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The Poltergeist Movie & Freddy Krueger Killer
50 Plays1 year ago
Welcome to the Nightmare Cottage! In our inaugural episode, we dive in to the dark side of cinema.
Nylene kicks everything off with the gruesome tale of a man who, inspired by horror movies, commited a series of violent murders. Nym’s nightmares also come from the silver screen. She explores the many unfortunate events surrounding the filming of the Poltergeist movie series.
Forgive the dust! We’re cleaning out the cobwebs and ghosts.
Enter the Nightmare for show notes, sources, transcripts and more!
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Transcript
Introduction to 'Nightmare Cottage' and Content Warning
00:00:25
Speaker
Welcome to Nim and Nyleen's Nightmare Cottage, where we explore history, mysteries, and other tales of the macabre. I'm Nim. And I'm Nyleen. Let the nightmare begin.
00:00:41
Speaker
Disturbing and mature content to follow. Into the nightmare, if you dare.
00:00:55
Speaker
Dark things are so captivating. A lot of people have a relationship, both positive and negative, with horror, true crime, like super dark history. We're
Personal Fascination with Spooky Content
00:01:04
Speaker
no different. Nyleen, what about you? what What dark stuff fascinates you? What are you most drawn to?
00:01:08
Speaker
So, like, I love spooky stuff, but I'm very easily spooked. I love watching and reading about haunting and demon type stuff, but there is a really tiny part of me that's like really afraid that I'm haunted. I don't want to like rock that boat, you know, like don't take me to a haunted house. I'm very much afraid of clowns and the dark.
00:01:29
Speaker
I love everything true crime though. So like growing up, I always wanted to be a forensic pathologist, but of course like that didn't quite pan out. I love the idea of looking at remains, trying to paint a story from them. I'm still very into getting into the nitty gritty of why people do things they do, how events play out, how people are caught or snags in the investigation, things like that. yeah What about you?
00:01:52
Speaker
Yeah, i love all of that stuff too. but I don't want to say more drawn, but I think my dark enthusiasm leans towards horror fiction. I read a lot. I watch a lot of movies, or at least I try to. There's just so, so many horror movies out there. It's hard to keep up. But don't know. I think I feel like some kind of comfort in the fact that it is fiction, that it's not real, that it's A totally made up story. and
Influence of Horror in Personal Lives
00:02:13
Speaker
It's just, I feel like there's some kind of comfort in the fact that it's fiction. have horrible anxiety, which you know. I guess fictional horror kind of helps because it's that whole, all of this is crazy, chaotic, and everything horrible in the world is happening, but I am safe under my blanket with my cat.
00:02:28
Speaker
And that's five. You say that, but like my grandma was totally the one that would make all of those like fictional things Just so real. It was all so real. It was horrifying. And so, you know, you kind of just get trapped in that sometimes. I don't know.
00:02:45
Speaker
Why did you sneak my horror? There wasn't nobody in my family was. Well, I take that back. My grandmother did read tarot cards for a living. that's fine And all of the ghost stories from my childhood came from her.
00:02:58
Speaker
which I'll tell that some other time, I'm sure. Same. Like we're going to have to be those like horror story grandma baddies or something. Apparently that's a thing you do. Yeah. So I think that's kind of part of it too, is that just because something's dark doesn't mean it's bad or evil. And and I just kind of find comfort in all of that. kind of My favorite thing is what I like to call delightfully dark, which is common things that people think of with us like Adam's family and Tim Burton and stuff like that. There's Darkness, yes, but there's also like love and humor and there's like beauty in the darkness and there's knowledge. I'm just so drawn to that.
00:03:32
Speaker
I can agree with that. There's something to be said about like romance in the gloom. I was more of monsters and Tales of the Crypt kind of kid. I love the idea of seeing like macabre in the everyday situations. But...
00:03:45
Speaker
Yeah, The Crypt Keeper was definitely terrifying. I should not have been watching those shows at a young age. Maybe that's why I'm really into true crime. Because I mean, that's not really like, it's a different kind of horror, right? But like, yeah, man, some of those, like, I remember like Santa getting murdered or something like that.
00:04:00
Speaker
Yeah, so okay, I love both The Monsters and Tales from the Crypt. Tales from the Crypt is actually a big part of my growing to love horror the way I have. I I remember when I would stay with my dad on Friday nights, when I would go over there, I would sleep on the couch and the TV would be on. And I would remember I would watch Tales from the Crypt and American Gladiators.
00:04:19
Speaker
Every weekend I would go to sleep with my dad. And I was much too young, probably for both of those things. ah
The Daniel Gonzalez Crime Story
00:04:26
Speaker
The age before parental controls.
00:04:34
Speaker
So are we ready to move on to our stories today? Let's do it So do you want me to start with my crime story today? Yes. Tell me everything. okay So this is the story of Daniel Gonzalez. He's age 25. He's also known as the Freddy Krueger killer. due to his claims that the killing sprees he went on over three days in southern England were inspired by horror movies.
