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Comics Catch-Up 078: Fantastic Four: Full Circle
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Alex Ross' 2022 prestige Abrams Arts tribute to Lee and Kirby's Fantastic Four is what we're catching up on this month. It's good, but is it great to the point we'd recommend it to others? Listen and find out!
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Transcript
Introduction and Show Details
00:00:00
Speaker
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Comics Catch-Up Segment
00:00:28
Speaker
Oh, my God, it's carnage. I think it's a fossil in the world. This is Comics Catch-Up. Hey, twerp. You better not be mine.
00:00:41
Speaker
Come on. Come on.
00:00:51
Speaker
where we read comics suggested by you, the listeners of War Rocket Apex, that we have missed. Oh, hey, didn't see you there.
00:01:03
Speaker
It's been a while. Let's catch up. Comics Catch Up, that is. This is the show where your hosts, me, Chris Sims, and, of course, Matt Wilson, catch up on the comics that we might have missed somewhere along the way that, ah for one reason or another,
00:01:21
Speaker
Either we or our listeners think we should read.
Discussion on 'Fantastic Four Full Circle'
00:01:24
Speaker
On the show this time, we have been suggested, it was suggested by our listeners that we read Fantastic Four Full Circle.
00:01:36
Speaker
A, i guess you would call it a graphic novel. It is a relatively short one. i You might just call it a prestige single issue. Was it short?
00:01:51
Speaker
It was 64 pages-ish. um No, there's no way. No way it's 40 pages, or 64 pages, come on. it's I mean, there's some two-page spreads in it. Be real with me, Matt.
00:02:08
Speaker
um It is by Alex Ross. It is from 2022. And throwback... a very much a throwback it's ah It's Alex Ross like doing his like Lee and Kirby tribute.
00:02:23
Speaker
you It's it's his his tribute to Lee and Kirby Fantastic Four, no doubt. Chris, am I to take from what you have said here that you're not that you weren't a big fan?
00:02:34
Speaker
fine that's fine It's fine. That's the thing. It's fine. Here's hear's one thing about it. It does look great.
00:02:45
Speaker
It is, it is i think, valuable as ah for us, as professional comic book critics, to read this. Because you never get to see Alex Ross pencils.
00:03:01
Speaker
You only get to see like painted stuff. And and getting like you know sequential pencils... is like pretty you know pretty cool to see. it It's a mix of, of I think, traditional pencil and ink art and painted art um in a very interesting way. like To my eye, it's kind of hard to tell what's painted and what's not in places. what we get We get that opening spread that's definitely like classic Alex Ross painted.
00:03:34
Speaker
yeah and then we have... ah By the way, ah art and script, Alex Ross, colors by Alex Ross. Alex Ross with Josh Johnson, ah littering by Ariana Mayer.
00:03:48
Speaker
but like yeah like There's a little bit of of painted in here, but mostly it looks like it's... yeah I mean, it's from 2022, so it's definitely like digitally colored, but it's very much a version of of digital coloring that is intended to evoke...
00:04:08
Speaker
like classic four-color coloring. like There's bende dots on various pages. and For sure. yeah and there's ah you know i mean you know it's ah It's a Lee and Kirby Fantastic Four tribute, so there's like a little oh a photo collage of of weird stuff when they're going to the negative zone.
00:04:27
Speaker
ah be like Fun to read. Looks good. you know i i'm not i wouldn't say I'm an Alex Ross hater. But I am someone who kind of like, you know, like when I was a kid, I thought Alex Ross stuff was like, wow, that's like real art.
00:04:45
Speaker
And then I was like, actually, that doesn't really make for good comics. I remember Wizard Magazine really like digging into what was that? What was that? His big like breakout series. Kingdom Come.
00:05:01
Speaker
Yeah, but the Marvel one. Marvels. marvel It was just called Marvels. That's right. Like, youre really digging into the art of Marvels and like being like, ah, in this in this piece, like the shadow of Cyclops' hand is over Jean Grey's crotch.
00:05:18
Speaker
It's like, okay, Wizard Magazine. All right. Wizard Magazine fucking busted a nut over Alex or Ross. I don't want to be foul about or anything, but...
00:05:31
Speaker
like, I think that was one of the things that kind of not, not turned me on Alex Ross, but definitely sped me on my way. was that like, soured boy, wizard magazine loved him.
