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Run The List: 2025 Wrap Up!
20 Plays15 hours ago
That's a wrap!
As we close out 2025 join our hosts as we revisit some of our most trending and most controversial topics from throughout the year.
This Special Episode features hosts: Dr. Dumebi Okocha, MD; Dr. Isabella Ntigbu, MD, Dr. Samiza Palmer, MD, Student Dr. Chinasa Anokwuru, & Jared Jeffrey, MS
From Love Island USA to the controversy of 24 hour shifts in medical training, join us in The Lounge for some insightful conversation and entertaining commentary!
Click here for the Thesis Pitch Sign up!
To share your thoughts on our discussions or if you have any questions to ask our hosts, email podcast@snma.org for a chance to be featured on the show
Disclaimer: The opinions and views expressed on our podcast do not reflect the official stance of the Student National Medical Association.
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Transcript
Introduction and Disclaimers
00:00:00
Speaker
The views expressed on this podcast represent only those of the hosts and do not represent the views of the Student National Medical Association.
SNMA Research Opportunities
00:00:07
Speaker
The Diversity Research Committee of SNMA invites current SNMA members registered for AMEC 2026 to submit abstracts for the thesis pitch competition.
00:00:18
Speaker
Presented research in three minutes or less, clearly communicating a significance to a non-specialist audience and a panel of judges for a chance to win a cash prize. The missions are due February 1st, 2026 at 1159 PM Pacific standard time to register. Please click the link in the description
Podcast Launch and Introduction
00:00:37
Speaker
box below. And now let's start the show.
00:00:58
Speaker
Welcome to SNMA presents the lounge. Whether you're in the student lounge, doctor's lounge or lounging around at home, get ready to join SNMA for meaningful conversations on topics affecting minorities in medicine and groups that often sit at the margins of healthcare.
Holiday Resolutions
00:01:12
Speaker
I'm Dr. Isabella and it is officially the most wonderful time of the year, my favorite season. ah The holidays. As we get ready to wrap up 2025, I wanted to ask everybody who's here, which is pretty much the whole gang at cass except my soldier, my dog, Dr. Aldi.
00:01:30
Speaker
I wanted to ask you all, what is everyone's anticipated New Year's resolutions for this upcoming year? I can start. My resolution honestly is to really just better my like lifestyle outside of medicine. I think right now I'm trying to figure out how to still be well rested and live a full life outside of residency.
00:01:54
Speaker
And I think because of the pressures of being an intern and all of this being new and wanting to know things, but at the same time, like not wanting to overextend myself because like, at then day, I'm not going to know everything and it's going to come step by step. So I think I just want to figure out really how to still do all the things that I love to do outside of medicine and not burn out quickly. That's kind of my resolution. So, you know we're going to continue to work on that, build up new habits, write things down, write my down my goals that I hope to achieve as I continue into this new year in my really the second half of my first year of residency. So that's kind of my New Year's resolution. but what are you about you guys who wants to
00:02:33
Speaker
Go next. Come one, come all.
00:02:41
Speaker
Not all at once, guys. I'm thinking like, oh my yeah means i oh, okay. Go for it. Go for it. and No, no, no, please. I'm still thinking.
00:02:52
Speaker
Go ahead. Oh, I bet. What's going on, everybody? It's your boy, aspiring student, Dr. Jared Jeffrey. um As for 2026 resolutions, um very much in a similar ah vein as you, Isabella, want to really hone in on making sure that I am taking care of business outside of my profession.
00:03:16
Speaker
My profession gets, you know, a good bit of time doing great at work. Things are going fabulously. But I have my outside goals now that I really need to. um Locking on. You know what i'm saying? I'm going to be going from working two jobs to one job in the new year.
00:03:32
Speaker
Can't wait for that. And along with that, I want to replace that time that I was given to that other job with real intentional goals, with real intentional goals and habits.
00:03:45
Speaker
So I'm looking forward to it. Love it.
00:03:52
Speaker
anybody else yeah hi everyone my name is chinasa um and don't forget the student doc come on y'all like what why are you selling yourself short yeah sure right town after four years of medical school you're just saying chinasa come on ah that's the name they gave me or that's the name my mother gave me ah Let's see. New Year's resolution. Honestly, you know, I've just been thinking about my hydration lately. i don't do a good job of drinking water and that's actually crazy. She's like, y'all are thirsty. I'm not going to be thirsty in this new year.
00:04:37
Speaker
It time, y'all. It is time. is time to drink at least four bottles of water. that. She said no AKI for me.
00:04:50
Speaker
Yo, that's so real though. Cause sometimes you can forget to drink water. Yeah, water's important. I definitely had piloting. No, for real. I know something. Shanah's about to have the best creatinine on this podcast. Point to point three.
00:05:04
Speaker
Clear. Listen, listen. yes got any No CKD, man. At all. i'll happily take any tips. Right now, we just get one in in the morning. That's about it. Trying to place one at lunch.
00:05:21
Speaker
i know I can't with y'all. This is really the comedic relief I needed, man. here for it, though. I'm here for it. though i'm here for it
00:05:32
Speaker
ah Love it. I appreciate that that. That was really important. You know what? Because you put the eggs in your New Year's resolution, I'm going to pay attention to it more. and i't see This is a TMI moment during my M4 year because this is real.
00:05:47
Speaker
This is Samisa again. I definitely had an AKI when I went to the doctor. All I got was a call from the doctor. She said, just drink some more water, baby. I said, lady, what's the creatinine? Tell me right now. Tell me right now. create do I need to go to the hospital? She went to But in i don't know, I think The reason I think I took so long answer before is because I was definitely going to make my New Year's Eve resolution more work-related. And don't know. just want to be better.
00:06:15
Speaker
I want to just be a better doctor, like, clinically. I want i mean, I'm in a very, like, procedural slash skills-based part of medicine. You always want to be better at that. But I think hearing y'all say like you need to think you're of yourself outside of medicine. m i don't know.
00:06:37
Speaker
I think I stay pretty connected to my family and friends as much as possible, but maybe forming more relationships in this new state that I'm in, really like creating a a network down here. I think I'm really cool with the people I work with. Everybody's amazing.
00:06:54
Speaker
um but definitely like creating like a whole network um just because you know and nobody I know from like my past lives down here so you're kind of starting afresh so I think maybe that's a goal just making sure I'm making stronger roots down here right I love it it's very dope I like that Hi, I'm Dumebi, Dr. Dumebi, OBGYN resident. I would say, um similar to Samuza, I'll be like a senior resident next year, which is kind of scary because I still feel like I'm just starting out.
00:07:32
Speaker
Chief. So I'll definitely, not tellly technically not chief, just senior york because I'll be PGY3. But yeah, same sentiment. and But um I think, yeah, like you said, like honing into your craft. And like, I think it's different to do so what I'm learning now. It's like, okay, I can do things, but teaching things is like a whole nother ball game. And then also like conducting yourself as like a leader. Like I haven't been in a leadership role in so long because like in residency, you kind of like work up the ranks and like in med school, like you start off as an M1 and then rise to the M4. And then, so now it's like the same thing with residency. it It's like kind of turning over so fast where it's like, okay, I gotta be in my leadership era now. And I feel like I've put that back of my brain for like the past two years. So I've been more of like the junior resident.
00:08:20
Speaker
um And of course, like having leadership, like, you know, in different clinical settings, but you know, like ultimately running everything by my chief and doing this. but then when you're 30 or you're like, you know, the senior, if not your fourth year and usually the third and fourth year kind of switch off being like, you know, the team leader in some senses. So that's kind of nerve wracking, but I feel like trust the process. Like I worked 80 hours a week for a reason. So something has to stick.
Work-Life Balance in Medicine
00:08:44
Speaker
so Yeah.
00:08:48
Speaker
Felt that work 80 hours a week for a reason. If anything. Right. For our pre-clinical students, running the list on the ward allows a team to address pressing matters of the day. In this segment of the show, we'll be discussing some recent events in medicine and beyond affecting our communities and the populations we serve.
00:09:10
Speaker
All right, so we have many different topics in our episode um that kind of span from across the year that were some of our favorites. And one that I talked about in one the podcasts was forming and sustaining romantic relationships as a black woman in medicine. um And like ah the famous show, like Married to Medicine. um I guess we can talk about more of like, has your perspective, a lot of us, like when we first talked about that, we were either junior residents, like interns or still medical students. So now that we're all like moved up a year, I wanted to know your guys' thoughts on this. um
00:09:45
Speaker
In my program, a lot more people have gotten engaged. um A lot more people have gotten married throughout like the span of the year. And I feel like it honestly depends on who you surround yourself with. And like, if you're able to like sustain that relationship, just based off of like people who support that and being environment that supports that.
Dating Challenges for Black Women in Medicine
00:10:03
Speaker
Like my residency program is very like, we have this thing called house spouses, um which is just like the club for the spouses of the residents. um And they all like,
00:10:14
Speaker
Oh, that's fine. Yeah, stay connected together. They all stay connected together. They golf together. They hang out outside of us in residency, which I find pretty nice that they all moved to this new city not knowing anybody and they have this connection. But specifically as a Black woman and for SNMA, I just wanted to know you guys' thoughts as you guys have started on this journey.
