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#6 Tommy Thorn - Kitchen, family and maintaining creativity.
78 Plays4 months ago
On todays episode, we get to talk to my good friend and fellow competitor on MasterChef, Tommy Thorn. Tommy talks to us about how he comes up with his dishes, how he juggles being a father, and running his own restaurant at the same time. He explains to us how he draws inspiration for his menus, and what it was like for him going to The Alchemist with MasterChef the professionals.
Please Enjoy, Tommy Thorn!
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Transcript
Introduction of Tommy Thorne
00:00:00
Speaker
Welcome, welcome back to the Check On podcast. And on today's check, we have a chef that you all know and love. Tommy Thorne was a master chef refreshanals finalist in 2023. He was the head chef at the Bristol restaurant, the Ethicurian, and is now chef patron of Puro in Cleveland.
Challenges of Juggling Roles
00:00:18
Speaker
Tommy shares with us what it was like trying to juggle being a dad, a head chef, and also competing in a cutthroat cooking competition. So please enjoy Tommy Thorne.
00:00:35
Speaker
Hey Summer, are you alright? Hello, I'm well, thank you. How are we done you doing? You alright? Yeah, good, good. What
Progress and Challenges of Puro
00:00:40
Speaker
are you up to? You having a day off? I said, treat myself. Nice children today. Then I drag you in and make you come do this recording. Oh, it's a pleasure. Don't be silly.
00:00:49
Speaker
Maybe, maybe, let me know at the end and see what you think. Yeah, I don't know if I got myself into so... Oh yeah, I mean, it'll be alright, just be a chitchat. How's the restaurant going? Yeah, it's going really well actually, keeping busy, making good progress, getting some great reviews, obviously it comes with its challenges, so we're sort of learning every day, developing as much as we can and um just, yeah, keep moving forward really, that's kind of the goal that we're all taking on board.
00:01:19
Speaker
I can imagine it's really, really bloody busy though, like having your name above the door and being chef patron as well. And kind of having a a young team where you have to grow together. It must be full of challenges, but good ones, but still. It is. Yeah, it definitely is. Like there is a lot of challenges of it. The pressure is definitely there as well.
Continuous Learning and Inspiration
00:01:41
Speaker
kind of felt like it was chucked in the you know the lines down a bit and sort of like right what's going on where are we how can we do this and we've all sort of taken on the same philosophy which is great so lucky to be we have a young young talented team who are hungry to just grow and that's what i love about it you know because um ah they're just learning every day and i'm learning with them so ah i think that's the most rewarding part of it all really um you know very open to changing things. How can we make our lives easier but you know smarter? How can we make this dish better? So we're all asking the same questions all the time and just growing and we want to you know provide the best food and service we possibly can so as a team that's what we're aiming to do.
00:02:24
Speaker
I think it's one of those things we were only just talking about it the other day, me and Vincent, that once you become a head chef, you're almost responsible for your own learning. Like when you're a Sioux, you've got someone above you or a chef to party. There's always someone above you who's teaching you new things and exposing you to new recipes and techniques. But then when you're a head chef, you've kind of got everybody looking at you. Okay. You're the one who's supposed to know. You're the one who's supposed to teach me and you kind of look at it and you're like, yeah, but I don't know everything. And who's teaching me now? When did I get to learn?
00:02:52
Speaker
That's so true, yeah. It's funny actually, like you say, as you're going through your training, you always say, oh, I'm not sure I'll do that. Chef, how do I do that? you know And the chef will give you an answer, hopefully. And and now it's like, everyone's coming to me and I'm i'm sort of looking around like, oh, wait, it's all on the one who's got to provide the answers and the lessons. And you know again, that's part of the learning. So like you say, you know you you don't know everything, but you can give as much advice and knowledge that you can.
00:03:21
Speaker
And, um, yeah, just keep growing really. So it's just part of the game, isn't it? I suppose it is a game for sure. How do you, how do you keep like pushing yourself? Like me, I, I read cookbooks and, you know, very, very rarely, but try to go out for dinner to different places, not necessarily fine dining, but just something that maybe I haven't tried before. Um, a little bit of Instagram, you know, I hate admitting that, but it is a little bit of Instagram as well. That's the new platform where people share what they're doing. yeah How do you get some new like reinvigorated and
Influence of The Ethicurian
00:03:55
Speaker
new ideas? That's a good question. yeah I read a lot of books, watched a lot of things on telly. I spend a lot of my free time thinking about food. To be honest, for me, I think a lot of it is what's near me, what's the season? It's constantly evolving, constantly changing, just walking around, um just thinking, to be honest. like
00:04:17
Speaker
The season's a big one. What's at its best right now? see that Right now, strawberries are coming out, cherries are coming out. We're entering like autumn now, which is exciting. That game's starting to kick in, so okay, you know game. I like to typically take an approach with a new dish of like a bit of a classic sort of combination, but then just sort of put it on its back a little bit. and Yeah, I don't know, just think a little bit. I don't want to follow other people because I think a lot of people do do that and I want to be excited by the food that I'm putting together and I just talk to my boys as well, you know, we'll sit down with a book and you know, oh, venison and blackberries are classic, right? How can we do that but with something a bit more exciting, you know, maybe get some Asian touches in there and just kind of like wacky thoughts to be honest is where a lot of our food comes from.
00:05:06
Speaker
We'll try it. Does it work? Does it need? So that's a big part of it. But yeah, listening to other chefs, you know, how they think about food. And, you know, for me, like, you can get inspiration from anything and everything. I just i sit down and watch my son eating. He's like eating fish fingers and chips. I'm like, yeah, fish fingers and chips. I love fish fingers and chips. You know, how can
MasterChef Experience
00:05:26
Speaker
I make fish and chips in a nice environment?
00:05:31
Speaker
Are you saying you're going to elevate fish fingers and chips on the puree menu? That would be great. I love that. I would love that. um You must have picked up quite a lot of things from when you were working at the ethcurean because I remember that was a really big part of sort of your identity and cooking when when we first met in MasterChef, you know, about going into the garden and seeing what was there and and seasonality. um But you've you've obviously had other experiences before that. Do you feel like that one was a really sort of big learning curve and really sort of pushed into your identity as a chef?
00:06:04
Speaker
Yeah, I think so actually. It's a good point. I never really thought about that, but um what was special about the Epicureum was the restaurant was quite literally in the middle of a garden. So you walk into work every day and you are surrounded by the produce, you know. So it really made you connect with your day and what what you need to do.
00:06:24
Speaker
What can I use? What's looking amazing? Oh, this is looking a bit sad today. The weather's very dependent on what produce you're going to be getting in. And the the menu was sort of led by what was next to me, which was a really interesting way of thinking, you know, normally a chef's brain would start with the protein.
00:06:44
Speaker
and then ah move on to how can I garnish it, whereas mine was the opposite, my brand was, I've got this a beautiful, this beautiful leek. I've got these amazing brassica tops, you know. What can I work with that? So that just changed my mindset quite a bit in how I would think really, to be fair. And it's really rewarding because like like I say, you know, we walk into work and really seeing the changes in the season.
00:07:10
Speaker
but you know, makes you connect with the produce a bit more as well. I have a bit more respect for it because the amount of work that goes into the growing, the harvesting is, you know, that's most of the work really. We just got put on the plate. So. Do you think that it changed you as in the sense like, I know when I learned about foraging and sort of looking at what's around me, did that really elevate that for you as well? Or was foraging always something that you were very much into?
00:07:38
Speaker
something i was always but very much into but being surrounded by every day it really you had to you know it's different so it made me a lot more aware of seasons um but yeah i've always had an interest in it because you can get some amazing produce for free by spending 10 minutes picking for it when you could be charged 20 quid for this or that So, you know, it's got its benefits and you're just learning, you know, it's not just in the kitchen now, you're outside, you know where to go, where to look for these things and I kind of enjoy that actually.
00:08:16
Speaker
We were at a, um, really randomly, we were just coming back from bath and we saw they had
Post-MasterChef Reflection
00:08:21
Speaker
a car boot sale and we're like, we've wanted to go to it for a long time, but we never had the time. So we just pulled in and went to the car boot sale and then walking back to the car, we just saw this massive amount of pineapple weed. And we must've looked like absolute crazy people. We were just on the side of the road on this tiny little goat track with cars driving past us, ripping out all of this pineapple weed. Cause we're like, whenever you look for it, you can never find it. So you just got to grab it. Yeah.
