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Tim Boote | Protein Rebel
98 Plays2 years ago
In episode 58 we chat with Tim Boote from Protein Rebel all about fuelling and specifically their new maple syrup based product.
To hear our previous episode with Tim please go to this link.
You can follow Protein Rebel on:
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Transcript
Introduction and New Product Discussion
00:00:02
Speaker
The following is a conversation with Tim Boot from Protein Rebel. Tim's second appearance on the podcast. He appeared back in February 2021 when they released their original product, the Cricut-based
00:00:16
Speaker
protein powders. Today we have a chat about fueling and protein rebels new product and how you can get involved in their Kickstarter if you want to. I hope you've all been enjoying the warm weather and we will see you on the next episode. Welcome Tim, how are you? Alright Joe, how are you? Yeah, I'm good thank you, I'm good. Are you enjoying this warmer weather that we're seeing or was it not for you?
00:00:45
Speaker
Oh, no, no, it's definitely for me. I love the sun. I love getting out there. It's just a great excuse, really. I haven't actually seen a sunrise, but I've been out early morning running. So that always just, yeah, is a great way to start off the day. Yeah. Yeah, it is. It is beautiful. Yeah. And these warmer early mornings and you get out before it's too warm as well, because it has been pretty hot, isn't it? And I think this weekend is going to be really warm, actually.
00:01:15
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, I think it's definitely barbecue weather. Yeah, definitely. Barbecue and hot tubs. So I was looking back. We last spoke. We did our last podcast. It was February last year. Time flies, isn't it? Yeah, yeah. A loss happened since then. Yeah, gosh, that does feel like ages
Tim's Marathon Experience and Life in Cheshire
00:01:42
Speaker
ago now.
00:01:42
Speaker
You were speaking before we speak about your new product. You were talking about then about doing the Chester triple. I can't remember. Did they all happen? Did you do that? Yeah, they did, but just at different times of the year. So they were all kind of squashed together in about six weeks. So. So, yeah, it worked out fine in the end, but it all happened in September and early October. So that was the Chester half.
00:02:13
Speaker
The marathon and the 10 cages, you know. Yeah. Yeah. You got to get the big one. Yeah. It's lovely Chester. You, you, you live in Cheshire, don't you? Yeah. We live in Cheshire. So not Chester. I mean, Chester is a beautiful city. Um, yeah, we're living in Nantwich. Um, very, very rural. Very nice. Very nice.
Unique Cricket Protein for Athletes
00:02:41
Speaker
Okay, so for those who haven't heard of protein level before, or perhaps missed last year's podcast, you're quite a new company, aren't you? We first spoke when you were first launching, really, maybe 18 years ago. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, you're like one of the first people I spoke to when we launched. Yeah. And yeah, I mean, the business is all focused on
00:03:09
Speaker
natural sports nutrition. And we were particularly focused on protein powders for endurance runners, cyclists and swimmers. And one of our products had crickets in or does have crickets in, I should say. Yes. So that makes it a little bit different from other protein powders. Yes. Remind me, I am going to reshare the link to
00:03:37
Speaker
the first podcast that we did, because we really dug into this, but just give us a quick overview as to why you use crickets rather than...
00:03:45
Speaker
Well I mean it kind of goes back to why do people take protein powders really and I'm sure you're aware protein powders are really big for gym goers you know it's really important to get your protein levels up when you're exercising to promote muscle protein synthesis to strengthen rebuild the muscle fibers.
00:04:07
Speaker
and so if you're going to the gym it's all about looking good you know getting actual bulk in your muscles and that sort of thing whereas if you're an endurance athlete it's about strength training so slightly different but the really important thing that you want from your protein powder is for it to be easy to digest you know lots of endurance athletes have problems generally with digestion because you know we see
00:04:37
Speaker
all the blood goes to your limbs to keep you going and kind of moves away from your core. So that generally gives you a more sensitive stomach. So you're looking for proteins which are easy to digest and the main one on the market is whey.
