Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
Exit Strategy - Handling Player Departures
28 Plays13 days ago
Sometimes players leave campaigns—life changes, schedules shift, or interests move on. In this episode of How We Roll Gaming, we discuss practical and creative ways to handle player departures without losing the momentum of the story. From character exits and party dynamics to keeping the table engaged, we explore how to turn an awkward challenge into an opportunity for stronger storytelling and better games.
Homepage
https://howwerollgaming.com
Merch Store!
https://merch.howwerollgaming.com
Patreon
https://www.patreon.com/HowWeRollGaming
DriveThru RPG affiliate link
https://legacy.drivethrurpg.com/index.php?affiliate_id=4933263
Eberron Renewed - An Actual Play Podcast
https://zencastr.com/Eberron-Renewed
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction to Podcast
00:00:02
Speaker
with the coachman D20 Radio. at Your game is rolled.
00:00:17
Speaker
How will We Roll Gaming is dedicated to spreading enjoyment of great role-playing games. We hope to bring you insights into games you may not have played, tips to be a better game master and player, and share us stories of momentous events at our tables.
00:00:29
Speaker
Every game is a new story to tell. I'm Daryl. I'm Nick. And here's Robert. And this is How We Roll.
Meet the Hosts
00:00:43
Speaker
Welcome back to the How We Roll Gaming podcast, everybody. I hope that you are doing well. Nick, Robert, I hope you gentlemen are doing well as well. Doing well as well.
00:00:55
Speaker
I'm doing as well as well as well can be. Right on. so Before we get into our topic this week, or this episode, I keep saying this week like we're weekly.
Daryl's Free Comic Book Day Adventure
00:01:09
Speaker
But over last weekend, it was Free Comic Book Day. And I was out doing my normal Free Comic Book Day shenanigans. And our probably biggest local game store, on Free Comic Book Day, does a buy two get one free sale in the entire store because they also sell comics.
00:01:30
Speaker
So I got a couple of new games that we're probably going to want to get on the table. no First up, now we got a quick start of this last year, or I got a quick start of this last year on Free RPG Day.
00:01:46
Speaker
But so i I made a little oopsie when I was buying my stuff. I was like, oh, they have the Avengers core rulebook or the Avengers expansion for the Marvel Multiverse RPG. Right on. I've been waiting for them to have it. And I bought it and I came home. And as I was about to put it on the shelf, I bought it sometime last year.
00:02:07
Speaker
oh no so So I had to go back and exchange it. So I was kind of limited on my options that were the same price as that core rulebook.
00:02:19
Speaker
So despite having not played that quick start yet, I got the core rulebook for Monty Python's co-curricular medieval reenactment program.
00:02:31
Speaker
It's not a rulebook game. It says so on the cover. Totally not. says so yeah It says so on the cover. See? see Right there. is No, it isn't.
00:02:44
Speaker
As I said, it's proof in advertising. So i I picked that up because it's Muddy Python. This is right up the alley of our shenanigans.
00:02:56
Speaker
The disenaginist of shenanigans. It's funny, coincidentally enough, earlier this week, YouTuber Bob World Builder put up a poll looking to get results for you know people's favorite role-playing game system.
Monty Python RPG Acquisition
00:03:16
Speaker
And I put it out there in our discords for everyone to see. And I read it. Yeah. And Betsy looked at it and she's like, so what I'm learning is there's a Mighty Python RPG and why haven't we played it yet? and was like, well, coincidentally enough, I just got the core rule book this weekend.
00:03:36
Speaker
So it is going to be on the table at some point once I at least look through the quick start. hu Something else that I picked up while I was there, just because it was too darn adorable to resist, was a starter game from our friends at Edge Studio.
00:03:58
Speaker
Dungeons and Kittens. And it's just freaking adorable. It looks like it might. It doesn't say that it's the same system as Arkham Horror, but it looks like it might be similar because it came with two boxes of different colored D6s just like Arkham Horror did. And it said said the character sheets the character sheets look similar, but it's just it's bloody adorable.
00:04:27
Speaker
Interesting. Interesting tone shift for the same system. That'd be interesting. Oh, yeah. if If it's the same system, here we go.
00:04:38
Speaker
Dungeons and Kittens. Yes, I've seen that before. well HB Lovecraft had a thing for cats. Yes. Don't you dare. Yeah, did no, Nick.
Exploring DC Comics RPG and 'Crisis Die'
00:04:50
Speaker
Nick, we don't want this. We don't want to strike. We don't want this episode deplatformed from all of the platforms. So don't you dare. and I said he had a thing for cats. I didn't say he had a way for naming cats.
00:05:09
Speaker
And then finally, i downloaded just the other night. I thought I had already downloaded it when I first heard about it a few weeks ago. But after many, many years of there not being a DC Comics RPG,
00:05:25
Speaker
There is a quick start out for an upcoming crowdfunding campaign on GameFound for the Justice League Unlimited RPG. Oh, cool.
00:05:39
Speaker
And I've looked through the quick start, and there's one thing that's super, super interesting to me. Nick, when I say DC and you think of events, what's the one word that comes to mind to you?
00:05:53
Speaker
Crisis. crisis There is a rule for what is called a crisis die.
00:06:01
Speaker
That if one of the the currencies, I can't remember if it's, that they have a system similar to destiny points or momentum and threat like in Star Trek or whatever.
00:06:19
Speaker
I don't remember what they're called. i' I think the the GM's currency is called editorial points. I can't remember what the player currency is. But when one of those is spent in a certain way or a certain amount, the GM, or as the game calls it, the editor, rolls a D20 on a crisis table.
00:06:46
Speaker
And the result determines the nature of the crisis that occurs right then. Robert, hold on. I can never be the one to roll it. It sounds like we would want you to roll because it sounds like would be some fun stuff on there. I just get dark side. yeah Well, no, it's it's stuff like um a dark version of of one or all of the characters shows up.
00:07:13
Speaker
Or time travel happens. you know You get shunted forward in time. Or things like that. And I was like, oh, now this is just fun. That's some fun stuff.
00:07:25
Speaker
we just going to get shunted into Batman Beyond and fight the Jokers with a Z? Who knows? Who knows? But yeah, it just looks plain fun. It could be an entire dark version of us that are also Batman.
