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Understanding Sustainable Brewing
314 Plays5 days ago
"A lot of customers are very concerned about their carbon footprint."
For all the challenges faced by the beer industry, it’s one that continues to forge ahead in many areas, not least when it comes to sustainability.
Whether the focus is powering breweries, recycling or reusing ingredients, supporting organic and regenerative farming practices, or creating new and innovative ways of cutting waste, the brewing industry and those with which it shares a symbiotic relationship are often hotbeds for fostering sustainable practices.
It’s an area we’ve covered extensively on The Crafty Pint and, in this episode of our podcast, Craig Williams brings together a panel of pioneers from different businesses helping drive industries in a more eco-friendly direction.
He’s joined by George Wade, co-founder of UK-based Zevero, which helps breweries calculate their carbon emissions, Tom Field, founder of Sydney-based Bearhug Pallet Wraps, and Jonathon Buntz, from Ecogrip, producer of 100 percent Australian-owned and manufactured recycled plastic can holders.
As well as exploring the genesis for each of their businesses and how they’re helping customers operate in a more sustainable manner, they discuss the benefits to brewers, the challenges of persuading more businesses to implement new sustainability measures in tough economic times, and how business owners can take their first steps in this direction.
Prior to the panel discussion, Craig is joined by James at Moffat Beach Brewing’s Caloundra Production House (where they’d recorded a future show) to look back at another big week in beer – and that was before the news about Fox Friday’s voluntary administration broke.
The Akasha-Wayward unification and rebirth of Molly Rose from liquidation, plus a recent post by Phil Cook on his Beer Diary site, spark a discussion about independence, its meaning and relevance, while Craig offers insight on Steve Jeffares’ takeover of the former Deeds Brewing site, after working with him on GABS for four years.
We pump up the launch of the Pint of Origin program ahead of the festival’s return on May 9, and in the middle of the show shout out the latest winners in the Have You Done A Rallings? campaign celebrating good beer citizens – nominate yours here.
Start of segments:
- 17:12 – Sustainability Panel Part 1
- 34:12 – Have You Done A Rallings Winners
- 38:49 – Sustainability Panel Part 2
Other relevant links
- Zevero's Starter Sustainability Kit For Brewers
- Bearhug Pallet Wraps
- Ecogrip
- Nominate a Brewery of the Month
To find out more about supporting the show or otherwise partnering with The Crafty Pint, contact craig@craftypint.com.
NB We mention a travel article on Québec in the intro, but publication has been pushed back due to the breaking news regarding Fox Friday.
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction and Craft Beer Scene
00:00:05
Speaker
Hello and welcome to the Crafty Pint Podcast. I'm James. And I'm not Will. No, you're not Will at all. You're you're Craig. and I am, yes. And um we're also not in the studio. We're not even in Melbourne. We're um here at the Moffat Beach Production Brewery. We're here on on my new neck of the woods, the Sunshine Coast, the craft beer capital of Australia, I'll have you know. And it's nice to welcome the Crafty Pint Podcast to what I think should be yeah beer's natural home here in
Upcoming Sustainability Podcast
00:00:29
Speaker
Queensland. Yeah, yeah know we're sat here because we just had a chat with Matt Wilson from Moffat Beach for a future podcast episode. It made sense keep the cameras rolling with our whole production team around us here, you know we already in one place gathered here. I know, and our feature panel, our feature interview this week is an episode on sustainability. We'll talk about this in a second, but that was something I recorded a few weeks ago. So in terms of our timeline,
00:00:52
Speaker
It's all messed up, but hopefully it all comes together in the in the wash. Yeah, I think
Industry Dynamics: Mergers and Liquidations
00:00:56
Speaker
so. And, you know, it's been a fairly, yeah well, a big week in news, which I think pretty much every week seems to be um at the minute in in an Australian craft beer. say, James, I'm really glad you got me on for my first sort of intro section for the podcast in in really what's been a ah pretty massive week in news. Yeah, yeah. um Thankfully, I have read a few articles and I haven't written any. And got some thoughts.
00:01:16
Speaker
I have thoughts. I have thoughts and feelings, James. Yeah. Yeah. No, it was pretty amazing. At the end of last week on the same day, we learned about Wayward and Akasha uniting the two businesses at the same time. Wakasha?
00:01:30
Speaker
Wakasha. I've seen Wakasha online. Will in our news went with Akashwood. I think I quite like Wakasha. Wakasha. I mean, it's Wakanda. It's Wakasha. It's what yahas like, there you go. um And then on the same day, Molly Rose Brewing reopened their venue. And I think it's a limited offering, limited hours, just 11 days after going into liquid liquidation. the de record A new record, by the way, I think. Is it? Yeah, I think Within the beer industry. Yeah. um Yes, the details there are still pretty limited. I know they're still doing limited offering for a while. um so yeah, we don't know a huge amount of what's happening there because I guess it has happened so soon. The process is still um ongoing. Yeah.
00:02:07
Speaker
But I think what's been interesting, you know, there's obviously some common ground between um so some of the what what's happened there. So, you know, so Wayward and Akash had both been through v a and know with with Molly Rose's sort of liquidation.
00:02:19
Speaker
Akash also liquidated and their Newcastle wing of the business not too long ago when they closed the Edwards, pretty much without warning, the pub they they'd bought in... Plus Waywood, I think, also having previously entered a joint venture or a merger with Batch to form that little, the the drinks collective. Yeah, yeah. why drinks i mean I think there's still that sort of shared distribution going on. But so it sort of, know it's different stories, different businesses, same day, but some sort of common ground
Impact on Community and Staff
00:02:45
Speaker
there. And I think what we found is generally looking at the sort of the,
00:02:49
Speaker
the feedback responses online that we've seen in some conversations we've had. A lot of people seem quite welcoming and positive about the merger, whatever you want to call it in Sydney, but also Molly Rose being back.
00:03:00
Speaker
Both stories have sort of prompted some of those other discussion points as well around, you know, in these sort of cases where you know whether there's liquidations or VAs, what happens to the staff, you know entitlements, that kind of stuff. We don't know the full details, certainly you know in and both of the recent cases, um but also potentially the impact on you know whether it's suppliers, creditors, you know what this actually means. I've seen other brewers you know jump upon from small breweries going.
00:03:25
Speaker
but yeah What's the impact on us when we've sort of kept our business tied? i think it's what Willie Simpson at Seven Sheds has said, you know that we're so you know we're sort of doing doing what we do.
Defining 'Independent' Breweries
00:03:35
Speaker
um And I think the other side of it that's been raised is and and Phil Cook, who actually presented the ah the inaugural and New Zealand Brewers Guild Beer Writer of the Year many moons ago. yeah yeah um He sort of rebooted his beer diary blog recently he's seen that, you know, the Wakasha issue as sort of a launch pad to discuss what does independence actually mean.
