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Built for the Long Run: Mike Seaman on Running 200 Miles & Building the National Running Show
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In this episode of the UKRunChat podcast, Mike Seaman, the driving force behind The National Running Show joins us to chat about the show's roots and also his own endurance running, having recently completed the Winter Downs 200, Javelina Jundred (100 miles), a 50k ultra, and summited Mount Kilimanjaro to raise funds for Birmingham Children’s Hospital.
We talk about Mike’s journey into running, his experience of running 200 miles, what goes on behind the scenes of major running events, and what he’s seeing across the running and outdoor industry right now.
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The 2026 National Running Show takes place on Saturday 31st January and Sunday 1st February at the NEC Birmingham.
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Transcript
Meet Mike Seaman, Founder of Raccoon Media Group
00:00:01
UKRunChat
Welcome to this episode of the UK Run Chat Podcast. Now, today's guest is someone who sits right at the heart of the UK and global running scene. Mike Seaman is founder and CEO of the Raccoon Media Group and launched the national running show in 2018, which has grown into one of the biggest and important events in the running calendar. Mike is also an avid runner and adventurer. Over the last year alone, he's completed the Winterdowns 200. I have a lean 100, 100 mile race, a 50k ultra and summited Mount Kilimanjaro. So in this episode, we'll have a chat about Mike's running, the story behind the National Running Show and what he's seeing across the running and outdoor industry right now. Mike, thank you so much for joining us today. Welcome.
00:00:46
Mike Seaman
Well, thanks for having me. That makes me sound like I know what I'm doing. that That was a very good introduction.
00:00:49
UKRunChat
Well, yeah.
00:00:50
Mike Seaman
Thank you. nothing
00:00:52
UKRunChat
I think you probably do.
Mike's Journey into Running
00:00:54
UKRunChat
i'm I'm kind of interested to hear how you go from starting running into having 100 and 200 mile races on your calendar. So perhaps you can give us a bit of an intro into how you got started with your own running to begin with.
00:01:07
Mike Seaman
Yeah, I was never really a runner at school. When I when when i was at school, with like you you did cross country when the PE teacher couldn't be bothered and they'd make you go and run around the did the sports hall and come back again. um i i loved football as a kid. I played football all the time. And then when I sort of grew up and and got a career, as I stopped being able to go to one place for training or anything like that. And you just played less and less. I was never any good at football, by the way. I just i just loved it. I played it all the time.
00:01:37
Mike Seaman
And I got quite tubby in my 30s and you're just lifestyle. And so I started running and I'd just run around the block in London and and get back to the house. And then I got a bug for it. And then I decided to set myself this goal of doing one thing a year to raise money for charity. And me and a few mates, we signed up for the Paris Marathon. That was our first ever marathon.
00:02:01
Mike Seaman
And... It was horrible. absolutely hate it. I ran it in all of the wrong gear and all of the wrong things. and it But it was also brilliant. it was It was just utterly brilliant. I was so naive. I trained really sporadically, wore all a budget pair of trainers that I bought from a discount shop down the road. and But we got around it and we had a great time and it sort of escalated from there. and because I was so keen to raise money i was kind of like every year it felt like I had to do something a little bit more so I started doing it in fancy dress um um I still think my PB my my official PB on the marathon is dressed as an elephant um and yeah and it was just you just do different things like that and then
00:02:43
UKRunChat
That's brilliant.
00:02:48
Mike Seaman
somewhere along the way I read a book by a guy called Dean Karnazes and it was called The Ultramarathon Man because I was doing like half marathons and marathons reasonably regularly at this point and it was this guy who did these ultramarathons in the desert and you know he he ordered a pizza to himself halfway through one of his runs and it's like this sounded insane and it was this whole new world and Then I found out that they actually had these ultra marathons in the UK. So I did a 50 mile run, which is where I now live in Surrey, um on the North Downs with a company called Centurion. um And that was my first ever ultra marathon. And again, I made so many mistakes on that, but then you just escalate from there. and then i
The Appeal of Endurance Running
00:03:32
Mike Seaman
I did seven marathons in seven days. I ran my first 100 miler. Then I started trying to do 100 milers in under 24 hours. And then someone told me about the 200 miler, which is what I did this year.
00:03:42
Mike Seaman
And in my head, because I'd gone from 50 to 100 miles, was going from 100 to 200 wasn't that big a step. It's quite a big step, actually. it's quite a lot further.
00:03:51
UKRunChat
Yeah,
00:03:53
Mike Seaman
But yeah, it just it just escalates really, doesn't it?
00:03:55
UKRunChat
it it does. What what what is it, you think, about endurance running? Because it it does batter us, really, doesn't it? It it beats us up, it chews us up, it spits us out the other side. Why do we keep going back to endurance running? why do you Why do you keep returning to it?
00:04:08
Mike Seaman
I just, firstly, I think um the the first bit that attracted me was there was only so far i could go on my PB on a marathon or in a half marathon and and it was becoming less enjoyable. I was really flogging myself to death, but I was actually seeing less of the course and I was experiencing less of the race because I was so like edged out. And when I when i did the the endurance races,
00:04:34
Mike Seaman
It's kind of like a long, slow picnic. and You get like all the cool food at the stations. You really get to stop and take in the sights. you You run through really beautiful places. And actually, that for me just ticked all of my boxes.
00:04:48
Mike Seaman
And then as I started getting into the the longer and longer stuff, it was kind of that point where... your body says, absolutely not. I am not doing this anymore. This is stupid. I give up. And then somehow you figure out how to put your foot forward again and you you keep going. So it kind of suckers you in thinking it's a long, slow picnic. And then it becomes this weirdly sort of cathartic experience of being able to go beyond your limits. And I think I find that really addictive.
00:05:19
UKRunChat
Yeah, yeah, it it is, isn't it, I think? And I think when you get to the finish line under your own steam, I think it's quite, you're kind of like, I can't believe I just did that.