00:07:39
Speaker
Yeah, I want to read through that. I want to give that a try. um when it When the crowdfunding goes live on GameFound, by having signed up for updates early, if I pledge, I'm going to get to choose a D20 in the design of the Justice League founder of my choice.
00:08:01
Speaker
Ooh. You know, it's like a a d20 that i presume it's the 20 face there's a blue one with yellow numbers and a superman shield there's a green one that has a green lantern symbol black one with yellow writing that's batman they look cool i want all of them but i can only get one but you're not going to get one in your boy's colors your boy richard He's not an option because he's not a Justice League founder.
00:08:37
Speaker
He's not a Justice League founder, which makes me sad. Yeah. They love you. Yep.
Eberron Renewed Podcast Promo
00:08:45
Speaker
But before now we get into our topic, we do still have some house cleaning to take care of.
00:08:54
Speaker
Looking for your next actual play, Obsesson? step into the world of ever on renewed a high energy dungeons of dragons podcast set in the magic fueled intrigue soaked setting of ever on yes follow a band of unlikely heroes as they chase down conspiracies clash with dangerous factions and navigate a world where arcane power meets pulpy adventure it's cinematic storytelling memorable characters and plenty of twists that'll keep you guessing They're part of the D20 radio network, and Eberron Renewed is perfect whether you're a longtime fan of the setting or diving into it for the first time. So cue it up, roll with the story, and discover why Eberron is unlike any other world in D&D.
00:09:42
Speaker
Yes, and we'll watch it and take notes of how their shenanigans versus ours are. I don't know if anyone shenanigans the way that we shenan. Well, if they don't go and start a tavern on an island and forgo the entire quest, then no.
00:09:58
Speaker
It's more of the Gan than the Senan. You guys are the... guys sweet You guys braver in the Gan of the Senan again. We have Shenan'd once and we will Shenan again.
00:10:11
Speaker
Always. i need I need to isolate that audio from Starfleet Academy to add to our soundboard. That sounds like a good shirt.
00:10:23
Speaker
Yes. Oh, yes. Oh, yeah. That's going to go on the on the store in July. But we'll talk about the store later.
00:10:34
Speaker
Yes. ah So now on to our topic for this time, this episode.
Handling Player Departures in RPGs
00:10:40
Speaker
So when a player leaves a campaign, it can shake up the story, the party, and even the group dynamic at the table.
00:10:47
Speaker
So this episode, we're talking about how game masters and players can handle those departures gracefully, whether it's a planned farewell, a sudden disappearance, or a character written out mid-adventure.
00:11:01
Speaker
So from respectful communication to memorable exits and keeping the campaign moving forward, We're diving into ways to turn a tough situation into great storytelling.
00:11:13
Speaker
Yes, because last week we talked about, of course, if a character passes away, but the player still stays. Now we're kind of doing the more extreme as when for some reason another, player leaves. And all of us who have actually had that happen, we all have our own stories to tell. And the third part of this trilogy, what happens when we have to execute one of the players?
00:11:37
Speaker
Not literally legal. no Right. Legal disclaimer. frank color color In Minecraft. There we go.
00:11:51
Speaker
All right. But yes, so let's get started there. Because there's plenty of reasons why people leave. we can talk about the very simple one. One that I have experienced is just.
00:12:03
Speaker
They don't mesh well with the campaign or simply don't think the setting is for them. I've actually had that happen recently as one of our care, my care players in my cyberpunk red game just said, I'm not, yeah, I think I'm going to drop out of this campaign because it's not really my setting. I don't think I'm really enjoying it.
00:12:22
Speaker
Yeah. Just not, just not grooving on the setting. And that's, that's perfectly fine. Very valid. that One of the, reasons why I even got our groups together on meetup was because of the most difficult task of making a role playing group is getting people.
00:12:41
Speaker
And sometimes you get into a situation where it's like, well, these are my only role playing group that I can be part of. So I have to grin and bear it. But you don't.
00:12:53
Speaker
If you don't vibe with a group for whatever reason, you have every right to leave. Yes. Now, we are kind of unique in that I've talked to people you who are into role-playing games who are not part of our group and they say, oh, hey, you you play RPGs? What do you play? Well,
00:13:17
Speaker
at any given time, we have probably a dozen campaigns going. Yes, we're very unique in that we don't do a... We do long campaigns, but they're not One system.
00:13:32
Speaker
We jump systems here and there every week, usually. Yeah, we we play most every Saturday and Sunday, but it's rare that we play the same game even Saturday to Sunday.
00:13:49
Speaker
Yes, and that's usually... It's mostly like a limited campaign that we just want to get through. Or a big event where it's like, no, no we got we need to double up.
00:14:00
Speaker
Even then, sometimes we don't do that. Yeah. Sometimes we'll play the same system on Saturday and Sunday, but two completely different campaigns. yeah Not even the same GM either. Yeah, and we're unique like that in the sense that even though that player left my campaign, they've got plenty of other op he's got plenty of other options to choose from in our group. That may not be the truth in your group. It doesn't have to be.
00:14:28
Speaker
I never feel like once they leave... It's over. It's done. You can always and the future get them back. and just because someone one leaves the game, especially if it's just because i am just not feeling this setting. I'm not feeling this particular...
00:14:47
Speaker
this particular concept or premise, that's not a reflection on you as the GM. Again, it it goes both ways. Like, a player shouldn't feel that they are pressured into playing a game just because it's the group that they found.
00:15:05
Speaker
Nor should a GM feel slighted when it's like, I just don't vibe with that. It's like, there's a million ways... ways to play role-playing games. Tons of systems, tons of genres within those systems.
00:15:19
Speaker
And sometimes a player just has a vibe of it. Yes, and I'll emphasize what you said, Nick, is that especially as GMs, do not take it personally, and nor feel like you have been offended by them leaving. Especially when they say, i just don't vibe with the setting.
00:15:38
Speaker
Don't everything's like, oh, I'm terrible, or how dare you. Don't go into that. Don't over that thought. That's the... that's And again, like it's we are in a unique scenario with our group, but it is like something like, yes, if you're in a small area and this is your you only have a small set of players, like that can feel bad that you've lost one player. but if it If it's a mutual agreement of like they come to you and say that I'm not good with this and you have no means by which to...
