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Combatting Stress: Part I
86 Plays1 year ago
From the small, mundane stressors of the everyday to the bigger, more overwhelming worries that can come throughout our lives, it’s simply a fact that many of us encounter stress often. And while we may not be able to always mitigate or erase the pressures completely, we do have more control over how they impact our life overall than perhaps we are aware! This week, we are starting a discussion on stress and how it affects our senses and physiology, some of the ways we can prevent it and share some strategies on how to balance the reality of stress in our lives with the bigger picture.
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Transcript
Introduction and Website Confusion
00:00:00
Speaker
Hang on. So I know I didn't write down the website. So let me just, I think I still have it up. Sure. Oh, it's one of those ones where, what is it? Yeah. Okay. So I was going to say off, awfully.com, but I was like, Oh no, is she, and she is, she's an occupational therapist and her name is Holly. So it's more like OT Holly.com. You have to check these things. These are terrible. Yeah.
Podcast Introduction and Stress Discussion
00:00:38
Speaker
Welcome back to the Modern Lady Podcast. You're listening to episode 133. Hi, I'm Michelle. And I'm Lindsay. And today we are talking about strategies to minimize stress.
00:00:51
Speaker
Marcus Aurelius, a Roman emperor and Stoic philosopher from the second century, once said, quote, if you are distressed by anything external, the pain is not due to the thing itself, but to your estimate of it. And this you have the power to revoke at any moment. End quote.
00:01:10
Speaker
Stress can come in many forms in our day-to-day lives, and there's often just no way around it. But as the stoic says, our perspective and reaction to it can make all the difference, and that is entirely within our control.
Engaging the Audience: Reviews and Comments
00:01:26
Speaker
But first, the best way that you can support the Modern Lady podcast is by giving us a rating and review on whatever app you use to listen to podcasts. Your reviews, especially on iTunes, can really help others who might be interested find our podcast too. Your comments mean the world to us.
00:01:42
Speaker
This week's shout out goes to yayayazgirl who left us a review during our break on Apple podcasts and said quote, new listener here and I just adore every episode I listen in on. I feel so connected to their words, stories, testimonies and laughter. I hope they stick around. Surely they're helping me grow closer to Christ and the church. End quote.
00:02:07
Speaker
Well, thank you so much, yayayazgirl, for taking the time to leave us this wonderful reading and review. And welcome! We are so glad that you found us and that we have been able to connect over all the things over here at the Modern Lady Podcast.
00:02:23
Speaker
And if you would like to leave us a comment, you can do so on our website, www.themodernlady1950.wordpress.com, or you can leave us a comment on Facebook, Instagram, or YouTube, where you can find us at the Modern Lady Podcast.
Rice Water: Uses and Benefits
00:02:43
Speaker
But before we get into today's chat, Lindsay has our Modern Lady Tip of the Week.
00:02:49
Speaker
I came across a cool post on social media a little while ago and I bookmarked it for our first tip of the week back. So while I don't often make rice, I know your family Michelle eats rice more often than my family, I was impressed when I saw this list of great uses for rice water.
00:03:07
Speaker
Now, I got this information from a blog that can be found at www.kimchimari.com. And in it, blogger slash photographer slash stylist slash recipe maker Jinju shares her favorite uses for rice water. First of all, rice water is called, now forgive my Korean, sal to nu in Korean. Sal meaning rice and mu means water.
00:03:32
Speaker
Jin Ju also makes it very clear that the first rinse of rice often contains pesticides and is best used for cleaning purposes, and the second or third rinse can be used for cooking. Then she continues and explains the science that makes rice water such a versatile thing. It has vitamins B1, B2, lipids and starches, which basically becomes a colloidal solution, which means it can clean things without chemicals.
00:03:57
Speaker
Okay, Jinju, we are impressed. Now what can we use it for? She first suggests using it to wash dishes. She says that this works on even greasy dishes. Her mother-in-law only rarely uses dish soap. You can use first or second rinse rice water for dishes. You can water your houseplants with first rinse water or veggie gardens with a second rinse water.
00:04:19
Speaker
She also recommends using it in cooking, second or third rinse. It makes broth richer and many Koreans use it to rinse their fish as it can help reduce the fishy smell and taste. You can soak fish in it for 30 minutes and it also helps make the fish tender. Smelly Tupperware? Rice water to the rescue! Fill stinky containers with rice water and let it sit for 30 minutes and that should do the trick.
00:04:44
Speaker
Now, the last homemaking tip involves using rice water to polish glass and mirrors. It works in the same way that it works on our dishes. Put some in a spray bottle and wipe down glass surfaces with a dry cloth. I bet you weren't expecting more, but there will be a part two. Next time we will learn why so many women swear by rice water for their skin and hair.
00:05:05
Speaker
Oh my goodness, I love this tip. Although I'm kind of kicking myself for how much rice water I waste. Well, I was wondering if you already do these things. Like, do you use rice water at all? Did your family? No, no, I don't. We do, I rinse the rice a lot before I cook it. Definitely to get like that first rinse, always like to get the dust and the pesticides and stuff off the rice. And then I would always do like a second, sometimes a third rinse.
00:05:34
Speaker
But I always just pour it right down the sink again, and I had no idea that I could actually use rice water.
Understanding and Mitigating Stress in Daily Life
00:05:41
Speaker
But when you were talking about it, I was thinking back to my childhood, we didn't have rice water, but I do remember my mom giving us barley water.
00:05:50
Speaker
sometimes to drink. Yeah, it was not my favorite thing. I will just say that right off the bat. But because it was good for us. And I'm sitting here thinking, well, I guess rice water and barley water, which share a lot of the same properties. So this is absolutely fascinating. And then the cleaning blows my mind. Yeah. Yeah. Especially the dishes. Like I want to try washing my dishes in it. I think that that one is particularly fascinating.
00:06:18
Speaker
And do you know what else is interesting is that this now kind of starts to make a little bit of sense about how Hammy Mummy, the YouTube channel that we love, how she always cleans with like food, water, I'll call it. She's like, yay, I'm going to bake with oranges. And while I'm cooking with the oranges, I'm going to soak the rinds in boiling water and clean my range hood with it.
00:06:47
Speaker
I never thought of doing that before, but maybe more food water is useful than I thought.
00:06:59
Speaker
From the small, mundane stressors of the everyday to the bigger, more overwhelming worries that can come throughout our lives, it's simply a fact that many of us encounter stress often. And while we may not be able to always mitigate or erase the pressures completely, we do have more control over how they impact our life overall than perhaps we are aware, right, Lindsay? Yes, that's so right. So we have talked about stress before sprinkled through many past episodes, right?
