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Watch out for that roof! The Santa Clause (1994)
158 Plays1 year ago
In the final festive film review of 2023, join Satsunami and Andrew as they discuss the holiday classic The Santa Clause! But since the duo have none of the nostalgic feelings towards this film, does it truly hold up? Can you become Santa through trial by combat? And what is up with Neal?! All this and more in this final episode of the festive season!
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Transcript
Introduction and Santa Movie Saturation
00:00:05
Speaker
Welcome to Chatsunami.
00:00:16
Speaker
Hello everybody and welcome to another episode of Chatsunami. My name's Satsunami, and joining me because of his legal obligations as part of this fan-requested episode is none other than the one and only Andrew Claws. Andrew, welcome back. I should have read the fine print. You should have watched your step on that roof, but that's a story for another day.
00:00:41
Speaker
It's a slippery slope indeed. Yeah, how are you doing today in that horrifying note? I'm good. I would have been better off if I hadn't watched as many Santa Claus movies as I have, but it's been enjoyable going through all these Christmas movies to discuss with the listeners. Yeah, I honestly wish I could say that the market for Santa Claus films isn't over-saturated, but yeah, no, that would be a lie. I would be lying to you, dear listeners.
00:01:04
Speaker
Funny enough, I was actually discussing this with you beforehand, but I've just seen the new Wonka film, and at the cinema I was at, they are actually showing the, I think it's called the Santa Claus movie, and it's a relatively old one, I don't know if it's from the 80s or 90s, and if it's from the 70s, I greatly apologize, but I'm sure it's from the 80s or 90s, and they were advertising it, and they were saying, recapture the magic,
Exploring 'The Santa Clause' (1994)
00:01:32
Speaker
as it were. That surprisingly brings me on to today's film. I always got that film which is completely different. That film is a origin story about Santa and his wife getting lost in the North Pole and then they end up taking the mantle of Santa Claus whereas the film we're going to be talking about today is one that has a rather contemporary take on the story and I'm going to be honest it's a very damn dark
00:02:02
Speaker
twist on it. We are going to be talking about The Santa Clause which came out in 1994 and stars Tim Allen. So before we go on and discuss this very interesting film, this time capsule of a film, did you ever watch this one growing up?
00:02:18
Speaker
I don't have particularly strong memories of this first film growing up, but I did watch this second and third one a couple of times growing up, because I just have that distinct memory, particularly from the third one, which had Jack Frost in it, and I know that it was played by Martin Short, and for some reason that just stayed with me much more than it should have.
00:02:36
Speaker
But yeah, no, the first one, it was very much not a classic in my household. I didn't watch it very much. I saw it again a few years ago and was just like, oh, this film's a bit crap. But yeah, no, it's never been particularly important to my Christmas rotation list. You know, a lot of people who do milk and cookies right now have probably smashed them on the ground with you saying that was a pretty crap film.
00:02:58
Speaker
I mean, every person has their own opinions on these. I don't have the nostalgia for them and kind of watching them now, I was just kind of a bit confused by a lot of what was happening. And some things were funny, like I did enjoy certain aspects of the film. And we've been watching so many terrible Christmas movies recently, the by comparison, this is a decent Christmas film. However, it just doesn't hit the mark for me like so many other Christmas classics.
Childhood Christmas Movies and Opinions
00:03:20
Speaker
Did you grow up with these movies?
00:03:21
Speaker
Well, the thing that actually made me feel old was the fact that I would have been about two years old when this film came out. So when I was growing up, I remember obviously the classics like A Muppet's Christmas Carol, The Grinch, Jingle All The Way. Those were the kind of films that I watched. And of course, there's a whole load of other
00:03:42
Speaker
Christmas Films Above also reviewed at Chatsanami.com. Just putting this sleek advert in there. But for this one, this is a weird example for me because I was always told not to watch this film. Not because, oh you shouldn't watch this film, it's offensive or anything, but more because people kept telling me it's not very good. And I don't know, I kind of internalised that and just never really bothered with it. I mean, don't get me wrong, I didn't think, oh it's terrible, it is gonna be awful. But at
00:04:12
Speaker
At the same time, after watching it for the first time this year, I can certainly see why people would like it as a child growing up with it, and I can see why it's a personal favourite for a lot of people, but for me, slight spoilers going into it.
Plot and Themes of 'The Santa Clause'
00:04:29
Speaker
I don't think from an outsider's perspective it holds up as well.
00:04:34
Speaker
And the funny thing is the only thing I know about this film was the way they advertised it, and they literally just show you Santa getting absolutely wrecked on the roof. So for anyone who doesn't know the five of you out there who probably doesn't know, the whole premise is Santa falls off of Tim Allen's roof.
00:04:52
Speaker
And yeah, he bank-enobies himself where his body disappears, but his clothes still stay. And then Tim Allen takes over the Santa Claus. There's just so many really creepy implications, but that's the way they advertised it, that Tim Allen inadvertently killed Santa Claus and then he took up the responsibility of Father Christmas.
