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#14: When NextGen Ministries Unite (interview with Cody Mummau regarding Episode 2026)
38 Plays1 month ago
In this powerful conversation, Rich sits down with longtime friend Cody Mummau, high school pastor at Thomas Road Baptist Church, to unpack the heart, vision, and behind-the-scenes journey of transforming a long-standing single-church winter retreat into a citywide, multi-church movement called Episode. What began as one church’s long‑standing winter retreat has transformed into a multi‑church, kingdom‑minded movement—one marked by humility, collaboration, and a shared desire to reach the next generation.
Cody shares how God prepared him years earlier through ministry partnerships in North Carolina, where he learned the impact of churches working together rather than competing. Now serving in his hometown, he’s bringing that same vision to the 434 area code—inviting churches of all sizes and backgrounds to unite students around the gospel.
As Rich says in the episode, “I want you to be motivated to ask yourself, what can I do to be a part of something greater than just me?”
And as Cody reflects, “There’s no possible way that even as large as our student ministry is, we can’t do it alone… The church has to reach the city.”
This conversation is a behind‑the‑scenes look at humility, collaboration, and the kind of leadership that builds a culture of “we, not me.”
Links
Episode Sessions (student gathering hosted by Thomas Road Baptist Church)
• Episode Recap
• Session 1
• Session 2
• Session 3
• Email for Cody Mummau (TRBC): cody.mummau@trbc.org
• Email for Rich Brown (NGM): rich@nextgenmatters.com
• Subscribe for NGM Thursday Tools email
• Watch this episode on YouTube
Timestamps
• 00:00–02:00 – The mission of Next Gen Matters and introducing Cody Mumaw
• 02:00–07:30 – From North Carolina to Lynchburg: Cody’s ministry journey
• 07:30–15:30 – The early days of collaboration: The 460 Project and multi-church retreats
• 15:30–23:30 – 180 Weekend: Scaling a shared student event across 30+ churches
• 23:30–30:30 – Returning home and reimagining “Episode” as a kingdom-centered gathering
• 30:30–36:30 – Building trust among churches and creating a culture of shared leadership
• 36:30–42:30 – Practical steps for leaders: Finding your people and starting small
• 42:30–End – Don’t quit: Longevity, community, and a 24-hour action plan for collaboration
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction to NextGen Matters
00:00:01
NextGen Matters
For those of us serving in NextGen ministry, here's what we have learned. Spiritually healthy students come from spiritually healthy ministry systems, and these systems only come from spiritually healthy ministry leaders.
00:00:14
NextGen Matters
And that's why NextGen Matters is all about relationally empowering ministry leaders to impact the next generation.
Purpose of the Podcast
00:00:23
NextGen Matters
Hey friend, Rich Brown here. Welcome again to the Next Gen Matters podcast, a show for ministry leaders seeking to move beyond overwhelm and move into leading with clarity, confidence, and consistency.
Interview with Ryan and Event Highlights
00:00:35
NextGen Matters
In the last episode, i interviewed my son, Ryan Brown, as we and we mentioned this incredible citywide youth event that our church was blessed to be a part of. I mentioned that I needed to reach out right away to my friend, Cody Mumaw, who's the high school pastor, the host pastor of this event. So sure enough, I texted him that afternoon and he was so gracious to get back with me and say, let's go.
00:00:57
NextGen Matters
So here we are. we got Cody in the house. Actually, I'm in his house. This is his office. So... They call it the library. don't
Cody Mumaw's Collaborative Mission
00:01:04
NextGen Matters
know why. Exactly. And you're the librarian. So in this episode, my dear friend, I want you to come behind the scenes with us as far how this event even took place, but really more than just the logistics of the tactical side. And that will be covered a little bit, but really into the heart and soul.
00:01:21
NextGen Matters
of here's this man who surrendered his own church's big event, their biggest high school event of the year, surrendering that to say, you know what, I have to think bigger. i have to think the kingdom of Jesus. And then he began to invite other churches in our city to join him in this mission. So when this episode concludes, I want you to first of all rejoice what God is doing here in Central Virginia.
00:01:45
NextGen Matters
But more intentionally, i want you to be motivated to ask yourself, What can I do to be a part of something greater than just me? So,
Cody's Ministry Journey
00:01:55
NextGen Matters
Cody, tell us a little bit about yourself. Hey, Rich. Thank you so much for being on. love listening to this. And so it's kind of cool to be a part of it. I've been student ministry for 30, 31 years now Love it. Goes so fast and never really intended to be a youth pastor when I was growing up. When my wife and I started dating and then and got married, we thought we'd go into camp ministry. Gotcha. And then her church called us to come in and lead their student ministry for a little bit.
