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The Making Of A Serial Trophy Winner
413 Plays5 days ago
"I got the feedback and it was brutal. But I didn’t get upset; I just took it on the chin."
Who better to feature on the podcast the week after the country's biggest beer awards than the man whose beers have won more trophies in recent years than any other?
Moffat Beach Brewing Co might have had to make do with a clutch of gold, silver and bronze medals at this year's Australian International Beer Awards but the small Sunshine Coast brewery's name has become as synonymous with trophy glory as any.
To find out how the operation that was born in a beachside café reached this point, we sat down with co-founder Matt Wilson at their Caloundra Production House to trace the story from his days growing up playing rugby in regional Australia via the armed forces to becoming a trader in Sydney. That's where he met wife Shaz, the driving force behind the decision to buy said café pretty much sight unseen, from where they'd embark on a whole new odyssey.
Matt takes us back to his earliest brews, the "brutal" feedback from awards judges that set him on the right track, subsequent glories, expansion, and the roller-coaster ride of life as a brewery owner in a region where they were the second to open and in which you now find more than 20.
Prior to the main interview, Craig and James reflect on what appears to have been the most successful Pint of Origin to date, last week’s awards, and the Aussie Hop Series we launched with HPA earlier this month.
There’s a reminder to celebrate the country’s brewers and good beer citizens in our Have You Done A Rallings? and Bluestone Yeast Brewery of the Month campaigns. And, if you took part in Pint of Origin, to share your feedback so we can aim to make it even better in the future. We did, however, record it too early to include the news that Mountain Culture have bought Fox Friday and associated assets.
Start of segments:
- 17:36 – Matt Wilson Part 1
- 44:33 – Matt Wilson Part 2
Relevant links:
- Moffat Beach Brewing Co
- The Story Of Moff's Summer Ale
- Pint of Origin Consumer Survey
- Aussie Hop Series
- Nominate a Good Beer Citizen
- Nominate a Brewery of the Month
- Mountain Culture Acquire Fox Friday
- Roxset Australia
To find out more about supporting the show or otherwise partnering with The Crafty Pint, contact craig@craftypint.com.
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Transcript
Introduction and Overview
00:00:05
Speaker
Hello and welcome to the Crafty Pint Podcast. I'm James. And I'm Craig. Yeah, we're back together again and I guess ah reuniting because this is the episode um that we were recording last time we did the intro together.
00:00:18
Speaker
Moffat Beach is our main guest coming up later. Yeah, Matty Wilson. he's he's done ah He's done a few podcasts before, but I like to think we we maybe extracted a few more nuggets out of him.
00:00:29
Speaker
Yeah, I'd hope so. um So yeah, as we'll get to that later. But um yeah, plenty to talk about beforehand.
Pint of Origin Event Success
00:00:34
Speaker
I guess this is our first podcast post Pint of Origin, which by all accounts, I've had sort of feedback, you know, out and about, emails, text messages, whatever seems to have been um the biggest yet. so we've got the...
00:00:48
Speaker
the consumer surveys and venue surveys out at the minute. We'll include those in the show notes find out a bit more. um But I've had messages coming in from people saying record breaking. I know that Whiskey and Ailman, they upped their orders of Pine of Origin specific boilermakers this year.
00:01:04
Speaker
And I got a message from them on Saturday going, we've sold out all of almost all of them already. um And just a feeling that that it's sort of, I guess, tapped into a bit of a wider audience this year. So that's That's pretty exciting. like you You never really know. I guess we sort of did this on an even smaller budget than last year. The old the old oily rag got even smaller. yet um and Yeah, it's the shoestring, but maybe not even the shoestring. It's that little plastic bit at the end of the shoestring that that we work off. but No, awesome result. And um I was blown away by the amount of media coverage I saw for it. And shout out to the the PR team, McGrath PR that we were working with. But i yeah, it really felt felt like there was a lot more um mainstream and and food and wine, food and drink sort of media getting getting interested in and shouting the good word of Pine of Origin, James.
00:01:52
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, so maybe, I guess, given the you know the current situation facing the wider world and the industry, maybe people, maybe that actually works in our faith. maybe Maybe people were desperate to get out. Maybe the venues were keen to put on a good show and get people out there. And it was it was funny, actually, um last Friday, Will and I headed out with Guy Southern, who had flown over to collect his award for Best Media.
00:02:14
Speaker
And we walked into beer Mash, which is doing their plant of origin and with their Scandinavian beer still not here. And um we walked in and the two people waiting at the bar in front of us both had their phones out with the Pine of Origin passport, ordering their beer, collecting their scans or getting their stamps. And Guy was like, James, this is amazing. This is proof of concept.
00:02:35
Speaker
It works. It works. So that was but was really nice to see. Because I know not everybody that does the festival you know downloads the passport because you know so if you're going to complete a crawl or you know go to at least six venues or whatever. But it was really nice for Guy, I think, to fly in, having not been to Melbourne in a number of years.
00:02:50
Speaker
be here for a couple of days and go, oh, so this is this is how it works. Yeah, nice. It's like when the ah the Frankenstein you know monster wakes up and you're like, it's alive. It's really alive. Here we go.
00:03:01
Speaker
yeah exactly. um So, yes, if you if you did attend, we'd love to get some feedback to you know see what you loved. Any ideas for how we could be better in the future um would be awesome. um And I guess you know we we obviously did last week's podcast episode live um after the Avers.
00:03:17
Speaker
um But I know Will's been chatting to Wedgetail Brewing this week to find out a bit more about the... I guess the surprise winners of the the champion Australian beer. So I will include a ah link to his article in the show notes. so you can find out about these former chopper pilots from WA who they started brewing almost 10 years ago, but only actually opened their tap room less than two years ago. So and we'll have more on that. tre I know you've had some interesting conversations with some of the Queensland winners since, since the awards week. Yeah, well,
00:03:45
Speaker
ah First of all, I love the the live stream or the live podcast from AIBAs or you know live but not so live. But I could hear the excitement in Will's voice as he was interviewing the filter filter guys and and a few others. But I think he even gets louder as the he...
Award-Winning Conversations
00:04:04
Speaker
Maybe he has a couple of beers, but I was... I think maybe he thought because we were in a busy room, like what you couldn't see was like so over to the right, there was basically, you know, three, 400 people just getting on it. So he, but his mic was this close to his mouth. so he didn't really have to talk that loud, but it was, it was definitely um peaking and Matt, Matt did his best overnight to try and solve the sound. But um yeah, I think, I think he was he was having fun.
00:04:28
Speaker
Very good. Well, I had definite FOMO listening to that. I i do love the Avis and it's a great awards night and a great chance for the industry to get together. But yeah, I spoke to Alyssa from Slipstream Brewing just after the awards, sending her ah congratulations message on, I think they picked up two trophies, the um small Champion Small Brewery and also for their ah Gold Wild Ale, which is an amazing beer. It's their very first, believe it or not, wild fermentation beer. They've done a bit of barrel aging, done a lot of barrel aging in the past, but this was their first um wild ferment. And I think it was like a couple of years in the making.
00:05:10
Speaker
um I sent a text saying, oh my God, congratulations, amazing. And first first thing she came back with was, we're stoked, but you know we've only got 20 bottles left of this this amazing beer. And I just kind of got me thinking about, um you know, you you're a brewer, you enter these awards, you put these these limited release beers on your core range and so on. But it's almost it's a great result to win anything, but um it's a kind of a a double-edged sword when you win with a beer that, well, that beer we're already out of or we're almost out of. Or I guess, you know, what do you do then? What's your decision? do you Do you think about re-brewing it straight away? Is it even possible to do that?
