Transcript
johngrimsmo: Good morning and welcome to the Business of Machining episode 433. My name is John Grimsmo.
John: And my name is John Saunders.
johngrimsmo: And this is the, your weekly dose of manufacturing where two business owners kind of touch base and see what's going on. And, you know, we don't always, we're close friends, but we don't always chat throughout the week. So this is our chance to like, you know, catch up.
John: It's a funny point. You and will, I don't know, like maybe once a quarter we'll end up with like a good side conversation, but like it's really this conversation.
johngrimsmo: Yeah, exactly. This is our touch base.
John: and Right.
johngrimsmo: Like, I don't need to talk to you throughout the week because I get you on Friday, on Wednesdays. Like.
John: We batch it, we batch it up.
johngrimsmo: Exactly.
John: Yeah, but that's funny. I guess I'm, well, and part of me knows in a subconscious way, ah and I respect you subconsciously for this, but I know if I need you and I DM you, like, or WhatsApp you, you're not usually quick to respond in a way that I think is great because it means you're just, you're being a surgeon or doing your own thing. At least that's what assume.
johngrimsmo: Yeah, certainly not minutes, but hopefully hours I'd say i I can get back, especially like, like WhatsApp is very direct.
John: Hmm.
John: Hmm.
johngrimsmo: DMs are like days or weeks.
John: But what's that? But like, if I DM, I don't Lawrence or Dennis, I bet you they respond in 30 seconds, almost any point in time.
johngrimsmo: Right.
John: That's not you, which is which is good.
johngrimsmo: Yeah. yeah Yeah. Yeah.
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: um Okay. So I got a couple of things this week. I'll give you a little foam update. Um, Norseman blades in heat treat a 15 minute tracker.
johngrimsmo: And um let's touch base again on our paving company idea.
John: Ha ha ha. i like Are we going to start building roads, Yeah.
johngrimsmo: yes
johngrimsmo: No, ah anything you got lined up for today?
John: um Musical chairs with CNC machines, ah water systems like ah RODI, water quality, um quick update on Home Assistant, a book called Dive of Zero.
John: And I have two, theyre not really gift, but well, one's gift box, one is not, but two boxes of things to mention. And that's right.
johngrimsmo: right, let's jump right in.
John: Yeah. Foamy, foam me.
johngrimsmo: Foamy. So I've had a week to play. I got in last week. I bought the the wrong foam, the rigid foam. And then I bought the flexible foam and I got that.
John: That's right.
johngrimsmo: Started playing with it. um And initial result was just like in a red solo cup, you know, mix of two parts, let it foam up um to kind of see because I got four different densities.
John: Okay.
johngrimsmo: I got four pounds per cubic foot, 10 and 15 pounds per cubic foot of like the hardness of it pretty much.
John: Okay.
johngrimsmo: when When it expands, it should weigh a cubic foot should weigh 4, 10, or 15 pounds.
John: Oh wow.
johngrimsmo: Yeah.
John: 15 pounds on cube of foot is dense.
johngrimsmo: Yeah, exactly.
John: Interesting.
johngrimsmo: And so I played with the 4-pound, and I ended up 3D printing a mold, like a negative two-part cavity system, where the inner air is what I want, is my foam insert.
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: um And it's like a temporary stopgap. Eventually, i want to have layers with a silicone liner on the inside. um
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: because the foam doesn't stick to the silicone and it's just better. But i was like, what is the quick and dirty, like easiest thing for me to do? Let me just print two halves and fill it with foam. And there's little vent holes on the top so that the excess gas can come out.
johngrimsmo: And you kind of size those vent holes to create some back pressure inside the inside the mold.
John: Okay.
johngrimsmo: So you can literally overstuff the mold. You can run a bunch of math and you can be like, it's supposed to expand 13 times, but I'm going to compress it.
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: So it only expands like eight times. And then it's stiffer than normal. So ended up doing 200% compression. um And it takes, to it cures roughly in like, like it reacts and within 20 minutes, but then it takes about two hours before you want to demold it.
John: Mm-hmm.
johngrimsmo: um So once I demolded it and I used mold release on the inside, um i got a very interesting result. It's like, i must not have mixed it super well, or maybe I messed up my ratios ever so slightly because it's a little like weird and streaky.
johngrimsmo: And I used three drops of red colorant. I bought a whole pack of all the different colorants. I'm like, how much do I need? don't know. So I've got three drops in and it's like a light red and still kind of streaky.
johngrimsmo: like okay, so I need more.
