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The World Needs Your Prayers with Adriel Sanchez
264 Plays6 months ago
In this episode of Straight to the Heart, Adriel Sanchez shares with our host, Rush Witt, how the Lord’s prayer can be used as a fresh and helpful guide for those of us who struggle in our prayer lives. Adriel also shares practical principles that will help you to pray faithfully, as well as the not-so-well-known National Day of Prayer, on Thursday, May 2.
ADRIEL SANCHEZ ONLINE
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MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE
Praying with Jesus
Why Should I Pray?
I Prayed and Nothing Changed
For more about the podcast at New Growth Press online.
Timestamps:
1:53 – Welcome
4:11 – Intro to the book Praying with Jesus
5:55 – Adriel’s upbringing and conversion
8:31 – Expecting God’s goodness in prayer
14:32 – What to do when you don’t feel like praying
21:50 – Tools which help us pray personally or at church
31:51 – How the prayers of a homebound saint moved D.L. Moody across the ocean
36:22 – The National Day of Prayer
41:16 – How the Gospel connects to daily prayer
45:13 – Farewell
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction to 'Straight to the Heart'
00:00:00
Speaker
And so as that happens, this is what we're praying for. God, let that new creation break in in my own life. Help me to grow. May your kingdom advance in my own heart, those areas in my own heart that are still in rebellion. God, let your kingdom take control, but not just in my own heart, but in my community.
00:00:26
Speaker
I'm Rush Witt, and you're listening to Season 3 of Straight to the Heart, a podcast from New Growth Press. Each episode includes thought-provoking conversations with leading Christian writers and thinkers. We hear who they are, what they believe, how they approach their work in ministry, and the moments in people who have changed their lives. In Straight to the Heart, we go beyond the books to connect with the remarkable people behind them.
00:00:52
Speaker
Today, I sit down with Adriel Sanchez to discuss the important and challenging topic of prayer. Adriel is the pastor of North Park Presbyterian Church and the host of Core Christianity Radio.
Using the Lord's Prayer as a Guide
00:01:05
Speaker
He is married with five children and they live in beautiful San Diego, California, which honestly makes me a little jealous.
00:01:13
Speaker
In this episode, Adriel and I talk about how the Lord's Prayer can be used as a fresh and helpful guide for those of us who struggle in our prayer lives. His book Praying with Jesus is about this very thing. Adriel also shares practical principles
00:01:29
Speaker
which are helping me to pray more faithfully even today, as well as the not-so-well-known National Day of Prayer on Thursday, May 2nd. We, our churches, and our world need our prayers, and today's episode can help you and me grow in this important Christian privilege and discipline. This is Straight to the Heart. Adriel Sanchez, thank you for being a part of Straight to the Heart today.
00:01:56
Speaker
Yeah, I'm stoked to be on here and to get a chat a little bit with you. Yeah. Now I know because of our conversation, you are on Pacific time, but I don't know exactly where
Adriel's Life and Ministry
00:02:08
Speaker
you are. Okay. So I live in San Diego. Have you ever been to San Diego? I have a long time ago when I was a kid, I went there. Yeah, just once.
00:02:19
Speaker
Okay, so I grew up here in San Diego. My wife grew up here as well. We've been here all our lives. And I live close to Balboa Park, so like where the San Diego Zoo is, near there. I mean, so I could walk there. It'd be kind of a long walk, but sort of an urban neighborhood of San Diego. And we're raising five kids right here, concrete jungle. It's a lot of fun.
00:02:45
Speaker
That's cool. You pastor a church there and you're the host of Core Christian Radio, right? That's right. So I pastor a church called North Park Presbyterian Church. It's actually just a few blocks from where I live, which is great. So I get to walk with the older, the older three usually will come with me and we'll get there early on Sunday morning. They'll help me set stuff up.
00:03:05
Speaker
So Faster North Park Presbyterian Church been doing that for about 10 years, which is wonderful. And then I host a Christian radio broadcast called Core Christianity, which is like a Bible Q&A. People call in and ask questions about the Christian faith. Really broad audience like every Christian tradition out there. So that's a lot of fun as well.
00:03:30
Speaker
You know, I have a list of books. I've got to confess to you, I have a list of books and I know that you wrote Praying with Jesus, but I haven't gotten to it yet and I want to. But I'll tell you this though, I am encouraged by an opportunity to talk with you simply because of that book. Because anyone who can spend time thoughtfully writing a book about prayer is someone that I need to talk to because prayer always feels like a weakness in my life. And so
00:03:59
Speaker
I hope that maybe our conversation today will help me and I'm sure there are other people that feel the same way, probably lots of us. Give me a little background though on the book.
