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00:00:01
E38: Shim Sham Shows
102 Plays5 hours ago
Maybe the most legendary of the Crows live shows, Counting Crows played for 5 consecutive years in New Orleans during Jazzfest.. The "Shim Sham Shows" (played at the Shim Sham Club) occurred from 1999-2003.
Lewis Fowler was there for 3 of them and was the "official/unofficial" recorder of those bootlegs. Yes, if you've heard those shows - it's because of Lewis.
Join Lewis, Chris and Eric as we walkthrough an amazing aspect of CC history.
Listen to the shim sham shows on YouTube.
Lewis Shows (00-02):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcF-CUUyX9Q
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q6PySvbpj5Y
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B0n9xWRAPFE
99 Show:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FRYD-f97IqE
03 Show:
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction to the Shim Sham Show
00:00:16
Speaker
Welcome to Sullivan Street for the Shim Sham Show, but first let's say hi to Chris. Chris, good afternoon. ah I'm so excited to be here, Eric. I'm so excited to break down these shows. It's been just really fun to listen to them again. It's been a while, and I'm i'm really excited. It's one of the favorite things about the the way we do the show is that I get the excuse to go back and listen to stuff, but it's been a long time, and it was this was particularly fun.
00:00:42
Speaker
Yeah, this was something that I know you as the live expert really wanted to talk about me. I only had ah cursory knowledge, and and but i yeah it gave me a chance to get into it.
Listener Lewis Fowler's Insights
00:00:53
Speaker
And speaking of ah people that wanted us to talk about this, ah one listener emailed us and he is on the show, Lewis Fowler. Lewis, welcome to the podcast. Thanks so much for having me, guys.
00:01:04
Speaker
Yeah, so Lewis will come on. We have a couple things to talk about first, but Lewis is going to come on. One, he has listened to these shows a lot, knows them pretty well, and also ah knows them well because he attended three of the five and has some great stories and has actually written as such on Reddit, etc. So we'll talk about that ah in just a bit.
North American Tour Reflections
00:01:21
Speaker
But let's just quickly ah kick off, Chris, just to do more of a timely wrap-up the North American tour today.
00:01:30
Speaker
Soon they're done. Then they're going to take a one month break and then they will be heading to Europe for the first time. Actually, not in too long since 2022. Although part of me thinks they mostly go there when they release something and they just happen to release something, you know, three years ago.
00:01:44
Speaker
um So did you have I got to see them locally, but I also wanted to ask you if you have any final thoughts about their tour this year, 2025. Well, two
Unexpected Jam Session in Connecticut
00:01:54
Speaker
things. I there's the um i saw them a second time after the last episode that we did.
00:01:59
Speaker
um And so I saw them ah up in up in Connecticut. And that was a very it was a really good show. ah The really interesting thing about that was they went into Friend of the Devil.
00:02:13
Speaker
And Adam left the stage and and never addressed why he left the stage. um but he did was holding onto his stomach a couple times. So I don't know whether he just, bathroom problem. I don't, I know it was never addressed, but the band played about two and a half minutes of friend of the devil.
00:02:31
Speaker
And for the first time, which is interesting, right? They
Atmosphere Comparisons: Casino vs LA Crowds
00:02:34
Speaker
play a very arranged version of friend of the devil, which of course is a grateful dead song. um The sort of jam band. um It's the first time I've ever actually seen the band jam.
00:02:44
Speaker
on Friend of the Devil, which was this just sort of an interesting thing to see, and it sounded great. and the i Dan and Emmy were trading licks and doing some different things. Then they went into round here, but again...
00:02:57
Speaker
we're still waiting for Adam. And so they did like ah banded, like a two and a half, three minute sort of jam on the intro of round here until finally Adam came out and Dave just sort of went right into the main intro.
00:03:10
Speaker
Um, just a really kind of interesting thing that I have never seen before. And if if you're looking for tapes to listen to from this door, um, that one is sort of an interesting one to, ah to grab but um and and give a listen to.
00:03:26
Speaker
ah cool so Yeah. in Bridgeport, Connecticut. I kept thinking, I couldn't think of the name Bridgeport, Connecticut. Weirdly though, it's the Hartford healthcare care amphitheater in, which is just a strange ah thing. But that was a good show. Good night, Elizabeth too, which is always great to hear, even if they really should find a different all to do at some point.
00:03:44
Speaker
um And yeah, The other thing i just wanted to talk about was some of these versions of Round Here in the last couple weeks with um Wristwatch, ah the MJ Lenderman song, and Raining in Baltimore together, which have been super fun. Did they do that?
00:04:00
Speaker
You saw them a couple weeks ago. They did very abbreviated Raining in Baltimore. So I want to say almost no. But you got some Raining in Baltimore. That counts a little bit. I'm one
Incident Involving Brian Fallon
00:04:10
Speaker
of the only ones I think that recognize that even though I'm sure a lot of people had that album.
00:04:14
Speaker
Um, yeah, it was interesting. I saw him at the, at the, at the Yamaha, uh, theater in Highland, which is kind of San Bernardino. Uh, yeah, the, the, another casino show it's local to me. So of course I'll go.
00:04:25
Speaker
um Yeah, a couple. I mean, definitely some highlights. I know this kind of timely, but first of all, the big thing was Chris has been bothering me for years to get into Gaslight Anthem. I wanted to get into them.
00:04:36
Speaker
i got there early. i had extra coffee. They did not play because about, i guess, 45 minutes before they were due to come on, ah the singer got in a fight with the... What was the lead singer's name? Why am I forgetting? Brian Fallon.
00:04:50
Speaker
Brian Fallon, yeah. Got in a fight with their security... but I guess ostensibly because he wanted his daughter backstage and they said, absolutely not. Nobody under 21.
00:05:01
Speaker
If you're curious, I just saw somebody uploaded Adam's explanation on YouTube and it already has like thousands of of views. anyway I don't have too much to say about it. um I'm glad they played ah crows because it sounded like they at least flirted with the idea of not playing or, you know, or when they were confronted about it, you know, thought, Oh, is that an option?
00:05:22
Speaker
um So highlight to me, well, no. So I wanted to see them this year to hear that all that they're basically playing all five songs, at least four of them. Guess what? The night I went, they only played three, I think partly because of this issue.
00:05:34
Speaker
So they did not play Aurora, which they've been playing in almost every show. They've skipped a couple and boxcars they skipped. So in the first seven songs, I got to hear, you know, Spaceman, in Virginia and With Love. I love them.
00:05:45
Speaker
he he He always, I shouldn't say that because I know he gets in the longest summer. Generally, Adam has more fun singing either new songs or songs that he doesn't have to quote unquote play every night, which makes sense.
00:06:00
Speaker
That makes sense. He loves these songs and and they're great. So I i thought they were great. um It was so interesting hearing the crowd ah around and talking to people, even with, I mean, one thing I'm starting to realize again, it's partly our age and I know I would maybe be the same way about other bands that I used to love. Like, I don't know, Dave Matthews or something that I don't really keep in touch with anymore.
00:06:21
Speaker
or follow, but there are people there that see them 10, 20 times and wear their shows, those shirts do not have the new album. um Some ways don't even know some of the B-sides, even in the album. but I shouldn't say B-sides, right? But you know what mean? The deeper cuts on the album. Yeah. Like, you know, they...
00:06:39
Speaker
you know, guys all I couldn't they don't play, they didn't play Miami. That's my favorite song. and I'm like, geez, they play that every time, you know, that I'm glad they kind of took a break. um So that was really interesting to me. ah For me, the highlight, which, the so at casino shows, I was saying now that I've been to a couple,
00:06:56
Speaker
I find that the crowd is um a mix of older and younger. yeah I think like almost or yeah older than me and also maybe some younger that just because of their casino.
00:07:07
Speaker
And they surprisingly less drunk, I think, than like the amphitheater shows, right? Where people maybe go, let's split a bottle of wine in the in the grass or something like that. And here, maybe they, whatever, because they're traveling and whatever. ah Maybe they've had one drink or two, but not drunk.
00:07:23
Speaker
ah More of like a sitting in theater. Very polite. Not a lot of like cell phone talk. Because Zephyr got a hold of me for the next show in l L.A. And he said it was great. But he said that he thought the crowd was just too much talking between songs, not really paying attention on their phone. You know, he he almost called it typical L.A. behavior.
00:07:39
Speaker
I saw none of that um where I was. If anything, people just didn't even, in fact, the the really hardcore fans really stand out. i'm like, okay, those five people have the new album. The other 700 people I can see don't have it.
00:07:52
Speaker
um Mrs. Potters was a highlight. I hadn't seen that in years and I love it. And of course, some of that, and that we've now that we know from David Lowery, some of that... ah that what is it? The fourth verse references, uh, an area in yeahle to pi pioneer town. Oh, Joshua tree. Yeah. Up by Joshua tree. So that's not far from where the casino is. So, um, yeah, that was great.
00:08:13
Speaker
Um, they didn't have the highlight t-shirt yet. Uh, for those that haven't, um, ah and by the way, Lewis, they have new t-shirts. And not only do they have like a Crown and Crows High Life one, which I said I want to get because it looks cool.
00:08:24
Speaker
Although people are going to think I'm advocating for pot, ah you know, universal pot usage or something. And then the other odd thing that- You live in California, though, so you don't need to advocate. Yeah, i know. i'm just I'm just teasing. But they might think that's why I have this shirt is what I
History of Shim Sham Shows
00:08:38
Speaker
guess is what I'm getting at.
00:08:39
Speaker
um ah Not just because I'm a diehard Crows fan. But then this is the best. and So I think I'm like, oh, I host the Count and Crows podcast. I know everything. They have another um T-shirt and I did not get the reference.
00:08:52
Speaker
Did you see that? Oh, it's the the the all my friends um flowers in their eyes. Yes. I don't know. I don't know why. Again, maybe I'm just getting old at first. I'm like, what is that? There's like flowers in the eye, which is also high life.
00:09:05
Speaker
Yeah. because i got none So anyway, I thought that was cool. Oh, it's Highlight. You're right. Yeah, you're right. I going to say real quick about the casino shows. I mean, one of my favorite versions of Mrs. Potter is from an Atlantic City show.
00:09:15
Speaker
In the middle, Adam does this whole kind of interlude where he's talking about, you know, the decline of Atlantic City and he ties it back to Pioneertown and, you know, somewhere...
00:09:26
Speaker
Somewhere in the Joshua Tree, there's this town still standing, the Pioneer Town, and goes back into the song. it's it's a It's a pretty great version. That's fantastic. They used to play Atlantic City a lot. for some I feel like there was some reason... There was a couple of years there where they played it a bunch.
00:09:40
Speaker
um I do just want to call it... Again, just the wristwatch thing. i there's a There's a decent number of versions. The one from San Diego um is up, and I thought that was very good. That and Raining in Baltimore.
00:09:53
Speaker
But Adam... I'm not a huge... i've I've listened a little bit of MJ Lenderman. I guess I'm maybe I don't get it quite yet. um But some of the lyrics in that song are so great.
00:10:04
Speaker
ah Adam singing, I've got a houseboat docked at the Himbo Dome is one of the great line reads of all time. um He gc says so plaintively, I've got a houseboat docked at the Himbo. I don't even want to spoil it for and try to but like some go.
00:10:21
Speaker
Everyone who's listening, if you haven't heard him do this, go, go find that. And, um it's a it's a good one. Also, as someone who spends a lot of time in Buffalo, because my wife's family there, um because the the singer in that song, much like sort of around here or Raining in Baltimore, which they've sort of connected to, is sort of, like you know, kind of plaintive and and kind of sad, but that they're sort of humble bragging, right?
00:10:42
Speaker
And I've got a beach house up in Buffalo, i can confirm, is a very sad crack. I love Buffalo, but you've got a beach house in Buffalo. That's not, you know. Not the same. That was the song that I heard from from MJ that gravitated me towards his music. I have to it was the lyrics as well. I felt Wristwatch really captured me and sort of was my introduction into his music.
00:11:05
Speaker
Yeah, feel like I've got to go deeper with him. i that could Because the second thing down under Wristwatch was a really beautiful... cover of the um Magnolia Electrico song, Just Be Simple. So I'm like, maybe I've just got a, maybe I just got my ears hearing Adam and I'm like, I got to hear the rest of the stuff.
