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S3 Ep23: Mastering Improvisation and Humor with Stevie Ray
39 Plays1 month ago
In this episode of the Dial It In podcast, hosts Trygve and Dave reminisce about their first meeting and introduce humor expert Stevie Ray. They highlight Stevie's influence on their lives and his unique approach to teaching improv, emphasizing its value beyond the stage. Stevie shares his journey from aspiring speech therapist to founding Stevie Ray's Improv Company, offering insights into the therapeutic and pedagogical aspects of humor. They discuss the eight rules of improv, the balance between humor and professionalism, and how to effectively use humor in today's polarized world. The episode also touches on the role of humor in societal cohesion and the complexities of appreciating controversial comedians like Bill Cosby. The conversation concludes with an emphasis on the importance of trust and listening in successful improvisation and sales techniques.
Connect with Stevie:
steviesrays.org
Sponsor:
DataQuick.co
…
Dial It In Podcast is where we gather our favorite people together to share their advice on how to drive revenue, through storytelling and without the boring sales jargon. Our primary focus is marketing and sales for manufacturing and B2B service businesses, but we’ll cover topics across the entire spectrum of business. This isn’t a deep, naval-gazing show… we like to have lively chats that are fun, and full of useful insights. Brought to you by BizzyWeb.
Links:
Website: dialitinpodcast.com
BizzyWeb site: bizzyweb.com
Connect with Dave Meyer
Connect with Trygve Olsen
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Transcript
00:00:08
Speaker
Welcome to Dial It In, a podcast where we talk to fascinating people about marketing, sales, process improvements, and tricks that they use to grow their businesses. Join me, Dave Meyer, and Trigby Olson of BusyWeb as we bring you interviews on how best in their fields dialing it in their organizations.
00:00:26
Speaker
Let's ring up another episode.
00:00:30
Speaker
Do you remember the first time you were in you and I were in a room together? I think so, but it's been like 12 years. So it's been a long time. You and I were in a conference room at a hotel and we got brought in by all the constant contact people.
00:00:49
Speaker
That's right. Yep. There was a wonderful older guy there named Bob and Bob liked to pontificate and, and you were getting, you and I had never met before. And I was like, who's that guy? Yeah. And then yeah Bob had talked for a while and then you had thrown out a comment like, yeah, and Bob, i can't imagine how Bob does all of his speaking with his shirt off all the time.
00:01:10
Speaker
And I was like, oh okay, I get that guy now. And we've been, we've been together ever since, so to speak. I'm more than a little hurt that you didn't remember. the first time we met, but I'll get over that. I'm super excited. I think this is probably one of the more influential and impactful things that we're ever going to do on this podcast, given the world that we live in, which is to have a serious conversation about funny and talking about funny. So our guest today is somebody who has really fundamentally changed my life for the better. And I'm more than happy to even talk about this today because he's going to feel sheepish sha about it.
00:01:43
Speaker
But I'm super excited to to get into this today to talk about how to be funny in today's world. So before we do that, though, do we have ah we have a sponsor? We do have a sponsor today, so I'd like to introduce DataQuick, the ultimate tool for HubSpot CRM administrators and data architects.
00:02:00
Speaker
DataQuick seamlessly exports your HubSpot CRM architecture into an interactive, user-friendly map, streamlining data mapping, cleanup, and organization. With DataQuick, you can quickly identify and manage every object, property, and dropdown value in your portal, saving valuable time and reducing manual effort.
00:02:18
Speaker
Experience efficient data management and ensure accuracy with DataQuick. Visit dataquick.co to get started today. All right, I'm getting ready to introduce our guest and I'm going to immediately piss him off by reading from a script and not doing this off the top of my head.
00:02:35
Speaker
But I'm super excited. This is a huge deal for me on a personal level. Our guest today is Stevie Ray. Stevie Ray is a master of communication, humor and improvisation, helping professionals navigate high stakes conversations with wit and confidence.
00:02:49
Speaker
As the founder of Stevie Ray's Improv Company, he has spent over 30 years coaching Fortune 500 executives, business leaders, and teams on thinking on their feet, engaging audiences, and building trust through humor.
00:03:02
Speaker
His expertise in quick thinking, persuasive dialogue, and the science of comedy has made him a sought-after speaker and consultant. From corporate boardrooms to comedy stages, Stevie understands how humor shapes relationships, decision making, and leadership success.
00:03:18
Speaker
In this episode, he shares how anyone, yes, even you, will be able to use humor to be more engaging, effective, and memorable. Making it up as he goes since 1989, welcome Stevie Ray. Hi there. Hi there.
00:03:31
Speaker
Yeah, I have to admit I'm a little verklempt. I went through of Training in 2013. thirteen It was the summer before my son was born. One of the things that I got out of it that really was fundamentally life-changing for me because speak and I talk to people all the time is I had spent so much time fundamentally apologizing for who I was as a person and trying not to offend people ahead of time.
00:03:58
Speaker
and making jokes about how, I'm sorry if you're offended, just stick with it, I'm sure I'll say something funny in a minute. um And i really don't do that anymore because the teachers that I had got on me of like, why are you apologizing for being funny?
00:04:13
Speaker
You're funny, just go with it. So that... That was huge for me. I'll start by saying thank you for that because that in in my life, that was really one of the big touchstones. So how did you get into comedy?
00:04:25
Speaker
What most people will tell you about humor and how they access it is everybody grows up having their own needs satisfied with whatever skills they develop.
00:04:36
Speaker
And I'm very conscious of not saying the gifts people have, because I firmly believe that a gift is something you get without work. It's just given to you.