00:07:27
Speaker
But there are a couple newer phrases relating to motherhood and stress that I'm seeing all over social media right now, and they are sensory regulation and overstimulation. So I have to say that when I've heard those terms before, it was always in talking about children and their development, but I'm seeing mothers using those terms and their reels all the time about what they're feeling, right? So we're like, okay, there's a lot going on here. And when I open this up to my Instagram followers to be like, tell me about your stress,
00:07:56
Speaker
My goodness, Michelle, I haven't even gotten an inbox flooded like that, like I have in a very long time. So it seems to be top of everyone's minds right now. In fact, you and I had a different episode planned for today. And yes, right. And it was we were really excited for it. And then this just shot front and forward. And we're like, OK, clearly, we need to address this ASAP.
00:08:17
Speaker
right, a very shared and communal concern amongst us right now. And I 100% understand and relate to it. Like as soon as you started talking about it on your Instagram stories, and then when you messaged me, like maybe this needs to be the episode, I was like, Oh my goodness, I would love to talk about this too, because I
00:08:39
Speaker
have only recently, maybe in the last few months or so, started realizing that was kind of my problem too, was overload, sensory overload and overstimulation. And it's been an interesting journey to try to process what that means and what I can actually do about it.
00:08:58
Speaker
I think it was just another one of those divinely providential inspirations that you got for us. Well, and so much of it is because I've worked really hard over this last year in reducing stress in my life. But then the truth is too, my kids are in school a lot of the time. I won't say regularly because as you know, Michelle, my kids have missed a lot of school.
00:09:18
Speaker
So I do only maybe get two days a week where I don't have somebody home with me. But because I have silence for the first time in 15 years, I'm understanding like from a sensory perspective, things I never understood about myself before, because I realized that for 15 years, I was living in that world of overstimulation and just
00:09:38
Speaker
surviving in it. It was normal. Now that I have silence, when they come home and I hear all of the noise come in, it hits me in a way it never did before. So these different seasons of motherhood will try to cover all of the seasons of motherhood and overstimulation in one short episode. There's a lot to talk about, but I think we should just dive into a little bit of the science first. So let's talk about what is sensory regulation or another word I kept coming across is sensory integration.
00:10:08
Speaker
So I got some more information from a website that is sensoryintegrationeducation.com.
00:10:15
Speaker
And quote, it says the term sensory integration refers to the processing, integration and organization of sensory information from the body and the environment. Simply put, this means how we experience, interpret and react to or ignore information coming from our senses.
Exploring Sensory Processing and Stress
00:10:32
Speaker
Sensory integration is important in all the things that we need to do on a daily basis, such as getting dressed, eating, moving around, socializing, learning and working.
00:10:41
Speaker
Now, that's the end of the quote, but I found that to be basically the same definition for sensory regulation, but basically our bodies taken information from our five senses with three additional senses. This is exciting. Do you have those two? Yes. I was like, did you see the secret three that clearly we've been ignoring for all these years? Yes. I actually wrote at the bottom of my notes, these additional three are so fascinating that I wanted deep dive, right? You and I are so excited. So same.
00:11:11
Speaker
Okay, well, I'll just list them and we can talk about them. But the first, okay, well, actually, maybe you should because these words are weird. Okay, like proprioception. Proprioception. I think so. Yeah, proprioceptive. Proprioceptive. Okay, so that is senses of body awareness and position.
00:11:29
Speaker
vestibular, which is awareness of movement, balance, and coordination, and interoception, our internal sensory system that tells us when we are hungry, you need to go to the bathroom, and are tired. So those are the three additional ones to our five. And just as a recap, the other five are sight, scent, touch, taste, and smell. So I found this really interesting because I think when we are familiar with the five,
00:11:58
Speaker
Yeah, I was like, yeah, okay, we can try our best to like, manage those ones. Yep. And they make a big difference. But sometimes you do and you're still like, completely overloaded or overwhelmed. And I'm like, Oh my gosh, these other three mean so much. And they make so much sense if it's out of balance. Even the, the one I particularly liked was the
00:12:24
Speaker
It's an introsep...introception you said, right? But I was like, yes, because sometimes when there's so much else going on around us, we're not paying attention to how comfortable we are. So that's the whole hangry, like the Betty White commercials, right?
00:12:47
Speaker
or even if like your clothing isn't comfortable and you've been pulling it and or the tag is rubbing against you in the back and you don't pinpoint those things but that is sensory input that your body is having to process and it just these little things will compound so I found those yeah these other three really intriguing because they probably factored really heavily much more so than we thought
00:13:13
Speaker
Yeah. And I'm like, why am I just learning about this at 42? Honestly, why did we only think of the five senses? That's all that we've ever been taught. And yeah, you're right. There is so much to do with these other ones. And what's so interesting is that, and maybe they don't think we need to learn this because we learn it when we're babies, essentially. Like we learn how to process those things starting from when we're babies through our toddler years. Um, but clearly we need some updated information on this as moms and
00:13:40
Speaker
So I found a medical journal article that summarized a study done that looked at sensory processing and perceived stress and burnout in a working population. And just to be clear, they did the study on people who were working during the pandemic. Okay, so
00:13:55
Speaker
But that aside, the findings are clear. Those who are more sensitive to their surroundings, more in tune to all those senses, those who are hypersensitive, they scored higher on tests for perceived stress and burnout. No, I'm accentuating the word perceived because I want to get into that a little bit more in a minute. Now, the study used people who do not have underlying sensory related disorders like ADHD.
00:14:18
Speaker
The conclusion is that sensory processing difficulties are definitely linked to burnout and stress. I mean, that makes sense, right? If you are hypersensitive, then you really do perceive that maybe you're feeling more stressed.
00:14:34
Speaker
This actually goes back to what you said about Marcus Aurelius, actually, the word our estimate of it. I really kept seeing this in the studies over and over again that it isn't even like our bodies might be feeling stressed, but it's really that we think we're stressed, like so much of it is a mindset. And we'll look into that more with the ways that we want to overcome that mindset. But yeah, I found I keep seeing that word, our estimate of it, our perception of stress, I found was really interesting. Now, just one last point here about hypersensitivity.
