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056 - Pivotal Sports Performance w/ Pat Nolan
99 Plays7 days ago
Performance coach Pat Nolan is building something different in Parker, Colorado. From training NFL combine prospects to developing high school leaders, Pat's approach challenges conventional wisdom about athletic development and youth sports.
We explore his strong stance against sports specialization, sharing why college coaches now avoid over-showcased youth players and how Trevor Baptiste played three sports before dominating professional lacrosse. Pat discusses using productive "trash talk" to build mental toughness and teaches a simple filter for handling criticism.
From scaling his team of coaches to creating accountability systems, Pat reveals his vision for making Pivotal Performance the "third home" for every athlete and transforming his entire community through athletic development.
Training - Old Bull Program - 7 Day Free Trial - https://bit.ly/old-bull-train
Education - Why They're Not Listening: Coaching the Modern Athlete - http://listen.captainsandcoaches.com
#SportsPerformance #YouthAthletics #LeadershipDevelopment #SportsSpecialization #LacrosseTraining #AthleteCoaching #MultiSportAthlete #MentalToughness #HighSchoolSports #PLL #NFLCombine
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Transcript
00:00:00
Speaker
toleration is the number one excellence killer oh yeah um so if you're tolerating something you know if like that coach is coaching like a way that we don't want or you know coming in a certain way or things like that and i just tolerate it or even for one half one coach not the other coach if i'm treating differently or something that's just gonna keep going and get worse and worse and then you know that excellence that quality piece drops.
Exploring Leadership in Athletics
00:00:26
Speaker
Welcome to the Captains and Coaches podcast where explore the art and science of leadership through the lens of athletics and beyond. I'm your host Tex Wokokan and today we're in Parker, Colorado at the intersection of performance training and character development.
Guest Introduction: Patrick Nolan
00:00:39
Speaker
I sit down with Patrick Nolan, founder of Pivotal Performance, who's building something revolutionary in his community.
From Athlete to Coach: Pat Nolan's Journey
00:00:47
Speaker
Pat's journey from multi-sport athlete to performance coach reveals powerful insights about developing courage in young leaders the hidden dangers of sports specialization, and why the best training happens when athletes from all different sports train together.
The 5 E's of Leadership: Building Confidence
00:01:03
Speaker
We'll uncover his five E's of leadership, discover why he believes toleration is the number one excellence killer, and learn how trash talk can actually build unshakable confidence.
00:01:14
Speaker
Whether you're coaching high schoolers or professional athletes, Pat's approach to creating transformative training environments will challenge how you think about developing human potential. Now, let's throw it out to Pat to help us raise the
Pat's Sports Background and Transition to Coaching
00:01:29
Speaker
game. Ready, ready, and great. Coach, how are we doing today?
00:01:32
Speaker
I'm great. Thanks for having me, Tex. Yeah, man, a blind reach out. So I'm um fortunate for that. That's how this world works, and this community is just so open. And networking, i understand, is... is big part of what you do well.
00:01:44
Speaker
So, ah lacrosse, that's how I found you, but you didn't start as a lacrosse guy. You fell into this. Yep. So your background, football, baseball, hockey. Yeah.
00:01:58
Speaker
From the north. And I mean, that, that is Colorado to me. Those, those big sports right there. So and now lacrosse. Yeah. Now I wish, I mean, going back, I, Take me back to freshman year in high school. I'm playing lacrosse. Yeah. Did your school have it?
00:02:12
Speaker
They did. Yeah. Oh, all right. But playing baseball, you know, from T-ball whatever on, it was just like, that was, that was my jam back then.
00:02:24
Speaker
And, but yeah.
Youth Sports Observations and Mentorship
00:02:27
Speaker
yeah the youth sport is different the sport is different youth lacrosse is probably my favorite just with the little kids with his giant helmet yeah yeah it's like darth darth helmet from space balls running around out there with a stick it's same with pop warner football it's just hilarious i call it bobblehead football that's a good way to put it yeah um So your introduction to performance came from your athletic career when you found a coach. I heard an interesting story on the Outside the Crease podcast, NSCA SIG for lacrosse, shout out, where you we've asked for speed lessons instead of video games or any other normal boy stuff.
00:03:02
Speaker
Yeah, that was, and you could find me outside and outside only. I was never, i hated being trapped inside. um And I had a passion for sports of just I was a geek when it came to that and I loved movement. I mean, I wasn't the fastest kid, but I was on the faster side, I'd say.
00:03:20
Speaker
um But I wanted to be the fastest, just my competitive nature. And when my mom asked me, like, what video games you want or something, thinking that was like a normal gift to get your kid. i was like speed training lessons.
00:03:32
Speaker
um And I was very lucky enough to have some of the best speed coaches in my area at the
Mentorship's Impact on Coaching Philosophy
00:03:38
Speaker
time. um Tommy Christian from TC Boost. And then he passed me on because he was actually having a kid at that time to Michael Drock, who's, you know, all over Instagram and social media these days. And before there was a facility, everything, we're just going out to parks and whatever equipment they brought out there, I was all in and, you know, i mean still keep in touch with both of them to this day.
00:04:04
Speaker
That's great. And then I imagine that really fuels their fire when they see the lessons that they handed down to you, you continue to then just reverberate everything that you picked up way back when.
00:04:15
Speaker
Yeah, it's really cool. Cause, uh, I mean, so trained with them as middle school, high school athlete, went on to college, came back interned with them and then got a job at their facility as well.
00:04:27
Speaker
And it's the same thing as you just saw, uh, Jaren, trained him in high school, trained him in college. Came back, interned with me throughout college, and now he's coaching director of coaching here. So it's kind of like a full circle thing to see that. Yeah.
