
like me one drop they're like yeah yeah one drop from what they i mean i live near there and they're really quite proud of that it'd be so cool for australians to do that like you know if they're if they're out of australia they're like oh i'm from australia i like craft beer you like coffee oh you've got one drop locally but also here in australia as well that's so cool but because australians generally don't like to big up um themselves, which is kind of can be good in some ways, but there's also that sort of tall poppy syndrome that means that they, it's almost like you have to be successful overseas as an Australian to be respected locally or whatever. So, yeah. but some
01:11:51
Speaker
Yeah. have have you only if you found that but for yes I don't get that. well I don't thought i'd get it. What do you mean? Oh, no, as in like it seems to me you that Australians like to cut anyone down that's having success and like they'll only sort of get respected if they actually become successful overseas. And then it's like, oh maybe they're actually quite good.
01:12:06
Speaker
oh You what I mean? There's there's this that the tall poppy thing. with oh those but Well, actually, we got a lot of that when we started. Big time. oh going We got a lot of like hate online. It was really shit, actually.
01:12:17
Speaker
centred on what? on Like when we started doing what we were doing, everything we were doing was just... People were like so under stress in COVID. And a lot of people in the beer scene at that time, they vented that stress by just trolling anything they could online. And they forgot that there were real people behind real companies that were also...
01:12:39
Speaker
trying really really hard yeah just to survive support not just ah yeah it was a really dark time in craft beer but i feel like the scenes changed now there's not like this kind of type of person that owns beer it's like now it's like for everyone yeah it definitely feels like it's opened up a lot yeah and at that time we were not fitting the mold and a lot of like online hate kind of came out yeah Yeah.
01:13:01
Speaker
There you go. I mean, we looked at some stats. We looked at some stats online and the majority of our followers are women between ages of 26 and 35. Yeah, we've got more female. It's a big chunk. We've got more female audience than what we have male now. yeah yeah i know from crafty and from like running could be a week for a number years like it generally skews like 70 30 or more yeah towards men so that's yeah it's pretty cool to see it's just it's changing you know it's evolving we're seeing weird in the top 10. yes long may continue yeah so yeah yeah just yeah hopefully it just keeps growing in the right direction yeah for sure
01:13:41
Speaker
My mentor said that beer is now pale, male and stale, which I couldn't agree with more. um So we go in the opposite direction of that. yeah Yeah. And I feel like the industry is changing in that. Yeah.
01:13:54
Speaker
You know, we're already doing that. And I feel like the industry is starting to move away from that mold, which seemed to have worked the last 10 years. Yeah. And being opening spaces that are more inclusive, creating products that are more inclusive, whether it no outs or gluten free or products that aim for the fringes of what craft beer drinkers drink or even not craft beer drinkers at all maybe doing RTD seltzers, protein water, whatever.
01:14:16
Speaker
But I think that is the future in general for beer. beer Yeah, I would hope so. Because I feel like we take ourselves in the whole you one drop of the industry in the last like 10 years. and Yeah. And I think that's of the things that actually come out from doing this and weekly podcast for the last few months is you talk to all these people and and it the industry is like all the people we're talking to have so much more, like many more layers and so much there's much more nuance and so many more interesting stories and characters and and you know ethos and beliefs that people have that it's way outside of that. And I think the problem is that, yeah, it wasn' maybe the industry wasn't necessarily...
01:14:51
Speaker
pale, male and stale, but that was, it was making itself easy to be categorized that way. You what mean? And I think, you know, it that was how it appeared on the outside too blokey or whatever it was, you know? So yeah, certainly not something you'd insinuate about one drop.
Conclusion and Crafty Pint Promotion
01:15:06
Speaker
No, that's great. Thank you so much for your time welcome me into your old home and now the gin bar. um Yeah, that was great. Awesome. Thanks for having me. Thanks James. Cheers.
01:15:21
Speaker
Are you a supplier to the craft beer industry? Are you looking for more customers? Chat to the team at The Crafty Pint today. Across our website, email newsletters and weekly podcast, we reach more industry decision makers than any other media platform.
01:15:35
Speaker
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01:15:51
Speaker
The Crafty Pint podcast is produced and edited by Matt Hoffman. You can get all your beer-related news and reviews on the Crafty Pint website, craftypint.com, and can stay up to date on future podcast episodes via our socials.
01:16:05
Speaker
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01:16:20
Speaker
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