00:04:55
Speaker
that kind of dominates the protein powder market. And it's a fantastic protein, but it is not easy to digest. Lots of people have problems digesting it. And if you're in a gym indoors, that's really not a problem. But if you're outside, it definitely is a problem. So it's really looking for alternative proteins, which are easy to digest.
00:05:23
Speaker
And crickets is one of those. And since we spoke, Joe, we've actually been working with University of Chester and a spin out from Newcastle University that's measuring the digestion
00:05:43
Speaker
crickets and they're coming out to be more digestible than way so that's really good so it gets into your bloodstream quicker. There's a few more stages we need to go through but you know these tests kind of take a long time this research takes a long time to finalise but basically it's indicating that it gets into your muscles and does exactly what you want it to do.
00:06:07
Speaker
really quickly without the side effects that many people will find with Wei.
Collaborations and Research on Cricket Protein
00:06:14
Speaker
Yeah that's very interesting to hear.
00:06:19
Speaker
And sorry, you were working with the University of Chester, you were working with them at the beginning, weren't you? Yeah, that's right. Yeah. And now we've got, well, things were kind of a bit delayed because of the pandemic. You know, we couldn't do the test with different people that we wanted to do and all that sort of stuff. So things were delayed a bit. But actually, we've just got funding for a PhD student.
00:06:48
Speaker
to look at cricket protein. So that, that is really exciting. So again, you know, that's a long term project, it'll take three years to complete, but it will give us really solid data to support our claims. And that will be better than, well, pretty much any other protein that's out there. Yeah, very good.
00:07:12
Speaker
It's interesting you said about it being easy to digest, because that was actually one of your questions when you put a poll out on Sunday night on the chat hour. I wasn't sure what the outcome of that was going to be. You asked, what's most important to you in choosing your Ace Fuel and the options you put were in the amount of carbs, taste and texture, easy to digest or other. And easy to digest was 59%. It was way beyond. It was more than the other three put together. I found that really interesting.
00:07:42
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, I think again, you know, we've obviously talked to a lot of people and really that's quite consistent with what people say. Yeah.
00:07:54
Speaker
You might have thought taste would be up there. That's exactly what I thought, yeah. And in terms of the nutritional content, the carb content, you can read the back of pack and it is what it is. But I was pleased because it kind of supported everything that we'd
00:08:17
Speaker
found out from people that we've spoken to. But yeah, almost 60%. I mean, that's, that's a lot. Yeah, it shines a light on the fact that we do that. Do we have sensitive tummies when we run? Yeah. Yeah. There were some other interesting questions as well.
00:08:36
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, it's a real issue. And we don't have to put up with things that exacerbate that situation. If you're doing endurance exercise, you're going to have a sensitive stomach more than likely. So that's just a fact. But what we consume to fuel that endurance could either help it
00:09:03
Speaker
or actually exacerbate the situation, so exaggerate it. And what we want to do is actually find solutions that's going to help people and not exaggerate the information that happens in your stomach when you're exercising. One of your other questions, it got some funny responses where you asked, up to 90% of distant runners,
00:09:29
Speaker
complain of stomach issues while exercising. This could be made worse by poor fuel choices, which is exactly what you're saying. And you ask, what was your most memorable toilet experience?
00:09:38
Speaker
That's a funny thread to anyone who hasn't read that should come back through and have a look. Yeah, that's right. It's just really nice to know that you're not alone because it's not, you know, it's just can be a little bit embarrassing, but just shows that, you know, loads of people have been there. Yeah, there was plenty of people who were embarrassed to tell this story. Very cool. Very good.
Protein Rebel's Progress and Maple Ignite Launch
00:10:02
Speaker
So tell us what's happened in the past 18 months then and then how things have gone for protein level and then tell us about your new product as well please.