Sequels and TV Show Continuation
00:05:14
Speaker
Funny you should mention the third one, because again, it was one of these films that always came up at Christmas,
00:05:20
Speaker
I never really watched it, but I vividly remember the third one being advertised a lot. Yeah, it was always on TV. It was the one that was syndicated the most, I think. It was just the cheapest one to show. They had the fewest residuals there to pay for it, which I think is often the case with these sequels. But I was pretty familiar with what happens in the third one. I couldn't tell you now. It's completely gone from my mind. But I did watch it relatively often around Christmas time when I was younger, because it would just be on TV.
00:05:47
Speaker
Yeah, because the thing that I found really weird as well was the time between the sequels, because the first one came out in 1994, and then I watched a little bit of the second one today to get a feel of where the films actually went, and I'm going to be honest, I apologise in advance. I did not enjoy it from home.
00:06:09
Speaker
So it was a little too whimsical for me, and that's coming from someone who likes Lord of the Rings. But yeah, the second one came out in 2002, and then the third one came out in, I think, 2006. So it's like eight years between the first and second one, and then four years between the second and third one, but then in 20... I want to say this year, actually. 20 this year. Yeah, 20 this year.
00:06:35
Speaker
See the 2020s, you might as well say 20 this year because they all went into one. 20 this year, yeah, they ended up making a TV show, I think, on Disney+. Yeah, which I think is still running at the time of recording. I think they're releasing episodes weekly. I've not watched any of them. Maybe I'll check them out after this just to punish myself further.
00:06:56
Speaker
not gonna lie, between the posters and what I saw in the descriptions for the episodes where it's like, evil centres coming to the North Pole. Unless there's like a North Pole D-Day sequence that I'm missing out on here. Isn't Larry the Cable Guy in it? Oh, probably.
00:07:12
Speaker
And then I think like Fluffy or something, or the Latino American comedian. Oh, um... Gabriella Iglesias. Oh, Iglesias, yeah. Because I did see him on the poster as well, you're completely right there. There's a lot of famous faces, but unfortunately, I know, I know, I can hear the audience go off in the background.
00:07:29
Speaker
But yeah, today we are going to be homing in on the Santa Claus 1994
Podcast Promotions: Chatsunami and Crime Divers
00:07:34
Speaker
one. And we're going to be talking about the good, the bad and the downright horrific of this film. So without any further ado, for our final festive episode, are you ready? I am. I'm strapped to my roof tightly so I don't fall off and I'm ready to go.
00:07:49
Speaker
And with that, we will be right back after these festive messages. Welcome to Chatsunami, a variety podcast that discusses topics from gaming and films to anime in general interest. Previously on Chatsunami, we've analysed what makes a good horror game, conducted a retrospective on Pierce Brosnan's runs James Bond, and listened to us take deep dives into both the Sonic and Halo franchises.
00:08:12
Speaker
Also, if you're an anime fan, then don't forget to check us out on our sub-series, Chatsunani, where we dive into the world of anime. So far, we've reviewed things like Death Note, Princess Mononoke, and the hit Beyblade series. If that sounds like your cup of tea, then you can check us out on Spotify, iTunes, and all big podcast apps. As always, stay safe, stay awesome, and most importantly, stay hydrated.
00:08:35
Speaker
Hey everyone, I'm Laura. And I'm Jill. And we are the hosts of Crime Divers Podcast. We are Scottish sisters who tell each other true crime cases that other hasn't heard of. New episodes are released every Tuesday and you can find us on your favourite podcast platform. So what are you waiting for? Grab your wetsuit and join us as we dive into the world of true crime. But remember, watch out for those sharks!
00:09:03
Speaker
So let's kick off talking about the Santa Claus and oh boy, I have a lot to say about this film.
Character Critiques and Dynamics
00:09:10
Speaker
I feel as if this is just free therapy for me because I finish watching this today. I don't like a lot of these characters.
00:09:20
Speaker
And be honest, I think of all the characters in this film, Tim Allen, of all people, he comes off as the best character I would say, or at least the least egregious. Now, would you agree with that?
00:09:35
Speaker
I think that for every moment you think that like, oh, he's maturing. He's doing well here. He'll then immediately do something that he's like three steps back on that. And you're like, Oh, you've just been completely immature and irresponsible here. He at one point kidnaps his son after losing custody rights, which is like, he probably shouldn't have lost custody rights. So you can understand maybe why that's happened. But like you do
00:09:54
Speaker
honor it until you prove yourself worthy of getting that you don't kidnap your son. And so like this woman is terrified that what's happened to her son because he's hanging out in the North Pole. She doesn't know that she thinks they're probably like Mexico just hiding away from the law. Like it's absolutely crazy. Every character, the one I would probably say is most rational would be other than Bernard, the elf would be the mother. She did choose majority of rational decisions. She does have a very strange reason for like hating Christmas. I think I'm remembering her character. Well, oh, wait, am I thinking of someone else?