Struggle and Inspiration for Writing
00:04:10
Speaker
Yeah. Praying with Jesus, getting to the heart of the Lord's Prayer. Honestly, some of it was myself also wrestling with prayer and thinking through, okay, what's this supposed to look like, especially in those moments or in those seasons where it's like, I have nothing in me. I don't feel like praying at all.
00:04:30
Speaker
And of course, just as a minister, I don't think I've ever met anybody who says, that's an area of my Christian life that I feel like I don't need any help. So, I mean, for all of us, I think it's an area of growth. And I often say, it's interesting that the disciples of Jesus, they even go to Jesus and say, hey, can you teach us how to pray? Think of all the things that they could have asked him.
00:04:56
Speaker
to teach them, like, teach me how to raise the dead, teach me how to multiply loaves of food. You know, I'd really love to preach like you preach. But the fact that they ask Jesus, in Luke's Gospel at least, teach us how to pray, I think is a sign of the fact that this is something we all struggle with, and also probably a sign of the fact that they saw something in Jesus that revealed to them that prayers are pretty important.
Faith Journey and Influences
00:05:22
Speaker
And so I'm right there, I would say, in the boat with you, I guess. For me, it was wanting to grow myself, really wanting to think through the Lord's Prayer in particular. I had preached on it, I think, six or seven years ago now, and it was a really impactful series that I preached through for me personally, and I felt like it was helpful for a lot of people. And so then that got the wheels turning into like, hey, I'd love to write more on this and maybe even turn this into a book that I hope
00:05:52
Speaker
encourages other people. Yeah, I do not like to be in the boat alone, so I'm glad to be in the boat and in the boat with you. And I'm curious, what has been the role of prayer in your life as you have matured as a Christian, and maybe even how did you become a Christian?
00:06:12
Speaker
Yeah, so I was raised by a single mom in a nominally Roman Catholic home. And I mentioned this in the book, my mom taught me the Lord's Prayer when I was, I must have been three or four, you know,
00:06:28
Speaker
And I remember praying the Lord's Prayer as a little kid. So my mom, you know, we didn't grow up going to church, but she did try to establish some sort of baseline spirituality for me. And the Lord's Prayer was one of those things. And it wasn't until high school that I really
00:06:47
Speaker
Began to understand the gospel and that was through the influence of just a christian family i was i was going to public high school in my neighborhood and i had actually gotten into some trouble and my mom grounded me for the entire summer and said i was allowed to hang out with my friends.
00:07:02
Speaker
And so like halfway through the summer in San Diego, you know beautiful weather it's sunny I can't go hang out with any of my friends and I asked my mom if I could hang out with one family that we knew of they were Christians and they had a son that was my age and we We kind of knew each other but didn't spend a lot of time together and my mom said okay You can hang out with that family because she knew they were like
00:07:23
Speaker
They go to church every Sunday and it'd probably be a good influence for Adriel. And so it was sort of like a last ditch effort to hang out with peers over the summer. And God used me being grounded during that summer. And then this family, this Christian family was actually pretty neat. I got to see the parents just this last month, which I hadn't seen them in years. And it was just so cool to be like, man, thank you.
00:07:51
Speaker
So so grateful for how the Lord used you in my life and but God yeah, God used them. That was where I first began to hear the gospel and And they were very much like just come over and hang out with us And I would just spend the whole day there right like they're you know hospitable. We're having meals and
00:08:10
Speaker
And they weren't super preachy, but they definitely lived out their faith. Everything that they did as a family was infused with the gospel, and that's where the Lord got a hold of my life, I would say. So that was in high school.
00:08:30
Speaker
Man, I'm sure they were praying for you along the way of that time. And what a great story and example of God's providence. I think most people, if they were to see that happening, would have just thought, oh, it's just like getting away from being grounded. But to see that God had enormous other plans is really an incredible testimony.
00:08:51
Speaker
I was just, I just started preaching through the book of 1 Corinthians and I was preaching on Acts 18, sort of setting up 1 Corinthians, the planting of the Corinthian church. And there in Acts 18, Paul is hosted by Priscilla and Aquila, this couple throughout the New Testament.
00:09:09
Speaker
And they're all over the place in the New Testament, right? Like they're opening their home for the church in Rome, in Ephesus, in Corinth. And I mentioned this family because it was just like you couldn't pass through their home without getting a little bit of Jesus. It might have been a prayer, it might have been like a Bible discussion, or just seeing how they interacted with each other. And so it really is God's providence and just the faithfulness of
00:09:34
Speaker
Christian people, Christian families who love the Lord and are open, and they just were open with me, and God really used that.
