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EPISODE 28 - The inside story between Drake Maye and Joe Milton. Featuring Pats Pro!
313 Plays26 days ago
Drake Maye and Joe Milton Drama
Patriots draft talk
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction and Guest Appearance
00:00:00
Savage Boston
Alright guys, welcome back to the Savage Boston Podcast. We are here at 8.30 sharp on April 8th, 2025.
00:00:05
Bret
you
00:00:08
Savage Boston
We are here only probably about you know two and a half, almost two weeks before the draft. Uh, finally, finally coming up. We've spent a long time, a long time coming and a lot of draft prep and too many mock drafts.
00:00:22
Savage Boston
So, uh, happy it's almost here.
00:00:22
Snooty
So.
00:00:24
Savage Boston
We got a special guest with us today. your favorite citizen insider, as he says from Twitter, Pat's pro. How you doing, Pat's pro?
Controversial Joe Milton Trade
00:00:33
PatsPro
I'm doing well. Thank you so much for having me. Appreciate it.
00:00:36
Savage Boston
Nice, man. Thanks for coming on. so So, yeah, so Passport wanted to come on and we wanted to have him on just to talk a little bit about, first and foremost, kind of what we all know about. and know it's tried out, but the the Joe Milton, Drake May situation, that won't die.
00:00:49
Snooty
Thanks.
00:00:51
Savage Boston
Yes, Joe Milton is traded. So technically we can stop talking about it. But I feel like this this this whole why he's traded has been such a massive overblown talking point for the last last week or so.
00:01:04
Savage Boston
um Mostly because of the return, which was which was low. People think it's low, a fifth rounder for, you know, For Joe Milton, they thought they could hold out for better. But, you know, it's kind of more about what we've been hearing in the locker room and why they traded Joe Milton rather than the return for Joe Milton. So I just kind of want pass for why don't you kind of lead it off and tell me, you know, what do you know? What have you heard about?
00:01:29
Savage Boston
And I can tell you after what I've heard about why did they actually get rid of Joe Milton?
00:01:34
PatsPro
Yeah, so I think it's pretty it's pretty easy here, right?
00:01:36
Snooty
ah
00:01:39
PatsPro
there's There's three things that come to mind that um I kind of want to harp on a little bit, and they're all quotes from um Mike Vrabel. ah Two of them from his opening press conference, the other from the draft, i'm not the draft, the ah Combine.
00:01:55
PatsPro
ah So one of them is that he wants to remove entitlement from the locker room. And a thing we that that we've heard a few times from a few people and I've heard from my guys that ah Joe Milton thought highly of himself to say it politely, I guess is the best way to
00:02:10
Snooty
That's correct.
Locker Room Dynamics and Milton's Impact
00:02:11
PatsPro
put it.
00:02:11
Savage Boston
Mm-hmm.
00:02:12
PatsPro
Um, he, and I know Tom Curran has kind of said this as well.
00:02:13
Savage Boston
Hmm.
00:02:18
PatsPro
He thought that he, the, the gap between him and Drake may wasn't exactly as big as people would think it would be. You know obviously he's, he's a QB, but he's also 25 years old.
00:02:29
PatsPro
So he's an older player who, you know, thinks he, he kind of knows more. Uh, so, yeah I mean, that kind of sounds entitled to me. Wouldn't you think? So there's that.
00:02:41
PatsPro
ah There's also, you know, he wants to galvanize the team. And when you think about galvanizing, you know, it's bringing the team together, hardening it, right? Making sure they go through some adversity. But the part the process of galvanization isn't complete, I guess you would say, unless you remove imperfections before you attempt to do that.
00:03:01
PatsPro
So when you have a player who, you know, they might feel he's entitled, you know, is entitled from their previous dealings, maybe he's talking around the team. That doesn't exactly exactly help you galvanize your team when the time comes.
00:03:12
Snooty
Yeah.
00:03:15
PatsPro
but Another thing that ah kind of stuck out to me was Vrabel's combine presser, where he said, we want to coach players who want to be here. ah I mean, did Joe Milton really want to be here if he didn't want to start, if he has that high of an opinion of himself?
00:03:29
PatsPro
So, yeah, you could say, oh it's it's a six rounder.
00:03:30
Snooty
okay
00:03:33
PatsPro
You know, he looks so good. He was playing against backup guys and future insurance salesmen in that week 18 game. I'm pretty sure a lot of people could look good. To quote Bill Belichick, we get some guys from Foxborough High out there to make that play.
00:03:43
Savage Boston
yeah
00:03:48
Savage Boston
I mean, I remember you said almost right away, you were like, you know, hey, the reason why they got rid of Milton, people were like, oh, the return, what the heck? And kind of like pretty early on, you were like, hey, I think they got rid of Joe because they didn't want Mac Jones, Bailey Zappi scenario.
00:04:03
PatsPro
Yeah, so...
00:04:03
Savage Boston
and you
Milton's College Career and Trade Decision
00:04:04
PatsPro
I'm sorry, go ahead.
00:04:05
Savage Boston
Yeah, go for it.
00:04:05
Savage Boston
Yeah, no, go for it.
00:04:06
PatsPro
So, they they didn't want that, because we all saw how that worked out, right? Like, yeah, that that was Bill's style. He wanted to make sure that Mac was, you know, built for the moment when it came.
00:04:17
PatsPro
However... That's kind of not how the modern quarterback works, unfortunately. These guys have been told since you know they they were in seven-on-sevens that, hey, you're the guy. Now, not to say that Drake May has a fragile mindset, which we clearly know he doesn't, but it just it makes it easier two you know build and create the culture you want when you have people on board who want to be on board.
00:04:43
PatsPro
Now, you also have Joe Milton. I mean, just as a background, the guy went was at three schools. All three schools, he looked okay, but just couldn't stay consistent. And his last season, i mean, yeah, he looked good, but again, couldn't stay consistent.
00:04:58
Savage Boston
reason why he was a six-rounder.
00:04:59
PatsPro
There's a reason why he was a sixth rounder, exactly.