00:05:29
Mike Seaman
believe I did this. yeah i it's and the camaraderie on on the sort of trails and ulttras is i mean to be honest you get that across running and i think
00:05:36
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:05:36
Mike Seaman
with the national running show with all the things that we do like i'm looking enough to meet really cool people like from the elite runners right down to sort of just people like me like normal people and actually it's everyone's really cool everyone in running is really cool because we're all you know whether you run a super speedy five k or a long and slow ultra or a super speedy ultra they're They're generally just really nice people.
Conquering 200-Mile Races
00:06:01
UKRunChat
yeah just tell us about the tell us about the 200 mile race well i'm calling it a race it's obviously not ah a race is it but how was it how does it compare to 100 i've never done 100 the most i've ever done is 100k so 100 miles to me sounds like who way out there but a 200 mile race like how long does that even take somebody
00:06:20
Mike Seaman
Well, well this it took me three and a half days. um so the
00:06:22
UKRunChat
oh
00:06:24
Mike Seaman
So the 100 milers, put that into perspective, if if you've done 100k, mean, 100k is tough. That is a a long stretch. So what, 62 miles? So the 100 miler, kind of the benchmark time for 100 miler is 24 hours.
00:06:38
Mike Seaman
That's kind of like, I'd probably say like about the four hour marathon mark. It's kind of, you know, I'm i'm a middle of the pack runner.
00:06:41
UKRunChat
Wow.
00:06:44
Mike Seaman
I'm certainly not winning anything. um And I'd gone to the point where I can run 100 miles in under 24 hours. And now I was starting to do that. I did the Javelina, which is in the desert. So that's in the Arizona desert.
00:06:55
Mike Seaman
It was like five 20 mile loops. Amazing race, like festival feel. So I did that as a training run for the 200, which sounds completely ridiculous.
00:07:02
UKRunChat
That was bonkers, isn't it? Yeah.
00:07:06
Mike Seaman
So, and I was told by a friend of mine that you probably need to, it's probably going to take you three times whatever your 100 mile time is. So I'd set myself a target of doing in three days. But the cutoff time is four days. So very generous cutoff time. you You could probably hike the whole thing if you if you could manage your sleep and things like that well. um and get and get there within the four hour cut-off. So it's 200 miles, it's the north and the south down, it's connected by the vanguards and the St Swithins.
00:07:40
Mike Seaman
It's a beautiful route, so it's in the south of England, um but it's in December, so it's it's cold and a bit slippy and slimy. It can be really rainy and s snowy. um we We got quite quite good weather. um and Because it's so long, you actually you have to factor in sleep. So 100 miles you can go just through the night, but for a 200, you really have to think about your sleep strategy.
00:08:07
Mike Seaman
So they have kind of three life stations around the course where you can you can sleep. Or if you're crude, which some people are, you in in a dedicated cruise stop, you can sleep in the back of a van. You just have to let them know that that's what you're doing. and So I went for the second option because what i what I wanted to do was have kind of an order of breakfast, lunch, dinner, sleep. And that was that was my plan so that you didn't just become lost in this weird situation time lapse.
00:08:36
Mike Seaman
So my aim was to try and run as much as I could in the daytime, which there was, yeah it's at that time of year it's 16 hours of darkness, so you're predominantly in the dark.
00:08:44
UKRunChat
Yes.
00:08:46
Mike Seaman
But the breakfast, lunch, dinner at least meant that was running in the daytime. So I still, the first 70 miles are actually all right. um They kind of, i ran along with this guy called Duncan, who I'd never met before, but actually we we ran probably that most of that period together.
00:09:02
Mike Seaman
um The Vanguard way at that time of year is really slimy and horrible. It's like, so every time you're taking ah a step forward, you're kind of sliding backwards. You know, it's, your feet are underwater quite a lot. So if you're going to do this race, I'd certainly advise waterproof socks. um And it was, it was, it was tough. It was, the North Downs is actually quite easy going, quite good going, but the Vanguard is just, there's a ah few water,
00:09:29
Mike Seaman
not really river crossings but a bit where your feet are quite definitely fully submerged um and it was just grim going, you just it's it's kind of a trudge. Then you get out onto the South Downs and you see the sunset and the sunrise on the South Downs, probably the most beautiful thing you could ever see and you're running along and everybody's in good spirits and I got to the van and i had a couple of hours sleep in the back of the van and I woke up and I was like giving it all the big one for social media and skipping out and I was really happy. I was like, I am going to smash this. I was miles ahead of my time and I was like, I'm amazing. know if you will realize I am amazing. um And I felt like that going into the second night and I was like, this is my hubris. think you see where this is going. um
00:10:15
Mike Seaman
and
00:10:15
UKRunChat
show.
00:10:16
Mike Seaman
And yeah, so i'm like I'm just having a really good time. Duncan and i separated, he was struggling a bit. And so we we agreed to sort of go our own way, which is kind of the rule of these things. You you meet up with people for a bit and then you move move on. but ah And then I just sort of just just started predominantly on my own from that point. But you you there's not many people doing this kind of a race. I think there are about 100 signed up, maybe 80 actually made the start line. And I think probably half of that finished. um And going into the second night, I was doing okay. It was, you know, obviously things are starting to hurt at this point, but I was making really good time and you're still on the South Downs. So I think you do, i mean, it's quite a long stretch on the South Downs, but for anyone knows the South Downs, it's it's not flat.
00:11:03
Mike Seaman
it's got some It's got some lumps and bumps in it. um But I was feeling good. I was really positive and I was going into the aid stations going, what's up dudes, I'm feeling really cool. Like, you know, being the big man. And um then I went into the night time, just didn't sleep.
00:11:18
Mike Seaman
um And I really struggled to sleep that night.
00:11:19
UKRunChat
Thank you.
00:11:20
Mike Seaman
So like I lay down for two hours in the van, wasn't really sleeping. So I was like, right, just going get up and go. And I went. and And that's where sleep really came into this. I think physically, actually, I was probably in the best condition I've ever been in. a like I ah trained really hard for this and really put some effort into it.
