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S2-93: Lessons Learned for your New/Young Snow Company Part 2
933 Plays1 month ago
The guys welcome back Mike Santolucito from ODP, and Scott Lesak of Kasel Rocks to tackle some listener questions from our part 1 episode
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Transcript
Introduction & Host Determination
00:00:41
The SnowJobs Podcast
Here we go, Snow Jobs Nation. We are back again bringing you episode 93 of the Snow Jobs podcast powered by Top Gun Backblades. As always, I'm Steve. And I'm sick as a dog tonight, but we gotta get it done. So ah you know suck it up, get it done. And as always, you know who's with me, main man, couldn't do it without him, Mr. Rick James.
Current Snow Conditions & Preparations
00:01:11
The SnowJobs Podcast
Chuck Norris is snow. What's going on, Jay?
00:01:14
RICK JAMES
It's another night here in the lovely Fargo.
00:01:17
The SnowJobs Podcast
There we go.
00:01:18
RICK JAMES
It's just a pretty uneventful weekend, not much happening. so
00:01:22
The SnowJobs Podcast
No snow yet.
00:01:24
RICK JAMES
Nope. City's had some a couple hours away this last week. I heard from two, I heard from two to four or so slushy snow.
00:01:27
The SnowJobs Podcast
They did.
00:01:31
RICK JAMES
So kind of got guys's interest peaked a little more now, but we'll see.
00:01:36
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, they were pushing some.
00:01:37
RICK JAMES
Hopefully you guys get their stuff together and get ready.
00:01:40
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, they were pushing some Northeast stuff, looked like, more water than snow.
00:01:44
RICK JAMES
Concrete.
00:01:45
The SnowJobs Podcast
I don't know, they said it wasn't, Brandon said it wasn't concrete. I talked to Brandon Riley. He said it was just slush, but yeah, it was a good dry run, right?
00:01:49
RICK JAMES
Yeah. It's watery. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think it was a wet one, but yeah.
00:01:57
The SnowJobs Podcast
A wet run, dry run, whatever.
00:01:58
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:01:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
ah
00:01:59
RICK JAMES
Yeah. No, it's always good to get one of those and get guys, at least hopefully get their shit together.
00:02:05
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, it is coming.
00:02:05
RICK JAMES
Ready to rock.
00:02:07
The SnowJobs Podcast
It's coming, it's around the corner. Winter is upon us. it's
Winter Predictions & Expert Plans
00:02:11
RICK JAMES
So like the Rockies are going to hit this week.
00:02:11
The SnowJobs Podcast
ah It'll be here before we know it.
00:02:13
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, i thought I thought maybe it might reach you guys, but maybe not, I guess not.
00:02:14
RICK JAMES
So I saw a couple of things that they really come up north to get us, but yeah.
00:02:21
The SnowJobs Podcast
All right.
00:02:22
RICK JAMES
I don't have anything in the next 15 days according to true weather.
00:02:25
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh, well, I mean, then take that to the bank. The weather guys are saying no snow.
00:02:28
RICK JAMES
yeah I was going to go on vacation.
00:02:29
The SnowJobs Podcast
Well, that's it, right?
00:02:31
RICK JAMES
so now so Same thing, same thing, nothing.
00:02:33
The SnowJobs Podcast
What's weather pros saying? We gotta check in with those guys. Yeah, Robin Knicker are confirming.
00:02:39
RICK JAMES
They were confirming so we got two for two so I mean can't have two other guys wrong right?
00:02:44
The SnowJobs Podcast
We got to get we got to get them on there.
00:02:44
RICK JAMES
ah
00:02:46
The SnowJobs Podcast
We got to get Robin Nick on here to do like a winter outlook or something.
00:02:48
RICK JAMES
Should we do like a, should we do like, yeah, we should do like a true weather.
00:02:50
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
00:02:51
RICK JAMES
Yeah, let's do it. Robin Nick and might as well.
00:02:53
The SnowJobs Podcast
Have a battle, have them playing off each other, have everybody on at once, just arguing.
00:02:58
RICK JAMES
I don't, I think they'd play nice though.
00:02:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
but I think so, too.
00:03:00
RICK JAMES
I think they'd be too political and play nice.
00:03:02
The SnowJobs Podcast
I think it'd be very politician like.
00:03:02
RICK JAMES
What's the fun of that? What's the fun of that? But I'm guessing we get them on and we can stir some shit up, but at least I know I could.
00:03:10
The SnowJobs Podcast
Everybody, I'll tell you, I think Rob and Nick, we should probably try and get on here and maybe do some kind of winter outlook because those guys were funny that everybody had a good time with their episode last time that they came on and did.
00:03:10
RICK JAMES
So.
00:03:20
The SnowJobs Podcast
So, ah yeah, that might be something we we should explore.
00:03:21
RICK JAMES
yeah Yeah, we should do that.
00:03:24
The SnowJobs Podcast
See if they'll come on and do a winter outlook for everybody.
00:03:24
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:03:26
The SnowJobs Podcast
Go region by region or some shit like that.
00:03:29
RICK JAMES
Yeah, let's do that.
Episode Review & Listener Feedback
00:03:30
The SnowJobs Podcast
Ten four. All right. So what did we do last week? Last week, we had Scott Lezak and Mikey Santo Lucido on with us. All right. They did a lessons learned for a younger new snow company. um There was a lot of good information coming out of that one. And I think we're we're going to keep it going today with part two. We cut it short and there's some more information and guys actually sending some questions. So we're going to have those boys back tonight and they're they're back with us.
00:03:58
The SnowJobs Podcast
We're going to do it again. But before we do that, as always, let's hear from team Top Gun and come back and do our weekend review.
00:04:36
The SnowJobs Podcast
All right, guys, we're back. I apologize in advance for my voice or coughing if I can't mute out in time. I'm not feeling it tonight, but we are back. So let's do our week in review. Last week, as we said, we had Scott and Mike doing a lessons learn for new snow companies, ah hopefully help guys out there avoid some of those pitfalls for newer younger snow companies, um you know, and avoid them making the mistakes that so many of us have made learning the hard way.
00:05:03
The SnowJobs Podcast
ah before we ever had a show like this or or social media, you know, 30 years ago to help us out along the way when we were learning. um But we've had nothing but awesome feedback on that one from ah you guys out there in Snow Jobs Nation. So big thanks to Scott and Mike for giving us the time last week and also coming back with us tonight.
Industry Updates & Tributes
00:05:21
The SnowJobs Podcast
What else did we do? We dropped the snow power update episode on Tuesday last week. All right. Uncle Rick while and Dan Zuber joined us. Uh, they touched upon, uh, what snow power has been up to since we last talked to him pre SEMA. All right. So it was great to hear, um, you know, great to hear those guys are still knocking it out of the park. Uh, it's always awesome hearing what Rick has up his sleeve coming at us next. It's a never a dull moment talking to him.
00:05:46
RICK JAMES
I should have him on too much because it looks sounds like he's gonna let everything out of the bag if we keep talking.
00:05:50
The SnowJobs Podcast
Absolutely.
00:05:51
RICK JAMES
about But remember, yeah, I get in trouble, but whatever.
00:05:52
The SnowJobs Podcast
the The man has no secrets.
00:05:57
The SnowJobs Podcast
You were a vault last episode, dude.
00:05:59
RICK JAMES
you I knew stuff you didn't even know.
00:05:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
I found out about stuff.
00:06:01
RICK JAMES
Yeah, see?
00:06:01
The SnowJobs Podcast
Exactly. You had stuff I didn't even know about. So there we go. You were a vault.
00:06:05
RICK JAMES
Hey, remember if he's trying to, he's trying to close out those Jen ones, everybody's interested. So he's called.
00:06:10
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, hopefully I got him a line on that. I hope hopefully ah hopefully him and Corey can do something.
00:06:17
RICK JAMES
Yeah. I talked to Corey this week, so he better do something. He has nothing to lose. And then I sold one.
00:06:21
The SnowJobs Podcast
And Izzy,
00:06:22
RICK JAMES
and I had Josh, Josh is buying one. Yeah. So I got one sold for him there.
00:06:25
The SnowJobs Podcast
by there we go.
00:06:26
RICK JAMES
So yeah, moving and shaking, moving and shaking.
00:06:28
The SnowJobs Podcast
See, people helping people, just facilitators.
00:06:32
RICK JAMES
That's the video.
00:06:33
The SnowJobs Podcast
Ah, well, unfortunately, though, we do have to touch on a very sad note for the Snow community. um Back in June 23, we were at Simon Show in Hartford, and we were actually all at the Arctic Party. We had the pleasure of meeting a group of guys from Canada that night and chatting with them, you know, basically hanging out with them the whole night. One of the gang was Mr. Joey Robarish, who started JR Snow, JR Lawn and s Snow, and eventually Sunshine Snow.
00:07:01
The SnowJobs Podcast
ah Joey was called Mr. Snow. ah He was quite a character. and So of course we were drawn to him. Our our group loves, loves larger than life characters. um You know, we hung out with him. Joey's passion for Snow and the industry in general was immediately evident, ah just talking to him for a short time there, as well as the fact that he was just a genuine, great, great guy. ah Joey unfortunately passed away suddenly last Sunday.
00:07:28
The SnowJobs Podcast
um Very difficult news to hear. ah Jeremy, I know spoke to Joey regularly over the last 18 months since we all met. And we always tried to get him to come on and do the show with us, but we were unsuccessful, unfortunately. um I think we're always going to regret not pushing harder to get him to come on.
00:07:45
The SnowJobs Podcast
ah because we'd have that recording now to look back on. um yeah If you ever met Joey, you know how great that episode would have been on so many levels.
00:07:54
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:07:55
The SnowJobs Podcast
ah Jeremy and I would just like to offer our condolences to Joey's family and his friends on on their loss. And also to his family at J.R. and Sunshine Snow. Again, if you had the pleasure of meeting Joey, you know what a huge loss this is for all that knew him as well as the snow industry in general.
00:08:11
The SnowJobs Podcast
So Joey Riberge was 42 years old. He's going to be sorely missed by all who were lucky enough to have met him. All right. So got that done. Unfortunately, that's we just wanted to pass that along because that's that's kind of a big deal, Jay.
00:08:23
RICK JAMES
um
00:08:25
The SnowJobs Podcast
You want to say something?
00:08:27
RICK JAMES
Yeah, he was a great guy. I got to, I got to talk to him quite a bit. Actually we made what we called each other back and forth. And I don't know. He was phenomenal guy and just straight shooters straight to shoot.
00:08:37
RICK JAMES
You can, you know, is he's, he's going to be missed.
00:08:37
The SnowJobs Podcast
Joey!
00:08:40
RICK JAMES
I mean, his, his crew up there just killed it and um stuff. He was sending to me and stuff was unbelievable. Those guys would get done. I mean, he was larger than life character and he just laid it all on the line and you know, he had the guys are going to carry on.
00:08:54
RICK JAMES
I know Vinny up there is gonna, they're going to take it by the, Keep going with it. But it's uh, yeah, he's me really missed. So yeah, he's he's good guy. So
00:09:03
The SnowJobs Podcast
Absolutely. Absolutely. And if those guys need anything,
Hidden Costs in Snow Contracts
00:09:07
The SnowJobs Podcast
don't hesitate to reach out to us. ah All right. Well, that's going to do it then for the weekend review. Sorry we ended on a downer, ah but, you know, had to be done. ah But let's hear from our partners and we'll be right back to get into it with the boys.
00:12:14
The SnowJobs Podcast
All right, gang, we're back. So let's welcome back Mike Sanol, a seat of ODP and Scott Lezak of Castle Rocks. Boys, long time no see.
00:12:25
The SnowJobs Podcast
How are we?
00:12:27
Mike Santolucito
Doing great, man, how you doing?