00:10:40
Speaker
It's gotten worse-er. Yes, Father God. For context, Isabella and Samisa, you guys are in new cities as of this year, right? Yes.
00:10:54
Speaker
We are in new cities. We have moved up the ranks from med student to PGY1 residents. Do find that there's less options now that you have like the full doctor title? Just given that you know as you get more towards the top, it gets lonely at the top.
00:11:13
Speaker
and then there's less people that look like kind of at the top. If you're looking for people that look like us, okay? Tell me about it. It's crazy. It's gotten worse. That's just how I kind of, you know, summarize it. I think, oh, I mean, when you tell someone what you're a doctor, what do you think the reaction is going to be?
00:11:33
Speaker
You know, it's like, if they're not that, or if they're not even something equalqui some around that, yeah. It's like, you're looking at me, I'm looking back at you. you know I'm trying to say? And it's different as a woman because- is It's happened this happened to you?
00:11:47
Speaker
Yeah, it's definitely happened to me. And I've actually wow had men, i've I've had men try, not don't want to say humble me, but try to make it seem like it's not that big of a deal because they knew that right what they were doing wasn't really touching that. You know what I'm trying to say So it's like- I think, ah yeah, I think it's the head swipe for me, but you know, I i do think that ultimately, um I do think, sorry, the listeners can't see what we're seeing, but ultimately I do think that, um yeah, you know, I don't know how things will improve.
00:12:22
Speaker
back yeah very doc. No, stop. You know what? I'm even, but let me, let me, me, okay. For me, I'm trying to think. I don't know. I i think for me, a really big problem personally is just the amount of time spent in the hospital.
00:12:40
Speaker
Okay. That's what I was thinking. Yeah, that's what I was thinking. that like That for sure is a significant part of the problem. As I just stated, I'm getting there now. What? 5? 5.05? I'm leaving six six thirty yeah
00:12:59
Speaker
everybody's gone. Everybody's gone. and And the thing is, I'm not, I'm not, we're doing the five minute drive from work to the hospital. I'm not going, I'm not going nowhere. I'm not going anywhere. I'm not really going straight home.
00:13:16
Speaker
Going straight home. You lucky if I get some food to eat. Like, you know, it's sleep for dinner. So like. Sleep for dinner? Literally thinking about trying to incorporate somebody into that is really a lie. Right? It's crazy. And especially, i think me and my friends, you know, a lot of people that I like are are not in medicine, but they're also like professionals. I feel like we're kind of all experiencing the same thing, right? Like you've reached such a pinnacle in your career. And the thing is, we're not at our pinnacles, right? So it's it's quite literally only going to get worse. yeah And it just feels like there's not necessarily a balance, right?
00:13:57
Speaker
And putting yourself out there for somebody that it doesn't feel like there's a balance with, It's just like, why am I putting myself through this unnecessary work? yeah Like, I am tired, actually. I'm tired. still trying to get better at my craft.
00:14:12
Speaker
yeah I should be studying, but I'm talking to you. And then I talk to you. and you're like, oh. Oh, my So, like, what's your love language? Is it physical touch? What's your favorite colors? Useless, useless questions, you know? I'm literally so in Oh, my gosh.
00:14:30
Speaker
Okay. Okay. It's like your time is so limited, you know, i question and it's like, you don't want to waste it on nonsense. Sorry. No, no, no. When we were in undergrad and med school, did you feel like that was something you prioritize and it's just getting harder or because like now we made it to residency, we're just like, you know, finished, you have a guaranteed job. It's more of like, um, less of, I mean, still a grind, but not the same grind as like trying to get into residency and trying to get into medical school. Do you think that is it because like,
00:15:02
Speaker
because our priorities were shifted somewhere differently. But now that we're like higher up, it's harder to find that person because it wasn't like something that we prioritized when we were younger.
00:15:14
Speaker
now You know, i even tried to prioritize it, but the mess was still there. just go worse i just feel like it just, it gets worse in different ways. If you get, it you know, it's like it was worse than undergrad yeah how i get to i like getting an undergrad, right? No, I whatever question. Yeah. didn Yeah, I just, just that the things change with each stage of your life, right? Undergrad, no one's serious. For the most part, nobody's really serious. We're all just trying to play the field or just trying to, you know, we're excited. We're out of the house and we're just trying to like get to know ourselves and other people. And then we maybe have aspirations, but nobody has any money and you can't really date meaningfully because of that.
00:15:56
Speaker
And then... As a med student, now you're in ah a bubble where, okay, we're black black women in medicine. We probably have preference that we want to be black men. How many black men compared to black women do you see in medicine? You know, that kind of thing. And most of the time, these are the people you spend all your time with. So it's like, if you're not really dating the people that you're around or that you're kind of in the same circles with, you're not really having time to date other people outside of that. So it's just there's blockades at every road. Now we're in residency. Our time has even gotten worse than what it was in med school. And you' you're even grateful if you even see one or two black male doctors in your work environment, you know, or just someone in in the medical field, period. So I just feel like the it just kind of continues to get narrower and narrower and narrower as you kind of get go up the ladder of this training.
00:16:45
Speaker
um So I can i provide don't know. Can I provide a small a small glimmer of hope? I think that's need. all means. So so what i what I will say is, um like I said, I've been working two jobs. I have been completely out of school.
00:17:04
Speaker
I have been doing like my independent studying, but you know no rigorous academics or anything like that.
Expanding Social Circles Beyond Medicine
00:17:09
Speaker
And I've been going on a couple trips. When I go on these trips, the Black Professional Men's is there.
00:17:17
Speaker
If you go on a trip to somewhere where the peoples is congregating and whatever the case may be, going to put this in the the the gentlest way I can. Right. Only a certain tax bracket is making it on these trips.
00:17:32
Speaker
trips to where exactly now, Jared? Well, if you could if you can imagine, like, any kind of... They're traveling to the moon. they space trips now? No, not even. not No, it's not. related and So so so i go get too specific because it's brands and stuff like that.
00:17:52
Speaker
But what I'll basically say is if you could imagine, like... um like festivals that the culture will be interested in right like a coachella uh like a um like a like a dreamville like a dreamville like an afro nation exactly exactly you know what i'm saying those like like what you looking for is there in large supply and like it is a trip it it is a trip it is a trip so you know take it with a grain of salt but i i feel the woes of y'all that have that have struggles in your personal cities and i will say that on the road i'll be on the road i be like nice cop out here damn it's some yeah so the trips that they're tripping on are they tripping um with people like or who are they tripping you know the question
00:18:37
Speaker
Correct. You know what I'm trying to say? that's the That's the real question. Because I see those men on trips, but the people that they're eyeing, you know what I'm trying to say? so So I'll put it like this, and I can only speak for me and my friends.
00:18:50
Speaker
I did not come to this ah thing highly desired by Black women to go find anything else. You know what mean? Like if I signed up for this and like, yeah I'm here to indulge, I'm here to indulge. And you know, i have a shared interest with you for this, then I'm likely going, you know what I'm saying?
00:19:11
Speaker
And you'll be surprised how many like real professionals that you find in that mix.
00:19:17
Speaker
Jared is living in the most blissful of realities because I haven't seen this. Just let me know if I need to take y out a little trip with me, man. What happens to love is blind. What about the non-professionals, y'all? We're like professional. Honestly, the answer is i have to go ah probably on a Love Island version of medicine.
00:19:40
Speaker
um What if we actually did that? You know? Like, imagine. That would be wild. That would be wild. That would be so good. That would be so funny.
00:19:51
Speaker
Wouldn't that be great? Like, it's getting so dark that, like, you kind of, like, you're spending so much time in the hospital. You making stuff up. Oh, me and him have all the same patients. That's the love of my life. it's not. It's definitely not. they have a surgical and another and another services problem that's why you're like oh my god like y'all don't know like i've seen him like five times today like that's literally crazy work right like I don't know. I think it's very difficult if you're in the same spot all the time with the same people to like branch out and like, you know, just make yourself known. And like, Jared, like I said, it's a great and amazing idea. The reality, at least for me, let me speak for myself.
00:20:42
Speaker
I got three weeks of vacation this year. Right? Right. We can mix a shake with that sis. We can, but you have to request it.
00:20:54
Speaker
Then I have to have the money for it. Right. And it has to work with the schedule. Like, it It really is like, you know, you you like you come up with the big ideas and you want to make it
Media Representation and Social Norms
00:21:05
Speaker
work.
00:21:05
Speaker
And you're trying to make yourself as available as possible. But sometimes, like, it legit is just easier to just chill. think that's a problem. I don't know if I've found someone that makes me want to, like... Not chill. Yeah, that warrants me not chilling. You should chill with you. You're tired. This sleep...
00:21:26
Speaker
Oh, I am. And I would love that. But it would actually require me seeing some substance. Like, when I go on Hinge or wherever and they're talking about nonsense...