00:04:41
Speaker
Yeah, I love
From Chicago to Denver: Establishing Pivotal Performance
00:04:42
Speaker
that. And Pivotal, I mean, you're not from Denver area. What brought Pivotal here? What brought you to Denver and then this create this opportunity Pivotal? So yeah, from Chicago, but always wanted to move somewhere else in Colorado. Just again, being an outdoors guy, like, I mean, i don't, I can't figure out a big better state than ah Colorado.
00:05:03
Speaker
um So yeah, moved out here, did not have a job lined up, but had a couple um resources and connections.
Innovating a Gym During COVID Challenges
00:05:10
Speaker
And actually Joel, who you have in a future lineup.
00:05:14
Speaker
Yeah, he should have been this morning. He's making a real hard on me driving. and Yeah, because my friend's in Parker, so now I've got to drive north, then come back down to where I'm staying. So he's making it hard on me That's Joel for you.
00:05:28
Speaker
Shout out to Joel. um But yeah, Joel ah brought me on board with him, and then ah we developed a great relationship. um But then there was a time where I just felt like I needed to go on my own. um Happened to be during COVID.
00:05:43
Speaker
um Like during COVID, or you set the plans and then COVID happened? I set the plans and COVID happened. So, you know, out of a gym, um having bunch of clientele and everything, had to brainstorm and problem solve and opened up a garage gym, which honestly, like I could go back to that summer because it was one of the funnest times, like yeah going to parks, just random different parks, having a garage and, you know, strip a strip of turf on my driveway, VertiMax laid out and, you know,
00:06:13
Speaker
our neighbors just watching me just run a bunch of different people through our neighborhood on sprints and different things like that. But then got to a point where I'm like, I need to get a facility, and that was always the end plan.
00:06:25
Speaker
um And after, you know, COVID calmed down a little bit, I was able to... actually search buildings and everything because that was actually the biggest problem is like we couldn't even go out and check out buildings and things like that.
00:06:37
Speaker
um But found one and it was, again, kind of still during COVID, kids were... doing school at home and things like that. And parents wanted their kids outside the house and, you know, lucky enough, I always joke about it. Like Parker's a very conservative town and you know, they didn't really care too much and they wanted their kids out of the house. So it was a huge referral source. So it was great to move to a new location in Parker and, uh,
00:07:04
Speaker
build a whole network of new kids and everything. And I work with the one of the local high schools out here that I've been contracted with for, think going on year 10 now. Yeah. do you go into the school or do they come here?
Leadership Classes in High Schools
00:07:16
Speaker
Yeah, both. Both. So, i mean, we get handful of different high schools as well here, but probably majority is Ponderosa. um But yeah, one of my coaches was there this morning working with the dance team.
00:07:28
Speaker
I was there this morning running a leadership class. um And then all summer we'll be running... programs there as well. That's awesome. Well, let's, let's spend some time. I know I want to get to lacrosse, but I want to spend some time with that leadership class.
00:07:42
Speaker
Yeah. So now how did that spark? Was the coaches, they said they needed it or you saw that they needed this and you created the opportunity. um I have a passion for leadership as well. That's a huge... um I mean, I think it just goes hand-in-hand with sports. um So if you ever look at my library of books, it's, you know, exercise, you know, science books and leadership books.
00:08:06
Speaker
And that's... You're not going to find ah fictional book, um, in my library. Uh, but that's all right with me. Um, but yeah, leadership is huge. Um, Jeremy Boone, um, athlete by design. Okay. Um, who runs a leadership course himself with coaches. Um, he's one of my biggest mentors.
00:08:27
Speaker
And I did this whole course with him, mentorship, and then he challenged me. He's like, you know, you're learning all this leadership, go apply it to other things. So I reached out to the AD. I was like, because I knew he was running this leadership course, but he wasn't running it to the fullest of his ability.
Developing Junior Athletes' Leadership Skills
00:08:44
Speaker
um And you already had the the strength sessions with them? Yes. Okay.
00:08:49
Speaker
So I reached out to him, I'm like, hey, can i take over this? And he was absolutely, like, it was a pretty quick yes. And kind of shifted and how the whole program ran and everything.
00:09:00
Speaker
i'm New AD now, and I actually have the AD in um working, so we go both um kind of joint education with that. Just so he's, you know, more involved with the students because he's so admin.
00:09:13
Speaker
um So I thought that was a good opportunity. And it just provides another voice. But yeah, we, I mean, I had them this morning. um Today was our last meeting, but ah we meet with just juniors.
00:09:26
Speaker
um I've, throughout the years, I figured out that, you know, we had, you know, coaches would just assign two athletes. It was the cool kid or it was, you know, the senior leader that, you know, football or whatever, and then football's on, you know,
00:09:41
Speaker
two and we meet once a month with this and they're gone. yeah so I wanted like, well, they're gonna learn in this stuff and they don't apply it. So I wanted juniors only. Now it's, it doesn't matter how many, like it's not limited to a certain amount of sports or whatever, it's applications. So they have to seek it out. they have to go get recommendations from a teacher and a coach.
00:10:00
Speaker
So it puts a little more accountability on the kids, but yeah, we talk about a whole, you know, list of leadership qualities and building skills and strategies and just building that courage in them is the biggest thing to like, you know, approaching your teammate in a, you know, in a tough situation, like they're not going to hate you. It's not the end of the world. And like having them overcome that and learn like, all they're going to forget about it tomorrow anyways. And that's like a huge part. I think that's missing in high school leadership.
