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Episode 6: It's Never What You Know
69 Plays2 years ago
Greetings Rule Breakers! In this episode Sarah and Jaimie dive into the oldest saying in the world: "is it what you know or who you know". As you can probably guess there is a LOT of gray area in this topic. From how this phrase can serve or harm those involved. Sarah and Jaimie bring interesting points to consider in "who you know".
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Transcript
Experiencing and Overcoming a Book Hangover
00:00:00
Speaker
I just saw this interesting thing. I think we're both in book doc, aren't we? Yes. I saw this interesting thing where someone said if you have a book hangover after reading a guitar, read X, Y, and Z. And it got me thinking about how whenever somebody reads like a really good
00:00:18
Speaker
genre of book, we immediately want them or we immediately want to give them another book in that genre. But to me, that's like you're already setting yourself up for failure. Yeah, because what you actually want or what that person actually wants is they want to be able to like erase their memory and reread the book they just read, right? That's like what you crave.
00:00:38
Speaker
So I have this theory that the next time somebody says like, oh, I just read X, Y, and Z. It was so good. I have this book hangover. I don't know what to read next. Give them something completely out of left field in a completely different genre and see how that goes.
00:00:53
Speaker
Well, and sometimes it's really hard because then when someone tells you what they're reading, it's like your mind is already on that track. So you're like, Oh, I know you can, but I agree. I think when I was, I had my hangover from fourth wing, those two books, and someone's like, Oh, you got to jump to a guitar. And it took me forever to like Feyre.
00:01:12
Speaker
And then I never really liked Tamlin, which anyone who hasn't read the series, you'll find out. Um, but it really took me a long time to get into her as a character because she is like very abrasive in the beginning. And I was just like, I almost didn't continue on cause I was like, Oh, I just want it to be Violet. Which is funny because Violet is a little bitch in Iron Flame. I don't think she's a little bitch. She's so annoying in Iron Flame, Sarah.
00:01:41
Speaker
Okay, she's annoying. She's like, Zaden's keeping secrets. And it's every other fucking page. I know. And I'm just like, Zaden is hot as hell, gives you the best sex of your life, is trying to protect you and has done nothing but stand beside you. Also, he hasn't known you for very long. So why the fuck do you think he should be just like,
00:02:01
Speaker
spilling all the secrets of everyone the moment you guys sleep together. It's like, it's like even even if he did tell you all the secrets, then you would be mad that you didn't know earlier. Like, like, what is he supposed to do? Just walk up to you and be like, Violet, life story. Here we go. Take it or leave it. Yeah. So I mean, ultimately, we should be mad at Rebecca Yarrows for not taking more time to flush out that book. But I think she had a little bit of pressure from the published publishing industry to push that book out pretty fast.
Introduction to the Rule Followers Podcast
00:02:31
Speaker
Well, howdy, friends. Welcome to the Rule Followers podcast. My name is Sarah. I'm Jamie. This is a podcast where we examine commonly held beliefs, life rules, self-imposed, and society imposed, and deconstruct them, re-examine them, and hopefully live a little bit more in the gray. Today's rule is about, is it what you know or who you know?
Relationships vs. Skills in Career Opportunities
00:02:59
Speaker
All right, so why did I choose this topic for us this week? Because I was just thinking about all the connections that I have made in my current career as a wedding photographer. And my biggest opportunities have never been about what I know behind the camera, what I know at the computer or what I know as a business owner. It has always been about what relationship
00:03:20
Speaker
Did I have with a client or with a colleague that opened up doors for me? And it's so interesting because I think there's this really unique balance when it comes to what you know versus who you know. I think there are some people who have the ability to fake it till they make it and it doesn't matter either way. And they might not know anything, but they know the right person. So in that regard, I wanted to have us both kind of look back at our early jobs.
00:03:49
Speaker
and any cool opportunity we've ever had and you know really examine what was it about the opportunity and the connection was it ever like someone found you because you specifically had the skill set or was it like so and so recommended you and I want to just talk through each of our experiences with that rule
00:04:06
Speaker
And then why do we think it is that way? So take it away. Tell me about your job experience and how you got them all. Well, I actually remember in college, in film school, we had a class on production and film business. And one of the things they told us straight up was that the industry had nothing to do with our work.