00:21:38
Speaker
and I'm trying to make sure I'm not nonsense at work, one of these things is gonna win. And it's not the nonsense man on the app. It's not. a hundred percent It's gonna be me, 100%, right? So like like I think- Like I said, y'all, the answer is not- It's true. It's just not in reality. we have We have to create our own reality. In fact- You do. i Me, I wanna enter the villa.
00:22:00
Speaker
ah Me, I wanna enter the villa, but I wanna enter the about the villa in the wards.
00:22:13
Speaker
Okay, I want to add to the villa because this is the this was the year of the villa, y'all. Honestly, we really saw how in 2025, everybody was enamored by the concept of Love Island and how you can really make a connection off of very little, but just energy and vibes. And maybe that's what we need.
00:22:32
Speaker
But, you know, let's talk a little bit about... I feel like that bubble helped too. That bubble. Oh, 100%. That bubble definitely helped. Let's talk about it. Let's talk about Love Island. That was actually one of our most popular topics this year that we talked about in a prior on the list episode. Everybody loves Love Island. It's very...
00:22:51
Speaker
It was a very popular concept um for those who don't know what it is. Just a very quick recap. It is a widely popular international reality television franchise that kind of just shows modern dating, but it also sparks a lot of heated discussions among fans about the desirability of black women and darkest com complexion people often on air. So, you know, this year we had some really popular contestants. We had Alandria, Shelly, and then their partners, Ace and um Nick, respectively. Now, Nick is not a black man, but he might as well have been the way that he was getting doted on um with Nick Alandria Nation.
00:23:26
Speaker
So we had a couple of popular topics that kind of popped off from the season that honestly, I think is worth mentioning because as a medical podcast, let's focus on underrepresented people. We got to make sure that we mentioned some of these things that would affect people like us who kind of go on this pod and talk all the time. So Alandria earlier today, earlier this year, you know, was left out of people magazine, which is kind of really emblematic of how a lot of times black people get kind of, um,
00:23:55
Speaker
omitted from the narrative, they kind of get left out from the story. and it you know it kind of sparked people to be more intentional about why is it that black women are easily forgotten or easily left out, kind of like what we were just talking about now, how it's very easy for us to not know if we have a space in society and where we really fall.
00:24:16
Speaker
um So I think she's been really pivotal in kind of helping us to think more about that. Then we had Shelly and Buzzfeed where um they basically had Shelly's face and a knuckle sandwich posted and kind of just talking about like basically what kind of food that they would have them be served for breakfast because the breakfast being made in love island was a really big concept and they did a knuckle sandwich and everyone was like hmm using a black woman and then a knuckle sandwich kind of points towards aggression violence like why are these things that we are okay with putting towards black women so another thing that we kind of had to think a little bit more about in this um with this show
00:24:56
Speaker
And then last but not least, we heard about the racial slur that was said on one of the Love Island castmates TikToks that was said against Alandria and how that got some attraction that eventually Huda Beauty, which was partnered with said castmate, ended their partnership with the with the particular castmate. So thinking about how our voices matter when it comes to standing up for what we believe in and all of that. But, you know, I think just thinking about all those things and we definitely want to, you know, be mindful of,
00:25:25
Speaker
how these concepts affect us. Clearly this podcast is predominantly black woman, um, represented and kind of how does love Island, would you guys say from your perspective, how does it continue to champion some of these concepts that we're talking about? And also just in general, like if we want to still continue talking about love and relationships, like how has love Island kind of,
00:25:47
Speaker
maybe change the perception of who is desirable, who is desirable of love and how can love be pursued and, you know, sought after. So yeah, i'm interested to kind of know you guys' as thoughts on all that. If you don't mind, I like to open this one up.
00:26:02
Speaker
Since we had the discussion back during the season, I actually went back and I've watched the entire show. I have some thoughts. Okay, period. Let's hear the thoughts. Let's hear the thoughts.
00:26:15
Speaker
I think Love Island is a little microcosm of society. um i think the rules that they set in place make it is what makes it interesting for us to watch, right? These people are alone in a house with each other for days on end, you know, they get to know each other, they're building these connections, and they have nothing to do but talk, right? Like, it's a little version of society where you don't got to work, everything's taken care of for you, you kind of wait for these little, you know, team builder challenges or whatever the case may be. But outside of that, you're really just talking and building connections. And i think it makes it easy to see
00:26:50
Speaker
how easy how simple it could be for us to like meet somebody right like all you really have all you really need is proximity um because you know you kind of saw like some of these people on love island would make multiple connections or whatever the case may be right yeah you could talk to this person you told us that i person oh yeah we had a connection but we might have had a stronger connection oh yeah oh me and this person are from the same place yeah that definitely helps the connection oh but you know she just does this thing that i like and I think that it gives a just a little bit of what society at large gives. Right.
00:27:23
Speaker
um And I want to tie that into your piece about Andrea. Andrea spent that entire show with the weight of black women on her back, period.
00:27:35
Speaker
I think that in everything she did, in every facial reaction, she always remembered. I'm one of two black women here, right? I go have them talking about us no kind of way.
00:27:47
Speaker
ye Oh, this is crazy, but to take it on the chin. yeah yep And
00:27:58
Speaker
I think it took a ridiculous level of maturity, a ridiculous level of wherewithal to you know not let cameras that are following you everywhere catch you slipping. could have crashed out multiple times and she never...
00:28:11
Speaker
multiple times and the one time she did crash out at the truth-telling event everybody came at her neck you know it goes yeah oh yeah and honest um and i and i will say that shelly also held herself with the plum as well you know what i'm saying always confused um but and he help her um yeah right i think that that kind of represents the little microcosm right we're like and i'm not gonna make this like a whole race thing but
00:28:40
Speaker
the black women understood they were under a microscope they understood that their moves held a little bit more meaning behind it and that you know once again like people are watching right but some people are just being scrutinized so much differently and i think they understand the scrutiny that was to come and they moved in a way that would
00:29:06
Speaker
kind of let the scrutiny be on just them and not the race you know what i'm saying yeah not black women as a total what do you guys think though I'm sorry I just had to get that out there because I'm so excited I watch the show now I'm screaming yeah I think that well I'll give a backstory so my mom like growing up she loves like reality TV my mom watched The Bachelor anything that has to do with you know fame, love and destruction my mom was watching. She loves all that stuff. And I remember watching like things with her as a kid, just kind of like do my own thing, but like her TV being the background. And like we watch things like the old ones, like The Bachelor learn all that stuff.
00:29:43
Speaker
The black women would stay on a little bit for like comedic relief, but would never get the dude at the end. So I'm happy the way that reality TV is progressing where we're seeing women, especially like um dark women, um like get their love interest and kind of like tying into the last, um the last segment we were in. But I think that if anything, like with Nick and Alandria, think Alandria said, and I could be wrong, but Nick wasn't like her typical type, like someone that she wouldn't have gone with, like in the outside world, but because of proximity, closeness and building those relationships, she's able to like see like deeper. Right. So I think if anything, it tells black women, like,
00:30:30
Speaker
you know, broaden your scope just a little bit. You know what I mean? And, you know, I think we have like this, i think black women are very loyal. I think we ride hard for, you know, but I think sometimes, you know, and we love y'all for it. We might love y'all for it.
00:30:48
Speaker
It's becoming a struggle kind of love. Yeah. Or look wider. You know what I mean? Widen your scope, you know, just a little bit and see what else is out there too. And just try something different. So.
00:31:04
Speaker
I totally agree. I think it's time for us to it's time for us to trudge forward. At work, listen, if you're in medicine at this point, everybody needs be open to a nick.
00:31:20
Speaker
ah that's That's all I'm going to say. You got to be open to it. Just give it a try. If it doesn't work out, say, oh, I tried and it wasn't for me, but you never know. yeah No matter what, go where you're treasured. Go where you're valued. That's a vibe.
00:31:41
Speaker
Always.
00:31:48
Speaker
I got a comment. had a
Celebrity Accountability and Legal Issues
00:31:49
Speaker
comment. I'm not going to make it, though. I'm not going to make it. It's okay. It's okay. it's okay no Here's the thing. It's not safe. It's Yeah, your buddy Aldo, he left you out here high and dry. Just is, all I'm going to say is,
00:32:12
Speaker
just a little bit right live ah we all all im must say is all im must say is all im must say is I know it's tough. I get it. That is tough.
00:32:22
Speaker
You know what I'm saying? um
00:32:29
Speaker
When you say broader your scope, broad maybe it does. Maybe it means broaden the places you're looking. You know what saying? So like instead of just the hospital, maybe it's the hospital and the church.
00:32:44
Speaker
Maybe it's the hospital, the church, and, you know, the local coffee shop. You know what I'm saying? Maybe when you got some flashcards to do, you find a little public spot to do your flashcards and you let fate intervene. That's I'm going to throw there. That's I'm going to out there. Fate the reason why we're suffering. match.
