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Spring Marathon Round-Up 2025 | London and Manchester Marathons
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It was a big year for marathons at the Run Testers. Nick and Kieran took on London Marathon for another time and Tom nipped up north to try out Manchester Marathon. In this podcast (also available as a video on YouTube) we chat through both events, from the course and crowds to the kit we wore on the day.
Big thanks to Fear of Tigers for the killer intro music. You can listen to more of his stuff over at https://www.patreon.com/fearoftigers
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Transcript
Introduction to Spring Marathons Episode
00:00:01
Speaker
Hey Tommy from the Run Testers and welcome back to the Run Testers podcast. In this episode we're going to be talking about the spring marathons that we've done. So myself, Nick and Kieran have all done marathons
Marathon Overview: Manchester vs London
00:00:11
Speaker
this spring. I did Manchester and they did London. so we're going to be talking about those events, the course, what it was like to get to the start line and how we performed on the day.
00:00:21
Speaker
This audio version is also available as a video version on YouTube so you'd rather watch that then maybe stop listening to this
Post-Marathon Reflections: Energy Levels and Experience
00:00:28
Speaker
now. Right, let's dive in and talk about spring marathons.
00:00:38
Speaker
Hey guys, how's it going? Hello. Hello. Yeah, live. Yeah, low energy. Low energy, yeah. We would we don't normally record this ah quickly after finishing the marathons, but um another year of spring marathons.
00:00:51
Speaker
Pretty much the big ones are an end, aren't they? There's probably a few more. like Copenhagen in a couple of weeks, but yeah. Yeah, so us three, we've all done marathons all on the same day, not the same marathon, but um we've done London and Manchester yesterday i and pretty pretty positive views all around, I imagine.
00:01:10
Speaker
On the event itself was just a general a feel from from both
Emotional Impact: Joy vs Overwhelm
00:01:15
Speaker
of you. The buzz, I mean, it was it was great. I had a really lovely time. Excellent. I've just been editing the race test video that we've done for London and Nick is a lot more joyful than i was. I'm slightly more grumpy. Nick's like, yeah, everything's brilliant. This was great.
00:01:30
Speaker
i was a bit like, I wish they would turn the volume down on London. Yeah. Well, I saw a photo of afterwards, a video you posted on no your Instagram and you looked quite tired. I was a bit beat. Yeah. but yeahll We'll dive into the reasons for maybe why that second half was hard later,
London Marathon Insights and Records
00:01:43
Speaker
shall we, Kieran? Yeah, yeah there ah there is a good reason for that.
00:01:46
Speaker
Well, we've done our um we're not going to go into too much detail about the actual races themselves because we've done our guides. Well, we've done our guide for London, which people can um watch or listen to if they want to. But what we'll do is just chat through the marathons and our experiences this year. So the first thing to do is to start with London, because you both did that one and it's the most positive experience.
00:02:07
Speaker
event out of the two from us all. Diving the darkness of Tom's Manchester journey. Yeah, I'll save that for treat for you. um So let's talk about ah London as an event this year. How did it all go down? What was it what's the crowds like? All that sort of thing. Biggest biggest field ever, I think. wasn't it Is that right? I've got an email saying I was part of a Guinness World Record, which I didn't know. Paris had nicked it, hadn't they? and then Paris nicked it? always thought it was New York. Anyway, sorry.
00:02:33
Speaker
I think Paris took it, whatever, well was a week ago, wasn't it? Was it a week ago? A couple of weeks back. Oh yeah, a couple of weeks ago.
Challenges of the London Marathon: Heat and Crowds
00:02:39
Speaker
And London have now got it with 56,000 something or other. 56 very hot people, that sounds really fair to say. I had a moment on the way back, it was quite warm yesterday, it's fair to say, and I had a moment thinking, it wasn't so bad, and I thought there were people there who hadn't started until it was already 20 degrees, because of how long it takes to start, and that would have been pretty tough, I think it's fair to say. felt for those 11 o'clock finishes i mean i i think out on course i saw more people collapse than i think i've ever seen at any race i i it was it seemed like there was a lot going on and i i don't know it was one of those when i kept looking at my phone looking at the temperature even at the start at nine o'clock and it the same sort of like 12 degrees but it felt like it already felt like sort of 17 you know i don't know it's sort of mental but it was
00:03:21
Speaker
No, definitely. don i think I always think, I know the UK gets a lot of stick. It's very mild. You complain about the extremes temperature, but I think it always is hotter in London than it looks on the temperature scale, obviously, because it's not just the buildings and all those things reflecting and storing the heat. It's just, it's ah it's quite a humid place, which ramps it up a bit.
00:03:37
Speaker
It was really misty on the morning of the day, which I think you know shows that it was going to be humid that day. And yeah, I think, It's a hotter than it looks. yeah People are scoffing, oh, it's 20 degrees or something so like that, but you know it felt hotter than that. and Always, it's like the first hot day after training in cold weather for three four months. so i think it was hot. It wasn't that bad, I think, probably for us, necessarily, because we started fairly early. and but you know The sun was quite high in the sky already, but Yeah, I think um I could just say that I was slowing down quite drastically in the second half of the race and so I was was I was barely overtaken. i was overtaking people pretty much the whole time because people were was having really big blow ups because it was it was pretty hot. Canary Wharf was like a bit of a end of race for lots of people. It feels like.