00:03:59
Speaker
Yeah, i am I caught Phil's article. He is he now he's in Australia now, isn't he? Yeah, he was he was running Rangers Appetit's Taproom for a while. Yeah, he was working at Stomping Ground for a while as well. But Phil writes under the blog Beer Diary at I think philcook.net. And he wrote a piece sort of probably a ah little bit semantically, but looking at the word independent and what that does, that still mean what we think it means. And, you know, he kind of made the draw the point of You've got small breweries merging. You've got Hawkers, White Bay. You've, you know, Local Drinks Collective. You've got all these different structures coming along. And um at what point does independent really still mean the word independent?
00:04:41
Speaker
And he he kind of, I guess, made the point that really when we say independent, when we're talking about that, we're really just meaning independent of the foreign ownership or foreign ownership and so on. and I think that and maybe independent of...
00:04:55
Speaker
the major retailers as as well. That's become a yeah bigger talking point, but the home brand beers, you know, having more prominence. it something It's something, it's story. It did actually resonate with me a fair bit. and And I kind of, maybe because I'm in marketing and communications and I i do think it's really important that we,
00:05:12
Speaker
find the way right way to sort of describe this industry and what what it means.
Supporting Local Breweries
00:05:16
Speaker
And, you know, I have no problems with the word independent. I think if you're naming a brewers association or using it as a collective term to describe an ownership structure, that's fine.
00:05:26
Speaker
But I do think it's really important that we get that story right to consumers and you know I've always had a little bit of a problem with the word independent. I don't think it has the same resonance with a consumer or someone buying a beer as it might mean to someone who owns a brewery.
00:05:41
Speaker
um I think when you you know at our core, we're consumers and we really know that it doesn't matter what business you're in, you can be in brewing or whatever, but no business is truly independent. You're dependent upon customers, you dependent upon investors, suppliers, staff, all of that.
00:05:57
Speaker
i you know we We don't operate in on an island basically. So I don't know what it is, but my personal preference, I i want to support Australian owned businesses and successful Australian owned businesses rather than foreign owned businesses where you know they they invest in the local community, they employ locals and so on. so I don't know if there's something in that that Phil has maybe touched on a little semantic thing that could be bigger. I've always liked local.
00:06:22
Speaker
Phil touched upon this this guy. Does that only really work for smaller businesses? But think local is something that's more easily understood. And I've always said, if you... you know, use local, you can bring someone into their local business, whether it is someone like Moffat here or, you know, Black Flag up the coast, whatever it might be.
00:06:37
Speaker
And once people are in, if they're engaged, then the owners or the staff can tell the story about we're in an independent business. And that to us means we're owned by mates or owned by family, you know, and and that way it's more engaging.
00:06:48
Speaker
think you should just be proud that you're an Australian owned business and that you've built something in our country that's, and and not with ah you know, a nationalistic or a jingoistic kind of sentiment to it, but uh you know i think it's it's a pretty awesome thing to have built something and i don't i don't care what the structure is if it's two businesses merging or whatever it might be but if they're investing in you know our region our country think you're seeing that at a state level like the western australians do it really well with that drink west drink best campaign uh even tasmania they've gotten right behind their local producers and suppliers it can be done and that story can be told but i think it needs to be
00:07:26
Speaker
told in a more compelling way.
Consumer Perceptions of 'Craft' and 'Independent'
00:07:27
Speaker
I think it's very hard also to to find a ah catch-all term or even a phrase. I remember saying to people years ago when the CBI became the IBA, and i was like, what's your one or two sentence catch phrase that says to people, this is why you should support independent brewers.
00:07:43
Speaker
It's the hardest thing. Yeah, it is. It's really hard. But I think I look back 11, 12 years ago when I was writing the intro to the beer books I wrote and sort of addressing what craft meant, you know, and ah mentioned twice in the intro now today, but Willie Simpson, who's the BRI, he sort of to said it's like in the castle, so it's the vibe.
00:08:00
Speaker
yeah And I was almost like that almost captures it better because there's so many to everybody, every every consumer or everybody in the industry, they have a different set of parameters as to what they'll accept.
00:08:12
Speaker
And so not, you know, craft to one person might mean something else to someone else. And I think really it almost is the vibe and, you know, there's maybe more easily definable stuff around independence, but I think Phil took
Consumer Knowledge and Market Changes
00:08:24
Speaker
touched upon it there. He'd rather support a business that it is a good business yeah and a good operator yeah um so maybe that's you know ultimately whatever the phrase or the explanation might be there's always going to be that gray area and that sort of debate but um yeah certainly yeah it's certainly a bit interesting to see that sort of debate coming up again i think often you do this sort of think the people that do know enough and care enough
00:08:47
Speaker
they probably have the knowledge to make the decision on whether they're going be impacted by that latest change or not. yeah And those that don't care enough or don't know enough, they're not going to care anyway. So, you know, um and it's ah in another way, almost like we need to push the beer bubble further out to catch more people as part of that. Maybe that it's getting more people involved in
Steve Jeffers' New Venture
00:09:08
Speaker
wanting to have that discussion. Yeah, yeah we can solve that in another podcast. Yeah, yeah for sure.
00:09:12
Speaker
um But then I guess and another big story that just and more recently seems to be a really positive one, one that you can probably give some insight on yeah is Steve Jeffers, the founder of the local Taphouse, Gabs, the Hottest 100.
00:09:25
Speaker
uh stomping ground he's taken over the form of deeds brewing space in glen iris planning to turn it into a hospital venue not brewing and people may not know but you worked alongside steve for a number of years running gabs so probably got so sort some thoughts again on on this i do i have lots of thoughts uh as mentioned james um No, Steve is ah an absolutely fantastic operator and I spoke to him yesterday after the news broke and he's very, very excited about taking on the the opportunity in the former Deeds Brewing Taproom and really for him it was kind of a
00:09:58
Speaker
I guess a match made in heaven where, you know, he's obviously built um the local tap house, starting his sort of beer journey there, um starting the Gab's Hottest 100 there, which then moved into Gab's, building those festivals out. And I worked with him for about four years, taking those festivals even further, um then Stomping Ground. and you know each of those things that he's sort of been involved in has just grown from strength to strength. And you know you you think of even those those four things we've mentioned, like they've been a big part of the conversation around Australian craft beer for a decade now. yeah um So I'm excited to see what he can do next with with the Deeds space. It is a fantastic venue and Deeds put a lot of time and money and investment into that space, creating a beautiful environment.
00:10:44
Speaker
um you know Steve is a person, he is a... ah like To me, he's just the classic entrepreneur. Like he's a very creative person. He's got always got a lot of ideas. He's maybe, and I think he'd be probably the first to say as well, he's probably not the best at executing the million and one ideas, but he's very good at building the right team around him to be able to cherry pick the good ones and and take them further. And I have no doubt he'll do that with um the deed space. I don't know what he's going to call the new venue yet, but yeah.