00:09:47
Speaker
Yeah, I hope our home is like that. And you know, even just thinking about the unassuming nature of your experience of how you became a Christian says something probably about mine. And yeah, I'm a pretty normal person. So I think probably a lot of people just says a lot about our probably low expectation of what God is doing in those moments. We aren't always in tune with that. And I just wonder, you know, I wonder in my own life how much that plays into my prayer life, my struggles with prayer,
00:10:15
Speaker
have to be. I know they are at certain times. They have to be far more connected to my kind of, you know, lack of expectation. And I wonder how that's been a part of your life. You know, how you felt in terms of expectation in prayer and maybe that's grown for you.
00:10:32
Speaker
Yeah, well, I definitely, it's interesting, right? Because there have been a lot of times that I've prayed, and then I just sort of say, Amen, and then totally, you know, like, forget about it. Zero expectations. So I'm like, Okay, well, what does that say about, you know, how much I actually think that the Lord is going to going to hear me or and I do think that that is something that a lot of people wrestle with is just believing that something I wrestle with is just believing that God is good.
00:10:59
Speaker
I think that that's why Jesus in the Sermon on the Mount says, you know, if you being evil know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father who is in heaven give good gifts to those who ask Him? In the context of prayer, He's saying, man, your Father is good. Earlier in that Sermon on
Developing Strong Prayer Habits
00:11:17
Speaker
the Mount, He says, your Father knows the things that you need before you even ask.
00:11:21
Speaker
And so I think one of the big hurdles in terms of expectation is we have a low view. We struggle with a low view of God's goodness. And the fact that he hears our prayers and wants to grant those things that are good for our well-being, for our spiritual nourishment, for our growth and grace. And so part of that is, I think, in the Lord's Prayer when we address God as our Father,
00:11:49
Speaker
understanding that He is that good Father that has good gifts for us, I think, is something that many, many believers haven't fully grasped. And I think all of us, and again, I'm including myself here, all of us wrestle with that every single day as we're confronted with whatever circumstances we face in life, really believing that God is good and that He's for us and that He has good gifts to give us.
00:12:17
Speaker
This break is a good chance to tell you more about Adriel's book, Praying with Jesus, Getting to the Heart of the Lord's Prayer. In Praying with Jesus, Adriel Sanchez explores the most famous prayer in history, the Lord's Prayer, and gets to the heart of each thing Jesus told his disciples to pray for. Using the Lord's Prayer as a framework, he unlocks the mystery of prayer, helping readers understand what prayer is, how to navigate the challenges of prayer,
00:12:46
Speaker
and how to form a habit of prayer. Sanchez points the way to how the Lord's Prayer helps us better grasp the essential truth that we're not meant to try to navigate life in our own strength and wisdom. In the book, Adriel considers some of the reasons behind an inconsistent prayer life and helps us cultivate a consistent habit of prayer.
00:13:09
Speaker
The book also guides us into union with Christ that is only possible through the daily practice of praying with Jesus. And each chapter ends with a prayer from the past. So we can pray along with our family in Christ throughout the ages. Our world needs your prayers. You can purchase a copy for yourself or copies for your church or small group when you visit NewGrowthPress.com.
00:13:39
Speaker
Yeah, that's really helpful to me. It reminds me that there have been some moments in my life recently where I think that I have grown a couple steps by thinking a little bit better. We were actually talking about this in our church just recently, thinking a little bit better about some of the nuances between what I think of as God's sovereignty, which of course is a way of talking about his absolute control, and thinking about God's providence in my life.
00:14:08
Speaker
Because on the one hand, sovereignty is obviously he's in control, but it doesn't necessarily mean that that control is just being fueled for my good. But that's what providence, you know, means that he is providentially working in my life. And so I think that's got to be a big part of my, you know, an area that I can grow in in terms of in terms of prayer. Another one is sometimes I feel I just don't feel like praying and it's hard to
00:14:37
Speaker
kind of get up the energy or the interest. And I wonder how you would advise me in that way. Is there something that you have done or tapped into to help you when you aren't feeling like praying? I think this one in particular is one that I hear over and over again and can resonate with as well.
00:15:04
Speaker
How do I approach God when there seems to be no affection? And then the times where I try to pray, I'm distracted, or just can't find the words. So I think that there are strategies, but I would say that the first thing, one of the ways I try to encourage people is by saying,
00:15:27
Speaker
just because you don't feel like praying first, that doesn't mean that you're like totally spiritually malfunctioning. I'm not a Christian or something like that because the reality is we all of us, I think, go through those kinds of seasons. And there is a reason why I think in scripture in the New Testament and in the Old Testament,
00:15:45
Speaker
Prayer is often associated with a kind of discipline. Like in the Old Testament, you had this idea of mourning and evening prayer. In the book of Acts, the disciples are going to the temple or the synagogues at the hour of prayer. Part of that was just saying, look, we have to set apart time to do this because we know how easy it is for prayer, this thing that we're called to, to escape us.