00:11:39
Mike Seaman
and And my legs were kind of holding up, um but the sleep just really started to get to me. I remember we came into Kewi Park um in the morning and i was like, I think I just need another little sleep. I said, can I just sleep for 20 seconds? and So I sat in the front of the van. I think I must slept for a couple of eight minutes or something. And that helped.
00:12:01
Mike Seaman
But going into that third day, I then started to hallucinate. And I don't know if um and in 100K, but certainly in in a lot of ultras, people do tend to hallucinate. And it's it's not always like crazy stuff. It's often things at the edge of your vision that it's a tree and it starts to look like a face or something like that.
00:12:21
Mike Seaman
And I was seeing a lot of that. But I'd never had this in the daytime before. um And so it was really, it was a bit weird, I was finding it quite funny. It was like I was drunk. And no I was just having,
00:12:31
UKRunChat
Yeah. So you knew it was hallucination. You weren't like, you were fully aware that it was your you mind playing tricks on you.
00:12:35
Mike Seaman
Yeah.
00:12:38
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:12:38
Mike Seaman
Yeah, because you're aware of it because it's always at the edge of your vision. You're like, oh, yeah, not that over there. And so it started, it it was it was controllable, but I was falling a bit behind my time, and I really wanted to finish in three days.
00:12:51
Mike Seaman
um So we get to the evening bit, and I'd had a bit of a weird day, but I'd hallucinate a bit but I was eating okay and I thought you know what if I push through i reckon I can still make it in under three days um and so I'm not going to sleep I'm just going to carry on and in my mind that was a really good idea and that was not a really good idea so what happens then is the wheels really started to fall off and I was Once I'm into the night, I'm fully hallucinating.
00:13:21
Mike Seaman
i'm like One mile took me an hour to do on my walk. And I was just walking around in circles in a field. I'd convinced myself that my watch was evil. and My watch was my navigation source.
00:13:33
Mike Seaman
So I wasn't listening to it.
00:13:33
UKRunChat
Oh, God.
00:13:35
Mike Seaman
um so I was just walking around in circles. And then I was climbing over stiles and through fences. At one point I like just lay down in the middle of the field and like, what am I doing? And you have obviously quite a lot of emergency equipment in your bag, and including a bivvy bag. So if you get stuck, you just get into that and have a sleep. I thought, well, okay, I'll have a little sleep. um So I did that. i got in the bivvy bag, had a little sleep, to see if that would work. It didn't really help, um but um you get calls as well. So the race...
00:14:04
Mike Seaman
you have a tracker on you all times. So the race will ring you going, what are you doing? And if you stop outside of a crew point, you have to let them know. My crew were calling me.
00:14:12
UKRunChat
Oh, so they could see you walking around in circles at this point.
00:14:12
Mike Seaman
i Yeah, yeah. so what but and they But they can't help you.
00:14:14
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:14:17
Mike Seaman
You've got to you've got to navigate.
00:14:18
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:14:18
Mike Seaman
and But at this point, starting to really see stuff, like like quite scary stuff. like So in front of me, I've got all these cartoon like football players and big cartoons, and they just they're like popped up. And it's like I have to run to them, and then they fall flat in front of me, and I have to run over them. It's really weird. And I see like lots of creepy faces in the trees and stuff. And it was it was really odd. And one of my...
00:14:43
Mike Seaman
So my crew chief was a lady, Emma Harris. she's She's amazing. She's um a very good doctor in her own right. She volunteered for the whole time to help me. She's a GP as well.
00:14:53
Mike Seaman
She went back and did a surgery on one of the days while my other friend Sean sort of took the crew, Sean and Seb, and she did a surgery, then came back that night to crew me. So anyway, so you ring them occasionally.
00:15:04
UKRunChat
Yeah. yeah
00:15:05
Mike Seaman
and I was coming, i'd I'd managed to sort of get myself back on track once I'd had like a little slip, but I still was really, by this point, it's like you're dealing with a giant drunk teenager.
00:15:17
Mike Seaman
um And I was, she was like, where are you? And I was, I was coming, I think it might be in Farnham I was coming into. And um i so I'm just coming into the town now. i'm coming down the road.
00:15:28
Mike Seaman
I'm just coming past the tree of clowns and the giant Matt Damon statue. ah And she just crashed with the what? Oh, no.
00:15:39
Mike Seaman
it's like And, you know, when you can hear yourself saying so, and it's really real. It just, oh, no, there is no Matt Damon statue in Farnham. Sorry, Matt Damon, you maybe you need one.
00:15:50
Mike Seaman
um But I made it, yeah and And you just get down and I got into the town and they were feeding me. And at this point, they changed the fueling strategy because three days have gone. It was just now about, can I get to the end?
00:16:01
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:16:03
Mike Seaman
And the last 20 miles, it felt like they took i mean i don't know how long they actually did took but it took forever because i was really struggling they switched me to chocolate and red bull to try and get me focused um i was falling asleep as i was running i i went into this phase of like repeatedly unpacking my bag and i wouldn't really know why like you become quite obsessive about your admin on these sort of races and I looked at the floor at one point, and I'm i'm in the in the woods or whatever the trail is, and and someone's trying to help me like repack my bag.
00:16:38
Mike Seaman
They're like, you okay? What are you doing? I'm like, no, it's all fine. I'm just ordering they're like, what am I doing? Like, why is all my stuff out? And so you just then frantically pack everything back in, move again.
00:16:48
Mike Seaman
And actually all the other runners were really good and supportive. And I think everybody's had a moment on ah on an ultra run like this where you go a bit crazy and they were all just really nice and trying to help.
00:16:53
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:16:59
Mike Seaman
But the worst bit was it was about 180. And I i i was running along. I was i felt like i'd I'd got back into the groove. And then I just heard this ringing, like really loud ringing. And it was it was my phone. And I was in the bivvy bag, asleep at the side of the trail in the middle of the day.
00:17:21
Mike Seaman
ah don't remember getting there. i don't know how I got there. And...