00:16:13
Speaker
As soon as that, that's not your fault. It's just the nature of how things go. It's a mutual leaving. it's a You both shouldn't come away with any sort of guilt either way.
00:16:26
Speaker
And what I would recommend, when especially when it's something like that, when it's something totally amicable, totally understandable, like i this setting just isn't for me.
00:16:39
Speaker
or this premise in this setting isn't for me or whatever. I always recommend communicating with the player who's leaving.
Importance of GM-Player Communication
00:16:48
Speaker
and Find out why they're leaving. you Is it, is it the setting just doesn't grab you? ah Like I am sure that Lauren would not mind us talking about their departure from cyberpunk red.
00:17:02
Speaker
And it's just, from doing casual nerdity and knowing what kind of episodes of clone wars that they vibe with i understand why cyberpunk red doesn't vibe yeah exactly and understand that too yeah and so but i would you know check in with them is it just the vibe or is it the particular premise within the setting. Is there anything that could be changed without totally derailing the premise that would prompt them to stay?
00:17:46
Speaker
And that's not trying to force them to say stay. That's trying to that not to accommodate the player. Yes. And it's also an opportunity for you, the GM, to give constructive criticism or constructive talk to to see other opportunities you can have. Because I'll even admit, in Cyberpunk Red, with the role that that he was playing, I had hard time figuring out how to put him in my story.
00:18:14
Speaker
and that And I'll admit, I usually have a hard time with with techie type of characters that are more for like buffs rather than actual fighting, even though he was good at dodging. Because I was like, I don't really know where to go with his character.
00:18:29
Speaker
And again, that's something to explore. Again, not a problem with... yeah're like They even came up to me, like if I ran one, is that they asked me about, like do I have ideas for techie characters? and I have some ideas for techie characters. I've run techie characters before. But again, I'm far away from running my own cyberpunk. But they said like if they they would definitely at least like to see what I have in store for mine if I...
00:18:58
Speaker
Because I didn't say that i I've run techie characters before. Yes, well, I've run more fighters or talkers or at best yeah simple mechanics, but not someone well deep into tech.
00:19:13
Speaker
At no point did they yeah say that you had a that they had a problem of how you were running it. Yeah, I never thought that. Yeah. Yeah. So that there's again there's nuance to these things where we can some people run games in the same genre, in the same system, differently. and they Yes, and I'll admit, as a player myself, as Nick knows, when he was running his G.I. Joe Transformers campaign, I was in in the beginning, and I liked my character, but I didn't really grow up with G.I. Joe or Transformers.
00:19:49
Speaker
So the whole nostalgia and references just kind of went over my head to the point where I was like, I'm not that interested in it because I didn't grow up on it, so I'm just going to bow out.
00:20:00
Speaker
And that was perfectly fine by me. it's like it what did Again, there's a multiple of personal reasons in terms of like why you would want to leave a game that are not like negative reasons.
00:20:13
Speaker
Exactly. And as Daryl said, communication is good when possible. If the get if the player's just saying, like, you suck, you're terrible at GMing, I'm out here, you... That's not good. Cut the cord, you're you're fine. That's yeah there is such that As someone who's been through multiple creative writing courses, constructive criticism is is different from criticism.
00:20:39
Speaker
because Exactly. like there's There's ways to say, like, this is not my thing, this is not my flavor, but here's what I liked.
00:20:51
Speaker
And if you could change that, but I'm not asking to change that. Yeah. Those those are better ways that there's ways of being diplomatic and helping GM understand, like, that's why it's not your flavor. And if they can take that and be like, well, maybe I can adjust it.
00:21:11
Speaker
Or if not, they'll at least think about that in the future when someone might have a similar concern going forward. Yes. the there if They're trying to shame you. Don't engage.
00:21:23
Speaker
yeah Yes. yeah did did and that That's a good segue into like, there's a lot of ways to end a, to leave a group acrimoniously.
00:21:36
Speaker
Before we make that segue, I wanted, I just want to say on the other side of that, as the GM, when someone's just saying, Hey, you know this, this game just isn't for me. It's, it's nothing that anybody at the table did.
00:21:54
Speaker
It's just not my flavor. So I'm going to bow out. You don't want to be accusatory about it. You don't want to be, fair how dare you leave?
00:22:05
Speaker
Don't you know that this is the best game ever? yeah definitely don't make it about you. Don't be like, do you know how much effort I have put into this? The hours I've taken to write this out, trying to tell you for your story. what The worst case is don't impose upon like but how are they going to get through this without your insert role as your character's role in the story or mechanics. No, you are not meant to put that
00:22:40
Speaker
Do not put that on them. that it This is a a role-playing game. It's a cooperative storytelling thing. And sometimes you don't get everything you need. for Sometimes you get a whole bunch of barbarians and they're going to be, but you don't, but if the, if the, if the cleric doesn't want to be part of the group, you don't, you don't guilt trip the cleric just because they all made barbarians.
00:23:08
Speaker
Yeah. And if you're, and if you're the GM, if someone does leave, it's your responsibility to structure it to where they can take encounters without that person. Like if you ever ran a D&D campaign, as an example, and you don't have a healer, you as GM should be able to structure an encounter to where they can get injured, but they have ways of healing.
00:23:29
Speaker
Maybe healing posts or or spell scrolls or something. NPC healers. I was about to say a a a snarky NPC healer who you has issues with them sometimes.
00:23:47
Speaker
Yeah. always That's where that's what we can go back to the last time i was on Me and Steve. That's where you can work in your Frank Burns character.
00:24:02
Speaker
yes. yes But yeah, yeah like there's a there's a lot of ways that to work with that. But then what most people are, and probably what some are tuning in for, it's like, yes, there are less than friendly ways of leaving things off. And those are thorny issues.
00:24:24
Speaker
Yes. And there can be the instance where they're not leaving, you are kicking them out.
Managing Player Conflicts and Exits
00:24:30
Speaker
And in those cases... what I'm kind of thinking for this episode is that we're looking more at how the dynamic affects the table. And in a case like that, ah you know without naming names, we will say that we've had to kick somebody out.
00:24:51
Speaker
Well, we were close to kicking somebody out and they left. Yeah. Yeah, but that was an example, at least for a session, Nick kicked some people out. yeah I had to remove individuals...