Explaining the 5 E's of Leadership
00:10:31
Speaker
Dude, I couldn't agree more. So conflict and arguing, like those are just, they're put negative tones on and light. It's like, no, no, no, no. Conflict is good. Conflict is healthy.
00:10:41
Speaker
And you how you approach conflict is whether it's good or bad. So let's let's work on confronting your teammates if their behaviors are not aligned with the team's goals. For sure. Absolutely.
00:10:53
Speaker
um And we yeah we have a whole long list. From Jeremy Boone, we have these five E's um that we, like, they see they find these, like, oh, it goes back to these E's.
00:11:04
Speaker
And the E's are um energy, example, experience, environment, and why am I blanking on the fifth one right now? Brain fart.
00:11:16
Speaker
um What did say? Uh, energy, example. Expectations. Environment. Yes. Expectations. Well, I missed one now. Um, energy, environment, experience. Experience.
00:11:28
Speaker
And so you're able to, like, find these E's and how they're able to mingle together and, you know, how is X going to experience me or what kind of environment am trying to create for my team to, like, pull them with me.
00:11:41
Speaker
Um, so it's a pretty, like... I think it's a great um kind of piece. huh Simple enough, um but it can get very in-depth with it. And they like, so depending on where the level of leadership that athlete is, like they can, you know, yeah build off that. So, you know, if they're just a lead by example, which is every, you ask every high school kid, what's your best leadership quality? I'll lead by example.
00:12:08
Speaker
Well, you know, that's not always good enough. You have to, Be bigger, be bolder, and branch out. Yeah, find find your voice. yeah like It's okay to be introverted.
00:12:19
Speaker
the same time, we still want you to step up when the the moment requires. For sure. Because coaches can't always be there. Yeah. And so I love it. And, you know, bringing the seniors back and talk to the juniors. I've had...
00:12:33
Speaker
I've had Jeremy Boone on. I've had some other like coaches come on Zoom calls. They give another voice. I've had even some of my pro athletes come in and talk to them. um And that's always a huge one, too. yeah because And I tell them, I'm like, this is the same language I'm having with you guys that I have with these guys, too. Yeah. yeah It's a different set. Have it's the same power within these realms, this framework that they're experiencing at these high levels. For sure. Man, that's that's very cool.
00:13:00
Speaker
And are are you prepared to share examples of your experience with these five E's from your athletic career, your coaching career? Yeah, absolutely. um i think the biggest, like where I'm at now is you know, for past four years, I've been pretty much a one man show.
00:13:19
Speaker
Um, you know, running
Addressing Leadership Challenges and Standards
00:13:21
Speaker
who knows how many sessions in a day, yeah but now I'm building a team. So I have five coaches now, um, under me.
00:13:30
Speaker
And so that's a whole new dynamic that I'm learning. um and you know, having to delegate, having to, um, give away some like power, um, cause you know, we all want like our standards of our training and everything and you know um might have a new coach and like he's not coaching it the way i want i can't get on him i'm like what am i doing wrong so like the reflecting piece of like yeah have i you know dedicated enough time to help him in his coaching development or her coaching development
00:14:01
Speaker
um instead of just you know hey this is how we do it and things like that or even just like seeing you know training session or whatever and that's like that's just not how we do it or whatever but not addressing it in that moment because you don't want put in front of the kids and everything no way um so just those are like and i'm very like type a when it comes to that stuff and like i want it like high level high quality like that's our priority here like we can you know We could bring in a bunch of kids and everything, but quality is going to go down.
00:14:30
Speaker
So um I keep quality here and quantity can you know fluctuate. um So that's where I'm focused on. I'm not just trying to become a rich billionaire.
00:14:41
Speaker
Well, you're in the wrong business. yeah um So yeah, so that's probably been the biggest um point right now for me and my leadership development. yeah um But yeah, going back to... i And that those are healthy examples of conflict that... yeah I know what I need to do.
00:14:58
Speaker
And now I need, even as a professional and business owner and, you know, experience with years beyond these kids, you still need to get ready for those conversations. Yeah. and i quote that i learned from, again,
00:15:12
Speaker
quoting Jeremy Boone, um but toleration is the number one excellence killer. Oh, yeah. um So if you're tolerating something, you know, if like that coach is coaching like a way that we don't want or, you know, coming in a certain way or things like that and I just tolerate it or even for one ath or one coach, not the other coach if I'm treating him differently or something, that's just going to keep going and get worse and worse and then, you know, that excellence that quality piece drops.
00:15:42
Speaker
So having those standards and those expectations, um, Having them listed out and again, going back to being a one man show, you know, I didn't have to have like programs listed out, things like that. I could just, you know, some of the stuff was in my head or like, Hey, I've already, I knew what I did with this group last week, but now with other coaches and we're switching off sessions and athletes are bouncing around different sessions. Like they need to know.
00:16:09
Speaker
having that prepared plan and overarching kind of. Mm-hmm. structure has been a huge change to and communicating that piece as well. Yeah.
Courage and Competition in Athlete Development
00:16:19
Speaker
And not just assuming they know.
00:16:22
Speaker
yeah that that that's a tough one. i still coach lacrosse sport and do the strength stuff. So I get both sides of performance and then the the play calling. that's That's what I appreciate.
00:16:34
Speaker
And then working with the high schoolers. more often than not the lesson that I'm aiming to teach that day or observe they need to work on, there's almost a reflection that I have that same growth piece in life that I need to get.
00:16:46
Speaker
Most recently this season, there was a few players in leadership roles that they were afraid to fail. So why try? so you know, the ebbs and flows of a season, there's highs and lows.
