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The Evil of Stephen Seddon
57 Plays7 months ago
A loving couple care for a disabled grandson after his mother dies. Their remaining son sees them as a cash cow, even after they bail him out of jail and buy him a house and give him spending money....BTW the son is in his forties. Unbelievable greed that just keeps on growing, until his parents are dead.
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Transcript
Introduction to 'Hearth, Home, and Homicide'
00:00:21
bclawson
Hello listeners, this is Bridget.
00:00:24
Caroline
and I'm Caroline.
00:00:26
bclawson
You are listening to Hearth, Home, and Homicide, a family production about family murders. Caroline and I narrate each story, and Andy is our producer.
Sensitivity and Listener Discretion
00:00:40
bclawson
As Caroline and I talk about each family murder, we're not only keen on watching justice unfold for the killer, whatever that may look like, And especially, we keep sensitivity for victims and their family in top of mind. So our podcasts do include violence and trauma. Listener discretion is advised.
Reflections on Aging and Happiness
00:01:06
bclawson
So, hey, Caroline, how you doing?
00:01:09
Caroline
I'm doing pretty good. How are how are you?
00:01:13
bclawson
I'm doing good. You know, it's You know, it's fall and i don't I don't like winter that much because I have slip and fall fears now that I'm in my seventies, almost. We'll say I'm not 50 anymore. We'll just put it like that. um that's an That's big. That's a huge gulf I just described.
00:01:37
bclawson
shit ah you
00:01:38
Caroline
It's a good one though. It's a good gulp.
00:01:39
bclawson
yeah but We're fine. You know, I still have the same goals I ever had and that is, you know, okay. I used to be more achievement-oriented, to be honest, um and career-minded, obviously.
00:01:52
Caroline
yeah
00:01:57
bclawson
Nowadays, it's more like, okay, that did not make me happy. I'm going to strike that off my list of things to do. What else is on my happy list?
Managing Family Happiness and Worries
00:02:07
bclawson
I just try, I want to be happy, and I still look for ways to contribute.
00:02:07
Caroline
Oh, I love it.
00:02:12
bclawson
but um It's a different vibe.
00:02:17
Caroline
Yeah, as it should be.
00:02:17
bclawson
It's also kind of a, yeah. And I just enjoy my family more than anything else.
00:02:20
Caroline
I mean.
00:02:24
bclawson
And, you know, I understand why people periodically just get so mad at their family because because you need them so much and you love them so much. And that makes you mad because life would be a lot easier if all you had to do is make yourself happy.
00:02:38
bclawson
But that's not all you I have to do.
00:02:38
Caroline
Oh my goodness, yes.
00:02:40
bclawson
Everybody in my family needs to be happy for me to be happy, you know?
00:02:43
Caroline
Me too. Honestly, you used to say to this to me, and I think it's the truest thing about me is, um well, if you didn't find something to worry about, you just wouldn't be happy.
00:02:54
Caroline
And that's true about me. I enjoy the worry, the worry about what's happening, what's not happening, what's potential. I worry about it all, but you know, at the same time, like I am striving to stop doing that.
00:03:09
Caroline
And I'm, it's helpful because my daughter is in this place where I'm starting to kind of ask her now too, because she's wonder where she got it doing the
Learning from Life Phases and Prioritizing Happiness
00:03:18
Caroline
same thing. And so I say to her, well, is that something we have control over?
00:03:23
Caroline
And that's helped me even just asking her that is like, okay, well, we're worrying about it.
00:03:27
bclawson
Yeah.
00:03:28
Caroline
And we're acknowledging that. Is it something within our control? Because if not, let's stop putting our energy and worrying about it, because Is it, it's not in our control.
00:03:36
bclawson
Or prepare, spending some time to prepare for this thing that's going to happen, whether we want it to or not.
00:03:39
Caroline
Yeah.
00:03:42
Caroline
Exactly. But it's, yeah, I think it's normal to, um, go through all those phases of life. And I'm actually really quite happy that you're in this. You know, does it make me happy face? Cause you can pass that valid and and important information onto us younger generations.
00:04:00
bclawson
There you go. It's it's not a chip in the brain. It's like a choice in the brain. And it is not easy. And it's ah like a daily thing where I will just let's take ah let's take what I'm going to eat that day.
Health Awareness and Staying Grounded
00:04:15
bclawson
You know, I'll tell you I've got a big long list of what I would like to eat.
00:04:15
Caroline
Yeah.
00:04:19
bclawson
And then I've got a very small list of what I ought to eat and And it's very, and ah the older I get, the more I really have to pay attention to, I am what I eat kind of thing.
00:04:31
Caroline
yeah
00:04:32
bclawson
And so um does it help me to think about all those foods out there that if I ate them, I would be going into a rabbit hole of eating that for a long, long time before I came back out?
00:04:44
Caroline
Oh, I, I'm in a rabbit hole.
00:04:45
bclawson
So, I mean, you know, yeah, yeah okay, I get it.
00:04:48
Caroline
I just ate a whole bunch of chocolate all week.
00:04:51
bclawson
And then, you know, I'm oversimplifying because a lot of things in life cannot be found at the grocery store.
00:04:58
Caroline
Yeah.
00:04:58
bclawson
And you you just, you know, I don't know. I want to be plugged into the real world. I do.
The Tragic Murder of Pat and Bob Seddon
00:05:05
Caroline
Yeah.
00:05:06
bclawson
There's another part of me that wants to just say, you know, just stay in your own lane, Bridget. Just stay in your own lane.
00:05:11
Caroline
Yeah.
00:05:12
bclawson
And I have two dogs to worry about.
00:05:12
Caroline
Yeah.
00:05:14
bclawson
So anyway, today's episode is about, um, two wonderful people, and I mean that. I am so mad at the killer today.
00:05:28
bclawson
just I'm so mad at him because his parents were just that silent majority of of good parents, loving people,
00:05:37
Caroline
Yeah, yep.
00:05:43
bclawson
great neighbors, contributing members of society, healthy, happy, caring.
00:05:45
Caroline
Yeah.
00:05:51
bclawson
I could just go on and on and on. And their son, their adult son, I'll put the word adult in quotes because emotionally he definitely never reached adulthood.
00:06:04
bclawson
He just wants what he wants when he wants. And you and I were talking about, is that because he's a narcissist or is that because he learned the wrong habits or what.
00:06:15
bclawson
So we're going to get into it.
00:06:15
Caroline
Right.
00:06:17
bclawson
We're going to be in a sweet village outside of Manchester, England, where an elderly, kind, generous, retired couple named Seddon were loved and cared for by their family, by their community, by everybody who met them.
00:06:33
bclawson
They were generous, warm. They kept their house and garden with enormous pride. They had been married for over 40 years, always lived in their neighborhood where they retired, enjoyed a cozy life, loving on their family and their friends. And there are millions and millions and millions of families like that all over the world, hardworking, struggling, surviving, loving their lifetime of family and friends, modest, generous, and kind. The last thing such people expect is deep, dark betrayal that a family murder entails. Stephen Seddon, their son, who they spent a lifetime loving and supporting, and we might say spoiling, but I'm not going to put it on them. They were loving and they're supporting. They're going to be murdered by him. And it just, as I said, it just
00:07:34
bclawson
yeah It always infuriates me, but today it's just very intense. So let's get into this couple and this family. Pat and Bob Seddon.
Family Dynamics and Challenges
00:07:46
bclawson
In 1965, Robert and Pat fell in love and got married. ah he I think he went by Bob to his friends and family. um But, you know,
00:08:02
bclawson
ah I call him Pat, I call him Bob sometimes, I call him Robert sometimes, so bear with me. It's the same guy. About seven months later, they had their first son and they named him Stephen, or Stephen. He was the center of their universe. A year later, they had their daughter, Leslie, and life was so fun, so good, so rich. It was just great.
00:08:26
bclawson
I mean, you know, you remember Caroline when you had Luke and then you had Lily and you just think like, and my ah my heart is so full.
00:08:35
Caroline
Well, yeah, you kind of want it. There's moments where you're just like, okay, snapshot, I'll just stay here forever.
00:08:41
bclawson
Absolutely. Absolutely. Or if you're in the time machine that I'm in, it'd be, I want to go back. I want to go back.
00:08:47
Caroline
um Yeah.
00:08:48
bclawson
um Thank goodness for cameras. Anyway, Stephen was as sweet a baby as you could ever hope, a sweet toddler, just a good boy in school when he was young, um just the same as millions and millions and millions of little boys all around the world. The couple worked hard all their lives. Bob was an engineer with British Airways.