00:11:20
Speaker
but well no He did say, um I'm about wrapped up. he you know um He did mention, so he played Blues Run the Game, which they play a lot, but they are frequently. But he said that that was a last minute addition. Or he said something like, Emi just told me we should play Blues Run the Game. So I don't know if that's subbed out for something like boxcars or they just want to do Because he actually, Emi took some time to tune up before that song. So the guitar was not ready for it.
00:11:46
Speaker
um the only thing on the ah The last thing I want to say about the show was for In the first half, which i guess is less of the hits, so Spaceman, Potters, Virginia, maybe Manual. um Yeah, I think Manual, too. I can't remember. Love from A to Z.
00:12:03
Speaker
And Colorblind, I know that's a hit, and and Michelangelo and Blues Run the Game, I thought Adam's performance on those eight songs were some of the best I've ever heard. um I almost think it tested him a little bit and his voice, and he had to play YouTube the next day.
00:12:17
Speaker
and I think when he got into the hits, he didn't challenge, you know, last seven songs didn't challenge himself that much, but which I understood because I couldn't believe you know so Again, i'm not ah I've seen Colorblind so much. i just certainly I was like, this is maybe his best performance of Colorblind, and I've seen it 18 times or something. So anyway, that's ah a wrap, and we'll um you know we'll check in after the end of the European tour to see if there's any interesting additions or subtractions to that ah to to those shows.
00:12:46
Speaker
Yes. So. But speaking of shows that are the opposite of casino shows. And also definitely featured Blues Run the Game and many other covers. Yes. The transition of Blues Run the Game. The Shim Sham shows.
00:12:59
Speaker
um And I'll just preface it a little. I know less ah you know than than the two of you. um Although. it at while way So the Shim Sham shows are five shows which I kept forgetting.
00:13:13
Speaker
started in 99 so it's 99 00 01 02 03 and um so all right we get because the the club was called the shim sham club right and um it was owned uh because it's funny you got in when i was researching this they interviewed which ah we were trying to get hold of him but the owner is actually a la native I don't know how he ended up owning that club, or I'm guessing he might have had some connection to Adam and the gang, because how did this all get set up? Maybe you'll have some insight there.
00:13:43
Speaker
um He doesn't live there anymore. He's back in l L.A. He owns a yeah a, speaking of high life, owns a 420 friendly hotel. I know it's soon illegal, I guess, but they don't want kids there because of it in Idlewild, but that's one of the themes.
00:13:57
Speaker
of Of the hotel out here. And i so I remember, Chris, I found out that ironically he became pseudo famous. And I don't I didn't follow this because he was ah featured in the Amber Heard trial with Johnny Depp.
00:14:11
Speaker
He was he gave testimony. I don't know anything about it. I didn't look into it. But that was the man who organized some of these Shim Shim shows. The club is still there, by the way. I believe it's called One-Eyed Jacks now. Yes.
00:14:24
Speaker
And I i was about to say that because I went in One Eye Jacks is gone, actually. Yeah, actually, have right. It just closed two years ago. It just closed a couple years ago. But I actually went there. And and in again, I was a Crows fan, but I love so many other bands. And it's weird thinking this because, you know, when you're in your 20s, one year seems like, you know, ah you know what i mean, right? Like one year is a long time where now the years keep, you know, flipping by.
00:14:47
Speaker
But I actually was at the One Eye Jacks, which was Shim Sham. My friend took me in um in 04, just one year later. and And somehow he already knew that the, he because he was a Crows fan. He said, yeah, the Shim Sham show, as we know it, is done.
00:15:02
Speaker
Okay. now Toulouse Theater, which is owned by Ben Jaffe. um Okay. From the preservation hall jazz band. Oh, okay. Oh, okay. ah Morgan Higby was the name of the owner of Shim Sham.
00:15:13
Speaker
ah So we're going to talk about the recordings. All the recordings are on YouTube for the audio. The video on YouTube is only available for $99, the first one, which was interesting.
00:15:25
Speaker
Which should been forever to come out, by the way. i i actually recall when someone finally dropped that on Crowstown.com. God, maybe it was a decade after something like that. But um yeah, that was for a long time. The one we didn't have was 99.
Pseudonyms and Recordings by Morgan
00:15:39
Speaker
Yeah. oh mean I don't know if you want me to jump in, but like, yeah, that one came out way later.
00:15:44
Speaker
And my understanding is that that was Morgan, the owner, had set up a VHS camcorder on a tripod and just hit record in 99. And that's what that is. It's just his home recording that Adam okayed on a tripod of the 99 show.
00:16:00
Speaker
can Can you, um this was something I should have asked it in the in the pre-show, but in was it in 03 or one of the later ones, Emmy comes out and says, ah welcome to the Devil and the Bunny show.
00:16:14
Speaker
Yeah. Now, is that exact? Didn't he, they do other shows that were devil in the bunny. And then also not all of these were devil in the bunny. Could you clarify that for people? mean, my understanding is that they were putting these things up under sort of pseudonyms and secret names, but the devil in the bunny seems to kind of be a reoccurring theme.
00:16:34
Speaker
And my understanding of it is simply that Adam had a bunny suit that he used to wear every single Halloween and And I think Emmy often would dress as a devil. And that was just kind of their go-to Halloween costumes.
00:16:45
Speaker
And so then when they started doing these duos, they decided to just call it that in homage to their Halloween outfits. And I think those Halloween outfits have later made appearances.
00:16:56
Speaker
I believe, Chris, you might know better, like 99 Boston and something like Something like that. yeah There's Boston one. I saw a Adam, but with Dave Bryson, but with Adam in the the bunny suit on a Halloween 108.
00:17:09
Speaker
oh no wait And Howard Stern, famously. The Howard Stern thing. But, that I mean, Adam... And and Adam... he's the he's in the holiday in Spain right he's an engine driver in a bunny suit but yeah that that's the devil and the bunny is literally just I think there's a they did a radio show that was called that at some point yeah and they'd be like who is the devil and who is the bunny and it's like well it's pretty obvious actually guys there's pictures if one of you is the devil and one is the bunny but I guess I just yeah I guess I just wasn't sure like when he said that I was like are they wearing those costumes this time I think no right I don't think so yeah okay mean they they did I have it here it's funny um
00:17:45
Speaker
2000, they called it publicly, The Devil and the Bunny Show. Okay. 2001, they called it The Amnesia Show. And 2002, they called it a Uriah Heap tribute band, which I believe is like a 70s band that Emmy's a big fan of.
00:18:02
Speaker
Oh. Okay, so I'll let you guys or one of you, maybe Chris and then Lewis can chat. I'll let mostly – I'll have thoughts on every ah show, but I'll let – Chris, I'll let you lead the way. We can we can talk about all five shows just overall.
00:18:15
Speaker
Yeah, but let's talk about – I just want to maybe it's set the stage for people,
Intimate New Orleans Shows
00:18:18
Speaker
right? So so ah the Shim Sham Club, right, it's a small club in New Orleans. My understanding is all of these shows were both the week of Jazz Fest and very late at night to varying degrees.
00:18:31
Speaker
Yes. So I just want you to maybe justlu just, Luke, just kind of like set the picture for us. Like what's the club like? What's the energy like? Like what's the, what's the vibe of the shows? Sure. Before we talk about the specifics of them.
00:18:43
Speaker
But I mean, again, you've got to like put yourself back in that time period too. It's like sort of, not going to say the advent of the internet, but it's early internet days. Um, and And as you guys have mentioned on previous episodes, like back then, AnnaBegins.com, the fan site run by Lisa was like everyone's sort of like gateway into the tape trading community and also just sort of news about the ban.
00:19:08
Speaker
And one night in college, I went to school in Mississippi State in North Mississippi. I grew up 90 miles from New Orleans. And one night a post comes up.
00:19:21
Speaker
Hey, I mean, I don't know exactly what the lingo was, but something like, you know, secret show, New Orleans this weekend. Keep it quiet. adam Adam and some friends, something like that.
00:19:32
Speaker
And so we get in the car and drive four and a half hours to New Orleans that Friday night or whatever night it was. Me and a bunch of friends not really knowing if this was real or not, like not really knowing it is.
00:19:44
Speaker
Was this a fake post or is he going to show or is he going to back it? Like, we don't know what we're going to. And we get there. um i remember it daylight, so it was not super late. And I get to this club and there were some fans. There were like people who clearly knew what was going on. They'd seen the same post.
00:20:04
Speaker
The club is, i mean, I'm terrible with like numbers of people, but we're talking a hundred people, 200 people. I mean, it's quite small, has a balcony, but the balcony was closed off if i if I remember correctly. And I mean, the Shimsham was a great club, like, by the way, like Morgan ran it.
00:20:20
Speaker
and my My understanding is his ties were, Like they did a lot of punk shows there. The Cramps used to come and play there a bunch. um I think there was a lot of burlesque type shows. So it was not necessarily what you would have thought of as Counting Crows fan type club.
00:20:38
Speaker
But if you know Adam and his ties to l LA and his ties to the Viper Room and all that kind of stuff, it was sort of in that same scene, I think. Which I think is, he must have known Morgan from l LA in some way before Morgan went to New Orleans to open this, I think.
00:20:53
Speaker
That would make sense, right? Yeah. That makes sense. So I get there and, you know, i brought like this, this mini disc tape recorder and, and and a microphone that I used to travel with to shows and it was like, well, I'll see what this is. Like I, again, you don't, the 99 show was not out. Like we didn't know what this was like for all I knew was a County Crow show.
00:21:15
Speaker
I think I met Morgan, the owner, briefly and was like, Hey, and I introduced myself and said, I'd like to take the show. And he was like, uh, he's like, had, had that look of a club owner who was quite busy and that this was not exactly what he wanted to be dealing with at the moment. And right around the time a cab pulls up and Adam and Emmy get out and em he's like pulling his acoustic guitar out of the, out of the, uh, back of the cab.
00:21:41
Speaker
It was such a kind of rock and roll moment of them just like rolling up in a cab and like everyone's just kind standing looking. And, ah I think I just went right up to Adam and just like, Hey, and I introduced myself and i was like, ah brought this thing to record tonight. If you're cool with it. And he's like, uh, man, I don't know. Like, that's not kind of what this vibe is. Uh, I don't know. Let me let me think about it. and Like kind of like brushes me off and I'm like, no problem. Cool. Whatever, you know?
00:22:08
Speaker
And then, We were there quite early. And so my memory is that we had like, we had like three or four hours to kill. We're just kind of sitting around. Maybe we went for a walk. Maybe we went and grabbed bite to eat. I don't really remember.
00:22:19
Speaker
yeah i I'm only going interrupt just by saying that i the only I didn't go, but my one friend did go to that show and he just said the exact same thing was you, that everyone was there or at least a lot of people were there, maybe the hundred. i think he might have been with you and you guys were all having a drink and then they came in and then you had a couple hours to kill. And so he said, yeah, he went out to dinner came back to the show. Yeah, it was like a lot of time to kill. I come back to the show and at some point before the show, Morgan, the owner comes up to me and goes, hey, Adam said you can record.
00:22:48
Speaker
I like, all right, cool, no problem. And um I was earlier, before we recording, I went I went down into my basement looking through some old things. i actually found the old mini disc recorder that I use for this thing. I don't know if this thing still works, but I used to record with this Sony.
00:23:06
Speaker
minidisc Walkman and like a cheap microphone I bought from Radio Shack back in the day. And that was how I recorded shows. And it was not the professional rig that certain like jam band tapers used to really use. This was like really my sort of down and dirty way of recording shows. And I remember going into the club and being like, this is going to be loud because it's it's a club. It's a bar. It's packed.
00:23:30
Speaker
And there were these like risers over on the left side, just like one or two steps. And I was like, all right, I'm going to go stand stage left so that I'm kind of above the crowd a little bit. And I had to sit there and like hold the microphone the entire show. like I'm just sitting there like old school style holding this microphone.
00:23:48
Speaker
And that's the that's the 2000 show. And um and just to close the loop on all that, I record the show. We have a great time. We pack up. We leave. I go home and a few weeks or maybe a month or so later, I get this email from Lisa from Anna Begins and she's like, hey, um Adam was wondering if he could get a copy of the show.
00:24:10
Speaker
I'm like, yeah, it's his. So sure, no problem. and I don't know. I mean, again, this was before you could download shows. This was the early tape trading or CD-ROM days.