00:16:57
Speaker
So if certain things didn't go our way, well, I'm just going to sit back because it hurts to fail. So then i observe that in them and it forces me to then externally look at, okay, where am I in my life? Am I afraid to try? Because i don't want to fail. Okay.
00:17:14
Speaker
i'm I'm teaching this lesson. I need to model it as well. Yeah, so for sure. Yeah. I like these five E's for that. Yeah, you look behind you, those are my two favorite words right there. So it's a daily reminder for me, and it's a visual cue, because I athletes will be like, well, what's courage? What do you have to compete?
00:17:33
Speaker
Or whatever. um And I mean, I even get jokes sometimes, like one of my NFL combine guys this year, like they wanted to play spike ball, and you know it was during a deload, and like we're trying to calm down before their big days and everything and they want to play spike ball. I'm like, no. And they're like what does that word say up there? So it bites me in the butt sometimes. Did them play?
00:17:53
Speaker
No, but they ran fast. so Well, sometimes courage is yeah holding back and following the plan. Exactly. So, but those are two daily reminders. Those are my two favorite words, courage and compete, because you have the, have the courage to compete in whatever you know, thing you do.
00:18:10
Speaker
Yeah. Whether it's, you know, grades or whether it's, I always joke like you, you can't like confidence, confidence, You gotta wait for that confidence piece. But courage, and just gotta step up and do it. Yeah, I like that.
00:18:24
Speaker
Time out. Coach, are you banging your head against the wall trying to motivate athletes who seem mentally soft? You're yelling, they're shutting down. You're punishing, they're checking out. Sound familiar?
00:18:36
Speaker
Here's the thing, the game has changed, but most of the coaching education hasn't caught up yet.
Connecting with Modern Athletes
00:18:41
Speaker
They're locked in on teaching programming and not people-ing. In my new course, Why They're Not Listening, Coaching Today's Athlete, you'll learn how to connect with your team and transform disconnected players into captains who perform under pressure. Stop fighting your athletes and start developing them Go to listen.captainsandcoaches.com to enroll.
00:19:03
Speaker
That's listen.captainsandcoaches.com. Transform your coaching today. Now, back to the show. Ready, ready, and ready. Within the, in line with the three, five E's, excuse me, ah worked with Ryan Davis, University of Maryland football.
00:19:19
Speaker
And what he brings to his squad is three H's. So he has the guys, this is practicing in public speaking. So you give a hero, who's a hero in your life. and You express a highlight. So what's a highlight from the season, from training, from you know high school football, whatever it may be.
00:19:35
Speaker
And then hardship. So you're sharing to your, I mean, whole squad, we're talking 105 dudes. That's big public speaking, something that is challenging that you've been through. So what Coach Davis then challenges his team and staff to do is you got to be ready to present as well.
00:19:52
Speaker
yeah And then the guys are going to see you right through if you're inauthentic in those moments. For sure. Yeah. I love that. The, the public speaking piece, that's a big part of leadership as you know, so leading sessions, that's public speaking. So how are you framing with the the leaders that you're working with within this group that even what they're doing, just communicating within the group is going to help them in huddles and moments in the game when they, they got to find their voice and be listened to.
Teaching Legacy and Urgency in High School Sports
00:20:20
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, it goes back to that courage piece as well. um and just like what is it that you want and again what are you tolerating that you can't tolerate anymore and just yeah stepping up in that moment is it truly what you want um you know everyone talks about finding that why or we talk about at the um leadership group that i work with at the high school is like what's your legacy what kind of legacy do you want to live and like today was our last session so it's like
00:20:51
Speaker
you have one more year left. So that's that urgency piece that's going to create action. um You have one more year left. What kind of legacy do you want? And besides winning, like, yeah, well we want to win state.
00:21:05
Speaker
Okay. Well, you won one game last year. I'm not saying that stuff, like, the state is just the stereotypical, I want to win state. I want to be all state. I want to be all conference, things like that. Like that's, you know, there's so many other factors, but like, besides the winning piece, what kind of legacy do you want?
00:21:26
Speaker
Like, and like a kid today, it was like, I want to have our defense this year is going to be the, he's a football guy. Our defense is going to be the best, like connected group. And I was like, right, I've been there for 10 years.
00:21:37
Speaker
I'll tell you at the end. And he's like, all right, it's going to easy. i was like, no, it's not. But he's confident. But then, yeah, and then there's this other girl on the dance team. And she was saying the same stuff. he's like And the dance team is very successful.
00:21:52
Speaker
and she's and But they haven't won in like two years, like state. Like we wanna like we are doing extra stuff right now because we want to get back to that and she's like I want to be the one that like led that charge so she's having these tough conversations with the girls and pulling them in to do and like extra running and things like that that they're just doing on their own now.
00:22:12
Speaker
um So she was like really like energized you saw it in her eyes too like I was I told her I was like I'm ready to go run with you guys. ah wonderful so That's powerful and like you keep that going. it's like But they have like, they realize that urgency piece because like I've one more year of high school. split Oh yeah.
00:22:30
Speaker
So that urgency piece is huge. That is very tough to communicate, and especially at that high school level because you're saying it. Sometimes they don't hear you. And then we get to okay, we only have three games left. I can count it on my hand.
00:22:44
Speaker
Oh, now I start to care or try. When you, yes, we could have been doing that, you know, months ago and be in a better position. Yeah, there's always those.
Accountability and Team Environment
00:22:56
Speaker
Yeah. And so in working with leadership and the athletic development side, have you noticed a difference between leading young men and leading young women? Um, that's a really good question.
00:23:12
Speaker
have to really think about it. Like up front with the athletes that I'm working with, like those top tier ones, no. The ones like below that?