00:05:02
Savage Boston
Yeah.
00:05:02
PatsPro
Now, the fact that you got a fifth back, but you had to you know trade a seventh with him, that essentially means you get a sixth round value. I don't really care that. That's his value. A fifth round pick is his value.
00:05:13
PatsPro
A sixth round pick is his value. and this In this draft with the limited amount of talent, yeah, a fifth round is the best you're going to get. And I think it's kind of clear that Dallas was really the only suitor.
00:05:22
Savage Boston
Yeah. Now, let me just to tell you what I heard. So I got like a I mean, i don't know if you want to say it's a scoop, but I got like a scoop from somebody um who kind of took what you said about Zappian and Mac Jones and took it.
00:05:37
Savage Boston
like a little bit into the next step. um You know, and in his mind, it wasn't even just that they didn't like the competition aspect. It was more like Joe, Joe Milton was actually, and I'm not going to use the exact word he used because, um uh it's a the c word but basically he was a little bit toxic in the locker room that's what this guy was implying is that you know not only was joe milton you know behind the scenes like hey i think i'm the starter but like he was telling people in the locker room like i deserve to be the starter like i should start go start over drake and like that and he was doing that i guess and to multiple guys in the locker room and so
00:06:17
Savage Boston
You know, that that's what I heard was it was more than just, um let's get rid of him. I don't like
Evaluating Milton's NFL Potential
00:06:22
Savage Boston
this. He's not that supportive. It was more like he was actively almost trying to undermine Drake. And that's fine. The guys, he he thinks really highly of himself.
00:06:30
Savage Boston
And so do a lot of guys that get to this. You're you're a pro quarterback. Like a lot of these guys have massive egos. I'm sure Drake has his own ego, right? But like clearly Drake's the guy. And I support what Vrabel did ah trading Joe Milton if Vrabel thinks that's the right decision.
00:06:46
Savage Boston
Because you've got to go with what mike is what Mike's doing.
00:06:46
PatsPro
Thank
00:06:48
Savage Boston
If Mike thinks, you know, this dude is toxic for our locker room, and I'm not trying to just dump him like the Red Sox do to people who walk out the door. you know, I'm not trying to just dump all over him. But if this is what i hear, and it's the truth that he's telling people locker that he deserves to be the starter, how is that conducive to improving that locker room?
00:06:58
Snooty
ah
00:07:07
PatsPro
It's not. And I mean, like, yeah, the guy's six foot five and he can do a backflip. That's really cool. To quote Alex Barth, if you need Joe Milton to throw a ball 80 yards, Joe Milton will throw that ball, all of that 80 yards.
00:07:22
PatsPro
If you need him to throw a 10 yard out route or a five yard ball with touch, Joe Milton's going to throw an 80 yard ball.
00:07:29
Savage Boston
yeah
00:07:30
PatsPro
I mean, for for Christ's sake, Demario Douglas, you know, damn near admitted Joe broke his hand in a a practice session that they had. Yeah. before the season started so i mean like yeah it i've i've heard some of the same thing that joe you know has a inflated sense of self we all do you know what i mean like i'm i'm six one and and overweight i get an inflated sense of self too
00:07:49
Savage Boston
Yeah.
00:07:53
Savage Boston
Hmm.
00:07:53
PatsPro
But I mean, like, let's let's be honest here. There's a reason why you were a five-year college player. I believe he was anyways. A five-year college player. You had three schools and he couldn't really achieve anything until your last real year of eligibility.
00:08:07
PatsPro
There's a reason. It's because you you don't have the skills that Drake May has or, quite frankly, Dak Prescott has to be somebody in this league at a high level. You look really good against insurance salesmen and backups.
00:08:21
PatsPro
I'll give you that. But you don't have it when the time comes. If you kind of watch his college tape, it's all over the place. And I think people just, people are losing their minds because Tom Brady, oh my God, he was a six-round pick. Everyone doubted him. He was scouted wrong. Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
00:08:36
PatsPro
You think people didn't learn their lesson after Tom frickin' Brady? i I just think people need to kind of get a grip on it.
00:08:44
Snooty
I mean, he's like physically he's everything you'd want in a quarterback. He can run. got a cannon for an arm but everything and everything. But, I mean, he played five years. He never really developed in college.
00:08:55
PatsPro
Exactly.
00:08:55
Snooty
You ask anybody from Tennessee or Michigan, they're all like, yeah, no. Like they were laughing that people thought – they were laughing – at people in New England who thought he should start last year.
Future Quarterback Prospects and Trade Speculation
00:09:06
PatsPro
They're still laughing.
00:09:06
Snooty
They were openly laughing. Yeah, they they were like, yep, okay, so you're in step two, where, like, you you think he's good. Okay. Like, just wait.
00:09:14
Savage Boston
Dude, I rewatched the Colin Coward clip.
00:09:14
Snooty
Just wait.
00:09:16
Savage Boston
ah Sorry to check it out. but like That Colin Coward clip when he's talking about Michael Hawley and he's like, you know, I really predict Joe Milton's going to beat out Dre in camp. Like, the most out of touch. Like, I was following training camp every fucking day and it's like,
00:09:30
Savage Boston
What, just because Joe Milton threw a couple hard balls like Michael Hawley got all o we got all excited? like Those were ridiculous like to make national news. And then Volan comes out, and Volan, I get it, trolling Volan. I understand. He's one of the few guys who's had a story saying that you know that irked May's family.
00:09:48
Savage Boston
don't know where he's getting that, but I could see it irking my family. you know If I'm the guy who gets drafted third overall and you've got a six-round draft pick who can do a backflip and throw really hard,
00:10:00
Savage Boston
And all of a sudden you get a national media pundit coming out like, ooh, I think he's going to overtake him. I think my family would be pissed. So,
00:10:06
Snooty
But isn't that isn't that like the perfect example for why they should have traded him? Because like, you know, like the first time anything bad happens, it's like, oh, I don't know.
00:10:10
Savage Boston
yeah.
00:10:15
Snooty
Maybe should we look at where should we look at Milton?