00:08:46
Speaker
figure out what to do with it later but yeah and it's great isn't it you've got it and you're like right i've got like three days before it goes so it's got four bags of this stuff what can i do to preserve it you know i like i like that race of like How can I get as much flavour out as possible before it dies, you know? yeah got support but We made a vinegar out of some of it. Nice. We dried some of it um because we've learnt that infusing it into a jus is really nice. So we've made some pineapple weed jus. Yeah. um And then I think we've frozen some of it to use into maybe some kind of ice cream later. But it is that, isn't it? It's like, you know, I can't just I can't leave this here and I can't just leave it see in my kitchen. How do I preserve this to then use it in the future? 100% yeah I love that it's great. So especially at the Epicureum because um in the winter when it's really frosty your produce is very minimal so you've got to be quite smart you know making your misos out of all these things and like say vinegars to finish the sauces and preserving pickling fermenting you know whatever it may be to their news in those quiet months so it's quite rewarding as well you could have that on your shelf for the next two years you know.
00:09:54
Speaker
Yeah, we literally do. I think we've had an elderflower vinegar on our shelf for about two years and it's still going strong. Yeah, it just gets better and better, doesn't it? sir I think that's something that we picked up when we went to um Sweden. They were very, very big on taking something when it's said at the end of its season or you know at the best and they preserving it in one way or another and then using it throughout the year. And I'd never really seen anything like that because growing up in Australia, like we have such varied climates that if you can't get it in Victoria, chances are you can probably get it from Queensland.
00:10:24
Speaker
So we really don't live to the seasons quite as much as what the rest of the world does I feel like. So when I came over here and I saw how excited everyone was getting for strawberry season and asparagus season and you know like everyone gets so excited for it and it's on everyone's menu. Whereas in Australia you'll probably see strawberries you know nine months of the year kind of thing. Yeah it's crazy. Yeah it's interesting like how different parts of the world are so different in their seasons like do you have three seasons or four seasons in Australia? How does it work?
00:10:54
Speaker
I mean, we've got four seasons, but it very much kind of merges into it. Yeah. Yeah. Water will feel like spring for a lot of the time and winter will feel like autumn for a lot of the time. We don't have, except for summer, I guess summer is a really long season. Um, but winter, it doesn't really feel that bad, especially up in the north. Like winter might be 20 degrees. Oh wow. Yeah. that Yeah. But not summer might be 45, 50. Yeah. It's lovely.
00:11:24
Speaker
that's not but I'm going back in November actually. I'm taking all the Vincent's family with me. It's going to be oh nice. of So we, so we obviously, we met on MasterChef. Yeah. Um, and I wanted to ask you what your sort of first impressions were when you, when you first walked into MasterChef, not of me, I don't want to know your first, please dear God, no. Um,
Building a New Path with Puro
00:11:46
Speaker
but how, how did you feel? Did it feel how you expected it to feel? Cause I know for me, it was very, very different to what I thought it was going to be.
00:11:53
Speaker
That's a good question. I mean, I was incredibly nervous. I was very different in the sense of, for some reason in my head, I thought I was going to go into the room and the chefs around me were going to be very like, you know, competitive, won't talk to you, that sort of, you know, like, I don't know, ego, match stuff, if you know what I mean. But um everyone everyone was very friendly. The team were very friendly. They were very accommodating.
00:12:18
Speaker
But I was, yeah, obviously very nervous. I knew obviously the skills test was coming in and the cameras, it's obviously a big operation as well, you know, so like so many different rooms. You just feel like a bit lost obviously, don't you? You're sort of walking around like, oh my God, on my back to like go on camera, like what the hell is going on? Regretting it, you know? um Just feeling sick, I think, you know, it's kind of how I remember feeling.
00:12:45
Speaker
um But yeah, like the team were amazing. I made you feel as welcome as you could be. I remember I couldn't really eat, feeding you breakfast onto dinner. I was like, I don't know how to do this. But yeah, no, like as a whole, yeah, it was lovely. like event as well as it could have gone without feeling too nervous. And I just don't forget my skills test. I remember laau pumping myself up like, yeah, come on, I'm ready. I can do this. I can do this. And as soon as they call your name out and you just sort follow them out, oh, no, wait, what's going on? They don't tell you to do that. They just say, Tommy, come with me. I follow them. I'm like, wait, is this it? What's going on? They just head over to these doors and they literally just chuck you in there and you're like, all these cameras, Marcus Rarin's there.
00:13:28
Speaker
And I just went in on myself like, oh my gosh, I've never felt like that before, you know, like so petrified that I didn't even know who I was. I remember standing outside and they took me out there and they took a photo of me with the MasterChef sign.
00:13:45
Speaker
And they were like, um ah they're they're not quite ready. you We just need five minutes. So I was standing outside for five minutes and I was just, I was just dying. I'm like, what, what am I doing? Why am I here? Why did I think I could do this? Like the amount of nerves and stress that I felt, I genuinely thought I might be sick. I was so stressed. And I'm, I'm not normally like that. Like I'm in some stressful, shitty situations. yeah And normally you can talk yourself through it. You're like, it's fine. Everything ends like,
00:14:14
Speaker
no shitty situation lasts forever. yeah In that moment, I was like, I cannot do this. How do I get out of this? Like, yeah if I fake faint right now, will they let me go? What can I do to get out of this? well Literally. ah Yeah, I couldn't agree more with that. It's definitely the most overwhelming um feeling I've ever come across. Just like, yeah, just can't do anything. Your brain is not working. You're just straight up scared. It's like survival mode, you know, like all these cameras, you just feel like very vulnerable don't you you do it's very exposing and i remember like i i binged watched the last three seasons before i went on and i remember watching this poor guy and he had to make a hollandaise oh yeah i remember that and he he fucked it up he forgot how to make a hollandaise and being an armchair expert never doing anything like that i was just like how do you forget how to make a hollandaise yeah
00:15:07
Speaker
And then when I was there and they're like, right, you're making an apple tartare tan, um, with a Calvados Anglaise sauce. And I'm like, I've got this. I know how to do all of that. And here's me trying to make an Anglaise with a whisk and Monica had to be like, would you like a spatula instead of a whisk? And I was like, thank you.
00:15:26
Speaker
ah Yeah, 100%. I was definitely one of those people watching like, what are you doing? What's wrong with you? Like, how do you not know that? And then being and going to do it. I'm like, okay, a fair play. I completely understand that. You know, I'm never going to shout at someone on my chef every time. Or any cooking program like well i work it with a whole different appreciation now when things go wrong. And I'm like, yep, can totally get that. Like you just sometimes you just blank because all the nerves you're like,
00:15:53
Speaker
What is going on? Yeah, I mean, there's so much going on at once, isn't there? That's like, okay, the task is simple. Make me this, you know, something you've done 100 times before, but you're in this new little kitchen, and you don't know where anything is, you've got 15 people staring at you, all this equipment. um It's just very different, isn't it? It's almost like, it's not even about your skill at that point, it's about how much pressure can you handle at that point, you know, like,
00:16:19
Speaker
um So yeah, ah laugh I think that was the scariest moment of my time. I remember it was a bit of a running joke throughout. Every time there was a challenge that we didn't know about, we were like, I swear to God, if it's another skills test. Yeah. I might have left. One more time, you know, see if I can handle it a bit better this time.
00:16:38
Speaker
I think you would. I think if we got to do it again, if there was a second time around, um, it would still be nervous, but surely it wouldn't be quite as overwhelming. Like, you know, how the camera system works, you know, how the Sandys work, you know, there's lots of causing and stopping for the judges to try and repeat something. Cause they didn't like the way they said it the first time. Like, I think, you know, the whole process now. And even though it would be scary, it would be a lot different. Yeah. No, I would agree with that. But that's to the situation, not better.
00:17:08
Speaker
Or maybe it would be worse because you know it's coming. I don't know. I'd love to do it all over again to you, Farrah. I would too. It was great, wasn't it? Let's put it out into the universe and inspire people. Tommy and Cassay would like to do this again. Yeah, invite us back, Freddie. We'll bring the identities if we must.
00:17:28
Speaker
um What was one of your favourite moments throughout MasterChef? Oh, there's so many to be fair. I do think my favourite had to be the chefs table though, cos I...
00:17:39
Speaker
I mean, I've watched my chef for years and years, so always watching the chef's table in the room of chefs there, you know? That was kind of my favorite and worst, but like, my favorite moment was going up to see the chefs, you know? The day itself was horrendous, was horrific, horrible. But like, that moment of just going out of that room, and you're literally looking around, you're like, what the hell? Like, all these guys have just tried my food, like these are my icons, you know? um So many names, it's ridiculous. I knew every single person up there.
00:18:08
Speaker
um So that was just like, wow, never gonna you're never going to get the opportunity ever again. You know, like, why are they here to try my food? And when are they all going to be in a room together again where they're trying my food? Yeah, that that's the dream, isn't it? but Bonkers.