00:04:31
Speaker
And it had everything to do with networking and who we knew and how we were able to genuinely connect with people. So I kind of already knew that going in when I entered the wedding industry, but
00:04:49
Speaker
I do think that your work still has to be there like you can't be inept technically but we do all begin somewhere right so we can look back at our early work and be like well if I was comparing now to then obviously my work wasn't that good but I still got work. In the beginning I connected with trying to remember
00:05:10
Speaker
I somehow got connected to first and foremost productions. I don't know if it was through Tony, Christine, or... Yeah, that's so weird. I know I listed myself on the knot, but the only reason I listed myself on the knot was because I had a free year of advertising, because the knot reached out to me to film their, like, party. And so I filmed their party, gave them, you know, the edited video, and then they gave me a year of free advertising, so I got a lot of work that way.
00:05:39
Speaker
But the previous year, before I was booking a lot for myself, I was second shooting for JJ of first and foremost productions for free. But I honestly, I cannot remember how I met them. Isn't that how the best love stories are? Right. But yeah, so worked with JJ, got kind of some skill set under my belt that way, ended up getting connected to Tony and took her business course, which helped me launch sort of into legitimacy.
00:06:09
Speaker
And then yeah things just kind of rolled from there and yeah i would i would say i mean ever since then we know in the wedding industry the best leads always come from the people you know the frienders and do you have a specific story.
00:06:24
Speaker
Okay, so I was specifically thinking about the relationship I have with Sam McFarland. And she is another incredible wedding photographer here in Seattle, we know her very well. She is about to have her second baby, which is so exciting.
00:06:40
Speaker
But when she was pregnant with Rhett, her first son, she was supposed to go shoot this wedding in Cabo. And I think, I can't remember if it was because she was, it was before he was born or after he was born, but basically it just didn't work out. And she was like, Hey, can I send this to you? And I was, first of all, flabbergasted and honored that she even thought of me because like our styles were very different.
00:07:02
Speaker
And I was like, yes. And so the bride reached out to me and it all worked out. And I ended up going to Cabo, brought a second shooter with me, my friend Sydney, who basically offered to pay her way to just come shoot. And we had the absolute best time. It was such a joy. We were there with the French family and they're not actually French, they're Canadian, but
00:07:23
Speaker
French is their last name and we really got to know the bride's family and it was just such a joy. Like these were people who were just so kind, so generous. We're working with Amy Abbott events who is a huge destination planner in Cabo and it was my first exposure to really luxury weddings. But from that the bride's brother was engaged at the time and
00:07:47
Speaker
He and his fiance at the time Stephanie who I now adore and love and love them both They fell in love with me and Sydney and they were like Will you come shoot our wedding in Italy? And I thought they were joking at first but then they literally fired their other photographers and hired us just based off the experience they had at the wedding and when they saw the preview that I sent and
00:08:10
Speaker
the night before we all flew home. And that is how I got the big Italy job. And those two events would never have happened. They would have never been on my radar had Sam not made the first connection.
00:08:23
Speaker
And then I got to go do this other thing. So I think that those instances just blow my mind when it had, it had nothing to do with my talent. Like, yes, obviously they looked at my book and I had good work, but like Stephanie, Stephanie and Ethan had only seen the preview that I had done for the bride and groom. They hadn't even seen a full gallery and they were willing to hire me for their wedding. And that was mind blowing to me.
Ethical Concerns in Networking
00:08:46
Speaker
Um,
00:08:47
Speaker
I also was thinking about this whole thing in the context of, I don't know if you listen to this other podcast called Dr. Death. I know of it. Or like Bad Surgeon. And, you know, there are like, there's one about like Dr. Macchiarini, who was this horrible guy who had like synthetic tracheas that he was putting into people.
00:09:06
Speaker
and literally had never done animal testing and was using humans as guinea pigs. And he killed a two year old, he killed a couple of grown parent, like grown ass adults, like, and these major,
00:09:20
Speaker
hospitals like Karolinska in Sweden, I believe, literally covered it up like they just like turned a blind eye because of like the embarrassment it would have been to realize that they had like endorsed this guy who had literally skipped over the entire, I don't know, major chunk of medical research you have to do before you do human trials.