00:10:24
Speaker
You see, is this going back to what we were talking about last week with I Believe in Santa when it was like, oh, I didn't get the presents I wanted at Christmas, therefore I don't believe in Santa. I'm a misery guts. I think I discussed that in last week's episode as well, but like, it feels so inappropriate to be like, you don't believe in Santa. And it's like, well, I've been buying the presents this whole time. Where do you think the presents have come from?
00:10:48
Speaker
Oh my god, seeing that note, can I just dive into the worst character of this
Dark Themes and 90s Film Tropes
00:10:54
Speaker
film? Is it Johnson, the guy at the very start who's got his secretary in his lap while he dresses Santa Claus? He is horrific as well. The film starts with him just joking about infidelity. I actually made a list and I was indeed checking it twice. Very good. Thank you very much. There was a lot of themes that I wasn't expecting in this film. I didn't even realize I had to coin the phrase Santa-side and
00:11:16
Speaker
this, but we have Santaside, we have Child Endangement, we have Kidnapping, we have Infidelity, we have Fat Shaming. I don't know if Gaslighting appears, because it's a really weird scene where the Stepfather character, and believe me I will get onto him, but the Stepfather figure is talking to the main child, Charlie, who is Tim Allen's son in this one, and he's like really
00:11:42
Speaker
And I know he's supposed to be a psychologist, but he's like, you don't believe in Santa, do you? I honestly thought for one minute I'd put on a war drama where someone was getting interrogated as, like, give me the plans for this. I was like, oops, no, no, no, it's just the Santa Claus, where it's like, oh, well, how do the reindeer fly, smart aleck? How does he get around without a chimney and everything? Jesus, dude, the kid's like, what, eight years old? Seven years old? What's your deal?
00:12:08
Speaker
He is so strangely confrontational. He's like, why are we still letting this kid believe in these delusions? He's five years old, thinking he's learned enough by now to know that Santa isn't real and all his hopes and dreams are going to die. I bet you he likes Freud as well, the hack. Surprisingly enough, we don't get enough psychology jokes on this channel, so...
00:12:25
Speaker
There you go. Backtracking a wee bit, because the stereotypical stepparent archetype in 90s films was usually a character that wasn't really well-liked. You know, they were supposed to be over the top, they were supposed to be quite confrontation. I will never sign this to you off air, but the only exception I saw at the time was probably Mrs. Doubtfire, where Pierce Brosnan's character is actually shown as being quite competent and quite
00:12:52
Speaker
passionate as a partner, whereas this one, Neil, the psychologist, he is just really horrible. And don't get me wrong, I get why he's concerned, but he goes about things in the wrong way, doesn't he? Yeah, he is very strange in how he's always trying to one-up
00:13:11
Speaker
Scott, and I think he has a lot to prove. I think he himself requires a fair bit of therapy to get over himself. It's very strange how he deals with the situation of being a stepfather. And like, this isn't a big issue. But it bothered me that in the first film, his name is spelled N-E-A-L. And in the second film, it's spelled N-E-I-L. So they just changed it from one film to the other. And like, it shouldn't have bothered me as much as it did. But I was like, they thought I wouldn't notice. We all read the subtitles.
00:13:36
Speaker
They weren't anticipating I'd be doing a Santa Claus movie marathon. Yeah, I don't get that. I don't know if there's like a lower appropriate reason. I don't know, Father Time's looked in and, yeah, I don't know, Woevee's magic, whatever. I just did not like his character. Every time he came on screen, it wasn't even entertaining. That's the thing. He wasn't like smug, but he kind of thought, oh, he's quite funny with the way he did it. Every time he came on screen, I just rolled my eyes and thought, oh, great, here we go again.
00:14:05
Speaker
And the thing I didn't like as well, and I don't know if you noticed this or picked up on it, was the fact that whenever he said something, you know, that he believed in, he always tried to impart his beliefs onto Laura. I thought that was a bit disturbing because there was a lot of it where he'd be like, oh, he's too old for this. And then she would turn round and be like, oh yes, I agree. We think that. A very particular choice of pronouns. He was like, we think that. Do you Laura? Do you really?
00:14:32
Speaker
do you think a five-year-old or seven-year-old or whatever, do you think he's too old to be believing in Santa Claus? I can't believe it. I was like, my god, I'm siding with Tim Allen here, Buzz Lightyear himself. I'm siding with him when he's like, well, he has to use his imagination. But yeah, what did you think of that?
00:14:49
Speaker
I didn't really know that he'd sucked, essentially, when I was making my notes from it. I didn't know too much else about him, but he just was always really inappropriate in the scenes he was in, I found. He just tried to control Laura, tried to control Charlie, and was the one that essentially pushed for full custody and restraining order, all that kind of stuff. Laura herself didn't seem too sure on doing a lot of those things, and it was very much Neil that pushed her to do that. So he was probably the worst person
00:15:16
Speaker
in
00:15:31
Speaker
Scott himself is an asshole. There's definitely like a history there that they probably have fought for years. And this is kind of what's happened. You wonder what the relationship between Laura and Neil, how it started, whether or not he was her therapist initially, which would be a really kind of dodgy situation. Of course, we don't know that we can't necessarily imply that but wouldn't surprise me if that's what they want to imply.