00:10:15
Savage Boston
Where's Joe? Joe.
00:10:17
PatsPro
From two to six, they will be the most annoying people in the world if anything happens like that.
00:10:17
Snooty
Well, I think Milton could get it. Yeah. Yeah.
00:10:22
PatsPro
it It'll just be like you you want to talk about resetting a franchise, resetting a culture. I'm sorry. You don't do it with a guy who's going around the locker room trotting like he's hot shit.
00:10:33
PatsPro
You just don't do it. You can't.
00:10:35
Savage Boston
Yes, I mean, he literally did say he wants to remove entitlement.
00:10:38
PatsPro
Yeah. Remove entitlement from the building.
00:10:38
Savage Boston
Then you have a guy, like you say, this guy is a third string quarterback walking around being like, I'm the fucking balls.
00:10:40
PatsPro
That's an exact one.
00:10:47
Savage Boston
Like, I need to start on this team. And that is entitlement.
00:10:51
Savage Boston
He hasn't earned anything.
00:10:51
PatsPro
He couldn't beat Jacoby Percet out.
00:10:53
PatsPro
He could not beat Jacoby Percet out. like I think that needs to be said.
00:10:56
Savage Boston
Yeah, and I mean, I know.
00:10:57
PatsPro
As bad as Jacoby Percet was, he couldn't beat him.
00:10:59
Savage Boston
It makes sense why they traded him. like i i I get the trade. I think people are going a little overboard now saying that you know this proves Drake is soft. I don't think this was a Drake May choice. i think I'm sure Drake didn't like what Joe was saying.
00:11:14
Savage Boston
like That makes sense. Why would you like someone who's like, I'm coming for your job? like I don't know why anyone would like that. I'm sure Drake didn't like it. But I absolutely do not think Drake May was like, we need to get rid of Joe Milton. Like, I don't think Drake, I don't know that person. Like, I don't have inside info on that, but ah but I can't imagine Drake doing that.
00:11:33
PatsPro
Well, let's go through the thought experiment on this just real quick. Let's let's say that you know Drake May didn't like it. How logical is that, truthfully? Because he sat behind ah Sam, whatever his name is.
00:11:44
PatsPro
I can't even tell you what his name is.
00:11:45
Snooty
Sam Howell.
00:11:46
Savage Boston
How?
00:11:46
PatsPro
yeah Yeah, Sam Howell at UNC for a year, or was it two years?
00:11:48
Savage Boston
Yeah. Yeah.
00:11:51
PatsPro
Whatever it was. But he sat behind, he knew his place, he knew his time would come, even though he knew he was the more physically gifted quarterback. He was a top 10 recruit ah in his recruiting class.
00:12:02
PatsPro
He was more physically gifted.
00:12:02
Savage Boston
Yeah.
00:12:04
PatsPro
he was the better QB. But he did his time. He bided his time because he had the mental stamina enough to do that. I don't think some five-year ah college player is going to come in and threaten him or really anybody other than himself for a job.
00:12:21
PatsPro
You know what mean? It just it doesn't... It doesn't make sense. So I don't know where Volan got that information. I haven't heard anything about, oh, it was drake's ma Drake Mays Camp who ah was upset and you know went to Vrabel. No, if Drake Mays Camp did that, I guarantee Mike Vrabel would just look at them laughing their face and tell them to go fuck themselves.
00:12:40
Savage Boston
And I mean, we saw Fitzy today on on radio to to stay current like only a few hours ago coming out and saying, i know that he's heard, you know, Drake's a little bit, maybe a little bit sensitive in the room. And that's the first time I've heard that.
00:12:54
Savage Boston
I don't, I think.
00:12:56
PatsPro
Thank you.
00:12:56
Savage Boston
And I'm not saying Fitzy's wrong at all. I like Fitzy a lot. He came on our program and he's a great dude. I don't know the truth behind that. I know that, again, would I be happy if there was a dude who's the third stringer being like, I'm coming for you, like in the back, you know, at my job?
00:13:10
Savage Boston
Like, no, I wouldn't be happy. And i don't i'm not I don't think exactly Drake, like, needed a one-on-one meeting with Mike Vrabel being like, Mike, you got to get rid of Joe.
Media Narratives and Insider Information
00:13:19
Savage Boston
But I think Vrabel is an astute, smart person who sees this entitled third stringer and is like, get this guy the fuck out of here.
00:13:26
PatsPro
Yeah, Fitzy, I love you. god God knows I love you. I just don't think you have it on this one, ah truthfully. Now, with the Vrabel stuff, I mean, did it Mike's, like you said, Mike's a smart guy.
00:13:33
Savage Boston
Yeah.
00:13:39
PatsPro
Mike's going to do what's best for the team, and what's best for the team is removing an entitled guy who thought he was more than he was and didn't clearly understand his place. That is what is best for the team.
00:13:49
Savage Boston
Yeah. I mean, it's it's certainly, you know you know, here we are. It's not an accident happened right before the workouts began, right? Like, he clearly was like, I'm not letting Joe Milton enter the workouts.
00:14:04
Savage Boston
Do know mean? Like he's like, he's not, he's not coming in the room, but shows you something. And, you know, you never get these real stories behind the scenes that, that accurately, you get these little, these little glimpses, these little snippets, you know, um it's hard for this stuff to really leak out, but like, but through a person who knows a person, you know, I'm hearing a little bit, that was it just got a little bit too toxic. So.
00:14:27
Snooty
i think I think the only reason people are upset is because they overinflated his value.
00:14:28
Savage Boston
Yeah.
00:14:33
Snooty
like Everybody's like, oh, second or a third round pick.
00:14:33
Savage Boston
Yeah.
00:14:35
Snooty
It's like, that was ludicrous.
00:14:36
Snooty
like That's never going to happen.
00:14:36
PatsPro
Well, you have Felger and Maz who are like, oh, he's got to go for at least a third rounder.
00:14:37
Savage Boston
Yeah.
00:14:42
PatsPro
You've got Jones and Keefe. It's got to be a second rounder. And this draft with a lack of talent, it's got to be a second rounder.
