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Gotta Rate 'em all! Pokemon Generation 1 Tier List
152 Plays11 months ago
In this episode, Satsunami is joined by Andrew to rank the first generation of Pokemon. But with 151 of them, how will they judge if they truly are in the top percentage of Rattatas or if their dads indeed sell Moo Moo Milk? Let us know if your favourites were featured in this list!
This podcast is a member of the PodPack Collective. The members are as follows:
Chatsunami
Casting Views
Nerdstalgic
2 Girls 1 Reusable Cup
Review it Yourself
Seismic Cinema
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Transcript
Welcome and Catching Up
00:00:05
Speaker
Welcome to Chatsunami.
00:00:17
Speaker
Hello everybody and welcome to another episode of Chatsunami. My name's Chatsunami and joining me today is none other than the top tier podcaster himself, Andrew. Andrew, welcome back. Chatsunami invited Andrew. It was super effective. Well done. Very good. Thank you. Yeah, how are you doing tonight?
00:00:35
Speaker
Yeah, I'm good. It's been a fun festive period.
New Podcasting Tools
00:00:38
Speaker
We've actually not been on to record with each other for quite a number of weeks now. So it's nice to get back into the seat in front of the microphone. I've been given a few toys to help with the podcasting over the last couple of months. So hopefully things sound nice and clear for everyone at home and makes it a much easier process in editing for Satsunami. It's been 84 years indeed, Sandra. It's been 84 years.
00:00:58
Speaker
Yeah, today we are coming at you with a topic that, quite honestly, I'm quite surprised you and I haven't done an episode on
Intro to Pokémon Discussion
00:01:05
Speaker
it. That, of course, being the wonderful world of Pokémon. Yeah, for sure. I know you've done quite a few episodes now with other guests. I think it might have only been Craig, but you've done a few episodes with him and I know there's some more to come this year, so it was nice to be able to hop on and contribute to my thoughts on the series.
00:01:21
Speaker
I can't wait to hear your spicy takes today because we are indeed going to be doing another tier list, which I think the last one, at least Pokemon-wise, that we did for the show was with Craig and I when we did our tier list on Generation 2 and 3. And yeah, that was certainly an interesting list, I'm not gonna lie.
00:01:44
Speaker
That was a very, very interesting last. But today we are keeping it old school, we're going retro, we are going to be focusing solely on Generation 1. Now before we go on to this, what is your experience with this generation? Was this your generation growing up?
00:02:01
Speaker
This was my original generation. Yeah. I did grow up with the games and the show from the very beginning. So I think I got to grips with the games best from generation three onwards. Like that was the first one that I completed and like understood what was going on in the game. But I hold such a special place for generation one because it was what I played. It was, I watched the TV show. I had some of the trading cards. I used to play Pokemon stadium as well. I had such a huge interest in this initial generation and I've gone back and played it.
00:02:31
Speaker
more so than any other, especially when the remake Fire Red came out or the Game Boy Advance, I want to say. I've played that more than possibly any other video game that I've ever played, maybe with some exceptions, but I played that so often that I'm more familiar with this generation than any other. What about yourself?
First Pokémon Experiences
00:02:48
Speaker
Yeah, I definitely played this growing up. This was my very first entry into the series with Pokémon Yellow, which I didn't realise came out in the year 2000. I thought it was like way earlier than that, but I played it absolutely adored it. It was just one of my favourite games of all time. Then it was introduced to Pokémon Silver, which I loved even more. It was definitely the game that I think
00:03:12
Speaker
I spent the most hours on because I played it so much that the battery died on me, so I lost all my old original Pokemon on it. And then throughout the years I kind of had a love-hate relationship with Pokemon. I played Sapphire when it came out. I loved it. Unfortunately, we're
00:03:30
Speaker
or maybe fortunately for yourself, we're instead going to be focusing on Generation 1 today. So see, without any further ado, will we jump in and start wrecking a lot of people's childhood with us dealers?
Ranking Criteria Debate
00:03:43
Speaker
Yeah, you and I have obviously done one tier list before and I was saying prior to the recording that we were very amicable, I felt, with our kind of decision making and
00:03:51
Speaker
our conversations on that. I think that might have been like the Disney or Pixar tier list. We did the Pixar tier list and we were pretty amicable. I don't know if that's going to be the case today, which might make for a more interesting listen. So as I get my fisticuffs ready, we have five tiers that we are going to be running through today. For our S slash top tier, we have top percent of ratatas. For our A tier, we have shiny Charizard. For B, we've got I wanna B, the very best.
00:04:21
Speaker
for C tier, we've got Professor OK, I guess. And last but not least, for our undesirable tier, we have Yerda Sails Moo Moo Milk. And we hope that none of these Pokemon end up in that tier, but without any further ado, let's listen to some messages and we'll be right back.
00:04:40
Speaker
Welcome to Chatsunami, a variety podcast that discusses topics from gaming and films to anime and journal interests.
Podcast Interlude
00:04:48
Speaker
Previously on Chatsunami, we've analysed what makes a good horror game, conducted a retrospective on Pierce Brosnan's runs James Bond and listened to us take deep dives into both the Sonic and Halo franchises.
00:04:59
Speaker
Also, if you're an anime fan, then don't forget to check us out on our sub-series, Chatsunani, where we dive into the world of anime. So far, we've reviewed things like Death Note, Princess Mononoke, and the hit Beyblade series. If that sounds like your cup of tea, then you can check us out on Spotify, iTunes, and all good podcast apps. As always, stay safe, stay awesome, and most importantly, stay hydrated.
00:05:22
Speaker
Join me, Slade, and my two co-hosts, Joey and Tim, over at The Video Game Club, where once every two weeks we review a video game, not too dissimilar to a podcast.
Starter Pokémon Debate
00:05:35
Speaker
You can find us at The Video Game Club on all good podcast providers and some sketchy ones as well.
00:05:46
Speaker
I have a proposition for you, go on. So for the first three, I feel as if it would maybe be in our best interest to rank the starters on the same tier, purely to not get hate mail. I would honestly say C for the three starters, I would genuinely put them at the top percent of Rattata. And when I say starters, I just mean the first tiers for Bulbasaur, Charmander and Squirtle.
00:06:13
Speaker
I was going to suggest we discuss the initial evolutions for those three before we move on to the next ones as well. I do think Squirtle deserves to be the top percentage of Rioters. Controversially, Charmander and Bulbasaur would go in Shiny Charizard for me. They're okay. I don't think that Charmander's as cool as a later evolution of his, but I am willing to concede those three to be in the top percentage of Rioters.
00:06:37
Speaker
I love how we were like, no, we're going to be harsher. It's like, yes, I can see jokes aside, I completely agree with you there. I feel as if they are the most iconic scene terms of starters in any generation. They are the ones people know best, I would say. I think just because this might not be true. So I say it was when Pokemon was at its most popular.
00:06:56
Speaker
No, that's fair to say, because I mean, even with Generation 2, it was really popular, but Gen 1 was when things really took off. But I was wondering if more copies were sold for the later games than the initial games. So next on the list, we have the... Ah, now this is a tough one, because we've got the three middle evolutions. We've got Ivysaur, Charmeleon, and War Turtle. Now, personally,
Ranking Pokémon
00:07:22
Speaker
would you say that these are on the same tier?
00:07:25
Speaker
I'm generally of the opinion for starter Pokemon that the middle tier is always the weakest. And I don't think that the first generation is really an exception to that. I don't really hold much of a relationship with them. It always felt like a stopgap of lists like, all right, need to get to final evolution for these particular Pokemon.
00:07:44
Speaker
I don't know that they're necessarily bad, but I think they're pretty whatever. I remember from the anime, he didn't evolve Squirtle or Bulbasaur, but Charmander evolved into Charmeleon. And he was just a bit of a dick for a while. And he continued to be a dick when he was Charizard, but he was just a bit kind of impertinent. He was like a mopey teenager. So my controversial opinion, middle tier, I want to be the very best. For all three of them. For all three of them.
00:08:05
Speaker
See, I would agree with you there, to be honest. Yeah, the middle tier, I think the only exception, see off the top of my head, and this is going to Generation 2, but the only exception for that is Bayleaf. I mean, I feel as if I prefer that to the other Evolutions, but that's literally the only exception I can think of off the top of my head, because usually the middle tier, as you said, or yeah, basically just
00:08:28
Speaker
they're there. They're like a means to an end to get the cool Pokémon. Speaking of which, that's who we've got next. We have Venusaur, Charizard and Blastoise. Now Charizard and Blastoise, I get the feeling you're going to put them in the top percent of Rattatas.