00:15:03
Speaker
or people that are more formerly called high sensitivity people. They represent around 20% of the population, but they did stress too, it is completely understandable that every single mother out there, so listen, listeners, every single mother feels this at different points of her motherhood journey. Okay, so let's just talk briefly about motherhood. Let's talk about otherwise healthy, quote unquote, women operating on very little to no sleep, right? Working hard from sunrise
00:15:33
Speaker
to long after sunset with little to no outside help. And often two or more children, especially our listeners, we know so many of you have larger than average size families and all of the noise, the smells, the diapers, the snot, the touching of mommy. No wonder our sensory regulation systems are out of whack.
00:15:55
Speaker
And then this just leads into the last thing, which is overstimulation. And there's one mom, her name is Mariah Maddox. She shared her experience of overstimulation, triggering her mom rage on a great article on motherly.com.
00:16:07
Speaker
And she said this quote, and she sums it up perfectly. She says, it's the over-engaged senses from all the simultaneous noise, internal and external noise that never seems to cease. The constant sound of the washer and dryer, the dishwasher running, extremely loud toys, YouTube shows, your husband's phone, the neighborhood kids screaming outside, the hum of the air conditioner, the baby whining, the cat licking himself.
00:16:30
Speaker
screen door opening and slamming shut. They're running, the jumping, the falling, the constant mommy, mommy, mommy, right? My heart is racing, even reading that. And I'm like, yep, that's it. That nails it every single day. Like for 16 hours a day, in my case for 15 years. Yep.
00:16:46
Speaker
Yeah, exactly. I think that those things we can't turn off and as you're reading that list, I'm noting how many of those things are fairly recent innovations or modern innovations. So it may even be different generationally
Managing Sensory Overload
00:17:01
Speaker
too.
00:17:01
Speaker
Older generations, maybe our grandmothers generations and older may not understand why we feel so much stress or we are so overloaded sensory wise because maybe we didn't have YouTube and multiple YouTube channels going on at the same time. They weren't listening to podcasts while they were washing dishes.
00:17:27
Speaker
Even things like before washing machines or like appliances were a big thing, right? To have all those things going at the same time maybe wouldn't have happened as much. So that's really interesting. And then another consideration as well is that everyone, I was reading that everyone has a different sensory makeup. So all of our thresholds for all these different senses are even different from one another too.
00:17:57
Speaker
So that's how some people like background music while they're studying, but other people can't. They need complete silence. And some people crave physical touch and other people get touched out really fast. So in addition to that, for each sense, we also have different thresholds from each other. And so there isn't going to be a definitive how-to when it comes to regulating sensory overload. It's really going to have to be every individual person.
00:18:27
Speaker
taking a look at their own situations and thinking which ones are the things that really trigger me or really get to me and are there ways I can mitigate it which we'll get into in a little bit but the one thing about motherhood in particular I love having this conversation and doing a bit of the research for this and then hearing you talk about what's all going on in our brains because it's it is actually a relief
00:18:56
Speaker
and comforting to know that the problem is more biological than it is a character flaw because I think that sometimes we can be and I know I am sometimes hard on myself because I'm like if I just had more patience.
00:19:12
Speaker
Or, you know, I must be selfish for wanting to get away from it all or needing rest or that I can't meet the demands of all the people all the time. If I just had more patience, if I just had more charity in my heart, like all these things. And I think that's good to have those goals. But what we're hearing is that this is so physiological.
00:19:35
Speaker
And that your body is actually doing exactly what it's supposed to do under stress, right? And that's what overstimulation is. It's a stress response to these external things. And so when we talk about how we're going to deal with it then moving forward, that's where the discipline of it is going to help our character growth.
00:19:57
Speaker
So it's not that you're feeling these things. That's not a personality thing or a character thing. That's biological. And then how you respond to it, that's where the character and the growth comes into play. And just putting those things in their proper perspective, I think also can kind of give us as humans, women, mothers, a little sense of relief.
00:20:22
Speaker
Okay, so this piggybacks off what you're saying perfectly because there was a link in that article I was just reading from Motherly to the website parents.com. And that article is five ways to cure stimulation overload as a parent. And the first suggestion, and this is what reminded me of your point, Michelle, is to accept your temperament.
00:20:41
Speaker
Now, we did a whole episode on knowing your temperament. You don't often see the word temperament in non-religious articles, so I loved that. Now, so if people don't know about temperaments, feel free to look up our episode on that. So this is again about being self-aware and understanding your own limits, like what you were saying. I love that, Michelle, about how certain things might trigger me in a sensory way that might not trigger you.
00:21:05
Speaker
And then working within them. So if you find the noise becoming too triggering, find solutions that help you manage the noise, but they still have to let your kids be kids. And that did stress that, right? You can't just silence your kids. So you as the adult need to come up with solutions here to manage those things that trigger you while still letting your kids be kids.
00:21:27
Speaker
And then their next suggestion is to prioritize downtime with
Balancing Family Life and Stress Management
00:21:30
Speaker
rest. And we will talk about that later in the episode. Their next one, though, I found was great. It was about streamlining decision making. And this is why so many successful CEOs like wear the same outfit every day, like Steve Jobs with his black turtleneck, right? He wore that everywhere.
00:21:45
Speaker
Now, many moms might be doing this out of survival mode. I'm thinking, you know, black leggings and a t-shirt and a messy bun. We're like, well, I do that. I do wear the same outfit every day. I look at myself right now. But I want to suggest like there's so many cute loungewear outfits out there. I'm just saying this to me too. I've not bought any of these, right? Loungewear was the outfit du jour during the lockdowns. And so there's a lot of cute options.
00:22:09
Speaker
So maybe being a little more intentional about that daily uniform that you're wearing, you're still limiting your choices, but you might have a few nicer ones that make you feel better about yourself when you're getting ready. And then finally, it says to step away from the chaos. Seriously, you can leave the room. Even if it's for a couple of minutes, get control of yourself. Even with babies, you can leave the room.
00:22:29
Speaker
Um, I have learned time and time again, and I'm sure this is not a surprise to anybody. Your kids regulate off your moods, right? Like, so the more ramped up you get, the more ramped up they get. Um, and then I'm really learning the truth is like, my kids won't learn to self-regulate if they have a mom who can't self-regulate. Like that's the legacy we're passing on. So it's time to learn those tools and we will share a lot of what we've been doing in our own families.
00:22:55
Speaker
I love that. And I actually have been thinking a lot about that too, about what our kids see, what my kids see, right? Because I know at the beginning of the episode, you were mentioning how after years of homeschooling, your kids are in school, so it's different. And I have switched with you. So for years, most of my kids and my youngest actually never quite entered school.