00:02:22
NextGen Matters
And that was back in 96, 97. And suddenly here we are all these years later and wouldn't have it any other way. And so we've been doing student ministry. We've done it in North Carolina and and Virginia. And you and I, you know of course, cross paths a long time ago down there, but came to Christ at Thomas Road Baptist Church when I was in high school and went to Liberty. And then after the call to ministry he was in North Carolina for a long time. And about four years ago, I got a call from Thomas Road Baptist Church that said, would you consider coming back and leading? Come on home, baby. Come home. And, i love and you know, they say you can't go home, but but we did. and And there's not a day that goes by after coming back that I don't. I don't look out of the mountains here in central Virginia and and give thanks for while just the unique opportunity that we have to do ministry in what I call my hometown. Absolutely. You played
Navigating New Roles and Events
00:03:14
NextGen Matters
high school football here. I mean, yeah I know, right? I love it. I love it.
00:03:18
NextGen Matters
So take me back a few years ago, because you've only been here at the church, like you said, less than four years, but take me back the... as we all do when we're the the new face, we're the new guy, or new guy, we step into that role in a good way. There's already this legacy that's there. There's always this, you know, s SOP is going on, operating procedures, and you got your events. You walked into a very, the episode was a very high level event because as a professor here in the same mountain, you know, I had so many of my college students that were helping at Thomas, or serving in high school ministry, going to the big event,
00:03:57
NextGen Matters
down in so down of North Carolina. right So you walked in, they got this big thing going on for what, 20 some years? Yeah, at least. At Ridgecrest, et cetera? For me, it was the first thing that I did with Thomas Rhodes students. When I came, they they invited me to come on. And I wasn't quite yet on staff, but I had already moved here. And so they said, we want you to come along and observe what we're doing. And And so we hopped on buses and and we we set off for about three and a half, four hours and went to Ridgecrest, North Carolina.
00:04:25
NextGen Matters
Amazing. Oh, yeah. Absolutely amazing. I think we had 330 students going and just a wonderful weekend away. Music. I mean, it's it's the it's the really big Disciple Now type thing. Right. But in the mountains with with the cabins and stuff. And so, yeah, they the thing was is is when you come on, there there are some things that they say we want you to evaluate and take a look at things. Right. And what can change what can't, but there's always one or two things in a ministry that go, but this is the thing that we've always done.
00:04:53
NextGen Matters
and mean, this is the baby, this is, this is the protected. And to be fair, the, the amount of work that went into it yeah and the buy-in from leaders and and from students and from families, this was, this was their getaway. This was the thing. And so, you know,
00:05:09
NextGen Matters
it It was it was great. And so we we did that. That was that was the very first thing that I did here, but it it did correlate to some things that my mind's always kind of working of of how can we take what we're doing and have a larger kingdom impact for Sure. sure
Vision for Kingdom Impact
00:05:24
NextGen Matters
Yeah. So you step in, you inherit.
00:05:28
NextGen Matters
Episode. Yes. As a standalone event where you travel a winter retreat away. yeah And that was kind of say that phrase, your Super Bowl, that was your big event of the year.
00:05:39
NextGen Matters
And yet I want our audience to know that God had already been preparing you for what we're going unpack now years ago, because here's where it starts. He has a greater vision than just how can I help my students that God has called you to shepherd rightfully. So are, we will give an account for these things.
00:05:58
NextGen Matters
But yet your heart is not just us internally, but us internally. in a larger sense. Right. Our area code here in central of Virginia is four, three, four in the four, three, four. Right. Right. Yep.
00:06:11
NextGen Matters
So you have this greater vision when you're stepping in here. Am I right? Yeah. Oh no, a hundred percent. Like I said, this, for me, this is my hometown. This is what I call home. And and I knew that being called back here, like want, I want,
00:06:28
NextGen Matters
I'm not young. I'm not spring chicken, you know, and, and so I feel like this is probably where I'm going to be planted until I'm yeah not able to do ministry anymore. and And I want these years to have the greatest impact, not only on the students that are attending Thomas row Baptist church. I want to impact them, but really want to make a mark for the gospel in this, in this community to where,
00:06:51
NextGen Matters
Where we're seeing a culture change within within schools, within homes, within in teams, much in a similar way that when Dr. Falwell started Thomas Road Baptist Church, it I mean, it was we're going to we're going to put a stake down in in this city and and we're going to claim it, but we can't.
00:07:09
NextGen Matters
For me, I went, there's no possible way that even as large as our student ministry is, we can't do it alone. Like, like right this isn't our church reaching the city. The church has to reach the city. The big C. Yeah,
Value of Church Collaborations
00:07:21
NextGen Matters
the big C. Yeah.
00:07:23
NextGen Matters
So for our our listener... Cody invites me, I don't even know what year it was, like 2010 maybe? i think it was before that. Dude, it was 2008? I think it was 2007 or 2008. I moved Seattle to Lynchburg in 03.