00:05:46
Speaker
Wizard magazine really loved him. Yeah. Uh, like probably too much. Like Alex Ross is like, I, I have no distaste for Alex Ross. Like I, I like a lot of his work just fine. and well i like I will say this. I feel like this book is some of the most dynamic – even back when he used to do interiors, like painted interiors, like light Marvels and Kingdom Come. like They always felt very –
00:06:24
Speaker
posed and staged and rigid, and there wasn't a lot of a sense of action to the art. This is way better in that regard.
00:06:35
Speaker
Yeah, I do think it is it is worth noting that Alex Ross did, I think, go through a a period where he was doing a lot of art that didn't play to his strengths.
00:06:54
Speaker
like It was just like a big deal to have an Alex Ross cover. And so a lot of them just like kind of... they They weren't showing off what was good. I think he's done some of his all-time best work recently.
00:07:10
Speaker
i agree. Doing like the the covers for FF. have been so ro that oh For the Ryan North run. I was actually very interested to see... that The Fantastic Four costumes that debut in this book, which I think it's worth ah pointing out that this was not just straight published by Marvel Comics.
00:07:33
Speaker
It was published by Abrams Comics Arts. Yeah, I mean, look, I'm not going to lie. That also like triggered my contrarian-ass streak where I'm like, oh oh, this is from Marvel Arts.
00:07:48
Speaker
Yeah. Oh, this did you did you had to get you had to get like a special thing for this? Marvel Arts?
00:07:58
Speaker
Yeah, they they went to Abrams for this one. and and And had to make it very special. Instead of just being published by straight up Marvel. yeah Come on, man.
Themes and Character Development in the Novel
00:08:16
Speaker
like just like I feel like this book really... Like, I sat down and I was like, alright book, I'm ready to read. And this book was like, hey, do you want be an asshole about some stuff? And I was like, do I ever?
00:08:31
Speaker
I'm trying to see what else has been published under the Marvel Arts banner. Spider-Man panel by panel. ah The Chip Kid. That's the Chip Kid Spider-Man book.
00:08:44
Speaker
ah Avengers The Veracity Trap. That's also a Chip Kid thing. just that Honestly, I think this is someone who has ah certainly enjoyed... Chip Gidd published the Batmanga stuff before DC did like He's the one who went and dug that stuff up so that we could see it over here in the ah and in the Western Hemisphere.
00:09:09
Speaker
And I'm like, boy, that... What is it? The veracity trap? That sounds insufferable. Yeah. and That's not fair.
00:09:20
Speaker
That's not fair of me to say. ah Let's see. X-Men Elswin, which was a I think is a reprint of a John Byrne thing. That's probably bad. That's probably bad, yeah.
00:09:33
Speaker
ah The Mighty Marvel Calendar Book.
00:09:38
Speaker
Not a lot. There's not a lot under this. under this and and Well, another Alex Ross thing, his Uncle Sam book, it got an Abrams ah version.
00:09:50
Speaker
That's wild, because that's just a straight-up DC character. That's just a straight-up DC comic, I think. Yeah. It was Vertigo. It was Vertigo, yeah. yeah That's right. ah Marvel classic blacklight posters. Yeah.
00:10:06
Speaker
they must They must have really invested heavily and in whatever ink you need to use for Blacklight posters. Doctor Strange, The Book of the Vishanti. o hu ah Another Chip Kid thing, Fantastic Four, panel by panel.
00:10:23
Speaker
it's this It's this kind of stuff. It's the it's the kind of like highbrow ah comics stuff. so So yeah, that's what That's what we're getting here. that's That's the... And as you know, listeners, we're a couple of dummies.
00:10:42
Speaker
yeah We're a couple of dummies who don't like intellectual stuff.
00:10:50
Speaker
i I will say this. i I think I started to say this and then cut myself off. um The Fantastic Four costumes from the Ryan North run apparently originate in this book.
00:11:04
Speaker
Like... I thought they just looked different, but according to this comic, they have a functional difference. It's a different kind of unstable molecules.
00:11:17
Speaker
There's like vibranium in them too, that the the Fantastic Four put on so they can like... be protected in the negative zone. I mean, they put them on because Alex Ross wanted to design some new Fantastic Four costumes.
00:11:32
Speaker
Absolutely, yes. But there he does try to explain, here's why we need new costumes. There is and there is the barest justification for Architect Adventure Fantastic Four suits, yes.
