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What I learned in politics is, you need to work with everybody
130 Plays1 year ago
When I was very young I just was interested by politics because you can influence. It's very fulfilling when you see that you can make things change. So that's really the main driver now.
20 YEARS IN PERSPECTIVE:
From 2009 to 2020 I was having two hats - one was the local managing partner of EY in Luxembourg, a firm of about 1700 employees, the second one was to be the private equity leader for EMEA.
I always had also a kind of public vibe in myself which is that I was always very much engaged into politics - not in the first row, in the second or in the third row, but co-managing electric campaigns. I was appointed to the State Council in Luxembourg, which is kind of the Senate, or the Upper House and I am today the vice president of that chamber.
In 2019 I was approaching to be 50. Working for big 4 is great, but I have been there for 25 years, it's super intense and I came to a point where quite frankly I was quite exhausted. After a lot of sleepless nights I decided to leave EY.
I took a couple of boards, I have 5 today, where I actually can make hopefully a difference. I'm spending more private time, so I have more time to practice my dancing skills
It's true that when you have a portfolio of activities which are very diverse, it requires a lot of organization and planning.
My political engagement is strong, but not that strong that I would want to become a full-time politician. The interesting thing is this the combination between business and politics.
You do it a bit for yourself, because it's very interesting, but at the same time definitely you're not doing it for financial reasons. So in that sense you're giving something back.
Biggest regret… in life there are sometimes windows of opportunities and you say no or yes and then you regret it. And I had 1 or 2 windows like this on the private side, where I took a decision which today I would have taken differently.
ON TOPIC: Big 4, being a part time politician
They are 4 Big 4, so each one has a natural share of the audit market of 25% so there are 75% left where you can do consulting, it's the wrong debate. It's just the way its needs to be organized.
Most of these people went back into the industry after a couple of years, so it's making a kind of training for the entire ecosystem. It's a fantastic career opportunity and it's a very socialist / communist, egalitarian system, based on meritocracy - no matter who you are, who your parents are, whether you're black, white, whatever your religion, nobody cares. Only thing what matters is your performance.
You work 80 hours a week if you want to progress and it is a tough school. But that's also part of the natural segregation. Once I became a partner and specifically when I became Managing Partner, it's where it really went to the 80 hours.
There are people who are saying that you should not ask the “hours” question, it's a matter of organization. I think that's rubbish, it's just not true. The reality is if you take that type of job, you just need to know it's going to be a phase in your life, maybe 4 years, maybe 8, where you're going to work crazy hours. If you don't like it, don't take it.
All THINGS INSEAD AND GIVING BACK
INSEAD has been probably the best decision in my life, educationally and professionally, and overall probably. It has been probably one of the best, if not the best year in my life. And I think I would not be who I am today without INSEAD. I am very thankful, grateful to INSEAD as an institution, but I would say, to you and to everybody who I had the chance to cross on my path at INSEAD, to our community, our class.
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Transcript
Introduction and Podcast Overview
00:00:00
Speaker
This is Republic of Insead, the 20 years later O3D podcast edition. I am Milena Ivanova and will be your host in this limited series. So, here we are, 20 years later, hopefully all the wiser, naturally smarter and as charming as ever. There were 432 of us in the O3D vintage.
00:00:25
Speaker
And certainly there are 432 unique and very interesting personal and professional stories to tell. While I cannot physically cover all, I have tried to make a selection of stories that will keep you interested and curious and will hopefully convince you to join us on campus for reunion. Welcome to the Republic of Insead Podcast Edition and enjoy the show. OK, here we
Mystery Guest Introduction
00:00:51
Speaker
are.
00:00:51
Speaker
I'm starting with the opening lines for this guest from our yearbook, 20 years ago. You ready? Okay. Yes. Lovenarabla moussou a.k., a gentleman, a true master of style and grace, always impeccably groomed. He dressed according to the very latest fashion trends, even during more risque events.