00:11:12
Speaker
i think watch this space i think it it'll it'll be beer but probably bigger than beer and and have a ah bit more going on there as well and you the one thing i like about steve and we kind of touched on this earlier as well is that whilst he's got lots of ideas and so on he's always been very very focused on the consumer experience so found that with gab's it was always about how can we every year make this thing better to bring in and bring in new elements to the event that would appeal to to female drinkers or to this particular community or this particular community how can we bring more people into the the world of better drinks i suppose so yeah yeah yeah for sure i mean yeah very well received fascinating to see what happened and i think talking and bringing more more people into beer or in this case beer festival we launched uh the full pint of origin
00:12:00
Speaker
festival site last week exciting and the program and after introducing the beer sorry the boiler water maker hub at whiskey and element last year this year we've introduced a beer cocktail hub at captain melville um and there's some really great foodie stuff going on as well so we're hoping bring more people into beer venue or traditionally beer venues, venues and bars and breweries over the 10 days, May 18th.
00:12:23
Speaker
I'm all about this.
Pint of Origin Festival
00:12:24
Speaker
Pine of Origin is awesome. One, from an industry point of view, we're not setting up an event on some greenfield site or in a convention center and charging people a ticket to go to it. Where basically it's a free event. People can join in at their leisure.
00:12:37
Speaker
It's pushing people into venues, so supporting industry. um You're also getting a chance to try beers that have never made it to Australian shores from all over the world. And it's become so much harder for them most venues to get hold of those beers as well. Now there's less beer being spent across the planet. you know I was speaking to the guys at Beer Mash a few weeks ago, and they were like,
00:12:55
Speaker
well We don't know we're actually going to be able to get hold of any Scandinavian beers and then they got hold of the right person they'd used last year and this one guy kind of pulling together this palette for them because most of the breweries over there aren't sending so much beer anymore. Like it's almost become more of an effort to bring this stuff here and to get the beers across the country.
00:13:13
Speaker
Mate, get some Rowling's nominations in. i don't want to I don't want to talk this event up too much, but Pine of Origin may just be the best festival in the entire world. So... Great. Get to pintoforigin.com. Get some tickets. Not tickets, but get get download your passport and get started. can buy tickets to some events, but yeah, if you head to pintoforigin.com, we've got the ah the venue announcement and some some other teaser videos going out at the minute every day, most days. So you keep an eye on the Crafty Pint socials for that. And yeah, it should be pretty just three and a bit weeks to go
Exploring Canadian Beer Scene
00:13:42
Speaker
now. So yeah not pretty exciting.
00:13:43
Speaker
and And we'll have a Pint of Origin in Canada venue again at White Hart in the CBD. um and if you We're keeping them very far away from the Pint of Origin USA. venue Yes, very true. um And yeah, if you want to learn a little bit about sort of what the Canadian beer scene, I'm actually going to ask one up on the website and just August on the eve of this podcast um about the beer scene in m Quebec.
00:14:06
Speaker
yeah So people will know John Preston. and He was the founder of one of the leading homebrew shops in in Australia, Greg McGrain. His daughter is now a his journalism doing a bit few pieces for us so george is living in canada at the minute and sent us a piece if any beer travel is going to quebec so you can check that will put that in the notes as well um but yeah so that's it's been a pretty um yeah full week yeah well you know you're on the sunshine coast now mate so time to kick back
00:14:37
Speaker
Island time here we go exactly so coming up in the break between the the main panel not so much interview at panel sustainability panel chat today we've got our latest winning winners in our have you done a railings campaign if you want to get your nominations in there that's craftypoint.com slash railings and also seeking more nominations for our bluestone yeast brewery of the month and celebration of great breweries around the country that's craftypint.com slash bluestone um which brings us to this week's main chat which was you craig this this so yeah this one's the idea a few weeks ago this one's the craig show uh no this one um i you know i i've got a personal interest in um sustainability and uh i know it's something that it's a topic that the crafty pint writes a lot about and we're um very rigorous in our coverage of
00:15:26
Speaker
of sustainable brewing and so on.
Sustainability in Brewing: Expert Panel
00:15:28
Speaker
And I wanted to, I guess, create a bit of a panel discussion that sought to demystify it a little bit for breweries, particularly if you're thinking about it, if you're thinking, how can I get started on that journey, make my beer more sustainably and better for the environment?
00:15:44
Speaker
So we put together this panel discussion around sustainability and we've got on there George Wade from Zavero, which is a UK business starting to work with a lot of Australian breweries led by Tom Delmont in particular.
00:15:58
Speaker
We've got Jono from EcoGrip, which makes sustainable can holders and Tom Field from Bearhug Pallet Wraps. These are all businesses that we've written about before, but it was a great opportunity to get them on board and just so talk through that process of what does sustainability mean how can we kind of simplify a little bit and what what's the low-hanging fruit how can breweries get started on the journey so it was a really good discussion and um yeah definitely enjoy it it's nice sippy chat so that's coming after the break and before then will's not here to do his usual slot i get guess i'll have to take over um
00:16:33
Speaker
enjoy the show and if you do please like and subscribe and you can even rate and leave a review or a comment on most platforms as well so please do five stars my friend five five stars all the way um and yeah thanks for you know hosting the intro with me today pretty much the whole podcast today craig so there you go enjoy cheers
00:16:55
Speaker
All aboard! Get ready to travel the world of beer at 22 pubs, bars and breweries across Melbourne this May. Next stop, Pint of Origin Festival.
00:17:06
Speaker
Visit pintoforigin.com.
00:17:13
Speaker
Guys, welcome to the Crafty Pint podcast. Today, I'm thrilled to have you all here. We've developed what I think is a little special sustainability expert panel. And really the idea today, you know, go a lot of industry conferences, I go to events, I talk to brewers out there.
00:17:29
Speaker
um Sustainability is a huge topic of conversation and it's something that the Crafty Pint covers rigorously. um Some of the questions I get are really around, i guess, sustainability is a big thing. They want to drill drill down on kind of how does a brewery become more sustainable and how do they do it in a cost effective way that ideally is going to even save some money. So today we put together a ah panel of gut guns from across the industry. We've got George Wade from Zavero, Jono Bunce from EcoGrip and Tom Field from Bearhug.
00:18:03
Speaker
Guys, welcome to the podcast. Thanks for having us. Good to be with you. Guys, that it's going to be a fun moment. don't think we've had a panel before with with three people, three guests on the podcast. So we'll we'll see how we go. But I'll kind of talk to each of you at this different times. But George, let me let me start with you from Zavero. Tell me about Zavero. i How did the business kind of, what's the business about? What's the problem that you're trying to solve for Australian Brewers?