00:18:24
Speaker
I think it was so daunting and like it was such a long cook as well. It was a long time to keep pushing and keep focused for. um But I remember like all of us during service, like when we were actually serving, it was so hard. The judges were really like pushing and hounding and they were relentless. Yeah, they were. They were on it that day, weren't they? Like you couldn't do anything right that day. Like just remember,
00:18:49
Speaker
Just like Marcus and Monica like going in on Charlie and I was like, Oh God, okay. Then he stopped going in on Tom and I was like, Oh no, it's me next. I'm going to get it now. You know, the build up. And then I got absolutely handed as well. And it was just like this chaotic day of like stress. Yeah. It was like the worst service imaginable, but for no reason. Yeah. Like not, not for no reason. It went as well as it could have gotten. Yeah.
00:19:11
Speaker
But the pressure is obviously immense. Because the judges, at the end of the day, they've chosen the contestants as well. So they've got responsibility. And they're probably feeling the pressure as well. Because if we look silly in front of all these chefs, then the judge is going to take a bit of a hit there. So I think just as a whole, everyone was feeling it, really.
00:19:31
Speaker
I felt a little bit sort of separated from it. Cause obviously I had dessert and I was tucked away in that little room yeah and I didn't really, like I saw Charlie getting ridden during service because I was there helping him. I didn't see you and I didn't see Tom. All I remember was like, I was the last one to serve. And I remember you and Charlie coming over and being like, Oh my God, that was so rough. I was like, what's going on? yeah Oh God, it was terrifying. It was, there I remember after service had finished, like that little waiting period where you're waiting for everyone to be served and you're about to go up. I was like, I was crouched down at the bottom of the stairs. Like yeah I was terrified because I didn't necessarily grow up with all of these names, but coming from Australia, we don't have Michelin stars. yeah So we obviously look at it a little bit differently. And we almost.
00:20:26
Speaker
I don't know, maybe we put it even higher on a pedestal because we don't have it.
Philosophy on Creating Exciting Dishes
00:20:30
Speaker
So knowing all of these people are up there. And a lot of the names that I knew, of course, Matt Abbey, I knew I was terrified to see that he was there. For me, it was it was extra terrifying because it was, um yeah, I don't know, it's like the unknowns as well, I suppose a little bit. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Makes perfect sense. Like, you don't know, you don't really know what you're walking into, I suppose.
00:20:54
Speaker
And you don't know what they're going to say. You're like, all of these people are highly, highly skilled and legends in their own regard. yeah And I've just fed them something that I've, you know, had to try and create in not a lot of time and try and execute as well as possible in also not a lot of time for the observing. And in your head, you're like, please, please, please just don't hate it. Just anything like, you know, I can take a little bit of criticism, but please just nobody tell me that you hated it yeah that's it isn't it like yeah like you say the time the time frames and just every round in general i think was the hardest part of it all actually you don't get much time at all and then you're doing it all from scratch you know and then you ask for like a venison loin and you get given a whole saddle so you've got to break that down and you know like they're they're quite they're quite good on you know making can you run i suppose i mean i don't run anyway because i give myself so much to do every time but yeah and they're cooking for those chefs like
00:21:52
Speaker
just hear in the comments. That was probably my favorite part of it all. I was really pleased, running around for a good few hours and I was like, oh no, I'm not going to be able to get this done. I think that was the thing that went on my head most right. I'm never going to be able to get this done. I'm never going to be able to get this done. And you go like the last 10 minutes and you're like, I'm never going to be able to get this done.
00:22:12
Speaker
and then you know like the last few minutes you just got this next level beast mode kicking in ah yeah i always hated that though because then you're like why didn't i have that beast mode throughout the whole thing and then i wouldn't be panicking at the end yeah literally just the panic like the sheer panic of getting it done making it as good as possible And, you know, I think for me anyway, like in every round, I always looked at my platform and was like, oh, I could have probably done that better. I could have probably done that better. Like, I didn't ever get it perfect, I wouldn't say. um But, you know, again, in the scenario, in a situation that don't think you're ever really going to get anything perfect. It's kind of like what you can do and get the best out of in that time, in that situation.
00:22:53
Speaker
I think everybody feels like that though, cause it's only you that knows what you want it to look like in your head. yes true Nobody else knows that, but you do. So when you plate it and then you're like, Oh, that's not how I wanted it to look. But nobody else knows that.
00:23:08
Speaker
You know, it's something that I always try and remind myself, like, yeah we're perfectionists and we have this perfect Instagrammable image in our head of what we want it to look like. And then when it's on the plate, it doesn't quite look like that. And you really get hung up on it. yeah Sometimes you really have to remind yourself, like that's only in my head. Nobody else knows. Yeah, that's true. As long as it doesn't look terrible. but Yeah, yeah. No, absolutely. It's funny really, isn't it? Like, it's true.
00:23:35
Speaker
I think we're hardcore perfectionists sometimes. It's unattainable. It's a tough ah tough thing to shake for sure. and a hundred um How did you feel when you found out that we we're going to the Alchemists?
00:23:50
Speaker
I was absolutely buzzing to Feb. I didn't ever see that come in. I knew um i knew all of the Alchemist very well, just because of their wacky food, you know, with the stuff that they're doing there is sort of unheard of. And um Copenhagen, you know, is like somewhere I've always wanted to go because of the food scene as well. as It's got to be one of the best in the world, really. um So when, yeah, when they said that, I was just like, no way. Wow, that is incredible. like I knew I was going to walk in that kitchen and feel like I knew nothing, which is exactly what happened.
00:24:22
Speaker
Yeah, that was actually mega to be fair. That was very cool. I was terrified well yeah when they said I was like, because I knew I knew at some point we were going to have to cook for him. Yeah. In my head, I was like, there is nothing that I can do to surprise this guy. No, that's it. leilla I'm nothing. What am I supposed to do with this? so I think when he showed us the table of what we had to cook with was like probably the most scrambled my brain had been, you know, like there's a sheep's head, some jellyfish, some cow's bladder, pig's tongue, you know, like it's sort of looking at these things and I'm sure you thought it's things we were all looking at like, what the hell is this? You know, I've never, never seen most of this stuff before. How am I supposed to cook something nice? Literally. And how am I supposed to cook it? How do you cook it? How do you cook a cow's order?
00:25:08
Speaker
like Yeah, I didn't even know that was the thing that you could eat to be fair enough. I'm a celebrity, but, you know.
00:25:17
Speaker
um I remember, I'm pretty sure they managed to capture it when we all walked up and saw the table. I think we had a moment where we all looked at each other and we were like, what? I kind of love that ethos that you had as well, though, like, because that is really out there, you know.
00:25:33
Speaker
taking the most obscure ingredients that no one ever touches. And ah that had a real powerful story. you know like Even the cod jaw, the plastic fantastic, I thought that was just so clever. um I really ah really like that. And the storytelling I thought, throughout his dishes, I think that's what really captured me the most. I really was quite inspired by that actually.
00:25:54
Speaker
Yeah, I like that sort of everything had a bit of a, like a genuine reason behind it. yeah But then I found that really hard when he said, I want you to create something that's got a reason behind it. I'm like, we've got 20 minutes to think about. Yeah, he did like months to really bring together what he's doing, you know, like he said.
00:26:15
Speaker
I think, what was it? like The omelette took him like three years to get from start to finish. It's absolutely amazing. and um You can see the hard work that goes and and just the creativity. um When you're sort of chucked in the deep end and like, there you go, it's a cow's bladder, make me a dish, one hour, go. And you're like, what the?
00:26:31
Speaker
And you were up first as well. I know that in the editing it looks like we're all cooking together, but we did go up separately. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, yeah, that's true. sco up Was that really daunting? and It was quite a dark kitchen as well. it wasn't Yeah, it was but it was a dark kitchen. I remember feeling quite disorientated where it was very dark.
00:26:50
Speaker
like you You know when you sort of walk out from outside and you walk inside and your eyes are all like adjusting. I felt like that all day. ah But um it was daunting, yeah, because you don't really want to go in there on your own. But then again, you want to kind of get it over and done with. So I had an idea of what I was going to do. I sort of come up with the concepts and then um I've sort of picked a few ingredients I was familiar with. So I went with like pigs tongue, pigs ear,
00:27:22
Speaker
um Pig's windpipe, which I'd never touched before again. I didn't even know that was really a thing so I sort of experimented a little bit and I asked because the the team were very good weren't they to fair like i I Did say to one of the chefs I was odd could I make her?