00:01:17
Speaker
such as the pajama party at the end of P3. As the superb host of the legendary Fontainebleau Soirees, he also made sure that we were pampered most extravagantly. But this is not all. As a regular at the party scene, he used his Fred Astaire dancing talent to impress the ladies on the dance floor.
00:01:42
Speaker
With the ever-sharp remarks in class on just about any topic, he did do his best to educate us in the advantages of tax-free havens and numbered bank accounts. And yes, that, as with everything else of any importance in the whole of Europe or even the world, would be in Luxembourg. Well, that's giving away a lot, but here you go. Welcome to the Republic of INSEAD podcast.
00:02:10
Speaker
Yes, you are the mystery guest that does Fred Astaire and still dresses impeccably well. I can attest to that. So, how are you? I'm great. It's really funny to listen to this and I actually still believe that Luxembourg is very important and I try to entertain my dancing skills. I don't know if they match what they were at the time, but I try to keep up. Well, hopefully we'll get to see and test this in a few months.
Career Journey and Crisis Management
00:02:40
Speaker
Yes.
00:02:40
Speaker
Stay tuned, but in the meantime, let's start from the beginning, the end, the last 20 years for you in a nutshell. If you can walk us through what you've been up to in the last 20 years and where you've ended up today and then we have more. Yeah, sure. Well, I would try to make this short and brief.
00:02:59
Speaker
So basically after INSEAD, I went back to a big four, which is really not what I intended to do. So I ended up being at EY when leaving INSEAD, and I had an offer which I couldn't refuse, which was to build up the private equity practice first in Luxembourg and then in Europe. So that's basically what I did the first couple of years after INSEAD. And then in 2009,
00:03:24
Speaker
There was a real crisis in the Ernst & Young partnership in Luxembourg, lack of strategy, difficult management, no cost control, low earnings, et cetera, et cetera. And basically, at the time, I had put my hat on the table to become the new managing partner, and I was elected. That was back in 2009. And so from 2009 to 2020, I was actually having two hats. One was the local managing partner of EY in Luxembourg, which is
00:03:54
Speaker
It's a firm of about 1,700 employees. And the second one was to be the private equity leader for EMEA, Europe, Middle East, India, Africa. So that was basically the main of my career since leaving INSEAD. I always had also a kind of public vibe.
00:04:13
Speaker
in myself, which is that I was always very much engaged into politics, not in the first row, but in the second or in the third row by co-managing electoral campaigns three or four times, actually four times.
Political Engagement and Current Roles
00:04:27
Speaker
And so my party came to government in 2013 and is still in government. And we are having the prime minister here in Luxembourg. And so
00:04:38
Speaker
This came with a lot of additional, I would say, party work for me. And myself, I was appointed to the state council in Luxembourg, which is kind of the, you could say, the Senate or the upper house. And I'm actually today the vice president of that, of that chamber. So I kind of kept these two, these two hats. And yeah, and then in 2019, I was approaching to be 50. And I thought, well, you know, working for big four is great. But I have been there for 25 years.
00:05:08
Speaker
It's super intense. And I came to a point where, I mean, quite frankly, I was quite exhausted. I mean, I did not have the burnout like it is today popular to call, but it was just being tired, having difficulties to sleep, and just also having the impression I was doing the same thing all over again because I was managing partner for 11 years, which is extremely long. Normally it's four or maximum eight.
00:05:35
Speaker
And so after a lot of sleepless night I then decided to leave EY, so I informed my partners one year and a half in advance. So we had a very smooth transition process and in January 21,
00:05:50
Speaker
I completely left and I basically started to do other things which I enjoy very much doing which is that with a couple of people I created a small private equity entity where we are investing our own little money and the money of family and friends if you want.
00:06:11
Speaker
only private equity funds and private equity direct investments. So that's one. The other one is that with a long-time partner, which has been my long-time boss at Arthur Anderson and EY, we created a little boutique, let's call it a little boutique M&A type of firm, where we just do one or two deals per year, very specific, very complicated situation.