00:04:47
Speaker
And the skills and talents people have are the result of hard work and discipline and going in a path that other people didn't take. So when I was growing up, I wasn't the smartest kid in class and I wasn't an athlete and I sucked at every sport that kids would play.
00:05:05
Speaker
And you got to get attention somehow. And if you're not going to be the smartest kid in class and you're not going to be the fastest kid or the one that can throw the ball, you got to do something else. And i started to realize that people thought I was funny.
00:05:18
Speaker
The more you focus on that, the more you pay attention to it. So if one of my siblings told a joke and it didn't get a laugh, big deal. They got their recognition through other things.
00:05:30
Speaker
If I told a joke and it didn't work, it really bothered me because it was who I was. So I spent countless hours figuring out why it didn't work. What did I do wrong?
00:05:42
Speaker
And it slowly grew that way. And a lot of people who met my parents would say, oh, that kid, he's going to be a comedian someday. That's not what they wanted to hear because they wanted me to meet her earn a living.
00:05:55
Speaker
And the interesting path was I grew up wanting to be a teacher. I was always going to be a school teacher. And back when I was in high school in the late eighteen hundreds There was a glut of teachers in America. There were too many teachers, if you can imagine such a thing.
00:06:11
Speaker
So a guidance counselor said, you're not going to be able to find a job. And if you do, it's going to be in some small town in a one room schoolhouse. So they had me take one of those a high school interest inventory tests to tell you what job is perfect for you.
00:06:29
Speaker
The one that I took was really popular at the time, but it fell out of favor so bad it still exists, but their website says not to be used for official purposes.
00:06:41
Speaker
That bad. And you answer a whole bunch of questions. And it was based on what do you like to do in your free time? And if your daily interests match the daily interests of somebody in a career, then you should enjoy the same career.
00:06:57
Speaker
Now, that's an interesting theory, not accurate. So I took all the questions and it came back and it told me my top score. What I was, according to this test, was a female physical education teacher.
00:07:10
Speaker
Wow. well you That makes three of us. And now those are two things I'm not very good at being, female or physical education. So yeah I said, what's next?
00:07:22
Speaker
The next highest score was a match between priest and nun. And went, okay, whatever is next that is male and doesn't involve a vow of poverty, um'm going to take good look at.
00:07:36
Speaker
And it was a speech therapist, speech. And, and so I grew up in Rochester, Minnesota, home of the Mayo Clinic. So my parents scheduled an appointment with me with a speech clinician. Talk about what that job was like.
00:07:51
Speaker
That's not a very good way to approach a job because if you talk to somebody in a job, they'll just tell you all the good things about it because they're in it. You should shadow that person for a week and say, do I want to spend my time doing this?
00:08:05
Speaker
But the guy said, you're basically still a teacher. You're just in a specialty and you're helping people overcome speech impediments. And I thought that's, that sounds great for me. So I went to ah local university here in Minnesota, up in Moorhead, Minnesota State University, Moorhead, because they had the best speech path program.
00:08:25
Speaker
Home the Dragon. Yep. The whole time I was in that program, and I was in it for two and a half years, I was teaching, I was working with patients in the clinic, I was being a speech clinician, the whole thing.
00:08:36
Speaker
But in my free time, I still kept entertaining. at open stages and coffeehouse nights. And I put together comedy routines with friends that I knew. i didn't want to be an actor because acting is a whole different world.
00:08:51
Speaker
I didn't really want to be a standup comedian solely, even though I love doing it, because that's just a different kind of career. i just put together all these different shows and everybody kept saying, why don't you do this for a career? i said, ah, that would take the fun out of it.
00:09:06
Speaker
which is not true. But one day I woke up, middle of my junior year, and said, i don't want to be a speech pathologist anymore. I really didn't know what to do. My parents recommended a book that's really popular and very effective. It's called What Color Is Your Parachute?
00:09:23
Speaker
And it's designed to help people decide what they want to do. And it was instant right in front of me. I have to use humor. I have to teach and I have to run an organization that imparts this on other people.
00:09:36
Speaker
I went to a professor that I knew and said, I want to create my own degree. And he said, you can't do that. Universities have a program, pick one. I said, no, I want to study my own thing. He said, fine. What is it?
00:09:49
Speaker
I said, humor and comedy. And ah he said, I'm going to send you to this other professor because I'm going to be out for a year on sabbatical. So you go over to this guy.
00:10:00
Speaker
And he sent me to the driest... most professorial guy you can imagine. He taught rhetoric and debate. So I thought a comedy degree with that guy. Are you kidding?
00:10:13
Speaker
I walked into his office and said, I want to create my own program. And this is what I want to study without batting an eye. He said, great. Let's put together a program. And within 10 minutes, he had an entire curriculum set up for studying classic and modern theories of comedy, the psychology of humor, how it works in society, how it'll work for me.
00:10:37
Speaker
I had to petition the university board of directors to accept it as an accredited program. And they made it twice as hard as every other program.
00:10:47
Speaker
Cause young man, if you don't want one of ours, we're going to make you work for it. So that's how I graduated with a degree titled theory and performance of comedy. My parents were so proud.
00:11:01
Speaker
that They thought we have other children. Yeah. With your class though. Yeah. I was unequaled in my work. yeah. Do you know if lots of people joined and decided to go down that path well at Morehead after you? According to the rules, they have to keep it as an accredited program because they accepted it, but they don't have to publish it.