00:04:17
Speaker
i I stopped and walked at one point in in Canary Wharf, just not for long. But yeah, I had to take a moment just to decide what ah what my plan was. But the one thing I found really interesting from the from this, this is I felt like this was the busiest London that I've ever run in and from the crowds and the support.
00:04:32
Speaker
And there were two things that for me made it quite intense. And one was, ah i don't know whether they changed the way the waves were mixed up. But you never, in some marathons when you run in a pack of people who have got a certain qualifying time when you're running for a certain time, you tend to run free eventually. You know, after 5Ks or something, it settles and you're running with people at your pace and it spreads.
00:04:50
Speaker
This, I felt like I was constantly running up behind people who were at a very different pace. Oh, really? And it was packed and busy. And so I think I i spent lots of time weaving. I just kept thinking in a minute it must clear.
00:05:03
Speaker
It never really did. And then I i think actually this I've never seen so many people lining the entirety of the course to the point where, and this is a flip side, I'm going to be, there's part of me who's going grumpy old you know and chap who who didn't run quite so well in the second half.
00:05:16
Speaker
if you're If you're flying and you were buzzing, all of that noise and all of that encouragement and all of that, it was it was loud the whole way for me, I think would have been brilliant.
Personal Running Experiences: Kieran and Nick
00:05:25
Speaker
If you're on the struggle bus a bit, it felt at times almost too intense. I need i really wanted sort of to have a little bit of place to go and hide. and yeah I've never had it like that. you know it was It was loud all the way. but So yeah, the support was fantastic. but i think yeah And that's my fault. It's not the the fault of the support. Well, your London Marathon last year was pretty positive all the way, wasn't it? it was manchester last year i was manchester last year of course yeah yeah that's where you got your gfa wasn't it yeah yeah but uh i will say where i was so it did spread out a bit where i was you know i i was pretty near the front of the race and that made the crowds so i was i was about 10 miles to go i started like going if you just run kind of this pace fairly slow pace you'll be okay and i was still running quicker than that i kept running quicker than that but
00:06:08
Speaker
It meant that because it was spaced out and I was kind of overtaking your person and I was just running fairly relaxed. I kind of was with, i wasn't killing myself on a red line. yeah I was redlining, but I wasn't, didn't feel like it in a way, you know, and I'd eased off slightly.
00:06:21
Speaker
ah It meant that I was really going for it with the crowd a bit. I've never really done this in London before, but because I was but by myself, the crowd was quiet. i just literally put a hand to an ear, do the hands. And there's no one out there, no, the highly any runners there. they really go for it And it does feel amazing because it's just cheering you, you're helping you along in the last 10K.
00:06:35
Speaker
It's a struggle. And so I, yeah, did that a lot and really liked it, basically. So I um found the support was utterly ridiculous, yeah. And then it was probably, yeah, i was a bit of struggle. We'll talk probably more about the race this second. But yeah, I felt that the crowd... Yeah, it really helped a lot of people.
00:06:49
Speaker
But you like you say, it can be so intense. And I saw couple of really bad collapses, like you say, Kieran, one like right near the end on the on the coming towards the birdcage walk. And it just looked really pretty intense all around. And it just got hotter and hotter. So if you think, yeah, if you start at like a 10, 30, 11, and you're a five, six-hour marathoner, you're going to 20 degrees plus the whole time. And with that many bodies around, I think that makes it even hotter, doesn't it?
00:07:12
Speaker
I actually had to help. another one Another one of my stops, I took a few because I needed them. not yeah They were kind of almost like an excuse, but I actually had to help one guy who was going sideways across the course and he was gone. And I sort of, everyone else was flying past. I just sort of pulled him to the side and sat him down, gave him some water from some, left him with some people in the crowd.
00:07:29
Speaker
The whole thing took about a minute, but you know, there were lots of, there was lots of that going on, I feel like. Yeah, but it was very hot. um but How hot was it in Manchester, Tom? Pretty similar. It was really hot. A lot of people passing out as well.
00:07:40
Speaker
Not you, though? Just about? Me? No, I wasn't going fast enough to pass out. Anyway, let's before we go to Manchester, I want to come to the crux the race, which is Kieran's first half, where he ran...
00:07:52
Speaker
Yeah. rod So let's talk about your experiences of London Marathon this time. And Kieran's got the probably most interesting story if you look at his his splits. So Kieran, how did it go for you?
00:08:04
Speaker
Yeah, i mean, me and Culper, I talk a lot about running on feel and I do love it. And it's worked for me many, many times. It did not work for me on Sunday because i I think I felt too good in the first bit. I I was kind of coming off a bit of a cold from sort of Friday, Saturday. i wasn't feeling great. I don't know why. i think it because all those people around, I was trying to break free of people, the cold. I thought, actually, I'm just, I just wanted to take it on a bit. And almost, it was almost like i was trying to prove to myself that I was going to be able to do it.
00:08:30
Speaker
And also, I think the shoes really helped. I just felt good. I felt really good. And I thought I was, I didn't realize I was actually pushing as hard as I was pushing until I got to about 13 miles and saw the halfway clock, did a few little calculations roughly and realized that I'd probably, I think I ran a half marathon PB in the first half, which is obviously suicide. How many marathons you done, Kieran? That was my 60th. 60th, yeah. And what would pre we all your first bit of advice be to be not a first-time marathoner? Whatever you do when you're running a marathon, don't go out too fast in the first half. Yeah. because Your 5K and 10K times were really fast, weren't they?