00:06:34
Speaker
deals which normally do not come on the market, which we try to unlock. And then the last thing is that I took a couple of boards. I have five today, so the idea is not to be a full-time independent board director and to have 20 boards, but to have maybe five, six, seven really interesting, serious boards where I actually can make, hopefully make a
00:07:00
Speaker
make a difference. So for example, I have a very diversified portfolio. One is a company which is quoted on the Euronext, which is the largest stainless steel maker in the world. So industrial company. Then on the board of the largest Luxembourg insurance company. Another one is a French private equity firm. So it's quite diversified in terms of things which I'm doing.
00:07:27
Speaker
And I think last but not least, I'm spending more private time. So I have more time to practice my dancing skills and invite people for nice dinners and spend more time with the people I'm close to.
00:07:42
Speaker
That's
Portfolio Career and Diverse Activities
00:07:43
Speaker
nice. So basically, one of the questions in the last section of the podcast I have is retirement ever or never. And the way it sounds to me is you've done the retirement bit in the classical job, you've moved away from the classical career, you are done with that. And now it's on to the portfolio. A few years ago, I was trying to explain to someone what I was doing and I was struggling.
00:08:08
Speaker
because i do too many things and at some point it was a headhunter he said oh you have a portfolio career so basically now you're to me it sounds like you're into the portfolio side of life and also enjoying life what is most challenging so with you i'm starting a bit backwards what is more challenging to this
00:08:30
Speaker
setup. So we'll talk about the previous 20 years with E and Y, et cetera, a bit later. But what is most challenging in having so many different activities for you?
00:08:42
Speaker
Yeah, I think it's a great point because when you are a full-time CEO, you have only one job, right? You have one company you focus on, although there are various tasks within that job, but it's still one job. It's true that when you have, as you say, I think it's a good word, a portfolio of activities,
00:09:00
Speaker
which are very diverse like the ones I mentioned. I think I can just speak for myself, but it requires a lot of organization and planning. That means that, for example, the boutique M&A staff I was talking to you
00:09:16
Speaker
This is like one day week where I sit in our common office with my partner, and that's on Wednesdays, and we concentrate on that. Of course, there are always exceptions. But the State Council is Monday afternoons and Thursday mornings. So it's kind of organized.
00:09:34
Speaker
Any my boards is a bit the same so i want to mention for example. My board which takes the most time is the Luxembourg stock exchange because i'm the president of the election exchange now the good thing is if when you the chairman you impose the agenda. And so when you remember boards you can't impose it however i try to clarify before i join and it doesn't fit the agenda i don't go and i think that's the.
00:10:00
Speaker
the luxury is that you can pick and choose. And so that way, actually, the activities you have need kind of to fit into something where your week is a little bit organized because otherwise it's a mess because then you get conflict in your agenda all the time and you spend your time sorting out conflict.
00:10:22
Speaker
So, and there are weeks, I mean, last week for me was, for example, terrible because like end of June, you have a lot of board meetings and a lot of stuff coming together. So it's never perfect. But I think by and large, it works pretty well subject to the condition of making the other people also respect your own agenda, which I mean, in my life as a consultant before was impossible because you need to adapt to the needs of your clients and vice versa.
Big Four Firms: Structure and Controversies
00:10:49
Speaker
So that's a really big change.