00:25:04
Speaker
Because, it and admittedly, some of the blame is on me, some of the blame is on them, but ultimately I had to make the decision to remove them from the situation, and when I did, i didn't call the Cessin there.
00:25:20
Speaker
I removed them from the table, and I sat everyone down so that we could discuss it, and it's to sort of... recollect because again, like I couldn't just send everyone home at that point.
00:25:36
Speaker
Things had changed significantly and I wanted to, how do we get back on track after this? So it was sort of a pseudo quasi therapy session.
00:25:49
Speaker
Yes, but I think Daryl's right. We'll focus on the actual departure itself because I know in previous episodes we've talked about kicking out players before. yeah In this case, as far as group dynamics, it's always a good idea if you can and they're willing to do it. It's like, just talk with the rest of the players who know that this player is leaving.
00:26:13
Speaker
Don't have to explain the reasons. Don't have to put a spotlight on them. Just be like, this player is leaving. Just want to get a feel for everyone. We're going to keep going. I'm going to make some changes, of course, since that character is going to be gone, especially if some players have had their stories or dynamics tied to that character.
00:26:32
Speaker
or do to read Either as a warning or just getting their head space to be like, they're leaving. going to change things up. you guys are gonna have to You might have change things up depending on how you wanted your character to go.
00:26:44
Speaker
and we'll get through this. Readjust your character points if you need to store up in an area unless you we find someone else who can fill that spot. but like It's more or less case of like you should let them know And they should have the option, but it should always be like, if they want to ask you what's what's going on and you are privy to do that, do that off time. It it could be a... Exactly. be it's it's It's... We aren't... We may be all friends and buddy-buddy, but we're also not trying to be a gossip mill.
00:27:23
Speaker
Yeah, this could be as easy as after session or you just Go on a group chat or even a private chat with people. Just get their headspace. And some people may already know what's happening with that person.
00:27:36
Speaker
Exactly. The big thing as GMs we have to do is as a player leaves, how do you redirect or shift your campaign when you had ideas on how that certain character was going to be used or how their story was going to play?
Adjusting Campaigns Post-Departure
00:27:51
Speaker
And that is ultimately the much more thorny issue. Obviously player characters make their stories with each other, but as it ends, we sort of have to think long term.
00:28:06
Speaker
If we used an analogy, someone who's writing a book knows the entire story, knows when a character is going to leave and how it's going to follow. We, since we're creating a story together, don't know that.
00:28:20
Speaker
So we have to reorient, shift, move things around when that happens. Right. I've been in a situation where a campaign that I was running, a Star Wars campaign, surprise, um was the victim of the dreaded scheduling curse, where one by one,
00:28:48
Speaker
With a a group that started out ah with about six player characters. One by one, player characters started dropping until I had two left.
00:29:04
Speaker
o But, coincidentally enough, because i was part of Nick's Star Wars group at the time, other players...
00:29:18
Speaker
heard, ah you knew about that campaign. And when they heard that I had four players that had one by one drifted off from the campaign, expressed interest in joining it.
00:29:33
Speaker
And so what I did, and this can be done in a campaign when even just a single character leaves, especially if there are story points hinging on that character,
00:29:46
Speaker
I was able to use that to kind of redirect the campaign. So for instance, one of the running threads in that campaign was that the player characters were based on Naboo and were on good terms with a local rebel cell on Naboo that had a legitimate private military command.
00:30:14
Speaker
organization basically you know they they basically had a a star wars version of like black water yeah that they operate yeah totally private security military that was their cover for working for the rebels that's why they had weapons and materiel and all of this and they were secretly a rebel cell And the player characters were bequeathed with docking space and things like that at their headquarters in the city that they were in on Naboo in exchange for occasionally doing jobs for the Rebellion.
00:30:58
Speaker
So A, even though hit hit unintentionally the campaign had a very strong Firefly vibe to it just because of the player characters that the players made.
00:31:12
Speaker
But even though it had a very strong Firefly, smugglers, scum and villainy flavor to it, definitely an Edge of the Empire campaign, we got to throw some classic Star Wars rebellion-related stuff in there.
00:31:30
Speaker
Well, as the cast changed over, I was able to kind of redirect a little bit hu through choices that the new players made. They put, they put a great big spotlight in the form of blowing up about with a two thirds of the feed reactor complex. Yeah. I remember that. And someone kind of leaving a mark. Yes.
00:31:59
Speaker
They put a spotlight on that area of Naboo. And Imperial Martial Law cracked down and they had to make a hasty getaway and leave Naboo behind.
00:32:15
Speaker
They had a new ship based on the new characters coming in and they took off and I was able to, yeah since I wasn't getting as much mileage out of the tangential connection to the rebels as I thought I might. i was like, you know what?
00:32:36
Speaker
I can leave that behind. I can do a pure Edge of the Empire campaign. So I started to redirect and it was ah straightforward Edge of the Empire, still very heavily Firefly themed to the point that I had found homebrew stats for the Firefly class ship for the Star Wars RPG and they were in a Firefly.
00:33:02
Speaker
And that's a good example, and then makes sense. If multiple people leave, or even if one person leaves, you can reorient the the core idea of the campaign or the core setting to be something else.
00:33:15
Speaker
Because it's also a good point, especially you're on game. There are times where players are sort of, quote, unquote, your lintspin, it's sort of like, you best not to do that. But sometimes someone becomes the, quote, unquote, main character.
00:33:32
Speaker
of a campaign and like you sort of put a little bit too many eggs in the basket and but then that does mean that if they move you need to pivot. Yes or maybe not main character in some sense more like they have a key connection to a big plot point you have that's very integral to the campaign you're thinking of running.
00:33:57
Speaker
And that's where especially if they leave you can first if you're on good terms with them can ask.
Player Consent and Character Usage
00:34:02
Speaker
Hey, can I still use your character or i can can I do this with your character to kind of either end their story or make it ambiguous in case you ever decide to come back.
00:34:13
Speaker
That is another thing. It's like, and again, like something that some, I've heard some GMs in other situations say like, well, i your character, i can use them. It's like, no player characters are owned by them.
