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Paul Willan, “The Accidental Runner”.
455 Plays9 months ago
In 2007, Paul Willan was a 26 year old overweight smoker when his boss encouraged him to join him in a daily lunchtime walk, which soon progressed into running. Once gasping for air at every lamppost, Paul is now a dedicated ultra runner, who trains 6 mornings a week.
Listen to hear how Paul:
- Overcame the initial challenges of going from walking to running.
- The moment when running stopped being a weight loss tool and started being an enjoyable hobby to him.
- Overtraining - recognising it, and coming back from it.
- Training for ultra marathons.
- Early morning running and motivation.
Instagram: @willanruns81
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Transcript
Paul's Introduction and Early Days
00:00:01
Speaker
Hi, Paul. Thank you so much for joining us on the UK Run Chat podcast. It's really good to have you on. Would you like to introduce yourself a little bit? Tell our listeners a little bit about yourself. My name's Paul. I'm 42 from Bolton and I'm an avid runner and love running. Got a daughter and a wife.
00:00:26
Speaker
Yeah. So you didn't, you didn't used to be a runner though, did you? How did that all start then? Tell us a bit about your story. Well, I was never, I was never a runner or anything active as a, as a child. Um, quite unfit to be honest. Um, and it was only until around about 2006, 2007.
The Birth of a Walking Club
00:00:50
Speaker
Um, it was by chance really one of me, uh, coworkers,
00:00:55
Speaker
just came up to me one day and said, do you fancy going for a walk? So yeah, I said, um, we went maybe one, one and a half miles, something like that, just to say how long it would take us. And we, we did that daily. And then he then, um, he then ducked out because he, he got the management position. One of my other colleagues, um, two of my other colleagues actually went and, uh,
00:01:25
Speaker
asked if they could join. So we kind of started a little bit of a walking club at dinner.
Transition to Running
00:01:32
Speaker
So every dinnertime, we went out and built it up to four miles or just over four miles in the hour. And that's a fair old pace that walking, isn't it? Yeah, so yeah, it was it wasn't it wasn't hanging about and we were
00:01:53
Speaker
we were pushing it and my feet were sore and everything else was sore because I wasn't used to doing that kind of exercise to be honest. And at that time I could see the weight was coming off. So I thought we kind of, we got to a point where we couldn't do any more in the hour. So
00:02:22
Speaker
We kind of said to ourselves, well, what do we do now? What's next? How do we fit more in? So one of the guys turned around and said, well, why don't we try running? One of them was already, he'd already had experience at running. He'd done it as a kid and he was fairly experienced in it, but he hadn't done it for a while. And me being me, being a little bit
00:02:51
Speaker
overconfident in a way thinking I can walk four and a half, four miles, four and a half miles in the hour. How difficult is it to run a mile? So the next day we got our running kiln and we set out and I was surprised. Couldn't even run to the next lamppost. I was
00:03:19
Speaker
almost throwing up, it was that much of a shock. And we kind of stuck at it, just did lamp post to lamp post, walked when we needed to. And one of the other guys, because they were more experienced, they were ahead of me. And I always remember thinking, why am I doing this? I'm not enjoying this at the moment.
00:03:49
Speaker
Why am I doing it? I felt like I was almost killing myself. I was determined to do it and determined to not leave them or sort of duck out of it.
Competitions and Lifestyle Changes
00:04:04
Speaker
And then it was probably about, I'd say six months-ish, we decided to have a bit of a competition.
00:04:19
Speaker
So the guys with my experience, they do the longer route and we do the shorter route. How far were you running at that point? I'd probably say we've got up to two and a half miles.
00:04:38
Speaker
Yeah, something like that. So was that without stopping them? Because going from throwing up between lampposts to running two and a half miles. What what was kind of the how did that work? How did you build up to that? It was it was run walking. Yeah. And we kind of built it up. We'd run
00:05:02
Speaker
or try and run to the next lamppost and then we'd extend it to two lampposts and we'd build it up from there and then the guy who came up with the competition or the challenge, should we say, he just decided like, right, we'll
00:05:31
Speaker
We'll do this competition. I do the shorter read, which was, I'd say, again, about two and a half miles. They do about three miles. And something just clicked. And I'm not sure what it was, whether it was just because of the mental attitude, because it was never a competition. Yeah, you had a bit of motivation there, didn't you? Yeah. I'd also got some
00:06:01
Speaker
better trainers. Okay. Which does help. And we set off. And I was at the back. And I can't really describe it. It was, it was almost like some, some switch had been sort of flicked. And I found myself overtaking a couple of the people. Yeah.