00:05:00
Speaker
So Daniel was painted as a bored, unemployed loner. He's also painted as a drug user who lived at home with his mother, spent most of his days watching horror films, playing computer games, which I mean, that last part doesn't sound too bad, but you know, prior to his three day killing spree, he spent two days planning how he would make newspaper headlines. And during the week of September 11th, 2004, September 12th, 2004, Gonzalez went to a rave in Hackney, East London, and admitted to police that he often took speed, ecstasy, cocaine, and ketamine. Was he arrested? like what was he Why did he... We'll get to that. Okay.
00:05:37
Speaker
All of this and more. But that was a very good question. So we're going to start with his very first encounter, right? So like this guy has been basically on a bender all weekend, and doing all kinds of efforts, right?
00:05:51
Speaker
So the first encounter took place on September 15th, 2004. Gonzalez left home with a steak knife after his mom had gone to work. At around 1130 a.m. in Portsmouth, Gonzalez encountered Peter King, 61 years old, who was walking with his wife and dog.
00:06:09
Speaker
Gonzalez lunged at King with a knife saying, I'm going to kill you because, you know, and attempted to slit King's throat. So King was able to fight him off. He sustained non-life-threatening injuries. Gonzalez dropped the knife and ran, saying, sorry, I'm a schizophrenic. I can't help it. And then he boarded the train towards Worthing.
00:06:27
Speaker
So basically, this guy is just absolutely blasted on uppers the past few days. And if he actually is schizophrenic, that's just a really bad combination to start with. And he just says that as his, like, excuse. Like, it's fine. I'm schizophrenic.
00:06:40
Speaker
Right? Like, it kind of does feel very horror movie, right? Like, you know how, like, the murderers always, like, announce themselves before they like completely murder you. Not to make light of this, but like the first guy didn't die. So I guess it's not as bad. Definitely feels a little, little horror movie. So moving on after he boarded the train towards Worthington, he then got off the train at Worthington a little while later and he bought a knife in town during police interviews. Gonzalez stated that I was walking down these alleyways with a knife waiting to carve up someone. The knife was six inches long. It was like a butcher's knife used to carve up bits of meat. I was going to the first place I could to kill someone. one
00:07:22
Speaker
but The explanations are just so... Matter of fact, right? Yes. I don't know. I kind of almost feel Asperger's in this situation because it's so very direct and matter of fact. Yeah. So we will get to what his diagnoses were, but like I was kind of feeling the same thing. So he told police, know, he bought this knife. He was just walking around town looking to murder anyone he could find. He followed a man in Worthington, but he didn't attack him because he turned into a main road. And so he got scared and he failed to find anyone to attack in that area. So he decided to get back on the train and started going to Fishergate.
00:07:57
Speaker
Once he got off the train near Fishergate station, he walked to a remote area where he hid in some bushes and waited for his next victim. Gonzalez stated he put his hand on her mouth and stabbed Maria Harding, 73, in the neck and back as she was walking home. He stated he slit her throat because she was screaming and he wanted to do it and get away as quickly as possible. How dare. Yeah.
00:08:21
Speaker
When police asked why he stole her money, he stated it was a dead person. Might as well take her money. Might as well. Yeah. Everything's just really cold and calculated. Her body was found at around 4.28 p.m. on September 15th, and she died from multiple stab wounds from the neck and back. The knife was never found. So all of this happened so far within like five hours, right?
00:08:42
Speaker
At this
Gonzalez's Mental Health and Legal Proceedings
00:08:43
Speaker
point, he decided he's just going head home. And his mom reported seeing him in his bedroom, just chilling at around 7.15 PM that night. Definitely headed home. The following day, he was seen on CCTV at King's Cross Station at 4.26 PM wearing a blue and white Honda motorcycle jacket.
00:09:01
Speaker
Around three hours later, he stole two large kitchen knives from a department store and went drinking in pubs around the West End. Yeah, like I'm wondering how like he's just walking around with two large knives and I mean, they're probably in a bag, but man, he has a thing for knives.
00:09:15
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, and it kind of, like, fits the whole Freddy Krueger thing, right? Because, like, didn't he have, like, little, like, knife fingers or something? yeah he had. Like, Edward Scissorhands type. it Well, not quite like that, yeah, but it's...
00:09:28
Speaker
But yeah, he's he's got his glove. it's It's a specific gloves with blades on it. I was wondering how this was going to get to Freddie. In my head, I'm like, how is the nightmare going to happen? i agree. Yeah. But yeah, that's that's I have like a little little bit of reflection later. So he did end up stealing these knives. He is like obsessed with knives. I am wondering how he's going to different pubs. Even if he has them in a bag, there's no one concerned. This guy's just carrying around knives in a bag But he went out drinking that night. So this is like an entire day. He didn't kill anybody, but he did like obviously buy knives and decided to go get blasted. So in the early hours of the morning of September 17th, Gonzalez attacked Kevin Molloy, aged 46, who was on his way home from drinking at a pub in northern London. So Gonzalez stabbed Molloy death with two knives, the two knives he stole. When investigators asked why he stabbed Mr. Malloy, Gonzalez stated, his face started winding me up.