00:33:03
Speaker
Leaving things to chance. You see, it hasn't served us well. ah Oh, man. Yeah, so, you know, but I hear you, though. I receive it, but...
00:33:14
Speaker
Yeah. that that' that um i mean that' That's not so hot take. I'm going to just leave it at no comment. And with that, to the next topic.
00:33:27
Speaker
I tried my brother. Going back to the hometown. Had to talk about our real housewives of Potomac, Karen Huger, getting released from jail early. you know But you know the reason she was in there was because of her multiple DUIs.
00:33:44
Speaker
yeah um And you know on the podcast, I think I was on this episode when we kind of discussed like You know, like we are watching reality TV. We know these people. We love these people. But like this is kind of a serious crime. And right. Kind of, you know, was it was actually a danger to the public. And, you know.
00:34:09
Speaker
She did get her early release in September from Come On MoCo, period. Sorry, that's literally all I have to say. for good For good behavior. um And she's going to be on supervised probation for five years. She can't drive for a year. um and she has to use an ignition interlock device in her vehicle for four years.
00:34:31
Speaker
Oh, the breath light is to turn on the car? the car breathalyzer to spot your car. I just want to know what's going on in that Potomac land because it's her, then my sister Wendy. Oh no, it's getting real dark. It's getting real dark over there. And then Wendy and her husband are doing legend. I can't.
00:34:47
Speaker
Oh, Wendy. Like, what's, and then did something happen with Mia? I think, I don't know. At this point, It's getting real dark over there. and It's getting real dark.
00:35:00
Speaker
I literally went to a museum in Potomac like when I was in high school. like It's real busy over Because they don't actually live in They live in It's true. They live in the DMV, but the only one who really actually lived in Potomac, I think, was Karen.
00:35:19
Speaker
All the other people live in like either deep Maryland, deep Virginia. Like, it's given yeah mean Wendy definitely live but wendy definiteftly lived borderline Baltimore, actually, which is nowhere the- hours. That was the DFB. Right. live in Waldorf and are claiming Potomac. Who are like the real wealthy, classy.
00:35:42
Speaker
They're not on this show. I'm sorry, they're not. Like, they don't want to be caught in this. Like, because now look three castmates On the road. Zoom, just like that. Yep.
00:35:53
Speaker
It's crazy. is that is that is That is very wild for one year. That is yeah very wild. do Do you guys think that um following like, you know, so the last two seasons, in my opinion, were like really good. And I think they really like boosted the show in like ratings and everybody was like like getting a lot more popular. Do you think they started flying too close to the sun? I think you, ah sorry, I'm talking too much, but I think it's more of like,
00:36:19
Speaker
your you're paying to play and you don't have enough tokens. And then so you start stealing. mass That's a big, that's a big her right there. I mean, honestly, you're trying to maintain that certain level and then you can't maintain it anymore. Like with Wendy, right? She had like a normal profession. She was a professor. was also like a news, like what's called? Like a po political commentator. Commentator. Her husband was like tax law, which is like, you know, good money. Like they were like a typical like Potomac hardworking family, but they weren't like, yeah.
00:36:58
Speaker
everyday Birkin type of family, which is fine. Like yeah upper middle class, if not like, you know, up there, like upper class, but they weren't like what they were appearing to be. So when you try to keep up with the Joneses and you can't keep up anymore, you start finding other ways to keep up.
00:37:14
Speaker
So. what I'm trying to say? So we'll we'll circle back to Karen. We'll circle back her. That's a race every time you run it. Yeah. Just because, you know, what everything it we know that, you know, we're not here to slander anybody's name. support all successful... but Well, I support all black people, period. But, you know, especially those who...
00:37:34
Speaker
are trying to make a platform in which that we look like we are a hardworking people, which we are. And a lot of times I think they tried to make us look a certain a night in a negative portrayal. And here I'm expecting like, this is where we're looking on a more positive and like hardworking, yeah um doing well for ourselves, trying to make the most out of, you know, the, the, the careers and opportunities that we've been given.
00:38:00
Speaker
So that is powerful, but I think that it becomes negative when we have stories like this, right? Or we have stories of DUIs, which we know is very fatal working the emergency department and seeing people coming in, in,
00:38:12
Speaker
fatal car accidents and devastating car accidents. It's not a joke. So yes, I think, i do think Karen should have served her time. I'm happy she did. I hope she learned her lesson and she's not going to sit up, you know, around drinking a bourbon before she enters the car again. And then for Wendy.
00:38:27
Speaker
Sorry. Oh, yeah. On the Karen topic, my fault. I thought we was done with Wendy. Come on, guys. Let's let Wendy get rest. Oh, yeah. You're right. Yeah, yeah. We'll let Wendy rest. but oh On the Karen topic, yeah, I do think that the um it's nice to see, you know, that even though she's a celebrity, she got a fair and, in my opinion, just...
00:38:52
Speaker
punishment. They didn't drag it. You know what saying? They didn't overdo it, but the punishment fits the crime. You know, you can't drive for a year. And when you do drive, you got to make sure you got to blow something and make sure that you weren't drinking. You know what saying? I think that that definitely fits the bill.
00:39:05
Speaker
And you know, it's, it, it does society some good to make sure that like, you know, it won't happen again. That's, ah that's, that's, that's calling my opinion. That's calling my opinion.
Residency Shift Debates
00:39:16
Speaker
Speaking of doing the time and residency, the big topic is doing time for me. We're doing our time. We're serving the community. We are.
00:39:25
Speaker
think We're serving time. We're serving time in the hospital 90 hours a week. Come on. There was any TikTok discussing whether hours should like be banned or remain in residency. um I know I do 24 hour shifts. I think most residents like whether medicine, surgery, whatever, usually do 24 hour shifts, if not like 12 back to back or like overnight shifts, whatever the ACG to me, um I think before had a rule about interns doing not doing 24 hour shifts. But I know as an intern, I was doing 24 hour shifts and we do 24 hour shifts. You're required to have like, I think,
00:40:08
Speaker
14 hours between the next shift or something like that. And then if you're doing 12 hour shifts, you're supposed to have an eight hours break before going to the next 12 hour shift. Also a lot of programs will use this to their advantage by doing some things. My program doesn't do this, but like home call for instance, where unless you come into the hospital, the hours don't count as on call, even though you're well alert to receive any calls, you're just at home on your couch.
00:40:32
Speaker
um right I guess my question is, what are y'all's opinion now that you guys are, you know, your first year in training doing 24s or like really long 12s. What's your opinion on 24 hour shifts?
00:40:43
Speaker
Are they beneficial to you? Are they harmful to you? What's the alternative? Ban them. I have have a tack on question too. When I work a 10 hour shift, I get an extended break. i didn't get a break What does a break look like?
00:41:01
Speaker
What does a break? the fighter is said I don't know about y'all, but my life is very, it looks like that. What does a break look like? what is right look like This a serious question. This is a serious question. I'm sure inquiring minds want to know there are M4s that are getting ready to go to residency.
00:41:21
Speaker
They're like, no. There's no break. You have to create the break yes and make sure that when you do the break, nobody knows you're on a break. I say I need to use the bathroom and I really don't. I'm just sitting on the toilet, just trying to get some space.
00:41:35
Speaker
that's There's no lunch break. None of that. You just find time. You sneak away when no one's looking. I'm sorry. There's no like a sign like, okay, from this time to this time, don't call me, don't catch me.
00:41:47
Speaker
I need to run i need a run to Target real quick before it close. Target? You're asking me to look at your podcast and revoke it. Shopping at work? You're lucky to go to the cast to get some fries. So this is me talking as a as a medical professional that is not a doctor.
00:42:04
Speaker
this is This is, you know, this is what the rest of us is on. You know, we we we make lunch dates and we we we go eat with our coworkers. What's that? Yeah, no. Okay. All right. I was just, okay. Let me, let me, let me, let me just break this down real quick.
00:42:22
Speaker
Okay. Because yeah'all can tell me if it should be banned too. Y'all can tell me if it should be banned. I'm going to stop. no So when I, when we talked about this, I said, I said no. And do you want to, I, the reason I said no was because of the concept of home call.
00:42:40
Speaker
If you have a 24-hour shift and you're on home call and you're on a busy service, I don't think you should i don't think you should have a 24-hour service and be on a home call and be on a busy service. I think you should just have 24-hour call, in-house, and get your rest. And then just know that post-call is post-call.
00:42:58
Speaker
Exactly. And you get your post call. Now, i on the podcast, I said, now, whether or not i'm talking from a place of bondage, that's neither here nor there. But that's the reality, right? The reality is somebody has to be at the hospital.
00:43:13
Speaker
Somebody has to be available for an emergency, at least in in in in in in my field. And pretty much everybody's field here day is a doctor right right now. Literally, somebody has to be there.
00:43:25
Speaker
So in that regard, if someone has to be at the hospital and we work from that angle and you have to be available, I would much rather know that I need to be available all night, be at the hospital, I don't got to travel nowhere, and do that rather than, hi, this is whoever calling from six whatever. The patient needs some Tylenol.