00:18:32
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. Uh, thanks very much for having me. um Um, yeah, Zavira was started four years ago. Uh, and actually interestingly enough, when I looked at kind of who was on this, uh, and seeing something about pallet wrap was actually one of the the reasons that led me into, to working in the industry that I'm in.
00:18:48
Speaker
Um, and effectively I was working with organizations, big and small on helping them understand how they can actually move the needle on sustainability. What is the impact of their business?
00:18:59
Speaker
And I found a lot of companies focusing on things like pallet wrap. And that is obviously an incredibly important part from a wastage perspective, but I was wanting to understand beyond the waste side, what are the biggest sources of emissions and, you know, specifically for consumer goods based companies.
00:19:13
Speaker
And interestingly enough, you know, that trigger in my mind was about how do I make the visible data from things like pallet wrap. That's easy for people to understand the impact, but the invisible information, which is all of the emissions that go within it.
00:19:28
Speaker
So now at Zavira and over the last four years, we've worked with organizations, big and small breweries across the world to ultimately help them measure, reduce and report on their emissions. So we work with breweries, um whether that's Asahi in Japan through to companies across Australia, UK to help them actually reduce their impact, but understand what it is and where it comes from um with that really kind of focused lens on brewing and the industry itself.
00:19:55
Speaker
ah So, and George, you're primarily focused on on carbon emissions as the main metric. Yeah, absolutely. Greenhouse gas emissions. So it's the, all those other funny ones that are included. So it's CO2 equivalent is kind of how you'd see it talked about.
00:20:09
Speaker
um But yeah, our focus is around greenhouse gas emissions, but we also do loads of other great stuff around things like reporting, supplier engagement and and and things like that as well. So it's it's all in the realms of sustainability, but greenhouse gas emissions and CO2 is that number that gets the yeah it gets the the world going ultimately in our space.
00:20:29
Speaker
Mate, you mentioned that word sustainability. and I'd love to just kind of, I guess, set the framework for that earlier in the discussion, but it's a big word. and And I think for business, it can mean a lot of things. It can be, you know, how you make your products, how you source your ingredients, how you transport your products, all of these different elements.
00:20:48
Speaker
I guess for a small brewery, like how do you kind of just wrap their head around that big concept and give them a tangible starting point? Like what's the what's the place to get to?
00:20:59
Speaker
Yeah, it's it's a really great question. And actually a fellow Australian, I heard speak about this in ah CBC Craft Brewers Congress in Vegas last year was James Perrin.
00:21:11
Speaker
And he said a lot of great things around around this. And he was actually saying sustainability is what matters most to that brewery. So from from my world, sustainability is around ah the climate, but sustainability is about things like what's your impact that you have on your and community and things like that as well. so From the world of sustainability, it's about how do you create a business that cares about where you are and the the impact you have. But from my world, which is around kind of sustainability from a climate perspective and and solving that greenhouse gas emission number, I think the biggest thing for people to kind of, there's lots of complexity, but at the same time, it's super simple.
00:21:44
Speaker
I remember my co-founder initially does these technical terms, scope one, two, three. When he first started and sold to his first brewery, didn't really understand them enough. So he just said, ignore all of that. because he didn't want to explain what it was. he said, just think about everything that you buy.
00:21:59
Speaker
your brewery operations and when you make beer and what happens when you sell it. And it's simply as much as that is what ingredients are you buy and where you buying them from, who cares about sustainability with the ingredients you're buying?
00:22:11
Speaker
How do you do it in the most efficient way, which has brewers everyone wants to do anyway, right? Cause it saves you money. And then ultimately at the end of it is how do you sell that and what's the impact that you can have in the community and things like that as well. So I think that's the easiest way for people to understand sustainability is work with yourself of like, what is the most important thing for you as a business?
00:22:28
Speaker
But then from a climate side, it's really assessing everything that you buy, everything that you do in the in the brew house and the production, and then kind of the the packaging formats and the great solutions like Bearhug, Tom, which we'll we'll get into on ah how you can actually kind of make the difference with the with the products that you sell as well.
00:22:45
Speaker
Yeah, nice. I think that's a really nice way to put it. um Tom, let's
Innovations in Sustainable Practices
00:22:49
Speaker
let's jump to you. So, Bearhug, you guys have developed developed these really cool reusable palette wraps. I saw my first one literally yesterday and I was very excited.
00:23:00
Speaker
Mate, give me the backstory here. Where did the idea come from ah for Bearhug palette wraps? I guess, um, first few days out of high school, I went straight over to motors transport and started working there, driving a small truck around Sydney.
00:23:15
Speaker
Um, and I think I just calculated the other day over the four years I was there, I probably used about 300 kilos of soft plastic myself. Um, so I think we're starting to make amends for that a bit.
00:23:28
Speaker
Um, But yeah, it's it's actually not a product we developed. It's something that's been around since the 90s. think it was invented in Canada. um And ah when I yeah first started looking at the problem and what something can be done, um we just ordered in some existing products, tested them out at Modus, um and then started getting our own in.
00:23:51
Speaker
ah But the glaring thing there was that there's something that I can use because I'm delivering, know, cases for 20 different brewers and then across 20 different bottle shops and can take that rep back at the end of the day. But you know the vast majority of pallet movement relies on stuff moving between multiple parties.
00:24:10
Speaker
So I guess the two glaring barriers we saw there are the lack of a pooling system, any system for moving them between people, and the lack of automation because, you know, any big company is going to need something fully automated to be able to adopt.
00:24:28
Speaker
Yeah, wow. And mate, just to, I guess, paint the picture of the size of the problem, um you know, give me the stats. Like, is there any way that we can kind of estimate just how much pallet wrap is is used around the world at any one time?
00:24:42
Speaker
ah love stats. I love stats. Yeah. we to stats are good there's about five billion pallets in the world some of them are just you sitting idle in a warehouse some are getting used every two three days it's definitely a pretty variable thing um but there is about five million tons of pallorap used every year that's enough to wrap around the earth sixteen thousand five hundred times a year yeah and It seems, I don't know if it does seem like a small percent, but 1.5% of all the plastic waste in the world is from pallet wrap.
00:25:20
Speaker
And I guess it does make sense when you're in the industry and you see that, you know, you might be using X amount of plastic on each product, but for every hundred or so, you've got half a kilo of soft plastic going along with it.
00:25:32
Speaker
and And it's not, you know, it's just, it's used once and then pretty much thrown away, isn't it? It's not like, there's nothing reusable about it. Yeah, and it's yeah pretty up in the air about what's recycled about it as well.
00:25:45
Speaker
ah Mate, well, very exciting. wellll um And Jono, let's talk EcoGrip now. You guys, you make and sell can carriers, which are those little plastic clips that go on your four pack or your six pack and and so on. And so it's certainly, i guess it's not a new thing, but a what's different about your range? How are you doing things differently?