00:10:14
Speaker
Yeah, so we've been focusing on research for the products that we've got out there. We've been looking at new products as well, really doubling down on our target market.
00:10:33
Speaker
We've got some new designs, which is kind of very marketing sort of stuff, but that's the stuff I love. And yeah, that's kind of culminating in our new product called Maple Ignite, which we'll be launching later this year. Excellent. So I was, I suppose stunned, stunned, stunned the right word. I was amazed to see just
00:11:02
Speaker
There's two ingredients in it, I can't believe how simple it is, but we'll dig into that a bit. So how did you get to, you may believe, ignite? Well, being focused on, sorry, I suppose the premise here is that natural food is going to be easier to digest and all the research we've looked at
00:11:25
Speaker
as well as anecdotally, says that it is compared to your chemical type ingredients that often you find in sports nutrition products. Because brands are designing those products to hit certain nutritional goals and it's a lot easier
00:11:46
Speaker
and cheaper obviously to do that with chemicals. But that suggests that we know everything that we need to know about our bodies and that's absolutely not the case. And these kind of chemical type products often give us digestion issues. So it doesn't matter how good nutritionally the profile looks on the back of pack,
00:12:16
Speaker
If you can't digest it, you're not going to carry on using it. So we really wanted to look for natural ingredients that are tasty and easy to digest, as well as having the right nutritional profile to support your endurance activity. And that's where we came up with, after a lot of research, looking at maple syrup. Okay. So what's in maple syrup then that makes it so
00:12:45
Speaker
There's a lot of really good stuff in there. So obviously it's high in carbs, which you need to fuel your run. But it's also got antioxidants in there, a whole host of electrolytes as well. It's vegan, which is very important. It has a low GI of 54. So it's not going to kind of
00:13:13
Speaker
give you a sugar crash, it's going to be more of a sustained energy release to help you keep going. It's high in manganese. It's one of those nutrients that helps regulate your blood sugar and convert the carbs into energy.
00:13:31
Speaker
Zinc in there, calcium, potassium. So loads of really good things that naturally occur in maple
Advantages of Natural Ingredients in Sports Nutrition
00:13:40
Speaker
syrup. You don't really have to add a lot in there to make it suitable for endurance. The only thing we've added in is sea salt, and that's because the one thing it is short on is sodium. Okay. So how does that compare to
00:13:59
Speaker
the current energy gel plethora of products that's out there. Yeah, well, the vast majority use chemicals and so you get what you get.
00:14:16
Speaker
know, because those chemicals are obviously designed to deliver, you know, carbohydrates or other nutrition. But that's all you get from those. And that's really the significant difference with using a natural product. You get a whole load of other nutrients that are in that natural product as well. So what are the chemicals, these like the binding agents and things that, you know,
00:14:44
Speaker
Yeah. So the maltodextrin is a really common one. Yeah, that's right. Yep. Um, but you also have like acidity regulators in there. Um, you have thickeners in there, a bulking agent stuff. You know, when you start looking into it, um, and if you look on the back of pack for most gels, it's a really long ingredient deck.
00:15:11
Speaker
and none of it sounds particularly pleasant, but also the more ingredients that a product has, the higher the likelihood is that it's going to have a negative effect on you.
00:15:27
Speaker
Um, so that could be the combination of the way the ingredients interact with each other, or it could be a particular ingredient in that ingredient deck on the back of the pack. Um, and they can cause stomach upsets, which as we've talked about, um, lots of people would agree is the thing that you want to avoid. Yeah. People, um, well, it's, it's definitely one of the rules is not to try any new fuel in actually on a race, but
00:15:56
Speaker
you do see people going through testing different, there's a thread actually being put live today of somebody asking for recommendations for fuel to try during their marathon training. People kind of settle on a product that they know works for them is what you tend to see. I totally agree.