00:14:46
Savage Boston
Right
00:14:46
PatsPro
I mean, come on. but let's Can we think logically? but I get it. We have a show to do today. I don't care.
00:14:52
Savage Boston
on.
00:14:53
PatsPro
Give a good fucking take for once in your goddamn lives. He's a sixth round pick who played one game at the end of the season in a game they were supposed to lose.
00:15:02
Savage Boston
and
00:15:02
PatsPro
And he couldn't do it.
00:15:03
Snooty
Yeah.
00:15:04
PatsPro
They got a fifth for him. That is a win.
00:15:07
Savage Boston
Yeah, it really technically is a win. I mean, you got your third quarterback for a fifth-round pick.
00:15:12
PatsPro
Yeah, that's a good thing.
00:15:12
Savage Boston
You know, I think honestly, like, if if you if you basically, though, if you come back and all sudden Joe beats out Dak and he's a world burner and at the quarterback of the dallas texas to add Dallas Cowboys, then sure, let's talk about it again.
00:15:14
Bret
well
00:15:25
PatsPro
I will tattoo I love Jill Milton on my ass if that happens.
00:15:25
Savage Boston
don't think that's going to happen. Yeah, yeah. I don't think it's going to happen you. The dude's playing for a long time. There's a lot of film out on Joe Milton. I don't think anyone – they got one offer, and it's just because probably Jerry Jones fucking watched that game from Joe Milton and was the only one who was like, you know what? That guy's got some ability.
00:15:43
Savage Boston
They had no other offers.
00:15:45
PatsPro
He traded a fourth for Trey Lance a year ago.
00:15:48
Savage Boston
Oh, that's so horrible.
00:15:50
PatsPro
ah ah Let's just think about that.
00:15:50
Snooty
Yeah.
00:15:51
Savage Boston
yeah No, it's horrible. And I mean, you have something like, and and I get like, I'm getting a little sick of this media game too on Twitter. Obviously I'm on Twitter all the time following this stuff. And you know, like someone like Jordan Schultz who good for Jordan Schultz, he worked his way up. he He has a lot of connections in a lot of ways. Right.
00:16:07
Savage Boston
um But basically like,
00:16:09
PatsPro
it helps when your dad's company is in the Fortune 500, but yeah.
00:16:11
Savage Boston
Yeah, it helps when your dad owns Starbucks or whatever, the CEO of Starbucks, which, you know, good for Jordan. He can pay people, whatever he needs to do. i don't want I'm not talking shit. I don't know what the fuck's going on with Jordan Schultz.
00:16:22
Savage Boston
But all I'm saying is that he tweets out like, oh, you know, the Patriots, they really wanted to send him to his first choice and blah, blah, blah. It's like, who who texted you that? You know, like like some eight like Joe Milton's agent, Elliot Wolfe, texts you directly like, hey, say this.
00:16:39
Savage Boston
Like, who... You know, just straight from Stacey.
00:16:39
PatsPro
It was Stacey James.
00:16:42
PatsPro
Yeah.
00:16:43
Savage Boston
Straight there, hey, hey, Jordan, can you get this out? Thanks, bud.
00:16:47
PatsPro
It was a pure PR move because they were worried that they were going to get killed. that I just don't understand. They haven't learned that they're going to get killed no matter what they do. They signed Milton Williams and Felger was on 20 minutes later going, oh, it's an overpay.
00:17:01
Savage Boston
but why is But why is Jordan Schultz putting that out?
00:17:04
PatsPro
Because it's ah it's a story.
00:17:04
Savage Boston
Do you know what mean? Unless he just...
00:17:05
PatsPro
It's it's engagement. Stacey James texted and said, hey, you can use this. And Jordan goes, okay, great. I can use this. It'll get engagement. Who cares if it's really true? I've got a source telling me it, so I'm going to report it as fact.
00:17:16
Bret
Thank you.
00:17:17
Savage Boston
But it's like someone like Mike Reese. That's like me. That's like what I would do. You know what I mean? Because I'm not fucking reporter.
00:17:23
PatsPro
Yeah, there's levels to do this shit.
00:17:23
Savage Boston
forever You what I mean?
00:17:24
PatsPro
it it It goes fucking Mike Reese, Tom Curran, Schefter, and Pellicero, and Rappaport.
00:17:25
Savage Boston
Like... like
00:17:33
PatsPro
And then you go like five levels down, and Jordan Schultz is kind of right there, unfortunately.
00:17:37
Savage Boston
Like, ah Reese is like the top of the top reporting-wise and how much he, you know, he really...
00:17:37
Snooty
Yeah.
00:17:42
PatsPro
Locally, absolutely.
00:17:43
Savage Boston
you know He really needs multiple, multiple confirmations. That's why I like Reese so much because you know when it's coming out, Reese has it. Same with Shafter, Rapp, all those those national guys. you know but But even like Curran the other day, i was we we talked about this on the last pod, and it really pissed me off because i feel like Curran himself – um kind of got abused in this situation.
00:18:01
PatsPro
Thank
00:18:03
Savage Boston
Like he got a message from somebody and he he put out an article, full article he wrote that said, um the Patriots aren't interested in Divas. ah They're not in on DK Metcalf, right? And they weren't in on, we talked about this past bro.
00:18:16
Savage Boston
He was like, we're not in on DK Metcalf. We're not in on whoever, another Diva. They probably won't be in on Diggs. He puts out a whole article, and then all a sudden, like we knew.
00:18:27
Savage Boston
We knew they were in on Metcalf. You knew, Pats Pro. You told me. Right off the gate, you're like, I know that they're interested in DK Metcalf.
00:18:34
PatsPro
Yeah, they they were interested in DK Metcalf. They were talking to Seattle. for From the way I heard it, and this has been reported and backed up by Phil Perry, they found out that DK wasn't exactly thrilled with them, so they decided not to put through an offer.
00:18:47
PatsPro
I think that makes the most sense.
00:18:47
Savage Boston
Yes.