00:08:43
Speaker
Yes, I do think that Charizard and Blastoise deserve to be in the top percentage of Riotaz. They are among my favourite Pokémon. Blastoise is one of my favourite Pokémon for sure. Charizard I think is up there definitely, I think probably deserves to be there. I could hear an argument for Shiny Charizard because I do think as much as I do love Charizard, I do think he's a little bit overrated. Venusaur, I don't hate Venusaur, but like I'm not interested in Venusaur.
00:09:09
Speaker
I would definitely say Venusaur's the weaker of the three. Which, I mean, I'm a Bulbasaur fan. I love Bulbasaur. I think he's one of the coolest ones. But for his final evolution, I would put it as shiny Charizard even. For Venusaur? For Venusaur, yeah. I'm willing to agree that Charizard and Blastoise are top percentage. But Venusaur, I would say shiny Charizard because I don't think it's as bad as the Meadow Tears. But at the same time, I don't think it's got quite that
00:09:38
Speaker
to put it in the top percent of Rattata. I think it's somewhere in between those two. I think I would make an argument for either top tier of the middle group or bottom tier of Shiny Charizard. I don't think Venusaur is particularly interesting. I think it looks the silliest of the three. I didn't enjoy its moveset as much as the other two. One of its big power moves was like Solar Beam, but it required Build Up to be able to do that unless it was a sunny day. So I'm willing to put it in either B tier or lower A tier.
00:10:07
Speaker
I would say shiny Charizard. Okay, I was in between, so I'm willing to put that in shiny Charizard. Blastoise goes straight to the top. Yeah, Blastoise and Charizard are well with that. They look cooler. And I'm just turning away the model of Bulbasaur there. Don't look at me. That's Bulbasaur though. He isn't defined by his later evolutions. You could give him an Everstone of where it's called and keep him a Bulbasaur forever.
00:10:30
Speaker
That is true. That is true. I keep saying he. It's a gender non-specific. So next on the list, we have the three bug lines. We have Caterpie, Metapod and Butterfree. We have also got Widokakuna and Beedrill. I've got a particular bias against Beedrill, just purely because I don't like bees. There's no other reason. I just think the thought of a giant bee is terrifying. I like Beedrill. I think they look
00:10:56
Speaker
cool. And they're quite a fun Pokemon to have in your party. So I think Beedrill is decent. I'm not a fan of Kakuna or Metapods. I'm not a fan of them either, but do you know what gives Kakuna the edge? Do you remember all those memes where it looks as if he's wearing a shirt and tie? I do like that he looks like he's wearing a shirt and tie. I mean, where's Metapods?
00:11:19
Speaker
I mean, Metapod's got the weird, you know that optical illusion of the rabbit and the duck? It's like, what do you see first? Metapod's got one of those weird faces where if you look at it one way, he's facing one way, but if you look at it the other way, it looks like he's frowning with a very pointy nose. Yeah, I'm just looking at that now, actually. Yeah, it's really weird, isn't it?
00:11:41
Speaker
Yeah, I can't justify putting Metapod anywhere higher than Yodasismumumu milk. I just can't. I think it's such an annoying Pokémon to encounter. It just uses Harden. It's rubbish. I do not like Metapod and I'm willing to send it into the fiery pits of Yodasismumu milk. For any complaints, please send them to Andrew. So what about Kakuna then? Would you go for Professor Okie, I guess? Or
00:12:04
Speaker
I would also want to put them in your diacels with my milk. Are you strongly in favour of Professor OK, I guess? It's just the shirt and tie combo. I mean, look at, you know, the virgin metapod versus the chat cocoona. You know what? I could easily put them in your diacels with my milk, but I do think he's dressed very sharply. We'll put cocoona in Professor OK, I guess.
00:12:27
Speaker
What about their pre-evolutions, Caterpie and Widow? I hold a little bit of nostalgia for Caterpie from the Pokémon series. It is kind of cute. It is useless, but it's kind of cute. So I'm willing to put it somewhere between. I'm being very on the fence here with all these, but I'm going to put it in between. I want to be the very best and Professor Oak, I guess.
00:12:46
Speaker
I would probably go for I Wanna Be The Very Best purely for the fact it is like the first Pokemon you're likely to catch beyond the generic ones. I mean, Widow has that as well, but I suppose they are iconic enough to be in I Wanna Be The Very Best, but then they are saying that Caterpie and Widow are the same as Ivysaur to Wartortle. There's tiers within those tiers, I feel like. You can be the lower end of that tier.
00:13:14
Speaker
If we were going to do this properly, we'd have sub tiers here. Sub tiers, we'd have 10 tiers almost, but like, that's not interesting. So we'll be more firm and we'll say this goes in this tier, this goes in this tier. I think Caterpie deserves to be in the very best. Okay. Same with Weedle? No, fuck Weedle. Okay. That says Moomin milk. The thing with Weedle is that you're going through Viridian Forest, you get hit with Poison Sting, and now you have to head back down to Viridian City.
00:13:40
Speaker
Is Viridian City not the one you come out after? No, that's Pewter City. Oh, okay. So you head back down to Viridian City, and you have to go get Antidote, or you have to go back to the Pokémon Center, because now you're your Pokémon, or all poisoned, and you're about to die. And if you're on a Nuzlocke, it's one of the biggest screwovers, like, early in the game. I do not like Weedle. I'm willing to put it in your dad's sesame milk, because of how annoying it is. I agree. And to Butterfree and Beedrill. So, Butterfree.
00:14:05
Speaker
shiny Charizard at least your way. Okay, so it's a complicated one, because I would not use a Butterfree in any time I would play it now. But it has been in my squad before. And I have that nostalgia from the TV show for it. I have the Leaving Ash episode of the show, which was very emotional.
00:14:24
Speaker
It was useful as well because it could learn some flying type moves, which was good when you got to like the grass gym, but it was quite weak. You often kind of used it as just that one that would learn all like the status effect moves. You'd give it sleep powder and stun powder and poison powder and all that kind of stuff. So it kind of just held that position in the team. I'm more keen to put it into B tier. What is your argument for Shiny Charizard?
00:14:48
Speaker
You know what, I could probably concede to want to be the very best because it's just because it's more, as you said, it's iconic. You've got that very poignant episode of the anime as well. But I mean, it learns moves like Confusion, which is game breaking in Generation 1. But it is also very squishy because it's a butterfly.
00:15:07
Speaker
I'd forgotten about the psychic moves it can learn. That is quite useful. I mean, I'm happy to drop down to B tier for that. I wouldn't say it's a staple like you need Butterfree, but I do think it's a very valuable member of the team. Probably say the same for B drill though, to be honest. I do think, jokes aside about being terrified of Bs, I do think he is a very good asset for the team. I do like me and B drill. B drill can learn a lot of the hidden moves as well, which is quite useful from what I remember. It could learn cut and I think it could learn strength maybe.
00:15:37
Speaker
maybe rock break it, I'm not sure, but Beedrill could learn quite a few useful moves to be your kind of party member that held those HMs. And Pin Needle was quite fun and just trying to like battle through with Beedrill. And then going to another content creator, watching Game Grumps play Pokemon Fire Red, they like heavily depended on their Beedrill. And like, there was a whole kind of narrative around how Beedrill was like their best Pokemon. And that was always quite fun. I'm willing to put that into, I want to be the very best as well, because I recognize that it's not amazing, but it's still pretty cool Pokemon. And I would put it just slightly ahead of
00:16:06
Speaker
So next up we have the Pidgey line. So we've got Pidgey, Pidgeotto and Pidgeot, which this might be semi-controversial. I would probably say for Pidgey as Professor OK, I guess, but it's Pidgeotto that is the more iconic out of the three.
00:16:26
Speaker
I was also going to talk about this, that the second line is actually my favourite of the three, which is, we were discussing that earlier, it's not very common for a lot of evolutions, but it's my favourite of those. But Pidgeot's good, but he's not iconic, and plus technically he does get called Pidgeotto in the Pokemon form, which is what I learned today.
00:16:45
Speaker
There's a guy with a Pidgeotto and he goes, oh yeah, high winds are a breeze for Pidgeotto here. And it's like, you're a liar, sir. You're a damn dirty liar. Well, I'm trying to see what the main differences in appearance between them are. Pidgeotto has like a bit of a bigger belly and it's like hair thingy is, I guess, a bit straighter. It doesn't go down its back as much. And then its talons look more like inwards, whereas Pidgeotto is more out grasping, like it's about to grab a mouse.
