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293 — Buggin Out
76 Plays1 year ago
Ty & Eric are into the holiday spirit(s), as they discuss drinking white Russians, Kendall Jenner’s novel take on the 818 espresso martini, and how to make Christmas music not suck. They also discuss the blueprint for the ideal sandwich making station, finding a bug in your footlong (and why it may be a good thing), whether they are sandwich artists or sandwich scientists, and the flaws of ordering at McDonalds.
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Transcript
Technical Setup and Holiday Music
00:00:03
Speaker
We are rolling. Rolling, rolling, rolling. Hello, Eric. Hello, breadheads. Another episode of Think Fresh. So happy to be here.
00:00:15
Speaker
I'm so happy to be here, Tai. What a journey we have been on today to get you set up to record who knew forgetting your laptop would be such a headache. Dude, I've plugged this Yeti stereo microphone into three different devices in order to make this thing happen right now. It's incredible what will and will not accept the micro USB port on it.
00:00:41
Speaker
Yeah, dude, Micro USB is truly an archaic technology, but it doesn't matter because we are here, we're recording, and hopefully the breadheads are listening to some crispy, nice audio right now because there's a chance that they're not. Dude, I'm sure this is a welcome break from the Yuletide tunes that are probably bleaching the breadhead's ears this time of year.
00:01:05
Speaker
Mm-hmm. Oh my god. Yeah. How do you feel about a Christmas music tie? Are you are you rocking around the Christmas tree or are you? Sitting in the corner on mute, you know, I'm not a fan I there's only one Christmas song that I like playing Eric and it's an official cover of Weetus's teenage dirtbag but they've we just has changed the lyrics to be a Christmas dirtbag and It's it's fairly well done. The opening line is like
00:01:35
Speaker
The night was no well. Just to give you a sense of where it goes.
00:01:43
Speaker
That's sick. I'm actually gonna check that out after this. Contrary to what most people probably think of me, I love Christmas music tie. And I think it's fun to curate like actually good Christmas songs together and to create a like unexpected playlist of like
00:02:05
Speaker
maybe some R&B Christmas tunes, maybe some soul hits, some rock ballads, you know what I mean? Just get away from the whole Buble thing. I'm not really a fan of the bubbly guy. Yeah, I get you, Eric. I actually have a similar holiday urge to curate a collection of Christmas tracks that you've never heard before. I think that's honestly the biggest issue is that we need more diversity.
Evergreen Podcast Topics: Subway's Timelessness
00:02:31
Speaker
i don't want to like i would feel this way about any music that i had to hear as many times as i've had to hear all i want for christmas is you like it's it's too much so i actually have a similar playlist on my spotify which is songs that are like one like one-offs by real musical groups making music that would be welcome at a christmas party exactly that and also like um
00:03:02
Speaker
songs that are like Christmas adjacent or even just like winter adjacent like maybe they don't have the word Christmas anywhere in the lyrics but songs that are mentioning of like ice or snow you know what I mean there's a song by the cocktail twins called ice blink luck that's all my Christmas playlist has nothing to do with the holidays but it just feels icy as a song yeah yeah yeah i know exactly what you mean by that so so you're telling me let it go makes the list
00:03:33
Speaker
It does not but I like the attempt what about ice ice baby also
00:03:39
Speaker
That would totally make the list. It's just not on there right now, but who
Innovative Cocktails: Espresso Martini with a Twist
00:03:43
Speaker
knows? Maybe 2023. I'll add that in as a late edition. Um, but did you know that Tyler creator has a full Christmas album? I didn't know that, but I believe it immediately. There's of course he does. I think it's stupid for artists to not create a Christmas album because it probably just makes so much money. It's a free money hack of your musician because you're going to get so much like royalties forever afterwards.
00:04:10
Speaker
Yeah, dude, you get every year it becomes relevant again. You don't even have to make new songs that just magically becomes listenable. What do you think the podcasting equivalent is to that? Because I would love an episode that is evergreen. Like all we talk about are rumors of rap albums coming that never do. We need an episode that only talks about something that is always relevant.