00:15:50
Speaker
I'm not saying that happened, but it happened. My headcanon. My fanfiction. Yeah, you can check out the rest of our Santa Claus fanfiction at catsanabe.com forward slash. This is a joke. But yeah, he was just the absolute worst. And one of the things I have to admit I was laughing at before we talk about the very infamous scene of how Tim Allen slash Scott
00:16:12
Speaker
came Santa Claus.
Transformation and Fantasy vs. Realism
00:16:14
Speaker
There was a particular scene where because he puts on the outfit and everything he starts turning into the traditional Santa by getting fatter and he gets the full white beard and the white hair and don't worry I will come on to that as well because I thought that was a little bit off but at the same time it was the 90s.
00:16:32
Speaker
there was a scene where the wee boy without any filter kept running around saying, my daddy's Santa Claus and everyone thinks this kid is crazy for obvious reasons. But then the wife turned round and I could not stop laughing at this. She's like, oh my god Scott, you wait.
00:16:49
Speaker
trouble to change yourself into Santa Claus so the sun would love you more." And I was like, we don't have a frame of reference for the amount of time that's passed. It was in normal one day and then all of a sudden he's just suddenly bloated up and he's just completely fat and he's got the big
00:17:09
Speaker
beard and everything because there's obviously that scene in the conference room where haha he's fat so he eats all of the desserts and things and that's why I was getting that with the fat shaming because I was kind of like well should they not be more concerned that this guy was like really thin yesterday and then all of a Sunday's ballooned up like this isn't a wee bit of gradual waiting
00:17:30
Speaker
That is my note as well. Bringing up someone's weight is not professional, but you would be concerned for someone if they gained that much weight in that short of a period of time. Because even just eating a ridiculous amount, you don't bloat that quickly. I saw a cartoon. It's insane that he's all of a sudden gone grey, grown huge amounts of facial hair, gained that much weight. He said to the doctor at one point that he gained 40 pounds in the space of like two days. That was the worst doctor in America, by the way. The fact he was like, oh, it's just
00:18:00
Speaker
the milk and cookies you've been eating. And I was like, what was in those milk and cookies? Was that protein powder or something? Was it just pure protein powder or something that was snorting up his nose? Merry Christmas, kids. But on that mental image... It's gonna be a blizzard.
00:18:15
Speaker
is find it out who's naughty or so. I know it's a fantasy film about Santa Claus, but there is no conceivable way that a normal human being could bloat to that size. And, you know, as you said, go grey without some kind of medical abnormality. And the reason I bring that up is because people will wave that off and say, oh yes, a fantasy film, suspension of disbelief. But they treat this very straight and serious.
00:18:41
Speaker
You know, they don't say, oh, maybe it is something magical or they never entertain the idea. It gets so bad that, as you said, Neil goes to the court for a separation order and then, of course, you get the kid who just has no filter at all and that made me just day-spam every single time where the wee boy kept saying, I told the judge about the North Pole when I'm like, read the room, kid, read the room. I want my five bucks back. I want my five bucks back.
00:19:09
Speaker
Yeah, that was also a disturbing scene where it essentially implied that he was okay with bribing his son to lie to his mother. I was like, oh, that's great. And I know why he did it, obviously, because he would have thought he was crazy and he would have lost custody, but as he said, he'd read the room.
00:19:27
Speaker
Yeah, I do want to quickly discuss the son Charlie again where on Christmas Eve, Charlie's dropped off at Scott's house and you hear Charlie say, do I have to stay with an earshot of Scott? If I was separated from my partner and we had a kid together and they said that, that would be the most heartbreaking thing I think I could ever hear. Like that is horrendous. I mean, it's obviously sort of trying to lay the foundations and explain their relationship together and how not a good father Scott has been.
00:19:56
Speaker
But that is such a horrible thing to hear. I instantly felt bad for Scott there.
Narrative Gaps and Dark Humor
00:20:01
Speaker
I think the main problem with this film, and again they're obviously wanting to focus more on the Santa Claus aspect than the politics of a divorced couple, but there seems to be a lot of missing context in this film.
00:20:15
Speaker
because we are told that Scott is a very absent father and you know you can kind of see as very much similarities to a film like Jingle all the way when he's constantly at the office and everything but even when they get some to visit and they cook the turkey for him
00:20:34
Speaker
at least he's trying to make an effort with him to keep getting told that Scott is like this terrible father and don't get me wrong he could be better than a lot of regards like for example when he takes his son to Denny's which after that I did laugh at when it's all the other parents or all the other single dads there. Yeah so I initially noted like oh Santa Claus sponsored by Denny's and then I made it went I take it back this Denny's does not come out looking good from this movie. Yeah so this single dad
00:21:00
Speaker
all the single dads, and they ask for food, and every time the witch is like, we're out. I did laugh at that when Charlie was like, I'll have a chocolate milk. And she's like, we're out of chocolate milk. And he was like, I'll just have a regular milk, please. And it was like the saddest length of everything I've seen from a child.