00:23:24
Speaker
Yes. um Actually, i don't know. Maybe I retract that statement. But like the ones at the top, like they are the ones like I have athletes that come to me, like regardless of what high school they like. Hey, they want to just like put their goals on paper in front of me.
00:23:40
Speaker
Mm hmm. um And we sit down and we go over that stuff. And then, you know, I'm very, i think one of my sure strengths is I hold people accountable to the fullest. like I will have those tough conversations, you know, whether it's with my fiance or um ah freshman in high school kid, like a broad range, you know even even my dad, like we go back and forth, like with, ah he's a small business owner himself and we share our goals together.
00:24:06
Speaker
like, hey, you gotta do this or whatever. like That's us. and mean i mean I learned from him because he does it hard on me. So now it's like payback to get to him. But it's just like been a strength of mine.
00:24:17
Speaker
um But going back to it, with those athletes, the leadership and the physical side, like if you're all in, you're all in. And i see you could see right through that of like, I mean, our commitment board, like those people are the ones coming in, in season, out of season. They're the ones, you know,
00:24:36
Speaker
that are even in our groups, we do mostly group training here. And we call it Athletic Development Program ADP. So we have a volleyball girl, a football guy, a lacrosse guy, lacrosse girl, a volleyball girl, like all different sports, you name it.
00:24:51
Speaker
But those ones that are the leaders, like usually the best in the sport too, or like the ones going on to play at the next level, they're the ones like leading that group. And we'll have kids that, you know, we have some athletes that don't even play sports. Their parents, like maybe it's like a younger brother or something that just like,
00:25:07
Speaker
you know, doesn't play sports, but they want them to be a part of something. Like, this is their team. And those kids pull those... Because I actually just found out one of them is a senior that's never played a sport, but he's invited to one of our top football guys' graduation party.
00:25:22
Speaker
I'm like, that's a really cool thing. Yeah. I mean, that shows what you're aiming to do is bring a team environment. It's not just the football team. Now we get an opportunity to to bring different schools together or different classes and different sports. That's what I wanted, just a whole, like a new community.
00:25:39
Speaker
Yeah. Well, and then that's what the most successful gyms from my experience are is they, they build that community and then they run it like a business. So still community focused, but then everything aligns on the backend. Yeah. We always say we want to make it our, the third home for everyone.
00:25:55
Speaker
Like Starbucks. Yep. That's where I got it from. Um, You know, home is obviously they're going to be the most spot and then school. And then even like for our adult clients, like work or whatever, like this is their other place. Like with the outdoor spot, like I want to make it a playground. We're going to put a basketball hoop. going have a pickleball court.
00:26:13
Speaker
And just like kids can come early. They can come late. They can come on another day. Just like if they're coming in here in the building, they know like it's a safe spot. Like no one's going to harass them. Things like that. I'll harass them, but give them a hard Give her away.
00:26:26
Speaker
Yeah. This is called candor. Just give him a hard time. Not harassing. ah Preparing them to manage. that That's one thing I do like about working with the high school age is teaching them how to give and take action.
00:26:38
Speaker
trash talk yes so then ah one one approach we can get into this so one approach that i take is if they clearly have like developed calves i call them out for small calves so what i aim to accomplish there i want them to think about is that true Yeah, I love that. No, it's not true because they got just genetically gifted calves or whatever.
00:26:59
Speaker
So then now when a kid says something, an opponent says something to them, I want their first thought to be, is it true? Because most kids, if they say something, they'll get defensive. No, it's not.
00:27:09
Speaker
So now it's like... is this a filter? Is this true? And then now we can step up and just ducks, ah water off a duck's back, like brush it off. Cause that second man always gets caught, especially with yeah our referees in Texas.
00:27:25
Speaker
So i aim and that's one thing I focus on is just find something that's not true and then just give them a hard time about it and then teach them this filter of, is it true? I do that, but I've never really thought about it context. so I love that. Yeah.
00:27:39
Speaker
the I mean, Everyone jokes like I'm the number one hater for everyone, and even though they all know I'm their number one biggest fan. Yeah. um But in here, just i think I'm the best that shit talker around. Even like my pro guys, you talk more shit than anyone. That was just like indirectly what I do to build that, you know, courage and confidence piece.
00:28:02
Speaker
Yeah. the The higher the level, the better talker you gotta be. Oh yeah. So it's, it almost is this rite of passage where they got their guards up. I mean, at the, the, the football level, especially there's a lot of people coming to to help them, but not really help them. yeah So guards are always up.
00:28:19
Speaker
So this is a good way to break down and and make that connection. Yeah.
Coaching Banter and Building Connections
00:28:24
Speaker
the Yeah. So, well then you aim to, this is one thing where you're handing off duties.
00:28:30
Speaker
Like, how can you help your your team, your ah your coaches make better connections is through this piece that it it may not come naturally to you or you've just been in that environment your whole life.
00:28:42
Speaker
So then, yeah, see how you can hand off that teaching and then start to have your own. yup Here's five S's of shit talking. I don't know. Whatever. I've always been a shit talker, though.
00:28:54
Speaker
Yeah. So. But then it comes naturally to you. yeah So now, yeah can you teach that? For sure. And actually, I mean, one of my athletes told one of my other coaches, like, all you do is just shit talk.
00:29:08
Speaker
He's actually, wait, Patrick, shit talks more than you. So they realize it, but I'm like, all right, he's already starting to run that same page. But i haven't we haven't even discussed that. I'm like, that'll be at our next coaches meeting where talk about that. like, why do you guys think I harassed the kids?