00:06:30
Speaker
And it was then, it kind of thought to myself, well, actually, I can't do this, because I'd spent so long previously thinking, I can't do this, but I'm not giving up. Yeah. And it was the, it was the people ahead of me that were motivating me to carry on. Right. I'm not one for giving up. And
00:07:00
Speaker
I was ahead of them or ahead of a couple of people. And they actually, I came and when we finished the race, I'd actually finished before everyone else. I know they were doing a longer, a longer route, but it felt like I'd, I'd won that particular competition. So from there, I got the bug then.
00:07:25
Speaker
Okay, so yeah, so that's, yeah, that's interesting, actually, that competition has inspired that. Yeah, yeah, it was. At first, it was more, it was more to do with the weight loss. I could see, I could see the weight coming off. I was, I was around about 18 stone when I started. And I was a smoker. So the, the healthy you're eating started. Yeah.
00:07:55
Speaker
the smoking stopped. And yeah, it was that, like I said, it became, at first it was about the weight loss, but then it just became about the running. I started to enjoy it then. It was more of a bug then. Yeah. That's when it really clicks, I think, isn't it? Rather than, cause I started running initially for weight loss actually. And I didn't really enjoy it funnily enough when I was running to kind of lose
00:08:23
Speaker
weight and inches, it was kind of a chore, but it's, I think when you actually, it clicks and you think, I'm enjoying this, you kind of run for a different reason, don't you?
Making Running a Habit
00:08:35
Speaker
Yeah, I think that's, I always advise people when they ask me, make sure you enjoy it. Start off really slow, really short distances, but make sure you enjoy it and
00:08:54
Speaker
make it into a habit. And because we were going out every lunchtime, it became a habit as well. Yeah. And I found going out with two of the other guys made it easier because I'd sometimes be sat at my desk thinking, I don't really want to go out today. And then
00:09:20
Speaker
the guy next to me to term in as a, are we still up for it at lunch? And it'd be like, yeah, all right, go on. Yeah, that accountability must have been so important at the start. Yeah, yeah, it was. It's definitely, definitely a motivator to, to keep you going. Yeah. And how were you physically, when you started, like in terms of, did you have any kind of typical beginner injuries or anything, or was everything
00:09:48
Speaker
Did everything run smoothly there? On the whole, it went pretty smoothly. I think I must be quite robust in terms of my muscles and the way I'm built. I got the odd niggles, my knees were aching a little bit, primarily because I was overweight. But on the whole, I think I was quite looking
00:10:18
Speaker
escaping the typical beginner's injuries, really. I got a few shin splints and things like that, but they seem to pass fairly quickly. I just rested. Yeah, that was what I was kind of thinking about, because that is a typical beginner injury, isn't it, shin splints? It does hamper a lot of people and it does put them off. But I guess maybe because you started, you were doing walking for quite a while. I guess that does build you up as well, doesn't it?
00:10:46
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. We built up the, some of the muscle endurance from, from, from the walking, but running's totally different as I found out.
Lessons from Races
00:10:59
Speaker
Yeah. So, okay. So you've got the bug from having competed against some of your fellow runners. So what's next? You know, where do you go from there? We started doing longer distances during the lunch. Um,
00:11:17
Speaker
I then, I think we built it up to about five miles, five mile route in the lunch hour. And then I started to look at racing and competitions. So my first competition, or event I should say, was 2008 at 10K in Birkenhead. I did it for cancer research.
00:11:47
Speaker
And I totally got the pacing wrong, set out way too fast. And it was a two lap course. And I don't normally like laps courses because after the first lap, you know what's coming next. You do. Yeah. And it became a psychological battle then. But again, I was determined I wasn't going to not finish. So
00:12:15
Speaker
I ended up doing that in 56.15, which I was over the moon with. Yeah. Because I'd built it up to, I think I've got about an hour in training, maybe a little bit more for 10K. But yeah, I was over the moon with that one. And then it was just, again, I got the bug even more then.
00:12:43
Speaker
and I just started to enter as many races as I possibly could. Mainly 10Ks for the first couple of years. I think 10K is quite a hard distance to get right, isn't it? Yeah, it is. It's one of them where it's easier to set out too fast if you're not careful.