00:10:21
Speaker
I had to carve him. As I was stabbing him, he said, what are you doing? I thought, how can you ask that? It's quite obvious. I'm trying to kill you. Yeah. I just can't. I know.
00:10:32
Speaker
It's hard. Malloy's body was found around 5.30 a.m. m on September 17th at Tottenham High Road in North London. He died from multiple stab wounds to the face, neck, chest, and abdomen. So like he just went ham on this guy at 530 in the morning after drinking.
00:10:49
Speaker
So a few hours later, around 7 a.m., Gonzalez attempted to break into a nearby house. There, the homeowner, and I am going to butcher this name, no pun intended, Kumis Constantinou?
00:11:07
Speaker
That's his name, Constantinou. finds a man with a large kitchen knife in his home in North London. It's Gonzalez. Constantinou was stabbed and bitten by Gonzalez, but Gonzalez ran away when Mr. Constantinou's wife ran outside screaming for help. So didn't murder the guy, but he did like attack him. Right.
00:11:27
Speaker
So Gonzalez then bought a new knife around 8 a.m. So like an hour later, he then randomly pressed buzzers on flats trying to get someone to open their door. Derek Robinson, age 75, answered the door and Gonzalez immediately stabbed him repeatedly in the throat with a 12-inch knife.
00:11:47
Speaker
Gonzalez then stated of Robinson's wife, Jean, age 60, that the woman was really strong. I started feeling really sorry for her. I went through her throat and then I stabbed her loads of times in the heart because I wanted her to die quickly.
00:12:01
Speaker
At around 12 p.m. on September 17th, Gonzalez was arrested at the Tottenham Court Road train station after buying a ticket with bloodstained money. Upon capture, Gonzalez said of the killings that, quote, I felt clean, orgasmic. I had washed all the rubbish out of my life. I felt better.
00:12:20
Speaker
It is something I live for. It's a really good buzz, killing. End quote. That's very unsettling. Agreed, yes. And it kind of gets worse, like,
00:12:32
Speaker
all right. So just to get into it, while awaiting trial, Gonzalez was placed in the special care unit of the highest security ward in the county, which was Broadmoor Psychiatric Hospital. In this hospital, he was surrounded by lots of other immensely disturbed people, but they were all afraid of him. There were claims that he would reenact how he killed his victims and try to kill himself.
00:12:55
Speaker
Trigger warning by chewing into his own veins and arteries. oh Yes. Like, can you imagine? no no. Wow.
00:13:08
Speaker
No. Yeah. Like I thought this might just be an over the top attempt to try to use the insanity plea, but there was a forensic psychiatrist named Edward Petsch who evaluated Gonzalez while he was at Broadmoor and Petsch claimed of Gonzalez, quote, I have never seen anything like this. The degree of disturbance was without parallel in my existence. He was at further risk of extreme unprovoked violence and would attack his visiting family or try to harm himself. End quote.
00:13:37
Speaker
Petsch went on to say, I've never seen anyone bite himself with the ferocity he did. It was a serious attempt on his life. Like imagine how terrifying you have to be to scare up forensic psychologists who evaluates people for like all kinds of horrifying crimes all the time. Petsch believed Gonzalez to have schizophrenia and antisocial personality disorder,
00:13:59
Speaker
but he admitted the symptoms changed from month to month. So it was kind of like one of those, like, he has all the symptoms, but like, they're always changing. So like, are they real? Or are they fake? Is there like a history on him? Like where he came from? Are you getting to this? Yes. Perfect. No, this is a perfect segue. Yes, exactly. so Gonzalez did tell doctors that he only went on the rampage because he was bored and that he would watch horror movies all the time and just thought about doing it and what it would be like to be maybe Freddy Krueger or something like that just for one day.
00:14:36
Speaker
His aim was to kill at least 10 people, which he only killed for wounded two others, right? But he was trying to go for 10. That was his number. In his trial, Gonzalez attempted to claim not guilty by reason of insanity. He did admit to two counts of attempted murder, but denied that he murdered anyone since he was schizophrenic and was just doing what the voices told him to do.
00:14:56
Speaker
So to throw another wrench in this, after his capture, his mother, stepfather, and Daniel Gonzalez himself all claim that they had tried to seek help for his mental and emotional issues before all of this had happened, but they were always dismissed. So his mother, Leslie Savage, said in a statement that, quote, every time we asked for help, we were told we would have to wait for a crisis to occur before he could even get the help he needed. I'm sorry, what year was this again?
00:15:22
Speaker
This was around 2000. Well, the murders happened around 2004. Okay. Yeah. So, I mean, not long ago, but I mean, mental health has come a long way since then. It really has. And this was in England, you know, so I don't really know much about the mental health system there.
00:15:42
Speaker
Well, same, but I know that the whole keep calm and carry on thing is a very British way. so Fair enough. So, To make matters worse, in a letter to his doctor in October 2003, a year before the murders, Daniel wrote, I really do need help now.
00:16:01
Speaker
I've tried to cope on my own without help or medication, but I have not managed to succeed. Please, please help me. This is very urgent. I really do need medical help to find the correct medication. I need to take this in a controlled hospital environment.