00:11:44
Speaker
Yes. And ah the thing is just like, still trunks for me, huh? It's it's a good, like again, this is not a bad comic. It's fine. I just, of all the comics that people think we should read, I'm very curious to know, why this one?
00:12:02
Speaker
I think people were under the impression that this would change our mind about Alex Ross. That this would like convince us or convince yeah convince us that like Alex Ross is more like we are and likes the kind of stuff we do.
00:12:18
Speaker
More than other Alex Ross work. I mean, I've never thought that Alex Ross doesn't like comics. I mean, you know, clearly he likes Jack Kirby. Like, there's a lot of Jack Kirby in this. And, like, it is a fitting and enjoyable tribute to Jack Kirby. This is definitely because at some point I said, like, i don't even think Alex Ross likes comics.
00:12:43
Speaker
And then immediately forgot I said it
00:12:47
Speaker
and And I was very sure of this when I said it.
00:12:54
Speaker
Sure. Yeah. that I could buy that. Yeah. this This does also continue what I think is an interesting trend of comics of the 2020s.
00:13:06
Speaker
Mm-hmm. So, like, you know, like back in the 2010s, when we were writing about comics a lot on Comics Alliance. Yes. I in particular got like fascinated by the idea of like the question of, what age of comics is this?
00:13:26
Speaker
And I even did like a For a while, I did a up ah continuing piece, like a monthly piece on Comics Alliance where I would ask the same question of several creators or retailers or whoever the question was appropriate for.
00:13:47
Speaker
And just, like, publish their answers. It was like a a big quote rail of answers to the same question. One of the first ones I did was, what age of comics is this?
00:13:58
Speaker
And a lot of people answered, like, the sort of Grant Morrison-theorized prismatic age of comics. Where comics are increasingly a reflection of comics.
00:14:14
Speaker
Like, comics. the various previous ages of comics. And I don't know how accurate or correct that is. To a degree it is. Like, it does feel like comics are always looking back or were always looking back in the 2010s in particular.
00:14:33
Speaker
In the 2020s, we've gotten a specific different kind of looking back of going back to like the early stories Of a character, in particular a Marvel character.
00:14:48
Speaker
And snatching out like little used or obscure stuff from those early stories and bringing them back. And this does that.
00:15:00
Speaker
this This brings back that guy who who became the thing for an issue. I mean, you say little used and obscure, Yeah. I would say this man, this monster it's well yes not obscure. It's not obscure, but that guy never came back, to my knowledge, until no Alex Ross brought him back here. Yeah, which I think is like, was immediately put off by that. Because I was like, do we need a sequel to this man, this monster?
00:15:37
Speaker
And what we end up getting is kind of more than that, but also kind of less than that. And, you know, you said it's a ah great tribute to Kirby, and it is.
00:15:48
Speaker
in on In one respect. Where it's, you know, it's it's very obvious that Alex Ross really likes Jack Kirby. But, like, I'm not saying, you know, you you can't do stuff that Kirby did.
00:16:06
Speaker
Because then we just wouldn't have Marvel Comics. We'd have Spider-Man. And that's it. Yeah. the The reason I say that is like like Zeb Wells brought back the living brain.
00:16:19
Speaker
Yeah. For Spider-Man 900. Or kind of for that whole run, but like in particular for Spider-Man 900. Yeah. And like I feel like there are a couple other examples of that in recent years.
00:16:32
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, undoubtedly. Yeah. I just – it's – this is a weird one to me. But it's fine.
00:16:44
Speaker
It's fine. Well, i you know, I do like – I like – here's my favorite thing about the whole story. Okay. It seems like – well, at first it seems like the guy is a villain.
00:16:56
Speaker
And then it seems like he's dead. But they go to the negative zone to try to figure out what's going on with him anyway or why he came there. And and you know so on and so forth.
00:17:08
Speaker
And then they go to the negative zone. you know there's There's complications ah to to finally find him.
00:17:19
Speaker
But when they finally find the guy, he's like, oh yeah, being the thing changed my life and made my life better. like yeah Ben Grimm made me a good person. like By becoming him for a while, he rubbed off on me and now... like I'm an altruistic and good human being.
00:17:37
Speaker
Yeah, I did really like the kind of idea that, like, I realized i realized i was a better person when I was pretending to be you. Yeah. And, like, I feel like that's not only, like like, that's, like, a good, like, that's a good bit, but it's also, like, a very Marvel Comics thing.