00:21:16
Speaker
then like the waitress is walking away and scott's like oh at least we'll get their famous apple pie or something and the waitress like walking away and goes don't bet on it what fucking denny's is this i've never been to a denny's i can't say what they're like generally but like i do not have a good impression of denny's having watched this now do you know
00:21:33
Speaker
enough. Denny's, for anybody outside the UK listening, Denny's is not a popular chain in the UK. There's Denny's in the UK? Well, there was one in Scotland and I remember it shut down very, very quickly because I was reading the reviews and there was things like the staff wouldn't even come over and they were just very abrasive to them. The menu and the food wasn't good and that lasted six months.
00:21:58
Speaker
maybe? Maybe a year if I'm being generous. There are a lot of American chains that have come over, like Taco Bell and things like that, but that's a push. There's like a very small smattering of these restaurants. There is one remaining in the UK. It's in Swansea.
00:22:16
Speaker
Welsh listeners, you head down to that Denny's or if you've already been, tell us how it is. Yeah, please reach out to us. Genuinely, if you've been to Denny's in the UK or outside of America, please let me know because even when I visited America, I actually didn't visit Denny's. I visited IHOP. That was an experience. I like how we hold up Denny's tourist destination, going to see the Empire State Building or going to see the Washington Monument or something like that.
00:22:40
Speaker
It's like, you know those crazy travel vloggers who go to these dangerous countries and things and they document their experiences? No, no, no, forget that. Denny's is what it is. If you want a bad experience and you want to document your life, then hell, go to Denny's apartment with Denny's responsibility.
00:23:01
Speaker
Well, when I went to America a couple months ago, and I've not really been to America often, so it was only my third time, I was like, all right, I'm going to try and get up all these places I've heard of. Just like, I want to know what the fuss is about when not like all these things were mentioned in pop cultures. I went to Olive Garden. I went to In-N-Out Burger. I went to Jersey Mike's Subs and come try and think if there's any other random chain restaurants I went to. But like, I tried.
00:23:23
Speaker
I did not go to Shake Shack. I did not see any Shake Shacks while I was there. They are pretty good. I have done that. Shake Shack is pretty good. This episode was sponsored by Shake Shack. For all your shaking and shacking needs? I don't know. I've only been once. Don't sue me. I did have the tourist culinary experience of all these crappy American chains. Well, I'll say crappy. Some of the burgers and food was alright.
00:23:44
Speaker
there is an interest in going to these chains that you've heard of in pop culture. We've gone very far away from our main topic. Yeah, I was gonna say we went down a culinary rabbit hole here, Jesus. You know what, we're far too happy here. Let's talk about the death of Santa Claus from Denny's to Santa's side. Oh my god, that scene. I've seen it in a lot of trailers. I've seen the Santa falling off the roof, the dead body in the snow, and
00:24:10
Speaker
You know, it's the image that for some reason they always advertise when it comes to this. And if not, it's the weird fat suit Tim Allen when they just photoshop his head on top of the body. Probably really weird, I don't get that. But yeah, so the premise of that is the wee boy hears a clattering on the roof. He tells his dad to go out and check it.
00:24:31
Speaker
it. Dad runs out, spooks Santa, Santa slips and I'm assuming cracks his head open. And then I honestly, I kid you not, he does a bankanobe where his body disappears, but his clothes stay there. If you strike me down, I'll become more fister next year. But before he does that, he does this little like wave with his glove.
00:24:51
Speaker
Yeah! It was so creepy. I was like, oh, why have you done that? Just leave him dead. It's like the Terminator at the end of Terminator 2, the thumbs up. So essentially he looted a dead man and then the dead man disappeared. And what I hated about it as well is, again, the kid has no survival instinct. He's just like, wow, is that Santa? And he's running out. This could be like a murderer or a
00:25:18
Speaker
burglar for all we know but no he's just like I want to see the dead body it's like charlie you're sick you're on the naughty list for a reason what the hell man i don't even know why scott has allowed him to stay out there i've been like charlie don't come out charlie's like stay inside to be fair he does tell him that charlie just doesn't listen because as i said he's got no survival instincts
00:25:37
Speaker
Santa could have had a shotgun, but no, he's just like, no, let's run outside. And yeah, they see the Santa suit and he keeps saying really weird things like, put the suit on Dad, climb into this dead man slowly. This film is dark.
00:25:52
Speaker
Yeah, he's very much like, alright, let's go with this kind of kid. There's no thinking like, oh my god, the situation's happened, what do we do? It's like, oh, well, I'll just put his clothes on. This is mine now. That's what you do. You just take someone's clothes and just be wearing it now, that's what happens. Kids, this is what happens when you play too many video games, okay? See once in a while, go out, touch grass.