00:16:15
Speaker
Please, can you help me? I really would appreciate if you would help me to improve as I am in a desperate situation. But is it genuine? i mean, it almost feels like, help, I'm sick. Get me out of the cage. And then I stab you. I mean, yeah, but that was like a year before all this happened, right? Like, apparently he had premeditated this like two days before, right? He had been planning like the entire weekend. But I mean, maybe he planned it a year in a advance. I don't know. But, you know, it sounds like he was really, you know, trying.
00:16:46
Speaker
And then the day before he committed the offenses, he was seen running around the city completely naked. was not arrested. And Gonzalez states that the morning before the murders, he was punching himself in the face, trying to give himself a black eye, trying to break his nose by jumping face down into the dumpster, threw himself down the stairs about three or four times. And his stepdad went down to the police station to try to get them to come help him because he felt like if he talked to them in person, he could tell them like, hey, he's schizophrenic, he's not on medication, like these are all the problems, please listen, please help.
00:17:19
Speaker
And like tried to tell him there was something seriously wrong, but the police never came to help. And like in his mugshot, he does look really beat up and honestly kind of horrifying, like just scary. Like he has dead eyes for real, but I'm not sure if that's from the events or the murders or the capture or like what all it's from. Right. But his story is that he was basically trying to like knock himself out or injure himself so that he wouldn't go through with these murders.
00:17:47
Speaker
What did you search for
The Alleged Poltergeist Film Curse
00:17:48
Speaker
to find that mugshot? um I can give you the link. I have all. Okay. We'll put that in the show notes. yeah Yes, definitely. He definitely looks really beat up. So his plea for insanity was rejected due to his past admittance to have deliberately fabricated symptoms of mental illness to avoid being sent to prison. So like for other crimes that he had done, he did end up getting sentenced to life in prison. And then he ended up dying by suicide in prison at the age of 26. Yeah.
00:18:17
Speaker
So reflecting on all this, I kept wondering, like, realistically, who the heck was selling knives to this guy? Like, I guess there isn't a law against it. But if he's attacked and killed this many people throughout the day, he has to be bloody. Right.
00:18:32
Speaker
Also, no one is stopping this guy who is on the train and has blood all over him. Like, I understand, like, not personally stopping him because, like, I don't want to get stabbed. But, like, call the police or something. And who's selling him a kitchen knife at 8 ?
00:18:44
Speaker
I don't know. It seems an awful lot like a I'm going mind my own business kind of situation. Okay, stop blinking at me. I understand. I'm not saying that's correct or ideal or not psychotic, but just saying. So like, I'm also not sure if he was really schizophrenic or just mentally disturbed in some way. Like he obviously wasn't okay. Again, you can tell from Not just the murders, but his picture. It's really intense. Like the way that he just looks is really intense. And the forensic psychologist that was evaluating him at the mental hospital even said his symptoms kept changing. Right. So it makes me believe he was faking it or maybe like it was a mental condition that was fueled by all like the drugs and stuff like that.
00:19:32
Speaker
And also, I really, like again, wasn't sure why he was named the Freddy Krueger killer, since he wasn't killing children, and he wasn't using a slasher glove. Not that I would have preferred either of those things, right? But like I know I'm getting really into weeds on the name, but like it doesn't make sense to me.
00:19:49
Speaker
But that was what he was named. so I'm going to guess that it it ended that way because of his propensity for knives, combined with his propensity for horror movies, combined with the general public's unawareness of i mean they we we generally tend to lump things together and put one label on it right so everything horror in a particular moment is whatever the horror movie of the moment is you know and he was like saying that he wanted to be like freddie kreuer i mean tie that all together with a pretty little bow and i guess you know that's the story of daniel gonzalez also known as a freddie kreuer killer that was really really horrific
00:20:29
Speaker
I mean, yeah you was worry it was, it was like a lot, but like, you know, I feel like it could be worse. Right. I don't know about worse, but I'm sure we'll find a lot of other things that are just as surely screwed up as that.
00:20:46
Speaker
Agreed. But yeah. So any thoughts on this one I will say that as a fan of podcasts in general, including some true crime ones, it does seem a little bit different having the conversation in person.
00:20:58
Speaker
Yes. Have you heard of this one? I picked this one specifically because I haven't heard of this one before. No, actually, when you told me you were going to be doing the true crime angle of movies where, you know, you know, crimes inspired by movies, I realized I didn't really know a whole lot about that side of it at all. And I didn't do any digging because I'm i'm excited to be surprised about what else you found. But that's grotesque and horrible. the Horrible? or Horrible. no I like horrible. Horrible is good. Full of horror.
00:21:25
Speaker
beautiful very hard
00:21:34
Speaker
So what are you talking about today? You know, there's there's tons of curs so so-called curse movies out there where things have just really plagued the cast and crew or maybe the cast and crew over the course of years have passed away in horrible, horrible ways or just went early or whatever. odd enough I honestly haven't heard many.
00:21:53
Speaker
So like, I'm really interested to like hear what you got going on. Like I know there are some out there, but I've never like actually heard much about them. Gotcha. Okay. The first one I chose, I picked one because it's one of the most notorious of the folk curse films. It's one that um is kind of notorious for its reputation, even when people don't know why. Have you seen Poltergeist?