00:23:22
Speaker
We just like to cover both sides for our listeners, right? We're like, if I'm not homeschooling, you need to take that up. And so we're always in your world, everyone.
00:23:31
Speaker
We always have to have the basis covered. So yeah, I've also found an article that talked about those little tips and tricks you can use while still letting your kids be kids because I love that you mentioned it because that is always, that's our core message. And I know that it's something we all really strive to balance.
00:23:52
Speaker
So there were some really great tips from a website I was reading called otholly.com about sensory strategies for moms and for parents in particular, but she broke it down into all the senses. So like for auditory overload, she says you need to both prevent and have quick fixes at your disposal in the moment. So you can prevent a lot of auditory overload by like,
00:24:20
Speaker
switching off non-essential noises during fussy times. So maybe that five o'clock PM hour where everyone seems to just kind of lose ourselves. Maybe that's not the time for your washing machine.
00:24:37
Speaker
Yeah, maybe that's like time for a quiet TV show, or maybe that's when you take your TV break completely. So you don't have that in the background. And this was a great one too. She said, try to avoid big conversations during times when the house is generally loud.
00:24:59
Speaker
And I was like, oh my gosh, that for me is a big one because when Phil gets home, again, around that five, six o'clock PM hour, I want to discuss all the adult things. That's right. But the kids are still active and running and need us and stuff like that. And I just sometimes get frustrated when there's a lot of commotion. And then in the moment, if you're already there, you can do things like lower your own voice.
00:25:25
Speaker
Oh, I never do that. Right. I think teachers probably do this more like when your voice is quiet, people have to become quiet to hear what you're saying. So that might work. And or hum to yourself.
00:25:47
Speaker
That was another suggestion or step outside like what you were saying even like into the backyard or the front porch or something for visual overload like Yes, limit your screen time. Yes declutter. We'll get into more stuff like that. This is all preventative She also talks about using lamps or dimmer light. Oh, yes I have nothing in my notes
00:26:10
Speaker
Yes, so we'll talk more about that too, because I also have things to say about lighting, but in the quick fix moments, like close your eyes, just close your eyes for a minute. And again, step outside. Didn't we talk about once about the mom sitting on the floor and putting the apron over her head? Which episode was that? And I forgot who did that, but she would sit and that's how she'd use her apron. She'd just sit cross-legged, cover her head with her apron for a couple of minutes, make a little fort, a mommy fort. I love it.
00:26:36
Speaker
That's so brilliant and yet another amazing use for an apron. And then yeah, just the other things too, remember those three amazing senses that we never think or talk about that we just learned about today. We were today years old when we learned about them.
00:26:54
Speaker
For your balance one, the vest, what is it? Vestibular? Yeah. Vestibular one. You can kind of reset by like hanging upside down on your bed or dancing or just swaying like back and forth, bouncing on an exercise ball. You can help your
00:27:13
Speaker
proprioceptive sense, which is the movement one. She talks about how pushing, pulling and squeezing helps. So do push ups, even if it's off the wall, like you're standing and you're pushing against the wall. Tight hugs. So she talks about how like ask your kids to hold you tight, give you a big tight hug instead of lightly touching you.
00:27:34
Speaker
Yeah. That will be better for your sense. And then for the deep pressure, she said deep pressure is deeply comforting and regulating your senses. So lie on your tummy and have your child lie flat on your back. Oh, all the time. I say one thing about this. So my boys were punching my feet the other night and they thought they were being funny and like crazy boys. And I felt that I was like, honestly, keep going. Like you were like, they were punching full strength.
00:28:01
Speaker
And I thought, I prefer this to those gentle little kid hugs and kisses. No, punch my feet. Go right ahead, sons. Yeah, sometimes you need a bit of both. And sometimes it's the punching the feet that's going to do it for you.
00:28:18
Speaker
Yeah, so either that or like a weighted blanket or swimming she mentioned and I gasped when I read that because I used to be a lifeguard and a swimming instructor and part of that job was teaching aquafit and so I had to take aquafit instructor courses and they talked about how the pressure of the water is so good for your blood flow and for your circulation So the hydrostatic pressure is really good for you. So when she said swimming I'm like, oh my gosh, yes because
00:28:47
Speaker
you're putting that deep pressure on your body. And so yeah, these are like, I thought these were great suggestions of things you can do in the midst of everything because you're right. Like we're kind of caught in this conundrum that stress happens, but you're not always able to like just leap, just say stop it and it's done. So these are great.
00:29:13
Speaker
Okay, so for me, one of the biggest changes I experienced in the last year came from a woman on Instagram who's actually taken this last year off of Instagram so she can focus on her own family and reduce her stress. And I actually didn't write down her handle, but I think it's a jolo togue or something like that. It's pointless even looking her up because she's not active on there anymore. But she said this thing.
00:29:36
Speaker
about making the big things big and the little things little. This was revolutionary for me. I make all things big. I do that. I'm very much an extremist. So that is something I've actively
00:29:49
Speaker
really been intentional about every time something happens to me, to someone in my family, or just in general in our environment. I'm like, is this a big thing or a little thing? Now I realized I've been doing that with my kids for years. When they would have a tantrum or it would get really upset about something, this, this has always been one of my methods of communicating with them when they were little was I would show them with my hands. I would say this is, um, this is this big. And I put my hands pretty close together, right? If they were upset that they lost in a video game.
00:30:17
Speaker
And then I would extend my hands. I'd be like, but this is your reaction to that thing. And then they go, oh, and I'm like, does it match up? Like, is that the proper reaction to the size of the thing? And I was like, no. And I'm like, okay, so what is the reaction to like that fits in that size?
00:30:32
Speaker
And that seems pretty rudimentary, but kids can grasp that. I just wasn't doing that for myself. There was no one showing you their hands. No! Lindsay, this is your problem. This is the stress. Thank you. I needed a mom to show me.
00:30:49
Speaker
Yeah, I really like this and I like that we're starting off with it because I think it's probably going to underlie a lot of other things that we can share and that our listeners have shared when it comes down to keeping proper perspective. Right. And I think that's going to come up over and over again because when we're able
00:31:07
Speaker
to keep that mindset, which is difficult in an age of distraction, which may be one of the hurdles, that that can really help. I think in this age of so much coming in, so much input, everything vies for your first priority.
00:31:24
Speaker
everything seems urgent and so you're right like everything seems like a big thing sometimes and it's only if you can actually have that either someone telling you like stop and take stock of what is actually big and what is actually little.