00:05:48
Speaker
Yeah, I just thought it was an interesting discussion. yeah Yeah, well, I guess just thinking another one from WA, like King Road won two more trophies last week. um They've been winning trophies there for a number of years now. And it was for two limited release release beers as well. Now, yeah do they look at it and go, ah maybe we should add that? I suppose they were limited to release beers like other beers in their core range.
00:06:09
Speaker
um But yeah, you wonder whether they're hoping for that reflected glory and going, oh oh they were good. Let's try something else from their range. um But, you know, we were chatting about this with Will earlier. you know, he mentioned Rattenhund, which was a beer that he fell in love with halfway through his first can.
00:06:24
Speaker
um Went on to win, you know, champion Pilsen champion lager a few years ago and then has become a core range beer for for Hop Nation. um And I guess, you know, almost thinking,
00:06:35
Speaker
Similar to that would be Gab's, i sp you know which which you ran for a number of years. The number of Gab's beers that do either win the People's Choice or do really well that then go on to become ah you know a rebrewed core beer. There haven't been too many over the years because I guess they are generally so esoteric. that you you know Do you want limit an addition 8% fruited Imperial Stout or whatever?
00:06:59
Speaker
Feral Brewing used to used to do it really well. I remember speaking with um with Will and Brendan back in the day and you know they would almost look at Gabs as like a giant market research opportunity of of if we're going to brew this kind of something pretty experimental, they'd always put a lot of effort into it and and come up with something quite original and unique and just see what the reaction was. And you know you saw beers like their Watermelon Warhead Sour.
00:07:25
Speaker
um They did their... the Shooter McGavin beer, the breakfast thing. And like theyve they had a few beers that that really took off at Gabs and then they would incorporate them into their future sort of either core range or limited release program. So it's sort of, I don't know, I think um i think these awards are fantastic and they and they're great to be able to, even if you win with a limited release or a core range or whatever it might be, it does um shine a bit of a spotlight on on the brewery.
00:07:54
Speaker
um I would love to see all the awards, the AIBAs, we have the Indies, there's the state-based awards and so on. I'd love to see them get a bit more consumer recognition and actually drive purchase behavior. like we've We've talked about this before, James, but um you know having worked with Moffat Beach as well, who we're about to talk to, Matt, you know one of the biggest award winners in the country, a serial award winner, we call them.
00:08:20
Speaker
um You know, the awards were were fantastic for the sales rep who's going into the the bottle shop or the, you know, the the bar or whatever it might be to be able to point to those awards and say, this beer has won so many trophies or medals.
00:08:33
Speaker
um But I don't know that it actually connects that well with consumers yet. And that's that's where i think the there's a gap or an opportunity there for one these awards. I wonder whether it's something that, um you know, is almost...
00:08:47
Speaker
um has parallels with you know the challenge for the IBA in getting the indie message across, you getting consumers to pay enough and you know attention or have have enough interest and go, I'm going to look for the indie seal or whatever.
00:08:59
Speaker
um I guess it probably ties into that moving beyond just the the already engaged beer consumer to you know pay attention to those things. um I guess you know a lot of people who are engaged, who are paying attention, consumers who are paying attention to the awards go, oh, great, my favourite brewery won. Excellent.
00:09:18
Speaker
You know, I'll go and try that beer again or whatever. But how many people might go, oh I'm actually going to go make an effort to to get that now? um yes Yeah, probably it's part of that that sort of wider um quite a challenge on that front.
00:09:30
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah, but there's certainly going on. I think, you know, some... we go into a fair bit of detail with with Matt is is the feedback that brewers get as well. you know I guess that's one of the key things for them is is getting that feedback on how their beers have traveled. And um you know and Emily talked about it um in last week's podcast, a young brewer from Mountain Goat, how you know entering the wards and judging is a real good, as she said, kick up the bum um you know to sort of see what what could be who's doing things well, where the faults are, how you can be better, that kind of stuff. So I guess there's there's a number of aspects to it and as well as the the fun night. So you'll have to come down next year, Craig. you know but book Book the week off as soon as we've got the date.
Spotlight on Hops and Breweries
00:10:09
Speaker
That's it, yeah.
00:10:10
Speaker
Pint of Origin and AOBAs, can't wait. Now something else you've been working on for quite some time actually, which has finally started sort hitting the airwaves, so to speak, in the last week or two, is the Aussie Hop Series that we've been putting together with HPA. you want to tell us bit about that?
00:10:26
Speaker
Yeah, this was a ah really cool project and and massive thanks to HPA for for um backing it and putting it together. So essentially, um we've put together like a mini series of podcasts where in each episode, we're focusing on one of six kind of classic or or new modern Australian hops.
00:10:46
Speaker
And in each one, we're talking with not only with someone from HPA, but also with a leading brewer from around Australia or even around the world. So we've released, I think the first episode was talking with Keelan from Stone and Wood about Galaxy, obviously a hop that is almost synonymous with that brewery and their flagship beer.
00:11:08
Speaker
um We've just released an interview with George McGregor from Ether Brewing talking all about Enigma. It's a mysterious hop. that's He loves playing with other hops.
00:11:19
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. and um But we've got some great episodes coming up as well. We're talking with a a couple of brewers from the US, one of the the team from Stone Brewing, who you might know. They're a small little operation over there.
00:11:32
Speaker
uh and one of the brewers from cellar west um in colorado uh jesse searles from young henry's um god gone blank on who the others guys are but we recorded them a little while ago and i have been editing together over the last few months but um yeah you i guess know they They're really nice snappy snapshot, snappy snapshot, what a terrible phrase anyway, a snappy shot.
00:11:56
Speaker
Snappy snapshot. Yeah, you know, of what the hops character, you know, is the best beers to use at them in, um you you know, what brewers have found. And, you know, in each interview, there's there's an HPA expert talking about them as well. So I guess, you know, they're definitely, um you know, for anyone, I guess, even you whether you're brewing at home or whether you are brewing commercially, commercially,
00:12:17
Speaker
I guess we've selected people who, brewers who use these hops a lot in beers that are very successful and have worked out, I guess, you know, how best to use them. So yeah, we're putting them out each Tuesday. um So you can find them on the Crafty Pint podcast channel or the usual spots. There'll be another four coming out on the next four Tuesdays. And I imagine this, these sort of offshoot, I guess, almost more technical, more specific shows are something we'll be looking to do more over time as well. So um yeah. Yeah.
00:12:44
Speaker
If anyone out there, any any business out there got ideas for things they'd love to showcase, then, you hit Craig up. Yeah, well, I'm thinking we yeah we could do more on on yeast and malt. And there's certainly, I think, a lot of opportunities there. It's nice because each of these brewers, um like you said, James, they they kind of, they've worked with these hops. They know these hops. have experimented in numerous sort of ways. And, you know, whether you're yeah professional or home brewer, you're going to get some sort of some technical tips from the experts on how to get the most from these great Aussie hops. So yeah, check it out.
00:13:16
Speaker
And yeah, before we get to the main interview with Matt, a reminder of the two campaigns we're going on celebrating all the good things in the beer if your industry. If you'd like to nominate your favourite brewery for a Bluestone Yeast Brewery of the Month, you can do so at craftypint.com slash bluestone.
00:13:31
Speaker
And also, if there's anyone out there who's just doing great things in the industry or has done you a massive favor recently, anywhere in the beer industry, could be anything at all. We're looking to celebrate good beer citizens through our Have You Done a Rallings campaign.