00:22:15
Speaker
Yes. When I was really little, it was a horrible idea for a child to watch. I am horrified like, you remember like when you would fall asleep really late at night and like the TV would turn to static or that like the different colors on the TV. The sign off. Oh yeah. That was amazing.
00:22:32
Speaker
that was terrifying to me like still to this day i cannot deal with the sound of static because it terrifies me did you correlate it with that movie yes because like wasn't there static and then they would start talking and then like know sometimes like with the old tvs like you would be switching the channels and then like it would be staticky but then all of a sudden something would come out come in and like the the signal and that's what that reminded me of and i'm like no like I don't want to die I'm good My parents didn't really expose me to horror. I wasn't allowed to watch scary movies or anything like that when I was little. I don't think I was either. i honestly don't know how I did any of these.
00:23:10
Speaker
Well, and that that's my conundrum on this one because it was a huge part of my childhood. Like we, even the last time my mother was in town, ah we ordered food and when they got there, she said, they're here. Which is used in the movie. That's what the little girl says when they're in the TV. And like, we still quote this. It's, it's, it's amazing.
00:23:29
Speaker
family. It's been part of my family culture for since I was very little. And I remember things like ah the trees on the window and the clown doll. Yes! Oh my god, the clown doll. like I am horrified of clowns. And that thing was the worst. Okay, well it actually did some kind of screwed up stuff, so we'll talk about that. Yeah, so it's okay. It's okay. I promise it'll be okay. Well, it's not okay.
00:23:51
Speaker
But yeah, so this movie is definitely it's kind of part of my DNA in a way of it having been memories from my earliest, earliest childhood, despite the fact that just can't imagine my parents letting me watch it, but they must have. So anyways, for those who haven't seen it, Poltergeist is your classic demonic haunted house kind of story. Happy Family's House gets haunted and horror ensues. Sorry, what you year was this movie? 1982 for the first one.
00:24:15
Speaker
The thing with this stuff is that the entire franchise is cursed. It's, that well, you know, one, two, and three, there's various things that happen. I'm only going to touch on some of the kind of major, you know, more obvious things.
00:24:26
Speaker
um But there were actually quite a few kind of little weird happenings. But yeah, so this is, it has the reputation of being one of the scariest movies of all time. So many people put it as their scariest movie. um The reason it's kind of one of the most notorious of the allegedly cursed films is due to the fact that the tragedies were very, very extreme.
00:24:43
Speaker
so Like real life tragedies? Real life tragedies, yeah. Yeah. Really kind of the biggest stuff happened to the three siblings that were in the movie as a brother and two sisters. Robbie Freeling, the brother who was played by Oliver Robbins, was in a scene where, im so spoiler alert if you care, was clown doll, which looks super crazy scary. It's like an 80s toy, right? Everything had little jubilee bells on it. Yes, and it had that the face. and Yes. oh So it was just kind of generally creepy anyways, but in the 80s everything kind of was, so it it just kind of fits. It was just clown doll. But probably why so many of us have a fear of clowns.
00:25:24
Speaker
is because so in in a scene that doll drags drags robbie under his bed by the neck but it turns out that the mechanism that was pulling him under was actually choking the actor and they didn't realize that they thought he was just a fantastic actor as he's like struggling like you think they would have like safe words or safe signals the okay but like they're children you're working with children was the eighty s oh my god and because They didn't notice until they had called Tut and he was still like convulsing and he was turning purple. and
00:25:58
Speaker
yeah Yeah, I mean, they got him out. He was fine. it felt ah you know very off to everybody, right? so So did they ever figure out like why it malfunctioned? I mean, that had to like that couldn't have been the first time they'd done the scene. or or the it it It was not expected to wait, but I will say that it's very, very good publicity for horrible things to happen on the sets of horror movies. Right.
00:26:21
Speaker
it it creates that buzz, especially the 80s before we had the internet, right? So anything that goes viral is because, you know, everybody's just talking about it as a thing. So the the buzz behind the potential curse, you know, that you know brings people in.
00:26:37
Speaker
So that's the biggest part of the first movie that really stands out as cursed. But what people think caused the curse also happened in the first movie And that's the fact that there's a scene where the mom who is played by Jo Beth Williams, there's a scene where she's like in this muddy pool with a bunch of skeletons popping up. Okay. So people think that the movie is cursed because in that scene, they used real human skeletons from India.
00:27:09
Speaker
what Tell me your reaction to this. Like, why? Like, okay, I understand it was the 80s. Maybe they, like, couldn't really get, like, make props that were that realistic in the 80s. I don't know. But, like, I feel like using real human skeletons, regardless of how much you clean them, it's kind of fucked up.
00:27:30
Speaker
That's, like, actually really fucked up. Like, if I found out that, like, and I'm really into, like, that kind of stuff, right? Like, I've, you know, done my own dissections, not, like, by myself, like, obviously, like, at school and stuff like that. And Like I said, I wanted to be a forensic pathologist. So to me, like, that's a cool thing to do to like see one of those, but not like in a movie. I'm an actor. Like, I definitely don't want to be with some real dead people just chilling in a pool of mud.