00:12:29
The SnowJobs Podcast
Everybody's good.
00:12:29
Scott Lesak
Man, two weeks in a row.
00:12:30
The SnowJobs Podcast
Well.
00:12:31
Scott Lesak
It doesn't get much better.
00:12:31
The SnowJobs Podcast
two weeks in a row.
00:12:32
Scott Lesak
This is great.
00:12:33
The SnowJobs Podcast
There you go. Well, you guys did such a great job last week that there were a lot of questions that guys had this week and they sent them in and because we did say we were probably going to do a part two.
00:12:44
The SnowJobs Podcast
So, ah yeah, we'll just get right into that. um The first question that we got, I think one, two. Three times ah guys were asking more about because we only touched on one thing each hidden costs that we sometimes forget when putting together pricing and stuff or hidden costs of a contract. ah Let's keep going on that. If you guys don't mind, we'll go around again and see if you guys got any more gems on the hidden cost line. ah What about Mike? Mike, you got any more hidden costs there that we didn't touch on last week?
00:13:14
Mike Santolucito
Yeah, the number one thing that, because we're already starting to do it right now is just staking your sites. I mean, a lot of guys used to do that for free. I get it. It it just kind of helped, uh, prevent damage.
00:13:25
Mike Santolucito
They had to pay for it later, but stakes costs money costs money to send the guys out there to, uh, to put them in the ground.
00:13:29
The SnowJobs Podcast
yep
00:13:32
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yup.
00:13:32
Mike Santolucito
It's just one of those things you should absolutely stick into your contract. It's not just protecting you, it's protecting your client's property. So they should, they shouldn't even be able to squawk at that. They should see that as a very small cost for preventing some large dollar damages in the future.
00:13:46
The SnowJobs Podcast
Amen. Amen. What about you, Scott?
00:13:50
Scott Lesak
Yeah, I agree with that site setup fees in general. What are you doing with your salt bins? What are you doing with your snow stakes getting all that stuff paid in the seasonal realm while when you're signing the contract first and last month due on signing so you cover a lot of that make sure that those numbers are figured into your indirect costs while you're figuring out your seasonal ah for per event stuff put a site setup fee in there right off the bat.
00:14:17
Scott Lesak
We charge for equipment as well as hauling it, getting it there, staking the site, everything in that site setup fee. So whether it snows or not, we're getting the equipment covered at least. That usually turns into a negotiation with some people. So be careful you don't lose contracts around that, but start out high on that one. And a lot of people do buy it and some others you you got to negotiate around that. And ah the other one, ah another big one is just equipment hauling in general.
00:14:46
Scott Lesak
ah During storms, relocation, stuff like that, if you're moving wheel loaders around, I mean, that's, you know, 600 bucks to the site, 600 bucks away from the site, depending on how far they're going. Make sure you're covering yourself for the equipment hauling as well as your hourly rates when you get into that type of stuff.
00:15:02
The SnowJobs Podcast
Absolutely very good
00:15:03
Mike Santolucito
That's nice to hear.
00:15:03
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:15:04
Mike Santolucito
but You have that in like a separate line in your proposals for your seasonal stuff.
00:15:09
Scott Lesak
Yep.
00:15:10
Mike Santolucito
Okay. Uh, we do, we do a mixture of that, but a lot of ours is, is tucked into our, our seasonal costs.
00:15:11
RICK JAMES
That's.
00:15:17
Mike Santolucito
The client doesn't usually see it. It's usually like between but call it like two to 5% of the contract worth. It's really small dollars when you look at it, but that's, that's great to hear that, uh, that you lay it out like that.
00:15:30
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
00:15:31
Scott Lesak
Yeah, absolutely.
00:15:32
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yep.
00:15:32
Scott Lesak
And that's more so for, if it's equipment going to the site to service for that seasonal value, that's all rolled in there. That's all put into the cost. But if we're going in there for relocation or get into any additional fees on a seasonal that we have to bring extra equipment in, it's in a line item under the hourly table to say, you know hey, X amount of dollars to get the equipment there and then ah X amount per hour to run it.
00:15:56
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yep.
00:15:56
RICK JAMES
Hmm. Yeah.
00:15:57
The SnowJobs Podcast
What about you, Jay?
00:15:58
Mike Santolucito
That's great.
00:15:58
RICK JAMES
That's, I mean, the staking thing is probably a big thing we should probably do more of that we don't, but yeah, that's, that's, that's a huge cost.
00:15:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
Anything you?
00:16:08
RICK JAMES
And I hate staking. I just, you know, they I mean, not staking itself, but it's just like, you know, it's just, there you go.
00:16:11
The SnowJobs Podcast
Everybody does ah Shameless plug ah ah Yeah
00:16:15
Mike Santolucito
Not when you're using plot right marking stakes.
00:16:19
RICK JAMES
Look at that. and Yeah.
00:16:21
Mike Santolucito
don't need Don't need gloves with those.
00:16:24
RICK JAMES
yeah you don't need glove with bit now I'm just saying it's just, you know, you drive by your sites and you got kids pulling them out of the ground, playing swords with them. You know, they all come back broken or whatever. It's just, I'm not part ones, right?
00:16:35
RICK JAMES
They don't come back broken.
00:16:37
Mike Santolucito
That's right.
00:16:38
RICK JAMES
They pop back over, but, uh, no, it's just staking. Yeah. We should definitely do more of that. And I guess we were talking before show and a lot of stuff you were doing, Steve is. interesting too. I mean, everything has a cost to it.
00:16:50
RICK JAMES
And we should probably be figuring more of these costs into our contracts, honestly, you know, that from, you know, what were you talking like?
00:16:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
yeah we we do a percentage like Yeah, we do a percentage on consumables that we add.
00:16:59
RICK JAMES
You were talking hotel room. I mean, you were talking everything. I mean, that you oil changes.
00:17:06
The SnowJobs Podcast
There's there's a line for all the contracts that we have consumables. So like if we're doing a multi-year deal for a complex and we know we're going to have to keep minimum two skids there, say three skids some to do that complex, they're married to that site.
00:17:21
The SnowJobs Podcast
We know those snow tires on that site. By experience, we know we're getting two years out of a set of skid-steer snow tires in the Northeast. ah You take the pre-treating, the warm pavement, those things, they're grippy for a reason because they're soft rubber. You're getting two years max.
00:17:37
The SnowJobs Podcast
That's a three-year contract. We know over the cost over the course of three years, we're going through one full set. Should we be on the hook for $2,500 that we didn't include in that contract? No, so we factor that in the consumables. If those machines are for that multi-year contract and it's going to and they're going to be there all three years, ah what about filter changes, oil fluid changes, you know all the servicing? that all it's not We're not charging the whole thing, we're doing a percentage of.
00:18:04
The SnowJobs Podcast
um And we break it down like we're used to I honestly I think cuz we're The people in our area when they call us originally They're kind of shell-shocked by our pricing and that's why we we won't give them a bid unless they're agreeable to a ah bid presentation meeting so we can explain our pricing and what actually goes into our pricing where most people are writing down almost in crayon I think around here of hey Will Ploughs know $200 and they hand it in? Like our bid proposal is very drawn out and it's it we explain everything. We have everything broken down, all of our costs, our profit margin, so they can see what what what they're paying for, what we're making on it. you know And we're basically trying to be as transparent as possible to explain why our prices are where they are. But yeah, we put
00:18:53
The SnowJobs Podcast
everything goes into that consumables. We've even put stuff in there for the nor'easters that we get because we're guaranteed to have one of those storms. It's going to be a 24 to 28 hour banger where we're going to have to have if we have to have guys in that site, you we all know in this room, you send them home to take a break. You have a 50 50 shot of getting them back.
00:19:13
The SnowJobs Podcast
You know, it's, I couldn't get out of my driveway once I got home. I, you know, something happened on the way home. You lose them. So we, we put hotel rooms, we get hotel rooms on standby, you know, right next to the sites. And you know, we, we keep them in there. Should that be a cost that is unrecoverable for us? No, I don't think so. We're putting those guys in hotel rooms to make sure those sites are getting accurately serviced. Like Jeremy says all the time, snows and emergency service.
00:19:42
The SnowJobs Podcast
So, you know, we need those guys to be there. they They you need them to be there as the customer. So that's a cost of doing that. Snow stakes, we definitely put in their labor hours to to stake the property. It's in there. um We have a we have a line item for the bid proposal because should you spend 10 to 12 hours preparing a proper bid and not get compensated for that?
00:20:07
The SnowJobs Podcast
you know, all, all those things we put into there. But like, like I said, if you don't, if you don't think to eat at least try and recoup some of that, that cost, then it's just, it's a hidden cost on that contract bottom line and you're not making money.
00:20:19
RICK JAMES
I would, I would also say now with all these cameras, like the view camera, if we somehow get that into the contracts and stuff too, because you know, that's an expense, but it's, it's for the good of the, you know, of the operation, you know, for, for us to see what's going on all the time.
00:20:32
The SnowJobs Podcast
I,
00:20:34
RICK JAMES
And and everything costs money and that's, it's not cheap. I mean, but it also helps, helps you be on top of things a lot better. So.
00:20:42
The SnowJobs Podcast
I agree. Um, for us, that wouldn't work only because my customers would say, you guys have never had a problem for the last five, six, eight, 10 years that you've been doing this because you guys are very diligent and you're sending guys out to check sites. Why do we need to pay for this? We're already paying you for site checks. That's, that's their argument and they're not wrong.
00:21:04
The SnowJobs Podcast
So, but that's I'm in a very tight condensed area. I keep my properties very tight for a reason. I don't have to send guys out there, you know, 45 minutes away or 30 minutes away. So for somebody that's more spread out, that might make a lot of sense though.
00:21:18
Mike Santolucito
Yeah, good point.
00:21:21
The SnowJobs Podcast
What else, Mikey?
00:21:21
Mike Santolucito
Scott, I don't know if you i don't know if you touched on this, but ah salt bins, any de-icing structures that you got to put up.
00:21:28
Scott Lesak
Yes.
00:21:29
Mike Santolucito
You may get to a site if you're new to it. There may be one there that you're using. Great. You don't really have to worry about ah much more than just hauling the material in, but if you need to store it to keep it dry,
00:21:40
Mike Santolucito
whether it's a ConX box for your pallet de-icing material, for your walkways, you know keep your shovels and all that. Make sure you're including the monthly rental cost of that in the price, but also if you need to build your bin, like Scott said, you're you hauling, getting the block there, the guys putting the hoop house up if they're going to do that, or just making sure you cover the tarp, ah the tarp cost, and then taking it down if they don't want it there for the entire season, making sure that you price out, getting it out afterwards.
00:21:56
The SnowJobs Podcast
Hell yeah.
00:22:10
Mike Santolucito
And you can do that separate. You don't necessarily have to put that into the contract. There's quite a few bins that we put up and take down every year that the clients on our portfolio pay for. And that's fine too if they want to do it that way, but you know you can still tuck it into the cost if it makes sense for you.
00:22:26
Scott Lesak
Yeah, that's a, that's a real cost. If you're going from scratch and getting everything, I mean, you can, you can easily be 20, 25 grand in on a salt bin real quick.
00:22:31
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yup.
00:22:34
Mike Santolucito
Mm-hmm.
00:22:35
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yup. 100 percent. I mean, that and that's if you have a concrete plant nearby that has those bin blocks real cheap and are willing to load them like, you know, we do.
00:22:40
Scott Lesak
Yeah.
00:22:46
The SnowJobs Podcast
Thank God, like I think we can get them for 50 bucks each for two by two by six.
00:22:48
Mike Santolucito
yeah Yep.
00:22:50
The SnowJobs Podcast
So that's great. But I know some guys that are paying one hundred dollars a bin block. It's like that's not cheap. And then to haul them, forget it. What are you going to get a low boy and You know, I don't know.