00:13:43
Speaker
So jump online at craftypint.com slash rallings, R-A-L-L-L-I-N-G-S, if you'd like to nominate someone there. I think you you were saying we should give a little Rallings shout out to, believe it or not, the team at Rallings. Is that right, James? Did they they come to the party for us?
00:14:00
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. I guess, you know, what one of the things when you're trying to pull off, ah I guess, a major beer festival with the small team we have and limited resources we have, not everything happens maybe as early as you'd like.
00:14:12
Speaker
And we found ourselves... um only about a week or so out, sending through the print-ready files for the posters for the venues, the coasters, and even the maps that we did for the first time, which was something new we tried, and people loved them, so that was a really good addition.
00:14:28
Speaker
And it was like, when can we get these through, Paul, given that I'm in Melbourne, they're in Queensland, and we have to get stuff out to 23 venues? And somehow they turned everything around in, I reckon, 48 hours ah express delivery, and I...
00:14:42
Speaker
but Me and the team here, we managed to get everything into the venues in time for the festival. um So, yeah, big shout out to Paul and the team at Rowlings for helping us on that front. um Well done. Well done, Rowlings. You've learned yourself a ah little Rowlings voucher. to If you need labels, stickers or packaging, then um call the team at Rowlings. Fantastic.
00:15:01
Speaker
Exactly. um
Moffat Beach Brewery Journey
00:15:02
Speaker
Good stuff. And so, yeah, on to this week's main interview, which you and i recorded at um in Caloundra a few weeks ago. um i guess, you you know, it's a good one to tie in the week after the awards. I know Moffat didn't pick up any trophies this time, but there's more gold.
00:15:16
Speaker
You know, we talk about Trilogy, and probably Matt's favourite beer from his, one of his favourite beers in the line-up. um But yeah, we I guess, you know, we we wanted to have a chat to him and but about Trilogy. hey Matt and Chaz's backstory but you know before getting into brewing, you know the the evolution of Moffat Beach, but also with that focus on how he went from you know a home brewer to this cereal trophy winner.
00:15:38
Speaker
I do. I think Matt's story is incredible. And obviously, I worked with Moffat Beach for for a few years when I first moved here to the Sunshine Coast. And I spent a lot of that time just trying to think about how the hell has this guy gotten so good at at brewing? And, you know, he really is remarkable in that he's gone from being a professional soldier with the Australian army to pretty much a stockbroker, i random career transition, you know, to a cafe owner that liked to home brew that then put in a commercial kit. This is one of the smallest kits in the country.
00:16:14
Speaker
um And literally the never studied brewing, never worked for another brewery, never undertook any vocational training, but just passionate about it. And like you said, at at the start there with the a is you know his only real peer feedback was through these awards that he was entering and getting this this feedback and today you know he's got a trophy bench that most brews would be in in absolute envy of so yeah it's a great chat and and yeah I think he's ah he's a force of nature Yeah, and I love the fact they bought the cafe pretty much sight unseen, didn't really know the area that well, or sha Shaz yeah knew the area a bit.
00:16:51
Speaker
And the know the story about going to a Holgate Live Brew Day at an early Brews Vegas at archive and going, oh, I should set something like that up at home. like All these things, it's like it is so much the classic...
00:17:03
Speaker
modern craft beer and modern brewing story, like really is, you know, grassroots, and pulling yourself up and then suddenly taking to the stage every single award repeatedly. So um yeah, it's a great chat.
00:17:14
Speaker
and So that's up after the break. um Before then, would you like to take ah will Will's role this week, Craig? ah Guys, if you haven't done it yet, then jump on, like, subscribe, comment, share this podcast with your friends. Get it out there, guys. Really make this a thing. Let's do it.
00:17:30
Speaker
Excellent stuff. All right. Enjoy the show.
00:17:38
Speaker
Matt, welcome to the show and thank you for having us here to your, the production house in Caloundra. Thanks for having me and yeah, welcome. Yeah. Um, now I figured we'd start off sort of almost back at the start pre brewing. yeah You know, i people in the beer industry know Moffat beach for winning pretty much every award going for the last few years.
00:17:54
Speaker
Um, but I guess you're still fairly locally focused on, you know, the Sunshine Coast, Queensland region, but people outside of that sort of what were you you and Shaz doing before launching this? I mean, yeah you had at least one or two other careers before moving up here and getting into beer. Yep. i um Both of us were working in financial markets before we moved up here.
00:18:15
Speaker
Prior to that that, most of my twenties, I was in the military. i was in the in the army. Majority of that time I was based up in Townsville. um Yeah, in the infantry.
00:18:26
Speaker
And then I got out, was... I was long time ago now, 2005-ish. um And then, yeah, somehow managed to jag a job in financial markets.
00:18:42
Speaker
um what ah it was What a segue, you know, military finance. How it happened, like I went to boarding school in Sydney, um played a lot of rugby. um I think my ambition exceeded my ability as a rugby player. So I was playing footy in Sydney, the um the club that I was playing for.
00:19:00
Speaker
got me a job with a stockriking firm and i was in the mile were most but ah internet wasn't really a thing so i i was just tying contract nights around the city um ah worked out though yeah i was never going to play for the wall of these or morars or anything like that so i um I signed up and I joined the army and loved it. Did a couple of did a couple of trips, which was which was good.
00:19:26
Speaker
um Great experience. ah I did lose a couple of nights during that time as well. um But yeah, I got out. um Yeah, sort of in the mid two thousand s um I struggled for a number of years because I went from very, I was in a pretty, I was in recon return, which was a pretty specialized role.
00:19:49
Speaker
um So i went from being sort of the big man on campus to absolutely nothing with no qualifications. And I like sort of was a bit lost there for for sort of year or two. But my mum said,
00:20:03
Speaker
You enjoyed that stock-breaking job. Why don't you give that a crack? And I went, i worked in the mailroom, Mum. But I sent my resume off to every breaking firm in Sydney. um And then, yeah, someone probably saw Recon Batuno. This guy looks pretty cool. So, um yeah, I got a job. ah And then I just ah got my license. So I was what you call an operator. So my job was the...
00:20:32
Speaker
the dealers would get the orders in from their clients to buy and sell whatever. And then they'd give me the or sell ticket and I'd do the actual buying and selling um on the market. um The equivalent of that would have been the guys on the trading floor back in the day, which is now obsolete. It's all done on computer. And even now that job that i'm doing that I was doing is almost gone now. the the The dealers put their own stuff through on the computer.
00:20:58
Speaker
um most fast i guess so did you meet Sharon that's how I met Sharon Sharon was an operator as well um I just met in the pub after work she knew one of the guys that I sat next to um and then I ended up couple smooth operators just a couple of smooth operators yeah um and then um was actually we were friends for know probably six months before it turned into something else um And then I ended up working for her best friend's husband for um probably five or six years.
00:21:28
Speaker
um By stage, we're married. We had two kids. We pumped them out back to back. So yeah, Shaz had been on maternity leave for almost two years or three years straight. She was on maternity leave, went back to work, and then she got pregnant straight away again. And then she was on maternity leave, which they weren't super thrilled about.