00:11:25
Speaker
So I don't think anybody else knows it exists. and think they want to tell a lot of people because they got a reputation. When people talk about the elevator speech, and what you're supposed to say in two sentences, what do you do? Do you even lead with comedy?
00:11:38
Speaker
No. Is what you do? No, because it's hard to explain. And even my parents, they got four kids. When everybody anybody would ask them, what do your kids do? The other three, they can explain in a second.
00:11:51
Speaker
One is a mechanical engineer. There you go. Another one works in a hospital running a heart lung machine for heart surgery. There you go. Another one is the special ed teacher.
00:12:02
Speaker
With me, I think it took them decades to even figure out what it was that I do, especially because my company keeps growing and changing and adapting. So it takes I don't know how to explain exactly what I do.
00:12:16
Speaker
And I like that about it. Honestly, I don't agree with the elevator pitch approach to life. Humans are much more complicated. Only insects specialize.
00:12:28
Speaker
Yeah. I, if people ask me my elevator pitch in an irritating way, I tell them I'm a grape stomper. like what do you mean it's like i'm a big guy and so i get i get hired out by boutique wineries in northern california during the summertime and i go and stomp on the grapes and they're like and people ask me like what is that is that a challenge for you is like really it's the foot bleaching that really gets to you there that that tends to add up a lot because and god help me if i can ever keep keep a pair of white socks white but So let tell us about Stevie Ray's improv. Cause I, part of it is obviously it's an improv company and you put on shows we every, just about every weekend, but there's so much more to that than just, Hey, let's be funny for 90 minutes. Yeah.
00:13:13
Speaker
I kicked around Minneapolis working in different organizations, always wanting to start my own. And then i was, I was contacted by ah local club actually that I'd been working at a lot and,
00:13:26
Speaker
working with the owners. So not just performing there, working with them. And they said, we don't want to run it anymore. We just want somebody else to run it. We'll own it. So I said, okay, who am I going to work with? They said, this woman named Pamela is going to be the theater manager and you guys are going to work together.
00:13:42
Speaker
And I said, cool. Very soon into it, we started looking at the books and it really wasn't on strong financial ground. And they kept saying, oh, we got it. We got it. And as the months went by, it got worse and worse.
00:13:55
Speaker
They finally come up to us and said, look, this isn't going to work. Do you want to take over? And if you assume the debt personally, we'll sell you the company for a dollar. And so that's what we did.
00:14:07
Speaker
We took over a tying company. That's how you start a business. But we always wanted to run, Pamela and i an organization that supported different facets, which is not just one form of comedy, but everything comedic.
00:14:23
Speaker
So people would come to us with ideas and they would say, I'm a comed i'm a stand-up comedian, but I don't have enough material to go on the road. So what can you do? And we would put together a review of a standup review of 10 comedians.
00:14:38
Speaker
So all of them would get a chance to hit the stage and develop. People come up and say, i have a sketch comedy show or my partner and I do a two person character show. Like you see on some old TV shows, we would put together every kind of comedy show you can imagine to support new artists.
00:14:57
Speaker
But we also looked at the techniques of improv as life-changing. So we really took a different tack. We did not market our improv classes to actors or comedians or performing artists.
00:15:11
Speaker
We marketed them solely to the general public, what we refer to as the normal people. And really focused on it being something that would improve people's lives, whether personally with self-confidence or some kind of skill that would help them in their life and in their relationships or professionally to give them skills to use at work.
00:15:34
Speaker
So out of that, we really liked seeing it how it helped people in all facets. One day a guy come up to me in a class and he said, hey, that tick that you the thing you taught me last week, I used it at work when dealing with a client in a tough situation and it was really effective.
00:15:52
Speaker
I said, great, we were hoping for that. And he said, have you ever thought of, instead of waiting just for individuals to come to you, for you to take this training directly to companies and offer workshops?
00:16:05
Speaker
I had never thought of that. But at Stevie Ray's, we have always based our business on a one word business plan. That word is okay. So we just said, okay.
00:16:17
Speaker
We started contacting businesses and saying, we offer this training. And it wasn't easy to do because most people back in the early nineties, late eighties, when they heard the word improv, they thought of standup comedy.
00:16:31
Speaker
Because it wasn't that understood. So a lot of companies said, are you going to try to teach us how to be funny? And it took a lot of work to get them to understand, no, this is entirely different.
00:16:42
Speaker
It quickly grew to become half of what our company does. As I go around to different organizations, doing keynotes at conferences or workshops, using the techniques of improv to help people be better at what they do.
00:16:57
Speaker
Nowadays, it's a lot easier because almost every company is familiar with improv and how it's used in the workplace. So now it's come full circle where it's a lot easier for us to do.
00:17:10
Speaker
So we got our classes for the public. We have our workshops for companies. We have our shows every weekend year round. And that's what keeps us rolling. I think it's fascinating on that because we have had improv training at our end, especially for our most introverted team members. it was very clear that they were incredibly uncomfortable with the initial, but then once they got rolling to a person, every one of them was just overjoyed and they're like, I can't believe I just did that.
00:17:42
Speaker
So there's there's a science to yes think differently, isn't there? That's why we really like the way we approach it, because if you take an improv class from a performance oriented perspective, then it's a sink or swim.
00:17:58
Speaker
You really rely on background, like acting training. Most it's surprising to people that most standup comedians are not interested in improv. Likewise, most improv performers don't do standup.
00:18:12
Speaker
There's a small crossover. I do both. And I know a handful of people who do both. Most people are like cooks don't like to bake and bakers don't like to cook. And that's the way it is with improv.