Community and Support in Ultra Running
00:17:25
Mike Seaman
It was Emma and she rang me and she was like, what are you doing? I was like, I'm asleep. And I was the and we had a big argument like a parent and a teenager. and She's like, get out of the bivvy bag. i was like, no, I'm staying in bed. She's like, get up. was like, no. And she's like, well,
00:17:43
Mike Seaman
you're about a mile away from the aid station and no one's coming to get you. So you either live there now or you get up and you come and come to us. And I was like, okay. So that's everything else I went there.
00:17:52
UKRunChat
Thank you.
00:17:54
Mike Seaman
But in the end, I sort of, we we got there and it was, it was, It was a really, really tough mental and physical experience. But I think the the sleep deprivation was really, really difficult to deal with.
00:18:09
Mike Seaman
But when I crossed the line, it was the biggest anticlimax of all time. Because, you know, when you're so dead everyone's like, yeah, and you're like... i'll just have a bacon and egg and then go to bed. um But actually the next day when I sort of just went back and and thought about it, um it was I'm actually really proud of it because I really went to the end of my limits there. I think I could have i think i i should have done things better. i think I should definitely have taken more sleep. um
00:18:40
Mike Seaman
But I was really proud of myself that I crossed. It took me about three and a half days to do 200 miles on really difficult terrain. in really difficult weather. And actually, there were lot of times when I probably couldn't have done it.
00:18:53
Mike Seaman
and shouldn't have done it but some of my really good friends so emma like deserves i wouldn't have finished it without her 100 she was amazing and seb and sean and kate and all of the people who came out lots of people came out like some of them on a night out they'd be in the pub and they'd just be like come and wave at you and then they'd go back to the pub and you'd be like i'm not sure if this is healthy or it's good but it was just really nice and We raised a ton of money. like I support all of the challenges that I do generally for Birmingham Children's Hospital um and the running show. And a lot of the shows that Raccoon organise are in Birmingham. And we just built a really good relationship with Mark, who's the CEO there. And actually, I've been to the hospital a few times. And you see a children's hospital and you see some of the things that those poor kids have to go through. And it just gives you a real motivation to go out and keep going. So we
00:19:47
Mike Seaman
We raised really good money for Birmingham Children's Hospital, which i was really pleased with. So, yeah, I mean, I'm not sure do it again, though. Do
00:19:55
UKRunChat
Wouldn't you? No. Well, not that one. Would you do another 200? Do you feel the need to keep going? Like, at what point do you stop?
00:20:01
Mike Seaman
you know what? That's the thing I don't know, is the honest answer. i' want to I think for probably a month afterwards, I was like, not a chance would I go and do it again. And I think actually I've got a year where a lot of people helped me on that that race. Like they really did help and they gave time.
00:20:19
Mike Seaman
and i think I owe them some time back now. So I think this year I've got a crew a few races. i want to volunteer at a few races, just try and be be a good citizen to the running community. But then maybe, maybe, maybe I'll do something else.
00:20:34
Mike Seaman
I don't, you know, maybe not that race again, because I feel like I've done that one now. um But maybe, maybe it would be easier this time. I don't know. It's like, i was I did a podcast the other day and someone suggested that I do the spine.
00:20:47
UKRunChat
I was that was literally on the tip of my tongue. Yeah, that's the next logical step, isn't it?
00:20:51
Mike Seaman
Have you been watching it though?
00:20:52
UKRunChat
I have.
00:20:52
Mike Seaman
Like it's awful.
00:20:52
UKRunChat
is Yeah, it's addictive.
00:20:53
Mike Seaman
Yeah.
00:20:54
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:20:56
Mike Seaman
It looks so hard. um
00:20:57
UKRunChat
Yeah, it does.
00:20:58
Mike Seaman
So i do I don't know. is yours i I do feel that the 200 was probably the limit of my ability. um But i would have said that when I first ran a 50 and I said that when I first ran a 100. And it just, you know what seems mad?
00:21:12
Mike Seaman
It's the fact I did a 100 mile run as a training run this year.
00:21:15
UKRunChat
yeah
00:21:16
Mike Seaman
And...
00:21:16
UKRunChat
that's correct how did that feel that hundred knowing that you then had to do double that
00:21:23
Mike Seaman
I felt good
Training for Extremes
00:21:24
Mike Seaman
actually. And I was really surprised because it was in the desert and I was, and I'm not very good in the heat. Um, I've always struggled previously in the heat. So that I was really worried and I, I managed myself really carefully in that one.
00:21:24
UKRunChat
yeah
00:21:36
Mike Seaman
Um, but the route was cause it was five, 20, 20 mile loops that, that kind of felt, it just felt like five loops.
00:21:40
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:21:43
Mike Seaman
so felt quite manageable mentally. um it's obviously difficult each time you go past the end to go, I've got to go out again. um But i I, yeah, I actually, I found that one was okay. It was really in the daytime when it was hot, I was just, you had to have these ice bandanas on your neck and you had ice in your arm sleeves, ice in your hat, and it would just melt after about, you know, 40 minutes.
00:22:07
Mike Seaman
um So that was a real challenge and fueling in that was a challenge just to take on actually solid food was quite quite difficult because of the weather. um But the fact that I could do that actually gave me a real confidence boost going into it.
00:22:22
Mike Seaman
I didn't set out to get time. I just went out to get round. And I think, again, that approach of going to a race with no expectations other than the finish line, um I think was really nice.
00:22:33
Mike Seaman
And I kind of I think if I did do another big challenge again, I think it would be something that I just had to finish, not where I was going against the clock.
00:22:40
UKRunChat
Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, that sounds good. I mean, how does suffering like voluntarily like that for 100, 200 miles, that's got to change your kind of perspective on life in general, hasn't it?
00:22:52
UKRunChat
And work, does that must impact other areas of your life now that give you a bit of resilience.
00:22:57
Mike Seaman
i i think so i think it's I think resilience is it. And I think, you know, is is when you set up your own business, like, I think that's kind of one of the main things that you need. And i i just don't like to quit.
00:23:12
Mike Seaman
um And I think there's always a way forwards. And I think running teaches you that. And if, you everyone has ah Everyone has a bad day and everyone has a race that they fail. um That's okay.