00:43:51
Speaker
I'm here. I'm awake. I'm not comfortable on now in my bed. You just woke me up at 2 a.m. to do something that's important, but it's not like life saving. Right. Right. Which is how home call really works. Right. You're up still at the same amount of time.
00:44:08
Speaker
you may or may not get called in for an emergency and then you still have to come back to work again the next day. You do not get a post-call day. So with that in mind, no, I don't think 24 hour shifts need to go. Now, whether or not you should have a night float system, that's not, that that's a different concept, right? But if you have the choice between a 24 hour home call and a 24 hour in-house shift, I'm going to pick the 24 hour in-house shift because then I know I get a post-call day.
00:44:33
Speaker
Yeah. I've heard that before. I've definitely heard that before. but So previously for my residency, for our trauma ICU rotation, we were doing 24s and we had the post call days and all those things.
00:44:44
Speaker
They very much took it away. And now it was 12 hour shifts, but more 12 hour shifts. So now you're working more back to back compared to when you're doing the twenty four s Me personally, I always told myself there's there's no reason why I should be awake for 24 hours to do anything in my life.
00:44:59
Speaker
That's just me. Yeah. So when that news came, was just praising Jehovah Jireh because I said, I don't even know. I was just struggling with my 14 hour nights that I was doing on ortho. I thought I was going to pass out.
00:45:15
Speaker
So if you had me doing this 24 thing, I don't know what, you know, what was really going to happen. So I do think it's very odd that in medicine, we've normalized entire having well you know, working days, like a full day on end is not normal.
00:45:29
Speaker
You can still learn without having to have that kind of system. yeah no it's It's literally not normal. Why can't we just hire the, I guess the night team?
00:45:41
Speaker
and we're something So that's the concept of night float, right? My program has a night float, but we still do 24-hour shifts on the weekend. like We don't do Q3 24s, but we definitely like do weekend call that's 24-hour shifts. And yeah, like I remember I did my first was it no i didt my first like overnight shift. I think our overnights are 14 hours long or something like that.
00:46:02
Speaker
13 hours long and i I was hallucinating towards the end. I i yeah i'm talking i was yeah literally visualizing things that weren't there. I was hearing voices that weren't there. yeah I was like pushing with the patient. I thought the baby was out.
00:46:16
Speaker
thought the baby was out. can maybe cry I was was like, oh, I've delivered the baby. No, the baby was so much inside. So I just feel like- Right. they i don't well Is this not concerning? But it definitely is.
00:46:39
Speaker
I mean, I feel like if my program had one more resident, we could get rid of 24 hour calls or space out our 24 hour calls on the weekend. But the ACG and me, you know, love y'all. Y'all gave me a job. Cool. that's a thing Cheap labor, cheap labor. that's The residents we request, you give us the residents like just right before it. So,
00:46:59
Speaker
Y'all could do it. Right. And the thing is, they don't want to hire more. They don't want to open up more spots. They don't want to hire more residents. It's more money for them. That's the point. Right. And that's why we now find ourselves in situations with horrible scheduling that really is like detrimental to our health.
00:47:14
Speaker
I just went to go see my PCP yesterday, hoping and praying that my blood work. It's normal. but You understand? Like, it's just,
Professional Boundaries in Psychiatry
00:47:21
Speaker
I don't know. So. already told y'all about the AKI and M4. I don't want to think about what's going on at that CMP. Don't even ask me. Don't even ask me about it.
00:47:32
Speaker
Start early, man. My line sister yesterday was like, you don't go to the dentist, do you? I said, excuse me?
00:47:47
Speaker
but That's about like right it's it's been like six years. I said, no, yeah, i just went to the dentist. Thank you. It's been a minute. Yeah, it's been a minute. But we went like in the last like year or two. Not too much. But I mean, asked her, I said, when do you go to the dentist? What time? What day? Right.
00:48:09
Speaker
Like, you go between 8 and 5 p.m. Right? Monday through Friday. Monday through Friday, 8 to 5. I'm for sure in them people's hospitals. When am I supposed to to the hospital? Shameless plug. Shameless plug. Shameless plug.
00:48:25
Speaker
I got some dental work done recently. stay I went to a... um I'm sorry. I'm about to cut him off. He talking about Target during lunch. i have i have two jobs, right? Yeah, I know I got two jobs. So I'll be i'll be busy during ah the hours that they normally open.
00:48:44
Speaker
I went to a dental hygienist student who needed hours. And i got it done free of charge. yeah It was free of charge. It was free of charge.
00:48:56
Speaker
I love that. It was, you know, a little, uh, a little rough. Hello. You know? Yeah. But, you know, i feel like she learned something, you know what I'm saying? So that was, that was, that was the important She learned something. Did you, do you feel like your teeth were properly hygienist? I'm not I'm not going lie. If there's something in my mouth felt after that, it was clean.
00:49:23
Speaker
It was clean. It felt clean. okay period okay period that's and that's on everything and you know um that is going you know clean mouth a clean mouth is essential for maintaining boundaries between yourself and your patients you know what i'm saying
00:49:46
Speaker
Wow. This episode is too unserious. This is too unserious. it's very unserious. Oh my gosh. not going to lie. This is a great way to end 2025. I miss y'all. I miss y'all.
00:49:59
Speaker
One of our other ah trending stories from throughout the year was about a woman on TikTok that voiced that she fell in love with her psychiatrist. And we wanted to approach the angle of the a turbulent situation that it could be um for doctors and patients that may run across this kind of, ah I'll say, I'll call it ugly scenario, right?
00:50:24
Speaker
um In this example, you know, ah this the the the man is a psychiatrist and you kind of have to like understand, right? Psychiatrists have the Like their profession and it revolves around like talking and discussion, right? They have to balance warmth and empathy kind of with like their professionalism. And so it seems that in this situation, you know, the young lady may have mistaken professionalism for true romance or romantic feelings, stuff like that. Um,
00:50:53
Speaker
And, you know, during the actual episode, we kind of talked a little bit about, like, you know, the ethics the ethics of whether or not he should have continued to be her provider once after finding out and stuff like that. So I just wanted to um kind of rehash the conversation and see what you guys think. See if we could get a couple new opinions on, like, you know.
00:51:12
Speaker
the very tumultuous situation that could be a patient that you are providing services to developing feelings for you because, and I'll, I'll, I'll definitely preface with this. I have noticed with my um SNMA friends that are black women, patients not expecting to see attractive black women be their physician. You know i'm saying? So like, I'm sure that unwanted,
00:51:37
Speaker
i won't say advances, maybe cat calling, maybe ah flirting, flirting, unwanted flirting may be happening to you guys more than it would to like other people. So like maybe you could discuss a little bit on that and how you maintain boundaries there.
00:51:53
Speaker
yeah i mean so a lot of times thankfully it's my my sweet old demented patients that you know they like to just run their mouth bob but above but oh you're such a beautiful woman this this this so you can just brush it off you know brush it off your shoulder because you know come on like that's just grandpa talking that's just a compliment yeah correct yeah and i think you're right in the sense of like a lot of times when you step into the room, theyre they're not expecting you to be the physician. And so that comes with its own kind of, um, uh, I don't want to say issues, but I guess it comes with its own level of expectations that they may already place on you or without you actually meeting those expectations or fitting that mold that they have when they think of a doctor. um I think in terms of like the doctor patient relationship, I think social media has fried our society's brains in terms of how close we feel to people.
00:52:47
Speaker
And it's even coming in the sense of what I would say, ah crossing professional boundaries. Like, let's say if we know people who might be influencers or doing things on social media and feeling like they know you because of that or bringing those things up. Now, thankfully, I'm not in that position, but I do know that, you know, those things can happen. And I think in this case, like with something like psychiatry, which I wish our Resident psychiatrist Aldi was here because i'm sure he could talk more about that. I do think that like, yeah, there's there's so people walking around just undiagnosed all sorts of mental health issues. And you just wouldn't know because a lot of times people don't seek mental health care. So you could be having ah either patients or just people in general who probably they're not even the patient. They could just be the parent of the patient or be like the friend of the patient.
00:53:35
Speaker
And they just, you know, they're just walking around undiagnosed. And then, um, and you as the physician, right. You just have to do your job, which is like managing the patient. You know, it's not necessarily your job to think about all the other things that are happening too, but then you have cases like this, like, let's say something like psychiatry, where your job, once again, like I said in the last episode was that all you have really is conversation and medications. That's all you really got.
00:53:59
Speaker
So the conversation is a very structured conversation in psychiatry. You're asking specific questions. Does this person want to harm themselves or harm somebody else? um you're trying to gauge like background ah about the person's life.
00:54:13
Speaker
And that is all very personal stuff. People can feel close to you because you have access to this information. So I could see how that could easily cross boundaries and lines with what people how people can perceive you even when you are the one wearing the doctor badge, right? People can just assume, well,
00:54:30
Speaker
this person must understand me or the, you know, their mind could start flying in different directions. And I think it's hard to know, at least from the essence of if you were psychiatrist, I know for me, it's, I walk out the room, I say, all right, thanks. Um, we'll follow up with you with the supervising doc after I talk, we talk about the plan. And then I give my plan and I may not even enter that patient's room again versus psychiatry.