00:28:01
Speaker
There. So what if I told you that most skeletons you see in most movies are real human skeletons? Do the actors know? Yeah. So here's the thing. Budget is always king when it comes to film production, right? So budget is what it is. I don't know how things have changed now. I don't know what it's like in in modern times, but especially I would say nineteen ninety s and before, it was far cheaper to go to like a biological supply store where they like had stuff for schools and things and pick a skeleton, a real life human, real life, a real human skeleton to use as opposed to having somebody sculpt a skeleton. it was far cheaper. and budget will always win. And that's what it is. Listen, I feel like you could just
00:28:48
Speaker
Okay, well, i guess, you know, day and age, things change. Because, like, so I've seen the stuff that, like, Monkey has done, your husband has put together. and like, the way that he paints stuff. Like, I could imagine someone who is actually, like, doing this for a living could take one of those plastic or even, like, a ceramic skeleton and make it look really gory and nasty. And, you know what I mean? And that would be lower budget than taking an actual human and cleaning the bones and making them. So it is now.
00:29:17
Speaker
It is now, and that is probably what is actually done now in most cases, because you know I would say these days and in this year of 2024, on the cheap end, $30 for a human-sized skeleton is pretty standard. I don't know what the prices were like then, but I don't think that those big plastic skeletons were findable quite like they are now.
00:29:39
Speaker
But looking back at horror films over the decades, even non-horror films, have used real human skeletons in them. Yeah. I feel like that would cause some problems. Like, I mean, I've said I'm okay with having my body donated to science, but like, see this, I agree with. Cause I, if you agree to donate it to science, you're not agreeing to donate it to Hollywood. Yeah. Because like, what are they doing with your body? Like, are they just like throwing it around like putting it trunk? Like, I mean, I guess I'm not using it but also like rude, you know, like I don't like the dark. Why are you putting my skeleton in a dark little box? Like that's not okay. Well,
00:30:14
Speaker
Your skeleton at that point does not contain you. It it doesn't matter. i don't want to be in the dark. i I don't disagree. I think that it's like if if... I feel like there's more restrictions and guidelines today. I don't know this for sure. I would need to look it up. But if that is a thing that would cause a curse...
00:30:37
Speaker
They think that was like one of the like real skeletons. That's the primary theory. In fact, I think in most of the other cases of the ones I've been looking into, there's not even like a pinpoint reason why aside from the content matter, which is usually, you know, the word blasphemous.
00:30:51
Speaker
that That's the primary reason why they think the series as a whole is cursed. So what other stuff happened? There's a couple of other situations that kind of happened, but one of the the characters of the second movie was, actually two of the characters in the second movie. one of them One of the exorcists in the second movie passed away like a year after filming um and one of the really spooky characters passed away by so from stomach cancer and after I think the second movie and they had to have a stand-in actor with prosthetics on his face to so he could still be in the third movie.
00:31:25
Speaker
Okay, but like in all fairness, not to like poke holes in your theory, but let me just like poke some holes in your theory. I feel like stomach cancer doesn't really like relate to this. Like don't understand if they like died in like some freak accident, but it's like, I'm going to stop you right there. This is not my theory. Okay. Okay. Well, people included why they think that this movie is close because I, I, the reason I'm not really super covering those is because I did feel like they were a little bit more far-fetched. However, the fact that they had another actor with prosthetics to make him look like the, the former actor is, That really unsettled a lot of the cast, so that was kind of unnerving to them because you basically have this person that you know is dead standing right in front of you. The two bigger tragedies that happened, I mean, like as screwed up as that whole clown stuff was, it really just gets worse from here. So the other two siblings, the two sisters, of the actors that portrayed them also bethe all really horrible tragedies. Dominique Dunn, who played the older sister, Dana,
00:32:26
Speaker
During the filming of the first movie, she was dating a man named John Sweeney, who happened to be the sous-ship for Wolfgang Puck. of Fun fact. But apparently this guy was a real piece of trash and he beat her, was emotionally abusive. Like he was really, really horrible. and she did end up breaking things off with him before the end of filming. But after the movie came out and was super successful, he shows back up at her door. She didn't want to let him in, but he beats her up, chokes her out, and she ends up in a coma.
00:32:50
Speaker
unfortunately a few days later they took her off of life support and she passed away. And this was like while filming? This was after. It was after the movie had come out it was a big success. Yeah. Did they like ever figure out like besides I mean he was just always abusive? It was just well I'll get into the well ill actually I'll get into right now because the the trial was actually kind of messed up. It seemed like you know Either he knew somebody on the inside or something. But for one he had a history of violent, abusive relationships in the past. And for whatever reason, that was not admissible in court. And so they weren't even able to bring that up during the trial. And then he ended up with a plea bargain and was only charged to 10 years after this murder.