00:07:37
NextGen Matters
So maybe four-ish years down the road. yeah I get invited to a gathering, like a D-Now weekend. It wasn't like it was. right A retreat where yourself, our friend Dale Mason, different church, and another church were involved. yeahp I think there was three or maybe a few more. There was three main ones and then then another church kind of joined along with us. Okay. but but three of So when I'm yeah speaking at this event, uh, during the weekend and in, in a, in a smaller context, I mean, you just had a thousand this last weekend. Yeah. So I want you to, to get your head on this listener and or viewer is like, don't think a thousand think what there was maybe 80, 70, 80 max, maybe max. Uh, I, I think that in that event, I think I had 35, uh,
00:08:21
NextGen Matters
i think i had thirty five I think Dale had- And you were the mega church. Yeah, we were the big church of the group. And and so we had we we had probably 35 to 40 with us. And Dale, I think, had 20 to 25. And then the other one had 15 to 30. And what I think is cool is our friend Dale was actually a former student of mine. And when he'd come back up here to visit from Carolina, Burlington.
00:08:44
NextGen Matters
Yes. And remember, that's the Elon College right there. i Found the Starbucks next to Elon College. Because when you travel, one must find a Starbucks. right It's all about the coffee, y'all. And I loved it because Dale would come back up and visit here and he would say, hey, Richie goes, we are actually, the two of you, we're actually meeting with other ministry leaders in the area who had a heart for ministry, but maybe didn't have the educational side. And you were like, how can we help not berate them or look down on them, but how to help in a healthy way, come alongside, coach them up.
00:09:15
NextGen Matters
And you actually started my my old class back in the day Youth 460 and the programming side of ministry. And you said the 460 project. yeah And I think that is such a cool story. Yeah. So we, we, Dale and I actually met in in a school campus ministry, you know, yeah we, we, we sat down in the, at a lunch table, same lunch table and looked across each other. And I was like, you're too old to be a high schooler. And he's like, look at you.
00:09:40
NextGen Matters
And, and we realized that we were both student pastors. His kids look. Yeah. Right. His kids were sitting right there and my kids were sitting right there. And we were, know, that's one of those things you go, they're all hanging out together.
00:09:52
NextGen Matters
all all They might go to my church. Wait, wait, you didn't even know each other? No, we had never met. That's the first you was the first we met was was in school. i didn't know that And him and I just talked that whole lunch period just about, we were lonely yeah in ministry. And and in in the year at that point, I'd been in ministry when I met him. I'd been in ministry probably about seven years. And I'd never really had a relationship with another youth pastor.
00:10:16
NextGen Matters
And so him and I decided we we decided to go out and eat and talk. And we realized Liberty University. You both went to the same school, same school, same classes, same. We learned how to do ministry the same. And so we decided to start having coffee together on a regular basis. And we we both committed. Hey, let's let's try and see if anybody else is like us love it around here. And after a while, we had about, I'd say, 10 to 12 guys that would semi regularly all meet at this little coffee shop in Burlington. And they they started asking questions. How do you guys plan? How do you guys do these things? We started just showing them the 460 project and all of these things. And they said, could you teach us how to do that?
00:10:54
NextGen Matters
So we started doing getaways where we would we would, in the spring, go and plan our plan our year plan our calendar year of what we're going to teach and the retreats that we're going to do. We put together ministry calendar.
00:11:06
NextGen Matters
and And we help them do that as well, because what i I mean, what I've been taught and what I've learned experientially is that the the better that student ministries are citywide, the better my student ministry is going to be that that when we can encourage and and empower other student ministries to be effective at at reaching students, the the culture within the schools and the culture of the schools is going to be one in which student ministry is important.
00:11:35
NextGen Matters
and And we found that to be true.
Success of Collaborative Events
00:11:37
NextGen Matters
And so out of that, we kind of, all of us kind of wanted to do a winter retreat or something. And and we said, Hey, why don't we, don't we just do one together? Because if it's one thing, if I have 30, 35 kids and I do a D now yeah with them versus If I have 100 kids and it's not it wasn't just about numbers, but suddenly we were like, these guys do life together in schools. And what if we got them together one week of year and we worship together, we learn together and then we say. go reach your city, go reach your school together.
00:12:07
NextGen Matters
And then they wore their shirts to school and they were like, Oh, we you you know, we all went to the same thing. And it was, it was a neat testimony to the, to the culture around them that you guys don't go to the same church, but you did the same. You actually like each you actually like each other. So we, we just that kind of started having this culture of, of working together. We, we had our own mission, our own churches and things that we were part of. Yeah. But In reality, was neat when a kid walked in and said, Hey, I go to Altamont Hall. I'm like, Dale is my dude. You know, he's a great youth pastor and we can encourage each other. was really neat. Wow.