00:23:00
Mike Santolucito
It's not, it's not one trip, it's two.
00:23:02
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, it's a couple trips.
00:23:03
Scott Lesak
It's like 13 blocks a load or something. That's all you're getting.
00:23:06
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
00:23:06
Scott Lesak
You're not getting a whole lot.
00:23:07
RICK JAMES
All right.
00:23:07
Mike Santolucito
Yeah.
00:23:08
The SnowJobs Podcast
That's it. That don't.
00:23:08
Mike Santolucito
They may look small, but they weigh a lot.
00:23:08
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:23:10
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yup, they do.
00:23:10
Mike Santolucito
You're not getting much on that trailer.
00:23:10
RICK JAMES
Oh, yeah.
00:23:12
The SnowJobs Podcast
Well, they two thousand pounds each. A little more.
00:23:14
Mike Santolucito
Yeah, like just over that.
00:23:15
The SnowJobs Podcast
Three thousand pounds.
00:23:15
RICK JAMES
probably i would say Yeah, Sorry.
00:23:17
Scott Lesak
Yeah, somewhere in there.
00:23:17
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:23:17
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah. Yeah, those are not. the the But these are these are real things like if you're say you're a smaller guy and you're just doing now your first big commercial or or industrial and you got to put one of these up and you've never done it before. If you're not thinking in advance to put that in the cost of the contract, you're eating that. You know, think about the expenditure before you even put a plow on the ground. You know, it's crazy. You could eat up easily 20 percent of your contract if you haven't bid it right.
00:23:47
The SnowJobs Podcast
So that's that's a huge, that's a huge hidden cost if you're not thinking about it.
00:23:47
RICK JAMES
Right.
00:23:52
The SnowJobs Podcast
What else? Anything else in the hidden costs?
00:23:52
RICK JAMES
Yeah. I always, I always say like September, you know, all through November is kind of a tough period where you seem like a lot of money's going out to get stuff ready and not much coming in.
00:23:54
The SnowJobs Podcast
What do you got Jay?
00:24:01
The SnowJobs Podcast
A hundred percent.
00:24:03
RICK JAMES
So it's, you're just, you're just scrambling, you know, you're trying to, trying to keep costs low, but you got to get a lot of shit done in a hurry.
00:24:10
The SnowJobs Podcast
A hundred percent.
00:24:10
RICK JAMES
So yeah.
00:24:12
The SnowJobs Podcast
Everybody's praying for November 1st.
00:24:15
Scott Lesak
ah This one's not necessarily a hidden cost, but I got to point out, I wish everybody listening could have heard the head shaking about the presenting your bids instead of just submitting bids comment that you made, Steve.
00:24:20
The SnowJobs Podcast
Go ahead.
00:24:25
The SnowJobs Podcast
A hundred percent.
00:24:28
Scott Lesak
As soon as Steve said that all four of us are sitting here shaking our heads, yes.
00:24:29
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:24:31
The SnowJobs Podcast
A hundred percent.
00:24:32
Scott Lesak
Get out there and present the bids. Don't just submit them. Don't just email them. Get out there and show what you're doing and have the conversation around it.
00:24:40
The SnowJobs Podcast
Don't even waste your time if they're not willing to agree to that because yeah like we said, 10, 12 hours sometimes to do a proper bid.
00:24:40
Mike Santolucito
yeah
00:24:43
Scott Lesak
Yep.
00:24:48
The SnowJobs Podcast
If you don't have a chance, I know for me personally, if I don't have a chance to explain it and show them what they're paying for, we're going to get laughed out of there. We're we're going to get thrown out right off the bat because we're going to be 25 to 35% higher than anybody else in my area.
00:25:04
The SnowJobs Podcast
So without that bid presentation meeting to show them what they're paying for and what the other guys are not providing that we do, we're, we're dead in the water. So definitely make, make sure they agree to a bid presentation meeting and a walkthrough because if they're not willing to do a site walkthrough for you to help you prepare a proper bid for them, they're not serious.
00:25:14
Scott Lesak
Thank you.
00:25:18
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:25:19
Scott Lesak
yeah
00:25:23
The SnowJobs Podcast
Like I don't need any tire kickers.
00:25:27
The SnowJobs Podcast
I don't know. That's just me.
00:25:28
Scott Lesak
Amen. Amen.
00:25:30
The SnowJobs Podcast
Um, what about, what about broom bristles for if you have to have a ah broom machine? Cause we do, i I know you guys chuckled when I said that, but, uh, we put them on there.
00:25:41
The SnowJobs Podcast
If it's a multi-year deal, if it's a three year deal or a five year deal, we know we're going through at least one set of bristles for those SSVs to keep those sidewalks open. We're putting them in there. That's in the consumable consumables line.
00:25:53
The SnowJobs Podcast
You guys doing that?
00:25:54
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:25:55
Mike Santolucito
Yeah, that's mixed into our overhead is just um R and M.
00:25:55
RICK JAMES
No.
00:25:57
The SnowJobs Podcast
There you go. Gotcha.
00:25:59
Scott Lesak
Yeah, that's that's all in there.
00:25:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
Cool.
00:25:59
RICK JAMES
Unless you buy a, you buy a, buy a Vroom Vroom, you won't, you won't go through them.
00:26:01
The SnowJobs Podcast
Think about it. A vroom vroom. Yep.
00:26:04
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:26:04
The SnowJobs Podcast
Vroom vroom. Another shameless plug, too. There we go.
00:26:07
RICK JAMES
Shameless plug.
00:26:07
The SnowJobs Podcast
but ah ah Oh, shit.
00:26:11
RICK JAMES
There you go, Tommy.
00:26:12
The SnowJobs Podcast
but But I mean, listen, that that those are real costs that if guys aren't thinking about it, then boom, the contract's over. And now, shit, I'm out 600 bucks because I got to replace those bristles.
00:26:20
Scott Lesak
Absolutely.
00:26:22
The SnowJobs Podcast
And I didn't think about that. Who's paying for that? If you don't think about it, you are.
00:26:28
Scott Lesak
absolutely
00:26:30
The SnowJobs Podcast
What else? any but Any other hidden costs or will you cover most of them?
00:26:36
RICK JAMES
over my eyes to feel that's for sure.
00:26:39
Scott Lesak
I think there's always hidden costs that we definitely missed.
00:26:41
The SnowJobs Podcast
There are.
00:26:43
Scott Lesak
but But I think we hit some good ones.
00:26:43
The SnowJobs Podcast
I think, honestly, I think we're all still finding them. I mean, every year you seem to find one or two
00:26:47
Scott Lesak
Absolutely.
Contract Types & Strategic Site Management
00:26:49
The SnowJobs Podcast
that you're like, fuck, I've been doing this how long?
00:26:51
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:26:51
The SnowJobs Podcast
How did I not have that in there? All these contracts, all these years. Like there's always something, man. Always something. um All right. The other question, one of the other questions we had was how do you guys do your contracts?
00:27:04
The SnowJobs Podcast
Are you all seasonal? Are you per are you all per push? Do you do a combination of both? What's everybody's feelings on the seasonals versus per push? I know Jeremy's a lot of T and M. um That's not such a thing in the Northeast.
00:27:16
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:27:17
The SnowJobs Podcast
But ah what are we doing?
00:27:18
RICK JAMES
We're, we're a whole lot of seasonals this year.
00:27:21
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
00:27:22
RICK JAMES
I mean, I mean, it's, that's what everybody, some of these guys are wanting, but yeah, we, I mean, we have mixed everything seasonals and T and M and you know, some per push, not much.
00:27:22
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh, nice.
00:27:32
RICK JAMES
No, we don't do much per push around here, but a lot of T and M and seasonals.
00:27:35
The SnowJobs Podcast
yeah God, they get torched if you did another forty seven pushes.
00:27:40
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:27:41
The SnowJobs Podcast
That'd be'd be a lot.
00:27:44
RICK JAMES
There's always extras in those seasonals, but they're not all seasonal.
00:27:44
The SnowJobs Podcast
um
00:27:47
Scott Lesak
Yeah.
00:27:48
The SnowJobs Podcast
Absolutely. So what's ah what's everybody do? what ah What's Mike? What does ODP do? Mostly seasonals, a mix. What do they do?
00:27:55
Mike Santolucito
Mostly seasonals, like Scott, we're like 60-40, but try and shoot for 50-50 if you can. It's hard to do right off the bat, but you know think of it this way. yourre Your seasonals pay your bills and then your per push picks up the rear end.
00:28:12
The SnowJobs Podcast
Hmm.
00:28:12
RICK JAMES
Yep.
00:28:13
Scott Lesak
Yeah, absolutely.
00:28:14
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah. You agree with that Scott? 50 50 is the good ratio or you think higher one end.
00:28:16
Scott Lesak
Yeah.
00:28:19
Scott Lesak
i We really like the 60-40 and potentially even pushing up to 70-30 we've talked about. And the way we do our seasonals, the majority of them are paying us 12 months out of the year.
00:28:29
Scott Lesak
So we're getting paid 12 months.
00:28:30
The SnowJobs Podcast
um Okay.
00:28:31
Scott Lesak
um And that's part of the reason that's part of what funds our growth. And we're able to buy the massive fleet increases that we've been putting in place for the past two seasons now. because we're getting paid and then we finance the equipment mirrored to the durations of the contracts getting a lot of those as five-year contracts financing equipment for five years it's paid off at the end of the contract then and we're in a safer safer zone we can trade it back in on new stuff to keep it under warranty we can keep legacy fleet we have some flexibility there so i love the seasonal model
00:29:05
Scott Lesak
It has not bid us um like Jeremy just said, there's always make sure you have hidden ways to bill extra again. We're we're in the industrial world largely, but even if you're not, um you know.
00:29:17
Scott Lesak
Cars moving, if you have to come back and plow where cars are, that's an hourly rate. Tractor trailers moving around, jockeying trailers, and that's an hourly rate. Drifting any of that type of stuff is all an hourly rate above and beyond the seasonal, as well as put a cap on it.
00:29:32
Scott Lesak
you know there's there's Caps are a really good thing. Floors are not as good in my opinion, but you know you if you no, they're not bad if you don't hit them.
00:29:37
The SnowJobs Podcast
ah
00:29:39
RICK JAMES
Yeah, help.
00:29:39
The SnowJobs Podcast
They're not bad if you don't hit them.
00:29:42
Scott Lesak
That's true.
00:29:42
RICK JAMES
Gotta make a wall.
00:29:42
Scott Lesak
long
00:29:43
Mike Santolucito
Well, depends on what you're giving back.
00:29:43
RICK JAMES
Gotta make a wall.
00:29:43
The SnowJobs Podcast
ah
00:29:44
Scott Lesak
So that is a little bit.
00:29:47
Scott Lesak
But you have you have that ceiling in it. And you know if you hit a really big winner, then you're just charging a little bit more. We go per foot above the ceiling. That's typically what we do in our contracts.
00:29:57
The SnowJobs Podcast
here
00:29:58
Scott Lesak
And every foot above that, you go additional. So it's not just like, oh, you have X amount more at the ceiling. You have bars of that.
00:30:05
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah. Increments.
00:30:06
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:30:06
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yep.
00:30:07
Scott Lesak
And ah we don't get bit.
00:30:07
RICK JAMES
ah you
00:30:08
Scott Lesak
I mean, point blank, we don't get bit on these seasonals. We make money every year.
00:30:11
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yep, that's how we do it.
00:30:12
RICK JAMES
you You have to have a ceiling. i mean You can't just give everything away, otherwise you won't be in business. i mean
00:30:17
Scott Lesak
Yeah.
00:30:18
RICK JAMES
it just
00:30:19
The SnowJobs Podcast
you yeah Yeah, I mean, yeah, you can't, yeah there's so much variation now.