00:54:50
Speaker
Um, You can't really do that. Like you're there to manage their mental health. And so the conversations may continue. They might, they might continue to be ongoing, whether you like it or not. And you got to figure out how you're going tell that line. So that's kind of my perspective on, on it.
00:55:06
Speaker
Yeah, I think, well, one situation that happened to me in medical school, like in our med school, we had like our own like primary care clinics that we have like patients under our names and things like
Impact of TikTok Ban on Black Creators
00:55:18
Speaker
that. And there's this one patient, he usually saw a different med student, but I had to like cover for him. So I went in to go see him and he's just looking at me and his like chief complaint was like depression and like his thyroid is all out of whack and all this stuff. He's like, oh dang, you look so good. Oh gosh. And I'm like, relax, dude, you know, like relax. And then he's like, I'm developing chest pain. you know like And I was like, oh, please, we're literally drama. I was literally drama. And then I went to my attending and I was like, he's saying he's having chest pain, whatever, but you know like he's just like being weird, whatever. She's like, well, he does have a history of an NSTEMI. You want him to do like a walking DSAT or something before he leaves the clinic? So he did the walking DSAT with
00:56:00
Speaker
the nurse and he was sat in like appropriately. And then I was like, no, I think he's just being dramatic. Like, and then it's like, oh, walk with him then and see what happens with you. And he literally decided down to 89% when I walked.
00:56:14
Speaker
Oh, Lord. I took his breath away, you know, like, and that's just what it is. Period. I realized, okay, y'all are doing a bit too much on the other side there. Right. I feel like in gynecology, we also have like,
00:56:32
Speaker
similar but different relationships with our patients like we deliver all their babies you know about like their you know intimate details we're there with them through menopause that sort of thing um and i think it's just important to like yeah establish like boundaries um like so for me for instance like because i always get like results and labs back i have like a designated time unless like super like critical but like I'm not gonna like be up at 2 a.m. in the morning, like telling you your hemoglobin is normal. You know what I mean? Or that you need vitamin D supplementation. I set those boundaries like pretty clearly.
00:57:05
Speaker
um And even if my patient gets upset, like, oh, you haven't talked to me about my result. And I'm like, do you not want me to go to sleep? You know what i mean? Like, I just think it's important that now that we're in training to like separate home from work, if you're you know able to, and just like set that clear boundary. page Like, you know, I want to be nice to you. I want to like know about you. But at the end of the day, like patient doctor relationship. And there's like a certain boundary that we can't really, you know, cross, you know? So um i think that's just like an important thing that I'm learning in residency because you like really love these patients. You see these patients like all four years and you see them like, even you was about like, they're probably in the ED multiple times that one month. You like build that bond with them. But sometimes you got to be like, no.
00:57:48
Speaker
no No more. So, or like, we're not doing that. I'm not like gonna change my standard of care just because I love you as my patient. You know what I mean? And I think that's kind of like a hard thing to navigate being a young doctor. So.
00:58:02
Speaker
I agree.
00:58:06
Speaker
Growing pains, growing pains. But I think, I mean, still on the topic of this very popular social media app, if you will, TikTok. Throughout the year, it's been banned. then you got it. Oh, girl.
00:58:21
Speaker
It was banned for, like oh yeah, that's how long. It was banned for 24 hours. It wasn't even banned for a full. That was a long way 24 hours. Man, some music got shifts longer than that. Right. Right.
00:58:34
Speaker
Yeah. But, you know, considering that, um, a good number of people who look like us use, use the tool for dear, for dear brands, for dear businesses, for education, whatever it is you're doing on there to generate income for your family. yeah.
00:58:50
Speaker
was curious to hear your thoughts on how this ban has just affected black content, content creators, black producers, um, Black storytellers, Black marketers, all of that.
00:59:05
Speaker
I think I'll start for me. I don't own the app or I don't have the app my phone particularly, but I know that when i was thinking again about this new year's resolution of drinking more water, i was like, okay, i need to go and look at skincare, all the skincare videos.
00:59:23
Speaker
See what they have for me. And you know what I mean? like Like our Black girlies are out there. put in the links to all these products and stuff like that, um which i appreciate you know I appreciate, especially since you can even find affordable, like the substitute for this very expensive French skincare line.
00:59:44
Speaker
um so yeah, I was just curious to know what y'all think about the ban and how that's just affecting our community and the revenue our community can generate from this from this tool in general.
00:59:59
Speaker
Yeah. Well, definitely want to clarify that. Thankfully it was only banned for 24 hours a while back, but now TikTok, you know, has been active present. Everybody was crashing out though. Everybody was very much crashing out for the 24 hours. I was definitely different. but I love scrolling. Right.
01:00:17
Speaker
Guys, as Instagram was right there. Instagram is like 10 years behind. so Yeah. TikTok is the new, the new thing. Yeah. What I find like super interesting about TikTok is one, like they change the concept of virality like in general. like You know how hard it is to go viral on YouTube, go viral Instagram, go viral on Twitter, go viral on Pinterest? But like TikTok changed the game. like You can have just one moment and then like you're like almost like set for life. It's a very interesting algorithm. Interesting. But i also feel like
01:00:52
Speaker
as a doctor being on tick tock seeing things like i love watching like people's labor and delivery stories because i can call out like oh that's standard of care i'm like and that's nonsense you know what mean like i think right people like like oh the doctor said this to me they ran about their doctor and i'm like are they valid though or is it nonsense and i find it like like one my favorite past times being like it's that comment girl. That's so wrong. Like confront them. or I'm like, and I just like, Oh, that's kind of what you do. they're kind of in the wrongest So that's one of my favorite pastime.
01:01:30
Speaker
yeah i mean Yeah. I mean, I mean, I think, The ban was very interesting. It just goes to show how much our society depends on social media and a lot of people's income is driven by social media platforms such as TikTok.
01:01:44
Speaker
um So personally, honestly, it just kind of showed what where our society is
DEI Standards and Vaccine Policies
01:01:50
Speaker
right now. Once again, like I said, social media. has deeply ingrained the minds of our our fellow citizens and as someone who was also in the era prior to social media becoming as big as it is i don't know how positive that's been but i think that i like that we have more in access to information which is what tick tock definitely provides so yeah i mean i think tick tock deciding to come back to us was overall a good decision because i do think there is
01:02:18
Speaker
a lot of misinformation spreading out there and social media has given people like the capacity to have more ownership over what's being said so yeah i think it was a good a good move to bring it back but i just think people should also understand that like not everything you see on tick tock is law or evidence-based or backed up by fact so you got you got to also do your own research too on top of that so yeah that's that's pretty much that's pretty much it tick tock Like, every other social media platform that has come before it, you just got to take with a grain of salt. Like, you can't, you know, be like the WhatsApp aunties and just take everything as long, you know? It's the same thing.
01:03:03
Speaker
Exactly. like right Like, they talking about games on there and it's AI and all that. Just, like, pay attention. Like, if it looks too perfect, probably that's not real. um And...
01:03:16
Speaker
I think if somebody is a medical professional and they are saying you should take everything I say as law, I would automatically become suspicious of that. Like, I feel like most people who are of sound mind and body and have some sort of license they like to protect are like, oh, actually, like, I have a license to protect everything I'm saying. Yes, maybe there's a fact behind it, but also, like,
01:03:40
Speaker
I'm one person. So yeah, and just just have a little bit of discernment. But TikTok is fun. do you little dance. It's great. like It needed to come back. And honestly, it was so it was the drama when it left. I loved it. like Wow, so dramatic.
01:03:55
Speaker
No, very dramatic. Is it back on the app store yet? I remember they got like, they they brought it back, but it wasn't like available if you like deleted it or whatever. i downloaded back Yeah. and they deleted Yeah. They brought everything back. Interesting. Interesting. yeah ya Y'all was faithful. Okay. Got you. Got you. So the band ain't really hit for much, but you know, it showed y'all what could be and y'all ain't like it. Okay.
01:04:17
Speaker
Yep. Yeah, we we love we love apps, definitely. As um Bella already pointed out, I think that's where we're heading towards with this generation and generations to come. But um on a more medical note, it's been really, really fun talking about all these lighter topics. um But, you know, we are all in the medical profession, pursuing medical education on different on several different levels whether it's the pre-med level the med student level and now in residency graduate medical education um i think one thing has been really impactful this year was uh the amc's passing of the anti-dei um in may
01:05:02
Speaker
14th, the AMC just removed anything involving DEI as a standard that could be considered when when recruiting for medical education or anything of that sorts. I think what's what I'm curious about is how you think that's going to affect the future of medicine. I think for me, I've already noticed in the class behind or below me, um with the class of 2029,
01:05:30
Speaker
I don't think we have more than five people of color. And to give you some context, contest so in my class, we do have a third of the class of 60 who identify as black. So it's pretty it's pretty significant, you know? It's pretty significant to just see that all the whatever, i mean, there's just no incentive to, there's just no incentive to recruit minorities. There's no incentive to really think about all the challenges that comes to pursuing medical education, whether that's financial, there's just a lot of barriers for underrepresented minorities. And I just feel like without support from such a huge organization backing from AMC, then I mean, a lot of colleges around the nation will feel less compelled to to just recruit us, essentially.