00:18:24
Speaker
Both produce a great meal. It's just a different process. When we started focusing on the non-performing artist, we developed a curriculum that was unique to them in saying, this is a step-by-step process.
00:18:38
Speaker
You're going to learn some very basic techniques, and we're going to grow your skills a step at a time. Trigby, you got this when you took the class. It wasn't a jump in and sink or swim thing. This is, we're going to take you from where you are to where you want to be.
00:18:53
Speaker
And also we ask everybody who takes our class, why are you here? And some people say... I just want to have some fun. um want to get out of the house. This is like an adult playground.
00:19:04
Speaker
Other people say, I have to do a lot of presentations at work and it freaks me out. And that's why I'm here. So everybody who attends the class, we say, we're going to try to help you with that outcome.
00:19:16
Speaker
And along the way, they discover there's a lot more to it and they enjoy other aspects of it. So that's what we really like about it is just accessing anybody's goals. And there's like, there's a science to improv, right? Like, can you tell us about the four tenets of improv? Actually, we have there in the old days when improv was first being developed in the late, it started in the, like the modern version of improv started in the and through the late 1950s, was formulated and.
00:19:46
Speaker
it was formulated and One group that came out of the University of Chicago and they formed an improv company and that was in its infancy.
00:19:56
Speaker
Nobody really knew what they were doing. They formed a group called the Compass Players and they were located in St. Louis, Missouri. They moved from Chicago to St. Louis. And every night after a show, the whole group would sit around the kitchen table in the wee hours in a rental home that they all lived in and discuss the show and try to figure out why something worked, why something else didn't.
00:20:21
Speaker
They came up with the eight rules of improv and they were classic to that time. They were actually called the kitchen table rules. And it's been studied since then.
00:20:33
Speaker
and some groups in America or around the world will use the four tenants and they've taken the eight rules and condensed them. and Some try not to use any rules at all, even though they end up following them because if you don't, things don't work.
00:20:50
Speaker
So we use the classic eight rules of improv. And it's based on research into how human beings interact in a free-flowing and creative environment to get the best outcome.
00:21:02
Speaker
So that's where rules like yes and came from. Most people in the work world, when I do a workshop, and I'll say, how many have heard the rule yes and? 80% of the hands go up.
00:21:14
Speaker
And I'll say, where have you heard it? Only a few will know that it relates to improv from the classic fifties. And others will say, I just heard it at a workshop someplace.
00:21:27
Speaker
So it's a funny thing that it has broad impact without a lot of people knowing where it came from. But that's where the kitchen table discussion was. It seems to work better when we agree.
00:21:40
Speaker
Said that because without that rule and trig that you can know this as well in the classes you took, People started arguing a lot. Yes. it It seems to be this debate back and forth of, hey, hand me that spoon. I want to keep the spoon. No, hand me the spoon. I want to keep this book.
00:21:58
Speaker
Oh, we're not getting anywhere. That's where yes and came from. But the science behind it, and this is something we at Stevie Ray's really focus on, is the neuroscience of human interaction.
00:22:12
Speaker
And over the years, throughout all the stuff I've read about neuroscience and their realizations about how to keep a healthy brain and the world of psychology, how to build better relationships,
00:22:27
Speaker
It all comes down to how you express yourself to get the best reaction out of the other person. That's really what it's all about. Not, am I making myself clear, but am I getting the most out of the relationship?
00:22:42
Speaker
And yes, and fights against the most human tendency of yeah, but. And Psychologists will talk about trigger words.
00:22:56
Speaker
Trigger words are things that cause a reaction we have no control over. There are positive trigger words like ice cream. but great Then there are the negative ones.
00:23:08
Speaker
And what was discovered about the word but and its cousin, however, they both have the same effect on the listener. Whenever a human being hears the word but...
00:23:21
Speaker
We cannot remember what came before it. And we don't trust anything that comes after it. So let's take this into the work world.
00:23:32
Speaker
Most leaders are taught, if you're going to give negative critique, start with something positive. That's been around for forever. Or the critique sandwich.
00:23:42
Speaker
Start with positive, go to negative, end with positive. they strong There's strong basis for why that's horrible advice. And the reason is when you use that tactic, and I call it a tactic because it's a workaround.
00:23:59
Speaker
It's a workaround being honest. It's a tactic. Start with something that makes it easy for you to say what you really wanted to say all along. So if I say to you, um let's say I got Trigby sitting in my office and I want to give him some negative feedback, but I start with a positive.
00:24:19
Speaker
So Trigby, I've been looking at your evaluations here and all the rest of your team members say that one of the things they appreciate most about you is your attention to detail. You make sure that every dot is, every I is dotted, every T is crossed, and you've got a really good focus mark.
00:24:39
Speaker
what's coming yeah but or however and i've played this game i didn't think it was severe as the reports and the research claim it was I thought, how can somebody not remember what I just got done saying?
00:24:57
Speaker
I've played this game at a thousand workshops where i get a participant and I say, positive, positive, and I'll have the whole audience primed. I want you to say, but when I'm just about to say it, the whole room, but.
00:25:11
Speaker
Then I look at the person and say, what did I just get done saying? And they cannot remember. So what good is using that positive message if the negation erases it.
00:25:25
Speaker
Now trust is gone. And now you've lost them. And when I'm just about to give them the critique, they're stuck in a defensive mindset, so they don't trust what I'm about to say.
00:25:37
Speaker
Improv brings us back to the behavior that children have when they play together. If you were to push me down during tag, a child is not going to start with a positive.