00:23:23
Mike Seaman
And everyone has a bad training run and all of those things. But you can get up the next day and go again. And that's the beauty about running is it just shows you that whatever however bad it is today, it can be a lot better tomorrow.
00:23:30
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:23:35
Mike Seaman
And i love that. And I just love the ability that someone like me has to cover 200 miles. Whereas if have told that to me, Even 10 years ago, i would never have believed you, never in a million years.
00:23:50
Mike Seaman
But now I know
00:23:50
UKRunChat
Where were you? What kind of a runaway 10 years ago then?
00:23:53
Mike Seaman
Oh, I was probably, i was I was a regular, I'd done a 50 miler and I say I could do a half marathon. um i yeah was as i one of those people that could go and run a half marathon without thinking, without training too hard for it.
00:24:05
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:24:07
Mike Seaman
um But a marathon I would have had to properly train for. um i wouldn't have run a fast half marathon, just to be clear. um I was i probably running two, three times a week. I had a physique like a pregnant giraffe. um So, you know, I was a little bit tubby, but i've got long legs, so I could keep going. um you would You wouldn't have been worried about me if you were in a race. Yeah.
00:24:32
UKRunChat
Yes. So a lot's changed really in you, wouldn't How do you fit the training in for a 200 mile event like that? Because you've you've got a a busy job, you know, you're CEO, youve you you know, you must be really busy day to day.
00:24:44
UKRunChat
How does that work practically?
00:24:46
Mike Seaman
Yeah, and well, I've got two kids as well, and and it's sort of, it's difficult to fit it in is the short answer.
00:24:49
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:24:53
Mike Seaman
um i generally go early. I like to run before everybody else is up. And actually, I don't sleep a lot, which has always helped. um So I try and fit it in. I run at lunch breaks. i am I try and run commutes sometimes when I can, because I think i think those sort of things, da that junk time that you could have spent in a car,
00:25:14
Mike Seaman
Yeah, maybe it takes you half an hour longer if you run, but um it's utilising your exercise. So combining those methods of transport is quite helpful. um But the short answer is you just fit it in where you can.
00:25:27
Mike Seaman
um And it is inevitably a sacrifice. Do you know when I first started the running show, um i thought it'd be really authentic to do my meetings while I was running. So I used to take a lot of phone calls while I was running on the trails. And two things ah that are stupid about that. One is the reception's really bad, so you often lose all the calls. And the second is,
00:25:49
Mike Seaman
People find it really disconcerting if you were huffing and puffing down the phone to the room when you're running in along and you think, yeah, I'm all authentic and running there. Like, could you just sit still and not be weird?
00:25:59
UKRunChat
yeah stop panting down the phone
00:26:01
Mike Seaman
Yeah, it's just a bit creepy.
Inception of the National Running Show
00:26:04
UKRunChat
so where did the idea come from for the national running show because that's been going it'll be what eight eight years now
00:26:09
Mike Seaman
Yeah, it's well, it was i'd have the i have the idea when I did my first marathon. i Basically, I went to a marathon expo and... everyone it was really cool. I loved it. It was like there was trainers and all the stuff, all the nutrition. You could run on a treadmill as fast as you can and all of that kind of stuff.
00:26:27
Mike Seaman
But it was the day before my race. And I was like, actually, this is just really bad timing for me. that i I don't want to try anything new on race day. i want to i wanted Actually, all I want to do on race day is... get out this exhibition as quickly as possible, eat some pasta and not trip over anything. Because it's all of my race was the next day. So i rang a major marathon organiser, and was like, because I worked in exhibitions at that point, I just, in in a different sector.
00:26:57
Mike Seaman
And I rang the marathon organiser I went, I've got this great idea, you shouldn't do the show the day before the race, you should do it at the start of the season in January. And um they told me that i didn't know what we was talking about, and I was like, well, no, like I think I do. And they they were a little rude to me, and it sort of pinged my ego a little bit and I went, well, stuff for you, I'm going to do it myself then. And then I didn't, i I just sat on it for quite a few years before I got the guts to do it. And and one day I just went, well, it's now or never, you don't, and it was it was my wife and and she sort of, at the time we were driving back from a friend's house and she just went, well, you just stop talking about it and go and do it. um
00:27:40
Mike Seaman
And pretty much straight after that, I quit my job. set it up did we were in a shed in the back of my garden and probably six or seven years ago there that was the company head office um we've now got like a proper office and we're like a normal company now but back then it was that we used to call it the shop office uh which was in the garden and it was it was just a group of friends who kind of thought that the idea was good a lot of people worked for free just because they believed in it and
00:27:50
UKRunChat
wow
00:28:07
Mike Seaman
And we built it and we launched it. And the first running show outside of having kids is probably one of the best experiences of my life because it was just this thing that we made out a nothing.
00:28:20
Mike Seaman
and I didn't really believe it was real and for some reason on the first day before it opened I'd convinced myself no one was going to turn up. Even though we had like tens of thousands of people signed up, just no one was coming and it started to snow and normally for an exhibition that means 10% of your visitor numbers are off, no one comes early in the morning, all of the things.
00:28:41
Mike Seaman
And went to the door of the show and there were thousands of people in the queue before we were even opening. And I was just like, I blooming love runners. Runners are so cool. They will turn up rain or shine. And and it was just and that that show launched our company. you know it meant that i could It meant that my hobby was now my job. And it just it was just brilliant. it was such a great feature.
00:29:05
UKRunChat
That's cool. What were the biggest early challenges then of getting that going?
00:29:10
Mike Seaman
just people believing in it. I think people are instantly skeptical. but If you're an entrepreneurial and you're trying if you're entrepreneur and you're trying to do something new, everyone will tell you the reasons it won't work. Not because they're trying to be mean or negative, but it's just a lot easier to see the pitfalls of taking a risk than it is to see the opportunities for taking a risk. And actually, a lot of people were quite worried that I was giving up my safe corporate job and I was pursuing this thing.