00:24:22
Speaker
I don't even think I had the capabilities of getting these mini disc off. So I ended up having to like send these to some other taper who who said I can rip these for you and I'll send them back on like data disc. And then I cloned those and I sent those to Adam or something. I don't, I don't really remember, but it wasn't as straightforward as, you know,
00:24:42
Speaker
a we transfer link or whatever, or, or, or, and Lisa knew that you were recording cause you met her there and she saw you recording.
Recording and Trading Culture
00:24:51
Speaker
that what? No, I'm Lisa came to a later show. I think that Adam said to her, hey there was some guy there.
00:24:59
Speaker
Can you find him? and and I, maybe I had put on, maybe I don't even remember if Anna begins had like a message board, but I'm sure I posted somewhere like, Hey, I was there, i recorded it or Hey, here's the set list. Like I was, you know, if I would go to these shows, particularly a show like that, that was that special, like I would maybe like put a report up just so people knew kind of what was going on. And he probably saw it and had her like,
00:25:22
Speaker
so So the ones that were uploaded on YouTube by Barely Out of Tuesday, the 00, 01, and 02, are they all yours? Yeah. So
Influence of Shim Sham on Counting Crows
00:25:33
Speaker
yeah, 2000, 2001, and 2002. I wasn't entirely clear because there could be multiple recorders or whatever, but okay, great. yeah The 99 was the VHS that Morgan set up.
00:25:42
Speaker
I did 2000, 2001, and 2002. And then I had left the South, was living in New York by 03, and that that that one's not mine. Yeah, and in part of it, for those who weren't around at this time, like, these were kind of, like, kind of grail tapes. And and one of the biggest things that got, like, traded on places like Anna Begins and Hummingbird's Nest and stuff like that, because I think so much it's so much interesting material, right? And for just generally, right, it's Adam, generally speaking, Adam and Emmy and some friends, right?
00:26:16
Speaker
Often Andre Carter on trumpet, which is some of the best stuff in my opinion, um playing either very stripped down versions of Counting Crow songs or a lot of covers, like a wild array of covers, some of them which are very like, you know, ones the band has ended up doing a lot and other ones that are just totally off the wall, batshit kind of like wild stuff.
00:26:41
Speaker
And so these are the tape. I mean, cause everyone, you know, you'd get a couple of tapes and you had this and obviously again, if you get the the sickness, you want more and more and more, but like these were sort of the obvious ones to get because you weren't going to find another tape that had Adam and Emmy doing, I want to be sedated by the remote.
00:26:58
Speaker
Twice. um So that these were like, you know, these are cool. And and and it's, ah it is really honestly, loose we've probably talked to message boards before, but it is like the fact that you tape these things is such a great thing because like,
00:27:12
Speaker
Can you fucking imagine if these things hadn't gotten recorded for posterity? it's It would be such a shame. And I'm telling you, if Adam had said no, they would not have been. Like, I put it in his court and was just like, I'm here, I can do it if you want.
00:27:25
Speaker
And he had gave it some serious thought, I guess. and Which, rightfully so. Like, these are drunken, like look back on these knowing now what I know about the band and I think you know you you hear you hear about what do they call it the cock house or whatever the house that where he lived in l LA with all his bandmates and friends that would come through town I'm like the number of times they must like have late night sat around and done these stupid like Madonna cover or like the America cover you know just for fun and like this was like a performance of that this was a glimpse into that you know um and also to your point about like Andre Carter and some of the other musical guests that he would bring along like
00:28:05
Speaker
you know, we now know so much more about the band and his love of music through interviews and podcasts and his, his podcast that he did with James and and all of that kind of stuff.
00:28:15
Speaker
But back then, like you kind of knew what he posted on like the AOL message board and that kind of thing. And you obviously knew that he cared a lot about music based on the opening bands that he would take on tour with him and, and and how he would talk in in interviews about them. But, but these shows really, I think,
00:28:35
Speaker
sort of opened my eyes and then a lot of fans eyes up to his love of all kinds of music. And, and this first show, the 2001 having Jules sheer there with the, um, girls from the continental drifters and like, just being like, Hey, I'm in new Orleans.
00:28:50
Speaker
I'm friends with musicians. They're going to come and do some stuff. They're going actually play their songs. I'm going step off stage. Like it was so cool. Like it was just very, very interesting to watch him sort of orchestrate that whole thing. it was almost like a precursor to like the, uh,
00:29:05
Speaker
it's what he now does with the music festival or the traveling circus. It was almost like his way of bringing, you know, and on a much smaller scale. Yeah, it is. I do think, especially the festival, like this is sort of the genesis of, yeah, the idea of like, we're going to be in clubs and we're going to be able to do these things that we couldn't do on a big stage.
Adam Duritz's Candid Performances
00:29:25
Speaker
That's right. um And he's, and and and also like, Lewis is not speaking out of turn about the drinking because like, like, Adam, like, well multiple, if you listen these tapes multiple times, he's like, I'm so drunk right now.
00:29:37
Speaker
They are mixing drinks on stage. Like, this is not, they are are having a great time. It's clear everyone's having great. Was the crowd having as good a time as the band? Like, the part I'm curious too, like, is the crowd just sort of like, amped or, like, is the crowd loose too? or Yeah, I mean, i think so. I have to say that um when you're taping, you sometimes kind of have your eye on the tape and the levels kind of that you're, you're you're almost working.
00:30:05
Speaker
And then the other part of your brain is going, Hey, don't forget you're at a show. Like, why don't you enjoy yourself and like pay attention to to show. And so the thing that gets kind of left out is paying attention to the crowd. um I remember 2000, the first one ah being really fun, really loud.
00:30:19
Speaker
I think in the recording, you could hear Adam telling people to like quiet down for the quieter songs, like quite, ah quite a lot. And then I think in, in Oh he says something like,
00:30:30
Speaker
you know, we let too many people know about it last year. So we like more secret or something like that. So he was constantly trying to kind of playing with how much do we advertise this versus like, no one came in 99. Too many people came in 2000, 2001, maybe was the sweet spot. 2002, the whole band is playing jazz fest. So they're all there. So they they play for the, with the full band.
00:30:56
Speaker
um But yeah, I mean, it was just like, it was like going to like your, like, like, like a Bowery ballroom, even smaller, really like almost like Barry electric and just seeing them do like, you know, these acoustic numbers with Emmy and then, and then a bunch of friends.
00:31:13
Speaker
Yeah. I got to think about, um, one of the comments both of you hinted at, which is about the covers that we'll talk about each show, but in general, about 50% of the songs were covers and 50% were Crow songs or different interpretations of Crow songs.
Covers and Rehearsals
00:31:27
Speaker
Um, And then, of course, a lot of those covers ended up on albums, and even they mentioned that on one of them, right? Because they recorded covers twice, right? They recorded them after Hard Candy and then recorded them for... and So some of them goes, oh, we were just recording this, so you know it's fresh.
00:31:41
Speaker
But one thing I was really thinking, maybe it just depends on the song, is that it seems to me there were a lot of songs that they only played for this or these shows that would have required some practice and...
00:31:58
Speaker
you know That's interesting. I mean, I just joke that, you know I mean, even Adam kind of joked recently like, oh, I don't play Amy Hit the Atmosphere because I'd have to relearn the piano parts and I'm too lazy. he was kind of you know making a joke about it.
00:32:09
Speaker
And then I'm thinking, geez, when you're younger and you and i mean we're all like this and maybe they practice a lot just to play one cover song one time. Well, it's the thing of living with musicians, though, too, I think, because he's, you know, it's like Andre Carter who lived with him in L.A. think Amy lived with him at that time.
00:32:27
Speaker
Gibbs, for sure. Gibbs literally wrote that movie, Freeloaders. That's actually part of the other interesting, too. I think it's 03 where Adam's talking about like, oh, yeah, I moved out of this house. We're gonna get hanging out. We're you know hanging out less.
00:32:40
Speaker
And like, A, of course, it's when Adam moved to New York, but it's also like literally the plot of that movie that Gibbs wrote, Freeloaders, that's about all of these people who'd been living for free in Adam's house and had to leave.
00:32:52
Speaker
um But they're just all, I imagine they're just kind of all like hanging out and being like, oh, it'd be fun to play this song. and they just got, they probably got great gear just laying around the house, right? like I've had this thought, you know, in hindsight, but like, I really do think besides the shit these Shim Shim shows being...
Influence on Later Albums
00:33:10
Speaker
sort of their having their place in the tape community of the County Crows history. They also serve sort of this other bridge, I think between this desert life and them recording that album with the cracker guys. and And they've talked in interviews about how loose and fun and offbeat that recording session was and the aftermath of that of, of Adam living in this house and having his friends coming through town.
00:33:35
Speaker
and and and then them gearing up for Hard Candy and wanting to record some covers. And then you tie this to, this was really the precursor for Underwater Sunshine, the covers album.
00:33:47
Speaker
Like most, almost every single song on that album was played at a Shim Shim show, I think. um and then And then to take it one step further, I actually also really feel like Somewhere Under Wonderland is, even though that's like a reference to his home in l LA and it has a lot of LA references, it's very much a new Orleans album. It's got a ton of new Orleans references and he's talked about how he allowed himself to lyrically write differently for that album. And I think there's a direct tie back to these Shim Sham shows. Like I think a song like, uh, um, earthquake driver or the Elvis song, like feels very much like something you would have heard in a cover of one of these other songs or, or actually like, um,
00:34:35
Speaker
I always, whenever I hear Cover Up The Sun, immediately think of Crossing Muddy Waters. Like, as like a, you know, not like a cover, but just as a reference to that song. I thought the exact same thing.
00:34:46
Speaker
He loves those that, I even had a comment about ah Muddy Waters, because it's not my favorite song, but I thought he did a great job. And it exactly what you said, reminds me of Cover Up The Sun. And whatever that genre is, he loves it.
00:34:59
Speaker
Like that. Yeah, he's country. I mean, that's a cover. Wander loves country. Yeah. Adam loves country and and so many of those, you know, I mean, again, like, you know, I'm a huge County Crows fan.
Adam's Musical Influence
00:35:14
Speaker
have been for a long time. um But one of the things I like about them more, even more so than their own music is just sort of all the music I've discovered from Adam and listening to him talk about bands and stuff.
00:35:26
Speaker
mean, I remember being at these shows and and hearing like Townes Van Zandt and being like, got to check that out. What's that? You know, or even like big star and, and, you know, stuff like that. Like I wasn't cool enough to act, you know, necessarily know at 20 what some of these songs were or who some of these artists were. And so a lot of these shows turned me on to like the stuff that I listened to exclusively now in my you know adult life. And, and, and they all kind of tie back to these shows and Adam's promotion of this type of music, you know?
00:35:58
Speaker
yeah It covers a lot. it's It's a lot of ground. And part of it, I think that's interesting is you kind of get your point, like these different pieces of their music, you can see all these things filtered through there. And the sort of the the more pop rock type of stuff, the country things, the sort of really devastated, like in country, I mean, like the versions of like blue eyes crying in the rain, which is like beautiful. I mean, he it's like Adam really like emoting and really kind of,
00:36:26
Speaker
slow versions of these songs, letting it the stuff come out. It's like there's a lot of different angles on the band, but at same time also playing like Oasis songs, just sort of like full revved up like acoustic guitar. And that's also great.
00:36:43
Speaker
Yeah. For him doing the live forever intro long December later in his, in his um live shows. I mean, so much stuff from the Sham Sham shows would come ah out in their tours even the year after. Like, just little nuggets, you know? Yeah. And that's a part of the interesting thing, and it is for worth context for people going back, is that, again, a lot of this stuff hadn't been...
00:37:07
Speaker
part of the sort of band lexicon at the time. And part of what put it into it, like the first time you heard, like the first time I heard Adam s singing pale blue eyes was definitely the version from the Shim Shim show, which of course they now sing like exclusively in the middle of good night, Elizabeth. But like, that's, I didn't, again, I didn't know what that song was.
00:37:26
Speaker
on And I was like, this is fantastic. What is this? I have, I've, Well, again, I yeah i was twenty probably like 20 something when I heard that. I was like, I wasn't cool enough to be listening to the Velvet Underground.
00:37:39
Speaker
You know? I mean, she doesn't exist. That like that became a ah all in around here. off and on for quite some time. First time I ever heard that was the 2000 Shim Sham show, you know, Robin Hitchcock cover.