00:16:11
Speaker
And it's sort of like, I mean, when you think of it like that, that's sort of helpful. That's encouraging to me at least because it's like I, you know, like exercise, for example, I like to go to the gym, I like to work out. Rarely do I wake up in the morning and think like, man, I just am so excited about where I want to run right now. But I do it because, you know, over time I see the benefits and I'm encouraged, I'm blessed by it. I know it's a good thing, it's a healthy thing.
00:16:38
Speaker
But we would never really go to the gym like we ought to, or take care of ourselves like we ought to, if we just did it when we felt like it. Usually, a lot of times, for many of us, and I mean, I'm, again, speaking for myself, the holidays come around, and it's been really rough, and January 1st comes, and you're like, I know that I
00:16:57
Speaker
I think it's time for me to think that I've gotten so bad that I need to figure this out. And that's often how we approach prayer, is we wait until things have gotten so bad, or we just have that energy and that excitement about prayer that we're going to engage in it. And so I think a part of maturing in prayer is allowing the grace of the gospel, not our feelings,
00:17:27
Speaker
the grace of the Gospel and God's goodness to be the wind in our sails every single day. Because our feelings, right, like if we only pray when we feel it, then those winds are going to be there and they're going to be gone. But if there's something deeper that we're drawing from, an endless well of God's goodness, and we find it all sorts of places in Scripture, we find it in the Gospel,
00:17:51
Speaker
Well, then there's always a steady breeze. There's always that wind that we need. And so I think it's drawing from that and also not beating yourself up when you don't have those feelings and learning to build that habit or discipline of prayer. It's a gift that God has given to us. I try not to see it in a legalistic manner, but realizing that just like anything, just like so many good things, it requires effort in terms of the cultivation of a healthy spiritual habit
00:18:21
Speaker
And I'm in the fight still. I tease sometimes, it's actually easier to write a book on prayer than it is to actually pray consistently. So if you're doing a good job in prayer, you've already done what you need to do. But that's where we struggle, is with that. So my hope with this, I mean, I was trying to encourage myself, but my hope was also to encourage others in that struggle and
00:18:50
Speaker
to encourage them to lay hold of this gift of prayer that God has given us in His Word. That's the way to think about it. I've heard friends from time to time around topics like prayers or any other thing in the Christian life where we don't feel like it.
00:19:06
Speaker
kind of express that feeling of, you know, I feel like a hypocrite because I'm doing this thing, but I'm kind of going against my feelings. But you know, in reality, actually, it's the most authentic thing I think that we could do is to use your workout analogy. You know, no one would say you don't feel like going to the gym, but you go to the gym. What a hypocrite you are. You're such a hypocritical athlete.
00:19:31
Speaker
And you say, wow, you're really a committed athlete because you go against the grain or against this obstacle. And so I think that's a that's really helpful way to for us to think about it just the way you're just the way you're putting it. Yeah. Well, I think I think for a long time, I also you know, I just thought that prayer was always supposed to be this spontaneous like overflow of your heart. And and if it wasn't that, then it was it was hypocritical. But
00:20:01
Speaker
Again, I think all of us, I think we've experienced this where it's like I would hardly ever pray if that's all it was. And so I think God gives us, again, those resources to use and to take to Him. I can't tell you how many times I've just used the Psalms, for example, when I don't have words and I'm struggling to find those words, I'll go to Scripture and I'll pray God's word.
00:20:28
Speaker
or even the prayers of godly men and women throughout the history of the church. And sometimes that's almost like the jumpstart that you need to get your own prayers going and flowing.
00:20:39
Speaker
Growing up, I said I was raised by a single mom, so we were always driving just beater cars. I remember there was one car we had for a while that was like, not only did you have to jump start it, but you had to push start it. So it was like all this work to actually get the car going. It was like you'd jump it and then you'd have to get your neighbors to come and help you push it before it would... So I remember doing this.
00:21:01
Speaker
Sometimes we need to be like push-started with our prayers. And I think God's Word can be a helpful push-start or using the prayers of others and aligning ourselves with those words. I think even the Lord's Prayer, right?
00:21:16
Speaker
of all the prayers, the one that Jesus gave his disciples, the one that he taught us to pray. It's a low-hanging fruit. It's like, here it is, let me help you. Sometimes it's hard to get the car going. It's cold. You need things to warm up. And that's just the reality of, I think, human nature and where we are. But there are a lot of helpful tools and resources and things that God gives us.