00:17:55
Speaker
You know? it's a very it's a It's specifically, I think, a very Ben Grimm thing. Like, it's just by virtue of being around Ben Grimm or being in his presence or, or like taking anything from him.
00:18:10
Speaker
His name is Ricardo Jones, by the way, which you know, good name.
00:18:19
Speaker
It's, it's a little weird to be like, yeah, he's he's just got like a regular person name. Uh, but yeah, that's his name, Ricardo Jones. Uh, but like,
00:18:31
Speaker
being Having his life positively affected and improved by Ben Grimm, and then being helped by the Fantastic Four to not have to live in the like mechanical suit that he's been living in for, in in real time, 63 years?
00:18:54
Speaker
sixty No, 61 years. Yeah, well, ah this man, this monster was 64. six Was it 66? It's later than I thought. Okay. Yeah. Cause it's after Galactus. So, so not quite 60 years, I guess. Yeah. Um, but like, yeah, it's gotta be on a Galactus because it is when Johnny's at college and Johnny goes to college at the end of the third part of the Galactus trilogy.
00:19:19
Speaker
Right. a tough ways second issue The second half of fantastic four, number 50 is just Johnny going to college. Yeah. Um, But ah the whole thing of like, they save him again or they help him again by giving some of their new outfits to him so he doesn't have to wear this suit anymore.
00:19:40
Speaker
um like I like that. I like the sort of pure altruism of not just Ben, but the Fantastic Four in total.
00:19:52
Speaker
yeah No, like it's it's, again, when I say it's fine, I mean, it's better than average. Yeah. There's stuff that i really liked in here.
00:20:03
Speaker
I do not regret my time reading it. I am shocked to find out it's 64 pages. I mean, it's probably more than that if with all the double page spreads.
00:20:17
Speaker
But yeah, it's it's not that long. There is a really good joke about when they go to a Negative Zone version of Earth and Johnny says that he wants to see if there's a Shonies. That joke struck me weird.
00:20:32
Speaker
How did Johnny Storm know about Shonies? how does it Was Shonies in New York City? No! No, it wasn't in New York City. Where's Alex Ross from?
00:20:43
Speaker
I think Alex Ross is maybe a Southern guy. If he's making jokes about Shonies... He's from Portland, Oregon. Wild. He's out here making jokes about Shoney's. Alex Ross and Scott Steiner had a great conversation one day at a con.
00:21:01
Speaker
Shoney's is like... One of the only ones left is owned by Scott Steiner. Yeah.
00:21:11
Speaker
It never got outside of the Southeast. No. No, it did not. it's It's bonkers that he's like... out That would be like... If Greg Rucka had Daredevil talking about Bojangles.
00:21:26
Speaker
yeah You know what? You know what? He should. Daredevil should fly down to Charlotte and be like, damn, they got Bojangles in this airport. they yeah There's Bojangles everywhere here. I'm staying.
00:21:40
Speaker
I can smell that Cajun flavor from here. I got it my advanced ah smelling senses. God, Matt, I would fuck up a Cajun Filet right now.
00:21:52
Speaker
I can imagine. I can imagine. I would mail you one if that would work. There's got to be a way. There's got to be a way that doesn't involve me driving to... don't even know.
00:22:05
Speaker
Let's see. According to Wikipedia, as of April 2024, which is two years almost two years ago Shoney still had 58 operating locations, which seems high. That does seem kind of high.
00:22:22
Speaker
But they were they are all in the southeast. All And why in Pennsylvania? There's one in Pennsylvania. i would I believe i would have to drive to Kansas City or normal Illinois.
00:22:43
Speaker
Okay. There's a Bojangles at a truck stop in Illinois. That is nuts. And there's one in Pueblo, Colorado. They are expanding west. I know that. Okay, there's one in Pueblo, Colorado and one in Las Vegas.
00:23:00
Speaker
that meant that I can buy that. I can buy that there's one in Las Vegas. There used to be one in New York City. ah A Bojangles, not a Shoney's. ah For a long time.
00:23:11
Speaker
And then it finally closed.
00:23:15
Speaker
But there was one Bojangles in New York City for a while. Yeah, i think I think I could drive directly south.
00:23:27
Speaker
I could get on 35 and drive to Bojangles.