00:16:23
Speaker
Not only do you need your training plan, but you also need your nutrition plan as well. Because if you don't fuel efficiently and at the right times correctly, then you're going to run out of energy. And you're obviously doing endurance. That's absolutely key. You need to have the energy to keep you going. Why make maple syrup? Was there other things like honey or that kind of
00:16:52
Speaker
product that you look down? Yeah I mean I don't know about whether it's just because we've been looking at it but over the last year or so there seems to be a lot more honey products that are coming out and
00:17:08
Speaker
You know, honey, honey is good for a lot of things, except, you know, obviously it's made from bees, so it's not vegan. So that won't suit a lot of people, but also it has a much higher glycemic index than maple syrup. Um, it's mostly fructose. Um, so, you know, that's not ideal for people with IBS. So, you know, that again could be a trigger.
00:17:35
Speaker
for giving you an upset stomach. And it doesn't really have as many of these other smaller quantities and ingredients that I've been talking about that maple syrup has. So it's much more limited in that respect. Will the maple syrup give you a sugar crash then or not?
00:17:59
Speaker
No, it won't. Obviously, we're all different, but this will be sustained energy release. It's got a low glycemic index, so that normally suggests that the energy will be released over a longer period of time, so you won't get a sugar cache from this. Okay. To one of the things that strikes me, the reason why some
00:18:26
Speaker
brands do use chemicals, you mentioned that it's cheaper. Does this mean your product is expensive?
Kickstarter and Sourcing Challenges
00:18:31
Speaker
Well, I mean, it's not going to be the cheapest product out there, but definitely we will be if we're going to be launching on a Kickstarter. Yeah. And
00:18:48
Speaker
I don't know if you know how Kickstarter works but basically it's pre-selling the product and you have different reward levels and our smallest reward level is 13 pounds and you get nine tubes of maple ignite and then if you're going up to I think the highest one we've got is like 500 tubes
00:19:13
Speaker
for £600. So that might be good for, you know, a running club, for example. Yes. Yeah. You wouldn't want all of that for yourself. Living on maple syrup. It's still, it's still just, I can't, I'm trying to grasp, it's just so simple.
00:19:38
Speaker
Why hasn't it been done before? I don't get it. Before we answer that. Getting hold of maple syrup. Go on, please. Getting hold of maple syrup. Yeah, as I say, getting hold of maple syrup is not easy.
00:19:56
Speaker
And then it's getting hold of the right maple syrup. So there's different grades of maple syrup and the ones that we normally buy and you'll see for sale in supermarkets, it's quite dark and quite strong tasting. So it's great for pancakes and all that sort of stuff. The one we've chosen is much lighter.
00:20:23
Speaker
lighter in colour and lighter in taste. But it still has a maple hint to it.
00:20:32
Speaker
And so then it just makes it easier to consume. And, you know, that just takes a lot of effort to find that really. Yeah. And yeah, so we've gone through loads of different types of maple syrup from different maple syrup farmers. So I consider myself something of an expert on maple syrup. That was my next question, is how have you come to this formula and have you been living on maple syrup for the last 10 years?
00:21:01
Speaker
How have you got to just be those two elements and how have you got to the formula that you've got? So really it was about getting quality ingredients, starting with quality ingredients and knowing the nutritional profile that we wanted to hit. So we wanted to have something that had carbs in it. So we've got 24 grams of carbs in each tube.
00:21:31
Speaker
We know that we wanted sodium in there as well. So that meant mixing it with some sea salt. So we've got 110 milligrams of sodium in there. And then you've got all these other naturally occurring electrolytes that are going to help balance your blood sugar and convert the carbs into energy. So we started off with a goal of wanting
00:21:59
Speaker
quality natural ingredients that we're going to hit a nutritional profile that will suit most people when they're out doing their run and help them achieve their PBs, really. Yeah. And over what period of time has it took you to come to this then? So it's taken, well,
00:22:23
Speaker
We first came up with the idea a couple of years ago, to be honest, Joe. But it's really been in the last nine months that we've put more focus around this. Yeah. So, yeah, that's very different samples. Speaking to different blenders and all the rest of it, you know, making sure we've got the right people involved. Yeah.