00:26:07
Speaker
Thanks, Craig. um So EcoGrip is the only 100% Australian Australian owned recycled plastic can carrier on the market. That 100% Australian made flows through all areas of our business, from the manufacturing of the tooling, the molds, sourcing the recycled content that EcoGrip's are made out of and um producing the product.
00:26:28
Speaker
It's all made onshore in Victoria. When we came on board, there was no um option for any any breweries or beverage manufacturers to source anything locally.
00:26:39
Speaker
Everything had to be imported in from overseas. And that carries with it the carbon footprint of you know shipping things in, as well as bringing more plastic onshore without um you know adequate recycling going on to to to make use of it.
00:26:54
Speaker
Yeah, nice. And um what what took you down we took you down the path to, i guess, this recyclable plastic? i've I've seen a few other options out there, you know, clips made from bamboo or even those card recycled cardboard. Like, um was there a journey to get to the 100% recycled solution?
00:27:16
Speaker
um What took me down that down that journey was I own another business, which is an engineering business, and we cater to um servicing the nation's food and beverage packaging sector.
00:27:29
Speaker
And so I've always had a lot of experience in plastics. It's um it's something that that you know I grew up with him or throughout my career. And...
00:27:40
Speaker
I've also been a massive craft beer drinker and a massive supporter of craft beer. And so those two things just sort of married up. And I realized for a long time, there was no local option.
00:27:53
Speaker
And then when COVID hit, we had to get pretty creative with how we were going to i keep the engineering business busy. So we basically became our own customer for a little bit. yeah And yeah, created EcoGrip.
00:28:04
Speaker
and The market's been um picked it up very, very um overwhelming support on EcoGrip. A lot of customers are very concerned about their carbon footprint. So importing plastic from overseas you know is is is something they were all very concerned about.
00:28:20
Speaker
And, yeah, over the last few years, we went from a few breweries to being one of the most recognizable can carrier brands in the market. And we're on top of we are on top of many great beers in every bottle shop in Australia now, which is something, yeah. Yeah, nice.
00:28:37
Speaker
Is there a question of, um you know, when you're thinking about developing a new product, it's like it's form form over function. and And, you know, I think you can look at other products ecologically friendly alternatives and but maybe they don't do the job as well as a as a plastic solution you you know cardboard goes soft in the fridge your bamboo ones might sort of uh yeah not not carry the weight properly of a ah pack of cans um but you know yeah yeah you definitely is is that a question from an engineering mindset
00:29:10
Speaker
Yeah, you've definitely hit the nail on the head. i mean, plastics um are versatile and all those other products definitely have their place. um i From what I was, the feedback I was getting from breweries is...
00:29:25
Speaker
on a mass scale, they are hard. it It is hard to use those, those types of, um, the more paper, cardboard, bamboo options. Um, uh, yeah, plastics for better or worse are are here to stay. So, um, yeah, it was about finding a more sustainable way of, of, of using, of using that and supplying something like that.
00:29:45
Speaker
and Can they be reused Jonathan? Yes. Yes. Yes. They can be unclipped and reclipped and, um, Yeah, a lot of bottle shops have their own take back things, so they will reuse them in bottle shops, brew pubs reuse them. um Yes, they can be reused, recycled.
00:30:03
Speaker
Yeah. It's probably, i don't know if there's a next phase to it, Jono, but I see lots of posts on beer social groups and things like that with people with these huge stacks of of can carriers and yeah creating that that second layer of that circular economy of where can they you know hand them in for some sort of benefit or whatever it might be.
00:30:25
Speaker
Yeah, yeah that's um that's definitely something we're looking at as a take-back scheme so that we can basically cut out the middleman of the recycling centres. it's Yeah, that is the next the next stage. it's It's quite an involved process, as you can imagine, because you'll be dealing with hundreds of different sites all over Australia and trying to bring that bring that back. But that's something that we're working on for sure. Mm-hmm.
Motivations for Brewery Sustainability
00:30:51
Speaker
George, let's talk about, um I guess, the motivations for a brewery looking to become more sustainable. In your experience with Zavero and working with a number of breweries now in in Australia and the UK, a why do breweries want to become more sustainable? Is it is it kind of a, you know, the owner environmentally conscious, is that that motivation? Are they looking to, is it a sales angle? Like, i you know,
00:31:17
Speaker
um impress upon their consumers what they're doing or is it about just saving money first and foremost like what what are the things that you're seeing yeah i think it really interestingly varies uh across different countries um but also kind of with different kind of companies themselves as well right so in the uk when we first started we worked with ah kind of a lot of breweries and i think that there's an inherent uh evidently within craft beer or as my ah colleague Tom Delmont tells me good beer in in Australia and that effectively people care about their product right they want to produce a good product they want to craft a great product so there's an inherent kind of
00:31:59
Speaker
nurture around what it is they're producing. So we quickly found that breweries do care about not just their product, but also about the impact they have. And it's also a very physical kind of game, right? So whether it's Tom, you're working and you're driving around and recognizing all this pallet wrap, or if you're a brewer and you're getting kind of spent grain and then putting it into a container for it to be taken to a farm or whatever it might be, there's a really physical element to it. And I think that's where the initial interest from a brewer's perspective comes into it.
00:32:28
Speaker
So that's kind of where they're like the the desire to do something because it feels right comes from. Now, I'm not going to lie. There's a lot of obviously competing challenges within the brewing industry right now and sustainability, rightly so, or wrongly so, is not necessarily always top of that list. It's about making sure that we produce great beer, that we can do that in a way that makes the most sense and people can stay afloat.
00:32:49
Speaker
Otherwise there is no point in in sustainability in the first place. So in the UK, we have a lot more legislation with like big grocers and things like that, which is really putting the pressure on from the big grocers to kind of the midsize to now in the in the craft beer side of things as well.
00:33:05
Speaker
But what we're finding most of all in like Australia with what we're doing at the moment and the the customers that we work whether that's like Cop Nation and the guys like that is that there is an increasing need for this data to be used for whether that's tenders or from the sales side, but also it's working with companies and with with kind of businesses that do really care about this as well. So i think it ranges.
00:33:27
Speaker
There are a lot of benefits that come with it, especially in that kind of first mover adoption. The guys at like Rocky Ridge who have been doing this for a long time and you know people associate their brand with something which is aiming to do better for the planet. So I think that in this new age, that's really a factor, but there's lots of different reasons. And and my job is to in a sales process or just generally when I'm getting to know a brewery is to understand like what it is that will allow this to work for them.
00:33:53
Speaker
And that could be anything from an efficiency perspective, or it can be around what does it mean to be that brand and and does this exemplify what they want to achieve? um And our goal is to make it as kind of affordable and as feasible for companies to do that as well.