00:29:36
Mike Seaman
And they all just didn't believe it would work and actually when we started talking to the brands it was difficult persuading them too um so we tried to alleviate that so the first thing i did was i booked the nec and i booked kelly holmes and they they were the first two things that was what i spent my money on it was all my all the money i had um and uh i was like let's you know let's get if we're gonna go we're gonna go um That gave people a little bit of comfort.
00:30:07
Mike Seaman
But it wasn't until the first year it traded and we had all that all the runners show up that people believed it would work. And then it just... Then the other challenges came in, which is, oh, now this is a proper company. we need to do we need to hire people. We need to do things properly. We need to scale this.
00:30:26
Mike Seaman
And luckily, because i've that was my background and I've got experience in scaling event businesses, I kind of... knew what to do next, but it was then bringing in professional people around us. And then it's then actually the challenge was trying to find people who have the same sort of values as you.
00:30:43
Mike Seaman
So I think running is is very values-based and it's very community-based.
00:30:47
UKRunChat
Yes.
00:30:49
Mike Seaman
I think people can smell insincerity quite easily. And I think we always talk about here, you've got to have passion and purpose for what you're doing. And ah once we we brought in some really good people and they have really advanced the business. And I'm really fortunate with the people that we've got here now. They're all generally people that you'd want to hang out with. They're really cool.
00:31:11
UKRunChat
Yeah. So how how's the show evolved then since that first one back in, was it 2018, the first Yeah.
00:31:18
Mike Seaman
Yeah, the first one said, it's massive now.
00:31:19
UKRunChat
yeah
00:31:19
Mike Seaman
It's
Growth and Impact of the National Running Show
00:31:20
Mike Seaman
massive. but So the idea was always, I want it to be like the coolest running shop you can ever go to, with a load of celebrities just showing up for banter.
00:31:30
Mike Seaman
And it was, so inspiration kit, tech, nutrition advice, races, all over a weekend, all crammed in. And and now, if how it's evolved, I think it's probably six or seven times the size of what it was.
00:31:44
Mike Seaman
I think brands activate really well. So we're runners, we like to know what's new and what's coming out. And think it's it's really important that we now do have the variety of products because I'm a big believer in specialist running shops and specialty quality advice.
00:31:59
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:32:00
Mike Seaman
um i think, unfortunately, there's not many of them out there. And those that are out there can only carry limited stock because they're small businesses, right? So the they can't show you everything.
00:32:10
Mike Seaman
And I think running is... Running is very personal and the right pair shoes for me is not necessarily the right pair of shoes for you. And actually before you choose, you should try everything or as much as you can. And i think that's what the running show allows you to do. It allows you to get that breadth and depth of choice, breadth and depth of sizes and actually try cool random stuff, especially in nutrition and fueling. There is...
00:32:34
Mike Seaman
ah no rhyme or reason to what works for different people with nutrition um and it's really important that you try all the different things and and find what works for you um and what works for me is on on a 200 miler is definitely not what works for somebody over there on a 5k um and and i think you you see a lot of that that cool stuff there but then i mean just the speaker lineup now is just incredible i'll give you some of the speakers hang on i wanted to tell you something
00:32:59
UKRunChat
Yeah, go on. i was going to ask who's on this year.
00:33:01
Mike Seaman
Well, so don't the first name i'm going to give you is Carl Lewis, who literally is one of the greatest Olympians of all time. We were lucky enough to have him speak at one of our American shows, and he's he's amazing.
00:33:14
Mike Seaman
But I literally grew up watching him on the TV. We've got Tom Evans, who's had a fantastic year on the ultra circuit. You've got Laura Muir. Philly Bowden, Harry Judd, Ewan Thomas, Susie Chan. Hang on, I'm going to give you a few more.
00:33:28
Mike Seaman
Georgia Hunter Bell, Jason Foxy Fox, Colin Jackson, um Sophie Power, Dean Conazes, who's the guy that I mentioned earlier, whose book I read, who got me into runnings. Harry Akinzariti, he's a former GB sprinter who also is on Gladiators as Nitro.
00:33:48
UKRunChat
Oh, cool.
00:33:48
Mike Seaman
Roger Black.
00:33:48
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:33:49
Mike Seaman
Yeah, yeah, my kids are very excited about that.
00:33:51
UKRunChat
ah yes
00:33:51
Mike Seaman
um Roger Black, and people from all over, but just such a really strong sort lineup of line up a speakers. Some of the best, ultra runners in the world, some great Olympians, and some just really generally inspiring people. But if you have a look on nationalrunningshow.com, you can see that the full list.
00:34:10
Mike Seaman
But there's also other cool stuff you can do. Like there's a travelator that you can run up. There's like Pilates classes. There's a gym session area. So, again being a good runner is is about having a balanced and varied training program and sort of they's so we do talk about that holistic training as well and the other things that you can do i hate the fact that i just said the word good runner there's no such thing as a good runner but helping you helping you do better within your running actually it's important that you blend your training and do other things as well
00:34:32
UKRunChat
I knew what you meant. Yeah.
00:34:39
UKRunChat
Yeah. yeah is Is that something you incorporate into your own training to do a lot of strength work and mobility?
00:34:43
Mike Seaman
yeah i do actually i yeah i i tend i try not to double run day too often So I tend to have one day on one day off unless I'm really training for something.
00:34:54
Mike Seaman
And I try and mix that with strength training. I play a bit of squash every now and then still. I try and run around with the kids in the garden. and My son's really into cricket. So every now and then when the sun's out, we'll we'll go to the nets and things like that.
00:35:08
Mike Seaman
So yeah, you you try and mix it up. I think it's really important and good to be very, a hike a lot as well. um
00:35:14
UKRunChat
Yeah, that helps, doesn't it especially with ultra running. Yeah, because a lot of that happens during the event.
00:35:17
Mike Seaman
Yeah. I mean, a lot of,
00:35:19
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:35:19
Mike Seaman
Yeah, a lot of people underestimate how training your walk is quite important for ultras because you're going to be walking, you know, if you're like me, sort of 40, 50% the time. um So if you can if you can walk it walk with purpose, as as one of our speakers said at one of the shows, then it it can really, that can save you a few hours on your finish time.