00:09:05
Speaker
Yeah, but and i I did it within the race. I did a 10 mile PB. I did a think I did a 30K PB as well. Like, and and then after that, obviously it all went horribly wrong and it was horrendous and I struggled and you still going on though. You're still sub three.
00:09:19
Speaker
and i yeah ah Yeah. I mean, i and I say that. I felt like I was running really badly, but actually when you look this, still running sort of seven and a half minute miles, which is it' still pretty quick. And I think we'll come on to the shoes, but a lot of that I think was down to what the shoes were giving me. They gave me an awful lot and in that first section.
00:09:35
Speaker
And... yeah they They gave me what I needed in the second bit just to get all that last or a third to get me through to the end when it was a real struggle. so They performed really well. but yeah It was a silly way to run in the heat. when it's you know yeah just not Not to be advised. but yeah How about you, Nick? Some impressive numbers to look at when you're scrolling through your times, though.
00:09:55
Speaker
i mean, everything... to the end Everything just, it's the opposite of, yeah, is everything just gets slower. And then you can see I start, I think I started, like the first sort of split is I'm at like place 933 and I end up somewhere, like it just goes back and back and back and back.
00:10:10
Speaker
It's sub three the hard way, but it's still sub three. Yeah. yeah How about you now? I mean, I did similar, not as drastic. like and i took it out i was I planned to take it out as fast as I did. so London was a free hit for me because I PB'd at Seville. So, had two months since then, I've got back into shape, pretty confident.
00:10:28
Speaker
In a free hit, you don't you don't want to play a you know straight bat, forward defensive, you to big swing. So, the plan was to go out at 1.12 pace, basically, first half. was doing that by myself and came well not and not by myself big crowds of runners but i came across a group led by one of my friends who was pacing someone to 15 miles at that pace so that i'll jump in with this but he can just lead it i won't think about it the pan the whole race was basically to run just in groups because that was so good in civil i wasn't really going to be too worried about the watch if i but couldn't find a good group at the right pace i'd just go with the group whatever the pace was so but the pace was perfect 15 miles could tell already i think i was i don't think this is going to happen at this pace but i'll
00:11:02
Speaker
kind of pushed to 32k let's say or maybe slightly less basically about 10 miles to go uh the guy had obviously gone and immediately the little group he'd had with him pacing and disintegrated so i was kind of running by myself already um i i looked at 10 mile mark went ah okay if i run 10 miles in an hour like sixes this is kind of my full back pace I'll still run a pretty good time here. I'll probably run a sub 230. And then I just kept, every time I got a mile, I tick it off and I was still running quicker than that. It's like Kieran says, the shoes are very good at this. Like they really were, I was like, I'm starting to ease off here, but I'm not gonna look at pace too much. But every time I did, you know, see a split or something come up, oh, ah it's a bit fast and i thought i was running there.
00:11:35
Speaker
And that just kept going. And then I kind of almost started to feel great. I was like, last 10K, I wasn't running fast, any faster, but just felt really good about myself because, well, you're running this pace now. You can just take this over to the end. You're going to get pretty solid time here.
00:11:46
Speaker
You're overtaking people still. So it was I said in the Strava, so that it's like a controlled blow up where I settled back, I think, early enough that I wasn't going to have a huge block was me walking and stuff like that ran the whole way maintain a pretty solid pace and then had a little bit at the end to sprint trying clinch i think i think i'm 86th from the mass start which is what big aim was always to be top 100 from the master london i think i've done it now um and just yeah really had such a good time in that last okay because of that because i have stepped back a little bit and i was still slowing down but it it never got to the point of reach i mean mike's got a great video of me running well i think he was just after
00:12:19
Speaker
bankman tunnel coming out of it so it's a slight uphill as well but i am not an elegant runner at the best of times but i look like trash but i'm still going fairly quick and uh you know just taking really short steps uh and uh kind of moving past you know very nice looking runners so i did think it worked out okay and that's why i felt was so good at the end because yeah about 27k i felt like i was this isn't gonna really happen but i've just got to um just got to think of a way to go here and be happy with it and i was yeah pretty surprised how good it turned out given what i was feeling around the start of canary wharf
Celebrity Marathon Times Discussion
00:12:49
Speaker
Nice. Okay. So before we talk about the kit that you used for... Your marathon, Tom, for now. We'll move on to that. I've got a treat because ah okay every year when there's a little London Marathon, we get the Celebrity Times.
00:13:04
Speaker
Yes. So we can have a little intermission with Celebrity Times. It gets harder and harder every year because all the celebrities are people that are quite young. and i don't i don't know any of them. So I've had to go through these and actually find out who they are so that I can actually get some sort of view on it.
00:13:30
Speaker
Right, so first one, Spencer Matthews. He's been banging on about the the marathon for quite a while. how do you think he did? Quick. I reckon if he ran it properly, because he's done lots of big endurance stuff, hasn't he?
00:13:41
Speaker
m just didn't He just did a 24-hour track thing. Okay. want to say, I reckon he subbed three. I reckon he backed off and he ran a 329.
00:13:54
Speaker
In the middle. So he got three hours and seven, but he does want a sub three. So maybe if it wasn't hot, he he would have done that. He's definitely been training for it. How about Tony Ordenshaw? Do you know who that No.