John: Oh, ah okay.
johngrimsmo: I need more, more red than that. That's fine. Um, And the density is interesting. It's got this weird skin on the outside that feels kind of chunky and that it's soft and squishy on the inside.
John: Mm-hmm.
johngrimsmo: And where the vent holes are at the top, it's actually very dense because as it expanded in the cavity and it is raised up, um the holes at the top end up getting plugged with foam.
John: Sure.
johngrimsmo: And then the rest kind of expands within itself and not much comes out the holes because they're already kind of plugging.
John: the ports are self-terminating or whatever.
johngrimsmo: exactly so either you need to make the ports a lot bigger or just deal with whatever's happening kind of thing um and so i pull it out and i'm like well that looks interesting like it looks like the thing but if you look at it objectively you're like kind of looks like garbage um what is the next step what did i get the mixture wrong is the temperature wrong like the more i learn about it um the more variables there are but once you control all these variables
John: no
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: it gets better and better and better. And so the past few days have sort of had all these, you know, mental emotions of like, is it worth continuing doing this? Do I just scrap the whole project?
John: Right.
johngrimsmo: Am I, am I so early in the project that that would be stupid? Like good things take time. Is it worth putting a lot of time into this, like dozens and dozens of hours into this foam that doesn't make us any money directly?
johngrimsmo: um
John: Does it make the beer taste better?
johngrimsmo: Exactly. it's It's more of an experience thing and a protect the product thing, obviously, and reduce some costs or or shift time labor costs from our current method to this method.
John: Okay. Yeah. Yeah.
johngrimsmo: Take it in house reliability. like There's a lot of pluses and minuses, but it might make the beer taste better, but it doesn't make the beer worth more.
John: Pardon me for being an argumentative tone about this. I don't think it makes the beer taste better because your phone cases right now rock.
johngrimsmo: Sure, but okay, so internally the process, i want to change it.
John: yeah Okay. Can you remind me? Is it because the or why? Yeah.
johngrimsmo: there's a lot of waste with the current way we're making it, whether we waste it or the foam manufacturer may waste it.
John: yeah
johngrimsmo: And I just had this theory of like, why don't we just mold it in that shape with like zero waste or like almost no waste and no, no machining, no water jet, no skiving, like slicing it, no laminating.
John: right yeah
John: yeah
johngrimsmo: And we're having a lot of thickness issues and we're having a lot of machining issues. And like, so anyway, so I'm experimenting this path. And so I get this one mold and I'm like not happy with it, but it's also it's also like you look it and you're like, I mean, you're almost there. Like keep going, fix this, fix this, fix the holes, fix the voids, manage bubble control, all that stuff.
johngrimsmo: So then I tried the 10 pound density, which was harder.
John: Yep.
johngrimsmo: and um And I used, for the same volume, I used 20 drops of black. And I'm like, well, let's make this like real dark, let's see. And it is pitch black, like tar black, which is pretty cool.
John: Sweet.
johngrimsmo: And it it feels like rubber. Like it is a completely different type of foam than the four pound. And it's like squishy and soft, like um like a mouse pad kind of thing, but a one inch thick mouse pad.
johngrimsmo: I don't know.
John: make Grimstone Knife Mouse Pad product, I love it.
johngrimsmo: Yeah, exactly.
John: I love where this is going, yeah.
johngrimsmo: And so it's like a totally different result. And it looks way better, but still has some bubbles and voids and technical things that is literally just process control. I think I got the mixture way better.
johngrimsmo: I think I got the stirring, the colorant, like everything's getting better and better better. And I'm still in a cheap 3D printed mold. This is not proper net shape kind of like, like the shape is great, but it does.
John: Oh, yay yeah, yeah. Does it look like this shape though? Like,
johngrimsmo: Yeah, it is the shape.
John: Okay.
johngrimsmo: Yep.
John: Yeah. Okay. That's cool. That's awesome.
johngrimsmo: Yeah. Yeah. So it's, it's like getting there. And, uh, so anyway, I'm kind of at this weird state where like I'm wasting a lot of time on this, but also it's kind of fun. And also I feel like I'm really getting closer to a proper result.
johngrimsmo: That is a scalable process.
johngrimsmo: So I'm getting there.