00:10:52
Speaker
And speaking of consulting, so E&Y, 25 years you said in total. Yeah, I mean Anderson and EY because Anderson was bought by EY. So it's an industry or the big four, or I lose track of big how many there, but it's a controversial
00:11:13
Speaker
industry, right? One of them always ends up in a scandal somewhere around the world, right? So can you give running commentary on is this cycle ever avoidable or
00:11:28
Speaker
will continue to... Because they split the consulting and then 10 years later they are back into consulting and it's the inherent conflict of interest between auditing and consulting that's there. So what can you comment, as a running comment, on the industry being outside of it already? Yeah, I think that it's a very difficult question. I think I can give you my own views. Obviously there are very different views on that subject. Now, my view on that is that first of all,
00:11:58
Speaker
I think that the big fours are a fantastic school and it's for people because there are so many, I just take the one I was leading, we were hiring about 400 people per year and most of these people went back into the industry after a couple of years so it's a kind of making a kind of training for the entire ecosystem. The other thing is it's a fantastic career opportunity
00:12:22
Speaker
It's a very socialist communist, you could say egalitarian system where based on merit to credit, no matter who you are, who your parents are, whether you're black, white, whatever your religion, nobody cares. The only thing that matters is your performance. So it's by essence the system based on meritocracy. And I think that's a real
00:12:44
Speaker
you know, a real good thing. I think it's probably the type of companies which gives you the maximum objectivity when it comes to the evaluation, the career progression and reward. It's not perfect, but I think it's probably among the best you can find in the industry. So that's what is really great. I think it's not something for everybody because yes, you work 80 hours a week if you want to progress, and it is a tough school.
00:13:13
Speaker
And but that's also part of the natural segregation so people who want an easier life where they just don't join i mean so i'm so it's something for people who want that type of fast learning fast career fast progression. In terms of consulting and other than text being together.
00:13:33
Speaker
My personal view is that the multidisciplinary service firm is what offers the best type of service because if you do an audit today, what is an audit? It's like very, very heavy IT related. It's like more and more artificial intelligence used.
00:13:52
Speaker
then you have a lot of specialists required into text for example and if you segregate those well I mean often it's the text consultants and the IT consultants which work as consultants which also help out on the audit and if you don't have that
00:14:13
Speaker
Well, I mean, the people you will have inside the audit firm will not have the same expertise, the same skill set than the ones who work also in consulting and tax. And from a career perspective, it will not be attractive to be a tax specialist in a pure audit firm. And you can never do tax consulting. So I think that it's better to keep it together from a client perspective, if you're a client of a big four.
00:14:41
Speaker
And I think the conflict of interest can be easily managed because there are four big fours. So each one has a natural share of the audit market of 25 percent. So there are 75 percent left where you can do consulting. I mean, it's a wrong debate. It's just it's just the way, you know, it just needs to be organized. Now, there is a big temptation for the split, as you could see with the Y. It happened with Arthur Anderson when Arthur Anderson
00:15:08
Speaker
split and created Anderson Consulting, which became Accenture. Well, 10 years later, or even a few years later, NASA Anderson was rebuilding its consulting. And so, you know, it's, I would say, it's great. It can be, I think in the case of EY, I don't want to go too much into details. I think there was a lot of strategic logic to do it.
00:15:32
Speaker
And actually I think in the case of VY, there was a real business case to do the very first, as a first mover, the first pure audit firm and basically accelerate the growth in consulting through an IPO. I think the plan of VY was actually a good plan, but they couldn't pull it through. But overall for the industry,
00:15:54
Speaker
I think that there's also a lot of benefit to have multidisciplinary service homes. There you go.
Stress Management and Work-Life Balance
00:16:01
Speaker
So one more thing you mentioned is you weren't sleeping for a while. So can we talk a little bit about stress? And then you mentioned also 80 hour weeks, which
00:16:11
Speaker
in some other industries the more senior you get the hours get a bit more manageable i mean if you are senior it's always bad but 80 hours sustained for 20 or 25 years is rather extreme so can you talk a bit about how you manage that and obviously you chose to then exit so to retire from this side of life but yeah i mean
00:16:36
Speaker
In my case, it was actually less hours when I was an assistant or senior or even manager. But once I became a partner, and specifically when I became managing partner, it's where it really went to the 80 hours. Before, I think it was more like 60, something like that. And then the last 12 or the last 15 years have more been in the 80 range. I think it's too much.
00:17:03
Speaker
Yeah, I think it's just too much. But the reality is that I think it's the same for if you manage a law firm or if you manage a large strategic consulting firm. There is an expectation that you are there for your clients and for your people. And you cannot control this if there is a fire somewhere because a consulting job turns sore. You need to intervene. If a partner wants to speak to you, you cannot say, I'm tired or I have no time.