00:21:52
Speaker
And then she had just gone back to work after, um, Lily had just been born and then, um, I got made redundant from my role. Um, so the firm that, um, Andrew, who was my boss that we were working for, um, they merged with another firm from Melbourne and we were on what's called the institutional desk. So all our, well, all of his clients, none of them were my clients. um all his clients were institutional investors so super funds hedge funds and and things like that so we got um we got pushed aside um and i didn't really have any qualifications in it apart from my um my operating license which was being sort of pushed out so i was going to find it really really hard to find another gig doing it um
00:22:41
Speaker
Anyway, Shaz and I, Shaz just wanted out of Sydney. She didn't want to live there anymore. She grew up there. I'm not from Sydney. I grew up in rural New South Wales. um She just wanted to get out of there. It was hectic. We were living in a shoebox um and she just found this little cafe that was for sale on the beach. We'd never even heard of Moffat Beach. so There's no hospital background. you you Not for me, Shaz. Were you brewing at this stage at all?
00:23:06
Speaker
No, no. I was to not drinking a fair bit of it. No, Shaz had always worked in hospitality when she was, you know, uni whatever it was that she was doing after school.
00:23:21
Speaker
So she'd always had up a job, but no, me, nothing. i saw I grew up on a farm. I went boys' school.
00:23:33
Speaker
um You know, school holidays, was working with Dad with the cows and stuff, and then, yeah, played rugby, that Then I joined the army and there was yeah no hospitality experience at all for me. So Shazza said to you, let's buy this cafe sight unseen. and And you've gone, yeah, let's jump in.
00:23:50
Speaker
I went, yeah, righto. So we flew up and we we looked at the place and it was like the worst day. Like it was just torrential. Did you know the area? Had you been up here before? No. No. The show's had. um But yeah, I'd driven through it. yeah Driving from Townsville down to my mum's house in Newcastle on leave, that's about it. um Yeah, so we looked at the place and we thought we were buying a going concern, but it was pretty obvious that the guy had gone broke. Mm-hmm.
00:24:24
Speaker
and shows just went oh i don't know and it was pissing down with rain was coming to sideways and she actually said i don't know it looks a bit um like a bit big went it let's let's have a crack um so next thing you know we um and oh then the the real estate agent um he just went look at these guys desperate he wants this video he'll take this and it was it was bugger all anyway so next thing you know we're in the we're in the car two babies yeah pulling up in pacific hollow going or what the fuck are we doing um look we we made it we did a very very cosmetic basic renovation which um consisted of
00:25:11
Speaker
cleaning it and giving it a lick of paint. um And we were there on um and and this was sort of our light bulb moment. We were it was a Sunday afternoon. um we were filthy. was hot.
00:25:24
Speaker
It was and it was a beautiful day. So we we popped around to the the closest bottle shop, which was BWS at Dickie Beach. And we bought a six pack of four pints parallel that was in stubbies at that stage.
00:25:38
Speaker
And we sat at the the bench, which the Tarana ran into, which is not longer there. So we sat at that bench. That's another podcast. um And we just looked.
00:25:49
Speaker
The place was busy. and the two nana And they were Nana Cafes. One of them still is a Nana Café. um We just watched them pack up around people at two o'clock in the afternoon. And we just thought, why is no one doing beer here?
00:26:03
Speaker
So that was our sort of light bulb moment. um we We managed to scrape through Christmas. So we we took the place on November 2012 and we opened it up um just before Christmas. We managed to limp through that without a liquor license, which was tough.
00:26:24
Speaker
um And then yeah, got the liquor license in. And then the first thing we did was we, we managed to get in, um, a kegerator, um, four pines out there. And I was a fan of their beers for pines. Um, gave us that.
00:26:39
Speaker
um so we we put that in and then um it went off we had a guy playing and guitar and sundays and but what what happened because the bees got to be cold in those things so we had the the second keg in the in the cool room but with chefs going in and out of there um it warmed up a bit so then it was starting to pour froth when we um when we changed it over so i ran brad fidge who was the sales rep at four ponds i said mate i need another one of these things so then he got me another one um so then we were pouring two beers there and then same thing started happening so then we went okay let's
00:27:20
Speaker
David Wright- um but And it was an ambient system, which is not ideal for here in Queensland.
00:27:31
Speaker
um But we at work, but we're getting through the going through the beer pretty quickly. We started lot able do that. Four Pines Pale Ale, Four Pines Kolsch, Stone and Wood Pacific Ale, Moorbrough Pilsner, Holgate Mount Macedon Pale Ale and Murray's Wail Ale.
00:27:51
Speaker
So they're almost like some of the classics of the era. Yeah, and and it was pretty um extreme for downtown Caloundra at that time. But we made a specific...
00:28:03
Speaker
choice we didn't want to put on a mainstream beer because dicky beach surf club was around the corner the pub was around the corner you can go there and get that we just wanted to have the point a point of difference um and there was a bit of pushback from it but we made sure that um there were some approachable beers on there all of those beers now would be um sort of deemed approachable um i remember putting on a i think it was I think it was Holgate Road Trip IPA. And I had this bloke just go, mate, you shouldn't be serving this shit. But yeah, now that same bloke, we put our Iggy Hop double IPA on and you just just see him like he's like how screeching to get in there. And was that when it was still Blackwater Trading Co? So the Moffat Beach, it was in Moffat Beach. It was in Moffat Beach. And the name Blackwater came about because...
00:28:57
Speaker
we both love coffee and you know black water slang for for coffee and we both came from a trading background and I'm this this could be fake news but I think coffee was like the second most traded commodity in the world so that's where that sort of name came from but we we quickly moved into beer being our focus um and then I started brewing at home to educate myself on what it was that i was selling so um yeah beer a brewing beer commercially wasn't really part of the plan but it was yeah it was in the back of the head there it's like you know it would be it would be cool to do can you can you tell me maddie because i love the story of your first homebrew kit because it wasn't really any kind of commercial or
00:29:49
Speaker
kits widely available at that time, was it? No, there was not a, like the grain fathers and things like that that are available weren't really around. or Actually, where I got the idea from, um so we were buying quite a bit of beer, well,
00:30:06
Speaker
not a lot of beer but by a lot of cat a lot ofleandra um for to um um ah the archive beer boutique i think it was part of the old bruise vegas festival that used to be on um and den rowlings who was the sales repp for holgate at the time invited shaz and i to but um paul was still paul hogate was doing a a demonstration. He was brewing, I think, road trip from scratch on and he just had like a 40 litre urn and I just went, um can do this. So I went and I bought a 40 litre urn that, you know, you have a netball or, you know, community sport. Yeah.
00:30:52
Speaker
I nicked a bit of insulation roofing insulation off of the building site and tape that around it put you know some ball valves in there and got a thermometer and filled it and put it in and the steel guys at the back here I got him to weld together like a little pulley system he actually came in when we opened this up and went fucking hell it's improved a bit from your original system um and then away went um I got a bit of a bit of a hand from Dan because Dan was was brewing at home so I rang him up and got a few pointers
00:31:31
Speaker
and away i went so the first beer brewed at home was um our hipster doofus esb because i thought being a big multi-beer it might be a little bit more forgiving plenty of places to hide behind all that malt um and then yeah i brewed it and then drank it and it was like the best beer i ever tasted it was probably full of faults but um but you'd made it but i made it and it was cool and then it just um It became an obsession after that. It overtook the garage. i was buying new bits of kit all the time. and
00:32:05
Speaker
yeah Is that sort of part of your nature? if if you get into something, have you had that obsessive nature about it or was brewing something that just really captured something for you? I don't know.
00:32:17
Speaker
I say no, but Shaz probably would say yes. Yeah, because I'm... Listeners will note Shaz is not here for the podcast. No, she's not. We'll maybe get a phone in, a sort of a coder. Yeah, yeah. There'll be a fact check. I don't think so, but um she'd probably disagree. Like, you know, i I'm into my cooking as well. So, yeah, I buy heaps of shit for that. So, yeah, probably. Maybe.