00:35:39
UKRunChat
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. um So just going back to the National Running Show then, what kind of, is it for every runner? Is there something there for the beginner? Is there something there for the more experienced runner?
00:35:51
Mike Seaman
Yeah, and I think that was the premise when we started it. the two Two statements we went with. One is, no matter how far or fast you go, and the second was, if you take one step, you're a runner. And that's the underlying principle of the running show. it's The other shows that we're out there with for people who are running a marathon, this is if you're starting out as a 5K or if you're a club runner at five k who's smashing out super quick times, or if you wanna try your first ultra or you wanna try your first marathon right the way through to if you're a serial offender or a repeat participant, and And I think we've got the different programs have different things for you. There's I think there's four different stages now, each of which cover different disciplines. A lot of them have introduction to content. You have trail content, you have road content. And and the unifying point is the word running.
00:36:38
Mike Seaman
But actually everything else is whichever way you want to approach the show, whatever shape, size, whatever your background, you're welcome. And yeah hopefully there's there's something there for you.
00:36:49
UKRunChat
yeah So what what trends are you seeing in kind of running at the moment in the UK? Because you've obviously got a really broad overview of it all, haven't you? What's what's new and what's really trendy at the moment?
Trends in the Running World
00:37:00
Mike Seaman
Yeah, i think there's I think we're seeing people really move away from roads and towards trail and ultra. That seems to be the development.
00:37:06
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:37:08
Mike Seaman
Road is road is still big and still very important, but you're you're seeing a huge interest in trail and ultra. And a couple of years ago, we saw the shit. So we always go, what's your favorite distance for the audience?
00:37:19
Mike Seaman
It's always 5K, and then it's 10K, then it's half marathon. But a couple of years ago, the the next favorite became ultra marathon ahead of marathon.
00:37:29
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:37:29
Mike Seaman
which was really interesting. and And that's continued in the last few years. And I think we're a reasonably good snapshot of the UK running market.
00:37:40
Mike Seaman
and Globally, not so much. So we have shows in other and countries now as well. it's But it's still that sort of 10K half marathon is still the most popular distances. um But internationally, the the trail and ultra market in the Middle East is is quite ah quite underdeveloped.
00:37:59
Mike Seaman
In the US, probably similar to here.
00:38:03
UKRunChat
Yeah. Yeah.
00:38:03
UKRunChat
Why do you think ultra running is gaining in popularity over marathons in the UK then? What's your take on that?
00:38:03
Mike Seaman
I think not.
00:38:10
Mike Seaman
I know. I think it's more available now than it was. And I think when when I read that book, the Dean Karnasas book, he really is yeah the guy who sort of popularised ultramarathon running.
00:38:15
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:38:23
Mike Seaman
ah Ultramarathon Man is his book. I'm not on commission, but I feel like I should be because I keep recommending it.
00:38:27
UKRunChat
It's a great book. It's a really good book.
00:38:28
Mike Seaman
Yeah, it it it is a great book.
00:38:29
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:38:30
Mike Seaman
And Dean's at the show. He's a lovely man. but I've had the pleasure of meeting him a couple of times. He's amazing. um But I think back then it was just coming into popularity. And i think what's happening, if you run a marathon, the first thing anybody asks you is how fast did you do it?
00:38:45
Mike Seaman
If you run a 100k like you did, everyone goes, holy, that's amazing. Like you're you're a legend. you're And no one really cares about the time. And I think actually that's probably the reason. I think it's yeah it just allows you to engage with the race in your own way, as opposed to necessarily this arbitrary what a good time is.
00:39:07
Mike Seaman
And there isn't that, you know, a marathon is a distance. It's not a time. is's A good time is whatever it took you. is it Did you have a good time? Yeah.
00:39:14
UKRunChat
Yeah, yeah and and yeah. And what did you eat on the way?
00:39:17
Mike Seaman
Yeah, now you're talking. Maybe you can be friends.
00:39:20
UKRunChat
And did you hallucinate any Matt Damon statues?
00:39:22
Mike Seaman
yeah
00:39:22
UKRunChat
I've not got that yet. I'm never at that point, to be fair.
00:39:27
Mike Seaman
Maybe it's there. Maybe I might go back to Farnham and see if he's there.
00:39:30
UKRunChat
Yeah. can Can anybody confirm?
00:39:32
Mike Seaman
Yeah. let's message Let's message Matt Damon and see if he's been to Farnham.
00:39:33
UKRunChat
mean,
00:39:38
UKRunChat
i mean how how have How has running brands changed in the in recent years then? Have their priorities changed? Because obviously you're kind of you're accessing both markets, that you're helping kind of brands get to runners and vice versa really.
00:39:46
Mike Seaman
Yeah.
00:39:55
Mike Seaman
Yeah, I think there's a lot of passion led startups and I think we mustn't underestimate how much of the running community is from people like us who just genuinely love running and have an idea. um and And actually, I think that's what's beautiful about the running show is those people don't normally get a chance to talk.
00:40:12
Mike Seaman
to runners on mass at the scale that they do at the running shows. So it really does help those entrepreneurial brands. And then you've at the top end of the mark. So there's loads of those way more than there were when we started. they're just That entrepreneurial startup brand just culture seems to really be thriving. um At the top end of the market, ah you've really seen price points changing, particularly super shoes and carbon plates. And actually, the prices have have gone up quite significantly in the last 10 years, alongside the boom in running. But actually you're also seeing the influx of brands, particularly from the Far East, um that previously were kind of low price point, low quality, but are now reasonably me midpoint on pricing, but very high quality as well. So the quality of the the goods from the Far East is is significantly better. And actually those challenger brands are now really kind of dividing the market.
00:41:11
Mike Seaman
And you've seen brands like Onn and Hoka, which are still reasonably new, um really take massive slices of the market um by being niche and credible and and strong. And I think Hoka in particular were really credible as a as a trail brand for quite some time.