00:31:39
Speaker
Or we learn to do that for ourselves as an automatic thought response when we start feeling overwhelmed. We can quickly then start sorting through all the things coming at us and we can put things in their proper place. And that even will take a lot of the seemingly big urgent things and put them right down to the bottom of the list where they're meant to be. And we can carry on with a little bit of a lighter load.
00:32:05
Speaker
And now that so much of that, like you're saying, underpins so many of the other things. So I, as you guys have known, and I've talked about this a bit on my own Instagram, my family cocooned over the last year. We made, I felt the calling to do this. So did Jason. We felt it at the same time.
00:32:21
Speaker
And so much of our structure stress reduction in our family and for me personally Came from cutting out so many things right and just really putting a wall around my family and so I'm gonna combine a bunch of those strategies just into that one thing so that meant for me and
00:32:37
Speaker
saying no. I had no problem saying no my whole life. I really have no problem looking at you going, nope, I can't do that. But when I started taking my faith seriously, I really didn't know if that was the Christian woman response, and I really struggled with that because I thought, well, regular Lindsay, and I mean that in a silly way, would say no right to your face and feel no guilt. But newer Catholic-focused Lindsay goes, well, I should serve and I should give my time and I should be charitable.
00:33:05
Speaker
And I really worked through that with priests. And it turns out they're okay with you saying no to the church is okay with you saying no. And so but what I did differently this year is I stopped explaining all the time. There's only some times where somebody really goes, Oh, what's going on? And then if you feel like
00:33:22
Speaker
You should explain a little bit more. But I actually, when I start saying no to people right now, I start typing out all these things and then I go back and I delete and I'm like, no, I'm just saying, no, thank you. That doesn't work for us right now. Period. Yeah. Period. That's it. And then Resting Without Guilt. We've done episodes on that. I'm continuing in that journey where I'm because I'm very much a person who measures my own success by my level of productivity. That's always how I've worked.
00:33:47
Speaker
So working hard now when I can write these rhythms that we've talked about and then resting when I can, I'm doing that. But again, the difference now is without guilt, zero guilt. There's no voice in my head saying you should be doing something else. Nope. I'm just going to rest. And then gifting that rest to the other people in my family. I ensure that Jason comes home and rests now instead of me thinking whether I verbalized it or not, well, he should be doing the garbage while he should be doing these things. No.
00:34:14
Speaker
peak and rest. I gifted that to myself and I want to extend that to the people that I love. And then also just prioritizing my own immediate family. And I'm not talking about grandparents, aunts, uncles. I'm talking about my own four kids and my husband. They come first. That's who I'm married to. They deserve my immediate attention.
00:34:33
Speaker
and the best of me. And so if they want to go do other things with other people or see family, that's fine. But I'm really letting the whole family make those decisions and go, well, what do we all want to do today? The focus is on them. And finally, just in terms of the cocooning for our family, Jason and I both resigned from any external commitments we were doing. He's only part of one board now, and he had a lot more roles in that board that he has since resigned from after doing his term.
00:35:03
Speaker
So we don't have anything else going on in our evenings. Nothing. Our evenings are just hanging out with our kids. And wow, the change we've seen and especially our teenagers just having mom and dad available and mom and dad resting on the couch and not being all frenzied and trying to get everything done every night is has been remarkable. It has been
00:35:21
Speaker
life-changing for my family. We all just, they don't go out and see friends either. Our kids just stay home. They actually just want to be with us too. The six of us sit in our little living room and laugh and talk for hours every single night. So that strut, like that is a massive stress reduction and just knowing that's my night. I don't have to do anything else, but just sit and hang out with my own family.
00:35:44
Speaker
Oh, that's so good. I love everything that you're saying because I feel like I'm on the cusp of a lot of these things for myself, especially like the saying no and not explaining yourself. I struggle with this a lot. I know I've alluded to and talked before on the podcast about my own people pleasing tendencies my whole life.
00:36:08
Speaker
So, I mean, normally I wouldn't, I just wouldn't say no, period. And then if I really had to, I would be racked with guilt and feel like I had to have like a really good reason why and explain that to people. So I do need to work on this one. And I think I have too, like, like what you were saying, often if I'm texting a response where I have to back out of something, I'll write like a full essay on why this isn't going to work for me.
00:36:37
Speaker
and very apologetic in tone and things like that. And you're right, most of the time people are like, oh, okay, no worries. And then I'm like, oh, okay, well, good, good, I'm glad. Talk to you later, friend. Yeah, it's awesome. Because you know that if they were to just say, no, I can't do that right now, you wouldn't be going, well, I wonder why they can't. For the most part, most of us are so understanding when other people do it to us, we just don't expect that same thing back.
00:37:05
Speaker
Yeah well and I think it's also too like resting for us doesn't always seem like a good reason. So that kind of goes along with what you're saying about being able to rest without guilt. Yes. Right? That's also guilt when it comes to saying no to things. Like sometimes you're just really tired and there is no other plans you have other than you have to sit down for an evening.
00:37:28
Speaker
You have to sit down and rest. And I don't know, there is something like I can say to other people, but when it comes to my own mind, it is like mental gymnastics with myself trying to be like, no, it's a reason. It's a legitimate thing that you are doing that prevents you from saying yes to this event.
00:37:49
Speaker
And that might feed into the big things versus little things too. Like overall, who are you making time and space for? You only have a limited amount of both of those things. So we do have to be selective. And on that note, I mean, we are at a stage and we are of
00:38:07
Speaker
a certain kind of personality where we really do enjoy being out and about. For us, it is very social and especially with the kids being homeschooled. I missed that. I've said that to you before too. I'm like, I actually missed the drop off and pick up.
00:38:24
Speaker
Yeah. Because that was when I saw people for sure, for sure, every single day. And I really missed that during lockdowns. And then we decided to homeschool. And so when my kids are in extracurriculars, that is that for me, and it's that for them as well, that time away from my instruction.
00:38:43
Speaker
And so we make it work, but then that takes away from some other things that we don't need to feel guilty about saying no as well. I know that certain times of the year we're not going to have time to be very social in terms of like dinner parties or social gatherings or things like that because we have these extracurriculars. So I can say no to that.