00:25:49
Speaker
I understand that you're working on your assertiveness and that's good. However, moving forward in tag, you take your word child. Get away from me. A child says, don't that hurt.
00:26:02
Speaker
Done. Yeah. Honest, respectful. We're on, we're back on track. And then they get back to playing. So yes, and is not agree with everything and add something.
00:26:13
Speaker
Yes, and is what's the yes mean? Acknowledge what was said. Acknowledge the basis of their belief, even if you disagree with it, which is common. And what are you going to do next?
00:26:25
Speaker
How you going to solve the problem? Instead of saying, but you add something and then you both come to some kind of resolution at the end where this is what we're going to do about it.
00:26:38
Speaker
So that's one of the eight rules is don't negate. yeah And that is where yes and comes from. We also have the most important rule is trust. That's at the top of the list of every improv training.
00:26:51
Speaker
Trust yourself, trust your partner. People who don't fully trust themselves are the ones who control those around them. Controlling behavior does not come from arrogance. It comes from weakness.
00:27:04
Speaker
comes from insecurity. You can see that in the political or environment we're in right now. A lack of self-confidence causes people to control the world around them, and it turns out bad.
00:27:16
Speaker
If you trust your partner, you're both going to work well together. So those are just two of the rules that we teach. So a good example of this, Dave, is Stevie mentioned, oh I have a spoon.
00:27:28
Speaker
What are you going to do with that? Well, Stevie walks up to me and says, okay, I have a spoon. Okay, so I can do a lot of different things. I can say, no, you're using it as a you're using it as a gun and you're trying to hold me up.
00:27:38
Speaker
No. So that's building, but I've just negated the fact that he's holding a spoon. I've said it's i've turned it into something else in his hand. If I say something like, Stevie walks up to and says, look at my spoon, and I look at it, I say,
00:27:52
Speaker
I think that's big enough that we can get the entire pint of ice cream in one scoop. Let's go try it. That's an answer. Yep. Yeah. But now I've i have affirmed that it is a spoon.
00:28:05
Speaker
I've given us purpose of what we're doing together. And I've also anchored a location because now we're in the kitchen measuring spoons to try and figure out how we can eat all the ice cream in one scoop. And in in team dynamics in the workplace, they've discovered that Teams that effectively debate are much more creative and productive than teams that just agree with everything.
00:28:28
Speaker
It's how you do it. So yes, and even folds into disagreement. So if Dave says, I think we ought to hold a meeting every Thursday. If I disagree with Dave, if I negate and say, no, that'll never work.
00:28:43
Speaker
We're stuck. If I yes and, and this is where yes doesn't mean I agree, it just means acknowledge. If I yes and, I'll say, Dave, I don't see how that's going to work so well. Tell me why you think a meeting every Thursday is going to work.
00:28:58
Speaker
That gets Dave to explain himself and express his thoughts, which gets me thinking and everybody else in the room thinking, oh, here's where we're at. We stay we still may never do meetings every Thursday.
00:29:14
Speaker
We have remained respectful and productive throughout the process. And that team will want to work more together. And I think this is especially how helpful in the sales arena because as people throw objections of, oh, that's too much or, oh, I have to talk to somebody.
00:29:30
Speaker
That's not a real thing. no They've given you something. They've given you a spoon. Now it's a question of, can you get to the real meat of it in order to get to actually get somebody to say what they want? Why do you want to have a meeting on Thursday?
00:29:42
Speaker
And that leads to one of the core principles of improv that most people are surprised about is we don't teach people how to be funny. We teach them how to listen.
00:29:55
Speaker
90% of beginning improv exercises and all the way through to advanced levels is listening, not talking. It's not thinking on your feet. We already know how to do that. We got a brain that thinks without us telling it to.
00:30:08
Speaker
It's listening. So people are really shocked at how much they're taught to focus on the other person. And but you just mentioned sales.
00:30:19
Speaker
What is good sales? Good sales is good listening. yeah I got a friend who's a top salesperson. He gets sales of the year awards every year. and he said, oh, I never talk anybody into anything.
00:30:32
Speaker
I listen them into it. I love that phrase. um and So we're recording this in the first half of 2025. We're in a polarized environment, to say the least. Whether not you're Republican or Democrat, half the world thinks that you're wrong and that your person is a part of it because of identity politics. i want to ask a simple question that I think is really hard to answer. Is it okay to be funny right now? You know, that question has plagued man since Og in the cave
00:31:03
Speaker
in the cave first laughed at Oog before dropping a stone on his foot is what's funny and when can you be funny? The answer is, human beings don't just enjoy humor.
00:31:18
Speaker
They survive because of it. There are so many parts of laughter that are just not the, and it's not just for fun. First of all, It releases endorphins in the brain that it's long been known how laughter affects us physically.
00:31:35
Speaker
Endorphins are 16 times more powerful than injectable morphine at relieving pain. So when you laugh, pain goes away. It's not an effective thing. I still suggest using morphine if you broke your leg. Because once laughter is done, the pain comes back.
00:31:53
Speaker
So hold on. Are you saying that Reader's Digest has lied to us all these years is not good medicine? Laughter is great medicine for as long as you're laughing. Okay. Got it. All right, continue.
00:32:04
Speaker
But the other thing laughter does is, first of all, it creates cohesion. Laughter is a social form of agreement. That's its main purpose is when people laugh, the most common phrase that accompanies the laughter is something along the lines of, you got that? Or yeah, I've been there too. Or some kind of acknowledgement of similarity.