John: the Awesome. I mean...
johngrimsmo: Yeah.
John: 100 points for like the whole fun thing. I think it's always, always remind myself to be willing to kill it if you just, if you need to kill it you know what i mean? Like no harm, no foul, but just not whatever.
johngrimsmo: Yep.
John: And then it's also, think I used to sort of say um to folks more so when it would be like there this sort of a project or endeavor would be their main product. And that product may even be their sole means of of living in their business, right?
John: Like I want to quit my day job to pursue this one single product. It was kind of like, okay, Most people will, mean just looking at the numbers, most people will fail for lack of volume of sales or lack of profitability on a single product.
John: But the flip side is also like, what if it takes off? Do you want to make 1,000 of these? um Is that sustainable? Do you want to think about the the chemicals, the the the molds, the disposition or safety around making 1,000, 5,000 of these?
John: I have no idea what that takes on the smooth on side.
johngrimsmo: No, exactly. Exactly. I mean, I think Smoodon can absolutely um supply the amount that we need, which is which is not.
John: Oh yeah.
johngrimsmo: And then, yeah, do we want to make, you know, we're definitely new to over a thousand a month, probably, or a year, sorry, um probably several thousand a year of these.
John: Okay. Yeah, right.
johngrimsmo: And do we want to do that? And and is that scalable beyond that for the next many years? Say we keep keep growing, we we want more.
John: Yeah. Yeah.
johngrimsmo: I don't i don't know. But for now, I think think I got a good plan.
John: Yeah.
John: The thing that bothers me too is, and this frustrates me as an entrepreneur is like, especially around packaging, but just in general, anything like we did this with ERPs. We didn't like the ERP software out there.
John: We wrote our own only to talk to ERP companies and never looked back. But like when you buy like a high end, I'm thinking like Trijicon or like, you know
johngrimsmo: What's the truth of God?
John: ah rifle scope, like manufacturer.
johngrimsmo: Hmm.
John: They have different, they like red dots and thermals and stuff. Like some of these are high hundreds. Some of them are in the thousands or multiple thousands of dollars. Like they have bespoke foam, stuff like to them that's not machined.
John: It's done well. Like, I don't know, and I'm not, forgive me, I don't mean to say like, you should figure that out, but like, I wish I knew like who to talk to because there's companies that do this full time that would like probably laugh at some of the things, the ways you and I do things.
johngrimsmo: Yeah. No, it's good.
John: It's also what makes us us, like we've gotten there by doing it this way.
johngrimsmo: Exactly.
John: um
johngrimsmo: But to your point, you're talking about a very high value, both perceived value and real value item that is packaged and presented very well.
John: Yeah, exactly.
johngrimsmo: And that is the market I'm playing with. like
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: I keep telling you know the people around me and I keep telling ChatGPD, I'm like, this needs to look expensive. like it needs It can't have voids.
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: It can't have bubbles. It it just needs to look right.
John: But even John, like I bought a pickleball racket on Amazon two weeks ago. Um, and it was a hundred dollars marked down to 45 for some sale.
John: And it showed up in it. You'd think this thing was $600. Like it was in a box. It was like one of those rigid, uh, well packaged boxes with like a hinge and you open it up and it was the pickleball paddle was in this foam case with these like, congratulations. You're now stepping your game up.
John: I mean, like let's not get, this is a $40 pickleball racket. Like everybody calm down here. Um, and part of me was ticked off because I'm like, we've we've definitely had some stressors around like Modvice packaging.
John: I'm like, I just paid $45 retail for a pickleball racket that like, if I had to go order 500 of these boxes that are printed with the foam and the inserts, I'm thinking about probably 20 bucks a per box, like per packaging.
johngrimsmo: yeah
johngrimsmo: yeah exactly yeah i mean economy is a scale based on the country you're in but it's part but still it's the attention to detail and the choice like they could have put it in a ziploc bag and you'd have been like sweet my pickleball racket's here but you know
John: ah Um, like what am I missing here? Um,
John: are you Yes, touche.
John: Yeah. But it worked, it was actually like, I like kind of gave my, William but also likes to play and I kind of gave him a hard time like, William, you gotta come see. Like, I just went i went big on my new pickleball. It was was not 45 bucks, but he looks at it. And the same thing, he's like, oh my God, you think this thing's like a Rolex?
johngrimsmo: Yep.