00:26:14
Speaker
going for the love of God, do not steal a dead Santa's sleigh. Can't believe that has to be a warning in this episode, but I'm going to say it anyway. I have so many questions though about this Santa dying situation. Well, other than the fact that by North Pole law, there's a reasonable clause that involves trial by combat. What's the trial by combat thing? I don't remember that. No, I just mean essentially that a Santa can challenge another Santa to the death.
00:26:39
Speaker
Oh, I see. That's the thing, though. Like, how often does this happen? You kind of think like, oh, well, that guy was old, so he's been Santa for a while. It's like, well, no, no, necessarily, because Tim Allen becomes old when he becomes Santa. So like, maybe this center has only been on the job for a year and immediately slips off the roof because he was really rubbish. I don't know if it's the first one, the second one, but they comment in it about how like Tim Allen, Santa has been the best Santa they've had in such a long time. Finally got a good Santa or something like that. Wow. Like, that was such a rude thing to say about the guy who died like eight years prior from the job.
00:27:07
Speaker
Yeah, no, they do say that. They say, oh, happiness is going up by 86% and I was just like, I want to see your elf accountants because there is no way child happiness is going up by 86%. How are they going to keep those numbers up? That's what I want to know.
00:27:23
Speaker
Yeah, there's an expectation of a 25% increase every quarter or every year. This is not sustainable. I don't know how he can increase child happiness by that degree. Yeah, like, as next year it's going to be like, oh, it was down 12%, which don't get me wrong, sounds terrible if you take it out of context. But at the end of the day, that's all the, I don't know, big elf corporation came up with.
00:27:46
Speaker
But yeah, how often is this happening? What is the average lifespan of these guys? It does not seem like a particularly safe occupation given how easy it is for them to be knocked off the roof and caught by the police and all this kind of stuff.
00:27:59
Speaker
Oh yeah, that was depressing. The fact that we had a scene where Santa Claus gets arrested very akin to Medical on 34th Street, only the difference is, at least then, that kind of served a point. I mean, in Medical on 34th Street, obviously that was Santa that they were arresting, but he didn't go around flaunting his magical powers or anything, whereas in this one,
00:28:21
Speaker
It clearly does have the ability to change people's roofs, to have chimneys and things. He does have the ability to shapeshift, essentially. Then he gets caught by the police in the most GTA thing ever, but it's just like busted, and then gets carted away by them. I was saying this to my partner, imagine how traumatising it would be as a child to see Santa shoved into the back of a police car and driven away. We were like, oh, that's my childhood over. See if that was done nowadays. It would spark so many podcasts, wouldn't it?
00:28:49
Speaker
Sad as innocent, let me tell you why.
00:28:53
Speaker
Well, it's funny you should say that, because my note from the end of the movie, or my last note from the end of the movie, was that this family will be on every talk show. Every talk show is going to want to know about this family that had their kid kidnapped and their dad turned to be Santa, because this entire street saw Santa awkwardly ride along on his sleigh three times onto the screen for some reason. He just didn't leave the screen for a while, originally circled round a bunch of times. I think he just stole these reindeer, to be honest. Come on, Rudolph.
00:29:22
Speaker
It'd be light on that clutch. It'd be really light on that clutch. I knew I should have got an automatic. Anyway, sorry. There's no deniability. That's essentially what we'll get, there's no deniability unless the whole street signed like an NDA. Yeah, like a Christmas NDA with, I don't even know whose jurisdiction that was for wonder.
Legal Speculations and Uncomfortable Scenes
00:29:45
Speaker
Would that be a government thing? Would that be the CIA? The FBI?
00:29:48
Speaker
They're definitely federal in some capacity. Some state troopers like, we're keeping this real tight, we're not letting anyone know about this. Can you imagine having to draft up that ADA being like, I could have been a baker, I could have had like a shop and a bakery in Cincinnati or something, but no, I'm here writing an NDA for Santa Claus. Or sorry, Tim Allen is Santa Claus. Yeah, this film's weird. That's essentially my summary of this film. This film, I do agree, it has to have a
00:30:15
Speaker
huge degree of suspending your disbelief because you know at the end of the day it's a fantasy film it's a Santa film and I genuinely do think that if you grew up with this film if you watch this as a kid then I can understand why you enjoy it and that is perfectly fine but see watching this as an adult with no exposure to it beforehand it is a sobering experience and it genuinely makes me feel old personally
00:30:43
Speaker
because I'm sitting there going, oh my God, that's child endangerment. Oh my God, you know, because as a kid, I would probably be on the side of like Santa and, you know, the wee boy and be like, yeah, they want to go to the North Pole. Why is the mum not letting them go? The mum's like, you know, sticking the mud and everything. But have you seen that haircut? She sucks.