00:32:42
Speaker
Yeah, so yeah, that's how I got into the actual brewing. so And then um but I've told this story thousands of times, but um the beers at home were tasting yeah pretty good. Well, I thought so anyway.
00:32:55
Speaker
um And then Shaz just said as much, you know, we've got that dead space up the back of... they knew no one ever sat there except at christmas time or east time when we're busy because people like to look at the ocean she said maybe we look at pouring in ah little kit there so we um we did a bit of research we went and um attended a few things around the country and then Yeah, we beat the boat and we we bought a little 300 litre system. In hindsight, it should have been a little bit bigger. There wasn't a lot of room to play with though. There wasn't. You had to sort of squeeze between the kit and the tanks and you had to get to the toilet. Still do. We brewed on it. We brewed on it yesterday.
00:33:37
Speaker
And we brewed the hips of doofus for you go winter. There you But, yeah, there's not a lot of room, but we we could have probably had a 500-litre system in there and the tanks could have been a bit bigger. So we we ran out of beer from day one, even though it it was shit. like Scaling up from 30 litres to 300 litres <unk>s I really struggled with. and Did you get get someone to help you with that transition or you were like, well, not really. um we we We bought the we bought the equipment through Costa Nickius and he's part of his service was that he was supposed to. scott france or a luer in yeah From La Serene. Yeah. And lot i got on well with Costa. He was great, but like he lives in Melbourne. Yeah. So
00:34:26
Speaker
yes so There wasn't so much that, there wasn't a heap that he could do. and his skill set is probably not in big hoppy beers either. So, yeah, look, I got off the ground running. He he put it in and then he he went home to Melbourne. I was on the phone to him a little bit.
00:34:46
Speaker
um But I sort of had to find my own way. And it wasn't just a matter of, you know, 30 to 300, you know. right hondra you know timesing it in a linear fast in a linear fashion you know that equipment was more powerful it just sucked every bit of alpha acids and the first couple of batches were like paint stripper and then um yeah there was fermentation faults and everything but everyone drank it um
00:35:18
Speaker
Well, I think I must have timed my first visit really badly in that sweet spot. I got an email from you before we'd actually met and think we were coming last we come as a family within a few weeks or a few months, whatever. I think you were away when I called in and was like, you know, looking for new breweries to list on Crafty Pine and came in and tried them. And I i sat on that bench with lovely views, a beautiful sunny day and then saying wife, think I think I'll just leave this one.
00:35:42
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Let's give him a little bit time to get his feet under of the dust. And then it would have been not too much longer down the line. That you know that would have been 2015. That's when we put the kid in. yeah And then um the and it would have been the CBIA back then. um The conference was in Brisbane. So it was just down the road. So um we went to it and we ate some beers. Yeah.
00:36:11
Speaker
And then that was when I got the first bit of feedback because no one's, your mates are not going to say this is shit. They will when they get home and I don't know how it's going As they're pouring your schooner on the pot plant behind you. Yeah, yeah. So I got the feedback and it was brutal.
00:36:29
Speaker
But I... I didn't get upset I just took it on the chin and and went okay well then how do we how do we fix this and I just knuckled down and did jumped on the computer and did some reading and and went okay and the big one was oxidation all the beers were oxidized and I worked out that I was transferring the beer from I was using one of the fermentation tanks as a bright turn but I was transferring the beer and I wasn't purging the line with with co2 it's just such a simple little thing and as soon as i fix that
00:37:03
Speaker
The beers improved outside. Um, and then, you know, I kept entering awards and kept getting, I've been, I think in the next year, I think they were in Adelaide, um, which was fun.
00:37:15
Speaker
And then we got a gold medal there and, and then, yeah, the next year we actually, we, we won a trophy, which was then, um, the first Indies I think it was. yeah Yeah. I love, i' love to come back to that and how that sort of process work. Cause I mean, it would be,
00:37:29
Speaker
I guess over a number years, what key lessons, what learnings you took from that. But in terms of going back to the venue, I remember going in that first time, people that haven't been there, I mean, what was the capacity of the cafe? Not even 100, would No, no, no. But you had a bit live music. There was always the posters on the wall for the events you had on. Yeah, they're still there. Well, yeah, the posters there, they're gig posters. I just got them out of a book, didn't they?
00:37:54
Speaker
Plast of them on there. Yeah, look, we still have music there every Sunday afternoon. But I think like we fit about 60 comfortably down there.
00:38:05
Speaker
You can fit more in uncomfortably, but 60 is sort of where it's at. Yeah, and do have names for the tanks? Is that right? All the tanks down there have names on First Men or something? Yeah, I think so. It's not something that's been maintained. 10 years ago now. So um everyone seems to be having 10-year birthday parties.
00:38:22
Speaker
I can't remember, James. We probably did. and At that stage, it purely you were making beers just to pour through the taps there. Was anything going into some of the Brisbane venues? it was And we weren't licensed to either. um So to get the...
00:38:36
Speaker
um the what we call it um permission from the council to operate there part their um conditions were that we it was ancillary to the hospitality um focus okay um so we weren't allowed to um sell any beer off-site um so and and we couldn't keep up anyway i was still buying beer from other breweries so even at you know for six but six kegs of time and six taps in your own place in 60 capacity you were still turning over yeah and then we put in um like beer tanks so we they were all like single batch tanks um we should have put in double tanks from the start yeah but i didn't know yeah um
00:39:24
Speaker
So then we put in two tanks that were but double sized and that took the pressure off for a little bit. and um But then when we picked up like two trophies at the Indies in 2018,
00:39:39
Speaker
that stuffed us. We were but not stuffed us, but we just could not keep up. And i was in there. Did you find it that way? Like where people actually seeking the brewery out? They were really you after that. We, we did. Um, no one really had even heard of us, but when we picked up that award there, people, who the fuck's my, well, sounds a bit like, I was think be now like, well, when was first sort of getting into this game, sort of 2009, 10, like,
00:40:05
Speaker
nine ten yeah like Word was spreading around the country about Feral. a Feral were picking up all these awards, but they were only selling beer in WA. You might get a couple of kegs, but we'd go to the one of the co-founders, Pubs and Milk, but that was it.
00:40:16
Speaker
yeah So like the, I guess, early adopted beer nerds would be, if they went to WA, they'd be straight to Swan Valley. And I guess it sounds like you'd have been almost like a little sort Queensland version of that in the, Who the hell are these guys? Oh, they've just got this little cafe on the front. You've got to go there if you want to try the beer. So in his own way, it'd have been like a sort latter day Queensland version of.
00:40:35
Speaker
yeah also said i um But yeah, we didn't sell the beer anywhere else. um Steve Barber, who owns Taps and Black Flag. He, um just when the Sunshine Coast breweries were starting to sprout up, he um he had a like ah ah a night there where he was doing a Sunshine Coast brewery tap takeover and he hit me up for, and I said, mate, I can't sell it to you. i One, I don't have the stock, but two, I'm not allowed. And he goes, well, if you give me a keg, we could do that. And I went...
00:41:11
Speaker
yeah okay maybe and then we had licensing on our doorstep oh really yeah they came in and they went they took my laptop they took my ipad they separated Shaz and Just because they'd seen something on that event, that on that one night somehow. i don't know whether someone robed on us or what, but um yeah, it was pretty full on. and James, welcome to Queensland liquor licensing. I reckon Steve knew he was going launch Black Flag and this guy's going to be a competitor and I need to get him out of game early.