00:34:30
Speaker
it' yeah to use an old saying from the internet, original character, do not steal. Yes, and... You gotta get that. Yeah, and even if they say you can use it, I wouldn't make them just a trailing NPC in the party still, just be like, the cardboard cutouts that's there may say a few words, but they're just standing there, T-posing. They are doing their part for their part of the story, but their story is no longer tethered as heavily to the main characters because you want them exactly the player characters are the main characters you'll just be like all right they're doing their part of the story but it's no longer your focus now unless you want to assist them with that and then even then it's so like guess what you're the ones accomplishing the goals they're just the facilitator now or depending on the system and the character and what the plot line was
00:35:28
Speaker
You can even turn them into some degree of a an NPC antagonist, either foreground or background.
00:35:39
Speaker
This is true as well. Yes, definitely get player consent before you do that, but that is one way to go. If you can. If you can. If you can, because... So, I'll toss another example out there.
00:35:54
Speaker
Our Walking Dead campaign that we've mentioned many, many times. Yes. we had We had a relatively new player to the group who started off in the campaign, had a great idea for a character,
00:36:07
Speaker
and he privately messaged me after session zero and said, Hey, I don't want to overstep. I hope this is okay to contact you, but I have this idea for my character.
00:36:23
Speaker
I'm the one that suggested they go to Vegas ah because I'm trying to find this relative of mine, but I have a past with,
00:36:35
Speaker
dealing and my character has a past with dealing and using drugs. And part of why he suggested going to Vegas is that his relative is supposedly there and in deep with one of the factions. And I'm trying to get him out.
00:36:59
Speaker
And on my, on my motorcycle character had a motorcycle. I have a stash of drugs. And after the first couple of sessions, that player just kind of fell out of the group. We haven't heard from him anymore. And it vanished on us.
00:37:20
Speaker
And that's something we can get through the next. Here recently, just because the opportunity presented itself, I took that opportunity as a you several characters involved.
Incorporating Former Characters
00:37:34
Speaker
ended up in the hospital at the same time. And as one of them who was having, you know, was kind of out of it was looking around, like, what do I see? well, you see somebody, ah you know, in scrubs, in you know, in orderly scrubs doesn't look like they have a badge, but they're taking drugs out of the dispensary.
00:38:02
Speaker
ah and it And at the end of the session, i revealed that it was that former player character. Yeah. And it's also interesting because the player who saw that was Nick, whose character has died.
00:38:17
Speaker
Yes, who did not know who that character was. never told anybody. Because the character you were playing at the time had never met that character. There's that whole storyline that is going on behind the scenes in Walking Dead, carrying on the storyline that that player had in mind for their character, even though they're no longer there.
00:38:41
Speaker
and none of the, as the players you know, because you were there. We have idea as characters what's happening in the background. Yeah, the characters don't know what happened to him. yeah But it's still going on. And again, that's the other thing. like,
00:38:56
Speaker
Not every time do we get the luxury of a player giving a goodbye. Sometimes just life swallows them up.
00:39:09
Speaker
Understandably, that can be concerning, especially if they've been around for a while. Again, it's a length of time versus not, but it can still be, regardless, like a disconcerting moment for people at your table be like,
00:39:23
Speaker
Where did they go? how do we handle this? This character was doing X, Y, and Z. And and also his friends were like, we're worried about them. What happened to them?
00:39:35
Speaker
I'm still trying to get in contact with one of us. It is still sort of AWOL at the moment, but hopefully we'll hear from them sooner than later. And some that we know that are doing a important duties for their jobs and stuff.
00:39:51
Speaker
Yes. and they a year You said duty.
00:39:56
Speaker
Yes. And then in one of my first campaigns, I had a player that was mostly in there. he would do a few other things, but he was mostly in mine. And he left and he messaged me that he's just being with his family more while his kids grew up before they, as he quoted, didn't started getting teenage and didn't want to be around him anymore. He was going to take the time with him that he could. Yeah.
00:40:19
Speaker
And I'm lucky that I get to see him roof periodically on Sundays because he goes to the same church I do. So I know he's doing fine. I don't have to worry about him. But sometimes just people just poof.
00:40:35
Speaker
It's a complicated kid. There is no right or wrong way. In some ways, like a lot of like for some that I know that do eventually want to come back but are committed to certain activities. I'm like,
00:40:49
Speaker
I'm ah holding their character, but ah they're definitely going to have to at the get acclimated to a new environment after how long they've been gone. We have been similar with a character in your Cyberpunk campaign as well.
00:41:06
Speaker
Yes. im I still routinely, whenever a new session comes up, I'll send the invite to her as well. She accepts it or she doesn't until Haven't messaged her privately in a while. Might do that.
00:41:21
Speaker
But I still leave the invite open just in case life's treating her better and she can come back. And sometimes. You bring up a good point there, that if someone goes ghost or just is no longer in contact, you can either put the character the player in the background, have theirs have what they're doing still impact the story, or you can face it another way, like they're either going off doing these things, still helping the party,
00:41:47
Speaker
maybe become that minor antagonist role that you talked about. Or it could be just as simple as they've gotten to a good point in life where they're just upping. They're content with what they have. They're not going to go forward anymore. Ironically, like the character that I, again, not to call that anyone on street on podcast, but the individual I'm trying to get back contact, I feel that if they do contact me and say that they are not able to return,
00:42:13
Speaker
we could argue that due to a nature of a prophecy in the story that we were telling, we could just say that they are fulfilling that part of the prophecy. Yes. yeah Or as I know, yeah can talk are good yeah it just it wouldn't be disruptive. And if they're willing to bring them back, I definitely would like to bring them back for for the grand finale, obvious obviously, as an NPC. But It at least gives them a reason why they are departed from the party without disrupting things.
00:42:45
Speaker
Yes, or if the player says they're leaving, though they may come back. Daryl, I know you have a good example where you've kind left their fate to be ambiguous in case that player ever does return.
00:42:57
Speaker
Yes, that same Star Wars campaign, the first player that opted to leave ah because... just life was too much in the way to commit to the game.
00:43:10
Speaker
She came to me and said like, Hey, you know, I, I'm going to leave the campaign. She explained why I totally got it. And I, I conferred with her and I said, okay, so this next session, the group's going to be encountering the star Wars version of zombies.