00:29:25
Speaker
I didn't give them a hard time. Reframe that. Yeah. Candor is the- Candor, yeah. Why do I actually talk to kids, give them candor and all that? um I'm going to be curious for their answers. Yeah.
00:29:37
Speaker
It's a good question to bring back to our coaches meetings. some think Do you have siblings? I have three younger sisters. he's thrg yeah You've prepared them for life, I hope, by giving them some candor growing up.
00:29:48
Speaker
Yeah, they can handle. There you go. Yeah, I'm i' the reverse. I just got older sisters. Yeah. So then I utilize sports to then actually develop the Tufts scan and candor and get all that because at home it was all estrogen. Yeah,
00:30:05
Speaker
yeah dude, I do want to get to lacrosse. So you almost stumbled into this through one of your NFL connections to now open up a door where you got great opportunities at all levels with lacrosse.
00:30:16
Speaker
Yeah, it was, I mean, yeah one of the agents that I work with was representing Baptiste, who's pretty well known. Yeah. um And trained him like right after college, even couple times during college, his senior year, and then became some lacrosse guy.
00:30:37
Speaker
um but I mean, there was Clutch Rich and I was like, hey, we need a guy that, you know, played lacrosse, knows lacrosse, and trains lacrosse. I was like, disclaimer, i didn't play lacrosse, but i know I can train movement, I understand the sport demands, things like that.
00:30:50
Speaker
Like, I did my research and I watched the game, things like that, and also... You're 12 years old, so you just need athletic development. Yeah. But I won't tell you that part.
00:31:01
Speaker
um Yeah, lacrosse-specific training. Okay. Yeah. No problem. It'll be right next to the football program. Yeah. But ah yeah, so mean, just absolutely fell in love with the sport though and you know, built a relationship with other guys.
00:31:16
Speaker
Trevor brought in more athletes as well. And then it just, again, just like any other sport and sports performance realm, like it's a trickle down effect. um Train at high level.
00:31:29
Speaker
Yeah, in any sport, like, you're probably going to have those sports underneath you, too, in that area. Yeah. um And it's it's just exploding here in Denver. It's amazing. Oh, yeah. I mean, the buy-in of what lacrosse is and what kids are willing to do, parents are willing to do, and go the extra mile um so they their kids can, you know, maximize their potential.
00:31:53
Speaker
um So it's awesome, and, you know, We're getting there in terms of the state producing some fine athletes. Big time. Going to the next level and producing at the next level and then even getting to the ultimate level.
00:32:06
Speaker
Yeah, and it just creates that spark in that community. So whether they went to college here or they grew up here, it's still associated with Denver. And again, just like a trickle-down effect of, like, in our business, but, like, in the professional realm, like, you know, the Colorado Mammoth are a great program.
00:32:22
Speaker
We now have the Denver Outlaws back with, like, a home base. And then University of Denver, again, a great program. So like high school, middle school, like there's just great programs, you know, and the leadership up at the highest ranks he is going to help that. Yeah.
00:32:39
Speaker
Yeah. So yeah, great to see. Yeah. Good minds in there.
Sports Specialization Impacts and Misconceptions
00:32:44
Speaker
I do want to speak about sports specialization. So this is something that's starting to work into lacrosse. It's, it's infected baseball, it's infected basketball.
00:32:53
Speaker
And, uh, at certain club levels, they just try to steal kids away from different sports. So now using your expertise in long-term athletic development, your connection with athletes that have been to the top and continue to find success there.
00:33:10
Speaker
How are you presenting like encouraging parents to play more sports or be more active? Or just when they present specialization to you, how do you have that conversation with them?
00:33:21
Speaker
Yeah, that's always a tricky conversation, especially when, you know, some parents are blindfolded and just going, you know, narrow focus on this is what it takes. And well, I'm like, well, you asked Trevor, you know, believe it or not, he was a swimmer.
00:33:36
Speaker
um I did not know that. Yeah. And he played football too. um So he was three sports. And, you know, Jack Hanna, who I think is one of the best athletes in the PLL. He was football. He was basketball.
00:33:48
Speaker
Like, you look at my NFL guys. They were track. They were baseball. They were basketball, too. So, like, I don't, that's what, like, me and my mom, she's very similar to me in this mindset of, like, where is the disconnect of, like, you see it every year, like, in the Super Bowl, was, like, you know, 47 of the 53 played two sports in high school or whatever. Like, the drafts of, like, oh, this was a, like, watching the draft, it was, like, oh, this was a basketball guy. Oh, this was know, it was a track guy, like,
00:34:17
Speaker
Where is it missing at the lower level? Like where are the parents blinded? Where are the kids blinded? um so I think it is on us to educate them and, you know, give them, ah professional athletes like histories and things like that and guidance no this is you're good and you'll be found um so it's always it's always gonna be a debate i think because you're always gonna have you know those guys that you know the tiger woods things like that well you know hate to break it your kids probably not tiger woods um so there is that diamond in the rough but
00:34:52
Speaker
That's not end all be all. um So educating the parents. And I mean, I, I mean, and we have one of ah my high school lacrosse guys who's, you know, top five ranked in the nation right now.
00:35:06
Speaker
He didn't play basketball this year. He played basketball as freshman year, but he told me he's going to play basketball as junior year. I was like, good. Like, don't train with me. play basketball too. Like, if you want to come in, like here and there, do it. You get some touch-ups or whatever, but like,
00:35:20
Speaker
going to pick up a lacrosse stick too. Just play basketball. um So where you have those conversations with those athletes individually, things like that. And like, again, like when I, when athletes come to me and like break down their goals and everything, talked about that too. I'm like, you're going to burnt out.