00:41:43
Speaker
I don't think so. But um yeah, anyway, we yeah there was there was nothing in the in the books that could incriminate us.
00:41:54
Speaker
But yeah, the the officer um said, you expect me to believe that you just gave them a free keg? And I went, yes, happens all the time.
00:42:04
Speaker
It's promotion. um anyway then after that we thought maybe we um get produce a wholesale license so we we did um we were probably in breach of what council sort of said we were allowed to do but we got it ticked off from there Anyway, we haven't looked back since. Yeah.
00:42:25
Speaker
Well, that seems like a good
Sponsorship and Brewing Insights
00:42:27
Speaker
moment. Pause and take a break and then come back and have a guest, the second chapter of Moffat, how winning the awards and getting that feedback really the expansion. Yeah, I think legal breaches are a great spot to just, let's all take a moment it to reflect on ourselves.
00:42:40
Speaker
We'll come back with more. Well, for the third time on a podcast, I say, look, you know, statute of limitations. I'd imagine we're all safe now. No one's going to go me. I did not admit to selling him the beer. No, I did not.
00:42:52
Speaker
Exactly. All right, we'll see you again after the break. Sweet. Thank you. Cheers.
00:43:00
Speaker
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00:44:24
Speaker
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00:44:35
Speaker
Alrighty and welcome back. Matty, mate, we talked a bit before about your success in the awards and what's been going on there. um I think probably a question on everyone's lips is sort of how how do you think we've gotten to that point? You've gone from, um you know, you're completely...
00:44:52
Speaker
self-educated brewer, you've started as a home brewer, become a commercial brewer. The only real guidance and feedback you've had from peers, you know, it's not any kind of professional education, but it's through that feedback from awards.
00:45:04
Speaker
How has that shaped your brewing to get to the point where you're now literally the most awarded brewer in Australia? Yeah, look, it's, invaluable the the feedback and when I say I self-taught I have had help from other brewers and that um and a lot of that has been doing collaboration beers like every time you step into someone else's brewery you learn something new One of the big things that helped early on, we did a collab beer with Temple. Okay. Ron?
00:45:33
Speaker
What's that, sorry? In Ron's days, was it? No. Glenn? Oh, yeah. And um the late Wags came up as well. um And he was, that's the only time i ah i I've met Wags, but he was a great guy. um Yeah, I learned a lot from that. Got a few tips.
00:45:53
Speaker
um So yeah, I have had some help over the years, but a lot of the time I've been on my own in that little dungeon there at the beach and it's been a lot of fun. and what What was the level of detail in the feedback you were getting from the awards? Because, you know, I guess if there's consistently like the beers oxidized, the beers oxidized, that's one thing. yeah But does it go deeper than that? So have you really focused down on any other faults Yeah, there was there was, you know, the the classic ones like diacetol and there was some acetaldehyde. I can never say that word properly, but um those sort of things. And you just read up on how to fix it. and
00:46:29
Speaker
Oh, OK. That's what you do. um Yeah, just those sort of things. and Also, just doing my learning some sensory evaluation myself, just reading about and and learning what these things sort of taste like, going and buying stuff out in and the marketplace. and um but And Craig would know from when he was here, we we would actually sit down and and do some sensory training. So I'd buy off flavor kits and leading up to awards, we'd go, this is... Just don't enter the one you've dosed.
00:47:05
Speaker
No, no. leading up to the awards, we would, um you know, do a bit of an education session going, this is the process that the beers are going to go through to I will say Maddy's got one of the best beer pallets out there and It does make it very difficult to go somewhere else for a beer with him because it's often pick up a beer anywhere else and it's first thing he me tastes is the issues. I've got few friends like It's almost a curse.
00:47:29
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. Back in my army days, I just would have smashed anything, whereas now I will go out somewhere and I'll struggle to drink something if it's yeah not yeah not great. um But, know, it is what it is.
00:47:42
Speaker
yeah Just on on on your approach to brewing. So, you know, I think certainly there's the... Brewing is a process. It's a chemical, organic fermentation, all that sort of stuff. if you And if you identify a problem, oxidation, acetaldehyde, all that, you can read up on it. You can find the fix yeah and figure out what's causing that to happen.
00:48:01
Speaker
um I think there's something else going on where Moffat Beach's beers are obviously consistently winning these awards. Where's the the creativity, the artistry, is it the use ingredients? What else is going on there? I think one of my strong points is actually in designing the beers. Yeah. um
00:48:19
Speaker
I don't know whether you can teach just getting that balance sort of right. I think it's something that comes naturally to me. I'm not sure, but um yeah yeah. Is it that balance that you're always looking for? Is that that between hops and malt and so on? It's balanced, but like ah we make hop-forward beers. That's what we do. We do have other beers on tap, like the stout and things that are not hop-forward, but that's what we specialise in. And anyone can throw a million hops out of beer and make it hoppy.
00:48:49
Speaker
gotta be in in that so yeah i don't know ah I am quite methodical in nature as well. Like I'm process driven. It's probably side effect of going boarding school at the age of 12 and then joining the army. say before, you know, your past career, you know, you've got to go to boarding school.
00:49:10
Speaker
research and attention to detail we're going to be pretty damn damn important in it and stuff you've done before so but if you ask my wife if you ask my wife i'm pretty messy at home but here like you look in there yeah it's clean and it always has been um you know i'm a stickler for things being done the way they have to be done. So obsessive-compulsive disorder is a real benefit in growing basic cream. Pretty much, yeah. saying yeah Yeah, good stuff.
00:49:37
Speaker
um I guess you know you've been, but probably lost track of major trophies over the years, whether it's been for the beers or for the brewery at brew pub level and small you know so small brewery level, cetera, et cetera. Were there any particular awards or beers that have really meant something more to you? Like, was it the first one? and The first one is always pretty, going to be pretty special because we...
00:49:59
Speaker
had no expectation like i was really happy with um the beers that we sent down um but yeah to win a to win a trophy was um amazing uh and it was in sydney which was which was good it was you know and shows his hometown so yeah that that was cool that was when you were still just making just the kegs at the cafe The cafe? Yep. There was no wider distribution. It was just the case. Yeah, and it was Social Jam, which was our mid-strength parallel. And I designed that beer because the drive market from Brisbane was and still is a big part of our business. So I wanted to make a beer that was full-flavoured, but they could have more than one and still sort of get home safely. So, um yeah, my wife thinks it's ironic that –
00:50:50
Speaker
We won an award for a mid strength beer when you know, I'm a lover of big beer. So um yeah, that that was that was awesome. And then we picked up, I think, Champion Small Brewery on the night as well.
00:51:03
Speaker
That was amazing. um But apart from that, I think our first AIBA trophies as well. So I think we picked up Palo IPA and Small Brewery that that was that was a really special night as well. yes yeah bigger Bigger competition and a more kind of global. Yeah. Yeah. recognition as um And like getting Parlel and ah IPA, they're they're the two beer styles that I love. um Picking those up was. I'll tell you what though, Matty, as well, like Social Jam, Midstrengths, you've, um I always say if Queensland had a ah signature beer style, it it's the Midstrengths. It's, I've never, moving here from Victoria to to Sunshine Coast and it's it's all three and a half percent. That's the way to go. Yeah.
00:51:48
Speaker
And it sort of makes sense, you know. You can have a – because it is bloody hot here. and You can have a couple with without getting, you know. Too woozy. Too woozy, yeah.