00:14:07
Speaker
He's an Emmerdale actor. I think. I thought there were young people you didn't know, Tom. He's one of the ones I know. So I've removed a lot of the young people. He's Okay. Is he big runner, Tom? I don't What character does he play in Emmerdale, Tom? I don't know. i don't know. He's also in Brookside, apparently.
00:14:26
Speaker
he was in rooksider as well he was well not anymore but you what he was he was since 1990 what would a 50 years old man run four hours and 50 I'm going to 4.15 four very good yeah respect i mean this like I think these times are right these are coming from the evening standard but you'd expect that they get the times right they've all discussed John Terry haven't we We have we have this discussed on John Terry in the in the group.
00:14:55
Speaker
Okay, then people that I do know. Adam Woodgett. Oh, legend. Absolutely legend. Legend of the soap scene. 4.15. I think he would have...
00:15:06
Speaker
Putting a really hard effort and coming in at five ten Wow. Close. five seventeen um Okay, Joel Dommert. Joel Dommert should be fast. He's young.
00:15:18
Speaker
Yeah, but he ended up in he ended up in a tent. this stop Because he's run so fast. Yeah, I think he did it i think he had ah he struggled and got a bit wobbly. and but He's a handsome, fit man. I'd have guessed quite quick. Yeah.
00:15:32
Speaker
Well, so he was running pretty well and then he needed medical assistance. So he basically got pulled off the course. But he went back on, right? And then went back later after they basically said you can go back on. So he ended up with six hours. Okay.
00:15:46
Speaker
Two minutes? what is it What was he on for, Tom? No, six hours, three minutes. Oh, I've got no idea. I've not been through he's an hour? Only an hour behind John Terry with an enforced medical break. Yes. I mean, a couple of hours in the medical tent. That's impressive, though, getting up out of the seat and going and doing that again.
00:16:00
Speaker
Yeah, getting back on it, yeah yeah. I mean, yeah, I think but a lot of the celebrities tend to do for charity, don't they? So they they feel, know, they've got to gotta to get it done. Do remember what John Terry was? 5 hours and 43 seconds.
00:16:13
Speaker
5 hours and 43 seconds. yeah and yeah Danny Mills, ex-Liverpool footballer. I don't know. I can't remember. I think it was 3.10 or something around there. But he man he's now the fastest ex-Premier League London marathon runner.
00:16:26
Speaker
Well, obviously the gym because his son's professional athlete, right? so Yeah. He should be quick, he'd have thought. I mean, that's pretty poor that no one's gone to sub to three from the Premier League. mean, they wouldn't bother, would they? Why would you bother? I'm surprised, yeah. as yeah they're not They're not that quick, I think.
00:16:39
Speaker
They don't tend to be when they go out there. What about Harry Judd? You know Harry Judders? It's the drummer from McBustard, one of them. I think he's McFly. Okay, good. mike busster dont know I don't know. what They did form together to become McBusted, so can say that safely, can't you? Yes, yeah, yeah. ah I reckon he's fast.
00:16:57
Speaker
I reckon 3.09. 3.09. 4.45. Yeah, well, you're Nick. 3 hours 15. Damn fine time. Very good time. very good time sam hugan you know that he's ah' He's quite a famous actor. He was in an Outlander, but he's also one of the yeah guys who was discussed as being the next Bond.
00:17:17
Speaker
Oh, my wife likes Outlander. I've not seen it. um I think if he's in Bond and Outlander shape, he might maybe he's too muscle-bound run really, really fast. Then maybe he probably... He's pretty chill. He's pretty relaxed. He's probably running it in 4.26 and damn good while doing say and looking damn good while doing it
00:17:41
Speaker
Bond job. Give him von job give him the char give the chop give the job. now I reckon Lazenby probably ran like a 2.15. two fifteen I reckon he was amazing. I don't reckon Lazenby's ever run in his life. too busy drinking whiskeys brosden's definitely not even broken to a fast walk okay i'm running in gold no he didn't look natural he didn't like he wanted to do roger moore famously said that he would not run ah in any film he actually wanted like stub doubles to do his running for him didn't fancy it he wouldn't run a bath no he didn't right okay so that'll do is for celebrity marathon time
00:18:21
Speaker
right let's talk about what the real celebrity tom wheatley are we gonna do my one first well we've to talk about your marathon tom we'll do my marathon then we'll talk about all the kit together okay all right okay go on then ask me on the top you uh what happened you didn't look very happy you didn't sound very happy well let's Yeah, I'm going to
00:18:40
Speaker
yeah talk to us about the the the the course and everything like that so i didn't really know what to expect from manchester marathon um i can't even even remember i signed up to i think it was just like going to do a marathon load of mates so i've never planned to do it's a big marathon um On the whole, I was pretty
Tommy's Manchester Marathon Experience
00:18:54
Speaker
impressed with it. It was pretty big deal up there. you know and you go to these When you go to like the major cities over the weekend of a marathon, there's like you know runners everywhere and posters up and everyone's doing their advertising. It felt like that. it felt like a really big marathon.
00:19:08
Speaker
um and The whole city was just full of runners. There were good crowds all the way. Not London level, not London level at all. I mean, there were crowds most of the way, but like you said, Kieran, you could get some respite in Manchester. You could find whole streets where you could happily walk along and you didn't have loads people shouting at you. It was only the main areas that were covered. But good crowds. It was hot weather, so lot people came out for it. I quite like the route, Kieran. can't remember what you said about the route, but it's quite nice. It's quite an enjoyable route.