00:09:14
bclawson
And ah Pat worked as a cleaner. So I think she contracted her services out or she may have worked for some government offices cause she wound up with a pension. They couldn't have foreseen the sadness and loss that their future held. Thank God. Their daughter, Leslie was healthy and happy. But then end after she got a few years old, she became weak and quite ill and she was diagnosed with epilepsy.
00:09:43
bclawson
and she had a very serious condition and, ah you know, everything changed for Robert, Pat and their son, Steven, everything. Everything was suddenly centered around keeping Leslie healthy and alive and tending to her when she experienced seizures.
Stephen's Descent into Crime
00:10:06
bclawson
So can you imagine all the different doctor's appointments, all the different medications,
00:10:11
bclawson
the school, you know, and what you had to go through there.
00:10:12
Caroline
well and seizures, seizures, they're not like, that's a traumatic event. I mean, if that's not something that's normally in your world and then it's your child, like that's this is happening to.
00:10:27
Caroline
So there's a lot more packed into this than I think what we would even see on the surface of like, OK, everything changes and now you have this permanent sort of health care vein in your life with your child.
00:10:27
bclawson
Right.
00:10:39
Caroline
But then there's the trauma of these episodes like this is all very heightened, you know, I would assume.
00:10:41
bclawson
Right.
00:10:45
bclawson
Right. No, you're you're absolutely right because her condition was very severe. And um all the family energy, as I said, went into keeping her safe. That's a big issue with people who have ah seizure disorders. And hers was epilepsy. They have to make sure that she's always safe. I mean, even when they can't be around her.
00:11:10
bclawson
taking her to medical appointments, adjusting her medications and so forth. I mean, I'm sure it was very, very difficult for the parents. The way that Stephen handled it started when he was about 12.
00:11:25
bclawson
He began stealing and burglaring and even wound up in detention. And then he one time went to jail.
00:11:33
Caroline
Mm.
00:11:34
bclawson
His parents supported him, of course, they probably felt guilty or, you know, Maybe he gave him a mouthful of, you love like you love my sister better than you love me.
00:11:44
bclawson
You love Leslie more than me. I don't know. But they they supported him with money, bail, a home, and unconditional love every time this happened.
00:11:56
bclawson
They understood that he was acting out for attention, that he was not getting at home. So what did he do? He went and joined another family, called a bunch of thugs, or maybe even a
00:12:06
Caroline
I.
00:12:07
bclawson
a um clan, you know, a ah club.
00:12:10
Caroline
A gang.
00:12:12
bclawson
What?
00:12:13
Caroline
A gang, a gang.
00:12:14
bclawson
Thank you for finding that word for me that a gang is it's always something that I think of as as the gangs I grew up with were Hell's Angels.
00:12:16
Caroline
Yeah. yes
00:12:22
Caroline
You're right. It's typically a negative connotation. A gang is it's just short of a riot.
00:12:28
bclawson
Yeah.
00:12:31
bclawson
Always.
00:12:32
Caroline
Right. I mean.
00:12:32
bclawson
Yeah.
00:12:33
Caroline
me
00:12:33
bclawson
Yeah. So anyway, they did everything they could to support him and help him. when he got into trouble. They paid his lawyers. They paid his bail. Everything and anything, they would do it.
00:12:47
bclawson
In my opinion, it is possible that they realized that he was starving for attention after Leslie became so ill. But did they ever think that maybe he was born to be bad?
00:13:01
bclawson
I don't know.
00:13:01
Caroline
Well, I have to wonder. Like, why wasn't the response to, like,
Fraudulent Lifestyle and Conviction
00:13:06
Caroline
who are his friends? What's his daily activity like? Is this a matter of keeping his schedule more busy so he doesn't have time to think about these, you know, little tricks he can play and rob and, you know, creative?
00:13:19
Caroline
Because I mean, criminal behavior has a creative element. So maybe when he's young, you capture and redirect it.
00:13:25
bclawson
Yes.
00:13:28
Caroline
I don't know.
00:13:28
bclawson
Yes.
00:13:28
Caroline
I actually don't know how the psychology behind criminality works. However, you know I do think it's not good to just ignore it and and sort of put the bandaid on as things arise, better to sort of head it off at the pass and what was he into?
00:13:38
bclawson
Right.
00:13:43
Caroline
Maybe they could have put him in a space camp or ah a farm or future farmers camp where he could go have these experiences with adults and with other kids and get that feeling of whatever he's not getting at home.
00:13:56
Caroline
Because I think you're right, at the poor parents, they can't be two sets of parents at the same time.
00:14:02
bclawson
No, ah you they had to. Well, I think that they expected him to straighten up and fly right.
00:14:10
Caroline
Yeah.
00:14:10
bclawson
But they were so moment by moment, hour to hour, day to day, trying to save their daughter that um they he he was expected to step up and did he?
00:14:23
bclawson
No, he did not.
00:14:24
Caroline
No.
00:14:25
bclawson
And I think if I want to hang a label on him right now, it's going to be clearly this
00:14:25
Caroline
Yeah.
00:14:30
bclawson
This young man is antisocial.
00:14:33
Caroline
yes yeah yep that's probably appropriate yeah oh totally i don't know of a person on the planet besides like a billionaire who's not gonna agree with you there like it is just
00:14:38
bclawson
And so they might have been just trying to give him what he needed when he got into trouble with the law law. And frankly, you know, and I'm not judging them because I've done this many times myself, money is easier to give than attention.
00:14:56
bclawson
Right. I mean, every time I say to my child, okay, I have to go to the doctor. You have to come with me. I don't have a babysitter. You need to not whine, not cry, not pitch a fit, not tear up books.
00:15:07
bclawson
Don't do any of those things.
00:15:08
Caroline
Yeah.
00:15:09
bclawson
And if you do all of that, I will take you by Fred Meyer and you can have a, yeah.
00:15:14
Caroline
Totally. okay Some of us are surviving on that alone.
00:15:20
bclawson
I mean, so I'm not coming to this story with the purist of art.
00:15:26
Caroline
Totally.
00:15:26
bclawson
ah Every parent uses coping strategies when they have children.
00:15:30
Caroline
Totally.
00:15:33
bclawson
If it's one child or seven or 15 or whatever the limit is, i just you just you're going to use the tools that work.
00:15:43
Caroline
Yes.
00:15:44
bclawson
And what was working for them was, okay, it looks like you're in trouble again. I'm going to talk to your lawyer and figure out how much money we're going to have to pay for this.
00:15:49
Caroline
Get you out of it and then knock it off. Yeah, no, you're right. Any one of us would do the same thing probably because you're so busy and you're so tired.
00:15:59
bclawson
Yeah, I just think these are good, good, good people.
00:16:03
Caroline
Yeah.
00:16:03
bclawson
There's no question about that. There's plenty of stuff out there on the internet about what their neighbors had to say about them that was just, you know, they would they were people who opened their arms to anyone and they were helpful to everyone.
00:16:16
Caroline
Yeah.
00:16:18
bclawson
Now, thankfully, as a young adult, Stephen started a business consultancy that really took off. He and a friend who was also his business partner charged 295 pounds to many small businesses.
00:16:32
bclawson
Now that would be maybe $600 in US dollars, maybe 500 for help applying for and receiving help and applying for grants and loans from the British government.
00:16:36
Caroline
Really?
00:16:44
bclawson
So here we go. We're on a phone bank and we're calling up everybody who owns a small business.
00:16:46
Caroline
Okay.
00:16:52
bclawson
So we're going to be getting the small business records.
00:16:54
Caroline
Yeah.
00:16:55
bclawson
And we're just going to go down from AAA does this and you know all the way to. the end of the list and then you start over again because new people own small businesses. So that's what they were doing and they were calling people, cold calling people and saying, um I mean, they're in a room calling people up saying, here's what the British government has come up with for grants and loans. We're going to help you ah get ready for those grants and loans and we're going to help you
00:17:27
bclawson
apply for them and we're going to help you get them for a measly 295 pounds. And they had so much business within a short period of time, their business was a going concern and the money was a rolling in, rolling in. Steven married a disco dancer. He's ready to, you know, have a family. And they had, I mean, you know, he who you where are you going to meet people?
00:17:56
bclawson
at the disco for him.
00:17:56
Caroline
What's the disco dancer? Does that just mean like someone who goes to the clubs?