00:13:13
Speaker
Yeah. Have you got that sus now? Were you, do you know what you're doing? We've pretty much got that nailed down. I seem to over the years, my body's seem to have got into a pacing. It kind of knows what pace I need to set out at to actually achieve the distance.
00:13:40
Speaker
Yeah, I think that does come with a bit of experience, doesn't it? You do have to learn what feels hard and what feels impossible. And it's a fine balance sometimes. It is, definitely, definitely.
Training for Ultra Marathon
00:13:53
Speaker
Yeah, so you're doing some quite longer distance, aren't you now? So talk to us a bit about that. What are you?
00:14:02
Speaker
Well, at the moment, typical morning, we're doing about eight, nine miles in the morning. I've done a three, 32 mile ultra marathons, fairly flat ones. I'm yet to go up on the hills and up on the fells with the
00:14:30
Speaker
with the altars. We thought we'd start off fairly easy and ease ourselves into the ultra distances. And I've got a 50 miler coming up. OK, so that's the Manchester Liverpool one, isn't it?
00:14:47
Speaker
It is. Yeah. So that's a nice flat one, I think, isn't it? Yeah, I've not done that one, but yeah, it's about it. It's kind of advertised as a beginner's marathon, ultra marathon. So it's nice and flat. It starts off at Salford. Yeah. And it follows the West Pennine Trail, I think it is.
00:15:14
Speaker
or the Trans Pennine Trail. Yeah, the Trans Pennine, isn't it? Yeah. Yeah. And some of the ship canal. Yeah. So it's all fairway. It's off road, but it's hard ground. Yeah. So how, what's your training routine for that then? What kind of training are you doing for it? When is it, when is it happening? Cause it's normally Easter, isn't it? Yeah. It's good Friday. Yeah. 29th of March. So at the moment, uh,
00:15:44
Speaker
Training at the moment is we're building up the base, getting that pretty even. We're sort of building that up as well, maintaining it. And we're adding in back-to-back longer runs. Yeah. So what do they look like? What kind of distances are you doing on those? Yesterday, actually, I did a 20-miler. Yeah.
00:16:14
Speaker
And then what I'm looking at doing is on a Friday, doing a 13, 14 mile on a Friday, and then on the Saturday, maybe doing a 15 mile and upwards. Yeah, okay. So it's getting used to running on tired legs and just getting the muscular endurance. Yeah.
00:16:43
Speaker
So you're finding there's much difference between training for the 50K as opposed to the 50 miler? Do you mean anything different? To be honest, I'm not doing anything different, really. I might add more back-to-back longer runs in. For the 32 mile, the longest I did was a marathon. 26 mile was the longest I did. I'm not sure.
00:17:14
Speaker
I'm going to get up to a 30 mile run for the 50 mile race or event, but we'll see how it goes. Yeah, it's fitting it in, isn't it, with ultra training? It's how to actually get all those miles on your legs and the time on your feet. I mean, how do you fit it into your week then? You run most mornings, don't you?
00:17:38
Speaker
Yeah, I'm up at four. I'm out for 20 to five in the morning, do about an hour 20 running. And then it's back home and off to work. So that's why I fit it into my routine. I've switched from evening running to morning running. And that was a task in itself.
00:18:05
Speaker
Yeah, but I'm not a morning person, so I applaud you. Anybody who gets up early in the morning. Yeah, super human. I was never a morning person, really. I'd probably say for months and months as I was thinking to myself, I really fancy getting up in the morning and actually running, because for me it was the perfect time because
00:18:34
Speaker
What I was finding in the evening, there'd be too many excuses, problems cropping up, life gets in the way in the evening. It does. And the way of thinking was in the morning, especially that early in the morning, nobody else is up. Nobody knows I've been out and it doesn't affect family time. But it never happened.