00:04:39
Speaker
Yeah, I don't know. I mean, subway is my first guess. Like when is subway irrelevant? You know what I mean? It's it's permeated the culture in such a way that you can never not talk about it. Like you can always bring it up and people know exactly what you're talking about. Everyone has their own order. Everyone has like a subway story. You know, it's just like it's always a hit because people immediately jump in.
00:05:01
Speaker
because they're like, oh, I know a lot about that place. Dude, yeah, it's crazy. Everyone is an expert on everything, but particularly Subway. If the culture is bread, then Subway is the sauce that soaks into it and just enters every pore.
00:05:18
Speaker
Exactly. Ty, I have to tell you about what I'm sipping on right now. I'm sipping on this beautiful, extravagant espresso martini, courtesy of Kendall Jenner. Oh, she made it. She shook it for you herself, hey?
00:05:35
Speaker
Yeah, she was shaking it and I said, give me a taste of that. Yeah, dude, this is interesting one time because it's an espresso martini with tequila, but it takes it a step further. This one has olive oil in it. A little fat to coat the mouth. That's a nice addition.
00:05:56
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. However, since waiting for you to join the call, I've been like kind of letting it sit. And now all of the olive oil has separated from the espresso martini. So now I'm like not sure if I should take a sip, but I don't know. It kind of looks a little crazy because it's like fully. You need a little cinnamon stick to stir that thing together. Or just use my fingers and tap in.
00:06:20
Speaker
So the 818 is already innovated on the Espresso Martini concept by saying let's skip the vodka and swap it with 818 tequila which I think was a welcome change to the format. I like it especially because that tequila in particular has some subtle vanilla notes and the tequila itself is a little bit adds a bit more
00:06:42
Speaker
of a spunk to the cocktail but now we've done that move and then we've added an additional layer of olive oil the first sauce to enter the mix you could say my question to you Eric is when does this stop being an espresso martini i think we're like one more shift away to just calling this a new drink
00:07:05
Speaker
You know what, I think you're exactly right about that. Because even the ratios here are, like she freaked the ratios quite a bit, I'll be honest. Because like a traditional one, it's like equal parts coffee, coffee liqueur and vodka. It's all just like across the board and that'll make a perfect martini every single time. This one Ty, there's twice as much tequila as coffee liqueur and just a little bit less espresso.
00:07:33
Speaker
Uh, so
Cocktail Ingredients Debate: Simple Syrup
00:07:34
Speaker
just like taking a sip, like I let Bay, espresso martini's Bay's favorite drink. I let her have a sip of this and she was like making the stank face. Like I had given her an old fashioned or something. Aye, aye, aye. Perfect for Papa though. Papa needs a hard drink. It's actually pretty smart business decision because if you want to sell twice as much tequila, just make the recipe say two shots of tequila instead of one shot of tequila. Brilliant move. Mm-hmm.
00:08:02
Speaker
Yeah, it's perfect. I mean, I'm sure I could like, I don't know, put my own spit on this. Like, for example, I just didn't include the simple syrup. I think simple syrup is bullshit. What? Like, you don't ever need that. You know what I mean? When would you possibly need simple syrup, Ty? I use simple syrup all the time, man. It's the simplest thing. It's beautiful in its simplicity. Like, the fact that you just need water and sugar to make a fluid that, like, is so unique. It's already a fluid.
00:08:31
Speaker
Water's already with fluid. I just feel like it. I don't know. I think it adds. I think it's such a staple, you know? It can make anything taste good. You don't like something? I shot a simple serve and it's good again.
00:08:46
Speaker
Okay, here's a good comparison. It's kind of like adding salt and pepper to your foot long because like, yeah, salt and pepper is amazing and on its own it tastes perfect, right? It's a great ingredient. It can be used in many versatile different ways. But at Subway, the bread already is peppery.
00:09:05
Speaker
You know, I mean, you get the herbs and cheese and all the meats are so salty that you never need to add more salt. If anything, it'll make you like pucker up like a, like a dry little spongebob at the end of the foot long. I see. So you think that the simple syrup is adding unnecessary sweetness to an already sweet fluid experience.