00:37:50
Speaker
Yeah. And it's it's it's actually, it it's interesting in time, right? Because I think the really well-known version of that is, I think, Pink Pop in 2000, which would have been like a month after this. There's a lot of stuff, like you can trace history from these shows to Adam going, oh, going to drop this in. And then it become like,
00:38:07
Speaker
again, like a really obvious part where someone who's listening to this now, who's getting into this today would go like, Oh yeah, they're just, they're playing these songs. Like, no, this was not, this was not a common thing that they did, um, back then.
00:38:19
Speaker
Uh, Should we try to hit the show? i guess that Yeah, let's, let's um yeah, like like we can go. And even if we only have a little commentary, i'll I can just preface each of the shows. So the first one in 99, as I said, and as Lewis said, maybe not so well attended, a little too secret.
00:38:39
Speaker
ah Yeah, May 99. So this was um exactly, almost exactly five months before This Desert Life was released. Yeah. You can really feel the fact that they've been hanging out with David Lowery. Yes, yes, yes. Because there's just a ton of like, they're like, hey, we're going to do another Cracker cover.
00:38:55
Speaker
There's like at least three or four of them in there. Yeah, there's a bunch. And for for partly because I want to motivate people to go back to listen to the tapes, i'll and we'll talk about the covers, but I'll just quickly mention...
00:39:07
Speaker
not how they perform, but but but the names of either the the Crows songs or the ones that ended up, like Lewis said, on Underwater Sunshine or some albums. So Jumpin' Jesus, Rain King, Catapult, Four Days in Mrs. Potter's, both of them the live premiere, Mr. Jones, Horse Dreamers, Long December, Goodnight Elizabeth, and Round Here. I mean, talk about a mix of the three hits with three B-sides, you know, like, ah um yeah, Horse Dreamers. But anyway, I'll turn to you guys.
00:39:37
Speaker
Yeah, I think the good night, Elizabeth, i'm I'm looking at it now, he got about a minute and 42 into it and said, I'm too drunk. We're not playing this anymore. It's funny because he keeps referencing that in the other tapes when he goes to play Elizabeth.
00:39:48
Speaker
We tried this a couple of years ago and I was way too drunk and we couldn't do it. But this tonight I'm going to do it. and he that He does get through the song in the other versions. That's right. I think my favorite thing from this one ah is is Horse Dreamers in a Long December with the horns. Yeah.
00:40:04
Speaker
which I think are really nice. This is kind of, as you mentioned, right, this tape is just off a tripod, and so the audio is not great. That kind of holds back a little bit. um It also just kind of feels like they are just kind of figuring out the format.
00:40:18
Speaker
um You know, in terms of, like, things that, again, Blue Eyes Crying in the Rain, I think, is really cool. Always on My Mind is a great song, and I think Adam singing it is great.
00:40:30
Speaker
it's a really nice take on it, but this one is less, I don't have as much on this one. It's the, the Oh, the, in the Mrs. Potter's version, the version of Mrs. Potter is, it's kind of like ah more like a country hootenanny is kind of, Oh, he's pretty, yeah, he's pretty drunk on that one too. You could tell he's having a great time with the pioneer town bar, you know, line.
00:40:46
Speaker
Um, did, so a sax player comes out. I think they said his name's Will. I didn't catch or look into it. And he played a couple songs with Andre Carter. Have In the other shows, and again, because I didn't look at them or listen as deep as you guys did, like, have they ever had a sax player out except for this 1999 Shim Sham Club show?
00:41:07
Speaker
I don't think so. i mean, I think, I think, ah didn't they used to have a sax player come out on the traveling circus tour that played in the Michael Fronte band and he would come out and play some songs, I believe. yeah Yeah. He played, but I think that's guys from, I don't know if that's the same. I don't think it's the same guy. I don't know who that was in 99, but they did have a sax player. Yeah. Well, the one thing that cracked me up and again, i was just trying to start getting into this couple of weeks ago and I don't think they announced who they were if they did cause the recording was so bad.
00:41:38
Speaker
And so the thing, this just made me laugh on the YouTube video. So when Four Days starts, right, the new song, two women come come on stage. But I don't think he introduced them. Now it ends up one of them's right. ah Are there both musicians or one of them is a major musician? Do you know what I'm talking about? and Go watch the Four Days because she plays guitar later. But um when Four Days starts, it's just that these women come on stage, like hug Adam. One's wearing a dress, one's wearing short short. And what and then they...
00:42:06
Speaker
kind of move the tambourine around and sing. And literally I thought they were audience members or like, you know, both girlfriends of Adam's that he just invited on stage to to join four days. Well, it ends up, you know, not because they they did a lot more in later songs, but it just made me laugh a little bit.
00:42:21
Speaker
yeah so It's that loose feeling. it's that that That's how loose it is that you were like, i think I think people may have just wandered on stage. Yeah, and i thought he was like, hey go for it. um Okay, so that's that's the 2000 show, as you said, a couple, you know, um reference to it.
00:42:36
Speaker
By the way, we'll talk about it later. I love Jumping Jesus now. It's something that i just got into the last like couple months and that whole sorted... mean, Lewis, you talked about getting into old albums. i was I've been listening to that Sorted Humor album, but i'll I'll talk about that another time.
00:42:49
Speaker
So now we get to 2000, which was the first one also in May, like you said, during Jazz Fest. ah The first one... And that was such a big deal, by the way, for our generation. i mean, I had people from Syracuse that were driving down to Jazz Fest to go there.
00:43:02
Speaker
So in this one... um By the way, in most of these shows, they play about 20 songs. One of them had longer because they had guests. In my mind, when I had heard of Shim Sham, is that they were playing for like six hours or seven. Like, you know, it wasn't, it was fairly. Kind of, they're still long. mean, like for like the 2000 show, like what time does it start and roughly when does it end? I'm not. Oh my God. I think you can remember exactly.
00:43:24
Speaker
My memory. Holy cow. i I don't know. I feel like it probably started around 1030 or 11th. I don't think they started quite as late as Adam would like to say they did, but they were they would be quite late. I do have a story about being out late with Adam.
00:43:39
Speaker
Not with Adam, but ah in the 01 Shim Sham. But yeah, I mean, they'd start like 10, 30, 11, probably go to about 1.30 or 2. mean, I think I drove back to college one or two times after one of these shows. like for i um the They were such a blur when it comes to like,
00:43:57
Speaker
how I got there, who was there. I've had friends later in life be like, Hey, remember that time you took me to that secret County Crow show New Orleans? That was so much fun. And I'll be like, you went to that with me? I don't know.
00:44:10
Speaker
There was some system drinking going on as well. So, um, so yeah So in the 2000 show, also about half ah Crow's songs and a bit different on these ones. Wish I Was a Girl, Catapult, Sullivan Street, Mr. Jones, Closer to You, Horse Dreamers again. And then we got Long December, Good Night Elizabeth and Rain King.
00:44:30
Speaker
And then we can talk about the covers. But can you clarify, Chris? I should know this before. Closer to You is a Crow song. Was it played in addition to... Was it ever played outside of this show? i don't believe it was ever played outside of this. And it is. I had i had not thought about this song in forever.
00:44:45
Speaker
if In terms of, like, recommendations, that that song, but particularly that version with Andre Carter playing trumpet, is so fucking beautiful. yeah It's amazing. I mean, all the of all the lost songs that fans, like,
00:44:59
Speaker
talk about and and and and pine for. It's funny that this one doesn't get more right attention, which is totally fine. you No, but it's fair because like, look, Einstein is fine and it's ah I kind of get Adam's, it's a perfectly fine song and it's interesting.
00:45:15
Speaker
Closer to You is really good and I would love to hear a full proper Crows version of whatever exists of that. I would love to hear that. I also find it weird that people pine for Einstein so much when there is a studio recording. I'm like, you have it. What do you, what is it you want? Yeah, I agree with that. That actually, that's what I always said. I want to hear them record some of the demo stuff and and yeah quote unquote, fix it up. Like Adam says, I mean, um of all the hidden gems, like but when they released August and everything after, I thought, well, that there goes everything. i mean that was, that was everything.
00:45:46
Speaker
Like, We just knew of this magical song that existed. And suddenly he put it out with a full orchestra. And i was like, that's pretty special. As you say, Chris, also a lot of um Cracker covers in here and and Robin hit Hitchcock, who Adam says is one of his major influences. So, yeah.
00:46:05
Speaker
By the way, I got to thinking, Chris. there was I mean, I know he was being funny, but there was one time that Adam was interviewed, i think during the first Butter Miracle release. And someone's like, what do you say to all those diehard Crows fans? And he jokes, he goes, oh, tell them to get a life, like get ah get other hobbies, which is kind of true, I understand, but from his perspective. But then I also laugh because he is such a music nerd that is obsessed with certain artists.
00:46:28
Speaker
And, you know, yeah that's why he did a whole podcast on and, you know, and did five episodes on Prince or something. So I can also say that to Adam. um ah But he says something similar that started this show. He comes out and he's like, this is not a i was just listening to it in preparation for this. Like, this not a kind crow show. So you guys can all like get over yourself like or something like that.
00:46:52
Speaker
this is And so again, this is, this is Lewis's tape. This audience is a great audience tape. It's much better than 99. Like it's so much that was like a immediate instantaneous. i was like, oh, this is okay. Now I can, I was a little worried listening to 99. I'm like, oh man, did I, have I totally misremembered how enjoyable it was to listen to these shows? i was like, no, no, I just, I hadn't gotten to 2000 yet.
00:47:12
Speaker
um I really love this version of Sullivan street is amazing.
00:47:20
Speaker
I think that is that version is spectacular with with the horns, and it's it's really, really fucking good. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I agree. I'm just looking over the set list. like I love some, I mean, i Closer to You, I think, is is is is great. I love For the Sake of the Song. i remember him asking everyone to be quiet and singing that Towns Van Zandt song and being blown away by that.
00:47:46
Speaker
um I love that he asked for quiet and gets it in that, that he's like, he's like can you be quiet. And everyone's like, okay. Yeah. I actually really like the Jewel Shear stuff that is in the show. Like I didn't know who that was.
00:47:58
Speaker
Adam brings them out. Like, again, this is like Adam supporting his friends and bringing out, you know, introducing his fans to new music. And I still to this day now will put Jewel Shear on from time to time and listen to some of these songs. Um, uh,
00:48:13
Speaker
what What does he sing? Like, The More That I'm Around You, I'm In Love With You and Restaurant Scene. And and it's performed with, um and if she knews what if she knew what she wants, which is the Bangles song, it's performed with the Continental Drifters, which are... One of whom is was in the Bangles.
00:48:29
Speaker
Right, it's true. Vicki Peterson and Susan Cowsill. I'm sorry. Oh, you're right. Vicki Peterson was in the Bangles. Susan Cowsill was not. But yeah, which is why they they do that.
00:48:41
Speaker
that Bengals cover and Jewel Shearer um was in a band with Amy Mann weirdly enough that I'm blanking on the name of that band, but I can look it up later.
00:48:56
Speaker
um Like you said, Lewis, I thought crossing a muddy waters was a highlight and and definitely seemed to influence cover up the sun. um I thought, and he just does a great job in it. So, yeah. I also, I love the story like later, ah does he say it in this recording or was it later in podcasts where they talk about going in and being, having their like choice of what to record of John Hyatt's and, and, and Emmy used to play guitar with John Hyatt on some of the albums and stuff.
00:49:23
Speaker
And so they, chose to record, um, crossing muddy waters thinking like, Oh, this is a cool song. They'll never use it. Like we'll do this cover. And then it ends up being like the title track of his album, John Hyatt's album, crossing muddy waters. And Adam's like, the trusted kar said we were digging through the demos. so Yeah. Um, the other, so a couple of other interesting, poncho and lefty is really good.
00:49:47
Speaker
Yeah. Um, and, uh, they picked, uh, the, the, uh, Is Badfinger? Not Badfinger. Yeah, Badfinger. Badtime, which I knew because Guns N' Roses used to use that as an intro to Sweet Child of Mine.
00:50:02
Speaker
Oh, cool. I was like, that's such's an interesting sort of connecting of dots of like bands I listened to a lot of bootlegs of in you know the early Yeah. um Yeah. And it also goes, goes to show you that Counting Crows could play a bad time followed by good time if they wanted to, right? They could they could do bad time into good time. Yeah. That's what I mean.