00:31:02
Speaker
you're not wrong, it was the 90s, it was a different time, okay? As I said, for the negatives, I don't want to end on the negative, but I did not like Neil. I thought the mum was getting gaslit by Neil and she needs to chuck him. I'm not saying she should run back to Tim Allen, but I genuinely think she could do better. There was a lot of realism, I think is my main issue with it, there was a lot of realism up
00:31:25
Speaker
apply to a film that should have been more fantastical. You know it was like oh look it's some guy metamorphosing into Santa Claus. Although they took everything else seriously like the court order and
00:31:41
Speaker
not allowing them to be near his own child and things. Yeah, they don't really take him very seriously. As we discussed before with his health issues and things taking the role of Santa, can I just say I know this is like a business practice that's probably been implored before but I think it's a dick move to make your fine print that small on a business card
00:32:04
Speaker
I do agree that that seemed a bit sus and I feel like there could be some different legal questions about if it's not visible unless you look through that many microscopes to see it, how legally binding could this possibly be? Right, I've got a question for you though because the whole premise of course is the Santa Claus spelt C-L-A-U-S-E. That implies there's like a really good legal team of elves sitting at the North Pole but two issues here, two issues with that.
00:32:30
Speaker
One, does the North Pole count as its own sovereign state? Answer, probably not. No. Based on what we know from Christmas Wrapped Up or what the fuck it was called, it is in fact in Alaska and so it would fall under American jurisdiction. Ah, of course. No, that is true. But then again, they only have one reindeer.
00:32:49
Speaker
which if you want to hear that episode from last week then definitely go check it out but going back to my point though number two is the fact that they want to be very secretive so I know obviously they caught him by magic but the fact of the matter is legally they can't really press him into this role because it's like they would have to expose themselves which technically they do at the very end of the film when they bust him out of prison
00:33:13
Speaker
Yeah, and then he dances to ZZ Top. That genuinely, I did not realise that was a real scene. I thought people were meming on me and they were saying, oh, there's a funny scene where, and when I say dances to ZZ Top, I'm using that phrase very loosely. He kind of like shuffles and puts his arm out. It's all he could move in that fat suit. You know what? That is a fair point. I will do the Mr Robot. Yeah, that is all I can do right now.
00:33:39
Speaker
That wasn't the Mr. Robot. That was more likely your dinner is ready, sir. You know that way when you see butlers and things in films and they hold up their arm and they've got the cloth draped over them. You know, that's what it was like. You kept doing that. It's like, stop doing that, Dad. My Grinchiness aside though, what are your final thoughts on this film?
00:33:59
Speaker
There were a few bits that I enjoyed that we've not mentioned. When he had that medical, there was a part where they checked his heartbeat and his heartbeat made jingle bells, which I thought was quite cute and quite funny. I enjoyed his interactions with a lot of the elves. I thought that that was pretty fun. Judy was very cute, the elf that helped him out a bunch. And then Bernard was a pretty fun character. I thought like he was one of the highlights of the movie for me.
00:34:19
Speaker
There are other pretty questionable scenes, like when he's kind of transitioning into Santa and he's sat on a bench in the park and just a bunch of kids just come and sit in his lap. And then he kind of like facilitates all these children in a park that he doesn't know sitting on his lap. As Santa Claus, that's fine. But without context, for anyone sort of observing that, I'd be calling the cops. Like I would not be happy about this line of children coming to sit on this guy's lap that doesn't outwardly seem that much like a Santa Claus figure himself. So it was very strange, again, a very different time perhaps. But yeah, I found that to be a bit weird.
00:34:47
Speaker
Well, I mean, what is creepier, and don't get me wrong, probably that scene, spoilers, but what's creepier, that scene, or when he essentially catcalls a random woman on the streets of Santa Claus? That was very weird. It's like some sort of Spider-Man 3 walking down the street, but he's like, I can get you what you want for Christmas.
00:35:06
Speaker
Yeah that's the thing that made me uncomfortable and I have to admit this is definitely like a 90s thing and I'm ashamed to even say that but it definitely seems like a 90s joke that they probably thought, oh no one's going to really think about this as the Santa Claus but he's looking at kids and he's like, oh so and so nice, so and so naughty, that person naughty, oh nice blah blah blah.
00:35:28
Speaker
then he comes across this woman and like a very short skirt and he's like, oh you're nice or something like that or naughty or whatever and I think she kind of rolls her eyes and goes, oh when your dreams criss-crinkled or whatever she says back and then the camera kind of just lingers on her as she's walking away and you're just like, I could have been doing without Santa catcalling a lady to be
00:35:51
Speaker
on this. I mean, I don't know what's worst. In fact, you know, there's several things worst, but you know, I mean he catcalls a woman, he gets arrested. Is he the worst Santa in history? In fact, do you know what's even worse? Like going back to the sequel, and I know obviously the sequel was made eight years later, but I have severe doubts when they're saying things like, oh, happiness was up 86%. With what?
00:36:14
Speaker
There's some Tim Allen propaganda here. Tim Allen's the nice guy that everyone loves. Like, no, Tim Allen's an asshole. Okay, one more thing that was I thought was very cute was where on his first Christmas kind of thing where he first puts on the suit, he goes and delivers presents to the girl and he's a bit snappy, a bit rude. And she says he's not going to drink the milk because he's lactose intolerant.