00:32:29
Speaker
Laughter bonds people through our similar shared experience. And also laughter, it actually increases intelligence. there's been track There's been a tracking of raising of IQ the more we laugh because it uses more centers of the brain to cross connect and causes higher level thinking than any other form of human expression.
00:32:52
Speaker
It requires intelligence to laugh at a certain level. And it also requires some kind of social bonding. So when you look at our polarized environment that we're in right now,
00:33:03
Speaker
It's important to recognize that, and I deal a lot with ah public servants and a lot of training for city government, municipal, and that kind of thing.
00:33:16
Speaker
So i'm constantly reminded of facts versus story. First of all, What we hear the most of is just what people want us to hear in order to keep us tuned in online and streaming and liking.
00:33:31
Speaker
So you you don't get a lot of ratings for saying everything's great. you get a lot of ratings for saying how crappy things are. Most of what's going on right now really will not affect most Americans.
00:33:46
Speaker
Most of it, because there are roadblocks, there are obstacles, there are checks and balances. But the talking about it is what people are focused on. The second fact is the loudest people at the ends of both spectrums are the ones that get the attention. 90% of Americans live in the middle.
00:34:06
Speaker
Look at the last election. There are 161 million registered voters in America. million registered voters in america The current administration got in with 29 million votes.
00:34:19
Speaker
That's about 18% of the total electorate. So when you look at it, 18% is a pretty small number. So the whole world is not saying, oh God, let's go in this direction.
00:34:33
Speaker
No, this much said it. And even a smaller amount are happy about it. And even a smaller amount are talking about it. But those are the people who get on the news.
00:34:45
Speaker
So laughter right now is crucial because we all have common ground. If we focus on the common ground, Then all of that other stuff melts away.
00:34:59
Speaker
So I've had debates with people from both sides of the aisle. And I just said, at the end of the day, we really all want the same thing, don't we? And they all say, yeah, it's just a matter of how we get there.
00:35:11
Speaker
So why don't we just put all this noise away and really talk about what's right in front of us? Because I live in a neighborhood where I saw yard signs for both candidates, right?
00:35:23
Speaker
We're still going to help each other shovel the walk. At the end of the day, and we all just want the same thing. So I make laughter wherever I go because it reminds us we're not this or that.
00:35:37
Speaker
We're this. And let those loud people on the ah either end of the spectrum, let them do their thing. And maybe learn to laugh at them so that you can disarm some of the vitriol, right?
00:35:50
Speaker
I've got a friend who is a psychologist and there's a new movement in psychology. It's called the let them movement. And so if I say, I can't believe somebody said that, the advice back would be let them.
00:36:06
Speaker
Now what? Let them say whatever they want to say. Is it true? No. Why are you worried about it? The let them movement is gaining huge traction because in a more polarized environment, you have to just let people.
00:36:21
Speaker
And then realize that's just a few. That's just, and the goal of news or the goal of Facebook or the goal of Instagram or the goal of X is to keep us tuned in.
00:36:32
Speaker
So I'm constantly reminding my colleagues, there's a difference between information and mural input. All of these means of communication are just to excite the neurons in our brain and keep us focused in.
00:36:49
Speaker
We're not getting any information. Once I get information, I move on. what's I think it's a common question to ask people, what are you watching these days? So let me ask you, Stevie, what are you finding funny these days?
00:37:02
Speaker
Oh, I really do find most of what's happening in D.C. funny. Because if you take a step back and humor requires objectivity and distance, that's it's one of its greatest qualities is it forces you to back up a little bit and look at something from a 30,000 foot view.
00:37:23
Speaker
If you back up for a a little bit, it's just a bunch of kids fighting in the sandbox because mom and dad aren't there to tell them to knock it off. That's really what it is. I just, I am, I watch the news and I track things and everything else like that, but I'm very careful.
00:37:39
Speaker
about knowing is this news or is this just stuff? Real news. Manufactured outrage. What is it?
00:37:49
Speaker
And when you take, I just watched it today where they showed the president arguing at a governor's meeting, all 50 governors are in there and he was calling out one of them saying, did and that was going, well, you're back to him. I just looked at it and thought, what a bunch of children.
00:38:07
Speaker
all fighting. Why? Because it keeps us paying attention. And so I laugh at the ridiculousness of it and how they don't realize they don't really have that much control over my life.
00:38:25
Speaker
What I choose to do for the rest of ju today is my choice and they can't stop me. And I'll figure out a way to make my life happen. Even though they're telling me they're going to control it, they can't.
00:38:38
Speaker
It's just not possible. So I laugh at everything. And I really try to look for commonality. I laugh. I play this exercise, and this is something I encourage everybody to do. for it's a good It's a good exercise to improve your humor abilities as well as just connecting with other people.
00:39:00
Speaker
It's what I call owning a transactional relationship. Whenever I'm in a transactional situation at the store, at a bank, anywhere where there's going to be me transacting with somebody I don't know, and it's a very quick interaction, I never leave it at just the transaction.
00:39:19
Speaker
I always add something that doesn't belong. Most often it's a joke. Because that shows people you care. So i go to the bank, I pull up and the screen comes up and I put the little tubey tube thing in for the vacuum tube.
00:39:36
Speaker
And the person on the screen says, hi, is it just the deposit today? What are they expecting? Yes, thank you. And we're done. How do we don't want to live our lives that way?
00:39:47
Speaker
Isolation is caused by that. So I always say something different. Last time I was at the bank, I said, I actually, I ordered a large pepperoni and sausage.