00:09:28
Speaker
I think so because the coffee liqueur is sweet and I don't really need to go much further than that to be honest. I don't need a sugary drink. I like how I can taste the tequila, the coffee, even notes of olive oil. That's a fair point.
00:09:45
Speaker
You're right about the Kahlua ha ha ha ha being quite sweet. That's what I said. It's really had a nice brand glow up recently. Hey,
Traditional vs. Innovative Cocktails
00:09:57
Speaker
like I remember taking a Kahlua bottle off the shelf recently and admiring the branding and thinking, was it always like this? This is nice. Was it always nice? I don't remember.
00:10:09
Speaker
I don't think so. I think they definitely glue up a little bit. Um, yeah, they probably just made their typeface a little bolder, more sensory fee, but yeah, it's, it's, I have a bottle of it that I only use for espresso martinis and tiramisu. Nice as you should.
00:10:26
Speaker
Well, I was drinking a really weird beverage this weekend, Eric. The beverage in question that fueled my holiday party activation is known as the White Russian. Are you familiar? Oh, yes, dude. I only know about the White Russian because of the weekend. Does he have some lyrics that reference it?
00:10:48
Speaker
Yeah. He, he mentioned, um, something on a white Russian when the sun hits time, almost as like a pseudo coffee. Well, that's kind of what it tastes like. Like a white Russian is the kind of drink I would make in high school because it's mostly milk and only children drink milk. So if I was a child and I wanted to like dabble in alcohol from dad's liquor cabinet, it had to be a white Russian. I wasn't drinking anything. That's the only way I could handle vodka. Hmm.
00:11:16
Speaker
Yeah, no kidding. I've had it once before, like professionally made. And I don't think I ever needed to have it again. Like it's honestly not my favorite. It's just like too much milk. And I'm pro milk Thai, but not with vodka.
00:11:32
Speaker
I think it should just be with a nice cookie dunk, and that's it. Dude, I was a hater too, but now I'm a believer in the White Russians. I'm a White Russian sympathizer. So you're clearly... Yeah, I was gonna say, you've clearly picked a side. For sure. And here's the move. Use heavy cream, and you only throw a shot of it in. Match the vodka with it.
00:11:53
Speaker
So then you just got vodka, Kahlua, and heavy cream. It tastes like a good shaft. It tastes like a more chuggable espresso martini. I feel like a good shaft. Yeah, we're all craving a good shaft. So that's why I'm a white Russian sympathizer now, Eric. And I would recommend it for you to fuel the holiday activations as a welcome change from the rum and egg nog.
00:12:21
Speaker
Oh, I don't, I don't really care too much for rum and eggnog. Um, I think I'm more of a traditional just cocktail drinker in general. You know what I mean? Eggnog, like, wait, coming from the guy who just put all the oil in his martini.
00:12:37
Speaker
Well, okay, in that case it's a riff on a classic drink. I was just looking to spice it up this year because I'm out of Grey Goose and I have this unopened bottle of 818. So I figured it was time to crack that thing. It's been teasing me for the longest time.
00:12:54
Speaker
actually the more i think about it the more we're just actually bringing the espresso martini we're pulling it back to its roots a little bit more the the martini craves olives and this is the closest it's gonna get but still olives oh yeah wow thanks for post-rationalizing that for me uh yeah i totally agree um
00:13:17
Speaker
Yeah, dude. I saw this video the other day where it was like
Subway's Efficient Customer Experience
00:13:20
Speaker
how rich people order drinks versus like really rich people. Ah, shit. And then the rich guy was like... I'm probably ordering them wrong. I just know I'm gonna be ordering them wrong.