00:51:59
Speaker
And in terms of – a number of the beers have won multiple trophies. I think, you know, well, the B-Semple Trilogy has won. so You know, the the Pale, Miz Strength. Have they changed? Have you had to sort tweak them and evolve them over time thinking of the market's but moving? Or is it a case of just keeping them exactly as they were? they haven't changed. But – they They have a little bit over time. I think it's just natural that and they do.
00:52:22
Speaker
um The trilogy did. We um we actually ran. It was called Trilogy because there's three hops in it. But um at the time, our hop supplier ran out of one. So then it's actually got four hops in it now. so um And we won.
00:52:42
Speaker
for other Well, I can't. I've got to. I've got to keep it. Can't rebrand it as... Can't rebrand it as... What is it, Quadrilogy? Yeah, I guess. Quadrilogy? I don't know. It just doesn't roll off the tongue. I don't do words. In terms of, I guess, changing and things evolving, I guess the biggest one would be that we're near the production brewery and bigger venue.
Expansion and Challenges
00:53:01
Speaker
So, um you know, I guess how and when do you decide to take take the lead?
00:53:05
Speaker
It was... Or pretty much after that first win at the at the Indies when we because we literally could not keep up that Christmas.
00:53:19
Speaker
We had one beer of our own on tap and it was a stout and people were getting the shit like they come to drink our beers and six cakes would just be gone. because they just They were just gone. Yeah. And it is an awesome problem to have, but it was frustrating as well.
00:53:35
Speaker
So that's when we so we made the decision to to to go bigger. And and ah it took a while. We had a site in the Moffat Beach industrial area.
00:53:47
Speaker
um which would have been awesome because then we would have been able to really truly stay in Moffat Beach. So we had that picked out um and the guy that owned it was and he's one of our customers and he was going to build me, he just had a big block of land there, he was going to build me a shed.
00:54:06
Speaker
then he sold the land um but then the guy who was going to sell the land was going to still build the shed for us and then his finance got knocked on the head and then by this stage we had the kit on the way um so we had to find somewhere so we found we found this yeah this place um in between that, but yeah, we, Shaz and I went to, we flew to China. yeah I think it was 2019 to the CBB Expo in Shanghai. And that, that trip was invaluable because we, we got to see what was shit and and what was good. And and we came, there was a lot of shit um and there was some really good stuff.
00:54:47
Speaker
um And we came home with a short list of about five that we were probably happy to work with. We've got a quote off all of them. These guys just hit that sweet spot with price and quality. yeah And they'd done quite a few breweries in Australia at the time.
00:55:04
Speaker
um yeah Your mates up the road had just ordered kit off them, Ballistic in Brisbane, Tento's. So we were quite confident that they weren't going to take the money and do the runner because it's pretty daunting sending a big load of cash offshore to China because if they do the runner, there's no ombudsman to whinge to. So we were confident that they weren't going to do that. And they were really great to work with. So um but yet then, you know, I don't want to make this a COVID session because I think we've all heard enough about it, but they got hit with COVID.
00:55:39
Speaker
um And we didn't know how serious that was. um I'm like, hurry up and finish my kit. um And then it hit here and we thought, oh, it's pretty serious. So um yeah, had this big shed here.
00:55:54
Speaker
The kit was probably a year late. um Thankfully, our landlord froze the rent, but we we had to pay it back. And that really hurt us as well.
00:56:05
Speaker
um yeah then the kit came they weren't allowed in the country because they were going to come in and um commission it so um rodney duck who was one of our bar flyers still is um he just sold his business he was an electrician before that he was um an electrical engineer in the air force um i said mate you want give me a hand putting this together and he went fuck yeah we basically had everything laid out on the floor here yeah And it was like here Olympics, we we put it together without him. I would have been stuffed. um Yeah, it took us a couple of months and then we did have first brew on it.
00:56:46
Speaker
Unlike going from my homebrew set up to the beach. we nailed it straight away okay in the beer was actually probably better so yeah and just for sort of outsiders like me where are you exactly where are we now i guess in relation to you know the the beach itself or central cloud yeah so we're on calendar road which um is the main arterial road into caloundra off the bruce highway um as you can see there's nice little traffic jam out there at the moment um 50 000 cars apparently go past here every day i'd like a few more of them to drop in um in terms of from so we're just right on the edge of um like an industrial area but we're only
00:57:32
Speaker
ah five or six k's from the beach so it's not far from off a beach um but yeah this area is killounder west it's just on the way into town so more of its a destination venue for people coming in eating or drinking here but it gives you the ability to have send your beer correct felt far and wide yeah yeah and it's good because you know so sunshine coast is calendar in the south through the noosa in the north and you you've got what it 80 Ks between the two sort of thing. Yeah. Something like that. we And we're the most Southern yeah township on the Sunshine Coast. So it's not far to Brisbane, um, which is one of our bigger markets.
00:58:06
Speaker
Um, Sunshine Coast is our biggest market. Um, but yeah, we, we deliver to Brisbane once a week. um But yeah, would I do anything different?
00:58:18
Speaker
I don't know. um lock I guess there because there was no way of continuing necessarily at that small scale. You had to do something. like you Yeah. If you can't look and go, out let's see see what's happening over the last four years.
00:58:31
Speaker
yeah Would it be better staying that size? I guess you couldn't because you're already banging your head against a wall anyway. so there was What um maybe I could have done was rip that system out and then put in one that was slightly bigger, but it's...
00:58:43
Speaker
it's a It's a lot of money and a lot of effort to spend on um something where you're just getting a little bit more capacity. You know, it's been a pretty big and transition from what you had at, ah I guess, the Blackwater Trading Co. What's it the capacity here?
00:58:58
Speaker
ah bru length It's a 2000 litre system. yeah um As in litres per year, we wouldn't be able to get to a million litres without um buying some more tanks.
00:59:11
Speaker
and And in terms of, you know, I guess you had to do actually bang your head against the wall, you know, knowing what's happened in sort four or five years since, do sort of look back and go, maybe I've done things differently? Or, or you know, were you kind of...
00:59:24
Speaker
this this had to This had to happen. it's ah That's a really hard question to answer. yeah um It has been lot of fun executing the project and putting it together. Like, I've really enjoyed it.
00:59:36
Speaker
but you But there's no Nobel Prizes being given out for, you know, coming to the conclusion that the last couple of years have been really tough for yeah for everyone. um Like, here on the coast, there's I think there's 24 breweries. We were the second one after...
00:59:52
Speaker
um Sunshine Coast Brewery, which has been here for over 25 years, and then it just went boom. That's a lot of snouts in the trough. yeah um yeah Without the hospitality side of things, like there's no way we would have survived.
01:00:10
Speaker
um has it sort of changed the nature of the the scene on the sunshine in case are there substantially more people drinking craft beer now than there were you know 10 years ago or even five years ago absolutely there is okay but whether there's enough people drinking it to sustain the growth that we've had i don't think so okay um so you've really gotta you gotta shine yeah um and it's interesting isn't it mate because like i'd i've been here for a few years now and um i was chatting with uh josh donohoe a little while back and um you know on one hand it's it's great from a tourism perspective we've called it the sunshine coast of crappy capital more breweries per head but you also have the under the flip side of that are going there's more breweries per head than anywhere else in australia so there's you know there's that problem as well but
01:00:58
Speaker
um yeah i don't know i think yeah look to answer the question would i would i've done and anything differently i honestly don't know we had to do something because we couldn't keep up and we still wouldn't be able to keep up if we had that little system there yeah it would have like it's lot of time and effort would have gone into taking that little system out and putting something ah little bit bigger for not a whole heap more just to hit head on the wall again sometimes down the line yeah um we had to do something then whether this was the the right thing to do time will tell was going to say a few years time hopefully when the money's going through the economy again be like thank god when we've got this system it definitely has like
01:01:43
Speaker
been a struggle with cash flow and stuff. Like we've we've always made sure we've, you know, paid people. We've been late as I think everyone has, but um yeah, we've we've survived so far, but it would we do things the same?