00:30:20
RICK JAMES
you
00:30:24
The SnowJobs Podcast
There's so much standard deviation in so many markets. It's it's hard to do it without having some kind of safeties in place. Like, you know, yeah look even firearms have safeties, you know?
00:30:32
RICK JAMES
oh yeah
00:30:35
The SnowJobs Podcast
Like you gotta have some kind of safeties in place to make sure the gun don't go off.
00:30:36
Mike Santolucito
Yeah.
00:30:40
The SnowJobs Podcast
You know, and you don't get bit by it. um We do. We do the floors. We do the floors tactically, you know, like anything else. You you want to protect the client because ah we we say it all the time. The customer's biggest fear in paying a lot of money. If you're going in there and you're high priced, their biggest fear is that they're paying a lot of money and they're not going to need to use it.
00:31:01
The SnowJobs Podcast
It's like insurance. um But if you can offer them something back, like, look, I know what your biggest fear is. Your biggest fear is you're paying based on 40 inches and now you get eight and you think, shit, I should not have paid all that money. I am perfectly fine. I've said it numerous times. Perfectly fine activating that floor if I only get eight inches because my bid is airtight for the rest of that contract that my profit margin is even higher.
00:31:27
The SnowJobs Podcast
giving them 15 percent back or 10 percent back, whatever the contract calls for. I've made more money than I did on an average winner. So I have no problem doing that. And we use our like ah true weather has their 25 year you know outlook.
00:31:41
The SnowJobs Podcast
We keep track of our weather. We know what we've had here. If you put know your area, look at your 25 year history. You can average out to see what the floor was, right, to to see what you're never going to hit and make make it there.
00:31:49
RICK JAMES
i
00:31:54
RICK JAMES
i I understand your argument and it's a great argument, but it's just like insurance.
00:31:56
Mike Santolucito
Yeah.
00:32:01
RICK JAMES
If we don't use a insurance, you're still paying that. Why are we any different?
00:32:04
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh, I get it.
00:32:04
RICK JAMES
were i I know you get it, but I'm just saying it's it's a valid argument. And I know you want to make the customer feel happy, but I mean, we mer w well, you want you want them to feel good.
00:32:12
The SnowJobs Podcast
No, I don't care about their happiness. No, I don't care about the customer's happiness. I care about the relationship. No, I care about the relationship because it's a bad business relationship.
00:32:19
RICK JAMES
Yeah, you want to feel like I feel, I feel um fucked every year with insurance, but we still have to pay that, don't we?
00:32:22
The SnowJobs Podcast
If one of us comes out of the end of the year feeling like we got fucked, it's going to deteriorate the relationship.
00:32:30
The SnowJobs Podcast
ah Well, yeah, we're getting fucked with insurance.
00:32:31
Mike Santolucito
I think we all do.
00:32:33
RICK JAMES
I mean, we still have to pay that, right? I mean, we we have no way around that.
00:32:35
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, but i don't have a I'm okay. you know You can get fucked by your insurance company. You don't have a business relationship with them. They're they're there to fuck you. were I mean, that's not a big secret.
00:32:44
RICK JAMES
All right.
00:32:44
The SnowJobs Podcast
Is it? like if they if you if you have a If you have a slip fall on a Tuesday, they only cover Wednesday and Thursday. you know like they're they're not They're not in business to lose. You know, but this is yeah I just try and do contracts that are mutually beneficial, that we still make our margins that we need and the customer feels like they got what they paid for.
00:32:55
Mike Santolucito
<unk> right
00:32:55
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:33:06
The SnowJobs Podcast
That that's that's just like it's not a secret sauce or anything.
00:33:06
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:33:09
The SnowJobs Podcast
It's just I think it's just good business.
00:33:10
Mike Santolucito
Yeah.
00:33:11
The SnowJobs Podcast
But that's just me.
00:33:11
Scott Lesak
I agree with that.
00:33:11
The SnowJobs Podcast
That doesn't have to be everybody.
00:33:13
Scott Lesak
I agree. Contracts always have to be win-win. That's the best. you know Nobody gets taken advantage of them in them. I see both sides of it, but.
00:33:21
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, I agree.
00:33:22
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:33:23
The SnowJobs Podcast
No, I agree completely. Um, but Mike.
00:33:25
Mike Santolucito
So with your floors though, you you can get creative with those.
00:33:25
RICK JAMES
Go ahead, Mikey. Mikey's got some.
00:33:28
Mike Santolucito
So you don't necessarily have to give money back. Like you can do a credit for the landscape season.
00:33:31
Scott Lesak
Yes.
00:33:34
Mike Santolucito
You can do a credit on the last snow bill of the season. Or if you want, you can do like a enhancement credit where you do like a project of equal or lesser value on the site.
00:33:37
The SnowJobs Podcast
yep Yeah.
00:33:45
Mike Santolucito
It's not going to cost you what it would have to pay them because, you know, your guys, the the rate that it costs you to have those guys there is less the material you're getting at wholesale. So. it's kind of still a win-win there.
00:33:56
The SnowJobs Podcast
Sure.
00:33:56
Mike Santolucito
They're getting something out of it. you know You're not having to pay out the full amount out of your pocket.
00:34:00
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, now we don't give it back. We take it off the last, the you know, the sixth payment.
00:34:04
RICK JAMES
Yeah, exactly.
00:34:05
Scott Lesak
Yeah.
00:34:06
Mike Santolucito
Yeah.
00:34:06
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
00:34:06
RICK JAMES
yeah yeah or Or the following year, or the following year, or the next year, I mean.
00:34:07
Scott Lesak
Yeah, we we do.
00:34:07
The SnowJobs Podcast
So.
00:34:09
The SnowJobs Podcast
or Or they can roll. It's their choice. They can roll it into the next year if they have a year remaining or they're going to renew.
00:34:12
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:34:14
The SnowJobs Podcast
I know some guys use it as a way to entice them to renew, you know, the if they're on their last contract, which is smart.
00:34:16
Scott Lesak
Yep.
00:34:18
RICK JAMES
Right.
00:34:19
Mike Santolucito
Yeah.
00:34:19
RICK JAMES
That makes sense. Yeah.
00:34:21
Scott Lesak
what We do 10% towards landscape enhancement.
00:34:21
RICK JAMES
Yep.
00:34:24
RICK JAMES
Yep.
00:34:25
Scott Lesak
That's it.
00:34:25
The SnowJobs Podcast
Mm hmm.
00:34:25
Scott Lesak
Non-negotiable. If you're getting a floor, that is the only term that we're going to give you. And just like you said, Mike, you know, we can go in and we can, we can deliver the labor.
00:34:32
RICK JAMES
first
00:34:34
Scott Lesak
We can usually upsell ah an enhancement. So it's worth three times what the credit is too. So we can go in there and we're balancing everything out then. And you know, it works out well.
00:34:42
The SnowJobs Podcast
Nice. The industrial game.
00:34:44
Scott Lesak
Yes.
00:34:44
RICK JAMES
Look at you.
00:34:47
The SnowJobs Podcast
I love it.
00:34:47
RICK JAMES
ah so Yeah, you definitely are.
00:34:49
The SnowJobs Podcast
I love it. It's great.
00:34:49
Scott Lesak
It's still win-win, though. We're making the customer happy for you, Steve.
00:34:53
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, absolutely.
00:34:53
Mike Santolucito
That's right.
00:34:53
RICK JAMES
Yep.
00:34:54
RICK JAMES
Yep.
00:34:54
The SnowJobs Podcast
the The one thing I did getting back to the percentage you want to try for seasonal versus, you know, everything else.
00:35:01
The SnowJobs Podcast
um I started out trying 50 50 and I found that being a smaller company with the cost of equipment and everything, how high it was and not having larger, you know,
00:35:13
The SnowJobs Podcast
Like I'd say like $200,000 plus contracts to offset some of that equipment. I found that I had to push it to 7030 seasonal versus per push to cover my overhead and stuff because that's that's the that's the whole goal with the seasonal, right? Cover your overhead, all your operating expenses for the season, and then the per push is gravy on top of that.
00:35:33
The SnowJobs Podcast
um So that, yeah, I found that I had to push it after the first time I tried that. I'm like, yeah, we really didn't make what we needed to on that. Let's push it a little higher on the seasonal and guarantee that money. um So that that's just what I found ah for me being a smaller guy.
00:35:49
Scott Lesak
I'd agree with that.
00:35:49
The SnowJobs Podcast
um
00:35:50
Scott Lesak
And we're even bigger than you are. That 7030 seems to be where our target is going to be. I think for this year, we're probably, we're about 6535 now, but that 7030 is a sweet split.
00:35:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
Gotcha. Cool. Sounds good.
00:36:03
RICK JAMES
You guys out of you you had a quite a bit this year didn't you Scott good for you guys
00:36:03
The SnowJobs Podcast
um so Oh, yeah.
00:36:06
Scott Lesak
Yeah, we did. Yeah, we, we added 16, 16 machines is what we wound up adding all metal pluses on every single one of them and eight trucks fully set up. So we added. It's about between three and a half and four million worth a worth of equipment. so
00:36:20
The SnowJobs Podcast
Wow.
00:36:20
Mike Santolucito
Nice, man.
00:36:21
The SnowJobs Podcast
Good for you, dude.
00:36:21
Mike Santolucito
Good one.
00:36:23
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, we saw the parade. What was that leaving Starks?
00:36:25
Scott Lesak
Yeah, I was leaving storks.
00:36:27
RICK JAMES
Look good,
00:36:27
The SnowJobs Podcast
Nice. I was breaking his balls.
00:36:28
Scott Lesak
Those guys are awesome.
00:36:30
The SnowJobs Podcast
He sent that video. I was like, how did you that's a good videographer that he could get the same two trucks making it look like 20 trucks just driving around in circles up as camera. ah That's awesome.
00:36:41
The SnowJobs Podcast
They look great. Good for you, man.
00:36:42
RICK JAMES
It's called a loop, it's called come a loop Steve.
00:36:45
Scott Lesak
luedter out
00:36:45
The SnowJobs Podcast
That's it. Just a loop. Just a loop. Oh, man. um Well, we just hit we just hit the let's see contracts and we anything else to say on contracts, guys?
00:36:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
All right, good enough.
00:36:59
RICK JAMES
No.
00:37:00
The SnowJobs Podcast
We kind of hit the caps and floors too, so we're we're moving quite quite well here. um Commercials, we had we had two questions actually about doing commercials, retail, I think they're talking about here.
00:37:08
Scott Lesak
Loop it around.
00:37:14
The SnowJobs Podcast
One guy said, everybody wants to do big box sites. What is your opinion on doing smaller sites? Um, so I figured I'd kick that to, uh, to the group and see how we all feel about that. And you guys can actually talk outside of, I know your company structures, probably you're not doing quarter acre or half acre sites, but what's your personal feeling outside your company structures on those Mike. Oh, sorry. go ahead
00:37:40
Mike Santolucito
So there there are some, you know, half acre sites, one acre sites that we do.
00:37:42
The SnowJobs Podcast
Mm-hmm.
00:37:44
Mike Santolucito
It's usually just a root density thing or it's a relationship with a client that, you know, it's in their book. They just need someone to take care of it. So we do it. They're a lot less demanding than your larger sites.
00:37:54
Mike Santolucito
So it's a great little like segue to start out. If you're trying to get into commercial, get a feel for it and how it kind of operates and flows. Um, you know, as far as commercial goes for retail, we don't really do Any, but it's not bad to have as long as they, they understand your pricing model, they understand what it takes to do the work. And unfortunately, like we all know, the brokers, they've had them in a vice for so many years. They've been getting, you know, bottom of the barrel service because they're given bottom of the barrel prices.