00:09:39
Speaker
And it just blew my mind as I was watching this documentary of like, this guy got away with it because of who he knew and what they assumed that he knew how to do, you know? And so I just think it's really interesting when we have this rule about how who you know can lead to such incredible opportunities, but also who you know can lead to incredible conspiracies and awful outcomes.
00:10:08
Speaker
And what do you think it is about when, like if we're looking at it through the context of like bad surgeon or where these people are committing these atrocious acts of gross negligence, right? But based on who they know, like they're getting away with it. Like what do you think, like what's going on there? Like why does that happen? And, and, and why do people cover it up instead of like doing the right thing? I mean, I think it comes down to better the devil, devil, you know, is that the saying?
00:10:38
Speaker
Yeah, so people are more likely to just go with what is familiar to them rather than take any sort of risk, even if the risk would come with a greater reward. And I mean, people cover stuff up to save their own asses.
00:10:55
Speaker
And even in the wedding industry, this is not obviously as detrimental maybe as a fact, but I see it all the time where people will use the same people over and over again for their project. And half the time I think this isn't pushing you creatively. This isn't giving you like any new insight into projects or whatever it is.
00:11:23
Speaker
And also, you're not even seeing what else is out there. In some ways, it has benefit me, right? Because I have, I'm on a bunch of short lists. But at the same time, I think like, yeah, but then that's all, you're just getting me.
00:11:40
Speaker
Yeah, yeah.
Limitations of Familiar Networks
00:11:42
Speaker
And so it's it's so fascinating because I completely agree. And I think there are some like you and I just did a big shoot for a local wedding magazine with our best friends who are wedding designers. And like we realized that that was the only project this entire year that all of us are going to be on together. So it was really special. But I think that there's times where you find that core set of people that you really enjoy the flow with and you enjoy that work ethic and that that rhythm and tandem and like you kind of know what's in that person's head.
00:12:10
Speaker
And I especially love shooting with you because I feel like you see so much that I don't see and usually like I'm just gonna out myself like biting off your ideas. I'm just like, ooh, Jamie, I see you. And so like for me, I really like working with people who see so differently than me because it challenges me artistically. Now, eventually like I would learn to know your style so well that it would no longer like quote unquote, like surprise me. Like I'd be like, okay, yeah, that's totally, that is exactly what Jamie would do.
00:12:40
Speaker
So your eye would already have adapted to seeing those things too, essentially. Essentially, yes. And so there is definitely an advantage of working with others and really adopting their vision as well. Because you always change it and you mold it and you make it your own and all that kind of good stuff.
00:12:57
Speaker
And I would say that Bixby definitely has a short list of people they love to work with, but nine times out of 10, I feel like a lot of people are already coming to them with a lot of vendors they want to work with. I think specifically photographer and videographer, I feel like florist, stationer, dresses, a lot of that is very fluid. I don't think that people necessarily come with that own, like that short list to them. But I think photographer and videographer, it's kind of hard for them to like always get their recommendations in because I think that
00:13:25
Speaker
That's obviously easily seen on Instagram, which is interesting because I think you and I I don't know actually I can't speak to your experience But I've also gotten some really big jobs based on Instagram, which is so wild to me Because I used to show up a lot more on my story So people really felt like they knew me I was doing kind of a little bit of a different style I had a different ideal client and
00:13:44
Speaker
people just felt so relatable to me like I would have people who are like I've been following you for two years and I'm finally engaged and I want you to shoot my wedding and that just always blew my mind because in a way that's a little bit about both about what you know and who you know because like they obviously knew me and they obviously knew that I knew how to do my work correctly so but going back to kind of like the darker side of this
00:14:07
Speaker
You were saying how it's better the devil you know than the devil you don't. And I completely agree with that. It's kind of like, this sounds so bad, but it's like out of your friends, who could come to you and say, I need your help to bury a body. And you could totally shut your mouth and be like, yes. Who would come to me and I would say that? Like if someone came to you and was like, this is what I need Jamie. Like who's the person that you'd be like, yeah, no questions, I will do it.