00:19:40
Speaker
One thing I would say about it is they talk about it being like flat flat and fast. It's not flat by any stretch. There's whole stretches that are just undulating the whole way. I'd i'd say it's probably a bit hillier than London.
00:19:52
Speaker
And there's that one hill, I think it's 18 or something, isn't it? It kind of comes at the point. Yeah. don't know, in Altrincham, I think it is, if I remember rightly. But there's one big hill. I was pretty good at that point. And I got up that hill and thought, ah, that wasn't too bad. But if it came later on, I would have really not liked that hill.
00:20:08
Speaker
But yeah, i really liked it. And I like the fact that I think the choice to make it end in the centre, it did end at Old Trafford when you did it, Kieran. Yeah, yeah. So it didn't feel connected. Like it didn't, you know, you, it felt like you were running around as an outsider from Manchester, doesn't know it very well. It felt like you were running like the outskirts of the city rather than actually being connected to it. So if they, they changed that.
00:20:27
Speaker
Yeah. So it finishes in the inner city now and it it's great because ah my hotel was just near the finish line. And I think most people just booked theirs near the finish line. ah Although Ed Budd was there, i went shopping Ed Budd, he went to buy some Lego, but he was staying at the start line and i I'm glad I didn't because once you finish, I had like a three minute walk to my hotel, have shower and everything, then go back out um and it was heaving.
00:20:48
Speaker
I imagine it's quite annoying finishing at Old Trafford and then sort of hanging it around there or having to get back into the town. didn't any Lego, Tom? You're a Lego guy. didn't buy any Lego. I bought some Adidas Pro 4s.
00:21:00
Speaker
Made of Lego? They weren't. No, there are some Adidas made of Lego that you can get, but ah not there not running shoes. So yeah, on the whole, the event, very much enjoyed it. Thought it was a very nice route.
00:21:11
Speaker
The only issues I had, are the start area was an absolute mess. like Basically, the the start area is the car park or something outside of the front of Old Trafford. And it's like a circle. don't know if you had this, Cameron, either. They just put toilets all the way around this circle car park. It's by the cricket pit. It's the cricket ground, right?
00:21:29
Speaker
I don't know. It was on concrete. The cricket ground also called Old Trafford. Yeah, no. They're right next to each other. when When I started, you actually walked through the the under stadium of the the cricket ground.
00:21:42
Speaker
Oh, no. I think they've changed that. So maybe they've moved that as well. You basically just go right out the front of Old Trafford. Okay. And then it's just like a big concrete. area they've turned into like this basically where you got to go to go to the toilet and you just wait in there but there is nothing there apart from toilets it's just a big circle of toilets and there's so many people queuing up that it's just crisscrossing of people going to the toilet so you can't even get through to get to the the the the race start it's absolute nightmare people just pushing trying to get through because it's bit chaos so I wasn't impressed with that but everything else thought was really good really enjoyed it not so much my actual performance but
00:22:13
Speaker
um Talk us through can go out crazy fast. Is it just... No, part of this is the shoes, and we'll talk about those in a bit. But the I went out thinking, right, I'm going to just go... When I in Valencia, was a bit fitter at Valencia, but I went out way too fast in Valencia. went out at four-minute-kilometer pace.
00:22:30
Speaker
This time I went, right, I'm going to pull it back. I'm going to go 425, which is fairly comfortable pace for me. So I held that until 32K, absolutely fine. and No issues at all. Felt great up until that point. And then it just hit me, and I was just...
00:22:42
Speaker
Might have been the heat. I think the shoes did play a part. I made a bad choice of shoe. And yeah, I probably just didn't have the endurance in. But yeah, that pace was absolutely perfect for me. And up until about thirty two k I was on for about 3, I don't know, 3.07. Something like that I would have been pretty happy with. um But the last 10K was absolutely killer. was walking a lot and yeah, I was not having fun.
00:23:01
Speaker
So yeah. that's manchester your your retirement from marathons for a while right I'm not I'm not doing a marathon until hopefully I'm doing Tokyo next year if but I'm not I'm not doing that as I'm not going to try and get sub three in there anything like that I don't think I'm going to push hard at one this year now I'm hoping might be a fun one in the autumn something like that but Yeah, I think at two in the spring, successful spring, I can rest on that for a bit. Well, I really want to go to Tokyo and it just works out that if I could do the marathon as well and I go for like a three-week trip to take to america to America to Japan, that would be perfect for me. But I'm definitely not treating it as a, I mean, I'm useless flying as well anyway. So that would not be a nice marathon to go for marathon. God, yeah, he loves it. That's a long flight for Tom, who needs something to get him through a flight.
00:23:41
Speaker
Yeah, so I'm in a good state by this time ah but by the time im I'm over there. so I'm just going to go and jog that one, get my six-star medal, hopefully. And then I might ah might look at doing something in the autumn next year, like Frankfurt or something like that. Oh, cool.
00:23:56
Speaker
I woke up this morning with a month to go to 55 miles in the heat of the comrades just felt sick. I saw you just entered. So you had to get a time to enter it, Kieran? I'd already, you entered, but you have to, you can run a qualifying time. So just basically have to complete a marathon, but depending. Depending what your time is depends on your seeding.
00:24:16
Speaker
and that So that will give me actually that time. It's good that i got a sub three and pushed for it rather than wobbling home at 320 or something. So I get a group A seeding. So I'll be right up the front, I think, of the comrades.