00:40:00
Speaker
Ready? Perfect. Yes. Now that's not the funniest thing you've ever heard. It's just humorous. And the last time I was at the bank, they said, oh yeah, it came and we ate it.
00:40:12
Speaker
I love that. I was on an airplane just yesterday to come back from an out of town workshop and you're walking past the flight attendants. Transactional. What do they say?
00:40:23
Speaker
Hi, welcome aboard. thank you Thank you. Thank you. Hi, welcome aboard. What do they expect from us? i or nothing, which is rude. They're human beings right in front of you and you don't even acknowledge them.
00:40:35
Speaker
Last time I walked on, they said, hi, welcome aboard. And I said, hi I ordered patio seating.
00:40:43
Speaker
And they both woke up. It wakes people up. And they said, oh, that's on the wing. I do this everywhere I go. And now sometimes it's not a joke.
00:40:55
Speaker
Sometimes it's just, hey, I really like what you did with your hair. Acknowledge something that they did that they're hoping people will notice, but most people never say anything or nice earrings or nice tie or something.
00:41:09
Speaker
I never let a transactional relationship go by without owning it. And that keeps me sharp because every time you do that, the wiring in your brain reasserts this quickness and this cross connection.
00:41:24
Speaker
And instead of staying siloed, things open up. If we stay transactional, the brain kind of shuts down and it goes only to the centers needed for that interaction.
00:41:35
Speaker
And there's not many. So that's why I, that's how I keep laughter a part of every day. and it's an exercise that I teach people to do that keeps their skills sharp and it makes the world a happier place.
00:41:51
Speaker
I learned that from Stevie and I, so the next time I went to the bank, I had to get out a thousand dollars cash because I was buying something stupid on Craigslist that my wife wouldn't approve of. So obviously I needed cash. And the teller was a very young Muslim woman, uh, wearing a head covering and everything, very tiny, considerably physically smaller than I am.
00:42:12
Speaker
She looked at me and she said, okay, I can get you your cash. How would you like it? And I looked at her dead in the eye and I said, Nichols.
00:42:21
Speaker
And she said, very seriously, ah I'm sorry, sir. with for that amount of nickels, i we would need advance notice to order them and have them here because you're talking about 20 or 30,000 nickels. I said, okay, can you just give me a burlap sack with a dollar sign drawn on it?
00:42:39
Speaker
And she stared at me for about 10 seconds. And then she went, one moment, please. Walked into the back and then came out two minutes later with a burlap sack and a Sharpie.
00:42:51
Speaker
And then I proceeded to watch her draw a dollar sign on it. um And then and then she put bills in the burlap sack.
00:43:05
Speaker
never looked at me the entire time. Then finally, the last thing she said to me was, sir, would you like your receipt with you or in the bag? How perfect. I love you. You win.
00:43:18
Speaker
No, because here's the thing that I learned from improv training is really good. Comedy involves trusting your partner. And she went wildly out on a limb for that. And that is one of my most cherished memories as a person and ah as the somebody who was an officiant comedy. So I immediately called over her manager oh and I said,
00:43:40
Speaker
I want you to know that I gave her grief and she gave it back to me five times as hard in the most professional way possible. And she should be commended for not letting, not accepting my crap, but also giving it back to me. And I will always cherish this. And she got promoted as a result of that. Oh, wonderful.
00:44:00
Speaker
I've always, I've always remembered that rule too. And I, and I do that too. i If I see somebody with a very decorative head covering, I'm very common. I very often say, that's a very nice hijab.
00:44:14
Speaker
Very pretty. They're shocked that a white guy knows what it's called. Right. And that they're just being acknowledged for what they believe and who they are and yeah that it's okay that the rest of the world doesn't think that they're different or weird or whatever. It's just, it's a piece of cloth over your head.
00:44:36
Speaker
Let's get down to the reality. And it's, sort of we need a lot more of that. The perception, the point the point I wanted make about talking about my bank experience was that the thing really about good improv is that come you should never actually try and be funny.
00:44:50
Speaker
well Because the comedy is inevitable. It will come as long as you're listening and as long as you continue to build on something. And I think that's just been a life-changing rule for me too is...
00:45:03
Speaker
yeah As long as you're listening, as long as you're being aware of what's going on around you, that there they you can laugh at just about anything. And that's the thing about humor. When I got my comedy degree, I had to study a lot about the psychology of humor and the sources of it.
00:45:18
Speaker
And one thing that is universal are the sources of humor. Cultural differences will dictate what is acceptable material. But the source remains the same.
00:45:31
Speaker
Shared experiences, that falls under a law called the laughter um similar laughter of familiarity. We all laugh because we share the same experiences.
00:45:42
Speaker
Worldwide, people have relationships, they have children, they have jobs. Those challenges face everybody. So humor about that. is universal. We laugh.
00:45:53
Speaker
There's something called laughter of superiority. That's a means for everybody to bring the powerful back down a bit. Every culture will take the most powerful person and make fun at their expense because it evens the playing field a bit.
00:46:08
Speaker
And so the cool thing about, like we have America where a thousand different cultures in a square mile, we all will find commonality. by recognizing that at our core, we all still get up every day. We all still go to work.
00:46:25
Speaker
We all still try to feed the kids or feed our pets or get on an airplane and deal with that hassle or all the things that we experienced together. That's its most powerful use is a reminder that we're all the same.
00:46:40
Speaker
And so that's why I like inclusive laughter because the source of it's going to change, but the the context is important. I want to ask a question that if you don't want to answer, we can cut this out, but it's something that's plagued me for a long time. And I've always found you to be brilliant and thoughtful and and a master of comedy.