00:19:03
Speaker
I'd always set me alarm and then I'd always switch it off and turn over and go back to sleep. It wasn't, it wasn't until 2020 we got a new dog. Right. And he was a, he was a greyhound. He was an ex racer. Yeah. He'd never been in a,
00:19:30
Speaker
in a home as a pet before. So he was a stickler for his routine and he was up at four o'clock howling. Oh gosh, right, okay. So I'd gone from wanting to get up at four o'clock in the morning and never being able to. I'd gone from that to being forced to get up. Yeah. And I think it was a psychological thing because I was being forced to get up. I was
00:20:00
Speaker
kind of resisting it in a way. But that got me into the routine. I'd get up, take a minute for a walk, and then I'd be sat down then for the best part of three hours thinking I might as well do something. So I decided to go out for a run in the morning instead of the evening. And it seemed to be working
00:20:30
Speaker
quite well, to be honest. And I kept seeing this, I kept seeing this other runner run past me and we'd say morning and we'd acknowledge each other. And it wasn't until I saw him with one of my other friends who I follow on Strava. And it was one Saturday I saw him, I saw him run past with Emma and
00:21:00
Speaker
I then started following him because I've always wondered who he was. I'd always seen him and he was quite, sort of piqued my interest because he was always out. So I started following him and it turns out he's on a running streak. He's been running every day. Yeah, he's been running every day for four years. He messaged me on Strava.
00:21:33
Speaker
and for ages, for months, so I kind of resisted meeting up because he asked if he wanted to, wanted to meet up and I'm thinking to himself, how can we meet up?
Challenges and Consistency
00:21:44
Speaker
Because he's not got my number and I didn't want to put my number on Strava for everyone to see. Anyway, fast forward about a couple of months and I thought, right, okay, let's, let's do it. So,
00:22:01
Speaker
I messaged him, give him a number, we arranged to meet up and we've been running together ever since. Oh wow, that's brilliant. So 2021, we started running together in the November. And to be honest, he was the one who made me a lot more consistent than what I am now than what I was before, sorry. Yeah.
00:22:31
Speaker
Because I was meeting up with somebody, it was giving me that motivation to get up and get out. He was slightly faster than me. So that, as well, that gave me the motivation to keep up with him. Yeah, we know you like that competitive element, yes. Yeah, yeah. We started out maybe going out two or three times a week and then
00:23:00
Speaker
it kind of naturally just progressed to three times a week, four times a week, five times a week. And now we're running five days a week, weekdays together in the morning. And we kind of do our own thing at the weekends. So I'm running six days a week now. Yeah, that's great to have somebody
00:23:29
Speaker
that you can kind of count on to be there, especially at that time of the morning. That's brilliant. Yeah. What a find. Yeah. It's just weird. It seems to be both times when I first started running and when I got a lot more consistent seemed to kind of almost happened by chance. It's kind of, it's amazing how it seems to work out that way. Yeah. Yeah. Cause you have had quite a long break from running in between, haven't you?
00:23:59
Speaker
Yeah. How did that kind of happen and how do you get back into it after that? 2012, I found myself falling out of love with it. Yeah. And I think it was mainly because I was, prior to that, I was getting really into it but I was PB chasing every single run.
00:24:29
Speaker
So every single run has to be faster than the last run. And that was leading to over-training. I wasn't enjoying it. I was pushing myself too hard because I was thinking to myself, to be a faster runner, you've got to run fast. And I wasn't giving myself enough time to recover.
00:24:56
Speaker
And like I said, I was over training really. And I think it was my body's way of just saying, you need a rest. But then a few months turned into, six months turned into a year. And then before you know it, I've gained all my weight again. Right. And it's four years down the line. And at that,
00:25:23
Speaker
that point I kind of thought I wouldn't run again because I'd given away all my running gear and that. Oh wow, so you completely kind of cut yourself off from it then. Yeah. Yeah. It was like, I've had enough. Yeah. And I gave everything away and I thought I'd never run again. And then me, my cousin,
00:25:49
Speaker
messes me and he said I've moved back to Bolton do you fancy meeting up for a run or you know whatever a drink or whatever so I said yeah I says quite fancy a run to be honest so we met up and just went for a for a run round one of the local lakes and he mentioned
00:26:19
Speaker
that he was, he'd been roped into doing the Great North Run. This was 2016. And I thought to myself, I quite fancy that. So on the spur of the moment, I got myself a charity place for the Great North Run.
Competitive Running and Future Plans
00:26:43
Speaker
So then that was the motivation. How far ahead was this happening?
00:26:50
Speaker
Was it a long way off or? No, it was in the same year. Yeah. I would say. We'd met up, I think it was round about February, March time. And the Great North Run was in September. Yeah. So I had. I had a few months to train, but not as long as as I would have liked.
00:27:17
Speaker
And like I say, it was just like a spare of the moment. Oh yeah, fancy, fancy doing that. So that's where the motivation came to get back into the running. I did the great and off run in about three hours, which I was disappointed with in a way. Cause I kept thinking back to where I was before.