00:13:31
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, yeah. So the rich guy's like, yeah, let me get a martini, but make sure it's the top shelf stuff. Oh yeah. And also he throw in some blue cheese olives. And he was like, yeah, we don't have that shit. Um, and a really rich guy's like, yo, just make it how you want. I trust you. I was like, damn, that's some, that's some deep, deep thinking right there. Right. So giving the, this, the martini artist free reign of the counter. Exactly. I think as I've matured tie, I realized like,
00:14:00
Speaker
I have nothing to complain about. You know what I mean? Like if it's not great, I'll just take the L like a man and never complain. Right. Never speak of it again. Exactly. Dude, is it, is it a bit femboy to complain? Is that what you're trying to say? I think so. Yeah, I think so. One of us has to be grounded in the relationship. You know what I mean? One of us has to be the voice of reason.
00:14:27
Speaker
Yeah. Is that like this podcast? I think the challenge is that it falls into like the, when you think about emotions as a spectrum between like a little bit of emotion and a lot of emotion, there's something about being reserved on both the happy and sad side of the spectrum to just withhold, you know, the masculinity to swallow it and suppress it. Mm-hmm.
00:14:54
Speaker
Yeah, like that. Just compress everything. I'm in an active war with my own emotions to suppress them, to ignore them, to not give them an opportunity to manifest in any way. And I think I'm doing an okay drop of it.
00:15:15
Speaker
I think as a frequent subway patron, you have to practice this skill like almost every time you go in. You have to practice restraint, you know what I mean? In multiple ways. Dude, if you show your-
00:15:29
Speaker
what do you show your sandwich artist fear they will eat you they'll climb over that glass like a wicked spider um you have to show restraint tie when you add sauces you know i mean too much and you step over that thin line and you're ruining your sub you know but also when the sandwich artist inevitably fucks it up you can't assault them you're gonna end up working with them as we've learned from previous episodes
00:15:58
Speaker
It's a true collaboration. I'm curious if the sauce is more of an art or a science in this case. The sauce is emotion manifesting via food.
00:16:14
Speaker
The flavors are only reminiscent of like the strongest emotions, but the application of them, Eric, is to me more of a science. I'm thinking about the exact ratios I'm looking for and pairings. The age-old question, Tai, whether sandwich artists are truly artists or simply chemists, you know? Personally, I think they
00:16:44
Speaker
Fuck. I don't know. I think they lean towards art simply because that's the only way to justify their terrible application most of the time. You know what I mean? If they were scientists, they would be disbarred. Yeah, that's a good point. I think so too. And that would explain also the just like hectic nature of their, their workstation. The whole thing just feels like, like a very artful, chaotic enterprise happening back there.
Subway vs. McDonald's: Kitchen Efficiency
00:17:10
Speaker
Mm-hmm exactly the cutting room floor tie. Yeah, you don't want to you don't want to look under the counter. No, you don't want to see like For every beautiful sandwich they created there was a lot of mess behind that and there was a lot of a lot of disaster. Oh, yeah
00:17:27
Speaker
I wanted to talk to you, Eric, about pick up a conversation you and I were having before we hopped on mic, which is around the ideal kitchen design. I was explaining to you that the ideal kitchen design triangulates your your fridge, your oven and your sink to optimize for the movement between those three spaces. And when we take that logic to subway, we realize there's a completely different school of thought around the organization of their backup house.
00:17:59
Speaker
That's right, Ty. The entire kitchen is linear with a few exceptions, right? The toaster is a 180 move. Notably, not directly behind the bread station. Like you would expect like, as soon as you like decide the bread, you just do a full 180, put it in the oven to toast it, right? With your cheese in it and whatever. But you kind of have to like skip to the end, throw it on the toaster and then run back to the beginning where you can put on the veggies.
00:18:27
Speaker
yeah so i feel like the three major moments like the three areas to triangulators is it the bread bin the toaster and the i guess the lion i just i don't know why calling it the lion is so funny is i think it's only funny to meet you i think so too it feels so official um i remember watching the documentary about the guy that founded mcdonald's
00:18:57
Speaker
Was his name Ronald or like, where did they come up with Ron? A real crook. Um, I don't think it was a Ron guy. I don't know. Ron, Ron time, Ron place. Was his last name even McDonald? No, it wasn't. What the hell? Raymond Albert Crock.