00:33:29
Speaker
i guess it was manslaughter. Yeah. And then though. But it was like a really violent murder. It was. but then he ended up only end up serving three years. That's, I mean, the family had to live with the fact knowing that this guy was out there that killed their daughter. And yeah, it is pretty rough. But yeah, so that was very tragic. But what I think is probably and the most iconic reason why this movie is seen as cursed is the young actor, Heather O'Rourke, that played Carol Ann, the youngest sibling little girl who said they're here. This is...
00:34:01
Speaker
This is really sad. was How old was she when she she was 12? Oh no. yes it's It's so super tragic no matter what. But she was apparently just she absolutely loved acting. She loved doing all of the the different stunts and stuff like her going up the mirror and and doing. She just had so much fun with it. She wanted to direct and she would like talk to the director about how we would do stuff so she could learn how to do it too. it was just Let me just like pause you for a second because like don't come at me for this.
00:34:32
Speaker
But like, I don't think anybody ever goes, ah, well, I mean, that dead person was an asshole anyways. And that little kid, like they were just a piece of shit in general. Like, you know what I mean? Like they always find like the sweetest, best things. I know. Don't look at me like that. I'm a horrible. Nyleen, she lit up the damn room. Okay.
00:34:51
Speaker
All right. We'll just, she's a little angel. So what had happened? What had happened was moving into the third movie she had been getting sick before the third movie so went into production so she had been diagnosed with Crohn's disease which is like inflammatory bowel stuff and so that's what she was being treated for and like the only side effect that was really visible on screen was she was taking steroids and so in that third movie you'll see that her cheeks are super puffy and yeah and start getting so unfortunately she actually didn't have Crohn's disease So instead of an inflammation, what she had was a blockage. She had an abscess in her intestines that would collect fecal matter and other toxic crap. And then unfortunately it eventually you ballooned out and it burst.
00:35:35
Speaker
She went into toxic shock and passed away 12 years old. So, so far it sounds like the little girl, two two of the little girls have died, right? So two, three of the actors have died and one of them died.
00:35:52
Speaker
got hurt so in the first movie the younger brother got hurt with he was strangled by the clown and then in between production somebody else passed away i'd have to double check his name and then after the first movie the older sister she she was actually i think probably around i have to double check her age too but she was a young adult so she died or got killed and then the youngest sister during production of the third movie died.
00:36:21
Speaker
Jeez. Okay. So once that happened, the cast and crew were super done. they They packed it in, they were done, they went home. But as they are wont to do, the movie studio had a ton of money wrapped up into this production. So MGM forced them to finish the movie. They had to rewrite the ending to take Carol Ann out.
00:36:40
Speaker
It's a terrible ending. It's whatever. And the really creepy part is that at the end, they had the mom holding Carol Ann, So you have a body double and like you should see the back of her and she's obviously not her. Right. And so everybody was kind of like off about that. Yeah, exactly.
00:37:00
Speaker
it was pretty unsettling having to have refilm that nobody wanted to be there. Nobody thought it was a tribute to Heather. They just thought like like, why are we doing this anymore? Exactly. Exactly. That's really kind of the biggest stuff. The biggest reasons why people say that Poltergeist, the series as a whole is cursed. Do they have any like weird activity on set or anything like that?
00:37:19
Speaker
ah Nothing that really hit where I researched. and Most of my research came from the docuseries Cursed Films on Shudder and Biography.com.
00:37:30
Speaker
and So I didn't find any, aside from the the mechanism and the clown, which was a pretty big one, i didn't really see anything else. yeah There's actually in that Cursed Films docuseries, the guy who owns that clown now is on it. yeah and collect all this I would have just thrown that thing away. now yeah and it's And it's the on-screen clown. It was the actual one. I'm going to kind of wrap this up with a quote from Zelda Rubenstein, who played the exorcist in the films. She said,
00:38:02
Speaker
Heather died of an undetected congenital anatomical defect and Dominique Dunn died at the hands of an extremely ill-directed boyfriend. I think it's pretty much a courtesy to put an end to the superstitious crap.
00:38:15
Speaker
That's
Conclusion with a Horror Quiz
00:38:16
Speaker
how she said it. So it's generally felt like applying the superstitiousness of the curse kind of waters down the tragedy that happened to real life people. there's There's not, we have no proof of a curse. There's there's no,
00:38:32
Speaker
brutally unexplainable thing it was just i mean the movies were made over what period of time it's like they were all made within the yeah i'm wondering it was like three or four years because i mean that is like pretty pretty intense if it was like within a few years that all this stuff happened but not saying there is a curse but like you know what i mean not sure if i believe in curses but i feel like that's how you get cursed so right right so the first one was the second one was and the third one was Okay, so the like, yeah, within like six years total. Yeah, that's the curse of Poltergeist.
00:39:14
Speaker
right, so I mean, I feel like we talked about some pretty heavy stuff today. So I did want to just want to see if we could end this episode finding out what horror movie villain you are. Why didn't you warn me about this?