00:24:28
Speaker
And in comrades, it it matters because it's um it's gun time. So if you're just- Well, I mean, it probably won't matter for me, but what yeah, for the Bill Rowan, actually, yeah. so And it can take you 12, 15 minutes to get over the start line if you're way back.
00:24:41
Speaker
And that basically just takes, you take that chunk out of the time you've got to finish. Yeah, okay. you don't want a 15 minute. Do want give up 15 minutes over at 7 1⁄2 you for Bill Rowan? at 6, 7 1⁄2?
00:24:52
Speaker
Nine? I think I did 8.46, I think, was my last one. So i I have, like, between eight and nine and a half, I think, okay is the brit is a window. So I'm normally okay if it's... But, you know, you know you can in those distances, you can lose time.
00:25:05
Speaker
It's very easy to lose half an hour if things go badly wrong. So, yeah, it's nice to have that bracket. but
00:25:19
Speaker
Should talk about Kit? Yes. I mean, mine and Kieran's, I mean, I didn't test much new apart from the shoes, really. we can talk a bit about watches, but
Shoe Reviews: Puma Fast R3 & Mizuno Wave Rebellion Pro 3
00:25:27
Speaker
that's all in the race video. But the shoes were the Puma Fast R3, well, the Fast R Nitro Elite 3 me and Kieran both used, just had for a week before the race. We're about to do the review and the race video, so probably don't take a crazy detail, but I was very, very impressed by these shoes. Like,
00:25:40
Speaker
It's exactly what Kieran said, like when I was running well, it felt amazing, like really just natural, smooth part of the body. And the worry we both had probably with them was that what are they going to feel like when you start to go? Because it's quite, there's not a lot of support underfoot and they're much stable. But actually that's what impressed me most, that last 10 miles, 10K when I was struggling and I was still ticking over and running. It must have been,
00:25:59
Speaker
reasonably well to um tick over and keep and maintain a good pace so i think they're yeah they're right i've said in the video there's that and the meta speed sky paris i think uh better than all the other shoes for me this is it's not like you you can't just say for everyone these are the best shoes because they are a bit wild but i do think they are as good as anything i've ever run in i was really impressed certainly looking for you karen Yeah, I mean, in that that I ran super well in that first half, or even even actually up to probably about 19 miles.
00:26:25
Speaker
They were giving me everything I needed. Smooth, i felt you know I felt there was plenty of punch. One of my worries was about the kind of decoupled midsole that, like Nick says, doesn't feel quite stable. It doesn't always feel 100% natural. And when I've used them before in my 10-miler and in the test I did over in Germany,
00:26:42
Speaker
I actually she almost had to learn them a bit, but out there in the race, I actually i felt much more natural in them now that I've used them a bit. And actually, they were just smooth in the background, just giving me the extra that I needed.
00:26:53
Speaker
If anything, i you know it seems like a crazy thing to say, but maybe maybe even too much because I think it it kind of encouraged me to to move faster. I could have looked at a watch, obviously, and reigned my pace in like other runners do. but like But for the way I run on feel, i yeah, they they just – They just were giving me what I needed in that first bit. And then when the wheels came off, that was my big fear because of the decoupled midsole, there's not much by way of sort of a heel. So you kind of drop back almost.
00:27:21
Speaker
They almost sort of go to sort of negative drop if you drop too far back on them. But none of that was a problem, even when I lost like a minute and a half per mile and was running really ragged and tired.
00:27:32
Speaker
They just sort of carried me to the end. felt like the other i was there quite narrow as well and i mean you can see in some of the videos we've done that was a bit of a concern that they might be too narrow in my regular size but actually i had nothing in terms of sort of toenail problems or there's a flex in the uppers that works really nicely for me as well but Yeah, I would say the upper is really good actually all around. But I would say, yeah, I was rocking back on my heels in that last time. You can see in the video Mike ah mike did. I put it in a couple of the of the review video and stuff. But just still fine in the shoe. And the upper, I do think, yeah, it it runs slightly longer, the shoe, I think. But the actual upper is really good because it's flexible. There's a bit of stiffness to it. And on a day when it was really hot,
00:28:10
Speaker
it was very breathable also running through showers dumping water on yourself the the upper dry dry didn't get soggy and you didn't feel any squelching and just got rid of that water quite quickly so and the lightness is definitely a big thing as well also about the meta speed sky paris is like when you're really struggling or i'm really struggling the end of a marathon i've got a high turnover and a very high cadence just having a lighter shoe just makes it so much easier to keep picking up my feet and that was the big problem i had with the fast r2 was it felt really efficient when you're running really well and felt great but just bit heavy and it kind of i think suited a more loping style of runner a bit more whereas this now i think suits kind of everyone so long as you can get on with the slightly but but you really feel the way the plate extends up you know and pushes you into that position and i like that feeling because it feels really good and then
00:28:50
Speaker
yeah It always felt pretty natural running at speed in the first half, and then I just felt like I was enjoying what it gave me in the second half running when was much more tired. So yeah, I was very, very impressed. think they were sold out everywhere now, but it's a shoe to look out for in the future, I think, as well. i've got One thing, I've got quite a weird depression in the outsole, on the line, Kieran. If you check your outsole at some point, it's the same place on both shoes.