00:17:58
bclawson
Other people, it might be church or the grocery store, but know him, it's the disco. Okay, okay.
00:18:03
Caroline
Okay. I mean, what?
00:18:04
bclawson
All right.
00:18:04
Caroline
Yeah, okay.
00:18:05
bclawson
They had three children together. Okay. And they lived a high life in a big house, big house. Expensive clothes, cars.
00:18:18
bclawson
they had He had Bentleys. I think at one time he had eight Bentleys.
00:18:22
Caroline
No. Oh, that's too much.
00:18:23
bclawson
Yeah.
00:18:24
Caroline
That's one is too much.
00:18:25
bclawson
He was living high, Caroline. Steven's business was worth more than $5 million dollars at its height.
00:18:33
Caroline
OK, that still doesn't.
00:18:34
bclawson
So he got into a little room with another guy and started calling people and telling them they're going to help them. Of course, you know you know the punchline, they didn't help anybody.
00:18:42
Caroline
You know.
00:18:46
Caroline
Well, that and like, I don't know, I i watch a lot of Shark Tank, so maybe I don't know anything, but five million at its height. I mean, you know, like that doesn't strike me as eight Bentley levels worth of wealth.
00:18:57
Caroline
That's not, you know.
00:18:58
bclawson
Well, maybe he was restoring them, I doubt it. Maybe eight was just in an article, like over time he had eight, but he would trade them in.
00:19:03
Caroline
But still, even one, it just seems like he's obviously a high roller or wants to be one.
00:19:07
bclawson
that's Maybe that's what that meant. Yeah.
00:19:11
Caroline
He obviously wants the image of the spending of the money, which no one really has that kind
Caring for Daniel After Leslie's Death
00:19:16
Caroline
of money to be doing that. And if they do, that's they didn't get there by spending it like that. So I don't know.
00:19:20
bclawson
No, no. So Stephen's sister had grown up too, of course, and she had a little son. Unfortunately, her son had a major learning disability that thwarted his brain development. He was stuck in a three to five-year-old range as far as reasoning and self-care. So he's got a very serious and life everlasting cognitive disability. So Leslie, his mom lived with her parents to keep body and soul together. They worked out well, the four of them.
00:19:55
bclawson
And now in the happy house, it was Robert, Bob, Pat, Leslie, and her son. I should just call Robert Bob. I think that's what his friends called him.
00:20:05
Caroline
Okay.
00:20:05
bclawson
I'm trying to respect him by calling him Robert because I do respect him so much, but I'm going to call him Bob. Okay. So there's Bob, Pat, Leslie, their daughter, and their and the son who has cognitive disability, profound cognitive disabilities.
00:20:21
bclawson
Theirs was a loving and grateful family. surrounded by neighbors who loved and admired them. Just, you know, everybody knew who they were. Everybody was cordial and warm to them and they were always very considerate and loving back. Then in 2008, their epileptic daughter Leslie died at just 40 of a severe epileptic fit in her sleep in the family home.
00:20:54
bclawson
So this left Pat and Robert to look after her son. They could have put him in into care. You know, what we would call here foster care or a state institution of some sort.
00:21:06
Caroline
Oh, yeah, adult state. But yeah, that's never a great option.
00:21:12
bclawson
Yeah, I mean, remember he had a mental age of about three and now he had to be taken into their primary care or they would lose him.
00:21:16
Caroline
Yeah.
00:21:21
bclawson
And there were there was none of that.
00:21:21
Caroline
Yeah.
00:21:24
bclawson
Pat and Bob are not gonna lose his child. this is This is their family, and so they're going to start taking care of him. They arranged for him to be cared for two days a week by a young man who was a social worker, working as a respite chase pardon me respite care worker. Daniel is his name, and he was picked up from ah Pat and Bob's house, and and he would stay with him having activities and social contact until the end of the second day.
00:21:56
bclawson
So five days a week, you know, Pat and Bob have Daniel and they take care of him and they do everything for him, everything that you would for a toddler.
00:22:09
bclawson
And basically, you know, he was probably kind of a joy to be with because he was stuck in that joy of um discovery all the time.
00:22:20
Caroline
right yeah well and this is their only tie to their daughter who is now gone abruptly that's 40s very young
00:22:21
bclawson
And he he just enjoyed, he loved, he he loved. He was a full-time loving grandson.
00:22:36
bclawson
Right, and you know the ship has sailed on the sun. The sun is filthy rich now and he's just running around like he didn't have parents.
00:22:44
Caroline
Yeah, he probably caused them a lot of stress really too, but I mean, they were aging too.
00:22:44
bclawson
So
00:22:49
Caroline
So this is not an uncommon, I don't think this is an uncommon structure in the American family anymore.
00:22:55
bclawson
No, no.
00:22:55
Caroline
But I also think, you know, this is hard on an older generation to be doing, you know, second round, like,
00:23:01
bclawson
ah Very hard. Very hard. I can't even imagine. And and um the quiet, unassuming couple retired, but they they were tied down due to Daniel's needs. They also had to contend with their own ill health. Bob had suffered a heart attack. He had severe arthritis.
00:23:23
bclawson
and depression. Now remember, he's an engineer and he had worked for British Airways probably doing a lot with his hands ah in terms of keeping those airplanes from crashing down to the ground.
00:23:31
Caroline
Yeah.
00:23:35
Caroline
yeah
00:23:36
bclawson
And um so obviously, you know, he's gonna have some physical price to pay for that physical work. And and he had depression. I mean, you're having a heart attack and you have severe arthritis, you're caring for a mentally disabled, now adult child, and you're depressed.
Pat and Bob's Modest Life and Stephen's Betrayal
00:24:01
Caroline
Yeah.
00:24:01
bclawson
I don't think any of that is unexpected. I think that that's the bitter truth of what price he was paying for you know living this long and being as caring his as he is and the kind of work he did.
00:24:15
bclawson
And then Patricia, Pat, had suffered a brain aneurysm. So I think that I don't know if that's a type of stroke or if it just means that she had a leaking in her brain or something.
00:24:26
Caroline
It might be. Hmm.
00:24:31
bclawson
So they got the help they needed because, you know, I have to say that the British people have health care for everyone. I just want to put that out there.
00:24:41
Caroline
Yeah, yeah.
00:24:42
bclawson
Yeah.
00:24:42
Caroline
It was after the Second World War. They kind of but got what that what message the universe was sending them with that war. Like, you cannot let each other fall through the cracks. We are in this together. Actually, it's quite beautiful how it came about, because it was after the Second World War, and it was in a declaration to all peoples in Britain.
00:25:01
bclawson
I did not know that.
00:25:03
Caroline
Well, I learned that from Syco, watching the Michael Moore documentary on you know how horrible our health care system is.
00:25:10
bclawson
Oh yes, yes, yes.
00:25:12
Caroline
but None of them are great, but that one has a beautiful origin story.
00:25:16
bclawson
That is beautiful. So I'm glad for for Bob and Pat that they don't have to worry about Daniel's bills and they don't have to be impoverished because of their own medical bills.
00:25:30
bclawson
And um now they retired from working, as I said before, they did live comfortably. They lived in the same house they always had. So they were living modestly and they were living on Bob's pension from British Airways after a lifetime of work and Pat's small pension from her work as a cleaner for the government.
00:25:40
Caroline
yeah
00:25:53
bclawson
Their house was immaculate always, always, and they lived well. You know, they enjoyed life, enjoying the time they had with their grandson, Daniel, and their many friends and and neighbors. So with this family, it seems like the dynamic that I'm getting, the vibe I'm getting is just the devotion, the steadfast and unconditional love they have for each other and for their children and their grandchildren.
00:26:28
bclawson
They're not in the greatest health, but they have a will written up you know that their son will inherit everything now that the daughter is gone. um So they're putting their life in order. They have the will to go on. they could They don't know how long they're going to live.
The Canal Incident and Final Tragedy
00:26:48
bclawson
They want to be there as long as possible for their grandson who lived with them when he was not in respite care.
00:26:55
bclawson
now I just want to point out here that why would they leave everything to their son? Why wouldn't they live leave everything to their grandson?
00:27:07
bclawson
Well, because in Britain, everything that this grandson is going to need for the rest of his life is going to come at no charge to him.
00:27:18
bclawson
And their estate was really not that big.
00:27:19
Caroline
Okay.
00:27:21
bclawson
They they had their home.
00:27:24
Caroline
Okay. Okay.
00:27:24
bclawson
and they were living off of their pension. That's how they were paying their monthly bills. And, you know, thank God their wayward son was independent with a family of his own.