00:50:23
Speaker
I think the only other thing to talk about with this show is just again, like, like I mentioned before, like we didn't know what we were walking into. Like, I didn't know who was going to be there from the band, that it was just going to be Adam and Emmy, that it was going covers, not cut. Like all of this was a surprise for the first, you know, first time going to the show.
00:50:40
Speaker
And looking at the Counting Crows songs that they perform, and this kind of goes across all the Shim Shim shows, I'm kind of surprised that they do Mr. Jones like almost every show, which always, that's interesting. um The other one is, you know, Goodnight Elizabeth has the great line about New Orleans. So you love seeing him always sort of include that one. And I remember specifically this first one being like, oh, that's that's a sweet way to, you know,
00:51:07
Speaker
close out, not close out the show. I don't know. Do they close? Sing along is really good on that too. Like everyone, yeah it's like you can hear the crowd singing and it sounds great. think we really, that we had just seen something really cool and that that was the last song and it just felt like a very fitting weight. And again, it's an acoustic show, but it's not acoustic.
00:51:30
Speaker
It's not like a precious acoustic show. This isn't, this isn't a storytellers. This is like, It's more like a bar show. Yeah, I remember walking away from that being like, wow, we just witnessed something.
00:51:43
Speaker
something Something cool. We're still talking about it 20 years later. um Okay, let's go to a one. This one had the lowest percentage, I believe, of crows uh songs and partly because the covers they did did not end up on uh underwater sunshine so the crows so most of them some did um the crows songs catapult i'm counting <unk> la la uh horse dreamers rain king good night good night elizabeth so they have the two good nights uh long december and ballad of el gudo which i love um
00:52:16
Speaker
And the cover is a couple big stars, a couple of Ryan Adams, I think multiple Oasis, multiple Robin Hitchcock's. um Yeah. and he i mean well but By the way, another Horse Dreamers now has been in each of the three.
00:52:29
Speaker
And it got me thinking, I have a feeling that's the kind of song that they might never play again live, even if they bring back some cla some old ah rarities. I just have a feeling that's gone forever. So it was worth listening to that. ah Chris and Louis, your comments. Yeah. Well, listen, I mean, so this one...
00:52:46
Speaker
Did you kind of know it was coming? Yeah. So to set this one up, ah I know this one's coming. I'm going back. Again, I believe Lisa from Anim Begins was at this show.
00:52:59
Speaker
So clearly we probably had communicated and lined up to meet up and i was going to record. And I had a friend with another mini disc recorder. And so I came down with two mini disc recorders.
00:53:10
Speaker
And this is the one where, like again, for 2000, I asked Adam, hey, can I tape? And he's like, I'm not sure. And then later he sent word that it was okay. And then later he sent word, Hey, can I have a copy? This one was more like, i don't know, like it felt like he, like I was meant to be there to record and he was expecting me to be there to record. And, and so we lined it up and I plugged one of the, um, many disc recorders into the board.
00:53:36
Speaker
And then I sat in the balcony for this one, which was closed off to the fans. I sat in the balcony with my other recorder and the microphone. So I had two recordings going for this one.
00:53:47
Speaker
And right before the show starts, I was actually, they were, they would, their quote green room was up in this balcony. I remember as as a cool story, like again, This is the one where I had a little bit more exposure to Adam and Emmy and and and all of that. And I remember walking through their green room to so get something for recording and Adam was doing like his vocal warm ups, you know? and And so it's like, yes, these are like ramshackle bar shows, drunken covers, but like Adam is still protecting his voice, protecting his vocal cords and, you know, taking it serious. and And he was back there doing his vocal warm ups.
00:54:24
Speaker
And he comes up and he goes, hey, by the way, I'm going to be playing these two new songs. I don't want to record these. Like, let's lets let's not record these songs. I was like, okay, no problem. And I like turn around to leave and I go, wait, how am I going to know which song? Yeah.
00:54:41
Speaker
and And he's like, oh yeah, I'll tell you. and I was like, okay. um And so in this recording, he starts playing Goodnight l LA and then you hear him say, ah Lewis, turn the fucking tape recorder off.
00:54:56
Speaker
Well, in full disclosure, I'm manning the one with the microphone up in the balcony and I clicked it off like he told me to, but the one that's plugged in the board I'm not near it, like the board's down on the floor level in the back and that thing just kept recording.
00:55:14
Speaker
And i don't know where those tapes are. Oh, cause I was gonna wonder, is is the is the um the board tape, cause it sounds more like a board tape, but you don't know. i can't remember. And I wish I could give you guys, I don't remember if the board tape is the one that's in circulation or if it's the audience tape that's in circulation.
00:55:32
Speaker
Or maybe I had the microphone on a stand and I was at the board and I clicked the board off, but the microphone kept running. I don't remember. This one I was drinking. was kind of like matching Adam and drinking.
00:55:43
Speaker
I don't recall exactly what was happening, but I know one of the versions kept recording and that I then lost those tapes to Tom. But anyway, my memory is that he played Goodnight LA and I believe the other one was Black and blue, I think. Okay.
00:56:02
Speaker
Because it's definitely good night. He says good night, LA or says something. but Definitely good night, LA. And I believe it's black and blue for a millisecond. I kind of thought maybe it was carriage, but I think it's black and blue. I'm pretty sure it's black and blue.
00:56:13
Speaker
Okay. This one, I will say, in terms of the selection of covers, is but is but maybe my favorite. Actually, you know this is either number one or two, and I'll get to the second one that I think is... But this is, like, in terms of albums that apparently Adam and I have both listened to a lot.
00:56:31
Speaker
Yeah. um Definitely, maybe. And Heartbreaker. Like the fact, and this is, so I talked about this too, but I was but a very big Ryan Adams fan. So they play Winding Wheel, which is great.
00:56:42
Speaker
But he plays Come Pick Me Up and the version of Come Pick Me Up. where Adam describes why the lyrics are so heartbreaking is one of like my favorite, is one of actually my favorite Counting Crows things where Adam in the verse, because the but chorus of Come Pick Me Up, for those don't know what it is, ah Come Pick Me Up, Steal My Records, Screw All My Friends, um ah Behind My Back, We're All Full of Shit.
00:57:07
Speaker
And Adam's like, imagine what it'd be like if your girl, she went and she... She went behind your back. Oh, and she screwed your friends. Oh, and then worst of all, she stole your record records. Oh, and I'm like, that is so one of my favorite things.
00:57:23
Speaker
Absolutely. One of my absolute favorite counting gross things. I agree. I agree. And also this is around the time that, that Ryan Adams is recording gold. I believe in LA, we now know they were hanging out a bunch. Adam's a guest on that album.
00:57:37
Speaker
um They wrote Los Angeles together. Yeah. They wrote Los Angeles together, all of, you know, Adam, Ryan guest on Hard Candy. um And so, yeah, it's fitting again, like it's like you go to these shows, you don't know what they're going to play. They play these songs, you enjoy the show. And it's later that you realize, oh, this is why that was played. Oh, this is went on to become, you know, the all in ranking or whatever, you know, like it was it was almost like a glimpse into Adam's.
00:58:06
Speaker
head and world and and he was road testing some material or road testing, you know, stuff that he was working on with friends or hanging out, you know, listening to. um how and how how was Good Night LA in Black and Blue? Do you remember? it Like, were they good?
00:58:21
Speaker
They were good. i mean, they were great. I mean, there were, you know, again, they I believe they're in the middle of recording Hard Candy. So they were just sort of in their demo form. But I remember my memory is that they probably fit pretty much like the album. Those are also both, you know, pretty slow.
00:58:35
Speaker
minimal songs and piano driven songs. And so he just kind of, he had that down pat. Um, I have to say for some reason, also the Ryan Adams songs stick out the Oasis songs.
00:58:49
Speaker
I really loved, uh, outside chance by the turtles. I love that cover of it. And I believe, is it him or is it Gibbs that's like uses the British accent to intro it? I think it's Adam actually doing that.
00:59:04
Speaker
Um, I remember thinking that was cool. i'm I'm a huge Replacements fan, and I knew the Replacements at the time of this. And and when he plays Unsatisfied, I was like, oh, man, this is like this is really cool.
00:59:16
Speaker
um That's a great... job i'm I'm not as big a Replacements fan. That is... I really like... but Yeah, that was that was really... um remember that being like a big deal. um i remember 13 actually also being a big deal because like you know we now know Ballad of El Goodo, he's got the studio recording of that. But 13 is like the other big star song that is covered by so many different people, so many different versions, and and having a Counting Crows version of that song is is also very cool.
00:59:44
Speaker
Yeah. The Oasis songs we play, i Live Forever, which they obviously Adam played on piano a lot as intros to Long December, but also Cigarettes and Alcohol and Supersonic. And Supersonic is one of my probably one of my favorite Oasis songs.
00:59:56
Speaker
yeah um And weirdly, I was literally, I listened to this like two days after I saw Oasis, like a couple weeks ago. So I was like, I was very in the mood and I was like, this is cool. Tremendous.
01:00:07
Speaker
Tremendous. I remember the Robin Hitchcock Flesh No. 1 song being like really interesting. And i remember, again, this is before iTunes, and so I remember like looking for that song in like record stores or CD stores and like not being able to find it in Mississippi. I mean, imagine that. you can't find Robin Hitchcock. um You know, ah yeah again, like... think in Memphis or something, or not or or like in one of the big cities or in or Oxford or something, you could find...
01:00:36
Speaker
Yeah, totally. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And and yeah, we're in New Orleans, but yeah. yeah no not Not where I went to school at the time. But um yeah, it's a great show. um Like I said, this was the one where I've got two different recordings going. I don't know what happened to one of the tapes. This is the one where the photo, I think I said, like the photo of me with Gibbs and Adam and Emmy um backstage after the show. And again, like this was...
01:01:03
Speaker
kind of the time when Adam used to say like he hated photos of himself or he didn't like fans. And I was just like, I'm like, i need a foot I need a photo from this moment. So I still have it.
01:01:16
Speaker
And that's us backstage, I believe, after the show. um But at that point, you had already sent him the tapes from the prior.
01:01:29
Speaker
You were not just some random fan. You helped him memorialize Shim Shams. I'd like to think so. I don't know. Perhaps he would say that. I'm not sure. This is this is for for the viewers. I know this is a podcast, but for the viewers, this is Adam mixing his margarita. I think he's talked about this in interviews before where Morgan had like set up a bar because they couldn't get drinks up there because it was so crowded. So they were just like, here here's how you make a margarita. So that is Emmy.
01:01:56
Speaker
playing a song and Adam making himself a drink. I think maybe that's Gibbs might be singing during that. um also showed this photo. um This is Adam Duritz on an acoustic guitar, which I don't think anyone's ever seen before.
01:02:10
Speaker
um I don't actually think he's playing the guitar, but he is talking about how he wrote the solo in Long December and told Dan exactly how to play it. and hes And he's like doing it with his mouth while holding that guitar.
01:02:24
Speaker
In Long December on this show, i have a note that he says, he says, this is the best line I ever wrote before the all at once you look across a crowded room and see the way that light attaches to a girl, which obviously the man's written a lot of great lines.
01:02:38
Speaker
I'm not inclined to disagree with him on that one. That's a pretty good one. Yeah. By the way, check this out. I didn't even know this. ah There's another saxophone player in 2001. forgot about that. This is the saxophone player, if my memory serves me correctly, ah from gal the band Galactic.
01:02:54
Speaker
Okay. So funny enough, talking about these like late night um
01:03:02
Speaker
Jazz Fest excursions, I went down for this show ahead of time. Again, like I'd lined it up to to go and record. and and And I remember I went to New Orleans for like three or four days. I went to some shows.
01:03:15
Speaker
And it was this one night I went to, this is a pretty good story. went to see Van Morrison and BB King opened. And it was kind of an early show. It was like a 7 p.m. show.
01:03:26
Speaker
And BB King, I'm a huge Van Morrison fan. BB King was great. Van Morrison was absolutely terrible. He walked out to sound problems that he was pissed about and never could get over and couldn't get the show back on track. Whatever. I went to it.
01:03:41
Speaker
And then I'd heard of a ah show at Tipitina's late night with this band Galactic, which I was aware of Galactic. I knew they were kind of a jam band, not my style, but I think I'd heard Adam talk about them.