00:14:35
Speaker
That's hard because I'm pretty moralistic as a person. You asked them to turn themselves in. Yeah. I guess depending on what the body was or who they had killed, again, it's sort of like, I have come to a place in my life where I believe morality is relative, but I would have created in my own head a standard of and a boundary for morality around who deserves to die.
00:15:02
Speaker
And I would make that judgment pretty quick, as in, if I thought, whatever. But all that to say, I know exactly who I would go to if I had killed someone that needed help bearing a body. Ooh, who would you go to? Taylor, 100%. 100%. She would have zero qualms helping you hide a body.
00:15:27
Speaker
million percent like zero she'd never tell well maybe that would actually be the issue she'd be fine helping you bury the body but she wouldn't be able to keep her mouth shut no she would just have to tell jordan she would tell jordan ash and karson and cam and then all the husbands would know everyone would know well no body no in that circle
00:15:50
Speaker
No body, no crime. So I mean, I would say Taylor's definitely one of them. She would not help you lift the body, but she would definitely give you the schematics of how to get rid of it. You know what I mean? I mean, I'm sure she has a plan. Yeah. I would say the person I would go to if I truly had killed someone and needed someone to help me cover it up would be my best friend, Samantha and my sister. Emily is very moralistic and she would tell me to turn myself in. But Sam and Aaron would like, they'd be right there with you.
00:16:20
Speaker
lips locked, like never, they would never like lift your shield and throw away the key. They would, they would totally help me bury your body. Which by the way, if there is any police officer listening to this at a later date, I promise we didn't say any of these things with the intention of killing anyone at this given point on Tuesday, March 26, 2024 at 8.34 PM when we were recording this. Thank you so much. I played the fifth. What is the fifth?
00:16:45
Speaker
Silence like I put the Feth like I won't say anything the right to remain silent. I mean I yeah, I've heard that I just didn't know are we done talking about dead people? I have a question. I mean are we? Yeah, go for it. So what do you think about?
Critique of Educational Workshops
00:17:00
Speaker
Education in the wedding industry in terms of this question. Oh I could write a dissertation um
00:17:10
Speaker
It sounded a little bit like an orgasm though, so you should switch up your noises. How do you orgasm? Because that is not what it sounds like for me. I'm not going to show you that on here. Another time. Another time off camera. Another time, another place. Okay.
00:17:32
Speaker
Okay, so when it comes to education in the wedding industry, nothing pisses me off more than someone who got a lucky break who just builds a platform to quote unquote teach you things which are beyond basic that you could find for free on YouTube University
00:17:52
Speaker
And they make a fuck ton of money off of it just based off their reputation. Like there is nothing new that they are bringing to the industry. There is, I hate the lack of ownership of like, I got lucky. Like I had the work to back it up, but I got lucky. I hate it when people just do not admit that it absolutely pains me. There's a specific person who I do not like, who is a videographer who is doing this.
00:18:17
Speaker
And I will not speak her name on here because I don't even know her personally, but I'm not trying to start shit. So it just really makes me upset because I don't think that you should be teaching business classes. I think artistry can be taught at any point because I think that if you are a true artist and you're doing incredible things, and you have a very unique perspective, I think that that can be taught. I don't think you have to put in
00:18:41
Speaker
years in time, if you have a very established style, if you have a very generic style, you're not really teaching anyone anything. So when I think of like Henry's diary, who has developed this very unique style, and is very artsy, like he had developed that, like within two years of being a photographer, so like that was something you could easily teach. But when I think it comes to like true business and marketing, I think I would not buy a course from someone who has not cut their teeth in this industry for at least five to 10 years.
00:19:07
Speaker
because when you are 20 something with no kids and no responsibility, you can do 50 something weddings a year and just build your network as hard and as fast as you can and do crazy ass extreme shit to be very successful very quickly. However,
00:19:26
Speaker
What that doesn't do is show anyone how to build longevity or sustainability in a business. I would say most people who burn hot like that burn out a lot faster than anyone else because they just built ramped up way too fast. They didn't scale their prices. They didn't scale their work.