00:38:26
Mike Santolucito
When they see that, you know, the target, let's just say is, you know, it's 145,000 for the year to do a seasonal on it, but you know, they've been paying, let's just say like 80,000.
00:38:39
Mike Santolucito
They don't understand why the costs all of a sudden went up. Well, it's your local vendor. You have employees to pay equipment to pay. Like there's a lot of costs that they didn't really know about because they've just been taken care of by this huge company and just been shielded from it.
00:38:51
Mike Santolucito
So you're going to have to wait for that market to kind of.
00:38:51
The SnowJobs Podcast
yeah
00:38:54
Mike Santolucito
loosen up a little bit. You're going to have to wait for some management to turn over. You're going to have to wait for some brokers to kind of leave the area to kind of get your foot in the door for those. But they're great to have that they usually the timeframe from when they open it, when they close kind of works in your benefit.
00:39:09
Mike Santolucito
They usually 9am, 10am. So you got some leeway in the morning to get stuff cleaned up and treated while the sun's just starting to come out.
00:39:13
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah. Uh huh.
00:39:15
Mike Santolucito
You know, they don't nearly close down super late. So it's, it's kind of nice to have that Relaxing time to just let it fall and it build up and then do it like a nice yard off a nice salt after that but If you get some small ones that are kind of close by that They actually make that site even more profitable because you've got equipment in the area that you can kind of allocate to that to help with bigger storms Take care of it quicker, you know get treated faster and move those guys over to a bigger site to kind of be out there and
00:39:43
The SnowJobs Podcast
Sure.
00:39:44
Scott Lesak
Yeah.
00:39:44
The SnowJobs Podcast
What about you, Scott?
00:39:46
Scott Lesak
It depends where you're at in the game. it ah You know, it depends how many people you're running, how many trucks you're running, ah half acre to two acre lots, or they're goldmine. You can make a lot of money in that in that size.
00:39:57
Scott Lesak
I absolutely love them.
00:39:58
The SnowJobs Podcast
Amen.
00:39:58
RICK JAMES
Yup.
00:39:59
Scott Lesak
um We don't do them anymore because of the route. I mean, we'd have to be doing 800 of them and managing 800 different clients to do that. ah It gets challenging when you get to size, but that's how we came up doing small tire centers and coffee shops and you know just just small miscellaneous random stuff that $100 a plow for this one, $175 for this one, $300 for that one that is just getting bigger, but the ones that were $75 take you 15 minutes and you know it just they're all in a row and you can just rock and roll right through them.
00:40:15
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yup. Yup.
00:40:33
Scott Lesak
so that That was a big part of what we did. um and Retail in general, I think retail really gets a shaft from a lot of the snow community. A lot of people talk about how much it sucks, but you get good retail clients. You get good stores that understand the value of what you're providing and want to pay you for it. It's great. We have a phenomenal retail client that we've been with for five years, six years since the store opened.
00:40:59
Scott Lesak
And they're absolutely great. They pay us. They never second-guess it. They value what we're doing. We've never had a slip fall for them. ah you know it's just It's a good market with a whole lot of pavement to plow and keep clean.
00:41:10
Scott Lesak
So don't shy away from it. you know Know what you're getting into and the small stuff, if that's where you're at, absolutely do it.
00:41:13
The SnowJobs Podcast
amen
00:41:18
Scott Lesak
It's a moneymaker. Per acre, you're making more on that than you are on the million square foot sites, hands down by a lot.
00:41:23
The SnowJobs Podcast
Amen.
00:41:23
RICK JAMES
yeah
00:41:24
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yes, sir.
00:41:25
RICK JAMES
yeah
00:41:25
The SnowJobs Podcast
100 percent. This guy. Two thumbs right here.
00:41:28
RICK JAMES
yeah oh We the same thing we have we we ah but have plenty of big commercial we do but we also you're making a lot of money in the little commercial like Scott said you're in and out everybody wants these big commercial laws you know like you can make way more money doing
00:41:29
The SnowJobs Podcast
This guy. ah
00:41:36
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yup.
00:41:44
RICK JAMES
15 20 small lots and you can win a one one big lot and then you don't have the exposure either umll Let you do on a big lot. So I mean it's I Have we do plenty of small lots banks coffee places, you know when the one when they're knocking eaten up by these national companies I want to do it for $25, but you know, it's uh We make a lot of good money on there and it's like I say everybody wants these big lots but you're gonna make a lot of money in these smaller lots because you can do way more tonight and I
00:41:52
The SnowJobs Podcast
Mmhmm.
00:42:14
RICK JAMES
Usually you don't have much for complaints on them either. Cause you're in and out.
00:42:17
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yep.
00:42:17
RICK JAMES
Oh, simple.
00:42:18
The SnowJobs Podcast
100%. Yep. So Billy, Billy from Wisconsin, I will give you the same analogy I give on this argument all the time.
00:42:22
RICK JAMES
um
00:42:27
The SnowJobs Podcast
When I'm asked, you, you have a big box retail. Uh, let's say for argument's sake, that contract's going to be a hundred thousand dollars, which I don't think any of them are actually a hundred grand anymore.
00:42:39
The SnowJobs Podcast
They've been whittled down so much by the nationals. that they're they're all sub 100 now. But if you read those ah RFPs, what they want you to have on site, you have to keep like a half million dollars worth of equipment on site to make $100,000. And that's without a slip and fall, which you you will undoubtedly get.
00:42:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
You know, on that kind of high traffic, high liability site, and you're not being paid enough to service it properly, which you will find out a quarter of the way through the winter. um So why would I spend a half a million dollars on the ability for $100,000 contract when I can get, let's see, what I do, my model, I have $145,000 skid steer with a $10,000 10 foot Arctic. ah So that's 55 grand total.
00:43:29
The SnowJobs Podcast
He's on a route doing seven one acre or sub one acre sites that are all averaging between seventy five hundred and eleven thousand each. He's doing that in three hours. Those seven sites.
00:43:43
The SnowJobs Podcast
three and a half hours if he's getting if he's not getting help from one of the other machines that are finishing their route. Why the heck when I can make that kind of money with that little expenditure, would I want to take a high liability, low profit margin site like a big box retail? Again, that's just my my model. That's what works for me. But at the end of the day, ah it pays. You can still make ridiculous amounts of money. Like Scott said, per acre, your per acre rate is probably higher than guys that are doing these million square foot warehouses and you can get it. And the customer understands the value because guess what? They are the ones paying for it and they're seeing the work. They're seeing the results because if they're not opened and they're having slips and falls and it's a mom and pop type retail, smaller or ah a doctor's office or a, you know, a small,
00:44:34
The SnowJobs Podcast
whatever kind of shop like Scott's entire shop. Those guys are generally they're in need of good quality snow work and they need to be open because when they're not open, it costs them the money that they can't afford to lose. So they're willing to pay for it if you're willing to do the white glove service they need.
00:44:51
The SnowJobs Podcast
um That's you know, this is all about, you know, young guys starting out.
00:44:52
RICK JAMES
and
00:44:56
The SnowJobs Podcast
If you can spend very little money, get a skid steer, have target density in your area, have, you know, density in your sites and you're you're doing a bunch of small sub one acre sites and you're making five grand plus on a seasonal contract and it's taking you 15 minutes each time you're going in and out of there.
00:45:15
The SnowJobs Podcast
That's a huge win.
00:45:17
RICK JAMES
And a lot of these,
00:45:17
The SnowJobs Podcast
Any day of the week, that's a huge win.
00:45:20
RICK JAMES
You can make a lot of extra money too on these, you know, I mean, Lee scenario. I know you guys don't do a lot of, don't have to do a lot of hauling and stuff, but those smaller lots fill up with snow pretty quick.
00:45:24
The SnowJobs Podcast
Hell, yeah.
00:45:29
RICK JAMES
And you know, you can get offsite hauling and stuff like that.
00:45:29
Scott Lesak
Yes, they do.
00:45:29
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yes, they do.
00:45:32
RICK JAMES
So I mean, there's always little things you can tack on. So there's always that option.
00:45:36
The SnowJobs Podcast
We don't fall. We bring in the muskox bringing.
00:45:38
RICK JAMES
Oh, well, if you had a place to blow it, yeah, definitely.
00:45:40
Scott Lesak
Yeah, and the neighbor the neighbor's parking lot, right?
00:45:40
The SnowJobs Podcast
There you go.
00:45:41
RICK JAMES
Yeah. Same. I mean, yeah, we do the same.
00:45:44
The SnowJobs Podcast
Amen. ah
00:45:45
RICK JAMES
Wait for a, wait for a windy day and put her up in there and see where she goes.
00:45:49
Mike Santolucito
They said I had to go, they didn't say where I had to go.
00:45:50
Scott Lesak
yeah
00:45:51
The SnowJobs Podcast
Hey, listen, we've blown it.
00:45:51
RICK JAMES
Yeah. Hey, I always tell the guy, I don't care where you put the snow as long as it's going off the lot. I don't care where you drop it.
00:45:57
The SnowJobs Podcast
There's one property we've blown it out into the street.
00:45:57
RICK JAMES
No matter me.
00:46:00
The SnowJobs Podcast
And once we've blown it out in the street, then we just push it down the road and we pile it where the townplows do, you know, like it's, it is what it is. Get it off the property. They're paying you to get it off the property. Nobody's, nobody's tagging that pile saying, Oh, you know, that 10% of that snow is from you guys.
00:46:13
RICK JAMES
Hmm.
00:46:16
The SnowJobs Podcast
We're going to charge you for that. Just get it off the property and you can charge for it. You don't necessarily have to haul it 10 miles away.
00:46:23
RICK JAMES
and We'd be called in for that.
00:46:25
The SnowJobs Podcast
No, you wouldn't.
00:46:26
RICK JAMES
Yeah, we would.
00:46:26
The SnowJobs Podcast
No, you wouldn't. No, you wouldn't. As long as you clean up after yourself, you know, you re salt the road and move it away.
00:46:29
RICK JAMES
The city don't want anybody snowing their pile, at least around here. Yeah. Yeah. We get, we'd be.
00:46:34
The SnowJobs Podcast
Well, they have one pile right in Fargo, Mount Fargo.
00:46:38
RICK JAMES
Yeah. But you're they're like, you're like talking on a, you're like talking on the street or something like that.
00:46:38
The SnowJobs Podcast
The one big pile. but
00:46:42
RICK JAMES
I mean, it's yeah.
00:46:42
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh, we have a thing here like called cul-de-sacs and dead ends where they push the snow to.
00:46:45
RICK JAMES
Yeah. So do we.
00:46:47
RICK JAMES
I'm guessing they wouldn't want to see a bunch of loaders running in their big piles of snow to fill up there.
00:46:47
The SnowJobs Podcast
That's where it is.
00:46:52
The SnowJobs Podcast
No, you're talking. I mean, you're not talking in the grand scheme of things. You're not talking the amount of snow that anybody's going to notice. I could be like, oh, this was two shovelfuls before all hands got there.
00:47:02
The SnowJobs Podcast
Now it's freaking three truckloads. Not like that.
00:47:05
RICK JAMES
ah Oh, don't shy away.
00:47:06
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh, man. But anything else, ah anything else to add on big versus small commercial sites? Any other tidbits, guys?
00:47:17
RICK JAMES
You can make money.
00:47:18
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, I would definitely tell them go small, especially if you like, we're talking to guys that are younger or nor new snow companies. Don't that's where you're going to be. You don't get the small ones that you can get, but price them correctly.
00:47:30
The SnowJobs Podcast
So you you a don't piss off allies that you'd have in that area that would be willing to help you.
00:47:30
RICK JAMES
Yeah. Don't.
00:47:36
The SnowJobs Podcast
You know, if you're going in there to a site that was eleven thousand the year before for a seasonal and you're going in at twenty eight hundred, you're not going to make a lot of friends in that area doing that.