01:03:52
Speaker
And I was like, I'm going to go check out Galactic the night before the Shim Sham show. I go there. There are people everywhere waiting to get into the show. And um there's a band playing. they used to they They used to do these shows where they would have ah early shows, late shows, what have you. And this is at Tipitina's. And I get there and I'm like, can I get a ticket to Galactic? And they're like, no, man, this has been sold out. Like, you're not getting in.
01:04:18
Speaker
I'm like, really? Okay. I walk around the corner and there's this like loading van pulling gear out and I go up to the like lead roadie guy and I'm like, hey, um any chance I can help you like unload your gear and stuff and get into the show? Like I'm just trying to see Galactic.
01:04:36
Speaker
And he's like, he looks at me, I'm wearing like probably like button up and some, jeans or something and like Birkenstocks. And he just goes, not dressed like that. was like, I'll be back in five minutes.
01:04:46
Speaker
I run down the streets of this house I'm staying in, change clothes into like like shorts and a t-shirt. i come back and I spent the evening unloading this the gear out of this van. And as I'm unloading stuff, he looks at me and he goes, by the way, because we're like moving something quite large, like a big case or a piano or something. And he's like, don't touch the car.
01:05:05
Speaker
And he points to this Rolls Royce that's parked there. And I just go, whose car is this? Cause it was kind of like in the way. yeah and he looks at me and like rolls his eyes. And I look at the license plate and it says, Dr. John, it's like a personalized license plate. And it says, Dr. John. And suddenly I realized playing inside tip patinas is Dr. John, which is like a new Orleans legend. I mean, just, in I was like, Oh my God, i cannot believe I've been unloading this van, listening to this music. And I didn't know Dr. John was in there playing.
01:05:36
Speaker
We get done. We load up the stage. I mean, I think I even like set up like risers. to i was like on stage, like setting up gear. And at the end, they're like beer and pizza in the back. Help yourself. I go back. Galactic comes on at two in the morning. i am exhausted at this stage.
01:05:54
Speaker
The band starts playing and I'm in the balcony, like eating a pizza, having a beer. And I look down and I see Adam and his dreads and Emmy and his big ponytail. And they are like in the center of this crowd, just giving it. And I think Galactic went till five in the morning and Adam talked about it the next night at the show. He's like, we were out late last night. like, yeah, so let's.
01:06:16
Speaker
Well, thanks for that. Thanks for personal take. I had notes about the cover's.
Surprise Discoveries: Quiet Riot's Cover
01:06:20
Speaker
um but they're basically what all of you have already said about, you know, and I don't know, Ryan, Ryan Adams and, and, and Adam, ah you know, partly because the generation and everything, they're definitely and built of similar cloth or right. There's something going on that connects them.
01:06:39
Speaker
And of course with big star too. And ah I'm glad you mentioned the first, is it the first or second song, the flesh number one, Yeah, ah look I actually out of all of the songs that I was not familiar with when listening to these five ah years, that's the one that I kind of wanted to hear come back.
01:06:57
Speaker
that That's the one that I said, boy, it'd be neat if they played this again. They didn't record this one. OK, but ah so I'll embarrass myself about one thing that Adam and other music fans would think I shouldn't have a podcast.
01:07:11
Speaker
I did because um of when I grew up, I had no idea that Come On, Feel the Noise was a cover from the Slade song. that I thought Quiet Riot did the original.
01:07:24
Speaker
Because that was the first metal song I ever heard. i was six years old and someone, this guy was kind of pseudo babysitting like was babysitting me, but shouldn't have been. Like he was like nine and I was six.
01:07:34
Speaker
And he's like, listen to this. Come on, feel the noise by Quiet Riot. And I had never heard anything like it. I was six years old. but And I just assumed it sounds very glam metal-y. And I just thought, geez, this sounds like original.
01:07:46
Speaker
And then I, yeah, found out later this was- I bet that's the version Adam first heard as well. yeah So, but anyway, they're both both great. So, okay. Let's move to 02. Before, it should be very yeah please please should mention the Goodnight Elizabeth here. yeah Both has a bunch of horn, which is really beautiful, and a Thunder Rodalt, which is also, so that that one, if you're Goodnight Elizabeth fan, that would be one I would grow to. Because the horn on Elizabeth is heartbreakingly beautiful.
01:08:13
Speaker
Thank you. Chris, he does a Live Forever intro, something along December. He does that still? so No, I've heard that before though, right? He did it a bunch around this time. He did Live Forever as an intro along December.
01:08:25
Speaker
You've had me listen to so many old catalog live shows that they're all blending together. um Okay, great. No, thank you. So now you've got O2, which is very
Cover Recordings during 'Hard Candy' Era
01:08:36
Speaker
interesting. This would have been Lewis's ah last of his trilogy. And I would say the thing that um sticks out the most here is that almost all of the covers um either got recorded during that hard candy time or for Underwater Sunshine or both. Some of these got recorded for both. So I have that out of the 20 or whatever, that 80% of them, you know you'll recognize. Blues Run the Game, Yellow Taxi, Start Again, Have You Seen Me Lately Acoustic,
01:09:04
Speaker
Four White Stallions, Anna Begin Acoustic, Someday I Will Treat You Good, You Ain't Going Nowhere, Amy, it Richard Manuel, Carriage, Mercy, Wise Blood, ah Rain King, Grievous Angel, and Ooh La La.
01:09:18
Speaker
Yeah, there's only three songs in here that we don't have studio versions of. no Yeah. At the point of my notes, there's just notes just like, oh, they're playing the covers album. Yeah. yeah Because for those, and and there we talked, I think, a little bit about this with ah Hard Candy when we were talking about that album.
01:09:34
Speaker
You know, they recorded a lot of covers around this time. They ended up, most of them, they were thinking about doing a covers album. They decided not to do that. Most of them ended up being B-sides to the various UK singles and things like that. And again, a lot of them ended up being recorded for... um Underwater Sunshine.
01:09:52
Speaker
um and And weirdly then, it's like, this is the most normal of the shows. ah With Lewis, was it like but was it actually like the whole band, like the entire group, or was it a subset? or so So to set this show up, this one's just so different because the whole band is in town to play Jazz Fest at the
Challenges in Recording Shows
01:10:10
Speaker
fairgrounds.
01:10:10
Speaker
I went to it. it was a great, you know, fun show, good show. um It just... Even though it's a Devil and the Bunny Shim Sham show, it's the full band with their with their crew and their manager Tom is there.
01:10:24
Speaker
It was a Counting Crows show and it felt like a Counting Crows production. And, you know, these guys have a job to do. These guys that work for the band have a job to do. And it just... I just remember this being a very stressful night recording. I was having technical difficulties. I believe in this recording, don't some of the, some of these songs like cut out, like, I don't know.
01:10:46
Speaker
Yeah, it was like, um was plugged into the board and something because of there being so many you know band members and instruments on stage, there was some kind of like something in the feed that was causing my mini disc recorder to shut off.
01:11:00
Speaker
um And I just remember being very stressed out. I remember, again, I remember their manager, Tom, and and and some of their roadie members being very nice, very nice.
01:11:11
Speaker
But they have a job. Their job is to protect the band, make sure the band is set up, taken care of, gears not stolen. Like, there's a lot going on. And this just felt like a very different night than the previous two nights of Shim Sham.
01:11:28
Speaker
Yeah. It also sounds like it's a really small club again for like, I mean, it's a seven-piece band. You know, anytime I've seen them be in like truly tiny clubs, it's been a subset of the band. So it feels...
Notable Covers: Sparklehorse and Others
01:11:40
Speaker
Yeah. And they had a piano clearly at this club, but like they brought in you know, Charlie's Hammond organ and like they brought in probably, you know, a handful of Emmys guitar. Like it wasn't just any carrying his acoustic in like there were, there were a lot of, or dance guitars. Like there were a lot of guitars. Like it was a lot of stuff.
01:11:58
Speaker
There was a lot of moving parts to this night. And yeah, like they were clearly recording ah covers album at the time. And so they had these songs.
01:12:10
Speaker
sort of in the, in, in, in their making of it. Um, and they were just road testing them. Um, and it was fun. it was great. And like, I mean, I think the song for me that really stands out here is the sparkle horse song.
01:12:22
Speaker
I love sparkle horse. I loved them at the time. I knew that song. Um, and I remember hearing them cover that. I, I, then there is a studio b side of that available out online. That is, I think just one of Adam's best covers. Um,
01:12:39
Speaker
I remember really loving that. I'm trying to think what else. One thing that stood out to me, Chris and Lewis, is that that the version of Big Yellow Taxi, which, of course, this was way before the single or even the recording, the hip hoppy recording of it.
01:12:59
Speaker
ah without Vanessa Carlton, is that it sounds like they play it now. So it seems like the actual original, like I i always thought that they, because he had talked about how he wanted it to but have like a hip hop beat.
01:13:11
Speaker
So I always assumed that that was the original. They did that right away. And then they decided to do this acoustic version later. And the only thing kind of missing, oh no, was Matt Malley at this one, Louis? Yeah, he was, would he have been there?
01:13:23
Speaker
ah think. i Yeah. Yeah. yes Yeah. It didn't have Matt's base who that he brought that in a lot later. I mean, you know, I don't think it had the base solo if I remember correctly, but, uh, but anyway, that, that kind of, um, and it didn't have the maracas, right? that that That price in place.
01:13:38
Speaker
But, um, Hey, the, the, is this the first one of the, of the shows that had Anna begins with Andre Carter?
Unique Performances: 'Anna Begins' with Trumpet
01:13:45
Speaker
Cause that was a joke. Yes. That was great. That was, yeah.
01:13:48
Speaker
And he's like a little messy, but very cool. Yeah. I, one of the other kind of crows, uh, There's only, me make sure I'm correct on this. I believe there's only ah two other tapes. No, that's not correct. There's four other tapes.
01:14:02
Speaker
There's four other tapes in circulation that I recorded outside of Jim Sham. And one of them was at my college in Starkville from October 25th, 2000. And Curtis Watson comes out and plays trumpet in that show as well on Anna Begins, which is really great. The other three shows just yeah that I recorded was, I did the Atlanta, Georgia Tabernacle show in 99.
01:14:24
Speaker
And I did the two New Orleans House of Blues shows in 2001. Oh, which we talked about. We actually talked about those on an episode of the podcast because um Jeff Harkness, who wrote ah the book Rain King, was at those shows. he We were like, hey, what do you want to talk about? And you Jeff was like, oh, I went to these two really interesting shows in 2001 at the House of Blues.
01:14:46
Speaker
And so we have yeah deep down. Those are terrific. Yeah, those are mine as well. Awesome. Yeah.
Personal Stories Behind Songs
01:14:52
Speaker
The only other comment I had, yeah, thank you for letting me know about that, that, that the the trumpet comes in a couple other live recordings. to begins The only comment I had had to do with carriage.
01:15:02
Speaker
Not that, and first of all, i just thought it was very good. And i I do like that song, even though i had it lower in my hard candy rankings. But there was two things that stood out to me. One was the, um you know, he shared about the, which I was like, oh, I wonder if he's going to talk about the personal story. And he did.
01:15:17
Speaker
And one thing is he kind of had a I mean, for something as serious as this, he kind of had a funny one-liner at the end, which was talking about, which I had never thought about yet, the woman who was an ex-girlfriend. And and it i think he also, I'm just kind gossiping, but he admitted that this situation happened after they broke up.
01:15:36
Speaker
Like they broke up and they got kind of back together, as he says, as happens sometimes when you're used to each other, you know, physically or whatever, you might get back together a couple of times. And that's when the, situation you know, happened in miscarriage.
01:15:48
Speaker
And he said something like something about how things could mean different things. And he ended with, I think I mean something completely terrible to her now. So that was kind of interesting line because it's not like the miscarriage would be his fault or anything.
01:16:01
Speaker
um But, you know, it's so weird. i don't want to get too deep, but it all a sudden it hit me and We didn't talk about this during Hard Candy. You know, he's gone on record about, you know, choosing not to be a father and for different reasons. Part of it, he was maybe worried about his mental health or passing down mental, where he, but by this, could have very easily been a father. and And you wonder how that would have changed, just because, you know, it's almost like the sliding doors moment.