00:36:31
Speaker
he returns to that girl's house the next year and she's got soy milk for him because the previous year he said he was lactose intolerant. I thought that was the sweetest thing. I loved that. I thought it was really cute. I'm all agree with you there. That was really cute. There's some heart in this film between the kidnapping and the Santa side. You've got some heart from them. And then literally 10 minutes later
00:36:55
Speaker
But then at the very end of the movie, they said to Charlie like, oh, what do you want to do? And he goes like, I want to go into the family business. And I know the little fucker is going to push us down off the roof. I'm going to off him so I can be sent to next. The things we do for Christmas.
00:37:11
Speaker
He's gonna be poisoning those milk and cookies. I have to say that I completely agree with you in the sense that I've also been watching a lot of terrible Christmas songs recently, like, you know, the kind of cheesy, or you expect what's gonna happen kind of films, but it's so refreshing to see a film that at least is competently made.
00:37:33
Speaker
You know, the camera works good, the effects for what they are are relatively only. They're not like the Lord of the Rings effects of the era.
Final Thoughts and Engagement Encouragement
00:37:44
Speaker
The reindeer flying scenes were pretty rough. I don't really have much I can necessarily compare it to of the time. I can't remember what other films had done similar, but I was like, oh, these look really bad. The reindeer in general weren't great. We only ever focused on Comet for some reason and he was kind of annoying but freaky looking. Did he keep
00:37:59
Speaker
fart and there was that Santa no he did fart a bunch but yeah he was the only reindeer we seemed to focus on for some reason we didn't meet any of the other reindeer was only comment until we meet Chet in the next movie fuck you Chet pooch it hashtag just to switch it Chet needs to be fucking reindeared in I don't need that in my life right now that was very upsetting I did not enjoy that
00:38:19
Speaker
Okay, I was convinced that the voice actor was the same person who did the Rugrats. Oh, she is in the Rugrats, but she voices the mother? Oh, that's not what I expected. Anyway, Chet makes us laugh, which sounds like one of the Rugrats kids. Oh, it is. She's Phil and Lil. Okay. Yeah. So this actress, Kath Suki, plays Chet the reindeer and just laughs the whole time. And it's like a baby laughing. And it's just exactly like Phil and Lil do in the Rugrats. And it is so unnatural and really just frustrating. Every time Chet was on screen, I just wanted to die. So yeah. Merry Christmas.
00:38:49
Speaker
Yeah, overall, as I said before, I do think that this film does have some entertaining moments, but definitely if you're a kid it'll probably fly over your head, no pun intended. Or it'll fall off the roof in Tim Allen's case, but I don't know if I would honestly recommend this film, and that is going to sound like heresy. I genuinely feel as if this is a film that
00:39:13
Speaker
If you're a child or you've grown up with the film then you'll enjoy it a lot more but if you're coming into it as a bitter old Grinch like myself and Andrew then maybe it's not gonna be as endearing but I don't want to take that away from anybody if you enjoy the film.
00:39:30
Speaker
definitely more power to you. Enjoy the films, you want to enjoy this festive period. But yeah, that haulage on my note Andrew, thank you so much for joining me on not only the very last festive episode of the year but also the second fan requested episode of the season.
00:39:48
Speaker
Yeah, thank you so much for having me. Thank you for whoever suggested this. We look forward to getting more suggestions going forward. Despite what we've said about our own opinions on this movie, we do enjoy having these fan suggestions, sort of checking them out and doing these reviews. Even the films we don't enjoy, we still enjoy the experience of watching and then discussing them. So yeah, please do continue to comment and suggest more things you'd like us to cover.
00:40:09
Speaker
Yeah, honestly that is one thing I will say, just one final point about the Santa Claus, just the fact that at least it was memorable. I feel as if it were recommended a film that didn't have as memorable moments in it, you know, like obviously Santa falling off the roof and I'm not saying from now on I want films recommended to us where Santa dies, please no. Yeah, honestly thank you all so so much again for voting on the poll for this,
00:40:35
Speaker
episode, honestly it was much appreciated and yeah I hope you've enjoyed another festive month of Christmas films. Honestly it's hard to believe that this is the penultimate episode of the year because next week we are going to be having a more casual conversation. We're going to be talking about our memories about the podcast in 2023, we're going to be talking about the highs, the lows and by that I mean the Andrew episode versus the not Andrew episodes.
00:41:04
Speaker
You can choose which one of which. I made the former and the what. You knew I made the former. In the meantime, if you want to check out more of our past episodes, you can check us out our website, Chatsunami.com. You can also follow us on Patreon at Patreon.com forward slash Chatsunami. And you can follow us on Twitter or X, however you want to call it, at ChatsunamiPod.
00:41:24
Speaker
I also want to thank our Pandora Impatrons, Robotic Battle Toaster and Sonya. Thank you so, so much for supporting the show. But as always, thank you all so, so much for listening to these festive episodes. And as always, we want you to stay safe, stay awesome, stay hydrated and most importantly, stay jolly.