00:47:43
RICK JAMES
ah
00:47:45
The SnowJobs Podcast
And guys aren't going to be as willing to help you and let you benefit from their experience.
00:47:50
Scott Lesak
Yeah, don't be don't don't be afraid to talk to the guys around you either.
00:47:50
RICK JAMES
Yeah, I just don't. Yeah, go ahead Scott.
00:47:53
The SnowJobs Podcast
know Amen.
00:47:55
Scott Lesak
You know, hey, what are you guys charging? You're just had point blank ask that that question. And if you're listening and don't know how to price, get a hold of me. I'd be happy to walk you through, figure out how to do it.
00:48:05
The SnowJobs Podcast
Amen.
00:48:05
Scott Lesak
We get a little climatology data. We can get you some accurate pricing real quick.
00:48:10
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yep.
00:48:10
RICK JAMES
Yeah. Don't only take all these national bids that they're throwing out for nothing, you know, you don't.
00:48:11
The SnowJobs Podcast
100%.
00:48:14
Scott Lesak
No.
00:48:15
The SnowJobs Podcast
Don't take any. Don't take any.
00:48:16
RICK JAMES
Yeah. Yeah. Oh, I'm just saying, you know, there's, you know, just don't take a price to get if like weeks on the last show.
00:48:18
The SnowJobs Podcast
that's a po thing and
00:48:23
RICK JAMES
I think it was, if they're giving you a price, just say no, they're not.
00:48:26
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah. If there's a counter offer button directly below the price they're offering, you know, chances are you're just a moron. If you take their offer, it's so bad that they've put a counter offer or button.
00:48:35
RICK JAMES
Yeah. There's, you definitely don't take their offer.
00:48:39
The SnowJobs Podcast
All right. They know it's bad.
00:48:42
RICK JAMES
They're just seeing who they can reel in quickly.
00:48:44
The SnowJobs Podcast
Exactly.
00:48:45
RICK JAMES
Oh, native snow.
00:48:46
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh, I just, I don't know.
00:48:48
RICK JAMES
Boom. Got them again.
00:48:50
The SnowJobs Podcast
Dude, the best, the best is, uh, who the heck was telling me? I don't know. I can't remember who was telling me that they, somebody said they had a site the year before one of the nationals took it over, contacted them because they were quote unquote in the area asking if they could do it.
00:49:06
The SnowJobs Podcast
They told them, no, that's not nearly as much money or that's not nearly enough money. And they said, well, we think it's way more money. And the guy's like, no, we did it last year for three times that like, okay.
00:49:18
RICK JAMES
Oh, wasn't that Patrick Salmon was talking today?
00:49:21
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh, maybe, maybe it was Patty. Yeah. I glanced in on the group for a little bit.
00:49:24
RICK JAMES
Yeah. yeah it was ah Yeah, it was a post office.
00:49:27
The SnowJobs Podcast
That happens all the time though.
00:49:27
RICK JAMES
i mean ah and yeah just in case Just in case you might have missed that.
00:49:30
The SnowJobs Podcast
Happens all the time. Just say no.
00:49:35
The SnowJobs Podcast
Just in case we miss that. Just in case we miss that.
00:49:37
RICK JAMES
It was in the group chat today.
00:49:38
The SnowJobs Podcast
Well, we'll just check that out. you know Yeah.
00:49:40
RICK JAMES
that it was It was in the group chat where they priced out it.
00:49:42
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
00:49:44
RICK JAMES
i
00:49:45
The SnowJobs Podcast
oh
00:49:45
RICK JAMES
something they're like, you don't know your numbers what they came back with. And he's like, we did it for 18 years. I'm pretty sure we know our numbers.
00:49:50
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, pretty sure we know what we're doing.
00:49:52
RICK JAMES
ah
00:49:53
The SnowJobs Podcast
Jesus Christ. Yeah, just don't.
00:49:55
Scott Lesak
don't know your numbers get out of here.
00:49:55
The SnowJobs Podcast
If yeah, if you're new or if you're a newer, younger snow company, just it's safer to just stay away from, you know, if they're making an offer, you know that yeah it's not in your best interest to take that offer.
00:50:05
RICK JAMES
Just
00:50:08
The SnowJobs Podcast
It's not so you can make money. You're not making money on it. I guarantee it. If you think you are, then you need to have a math class or call Scott.
00:50:12
RICK JAMES
just
00:50:15
RICK JAMES
You need to make a good case you need to make good case for yourself. so
00:50:19
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
00:50:19
Scott Lesak
Absolutely.
00:50:19
The SnowJobs Podcast
Call Scott and and and have Scott go over basic bidding pricing and stuff with you. ah He said he offered. He'll do it. um oh What else we got here?
00:50:27
Scott Lesak
Absolutely.
00:50:30
The SnowJobs Podcast
um Let's see. I need equipment. I'm starting to get out of trucks or or thinking of getting out of trucks. I know I need to buy a machine. What is my best route to purchase financially?
00:50:43
The SnowJobs Podcast
And I think we all feel it's based on what sites they're looking to take. Right. What they're looking to do.
00:50:48
RICK JAMES
Oh yeah.
00:50:49
Scott Lesak
Yeah.
00:50:49
RICK JAMES
Definitely.
00:50:49
The SnowJobs Podcast
OK, what is you got, Jay?
00:50:50
RICK JAMES
And honestly, with the, with the getting out of it, some of these guys, they can't get out of the their pickups. Look at like another plug for Rick here, the snow power. I mean, it's, it's like, it's not shameless.
00:51:00
The SnowJobs Podcast
Shameless plug.
00:51:02
RICK JAMES
It's real life stuff. It's, I mean, those, those snow powers are like, they turn into compact loaders, you know, or a back blade from Top Gun or wherever.
00:51:03
The SnowJobs Podcast
It is.
00:51:09
RICK JAMES
So.
00:51:10
The SnowJobs Podcast
Listen, there's a reason they're partnered with the show. All right. if If there's a product that's partnered with the show, it's because it actually will help snow guys.
00:51:13
RICK JAMES
Right. Right.
00:51:18
Mike Santolucito
yeah
00:51:18
RICK JAMES
But and then also the, also the guys that are asking, you know, should we move the equipment, you know, over pickup?
00:51:19
The SnowJobs Podcast
You know.
00:51:24
RICK JAMES
I mean, if it fits your company, if it's going to make you money year round, yeah, go for it, but just don't do it.
00:51:24
Mike Santolucito
Yeah.
00:51:30
RICK JAMES
I don't always tell you guys, just don't do it for snow. It's just too, uh, it's, it's too volatile.
00:51:33
The SnowJobs Podcast
Amen.
00:51:35
Mike Santolucito
yeah Think about the entirety of your business.
00:51:38
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:51:38
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, skid steer can't tow a lawn mowing trailer.
00:51:38
Scott Lesak
Yeah. Yeah.
00:51:42
The SnowJobs Podcast
Well, neither can a loader.
00:51:42
Scott Lesak
It's true.
00:51:44
The SnowJobs Podcast
You know, so if that's your only, you know, if that's your only game right now, then that's your game that maximize that game. Like Jeremy said, you know, you got a bunch of options out there now to to get more out of a truck plow than you ever could have, you know, 10, 15 years ago.
00:51:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
So there's lots of options. So just maximize what you got. I would, I would, I would agree with Jeremy 100% on that.
00:52:06
Scott Lesak
And before you start,
00:52:06
The SnowJobs Podcast
You don't necessarily need to buy machines.
00:52:08
Scott Lesak
Before you start buying stuff, how are you going to pay for it? make sure you know that Make sure that answer is bulletproof, and you're going to be able to pay for it.
00:52:11
The SnowJobs Podcast
Amen.
00:52:15
Scott Lesak
I know I said that last week.
00:52:16
The SnowJobs Podcast
Year round, year round, not just the six months the snow is paying.
00:52:17
Scott Lesak
Year-round, absolutely.
00:52:18
RICK JAMES
have the Have the work first.
00:52:19
Scott Lesak
and and not And it's not, oh, if it snows, we'll be fine. No, no, no.
00:52:25
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yes.
00:52:26
RICK JAMES
Yeah, yeah, well.
00:52:26
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yes.
00:52:26
Scott Lesak
How?
00:52:28
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh my God. Yes.
00:52:30
Mike Santolucito
That's my favorite.
00:52:30
The SnowJobs Podcast
Do not buy on the no snow model.
00:52:32
Scott Lesak
i I do think if you're getting into purchasing though and you made the decision, you can do it.
00:52:33
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:52:36
Scott Lesak
I think leasing is a really good financial avenue to go first because you can have lower monthly payments. You don't get as much equity tied up in the machine as you can if you're buying it.
00:52:48
Scott Lesak
But if you're leasing it, your your monthly payments are roughly half of what it is if you're financing it. um And it usually comes out that it's similar to what it would cost you to rent that machine for the season, but you're going to have it 12 months out of the year and three year, five year commitment, whatever you're doing there. And once you build that up,
00:53:08
Scott Lesak
You can buy it out at the end. You can start financing them as you're growing and kind of make those decisions there. But ah that leasing model worked really well for us when we started getting into equipment and just keeping that cash flow.
00:53:20
Scott Lesak
Cash flow is the game. If you can keep your cash cash out as low as possible with the cash in as high as possible, you're going to do fine.
00:53:22
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
00:53:28
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yep. Amen. Love it. What about you, Mike? Anything to add?
00:53:35
Mike Santolucito
not effort Well, if you're looking i mean if you're starting off right and you're trying to do some root-dense stuff, skid-steers are a great option. They will always have a place in the industry.
00:53:46
Mike Santolucito
But if you need something that's going to kind of scoot down the road, get to the next site quick, a little more maneuverable, you don't necessarily need to go full-size. You can get a pretty good rate on a used micro loader.
00:53:55
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
00:53:59
Mike Santolucito
and i'll It'll do the same job. You can still use it for your construction season, your landscape season, and it's going to be a little bit more productive for you than if you're looking to to just add a skid for the sole purpose of doing snow.
00:54:14
The SnowJobs Podcast
Hmm, yeah, I agree.
00:54:15
RICK JAMES
Yeah, come.
00:54:16
The SnowJobs Podcast
here's Here's what I would add to that. What is your company makeup? Like if you're doing landscaping and snow, a skid probably makes more sense. And I would say, honestly, a track machine is probably the way to go because you can do dirt work with it.
00:54:26
RICK JAMES
Yep.
00:54:28
Scott Lesak
Yes.
00:54:31
The SnowJobs Podcast
um I think, ah like Mike's saying, I think a compact loader is more versatile when it comes to snow and zipping down the road. But if you only have one purchase you know ability with your budget,
00:54:44
The SnowJobs Podcast
you know, get the thing that's going to be able to make you money 12 months out of the year to help pay for it. um The only downside to that is you can beat up a machine if you don't take care of it properly in the snow.
00:54:56
The SnowJobs Podcast
You can rust that thing out real quick if you haven't cared for it.
00:54:59
Mike Santolucito
Oh yeah.
00:55:00
The SnowJobs Podcast
So make sure you do. But I think if you're a small or new company and you're like these guys are saying in these questions, you're looking to add up your first piece of equipment after a truck.
00:55:13
The SnowJobs Podcast
um I think a track machine for a lot of landscapers makes a lot of sense. I think that's probably your best
Equipment Selection for Snow Businesses
00:55:19
The SnowJobs Podcast
bang for your buck. um But if you are I know if you have if part of your business is ah you have a materials yard, then a compact loader, which you probably already have because you're loading trucks at this point anyway, I think a compact loader is probably the most versatile for snow. You know, Jeremy's kind of sold me on that. And I've seen it actually now that I gave that model a fair shot. There's things I can do with the three twenty one that I can't do with the two eighties or the three eighties.