00:18:49
PatsPro
Now, I will say Tom got burned. He got burned real bad by somebody, and I don't know who it is, but whoever did it, and that guy's a fuckface or purse, woman, whoever.
00:18:54
Savage Boston
Yeah.
00:18:58
Savage Boston
Well, if that's Elliot Wolfe or something, like he literally, how do you just take that information at face value again?
00:19:00
PatsPro
Yeah. Yeah.
00:19:03
PatsPro
Yeah, you can't. You you literally cannot. yeah You got burned by a source because they wanted to generate ah you know some sort of image. I don't know what image it is because it's certainly not positive because it just plays into every stereotype that is out there about the Patriots.
00:19:17
PatsPro
So I just don't get it.
00:19:17
Savage Boston
And then he had to go – well, he had to go get the information from outside of the team that I heard him talking about on his radio interview on EEI, right?
00:19:18
Bret
Thank you.
00:19:25
PatsPro
Yeah. Yeah.
00:19:25
Savage Boston
he So from outside the organization, he heard people say, actually, they were in on DK. And he at least – good to his credit, he were he retracted, right? He went back on it.
00:19:36
Savage Boston
But um I just think it's in.
00:19:37
PatsPro
It's still embarrassing.
00:19:40
Savage Boston
I don't know.
00:19:40
PatsPro
It's still horribly embarrassing for him. I feel terrible.
00:19:44
Savage Boston
And I like Karin. I just – yeah, i think it's –
00:19:46
PatsPro
I love Tom. Tom is the original guy who's been doing this. You what I mean?
00:19:51
Savage Boston
So maybe in the future he'll have to not just go, you know, one source or anything like that.
00:19:51
PatsPro
It's just that...
00:19:55
Savage Boston
But.
00:19:55
PatsPro
Yeah, I mean, i'm um ah I'll fully admit I'm a one-source guy, but that source has been pretty damn good so far, so I have no reason to question him.
00:20:02
Savage Boston
What was it, Pat's Pro? What did you have? What did you have really early? Was it the Doug Marone news?
00:20:07
PatsPro
So if we're being technical, I'm going to toot my own horn here, and I apologize.
00:20:07
Savage Boston
forget it.
00:20:12
PatsPro
I had Vrabel before anyone else. I had McDaniels before anyone else. And that's when you kind of picked me up and retweeted me and was like, oh, let's let's see if this guy has anything else. And then my source comes that I think it was like a Saturday night, was like, Doug Marone, new O-line coach.
00:20:27
PatsPro
And I'm like, are you sure about that? He goes, same guy. you know It's the same guy I talked to, gave me ah everything else that I've given you. And I was like, huh. Okay, well, let me put it out, and then it just kind of blew up.
00:20:38
PatsPro
So, yeah, I've had that.
00:20:39
Savage Boston
I
00:20:40
PatsPro
I've had kind of like the the proper narrative on the DK story and a bunch of other stuff, but like...
00:20:46
Savage Boston
i i love it, man. I think it's the most fun – of the most fun parts of Twitter, honestly, is like people –
00:20:51
PatsPro
Yeah, a bunch of cartoon avatars talking shit about things that, you know, the normal reporters won't even bother with. Yeah, it's great.
00:20:58
Savage Boston
Well, like, you know, as soon as I talked to, i said something, a top reporter DM on on Twitter. And I was like, hey, man, just FYI, like heard about, you know, Milton being a locker room toxic guy, you know, you know, ah couple of days ago.
00:21:14
Savage Boston
And then he's like, yeah, we had it last week. And he kind of like poo-pooed, you know, poo-pooed me. He's like, yeah, I
Patriots' Draft Strategies and Speculations
00:21:20
Savage Boston
already had this. I just didn't write an article about it.
00:21:22
PatsPro
Yeah, and it's like, cool, that's great that you already had it, and yeah cool for you, you're probably doing a guy a solid.
00:21:23
Savage Boston
Like, all right, okay.
00:21:29
PatsPro
you know you're You're not trying to burn whoever you're talking to, I get that. But to for some people to be like, oh, you guys don't know a thing, and it's just like, everyone knows the same shit. It's just, there are idiots like me who are actually going to put it out, because what what am I doing?
00:21:45
Bret
Thank you.
00:21:45
PatsPro
I'm not trying to create a career out of this, I'm just having fun.
00:21:48
Savage Boston
I think it's really fun, obviously. um All right, well, let's let's pivot a smidge, um and we'll get you know get Snooty and Brett in on this.
00:21:50
PatsPro
Yeah, it's great.
00:21:57
Savage Boston
It's back to the draft, which is obviously the main still the main talking point right now. um It feels like odds-wise, Snooty, why don't you rope us in?
00:22:08
Savage Boston
What's going on with the odds right now and who the Patriots are looking at it for according to to Vegas? Yeah.
00:22:13
Snooty
So actually they shifted again. If you look at draft Kings pick for Will Campbell minus one, 10 members plus 400 Carters plus 500 Mason Graham plus a thousand Jalen Walker back up to 1400. Now,
00:22:25
Savage Boston
Wow.
00:22:26
Snooty
ah Travis Hunter, 1,300. Personally, I don't think there's any, there's no chance you're going to get carter or Hunter.
00:22:33
Savage Boston
Yeah, I think that's done.
00:22:33
Snooty
I've come to this conclusion because I think Hunter's guaranteed to go to at this point. I mean, he's minus 300 to go to. I think that's been like the growing rumor. And then I was thinking about it. was like, you know, the argument that you could get Carter is that the Giants take Sanders, which I've never believed.
00:22:49
Snooty
um Or, you know, maybe they pass on Carter because they have Thibodeau and they have Brian Burns. But like I was thinking about it, I'm like, look, if you can't get a quarterback and you've got a stud prospect there, why wouldn't someone just move up to go get Carter?
00:23:04
Snooty
You what mean?
00:23:04
Savage Boston
yeah
00:23:04
Snooty
Like, if they're not going to take Carter, why wouldn't they try and move down? Because people will move up for Carter, right? So, like, that means you have to assume Carter goes pick three, and if you sit at pick four, you know, I mean, the first all-line pick, the first all-line pick, it's, ah what was it, 190 or something for, where is it?