00:17:31
Speaker
or go and see somebody else. Managing a partnership takes an awful lot of time because I had about 50 equity partners and 50 salary partners. These are all people who come in in the morning and who say,
00:17:51
Speaker
I know what to do, I'm a great guy, I'm a great girl, I'm an alpha person, and I know how to manage this firm. And so it's a company where your owners come to work in the office every day. There are not many companies where the owners work every day. And so you need to manage that group of people, that they work together as an orchestra, that they feel motivated, that they feel stretched, but not too much, etc, etc. And that just takes a lot of time.
00:18:20
Speaker
You need to work on strategy, you need to work on kind of all kinds of matters. And so in addition to that, you have a public function because you need to represent your company in the market, make presentations, lobbying, all these kinds of things. And somehow I did not manage to do it less than 80 hours. My successor told me that he said, I'm not going to work as much as you. Now he's in the job for two years. He's telling me, I'm getting close to.
00:18:51
Speaker
So at the end of the day, I think that there are people who are saying that you should not ask the hour question. It's a matter of organization. I think that's rubbish. I mean, it's just not true. Reality is if you take that type of job, you just need to know it's going to be a phase in your life, maybe four years, maybe eight, where you're going to work crazy hours. If you don't like it, don't take it. That would be the way I would look at it. And if you don't put in these hours,
00:19:20
Speaker
The chances are how you're going to fail, in my view. The realities of life in the fast lane.
Private Equity and Board Challenges
00:19:27
Speaker
All right, so the four activities you have now, private equity, boutique M&A, boards and politics, which one would you pick and comment on?
00:19:39
Speaker
the challenges you have there and why it keeps you interested and why you picked doing that activity. On the private equity, you know, the family office investment platform or call it like you wish, what we created, I would say it's really out of personal excitement for that industry, which has been my personal industry at EY as a client service partner. I have always had mostly private equity firms.
00:20:08
Speaker
and banks, but mainly let's say 70% PE. And so it's actually nice to be on the other side now and to be able to invest in the product. And I'd say also use the network which I, but not only me, the partners which are with me, they are mainly lawyers, have constructed in their life with both large and small PE houses.
00:20:36
Speaker
And so we can actually get entries, we can get tickets into these houses where otherwise, while it would probably be much more difficult. And then we make other limited partners, other investors benefit from that. So we are kind of deal by deal platform. So we proposing a certain number of investments per year and our members, our limited partners are deciding where they invest and not together with us.
00:21:00
Speaker
So that's really nice. It's super exciting. I think the other one, the one I'm doing with my former boss, which is this booting M&A, which I mentioned, is very challenging because we are starting from scratch. We currently have a first deal. And these are very complex organizations, transactions, because otherwise they would not come to us. They would go to an investment bank or
00:21:26
Speaker
And it's only here and me, so we have no staff or we have one person. And there's almost no staff. But it's really what we like to do is really unlocking transactions. But again, it's technically and intellectually, it's probably the most challenging from what I'm doing right now. I think the other one, which is not easy, is being on the board when the company is
00:21:52
Speaker
in distress. When you learn what it means to normally we learn in insert corporate governance courses that as a board member you look into the tent right but you don't have to put your hands in the tent but unfortunately if you know things turn sore you need sometimes as a board member to replace management you are kind of like acting as CFO or whatever during a certain time you
00:22:22
Speaker
you learn what it means to be a very, very active and responsible board and that can be very tense because instead of having five meetings a year, you have a meeting per week or two per week. I think that is back to your portfolio management, is that when you accept board memberships, I think one always needs to have in mind that
00:22:44
Speaker
it can turn into a situation where it changes your time schedule completely when there are situations like this, unfortunately. And that you have mostly with startups. So you've had such a situation where you have an ongoing...
Political Motivation and Community Engagement
00:23:01
Speaker
But then it's also a great learning experience. I don't necessarily see that negatively, but because a board member, I don't see a board member just as a
00:23:11
Speaker
you know, five nice meetings a year where you come and you say hello during the coffee and you go home. I mean, it should be something where you bring something.