00:43:34
Speaker
So I am going to allow you to make this heroic sacrifice. The last time that any of them see you, you will begin to be swarmed and overwhelmed by a group of these Star Wars zombies.
00:43:55
Speaker
But there will not be a body. There's not a confirmation of death. So... If you choose to come back, it's one of those dramatic stories where you at the last minute rallied and fought them off and have been surviving and found a way off world and rejoined the team.
00:44:16
Speaker
Or if you want a recent TV episode. you're You're shooting at stormtroopers while you're walking into the fog blasters ring around you. Spoilers!
00:44:26
Speaker
and I don't even have the casual nerdity spoilers sound loaded into the soundboard.
Temporary Absence Solutions
00:44:32
Speaker
But it's like, that there are ways to to, like, because sometimes even those players, when you do speak with them and they say they need to go, they don't know how long that will be.
00:44:45
Speaker
they could they could know it it's like oh i need to take this uh business trip for like two months or that could be like well i don't know when i'll be back but i know i want to come back yeah or be like i'm going for two weeks to be with my friend as he's moving somewhere else as we've had recently there there are just ways to understand that like to work around, and one of our ways of usually, regardless of, like, there's no such thing as a perfect, there's seldom a perfect attendance at any role-playing game event.
00:45:24
Speaker
And our usual way of working around it is the quote-unquote cardboard cutout routine. which we'll joke, like, yes, you're all there, and this player's cardboard cutout is, like, sticking out of the car door. It's just standing up to the side.
00:45:41
Speaker
Because sometimes it could be. Because literally sometimes we've had cases where like someone says, I'm not going to be able to make it. in And then say, like actually, I can. I'll just be like a couple hours late. it's like Yes, we've had that before.
00:45:57
Speaker
And then they're like, wow, your cardboard cutters right here. is like But if not, it's like, okay, your your character went through so sort of these events, so we'll catch you up, but you didn't do anything impactful.
00:46:09
Speaker
Yes. But as far as what Nick has said previously about what if a character player leaving as a character that you feel is integral to your plot line, I've might have a situation if one player thinks to leave my cyberpunk red campaign again, because kind of been deep into each of the the story plot lines, but right now I'm focusing on his right now, but if he left, it's okay because through the backstories and from what we did in the beginning,
00:46:39
Speaker
I still have other characters that can get tied in to that main plot line through different alleys. So even if he does leave, which I don't want him to do, but even if he does leave, i have other avenues to carry out the story that I want to do.
00:46:53
Speaker
and Robert, I'm sorry to tell you that with Cyberpunk Red, i am not leaving the game, so you will still have to try to come up with ways to to include my rocker.
00:47:05
Speaker
Sorry. I actually had some ideas with that. Because I have ideas of connecting every player but you to the main plot line as you're the outside observer to be kind of like the voice of reason if they get too heated up. That's kind of what I'm going for right now.
00:47:21
Speaker
Oh, so fact i get to be the one that says, that looks at the audience and says, do you believe this? That does fit kind of. Or you the person that's be like, hey.
00:47:34
Speaker
I'm going to tell you this because I'm not connected to this, so I can think more rationally than you are right now. Obviously, you have a lot of work for that.
00:47:45
Speaker
Like you pretty much did in the last session. Yes. oh yeah yeah So so i I did that all on my own, and it and it played right into your hands? Yes. Yes, it did. but like yeah and Again, that's also a good thing about like...
00:48:03
Speaker
Just in general, as a GM, never put all your eggs in the same basket. All your characters are the main characters of their story, even if it is your story.
00:48:15
Speaker
Yes. Like we said before in our manifestos, like don't try to get one person the spotlight. Because it's not fair to everybody else. And two, if they leave, you kind of don't have a story anymore. you And this is sort of a part of that. It's like, this is a good example of that. Because again, part of the difficulty of all of all role-playing games is not necessarily the writing or the role-playing part.
Embracing Group Dynamics
00:48:43
Speaker
It's the getting everyone together for that.
00:48:46
Speaker
And sometimes life gets in the way. Yep. Yep. But much more often than not, life ah finds a way. Exactly.
00:48:57
Speaker
They haven't played that game yet. Mm-hmm. life is like uh the way but it's like the main factor is like you want to be able to be flexible you want your story to be flexible you want your players to be flexible and if things don't work out which sometimes they don't you don't want the whole thing to collapse in on itself exactly who know What else? What else? when a customer with customer what when a customer leader please When a customer leaves, we cheer. Oh, I'm sorry. Did I say that out loud?
00:49:37
Speaker
You cheer or you find someone else to pay the $25 to sit in on the game. That's right. nice You got to accept said that sometimes, sign and this is a rare case, especially for GMs, sometimes you and the players just don't vibe.
00:49:54
Speaker
Or a player and a player don't vibe. And sometimes, like, yes, as a group, we're all supposed to be friendly and supposed to work things out like responsible individuals. But sometimes you kind of have to just take the take the loss.
00:50:13
Speaker
Yeah. And that's not an easy thing to say. as odd as it is to say, this is giving respect to all parties involved. Not everybody is going to vibe with everybody else. And it is perfectly acceptable to say, hey, you know what?
00:50:31
Speaker
Everybody else have fun. I'm not vibing with this other person. I'm going to sit out this game that they're in. Because, honestly, that is a mature way of handling it.
00:50:44
Speaker
It is. Yes, it is. that There are just sometimes, that as well as it's sort of the's part of, like we have the right to be like who we want to associate with. And sometimes it's just like, I just don't get along with this guy. and it's like It's not anyone else's fault. It's not the main fault. It's the thing I want to do. nobody's fault.
00:51:07
Speaker
Yeah, it's just some people don't click. It's just there for them. And again, like it's not a case of like sitting down and sometimes it's better that I just don't engage. And that that's just the way things are.
00:51:23
Speaker
And it's it's difficult, especially in groups like this where it's like you want everyone to be like, stick together, ah everyone together. But sometimes you just need to accept there's some things that just need to happen.
00:51:38
Speaker
and I think that we are we are exceedingly lucky that the core of our group does click so well. Even even those of us who have you know different ah you different perspectives on things. Like, Robert, we Stephanie and I adore that you went out of your comfort zone and went to Rocky Horror with us.