00:34:14
Speaker
And we'll be back in just a moment, but first we're here to announce our next Have You Done a Rowlings winner. James, now we've been running this campaign with the support of Rowlings label stickers and packaging for a little while now, as you know, and hopefully our listeners are aware this campaign came about, I guess, ah inspired by all the good beer citizens out there, the folks that kind of go above and beyond. They really embody that spirit of collaboration and sharing knowledge, sharing, you know, helping each other out that we see so often across craft beer.
00:34:45
Speaker
um I would put a call out to to everyone listening. I would say that, you know, we had a big burst of nominations when we kind of first launched. um It's definitely trickled off a little bit. So I would encourage everyone to I'm pretty sure there's still people out there doing good deeds around the beer industry and I'm sure in this you know time where things are a bit challenging, people would really appreciate that.
00:35:06
Speaker
Pat it on the back, knowing that what they're doing is being recognised. I'm just amazed no one's nominated me yet. Hint, hint, people who I work with. um I've pretty much worked for praise. I will work ah for praise and that's how I i live and operate. so Okay, noted. Stop paying you.
00:35:24
Speaker
Giving people a little bit a shout out. All I want a shout out, James. That's it. So we're back again. We've got a couple of nominations here. I think shortlisted. We've got someone on the list there, James. Well, I'm technically on holiday at the minute. I'm a Smith. I'm here with some Smiths. I'm in Queensland. this one ticked a few boxes for me.
00:35:42
Speaker
ah Nominator is Brendan Smith, and he's nominated his brother, Matt Smith, a graphic artist who has designed logos and helped market Cairns Brewery McAllister's, so one of the small breweries up in far north Queensland. Mm-hmm.
00:35:53
Speaker
Apparently Matt relocated to New Zealand, came across some hot varieties and products not yet available in Australia, sent back to Michaelis for them to try out. And he says he was always supporting this small up and coming brewery.
00:36:04
Speaker
I think he deserves some recognition. So I like that, you know, it's someone who's no longer got an attachment to the brewery other than he likes it and just try to help them, you know, find something new to do. And to despite the fact having left the country. So i thought that was pretty cool.
00:36:15
Speaker
There you go. a Nice little honorable mention for Matt Smith. And um who's our our lucky winner for this week's Have You Done a Rally? Well, and this one is maybe a little bit <unk>s very timely, maybe a little bit in-house, but it's tied um to a pint of origin festival. um Presented by the Crafty Pint. Presented by the Crafty Pint starting on May the 9th this year. Nice. um So the nominations come in from Dave at the Woodlands Hotel, being a part of origin venue for a number of years.
00:36:41
Speaker
They represent regional New South Wales, and it turns out that they've always been getting a lot of beers from ah really sort of wide scope around regional New South Wales. And it turns out that much of this comes down to one man, which is Michael Cichocchi from Tumut River Brewing. he was one of the guys that brought the brewery back for him, that having been closed late last year um with it um as's one of his former colleagues, Mary.
00:37:03
Speaker
It turns out that the part of the reason that Dave's been know to get so many beers on tap for Pine of Origin is that Michael, on his travels around the region, will drive around across huge swathes of regional New South Wales. It is famously a very large area. Exactly.
00:37:17
Speaker
Picking up one or two kegs from breweries, you know, you know on up on the coast, in the Snowy Mountains, in the whole wider region, sticking them in his van, and he'll then drive them down with with the tumult beers that are going to be tapped at the woodlands.
00:37:28
Speaker
um And I think, you know, Hopefully people are aware of what goes into running festivals. You've been involved in running gabs. you know There's a lot of stuff goes on behind the scenes, but tens, dozens, hundreds of people potentially involved pulling these things off. And I think to hear that, you know I guess this one you know one guy from one brewery, yes, he wants to have some Tumont River brewing beers on at the festival, but he's also willing to sort of celebrate the whole region. So I thought someone going out of the way like that to actually support other businesses who you could potentially say it would be his competitors is pretty awesome.
00:37:57
Speaker
So yeah, hats off to to Michael and there thanks to Dave at the Woodlands for the nomination. Yeah, nice one. And and both ah Michael and Dave will receive a ah nice little voucher from Rowling's Label Stickers and Packaging for getting involved, both for nominating and for winning the the Have You Done a Rowling's competition this week.
00:38:15
Speaker
um Guys, definitely get get on it. Think of that that good beer person in your life, someone who's helped you, helped your brewery, helped your your beers get out there into the world or maybe to a festival.
00:38:26
Speaker
um Jump onto craftypint.com forward slash Rallings. It takes two seconds and it can mean something pretty special to everyone involved. Craig would love multiple nominations, I'm I would, I would. I really feel I am deserving. So there you go Excellent.
00:38:40
Speaker
Anyway, we'll back to the main show. Back to the show. Cheers. Cheers.
Guide to Starting Sustainability Journey
00:38:49
Speaker
George, is there kind of a simple, I guess, starter kit of sustain sustainability measures that you would suggest to a brewery when they first come on board with Zavero? i What's the low-hanging fruit? How can they kind of get started?
00:39:04
Speaker
Yeah, well, luckily we put together a whole guide on this for the last few years of all the work we've done. Yeah, exactly. here's Here's what came out of the oven. um But yeah, there's there's loads of different things that we can do. And I mean, for me, the the first and foremost is just in kind of involving the team, right?
00:39:20
Speaker
How many of those projects that you you start maybe personally in ah in a company or by yourself that you don't bring the right people in who really care about this, that's where we see this dive. And I have the same from whether it's We work with a company and they just don't, they're not able to bring everyone around it. That's the biggest thing for me is start by bringing people together.
00:39:39
Speaker
Again, go back to that question you asked earlier. It's like, why is sustainability important for us and what does it mean for us? Because then you've got company-wide buy-in and you can't really kind of get away with not doing it at that point. And then there's a couple of other kind of small things. It's everything from kind of looking at your energy supplier. Obviously there's stuff like solar PV, which is upfront cost, but it's ultimately about like going through those, that list of, okay, where are we?
00:40:02
Speaker
currently producing emissions. How can we look at reducing that? um Interestingly for, you you know, breweries, what they can control is how do they be as efficient as possible with the ingredients that they're using, the gas, et cetera.
00:40:17
Speaker
But then more broadly, if companies are kind of looking to expand beyond that, Malt is typically the single biggest emission source for them. So they can look at kind of who they're using and and things like that. But I'm sure we'll be able to find a way to get either in the show notes, the link to the free guide or some other way people can message me. but Yeah, there's there's lots of great things. And I think it's really about just thinking about who do you need to get involved to get started.
00:40:41
Speaker
And ah by all means, that does not mean paying any money to somebody like me. ah You do need not need to do that before you can do anything to to take advantage of of opportunities.
00:40:52
Speaker
And I think it's probably, it'd be quite revealing, wouldn't it, to look at something like that? and And, you know, wouldn't have thought off the top of my head that malt was one of the biggest impacts, I guess. But yeah, you're right. Like, it's that downstream and upstream, to use some jargon, looking both ways along the along the timeline.