00:17:09
Speaker
Pidgeotto's more... it's got the yellow and red stripes on the hair, like at the top of its head, whereas those stripes are more for Pidgeotto's tail. Personally, I would say that, as I said, Pidgey, Professor Okayage's Pidgeotto, maybe I want to be the very best at the very least.
00:17:29
Speaker
I think Pidgeotto deserves to be Shiny Charizard. I really like Pidgeotto. Okay, I'll concede to that. I was going to say it, but then I was like, do I want to put him up that high, but I do think he's iconic. Pidgeot. I'm between, I want to be the very best in okay, I guess. I don't really hold that much attachment to Pidgeot. I would say okay, I guess, as well. Alright, just slightly ahead of Pidgey for me. Right, I'm putting ahead of Kakuna. Screw Kakuna. Is that business suit that saved him? You're on thin ice, Kakuna.
00:17:56
Speaker
So our next group are the Rattata Brothers Rattata and Rattakate which I'm going to be honest, I would actually, you see this is the kind of weird thing because with Pidgey I think Pidgey's okay, you know he's not the best but I would say Rattata and Rattakate are very underrated.
00:18:16
Speaker
I wish I could like screen share with you right now. Cause I'm just hovering Rata, like at the very top and ahead of the star Pokemon, the top percentage. Will we put them at the top percent? No, I'm just kidding. I would argue I want to be the very best for Rata. I'm not as big a fan of Raticate. I think probably cause it kind of creeps me out.
00:18:33
Speaker
Yeah it's got big teeth in the big tail. The only reason I'm saying yes is in terms of I want to be the very best for Raticate is because I did a Nuzlocke live on Twitch and I always remember, I actually don't remember if you watched it at the time, it was like the Pokémon green one. I think I came into some of it. Yeah and I had a Raticate call Kevin and he ended up dying quote on quote in the run but because I caught a Haunter I ended up calling it Kevin after.
00:19:02
Speaker
So I would personally say B because I think normal types are severely underrated, especially Raticate. I feel as if he is really underrated. I don't have that strong an opinion other than it kind of creeps me out. So if you think it deserves to be in the B tier, I'm happy to put it there. I would lean more towards
00:19:21
Speaker
okay I guess but yeah I don't have a strong opinion on that. We'll go for a B tier then. Yeah it's a good B tier. So next up we have two Pokémon that clearly are in the top percent of Rattata because Professor Oak himself says you should use a Master Ball on Firo and I even used a Master Ball on Spiro as well. Remember when we played in uni?
00:19:44
Speaker
For context, we played Pokemon Fire Red and while Satsunami had control and I just got the master ball, he went into the tall grass, saw a Spiro and threw the master ball at it. He had, I did not realize prior to that, had saved the game. So he just reset from before that. But like for a moment, I thought he'd use my master ball and I was not happy.
00:20:02
Speaker
The reason I say for Pharoah is I used to have a Pokemon guidebook and remember when they used to get guidebooks? There was like a speech bubble beside Professor Oak and they'd be like, oh you should only use the Master Ball for important and strong Pokemon like Pharoah. And you were just like, what the hell Professor Oak?
00:20:20
Speaker
Personally I would put these guys at okay I guess. Maybe at a push I want to be the very best but that's where I'm kind of leaning because I never really liked these. No, I really dislike both of them to be honest but more so I dislike Spiro. I would be willing to put into your diet cells movement milk because I just don't like it. It's just one of those annoying ones you just encounter frequently in the grass and you're just like, oh go away. Well for both of them.
00:20:43
Speaker
No, more so for Spiro. Firo, I could concede to OK, I guess. But yeah, I do not like Spiro. I think that it's a lame Pokémon. It's a dirty Pokémon. I mean, that attacks Pikachu and Ash. Come on, though. It is quite iconic from the very first episode. I will give it that, that it's a very angry bird that you encounter for much first thing in your Pokémon journey if you start watching the show.
00:21:03
Speaker
as a kid. So it does have that going for it, but maybe I have internalised resentment for it because of it attacking Pikachu. It's okay, you're amongst friends here. The trauma I feel towards Spiro. Next up we have Ekans and Arbok. I would say Arbok is probably like, I want to be the very best because it's a lot more iconic. Ekans is just a snake though.
00:21:25
Speaker
I kind of like Ekans's face. I think it has a funny face. And I believe that Jessie from Team Rocket had Ekans before and then evolved into Arbok. If I remember correctly, I don't think she started with Arbok. No, you're right. Yeah, she started with Ekans and James started with Koffing. Yeah, you have a bit of nostalgia for Ekans from the very beginning of the show. And also both of them make a fun noise when they come out of the ball, like, Ekans, Arbok.
Gender Bias in Pokémon Design
00:21:51
Speaker
so they're cool. It is stupid that their names are just Snake and Cobra backwards, but they're fun. Ekans would probably be lower, be the very best, upper, okay I guess, and Arbok would be lower, be the very best for me I think. We would just put them both at be the very best. Sure. I think Arbok is the more interesting one for sure, but I will concede to that. If it's a low, be the very best, then Ekans probably deserves to slaughter his way up there.
00:22:18
Speaker
The design for Arbok with its cobroed out flat panel is interesting and it's got like a scary face on that. I think that's cool. Like Ekans is just quite boring. It's just a purple snake. They did add a like rattly bit at the back of it, but it just isn't very interesting. A lot of them are variations of an animal, whereas Ekans just feels like it's just an animal that they like changed color on in Photoshop. Do you think we should bump it down then to Professor Rokey? Yeah, I think so, to be honest. I feel as if you talked your way into
00:22:46
Speaker
Okay, next up, we have the iconic duo Pikachu and Raichu. Personally, I would put both of them up in top percent of Rattata, purely because Pikachu is, you know, he's the mascot, he's the most iconic without Pikachu. You wouldn't really think of Pokémon without seeing Pikachu, and Raichu, I think, just gets a really bad rap compared to Pikachu. From me, mostly. I don't care for Raichu. I think Raichu is just there. Aww, what?
00:23:15
Speaker
What did Raichu do to you? I was never interested in Raichu. I just don't think that Raichu is an interesting Pokémon. The initial instinct was that Pikachu would go to upper tier Shiny Charizard, but you are right. It is so iconic. It is so kind of necessary to the franchise that it kind of deserves a place on the top percentile. Raichu, I would put it in to be the very best, personally. We could concede that Shiny Charizard
00:23:39
Speaker
I'm willing to negotiate Raichu into Shiny Charizard. I do not think it deserves to be that high but if you want it in the top percentage category then I think that's a fair compromise. I'll put my Shiny Charizard in as a compromise because I know you mean I think he gets a bad rap because he's related to Pikachu and I think
00:23:58
Speaker
that because he's related to Pikachu that a lot of people go, oh look, it's the famous sibling, just the weird cousin in the corner. It's like, who's that? And speaking of orange and fluffy, next we have two creatures that I've just realised aren't orange and fluffy. They're now those things of yellow and hard.
00:24:14
Speaker
We have Sandshrew and Sandslash. I personally, I don't know about you, but I personally do really like these Pokémon. I also quite like these Pokémon. I think that Sandshrew looks really cute, and I think Sandslash looks cool. Sandslash is like Wolverine almost. And a Hedgehog when he rolls up. That's true. You don't really see him roll up. You see him in Pokémon Let's Go. When he's moving behind you, he rolls in a ball. Oh, that's so cute. I've not had Sandslash walk behind me before in Pokémon. Let's go. That's really cute.
00:24:44
Speaker
probably shiny Charizard tier but what are your thoughts or do you think it should be lower and I want to be the very best because it is quite a hard one. I think Sandshrew be the very best and I'd say sand slash lower tier shiny Charizard.
00:24:59
Speaker
for me. That's a fair show. I mean Sandshoe is pretty darn cute, not gonna lie. So next up we have the Nidoqueen line. We've got Nido Rand Female, we've got Nido Reiner and we've got Nido Queen. This is gonna sound bad of me but I personally think the Nido King line are a lot cooler looking. I've never really been a fan of this line. At a push I would say I wanna be the very best.
00:25:25
Speaker
What's the second evolution called again? Nidorino. Nidorina is my favorite of the three. Going off the six, I would say Nidoking is my favorite, then Nidorina, then Nidorino. Really? And then Nidoquine, and then Nidoran.