00:27:37
Speaker
and the emulsion out of the pig's blood. He was like, you could, but I'll take you forever because he said he'd like coagulate and all this. I was like, okay, I'm not going to do that then. Can I do this? I was sort of trying to get a few hints out of him because they know their stuff about these products.
00:27:53
Speaker
I think they had to have those people there though so they had their research and development team and we were very lucky because we had a guy from England who was on there yeah um and they sort of said to us like if you want to use this you could potentially pan fry it or because they had to otherwise we'd just be serving I don't know weird stuff that we had no idea how to cook so they had to give us a little bit of an indication like you know I went with the windpipe as my main element and I was like
00:28:21
Speaker
ah how do i This is dried. about you What do I do with it? yeah ah that So bizarre. Did anyone use a jellyfish? No. I nearly did. I think me and you were talking about it maybe or something. I nearly did but then I sort of went with the pig theme instead.
00:28:43
Speaker
But it was quite interesting, I still didn't get to try it. It's you that put your finger in there and poked it, and you're like, oh my god, it's alive. Yeah, yeah. It's like, it's an actual jellyfish, like what? Yeah, um I want to say you like cut it as a carpaccio and then served it like that, and that's like, wow, that's just bonkers, isn't it? And I want to try that. I i can't even imagine what it would taste like. I imagine it would probably be more of a textural thing than a flavour thing, I wonder. Yeah, that's true.
00:29:12
Speaker
We'll have to go back. Are you going to go? I did book to go with a good friend of mine, actually. But it turned out I couldn't go. So I'm definitely aiming to go at some point, just um times my enemy at the moment. So when I get the opportunity, I'm going to fly over there straight away. I'm very keen to do so. What about you?
00:29:31
Speaker
Oh, absolutely. I want to go. I want to try and book it in for next year. Yeah. I think. Yeah. Vincent's going to come and we'll make a bit of a weekend out of it and yeah god but the go into the go into the ball pit afterwards.
00:29:44
Speaker
Yeah, that was cool, wasn't it? Like all the rooms that they had, even like the first room you go into, you know, you're going into this restaurant, even even just the door, like bonkers, isn't it? Like this massive still door. You just walk up to it and then it's just there. You know, you're sort of waiting like, is anyone going to let me in or what's going on here? Is there a secret knock or something? Yeah, yeah. It just obviously opens on its own. And then you sort of walk into this like mysterious dark room, get greeted. And then, yeah, it's just bonkers. I love that concept before. It's crazy.
00:30:14
Speaker
It was very cool. I remember when we all went into the room the first time, I mean, they, we ended up having to do a couple of goes at it, but the first time we went in and there's this, you know, beautiful woman dressed in Lycra who's yeah dancing and they've got all these speakers going and they're saying things. and And then at the end, they hand us this little like dehydrated crisp thing. And we were kind of just standing there holding it. because do we really know what ah do care but ah ah We just looking at ourselves like, this is nice, you know. thought I remember it took us all a good time to realise that we actually had to eat it. Yeah, we had to take the whole shoot because we didn't eat the snack. We were just holding it while we were meeting the chef, Rasmus. That was really awkward. We've got a snack in our hand. All right, do it again. You're supposed to eat it. I'm like, oh, bloody hell, OK.
00:31:05
Speaker
first isn't that But very immersive, like, you know, you're questioning everything, aren't you? Just starting the journey off with this, like, strange sensation and being gifted this box. And you just take it out and it was tasty, wasn't it? I can't remember what flavour it was there. Was it licorice or blueberry or something? Blackcurrant? I feel like it was licorice and berry or something. Yeah. I don't know. It was very cool. I was way too overwhelmed to remember what I was actually trying. Yeah.
00:31:32
Speaker
This lady in Lycra just made Tom spin me around. I remember i just remember the kitchen as well. i felt like i was in willy wonng yeah like i was in I felt like I was in Willy Wonka when I was going in the kitchen. you know like He's telling us he's got this sound wave machine that you can just put three ingredients in there and it makes it emulsify. and You know, just stuff you've never seen or heard of, like just science, you know. um yeah Next level stuff up beyond beyond my brain.
00:32:05
Speaker
My mind was blown by that. Like most of the stuff that he was showing us, my mind was blown by it. But I think his team to start off with were really quite intimidating. Yeah, they were. um Because they were very, very serious chefs. There was not a lot of smiling. And if they did joke, it was like a deadpan. Yeah. What's going on there? Did they laugh or? Yeah, they probably weren't there.
00:32:31
Speaker
But no, it turned out they were all actually really lovely, weren't they? And very welcoming. We had a drink, obviously, afterwards, which was great. I had some food twice.
00:32:45
Speaker
Yes. That was a long dinner. So we went out for dinner with them. And then we had this massive dinner and it was lovely. um And then Rasmus was like,
00:32:58
Speaker
We're just going to go out for like a little treat afterwards. And we were like, oh, we were going to take this to a restaurant or something. It's like a Chinese restaurant. And he basically ordered like the whole menu to come out. But it was like a celebrity that I wanted because everyone knew him. She was like, oh, it's great to have you here.
00:33:16
Speaker
And, um, I remember just going to that French restaurant before and looking at the price and I was like, Oh my God, it's like 60 quid for a steak. I'm like, I'm skin. I don't know if I can get any, but I was like the cheapest option as well, wasn't it?
00:33:30
Speaker
yeah You're like, I'll just have a bowl of fries, please. and
00:33:36
Speaker
No, he was so lovely and so welcoming and for such a big name, yeah he was so down to earth and so quiet. And, you know, like I think that's one of the things that really stuck with me is if you, if you just met him on the street, he didn't know who he was. There's, there's no ego there. There's no, this is who I am. And he's just, he's just such a cool guy. And even during service, um, you know, like he was very encouraging. I don't know if that's what he's always like, or if that was,
00:34:05
Speaker
you know, for our benefit. But I'd like to imagine... Yeah, but I think what I find interesting interesting as well is that I could just imagine, you know, imagine him sort of, imagine doing something wrong and a disappointment you would carry by him telling you, you've just done that wrong. You know, he he would take the time to tell you what you've just done. He'd probably tell you where that product come from, how it was grown and you would just feel like an absolute failure, you know, whereas I think I'd rather just be screamed and shouted at. which
00:34:33
Speaker
You know, ah but ready yeah I
00:34:41
Speaker
How did you find the service there that we had to do? Because you had you had the dumplings and what else did you have? The candy floss and the chicken foot I had. How did you go on the candy floss? The candy floss. I felt miserable just trying to dirty that.
00:35:00
Speaker
ah just kind of literally so I I was shown by the candy floss guy, who was like you know he was the candy floss man, do you know what I He showed me how to do it. I was like, oh yeah, that looks easy. He's smashing it, easy peasy. And he's like, right, get some gloves on, start going. And I was like, right, okay. And you you don't get to practice either, do you? You're in service, go. And I've never really worked with candy floss before either, and let alone make a dumpling out of one. multiple multiplely um um Yeah, yeah, lots of dumplings.
00:35:29
Speaker
and it's just melting on my fingers like and obviously with the canister as soon as some starts to melt you've got sticky fingers now. So I was just running back and forth to the sink, washing my hands, calling it down, start again. Get them going, get them going, get them melting, breaking, tearing. And I was just like, this is just miserable. I'm useless. I can't do this. I feel like you have the worst one. Like, I was not at all wanting to do the candy floss. Yeah, it was tough. Because I got warm hands anyway as well. So I took my gloves off because I didn't find no help in any way.
00:36:04
Speaker
And i'm literally ah I just touch it and it's just like melting in your fingers. and i you know I just couldn't get my head round how I was supposed to do it. so And obviously, the more you try, the worse it gets. I just remember looking over at you and you did not look like you were having fun in that moment. Yeah. I was like, oh no, I'm embarrassing myself now in front of the camera. This is great. I don't think anyone wanted that job, like, out of everything. I think the dessert I struggled with a lot because that was so fiddly and... Banana, wasn't it? Yeah. It looked like it should have been okay. But also, I think what people don't realise is
00:36:42
Speaker
they They would have had all of that kind of floss pre-prepared. Like they would have shaped it to order, but it would have been pre-done. You had to do it on the spot in the moment. Same with the dessert. The dessert, the banana shell would have been done well in advance, but they wanted to see you do it on camera to order. They want to set you up for failure, really. helpful yeah but Get them in there, see what they can do. So awful, but I guess it makes for good TV, so you know.
00:37:08
Speaker
Yeah, it's not it's part of the process as well. And, it you know, good challenge. Be boring otherwise. I could have done without that stress. So then obviously we had that, you know, really intense experience and then we came back um and we were all in the final sort of cook together. How did you come up with your dishes for the final cook?