01:16:25
Speaker
How would that have changed his career, his everything, his look on life? We we never know. And it's so, life is very fickle, right? And very, yeah.
Counting Crows' Cover Staple: 'Blues Run the Game'
01:16:34
Speaker
So anyway, I thought that was kind of deep, but it hit me there more than other times I've heard him talk about that.
01:16:39
Speaker
So, okay. The other couple things I'll just pull out here. I'm with you. Carriage. I thought the Carriage was really great. um and And it begins. It's a really good Rain King with a round here alt.
01:16:50
Speaker
um So if you're into that... um And again, yeah, this is one it's, uh, Oh, and and this has a much, a really nice version of blue eyes crying in the rain too. If if you like that, this is a a better recording than the, uh, the 99 one. But yeah, this one, this one feels weird listening back you. I'm sure I really loved it originally. Cause again, all this stuff wasn't really out now, but like listening back to it, I was just kind of like, I, it's less surprising as a re-listen. We've heard it.
01:17:16
Speaker
You've now heard it. I mean, I remember the time being like, this is so cool that I'm hearing bunch of covers full ban. um But again, it was just my recording was messing up and my memory, my personal just sort of experience with this show was one that was pretty stressful.
01:17:31
Speaker
um I will say starting the show with Blues Run the Game, i remember really liking that and not knowing that song at the time. and And at the time thinking, oh, this is like another one of those acoustic songs that they'll do for Shim Sham and then you'll never hear again.
01:17:47
Speaker
and instead it became like such a staple in the Counting Crows, you know, live show. um And it's funny you said that because when I just saw them play that at the casino, it's, you're so bright.
01:18:01
Speaker
And every time they do it though, 99% of the audience thinks it's a complete rarity. Yeah. Right. Because it's not a single, it's not on the, well, is Blue Sunder on the game on Underwood or something? I know it was, I think it was recorded with the hard candy stuff.
01:18:17
Speaker
I think it's a B-side to one of those hard candy singles. um Yeah, but anyway, i just laugh about that, Lewis, because you're right. like they They have perfected it so you know well now, and I almost thought Emmy plays it better than ever. but I agree. Emmy really gives it these days. like He's changed it so much.
01:18:34
Speaker
But at the time, I just thought, oh, this is another Shim Sham kind of rarity. and Anyway, cool how that kind of stuff goes
2003 Shim Sham Show Overview
01:18:40
Speaker
on. All right, so that leads us to the final Shim Sham show, which was 2003.
01:18:50
Speaker
Yeah, and this, I think, this is one of them, right, that they had, you know, where Adam took a seat for some of the songs, right? I know that happened on a couple shows. um This seemed to be about 50-50 of Crow songs and covers. I'll just, again, quickly mention the Crow songs, Catapult, Goodnight Elizabeth, New Frontier, which I'll say right now I thought was a highlight.
01:19:09
Speaker
up Even though he didn't sing it, I'm mentioning Barely Out of Tuesday because that is arow song a Friend of the Devil, ah which I don't know if that was one of the first debuts of this. I'm not sure.
01:19:20
Speaker
I think it would have been. Yeah. Yeah. Good night, LA. Long December again, which again, Lewis, I'm with you. I'm almost surprised they play any hits at all during these shows. ah good Good time, Amy, Rain King, Blues are in the game again.
01:19:32
Speaker
Girl from North Country and ending with Sullivan Street is a nice tribute to us 20 years before we started. So, um, uh, so, uh, comments, uh, then the, the, the covers are kind of all over the place. I, I, yeah, also there's a wild group of covers, there's two Madonna ones, right. And then, I really love Adam singing Madonna songs.
01:19:53
Speaker
And I, I really like both of these songs too. If I'm picking Madonna songs, borderline and crazy for you, I think are both great. I think, I think I like probably like the Madonna version of crazy for you better than borderline, but man, it's so weird. But Adam like crushes both of them.
01:20:07
Speaker
Yeah. Um, This one's got like just all... Doesn't it call back to like when people are like, oh, I'm surprised he's playing Taylor Swift. And the first thing I thought of is he played Madonna. And actually, at least the one kind of sounds like a cruise. I mean, I know part of the, because the piano, but the lyrics sound very Adam for the one, I think.
01:20:24
Speaker
And where these lyrics don't necessarily sound Adam, but you know, they're pop, good, well-crafted pop songs that he covered. Yeah. Yeah. I think, I mean, Charlie is definitely on piano on this.
01:20:36
Speaker
Um, I don't know if it's like the how much of the band is on it, but it's definitely Charlie.
Adam's Pop Interpretations: Madonna Covers
01:20:41
Speaker
And it's funny because I was, you know, you're big, Eric, a big Charlie fan. Yes. And I was just hitting me. It's like, oh, the piano is really And was like, this has got to be Charlie, right? and then Adam goes like, play something, Charlie. And I'm like, oh, okay. Like that's how like definitive like Charlie is to the sound is you can just hear someone playing piano on on covers and you're like, oh, that's got to be Charlie.
01:21:02
Speaker
Oh yeah. And even, I did not know that O2 was the whole band when I was listening quickly first time. And when I heard, have you seen me lately? I go, whoever's playing the piano there is incredible. they enable to know the song i will this about O3. I was not there. And I remember later either seeing the set list or getting a recording of this and being like, well, fuck, that's not, that wasn't the 2002 show. This is like 50 songs, three hours. I'm like, God damn it. wasn't there. Like I was being, i was pissed that I missed this one. Um,
01:21:31
Speaker
It's pretty good. i mean, i kind of love, ah I really love the America cover. um And I really love the Bob Seger cover. Like, I'm kind of a sucker for Adam's love of like, California 70s, like, like, top radio music and and I think that but including both of those is really awesome on this show. it Speaking of that, of California 70s Top 40, their version of These Days by Jackson Brown is yeah
01:22:04
Speaker
Beautiful. I love that song. um There's a really crazy, if you've ever, there's a Bob Saget tribute thing on Netflix where he does that song with John Mayer and it's it's amazing. But this, Adam really crushes that song. and I was like, I had forgotten because I had, I heard, I'm sure I heard that song and I just hadn't thought about it and I've become a fan of that song since then. And I was like, oh man, this is really beautiful.
01:22:26
Speaker
I remember hearing Better Things by the Kinks and knowing Like I was a fan of the kinks. I know the kinks. Somehow I didn't know that song. And I'm like, God, this is like the best kink song.
01:22:38
Speaker
And there's a lot of good kink songs. And i was like, oh, they, of course, leave it to these guys to like find the best one, you know? so So it's worth, mean, this is the one I maybe have the most unique notes. Not that I have that many, but I guess we have to go back to barely out of Tuesday because this is a song that they played.
01:22:55
Speaker
i don't even, I have to look back. I'm guessing like 10 times or something in their life, right? Yeah. Yeah, and and if he did and if they ever did it, it's like a couple of full ones, and then it's it's a around here all a bunch that year. Yeah, and, and you know, co-written, I guess, The Legend is by Courtney Cox, right? and and about so So he refuses to play it either because he doesn't think it's good enough or because Courtney was involved or both. and then But then he allows...
01:23:25
Speaker
the song to be covered by somebody else while he's there. Right. Cause Dave and we written though, cause Gibbs rewrites it. i mean, it's not, okay. It's not the, it's the same song.
01:23:36
Speaker
Like, melodically, but the, ly a bunch of the lyrics are different. I see. Um, gives talk in this show. He like mentions Courtney Cox by name. Doesn't he say he's like, we fix Adam won't play this song, but I'll play it. Like he says something like that. Doesn't he? I mean, it's legendary. It's crazy. That's, but I couldn't, you know, I, maybe there's a tape I had. I didn't hear him say, and I know he said there's something where he talked about that, where he, he tells that whole story of like, yeah, basically like Adam won't play this song. So he lets me do it because I really like it. And just, know, um, yeah, yeah.
Rare Songs: 'Barely Out of Tuesday'
01:24:07
Speaker
This is good on Adam for, you know, yeah. Pass it on. Oh, yeah. I thought that was that that that was so cool. and yeah I mean, it almost sums up the legendariness of the Shim Sham Shows, I thought, you know, that particular ah song. i um I thought a treat, because I actually kind of like the song and I like this version, was the acoustic New Frontier. um And it reminded me of the acoustic American Girls, which, because I said this... And it also reminds me, partly because they don't have the...
01:24:38
Speaker
I don't know, the reach that they did in the 90s that they don't reinterpret because they don't play enough of their regular versions of the newer songs, let alone reinterpret them. um But it got me thinking that so many of their songs could be, they have such the skill to reinterpret them and, and,
01:24:55
Speaker
Yeah. So anyway, i thought New Frontier was great with the piano. And as you said, it was Charlie. In terms of versions ah of of songs, this version of Good Time, you know ah how I feel about Good Time, Eric. This swingy version of this is by far the best version of that song I've ever heard.
01:25:10
Speaker
And I'm like, they should bust that arrangement out. But I'm with you. that Just more playing more. Also, they do O Susanna, basically, acapella. Well, I was going to say, I mean, basically, this is the the advent of ah that song, right? And has not gone anywhere in terms of alts over the years for kind of crows. And it's such a New Orleans, Alabama, New Orleans, you know, Southern folk song.
01:25:36
Speaker
um And this is kind of where he first bust that out. Although I have heard him say a podcast before that, the reason why he knows this song or sings this song is that one time he was like maybe after a ah gig or something in Ireland and they ended up at one of those Irish bars where everyone's kind of like round round table singing songs.
01:25:56
Speaker
And maybe he wasn't with any of his band members or something. And they wanted him to sing a song, but he didn't have any accompaniment of a instrument. And so he decided that was the only song he could sing off the top of his head, acapella.
01:26:10
Speaker
And that's, why that is a song that he sings. I'm not sure I've heard that story. That's awesome. That's interesting. yeah this was This was a fun show. I thought Friday I'm in Love was just fun. As you said, Night Moves, which is not one of my favorite songs. the bob sea river I like it, but I just thought Adam's... It was just great. I just enjoyed listening to this. I'm with you there.
01:26:30
Speaker
Here Comes Your Man. Was that one of them too? i thought that was so that was fun. that um And even... ah yeah they go so but You know what? One thing that's kind of interesting when we talked about the covers in Underwater Sunshine is that the two Two of the covers on here, Borderline and Girl girl from North Country, are only released as iTunes exclusive. So it's ah for Underwater. So they were recorded for Underwater Sunshine. The reason I know is because I love their version of Girl from North Country.
01:27:04
Speaker
i Weren't the iTunes versions live? or am i if if it's If the borderline is live, it's definitely... there's a They played this once or twice as a full band. and i think they Because I recall they put up a version of it on, I think, CountingCrows.com or something.
Praised Covers: 'Girl from North Country'
01:27:21
Speaker
But I think that was from... I want to say they played it in London that year, like a month later or something like that. Like once. Again, just total rarities. You might be right about The Girl from North Country. a Borderline, I don't think is. I'd have to re-listen to both. I think you're right. i mean I also have to say that, like again, I give Adam and Emmy credit here.
01:27:38
Speaker
i mean, their interpretation of Girl from North Country, I think, is just really interesting. It's not a straightforward cover. um And the way that Adam... I mean, sorry, that Emmy... you know, interprets that, that guitar bit is, is really great.
01:27:53
Speaker
Yeah. The only thing shame is that like, I think, well, border, you know what, both of those songs should have been on the underwater sunshine. Oh yeah. Borderline because it's a Madonna song and it would stick out compared to the other selections they chose and girl from North country.
01:28:07
Speaker
i think you could have made the case that that would have been the best song on the album possibly. So I don't know why they left it out. I really love the way Adam works with the melody of borderline. I think it's so, I, he's ah mean, again, I think,
01:28:18
Speaker
not ah Not an unpopular opinion in this group to say Adam is sort of a genius as a singer, but that one in particular is is great. A couple of like stray things from this one. During Goodnight Elizabeth, he sings, I was wasted in the evening. He's like, and that's the truth.
01:28:32
Speaker
yeah Which is great. um And there's an amazing, some amazing Andre Carter trumpet on Goodnight LA. Also, for you Springsteen fans, um they do a bit of Sandy in Sullivan Street, which is really kind of cool.