00:12:41
NextGen Matters
wow And then the Lord took you from that part of North Carolina down to the Charlotte area to Estonia. And then you and I are still staying in connection as you're coming up, the seeing us in in the youth men office, et cetera. And I'm hearing from you. Had you speak in my classes, yep hearing from you, like what God was doing. Now it's to the next level. Now it's a bigger scale. Go there. So arriving in Gastonia, North Carolina, it's just to the west of Charlotte. new caraines right the's It's just north of Carowinds. Where I lived, you could walk up on that this hill and you could see the skyline of Charlotte. So I always tell people that that my distance was I could get done at church on Sunday, high five everybody, clean up, lock the door, and I could be in the Carolina Panthers stadium listening to the national anthem with no problem. So it was close enough, but it was far enough. But arriving in in Gastonia, there there was an event that had begun. It was called 180 Weekend. And there there was a framework of two or three churches that had started doing this and invited smaller churches to be a part of their thing.
00:13:46
NextGen Matters
and And so that was one of the things they said, you can come as you're coming to be a part, but this is something that can't die. Like this is this is a good thing. And I said, I've heard that before. And so when when we started doing 180 Weekend, it very quickly took on the same framework in which I started being able to have relationships with youth pastors in the community. We prayed for each other. We did ministry on campuses together. We'd see each other at football games together. But really started help develop. You know, we don't want...
00:14:22
NextGen Matters
churches to come to our thing. We don't want to do, hey, we're the biggest churches in the community. We'll we'll do this big thing. And if they want to attend with us, they can. it was... We want something that every church has skin in the game. This is this is their event as much as it is our event. And it was hosted at our church. It was actually in that that community, our church and one up the road.
00:14:43
NextGen Matters
They were the two biggest churches and and it was it became so big that it it couldn't be hosted at one or the other. So we had two locations. So we we would bring in two speakers and two bands and people would register. And and we tried to figure out a way to...
00:15:00
NextGen Matters
equally distribute who which kids go which place. Some years we do middle school is at one campus. yeah High school was at the other. Eventually it became it it just kind of morphed into some churches just like being at one campus and and the other. But we still same devotional. Same weekend or not? Same weekend. It was it was considered one event and we would do things like we would do a missions offering where it was kind of the competition of did Parkwood's campus or did City Church's campus raise more than than the other. But we would have we would have live look-ins to the other campus. Just to say we're still all same t-shirts, same devotional material.
00:15:42
NextGen Matters
we We talk with the speakers and say, this is the direction you're going to speak towards. But it's still, it became, when I left Charlotte, by the time that i was I was done in my time down there,
00:15:53
NextGen Matters
uh we had an average of about 30 to 32 churches wow that would would attend in over a five-year period we'd have 50 churches all from the gaston county area yeah so from right from you know ground zero where it was taking place max distance was 15 miles the further church away yeah and it wasn't all one denomination uh in fact I think there was, I hate to say it on a next gen pocket, but it was six or seven denominations. Say it. I'm in a non-denomptuous. Well, I'm saying the six, seven, you know, Oh, Oh, the six, seven, six, seven. But, but yeah, hopefully when you see this like a year from now, that'll be history. It's done.
00:16:36
NextGen Matters
But it, but that was neat. We, we, as a, as a group recognize that there are our core elements that bind us all together, that, We never in 180 Weekend in the combined event, we never talked about modes of baptism. We never talked about things that that you know one church may practice differently than another. We focused in on the core doctrines of the faith. And there was a trust that developed.
00:16:58
NextGen Matters
A lot of these guys would meet together and and help pray over the next direction for the for the next year's event. Wow. And then there was there was several churches that said we'll carry the weight of putting the the thing together.
Logistics of Large-Scale Events
00:17:11
NextGen Matters
It was it was on our campus. So we recognize, you know, we have this gift. So that is some heavy lifting and some of the logistics. They did that. You know, they they we we always tried to make sure that it It was hosted at our campus. I didn't want to be the emcee up on the stage the whole time. I get that. I appreciate that. Yeah. we we didn't We never allowed local bands like our local worship teams to be the worship for the for the weekend. Right. We'd bring somebody in so that there was this... Kind neutral? Yes. It was kind of a neutral, things that we trusted, but we we weren't saying, hey...
00:17:47
NextGen Matters
We know that you go to that church, but if you come to our church, this is what you're going hear every week. you know it was It was legitimately, we're all experiencing something new, large and small. The way that we would have students come up, we'd just try and incorporate every church into some part of the life of the event. So that that if you had six kids come or if you had 100 kids come. From different ministries. From different ministries. You would see your students, your youth pastors, somebody leading at some point in the weekend.
00:18:18
NextGen Matters
So now you leave that. You come back to your home church. Yes. Which now this is all going connect. yeah We're circling back here this. So now Cody gets here four years ago and they have that.