00:27:35
bclawson
So they felt comfortable that, you know, maybe they were even hoping that he would try to incorporate Daniel into his life. They may have talked to him about that.
00:27:44
Caroline
Right.
00:27:46
bclawson
I don't know. So now we're going to look at Stephen. I don't want to, but we're going to. who in actuality is not above wiping out his parents as well as his nephew Daniel if it suits his fancy of the day. So Stephen said, and I don't like talking about you, but I'm going to because that's what our podcast is all about. The last time we were talking about Steve and he was making a fortune in business consultancy and living a very prosperous and even
00:28:22
bclawson
if I were to judge, which I am, ostentatious life with a wife and three kiddos in a life of luxury. That's the best thing I could ever say about this person. Stephen didn't realize that he and his business partner had been the subject of a fraud investigation that had been going on for literally years. It takes a long time to investigate and gather evidence about fraud.
00:28:51
bclawson
Stephen's business was a business consultancy and proving that it was a scam depends a lot on what is promised in exchange for payment and so forth. Now I want to just interject here. Many times fraud is difficult to track and and prosecute because the people who have been fraudulently, you know, hornswoggled For $295, they do not want to suffer the shame of having been duped.
00:29:23
Caroline
Yeah, isn't that sucky, though? I mean, getting duped happens. Like, you better to seek redress than to just sit around going, God, how embarrassing for me. But I get it. I i would feel the same way.
00:29:33
Caroline
It's like embarrassing. It's frustrating.
00:29:36
bclawson
And finding them, you know, you're not going to be keeping records if you're a fraudster.
00:29:37
Caroline
Yeah.
00:29:41
Caroline
Yeah, yeah, it's tough. Well, and oftentimes, even if you prosecute, where are you getting money from? It's just a judgment. That's all it is. You're not actually getting any of that. You know?
00:29:52
bclawson
No, you're not going to get that money back, but you're going to put this person away so he can't do it to others.
00:29:54
Caroline
No.
00:29:56
Caroline
yeah Well, yes, and you you would have a note. So anytime they tried to make action in the world around you, at least in the United States, you can often go after their paycheck successfully to get your redress. um
00:30:07
bclawson
so as that's ah That's a good thing in the column of the United States. Now, that that doesn't quite offset the medical care for everyone.
00:30:19
bclawson
but
00:30:20
Caroline
Yeah, definitely not.
00:30:20
bclawson
it it We do know how to go after criminals.
00:30:21
Caroline
I would trade. Yeah, I would definitely trade if if both were on the table.
00:30:24
bclawson
um
00:30:26
Caroline
I would prefer the medical.
00:30:29
bclawson
yeah would to Finally, the investigators had what they needed to prove that Stephen's business took the $295 from small business owners and never really helped the business with anything of value, never paved the way or advised them on how to apply for and receive government grants and loans.
00:30:49
bclawson
He was tried, he was found guilty, and he was sent to prison for one year. um Now, I was happy with that sentence until I got to the part that says one year.
00:31:01
Caroline
Yeah.
00:31:01
bclawson
One year.
00:31:01
Caroline
so Well, you and I were discussing this earlier. There are a lot higher penalties outside of this, at least in the United States. I know in our state we have a really robust, um people probably internationally know it as FOIA or Freedom of Information Act, which is to say that the American people have a right to know what their governments are up to.
00:31:21
Caroline
Well, each of the states has their own administration or or legislation around this. And so in our state, it's the Public Records Act, and it's really, really strong and robust on the side of the requester, the independent citizen, the watchdog, whoever it is.
00:31:40
Caroline
um And the penalty when you screw up there and requests can take years to complete and you really can't even determine outcomes until they are complete. But you can get sued as a government agency if you mess up. And I mean mess up, you didn't include that sticky note on top of that one piece of paper that I was a part of my thing. I need the sticky note too. That mistake could be up to $100 a day that you are charged for that mistake for every day that that mistake went uncorrected.
00:32:08
Caroline
So you're looking at million dollar, a million dollar penalties.
00:32:09
bclawson
woa
00:32:13
Caroline
A lot of times a lot of these are settled.
00:32:15
bclawson
Whoa.
00:32:15
Caroline
You know, agencies rarely win these kinds of cases. So I am shocked that after stealing millions that you would just go for a year.
00:32:27
bclawson
And small business owners. And, you know, maybe what he one of the things that could have I'm totally speculating here could have happened is that He and his partner, Steven and his partner, making these phone calls, they may have sent them what seemed like incredibly inside information, which was really printed government information about how to apply.
00:32:48
Caroline
ah Right.
00:32:52
Caroline
Right, like straight from the website or something.
00:32:54
bclawson
So is that a consultancy? I guess that might have been one of the questions that came up.
00:32:59
Caroline
Right.
00:33:00
bclawson
And so perhaps it was even difficult to even bring him to trial.
00:33:05
Caroline
Yeah.
00:33:05
bclawson
um I mean, he had the he that what promises were they making over the phone? That's another problem is you don't have is one person's word against the other but he was tried and they he was found guilty he was sent to prison for a year even though i'd like to see him get one year for every client that he built yeah yeah but you know we weren't there we don't know why and i'm i'm happy he went to prison i'm not happy that it was for one year so of course you know
00:33:25
Caroline
or For five years, one for every million you purported to have earned at least.
00:33:38
Caroline
Yeah.
00:33:43
bclawson
Pat and Bob were just mortified. I mean, they were very embarrassed. They were very disappointed. But they loved their son. They continued to probably blame themselves somehow that he is this way.
00:33:57
bclawson
They still did everything they could to help him. um Who, of course, now, Stevenson has not a dime. He can't work, you know, he hasn't had a job.
00:34:08
bclawson
He's a convicted, whatever they call it over there.
00:34:09
Caroline
Yeah, let's start over, moment.
00:34:13
bclawson
who who was wiped out, he was wiped out by his conviction and imprisonment. I want to say good, except for the part where I know that Bob and Pat are going to run in with the, you know, with the safety net and they're going to do crazy things though.
00:34:26
Caroline
Yeah.
00:34:28
bclawson
So here are some of the things that they did. Robert and Pat re-mortgaged their immaculate semi-detached house on Clough Avenue so they could buy him a house at Benevente Street, see him, a lovely, lovely neighborhood, far more upscale than where they were living, but they did it.
00:34:52
bclawson
And this is the former coal town where his wife, Nick Cola, the um the dancer, we'll just say dancer.
00:35:00
Caroline
Oh, the disco dancer. Okay. Yeah.
00:35:02
bclawson
Yeah, this is, they he they wanted to live near her parents.
00:35:07
Caroline
Oh, well, what, what was their percentage of input on this?
00:35:07
bclawson
And you know that makes me think that I don't know. I don't know.
00:35:13
Caroline
What was their half?
00:35:14
bclawson
I'm just going to say, if I got myself in a hole this deep through bad acts and I was imprisoned, I would be so mortified about how I had
00:35:23
Caroline
Yeah. Yeah.
00:35:35
bclawson
constructed my life and how I was conducting that life.
00:35:38
Caroline
Yeah.
00:35:38
bclawson
And I would not take anything from my parents ever.
00:35:42
Caroline
No, I would be living in the back closet of their home, begging them for forgiveness every day.
00:35:43
bclawson
and
00:35:48
Caroline
Are you kidding me?
00:35:49
bclawson
Right, right. I mean, what I would say, if I was the mother and father and I was caring for Daniel, I would say, I'm sorry, but we don't have anything to offer you.
00:36:04
bclawson
a but love and you can come here and live with us if you want to.
00:36:06
Caroline
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:36:09
bclawson
You can get a um covered wagon and put it in our backyard and you and your family can live there until you're back on your feet.
00:36:20
Caroline
Yeah, no, you were always good about drawing those lines, even as kids, you would say that to us like young working adults who felt like we're never gonna break into this, you know, like we're never gonna have your lifestyle. I mean, turns out that's true. However, like when you when we were coming up, you would say to us.
00:36:37
Caroline
Look, you are never going to be without people who love you. you're and Together, we are never going to be without a shelter. We are never going to be without food. and We are never going to be without love. That's all we need. We'll figure the rest out as we need to. It just made me feel like the world could explode, but if I had my people, we could do it together.