00:25:41
Speaker
Their names are all too similar, so I can never remember this evolution line. Purple one, I'd say blue first gen is the worst, then purple first gen, then Nidoqueen, then purple second gen, then blue second gen, then Nidoking for me. What is your preferred order? What do you think is the best?
00:26:00
Speaker
Personally I think the male Nido Ran line are quite cool and I think maybe that's because of the opening for the games and the anime where you've got Nido Reno fighting against Gengar. I think that pulls it for me but I've never liked the Nido Ran line for the female side. I don't know why, if it's just the design or I know what you're gonna say. You bigot.
00:26:26
Speaker
Like, in general, I don't know what it is, it's just, I think it's okay. I think it's cool, but compared to a poison bunny and four legs, and then you've got Nidoking that just looks like he's gonna trash through your house. I mean, personally, I would put at least Nidorine, no. I think Nidorina and Nidorino, the two middle-level missions, I would put them in shiny Charizard, and I would probably put Nidoking in either low top percent of Rattata to shiny Charizard.
00:26:54
Speaker
I'm of the same opinion for Nidor King. I think it kind of falls between the two. I'd be willing to put it into the top percentage of rioters because I did always grow up thinking it was like one of the coolest Pokémon. Nidoquine never really interested me, and I guess it's because it didn't look as cool as Nidoking. But I think I prefer Nidorina to Nidorino. I think that that's a more interesting kind of Pokémon than Nidorino is. First off, put Nidor King in top percentage.
00:27:17
Speaker
I want to argue Nidorina to be Shiny Charizard. Yeah, that's fine with me. I would say Nidorino and Shiny Charizard as well, though that's my way concession there. Okay, if I get to have Nidorina in there, then you get to have Nidorino in there. We did it, Andrew. We solved the quality. Once you get to the top, it's all meant.
00:27:41
Speaker
Yeah, I would say Nidoran, both male and female, probably I want to be the very best. I would probably put Nidoran female in okay, I guess. I do like that in the very start of the Game Grumps episode, that when Presser Oak is explaining Pokémon to you, he releases a female Nidoran and they just sort of scream. Oh yeah, I remember that. Other than that, it was always just kind of like, it was there in the total grass, you'd kind of encounter him like, oh, it's this thing. What about the other Nidoran? Probably in okay, I guess as well.
00:28:08
Speaker
Yeah, upper level of okay I guess. I don't think it's as good as a lot of the Pokemon in the rest of the B tier. Nido Queen is a tough one for me because I think Nido Queen is somewhere between be the best and okay I guess. I could put it in either. Will we put it in wannabe the very best? Sure.
00:28:23
Speaker
I'm not the biggest fan personally, but I don't think it's overly offensive, it's still recognisable in terms of them. But speaking of recognisable, we have two, surprisingly one of the other mascots of the series, we have Clefairy and Clefable, which I still can't believe they were going to be the mascots for the girl version of Pokemon.
Pokémon Mascot Discussion
00:28:44
Speaker
was it gonna be the girl version? I thought it was just gonna be the version. I thought it was just like instead of Pikachu it was gonna be Clefairy. Well that may be a rumor because there was rumors of a Pokemon pink version and people were saying oh it's for... I could be wrong in that I'm sure it was like you know one for girls one for boys they were thinking initially.
00:29:02
Speaker
and then we're going to move it to Clefairy and then Mitchell's Pikachu. It's a whole jumbled mess but yeah they were formally going to be a mascot of some variety but I'm going to be honest okay I guess or I want to be the very best. Yeah I would put both in that category. Okay I guess or...
00:29:20
Speaker
Yeah, I'd put both of them in okay I guess. The only thing I will say is they're damn lucky I'm not putting them in your daisils moo moo milk after that horrific minigame. Which one was that again? It was like you had to follow the directions on the d-pad. Oh I think I remember that. And you got bumped by a hammer if you didn't do it right and it was the most
00:29:44
Speaker
Next up, we have Vulpix and Ninetales. Vulpix and Ninetales, I would say probably B to be honest. Like maybe Shiny Charizard for Ninetales, but Vulpix I would say B.
00:29:59
Speaker
Yeah, I completely agree with that. I'd say Vulpix, B tier, Ninetales, Shine Charizard. They're cool. There are some of the earliest fire Pokemon you can get in the game. Ninetales you can only get with Firestone though, right? Yeah, that's right. Yeah, I remember that being a bit of an annoying thing, but it looks cool. It's based on Japanese folklore. I like it. It's cool. Next we've got a Vogtorb. Oh, sorry. No, that's a Jigglypuff from Wapai.
00:30:22
Speaker
That reference will never get old. I personally, I would say, regularly tough would be in the B tier, but I would say Jigglypuff's in shiny ratchet hat tier, purely just because of how iconic it was in the anime. I agree with both of those. I don't have strong opinions either way, Jigglypuff is pretty iconic. She's like the Miss Piggy of the Pokemon world, and they have of course the iconic stuff in the anime where her singing makes everyone fall asleep, she draws in their faces, love it. Not quite top tier, but we do stand at Jigglypuff.
00:30:49
Speaker
Zubat and Golbat, I would personally say her dad sells Moo Moo Milk. Do you have any objections to that one? Golbat, I would put in okay I guess. Personally, do you strongly feel Moo Moo Milk for them? Only for Zubat, just because of how annoying they are in the caves.
00:31:04
Speaker
Yeah, I mean Golbat's also very annoying to be fair. He's less prevalent. I will agree. He's okay. He's not bad to use. I just, I don't like his face. I don't like his long tongue that comes out of nowhere because he's not got a stomach. Yeah, where does his food go? He's just a mouth.
00:31:20
Speaker
He's a mouth with legs. He's like Mike Wazowski with legs. People have said that about me Satsu. People have said that about me. True, true. For the next one, we have a line that I have to apologise for after the Living in the Pokemon World episode. We have Audish, Gloom and Vyoplum. Audish, I would say maybe Bee.
00:31:40
Speaker
purely because I'm apologizing for saying that it gets milked. Gloom, I would say, in your da sales movie milk tier because I've never liked it. And Vileplume, maybe, and I want to be the very best as well. Yeah, I could get on board with that. Vileplume's kind of annoying again because it requires a stone to evolve it. I feel like it was one of those ones where you'd learn to use
00:32:01
Speaker
stones for it. Not so much like because Eevee mostly falls into that bracket. I feel like Vileplume is one of the first ones you use a stone on. Same kind of situation as Butterfree. It kind of feels like a stat effect Pokémon. You don't really get much from it. Oddish is very cute. Again, someone you meet very early on and can be quite useful if you went down like the fire route to try and beat Brock at Pewter Gym is to get an Oddish so you could use some grass moves to kind of get past
00:32:26
Speaker
Brock. Otherwise, I would probably say Oddish, B tier, Gloom, Udassil's Moomoo Milk. And then Vaalploom, somewhere between B and, okay, I guess. So the next one we've got, personally, Abba T, Udassil's Moomoo Milk for these ones are the Paris lines, purely because they're just nightmare fuel.
00:32:44
Speaker
They are pretty horrific and like the Pokemon entry behind them of they're essentially like that fungal parasite. I'm happy to put them in Daz's movement because they creep me out as a kid. I didn't like them. I didn't like the white eyes. Is it Parasect? Parasect has, yeah. I don't like Parasect's like milky white eyes. At least with Parasect it has pupils. Parasect just looks like a zombie. Like it's actually horrifying.
00:33:03
Speaker
Yeah, and plus it bodies a mushroom as opposed to the two small mushrooms on Paris. Yeah, it's completely overwhelmed by the parasite. It's incredibly disturbing. So for the next one, we have Venina and Venomoth. I would say Venina, at least for the first one, is potentially in shiny Charizard.
00:33:23
Speaker
Oh wow, really? Maybe low shiny Charizard or high. I want to be the very best. What's your reasoning for that? I just think it looks cute.
Evolution Line Analysis
00:33:31
Speaker
Even though it's a bug type, it's just like a ball with fluff. I mean, look at it, which is ironic because it evolves into a moth. So it's a literal mothball. I was going to say it's a mothball. It's a pun. It's a dad pun, which does elevate it slightly, I guess. I do not agree it should be in shiny Charizard. I think the jokiness of it and the fact it's kind of cute elevates it from okay, I guess, to B tier for me.
00:33:51
Speaker
Yeah, I would say beatier then. Venomoth, I never was really interested in. Yeah, it's okay. Yeah, and I think it falls into that category exactly. I think it's an okay book of one. Now dig, but the thing is, I like it well enough, but I feel as if it's too simplistic.