00:23:33
Speaker
You could probably find a Bojangles much faster than you could find Shoney's. Probably. i mean, damn, let's see. I'm on i'm on maps. Let's see.
00:23:44
Speaker
I bet the closest Shoney's is probably going to be in Missouri. Amazing. You nailed it. um Unfortunately, that Shoney's does say temporarily closed. Oh, But that one is – that's got to be Branson without even zooming in. Yeah, that's Branson. There's one in Branson.
00:24:05
Speaker
Of course. There's also one in Oklahoma. Yeah. So if I go even further down 35, I can then take ah take a left on 40 and get to Shoney's.
00:24:22
Speaker
Okay. Which, if Johnny Storm's looking for a Shoney's,
00:24:28
Speaker
he they land in the wrong place. they Yes, they go to ah what they think is a negative Earth in the negative zone, but is a in fact a positive Earth um imbued with positive energy, i think because of Ricardo Jones's presence.
Critique and Cultural References
00:24:49
Speaker
um And so, like, the Fantastic Four thinks everybody's there is going to kill him, but they're friendly. They're all friends. Yeah, and then ah some dude who looks like Leonard Nimoy shows up.
00:25:04
Speaker
Uh-huh, uh-huh. there's a whole thing about how on this planet, the Iroquois... met aliens and then they conquered Europe.
00:25:18
Speaker
Yeah, they they did reverse ah ah Manifest Destiny. Yeah, which i don't... Like, man, 2022, you didn't... act yout You could have not had Manifest Destiny at all on your on your um imaginary Earth you just made up.
00:25:40
Speaker
it It is weird that that guy who is just supposed to be a Native American has pointy ears, like a ah a Vulcan. Yeah, like, fully looks like... like There's a thing where he's like raising up his hand, you know saying, hey.
00:25:59
Speaker
And it's like, did you just not draw the fingers in the right shape?
00:26:05
Speaker
Why is he pointy? looks like Leonard Nimoy. like what Like, why are these people mutants? I don't think that's explained at all. Well, I mean, to be fair, Matt, in Marvel Comics, some people are just mutants. and you do so You can't just ask people why they're mutants. That's rude. You're just born in that way. That's true. yeah The Lion Man is just that way. Yeah.
00:26:31
Speaker
Which is, you know, that is Marvel Comics. That is true. they Man, there's some Star Trek-ass looking at people in here. That lady with the big forehead.
00:26:41
Speaker
there is ah There is a lady with a big forehead. yeah that's That's for sure. She looks like Bellana Torres.
00:26:50
Speaker
She does. You're you're right. yeah um the The nega man, Richard Janus, is also in this. who is also i feel like that's a little bit of a deep pull, too. that and that that is certainly I would say that qualifies as more ah oh obscure and underused than Ricardo Jones.
00:27:11
Speaker
Yeah, ah he he was in three issues of the early Fantastic Four run, and then he was in some of the ah Carlos Pacheco issues that got real weird. Carlos Pacheco issues did, in fact, get very weird.
00:27:33
Speaker
I mean, that's that that's the they're beautiful, yeah. um That's the period of Valeria from the future. Mm-hmm. who arrives before actual Valeria gets born.
00:27:45
Speaker
Yeah. That's, that's that period of fantastic four, but also I guess, uh, the nega man, Richard Janus is, uh, is in that as well. But like, that's, that's the big complication that keeps the fantastic four from getting to Ricardo Jones, um, is that they run into, uh, Janus, the nega man, um, who hates Reed.
00:28:10
Speaker
er because Because they were old college roommates too, like him and Doom. There is a very funny bit where ah Ben is like, hey, Reed, you got any other asshole college roommates do you want to tell us about? i did Not roommates, just... but just Any other legend i jerks you knew in college?
00:28:29
Speaker
Yeah, i I said roommates. i didn't i They just knew each other in college. yeah And Reed goes, only you, handsome. Which I think is a fun... That's a fun Reed exchange.
00:28:40
Speaker
There's a handful of interesting dialogue in this that I really wish it would dig into a little more. That that is true. like The line about Shoney's, the only you handsome, that kind of stuff. like There are moments of like flashes of being weird.