00:19:45
Speaker
and it just becomes a shit show. So when people, I once was on a workshop that it was like one of the ones during COVID where you paid like $17, you could tune into this live basically. And this girl was literally preaching that. And she was like, yeah, I'm just like really young. And so like, I just literally shoot anything and everything. I'm literally shooting a client every single day. And I'm like, that is not sustainable. Like when are you editing? How are you delivering? When do you have your own life?
00:20:14
Speaker
If you're occupying those times every single night, like you have no time for yourself. My long-winded answer is to say like, I hate it when people make a shit ton of money off of who they know and not what they know. Cause I don't think that that's fair or right. Like you shouldn't be taking people's money at that point. Right. It does feel like false advertising in a lot of ways. But again, I kind of feel, I feel probably similarly mad to you, but I'm on the end of the spectrum where I guess, do you boo?
00:20:44
Speaker
Like, if you're gonna do it, then do it. I'm not gonna pay for it. And that's fine. I can make that decision. If somebody else wants to pay for it, then they can. I think of I bought a workshop pre COVID from a duo that was very successful. I'd been in the industry for a long time. Wait, is it who I think it is? The Hans?
00:21:05
Speaker
yeah okay so i went to their workshop in la and they had the guy from the bachelor there speaking i know i can't remember his name now i think i took one valuable thing away from that workshop and i took zero networking relationships
00:21:23
Speaker
Maybe that was on me, but honestly there wasn't a lot of networking time. And the one valuable thing I took away from that workshop was to answer my emails really fucking fast. Yeah, you're really good at that. To answer my inquiries really fast. And honestly,
00:21:38
Speaker
I cannot tell you how many times an inquiry will get back to me and say, wow, thank you so much for responding so quickly. And I will book I guarantee you I book it because of my ability to just get in the door before anyone else. So that was really valuable. Nothing else from that whole workshop is value and it was probably about a grand.
00:21:57
Speaker
I remember I was going to go to that workshop when they were here in Seattle and Tony ended up going and she wrote a review about her experience at that workshop, which is still on her blog today. And she got a huge backlash because it was an honest review and Brittany Han ripped her new one about it and like went on social media and completely complained about it. So those kinds of people also pissed me off because they're just like, they want everyone to just blow smoke up their ass.
00:22:20
Speaker
because, oh, you know me, girl, I'm just here and like support you and we're here to house on. It's just like, no, you were literally dragged in 2020 because you were a horrible person. I don't know how much of this we're going to keep in. But when we're thinking about people like that, though, who those people who put on the workshop, the Hans, they had built up this reputation. So it's like when you heard it, when you heard about it, you were like, oh, everyone's talking about this workshop.
00:22:46
Speaker
I have to go. And so I reached out to Tony cause Tony was someone I knew liked and trusted as a friend. And I was like, Hey, do you think this is worth it to go? And she was honest with me and she said, no, I don't think it is. It's all very basic. It's all very rudimentary. You might take away one or two things, but I don't think it's worth the price. And I don't think they speak to their guests very well. Like as an attendee, I didn't feel like it was a supportive environment. It felt very cutthroat and it wasn't what I would have wanted.
00:23:13
Speaker
But yeah, I mean, it just goes to show that in our industry, whether it is what you know or who you know, there's always gonna be, whether it is as a vendor or as like an educator, there's always gonna be inconsistencies in people. Like as an educator, there's no, like this is maybe going on a tangent, but there's just no magic pill to get better at something.
00:23:34
Speaker
and I think that's what people go to educators for is they're looking for that like this is the tool that is going to make me uber successful and it's just not like it is a combination of your your work being consistent and good and then also on the other side like we've already talked about it is about your relationships and your networking and but there's no magic pill to getting a million bookings there's no there's not going to necessarily be like a light bulb moment
00:24:04
Speaker
I agree. And I think that's a lot of the reason why people hunt for they hunt for it. Because I think that there is with social media, we're so used to seeing this like overnight success, right? Like, but what truly happens is those people have been working for years and years. I think Amy Schumer talked about how she was doing stand up in
00:24:22
Speaker
New York and LA for like 12 years before she had her break, you know, and that that's a huge amount of time that you think about the woman who wrote Where the Crawdads Sing, which later became a really great movie. Like that was her first novel when she was like in her 50s or 60s, and she had spent so long preparing for that moment. And so I think it's really fascinating that like the who you know, can make you trust someone, even though they might actually not know anything.