00:19:20
Speaker
Huh, I obviously what a crock of shit. Yeah, no kidding. Oh, wait, Dick and Mac. Oh, right. I remember. Okay, it's all coming back to me. I'll spoil for you the documentary. Dick and Mac McDonald open their family owned burger business. And then Raymond Albert Croc nationalized it and he was portrayed as a bit of a an evil human for his
00:19:46
Speaker
efforts to undermine this family business. But the thing that I am reminding myself of right now, Eric, is when they first started to franchise the McDonald's, they needed a format in which to set up the kitchens to optimize for efficiency. They wanted to be fast. They want to be flipping burkeys real quick.
00:20:09
Speaker
So in the film at least, they went into an open field and then they set up fake stations and then they had people run between the stations and time it and then whenever they saw a flaw or an opportunity to optimize, they moved the fake stations around. So they just pretended to make burgers and fries all day until they found the ideal format for creation.
00:20:30
Speaker
which I think is actually kind of brilliant to prototype, but I don't get the vibe that Subway ever prototyped their back of house before they made 44,000 versions of it.
Subway's Bug Incident: A Marketing Spin
00:20:43
Speaker
I don't know, I think it works surprisingly well, Ty, because think about it, as a user, if this is like user-centric design, then it's perfect, because the customer just has to move from right to left, and they never have to like, I don't know, navigate anything. Like at McDonald's, for example, you had to like stand in front of this like cashier looking thing, or maybe it's like one of those robots that are replacing people's jobs, you just like tap on the burger you want.
00:21:08
Speaker
You have to go there and then you got to like find where they're like spawning all the food. Oh, yeah. And you got to look at your ticket number and be like, oh, number 69. Is it there yet? And then you got to wait for your number and then blah, blah, blah. It's like subway. It just goes from right to left. You know what I mean? The sub makes its way down the station. Achoo Choo ends up at the cashier cashier is the terminus station. And then that's it. You get off the train and you're you're going to
00:21:37
Speaker
uh what's it called heartburn city you go into the toilet next stop the bathroom exactly wow i never really thought about it but whether it was intentional or not that is an incredible user experience to have your eyes on your food from inception the first bite like your eyes never leave your sandwich there's no funny business business happening there's no mistakes it's
00:22:02
Speaker
It's pretty cool. Actually. It's like watching a loading bar, you know, it's like loading 50 percent 60 percent. Oh, no, it's exactly it. And if the artist is truly an artist and you're the creative director, you're also kind of like QAing the entire time. Like as they put on lettuce, you're like, yo, come on, son, like give me another scoop of that. Like stop playing with me.
00:22:27
Speaker
and then they do it and then there you go your sandwich is exactly how you want it yeah in that regard the feedback loop is instantaneous like i get why so many developers go to subway because they they like the feeling of commit they're committing code to their sandwich every every word they say 100 percent oh that's so weird and then sometimes you got to debug it too literally there could be a bug in it
00:22:55
Speaker
exactly um yeah should we talk about that news story dude hit me with literally a bug what's going on here so i found this on uh on reddit um in calgary tie there was a bug found in a sandwich okay this doesn't sound very crazy because i'm sure this probably happens fairly often however the bug was shaped exactly like a strand of shreddice
00:23:20
Speaker
and almost went undetected until it crawled out of the guy's sandwich and like did the dash across the bun and I can only imagine this guy's reaction because dude that would scare the shit out of me if something came crawling out of my sandwich that was like the size of a pickle
00:23:38
Speaker
Yeah, freaky as hell especially when it's clearly Like camouflaged which means now do you think that if it's camouflage that means natural selection Has allowed that bug to thrive in the sandwich like bugs that looked less like the sandwich have been squashed But they're getting smarter
00:23:58
Speaker
totally um there could have been a type of chameleon effect happening as well where it's like when the bug gets scared it just shifts into its environment um it didn't happen with the bun but it was doing it with the lettuce so it was kind of like a greenish gray dude
00:24:14
Speaker
Okay, so perfect. Obviously disgusting. No one wants to eat a bug for lunch. But subway missed an opportunity to own this moment. Nothing to me says fresher vegetables than insects wanting to live in it. Oh, you know, that's like straight from the garden kind of shit, you know?