01:01:59
Speaker
I think maybe if there was the scope to maybe put in a system half the size um in the industrial area at Moffat beach, that may have been the way to go, but and I don't know.
01:02:13
Speaker
I've really enjoyed it. and um We've had a lot of fun. We've made some really good beers.
01:02:24
Speaker
Yeah, made some great friends as well in the industry. um We've done some travel. like we've We've had a good time. And in in terms of like you obviously you changed the business over the years, I guess, to, you know, meat capacity, cetera e etc, etc.
01:02:37
Speaker
Has the rise of other breweries around the Sunshine Coast mean you've had to change the business as well in terms of reaching people or, you know, you've packed the drafts bit, you know, yeah have you had to evolve in a way you perhaps didn't think you'd have had to because there are now 20 plus other breweries within within your home turf?
Commitment to Quality and Future Vision
01:02:55
Speaker
I don't think so. I think we've always focused on brewing the best beer that we that we can. not um i know that some breweries have, you know, made beer cheaper and stuff like that. We we haven't.
01:03:12
Speaker
We've stuck to our guns in terms of probably to my wife's annoyance at times. um yeah our beers are a little bit more expensive than than some other beers because we we use lot of hops in them boomlo pool a lot of hops in them they're expensive um you know i don't i buy good quality stuff so um now we haven't we've we've always sort of just focused on that where the beer is good
01:03:42
Speaker
Nice. Well, i but before we get to the well because the past, present, future questions to wrap up, I guess it's important to ask you as someone who's made so many award winning beers, what is your pick of all the Moffat Beach beers? you know And maybe it's the one that you you love drinking the most. You've got one dedicated case of one you made so you did lose when you were in the armed forces. I mean, is there what one beer that's like this is Matty Wilson's beer?
01:04:05
Speaker
Yeah, probably um the Passenger Parallel is probably the beer that I drink the most. um And it is an original homebrew beer as well. i actually went back and had a look.
01:04:19
Speaker
It's nothing like what it used to be. It's totally different. But yeah, that beer is um pretty special to me. um Yeah, and it's been really good for us as well.
01:04:31
Speaker
um the trilogy as well I just I don't drink as many IPAs as what I used to they sort of knock me around a bit these days but that beer's been awesome for us you know winning um you know trophy other AIBAs for that was I think one year we I think we got Indies and AIBA that that was really good and then the other Matt Wilson he seems to win at the other That's Seven Mile. Yeah, yeah. You guys are alternating. Sort of alternating. So really, the trick to winning awards is changing your name to Matt Wilson. Maybe, maybe.
01:05:05
Speaker
But, um yeah, that those two beers. And like the Josh Porter Parlour, we release that once a year. That is a very special beer to me just because I served with Josh. And he sadly um lost his life in the service of our country in 2006. So, yeah, they' they're probably the beers that, you know, I love the most. Yeah. Yeah. Good stuff.
01:05:27
Speaker
Um, I guess so yeah, I, I usually also to wrap up, I mean i guess we've almost covered some of this already, but if you were to sort of, um go back to the start again, and I guess not so much with the cafe, but we're starting to brew.
01:05:40
Speaker
What's the one thing you wish you'd known, you know, when, when you were putting bigger kit, uh, that there was a big downturn coming. Um, that would have been handy to know. Oh, look, I don't know.
01:05:51
Speaker
It's all part of the experience. yeah Um, It's been fun. Enjoy the ride while you're there. Yeah, enjoy the ride. If someone came to me and said, don't open a brewery, I still would have done it anyway.
01:06:10
Speaker
There wasn't going to be anything sort of stopping us. Yeah. Just enjoy it. like you know Don't die wondering either. Well, that probably covers the second question. What's the one bit of advice you'd give to anyone starting out today as don't know what future Matty's doing. You've gone from my what schoolboy, rugby player, soldier, stock trader, professional brewer, business owner, hospitality. What's what's some pivot to 2029 Wilson?
01:06:36
Speaker
Day off. I'd like to go on a holiday and not... um Not be bothered. Yeah, there you go. I'm on my holiday here, sat across from you having spent an hour getting this set just made it a trip, tax deductible times. Exactly.
01:06:50
Speaker
I know Willie Simpson said I read something years and years ago when I was um you first getting this so off the ground and he was still writing about beer and setting up seven sheds in Tassie. He goes, I don't have a job. I have a tax-deductible lifestyle. And I think, you know, once once you went to the beer industry. You know what? Yeah. And that's true. Like, we when we were sort of researching, setting up this place, Shaz and I went to Canada and kind and ah And then we sort of caught the train from Vancouver to Seattle and then Portland and drag the kids through every single brewery in Portland.
01:07:25
Speaker
And like we had an absolute ball. The kids had enough of us by the end of it. But, um, yeah, it was. you know, research and development. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I think it was the first or second time we were coming to the Sunshine Coast with the kids, but and we were in Brisbane and daughter must be old enough to, you know, maybe five or six. Where are we going next? We're off to Mooloola Bar.
01:07:47
Speaker
And she goes, not another bar, daddy. yeah I was like, realized that by the time she was three, she'd been to more breweries than she'd been once on the planet. And it was like, you know what? We actually probably need it. I was like, you just go and do that stuff on your own. It's fine. I'll i'll look after the kids, you know?
01:08:02
Speaker
My kids are the same. but yeah And now you get them to go and work for you. yeah Yep. I guess the other thing for the future is, is that you know, in terms of, you know, other than getting through this downturn, if you have so one hope for the future of beer, either generally or in Australia specifically, but what would you love to see?
01:08:18
Speaker
ah Look, i just don't want to see the industry, like the independent side of it, um die. you know um ah I think there's a lot of value in having um yeah know places like this that are not you know a Coles or a Woolies pub that are soulless.
01:08:40
Speaker
you know You go down here and they've got a ah sign out the front, guaranteed gaming hours. yeah till 4am um it's soul destroying it is it is you know and i can't i'm not allowed to put a sign out in the front saying happy hour right on friday like it's crazy yeah um yeah i don't these shout out to queensland nicholas once again thank you these um yeah ah look rather than I know I'm talking my own book, but I know what's doing more damage to the community.
01:09:11
Speaker
And it's not a couple of boomers coming down to my venue and drinking $5 schooners, you know, someone putting their paycheck through the pokies at four o'clock in the morning is a bigger scourge on our society then know, having a couple of 6% beers on Friday afternoon. so um ah um yeah I don't want to see this the vibrancy of the industry die um i think it it is important to the the the fabric of our communities um that that's my big my big wish yeah yeah you you and many others i think now well and thank you so much for your time matt appreciate appreciate nadie thank you boys enjoy it always cheers cheers
01:09:55
Speaker
The Crafty Pint podcast is produced and edited by Matt Hoffman. You can get all your beer-related news and reviews on the Crafty Pint website, craftypint.com, and can stay up to date on future podcast episodes via our socials.
01:10:09
Speaker
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01:10:25
Speaker
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