00:36:59
Caroline
And all of our people knew that food and shelter are the most important and we love each other. And then the rest we can figure out. It was a really important message, which I don't. Clearly, Steven got a different message because I'm with you. I'd be humble city. I don't need my own residence unless I can pay for it myself. Mom, dad, no, you're absolutely not going to mortgage anything. I will figure out a way to get a structure on the property and live there temporarily.
00:37:25
Caroline
because you have Daniel, maybe, maybe I go to school and become a caregiver. I can be Daniel's caregiver. I mean, these are just the ways that you and I would go about it, but Stephen is a different animal.
00:37:37
bclawson
Well, you know, if you were moving in on my property and helping me with my property and helping me with the dogs and you were working and building rebuilding your career and all of these things, it might even be, among other maybe darker emotions, it might also be kind of exciting.
00:38:04
Caroline
Yeah.
00:38:04
bclawson
that where you know where' where you rebuild. Think about those people in Hawaii you know who are having to build rebuild their entire town.
00:38:08
Caroline
You're starting from zero. no Yeah.
00:38:15
bclawson
Most of them are not moving, they're going to rebuild.
00:38:16
Caroline
That's right.
00:38:19
bclawson
And um so I don't know why that came into my head, but there to to most normal people who hit a pothole so big that they can't get out of it,
00:38:23
Caroline
Yeah.
00:38:27
Caroline
Yes.
00:38:32
Caroline
Yeah. Yes.
00:38:33
bclawson
The process of rebuilding is in and of itself somewhat self-affirming, life-affirming, and it builds up the esteem that you have for yourself.
00:38:46
Caroline
Yeah, it can kind of heal maybe whatever happened to cause your fall or your descent or your loss. It can be be a part of the healing of that so that you don't carry it with you.
00:38:54
bclawson
yeah
00:38:57
Caroline
It becomes a part of the foundation for whatever new you're going to build in your life. Yeah, no, that's a really good point.
00:39:02
bclawson
Yeah, it's almost like, you know, it's kind of easy to be lucky and rich.
00:39:06
Caroline
Yeah.
00:39:07
bclawson
Well, let's just say lucky. No, it is. It is. It is. You know, if you have good luck and you worked hard and you're providing for your family, um that's good.
00:39:21
bclawson
But there's yeah but if if bad times come and you know that you can weather them,
00:39:25
Caroline
Yeah.
00:39:28
bclawson
um And you learn that you have it in you to start over.
00:39:33
Caroline
Yeah.
00:39:34
bclawson
um And to not be a simpering, whimpering complainer about what has happened to you.
00:39:40
Caroline
Right.
00:39:40
bclawson
You're looking around and saying, you know, okay, what can I do for my kids to help them in school today?
00:39:45
Caroline
What do I have control over?
00:39:45
bclawson
That kind of thing.
00:39:46
Caroline
Yeah.
00:39:47
bclawson
But he doesn't have any of that. He has lots of self-worth.
00:39:50
Caroline
Yeah.
00:39:52
bclawson
He has an abundance of that.
00:39:54
Caroline
Yeah.
00:39:55
bclawson
He's saturated with it. He's delusional with it, his self-worth, but he obviously has no self-esteem. He thinks the world owes him a living.
00:40:04
Caroline
Right.
00:40:06
bclawson
That is what I'm getting, the vibe I'm getting from this guy.
00:40:10
Caroline
first
00:40:11
bclawson
In fact, I'm just going to say, I don't know, my classic articulate way of saying, oh my God, what is the matter with this man?
00:40:20
Caroline
Totally. I mean, that sums it up.
00:40:22
bclawson
Right. Those are my words. Oh my God. He can't see that his parents are taking care of their disabled grandson?
00:40:34
bclawson
Keeping them home, even though they are in their 60s and not doing health one doing well health-wise, wouldn't you think they'd like a little vacation?
00:40:43
Caroline
Mm hmm.
00:40:44
bclawson
They should be traveling, indulging in hobbies, a meal out every now and then, or just taking it easy. But no, he isn't thinking of them. He knows that if he asks for a house and a gob of money, his parents will provide it even when it meant mortgaging their home.
00:41:06
Caroline
So crazy.
00:41:06
bclawson
He sees them as a cash cow.
00:41:08
Caroline
Well, that's it. He has no concern or consideration for them, which is awful because of how selfless they have lived their life. I mean, they're.
00:41:17
bclawson
I mean, I'm not a doctor, so I can't say that he's this or he's that, but I know one thing. He is not normal.
00:41:23
Caroline
Yeah.
00:41:23
bclawson
but He is not caring. And he is not upstanding. What darkness is it in him to make him feel entitled to have whatever he wants? I don't get that.
00:41:34
Caroline
Yeah.
00:41:34
bclawson
Plus we already know he's a con man because he just got out of prison serving time for fraud. You know, fraud is just seems like such an ugly word, but it's not as handy as con man.
00:41:46
Caroline
Yeah.
00:41:46
bclawson
I mean, in other words, that is all he is. That is the complete package right there.
00:41:50
Caroline
A hundred percent.
00:41:50
bclawson
He's a con man. If only there was a law that says that when you commit fraud, you get a day in prison for every dollar you stole from a trusting mark.
00:42:01
bclawson
And I'm thinking, yeah, because he'd have to stay in jail for 5 million days.
00:42:01
Caroline
You know. Well, that.
00:42:06
Caroline
That's it.
00:42:06
bclawson
So anyway.
00:42:06
Caroline
That might have a chilling effect. I mean, maybe we should write a local legislature or something. and Because you're right about that.
00:42:11
bclawson
Something.
00:42:13
Caroline
That's what the penalty is under or the public records. It's meant to deter future bad actors. Well, I mean, maybe we should do it here too.
00:42:20
bclawson
Right. You know, these people who, ah you know, end their own life by standing in front of a truck driver on the middle of the road, that always makes me mad because they're not even thinking about the trauma to that person.
00:42:32
Caroline
need him
00:42:34
Caroline
me to I totally agree with you. i Yes, 100%. I feel that same way. Don't involve anybody else in this kind of a...
00:42:42
bclawson
Yeah, he doesn't even have that.
00:42:44
Caroline
Yeah.
00:42:44
bclawson
He doesn't even have that. You know, he's just an empty vessel of ick. So let's talk about the murder attempt on his parents life and then the, and the, and the grandson, uh, and the murder itself.
00:42:59
bclawson
So Steven asked his parents and his disabled nephew, Daniel, please let me take you out to dinner to celebrate mother's day, which had actually happened weeks and weeks ago. And, and they, so so they said, yes.
00:43:12
bclawson
Okay. Now I would be thinking where are you getting the money? Oh yeah, from us. But anyway,
00:43:16
Caroline
Right.
00:43:18
bclawson
He picked them up in a rented BMW, and he told them that his car was in the shop. He had a knife in his pocket, and he had a special type of jack with him when he was driving them to the dinner. This jack is designed to smash a car window if you wind up underwater. On the way to the restaurant, Steven drove down a street next to a deep canal.
00:43:46
bclawson
He clutched his chest, feigning a heart attack. And then the car just flew into the canal. Steven got out by cutting his seatbelt with that knife he had and ramming the driver's side window with that jack he had. Once he emerged from the water, he stood on the roof of the car to make it sink faster and faster. Then unexpectedly, a crowd appeared.
00:44:14
bclawson
They were screaming at him to get off the roof and get underwater and get your family out of that car, which was causing, you know, the so him jumping up and down on the roof was causing the entire car to be submerged quicker than it would have been.
00:44:22
Caroline
Mmhmm. Yeah.
00:44:29
bclawson
Seeing the crowd, Stephen had to go into the water to quote, save his parents and his nephew. He didn't want to save them, but there were people watching.
00:44:39
Caroline
Right.
00:44:39
bclawson
So, you know, what are you going to do?
00:44:43
bclawson
His mother had stopped breathing by the time he got to her. But paramedics brought her back to life. And then Stephen was hailed as a local hero. He was on the TV. He was being interviewed. People were just talking about, oh, the valor. But at his next doctor's visit, Robert confided in the doctor that he believed his son had tried to kill him and his wife and nephew.
00:45:13
bclawson
So he's at the Dr. Caroline. This is Bob.
00:45:16
Caroline
That had to take a while.
00:45:16
bclawson
Remember, he's had an heart attack. He's got a lot of problems. He's got arthritis. He's got, you know, all kinds of problems, health-wise. Doctors saying, well, you know, yeah, I mean, you've got some issues, but chere odd look at your Your son is, aren't you just so proud of your son?
00:45:33
bclawson
No, I'm not proud of my son. I think he was trying to kill me and my family.