00:24:51
Speaker
And that's what I'm trying to get at. And I think that that is such an interesting fallacy of the human spirit is that you want to trust and you want to feel confident in the people around you, but humans are fallible and like we fuck up all the time. So I just think that's really interesting because I find myself to be one of those people who is very trusting. And that has served me and that has not served me in many ways.
00:25:18
Speaker
And I just think about all the people who trusted in me when I didn't know shit. It really built me to where I was. And so I think that's so fascinating. Let's say you're fresh to our industry, because I think we can specifically speak
Balancing Networking and Skill Development
00:25:33
Speaker
to it. But in general, any industry, what do you think someone should do if right now they only have what they know?
00:25:42
Speaker
and they don't have the who they know. I think there's a lot of good advice out there about genuinely showing up other people's faces on social media to try and get to know people to try and make connections and networking. On the what you know, I have honestly found that practice is the best way to learn anything.
00:26:03
Speaker
you could do a million education things even like the artsy education things but honestly most of that you can find for free most technical stuff you can find for free on youtube and ultimately it's going to be it's going to come down to putting things into practice in your real life and if you're trying to find your style
00:26:25
Speaker
I would stop, honestly stop scrolling through wedding Instagram and start looking at other art forms. I think fashion is a great place to start, paintings, like any of that. Just start going into other art mediums and maybe start to realize where your own eye notices things throughout the day or what like you're seeing throughout the day.
00:26:49
Speaker
and figure out how to pull those into your own work and then again practice like you don't need to hustle to the point of like I'm shooting someone every single day and I'm blah blah because oftentimes in that situation you're like shooting a bunch of different things every single day but you're overworking yourself you're not spending any time in front of the computer doing the actual editing which is a whole other aspect
00:27:13
Speaker
of your style and of what you know and it will make a difference the back end of your business or editing or any of that it will make a huge difference in your own workflow which will then like change how you are to work with and how reliable you are and consistent you are so again that's kind of us talking to like videographers and photographers but you're right there's no magic pill time takes time and you have to just do the work i my students at the college i teach at
00:27:40
Speaker
I told them the mantra to get through winter quarter is show up, do the work. Like that's all you have to do. And so many of them honestly couldn't do that. Um, I have multiple students who should have failed due to their absentees. Like it was insane. So we're going, we're working on it as a, as a program, but literally I think that's what it is, is like to be successful in anything, you have to show up and do the work.
00:28:05
Speaker
and be a good person. And on that side of things, as you are networking with people, I think plenty of educators that talk about this, but the way to connect with people is you don't think of it as like you have to be like friends with everyone that you want to work with. That's like such an extreme view.
00:28:25
Speaker
But you do want to show up genuinely in their space and connect on a professional level and be consistent about it and not expect, oh, well, I messaged you yesterday commenting on one of your stories and today I'm expecting you to like put me on your roster. And then I think a more important part of that
00:28:46
Speaker
is being able to follow up with being a good vendor outside of your work. So being consistent, being pleasant and happy and nice to work with on a wedding day or throughout the process, being good to clients, following through, and generally being a good communicator.
00:29:11
Speaker
always helps. So yeah, I think, you know, we've kind of created this like black and white idea of being a good artist and is it being a good artist or who is it that you know? But there's just so much kind of like what we talk about, right? There's like so much gray in there and being a good business owner is a part of that and being generally like just a good person.
00:29:38
Speaker
Yeah. And I think that, you know, part of what I teach at the college is I teach the business classes because you can be the best artist there is, but if you don't know how to run a business, you're never going to make money at this, at this work. And so I think that you have to, that's where the gray is, is like.