00:23:28
Savage Boston
for camel
00:23:29
Snooty
For Campbell, 190, minus 195 right now First alignment selected plus 150 for member.
00:23:35
Savage Boston
Yeah.
00:23:35
Snooty
Personally, I think my take is like, if you think Campbell's the a left tackle and you think he's your guy, just stick it for and take them. Don't fuck around. Don't move down. Don't go down to nine to see if he can make it there. Just fucking take him because either you think he's the left tackle and he's worth it at four.
00:23:53
Snooty
Right.
00:23:54
Savage Boston
yeah
00:23:54
Snooty
He is. If you don't think he's a left tackle, then try and move down or take somebody else.
00:23:58
Bret
Thank you.
00:23:59
Snooty
Take Membu or take Walker or take somebody else. Or Banks. I wouldn't mind moving down for Banks if you feel Banks a better tackle. But, like, if you think Campbell's a guy, just fucking stick and take him. Don't fuck around and try to get an extra third or fourth round pick by moving down a couple spots.
00:24:14
Snooty
Just fucking take your guy.
00:24:16
Savage Boston
yeah
00:24:17
Bret
See, I don't know if you caught that, Pat's Pro, but I love how Savage just slightly slid in the fact and said, hey, Snooty, what's this the ah you know betting line look like on the draft pick? But we yeah we get daily updates on the line shifts and how much we go through that, you know.
00:24:37
Bret
We're not a political podcast, but we know a lot of people are looking at the stock market. We, on the ah Savage podcast, we look at the draft shift in the...
00:24:46
Savage Boston
Yeah, that's we're not paying attention to the tariffs.
00:24:47
Bret
that line
00:24:48
Savage Boston
We're just watching just DraftKings odds.
00:24:51
PatsPro
That's what gets you guys horny, and I appreciate that because I'm doing the same thing.
00:24:51
Bret
Oh my god.
00:24:55
Bret
We watch the thing shift, and then we watch the trend, and we see what it looks like day over day, and and see where it shifts, but...
00:24:59
Savage Boston
like glu
00:25:02
Bret
No, it's it's a really unhealthy obsession we have here. But um yeah, I mean, look, we were all high on the possibility of Hunter coming this way because it looked like that was going to be a realistic possibility. But...
Giants' Quarterback Dilemma and Draft Prospects
00:25:18
Bret
You read the ah the shift in the money line, you read the tea leaves and all the reporting, and it just doesn't look to be the case.
00:25:25
Bret
So, yeah, I see Will Campbell coming up, but I also know we're still, you know, less than almost three weeks away, a little less than that um from the draft, and I wouldn't be surprised if it shifts.
00:25:25
PatsPro
Okay.
00:25:38
Bret
I know there was that Ewers quick bump that kind of came out of nowhere, which was kind of funky.
00:25:45
Savage Boston
That was a glitch.
00:25:46
Bret
Yeah.
00:25:46
Savage Boston
i was a glt
00:25:48
Bret
kind of funky how that kind of came out, but... All I'm getting at is shit changes on a dime, right? And I wouldn't be surprised if we made a move there um that didn't bring us in Campbell. And I've made it clear I don't want Campbell. I don't think Campbell's the right fit.
00:26:08
Bret
I view him as a guard. I don't think it's worth the position pick there. So I'm more on to a guy like Banks or even Membu ah in my opinion.
00:26:20
Bret
but we'll see. I think it's just, I think there's still so much time. It's crazy how much these things shift, but unfortunately, yeah, I tend to will agree that based on everything we're seeing, our optimism that we were going to get Hunter is kind of going by the wayside. So now we got to pivot. We got to figure out something else.
00:26:40
Savage Boston
Yeah.
00:26:40
PatsPro
So here's what I'll say about that.
00:26:40
Savage Boston
Mm-hmm.
00:26:42
PatsPro
And I'm sure you boys are, you know, experienced gamblers to, you know, I'll say, um what does Vegas like to do? They like to negate their exposure, right?
00:26:54
Snooty
Mm-hmm.
00:26:54
PatsPro
So early on, Travis Hunter, pretty high odds to go to the Patriots, got a lot of action there. Now, if they might find out that, oh, you know, it's looking like Hunter,
00:27:06
PatsPro
may go to the Patriots. Let's try to you know change the odds around a little bit, you know use some media bias, and try to negate our losses and maybe come out even or a little bit ahead. That's what the Sharps do, right?
00:27:18
PatsPro
So the gambling markets are what they are. Take them with a grain of salt. I still think, and this is just me, and I know I tweeted about this and got a lot of pushback, but I'm going to say it again.
00:27:24
Savage Boston
Mm-hmm.
00:27:32
PatsPro
ah The Giants need a quarterback, and Russell Wilson and Jameis Winston do not a quarterback make, a starting quarterback anyways. ah But between the two of them, They have skill, but not much anymore, especially Wilson. He's he' seriously declined.
00:27:49
PatsPro
And they're both on backup contracts. like it's You're not going to tell me that $10 million dollars is a starter contract or you know a long-term starter contract. You're just not going to do it. So I i think with Schoen and Dable fighting for their jobs,
00:28:03
PatsPro
I do think that Sanders is in play for them. I truthfully do. And I don't think anything is going to move me off of that position, regardless of what reports come out. I mean, we are headlong. We're two weeks out, 16 days out from the draft.
00:28:18
PatsPro
We are in the middle of bullshit season. There is not a thing that can be said that's going to sway me from this opinion that I think it goes...
00:28:21
Snooty
Thanks.
00:28:26
PatsPro
um ah Cam Ward to the Titans, Abdul Carter to the Browns, and Shadur Sanders to the Giants.
00:28:37
PatsPro
i That's just what I think is going to happen, and which it would be amazing.
00:28:40
Savage Boston
I mean, that would be amazing.
00:28:43
PatsPro
But like logically, for me, it's the most likely option given all of the factors.