01:06:23
Speaker
So, yeah. Has anybody else noticed that? You know, like an immediate decline? Once graduated from med school, closed my eyes and I said, good luck. All.
01:06:40
Speaker
I'm just like, listen, it it was already looking crazy when I was a med student. And so just to know that crazy they went and made it worse is just like, it's disappointing. um Yeah, you know, I try my best to not talk ill of any institutions that I've attended because every institution has held, you know, its particular um purpose in my life. And so, you know, I think this is more of a broader issue, but I will say that i think once these this anti-di thing was passed on that level from a medical institution standpoint man a lot of schools couldn't wait to just drop all the things they had said prior couldn't wait they couldn't wait and it makes me just wonder like was this for show like what what was really the purpose of um saying you're gonna do all these things and as soon as things happen from a more
01:07:36
Speaker
administrative level or federal level, now it's, well, we have nothing else. We like we don't have a say in this anymore. Everybody's throwing their hands up. It just makes me look at you just a little funny. And I feel like there's some schools I've heard that have kind of you know done that. And it's disappointing because medical education is not diverse in any way, shape or form. Medicine is not diverse in any way, shape or form.
01:07:59
Speaker
um And it's only gonna get worse as long as we do not care about
01:08:06
Speaker
continuing to recruit ah the next generation of black and brown physicians. So that's where stand when it comes to that. Like, I don't even know what it's supposed to look like. as I guess right now, just being on the interview trail, one thing, one thing that I feel like I did when I was applied is just to look at the, I guess the class roster. And it was shocking to me to see that for,
01:08:33
Speaker
many, many programs all over the nation. So it's just not really like program specific. You have, say one or two black people in the entire residency cohort for that year.
01:08:45
Speaker
and that was even difficult to wrap my head around. Yeah. And this was prior to um just prior to this anti-DEI stance. So only God knows, only God knows what the roster's gonna look like. Literally. Because I looked at it, I was like, oh, okay, they got, they no, they they they got two, not one. So that might be better because it's two.
01:09:09
Speaker
And it's out. Sometimes I would cluster other races together. I'm like, it's sort of similar with Pangea. Like we're all kind of the same. And then I would count that. That's how, you know, kind of like desperate you are to like find sameness and like make sure you don't feel other, you know, in your program, like, right like Chinasa said, like when I was interviewing, I told myself, I'm not gonna be the only black person in a program. I said, that's for sure. I said, there has to be at least one black person, one Hispanic, somebody has to be above me because it's so hard navigating this space being othered. And like, I would say like ACOG is a very inclusive like organization. They like,
01:09:54
Speaker
you know, like say out loud about like black maternal morbidity, mortality, whatever. Like, you know, I feel like ACOG is like very conscious of that, but like, unfortunately medicine as a whole and the people recruiting into medical school,
01:10:07
Speaker
isn't reflective in like what what like cause mission is all the time. So it can be hard even like OBGYN there are so many black women from SMA that go into OBGYN but we're all scattered across the country and then we cluster into like the same programs. But you know, finding programs with like nobody else in it. So I can feel that same sentiment of like trying to look for people that look like you.
01:10:30
Speaker
Yeah, no, 100%. I think from a federal level, man, there's just things where they haven't been looking um fantastic, especially when I think about the policies that affect people like us um on this platform. um It even ties into things that we've learned about throughout our medical but ah education, like vaccine adherence that has been under threats too, um with RFK literally firing the vaccine committee.
01:10:59
Speaker
And then we've seen new policies being done. Like apparently hep B is no longer required vaccine for newborns, which um I saw firsthand when had a patient when I was in the children's ED and parents said, oh yeah, like my infant, they didn't get the hep B vaccine. I went and told my supervising attendees, I said, well, you got you know, that's now the new standard, right?
01:11:24
Speaker
What? Yeah. Well, they didn't, no one batted an eye, which is kind of scary because it's just like, this is like people's lives. This is the stuff that we know to be evidence-based medicine as to how to prevent these disease communicable diseases such as Hep b I don't really know where we're going to go from here in terms of,
01:11:46
Speaker
the validity in vaccine education to our patients and just the people in general. um it's it's it's a little It's a little scary. um So in terms of that, whatever, RFK firing the vaccine committee, Hep B kind of being under threats. I think there's even some things that's been happening from a perspective of the flu vaccine. I don't even know at this point is just there. I don't know what's the truth anymore. So curious as to what you guys think.
01:12:13
Speaker
think we're going when it comes to vaccine education and just mandates moving forward um i think there is a public health crisis on the horizon um you know it's one of those things where like you know public health starts with policy and how policy impacts people and like sweeping changes like this at the federal level a
01:12:40
Speaker
it's it's cause for concern. You know what I'm saying? um There's not research that's backing up these these these changes. There's not any any kind of like new literature that says, oh, Hep B is suddenly less dangerous than before or Hep B is any less communicable than before. You know what i'm saying? Like it's, it is very much the clear and present danger it's always been. And we are simply electing to ignore it.
01:13:06
Speaker
Right. From where I stand, that scary. And I think like, Like hep B vaccines, like one of the newborn vaccines that you get. um And I just find it like when I talk to my patients about it, like, you know, like, should I give my baby the hep B vaccine? I first say like, I'm not a pediatrician. However, if I grew a baby for nine months and I pushed it out and I tore and I had to be,
01:13:31
Speaker
or stitched back up and i looked to my baby and I said, I'm not gonna protect you the best way I can. I don't know. i I just think that people think that hep B, like one, if your baby gets hep B, 90% of the time they're gonna end up getting cirrhosis.
01:13:44
Speaker
So I think if there's a way to protect your child from something that's out of your control, like even if you as the mom, could you check for hep B at the beginning of pregnancy, right? Even as the mom, if you don't have hep B, If you send your child to daycare and your your child gets bit by another child, you don't know what that child has. They could have hep B, they could have hep C, they could got have gotten it from the surface, they can gotten it from anywhere.
01:14:08
Speaker
But because you didn't want to vaccinate your child for whatever reason, now you have to deal with the repercussions of an action that wasn't in your control. I just feel like, you know, if you're growing all these organs and, you know, getting all, you know, like pushing out a whole baby, I would,
01:14:24
Speaker
you know, do things that are more evidence-based to protect my baby from what I can, like as a parent and, you know, cut it out if you need to, but that's just kind of what it is. I mean, i think what i always don't get, and I think it's hard because we have the extra like medical knowledge, right? So it's very difficult to be like, how don't you see that this can help you? But I think because we've had vaccines for so long, like people don't understand the actual... like And course progression of these diseases like cirrhosis, like liver failure is a horrible way to die.
01:15:03
Speaker
right Seeing somebody go through liver failure, you were, oh, I can get a shot. My kid might not have to go through that. like Yeah, sign me up, right? Or like... it can lead to cancer, right? Like that's that's kind of the end of hep B cirrhosis. You end up getting HCC, things like that, right? So it's just like, like it's really hard to sort of put into perspective that this isn't ah a decision that you know is just at one time like one point in time. Like, no, this will have lifelong impact on your kid and potentially might cause them so much distress in the future. When the general, like,
01:15:49
Speaker
converse of it isn't that distressing yeah right so like i think that's the thing right like you're coming like oh like i don't want to give my kid more things in their body and you know it's foreign and all of that but like more than likely you got this shot like yeah and you aren't dealing with the consequences of not getting the shot but you're everywhere i know you're potentially exposing your child to it mm-hmm And everybody is entitled to do what they want to.
01:16:16
Speaker
But I think sometimes because there was a huge push for vaccination and immunizations, like it's very difficult to see what the end result of basically a non-action would be because you just haven't been exposed to it. You don't know. You don't know that polio was really bad. Yeah, you weren't there, you know. The polio virus. Yeah. Right. It was pretty bad, right? Yeah.
01:16:37
Speaker
right like Yeah. People, angry people die. Kim, people are dying. Like seriously, like for real. People are literally dying. now People are literally dying. We, we, we had, we had some, some case of ah a previously eradicated illness that has come back. Was was it polio?
01:16:57
Speaker
and the iing I think it was folio. allpo somewhat yeah Leprosy, something that I don't i don't wish on anybody. Something that kind of is preventable. this and and fact think that's I think that's the the overall the overarching like idea here. like We currently have policy in place that is making very preventable very predictable illnesses, dangerous again.
01:17:29
Speaker
I consider that the early beginning of a public health crisis.
01:17:38
Speaker
Yeah. Mic drop. Literally, on your pediatric rotation, it's vitamin K, hep B, erythromycin. Like every every baby. we talk about it all the time. baby.