00:28:56
Speaker
And then there's a level of the ah there's there is a level of reverence to this that is maybe a little two
00:29:07
Speaker
adherent To the source material, to where it kind of reads as, not pastiche, but like,
00:29:19
Speaker
I don't know, like the whole thing about Ben wanting to make a big Dagwood sandwich at the start. I mean, yeah, but that like that's that to me is like the stuff that rings truest about it. Sure, I mean, it's it's very it's very faithful.
00:29:34
Speaker
You know? like it it It just also feels a little bit like... Almost this like self-parody. I don't know. ah it's It's hard. It's hard to say, like, is this too faithful to the original material to where it's just kind of a retread?
Humor and Character Dynamics
00:29:54
Speaker
Yeah, my whole thing was... was like with that With that only you, handsome, line, was the Reed busting out a handsome...
00:30:04
Speaker
in it. And I'm like, okay, is it weird for Reed to kind of pick on the thing that we know Ben is really sensitive about, which is that he's a fucking monster.
00:30:20
Speaker
Or is that me nitpicking and looking for things I don't like about this? Yeah, I i i like the only you handsome line. I do too. I i kind of came down on on like, no, you're thinking about it too hard.
00:30:35
Speaker
I feel like it's him trying to like, let Ben know. It's that kind of like, friend shorthand.
00:30:46
Speaker
Where like, People say, like like, really close friends say that kind of stuff to each other. Yeah, like how I'm always, like, you know, cracking jokes about the things that I know you're really sensitive about. I mean... From my fingers over here.
00:31:02
Speaker
youre you're ah Hey, hey. um But you're like, you know, and you're like, oh, man, I know you love John Byrne. Boy, do you love John Byrne. Okay, yeah, that actually is a thing I do.
00:31:14
Speaker
Yeah. That actually is.
00:31:18
Speaker
I mean, it's because you say you love John Byrne.
00:31:25
Speaker
There is a thing at the end of this where Reed is like coming up with some kind of
00:31:34
Speaker
meta explanation as to why the negative zone is the way it is. the negative like it's it That was very funny to me because you remember that thing in um in the Ultimate a book?
00:31:48
Speaker
where Reed's like, like Ultimate Reed, who is Doctor Doom? or is it, is it, it's not Ultimate Reed, because Ultimate Reed's the maker. Ultimate Reed's the maker, yeah. It must have been Ultimate Doom.
00:32:01
Speaker
i forget, I forget what their entire relationship was. But he was like, yeah, you know, I get into these, these depressive cycles. I call it my negative zone. And then it's like, oh, but this, this is like, actually that.
00:32:15
Speaker
i think this is I think that was Ultimate Doom, who whose depressive cycle was his negative zone. Yeah, so it does turn out that um the negative zone, like from from comics, is a zone where where the secret is real.
00:32:36
Speaker
Right. And it's all bad. You can manifest negative things with your thoughts in the negative zone. Yeah. yeah And ah and that he's explaining this on the last page.
00:32:49
Speaker
Yeah, just kind of like real quick drops by with, by the way, I think the negative zone is is ontologically a bummer. And he's like, ah and you know, only only Ricardo with his positive energy could like push back the negative environment of the negative zone.
00:33:09
Speaker
And then the last thing that happens in the whole book is just Ben saying, like, why don't you shut up? but Why don't you shut up and be happy that we're home safe? and shut Hey, Reed, shut the fuck up.
00:33:22
Speaker
Reed, just shut the fuck up. Let me eat my sandwich. Just shut up. i do I do like... i do i I mean, I think that's really funny. like i I would love it if they were like, yeah, by the way, the Negative Zone, everybody's bummed out all time because it's ontologically negative.
00:33:41
Speaker
like I think that's great. In the same way that I think, like you know how in our world, you know we've got we've got the God particle?
00:33:52
Speaker
Right. But in the in the in the Absolute Universe, they have the Devil particle? Like, that's... I'm fucking here for that shit, man. Yeah, that must be the Biggs Hosan.
00:34:06
Speaker
Exactly. Yeah. ah Or the... Never mind. Never mind.
00:34:17
Speaker
Alright, let's rank Fantastic Four Full Circle.
Final Thoughts and Reviews
00:34:22
Speaker
um Which is good. It's fine, yeah. It's good. Like, i will say...
00:34:31
Speaker
It's some of my favorite Alex Ross work. It's not needlessly dark. The art doesn't look like people in costumes.