00:28:43
Savage Boston
um
00:28:48
Savage Boston
I don't get why. i mean, I get the Travis Hunter a two pick.
00:28:51
Snooty
Thank
00:28:52
Savage Boston
I think even just watching him at Shadur's pro day, you watch him, you're like, fuck, that kid's twitchy. yeah like You know, like, but he's he's such a good player.
00:28:58
PatsPro
Oh, God, yeah. He could do so much in McDaniel's offense. It's not even funny.
00:29:02
Savage Boston
Oh my God. It'd be awesome. But, you know, watching Travis is like shooting. That's why I think, you know, obviously reports coming out now that he's likely at two or reports one week ago, or like, you know, really Abdul Carter is really likely at two. Like, so as i agree with you guys, it is bullshit season. Like you don't really know, nobody knows knowing until, you know, the day of the draft, 12 hours before the draft, right. That's when you're like, all right, we're getting real reporting. Now.
00:29:25
Savage Boston
The only thing we know is cam words going one, you know,
00:29:25
PatsPro
That's when you're kind of locked in. Yeah, Cam Ward's going one.
00:29:29
Snooty
Mm-hmm.
00:29:29
PatsPro
The Titans, they're in trouble. They need something to turn the franchise around, and God damn it, they're going draft a quarterback because Bill Levis, Mayo Levis, he's not saving them. He's just not doing it.
00:29:40
Savage Boston
Yeah, no, he sucks. But it's it's basically, we're just, I just don't want to keep, it feels like a dream at this point. You know, I'm holding out for Travis Hunter, but in reality, it it really feels like it's going to be sitting there at four, Hunter and and Carter are gone.
00:29:56
Savage Boston
And then you get a lot of people today are just like, you know, people yell at me all day on there, you know, I invite it. um But they're like, you know, it's Will Campbell and you're you're going to like it.
00:30:05
PatsPro
You are. You are going to like it.
00:30:07
Savage Boston
No, you're going to like it.
00:30:08
PatsPro
Yeah.
00:30:09
Savage Boston
And I'm like, listen,
00:30:09
PatsPro
yeah You're going to love it. You're going to love it so much. You know why? Because the guy played, was a starter at left tackle in the toughest division going against D1 talent, guys who got real guys who got drafted high.
00:30:21
Snooty
ye
00:30:21
PatsPro
i mean, yeah got guys guys who are you know defensive rookies of the year.
00:30:21
Savage Boston
It's true.
00:30:27
PatsPro
and dominated them.
00:30:27
Savage Boston
It's true. It's true.
00:30:28
Snooty
it
00:30:29
PatsPro
ummit um'm I'm not talking about, oh, you know, he he let off. He had two sacks last year. sacks. You don't do that unless you're a special talent.
00:30:38
Bret
Thank you.
00:30:39
PatsPro
So if if if the possibility, I'm i'm going to you know take take people at their word, if the possibility that Hunter and Carter are not there, you're drafting Will Campbell, you're doing it with the biggest O-line boner that you can get, and you should have a smile on your face.
00:30:55
PatsPro
Because this dude has the quickness, the agility. I understand those are two of the same things. I don't care. He has great footwork. He has great arm placement.
00:31:06
PatsPro
Even though they say, oh, you know, his arms are 30. They're 33-inch arms. That's the measurement I'm using. Even if they're 32 and 7-8, I don't care. You look at his film, and he has one hand planted firmly in most Russia's chest.
00:31:20
PatsPro
And he is not letting go. And he's using the other hand to hand fight and make sure the pocket stays clean for his quarterback.
00:31:28
Snooty
he's He's very athletic. He's got heavy hands for every report. He's pissed off. If you hear any interview with him right now, he's he is he is really pissed off, with advice which is awesome.
00:31:36
PatsPro
Oh, God, yeah.
00:31:38
Savage Boston
That's good. That's good news. Yeah.
00:31:40
Snooty
um I think I was telling telling you, Savage, like he's the type of kid, like look, he's good i think he I think the true measurement of his arms is 32 and 7, 8 or 33, right in that that ballpark, because I think the combine's been low across the board.
00:31:52
Savage Boston
Yeah. Probably 32 and 7-8. Feels about right.
00:31:54
Snooty
Right, which is, call it 33, it's the same fucking thing, right?
00:31:56
Savage Boston
Yeah.
00:31:57
PatsPro
It's the same thing. It's literally the same thing.
00:31:58
Snooty
So, you call it 33, which is, like, at the lowest cusp of being acceptable.
00:31:58
Savage Boston
Yeah.
00:32:03
Snooty
Fine. But he has very good technique, very good athleticism. He's also only 21, and he, like, just turned 21, like, a few months ago.
00:32:12
Savage Boston
Yeah.
00:32:14
Snooty
So, he's gonna fill out and get stronger. So, you know, and everybody is an O-line expert all of a sudden about, like, oversetting and the inside move and all that shit, but, like...
00:32:23
Savage Boston
yeah
00:32:23
Snooty
Like, he's going to get stronger. You know what i mean Like, he's he's going into an NFL program. And it's no disrespect to LSU because that's basically a pro program. But, like, I mean, he's 21 years old.
00:32:32
PatsPro
Thank you.
00:32:34
Snooty
Like, he's going to physically mature and and you improve. um And, he like, he can play left tackle. He played...
00:32:41
Bret
Yes.
00:32:42
Snooty
For three years, and he and not to get too into the weeds, but like he has significantly more true pass sets out of a pro-style system than a lot of the other tackles that are being drafted.
00:32:53
Savage Boston
and Let me just throw it out there. Snooty actually knows what he's talking about more than more than anyone probably about playing offensive line because he was a college offensive lineman. Just wanted to throw it out there.
00:33:04
Bret
Yes.
00:33:04
Savage Boston
Just
00:33:05
PatsPro
Hell yeah, Snooty. Hell yeah.
00:33:06
Bret
But what I will say is you talked a lot about he'll get physically stronger. He'll get physically, he'll get better. He's got good technique. He won't get physically longer with his arms.