00:41:12
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. there's There's loads of stuff that we found. and And I think the other thing as well is like every brewery is different. um We've worked with companies here in the UK that sell basically all their beer within a 10 mile radius of where the brewery is.
00:41:25
Speaker
And they've got no emissions really from transport. So until you really go through that, you can then start to assess like what that looks like and and where your emissions might come from. But it's a really great exercise of what we can do and and how we can help companies understand what that looks like and yeah it's been It's been wicked starting the company four years ago to now having you know the guys, whether it's Bodriggy or Hop Nation, kind of trusting us in Australia. And we know that there's a lot of opportunity for us to help help people cut emissions and and and cut costs at the same time.
00:41:55
Speaker
Mate, you mentioned cost and that is the big one, George. Tom, I'd love to ask you from Bearhug's perspective, um I reckon cost is probably ah the number one perceived barrier to doing things more sustainably.
00:42:11
Speaker
is it still Is there a perception out there that um doing things the green way or the right way or the sustainable way is more expensive, is is you know is going to add cost to the bottom line? Is that perception still out there? And and I guess what do you say to counter that?
00:42:26
Speaker
It's out there, but I think it's definitely changing. um i mean, reducing waste and inefficiency is kind of by its nature going to reduce costs if you're not having to you know pay for the collection of throwing something out and instead you can get a bit of cash back by recycling it or if you can, for example,
00:42:45
Speaker
What we always go with for the sort of ah benchmark for pricing for the reusable wraps, obviously it's a reasonable asset. So, yeah know, how much you're saving depends on how much use you can get out of it.
00:42:57
Speaker
But with a wrap lasting a thousand uses, costing 150 bucks, that's 15 cents each time you wrap a pallet versus $1.50. Yeah, wow. And then obviously it's just down to individual circumstances for a reusable um asset.
00:43:13
Speaker
ah But, you know, On the whole, I think sustainable sustainable companies get their impact from like scaled adoption. So know there's a lot of companies out there that will charge a premium on a sustainable product, but I think that the majority are probably just looking to make more impact.
00:43:32
Speaker
um And so especially if you're in an industry that's so cost-focused, then cost is king and you've got to price for that. but I think on the whole as well.
00:43:44
Speaker
Yeah, go on. Tom, do you have to buy the... um buy the pallet so like do you rent them like in terms of that like 15 cents versus one one dollar fifty how does it work our rental is 18 cents per day and that's uh what we do via the pooling system so that's 18 cents per day for a pallet wrap 12 cents per day for a keg wrap and that allows brewers to send them through their supply chain wholesale is 3pls whereas uh just buying them outright is you know generally going to pay off better in the long term
00:44:16
Speaker
yeah But yeah I guess you're right, Tom. I think, you know, I use the analogy of like the solar panel industry and, you know, 10 years ago or 15 years ago, it was deemed as it was a massive expense to just ah a household to put solar panels on the roof. But, you know, you're going to get your money back or your value back over an extended period of time. And just as as time goes on, technology gets better. The industry becomes more widespread and adopted. And,
00:44:43
Speaker
all of a sudden it becomes a really feasible sum where you can you can invest and you'll make your money back in a couple of years that rather than the you know the five or 10 years in the past. um I think we're seeing that just the fact that you know we've got these three guys, all companies that have been formed in the last, what, five years or so, that that there's more, I guess, suppliers out there offering i cheaper solutions or or um more widespread adoption of solutions that makes it more palatable for a brewery.
00:45:13
Speaker
Yeah, as the products mature, as the more competition comes in cost is always going to come down the long run. Tom, I'm curious because I i think as well you you've maybe benefited a little bit from, um or not benefited, but building off the back of the likes of Kegstar and Convoy with their keg pooling models, which you know was ah the previous solution was breweries would have to invest heavily in their own stainless steel and kegs.
00:45:40
Speaker
and all the transport and logistics that went around that. we've We've now seen a widespread adoption of a keg rental or leasing model um through those guys. this is I kind of see this as like taking it to that next step of, well, what do you wrap those kegs in?
00:45:55
Speaker
One of the big, you know, the world of shipping, logistics, warehousing, you mentioned 3PLs. It's a pretty complicated system out there. How have you gone about kind of ah getting that adoption of of those guys? and And do you think ah the fact that we've already got the KEG model, has that helped that with that?
00:46:14
Speaker
Yeah, definitely. I mean, we're starting, we're launching in the US in three weeks or so. And we've started having conversations around pooling there and it's not not something I think that has as much recognition there. So we're not getting, you know, we're not seeing the interest that we see here.
00:46:31
Speaker
um And yeah, I guess with the the kegs as well, Um, we've just started with LickX. They're now using, um, reasonable wraps on some of their empty keg returns to brewers.
00:46:42
Speaker
Um, so that's also a great one that we can piggyback where, you know, rather than a brewer having to pay, um, a delivery fee to get more reasonable wraps in that they'll then, you know, sorry to,
00:46:53
Speaker
To step back a bit and show how the system works, it's, you know as I said before, the 18 cents per wrap per day subscription for whatever's there in your warehouse, on your account. When you send them off, transfer them to your wholesalers, you stop paying for those.
00:47:07
Speaker
um And I guess, yeah, so that's something that significantly cuts the cost for customers now is that, you know, the empty kegs will be coming in with reasonable wraps on them um and you're just not paying that to the roof anymore.
00:47:20
Speaker
Yeah, nice. Yeah. No, very cool.
Sustainable Packaging and Recycling
00:47:23
Speaker
Jono, mate, I would love to pick your brain about recycling in particular because it's something I am very ah curious about and and you see a lot of ah news in the media around um how our country is actually doing in terms of recycling.
00:47:38
Speaker
um You know, I guess like most Australians, I... kind of have the assumption that I throw everything in the bin with the yellow lid and it just goes off to some magic place and gets turned into milk cartons or something. um i don't think that's quite true, is it? Like, give give me the, what's the real story?
00:47:54
Speaker
Well, you're you're pretty close. um So these days, ah curbside recycling in Australia is a lot more sophisticated than it used to be. Your recycled material that goes into your bin, um it gets picked up, obviously sent to a set ah sorting centre. It gets sorted out, cleaned, and then it can go on to another place to get broken down into resins and pallets.
00:48:19
Speaker
And then that is then on sold to manufacturers who will then turn that into products. Eco groups themselves, they start their life as milk jugs. And they then, through that recycling process, they are repurposed, given a new life instead of ending up in landfill.
00:48:34
Speaker
I guess, is this a ah message, you know, that idea of like we're turning milk cartons into your beer car beer carriers and we're doing it locally, we're doing it without with minimal transport and impact and so on.