00:21:46
Speaker
to encourage us to get moving. Yeah, what would you say are one or two of the tools that you have found most useful in your own Christian life, or maybe even in your church? Because I did want to ask you if you would share a little more about, I want to hear more about your church, and in particular, the role of prayer in your church.
00:22:07
Speaker
Okay, so in terms of tools, I mean, obviously, like I think really God's Word is so important because there have been many times where it's like, man, I got nothing, I don't even know what to pray or say. I mean, you have the Lord's Prayer, but again, you're just, in terms of my own prayers,
00:22:28
Speaker
And that's been helped by reading scripture, by meditating upon it. I think sometimes scripture gives us the right words or the right questions. Another thing that I found helpful in terms of just actually praying is like a prayer journal, writing down my prayers.
00:22:48
Speaker
just because I am easily distracted and so you try to stop to make time to pray and you're closing your eyes and as soon as you do, it's like I'm thinking about that grocery list or conversation I had yesterday and I lose my train of thought. Again, there are times where I'm like, I can't believe I did that, Lord. I started my prayer halfway through and
00:23:12
Speaker
And somehow I started having a conversation with somebody else, like in my mind, an argument with somebody or something that happened. So just...
00:23:21
Speaker
sometimes just writing my prayers down, having a prayer journal. And one thing that's actually cool about that that I've found as well is I can look back on those. And there are prayers that I, things that I prayed for that I had completely forgotten about. And I can look back on that and say, wow, I didn't even remember praying that. And I don't even know if I was conscious of when the Lord answered that prayer, but God didn't forget about the prayer that I forgot about.
00:23:51
Speaker
And so what's cool about that too is this I think helpful in terms of building that habit and helping with distractions, it also becomes a kind of like a testament to God's faithfulness and a reminder of the fact that the Lord does hear us. And so that's been great.
00:24:16
Speaker
So yeah, I would say, I would say those things. And then I also mentioned in the book, like at the end of every chapter, there is a prayer, I can call it prayers from the past, you know, different church fathers and people that have, that I've really
Resources for Spiritual Practice
00:24:27
Speaker
benefited. I'm kind of a church history nerd and like worship and liturgy nerd. And so, and so some of those prayers also that I've used either as prayers of confession or prayers of thanksgiving or morning prayers or evening prayers, some of those are in the book as well.
00:24:43
Speaker
So there's, I think there's some, you know, apart from what I've written, there's some good resources just there too. Yeah, helpful tools there. And that, and when you mentioned writing out prayers, reminded me of the Valley of Vision, the collection of Puritan prayers that, man, we have
00:25:04
Speaker
We've made really good use of those in our church. Our church is not overwhelmingly liturgical, but we have used the Valley of Vision in a liturgical sense, whether it's a kind of corporate reading together. And that actually was really encouraging to us just to keep rich gospel-centered prayer on the front of our minds and in the context of our worship service. And with that, I wonder what kinds of things. Are there some things like that that you have done corporately as a church?
00:25:33
Speaker
Have it been useful to you? We've definitely used some of those prayers from the Valley of Vision. We have a congregational prayer, a pastoral prayer every Sunday, which is usually done by me or one of the elders. We're essentially just bringing the needs of the congregation, the needs of
00:25:51
Speaker
The world also, right, like we're bringing these things before the Lord. I mean, I think prayer is central to Christian worship, and I think also, and this is something I really try to highlight in the book, like the idea of praying in community.
Role of Prayer in Church Community
00:26:10
Speaker
our prayers, when we pray, even from our prayer closet, when we use the Lord's Prayer, for example, it's all first-person plural. It's bringing to mind the whole community. It's very much, okay, forgive us our debts, our sins, lead us not into temptation. And so, you know, I talked about that just recently.
00:26:36
Speaker
just kind of an interesting experience. I have a family member who's gotten ill in the last few years, really bad Alzheimer's, but who was like just a mighty prayer warrior in our family and would just, just a mighty prayer warrior in our family and always encouraging with prayer. And one of the things that she's basically experienced since getting sick is just the inability to pray.
00:27:04
Speaker
Um, she, she feels like she can't pray, which has been, I mean, obviously devastating because, you know, your heart breaks because you love this person also kind of selfishly like, man, like those prayers. Like I, I think I really needed those prayers. Um, and one, one, just not too long ago, I was, I was out visiting
00:27:27
Speaker
And I got to visit the parish where they go to church, and I was looking in the church bulletin there, and they had not been to the church in over a year. So I went to their church. They hadn't been there in over a year just because of the illness. And in the church bulletin, it was wild. The back of the bulletin's names for prayer, basically like half my family, our names were there in the bulletin.