00:41:31
Mike Seaman
And then you have the big brands like Nike. So Nike had an interesting strategy where they they pulled away from retailers for a while. They went direct to consumer and they've reversed that now and they've gone back using their specialty retail connections.
00:41:44
Mike Seaman
So I think the evolution into trail, the the increasing price point, the increased competition, um that there's there's quite a lot going on, but it's all underpinned by a market that is just exploding.
00:41:58
Mike Seaman
Like running is running is in a moment right now.
00:41:58
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:42:01
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:42:02
Mike Seaman
adam And I really ah passionately think that's a great thing because at its base point running is one of the most accessible sports you can do. Most people have access to a pair of trainers and a safe place to run.
00:42:13
Mike Seaman
And at its core, that's all you need. You don't need any of the fancy stuff. And actually, if you're thinking about it, just put your shoes on and go out for a run. And the rest of the stuff,
00:42:25
Mike Seaman
you know, it does help. It does really help building into your training, but just try not to forget what it's about. It's about, it's about the joy of being out there in nature, running around.
00:42:35
UKRunChat
Yeah, we can get caught up with the super shoes really, can't we? And yeah, they're nice.
00:42:38
Mike Seaman
Yeah. They don't really help me much of the speed I run.
00:42:42
UKRunChat
There's the whole kind of sustainability angle though as well. i'm I'm noticing a lot more brands talking about that side of things. And we've got movements like the Green Runners who are kind of helping people make more
00:42:52
Mike Seaman
Yep.
Sustainability and Future Plans
00:42:54
UKRunChat
informed choices.
00:42:54
UKRunChat
Have you seen more of that coming into the National Running Show?
00:42:58
Mike Seaman
100% and I think that's that. um Really from the day we started, sustainability was a thing. and i i don't talk about it as much anymore because it's kind of just an assumed position. i think brands, we as runners expect brands to be environmentally conscious and we we expect them to operate sustainable practices.
00:43:21
Mike Seaman
I think it's, you you see a lot of people taking some quite sort of, that you know, there's organisations you can join, there's quite much sure you can get, there's accreditation you can get. um Weirdly, I think in the US that started to come off a little bit.
00:43:36
Mike Seaman
I think there's less interest in sustainability, which is a shame, I think.
00:43:36
UKRunChat
Okay.
00:43:40
Mike Seaman
And I, know, I think we have to protect the planet. I personally believe it's quite important. And I think it's really important that you make sustainable choices. I really love a lot of the initiatives around, i don't know if you've come across Jogon, but we, so we work with them at the running show and if you are coming to the show and you've got old shoes, they will repurpose or recycle your shoes.
00:43:53
UKRunChat
Yes, yeah.
00:44:01
Mike Seaman
So there's collection bins at the running show, we can take them away. um I think there's a lot of reuse, repurpose, recycle out there. And and I think that that's quite important.
00:44:15
Mike Seaman
I think that comes from the runners themselves in the main, but I think a lot of the brands, particularly the European brands, are really sustainably conscious in their production methods.
00:44:25
UKRunChat
Yeah. Yeah. Oh, that's, that's really good to know actually about the old trainers so people can just bring along ah old kids as well, or just rimming shoes.
00:44:30
Mike Seaman
Yeah.
00:44:33
Mike Seaman
So we did have a kit recycling. I don't know if it's on this year, if I'm honest. I think we the the organization that we work with, I think couldn't do it anymore. So I think it's just the trainers, but i will confirm.
00:44:41
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:44:43
UKRunChat
Yeah. So what are you most excited about for this year's show then, Mike? Anything we can't miss?
00:44:47
Mike Seaman
i'm bringing it I'm bringing my kids up and so i'm really excited to have them there on the Sunday and they ah they're very excited about seeing nighttro
00:44:51
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:44:57
Mike Seaman
because he's there and he's going to be in the queue. If you're there on the second day start of the show, he's going to... Oh, I think that's a surprise, so don't tell anyone. But yeah.
00:45:08
Mike Seaman
Cole Lewis for me, Dean Connance, he fundamentally changed my life because I started running auctions because of him.
00:45:10
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:45:16
Mike Seaman
Do you know what love? I love walking around the aisles and bumping into runners. And I just, I love that environment. And then I'll probably buy some stuff because I'm a sucker for it. And I do need stuff. I go through trainers like nobody's business. um And I do need some new kit. So there's always, there's always cool stuff that you find that you didn't know you were going find. But for me, it's the talks and it's the community and and just the people.
00:45:44
UKRunChat
Yeah, it is nice saying hello to people that we normally just see in our phones, isn't it? And, you know, yeah, put face to her.
00:45:48
Mike Seaman
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, or at the start of the race for like two minutes.
00:45:53
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:45:53
Mike Seaman
And then you don't see them at the end because you've finished at different times or whatever.
00:45:57
UKRunChat
Yeah. Oh, thanks, Mike. It's been really great talking to you today. and So just remind us when the National Winner Show is, how we can sign up
00:46:06
Mike Seaman
So it's in two weeks. So it's the last weekend of January. So it's the 31st and the 1st. So 31st of January, 1st of February. And if you go to nationalrunningshow.com, then you can get your tickets there.
00:46:19
UKRunChat
Yeah, fantastic. And lots to look forward to, including a real-life bodybuilder.
00:46:22
Mike Seaman
Awesome. Thank you so much for having me on.
00:46:25
UKRunChat
Yeah, it it's been fascinating, yeah. Especially hearing all about 200 miles and hallucinations. Yeah, brilliant.
00:46:31
Mike Seaman
it's been nice, John.
00:46:32
UKRunChat
Yeah.
00:46:33
Mike Seaman
always been nice cha
00:46:33
UKRunChat
i will Well, thank you very much. It's been brilliant to chat. and And for anyone listening, I'll include all the links in the show notes to the National Running Show. If you've enjoyed this episode, please do subscribe, leave us a review and share it with a running friend.
00:46:46
UKRunChat
Thanks for listening and I'll see you on the next episode.