00:34:07
Speaker
It is quite boring. There's a lot of puns around it, a lot of memes around it. There's an enjoyment to be had of both Diglett and Dugtrio. And within the game, once you hit a familiar city and you don't have a Pokémon that can fight against electric types, then going to the Diglett Cave and getting ground or rock type Pokémon can be very useful. And so that makes Diglett a bit more valuable than it would otherwise be. Its moveset is a bit kind of
00:34:31
Speaker
Whatever, Digg is just kind of an annoying version of fly. I mean, I would personally maybe say Digglets. I want to be the very best, but Ducktrio's okay, I guess. Three is not better than one. No, there's no. Bigger isn't better, I was just saying.
00:34:46
Speaker
Sure, Diggum's kind of cute as well, so I'm happy to do that. Next we have Meowth and Persian. I would say Meowth. See, if we're basing it on the anime, I would put them up in Shiny Charizard here. If we're basing them on the Pokémon, I would really get them to, I want to be the very best in Persian on OK, I guess.
00:35:06
Speaker
I personally would definitely put Persian in, okay I guess, I don't really hold any attachment to it. It's the bad guy Pokemon from Team Rocket, that's kind of all it was to me, because Giovanni had one in the anime, potentially also he had one in his gym, I can't remember, but I didn't really have much attachment to Persian, I thought Persian was just kind of there. I'm not really a cat person as well, so I never really was drawn to Persian. Meowth,
00:35:28
Speaker
Yeah, you have the nostalgia for the anime for sure you have me out for that. I don't think that otherwise I like me on a very much. Yeah. So I do think it probably falls into B tier. In my opinion. Do you have a strong case that you want it to be in shiny Charizard? Nah.
00:35:43
Speaker
Not really. As I said, if it was anime only, he would be a lot higher, but I agree. I'm not a big fan of fighting with him. I don't think I've really ever used him, to be honest, but just not his biggest fan. I would say he's okay, I guess, because he's still iconic as a design, but I'll agree with that.
00:36:02
Speaker
He has payday or something, doesn't he? That's like his special move. Yeah, he can get money off the ground, which is useful, but other than that, you know. Now, hear me out here. Golduck, I think, is probably lower tier. Like, I want to be the very best or okay, I guess. Psyduck, on the other hand, I'm going to make a case where it being the top percent of Rattata. Really? I mean, look at that chubby face. I mean, I'll even go as low as shiny Charizard, but look at that chubby face. Until that boy is going lower.
00:36:30
Speaker
I don't know. I think the design for Psyduck is a lot better than Golduck. Yeah, Golduck is kind of just like meh. I'd be willing to even put Golduck into Priscilla OK, I guess, just because I don't really like it that much. Psyduck's pretty cute. I do like Psyduck. I can't, with goodwill, put it into the top percentage of relatives. I can't. But Shy Charizard, I'd be willing to put Psyduck in there. So doing Psyduck in Shy Charizard, Golduck in Priscilla OK, I guess. All right, we move on to the monkey line. Monkey and Primate.
00:36:58
Speaker
yeah monkey and primate i did not like these pokemon i found them really annoying in the anime i found them annoying in games i just don't really enjoy them what is your opinion on these pokemon i would say that primate at the very least is i want to be the very best monkey on the other hand i okay i guess i
00:37:18
Speaker
feel as if he's quite annoying to use until you get onto Primape. The only reason I like Primape is because I caught a shiny version of him on the very first Nuzlocke that I did in Leaf Green and it really got me through the battle. So much so that it got itself killed fighting Gary's blastoise of all things that sacrificed itself for that. So I would at least have it in B tier but yeah for Mankie I would say okay I guess.
00:37:45
Speaker
I'm willing to put Manki even lower than that in your diet cells moving milk. I don't think he's that bad to be honest. He's not offensive, that's the thing. The other ones we've gotten that year are either annoying or just hideous looking. I would argue that Manki doesn't deserve to be
00:38:02
Speaker
You can't do my boy like that. All right. I'm willing to put Manki in the lower tier of, okay, I guess, and Primate in the lower tier of be the best. Yeah. So next we have your favorites, actually. I love them. I love them so much. I'm going to make a strong case for Growlithe being low tier, shiny showers out, upper tier, one of the very best, Arcanine being top percentage of rioters. Which is quite funny because that's Gary's team there with Arcanine and Nidoking beside one another.
00:38:31
Speaker
I'm hiring to see my inner Gary motherfucking oak. Now, for the next three ones, for the poly black, poly rural, poly rath, I would say that poly rural is top percent of rathitas. I make a strong argument for that, but the others I would say probably be tear if not shiny chores art. What is your argument
00:39:08
Speaker
Whereas I don't think Poliwrath has that. He just gets wider and angrier and Poliwag's cute but I wouldn't say he's cute enough to be top percent. Okay I got them mixed up, to be honest. Okay I thought we were about to throw hands there.
00:39:09
Speaker
probably well.
00:39:23
Speaker
Yeah, I was wondering why you were going to bat for polywag. I was like, polywags is kind of there. I would say that's a B tier, usually. Polywag is cute in that it's a little tadpole and you've got a little tadpole tail. But that's a bit of it. I like the little spirally belly thingy because I've seen real life versions of these where they've got like the transparent stomach and you can see like the little intestines. Polywag, I would put lower B tier.
00:39:43
Speaker
I don't have particularly strong feelings towards Polywrath and Polywhirl. The one nostalgia I have, and I actually, to be honest, don't know which of the two it was, because they do kind of look the same to me. Polywrath just looks a little angrier, otherwise it's the same Pokémon, which I feel like is kind of a demotion for probably Polywrath and that it just isn't very original to Polywhirl.
00:40:03
Speaker
One of the two I had a little clay version of that you got to paint with like watercolours. And so that's somewhere still in my home in Scotland. And so I remember finally having that and painting that. I also have a three-star book when I think that same thing. Where did you want Polyworld to go? I would personally say Polyworld was definitely top percent of Rattata. Maybe a low tier top percent, but I would still say deserves to be there. But I do agree with Polywrath. I think he is not as distinct enough.
00:40:31
Speaker
It just looks the same because I know they diverged later on in Gen 2 when they had polytoad. We're not talking about Gen 2 but I don't like polytoad. No, me neither. I can't even remember what we rated it but it wasn't high.
00:40:43
Speaker
wasn't I. Yeah, so I would say polywag and polywrath. The two are probably B and I would personally say polywhirl as top tier. I will permit polywhirl top tier. I will concede that since I've had arcanine up there, I think polywrath is B tier, probably like mid B tier. I think polywag is probably upper, okay, I guess. So would you say polywrath for B tier? Yeah, upper B tier or mid B tier.
00:41:09
Speaker
So the next line we've got is the Abracadabra, Alakazam. I really like these Pokemon, I'm not gonna lie. I think these are definitely the more iconic of the original 150. Counterpoint, fuck Abran teleportation. Your death cells move me milk. In fact no sorry, I would probably say okay I guess for an Abran then.
00:41:29
Speaker
Yeah, Abra I just found very annoying. I did want an Abra so that I could get the stronger psychic type Pokémon because that line is kind of the strongest you can really get at that point. Abra was just annoying to try and catch because it would just teleport away if you didn't like put it to sleep or paralyze it or something straight away. We're settling on okay I guess for Abra.
00:41:47
Speaker
Kadabra? Kadabra's cool. Yeah, I'd rather like him. I would go as much as say Kadabra's shiny Charizard for me. I would definitely say he is at minimum shiny Charizard and at best top percent. I would vote him probably above Alakazam purely because Alakazam was a lot harder to get because you had to trade him over. That was going to be my exact point. Alakazam, if you did not have the wire to do the exchanges or friends to do the exchanges,
00:42:15
Speaker
I'm not confident I ever got Alakazam until maybe you and I played together. Any of the Pokémon that involved a transfer to evolve, I don't recall ever getting them. So yeah, I'm going to have a very negative impact on my voting for those Pokémon as a result, with a couple of exceptions. So what we say, shiny Charizard for Kadabra and want to be the very best for Alakazam.
00:42:38
Speaker
Yeah, I'd say lower would be the very best just because of how annoying it is to get Alkazam. My strongest memory of Alkazam is this from the Pokemon movie where you get the apps he marked by Mewtwo and like the spoons bent. Also the fact that Alkazam made an announcement in Kadabra of that psychic Yuri Geller suing Pokemon over his likeness being used for Kadabra and Alkazam. I think it was only the last couple of years they got that resolved. I could be wrong in that, or I say the last couple of years, the 2020s have been a blur.