00:35:38
Speaker
And like, I was just talking with another, and one of my guys is like, if I just played lacrosse, I would hate it at this point. was like I'm 12 years in of playing at a really high level.
00:35:51
Speaker
i would hate lacrosse. Funny you mention that. so Inside baseball, speaking with a college coach, D1 recruiting, so then... interesting conversation that he's having with his peers all these different showcases and clubs go around so colleges they go and attend them and what they're looking for now if they see the same name within the eighth ninth and tenth grade level the same name and all these different showcases what they're doing is marking that name off because from their experience by the time that kid gets to freshman sophomore in college they are burnt out
00:36:27
Speaker
So they are just avoiding these kids that are just travel only yeah because they're missing one, athletic development. But two, just that kid's going to be high, high injury rate prone and burnout prone.
00:36:40
Speaker
So now it's like the harder their parents are trying to pay for all this travel ball, the more it's working against the kid at that level. Because coaches just, they and wasted a scholarship on a kid that was gone yeah when they could have somebody else.
00:36:54
Speaker
And I mean, that needs to be publicly known, like put that in the newspapers and say it louder for the people in the back as the joke goes. Um, because yeah, people don't hear that or in turns the blind deaf ears.
00:37:08
Speaker
Um, but then again, again, you're going to have some athletes. So I'm not going to completely bash like single sport athletes. Cause we're to have some and you know, I have one that's a stud I'm I don't know how close I am to get him to play football his senior year, but we're getting there. But he's a stud lacrosse player. He's got his D1 offer and everything. right But we like you make it in here.
00:37:28
Speaker
like We're playing like different games and things like that. So if you do have those single sport athletes, you have to make your training, not just lacrosse specific. And I mean, we don't do that anyways. but make it like warm up with dodgeball and just like do different things to expose them to different movements and demands that he's not used to and competing against different sports as well.
00:37:50
Speaker
So I think that is a way to combat that um and not like truly bash the single sport athlete because they're always going to be there. yeah So we can't, you know, turn them away or just like, hey, you're...
00:38:03
Speaker
I'm talking, yeah, you can't hold it against them. We're going to do what we do is encourage, empower, and lead. For sure. So changing, you know, some of your training um regimens for those athletes as well, I think, is critical for the performance coach. Uh-huh.
00:38:20
Speaker
Yeah, and then imagining with the pros as well, it's mixing in those fun games, movements, shapes, competitions that they don't get exposed to, especially with to where the league is now. They have careers and jobs and train and then travel to perform in the games on the weekends in the summer.
00:38:39
Speaker
mean, that's our best warm-up tool right there, the spike ball. Oh, I love it. I mean, sometimes, like I said with the combine guys, it, like, gets carried away. But, like, even ah with, like, my lacrosse guys and the NFL guys in the summer, and, ah again, they're all, like, I bring all those guys even together, too. so like Oh, that's most, yeah.
00:38:56
Speaker
It's easy for me to tell a parent of like, oh, i need them in a baseball specific group. I'm like, how come my NHL, my PLL, my and NFL guys are all working out together. They don't need specific training. Like, and I always joke, I'm like, I've never met a coach that wants a slower, weaker athlete.
00:39:11
Speaker
And that's what our training is going to do. We're going to make, not slower, weaker, but get faster, get you stronger. Mm-hmm. So that's going help in any sport.
Creative Competitiveness and Community Engagement
00:39:19
Speaker
Yeah. but So it helps like educate the younger parents um with the younger kids. I'm like, no, i' all these guys on this wall have all worked out together.
00:39:28
Speaker
That's awesome. um And they love competing against each other. But even like we will make up random games too. we're Like we're playing handball, volleyball.
00:39:39
Speaker
We'll go out to one of the beach volleyball courts out here and play the med ball volleyball. And it's just, Again, different athletes in different realms competing against each other and different movements of from everyone too. Yeah, I like that from two multiple sides. The strength coach side, just seeing how they move, right? How's their plant and change the direction with something awkward because sport's going to be some unknown thing that they've...
00:40:03
Speaker
in an awkward position and can they get creative with their bodies to solve that problem so watching how they move in something they've never done before and then i also want to introduce new games i want to see how they compete yeah do they switch it on and how are they responding to success how are they responding to failure With the high school guys, you can help shape and and craft that ah responsibility, like how they respond, their ability to respond to winning, losing, succeeding.
00:40:30
Speaker
But like the pro guys is fun because it's it's really instilled in them. And you can tell a lot about them. When put it on new constraints and they just attack me, that's that's the most fun for me.
00:40:40
Speaker
Oh, well, you're you're armed and equipped to yeah fire right back. Oh, yeah. Man, that's fun. um i Sticking with high school athletes to explore this, i don't know if you've had experience with having a kid that don't know how talented they are and certain sports, where basketball or football or lacrosse or something just comes so easy to them that then they lose interest because sports are no longer competitive.
00:41:07
Speaker
So I don't know if you've seen that, where just the sport just comes so easy to them, they lose interest. I think I saw back like when when I was playing back in like high school with some of my friends that were the best in their sports and everything, but we didn't have social media and everything. I think now, and again, we don't have, we'd be very lucky to find, you know, one of the five-star recruits in this neck of the woods.
00:41:32
Speaker
So we don't have those guys. yeah So I think, I mean, maybe it is a benefit of one benefit of social media is like, in terms of comparing to others is like, they see like there's better guys out there.
00:41:44
Speaker
Um, so they're like, they're chasing that. Right. Um, so maybe that a, finally a benefit of comparing yourself on social media. Cause I haven't really seen a lot of that. i don't know if you have. Yeah.