00:55:49
The SnowJobs Podcast
um It's just time between from site to site. You will shave a lot of time off and you will become more efficient with it. um But again, yeah, but again, if you're just starting out, I think you got one purchase to make.
00:55:58
RICK JAMES
Compacts are great. okay
00:56:03
The SnowJobs Podcast
You only got enough money to do one thing and you don't want to make a mistake. I think a track machine is the way to go. And let's face it, anybody that's looked at equipment in the last 10 years, the track machines do not decrease in value.
00:56:14
The SnowJobs Podcast
Those things are the resale on them is ridiculous.
00:56:16
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:56:19
The SnowJobs Podcast
You know, it's just check, check, check it out. Do your homework. But I think that's probably the way to go.
00:56:26
Scott Lesak
I'd agree with that.
00:56:26
RICK JAMES
yeah
00:56:26
The SnowJobs Podcast
Anybody.
00:56:27
Scott Lesak
I'd agree with that.
00:56:29
The SnowJobs Podcast
What do you got, Jay? Anything else?
00:56:31
RICK JAMES
No, I'm, I'm a big proponent of of compacts. Obviously they've, they've came along last what? Five to eight years.
00:56:38
RICK JAMES
They've exploded, exploded on the market. Like you can charge the same for a compact because you can a big load for the most part. I mean, they do, you can put almost a big push around those as you can. So you're doing, you're doing quite a bit of work with them and the visibility on them over a skidster.
00:56:38
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
00:56:50
Mike Santolucito
You sure can. You cost the same too.
00:56:53
RICK JAMES
I mean, yeah.
00:56:54
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, pretty much.
00:56:55
RICK JAMES
Yeah. Well, they used to be, you know, you used to get them for a decent price.
00:56:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
00:57:00
Mike Santolucito
Used to be a real affordable option guys, I promise.
00:57:00
RICK JAMES
Now they're saying. Yeah. Yeah.
00:57:03
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, it did just in the last two years, they've really jumped in the last two years, the compacts have really exploded.
00:57:04
RICK JAMES
Yeah. Back in the day. it Oh.
00:57:11
RICK JAMES
Yeah. Cause everybody wants them now.
00:57:13
The SnowJobs Podcast
Well, all right, well, let's.
00:57:14
RICK JAMES
Cause they used to just be bigging in what rental fleets, I think what's most of the guys had them and then all of a sudden they noticed everybody wants them.
00:57:18
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, yeah.
00:57:21
The SnowJobs Podcast
And Jeremy started talking about him and they all blew up and now everybody wants a compact.
00:57:22
RICK JAMES
stuff Yeah. Yeah.
00:57:28
The SnowJobs Podcast
That's what they all did. All those manufacturers got together and said, hey, there's this new show. yeah This guy, Jeremy Lindstrom, is talking about compacts. Let's all jacket 30, 30 percent, 25 to 30 percent.
00:57:35
RICK JAMES
Yeah. Yeah.
00:57:39
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh, man.
00:57:39
RICK JAMES
yeah
00:57:40
The SnowJobs Podcast
Well, let's let's hear some commercials here. We'll ah we'll keep going with these guys. We'll be back in a minute.
00:58:50
The SnowJobs Podcast
All right, we're back. Thank you to all our partners. We appreciate it. Anything more to say on the equipment purchases, guys?
00:59:01
RICK JAMES
Just don't buy any unless you have the work.
00:59:04
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, be able to pay for it.
00:59:05
Scott Lesak
Yep. Yep. How am I going to pay for it?
00:59:06
RICK JAMES
Or you could call Rob or if you call Rob and Nick and Mark and that they say there's going to be snow, I guess you guys just guarantee off what they say. So make it to the bank.
00:59:14
The SnowJobs Podcast
ah Yeah, take it to the bank. Take it to the bank. Oh, my God. um But no, I mean, if you are if you are buying or like Scott said, leasing is definitely a viable option. But if you are looking for some equity and and you you're looking to purchase it outright and stuff, there are places you can go that you can get top quality equipment and stuff. So we all know that. You know, to check out, you know, they can go to the nest, right? If they're looking for case.
00:59:44
The SnowJobs Podcast
I mean, they can go to Dinesse leasing.
00:59:44
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:59:45
The SnowJobs Podcast
they can They got skids. They got three twenty ones. They got everything. So check them out.
00:59:50
RICK JAMES
I got a call in there right now.
00:59:51
The SnowJobs Podcast
They'll set you straight. They will definitely set you straight.
00:59:53
RICK JAMES
I got, I'm looking at a few more.
00:59:55
The SnowJobs Podcast
Well, they got you.
00:59:56
RICK JAMES
I'm looking at a few more yet this year. We got to figure something out. We need a couple more pieces.
00:59:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
Do you call them?
01:00:01
RICK JAMES
Sure did.
01:00:02
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah. What they tell you, anything for the legend.
01:00:03
RICK JAMES
Find out tomorrow. I don't know. Yeah. I wish we said the little boys had this way.
01:00:07
The SnowJobs Podcast
Legendary Lindstrom.
01:00:08
RICK JAMES
It'd make me feel a lot better.
01:00:11
The SnowJobs Podcast
Get them on the road. I'll take 10. ah but
01:00:14
RICK JAMES
Yeah, I wish.
01:00:15
The SnowJobs Podcast
oh um Yeah, but I think that i think for for guys, like we all have our preferences, but you know just speaking impartially, if you're just starting out or you're just growing and looking to add that first piece of machinery, I think your best bet for being able to make money 12 months out of the year in any condition is probably the track machine.
01:00:36
The SnowJobs Podcast
I think that's the way to go.
01:00:37
RICK JAMES
Oh yeah.
01:00:39
The SnowJobs Podcast
The one thing I would tell you is try and go with maybe a 74 horse and not a 90. So you don't have the df issues in the winter. Everybody agree with that or no?
01:00:46
Mike Santolucito
Mm-hmm.
01:00:46
RICK JAMES
yeah Yeah.
01:00:47
Scott Lesak
Absolutely.
01:00:48
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
01:00:48
Mike Santolucito
Yep.
01:00:49
The SnowJobs Podcast
So I would definitely knock on wood, knock on wood.
01:00:51
RICK JAMES
I mean, the DF has issues.
01:00:52
Mike Santolucito
Say no to the blue cat.
01:00:55
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
01:00:56
The SnowJobs Podcast
I have not had any def issues with my three eighties. Um, they have, they have not failed us yet, but we'd also don't use them to push.
01:01:05
Mike Santolucito
You know what, I'll knock on wood too, just for you.
01:01:06
The SnowJobs Podcast
No, they load salt. That's it. Yeah, there you go.
01:01:10
Scott Lesak
yeah
01:01:10
The SnowJobs Podcast
There you go. No, no problems yet with that.
01:01:12
RICK JAMES
I got, I got a particle board.
01:01:15
The SnowJobs Podcast
Particle board.
01:01:16
Mike Santolucito
It still counts.
01:01:18
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, I'd say yeah for safety's sake in the winter, 74 horse track machine would probably be the way to go for as little problem as possible.
01:01:19
RICK JAMES
yeah
01:01:28
The SnowJobs Podcast
Um, what else guys, anything else that could to help newer or younger snow companies out that you can think about for the last two weeks?
01:01:36
RICK JAMES
I'll just do it yeah.
01:01:36
The SnowJobs Podcast
Anything you want to add?
01:01:38
Scott Lesak
Just do it. Just do it.
01:01:39
The SnowJobs Podcast
Just do it.
01:01:40
Mike Santolucito
Yeah, just do it.
01:01:40
Scott Lesak
If you're if you're scared of it, go after it. and you know Within reason, i don't I don't want you to think I'm saying jump off the cliff and take on a 3 million square foot site when you've never done anything but residential.
01:01:50
Scott Lesak
But if you're scared of that a lot, just do it. Just get into it. The only way to learn is to make mistakes. The only way to learn is to do it.
01:01:56
RICK JAMES
You know, yeah, you can be, you might be so scared.
01:01:57
Scott Lesak
And you're going to make less mistakes than you're fearing right now. I guarantee that.
01:02:01
The SnowJobs Podcast
Amen.
01:02:03
RICK JAMES
You'll be on top at all times. So ah that's, I mean, that's, that's just the way it goes.
01:02:05
Scott Lesak
yeah
01:02:06
Mike Santolucito
Yeah.
01:02:06
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, you'll over service.
01:02:06
Scott Lesak
That's how I was.
01:02:08
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, you'll over service.
01:02:11
RICK JAMES
I mean, you don't want to fail. So you over, overachieve sometimes. So
Risk-Taking & Team Engagement
01:02:17
The SnowJobs Podcast
Listen, there's nothing wrong with over servicing if you're bidding it correctly in the first place.
01:02:17
Mike Santolucito
Yeah.
01:02:22
The SnowJobs Podcast
You know, if you have enough margin built in, nothing wrong with going above and beyond on a contract.
01:02:23
RICK JAMES
right.
01:02:23
RICK JAMES
All right.
01:02:28
The SnowJobs Podcast
What?
01:02:29
RICK JAMES
No.
01:02:29
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, that's that's definitely something to definitely do. um What else? Mike, you got any closing thoughts on the last two weeks worth of conversation? Anything else we forgot to add?
01:02:40
Mike Santolucito
Yeah, I think a big thing is just don't underestimate your team's ability to take on more work. I mean, we all say it, it's easy to get the work and bring it in, but we always get nervous on, you know, how we're going to staff it. Can our current team handle the load? Your team is probably already just as excited as you are to take it on. You know, they may not show it, but you also probably have some studs that are ready for the next step in their career that will take that site on and take ownership of it. So.
01:03:08
Mike Santolucito
you know Take a look at your roster, really dive into you know who's hung around the longest, who's taken on more responsibility, who asks for more responsibility, who's responsible and loyal and takes care of your equipment, and see what they want to do. Have the conversation like, hey, I'm thinking of these properties right here. I'm bidding on them. what do you What are your thoughts? What do you think about tooling them? What do you think about the staff that we got? What do you think that we would need to do it? And let them run with it. you know Let them drive the conversation and see where it goes. because your, your team makes or breaks your company, right?
01:03:41
Mike Santolucito
We, we all, we all live by our team. So just keep them involved in it, feel them out, see what they think.
01:03:44
The SnowJobs Podcast
Amen.
01:03:45
RICK JAMES
know Yeah. yeah
01:03:49
Mike Santolucito
And I guarantee you, you'll, you'll find out that you got some guys that are excited for it and are ready for the next step and you can grow your company just pretty quick doing that.
01:03:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
It's so funny you just said that too, because you forget about that in the process where we literally just had a property that sandwiched between two other properties we do. And they called the other day saying, hey, they changed owners. ah Can you guys add us? Is that possible? And the first thing I did is I'll come out and take a look.
01:04:18
The SnowJobs Podcast
And I'll walk it with you. And then I walked it said, OK, this is good. I threw out, you know, what we're what we're thinking. And the first thing I did was I called the operator that would do that site and I called the sidewalk crew guy that would do that site. And I said, hey,
01:04:34
The SnowJobs Podcast
It's like NASA, mission control, go or no go. Can you handle the can you fit this into your production schedule without any problems? And yep, yep. Yeah, we got it. We'll put it. We'll pile it here. We'll stack there. Good to go. And that's yeah. Don't be afraid to involve your team in the process. I don't think there's anything worse. Is there is there ah like do you think guys get off put by that if they're not involved with the hey, we just took on all this freaking work and you guys are just going to have to go do it?
01:05:02
The SnowJobs Podcast
Like, do you think guys wanna have a say in what you're doing? Like, at least be asked.