00:27:43
Speaker
Yeah, it's easy to compare yourself, isn't it? Yeah, I was faster than this last time. Why can't I do it again? Not facturing that I've lost a lot of the fitness and I'd gained a lot of the weight back on. And it just took off from there again. My cousin decided he was going to become a member.
00:28:14
Speaker
So we'd signed up for the three years of the Great North Run. So we decided we'd do it together for the next three years. So I got charity places for the following year. I think I did that in two and a half hours, I think I did it then.
00:28:44
Speaker
Um, so I could see the improvement and again, spurred me on a bit more. Um, 20, I think it was 2018. I didn't find myself fit enough. I kind of, I kind of slumped a little bit with me running in 2018. Yeah. Um, so we didn't do it together in 2018. Um, obviously 20.
00:29:14
Speaker
2019, 2020, Covid hit. It did, yeah. So there was, there was no great Northland then. But then 21, 22, 23, did it subsequent years. And I think on 2023, sorry, no, 2022, I got 146.
00:29:44
Speaker
Oh, well done. So, yeah, I was always really tough with that. Yeah, really pleased. It's the fastest ever half marathon. Yeah, that's brilliant. Quite a tough one. I've done it, I've done it three times, but not for a long, long time. And I just always remember that there's like a hill kind of 10 miles in. It just seems to go up and up and up and up. I remember every time just cursing it. Yeah, it is. It is quite, it is quite heavy. But the
00:30:12
Speaker
the gradual hills, the not short and sharp, the one for quite a long time. And you can see it all in the distance as well. So I think that adds to the psychological aspect of it, because you know how far you've got to go. Yeah. It's obviously a very special event for you. Is it one you're going to keep doing?
00:30:39
Speaker
I've decided this year I'll have a break from it, try something new, because I've done it six times now. Yeah, that's a lot. Yeah, I'd signed up myself for the three-year membership. So I'd done that for three years. Previous to that, it was just either the ballot or charity places. But I decided this year I'll try
00:31:08
Speaker
try something different. I've not decided exactly what yet, but I'm sure I'll find something. Yeah. Well, yeah. You've obviously got your big race to train for. Yeah. Yeah. I'm concentrating on that first. Yeah. Yeah. And then see where it takes me. But I'm trying to get as many of the club races as I can in as well for Bernden, because I run for Bernden Roadrunners.
00:31:35
Speaker
Oh, okay. Yeah. But yeah, big club. Yeah. Lots of events. Yeah. So I'm trying to, I'm trying to get as many of the club championship races as I can. I didn't manage it this year. So I think, sorry, I didn't manage it last year. This year is going to be my year. I'm hoping. Yeah. So have you been doing like cross country and things with the club? You're a cross country runner or are you more on the road? I'm more road, if I'm totally honest.
00:32:05
Speaker
Yeah, I did. When I first joined 2020, yeah, 2021, I joined at the end of 2021. So 2022, I did the cross country and I didn't find it for me. To be honest, I prefer the road and staying clean.
00:32:34
Speaker
Although I think the past weekend's cross-country was it was very, the ground was very hard and frozen. Yeah. So disappointing lack of mud that you might have been all right this weekend. Yeah. Yeah. But no, I prefer the, I prefer the road. Minis might tell you different ways to run in life, but I prefer, I prefer running on the road. So have you got your eye on any kind of other ultras after this next one? You mentioned you've done the flat ones, so you're kind of looking at any hillier ones.
00:33:04
Speaker
Yeah, I quite fancy some more of the GB Ultra ones, maybe some of more of the the hilly ones. I've not decided quite yet which ones I want to do, but I fancy at some point trying the Grand Slam.
00:33:25
Speaker
Okay, which is what, just explain what that is. I think it's four or five of the 50-mile altars. I think they do one for the 50 and one for the 100. Wow. I'm not 100% on that. Yeah. But yeah, it's doing, I think it's five in the year. I don't think I'm quite up to that level yet, but it's something to aim for. Yeah. I mean, you certainly got that consistency, haven't you now?
00:33:54
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. And it's good that it's it's become a routine. Yeah. Yeah. So that's helps to keep the keep the motivation and the momentum going. Yeah. And hopefully you can kind of now you recognize those signs of overtraining as well. You can kind of keep that. You can keep an eye on that, can't you? Because you know what to what to look out for. Do you find yourself needing to plan in rest days now then to avoid that?