00:37:31
Speaker
Good question. I look up my dishes. They were all i so they all had an influence from something. So my starter was influenced from our time at Tom Shepherd's. So he did a scallop and artichoke dish, which I'm sure you remember, which was lovely.
00:37:49
Speaker
And I really liked the idea of, you know, serving the scallop with a very humble vegetable in different ways. So I decided to go scallop and aubergine. And then that's where I started developing the idea of that. So that's that was the idea. And I started building from that. The main course, where does that come from?
00:38:11
Speaker
Okay, I remember where the main course came from. It feels like a lifetime ago now, doesn't it? yeah i know my dessert obviously like so we had a couple of weeks sent me to design the dishes didn't we so the dessert i've come up with an idea of the strawberry and me sir And I tried it about four times, different sort of ways of doing it, different flavors, textures, just different dishes within those flavors. And I just wasn't, wasn't getting it. It just, it just wasn't right. I wasn't enjoying it. You know, something wasn't clicking. So I remember like, you know, cause I've been putting in hours, you know, you're working full time. You're doing this when everyone's gone home or so, you know, you're working long. And I remember doing it on fourth time and I was just like annoyed. like
00:38:51
Speaker
shit, you know, like what's going on? Why can't I do it? Why is it not working? why you know why Why am I not happy with this? You know, you know when you you're just not happy with it, something's not right. There was nothing wrong, it just wasn't the right thing. So I went home, woke up next morning and I was still thinking about it, like, you know, head in my hand, like what shall I do? And I remember just looking at Albie and he literally was eating them some black currants and he loves black currants.
00:39:16
Speaker
and I was like blackcurrant. You never really see a blackcurrant dessert and um then I remember at the Epicure and we had a blackcurrant bush which had like these amazing blackcurrant leaves. So that that all stemmed from a four and then I was like, right, okay, let's try it. And I did like a chocolate and blackcurrant leaf. I used the whole plant, like the blackcurrant leaf in the the chocolate era, the blackcurrant itself, and then the wood I used to make like an oil and stuff for that. And yeah, it's just that the first time I did it and I tried, I was like, yeah, I'm happy, that's it, I'm happy with that. And then it again, just, so I guess it just comes from, it comes from anything. I can't remember where my main course come from, to be honest.
00:39:55
Speaker
it was something oh yeah no it was like uh it's kind of like an asian influenced dish so i wanted to sort of because i've done that in the competition quite a lot so i sort of went i was going to do like beef then i thought you know i've done beef in the competition before so i went with ville and then like ville and carrot and then i sort of decided okay where can i go this what can i do the carrot to get a bit of asian flavor finish the sauce with like you know like almost like you like you would have dashy so yeah I guess it just kind of stems from a thought and then develops from there essentially and spending a lot of brain power thinking about these things I'm sure like
00:40:33
Speaker
while you were in the journey of MasterChef, your life is consumed by it. you know like Every moment of what you're doing, your brain's sort of thinking, you know what can I do next? um It was like a bubble, wasn't it? I'm sure you probably felt the same. It was definitely a bubble. And I sometimes tried to drag Vincent into that bubble, but he was like, if I have to hear the word MasterChef one more time, I'm like, come on, please. It's almost done. It's almost done. like Please.
00:41:01
Speaker
yeah that's the thing like no one really understands because no one really knows what's going on so you kind of feel quite lonely in this little bubble which i i found i really enjoyed obviously because it's like your own little experience that you're trying to get through and um yeah i just consumed everything really like every moment in my like in my experience i did you know going to work thinking about my next dish thinking about when i gotta go how am i gonna Um, leave the team on my days off, don't need to get some cover. And you know, there's so much going on that is what it's everything for four months. It's very intense, isn't it? It's an intense journey. I think I really struggled with that. Um, cause I did it, uh, within my first head chef role. So I was already working for a big company. Um, and I, you know, I was out of my depth for the first six months, probably I made it happen. Um, as I was starting to get on top of it.
00:41:57
Speaker
is when MasterChef started. And the restaurant was open seven days a week, you know, so it didn't matter when I left, I was always going to be leaving when they were open. um But it was just, it was so intense. Like I remember for the final cook, having to go in, having to wake up at 4.30 to get into the kitchen at five because nobody could know we were doing it. And yeah like by the time you set up, that already takes, you know, a good 45 minutes by the time everything's hot and turned on and all your ingredients are out.
00:42:26
Speaker
then you've got three hours to cook and to try and get everything right. Then you can taste it. yeah Then you've got to clean down and act like you only just walked in and and it gets to like 10, 10 30, everyone's walking in and you are knackered. You're on your fourth coffee and you're like, Hey guys, just got here.
00:42:43
Speaker
yeah that's ah but so true yeah it was like that i think i mean it got a bit obsessive from my point you know like i had to go in five in the morning i had to stay till one in the morning just to get that extra practice in because you know someone would niggle me and and i wouldn't be able to sleep anyway because that thing's niggling me so i'd have to just go and do it um But yeah, it was a whirlwind. I wonder if people, um, cause I know that there were people that had the opportunity to have a little bit of time off. I wonder if that sort of really gave them a bit of an advantage. Cause I know, I know by the end of it, I was completely knackered. Like I was tired and.
00:43:22
Speaker
Um, I kind of wonder now, like, I wish I had have given myself a little bit more breathing space, especially for the final. Um, you know, like the day after the final, I literally woke up in the morning and got on the train and went back to work. You know, it was, it was very much like yeah the whole time there was no reprieve. It was yeah work, practice, sleep, work, practice, sleep. And days off yeah and in London doing the competition, which was not a day off. It was harder of than work, you know, it was, um, it was a short stint, but a long stint at the same time.
00:43:51
Speaker
No, I can agree more with that. I think that's probably one thing I regret actually, is not enjoying it as much as I probably could have, you know. I just had a bit more fun with it, I suppose, because, you know, I think it's just such a daunting thing that you want to... I was worried about regretting something, you know, like my biggest scare was um doing something and then just regretting it. if you not i mean like I didn't want to leave the position of regretting that situation because I know that would kill me. you know so I guess I just put everything into it and just to see how far I'd gone. I didn't go in it to win it. I i genuinely didn't go in it. so I didn't think I'd want to go to the final. all
00:44:32
Speaker
if I actually entered because I wanted to learn and put myself out there. um Because, you know, put yourself in a comfortable situation, that was kind of the reason I wanted to do it. It wasn't because, oh, I want to win. I didn't really see it as a competition. It was more for me, you know, it's more for me to learn about myself as a person, as a chef. um Can I cope with it?
00:44:52
Speaker
You know, just, and and yeah, just enjoy it really. Yeah, for sure. I think that a lot of us went in like that. Um, like for me, especially, I had no idea how far I was going to get. Um, and I know they kept asking, they're like, Oh, you guys must have your finals dishes planned just in case. And I'm like, no, mate, I take every round as it comes. And when I get through that round, I'm so stoked and that I plan for the next one. And if I look too far forward, then I'm just going to overwhelm myself and I'm not going to enjoy it at all.
00:45:20
Speaker
Yeah, I couldn't agree more with that. I think one step at a time. That's definitely how I did it as well. like um Yeah, I should keep marching. Keep marching. Push through the next day. Stay alive. How did you cope? um you know Because you were obviously a head chef of a very amazing restaurant and you had a lot of responsibility. You also had a little boy. You've also got your partner. like that's That's a lot of yeah responsibility. Like me, I had, you know, I had my job and that was it. I don't have any family here or anything like that. I can't even imagine how much harder it must be when you've got all of those other pressures on there as well.
00:45:58
Speaker
Yeah it was definitely a lot to be fair obviously. um I mean it it just is in general having a child but going through that period. Yeah it was ah it was a lot, I mean I was very lucky that my girlfriend caught um took took the mission on you know she's extremely supportive I'm extremely grateful so she's just amazing she's a warrior you know and um yeah but obviously I missed him a lot didn't get to see him too much um Yeah, the responsibility was huge. It was tough. I'm not going to lie. But, you know, you just got to stay focused, you know, as it's quite easy to go off track and lose your way. But at the end of the day, you're there to do the job and the job needs to be done. And I know I sound a bit brutal or harsh, but that is the brutal reality of it, you know. um And yeah, I'm just very lucky to have the support and all fairness from from Courtney.
00:46:53
Speaker
um But, you know, like, when it comes to spending time with my little boy is very, you know, we have a great time. It's the quality time over the quantity, essentially. sure sure um Do you imagine, maybe I'm wrong, but, um, because you were obviously sacrificing family time, which is super, super important. Do you feel like that put more pressure on you during the competition? You're like, well, I've, I've sacrificed this already. Yeah. I need to, I need to make it worth it. I need to get something out of it.