00:45:36
Caroline
Well, that has to take a lot for Robert to get there. And it begs the question, how often have Robert and Pat or have Bob and Pat had to come to these conversations? But I think he did that on purpose.
00:45:48
Caroline
I don't think he plans on stopping this robbery business. You know, from the time he's 12 on, how many times did Robert have to acknowledge my son is doing bad things with the knowledge they are bad, you know?
00:45:53
bclawson
Yeah.
00:46:03
bclawson
I know and I don't know how the dynamics between the husband and the wife were when it came to bailing him out even after he got out of prison.
00:46:09
Caroline
Yeah.
00:46:11
bclawson
That's a big bail.
00:46:11
Caroline
Right. Well, and then to turn around and mortgage.
00:46:13
bclawson
You've effed up your own life. You go build a new one, you know.
00:46:16
Caroline
That's what I'm saying. And when they mortgage their house, knowing they had their grandsons care, like to think about they needed this home. Like, I don't know. There's just a lot there. I would have loved to have spoken with that couple about because that's so hard.
00:46:31
Caroline
What a hard place for those people to be in reality versus the desired reality about your family.
00:46:34
bclawson
Yeah.
00:46:39
bclawson
So yeah, this dad, this poor dad, you know, he he expressed this fear to the doctor, but the doctor didn't really, you know, he just didn't have enough information to take it seriously and he did not report it.
00:46:52
bclawson
He was just thinking that his patient, Robert Steaden, pardon me, Robert Steaden, he doesn't have a T in it, could not possibly be right.
00:46:52
Caroline
yeah
00:46:57
Caroline
Yeah.
00:47:00
bclawson
How could that possibly be right, Caroline?
00:47:03
Caroline
yeah
00:47:03
bclawson
It had been all over the news that it was Stephen Seddon who saved his family. If it's on the news, it's right.
00:47:10
Caroline
Well, we know that's not true.
00:47:10
bclawson
Right, Caroline?
00:47:15
bclawson
No. As time passed and the news reporters moved on to other stories, Stephen Seddon didn't give up his quest to kill his parents and his nephew and inherit a 230,000 pound value of the family home.
00:47:33
bclawson
He chose to pick a day that the electric company warned citizens that the power would be cut off in the area for routine maintenance. So in other words, okay, he's plotting how can I kill him, how can I kill him?
00:47:47
Caroline
Yeah.
00:47:48
bclawson
And you know nobody's interviewing me as a hero anymore, so now's a good time to go do it.
00:47:54
Caroline
right
00:47:55
bclawson
And ah then he gets a letter saying that everybody in this neighborhood, your power is going to go out at this time to this time on this day. And he's thinking, how can I use this to feather my own nest?
00:48:07
bclawson
So he thought, OK, I can put my car in the garage so I obviously cannot retrieve it once the power goes out. So apparently he's got a garage door opener that only works when you've got power, I guess.
00:48:23
Caroline
They don't have that red thing. I mean there's at least for mine. Not that they're easy to open and close.
00:48:26
bclawson
The rope that hangs down, yeah. I don't know, maybe they don't have those in Britain, or maybe he's just um thinking so at such a shallow level.
00:48:30
Caroline
Yeah.
00:48:37
bclawson
um I mean, this is gonna be his alibi, right? Well, it couldn't have been me, because I didn't have my access to my car.
00:48:43
Caroline
You're right. Right, we're right.
00:48:45
bclawson
He borrowed a friend's car, and he took a shotgun with him. He got the shotgun from another friend who was a criminal. Probably the other car was a french criminal.
00:48:54
Caroline
I was gonna say.
00:48:54
bclawson
I mean, you know, he's in the underworld, Caroline.
00:48:56
Caroline
Yeah. ah Some friends.
00:48:57
bclawson
he's He snuck into his parents' home. He looked each of them in the eye as they were rising to greet them or coming down the stairs to greet him while he aimed the shotgun at them.
00:49:10
bclawson
It was a sawed-off shotgun.
00:49:12
Caroline
Yeah.
00:49:12
bclawson
And he fired. He then went into his nephew's room with one bullet meant for him. But as luck would have it, Daniel was in respite care for the for the next two days.
00:49:25
Caroline
Oh, thank God.
00:49:26
bclawson
So then he decided, okay, I'm going to plant the shotgun on my father's lap to make it look like a murder suicide. And that's what he did. And he, later on, you know, when they found the bodies, they didn't find the bodies for two days because there was nobody coming to the house.
00:49:46
Caroline
Yeah.
00:49:46
bclawson
It was the respite care guy
00:49:48
Caroline
Oh.
00:49:49
bclawson
bringing Daniel back home that found the bodies.
00:49:50
Caroline
Oh.
00:49:54
bclawson
Isn't that horrible?
00:49:55
Caroline
yes that's horrible
00:49:55
bclawson
How come good people, bad things happen to good people and bad things happen to bad people too, but not bad enough?
00:50:04
Caroline
Well, I'm so curious.
00:50:04
bclawson
I mean,
00:50:05
Caroline
Honestly, I'm a little bit curious about the gun situation here because I know in America you find guns everywhere. But in England, I didn't think you could. I thought it was knives for days. what what but How do you get a shot off shotgun?
00:50:17
Caroline
Maybe if you're on a rural side, you can apply for permits to get them as for shooting, for recreation, maybe for hunting. Because I know they're still doing all those things. So, right?
00:50:28
bclawson
Right.
00:50:29
Caroline
I don't know. Anyway, it's an interest to me.
00:50:30
bclawson
Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:50:31
Caroline
How did he get a shotgun?
00:50:33
bclawson
People who live on farms and ranches and things like that, there's no doubt that they can have a, and then, you know, criminals are going to have guns because criminals are criminals.
00:50:38
Caroline
Yeah.
00:50:43
Caroline
Touché. I mean, they just.
00:50:44
bclawson
They don't care about that law. They don't care about that law.
00:50:45
Caroline
Yeah, that's true. That's a good point. I mean, it's a sawed off shotgun anyway. So obviously they could easily like rub off things like serial numbers. I don't know how it works. I'm not in the gun underbelly criminal world.
00:50:56
Caroline
Just know that England has a better handle on their guns than we do.
00:51:01
bclawson
course the minute that the bodies were found what did first of all let me tell you what what um what he said what he said about his parent Robert what he said about um not Robert the killer
00:51:18
Caroline
Steven?
00:51:19
bclawson
jerk that we're talking about is Steven Seddon.
00:51:20
Caroline
Steven.
00:51:24
bclawson
My mind is on these parents, I'm sorry. But anyway, he he he said when the police called and told him that his parents were dead, he said, well, oh my God, my father owns the mortgage on my house.
00:51:38
bclawson
What am I going to do now?
00:51:40
Caroline
Seriously, that's what he said?
00:51:43
bclawson
That's what he said.
00:51:43
Caroline
Ew. That's the weird thing to say.
00:51:44
bclawson
Now, you could reason it out that he was trying to act like an innocent person.
00:51:49
Caroline
innocent people who lose their parents.
00:51:50
bclawson
But he doesn't know how to act like an innocent person.
00:51:52
Caroline
Yeah, no, you would have to love your parents because that's your main focus is like your parents. I that's weird.
00:51:57
bclawson
Yeah, no, he can't think like a a regular normal person.
00:51:58
Caroline
What a weird thing to me.
00:52:01
bclawson
that it It would be like me asking a platypus to come and clean my refrigerator. you know yeah the what what I'm sorry.
00:52:08
Caroline
So nonsensical.
00:52:11
bclawson
just He doesn't know right.
00:52:14
Caroline
Yeah.
00:52:14
bclawson
He doesn't know what right is.
00:52:16
Caroline
Yeah.
00:52:16
bclawson
He doesn't know what normal is. He's just bereft of humanity.
00:52:22
Caroline
Yeah.
00:52:23
bclawson
So anyway, they found him. They found the bodies. So police easily detected right away that this stage has this scene has been staged. The trajectory of the bullet to Robert's head was inconsistent with suicide.
00:52:38
bclawson
He couldn't have reached that part of his head.
00:52:40
Caroline
yeah
00:52:41
bclawson
It was a homicide. And it was obvious that Bob and Pat were murdered. The investigation determined that the only possible person responsible was Steven. He didn't count on, well, Steven did not count on photo evidence being available blocks away that showed him parking his friend's car down the street from where Bob and Pat lived on the day of the killing, at the time of the killing.
00:53:10
Caroline
Oh, CCTV baby.