00:22:51
Speaker
It was uncanny, wasn't it, the day you contacted me and said, can we have a chat about this again? There was a thread, wasn't there, on Twitter, and I sent you a picture of the image that somebody had actually given to try maple syrup on there. They'd written it in pen and they just, just on their, on their, on their planet, they had, you know, scrappy notes up on the wall. And I was like, wow. Exactly. Like, I think, you know,
00:23:18
Speaker
That's obviously the way the world is going, you know, looking for more natural solutions.
00:23:25
Speaker
Or at least that's how I feel anyway. Plus, it's actually got some really good environmental benefits. You're not creating chemicals. You're actually, I don't know if you know this, but maple syrup is created from the sap of the sugar maple tree. So they tap the tree, which is basically putting a hole in the tree, and drain out the sap.
00:23:53
Speaker
and that will go for about six weeks during spring so maple sugar trees grow in North America mainly Canada so it freezes during the winter and as it defrosts and goes into spring summer then the sap starts running and then that's what's collected
00:24:16
Speaker
and that's how you make your maple syrup. So you've got six weeks of the year to harvest it and the type of maple syrup we've got is from the first couple of days. So it's making sure that everything lines up to ensure that we've got the right product here. So just as the tree
00:24:39
Speaker
matures throughout the summer. I assume that changes the taste of the maple syrup then, does it? Yeah, it does. It gets stronger and darker. And then, you know, during full summer, the sap isn't running in the same way. So that's when the harvest season stops.
00:24:58
Speaker
And, you know, the tree, you know, carries on growing. You know, it's not like you destroy the tree when you tap the sap. You know, maple trees grow to about 200 years. So, you know, we're helping indirectly, conserving the forests in Canada. Yeah. Very interesting. Very interesting.
Environmental Commitment and Future Plans
00:25:25
Speaker
Yeah, very simple.
00:25:27
Speaker
Just remind us on that point about the work that you do around the Fenton Habitat.
00:25:36
Speaker
Yeah, so we've been working for the last couple of years with the World Land Trust. So for each purchase or each tub that we sell, we save a square meter of threatened habitat. So that could be in the jungle, in the rainforest, it could be in the savannah. It's really where the need is most required.
00:26:02
Speaker
So we donate to the World Land Trust and they purchase that through their partners on our behalf. And that means that land is then saved forever. And that's really important because it's that loss of habitat that's really destroying literally the environment as it's converted to other things, car parks or fields or whatever it might be.
00:26:30
Speaker
So it's a way of really putting things back. Plus, you know, it gives us more places to run. Yeah, exactly. Is there plans for more products?
00:26:46
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, we've got another one coming out this year. I mean, it's typical, got two almost ready at the same time. So yeah, not great planning, but another great product. So that's really, it's going to be a marine collagen product.
00:27:07
Speaker
which will really help with the connective tissue, so your ligaments, your tendons, the things that kind of ache and get worn out as you're doing endurance exercise. So we'll be bringing that out later on this year. Okay, we'll look out for that one as well then. Where does everyone find you online please Tim, reminding us
00:27:36
Speaker
Yeah, please go to our website. We've got a stack of information about Maple Ignite and our Kickstarter. So we've got a page on our website. Our website is proteinrebel.com. We will be launching the Kickstarter, which is our crowdfunding campaign.
00:27:57
Speaker
towards the end of July, so we've got two or three weeks to go, so it's all quite exciting really. And then if you want to buy our products you can buy them from our website or you can buy them from Amazon and we're in a couple of other kind of endurance sports websites as well, third-party websites. Brilliant. Tim, thanks so much for coming on and
00:28:25
Speaker
Best of luck with the Kickstarter and I look forward to trying Maple Ignite. Yeah. Brilliant, Joe. All right. Cheers, Tim.