00:47:27
Speaker
Yeah, I guess so. It was more the fact that I didn't want to let them down, I guess. You know, like, I wanted to show my little boy, you know, you can do anything you put your mind to, you know, and push yourself. Obviously, he's a bit little now, but when he grows up, you'll see it. And I didn't want to go home and sell a court, you know, this or that or so. I had that, obviously, I guess everyone's got their own pressures, but, you know, I didn't want to let them down, obviously.
00:47:53
Speaker
that was something that I held quite quite strongly and I wanted to do them pride you know she I think I felt that but in a different way like obviously Vincent is a chef and he's an amazing chef he's probably better than me yeah yeah that' to him out loud um i he He did a lot with sort of helping me and pushing me. And if I needed to talk to someone about it, he was always there. um And I think i more than myself, I really didn't want to let him down. I didn't want him yeah to say to people, ah you know, she got knocked out early or she did this stupid mistake and that's why she's not still in. Yeah, you almost take that responsibility on, don't you, for that person? like
00:48:33
Speaker
Yeah, well that's that's good. That's great that you play with chefs, for a lot Vincent's a good legend, isn't he? Yeah, he's not that good.
00:48:41
Speaker
No, that's nice. Especially because you play with chefs is why you're sort of, you know, you're in the game together, aren't you? so And the thing that was probably quite nice for you is that you probably understood so quite a lot as well. Whereas court doesn't really understand um chefing as much if you know what I mean so yeah I go home and tell her a story she was like what what you know like I don't know it's just a different little world of stories isn't it the industry is quite it's very different to most people's surroundings yeah and I think that it's different not just in the sense of like what it is but I think it's really cool that we have this opportunity to
00:49:17
Speaker
do this kind of competition with our career because there's not a lot of careers where they have highly televised things in a competition like that except for cooking. um very true I always thought about that when we were doing it I was like what a wacky career like it's it's let me travel the world and work in different countries and you know you don't even need to necessarily speak the same language when you're in a different country. And then you've got this whole other avenue where you can go on TV and you can try and make a name for yourself. It's just a weird little industry. It is. I agree with that. I think it's just it all comes down to food. you know like Food is probably really one of the only things in the world that
00:49:58
Speaker
ah like No matter where you go, there is food. Food is needed by everyone. this ah yeah like I could go on all day about food. you know I think it's great. but ah so You can connect with food wherever you may be. It's different everywhere.
00:50:15
Speaker
you think about other things i don't think there's really much else that there is that people can relate to um in a in a worldwide it's one of those things that sort of connects everyone in it like it's it's when you think about music you know music brings people together and music style things that bring people together we always think about things like that and food and i think that's what probably makes our industry really special is it doesn't matter if it's you You know, your family getting together to go to McDonald's for breakfast, or if it's going out to celebrate it at a three Michelin star restaurant, like no matter which way you look at it, it's about sort of spending time together. Yeah. and so i get tooy it get romantic but you know um I know you just sort of, just after we finished filming MasterChef at the end of July, um it was, you said to me that the Epicureum was closing.
00:51:08
Speaker
yeah was that a bit weird to sort of be having that close in that weird interim period of finishing filming but before it actually comes out what was that like yeah that was actually that was probably one of the hardest things because Well, I once, yeah, so obviously I sort of found out African was shot in as we were filming MasterChef, actually. So it was this really weird, like, okay, I'm not gonna have a job in a couple of moments, but I'm in this competition for the next couple of months. there um Yeah, I didn't really know what to do with myself, you know, so.
00:51:44
Speaker
um I didn't want to rush into anything because obviously I wanted to see from MasterChef. I wanted to take the time. I know it's going to be quite an overwhelming experience anyway. I didn't want to jump into a new job. So I decided to help out at a restaurant that I worked at before just for the meantime because it was coming up to Christmas. I did some hours to help them out. um But dealing with like, you know, I just felt quite lost. I think it was probably the right word. you know I didn't know what to do with myself in the sense of, you know.
00:52:13
Speaker
Where shall I go? Where I live is quite remote as well in the sense of there's not many restaurants around here so I was very much contemplating whether to move. Me and my partner were sort of talking like where should we go? What do we do?
00:52:25
Speaker
um So yeah, I was ah was lost. I don't know where to go, what to do. um And obviously as my chefs come out, it's a very overwhelming thing anyway. ah Amazing experience, obviously, but it is a lot. um So I guess I just took my time and like, tried to figure out where to go. So I did like lots of supper clubs, private dining, helping out a couple kitchens, just to sort of plot on by and meet other people as well and like,
00:52:53
Speaker
get by essentially, I guess really, and learn along the way. um So I took quite a while to figure out what I was going to do next. and ah I was debating whether to move up to Yorkshire. Honestly, we we were really like, we could be anywhere. but We don't know what we're going to do. So um yeah, it was an interesting time actually.
00:53:13
Speaker
I remember, um, I remember thinking about you a little bit when we'd finished because obviously I knew that the ethic Korean was closing, but I remember just myself, how I felt after master chef had finished. And I felt so lost, like.
00:53:30
Speaker
This thing that have been such um like the only part of your life for the last few months and the most intense part of your life as well and then all of a sudden it just Stopped like there was no communication from the team. There was nothing we didn't it was like it almost had never happened, you know, and I remember being like what do I do with myself now and I still was working you know so I can't even imagine yeah what that was like that weird interim period where we're all feeling really weird and I talked to Tom about it as well Tom said he felt exactly the same and and he won you know like so if he was feeling like that then the rest of us were as well and I just I can't imagine
00:54:09
Speaker
sort of feeling a little bit lost after that experience. And then also having the restaurant that you were the chef at close, and it must have been sort of a task. Well, it's interesting. ah master chef was ah As was finished, I was unemployed, you know? Not because I wanted to, but because I had a job. So it was very weird. And I'd never been in that position before where I've been somewhere where I had to close, basically, first time. So that was obviously very new to me as well.
00:54:38
Speaker
But yeah, lost was the right, it's definitely the right word. um You know, because like you say, it's just such a strange thing, isn't it? Like, you know, watching yourself on telly is daunting as it is, let alone with loads of people. And then the yeah, it just sort of finishes and you're like, right, okay.
00:54:56
Speaker
What shall I do now? You know, I want to on push myself to do the next big thing. what What can I do? What's next? I spent so much time sort of looking around Where can I go? What can I do? um To the point it was just getting a bit ridiculous because I wasn't getting anywhere is really we run with time off As it is so like forced yeah, I'm off of something like that how did you know Yeah Well, I did, I think to be fair, right? She was thinking it was all done and over and everything was going to go back to normal and here's you driving her crazy again. yeah
00:55:36
Speaker
What's going on? before I thought I'd get a break by now. Done it all. But then, then you eventually, you know, sort of, you had to look around, you took your time like you wanted to. I remember yeah very adamant on that. You didn't want to rush into something. You wanted your next thing to be the right thing.
00:55:52
Speaker
So then you feel impure? Yeah. Yeah. So that was an interesting one actually. So very fortunate that is literally 15 minutes from where I live. There was a few um few options. We decided that we were going to stay local. So that depleted a lot of the other options. So we were like, right, we're going to stay here.
00:56:13
Speaker
and we looked at the options that were here. After Puro came along, I went to meet Dom, the owner there. and We both had very similar visions and what we wanted to do, which is exactly what I'm looking for. If you're going to work with someone so closely, they need to be on the same page. That's just not going to work.
00:56:33
Speaker
um I really liked the restaurant. It was a beautiful little place. The kitchen was you know definitely workable. You could definitely get some good food out of it, which is what we're doing. um The ideas were there. And I just saw the potential, basically. I sort of saw, you know okay, it's a challenge. you know um And I liked the idea of that. It's a challenge on just coming in and just go for it and see what you can do. and I kind of got excited by the thought of there's not really any security buyer. You don't know if it's going to work. I kind of liked that. I've never really sort of gone and done that. Obviously, when you when you're employed, you're there to do a job, whereas now it's more, I'm there.
00:57:17
Speaker
to make it work, basically, do you know what I mean? So, yeah, since we've started, we've changed quite a lot, to be fair, like, the restaurant, the kitchen, the equipment, constantly building, the menu's changing quite often. We've done that as well. Sorry, can you hear my little tick there? Let me just try, how do I turn it off?
00:57:45
Speaker
um Anyway, so yeah, we've met the menu's got bigger. We offer a tasting menu, another cart. We just want to keep keep learning with what people want. you know We want to become a destination restaurant where people are willing to travel to to come and eat with us because we want to offer just the best food and service we possibly can because that's what we enjoy doing.