00:18:33
NextGen Matters
single single church event. And in your mind, you're already thinking, dude. So we could do, i hate to say it, but I'll say Gastonia's experience. We could do that in the LYH. Yes.
00:18:47
NextGen Matters
To say that I didn't think that would be dishonest, of course, I came back. yeah But there's a lot of things, Rich, that underlie that. the Because one of the greatest gifts coming out of this type of thinking that helped me get to 31 years in student ministry is the relationships that were developed of day in day. It wasn't just about planning an event.
00:19:08
NextGen Matters
for the year. It was, i know i know these people each and every week. I pray for these these other ministries. and I know the ins and outs of them because we we celebrate, we we pray for, we cry with, we do we do ministry together in this community.
00:19:25
NextGen Matters
And so when I came back to Lynchburg, the first thing that I looked for is is community amongst student ministry.
Building Community Among Ministries
00:19:35
NextGen Matters
And i didn't I didn't find much i know right away.
00:19:39
NextGen Matters
It's considered over 400 churches in our greater area. And this city is maybe just over 100,000. When you throw in, i don't want to say suburbs, when you throw in our immediate neighborhoods, we're about a quarter million now. But still, we have about 400 churches.
00:19:53
NextGen Matters
That could be like my son had my oldest son has a church of 10 that meets downtown Lynchburg. Right. To Thomas Row and some others. We've got, what, six or seven churches over 1,000? Yeah. I mean, so for this smaller city,
00:20:04
NextGen Matters
There's a lot of church going, but doesn't mean we all there. I did not connect with a a lot of community within student ministry. Unfortunately, there can be distrust. or always new faces. And there's a lot of, wed i would love to take in that conversation another time, honestly. Why? Why the distrust? Sometimes it's leadership above us. no Because I remember that my day.
00:20:26
NextGen Matters
What we just experienced, my wife and I were sharing about this. I was not allowed to do that. right Because there was a fear of my lead pastor. Like, are your kids made go our kids may go to that church. So the protectionism, yeah isolationism. So all that to say, you get here and you're thinking,
00:20:43
NextGen Matters
So you did two episodes as normal for well, I did the one that I viewed like I came in and then I was going to North Carolina, and North Carolina. And then I did two more where I i helped lead the trip to North Carolina. okay Okay. So I did three down in there. I see. Okay. All the while, but by the time we did the second one, Derek Idle, who oversees all of student ministries here said, Hey, he actually spoke at 180 weekend down and in are in Charlotte, he said, I really think that if you could do, if you could help lead that here, because I think it would win.
00:21:18
NextGen Matters
But you're the new guy in the area. You don't, i know you don't come and say, Hey, we're going to blow up the the thing that is probably the most cherished of all. But we did begin the conversation and the conversation to make that change. Very wise, very wise. Don't blow it up.
00:21:35
NextGen Matters
The conversation internally to make that change was probably two years. Okay. one person at a time, casting vision, that it's more than just about building the vent. We as a ministry have been called to reach the students of this certain community, the surrounding area. And so we've we've got to do something that even goes outside of if we reached every student that we're capable of doing, there's still probably 20,000 students that need to be reached, you know? And and so we we need to help other churches come along to do that. And so then it was reaching out like drawing circles and saying, I'm going to talk to everybody within this this radius from this church. I'm going to find every youth pastor and I'm just going get to know them.
00:22:18
NextGen Matters
And then I drew a larger circle and then a larger circle. And just started kind of casting a vision for that and started getting, hey, we would be we'd be interested because everybody has their thing.
00:22:29
NextGen Matters
Everybody has their winter retreat. And so it's not just, oh, that'd be cool to go to. It's also if we're going to do that, what are we giving up? Because everybody's probably going to have to give up something in order to do this kind of a partnership.
00:22:43
NextGen Matters
But yeah, then at the after our episode 2024, when we started looking towards 2025, it took a while, even within the church here, to to get to go ahead of, let's move it from the mountains of North Carolina here.
00:23:00
NextGen Matters
It also changed the cost structure. It was 25% of the cost for a student to attend now than it was down there. is it was close to $200 to go to North Carolina. And we said, i i said, I think we can do it for $50 a kid here. yeah Well, I'm a dad, but ill and my teenagers are no longer teenagers. They're adults. But my youngest, if you watched last week, you met Ryan.
00:23:25
NextGen Matters
What Cody's explaining is he just went through as the brand new student pastor this last year was because we would go up to a great camp an hour north. I was there last year as a volunteer.
00:23:36
NextGen Matters
And yet the price would be what it is. I'm not going to say it. I can say where I love the camp. I'm a super fan of this yeah camp. I mean i'm really mean, they're good, godly people. But Ryan's realizing, want him to meet you, and he met you. You guys connected right away. right away. And for $50, $50, our students could go. And yet, he met resistance. yeah even He's still meeting a little bit.