00:34:23
Speaker
Yeah, I like to have at least one day off a week, which tends to be either a Saturday or a Sunday, depending on what I'm doing. If I'm racing on the Sunday, I'll have the Saturday off. If not, I'll run the Saturday and have Sunday off. And I find that helps the body to recover, but it also helps mentally as well. It's kind of like a reset button because as much as I like running,
00:34:52
Speaker
I do like on a Saturday or a Sunday, just being able to get up in the morning and make a drink and just sit down and chill. Yeah, yeah, it's nice just to have a bit of a rest sometimes, isn't it? Yeah, yeah. Sometimes I'm itching to go out, but I kind of rein it in a little bit and it enables me then to be motivated on the Monday to
00:35:22
Speaker
to get out. Yeah. Yeah. I guess there's always a dog knee talking. Yeah. Yeah. Are you ever tempted to run with the dog or? No, to be honest, we've not got him anymore. No, I haven't yet. No, no, we it didn't work out for us. So we unfortunately we have to we have to give him back unfortunately. Yeah. Yeah. He wasn't taken too kindly to my daughter.
00:35:51
Speaker
Oh, I see. Yeah. Yeah, it wasn't. It wasn't working out. So we've not got, we've not got a dog anymore. Yeah. But now you're a morning runner. Thanks to him. So yeah, yes. Thanks to him and Alex. Yeah. Yeah, that's brilliant. So just to finish touch, when we first messaged you, you mentioned that you've done the Leeds Liverpool Canal, haven't you? Not as a kind of a one
00:36:20
Speaker
in one distance, but you've done it over a few weekends, haven't you? I mean, even that's quite a, quite a fantasy, isn't it? We did that in 2010. Yeah. And it was one of my other cousins, David. He used to come over ever so often and we'd go for a run. He hadn't ran for a while and he used to run when he was younger.
00:36:49
Speaker
And he used to come over every so often and we'd go out for a run. And one day he just said, I fancy doing some challenge. And he came up with this Leeds Liverpool Canal. And it was 127 miles in total. Yeah. And he decided he'd like to do it over five
00:37:19
Speaker
consecutive weekends. So you got to work organizing it all. And I was really up for it because at that time I was really into it, into me running. And we started off on the 1st of April 2010. And we split it up.
00:37:48
Speaker
into as near as we could marathon distances. And his wife was the support in the car. So we worked it out wherever we stopped would be on like an access road. So it was easier to get to. So we did that for five consecutive weekends.
00:38:16
Speaker
and sort of starting where we left off the previous week. And it was really enjoyable, we really enjoyed it, spending time together and doing what we both loved. Yeah, that sounds brilliant, yeah. Yeah, it was really good, yeah. Yeah, you have attempted to do the whole thing in one go. I am. Yeah. I am, maybe not yet. I've cycled it in one go.
00:38:46
Speaker
Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. That took about 16, 16 hours. Yeah. Um, but yeah, I would, I would like to run it in one go. Um, I'm nowhere near that kind of level yet, but it's again, it's something to, something to aim for. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. My daughter's been, she, cause we, we live right near, uh, the canal. She's been, she, she would like to cycle the whole thing. She's so far done.
00:39:14
Speaker
She did Liverpool to Burska in one go. Yeah. So, yeah, she's doing all right. Yeah. So we're getting there, but I think we're, yeah, we're going to do little bits with her until she feels confident enough to tackle the whole thing in maybe a weekend we were thinking. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Build it up. Build it up slowly. Yeah, definitely. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, well, it's been absolutely lovely chatting to you, Paul. Thanks so much for coming on. No problem. Thank you for having me.
00:39:43
Speaker
Yeah, so are you on social media anywhere where our listeners can follow you and see what you're up to? Yeah, I'm on Instagram and Strava. So I'm on Strava is Will & Runs 81. Sorry, Instagram is Will & Runs 81. And Strava is Paul Willen, but the A is an act symbol. Oh, OK, yeah. Yeah.
00:40:12
Speaker
the links on the Instagram as well. Yeah, okay. Yeah, we'll pop the links in our show notes to the podcast as well. Yeah, so wish you all the very best with your upcoming Ultra on Manchester to Liverpool. Thank you very much. Yeah, and all the very best. Thank you.