00:58:07
Speaker
um and the team are very much on board. So, you know, it's going very well in that sense and learning every day. The team must also be learning a lot because I think one thing that I really noticed about your cooking during MasterChef was it was always quite different.
00:58:23
Speaker
There was nothing being sort of classical about it. It was always very different, which I think there's quite a lot of push for at the moment, you know, like people like their comfort foods and they like things that they know. And they're used to that. I think people are getting slowly more adventurous with what they're willing to try, which is exciting for us as chefs. Cause it means that we can finally start being a little bit weird and wacky and putting those things on the lawn.
00:58:49
Speaker
Yeah, I think for me I always play the rule of, with a menu at least, I always play the rule of 80-20. So I play 80% very familiar comfort food that you're not going to be, you're going to be very aware of, you're going to be very familiar with these ingredients. And then the 20% is, okay, how can we infuse this, you know,
00:59:10
Speaker
these ingredients you've probably never heard of, the sort of challenging element, you know, like, oh, okay, that's interesting. Just to create a bit more excitement through your experience. But I kind of like that idea. I think in MasterChef, yeah, I did sort of push the boat out a bit as well. um Because I didn't want to be the same as other people. I didn't really get excited by the classics as much anymore. Nothing against it. You know, I've got all the respect and award for classics and things like this, but I guess I'm just sort of challenging myself you know and and i I get excited by that and that's what I enjoy doing and I guess I learn more from as well because it's sort of the unknown you know. Yeah for sure. I think that was a very similar concept at the Alchemist as well like I was very surprised that
00:59:56
Speaker
he would do these weird weird things but would put um kind of a like a familiar twist to it because I think that if he was to do like absolutely crazy flavors and ingredients at the same time it would be really inaccessible but I remember doing the chicken foot and being like, this is very familiar. It's very odd and I don't know what's happening, yeah but it's very familiar. Yeah. Well, in essence, you know, you look at it and it's this cold, ugly chicken foot, but then eating it, it was like eating sweet and sour chicken.
01:00:31
Speaker
and Yeah, I thought that was, yeah, i like you say, very clever and the sort of transition through the emotions that he knows he's creating. You know, you're sort of looking at it a bit scarce, a bit like, am I supposed to eat this? This is very strange. So eating it and you're like,
01:00:49
Speaker
Oh wow, you know, like comforting. It was comforting, I thought, and I'm very familiar, like you say. So yeah, really, really clever. And I quite like that. It's quite interesting. I had a lot of conflict with that dish. I loved it and I hated it. I hated holding the cold chicken foot, but then eating the hot end of it. And I hated that it was served in a cage, but it tasted so good. And it was just, I don't know, it was very, very weird.
01:01:17
Speaker
Yeah, it was. The brain just like... How he comes up with that stuff blows my bo one mind. Like, I don't know whether it's a high fiving or... Yeah, a runaway. It's pretty deep and dark, isn't it? Yeah, I remember talking to his research and development team and they were like, mate, we've been working with him for however many years and we don't understand how his brain works. Like, he'll come to us with a concept and we're like, what?
01:01:45
Speaker
Yeah, like, what? is You know, yeah, so strange. I can't even wrap my head around it. Very interesting.
01:01:52
Speaker
But I reckon like, I reckon he, well, he must sort of create, he must create a story, I guess, or like, he might, maybe sort of, rather than us thinking about, we've got this, what can we do of it? He's probably like, oh, I'm feeling like this. How can I turn that into a dish? You know, like, I don't know. I i just don't get it. Really. I remember he said to me that, um, I think it was his, his name or something passed away from lung cancer. And that's why he put the sheep's lung dish on the menu.
01:02:21
Speaker
And like, I just, I wouldn't ever think to create a dish out of something that was really painful, you know? I think we always tend to think about what makes us happy, what makes us feel comfort and stuff like that. Never would I think, oh, this caused me an immense amount of pain. I'm going to turn it into a dish. Yeah, that's, that is true. Actually, I couldn't even imagine trying to do that too far.
01:02:47
Speaker
yeah a daily finder you know literally check on four sheets bladder you know you're like oh god fuck yeah she just be a constant state of depression yeah so how how is everything now i mean you've got a new baby on the way very very close yeah um you've got another one you've got a restaurant that you're running how yeah how does your brain function how do you handle it all um you don't
01:03:17
Speaker
That's a good question. How do I handle it all? I don't know. I just just feel very grateful to be fair, you know, like don't be wrong. it' It's hard. It's tough. I'm tired, you know.
01:03:34
Speaker
But at the same time, I thrive on that. I thrive on being busy, I feel like I'm pushing myself. If I don't, I just, I don't feel happy, you know? So it actually brings happiness to me by pushing myself on a daily basis. And, you know, like, unfortunately, you know, I'm running a restaurant, I've got a lovely little boy, I've got an everyone coming, so they're good things, they're for good reasons, it's not like, you know, they're not bad.
01:04:00
Speaker
bad things you know so if anything I feel very lucky and I feel like I've got responsibility to do that so you know I just do everything I possibly can to make it happen basically and you have to make it happen have to have to handle it always what's gonna happen you know who's gonna do it who's gonna look after my little boy you know I've got to do it so yeah that's kind of responsibility that I have pride in taking and doing really
01:04:29
Speaker
No. No, not really too fair. Don't get me wrong, like I say, some days I'm knackered. I'm sure you probably are as well. You're working extremely hard yourself and it's difficult. How do you handle it?
01:04:43
Speaker
you know No, I have certain outlets, like I always make sure I make time to go to the gym. um And that's, yeah, it sounds very sacred to me because it's, it's not just about the exercise. It's about that, that hour or hour and a half um where you just, you you physically have to switch off because, you know, like whatever you're doing, you have to focus on and you're in pain and you're out of breath and you don't want to do it. So you're just focusing on that. So for me, that's a really big switch off time.
01:05:13
Speaker
um be more with that I think that is very important actually. Yeah and it doesn't have to be the gym but I think sort of anything you know I was just talking to someone recently and we were saying you need to I don't know go for a walk in the forest and put your phone on flight mode so you can't respond to emails or something like the world's not going to end if you don't respond to that email as soon as it comes in it comes in an hour um which is is very good in theory and I can I can preach it but you know we don't do it that often.
01:05:42
Speaker
Yeah, and I couldn't agree more. I think that is important. I think it's quite easy to get lost in your way in a sense of, you know, just go, go, go, go, go. But like, um yeah, for me, going to the gym or going for the walk.
01:05:55
Speaker
just completely you feel better after and refreshes your mind doesn't it so I think that's very important actually to be fair I agree with that good advice I'll try and take it a little bit more often but I'm very lucky I've got I've got Vincent who very much manages the business but Yeah, it's it's a huge learning curve though. I mean, it's, um, it's way more work and more involved than we ever thought it would be. And everybody always told you that, you know, I don't know if you got it, but everyone always says to you, when you have your own business, it's, it's go, go, go. It's never stop. It's full on. And in my head, I was like, yeah, okay. But you know, you still get a day off. Like I can handle one day off. a yeah And then we were, we were looking back at the calendar and we were like, when did we have a day off?
01:06:41
Speaker
ah was that was it like people always did but you don't feel Yeah, I mean the thing is people only really see you going to cook the food they only see the plate obviously whereas I'm sure for you use the organizing the ordering The staffing potentially obviously going there to see it. It's it's a long process. I mean you and you do all sorts only so but there's so much more to a day's work like your day's work is probably a a few weeks in advance as well. So there's a few weeks planning for that one day's work. Do you know what I mean? So it's constant convey about of, um, organizing and chaos. I'm sure it was organized chaos, but sometimes it's just a little bit of chaos.
01:07:29
Speaker
ah There's always something I'm, I'm so glad that we did it though. Um, it's, are you enjoying it? Yeah. Yeah. 98% of the time. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You got to have your bad days. I don't love admin days. I'm not going to lie. Admin days suck. But somebody has to do it. We don't have any employees. So that's us. I think we realized that marketing is actually a full-time job. It's somebody's full-time job that they go to, you know, to study for and all of that. And all of a sudden we're the marketing people.
01:08:06
Speaker
And we're trying to figure out how that works. You're the receptionist. It's a little bit of a running jerk, actually, if Vincent's upset about something. I'm just like, well, go to HR then. I'll respond to you within seven to 90 business days. You review it and then I'll see whether you're in the right or not. We all know the answer to that. Poor old Vincent.
01:08:34
Speaker
Oh god, it was good fun. It was good fun. So is there anything coming up in the future? Any planned changes for Puro? What can we expect to see for Puro in the future?