00:24:00
NextGen Matters
But they, oh, taste and see that the Lord is good. Oh, taste and see the episode was good, right? So you've only done this now two years. That's right. This is, this, 2026 was our second local event. Wow.
00:24:13
NextGen Matters
Let me tell you what I saw. Okay. Let me, y'all watching this game. Let me tell you what I saw. Yes. Cody was on the stage. No, not a lot. Yes, he's the host. Let me say he's the host student pastor.
00:24:27
NextGen Matters
So yes, he is. And I think that's good. Yes, he does show his presence. But he had two other young adults who were actually running the games, the the big hype stuff, the color war idea, yeah you know, which really then because all the churches were in specific colors, if you will, teams. So now like our church has two or three your churches with us, I think, but two or three other churches are involved in the same team.
00:24:52
NextGen Matters
They're watching on the stage. They have a Liberty's campus band, which is top, top campus band was there to lead worship. So, yes, at different times, there is different people on the stage. Cody was one of those.
00:25:05
NextGen Matters
But he just handled himself so humbly. i mean, it wasn't like, you know, thumping the chest. This is my thing. Just the opposite. One thing I wrote many, but one thing I really resonated right away, I noticed you had a student come up Friday night session to lead scripture, to read, to read in scripture.
00:25:23
NextGen Matters
And on the screen was that student's name and their local church. yeah In other words, and then one of the students from our church, thanks very for asking. but But we had, he had different people from different churches.
00:25:35
NextGen Matters
By the time it taps out closing gathering time, You brought up every key adult leader. Not all of us. I'm a volunteer, but not all of us. But the key adult leader, student, pastor, whomever, from each of those 15 churches, side by side across, to say it was a literal a latitude of ministry. yeah It wasn't a hierarchy up to down. It was sideways. right It was left to right, right to left. Another thing I noticed, your your middle school pastor had on that morning of Saturday, said, I want for prayer time. I want you to get with someone near you and pray for another church.
00:26:11
NextGen Matters
I love that. And I specifically thought of a church here in town and their youth pastor is a former college student of mine. And I prayed for him and for their ministry. i don't know. And I text and said, dude, I just prayed for you. He's like, thanks, man. I mean, i love that. right You created that we, not me. right It's not Thomas Rowe. It's we. It's us. It's the body of Christ. I just want say, thank you so much. Now, we got our coffee mugs. If you're watching, you got, this is, a yeah he's got the cool hat on too, episode coffee mug.
00:26:42
NextGen Matters
Oh, he's really rocking it. I'm merged up. Cody, you got coffee now with, you got a youth worker. You're right now we're role playing. You got a coffee. So if y'all got your coffee drinking now, Cody, you got, you got some time here.
00:26:55
NextGen Matters
Take about five minutes and give three to five, like talking points of what could a, what could a leader do to move in this direction? So without question, as I've said, I mean, we we kind of talked through it this whole time that the very genesis of all this is relationship. I would say first and foremost, if I'm sitting across with somebody, say, do you have relationship with other student ministries in the community?
00:27:21
NextGen Matters
I'll be honest with you. I receive emails and sometimes postcards from ministries in our area that say, we want your students to come to our thing. We would love to partner together, but... What they're asking is we want your students to to help boost our numbers at our at our event. yeah I don't know them.
00:27:38
NextGen Matters
don't know their church. I don't have a trust level with them. right And so I'm not likely to participate. right Where these types of things grow and flourish and make an impact in the community is when you really put in the work of saying part of me reaching this community is knowing who else is doing it. and I'm going to pray for the churches up the road, I'm not going to have a suspicion of them. I'm not going to think things about them. I'm not going to hear things, you know whisperings about them. I'm going to know who's doing ministry, and I'm going to pray for them.
00:28:08
NextGen Matters
And so for me, it would I would say you've got to find those people. And there's a lot of people doing ministry in your community, and you're not going to know everybody but know somebody.
00:28:19
NextGen Matters
And then begin praying. It may not be an event that looks like episode. It may be a missions project. It may be a a missions trip that you do together. And then it may, it might be something like this. It could be a fifth quarter. It could be the way that that you you serve a local football team, that the high school's in between your two churches, something where you go.
00:28:41
NextGen Matters
we could do this better together than we can apart. And and it doesn't compromise your your autonomy as a church. And your uniqueness. Your uniqueness. But what it does do is it multiplies, the I believe, the effectiveness of ministry. So I would say All of this starts. Step one, find your people. Find your people. And then together say, what do we do really well? What could we do well together? yeah And then it don't it doesn't have to be the next big thing. right
00:29:15
NextGen Matters
It literally can be something that that is small, unique, but together. And maybe it grows to something that numerically is a big thing, but the impact happens, I believe, when when we are encouraging and praying and loving on each other.