01:05:08
Scott Lesak
I don't know, I don't know about have a saying.
01:05:09
The SnowJobs Podcast
Anybody? Or are you guys just gonna text each other privately?
01:05:13
RICK JAMES
ah
01:05:15
Scott Lesak
I don't know about have a say in it, perhaps, but kept in the loop.
01:05:19
The SnowJobs Podcast
But be involved. Yeah, keep kept in the loop.
01:05:19
Scott Lesak
but Yeah, kept in the loop 100%.
01:05:21
The SnowJobs Podcast
Be involved.
01:05:21
Scott Lesak
Hey, we're bidding on this. Hey, check this out. This is exciting. And and it's it's all about the narrative you put around it.
01:05:25
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yes.
01:05:27
Scott Lesak
If you're like, oh, man, we're bidding this. This is this crazy right now. I don't know what we're going to do. if They're going to think it's crazy. If you're like, we're bidding this, and it looks like we're going to get it.
01:05:33
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
01:05:34
Scott Lesak
This is going to be awesome. They're going to think it's going to be awesome. So make sure you you're communicating it the right way, too.
01:05:40
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, I mean, I give them I give them a say only because they know their route.
01:05:40
Mike Santolucito
Yeah.
01:05:44
The SnowJobs Podcast
They know their timing. They get they've been doing it the same thing for years. So I just want their noble shit. Yes, we can fit this in without problems or no, we can't. And what if they if they tell me they can't, then I got to make a decision that, well, guess what?
01:05:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
You're gonna or, you know, but, ah you know, yeah, or or add something.
01:06:02
Scott Lesak
Or add equipment, add a truck, you know and add a piece of equipment. just you know Back to that win-win.
01:06:06
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yep. Or add something. Exactly.
01:06:08
RICK JAMES
i a
01:06:09
Scott Lesak
If you expect more out of them and more than they can handle, give them the resources they need to succeed so they have it and they can handle it.
01:06:16
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yep. Yep.
01:06:17
RICK JAMES
I a conversation last, I had a conversation last week about three, three more sites, pretty good size sites.
01:06:17
The SnowJobs Podcast
One more pizza.
01:06:23
RICK JAMES
We're like, can we take them on? I'm like, yup, I'll figure it out.
01:06:26
The SnowJobs Podcast
but Never says no.
01:06:29
RICK JAMES
I'll figure it out. And I got it. I already got it figured out. I already got it figured out and figured out by the end of the day.
01:06:33
The SnowJobs Podcast
There you go.
01:06:34
RICK JAMES
I was like, I know a guy we'll get it done. So.
01:06:37
The SnowJobs Podcast
There you go. He just snuck over the fence into the case yard and reallocated three East Coast facilities machines.
01:06:39
RICK JAMES
So no, I need to do that.
01:06:45
The SnowJobs Podcast
put glacier stickers out of.
01:06:45
RICK JAMES
I need to do that for, I need to do that for a different site that I had a problem with on Friday. So that's my, that's my tomorrow figure out. I gotta, yeah, I got shit to figure out.
01:06:56
The SnowJobs Podcast
There we go.
Sports Banter & Business Preferences
01:06:57
RICK JAMES
I'll get it done.
01:06:57
The SnowJobs Podcast
All right, boys, anything else? Scott, any closing thoughts? Anything we forgot?
01:07:02
Scott Lesak
Oh, man, could go on for days. So I think if if we're ready to wrap up, we can just wrap up.
01:07:07
The SnowJobs Podcast
I think we're good. We can we could always do this again sometime.
01:07:10
Scott Lesak
Absolutely, anytime.
01:07:11
RICK JAMES
Yeah, like every every week I mean.
01:07:12
The SnowJobs Podcast
All right. Yeah, like like every week.
01:07:16
Mike Santolucito
Exactly.
01:07:16
RICK JAMES
but
01:07:18
The SnowJobs Podcast
All right. All right, Mike, you got anything else?
01:07:21
Mike Santolucito
Godspeed.
01:07:22
The SnowJobs Podcast
All right, Jeremy.
01:07:23
RICK JAMES
Oh, the Vikings are piing pissing me off here, so.
01:07:27
The SnowJobs Podcast
OK.
01:07:27
Mike Santolucito
Turn it off. Why are you still watching it?
01:07:29
Scott Lesak
mr
01:07:29
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, why are you still watching?
01:07:29
RICK JAMES
but Because I'm an idiot Viking town, that's why.
01:07:33
The SnowJobs Podcast
Well, could always be where I.
01:07:34
RICK JAMES
They're ahead, but they're playing like garbage, so.
01:07:37
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh, and you're complaining. They're ahead. Oh, they're winning, but I don't like the way they're winning.
01:07:39
RICK JAMES
But.
01:07:41
The SnowJobs Podcast
So I'm going to complain.
01:07:41
RICK JAMES
No, Darnell's throwing another pick.
01:07:42
The SnowJobs Podcast
and but Well, he was a jet, right?
01:07:45
RICK JAMES
It's like, come on, let's go.
01:07:47
The SnowJobs Podcast
only Wasn't he a jet?
01:07:47
RICK JAMES
Wow.
01:07:49
The SnowJobs Podcast
The Jets got rid of him.
01:07:49
RICK JAMES
Yeah, but he's playing pretty good this year.
01:07:51
The SnowJobs Podcast
It tells you how good he is.
01:07:54
RICK JAMES
Here it was.
01:07:54
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, well, because he's not a jet anymore.
01:07:57
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
01:07:58
The SnowJobs Podcast
It's a cursed organ.
01:07:58
RICK JAMES
You love your jets.
01:07:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
I hate him. I don't even watch him anymore. I haven't watched him in years.
01:08:01
RICK JAMES
Oh, you're a soccer guy.
01:08:02
The SnowJobs Podcast
I can't do it.
01:08:04
RICK JAMES
You're a soccer guy.
01:08:04
The SnowJobs Podcast
Can't do it, can't do it. No, now I'm a hockey guy.
01:08:07
RICK JAMES
Oh yeah, hockey dad.
01:08:07
The SnowJobs Podcast
Now I have to watch hockey all the time.
01:08:09
RICK JAMES
Did you order that suburban yet?
01:08:10
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yup. No, not yet. I think we're going expedition though. Expedition XL.
01:08:14
RICK JAMES
Okay.
01:08:15
Mike Santolucito
Oh, no more wagoneer.
01:08:15
Scott Lesak
those are so
01:08:16
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
01:08:17
The SnowJobs Podcast
Those were pretty yeah the wagon here. I we rented one at Sima.
01:08:21
Mike Santolucito
I know, I remember that thing was nice.
01:08:21
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
01:08:21
The SnowJobs Podcast
I did not like the ride. I i didn't like the ride.
01:08:24
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
01:08:25
The SnowJobs Podcast
um The Expedition XL we rented where in Minnesota and where were we just we were just in a quip.
01:08:26
RICK JAMES
Expedition was nice.
01:08:30
RICK JAMES
I don't remember.
01:08:33
The SnowJobs Podcast
We got the Expedition XL Louisville, Louisville, Louisville.
01:08:33
RICK JAMES
Oh, Louisville. Louisville. Louisville. Louisville. Louisville.
01:08:39
The SnowJobs Podcast
And we had the expedition both times. And that was a smooth ride. That was a nice, very nice
01:08:44
RICK JAMES
Wasn't bad.
01:08:46
The SnowJobs Podcast
I like the one in Louisville better than ah the one in Minnesota, only because that red interior and in Minnesota was weird, right?
01:08:53
RICK JAMES
I only never been that one. Was I in that? Maybe I was.
01:08:56
The SnowJobs Podcast
No, you drove.
Promotions & Podcast Conclusion
01:08:57
The SnowJobs Podcast
You drove.
01:08:58
RICK JAMES
Oh, yeah, I drove.
01:08:58
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, you drove to that. So you weren't in the rental.
01:09:01
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
01:09:01
The SnowJobs Podcast
Sean got in it. The first thing he said was, why are the seats red? i'm Like, I don't know, dude, it's a freaking rental. What do you want?
01:09:08
Scott Lesak
It's an F.
01:09:08
The SnowJobs Podcast
They don't give you a choice on what interior you want.
01:09:10
Scott Lesak
It's an F-150 with an SUV bag instead of a bed, man. You can't go wrong.
01:09:14
The SnowJobs Podcast
There you go.
01:09:15
Mike Santolucito
That's it.
01:09:15
The SnowJobs Podcast
That's it. Amen.
01:09:16
RICK JAMES
Yeah vote Tuesday swag getting cold it's getting cold
01:09:17
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh, man. All right, boys. Then I guess we will wrap it there if we're good.
01:09:23
Mike Santolucito
Get on vote.
01:09:25
Scott Lesak
Yes.
01:09:26
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yep. Get out and vote. Definitely vote Tuesday tomorrow. This is dropping Monday. So tomorrow get out and vote. All right. If you haven't already done so.
01:09:37
The SnowJobs Podcast
buy some swag, get to snow jobs and snow jobs, nation store.com, buy swag. And is the promo code still on or no?
01:09:45
RICK JAMES
No, but we'll, we'll have to, we'll do something else.
01:09:46
The SnowJobs Podcast
You killed it.
01:09:48
RICK JAMES
Yeah. Well, I think it was the 31st.
01:09:48
The SnowJobs Podcast
Some guys were saying they, some guys were saying they couldn't find the button to to put a promo code in at checkout.
01:09:55
RICK JAMES
I don't know. Well, they, I gave it to whoever ordered. So, so we're good.
01:10:00
The SnowJobs Podcast
All right. Good. You're a good man. I wouldn't if they didn't click it.
01:10:02
RICK JAMES
I know.
01:10:04
The SnowJobs Podcast
Sorry. I'm not sorry.
01:10:06
Mike Santolucito
yeah
01:10:07
The SnowJobs Podcast
I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding.
01:10:09
Mike Santolucito
wait what What if we did a counteroffer button?
01:10:09
RICK JAMES
it And I get the hard
01:10:11
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah. Yeah. Put a counter offer button in there.
01:10:12
RICK JAMES
that god
01:10:13
Scott Lesak
yeah but Well played.
01:10:14
The SnowJobs Podcast
Why can't we do that?
01:10:15
RICK JAMES
Should we doing let two ebay so youre do eBay auction on stuff?
01:10:15
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
01:10:18
The SnowJobs Podcast
That's great.
01:10:18
RICK JAMES
Should we do an eBay?
01:10:19
The SnowJobs Podcast
That is great, Mike.
01:10:19
RICK JAMES
Can we do that on Shopify?
01:10:20
The SnowJobs Podcast
Way to go.
01:10:22
RICK JAMES
We should see where we you do that on Shopify.
01:10:22
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh.
01:10:24
RICK JAMES
up I love playing those games.
01:10:24
The SnowJobs Podcast
Justin, just in case you want to make a counter offer, we'll put a counter offer button in there for you on swag. Oh, that's great tonight.
01:10:31
RICK JAMES
Denied.
01:10:35
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh man. Oh, you know, they, they don't like us, but
01:10:48
RICK JAMES
And they do.
01:10:48
The SnowJobs Podcast
ah
01:10:49
The SnowJobs Podcast
That's it. And they do. All right, guys. Well, let's wrap it here, then. That's going to do it again for this episode of the Snow Jobs podcast. As always, thanks so much to Mike and Scott for the time coming on the benefits of their knowledge and experience. yeah You can't do much better than these guys out there, right?
01:11:06
The SnowJobs Podcast
ah You know, and the whole purpose of these two episodes is to help fellow snow guys out there with real world info. So I want to thank these guys for continuing to do that. They make it easy for us to do this show when they're giving you information like that. All right. That's it, guys. Everybody be safe out there. Have a great week. As Jeremy said, get out and vote. Keep pushing.