00:41:55
Speaker
Just with, with certain guys that within realm of lacrosse, they're so gifted athletically that you just put a stick in their hand and they, they take it over and then that's easy.
00:42:07
Speaker
So it's, It's battling a lot of just school and home where they're not pushing them to be the best. So when they come to the six hours of lacrosse, comes easy to them, they lose interest quick because then, oh, I'm, coach is pushing me hard.
00:42:24
Speaker
Or they're, I don't get pushed hard because school, everything else comes easy to me. Yeah, no, i mean I mean, I've seen some athletes get a certain way, but then, you know, they go to a tournament out east and Your team gets spanked. You know, oh, yeah, we're fifth in the nation or whatever. And then they lose every game by 10. I'm like, are you guys fifth in the nation?
00:42:47
Speaker
no you did To a bottom team out yeah in Maryland somewhere. Yeah, exactly. So then, you know, it turns, you know, some of them it fuels their fire and some of them, you know, they sink and you got to figure out a way to get them back. Yeah. um So that that's what i call level set on skill set.
00:43:04
Speaker
Yeah. those travel tournaments from the colorados from the texas to the east coast that is a wake-up call because it's it's a representation of a team play for sure maybe they're individually gifted but how does their team dynamic work together yeah um Well, cool, man. I, we covered a lot here and the, I mean, it's, it looks like, you mean, you got a beautiful facility and you're building that team community.
00:43:31
Speaker
And I do love that. and what What else are you aiming to accomplish? You're expanding your team. What's the future look like for Pivotal to hear that people can look forward to? Um, that's a, I mean, we just moved into this place. So we're still working on growing out this place, you know, we're going add on with our outdoor area. So that's going be cool.
00:43:52
Speaker
um but yeah, just building that, uh, network of coaches, because obviously, you know, in the performance realm, I'd be the luckiest man in the world if I have Jaren and Javon and Dylan like for the rest of my life, but that's just not true.
00:44:06
Speaker
So building that connection of coaches and interns and all that, I think is my biggest area of like growth and like reach out of like a goal I have. Um, and we even, we're starting that with like a high school internship program now.
00:44:22
Speaker
Um, and actually one of the local high schools out here offers a high school internship program. And I just got a text the other day from one of my, a girl that did that program with me that she is now like the intern for sports science for the university of Hawaii football.
00:44:36
Speaker
I'm that's awesome. So it cool thing like that. And then, you know, when she graduates and she, if she moves back here, like she's got a spot here most likely because of like her experiences and everything like that, but constantly building those coaches, um, network and,
00:44:51
Speaker
We want to grow, like, in the community even more. like Again, there's four high schools in this town. um We're affiliated with one. We have reach-outs with... We've worked with all of them at one point in time or with teams or whatever.
00:45:05
Speaker
But just building, like... so we're actually starting Parker Speed Days. Okay, that's cool. Where we want to create, like, lists of everything, like, the fastest. Who's the fastest in Parker? I want to get shirts of, like, I'm the fastest in Parker. Things like that. Create, like, a In pivotal font, like yeah Parker. Yeah, that'd be cool. um But create like this culture of like speed, umm like this will need for speed in the town of Parker, where, you know, we have a second grader out there to a senior in high school to one of my pro guys coming out there for a day and just doing a basic speed thing, but then just timing people, ranking them based on
00:45:45
Speaker
age, sex, different things like that, where it creates like a whole thing. and like ah Ultimately, like it's a business tactic too, a marketing tactic. Like, hey, I want to be the fastest, so I got to go in and come back and like get more training in and everything.
00:46:00
Speaker
But just create a and it's free and we just want to rotate through all the high school. So I'm working with the eighties right now to try to establish that. But I think that's like a dream I have. So like if kids can't afford training, like they can go once a week on the weekend or whatever to that and get speed training and they're training, you know, at a high level.
00:46:20
Speaker
um So that's like one of my like visions and goals that I want. And then just, you know, have that become like, I, one of my missions, like my goals is whatever to be known in every household in the town of Parker.
00:46:33
Speaker
Focus on our neighborhood, our, our town and all the surrounding towns will just be a trickle benefit. Big time. And then the pros that you continue to send the next level and create those opportunities with, that's just going to continue to to help build the brand and build the name.
00:46:51
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. You talked about legacy with your high schoolers. It's clear what you're doing here. Thank you. Yeah. Well, cool, man. I appreciate your time. Blind reach out. But yeah, yeah it was fun to know you and learn ah about what you're building here, especially the community aspect.
00:47:06
Speaker
And that's something to be, ah i mean, ah I'm losing words here. It's something to, you know, I mean, admire within the field. Because so many people are, they're going for a logo on their chest versus creating their own logo.
00:47:21
Speaker
It's cool. Cool. Well, yeah thanks, dude. Thank you. Beautiful facility. Parker, Colorado. Check it out, man. And then any PLL guys we got looking forward to this season?
00:47:34
Speaker
Yeah. Plenty. Plenty of them. You know, Trevor will be number one in face-offs again. You know, Jack, Hannah, you know, I honestly think he could be the best in the world.
00:47:45
Speaker
I'm calling that out, and he'll take on that challenge. ah We got Colin Squires, one of the best D guys. um Then, yeah, a handful of the younger guys do that. they got ah They got to make a spot first in two weeks.
00:48:00
Speaker
That's beauty. And now I'll them shout-outs. Yeah, that's the beauty. I still love the the tryout nature of the league. yeah it It's highly competitive. That's a key word to talk about it. but All right, dude, thanks for joining us for Captains & Coaches Podcast.
00:48:14
Speaker
And see you. See you.