00:27:51
Speaker
And it just, it was so amazing. It struck me like in God's providence, right? Going back to God's providence, how this person hasn't been to church in over a year. Thank God for, you know, church secretaries who don't update the bulletin. Like they put our names in a long time prior.
00:28:07
Speaker
And God was using his church to pray for us, for the things that they were praying for. And that's how prayer is. We're a community and we pray for each other. It's one of the ways we bear one another's burdens.
00:28:25
Speaker
And so that's why, not just on a Sunday morning, but the church as a body praying, I think when we get to heaven and we're with the Lord, we're going to be blown away at how the prayers of others sustained us in our Christian life and how God used our prayers to work in and sustain others.
00:28:49
Speaker
And even when we feel like we can't pray, or we're not able to pray, how God is still working in and through his church. And so, and so yeah, I would just say like, man, I mean, in terms of our practices as a church, you know, some of the similar things that you, you mentioned, you know, congregational prayer, but
00:29:11
Speaker
even just more broadly realizing that we are this one body, one community of faith, and we hold each other up. Even when we're on our own individually, we're praying, our Father, hallowed be thy name, thy kingdom come, give us, that provide for us, what we need. And so we're bringing the needs of the whole body before the Lord.
00:29:35
Speaker
You know, during my conversation with Adriel Sanchez, it seemed to me that sometimes it feels like there are more reasons not to pray than to pray. Discouraging circumstances that haven't changed, long-standing requests that haven't been given a yes, boring prayer meetings, the list of reasons to give up can make prayer seem more like a duty instead of a delight.
00:29:59
Speaker
So, a couple more helpful resources to share with you. In the short mini-book, Why Should I Pray?, pastor and author Scotty Smith has struggled with prayer too. But he shares how his prayer life was transformed when he learned that prayer was about talking with his Heavenly Father as a dearly loved son.
00:30:19
Speaker
In this mini-book, using personal examples of how he uses scripture to pray, Scotty Smith gives practical, encouraging guidance, how prayer can transform your relationship with God and your approach to life. And then in, I prayed and nothing changed, biblical counselor Stee Casey challenges us to be honest as we talk to God about our struggles in our messed up world. Casey points us to see all that God is doing,
00:30:48
Speaker
even when he seems distant and encourages readers with specific ways we can see God at work in the silence. As always, you can find both the mini book, Why Should I Pray? and the Ask the Christian Counselor series book, I Prayed and Nothing Changed by visiting NewGrowthPress.com. And now back to my conversation with Adriel Sanchez.
00:31:14
Speaker
I'm sure it's been said by many people. I just remember hearing it, I think, from John Piper. He said that God not only ordains the ends, but He also ordains the means. And one of the central means of accomplishing His ends are the prayers of His people. And that was just a statement about prayer that really has stayed with me and has motivated me in some of those times when I didn't feel like praying.
00:31:40
Speaker
You know, it came back to me again and again. I'm curious, have you ever heard a story? I think it's kind of an obscure story about the evangelist and preacher DL Moody going to London and there being a revival in a church in London. Have you heard this?
00:31:58
Speaker
I haven't, but I want to hear it. All right. So here's here's basically the way the story goes is that there was a church in London that was just kind of stagnant and dying. And it was the same old church praying the same old prayers. And then D.L. Moody had traveled to London to preach at various churches and he had been brought to this church to to preach
00:32:24
Speaker
as an evangelist and he was there and I think it's you know in the morning that he was preaching he had kind of a call for response for those who you know felt their need to repent to place their faith in Christ and a number of people started expressing their need or raising their hand I think he had said
00:32:44
Speaker
come back tonight if you're interested raise your hand and come back tonight and there was going to be another opportunity to hear the gospel and a bunch of people raised their hands and the pastor of the church looked at him like I don't really know what's going on our church is not like this you know our church is kind of dead
00:32:59
Speaker
And so he had said for them to come back that night and a bunch of people came back. And then this kind of revival starts. But part of the story, which is the really striking part, is that a woman in the church had gone home to, I think, her sister who was homebound with illness.
Story of Revival Through Prayer
00:33:19
Speaker
And she goes in and she would always go home and her sister would ask her, how was church? And she would say, you know, it was the same old sermons
00:33:26
Speaker
and the same old people praying the same old prayer, something like that. And then this Sunday, she goes home and says, oh, something was different at the church. There was somebody new there, somebody preaching moody, something moody. And the story says that the other woman's face just kind of went white. And she said, don't bring me any food. I have to go pray.