Adapting to the Market and Financial Challenges
01:08:46
Speaker
um We're actually going to be looking at opening lunches midweek. It's exciting. So we find we want to cater for the locals at a bit more of an accessible rate um more often, essentially, because it's a little bit more expensive. We want to be a bit more welcoming, a bit more accessible. And we want to offer, you know, some just good food at very accessible rates, which we are already doing, but we want to sort of be a little bit more
01:09:17
Speaker
accessible essentially so we'll be doing like you know a two course menu 30 pounds maybe maybe some less we'll sort of review it but I saw we're looking at in the future within the next few weeks actually so that's exciting um we are employing another chef we've got a little apprentice start with us very soon there's lots of things going on you know like we were talking about the decor of the restaurant getting some new flowers in, to the table decor, to new chairs, to new tables. There's loads of things going on, you know, so every day just sort of reviewing things. What do we need? What can we do? um Yeah, it's just to be better, essentially. Obviously, it's very difficult times as it is anyway. um Running a restaurant financially is
01:10:05
Speaker
Relentless, you know, like everything is so expensive. ah Everything, you know, the produce, energy, staff, just everything in general. So the cost side of things are very difficult to manage. And um we obviously want to have that balance of we don't want to put it all on the customer because it's not fair. but It's not really much, you know,
01:10:30
Speaker
So I guess I'm learning a lot about that as well. But yeah, it's all going on. Very hard thing to juggle, isn't it? Because I feel like I always see comments saying like how expensive restaurants are to go out to at the moment and stuff like that. and um you know And they're usually quite negative and making it sound like the restaurants are just grabbing for money. Robin. And probably wants to be like, it's it's not not the case. like They are probably making the minimum margins that they can possibly do to survive at the moment.
01:10:59
Speaker
Yeah, that's literally it. you know like We're taking a massive hit at the moment um from our price. The produce we get in is premium. you know is The amount of work that goes into the dishes is huge. you know We've got four chefs currently. We're getting another one. um So the labour there is huge again.
01:11:22
Speaker
um So yeah, we're definitely taking a hit for now because we want to, you know, show everyone, you know, come join us. You know, we don't want to be shooting ourselves in the foot by charging huge prices. We want to be very accessible and welcoming and show everyone, you know, come join us. Have a nice time. Simple as that, you know, like...
01:11:42
Speaker
We don't want to rip people off. That's not why I go to work. youre not I want to work but feed people with great food. It's as simple as that. It's such a tough balance though, isn't it? It is. I know what your standards are and I know how well you want to do and what you you know what you expect to put on a plate, um but then you know trying to find that price point that's going to make people come into such a hard balance.
01:12:07
Speaker
you know it is it is and obviously the thing is like the higher market with the food now the mark the the amount of people that go for that now is obviously a lot more limited obviously the cost of living and things like this um you know especially the Bristol area for likes the sort of fast food scene is booming right now because it's cheap it's cheerful it's easy and um so yeah it's just like the food scene in general was kind of always moving it's interesting to see what's going on out there. It kind of has to be quite flexible to to pivot and um
01:12:42
Speaker
to change your offerings, I guess, without changing the identity of the restaurant. I think when I see two Michelin star restaurants offering quite a cheap set lunch menu, I'm like, all right, you can see where we're at then. Everyone is trying to adjust and pivot and make it so that people still want to come.
01:13:03
Speaker
Exactly and you you're seeing restaurants of very notable names closing every day so it is harder than ever without a doubt and yeah it's just like you say adapting I think you know talking to people what do they want what do they want to say you know a lot of the clients how we are coming to Pure at the moment are coming for a special occasion because they really want to you know have a really good time and stuff like that but we don't want to be just a special occasion restaurant we want to be you know your everyday restaurant as well obviously you know so that's where the lunches come in and we want to tick that off the list and again just welcome people in of all clients out you know. I think adding a lunch menu is a really smart thing as well because it it means you can still you know obviously give really nice food of but yeah at a more affordable price but then you're not pushing yourself out of that market for those special occasions because that would be really sad I think to
01:13:59
Speaker
to change what you're doing. You know, you guys are doing some really cool, incredible things. And I think, you know, me, you and everyone around would hate to see it dip because you thought maybe, you know, you weren't getting enough guests. So, well, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, 100%. I don't, you know, I wouldn't enjoy that. So yeah, it's interesting. You got to stay true to what you want to do, obviously, because there's no point doing it otherwise. And, um, but at the same time, it's just learning, you know, you got to,
01:14:28
Speaker
navigate you way through these things,
Restaurant Industry Realities
01:14:30
Speaker
haven't you? For anyone who realizes this is an audio medium, Tommy was just making a fish signal with his hand. Yeah, I do that quite a lot, just random sort of dance moves and stuff like this. Shame you don't get to see it, really. Maybe we'll move over to video one day, but I'm not brave enough for that yet. I thought that nicely, you know? Oh, you did. You put your best shirt on, I can see. Did your hair and everything? Not my best shirt.
01:14:57
Speaker
Um, we're creating a bit of a tradition on this podcast. So, um, I ask a really annoying question that I know everybody hates answering. So you can take a second to think about it. Um, but I wanted to ask you, is there something that you wish people knew about the industry, whether it's busting a myth or, I don't know, just something that you like think about and you're like, I wish, I wish just general average Joe Blow. They knew that about the industry.
01:15:24
Speaker
awesome That is an interesting question. I've never had that question before. You've got me thinking. i know That's why I said I know it's a horrible question. I don't know. I guess like... Oh, there's so many things. There's so many things. ah I really don't know. You've got me there. Let me think.
01:15:52
Speaker
ah
01:15:56
Speaker
I guess just like the sacrifice. I guess most people know that though, don't they? Like the hours you put in. But that's kind of a known thing, isn't it? I think it's the same thing within the industry. But I think maybe, you know, like your average guest might not quite realise that that one dish that they've taken to order for their main course, that that might have taken 12 hours worth of labour to make. Yeah.
01:16:18
Speaker
Yeah, I guess that would probably be it, just the effort into sometimes, because we take all the food to the customers. And sometimes it's a bit like, oh, you know, like you take out the food, explain the dish to them, and then it's kind of gone in two minutes, you know, and then you're like, oh, is it really worth doing all that for two minutes of your time? You know, they're like, obviously, it's plate of food. yeah but um Yeah, I guess just like, I don't know.
01:16:49
Speaker
Either way, yeah, what you just said, I think I'll go with that. Maybe you need to start looking really tired when you take it out and, you know, yeah like put some like black line under your eyes and make yourself look really knackered and you're like, it's taking me three days to make for you.
01:17:08
Speaker
yeah no like I know people people are very um appreciative of of the food so I'm not really looking for that anyway but I just wish people understood the hard work that goes into not just the plate of food you know like the hard work of the game as a whole and we're a bit more I guess appreciative of the hard work you know because some people who go out to eat are extremely rude you and think this and that and everyone's got their own things and what they think and stuff and that's just the way it is. you know
01:17:39
Speaker
um but There is a lot that goes
Emotional Connection to Feedback
01:17:43
Speaker
into it. You worked hard and all it takes is one customer a week to say that, oh, that was a bit bland. And then that's it, then that's your week to straw. It really is. It really is. Why does that stick in so much? the You know, the 99 good comments, we we tend to sort of tune out, but that one yeah might not be that negative, just like a slight criticism. We just focus on it and we just take it so, so hard.
01:18:07
Speaker
Yeah, it's interesting because like no other people ah yeah you say your office works like well you know you do your 90 or five you go home and then you live your evening and but like as a chef it's kind of like it's a lifestyle isn't it you know you're always thinking about what can I do now or you know do your ordering on your day off or do this and that and it's kind of like it's just this ever going journey that you've got to keep running on just to keep on top of it because not because you have to because you feel like you want to, I suppose. Yeah, for sure. It's like a hamster wheel. Yeah. You just don't want to get off. Yeah, it is. A little hamster wheel. Yeah. A little hamster wheel. You're running on with one leg. Just hop in. I'm trying to win with one leg. Because it's more difficult, isn't it? Right.
01:18:54
Speaker
was running um pointing my leg been along Well, thank you so much for coming on here. Um, everybody should go check out Piro because I can tell you it is absolutely amazing. And you guys worked so hard to, you know, put out some really cool and interesting foods. So, and the wines as well, the wines are amazing. Um, so everyone go check out Piro, which is in Cleveland, um, if you're in Bristol and even if you're not make the journey. Thank you so much for coming on.
01:19:25
Speaker
Thank you so much, lovely to meet you. Take care.