00:52:05
Speaker
You did not enjoy it. We know. And we appreciate you going. We appreciate you going and stepping out of your comfort zone and saying, okay, I did it. It's not for me.
00:52:21
Speaker
Next page. yep that's that is a That is a very mature. And that's basically how we sort how you sort view like most social gatherings. Sometimes...
00:52:33
Speaker
You just have to be like, all right, this wasn't my thing, not my flavor. But it's not a slight or or insult. It's a way of just like, that's just not my thing.
00:52:46
Speaker
Yes, and we also have, least with us, which in your group you can or cannot do this, we play a lot of different type of campaigns. I wouldn't fully recommend trying the dozens of systems and campaigns that we're doing, especially if you're just starting out. but if you can we are callinggenate for punishment yes But if you can alternate towards one universal campaign to another that you feel that that player you're close to may enjoy, by all means do that. Definitely good i get feedback from the other group as well. Be like, would you be interested in doing this?
00:53:20
Speaker
Especially if X player would enjoy this and and be in this one. Again, there's there's... We are not for lack of in the gaming space.
00:53:30
Speaker
For genres, for franchises, for experiences. Frontier games, more freeform games. There's more likely than not a way to play that everyone can enjoy. It's just up to what majority and how you want to play.
00:53:50
Speaker
Yes, and then far as a player leaving... We've talked a little about how we as GMs can shift the story or go this way or go that way. So hey if you have a player in your group that says, okay, that person's leaving.
Character Development After Departures
00:54:04
Speaker
This is how my character is going to react. And this is how kind of an arc I want them to go through. Like maybe they're not trusting in people anymore. Or maybe if that other player consents to that, his character being killed off. Maybe it's like, if we get someone else that fills that role in the group, it doesn't feel right to my character. Because it feels like I'm replacing this great friend that I had.
00:54:28
Speaker
or something like that. Fully embrace what they're doing. yeah there As strange as it may sound. like Real life like events like that can save how your character goes. Say that like we know a character is going to be gone for a couple months. And we abstracted story like...
00:54:47
Speaker
Oh, they're going on a training expertise forise or i taking time at a monastery. They're getting going off to research the ring. Yeah.
00:54:59
Speaker
When they return, the characters can reflect on that on the time that like they miss them or that they could spend a downtime session and be like, hey, here's what happened where we were gone and discuss what happened.
00:55:14
Speaker
Yeah, exactly. i but In a dietetic way. Oh yeah, or like message or sit everyone down to be like, okay, this player's leaving. He's giving me permission to do this with his character. With your characters, think on how, based on who they are, how close they are to this person, how the story's going.
00:55:30
Speaker
How do they react that this character has either that passed away or has now gone off to do X reason and they're not coming back or most likely will not come back.
00:55:42
Speaker
How do you react by that? it' There's multiple ways to let your players experience that sort of absence and fill that with story content. Yeah, in fact, it's... I'm calling this kind of a semi not coming back, but Nick, you've said, of course, in Walking Dead, you're going to wait until next season to actually make a new character. You're still going to sit in and play NPCs, but you're not making a new character. So ergo, for the rest of season one,
00:56:16
Speaker
you're gone. and As a player character. Exactly. As an actual entity that's, I will be rolling dice and acting out scenes, but they will not be, quote unquote, me acting as those. I will not adopt any of those characters. Yes, and so between my character and Dante's character, who had the most interaction with your latest character, we have our own arcs to go through Dante with his feeling that he abandoned you,
00:56:43
Speaker
And Hank's dealing with now he really does have to look after your daughter when he was hoping you two would reconcile and maybe he'd still be in life, but he wouldn't be the main caregiver yeah or the dad figure.
00:56:55
Speaker
But it's like, that's how the dice, the dice rolled. That's how the characters happened. And that's basically like, that's why I decided to be, I don't want to introduce a new character this late into the quote unquote season that And with like that character that was definitely one that I was very liking and enjoying playing and felt like, no I want that stuff to have its its residents happen. And that's the only way that i feel that would happen, right? Is if I don't like automatically step back in. It's like, welcome to the new guy.
00:57:30
Speaker
and it's kind of an example of, It's not like he doesn't like your setting, narrow-hearted jamming. He actually loves it so much that he wants that impact to last. Right. And I felt like that character deserves their moment.
00:57:44
Speaker
it feels like that character has has such an impact in the story that we're telling that it deserves to, rather than me make a new character and try and divert that attention, I'll just play NPCs and then next season...
00:58:00
Speaker
I'll be part of the new rotating cast. And there's, we we all know, anyone who's listened for a while knows that I will eventually come at topics like this from an angle of having a a media example to discuss it.
00:58:21
Speaker
Yes. And what you were talking about a moment ago, Robert, about a character's departure impacting another character and allowing that to drive the remaining character for a little bit.
00:58:38
Speaker
I don't think I would have thought of this example if I hadn't made a passing reference earlier in the episode, but on mash when I think I know when Trapper, when Trapper John left Trapper left Kasey getting a discharge with practically no notice while Hawkeye was away from the camp.
00:59:04
Speaker
And Hawkeye came back to Trapper already gone. And Hawkeye spent an entire episode upset with Trapper being gone. If I remember right, it was even the episode where they actually introduced BJ.
00:59:25
Speaker
And he took it out on BJ because BJ wasn't Trapper. BJ was Trapper's replacement, but he wasn't Trapper. Yes. Eventually they became great friends as well, but that's the sort of mileage that you can get out of here are the ways that the characters have been interconnected because they have been part of the story together. And now this one has gone off.
00:59:52
Speaker
And how does that topple dominoes with the other characters in how they behave? Especially if someone, like you said, does come in to fill that role.
01:00:05
Speaker
just It can make a great story point or big shift in tone. Yep. Yep, absolutely. Any other thoughts on this?
01:00:17
Speaker
think that's what I've got. I'll just reiterate again, if so if someone does leave, One, don't take it out on yourself. Don't take it out on them. And don't feel like your story is destroyed. Simply you now have an opportunity to take it a different place.
01:00:32
Speaker
um Your story's not destroyed. It's just changed. And there are perfect there are plenty of examples out there about how stories that change has been necessitated,
01:00:47
Speaker
by characters and cast members leaving or just other circumstances has led to something fantastic as you pivot away to accommodate that.