00:47:01
Speaker
Here's the question. Is it okay to still find Bill Cosby funny? That's a good one. That's a very good one. I personally grew up with him as my hero comedically, and that's because of style.
00:47:14
Speaker
I'm a storyteller. He's a storyteller. I'm not much of a joke teller like the Rodney Dangerfield. I like almost every comedian. It's much harder to ask me who I don't like because I appreciate how they all do their work.
00:47:28
Speaker
And I grew up memorizing every story that guy told. I think it's okay to professionally acknowledge his talent because he had to work to get to where he was. And it was a lot of work.
00:47:43
Speaker
I personally cannot listen to any of his work anymore because for me, i have to respect somebody. And if it gets to the point where they go, with I don't have to have them as a best friend, but but if they go over the line personally, it just affects my ability to enjoy them.
00:48:02
Speaker
So this happens for me with movie stars and other celebrities, as well as comedians. And I don't. They canceled bunches. Yeah. I don't expect somebody to be perfect. When somebody does something that I disagree with, I say, ah, we disagree.
00:48:16
Speaker
They don't have to be completely in line with my beliefs. Right. They can't cross a certain line. And Bill Cosby crossed a certain line. Most professional comedians, when his name comes up, they'll say, oh yeah, he's still one of the greatest.
00:48:33
Speaker
He still did something despicable. And right there you go. For me, i don't listen to him anymore. i still acknowledge what he accomplished. The thing that I, the way I reconciled it, and I'll give my answer since you were gracious enough to give yours is that I think one of the things that people don't appreciate in this day and age is that two things can be true at the same time. Yeah.
00:48:56
Speaker
is Bill Cosby's comedy is uproariously funny and you really can't deny that. Also, Bill Cosby is a horrible human being. Yeah. And the juxtaposition of those two things is for everybody on the personal level to work through.
00:49:10
Speaker
But, and like you do, it's hard to listen it to him Now, or, but because of his actions, that's a perfectly reasonable position to make, but that you can find somebody funny, but also realize that the source of the source material isn't good either.
00:49:26
Speaker
And I have, I've changed my mind about many comedians over the years, because personally, i don't use profanity in my regular life. It's just never been something I do.
00:49:37
Speaker
I live by a philosophy that only weak minds need strong language. And so I don't use it in my performance at Stevie Ray's Comedy Cabaret. We don't allow it in our shows because rule eight of the eight rules of improv is titled work to the top of your intelligence.
00:49:58
Speaker
So how are you constantly pushing yourself to to do your best? So not all profanity is unintelligent. Too much of it is used for shock humor.
00:50:09
Speaker
And... Then there are those people for whom that's their natural way of communicating. And if it's natural for them, you accept it. Richard Pryor grew up in a brothel.
00:50:19
Speaker
His mother was a madam in a New Orleans brothel. His language is going to reflect that. George Carlin used profanity to make a point in a brilliant way. At first, I wasn't really a fan of Chris Rock because...
00:50:34
Speaker
of the profanity. Then I started really listening and he's got some of the most intelligent, thoughtful comedy ever. Social commentary, political commentary, social issues in a way that I could never even match.
00:50:48
Speaker
So I got past it thinking his natural way of communicating includes his language, accept it for what it is. Not everybody has to be like me. Although they'd be better if they were.
00:51:01
Speaker
think that all the time too. So the one last question before we head out and you work a little over on time. So thank You've been incredibly generous with your time and your thoughts. ah We'd like to end each episode with naked self-promotion. So where can, where, no, I didn't need, I'm figurative, figuratively naked self-promotion.
00:51:21
Speaker
I should, I'm going to have to call. I have an OnlyFans account where people pay me to keep my clothes on. Super. Yeah. And just to prove that I've been listening, it o o from The Cave is now a very talented speech therapist in Rob Pistern, Minnesota.
00:51:36
Speaker
Where can people find you? Where can people more learn more about you? More specifically, I know you've got a number of books. Where can people buy your books? You can stevierays.org and there will be information about our shows where we have shows every weekend year round.
00:51:52
Speaker
And then we also add special shows on top of that. There might be some Saturday matinees or Thursday shows where we do something different. Like we just got done doing ah real challenging thing we we created.
00:52:05
Speaker
was an entirely improvised musical. Yeah. The audience calls out the title and the characters and the what's going on. And then the troupe takes it from there and does a musical entirely made up on the spot.
00:52:19
Speaker
We've got a show that we did last year that we're bringing back called Laughter is Blind, which is a show entirely designed for blind and visually impaired audience members. So no big humor at all.
00:52:31
Speaker
It's all just verbal, just for them. If you go to stevierays.org, you can see our classes. You can see my books. I'm working on my 12th book now. And you can see about how to hire me to come into your company and teach these techniques to your to your staff.
00:52:47
Speaker
So everything is right there on our website.
00:52:52
Speaker
Wonderful. Thank you, Stevie. Thanks, Dave, for this is what the first time in a month that we've actually done a pod together because my schedule and your schedule haven't been over. Yeah. So nice to be back. Nice to see you again, too. i think we We blame Dave.
00:53:04
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. The problem with Dave is he's a genuinely nice guy, so it's hard to blame him. Then we'll blame Nicole. Yeah, let's do that. All right. Thank you, Stevie. This has been another episode of Dial It In. I'm Trigby. That was Dave. It's Nicole's fault because she's the producer along with Andy Guntowski.
00:53:20
Speaker
And thank you so much. And with apologies to Tony Kornheiser, we will also try to do better the next time.