Collaboration for Longevity and Trust
00:29:31
NextGen Matters
I think one of the bigger things that comes out of this is it helps develop longevity in ministry, a trust amongst churches. I see it amongst the leaders of our churches as they start talking about what the student ministries are doing together, that that the church is joining hands together.
00:29:47
NextGen Matters
And, uh, is one of the great wins of that. So not necessarily looking and saying, how how can we as two or three smaller churches put a thousand kid right event on?
00:29:58
NextGen Matters
Don't look to that. No, don't. just say And that's not even fair to, I mean, it may appear not even fair to start there. That's why I mentioned right when you first brought me in. That first church, we wouldn't have had the capacity. it was I didn't have the leadership capacity at that point ministry.
00:30:14
NextGen Matters
to to lead an event that would draw 14, 15 churches together and a thousand kids. At that point, it would have been a disaster. But slowly God built that within me through continuing to love and partner and and see how these things work to where now I can't imagine doing ministry.
00:30:34
NextGen Matters
without reaching out and partnering and knowing what the other ministries in our community are doing and seeing them pop up on social media and not going, man, they did that better than us. I go, man, congratulations. That's awesome. You know, and and praying for them and loving them and encouraging them.
00:30:49
NextGen Matters
It's beautiful. It's beautiful. Is there anything else that you could like kind as we put this to a close? Is there anything that you'd like to speak into to encourage a leader, whether they're feeling alone Whether they're feeling hey, I tried that and I got burned, maybe stuck.
00:31:08
NextGen Matters
Or maybe if they're they're already doing it well. So there's three different lanes there I gave you. But is there anything you'd like to to kind of lead the audience with? How to encourage them to have that, what I call the power of shared ministry efforts. And I love how you framed it. It could be an evangelistic event. This is more of a a growth level event. This is more like the D-Now concept.
00:31:29
NextGen Matters
It could be a serving event, a local campus, I mean, physical, middle school, high school campus, and what can you beautify that campus? There's all different looks like could that could happen, but shared ministry efforts. so Don't quit.
00:31:46
NextGen Matters
like And what I mean by don't quit is if you're feeling alone, like I did that for seven years, and I didn't really know that I felt alone until I started. started really saying, I don't know how much longer I can go on. yeah And then just, and then the Lord brought Dale at just the real moment. But it was after I had begun to say, how do I do this? And I began to seek the Lord and say, I need, i need help. And And we're all in need of community. We're going to teach our students. if you're If you're in student ministry, I pray that you're teaching students that this Christian life is meant to be done in community. And we're teaching them to be in groups and we're teaching them to learn scripture in groups. Guess what?
00:32:27
NextGen Matters
Ministry should be done in community. We should we should know others and and be encouraged by others. it's hard to have conversation with those that are not in ministry about the the stresses and the struggle that you're you're facing. So you need people in your life. And if you don't have it, seek it, pray for it, look for it. And and I'm telling you, Rich, i I pulled up Google Maps and put churches near me and I zoomed in and and i I circled one mile radius.
00:32:54
NextGen Matters
And every church, whether it looked like a church that I would naturally resonate with or not, I've learned to not... limit to that. okay I just reached out said, hey, who's doing student ministry? and you're Would they like the for me to buy them a coffee? and Then the Lord will provide that that community. If you're doing it well, teach others to do it well.
00:33:14
NextGen Matters
I think that that when when you have found that lane in which ministry is flowing and you're you're good at at leading a ministry, there are 10 student ministers that are struggling for air right around you.
00:33:30
NextGen Matters
it's not sufficient just to do ministry well in your context. We need to be helping elevate the the leadership of of young ministry. A lot of reasons I believe youth pastors leave the church and leave ministry is because they've not been discipled to do it well. And they have great passion and a great heart to see students, one, but there's a lot more than just having that great passion and great heart you've got to administrate you've got to you've got to communicate you've got to be a parent advocate there's so many things that you have to do that to have you as somebody who's doing a welcome alongside and say let me walk with you yeah breath of fresh air for me yeah and when that happened episode 10 i really hit this strong that was all emphasis of episode 10 was on how we we need each other
00:34:19
NextGen Matters
yeah My mind just went to Elijah, the prophet. He gets done doing his thing there on Mount Carmel. And then it goes into that what I call the money morning mode, yeah where it's like after a Sunday, you're just drained, you're tired. I want to quit, right? And it's like, oh, poor me, woe is me. I'm doing this all by myself. And the Lord reminds him, how many prophets the Lord said, I still have?
00:34:40
NextGen Matters
You're not alone. right But he was feeling alone because he was doing it alone. And then Elisha comes in.
00:34:49
NextGen Matters
Moses had Joshua. Who did Joshua have? That's not trick question. I want you to think about that in the audience. Joshua did not.