01:01:01
Speaker
it's more than just I'll use my own I'll use my own easy thing I'll use my own example not my own example but i just TV show example or I guess a live action example of Critical Role season one when scanlans care Scanlan's player for a while had Scanlan leave and go somewhere else.
01:01:24
Speaker
And the parties had to deal without their horny bard. oh And also dealing with the fact that like maybe they didn't take Scanlan seriously. They always treated him as the joke bard character when he latched out at them.
01:01:38
Speaker
and Yeah, and there yeah there were a couple of instances, believe it or not, that odd example for role-playing discussion, but there were several times throughout the course of Glee that although the cast members were not supposed to be contracted to do other work, Some of them got big enough that they got Broadway offers and the production let them do it despite they the fact that they were contracted to not do it.
01:02:08
Speaker
They would have to come up with reasons why these high school students weren't in high school because the adult actor was on Broadway instead of in LA. They got sick.
01:02:24
Speaker
well I think that's what they did for one of them. That's what you usually do in high school. It's like, they're just having a sick day. um One of them, it wasn't a it wasn't a Broadway role, but one of them who was the basic juvenile delinquent of the group was was away in juvie.
01:02:44
Speaker
yeah Got arrested and was in juvie. yeah Not a bad way of of writing it out. Not a bad way, and when they come back, that's a great block to go through. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.
01:02:56
Speaker
Absolutely. This is a multifaceted, and these are just our our perspectives on There's plenty of ways to look about it, and again, it always changes based on your perspective. But like you said, there's a healthy way to express it in that this isn't the end of the world, this isn't the end of the group.
01:03:19
Speaker
it's no one's It's usually no one's fault, and you sometimes gotta play how it goes. If it's the end of anything, it's the end of a chapter. But hey, look, there's a new chapter on the very next page.
01:03:34
Speaker
Exactly. God closes a window, but opens a door. He's like, sure, Robb Stark died at the Red Wedding, but that didn't end in the Stark story.
01:03:46
Speaker
So, Nick, if you had a character leave, a player leave, and a new player came in would you prefer that character or that new player be a squirrel or a plush calculator?
01:04:05
Speaker
Obviously, I wouldn't want a squirrel there, but why would you bring... So a plush calculator, then. He's consented. He is consented. There is a new player in Delta Green tomorrow. Buddy is joining Delta Green.
01:04:21
Speaker
Oh boy. See how funny he is? Oh boy, a new pincushion. Hey, don't you touch my buddy. Yeah, come on, Nick.
01:04:33
Speaker
Besides, if you pincushion him, you're going to transfer his soul into yours. That's right. we say shelter it as a calculator You don't know what kind of ritual that will look that will cause.
01:04:44
Speaker
Who said i was going to put pins in and the calculator plus? Well, see, that would be assault if you did it to me. Yes. would have witnesses, and you have just confessed to premeditation of it.
01:04:59
Speaker
And that's grounds for a lawsuit. And tons of people listen to this podcast. but they have And we would have to get your HR involved. Yes, and we know that yeah you don't want to deal with your HR. No, no.
01:05:15
Speaker
And they've already filled the golf course now, so I can't hide the bodies. Oh, no. be honest, Nick, do you own a shovel?
01:05:27
Speaker
A snow shovel. So not not ah not a proper digging shovel. That won't work. Why do you own a snow shovel that Why do you have a snow shovel? I got it because one time...
01:05:39
Speaker
time when it was icy, I needed to get off of car. Snow shovels don't do squat for ice. Yeah, they're they are made for snow. When it comes to ice, you need an actual like shovel shovel.
01:05:53
Speaker
I know. I made the wrong choice. So you're saying you have a snow shovel for nothing. Yes. Okay.
01:06:05
Speaker
okay Glad we understand that. it it It's the truth. It's like, I bought a snowstorm. It's like, this will help me get the ice off my car. It's like, no. Well, it's so it's okay, Nick. The once in a blue moon time, it actually does actually snow and not just ice over.
01:06:22
Speaker
You'll have something for it. Right. I think it's been like 20 years since the last snow like that. But hey. The last time I can remember was I was like 12 and it was Valentine's Day and it was just actually snowing.
01:06:39
Speaker
Yeah. When it does snow, I'll be ready. I'll be ready. Yeah, but you'll just hide in your house. This is true. Or I'll build eight-year-old.
01:06:52
Speaker
yes I think we've bullied him enough. So we've reached the part of the show where I say, head over to how we roll gaming.com. Your central hub for everything. How we roll gaming. You'll find details on our current campaigns.
01:07:08
Speaker
All of those campaigns that I was talking about. Our full podcast archive, plus quick links to our merch store and all our social channels. So you can stay connected wherever you hang out online. And while you're at the merch store,
01:07:24
Speaker
Don't miss your chance to grab our limited Nat One Crying as a Free Action shirt before it's retired at the end of the month, which is May 2026, to make way for our upcoming Roll with Pride 2026 collection.
01:07:38
Speaker
And if you're looking to support the show directly, the best way is through Patreon at patreon.com slash howwerollgaming. We've got memberships tiers starting at just $2 a month, with perks ranging from special recognition in our Discord community,
01:07:52
Speaker
to on-air credits and exclusive discounts in the merch store. And while you're supporting us, you can also help the show at no extra cost by using our DriveThruRPG affiliate link and picking up your next tabletop goodies.
01:08:06
Speaker
And finally, we want to hear from you. Got questions you want us to tackle? Topics you'd love to see on the show? Or a legendary RPG glory story you've ever owned to share?
01:08:17
Speaker
Drop us a line anytime at podcast at howwerollgaming.com. We read everything, and your message might just end up in the show.
01:08:28
Speaker
So we want to thank you all for joining us. We hope you hope to have you back next time. And wherever your campaign goes next, make it count. As always, I'm Daryl.
01:08:41
Speaker
I'm Nick. And I'm Robert. And this is how we roll.
01:08:48
Speaker
This episode of the How We Roll Gaming podcast is copyright 2026, How We Roll Gaming, LLC. All games and associated intellectual properties are copyrighted their respective owners, and How We Roll Gaming makes no claim of ownership by discussing them here.