00:33:52
Speaker
And what apparently was going on is this woman had seen an article in the newspaper about D.L. Moody, who of course was in the United States, and she had a sense that she needed to pray for this person, D.L. Moody, to come to their church. And she began praying that he would come to their church. And that is then exactly what happened. And this big,
00:34:18
Speaker
It went on for days or weeks of revival in this church was an amazing thing. I just remember it's kind of an obscure story tucked away in a book somewhere. It's just an amazing story of prayer in that way, serious prayer.
00:34:37
Speaker
You hear these stories, right? Just the power of prayer, how God actually is working in and through the prayers of His people. Stories like that are great because I think they encourage us all to pray. That's part of the problem is we struggle to believe that He's good or we struggle to believe that He's actually able and powerful enough to grant the things that we're praying for.
00:35:03
Speaker
And so you hear stories like that and it's a real faith booster because it's like, no, God actually is able. Too often we have too small of a view of the Lord and what we need. And I think this is a part of, you know, when Jesus teaches us how to pray, I think this is a part of what's being emphasized. It's we're coming before our Father who is in heaven. I mean, He has it all. He's all-powerful. He reigns.
00:35:31
Speaker
And we ought to approach him as such. You know, like Hebrews says, the one who comes to God should believe that he is and that he's the rewarder of those who diligently seek him. Hebrews chapter 11. And I love that man. What a shock and also what a cause for praise that must have been for that woman. Yeah. I'm going to try to find where that story is and I'll send a reference to you. I try to find where it is.
00:35:57
Speaker
I wish you would have given it to me before I wrote the book, man. You can put it in the book. I hate building prayers. I could have told that story. There are other stories like that. I'm sure you have plenty. Yeah. I do have a few in there, but it's, and I think, I mean, it was, I mean, we have our own stories like that too, where it's like, oh, the Lord intervened in this way. That was just like, whoa, okay. I know God was listening. And so it's awesome. So, Adrian, you know, actually I think that this episode is going to come out
00:36:25
Speaker
around the time of the National Day of Prayer, which is May 2nd this year.
National Day of Prayer Discussion
00:36:31
Speaker
And, you know, to be completely honest, I don't know very much about the National Day of Prayer. Like, I probably couldn't have told you if you'd asked me when it was. I couldn't have told you when it was. I just looked up, though, I was trying to learn a little bit more about it. It's really interesting. You know, obviously, it was, I shouldn't say obviously, because it's not obvious, but I just looked up
00:36:52
Speaker
something about the National Day of Prayer, that it was actually an observance designated by the U.S. Congress. And listen to this. I did not know this. The president is required by law to sign a proclamation each year encouraging all Americans to pray on this day. It goes back to the 1950s during the Korean War in a time of the real feeling nationally that we need to pray. I just thought that was really interesting. And the fact that this episode is coming out around that time, it just
00:37:20
Speaker
It gives us an opportunity to think about the importance of prayer in our country right now.
00:37:27
Speaker
Yeah, that's funny, man. But you say that, like, I also did not know all the history with regard to the National Day of Prayer. I think most of us would say, like, we know that our nation needs prayer. Like, we know that we all need prayer. So, I mean, I think it's wonderful. I do think it sort of reminds me of, like, in the Old Testament, you know, when the kings of Israel would be like, we need to have a time of prayer, 2 Chronicles chapter 20, you know, Jehoshaphat saying, we need to pray because we're going through something really difficult right now.
00:37:56
Speaker
So I think I'm all for encouragements to pray. And I think we need prayer. I think our churches need prayer. I think where we live, our communities, and the country that we're in, we can all use prayer. And I think in part, when Jesus taught us to pray, your kingdom come.
00:38:18
Speaker
I don't think that that kingdom comes apart from having an impact on us individually and the broader world around us. Because the kingdom of God is the new creation. It's the manifestation of God's spirit through the proclamation of the gospel. It's people experiencing the forgiveness of their sins and being made new creations in Jesus Christ like Paul says in 2 Corinthians 5, 17.
00:38:46
Speaker
And so as that as that happens, this is what we're praying for. God, let that new creation break in in my own life, you know, like help me help me to grow. May your kingdom advance in my own heart, those areas in my own heart that are still in rebellion. God, let your kingdom take control, but not just in my own heart, but in in my community, where there is brokenness, where there is pain, where there is hurt.
00:39:16
Speaker
God, we want to see your kingdom and your gospel advance. And that's not just true for our communities locally, but certainly, it's like what Paul told Timothy, pray for all people, for kings and all who are in authority, that the church might experience peace, but also because God desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.
00:39:38
Speaker
And so I think any encouragement for the people of God to be praying is a good thing. And we ought to be praying, as Jesus taught us to pray, that the kingdom would advance. We ought to be praying for our governing authorities, that the Word of God would be at work in their lives as well, that they would know Jesus and know him better.