00:29:10
Speaker
It's like a rod almost underneath in the midsole. It's pressed through into one area and the outsole's caved in very slightly. It's not problem, but it's just weird it's happening same place on both. It's not like I've stepped on something. It's something to do with... I've definitely got a bit of scuffing on the back kind of section outsole. I'll have to have look. Yeah, I didn't... Yeah, that's on the fourth. I've got bit scuffing around the stuff at the back as well. And I don't know if Tom would just immediately remove that section of rubber at heel at the back. Tom, have to... I would shoo goo it in advance, Tom.
00:29:38
Speaker
but you used um yeah so I mean I did some watches but there's not my ah everything's in the race video you and nothing else too exciting I think Tom you went for a pretty wild shoe there right yes well we've we've discussed many times when we've done various versus and discussions about um the Mizuno Wave Rebellion Pro 3 because I always talk about how much I like that shoe and you you goaded me on to say you better try it in a marathon to how it don't blame me for this no well it's it's fair basically I went through all of my shoes before I went and I was really struggling to choose a shoe to to race in and I didn't want to go for i almost took out the endorphin pro 3 but I sort want to save that for when I'm fit enough to justify comparing it with my previous PBs so I before I left I saw it I thought oh i could actually use this for it this is probably the perfect time to test it because I'm not overly bothered about the time or anything like that so it it was a good opportunity but then when I got to Manchester I bought the at the Osprey 4s.
00:30:39
Speaker
But then I thought it was too risky as well, you wearing them straight away the the the day after buying them. So yeah, the Waverbredium Pro 3s, it was a big gamble. And ah i think I must have been the only person in that whole race who had them on. I was looking at people's shoes. I didn't see anybody wearing their shoes. And one guy did actually say what the hell are those you're wearing?
00:30:57
Speaker
Now, i've I've used each iteration of the Wave Rebellion pros, and I have never used them for a marathon race. and um I've raced in ah the ones and the twos up to half marathon, and they were fine for that. Even even the half marathon I used for the twos, it was ah it's a bit of an awkward shoe, as you will know, ah Nick.
00:31:17
Speaker
But what I found is that it really, the way those shoes are built, it really tips you forward. Like the drop is ridiculous in them, the way that the the shoe's designed. And for the if you've got at if you're feeling good and you've got a nice consistent pace, it was a dream. Up until about thirty k it just felt great. I just, consistent, lovely, and felt felt good all the way to that point.
00:31:37
Speaker
When I started feeling bad, that shoe is the worst shoe to wear because you cannot run a nice, like slow, easy pace in that shoe that when you're struggling because it's basically just pushing you forward with every step.
00:31:51
Speaker
right It almost doesn't let you just just go, i i can't run fast now, I just want to run naturally and just get through this next 10K. It almost won't let you do it because it's forcing your foot forward. and like I could feel my calves hurting quite a bit in the last ten k But also ah could feel my ankles hurting a bit because I think you've got to be, you've either got really strong ankles to use them for that distance or you need to be just maintaining that consistent pace so you're not really worrying too much about it.
00:32:14
Speaker
So yeah, I definitely felt in that last 10K that um they were they were not helping me at all. They were sort of forcing me to do my legs in this position where I just couldn't do it. And that's where, you know, that's where like the Adolphin Pro 3s and shoes like that worked really well for for me over that distance because you can just change your gait and you can change your cadence a bit when you're struggling. And it it just, you just slow down, it's fine. But these just didn't allow me to do it. It's just, they're quite, I'd say aggressive is the word, but they're just sort of pushing your feet forward. Demanding. Into position that you don't, you just can't do an easy running them.
00:32:46
Speaker
that you just it just just doesn't work um just because they because they're such an awkward shoe to run in but they were great until 32 i loved them for 32 because was thinking christ i'm gonna i really picked the best shoe for today because i'll maintain this for the rest of the day i'm gonna but no i didn't that last 10k was a real struggle I think there's still an element of that with the Puma, which, you know, I think Puma now has a perfect double lineup. I said this review. It was like the DV8 Nitro Elite 3 is a very natural feeling shoe. It's a much cheaper shoe. going to be much more durable and will work when you're really struggling.
00:33:16
Speaker
And then the Fast R3 is the outlandish on your game, really killing it. Great. Did cope better than I thought on that you know when you're feeling bad. But... I think they've got a nice lineup. And that's maybe one area where maybe the Metz B-Sky Paris could have a little edge still maybe over the Puma for me is that I think when I've been you know struggling at the end of marathons, maybe it just ticks over a bit easier because it's a bit more normal feeling, but the Puma was great for that yesterday. One thing I'll say, yeah I don't think it's the same with you, Kieran, in the race, is all these great carbon shoes now, every brand's got a really good carbon shoe around me, nearly all Nike and Adidas, that's all people are wearing still. um I think they're still really dominant in people's minds.
00:33:48
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, there was there was a big there was a big mix. I mean, one thing I did, you do notice that every, you know most people are wearing carbon ray shoes. There aren't that many people who are wearing sort of regular shoes anymore, few Novoblasts, but someone in front of me going sub three was in the Novoblasts.
00:34:03
Speaker
And I know from the test that I did in Germany with a Puma, I'm like, you'll be better off in these Pumas, but... um I think you're right. I think you're right with the Puma. Maybe it sounds like the shoe. I've not tried the shoe that Tom ran in. There are some shoes you feel like they're form shoes, right?