00:34:41
Speaker
No, I will say it definitely does. Reed Richards looks like Reed Richards, and The Thing looks like The Thing. Yeah. like The biggest criticism I think I would have of Alex Ross like art-wise is so often his art just looks like people like people in cosplay.
00:35:06
Speaker
like It looks like he got your neighbor to dress up as as Captain Marvel. or Or in Earth-X, when you know Captain in America is like the old guy draped in the flag with the A on his forehead. like That just looked like some guy that looked like a guy. that looked Yeah, it looked like his neighbor. you know like It didn't look unreal enough.
00:35:35
Speaker
it does It didn't look unreal like comics often do. yeah look like It was uncanny and not in the X-Men way. In and in a break-the-reality kind of way.
00:35:49
Speaker
Yeah. yeah so But yes, like ah here's here's the thing. I do not regret reading this book. I also kind of do not understand why I had to read it.
00:36:01
Speaker
You know? It's perfectly fine. And and even I would even say good. Would you recommend someone go out of their way to read this book?
00:36:14
Speaker
No. Yeah, me either. Like, it's it's good. Yeah, but there's there's comics I like more.
00:36:25
Speaker
Now, I read like the first couple stories in Lone Wolf and Cub, and I had forgotten that like the fucking first thing you see Ogami Ito do...
00:36:36
Speaker
is jump up on the baby carriage with a baby in one hand and the sword in the other hand and, like, skate the baby carriage down a mountain while sword fighting dudes? Yeah, man.
00:36:47
Speaker
And I'm like... There's good shit Lone Wolf Cub. Yeah, I could have been reading that shit this entire time. Like, there's other comics that I would much rather have spent this time reading.
00:37:00
Speaker
But this wasn't bad. Alright, I'm gonna find the exact midpoint of the list. Okay, 1684 is our total. You're right. said whole chest. 842 is alias number 10.
00:37:17
Speaker
forty eight thirty two
00:37:21
Speaker
it'd be eight forty two eight forty two you're right i said that with my whole chest
00:37:28
Speaker
ah a forty two is alias number ten And 843 is Sin City, The Hard Goodbye. i mean, I think The Hard Goodbye is better than this. Yeah, okay. 850 is Nightfall. I think that's better. Nightfall is better than this. Like, that's the problem. It's top-heavy list. I think we've got to scroll down a lot.
00:37:48
Speaker
Okay, 900 is Revenge of the Sinister Six. o Well, here's the thing about that. is That's the one where Doc Ock fucking wrecks the house.
00:38:02
Speaker
That's true. ah nine fifty is It's certainly not as good as what we have at 901, which is Judge Dredd America. Yeah. 950 is Hellboy Heads.
00:38:14
Speaker
that's That one's got a lot of heads in it. 975 is Flex Mentalo. I would recommend that before I would recommend this. I'm i'm surprised you're going by the 25s at this point, and not the 100s.
00:38:27
Speaker
Alright, 1000 is Masters of the Universe, the origin of Hordek. Also a Kirby tribute. Yeah. But one that I think was... It's it's is more kind of original.
00:38:41
Speaker
Or like, taking a Kirby thing to do something else. Yeah. yeah like A much weirder and more unexpected Kirby tribute. 1050 is Captain America Man of Straw, which is that story where John Walker fucks up a scarecrow.
00:38:57
Speaker
Man, i ah that story's really low, and I like that story. And we did not like we ranked it like recently, like last year.
00:39:08
Speaker
I think it's right where it ought to be. think that story's fun. ah Number 1100. Alright, this is better than Hot Claws for Hanukkah. That's at 1053.
00:39:21
Speaker
Okay, great. Is it better than Sleepwalker numbers 1 through 33? I don't think so. Okay. Is it better than I Left My Heart at the Justice Society Canteen? Yes.
00:39:34
Speaker
So it's the new number 1052.
00:39:39
Speaker
Sleepwalker, that's Sandman done right, Matt. Ha ha ha.
00:39:47
Speaker
ah Fantastic Four, full circle, and I'll put in parentheses Alex Ross.
00:39:52
Speaker
Is the new number 1052. You know, it's it's good. It's it's perhaps too too faithful of a tribute. to like it the think about This is the thing we've always said about Jack Kirby, I think.
00:40:10
Speaker
A lot of people have done a lot of Jack Kirby tributes. And I think if Jack Kirby were alive... And could respond to them. He would say, don't redo my stuff.