00:43:04
Speaker
could have been a lot earlier. But yeah, was it not one of those as well that had a whole thing where like the Pokémon card had like a symbol on it that had to be removed? Was that a religious symbol or was it like a swastika or something? That was Gobat, because I think it was something to do with Koga's gym or something that was obviously meant to be like a tempo I think or something like that, but obviously the symbol doesn't translate very well to the west.
00:43:28
Speaker
so they had to completely change the design of the card. They had to do a lot of design changes, actually. So yeah, we've got the Machamp line. I'm gonna be honest, Machop, OK, I guess. Machop, I wanna be the very best. And Machamp, maybe I wanna be the very best or shiny Charizard. Machamp, again, is another one you have to trade to get, so I'm hesitant to put it in that. I do like Machoke, to be honest. So I would personally have Machoke, shiny Charizard, Machamp, OK, I guess. And Machop, I'd put in OK, I guess.
00:43:56
Speaker
Now, this might be semi-controversial, but I would say the Bellsprout line should automatically go in your daisells Moomymilk. Yes, with exception for Bellsprout being upper, okay, I guess, because I do kind of like it. I just don't like the designs, to be honest. Just the gaping mouth. It's just too weird. Tentacool and tentacool. I would put them in okay, I guess, just because they're purely annoying.
00:44:20
Speaker
It is annoying to encounter them so often, but tentacryl is actually pretty cool. I would put it lower tier, be the very best personally, but... I agree with that. But tentacryl is annoying. You encounter it too often. I would put it in your diet cells moo moo milk or lower tier, okay, I guess. What is your kind of preference? Yeah, no, I'd agree with that. Well, I would say that tentacryl is, I want to be the very best and tentacryl would be okay, I guess. It's annoying, but I don't think it's your diet cells moo moo milk tier. That's fair.
00:44:48
Speaker
Now here's the proposition for you. I think for the next ones, Geodude is probably shiny Charizard to you. Interesting. What's your reasoning? I mean, it's a rock with arms. How many properties have you seen Popeye the Rock with arms? So you've got ones, quite cool as well. I would say he's like one of the very best, but I don't like Graveler.
00:45:08
Speaker
I'm of the exact same opinion. I would do Geodude, yeah. Lower, Shine Charizard, Gollum, Between B the Best and Shining Charizard, because they look pretty cool. But you do need to do the trade to get them, which is annoying. So I think that demotes them down to be the very best. And then Graveler Socks, I'd put in, okay, I guess. It was like the thing from Basket Case. Next we have Polita and Rapidash.
00:45:27
Speaker
I love both of these. Rapidash in particular, I think is really cool. I would make an argument for Rapidash going in top percentage of Rattatas and Ponyetta being upper be the best, in my opinion. Yeah, no, I'll agree with you on that. It's definitely the more, again, it's the same thing with Polywhirl and Pikachu. You know, they're very iconic. You see it and you go, oh, that's a Pokemon. You don't just think, oh, it's a horse on fire. Oh, Jesus. Next we have, I'm going to be honest, for the next two, I would say top percent of Rattata. For both of them.
00:45:56
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, look at those faces. How can you say no to those faces? I knew that was going to be your argument because that was awesome. My argument, I do love their faces. I don't really like them as Pokemon, though I don't think they deserve to be in the top percentage of rioters. Slowbro, I would put lower tier Shiny Charizard and Slowpoke, I'd put Apogee be the very best, personally. What is your, I mean, you've said top percentage of rioters. Do you genuinely believe they deserve to be in top percentage of rioters?
00:46:19
Speaker
I would put both of them at shiny charizard, even if they're lower tier, just because of how iconic they are. Everybody knows even non-pokemon fans knows what a slowpoke is, and slowbro because, yeah let's face it, he's a psychic slowpoke. I feel though safer than the next one, for magnumite and magneton, I'm gonna use the same argument for dickalit, I would say magnumite's definitely a strong, I wanna be the very best, but magnuton is just okay I guess, because it's just the
00:46:49
Speaker
lights put together. Yeah, it is pretty boring. There's a lot there of like that, like we're going to come up to Duo and Dugtrio in a second. I don't really like either of them, to be honest. And you're walking through the laboratory, I think it is. They're just like everywhere and it's kind of annoying. And they've got Confuse Ray, which is really annoying. Why did you say you would put them again? Be the very best for Magnemite and OK, I guess, for Magneton.
00:47:10
Speaker
I don't care about that. Farfetch'd, I would say shiny Charizard minimum. I know it's basic, but it's a duck with a leek and I won't die at this hill. Fine, fine, fine. I was going to say Rattata, but... No, you were not convincing me to put in Rattata. That would have been a step too far. Dodo and Dodrio? Again, same argument. I want to be the very best for Dodo and Dodrio. Okay, I guess. That's the same idea.
00:47:34
Speaker
Yeah, it's just boring. Seo and Dugong. I kind of like them to be honest. I like Seo, but Dugong's noises really hurt me out. I impersonate Dugong more than probably any other Pokémon because I think it's just fun to make that noise. Oh, true, true. What do you say high B tier low shiny jars are? I would put them both high B tier personally. Okay. You're da.
00:47:56
Speaker
Surely. I think Grimer goes into your dad and I think Muk goes into OK. No, I would say the opposite. Oh, OK. Grimer looks a lot happier. I mean, look at him, he looks. But then again, he has that controversy with the trading card. I personally flip them around. I would say Muk is in low tier. Your dad sells movie milk and Grimer's OK, I guess, but we could compromise and put them both.
00:48:21
Speaker
But in the bottom tier, yeah, I'm way ahead of you there. They're already in the bottom tier. They put themselves there, they have no self-respect. Shelter and cloister, I like shelter. I've never been a big fan personally, but what is your argument for shelter, just the tongue sticking out? Yeah, it just looks cute. But I would probably say B tier, to be honest. It looks cute, but it's no high tier, I would say. I'd say lower B tier, yeah. Cloister, cloister's kind of cool, I guess, but I don't know, yeah. Is it another poison water type?
00:48:49
Speaker
No, I think it's just watertight. I don't know if it's supposed to be water ice, because I know they're really true, or whatever name it is she uses it. It has very high defense stats which are always really annoying to beat, but yeah, I think both of them beat here. Now, here's where we get to the real meat of it. We have the ghastly line, and I'll just save us some time here. I would personally say Haunter Gengar, or top Ritatta tier, and ghastly is maybe shiny Charizard, or hi, I want to be the very best. Word, did you want ghastly, sorry?
00:49:18
Speaker
probably shiny charizard or I want to be the very best? No, I think ghastly deserves to be mid B. I don't think it's much higher than that. I do think Haunter is probably upper B, lower shiny charizard for me. What are your thoughts? I don't know. I would put Haunter and Gengar at top percent of ratatat. Gengar definitely. Okay, so my argument about like you needing to trade things to get them, the exception being for me Gengar, because I think Gengar is just really cool.
00:49:44
Speaker
I would put Gengar in the top percentage of Rattatas, but Haunter, I'd put Shiny Charizard personally. What argument can you make towards it deserving the top place? I just think it looks really cool, but I will concede if it came between the two of them, then Gengar would be up there in the top percent of Rattatas. So yeah, now I can concede to Shiny Charizard here for Haunter. I'll put it in the upper Shiny Charizard then.
00:50:07
Speaker
I'm going to be honest, okay, I guess, maybe I want to be the very best here. I kind of like Onix. I would go to bat for at least B tier for me. It's quite iconic to me. Brock had one. It's one of the first gym Pokemon you face against and it feels like a real achievement once you've beaten it. So I think it deserves B tier personally.
00:50:23
Speaker
Now these next two, yeah, your dad says Moo Moo Milk, unless you could convince me otherwise. I can't and won't. I feel like it's almost controversial to try and defend these two because they are creepy and give off vibes that you do not want to discuss in more depth. Moving on swiftly, we have Krabi and Kingler. Yeah, I would put Krabi and I want to be the very best, I have to say, and Kingler maybe.