00:34:16
Speaker
you have You have to be on it in terms of your form as much as your pace, right? And I think they fit that. I wouldn't... And, you know, we're raving about the Puma Fast R3. It definitely wouldn't be a shoe that I would pick if I weren't... really confident in going all out in attack mode if that makes sense if you're feeling like you're going to want to run a slightly more conservative marathon time yeah there are going to be better shoes for it and that's where that's where the deviate comes in or you know you go back to um the endorphin pro 3 and those shoes they're going to be a bit more accommodating and if you're running on a knife edge yeah i think for many runners there's there are probably shoes that are going to do a good job if you're ah if you're risking it on race day what Well, that last 10K, if I was wearing a shoe that was, even if I was wearing the Nova Blaster that last 10K, I could have quite comfortably jogged it slowly in. But I had to keep stopping just because i it just was not very comfortable at all. i did And ah ah Nick, you you know, walking in the Bizunos,
00:35:11
Speaker
is a bit funny because you're sort of wobbling on your on that fulcrum in the middle. as and thing It's really designed for, I think when they say, i think when they target say, oh, we're targeting sub-230 marathon runners. Yeah. The only thing is really necessary. It might just be, you can only run for about two and a half hours on these shoes. Yeah. regardless of what distance you're covering you need to be stopping at that point yeah yeah you you can't but you can't be ah flagging and stroking hobbling along because they're just I mean it's like wearing high heels isn't it yeah they're they're definitely wilder than the Pumas on that front I think the Pumas for me ah quite similar to something like the Hocus Yellow X1 2.0 but maybe a slight but a bit better I think potentially they they really do seem to work very well but obviously i want to try and run a marathon actually on my game throughout whereas the aspects I have done to complete marathons start to finish feeling great and so that's obviously good
00:35:56
Speaker
A few more Meta Speed Sky Paris around as well. I think that's the shoes I saw. It was mostly Nike and Adidas still. Nike and Adidas still, despite the fact I think every brand is doing well. But think Asics, Meta Speed Sky Paris, I did see a lot of on the course. Yeah, we definitely need to do a bit of a video survey of all the shoes at a start line of races to see how I think it's hard to break out of Nike because you know you do see they've obviously got all the best elites pretty much and they're wearing the shoes and people started with the Vaporfly so they probably don't want to leave Nike out loyalty and if they do it's to Adidas they probably were also using before the Vaporfly and things like the Boston. There's so many people in the Adidas Pro 4 at Manchester. They're just still the you know they're still the brand that people see so much of but I do think yeah Puma and Asics right now killing it. Nice. Well, anything else to cover on this year's spring marathons?
00:36:40
Speaker
i I just wanted to give a big shout out to this medal, which I think is... The best medal. ah Best metal noise medal. Best t-shirt. It's such a good medal. It's really nice. It's like... yeah not I'm not really... Not that I'm not that... The medals, you know, the medals are medal, medal.
00:36:54
Speaker
yeah This one just feels like... Huge. Yeah. yeah I'm very generous with everyone. weighted. It's I took this out on some great medals this year. the The Boston one this year was absolutely fantastic. Yeah. Yeah, it's a nice one. My one looks like ah an advert. Well, I took a photo of um the Seville and the London medals together. i was going to put an Instagram post at some point. And um yeah, it ah it looks like a toy next to the London one. It's like, that's annoying. It's like, yeah, London one could eat the Seville marathon. middle Cool. All right. Well, well done to everybody who's done London and Manchester on any spring marathon this year. Yeah. Yeah. hope if you If you're listening to this, chances are you probably did do one of them because...
00:37:30
Speaker
maybe you wanted to hear what our views are so congratulations you think of the events in the comments things that we missed we didn't mention on the on the pod we thought about london and manchester if you saw john terry what did you do when you saw him i don't like john terry i keep mentioning sorry well matt hancock was out there again speaking of the articles that i've read what do you do you see matt hancock and john terry on together work i didn't see any celebrities in uh in uh Oh, I saw Alex Scott getting the train, but she she was going away from Manchester, so probably wasn't doing the marathon. Just having a nice day.
00:38:04
Speaker
yeah Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's fair. But I didn't see any runners doing, the celebrity runners in Manchester. I'll investigate that see if anyone did it. There must be some Manchester footballers doing it. I wanted to give one last little shout out to, there were lots of people who came up and said hello on the way. i've got chatting to a guy called Gordie on the train down and it's always it's always quite a happy thing. People come and chat and yeah say hello before and after the race and well done to all those people. ah Hopefully all you guys got your time that I spoke to, but ten yeah. Yeah, it was really nice. A few people said hello, especially the people who came and said hello in front of my wife and my friend's family because it made me look like a big deal. So that was nice.
00:38:42
Speaker
I got a few in Manchester as well. Oh, and then I should probably also say, well done, Oli, my mate who's been trying to beat me six years who actually beat me at Manchester. Oh, and last well done, I'll give a shout out. spoke to him at the end.
00:38:53
Speaker
Cole Gibbons won debut home and debut marathon. Absolutely disgusting. I saw him at the end. I couldn't work he shocked. Just extremely chilled.
00:39:02
Speaker
Well, until next year. Yeah. Catch you guys later. See boys. Bye. Bye-bye.
00:39:11
Speaker
This episode of the podcast was presented by Tom Wheatley, Kieran Alger and Nick Harris-Fry. The podcast was produced by Tom Wheatley. The music was by Fear of Tigers.