00:23:21
Speaker
Yeah, I was interviewing Sylvia Saris, who's been serving on boards for the last 14, 15 years. And her commentary was that boards have become a lot more professionalized. And at least in Norway, it's the days of the white, pale, and something else are, I forget, and male.
00:23:44
Speaker
Yeah, are gone. So because you say it's not just for meetings or five meetings where you have a nice dinner afterwards and pick the line being the chairman. I've been in such a situation in my life to be honest.
00:23:58
Speaker
But anyhow All right, so and politics then which is going to also bring us towards the topic of giving back But politics your involvement in politics I don't know I haven't yet probably we do have other classmates who've gone into politics But I I couldn't think from the top of my head. So what's your motivation there? What do you see there?
00:24:25
Speaker
Well, in my case, I joined the political party when I was 16. And it was just so already when I was very young, I just was interested by politics because you can influence. And I think it's probably a bit easier in Luxembourg because we are so small. So you can maybe have an
00:24:46
Speaker
It's easier maybe to have an inference than if you are in a huge country. So I think that probably plays a certain role. But it's just a personal matter of interest. And I was hesitating a long time.
00:24:58
Speaker
to go into politics, I mean, to go more active even into politics. Because I think that, you know, it's very fulfilling actually when you see that you can make things change. So I think that's really the main driver. Now, I continued that endeavor over my entire life. I think I was, I had a little bit of chance also because when I was a young liberal, so I'm in a liberal party,
00:25:27
Speaker
I was the vice president of that party and the then-time president is the current prime minister. So basically, we have been working together for, I don't know, for 30 years or something like this. And basically, most of the people who were there when I was a young liberal are in government today, which is really nice because you have been struggling and working for a very long time. And the question came to me in 2013, actually,
00:25:57
Speaker
to join the government and at the time I was in my fourth year that's managing partner VY and I made the choice not to do that. So that shows that my political engagement is strong but not that strong that I would want to become a full-time
00:26:14
Speaker
politician. And I think the interesting thing is the combination between business and politics. A lot of people always told me, oh my God, you cannot be a managing partner with YY and clearly have a political cart, because clients might not appreciate or whatever. And I must say, YY was always very supportive. And I have always said,
00:26:36
Speaker
You know what? As an organization, we find this is the right thing to do because you are engaging in the community where you're living through politics. And as long as you are not, of course, an extremist party or doing crazy things, it's absolutely fine. And I have never had problems with clients or conflicts, on the contrary. So I find it super exciting. Of course, it takes a lot of time.
00:27:05
Speaker
That's always you need to make choices. But it is very stimulating intellectually. If I take the state council now, what you're doing is basically you are reviewing and voting on laws with regard to their compliance with EU directives, with the constitution, et cetera, et cetera. And so that means that you are automatically always aware of what's happening because you are obliged to read this stuff and write on this stuff.
00:27:31
Speaker
So you get also a benefit out of it. But you're doing it almost for free. I mean, you get paid, but it's like almost like if it's for free. So there's the side of giving back. I think you do it a bit for yourself because it's very interesting. But at the same time, definitely you're not doing it for financial reasons. So in that sense, you're giving something back.
00:27:54
Speaker
I think on the giving back, there are two things where I have spent a bit of time. One is I'm the representative of the Philippines to Luxembourg, because Luxembourg is so small, not every country pays a resident ambassador, so they name locals to be their honorary consul, if you want. And so that's basically, you know, bilateral development, it's helping the community in Luxembourg with their problems.
00:28:21
Speaker
And the other one I'm doing since a long time is as well as children's villages, where we are collecting funds to build villages in poor countries and support kids. Well, and with regards to INSEAD, I should note that you are one of the most consistent givers, very disciplined.