00:50:46
Speaker
and shiny Charizard. I would put Krabi upper mid to be the very best and Kingler lower shiny Charizard because I like both of them. I think they're cool. They have the anime connection going for them. I think they're fun. Now, what about the next ones? Because we've got Voltorb and Electrodes. I'd say OK, I guess. I've never really used them. And they do explode on you, which is just a nuzlocke disaster. Oh, God, don't get me started on that. Yeah, they are the worst to come up against. Yeah, I'll put them in OK
00:51:15
Speaker
I guess, personally. I'm actually curious to hear your opinions on the next two. Execute and executor. I've never really been a big fan of them. I've always kind of found them a bit meh. It's just some cracked eggs and a palm tree. I would personally put both in OK, I guess. Possibly executor and lower be the very best. But yeah, I don't write them particularly highly. No, I'm going to agree with that. Where would you like executor? Literally just the same Pokemon OK, I guess. Both of them OK, I guess. OK.
00:51:42
Speaker
Cubone and Marowak, I have a very strong case for top tier, for the top tier of Rattatas. For both? No, just for Cubone. Marowak I would say is B tier, A tier maybe, but the reason being is that Cubone, just the lore. Well yeah, it's Mum's Dead. Are you gonna really put a Pokemon whose Mum's just died?
00:52:05
Speaker
I don't know what are your thoughts for that? Yeah, I never really, like Marowak was kind of cool I guess, but I didn't hold that strong a relationship to it. Cubone is cute, has a sad story. Did you want it in the top tier? Honestly, I would go for shiny Charizard for it. Yeah, I think lower shiny Charizard for me for Cubone. Marowak I'd put upper to mid be the very best.
00:52:27
Speaker
Next we've got Hitmonlee and Hitmonchan. I would put them in B, I would say. They're both the most B. They're like the case point for B. They're just not particularly interesting. I mean, I used to like Hitmonchan because you used to get the elemental punches, but... They're not very strong though. No. They're not the actual elemental punches. They're just there.
00:52:45
Speaker
I actually used Hipmonchan in my very first nurse walk, and they got absolutely bodied immediately. I don't have phone memories of them. I'm going to let you take the next one. I do not like Lickitung. I have never really liked Lickitung. I did not really enjoy the joke in the anime where it is kind of licked up and down the body of, I'm going to say James. And Jesse, yeah. Even as a kid, I was like, no, no, not a fan of that. So it would be, upper your diet cells, movement milk, lower. Okay, I guess for me, what are your thoughts?
00:53:11
Speaker
If it wasn't for the big tongue, I would put him in okay, I guess, but the whole licking thing? Hashtag cancel Lickitung. Yeah, I would say your dad sells Moo Moo Milk for him. Coughing for me is either I want to be the very best or shiny Charizard, but wheezing I could do without in my life, to be quite honest. I always feel as if coughing is very happy. He's just, he's loving his life, but wheezing looks like a depressed smoker.
00:53:43
Speaker
Now, coughing's like you're in university, you're having maybe a bit of a social smoke, things are still good in your life, and then wheezing's like, I've continued that lifestyle for the rest of my life, and now I have another me growing and growing on top. So yeah, I agree. And like, you get the little kind of like coffee mugs that have coughing on it, which is cute. So I would put coughing upper B tier wheezing, lower OK, I guess, upper your diet cells, moving milk. I would put her, yeah, OK, I guess. Like, I don't think he's the worst, but he's teetering on the edge. There's definitely teetering on the edge.
00:54:03
Speaker
Yeah, coughing is the cool one.
00:54:32
Speaker
Maybe upper, okay, I guess. Rydon, pretty cool. He's a bit like Nidoking in a way. You could see them fighting against each other and being like two bros. You could see Nidoking and Rydon doing the predator handshake with each other, like they're cool bros. He does kind of feel like the predecessor to the third generation's Agron, which is like a much better version of him, but he's still pretty cool. I would put probably Shiny Charizard. Okay, I'll miss them up.
00:54:38
Speaker
Alright, next up.
00:54:56
Speaker
Oh, OK, I guess. Chansey, I would personally put a Shiny Charizard. Oh, wow. OK, interesting.
Iconic Pokémon and Tier Placement
00:55:05
Speaker
It's not my favourite Pokémon to use, and I feel as if it's quite annoying to catch. But I think that it's quite iconic, just maybe purely because of the Pokémon Center, because it's always there. It's got a nice face. It's quite kind looking. You know, I don't know, I could shank you at the back of the Pokémon Mart or the Pokémon Hospital.
00:55:25
Speaker
So that's like the focus ender but I mean they could put R be the best but what are your thoughts on that? I would have personally put Chansey in upper okay I guess so I think kind of compromise be the best probably makes the most sense. Tangler. Yeah your dad sells moo moo milk.
00:55:41
Speaker
Yeah, I don't like Tangla, like it would probably be upper Daisys movement milk, lower okay I guess, so I'll put upper Daisys movement milk because you'd seem to not like it. Kangaskhan. I like the episode in the Pokémon series with Kangaskhan, but like as a Pokémon it's just kind of there, and you have to go to Safari Zone to get it, it's just kind of an annoying Pokémon to try and catch.
00:55:58
Speaker
I always find this a weird Pokémon because it's two Pokémon in one. You're hitting a mother and a child. You just feel wrong just all round. So okay, I guess. Yeah, upper okay, I guess. Horsie and Sidra. I would say Horsie's okay, I guess, but Sidra's probably better and I want to be the very best. Yeah, I can get more with that. Galdeen is rubbish.
00:56:19
Speaker
Your dad sells moo moo milk by far. I don't like Goldeen and Seaking, I would even go as far to say your dad sells moo moo milk for them. I would put lower or okay, I guess, personally. But no, Goldeen has to, one of them has to stain your dad sells moo milk. Star me, upper okay, I guess, for me. Really? Star you, lower B tier. Really? You prefer star you to star me. Yeah, I like the colour scheme more. Well, you prefer the brown to the purple. Oh, I got the mix up then. Swapping around.
00:56:49
Speaker
Yes, Star is the first evolution. Stormy is the second one. Doesn't sound right on the tongue. I know. Mr. Mime? Yeah, I don't think he's... Daz sells Moomin milk. Scyther, I would go as far to say potentially high shiny Charizard low top percentage.
00:57:05
Speaker
I love Scyther, actually. I'm with you, I think, probably top percentage. I don't know, there's just something about him. I also like mimicking his voice as well, like, Scyther! Sorry for everyone listening at home. Jinx, your dad says I'm a mimic, I'm sorry. And for these, I'm going to group these three together because they are, for some reason, they're always, if I know, sorry, they're grouped together with Jinx, but Jinx is gone now.
00:57:26
Speaker
Can I put Electabuzz and Magmar together, but Pinsir and Jinx, I didn't really consider them to all be together. Well, yeah, no, I think Pinsir was just at the wrong place at the wrong time. They had to be there. I like Electabuzz, and I like Pinsir. I'd put them both B tier. Magmar I don't like, and I think goes to OK, I guess, personally. Yeah, it just, I think he's just survived at OK, I guess. Todos, I would put maybe B, maybe, but either B. Lower B, he is just a bull. He's got three tails. He has got three tails.
00:57:55
Speaker
top percentage, surely. I knew you were going to say that. Controversially, I don't mind him. I think B tier, personally. Lower B tier. For Magikarp? Yes, Magikarp. Did I tell you I caught a Magikarp with a Master Ball once? Of course you did. In my defense, I was playing Sword and Shield, and you know how you get the Den Raid? I remember I went down and I saw a shiny Magikarp there, and I thought, oh, that's cool. That must be really rare. So I threw my Master
00:58:23
Speaker
falling caught it because I was like, oh, I really want a shiny Gyarados. And then I went down to the next den. That had a shiny magic orb. So what I didn't realise was it was an event going on, so they were all shiny. So I was like, you know, Aladdin, but it's like, that magic orb's shiny. You idiot. They're all shiny. That was embarrassing. I would put Gyarados though, probably in shiny Charizard tier.
00:58:47
Speaker
I love Garros. I do think that he is sometimes overhyped, but I do like him. So like if you said top tier, I would have probably argued down to Shiny Charizard, but yeah, I'm happy for Shiny Charizard for sure. Now for Lapras, personally, and this might be controversial, I would put him in top percent of Rattata. Really interesting. That's not where I thought you were about to go there.
00:59:07
Speaker
I just feel as if out of all of them there's not really a Pokémon, at least in this generation, that looks like Lapras. I mean, it's so iconic that remember how it became the sprite for whenever you surfed. Yeah, that does make it pretty iconic. It's pretty iconic from the anime for various reasons.