01:17:49
Speaker
why we're potentially exposing a generation of children to stage liver disease is beyond me. But again, the average person does not need to know that that's the end stage of not getting this thing, right? ye But yeah like, what is hepatitis B? Like, what is hepatitis? Like, why would I need to about that? Just don't give my kid another foreign object.
01:18:16
Speaker
yeah Exactly, right? too And two. One day. uncle Uncle Jim got hepatitis. Now you know what that is, right? Yeah. But, like, it's kind of too late. The virus is there. It's exposed. It's dormant. Like, it's not going away. This isn't... It's not, like, hep C that can be treated, right? Like, it's... You get it. You get it.
01:18:35
Speaker
Yep. So, all I have to say for the people that are listening, like,
01:18:43
Speaker
It's really difficult. You do not need to have a medical degree, but I do urge you to continue to ask your providers questions and really have them explain it to you in a way that you can understand.
01:18:55
Speaker
Because they should be able to tell you that, hey, like you might not see the effects of this today, but it could potentially cause significant issues and an early death in your kid. like That's just the kind of reality. Everybody is allowed to do what they want to do at the end of the day yep i agree speaking of everybody's allowed to do what they want to do at the end of the day you can also have historical governmental you you can win you want to you want to it ain't you got it okay that's all that is
01:19:38
Speaker
But, you know, just for our last topic of the night. Oh, my God. It's been so fun
Young Leaders in Politics
01:19:42
Speaker
with you guys. I know. But for our last topic of the night, we wanted to end it on a super positive note and just talk about all the historical government first. um You know, everybody knows about our boys over on Mom Dottie in New York City. Being the youngest mayor and the first Muslim mayor to hold the position. Everybody, like, literally, it don't matter what. First millennial.
01:20:06
Speaker
Come on. Talk to us. Talk to us about the city. Come through. The the the town the towns the town's in an uproar. um It felt like a very big generational divide. ah the largest that I've ever seen a independent for those of you that don't know, I'm from Brooklyn.
01:20:24
Speaker
um I voted in that election and Andrew Cuomo, the previous governor was running for mayor and you know, it's very easy to vote for a familiar name, familiar face, whatever the case may be. He lost the Republican ticket um and ran independent.
01:20:41
Speaker
And that was the closest I've ever seen an independent get to winning anything. oh That was strong. He did way better than the Republican candidate. Republican candidate, I couldn't tell you their name.
01:20:52
Speaker
i But yeah, no, historic election, historic election. I'm very excited for what ah Manzami is going to bring to NY. The city.
01:21:03
Speaker
Yes, it's yes. And I think it was just exciting as somebody who was a kid during Barack Obama's like first um like presidential win. I just remember everybody around me being super excited and like crying and playing young DZ and all this stuff, right? not young gz my president you know the song go listen to it y'all um but i think it was really cool to see people be so excited about politics and i feel like don't know we're living in a doom scroll it just a little bit right i think it's very hard i think it's very easy to get disillusioned and like not care and But I think he like invigorated like some just excitement. And I felt like people were like, let's latch on to it. I'm in Montana, but let's latch on to Zoran. Because like he's giving me hope.
01:22:00
Speaker
He's not touching anything to do with you in Montana. But I think it was just really cool. No business going on in whatever's going on in Montana. But he still is making impact you know even all the way over there. so You know what I think is refreshing about it?
01:22:16
Speaker
Um... politics is not simply an old white man's game, you know? ah Even though that is what the majority of politicians in the country used to look like and what a large number still may look like, the age to run for president is 35 years old.
01:22:33
Speaker
Yes, it is. You simply have to be 35 and born in this country to run for president. Those are the only two criteria. You know what I'm saying? So like, it was kind of like,
01:22:46
Speaker
it gives us a little reminder that it is anyone's game and that real power, real influence comes to those who seek it. You know what i'm saying? And it's, it's, it's just refreshing because the young generally come with a certain verve to the office. You know what saying? Like, I don't know if y'all are history buffs like I am, but the way that people used talk about JFK, JFK was the, the the youngest elected president we ever had.
01:23:13
Speaker
Yeah. They used to talk about him like he was like a supermodel. They used to talk about him like he was like a movie star. you know I'm saying? He's up, he's around, he's doing things, he's going places, kissing babies. there was just a real energy that he brought to the office. And I'm excited for something like that to be coming to New York city, um, in the form of somebody that is talking about making tangible change. It it should be, it should, it should definitely be celebrated. We should also talk about those, some of the other historical wins. Um, I for one want to talk about Dr. Doris, Dorsey Apple, Apple Lurie's who has become the first black female mayor of Albany. I'm sorry if I butchered your name. Um,
01:23:51
Speaker
She is a fellow Delaware state graduate. So I just wanted to give her her flowers publicly on the pod. Congratulations. Love it. Honestly, I do. That's really good that you brought brought that up because the whole point is that we want to talk about how these are women and minorities who have taken these seats, which is a big win. And we're talking about local and state level positions. um And I think it's nice to see that in these offices, we are going to people who likely care about what we care about, because honestly, I'm all for Get the the geezers out of here. Let's get all the old people out of office. I'm not here for it.
01:24:26
Speaker
Take that however however you will, but there's a generation. Is Abela just mean that we need some fresh legs? like so You know what I'm about to say? Like you have young, fresh minds coming out of college and instead you choose to use you're the same age as your grandparent. We have to use common sense. This is a new ah generation, new era.
01:24:45
Speaker
you know So here's his here's here's my last hot take on the on the subject.
01:24:51
Speaker
If you qualify for Medicaid...
01:24:58
Speaker
Sorry, Social Security. If you qualify for Social Security, my bad, my bad. Don't laugh at me. y'all Don't laugh at me. If you qualify for Social Security. it's been five years. Yeah.
01:25:13
Speaker
It's okay. Relax. We want you to enjoy your life. As they say, take a load off. no Enjoy the glory years. You know what I'm trying to It's not everything. Work, work, work. Sometimes there's time to pause. It's our time now. It's our generation's time to take a step up. Oh my gosh. you Go fishing. just right Go fishing. Right. You don't got to be on a hill no more in Big Don.
01:25:43
Speaker
Do y'all have any other um any other people that that that that won in this this past election? Oh, I do also want to say that it is impressive that this happened in a non-presidential election. It is impressive that this was a midterm.
01:25:58
Speaker
We're not voting. like yeah like It's not the... You know what I'm saying? It's an off cycle. And yes, it's yes. That gives me a little faith in our generation.
01:26:09
Speaker
oh yeah i just want to shut up cut you off okay oh yes i was gonna say we cut off the earlier okay wow oh sorry i was just gonna say shout out to mikey cheryl and um abigail spandberg but specifically mikey cheryl who was the first female governor of jersey because you he all know i'm a jersey girl so you know i have to shout out my state we're always on the right side of you know history so I just wanted to to make that a point. But yeah, literally shout out to all the people. you know We talked about Dr. Dorsey. We talked about Mom Donnie. We talked about Sharon Owens, first black mayor of Syracuse. ah Mary Sheffield. She made history as the Detroit's first female mayor. We have Michelle Wu of Boston. She was the first woman and person of color. She elected to the position.
01:26:54
Speaker
ah We have Brandon Scott, who we know is a young black man who's been mayor of bostons ah sorry mayor of Baltimore. um And he was reelected to his post. And since he's been reelected, he has acted there. The city has actually seen an 18 percent decrease in vacant properties and its lowest crime rate in 50 years. So that just goes to show you this is how you make impact. You know, this is really how you make change. So shout out to them for real.
01:27:18
Speaker
And to everybody that's listening, that isn't necessarily, you know, a politician involved in politics. Just do your part. Get informed. Go out and vote. That's really all it is. You know saying? That's really it. Yeah, yeah. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, no. Shout out to Be More, for real. We thank God for all the growth. I can hear all of y'all laughing. I can hear all of y'all. Thank God for 170. Y'all are not low. Why are they so messy, man? There's something going on behind the scenes. They're going be looking at us crazy. I feel like should just say it at this point.
01:27:57
Speaker
No, I mean, it's just No, no, no. It's okay. We're not going to put ourselves out there like that. It's the end of the year. Yeah, it's okay. To end the show everything was important. These people made history. And like we said, think it's... Just amazing to see people get, you know, excited about politics, excited about young politicians and really go out and vote on a non-presidential year.
01:28:27
Speaker
ye And with that, y'all, so sorry, so sad.
Conclusion and Audience Engagement
01:28:31
Speaker
But this is the end of our show. Thank you guys so much for joining us for this episode of The Lounge.
01:28:38
Speaker
Let us know your thoughts. and the discussions we had today or ask us questions for a chance to be featured on the show by emailing us at podcast at snma.org.
01:28:49
Speaker
Be sure to follow the SNMA on all our social media platforms to stay up to date on upcoming events. Thank y'all for rocking now with us for all of 2025. We'll be looking forward to seeing y'all in 2026. We'll definitely be looking forward to seeing y'all at AMEC.
01:29:04
Speaker
This is The Lounge. We're signing off for the year.