00:35:00
NextGen Matters
He did not. He did not pour himself into another leader. And was a great dude. i mean, great, righteous and godly leader. Fantastic leader. But where the failure took place, he did not bring in to his life another protege, if you will.
00:35:16
NextGen Matters
And then, of course, one of the most... Hard verses to read in scripture is Judges 2.10. And I say it a lot on this podcast. And there was a next generation that did not know God, nor the things that God had done. Because Joshua did not resonate with a younger leader. So, hey, if you're a younger leader and you're like, where do I go? That's why we're doing this podcast. That's why God put Next Gen Matters on my heart. Reach out to Cody. please He loves. He does. he He's proved it.
00:35:41
NextGen Matters
He's got skin in the game. Anyway, I'd say with it just about every day, at least two or three times a week, I have a young leader reach out and say, can you help me with this next step? I'm struggling to get through. beautiful And at this point in my life, I really feel that that's that's what I'm called to. And so as much as I'm helping to lead our ministry, if I can help, I'd love to.
00:36:01
NextGen Matters
It's cool. So what you just heard today is more than just a story of a successful event.
Kingdom Impact Over Personal Credit
00:36:07
NextGen Matters
It's a story of a surrendered vision. Cody didn't build episode to make a name for himself or even his own church.
00:36:15
NextGen Matters
but he opened up his hands, he widened his circle, and he invited the body of Christ into greater Lynchburg, Virginia to move as opposed to just being separate youth ministries while we do our ministry separate to at least once in the year to come together as one big C church.
00:36:34
NextGen Matters
So when leaders choose kingdom over credit, God does what only God can do. Students heard the gospel. We had responses to the gospel.
00:36:44
NextGen Matters
We have, I mean, most of our students were already saved believers, followers of Jesus, but they were deepened in their walk. Churches linked arms. And a city catches a glimpse of who Jesus really is.
00:36:56
NextGen Matters
So as you walk away from this conversation that I had with Cody, don't just celebrate what God did through this ministry here. Ask yourself, what could happen where you are?
00:37:08
NextGen Matters
What dream or what event or what ministry, what opportunity might God be asking you to open up for the sake of something greater than you? Because when we surrender our plans to his kingdom, we don't lose anything.
00:37:24
NextGen Matters
We gain a front row seat to his glory. And that's why this matters. And that's why your leadership matters. And that's why this next generation matters. And that's why the gospel matters. Cody, you got the call to action. ye One or two action steps a leader could do today, tomorrow.
00:37:45
NextGen Matters
24 hours, baby. Right. 24 hours. I'm telling you, grab a coffee mug, find a coffee shop and send out 10 emails today to to churches that you probably already know about of somebody that's doing it well and somebody that you can maybe lead and just say, let's go grab a coffee. I want to see what's going on in your ministry and then sit and listen. Sometimes when you listen, you realize I'm not alone.
00:38:10
NextGen Matters
So get and get to know somebody. But i would I would say start with 10 outreaches. Reach out to 10. You may get two or three. That's right. yeah Yeah. Don't, don't try and get 10 people together. If you get two people that respond, you're going blessed. Oh yeah.
00:38:24
NextGen Matters
Yeah. Trip Lee was our speaker. He was good job getting him, man. hey That's a God thing, man. It was, what he he did a air quote show Friday night, but he came to preach he did and he exegetically taught the word of God. Yeah.
00:38:37
NextGen Matters
His last session was on James chapter one. He quick to listen, slow to speak. So youth worker, we're all a bunch of alphas. I get it. And we all need to learn that verse. I'm raising my hand.
00:38:48
NextGen Matters
The Lord's been hitting hard with this. Learn to just shut up and listen. Ask them how they're doing. That's right. And you're going to build a trusted relationship. So we're going to pull this together now. Thanks for joining me today on the Next Gen Matters podcast. Remember, if you've been ministered to, I love hearing from you. Email me, richandnextgenmatters.com. Some of you actually have my personal phone number.
00:39:10
NextGen Matters
Text me. I want to hear from you. Drop a comment in the comment box. Also, if you have not yet subscribed to the podcast, please do so. Follow us. We're on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and YouTube. And YouTube, by the way, is screaming right now. it's crazy getting all kinds of hits on this thing. So if you're not getting my Thursday Tools email, please get that. Always check the clutter box. Sometimes it gets moved to the clutter email. Even I, we're like, where'd mine go? I get my own email. Where'd it go? It's in the clutter. So always check the clutter on the link to that subscription is also there below.
00:39:42
NextGen Matters
Cody, you, this is This has been so fun. You you have been such a refreshment to me over all the time I've known you. Every time we're together, you you cheer me up. He's a big cheer wine fan Carolina. That's right. But he does, er pun intended, but does cheer me up so much. So, hey, until next time, let's do this together. ready? Your leadership matters because your ministry matters because the gospel matters. Booyah! Let's go!