00:33:18
Bret
And that was the biggest knock on it. And it's still enough. Like, look, if we get Will Campbell at four,
00:33:23
Savage Boston
you
00:33:27
Bret
like you're going to see me singing the roses and like saying this guy is going to be amazing because we have Doug Marone who's going to teach him how to do it. And Sky says that arm length doesn't matter and we're just going to make it happen.
00:33:41
Bret
But you asked me today, i don't like the idea. I think
Patriots' Internal Decisions and Future Outlook
00:33:46
Bret
drafting him at four, it's just I'm not i'm not buying in towards it. So I'm going to be a skeptic up until...
00:33:50
Savage Boston
it's but it Yeah,
00:33:53
PatsPro
Here's what I'm going to say about that. When it comes to the length conversation, I don't know about you gentlemen, but I'm Irish. I've been hearing it all my life. It don't mean shit.
00:34:06
Savage Boston
how you use it.
00:34:06
Bret
Thank you.
00:34:07
PatsPro
Exactly. It's how you use it. And God damn it. Will Campbell, he's going to get stronger. He's going to get bigger. He's going to stay just as fast.
00:34:14
Savage Boston
but Dude, you know what? Honestly, i think Will Campbell could be – truly could be one of those outliers. Like there are a couple other tackles in the league who have like low length. And I think he could be that guy.
00:34:27
Savage Boston
But there is a genuine possibility. Like his makeup right now is the same as like Will Freeze, who just got paid by, i forget it's like the Vikings or something, like six six like exact same makeup, exact same arm length.
00:34:39
Savage Boston
you know Guys like that, like he would be an all-pro guard off the bat. so But you're going to give him at least a full season at left tackle and be like, here we go. Let's see if he can do it. And he is a gifted athlete. His ah r RAS score was like when he's one of the top linemen of all time um in his athletic score. you know he's Same with Membu.
00:34:59
Savage Boston
Tremendously athletic players.
00:34:59
Bret
Thank you.
00:35:00
Snooty
Yeah, Matt Groh just fainted when you said that.
00:35:00
Savage Boston
um
00:35:03
Savage Boston
Yeah. no Well, at least, hey, you know what? At least Will Campbell can play. You know, unlike Tippy Toes, Tyquan Thornton, which, ah you know. First of all, this is – I'm going to change it really fast, like whiplash fast.
00:35:17
Savage Boston
Why the fuck did Elliott Wolfe and Matt Groh, how do they still have their jobs? I mean, this is – want to open this can of worms fully, but, like, I was thinking about it today.
00:35:28
Savage Boston
Like, what is – is Elliott Wolfe doing anything? Like, is he doing – like, there's all Mike Vrabel guys coming in the room. So, like, what is – Ellie Wolfe had one of the worst off-seasons last year I've ever seen.
00:35:38
Savage Boston
So, like, I don't get – maybe he'll be fired in May after the draft. I don't know. Or they'll they'll say he did his job. But, like, i ah truly, like how are these guys still in the room?
00:35:50
PatsPro
That's a great question.
00:35:50
Snooty
the only thing i can The only thing I can think of with Wolf is if he's still doing like more the grunt work in terms of building out the the scouting department. No,
00:35:59
Savage Boston
Yeah, if Dunger says he's like answering faxes, he's turning the lights off.
00:36:02
Snooty
I'm not even saying that, but like they were so far behind because the way Bill did it was so different from everybody else for so long that like every report from everybody, nationally and otherwise, has been like, have every outside people come in here and go, where the fuck is everybody?
00:36:03
Savage Boston
It
00:36:19
Snooty
You Like there's the the scouting department and analytics, like everything was just so far behind.
00:36:20
Savage Boston
works.
00:36:24
Bret
Thank you.
00:36:24
Snooty
And I know they revamped the whole scouting system after last year's draft. So that's the only argument for Wolf is that he's doing all of that work, all the heavy lifting in terms of like building out the, like a modern structure, basic.
00:36:38
PatsPro
Well, to add to that, I mean, all of last offseason, for the most part, he was trying to fill out Mayo's staff because Mayo had no fucking connections whatsoever.
00:36:47
Snooty
Yeah. Yeah.
00:36:48
PatsPro
that's what that's He didn't even go to the owners' meetings because of that stuff, because...
00:36:49
Savage Boston
How did Mayo get fucking hired? i don't...
00:36:53
Snooty
Peace.
00:36:53
PatsPro
but Because they were in an airport and he going to Israel and he was holding court and Robert was just like, you know, wow, look at this guy.
00:36:56
Savage Boston
Oh, Jesus Christ.
00:37:00
Savage Boston
It is...
00:37:02
PatsPro
He's just, everyone's listening to him. He's got the engagement of the room, which is not, that doesn't make a football coach. When you have a guy who has to walk back every single comment after he's made it because he doesn't know how to take his foot out of his fucking mouth, that's a problem.
00:37:17
Savage Boston
And I think Robert, you know, deserves – Robert deserves obviously a lot of blame for making the hire, but he also does deserve some credit for firing him after one season. Because he could have just been like had way too much pride and just say like, nope, he's the guy. And then we're four years later and be like, holy fuck, we messed that up.
00:37:36
Savage Boston
You know what i mean? And like instead he swallowed it and he's like, fuck it.
00:37:37
PatsPro
Oh, no. Robert deserves a ton of credit. He deserves a ton of credit for it because it it was a brave thing to do regardless of, you know, if it was what the fans wanted. Robert deserves credit for two things this offseason and only two things.
00:37:51
PatsPro
Firing Gerard Mayo and hiring Mike Vrabel. Those are the two best decisions that he's made for this franchise in the last 10 years.
00:37:55
Savage Boston
Yeah.
00:37:58
Savage Boston
Yeah. And it feels good that we have a legitimate coaching staff pack and guys that I think are actually going to make a big difference and still a lot more to do. And I'm going to add the pod here or else we'll keep going for the entire night.
00:38:10
Savage Boston
So take it easy, guys. We'll hear from you next time. Thanks for tuning in. Peace. And don't go anywhere, Pats, bro.
00:38:15
Bret
Peace.