00:24:36
Speaker
But he literally dragged his footlong through the garden. And when you do that tie, sometimes you pick up unintentional inhabitants. You know what I mean? A couple of worms, a couple of girlfriends. You never know what you're going to get. But I think Subway could have capitalized on this. They could have played into that and made this a special moment for the brand, like truly eating fresh. It's still alive.
00:25:06
Speaker
Yeah, I agree. But this is like a risky thing to lean into, though, because if you start saying like, oh, yeah, bugs love our vegetables, they're they're in there. You know, I mean, they're up in that shit. They're in that ass. Eventually, you know, people are going to stop going because they don't want to eat bugs. Like we're not in we're not in Kenya where we're eating crickets, you know, as a delicacy for sure. This is not an intentional ad. You know what I mean? So.
00:25:33
Speaker
could be a little risky. Okay, well, what if subway double down on they said, you shouldn't have to share your food with the bugs. We understand that the bug didn't pay for the sandwich. So why is it eating it? That's your sandwich. So here's what we're gonna do. You find a bug in your garden fresh green goddess, we will want get you a new sandwich that the bug can eat the first one. And two, we'll give you a little jar so you can bring your bug friend home.
00:26:00
Speaker
And then you can kind of collect them, you know, like NFTs. It'll be something for your patrons to celebrate and share with
Final Thoughts and Lighthearted Advice
00:26:08
Speaker
their friends. Look at this cool one I found. Mine looks like a banana pepper. Mine's a black olive. You can imagine the schoolyard banter that can form from collecting these little critters. That's probably how they invented Pokemon in Japan. It was like, well, this is, I don't even know. Maybe not.
00:26:29
Speaker
Yeah, maybe, or it was like the predatory fishing industry. Yeah, maybe. Yeah, that's interesting, Ty. I like how, I think we definitely subway missed a good PR moment. I don't know if it's leaning into the whole bug thing, the healthy, organic nature of the, or the lettuce, whether that's even true, or if it was something more creative where they could have maybe like, I don't know, lined the pockets of this guy to be like,
00:27:00
Speaker
Yo, like, sorry about that. Here's like $1,000. That would even open up an even worse bug hole, if you will. But I don't know, Ty. There could have been something here that somebody could have capitalized on, but they didn't. So here we are left, fearful for, I'm fearful every bite now, Eric. That's true. I'm actually going to have to inspect my foot long, a little bit closer now upon receiving it. You know what I mean?
00:27:29
Speaker
Like, what if, uh, what if like a black widow was in there? What if I eat a black widow? Like, Oh, I thought it was a black olive. This is, this is terrible.
00:27:39
Speaker
That is terrible. Words of advice for the breadheads. Check under the button and chew your food properly. Because I think if you take a bite of a black widow, you probably have like a second to eliminate that thing before it bites you. But if you're still consuming the venom, would that kill you? I don't know. I don't really know what would happen. I don't want to test it. I'm sure someone's tried eating one. RIP.
00:28:08
Speaker
So David Blaine for sure has eaten like a handful of them. Yeah. So I think the safest strategy here is don't chew your food. Take small bites and just swallow immediately. It will, I think it will reduce the likelihood of a bug biting the inside of your mouth. It hits the stomach acid right away and the smaller bites ensure that you will uncover a bug potentially before it even enters the mouth to begin with.
00:28:37
Speaker
Mm-hmm. Perfect. Um, bright heads. That's some sound advice to start your week with. Yeah. Anything else you want to get over, get over on your chest right now? Are we, are we good to wrap right here? This is, this has been a very informative episode. Yeah, dude, wrap this and sell it like a foot long. Let's wrap this, wrap it and bag it. All right, King. Well, yeah, I'm done bugging, so let's get out of here.
00:29:09
Speaker
Let's do it. Alright, birdheads. Ciao. Ciao.