01:28:50
Speaker
hu Oh, that's what I was going actually ask about that. I had that as a question for you. I didn't... It's a Bruce Springsteen column called Sandy slash... It's like parentheses, 4th of July, Esbury Park or something like that. Yeah, which is like a 14-minute song. So like, good on Adam for just cutting it down. Cutting it down. Yeah, it worked. His version, the cut-down version.
01:29:10
Speaker
This is... Yeah, this one is just one of those ones where it's it's like all over the place, but there's so much... This is a really interesting show. There's a lot of interesting stuff. in The cure Friday. I'm in love. Like that.
01:29:21
Speaker
So cool. It's fun. Yeah. I, that, you know, and, and, you know, the one thing I think about that song is out of all these, um, I don't, cause I don't think he did. I think Adam should have recorded that when he did his Valentine's solo album.
01:29:36
Speaker
Like i was like, Oh, Friday, I'm in love for us for, come on. It was so good. And it was, you know, it gives us with loves and Valentine's because what's it called? My my bloody Valentine, right? My bloody Valentine's. Yeah.
01:29:46
Speaker
um The only other thing to help the fans, because I had to remember because I'm out of it and and I wasn't as hardcore back at this time that Dave Gibbs, David Gibbs, I guess it goes that way, lead singer of the Gigolo Ants and who was and they were signed to Adams label at one point. Right. I don't think for their entire career.
01:30:06
Speaker
But least one of the one at least one of the albums came out on it. Yeah. ah Ipilobor's Unum. Yeah. And I think they might have had... Did they have other connections besides... Like, I know they toured together, right? I didn't know. I think he lived at Adam's house. I think that one of the other...
01:30:23
Speaker
and walk and and And Freeloaders. So Gibbs, I think, is that one of the co-writers of that movie um because it's basically his story. ah And then there's some stray – I think it's 2008. When we get to those that year, we should probably cover this show.
01:30:38
Speaker
But there's a really ah interesting Adam with Dave Gibbs and one other guy.
Collaborations with Dave Gibbs
01:30:42
Speaker
Chris Stills, maybe? i don't – so But like we' just Baltimore, where it's the one of the few shows ever that's billed as like Adam Duritz and Friends.
01:30:51
Speaker
um And that is a fascinating show as well that will. It's very like ah Shim Sham adjacent. Like it's basically a Shim Sham show. Right. it's It's a version. Yeah, a version of that. I think he popped up with Gibbs once or twice, like at Gibbs's shows, too. Like there's a couple of.
01:31:05
Speaker
Well, they also had that band Low Stars and Adam Guesthouse. There's video recordings of Low Stars, which was Gibbs and the other guy from that show. I believe you're right. Chris Stills and Adam guest on it.
01:31:19
Speaker
Yeah. so seefreed Chris Seyfried. Yeah. That's what it is. Yeah. Okay. Chris Stills is a person as well. It's the, it's the son of Stephen Stills, but. that's right um It's so weird. Again, um and something I said in the first minute, which was that, you know, when you're you know,
01:31:38
Speaker
um write how time moves different. When say, yeah, I'm talking about being a little kid. I'm talking about in and 30s that like, you know, you'll be like, oh, that was three years ago. Now you're like, oh, three years ago just happened. Like, no, it didn't. Or four years ago just happened. your kid was in middle school. And now they're, you know, almost going to college.
01:31:55
Speaker
And I say that because, um, even though it seemed like I missed it by a mile that, you know, as I said, the Shim Sham was what? 99.03. then I was able to go in 04, but they had stopped doing them.
01:32:08
Speaker
And then the very next year Katrina hit. So you don't know how that would have affected or if that would have, you know, that happened to 5. And even though it was years later, I think that even about some of the crows in, you know, across the wire that September 11th was just four years after they recorded that.
01:32:25
Speaker
um And that might seem, well, was four big years, but, you know, four years is pretty, pretty short.
Impact of Tape Trading Culture
01:32:31
Speaker
so um yeah anyway i'll play this funny side note as well about these shows and about this time period with counting crows you know i i i go down and start recording the 2001 2001 2002 i graduated from college 2002. um i'm now sort of like weirdly associated at least like with my friends as a kind of crows guy like i've just recorded them in new orleans and i listen to them and they're like you know we listen a lot of my friends listen to a lot of other music i mean
01:32:59
Speaker
in the nineties, like bands like pavement and, and, and, uh, dinosaur junior and stuff like that. Anyway, I was the counting crows guy and I was starting to sort of spread my wings musically and like listen to other stuff. And again, i give these shows a lot of credit to that. Like I really wanted to discover new music and leave college and I'm thinking about where to move to.
01:33:18
Speaker
And a friend of mine's like, Hey, why don't you come check out New York? And I'm like, all right. So I go up to New York and Oh two. And the week I'm there, it gets announced that kind of crows are going to be playing at Battery Park and at Irving Plaza. And I think also maybe like the the morning show, one of those morning shows or whatever they are.
01:33:36
Speaker
So I go to the Battery Park. It's like a day free show. I go down by myself and I'm like thinking about like, I think I'm going to move to New York. And I'm standing there at Battery Park watching the show. And after like the third song, Adam's like, so I'm moving in New York.
01:33:52
Speaker
And the whole crowd goes crazy. And I'm just in the back and I'm like, damn it All my friends are going to think, yeah, anyway. And I'm like, I'm moving to New York.
01:34:03
Speaker
You're still my thunder, man. Anyway. um Oh, Lewis, I mentioned it, I think on the very first podcast, but that that that I'll never forget to this day, especially because I'm doing a podcast about them, that he had met, you know, he was hanging out with college students after one of the shows. And that one, I actually went and gosh, I might've been only standing like four spots away from him. And there was just like 10 people talking to him.
01:34:25
Speaker
And I guess I was, I didn't know what to say. i mean, I asked him one thing about the show, but you know, he was mainly focusing on other people. And then i was like, what can I say that could be interesting? You know, you're you're racing through real quick and like, Oh, I know they're moving. He just moved to New York and none of these other people know that they're just casual.
01:34:41
Speaker
So that's when I said like, Oh, I heard, I guess you're officially in New York now. And he just looked at me and like rolled his eyes and said, I'm not officially anything. ah Don't label me, man. Yeah. I've met Adam ah handful of times since the Shim Sham shows. I've, I've, I've seen at his underwater sunshine festival at Bowery electric and,
01:35:00
Speaker
Like I said, I was at this McKittrick Hotel show and the whole van was there afterwards. Like it's the smallest show I've ever seen. i don't have mean I don't know what to say to the guy. Like it I sound like him talking about Springsteen. It's not that like, i mean, I am a big fan, but I'm not like taken by Adam in a way. I just don't, like I have gone up to him and I've been like, yeah hey, I'm Louis. I'm the guy from the Sham Sham shows. And he's like, oh yeah, you look familiar. I thought so. And he's like, how you doing? I'm like, I'm good.
01:35:27
Speaker
and then we're both kind of like, Have a great night. da Like looking forward to the show. Like, I don't, I don't know. There's just
Lewis' Journey into Fandom
01:35:34
Speaker
nothing. And, you know, you see him in his later career, like really taking fans and, and, and other musicians and people under his wings and putting them out on the road with him. And I think it's, I just think it's wonderful and great, but I'm ah always just kind of like,
01:35:50
Speaker
I got nothing to say to this guy. Which makes sense, right? It's like if some yeah random people person came to your work, they might say, oh, I recognize you from this. But one thing, i guess we can sort of end like this. ah It sounds like the Shim Sham kind of drove you into being a super fan in a way.
01:36:07
Speaker
What was that? had One thing we didn't ask you, which we've asked everybody else, how did you originally get into the Crows? um you know When did you start to like them? Yeah. I mean, listen, it was in the nineties. It was August and everything after, again, I was a huge music fan even back then. And I listened to, again, when you're growing up in Mississippi before the internet, to me, all this stuff just was the same. like I could listen, I could go from dinosaur junior to the County crows to, we used to listen to like math rock bands, like Don Cavallaro and, and, and these other bands kind of like that.
01:36:40
Speaker
To me, it was all the same. It wasn't until later when I went to college that things started getting placed in like the acoustic rock or the college rock or the, Back then, I mean, I was a big Grantley Buffalo fan. Like we were big fans of that band, obviously REM, stuff like that.
01:36:55
Speaker
And I, ah I'm sure it was like probably the Mr. Jones music video. And I remember being like, that's good. But then I got into tape trading and really my fandom of Counting Crows was some of those early sort of 94 tapes.
01:37:12
Speaker
I remember specifically like 94. They're just being like a lot of cassette tapes that I, I mean, i used to do like, I'm date myself, but like BNPs, like where you would send out the boring tape and post return postage. Like I used to do all that stuff with County Crows. And um there's this one show from 94. I have to look it up.
01:37:31
Speaker
I remember specifically as a child, like being like 14 and having this May show. 94 show from l LA and in like half the show or more than half the show is like very acoustic and very slow. think it was, yeah, May 22nd, May 94.
01:37:50
Speaker
That was like an early, early bootleg that I had of theirs. And I was like, I like this band. Um, there's a great ranking in there. he does in Mr. Jones, he says, I want to be Peter Stewart. Like it's that time period. And that's kind of that some of those early tapes was really where I became a pretty big fan.
01:38:10
Speaker
Well, Lewis, thank you for your, and I, I, you know, i was trying to find the original, I have 20 emails from you. i think you first wrote me, you know, cause we were set this up. I think you first wrote me about a year and a half ago. I'm glad we could get you on. And I, for some reason, I can't, well, I can't find the original you sent me, but I am pretty sure unless, you know, I'm busy and missed it or something.
01:38:30
Speaker
that you explained you know a bit, oh, I went to three of the shows. I'm a big fan. You guys should talk about this, which we all agreed with. I don't think you told me in that original email that, by the way, if you've listened to Shim Sham, that's me.
01:38:41
Speaker
um but I was the one that recorded it because I'm telling you, because Chris, I even sent you one. I mean, I know because I wasn't into the trading. I've talked about that a number of times, but there's a lot of people that had those CDs based upon your recording. So thousands, I got to imagine.
01:38:57
Speaker
I'm glad they're out there and I'm glad Adam, you know, okayed it in 2000. Yeah. Well, it's a real, it's a real contribution to the, like the history of the band. We get to, again, we get to do this 20 years later because you tape the shows. Otherwise it would just be some weird stories and we would not have had nearly as fun ah hour and a half talking about this.
01:39:16
Speaker
I agree. And I, again, like I think tape trading, I'm a big proponent of it as a way of spreading music and and learning about music. And again, Adam's just done such a great job throughout his career,
01:39:27
Speaker
promoting all kinds of different types of music. And and so again, him playing these shows and allowing them to be taped is just more part of his personality and what he gives to his family. And he was, we haven't really talked about that but that much, but he was famous for that back then, right? Because I would even read articles that weren't written for Crows fans and they would kind of say, oh, you know, Cannon Crows are one of the few bands that are like, okay, record and trade tapes and whatever you want to do.
01:39:53
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah, there were therere a handful. There were a bunch of them. And I think some sometimes that's why they get lumped in with some of those bands from the 90s, even though they don't play together or they don't really cross paths. um Obviously, Dave Matthews being like one of the ones you hear them yeah to talk about.
01:40:07
Speaker
But like Ken and Chris and Dave Matthews have never... intersected Other than they were just bands of the 90s and they both, yeah, allowed tape trading and that kind of thing. um No, I mentioned that because I said that, yeah, what they have in common is that you had a very good chance of hearing both of their songs at some, you know, outdoor frat party. But but besides in the 90s, but besides that, they didn't, they never really crossed paths too much.
01:40:28
Speaker
Okay. All right. Well, I guess that's, ah is that a wrap up, Chris? I think we are. Yeah, I think we get but think we covered it. Go listen to the shows. Almost two hours. Thank you guys for having me on, by the way. And thank you guys for taking the time to create this fan podcast of the band.
01:40:41
Speaker
It's great to listen to and for and and some of your exposure to your different guests and stuff. It's great as a fan to listen to. So thank you guys. No, thank you. And if if any of you out there have a ah right i have the the show idea, which Liz did, we were going to cover it sometime, but you know I think it sped up the process. So you can contact us at Sullivan Street PC. That's ah written out Sullivan Street, S-T-R-E-E-T, PC for podcast at ProtonMail.com. And besides that, thank you for listening and see you next episode down here Sullivan Street.
01:41:27
Speaker
I'm just