00:59:25
Speaker
Yeah, I would personally say top percent, just purely for that. But for its iconicness, I would say. I would personally argue for Shiny Charizard, but if you are quite passionate about it, I'm willing to concede to Uppertear. I mean that, and it's just our version of the Loch Ness Monster and Pokémon. It is that I was also thinking about that, to be honest.
00:59:43
Speaker
We've got so many Pokémon there now that I'm struggling. I have to zoom out on my screen to be able to put it. Now, Ditto, I would say B. Maybe Shiny Charizard at a push, but... I'm the opposite. What, you think okay, I guess? Yeah, I think at a push, B. I think probably pretty solid okay, I guess. I don't particularly like Ditto.
01:00:00
Speaker
I would say just for the face alone, maybe B, but like a very low B. I will put it in a low B. Yeah. My argument, Eevee. Rata. Rata. I agree.
Eevee and Evolutions Debate
01:00:10
Speaker
I love Eevee. I think Eevee is so cute. I think Eevee is on par with Pikachu in terms of how cute as a mascot it is. Eeveelutions. I think we might have some opinions on the placement of these. I'd say BTR for all of them. Oh, okay. I disagree.
01:00:24
Speaker
Maybe Jotion at Shiny Charizard. That is my agreement and Flareon for me goes in okay I guess. I don't like Flareon very much. Out of all of them Flareon's my list favourite and Vaporeon is alright. There.
01:00:39
Speaker
just there. But the next one on the other hand, I'm gonna fight tooth and nail to the very least get shiny Charizard for him. Poragon. Again, he's very iconic. I mean, if it was me doing this list alone, 100% would be top percent of Rattata. But I feel as if at the
01:00:57
Speaker
very least shiny Charizard, just purely because he is, I mean obviously other than I'm a huge Porygon son, but I feel as if he's very unique in his design again. It's that case of it looks more like a Digimon than a Porygon. I was gonna say he looks like a Digimon. I've never used Porygon, I never liked Porygon. Because it was so hard to get it, you know. I would get him, but he's pretty firmly an okay I guess for me. So if you want to negotiate to upper B tier. Yeah, as I said, personally I think you're doing my boy an injustice, but
01:01:28
Speaker
That's fair enough. In the words of the poker app, it's downhill from here. We've not got many to go now. I would say for most of the fossils, I want to be the very best, except on this star. I'm not a big fan of him. I would say he's okay, I guess. On my night, the first one, I'd say he's probably in B tier.
01:01:48
Speaker
So personally, I would say B, C, B, B, maybe a push. What's the one with the sword hands? Kabutops. That's a shiny Charizard for me. That's fair. Lower shiny Charizard. The rest all B to OK, I guess, in my opinion. The Pterodactyl one, upper B for me. And then the rest, lower B to OK, I guess. I think probably Kabutops. And in fact, Kabutops and the other two are probably both upper OK, I guess, for me, personally. But I'm willing to concede some of them to B if you think strongly enough about them.
01:02:17
Speaker
I would say they are probably deserving of B tier, except for Omnistar. I don't know what it is about Omnistar, I just don't like him.
Snorlax and Iconic Pokémon Discussion
01:02:26
Speaker
I don't like the fact he stands on his two tentacle legs, but I would say personally they're in OK. I'm sorry, and I want to be the very best.
01:02:34
Speaker
Alright, I promise you aren't okay, I guess, and the other two in lower B. Snorlax. Shiny Charizard. I don't know. I feel as if a certain someone would beat us up if we didn't put them higher. Definitely Shiny Charizard to you, but I mean, look at that face. Look at that face. We'll go for that then. For the legendary birds, now I'm in the same boat as the Eviolutions. I think Zapdos, Shiny Charizard, maybe Articuno, and I want to be the very best.
01:03:03
Speaker
Upper be the very best for me. Yeah, and Moltres definitely okay, I guess. I've never liked Moltres. Yeah, I'm not going to be a Moltres fan either. Alright, these fuckers were always hard for me to get and I think Dragon Knight required a trade to evolve it. No, I don't think it does. It's just a really high evolution.
01:03:19
Speaker
Oh, that'll be it. Yeah, I just had to get it to a high evolution. I'm not confident I even got it, except until let's go Eevee. But yeah, I would say B, okay, lower Shiny Charizard. Lower Shiny Charizard for all of them. No, first one B, second one, okay, third one, Shiny Charizard. The second one, okay, but for Dragonair. Yeah, it's just there.
01:03:40
Speaker
I don't know. I always thought like I'll accept that but I don't know. I would personally have put it in B. Like I would say Dratini, maybe if I know I'm going to put him there because I get the feeling we'll get shanked by somebody. So last two. I've got the last two here. Mew and Mewtwo. Personally for me, I would put Mewtwo in top percent of Rattata. Mew on the other hand, I would put in maybe shiny Charizard at a push.
01:04:07
Speaker
yeah i never felt that strong a connection to mu i would put it upper b lower shiny charizard i'm happy with either i'll put it in shiny charizard to end on the high then it's a pretty well distributed tier list there's certainly a heavier leaning towards the b tier we're a lot more critical than positive for i would say it's okay i guess
01:04:26
Speaker
Oh here we go, it's time for the poke rap of Chatsunami here. So for our S tier, top percent of Rattata, we have, for the lawful listeners at home, Wandering, we have Bulbasaur, Charmander, Squirtle, Charizard, Blastoise, Pikachu, Nidoking, Arcanine, Polywhirl, Rapidash, Gengar, Scyther, Lapras, Eevee and Mewtwo. For Shiny Charizard tier we have Venusaur,
01:05:16
Speaker
Then in I Want to Be the Very Best we have Pterodactyl.
01:05:19
Speaker
Articuno, Porygon, Seal, Dugong, Gong, Ponyta, Vaporeon, Krabby, Golem, Charmeleon, Ivysaur, Wartortle, Beedrill, Caterpie, Butterfree, Ralta, Gasly, Raticate, Archoke, no. No, it was the Cobra one, it's called again, Arbok. Arbok, Sandshrew, Marowak, Poliwrath, Nidoquine, Vulpix, Wigglytuff, Hitmonchan, Hitmonlee, Chansey, Oddish, Vileplume, Venonat, Diglett,
01:05:46
Speaker
Meowth, Primake, Machamp, Alakazam, Tentacruel, Magnemite, Dougduo. Dougduo, is that what it's named? Dodo. Dodo. Dodo. Dodo. Dodo. Dodo. Dodo. All right. Dodo, Dodo. Shellder, Cloister, Dragon Air Dratini, Onyx, Koffing, Sidra, Stormy, Electabuzz, Pinsir, Tauros, Magikarp, Ditto, Ominite, Kabuto.
Lowest Tier Pokémon
01:06:08
Speaker
And then in Presser, OK, I guess we have Moltres, Omnistar, Flareon, Kangaskhan, Rhyhorn, Exeggutor, Victory Bell, Machop,
01:06:36
Speaker
Do you want to finish off with your diacels moon milk?
01:06:39
Speaker
Yep, for your daisils, Moominmilk, you have Metapod, Weedle, Spiro, Zubat, Gloom, Paras, Parasect, Weeping Bell, Victory Bell, Muck, Grimer, the Horrible Wonder Twins, Drowzee, Hypno, Lickitung, Tangala, Goldeen, Mr Mime, and last and certainly least, Jinx. So that is a fair lust I have to
Listener Engagement and Conclusion
01:07:03
Speaker
say.
01:07:03
Speaker
I think we were quite fair with a lot of these. I'll be interested to see if there's many disagreements about it. I'm sure everyone has their own opinions on these, but I think we've been pretty fair with a lot of them. Yeah. If you have any comments or complaints, please direct them to Andrew. But if he's not in, you can direct him to at chatsanamipod over on Twitter. But on that note, thank you Andrew for taking part in this list.
01:07:25
Speaker
No, thank you so much for having me. It was good fun. Hopefully people have enjoyed this. Thank you all so so much for listening to this episode. And as always, please let us know your thoughts either by commenting over on Twitter or reaching out on our contact page at our website where you can also listen to other episodes at Chatsunami.com. I also want to thank our amazing Pandora and Patrons, Robotic Battle Toaster and Sonya. Thank you so so much for supporting the show.
01:07:49
Speaker
you would like to support us you can do so on patreon which is patreon.com slash chat tsunami. You can become a pandalorian patreon such as robotic battle toaster and sonya and yeah it's a really good way to hear about the latest updates from us to get episodes a week early and exclusive access to content. But as always thank you so so much for listening to this episode. Stay safe, stay awesome and most importantly stay hydrated with a glass of moo moo milk.