00:53:17
bclawson
I mean, you can't do anything in Britain without being, I mean, you can't do anything in America either.
00:53:19
Caroline
That's right. That's right. You got ring cameras everywhere.
00:53:23
bclawson
Yeah.
00:53:24
Caroline
That's the kind of side of tick tock.
00:53:24
bclawson
Ring of cameras everywhere.
00:53:25
Caroline
I thought a lot of the ring cameras. They're funny.
00:53:27
bclawson
Absolutely. Or people just walking around with their cell phones, taking pictures of anything and everything.
00:53:32
Caroline
Exactly.
00:53:34
bclawson
So then Bob's doctor relayed to the police what he had said he being Bob Steaden had disclosed his fears about his son trying to kill him and Pat.
00:53:45
Caroline
Yep.
00:53:46
bclawson
and Daniel in the canal. And it turned out when the police investigated that, that Steven Seddon had bought added insurance for the car he rented that ultimately wound up in the canal. But when he rented the same model car for himself the very next day from the very same rental company, he declined all insurance.
Judgment and Family's Grief
00:54:12
Caroline
Mmm, like he knew. Oh, I don't need it this time.
00:54:15
bclawson
but I mean, that's circumstantial, but all the other things combined, all the other circumstantial evidence combined, just pointed a big flashing red light at this killer.
00:54:20
Caroline
Yeah.
00:54:27
Caroline
Yeah.
00:54:28
bclawson
There was so much evidence against him at trial. Nevertheless, convicted fraudster, Steven, Sudden, 46, continued to deny his guilt, shaking his head and shouting, I'm an innocent man.
00:54:44
bclawson
man. Now, you know, when he was living in his bubble and his parents would believe every word he said, but not really, but they would do it anyway.
00:54:53
Caroline
Yes.
00:54:54
bclawson
Okay. Well, you murdered that.
00:54:56
Caroline
Yeah, different set of parents now.
00:54:58
bclawson
So now you're with a jury of your peers.
00:55:00
Caroline
Yeah.
00:55:02
bclawson
and they can see that you can say that all day, but you're not an innocent man.
00:55:06
Caroline
yeah
00:55:06
bclawson
He was found guilty of murder of Robert and Patson. The attempted murder of his entire family by driving the rental car into the canal and trying to sink the car by jumping on the roof of the car before a crowd stepped in and yelled for him to dive in and save his family.
00:55:27
bclawson
The judge handed down, not just a heavy sentence, He got 40 years, um and it in England they call it ah like a life sentence with a 40 year tariff.
00:55:42
bclawson
You're not even gonna, yeah, you're not even gonna look at getting probation for 40 years.
00:55:43
Caroline
whoa Whoa!
00:55:49
bclawson
He would be 86 by then.
00:55:52
Caroline
Wow! Good on ya, England. With terror for 40 years.
00:55:54
bclawson
Yep, yep, so he got a stiff, he got I mean, this is the same court system that sent him away for fraud for just one year.
00:56:02
Caroline
I know, it's all my time scales.
00:56:03
bclawson
Well, they're not fiddle-farting around with this murder and the attempted familicide, and you can say you're innocent all you want to, but it's not gonna work.
00:56:12
Caroline
Yeah.
00:56:14
bclawson
And so, you know, the judge handed down not just a heavy sentence, Caroline, but, you know, I really want to kind of wrap this up with what the judge had to say about this man, okay?
00:56:27
bclawson
He did not mince words about Stephen Seddon. You know, he was a well educated man. Obviously he's a court, you know, he's a judge of this courtroom and he's got words put together in a way that's way better than what I could do. Shut up. Hey, be quiet. No bark. So my dogs had started barking there and they might continue to bark every time we get to the murder part or the sentencing part.
00:56:57
bclawson
They know I'm, you know, they want to just start barking. Anyway, the judge handed down not just a heavy sentence, but he didn't mince words. Here's what he said. Stephen, you tried to murder your father, Robert Seddon, 68, and your mother, Patricia, 65, and your disabled nephew, Daniel, by driving into a canal with them strapped in the back seats in a fake
00:57:27
bclawson
road accident.
00:57:30
bclawson
Seddon, you then played the hero in the aftermath of the accident. You boasted of your supposed rescue attempts after aborting the murder plan when bystanders went to their aid in the submerged car.
00:57:49
bclawson
I mean, some of these bystanders were jumping in the water, Caroline.
00:57:53
Caroline
Well, yeah.
00:57:53
bclawson
He's on the roof trying to sink them and they're jumping in the water.
00:57:56
Caroline
That's crazy.
00:57:57
bclawson
But after that plan failed, Stephen said, four months later, the father of three, you, Stephen, blasted this couple to death with a sawed off shotgun at their suburban home in the sale of Greater Manchester. Your parents had made you the sole beneficiary of their 230,000 pound estate in their will after the tragic death of their daughter.
00:58:27
bclawson
Your parents paid for your, with they paid for their generosity toward you with their lives. Now during these remarks by the judge at one point, Steven said and shouted from the doc, no, no, no, no, no, not at all, me at all. I'm an innocent man. And the judge told him, keep quiet. And he continued his sentencing remarks.
00:58:56
bclawson
In effect, you have executed your own parents, he told Seddon. One can only imagine the horror of your parents' last moments in this life when they realized what a monster their son, whom they loved, had to become. Mercifully, their deaths were swift. The reason for the attempted murders and the murders' war was greed. You needed money. You had lost your job.
00:59:24
bclawson
You had a mortgage. You had a family to support. You had some grand plans. Despite the fact that your parents had already been very generous in supporting you, you wanted more and you wanted it now. Hence the plan to kill them and get their inheritance up front. The attempt at murder having failed You decided on a more ruthless and definitive method of killing. You attained a shot, I saw it off shotgun for criminal associates. In Greek mythology, someone who killed a parent would be pursued until death by the Furies. Now, Andy would know all about the Furies because he studies Greek
01:00:10
bclawson
mythology but I do not so I had to look that up and I guess what it is is through time the Furies are the goddesses of revenge and then they're also being interpreted later after they were created as a construct of ghosts of the deceased so you're going to be pursued by the Furies according to Greek mythology and I gotta say, I don't think he's going to care that they come back as ghosts to haunt him because he doesn't have a heart.
01:00:44
Caroline
Yeah.
01:00:45
bclawson
But revenge would be nice.
01:00:46
Caroline
Yeah, the Furies sound like they they could inflict some serious pain.
01:00:47
bclawson
So maybe, I hope so. Throughout, so thank you Greek mythology. So the judge went on to say that throughout time it's been recognized as a terrible and unnatural crime to murder a parent.
01:01:04
bclawson
I think that's pretty normal. In other words, some people murder and they they that I won't say that's natural, but there is something to the fact that under the right circumstances, you know, almost any of us could murder under the right circumstances.
01:01:17
Caroline
Yeah, you can see how that that became the outcome. Right. There's obviously there's always this, ah but I agree generally with this that the biology does not lend itself. Like when you have a horrible parent and they're just a horrible parent, but you don't ever really think to kill them or murder.
01:01:32
bclawson
No, it's unnatural.
01:01:34
Caroline
Yeah.
01:01:34
bclawson
It's unnatural. And you have not killed one parent, but you killed them both. And you did it for gain.
01:01:45
bclawson
You've done so having first unsuccessfully to kill them by other means. You have done so by the barbaric act of shooting them at point blank range with a sawed off shotgun.
01:01:53
Caroline
Dang.
01:01:59
bclawson
Sudden had lived the high life in the past posing in his Bentley Turbo jetting around the world and staying in the Waldorf Astoria in New York on one trip.
01:02:10
bclawson
The money came from a scam. You were jailed for fraud, but your thirst for money remained unquenched. I mean, this judge is going on and on and on, because he's fixing to give him a 40-year tariff.
01:02:22
Caroline
Yeah. I love that they call it a terrace.
01:02:23
bclawson
And so, huh?
01:02:25
Caroline
I love that they call it a terrace. That's kind of cool.
01:02:28
bclawson
It's called a tariff. In America, we'll say, you know, eligible for parole in 30 years. That's so inelegant with a tariff of 40 years.
01:02:39
bclawson
I like that better. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
01:02:40
Caroline
I do like that better too. Very poetic.
01:02:44
bclawson
Peter Wright QC was the prosecutor and he said that this man, Steven Seddon, is an ungrateful son who with an insatiable thirst for cash, like he was a maniac for cash.