00:39:26
Speaker
I just found out. ah but so are we just saying what we think we are are we taking a quiz oh no i'm I'm giving you a quiz right now okay ok yeah I'm going to find out what horror movie villain you are okay alright so you're going on another killing spree great what do you wear were you going to wear several outfits to keep up the appearances black covered overalls to help hide the blood meh whatever I find lying around the house nothing
00:39:57
Speaker
that That way there's no laundry or formal wear. People tend to hurt themselves more than I do. I think the black coveralls fit you best, but that's just me. The black coveralls is, um because before you started giving me options, I was thinking I'd be wearing all a black. But I also think that my anxiety might consider a costume change.
00:40:16
Speaker
So several outfits to keep with the pierce. See, I hate these quizzes because I have anxiety about choosing wrong. And let's go with the black overalls because that's what I thought before you said anything. All right. all right. So next question.
00:40:28
Speaker
There's only like five questions. i promise Let's say you need to take a break from killing. Where do you take a vacation? The Mulu underground caves in Borneo? Home to visit with family? Anywhere there books or good music? That one's yours. ah The Mariana Trench? That sounds awesome. Or a gaming convention. I think used to. I would have said the gaming convention, but yeah, definitely the books one. yeah That's definitely me. Yeah, i think that fits you the best.
00:40:53
Speaker
What kind of music do you listen to? Music that has a mysterious vibe to it and gives a room a nice dark ambiance. I feel like that is definitely you right there. I don't i don't think we need to move forward. Let's see. Let's say you need to make ends meet between murder sprees. What do you see yourself doing?
00:41:09
Speaker
Pediatric nurse, a babysitter, a landscaper, a swim instructor, Or a writer of personality tests.
00:41:18
Speaker
I feel like you'd be a landscaper just because you garden. yeah Or a writer of personality tests because you do write. I know it's tough. It's life-changing decisions. It is. I don't know why I spent so much time. I would say... I mean, yeah, let's go with that. The landscaper, yeah.
00:41:37
Speaker
Lots of good weapons to be had there. i' i'm just going to tell you the answer to this one. What's your favorite holiday? It's Halloween. um Let's see. What's your favorite month? It's definitely October. Let's see. What kind of books do you like to read?
00:41:48
Speaker
Yes. I know. Science fiction, romance, satire, adventure, or mystery? I know. It's hard. i mean, a lot of that Let's say mystery just for the sake of having a pick one.
00:42:02
Speaker
Because i I don't know. I'm a liar. This is very long. Let's see. You said romance? ah No, let's do mystery. thats really great Okay. The authorities are on to you and they're closing in. What kind of shoes are you wearing?
00:42:15
Speaker
Just tell me what kind shoes you're wearing. Sketchers. ah Okay. So runndon stilettos, roller skates, work boots, or no shoes, or you wouldn't get caught. I wouldn't get caught.
00:42:26
Speaker
Are you easily angered? Yes. There literally is just yes. So we're going to go with that. You love to come home to a pet. What kind of animal is it? A cat.
00:42:39
Speaker
What's your favorite color? Purple, black, green, blue, or red? We've had this conversation and three of my answers are there. constantly let black be an answer. We're going to go with that. okay While out window shopping, something grabs your attention and you must have it.
00:42:55
Speaker
What is it? It's a mask. It's a mask. It's definitely a mask. Sorry. I'm just going to answer this one for you. What do you fear the most? Losing your family, being attacked, being imprisoned, death or fire.
00:43:09
Speaker
Losing my family. There. When you're not on a killing spree, where would you like to hang out? At home or in a library? At home. have at home. I have books at home.
00:43:22
Speaker
Every killer needs a trophy. What would yours be? Something for the kids? Their clothes, license plates from victims' cars, their contacts, it makes hunting easier, or nothing.
00:43:34
Speaker
not Nothing. Why would you want to say that? Exactly. What's your favorite candy? Anything you can share? Snickers, Laffy Taffy, Jawbreakers, or Reese's Pieces?
00:43:46
Speaker
Out of those Reese's Pieces. You're at a carnival. What ride do you go on first? The Tunnel of Love? the roller coaster, the Tilt-A-Whirl, the Funhouse, or the Logfans?
00:44:00
Speaker
I want to say the Funhouse because that's a spookier answer, but the real answer is Tilt-A-Whirl. Really? love it. Oh my gosh. I get so nauseous. I love spinning. Oh, great. Hey, guess what?
00:44:13
Speaker
You got Freddy Krueger. You're Freddy Krueger. You're an insanely creative and intelligent individual who is often perceived as an outcast by society. Your wit is as deadly as a scorpion sting, and you have a dark sense of humor.
00:44:27
Speaker
This humor is so dark that you will crack a joke at the most inopportune times and usually cause general discomfort amongst others. But fear not, there are tons of people out there like you, and they're just waiting for you to come and have a laugh with them.
00:44:40
Speaker
Dun, dun, dun! Dun, dun, dun! All right. So this comes to the end of episode one of Nyleen and Nim's Nightmare Cottage.
00:44:51
Speaker
Thanks for joining us. See you next time. home name com
00:44:58
Speaker
If you have topic requests, book or movie recommendations, or just want to say hi, email us at nightmarecottage at gmail.com or visit our website at nightmarecottage.com. Sweet dreams.
00:45:15
Speaker
Bye-bye.