00:39:06
Speaker
In the summer, we kind of work it that we don't actually sign up for anything. From the spring until the fall, we're kind of just hanging out like what you said. So there's a time and a season for all these things. So all of that awareness and noticing how you choose to structure your family time and your individual time and how that's going to either contribute to or mitigate stress, it kind of goes with something that listener at Emma
00:39:34
Speaker
dot fear brought up when she shared with us that she adds things to her life that bring her joy. And she said like, less time to stress, there's less time for you to be stressed out when you're feeling joyful, essentially. And I love that because that's what I think I'm relating to right now with what I'm saying is that
00:39:54
Speaker
I'm certainly being better at saying no to things, but at the same time I am still saying yes to a lot. It's just probably the mindset has shift. I'm like, but why am I doing it though? Why am I saying yes to this? It's because this will bring either me or my family or both of us great joy. And so then it doesn't seem like it's adding burdens on you. So it can look different, but I love what she said about being intentional about
00:40:21
Speaker
adding the things that specifically, you know, it will bring you joy, it won't be adding to the pressure. And you can feel free to discern that and deliberate about that for yourself. Okay, and then all of this reminds me to have another message we got from somebody on Instagram, one of our listeners, Jamie Lynette. She said that she works hard at being intentional about not taking on too much responsibility. And that goes back to like what Jason and I have cut out the extras,
00:40:45
Speaker
But like what you're saying too, this intentionality, we can add this. We're making the decision to add this. We're not adding this because we think we have to or whatever, right? Like with all your extracurriculars or things you're doing, you're intentional about those decisions and you're doing things that add joy and add value to your family time and to your family culture. And that's great. If it doesn't add too much stress, right? Unnecessary stress. Of course it's busy. Of course it's going to be busy loading all the kids into their car for their lessons.
00:41:13
Speaker
dinner and all that kind of stuff. But if you're genuinely, if you can look on the scale and the joy and the value outweighs the little bit of natural stress, it's a great thing to keep doing in your family. Yeah, absolutely. And to go with what Jamie is saying, yes, we've continued to join a lot of things. But another thing I'm intentional about or aware of is that I don't actually have to be on the planning committee for all of them. Yes. I was like, oh my gosh, I can just join things and not run them.
00:41:43
Speaker
And it's revolutionary to me as well. Because I'm starting to see community, and this is actually a good thing to stay connected to your community at large too, is that you see that happening naturally. So and so is the hockey coach, but he brings his kids for piano lessons. He's not also the piano teacher. And then they go for swimming lessons. They're not coaching swimming as well.
00:42:08
Speaker
all those different things. It's like everyone has kind of taken a job when that happens. You can do really well in one thing or if it's your season of life where you can't do much. I used to be really involved in church ministries when I was a teenager and a young adult.
00:42:24
Speaker
I think every single night of the week when I was in that phase of stage of life, I was at the church for meetings because I was on so many committees. And right now I can hardly do anything. I can barely bring snacks for our monthly coffee Sundays to contribute.
00:42:42
Speaker
And I'm just, I've had to really remind myself, I'm like, right now, this is not what your thing is. You can show up because it's good to be part of community, but you can't run it right now. It's just not what you have time for. And then maybe it will come back up again. And then my next kind of grouping of changes I've made for my own personal stress reduction, it actually just naturally sprung forth after I turned 40. And everybody kept talking about this happening and I was like,
00:43:11
Speaker
Okay, no it really does what it does is it gives you perspective I've now lived through and Conquered and overcome a lot of rock bottoms in my life a lot of scary things a lot of things that would stress me out and I've come out the other side right stronger better and wiser and I see that more at 42 than I did at 32 and
00:43:31
Speaker
And so I think that I can actually step outside of things with an, with a better ease and go, Nope, this'll be okay. Uh, in a way I couldn't even just a few years ago. Also in your forties, you get much better at speaking up for yourself. Um, a lot of that second guessing everything and being, you know, nervous, like you really just, like I was saying with the no and not needing to explain that really came in my forties.
00:43:54
Speaker
And I'm not being callous. I'm not being cold or narcissistic. I'm just, I don't feel like at this point in my life, I have to trip over my own words and say those things. I can just speak up for myself in a different way. And that's okay.
00:44:07
Speaker
And in the same vein, basically in terms of not wanting to use as many words for everything, naturally I'm a talker, surprise, surprise. But I love engaging in debate and I would like go head to head all the time with, like in a fun way, but like really engage in everything.
00:44:24
Speaker
And then that can sometimes go from like a healthy debate right until you're actually starting to argue a little bit. And this I started to see happening, especially with my teenage son, because I have just realized we're the same person. I only realized it this week when I heard how he was on the phone with his buddies and I'm like, oh, that's me.
00:44:45
Speaker
Part of being the older person in that relationship now, I've learned that instead because he could be a lawyer. Like he comes back with an answer for everything, right? About like why you left the garage light on. It's always a debate.
00:44:58
Speaker
And I've learned in my 40s, I just go, okay. And I walk away now. I do it with Jason. I do it with anybody I'm talking to. I used to want to fight. I don't want to fight anymore. I go, okay. And there's so much power. And I was telling this to actually, to my teens, I let them in on the secret weapon and maybe I
Stress Relief Through Nature and Avoiding Conflict
00:45:13
Speaker
shouldn't have. But I said, even when they're interacting with their friends, just to say, okay, you're actually leaving this thing in the air where they're like, oh, maybe they actually don't agree with me. Maybe they do agree with me.
00:45:23
Speaker
Maybe, I don't know, and it's actually really powerful to just go, okay, in a non-committal, non-aggressive way and walk away instead of being triggered. So even with toddlers, that can work as a mom, even with toddlers who are pushing your buttons, that those two simple letters, okay, shrug your shoulder, smile and walk away. I found that that is incredibly powerful.
00:45:46
Speaker
Okay, well you're just making me really excited for my 40s. I feel like I have opposite aging anxieties. I'm like, oh, I can't wait to get there. It sounds so freeing and I remember feeling this way when I turned
00:46:02
Speaker
30, as opposed to my 20s feeling a little bit of that freedom from all the different societal pressures and things like that. But you're right, it really does sound like from what you're saying and from other friends of mine, for me, like Phil, people who have gotten to their 40s, things change a lot with your perspective. The big things, a lot of them really don't seem quite that big.
00:46:27
Speaker
when you've hit that stage. And I particularly like what you were saying about just saying okay and walk away. I really feel like that's biblical. I feel like Jesus did that too. You know who to engage in when, when it's going to bring fruit to engage back, right? Jesus didn't bother when he knew that the conversation wasn't going to go anywhere fruitful.
00:46:53
Speaker
he imagining him in my head he's like okay and then walking away from Pharisees or something like that because it is just the less we have to say the less that's the less energy that we have to take out of other worthy and worthwhile things to serve a purpose that ultimately isn't going to come back.