00:40:00
Speaker
and honor Him in how they govern, how they rule. Those are all things that we're encouraged to pray for in Scripture, and I think it just shows that God has a concern, not just for the spirit, the soul, for me as an individual, but for the world around me. What Jesus came to do is bring about the new creation, and we believe that one day as Christians,
00:40:24
Speaker
We're going to live in a glorified world that the very creation is going to exhibit the glory of God in this renewed sense. So the world around us is the object of God's love and the work of the Lord.
00:40:44
Speaker
And so, so yeah, so I'm hopefully this is, you know, people are listening to this, you know, in light of the National Day of Prayer, and they're thinking, okay, yeah, those are some things that I can be praying for, or just, you know, again, as we think about what, what does it mean to pray that I kingdom come. And that's some of what I tried to do in the book is just sort of like explain each of those petitions, because there's so much beneath the surface of each petition.
00:41:07
Speaker
and wanting to understand that so that we pray accordingly. And as we pray, we're saying, okay, this is what I'm seeking you for, God. So, Adriel, one of the things that I notice in my Christian life is more and more I'm finding connections that I had previously missed between the gospel and my daily life as a Christian. And I'm sure that one of those is prayer. And I'm trying to better connect my understanding of the gospel as an announcement of good news
00:41:36
Speaker
to my practice of prayer. And I know that you have done that and you have worked through that in your book and in your life. And I'm just curious what that connection is like for you now and what helped you make some strides forward to strengthen your prayer life by focusing on the gospel.
Understanding God's Goodness Through Prayer
00:41:54
Speaker
So I mean, I think part of it goes back to if we don't believe that God is good, we're going to have a really hard time approaching him.
00:42:04
Speaker
Um, and so like, I think of, I think of the guy in the parable that Jesus told, you know, um, who, who, who buried his, his, his talent. And, you know, the master comes to him and he says, you know, I, I knew you to be a, a hard man, you know, a harsh man, um, reaping where you didn't sow and gathering where you didn't scatter any seed. And yeah. And so I buried this talent that you gave me. Um, well, the reality is is that guy just didn't know, didn't know the master.
00:42:32
Speaker
Because the Master is not a harsh man who's like Pharaoh, who says like, hey, you go and build me these pyramids, but I'm not going to give you the material that you need to do that. God is abundantly generous. He's that good Father. And the gospel, I think, is central for understanding that. If we don't understand the forgiveness of our sins, if we don't understand just the riches of God's mercy to us in Christ,
00:43:00
Speaker
then we're always going to question the goodness of God. And if we're always questioning the goodness of God, we're not going to have any confidence when we come to Him in prayer. And one of the things that struck me studying the Lord's Prayer is the whole prayer, the very first few words of the prayer, presuppose the gospel. Because when we go to God and we say, our Father,
00:43:24
Speaker
We're saying something about our relationship to God that's special, that's unique. We're saying, I'm a child of God. And for us as Christians, we know that that sonship came
00:43:37
Speaker
through adoption. The reason I can call God Father by grace is because Jesus, the eternal Son of God, the Son of the Father by nature, by the grace of the Holy Spirit, has adopted me into the family so that every single time I say, our Father, I'm to be reminded of the fact that I'm, and I've been brought into this family through the work of Christ.
00:44:04
Speaker
So you're confronted with the gospel in one sense, just at the very beginning of the Lord's Prayer. And I think a lot of people don't realize that. What are the implications of those words, saying to God, our Father, that I can approach God that way?
00:44:22
Speaker
I think it's beautiful that that is what the Lord wants to be on the forefront of our minds as we come before Him. It's His fatherly goodness. It's the fact that He's all-powerful, that He does hear our prayers, and that He's able to answer them and willing to answer them as we pray in line with His will.
00:44:48
Speaker
And nothing exhibits the goodness of God and the love of God as much as the gospel does. And so the more we grasp that, the more I think we really, for ourselves, experience that love in our own lives, the more we're enabled to come before God with confidence, knowing that He loves us and that He hears our prayers. That's the good word that we need. And Adriel, as our time comes to an end,
00:45:17
Speaker
Man, I want to sincerely say that I am encouraged by our conversation and really appreciate that we've had it. You know, obviously I had not met you till today and I feel like we get along really well and I enjoy talking to you. It's been great. If you're ever in San Diego, shoot me an email, man. I'd love to show you around. Man, I want to come to San Diego. You should. It's great. I love it. Yeah. Cool.
00:45:44
Speaker
Thank you.
00:46:02
Speaker
And if you'd like to learn more about past seasons of our podcast, you can visit newgrowthpress.com forward slash podcast. Our next episode will appear next week, wherever you get your podcasts.