Impact of INSEAD on Life and Career
00:28:45
Speaker
Discipline runs as a theme through everything,
00:28:48
Speaker
you've given in 13 of the 20 years with alumni and you're a blue paint holder. So how do you think about INSEAD and giving back to INSEAD? What stimulates you there to give and to be so consistent? I mean, I still say and I had said that
00:29:09
Speaker
I had the impression when I left insert and I have had it every year is that insert has been probably the best decision in my life, educationally and professionally and overall probably. It has been probably one of the best, if not the best year also, somewhere in my life.
00:29:30
Speaker
I think it's just like I would not be who I am today without insert. So I am very thankful, grateful to insert as institution, but I would say to you and to everybody who I had the chance to cross on my path at insert to our community, our class, and with quite a number of our classmates, I have very regular contacts. And so it's a living community.
00:29:59
Speaker
I went back to INSEAD to do another diploma in 2021. Unfortunately, it was by Vizio because there was still COVID. But for me, it feels like home and it feels like INSEAD is just doing this incredible job of picking people. The admissions process is just absolutely excellent. They do the right mix and diversity of people who work together.
00:30:27
Speaker
and who keep that pride and that connection during their career, and I would say for many during their lifetime actually. Which program did you do, by the way? It's called Advanced Certificate in Corporate Governance. There you go. Well, there you go. Just to insert that keeps us glued together. Yes. And thank you very much for being such a regular... Pleasure.
00:30:55
Speaker
donor back. Moving to our last section and here I should admit that I am usually with this podcast super well organized. Those who I've been dealing with would say that but with Alain who is the most organized of them all I f-ed up a bit and didn't send him the script. So let's see how quickly he thinks because with him the last bit is he's getting the questions for the first time now. So are you ready?
Personal Reflections on Life and Success
00:31:22
Speaker
Yeah.
00:31:24
Speaker
Alright, let's see your proudest achievement. The combination between a professional career and a political strong involvement. Success for you is? I think the success is achieving your goals subject to these goals being ambitious and stretch goals. Happiness is?
00:31:51
Speaker
feeling happiness is a feeling feeling to have arrived feeling to be happy feeling to do something meaningful feeling to be grateful I like this biggest regret if you have any biggest regret actually a difficult so difficult to say
00:32:14
Speaker
Biggest regret, I would say in life there are sometimes windows of opportunities and you say no or yes and then you regret it afterwards. And I had one or two windows like this on a private side where maybe I met somebody where I took a decision which today I would have taken differently. There you go. What keeps you awake at night or hopefully you're sleeping well nowadays?
00:32:44
Speaker
Yeah, I sleep pretty well, but when I don't sleep well, what keeps me awake is like big geopolitical situations like what we had two days ago with Prigojin in Russia. Yes, that's something which I do have turned in my head sometimes. Politics is a mess globally, right? Yes. I wish you had known or someone had told you.
00:33:14
Speaker
Nothing which comes to mind. If you had to do it all over again, what would you change? I think I would probably be more attentive to enjoying every moment. I mean, to live in a more meaningful way.
00:33:37
Speaker
which means not run through life like in a tunnel, but basically be more present with my mind in everything I'm doing. It's probably something which I'm doing now, which has been evolving over life. But I think that if I would have to do it again, I think that we in our Western world, we sometimes lack education on, you know, more, I would say, meditation topics, more on
00:34:03
Speaker
working with your subconscious more working on yourself with for example in Asian cultures cultures people might be more accustomed to to do I think we're very Cartesian as the French say the way we learn and
00:34:16
Speaker
we sometimes do not work so much on the psychological aspects of human personalities, if you see what I mean. Being present. Yes. It's difficult for alphas, though, so I would guess a lot of our classmates are struggling with the same thing. Myself, I raise my hand, I'm totally suffering from this. So we covered retirement, so no more talk about that.
Recommended Books for Personal Growth
00:34:42
Speaker
And if you had to pick one book everyone should read, what would you recommend?
00:34:49
Speaker
Well, I would need to take a few minutes to go through what I read the last 20 years to pick the best one. But like what is in the top of my mind is maybe more things which I read recently. I think one on the private side, let's take one on the private side, there's a book which many probably know, which is a book which is called Spiritual Partnership, which is written by Gary Zukov.