00:47:14
Speaker
Actually, Michelle, you're right. That is sprinkled throughout scripture. Like there's no time to fight with people who it's, you know, pointless fighting with. And actually that reminds me of a favorite thing from Titus. And it says, but avoid foolish controversies and genealogies. We don't often fight about genealogies these days.
00:47:31
Speaker
And arguments and quarrels about the law because they are unprofitable and useless. Worn a divisive person once and then warn them a second time and after that have nothing to do with them. You may be sure that such people are warped and they are self-condemned. Okay, that's a little bold. Who wrote Titus? I know, I don't want to figure that out. St. Paul maybe. Someone who was done. Yes, a stressed mom perhaps. Someone who's over it.
00:47:59
Speaker
A ghost writer.
Healthy Living and Reducing Phone-Related Stress
00:48:03
Speaker
Okay, so in that same vein, then, about, you know, saying, okay, and walking away, why stop at a short distance? Why don't you just keep going?
00:48:16
Speaker
and go for a walk. That was my transition. I think it's the best transition I've ever done here on the podcast. But yeah, it's like no surprise and we've talked about this as well. So many times it keeps coming up about how being in nature really helps. Like there's something about the natural light, the fresh air,
00:48:39
Speaker
I think the way things sound is so different outside than it is inside and you feel, and I've said this before too, appropriately small. So there's that perspective then thing again too, right? And I have gotten better about all these things wrapping up into one about being
00:48:58
Speaker
more unapologetic about the time I do need for these things for taking care of myself, because that does reduce my stress. But even in other areas of my life and trying to prioritize the health, we talked about a lot last week, like even the sleeping, saying like, I'm sorry, I have to go rest.
00:49:20
Speaker
I have to go close my eyes or I need to turn in for the night, cutting things short in the evenings, whatever needs to happen to get that rest. I think that's really going to help us in the long run.
00:49:37
Speaker
part of the self-care too. We saw a comment from our friend of the podcast, Galadriel Morse, who was talking about for her self-care, one of the things she does is being very careful about what she consumes on social media or on podcasts or entertainment. Part of that input, what are you also putting into your body? Not just food wise, not just sleep wise, rest wise and exercise wise, but also entertainment wise.
00:50:04
Speaker
That can bring a lot of stress. She mentioned murder shows. But yeah, and I guess this is now Galadriel again talking about how social media breaks really help her out in terms of clearing your mind. So if you can figure out that health cocktail for you that is going to help reduce that stress, clear out the things that are cluttering your mind and usher so that it has space for the peace to usher in.
00:50:33
Speaker
whatever that mixture is going to be for you, figure it out and hold on to it. And you don't have to apologize because I think it probably takes a lot less time than we're worried it's going to take from other people. Yeah. What did you just call it? A health cocktail? What did you just call it? Yeah, I don't even know what I said. Like, yeah, something like that cocktail of stress reduction. I don't remember.
00:50:59
Speaker
and cocktails are great. But no, um, no, I love what you're saying there because try as I might, Michelle, try as I might for years to disassociate my body from my mind. You can't do it, right? They are, they are one. And so I am back to taking better care of my body, nourishing my body, right? Like really, because again, even the food we eat, if we're constantly eating sugar, then we're crashing. If we're constantly being fueled by
00:51:25
Speaker
alcohol, then caffeine, then alcohol, then caffeine, and all of these things, right? Our bodies respond in stress. I actually just heard a really crazy thing about alcohol from the Huberman lab. He was talking about how even if you have just a couple drinks on the weekend, that affects your cortisol throughout the week. Like it actually affects how your stress levels and you can't process stress as well during the week if you've had drinks on the weekend, if you're an occasional drinker.
00:51:53
Speaker
And I'm like, okay, that totally makes sense. So what we're putting into our bodies, um, in terms of food and then like you're saying in terms of entertainment. Yeah. Like there's a funny meme about how it's like, you know, girls, I don't know why I have anxiety and it's just like a venti Starbucks in one hand and murder podcasts all the time. Right. Um, it totally makes sense.
00:52:14
Speaker
And then, yeah, getting outside. Now, I will never be an outdoorsy person. That is my temperament. I know that about myself. But now that I walk my kids to school again after those years being homeschooled, that it's 20 minutes to school and back in the morning, 20 minutes there and back in the evening, waving, saying hello to a few people.
00:52:33
Speaker
Wow, my sunlight, my fresh air and my social bucket, awful. That's all I needed. And I do love that. And I do have to remember how much I love that when the kids are on March break or when we go into summer break, because it takes everything to drag me outside during those periods. But I do know it's better for me.
00:52:50
Speaker
and getting to bed at a decent time, my goodness, I've been trying to push that back a little bit. I've been getting into bed and sleeping by 1130, which is about an hour earlier than normal. I'm aiming for 10, but we're working on it. And also just one last thing about social media, our friend Belinda also messaged that she has turned off notifications on her phone. I do that all the time too, right? They have done those studies where you hear your phone beep and they have it in another room and you hear it and they're measuring your blood pressure and your heart rate and people
00:53:20
Speaker
are freaking like their bodies are freaking out until they can check and see what that notification was. Phil was reading a study too that was saying that like even if it's someone else's phone, if they have the same sound notifications as you do, your stress goes up even though it's not your phone. And so even like all those default ringers that sometimes we don't change,
00:53:44
Speaker
um you like we're all contributing to everyone else's stress too when all those go off it's crazy when you think about it i've never heard anyone else's phone ring and it's the murder she wrote theme song i was thinking as i was saying that i'm like except for you
00:53:59
Speaker
Thank you for your service. No problem. I like to help others. I think all of this can be summed up in my favorite meme that's been circulating the internet recently, which is like a scribbly picture of a man saying, Jesus, why do you give me all of your hardest struggles and challenges? And then it's Jesus on the other side going, I'm just asking you to put your phone down and go outside.
00:54:24
Speaker
I've seen that one too. It's perfect. I love it. Why your hardest struggles. I don't want to be the fiercest warrior. Put down your photo outside. That's it.
00:54:35
Speaker
Oh my gosh, it's so good. But you know what? I don't know why it took me this long. I have always had my notifications on silent for my social media apps. But obviously I let my phone calls and my text messages and stuff come through. And I've only just in the last few weeks realized that I can put my phone on Do Not Disturb.