00:40:26
Speaker
Make something new.
00:40:29
Speaker
Yeah. But like, i think it's I think it's fine to do a Jack Kirby tribute. Sure. And I think it's fine. like you know We've seen Tom Scioli and Keith Giffen do Kirby tributes.
00:40:43
Speaker
But I feel like those are also people who have... a long history of like making their... like kind of going their own way. oh And I'm not saying Alex Ross doesn't. Alex Ross has a long and like very respectable career. like i like Marvel's.
00:41:00
Speaker
I think Kingdom Come is fine. oh it's It's neither Mark Waid nor Ross's best work. Earth-X gets so weird that it's fascinating. Earth-X is fascinating.
00:41:13
Speaker
Like... I've recently dug into some of the kind of like lore of some of the later Earth-X series, and it gets so weird and out there that I have to give it at least some respect.
00:41:29
Speaker
well When you get to the Marv-El universe, that's when I'm like, okay, this is actually good. This is Shot the Moon.
00:41:41
Speaker
When you get to um Galactus died, so Franklin Richards had to be made into Galactus. Yeah, man. Earth-X is wild. Earth-X is wild, yeah.
00:41:53
Speaker
I did want to say there is ah a part of this comic that I did really unreservedly like, which is right at the beginning, there's a panel where the thing says, Johnny, you ignoramus, you made me smush my dagwood.
00:42:07
Speaker
Which is very funny.
00:42:11
Speaker
Yeah, he smushed it all right. Made him smush his egg would. I think my favorite thing about this book is the coloring. i I do think if you are an Alex Ross fan and you haven't read this, I mean, obviously, you're going to want to read this, you're an Alex Ross fan. But also, it is fun to see Alex Ross pencils. You know, Alex Ross pencils, inks, and colors, as opposed to so paintings, which is very fun.
00:42:37
Speaker
Yeah, and the the colors, I think, really complement it and get like abstract and trippy um in a way that a lot of Alex Ross art is not.
00:42:52
Speaker
Yeah. I do appreciate that a whole bunch of like trying trying to go a little more for the unreality and the heightened...
00:43:04
Speaker
comic-y-ness of it all. Definitely. Instead of trying to make it look like, you know, a guy in a costume. Yeah. ah So, okay.
Closing and Listener Engagement
00:43:15
Speaker
It's the new number 1052. We do appreciate the suggestion, everybody. um Yeah, I know I'm coming off crabby.
00:43:24
Speaker
I am curious to know... um' just Just generally, I'm curious to know like why people recommend us things. And I am like... Very curious to know if people... I i mean, i don't consider myself a hater, but there's a lot of things that I have not considered myself a hater on that it turns out other people like a lot more than I do. So if that was it, just let me know.
00:43:47
Speaker
Yep. Alright. If you would like to recommend... something else for us to read on Comics Catch Up. You can do it by emailing us at our email address, which is warrocketpodcast at gmail.com. You can also get in touch with us on Blue Sky. We're there at warrocketajax.com.
00:44:07
Speaker
That's our Blue Sky handle. So just look at look search for War Rocket Ajax and you'll find us. We're on Tumblr, warrocketpodcast.tumblr.com. We also have a Discord,
00:44:20
Speaker
um which you can join. If you ask us for an invitation, send us a message on any of the places I just mentioned, and we will hit you up with an invitation to the discord and you can join there.
00:44:31
Speaker
We're also on Patreon. If you want to support these monthly comics catch-ups, as well as every story ever specials in the regular War Rocket Ajax show, go to patreon.com slash warrocketajax, and you can contribute as little as a dollar a month there to help us out. And you can also message us there, suggestions for comics catch-up.
00:44:56
Speaker
Our website is warrocketajax.com. It has every episode of the show we've ever done. WarRocketWiki.com has all the info you could need to know about this show, WarRocket Ajax. If you want to find me and my stuff, go to MattDWilson.net to find links to everything. Chris, where can people find you?
00:45:12
Speaker
Everybody can find me by going to The-ISB.com. That is my website, and it has links to everything that I do. And you can contact me through that website and hire me, because I am currently unemployed.
00:45:23
Speaker
And you should. Do it. Do it. Hey. Do it. Thanks for listening, everybody. We'll be back with another Comics Catch-Up next month. Thanks for listening.
00:45:35
Speaker
And until next time, good catching up.