00:35:13
Speaker
which is a book about, you know, that a partnership is not something you have between friends, but something between real spiritual partners which connect spiritually. And it's a very strong book. The first 80 pages are a bit tough to read, but then afterwards it gets better. And there are a lot of interesting lessons
00:35:35
Speaker
in it. I mean, I find it really very good. And then I would give you two more which come to my mind, because it's good to have different stuff. I mean, there's one which is called Make Your Bat. It's a very small one by a US admiral. And it gives kind of 10 principles of life.
00:35:58
Speaker
And one is, make your bed, why make your bed? Because more things matter, etc. And so basically, it's a speech which he had given at a graduation ceremony, I think it was at West Point, I don't know where it was. And it's basically his 10 lessons from being a Marine in all his life. And it's finally very, there are some very, very true, non politically correct,
00:36:23
Speaker
statements. And then there's another one, which I think everybody should have read, which is a cruel book, which is called, which I guess most know, which is called The Prince from Machiavelli, which says a lot about human realities. So treat completely different things, which come to my mind.
Admired Leaders and Political Dialogue
00:36:44
Speaker
If I'm not mistaken, The Prince was required to read, but I may be mixing things, so why not?
00:36:51
Speaker
All right, most admired public person for you? Well, I mean, I must say, although she is not my monarch, but I like very much the Queen. I just admire her a lot for what she stands for over so many generations.
00:37:11
Speaker
I think that's for me exactly what monarchy should stand for. It's basically the values, it's the identity, the symbol, it's the integrity. So it is really somebody I admire.
00:37:27
Speaker
To me, it's a very interesting case of leadership, quiet leadership over a very, very long time, which we couldn't see another leader lasting so long. Most despised public person.
00:37:45
Speaker
Well, I mean, what would come to my mind is, again, somebody who is already dead. But obviously, characters like Hitler or Stalin would be the first which come to my mind as most despised. I mean, living people, I mean, there must be some really bad dictators left or right who I maybe don't know. But from the ones I know, I mean, the ones you see in the press today, there is nobody I would despise. I mean,
00:38:15
Speaker
I think that despising, what I learned in politics is you need to work with everybody. And whether they are called Kim Jong Il or if they are called Putin or whoever, it's not people I would despise. I think it's people I would try, of course, probably disagree with many things they are doing or most of what they are doing, obviously. But I think when you despise or even hate, you can't make the world go forward. I think one must be able to sit around the table
00:38:43
Speaker
with even the worst enemies to try to find the best outcome for everybody. And that's why despising is really something I could only have for somebody who does things like the two I mentioned before. And that's the politician I learned.
Conclusion and Future Plans
00:39:02
Speaker
Now I can give you a name, but before I give you a full name, last question, are you coming to reunions?
00:39:08
Speaker
Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. Yes, yes, yes, yes. It's a great pleasure. There you go. So it's October 6th in Fontainebleau. I'll stop saying this because you should all have it etched on your forehead by now. And that was a conversation with Alain Kish, who is an independent director, politician, and much more these days. Thank you so much for your time and for your generosity. And I'm very much looking forward to seeing you again in Fontainebleau. Me too. Thank you very much. It's a pleasure.
00:39:37
Speaker
You were listening to the Republic of India 20 years later or 3D podcast edition. It is my hope to remind everyone what an interesting and dare I say colorful bunch of people we are and how much we can contribute to each other, be it through ideas, knowledge or mere inspiration. The podcast is inspired by the original Republic of India, the yearbook produced on paper 20 years ago by Oliver Bradley and team.
00:40:04
Speaker
Thank you Ollie and team for this contribution to our class's memory and for letting me continue in the tradition, title and inspiration included. Creator and author of the Republic of Incia 20 Years Later O3D Podcast Edition, MI Milena Ivanova. Original music by Peter Dondakov would help from their film's productions. Stay tuned for more and remember to book your tickets for the 20-year reunion in Fontainebleau October 6th, 8th, 2023. Thank you for listening.