00:54:58
Speaker
And set the filters for that to be like, except for favorites, contacts, because I would still like, like Phil's phone comes through. Yes, exactly. Like to be safe. But for homeschooling, it's changed my homeschool mornings for me, even though I don't get a ton of notifications usually, but just knowing that
00:55:18
Speaker
I can literally forget
00:55:31
Speaker
The tools are there. They have given it to us. It's just now up to us to turn it on. The fiercest battle. It is the fiercest battle. It does take actual diligence and perseverance. We can joke about it, but in this day and age, making those decisions is a virtuous act. It really goes against the current to be the person.
00:55:53
Speaker
Whenever I had my phone within arm's reach during homeschooling, it severely impacted my ability to homeschool my kids. I just know that. Even if I said, I'm just going to text data at work quickly, 30 minutes would go by quickly because I'm scrolling everything, and then the kids would be asking me a question, and then I'd respond irritated, and it would set the full tone.
00:56:13
Speaker
And so really, I really try to leave my phone in another room, even though I don't homeschool anymore. Anytime I'm with my family, pretty much every evening, my phone, I don't even know where my phone
Content Recommendations and Conclusion
00:56:23
Speaker
is. Now, I do have an Apple Watch on and I remember lamenting that when we did an episode on it, how I can always be reached.
00:56:30
Speaker
But I have to say now that I've settled into it, I can do a quick glance and go, OK, nothing's on fire. No one's texting me because they're hurt. I that's fine. I don't respond. So I can kind of see it quickly. And it's not like my phone where there's Instagram and everything else that I would pop on to. Yeah, yeah, I could see that, too, because I had the same concerns about
00:56:48
Speaker
the smartwatches. I don't have one but Phil has one and I was like doesn't that mean you're even more available? But you're right I think having the freedom that it affords you to leave your phone completely in another area of your house but still be alerted if something major happens. That actually is a really great tool.
00:57:19
Speaker
Okay, it's time for our What We're Loving This Week segment of the show. So Lindsay, what have you been loving this week? I stumbled across a YouTube channel that I've already shared with you, Michelle, because it was too exciting to wait until we started recording again. But it is something I keep going back to when I only have about 10 minutes to watch something, usually with my morning coffee.
00:57:40
Speaker
And the YouTube channel is called Early American, and it features a lovely young woman named Justine, who's dressed in period clothing, usually early 19th century American. And she's cooking authentic recipes, known at that time as receipt, like receipt, like it's that's how it's spelled. So you'll see her write that and it's not an error. Using only fire, you know, fireplace in a log cabin.
00:58:04
Speaker
Now these cooking videos are, they don't have any talking. It's just cooking sounds and occasionally it's raining on the log cabin and the rain is just dreamy. So they're kind of ASMR, you know, those videos that make you feel like you're tingly. I'm definitely one of those people that can feel that.
00:58:22
Speaker
They're beautifully shot and edited. Her food looks delicious. And while Justine always takes a little bite of the food when it's ready and you can tell it's delicious, viewers can go to their second YouTube channel, which is called Frontier Patriot.
00:58:36
Speaker
where she and her fiance sit down at a table and they eat the meal she just made and they talk. They talk about a lot more of the details of the recipe and how it was made at that time and other historical things. And they talk for about an hour. So it's the complete opposite of like the 10 minute quiet video. It is them really going deeply into things. Now, to be honest, I'm not as much of a fan of those videos.
00:58:59
Speaker
But they are a really sweet couple. I just really like the short ones. I really find that the cooking videos on Early American are fascinating and relaxing, inspiring. The food looks delicious and it's just perfect edutainment. Okay, I remember you suggesting this to me and then we haven't actually watched
00:59:20
Speaker
much of it at all. I think I briefly checked, but we're still so into the Scandinavian YouTubers right now with Yona and then Cecilia from Svalbard, like way up in the Arctic. But I actually don't, I didn't think I realized that I knew they were like longer versions of the shorter videos.
00:59:42
Speaker
I didn't realize they were ASMR short videos. Well, that changes things a bit. I love that people do that. And I think it's really smart of them to have both available on the same topic. I don't think I've seen that anywhere else. So now I am really excited to check that out. And you'll just love the quality of the production. It's just they've done a really, really great job.
01:00:05
Speaker
They also really feature companies still in the US that make time period, like cooking utensils, that hand forge things. So they really go deep. They did an episode where she has a bath in front of the fireplace. She has a bathing gown on. She's modest.
01:00:26
Speaker
and she uses like homemade oatmeal scrubs and everything that they would have used at the time too. They have an episode where they string a rope bed that somebody donated to them from that period and they stuff a mattress themselves. Like it's really the work that they put into it. I'm just super impressed. I sound like an old lady. Oh, that young couple. I'm super impressed by them. Remarkable. Remarkable. So what have you been loving this week, Michelle?
01:00:54
Speaker
Well, we have spoken about this TV series before, but the third season of The Chosen was just starting to be released before Christmas. And that is what I am loving this week. It started releasing episodes weekly on Sunday evenings around Advent, when Advent started. And every time I watch this show, I just can't get over it. Like even in the in-between spaces between the seasons,
01:01:23
Speaker
I will think back with fondness about the chosen. And then when you're actually watching the episodes, I'm overcome with how they portray the tenderness and love that Jesus has for each of us personally. And in that sense, it is truly inspired.
01:01:42
Speaker
This season in particular, I'm really captivated by the lives of the disciples during the years of Jesus' ministry. That's really where the focus is. And the 12 apostles, they've all been called, and Jesus is fully into his years of public ministry.
01:01:59
Speaker
And I think sometimes we don't consider or we forget just how human the followers of Jesus were and how, you know, we here in 2023, we have this advantage of hindsight to see that big picture and they weren't privy to any of that while all this was happening in the moment. So I'm really struck by their faith and their trust.
01:02:23
Speaker
And I just feel a great affection towards them in a way that I didn't really necessarily before. And there's a relatability to them and their challenges and their frustrations. So, I mean, the show just continues to be excellent. And not only just for entertainment and edutainment, but as a tool for faith formation and as an invitation into deeper relationship with Jesus.
01:02:53
Speaker
Okay, that's going to do it for us this week. If you want to get in touch and chat with us about our topic today, you can find us on our website, www.themodernlady1950.wordpress.com, or leave us a comment on Facebook, Instagram, and YouTube at The Modern Lady Podcast. I'm Michelle Sacks, and you can find me on Instagram at mmsacks. And I'm Lindsay Murray, and you can find me on Instagram at Lindsay Homemaker.
01:03:20
Speaker
Thank you so much for listening, have a great week, and we will see you next time.