00:29:54
Speaker
there isn't like, I just have to be good at this, or I just have to be good at this. It's like, no, no, no, you actually have to build up both these things kind of at the same time. And it's like, you have to wax on with this one and wax off with this one, like both of them kind of build upon each other. Because like, as you develop your style, you start to develop your ideal client, and then as you develop your ideal client, you start to build out your back end.
Subjectivity in Art and Weddings
00:30:14
Speaker
And then as you start to do this, you start to connect with the right vendors that lead to that ideal client. So it's kind of like this whole weird, like tiered build up. And I think that
00:30:22
Speaker
a lot of people just want to have this idea as soon as they like they hit the ground running and this is exactly what it is but so much changes and molds and does all this stuff based on what you know based on who you know because the opportunities and the experiences are going to change what you want and what you don't want and so I guess my best piece of advice to anyone who is wondering what the hell to do would just be to show up
00:30:47
Speaker
do the work, be a good person. And be resilient because there will be downtimes and uptimes in the business and in any art and you just got to keep going until it is on the rise again. Yeah, you have to learn to ride the wave. Totally. People talk about that all the time. I think of what you were talking about with like where the crawdads sing and how it was her first novel and she was in her fifties. There are so many people
00:31:18
Speaker
are constantly wondering, like, why am I not making it? Why am I not making it? Or, you know, people that talk about how hard it is to get into the publishing industry or whatever. And I've always thought that all it, not all it took, but it just takes resiliency, like being willing to keep going, keep learning. And even if you're not getting as many weddings as you want, even if you're not getting that book deal, even if you're not X, Y, and Z, you just got to keep trying.
00:31:45
Speaker
And eventually something will stick. But if you're that person on American Idol who literally can't sing and everyone's just telling you to keep going, like there's also a difference. You know what I'm talking about? Like those sad people who there can not, yeah, I just can't, but there can't be like, if you're really that bad at something, my hope would be that someone would tell you you suck and you just, you have to find something else to do.
00:32:09
Speaker
Well, apparently in the early 2000s, that was not a thing because we all watched American Idol and those poor people who just humiliated themselves. So I always that's actually last little comment. Like that was always the biggest fear of mine when I launched this business was that like no one was telling me that I was actually really bad. It's like when you have a booger in your nose and no one fucking tells you like a true friend would be a yo, you got a bogey.
00:32:39
Speaker
Okay, but here's the issue, and I meant to say this earlier because it's kind of interesting, but taste is so varied person to person. There are people who some people would call extremely proficient wedding videographers, and I can't fucking stand a single second of their films. I know exactly who you're talking about.
00:33:01
Speaker
I mean, I know who you're talking about, who I'm talking about, but there's many, honestly. Welcome to the Shit Talking episode featuring Jamie and Sarah's opinion on the local wedding industry here in Seattle.
00:33:19
Speaker
I forgot where I was going in at that point. But yeah, taste is so varied. So especially with art, I mean, maybe not singing, like there are bad voices, obviously. Like, I don't think you can argue being in tune or not. But in the wedding industry. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Because I mean, I look at my earlier work and I'm like, how the fuck did anyone pay me for that? You know, so yeah, it
00:33:43
Speaker
You're totally right. But I think, I think there are, you know, there are some objectable standards. Like what? Like being in focus. Okay. Mine is the current trend of like, Oh, some are blurry and artsy, but it's like no one would want their entire wedding blurry. Unless let's say they hire a film photographer and it's not going to be sharp, tack sharp. Depends on what lens you have. You can get them tack sharp. But you know what I'm saying? I know what you're saying.
00:34:08
Speaker
There's such a small, very small margin of people that are objectively bad, like that every single person in a room would say bad. That's a small group, mostly it's taste.
00:34:22
Speaker
Yeah, no, I agree because I think back and I think about weddings that we've done where I've like looked at what people have been wearing and I'm just like, you chose that today to show up to a wedding. Like that's, that's, that's poor taste right there. Alrighty, rule breakers. Well, be sure to hit follow, like, subscribe wherever you find your podcast. Give us a good follow over on Instagram at rule.followers. And don't forget to leave the five star review because you know you love us. And if you don't, you can leave. No one's holding you here. All right, guys.
00:34:52
Speaker
Please love me though. Okay. Okay, bye friends. Okay, bye!