00:48:46
Speaker
is that Is that a message that i resonates with customers, with beer drinkers? Is that something that I guess a brewer can communicate um on their can carrier or on their cans or on their websites and so on? um What's your thoughts there?
00:49:01
Speaker
Yeah, I definitely think that it's ah a message that will resonate with consumers, especially if it's viewed with a realistic understanding of plastic use. um The ongoing efforts to reduce single-use plastic and the environmental impact of single-use plastic are really commendable.
00:49:16
Speaker
But plastics as a whole probably aren't going away anytime soon. So as ah as a society and ah as ah as an industry, we need to start looking for ways to reuse and repurpose the plastics that we're currently using.
00:49:29
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. Nice one. Well, um guys, we're going to wrap up in a minute, but I'd love to kind of finish our session. um i guess I'd just love like, you know, one or two little pieces of advice from each of you on i on how brewers can get started on this journey and and what I guess they'd get out of it. Like what's the return on their investment?
00:49:51
Speaker
um George, hit me. What do what do you got? Yeah, I think ah from from my side in terms of that investment, piece is to really work out like your why.
00:50:02
Speaker
It's if you've got a reason behind it, if you've got an understanding, you've got like Jonathan, Tom, you started companies, you understand your why is what you want to do it. Brewery is the same. They want to produce great beer, but they wanted to do it for a reason. So kind of understanding how sustainability fits into that why is the one the one thing for me.
00:50:20
Speaker
I think the the final thing there is like the reason why people will benefit from it is what we're seeing across the board is that sustainability is becoming this, this hygiene factor. And, and that's to say that it's becoming something which you kind of almost have to do and have to think about.
00:50:34
Speaker
And anyone that doesn't do it will be left behind the same way that, you know maybe a few years ago, if you did it, it was like, wow, that's exciting. That's really cool. Now it's actually, okay, yeah, cool. You're taking steps to, to reduce your impact on the planet. You're trying to be more sustainable.
00:50:48
Speaker
We expect that of you. And I think coming from the UK and, where I see that a lot more and any company that's kind of not taking that impact and has not gone through that process already is feeling very much behind. Um, you know, I have conversations with brewers who go, I really wish we started this couple of years ago because we see all these great people.
00:51:08
Speaker
Luckily they're always pointing to my, my clients, which is always nice doing great things. Um, and we want to be there. and And I think for, for people to understand that it doesn't, they don't just get to there overnight. It's actually about recognizing that it's a journey, bringing the right people together and finding that reason.
00:51:23
Speaker
um and And then a lot of benefits come with it as well, I think. I love the way you said that it's like a hygiene factor. It's kind of, um you know, you you look back 60, 70 years or whatever, and it was occupational health and safety. And, you know, how are we operating a business for the, but keeping our workers safe? And it's kind of an extension of that. Now it's like, well, how are we operating a business, keeping our workers safe, but also keeping our planet safe? and yeah It's a great, great little analogy.
00:51:51
Speaker
Yeah, I've actually used that a lot in the past. I was going to say health and safety was a nightmare administrative burden, which I'm sure for a lot of people it still is. But companies found a way to get through that. and And everyone hates sustainability for it being a burden data wise. Now, we try to solve that.
00:52:07
Speaker
But I think it will get to the point where it's so easy for everyone to to get that layer in. It's about who can make the action kind of happen quickest and who can really reduce the emissions as well. Well, I'm sure back in you know the industrial revolution times, they would have had a podcast like this and it would have been, well, how can we stop people getting their arms caught in machinery? and And now it's how can we reduce our greenhouse gas emission?
00:52:31
Speaker
Times change, but the the problems are the same.
00:52:36
Speaker
Tom, what's your what's your nugget? what's What can you tell us? I guess, um, for a lot of, you know, service based companies or whatever out there, like, you know, your, your emissions and your waste can be quite a complex abstract thing, but I think for product based companies like brewers often it's right in front of you and it's a pretty visceral thing.
00:52:57
Speaker
So, um, you know, i think it's just taking the time to like, just stand in the warehouse and look around and sort of think on the logic of, you know, if you're If you've got a lot of empty miles on trucks, there's platforms out there to fill those empty miles. If you've got pallet wrap in your warehouse that you're putting on and then cutting off a day later in the same warehouse, then there's solutions out there.
00:53:22
Speaker
And often they're pretty simple. ah you Do you know any solutions there, Tom? for that pallet wrap situation? um Unfamiliar. Yeah. it's um You're right. It's such a visible thing that brewers do. you know you're you've We've all been on the brewery tours. We've all had the, this is you know how the beer is made. Here's how it's packaged. It comes out. It's a very simple process and very easily understood by a consumer. And I think,
00:53:50
Speaker
it's you know You can very quickly identify um small tweaks that make a big impact and then most importantly, you can communicate that to your customers for ah ah you know to to benefit your brand, benefit your impression and and so on.
00:54:05
Speaker
it Jono, mate, last man on the on the on the pod. Here we go. Give me the the nugget from Ego Group. Yeah, look, I probably just echo what the other podcast guests have said. It's it's a lot about your input. That's the easy way out.
00:54:19
Speaker
Yeah, I know. but it's it's but it's But it's true though, isn't it? it's ah It is. It's about your input. I myself run a manufacturing business and um it's it's about looking at those inputs.
00:54:32
Speaker
It's... ah not necessarily always looking for those big ticket items like solar power, but you can be those, that real low hanging fruit of that everyday item. no How can, how can you get a more sustainable outcome out of your packaging out of yeah your transport?
00:54:50
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. And packaging is is probably the, it's such a, um you know, single use plastic is probably the the the devil in in in all of sustainability. It's the one that draws probably the most attention out of, um because it is so visible every day in everyone's lives. um you can You can really tell a story with that. And I think you know making a small change on something that it might look like a little one piece of plastic, one clip, but you know it's billions of them every year that are going out. So making a small change there can make a big difference.
00:55:25
Speaker
um Guys, thank you so much. This has been great. And I'm thrilled with this three-person panel thing. This seemed to work pretty well. So I really appreciate your time this morning and this evening, George. And yeah, look out for it on the Crafty Pint podcast. Thanks so much.
00:55:42
Speaker
Thank you. i so Sorry for getting everyone up early this morning. All good, mate. All good. Cheers, guys.
00:55:51
Speaker
The Crafty Pint podcast is produced and edited by Matt Hoffman. You can get all your beer-related news and reviews on the Crafty Pint website, craftypint.com, and can stay up to date on future podcast episodes via our socials.
00:56:05
Speaker
We wouldn't be able to produce the podcast or the website, events or festivals we run without the support of the beer industry, whether that's suppliers, bars, breweries or bottle shops. If you'd like to support the show or partner with The Crafty Pine in other ways, please reach out to Craig via the details in the show notes.
00:56:21
Speaker
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