01:02:59
Caroline
Yeah, that's probably true.
01:03:02
bclawson
Yeah, his elderly and caring parents had already gifted him 40,000 pounds in cash and bought his home in Seaham County, Durham to keep a roof over his head.
01:03:14
bclawson
They enjoyed a modest but comfortable life with Mr. Seddon getting an occupational pension from British Airways and Mrs. Seddon, her state pension. The couple married for 47 years, Caroline.
01:03:27
Caroline
Aww.
01:03:31
bclawson
They made a will in October 2009, naming each other as the beneficiary. But if one of them died, their estate would be worth 230,000 pounds. And if they died, stay steve Stephen would get the lot. And the next day, he was dead. So what they're saying here is that ah once Stephen realized that he was going to inherit everything,
01:04:00
bclawson
I don't think that they were technically correct when they said the next day he was dead. I think that what they meant was the idea to make them dead was born.
01:04:08
Caroline
yeah Right. Yeah. Well, and because I don't know why he would feel the need to kill Daniel other than to not have to carry that burden. What he viewed as a burden forward for his care potentially.
01:04:21
bclawson
Yeah.
01:04:21
Caroline
I don't really know, but I do know that. For me, I had that question about why wouldn't they have left everything to Daniel or at least split it up between the two of them, since she is Leslie's only survivor, their daughter's only surviving child.
01:04:35
Caroline
But you raised a really good point that Daniel's already within a system in the government that's going to allow for his care that he needs. So it isn't like he needs an income, right? Is that kind of...
01:04:45
bclawson
No, he doesn't need an income, and not only that, but I mean, I just hate to say this because it's so overwhelmingly sad, gut-wrenching, but they probably believed that their son, Stephen, would take that inheritance and see after Daniel.
01:04:55
Caroline
Yeah.
01:05:03
Caroline
Would step up. Yeah. No, no, no. I never got that from the story, but i I get it. Being a parent to, yeah.
01:05:13
bclawson
These parents, that's how their brain worked.
01:05:15
Caroline
Well, it's how a lot of parents' brains work. This is how you get kids being the problem. And the parents are like, no, this class of 32 kids is the problem. I mean, it's just the way our brains are designed around our own kids, you know?
01:05:26
bclawson
I know the prosecutor pointed out to the judge that Pat was still recovering from the car accident. You remember she had to be she had to be revived.
01:05:40
Caroline
Right.
01:05:40
bclawson
And who knows how long her brain was without oxygen.
01:05:44
Caroline
Right.
01:05:45
bclawson
um But she evidence showed that she tried to fight with Steven when he produced that soft shotgun and aimed at her head. She was found in the hallway, blasted in the temple from close range as she lay on the floor.
01:06:01
Caroline
Oh, God.
01:06:02
bclawson
So he knocked her down.
01:06:04
Caroline
Well, and she was attempting to either flee, yeah, flee or fight. She knew what was coming. That's really that's really horrific.
01:06:12
bclawson
His father had been shot in the neck as he got up from the sofa to greet his son who came through the front door.
01:06:21
Caroline
Oh, my gosh.
01:06:24
bclawson
So he got it in the neck. Police also pointed out that it would have been a ah triple murder had it not been for Daniel being in respite care that day.
01:06:35
Caroline
Right.
01:06:37
bclawson
And then he set it up as a ah murder suicide. So he's gonna he's going to cast his father as a killer.
01:06:43
Caroline
Jesus.
01:06:46
bclawson
I mean, you know this just went on and on and on and on after the guilty verdict because they need to justify that 40 year tariff.
01:06:53
Caroline
Yeah.
01:06:55
bclawson
So anyway, um again, I think I mentioned already that when the police called him, he, Stephen, he said, what am I going to do? My father has the mortgage on my house. And he said that it was just ridiculous to blame him. And he just kept saying that in court.
01:07:17
bclawson
Outside of court, Detective Superintendent Dennis Worth from Greater Manchester Police, who figured all this out, said, I actually find it difficult to put into words someone who would kill and murder their own parents.
01:07:32
bclawson
It's hard to describe somebody. How do they prepare to do that?
01:07:35
Caroline
Right.
01:07:36
bclawson
How do they do that? I mean, he portrayed himself as a devoted and loving son. And yet he told lie after lie after liar. He's just evil. He's an evil wicked man who did it all for greed. So PC Brian Jones was the family liaison officer. So all of the relatives of Pat and of um Robert, they were able to give a statement through the liaison officer. They said that this past nine months have been very sad and emotional time.
01:08:11
bclawson
The shock of having both Pat and Bob taken from us in such a horrifying and tragic way has left us feeling numb. Pat and Bob were kind, loving, selfless, a couple who will be missed by their family and friends, and especially their grandson, Daniel, who they cared for with such great love and affection. Can you imagine that transition now to full-time care?
01:08:40
bclawson
And you can't explain to him what happened to his parents.
01:08:40
Caroline
Oh, I feel bad for Daniel. Well, no, and I can't imagine Steven is someone he's even wanting anything to do with. His mother's gone. These other two people who adored him are gone. Like, ugh, God, my heart just broke. That's awful.
01:08:58
bclawson
What's interesting to me, listeners, about this case and the reason I decided to cover it, Carolina and I both wanted to cover it because some of the cases we,
01:09:10
bclawson
cover are for greed. Many of them are for greed. um And they're yeah typically in well-off families.
01:09:18
Caroline
Mmhmm.
01:09:19
bclawson
And um it's just starkly almost impossible to comprehend to us how these two purely innocent people could raise this child and have him
01:09:33
Caroline
Yeah.
01:09:40
bclawson
pull, sawed off shotgun at them and killed them in the manner that he did. And for pittance, he already had a home, Caroline.
01:09:49
Caroline
forentance And it was his second attempt. He tried to ground them first. I mean, this, it is really crazy to me, actually, that this Steven person is this cold, callous and uncaring. And yeah, you're right. Not for a whole lot, not for, for just basically something that's not going to last him very long. It wouldn't last you long.
01:10:14
bclawson
I wonder if he was filled with greed but also hate because his parents were so good.
01:10:19
Caroline
Yeah.
01:10:22
Caroline
Maybe and he was so not, you know.
01:10:25
bclawson
And he was so not good. And he just couldn't have it that they would that they would live and be able to live such a happy, joyful life in spite of their illnesses, in spite of their burdens, in spite of
01:10:42
Caroline
Yeah.
01:10:43
bclawson
everything that had happened to them in terms of sadness of losing their daughter. that Did he have just hatred for them? he couldn't so like he he you know like he He's going to obliterate them so he doesn't have to think about it anymore?
01:11:00
Caroline
He must have because why otherwise, why demand they buy you a home? Give you an entire annual salary for other people just in one fell swoop. I mean, 40,000 pounds, I imagine, is an annual income for many.
01:11:13
Caroline
I don't know.
01:11:13
bclawson
Well, yeah, yeah, I mean, they did everything for him.
01:11:14
Caroline
I don't live here, but I know in America I'm looking pretty good.
01:11:16
bclawson
I don't know what I don't know why this man has killed. But to me, he is like beneath some of the killers that we have covered.
01:11:25
Caroline
Yes, I agree. Well, the callousness, the coldness, the total, like, there's just and negative amounts of empathy, compassion, and and consideration here. I mean, negative amounts.
01:11:36
Caroline
I don't know what his disco dance and wife is like or his three kids, but oish.
01:11:37
bclawson
Right.
01:11:41
bclawson
I don't know he's in prison now and I like that word tariff and I like those letters, I mean numbers four and zero. i'll I'll close today Caroline by quoting the family of Pat and the family of Bob. We would like to now be left in peace to mourn the deaths of Pat and Bob.
01:12:09
bclawson
and be allowed to remember them as the loving couple that they were. And, you know, I hope that that is what they're living as.
01:12:22
bclawson
I hope that they're able to find peace.
01:12:24
Caroline
Yeah.
01:12:25
bclawson
So um that ends our episode today. Today's episode is research written and narrated by Bridget and Caroline, produced by Andy.
01:12:36
bclawson
Our research is solely based on public domain documents, including legal documents, articles, and books about our subject. Episodes are aired every other week. And if you like us, please subscribe and give us a five-star review. Tell your friends about us in person and by social media. All of these actions help new listeners find us. It really does help. So thank you. We appreciate you very much. And don't forget.
01:13:05
bclawson
to live and let live. Bye-bye, Caroline.
01:13:10
Caroline
Bye bye.