John: um So I give you a lot of credit on the full Grimso aspect of like, hey, you make people like think, woo, yeah.
johngrimsmo: Thank you.
johngrimsmo: Yeah. Yeah. It needs to match, you know, everything needs to be equally awesome.
John: Do you, are you degassing it?
johngrimsmo: I'm not cause it's foam and you kind of want the gas.
John: Oh, that's so funny.
johngrimsmo: All right.
John: I think about the vacuum pumps on the, we, cause definitely cast a few smooth on things in my days.
johngrimsmo: I know it's so weird.
John: And you always think about like, it's kind of like in the old days of like 3d printing or it's like, there's three things that can go wrong.
johngrimsmo: Yeah.
John: Bed leveling, bed leveling and bed leveling.
johngrimsmo: Yep. ye
John: It's like the smooth on stuff. It's like, you're not degassing. Hmm.
johngrimsmo: However, with the way I'm currently stirring the batch in a in a solo cup with a wooden spatula, I'm fluffing it. I'm putting bubbles in it. Maybe I'm putting some big bubbles that are causing problems in my finish. maybe i'm So I've got some more automatic ways to mix that is going to control that significantly, but I'm not ready to invest the time and a little bit of money in building that solution yet.
John: Got it.
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: So I'm taking this you know step by step by step. But yeah. I do think it will continue to get better and better and better and it's kind of exciting.
John: I wonder if there are those um swizzle swizzle stick mixers on like ah like Maker World that you can 3D print.
johngrimsmo: the It's called a Static Mixer where it mixes part A and part B. yeah Oh yeah, i've been but I've been deep down this rabbit hole.
John: God bless you, static.
johngrimsmo: um Yes. And the real trick is to use a static miser mixer with a dynamic mixer where it's got a little blender at the end or something like that.
John: Like active versus passive, like there's an actual propeller.
johngrimsmo: like little yeah propeller that is motorized um that further blends it. So that's kind of what I have in mind here. um I've used the static mixer a little bit and even smooth on is like for the foam, you don't really want to use the static mixer. It doesn't mix it well enough.
johngrimsmo: You want to agitate a little bit.
John: Really?
johngrimsmo: You want to add a little bit of bubbles maybe. um The foam wants, it's like different than silicone.
John: Okay. Okay. Okay.
johngrimsmo: Yeah. But i I'm still kind of, you know, determined to to find a really cool semi-automated solution here. So I'm getting there.
John: um I want to come back to the mixers, but two things to that came to mind. Number one, Send Cut Send is doing foam now. um And I don't know if there is, I don't know being Canada makes them less appealing to you, but I tell you, Send Cut Send is like rocking our world these days in a good way of like lots of things.
johngrimsmo: Mm-hmm.
John: And um we, it's so funny. It's like sometimes I just am so blind to so to the ease of solutions it's like oh they did this for sheet metals like i want this metal bracket made and bent and powder coated and like you don't want to you can't call a local fab shop to do like hey will you make one of these senkacen owns that world and tim paul from now from toolpath was even like hey i needed some some aluminum parts like machined as blanks to do it he's like i could buy the machine because they're doing machining now i could buy the
John: three pieces or whatever it was, six pieces from SendCut Send pre-machined for what i wanted cheaper than I could just buy the aluminum material, like normally. um And foam, it's like, we've really had some stressors around foam.
John: We've had some inconsistent, smaller vendors. We've had some pricing weirdnesses from bigger vendors and just like the stressors of it. It's also not our bread and butter. It's like, we don't necessarily know the lingo and who's the players.
johngrimsmo: Yep.
John: And um it's like, oh, SendCut Send's offering foam. Oh, we upload our thing and we get pricing. Oh, this is like, Like, God bless you. This is great. um The other thing, which is super random, is there's an artist named Rachel White Reed.
John: And if you ever have the chance to like see her or look her up, um I don't know she's a big deal anymore, but maybe 10 or 15 years ago, she was making a splash. um Had a big exhibit at MoMA in New York. And her whole thing are is doing like life-size exhibits of negative space.
John: And so like she would cast a whole room or a whole object. And look, for a lot of people that don't care about art or don't want to get it, I'm not going to sit here and prolestatize it on you, but very impactful and very curious to see like, how do you, like the office that I'm in right now, i have a desk, I have a couch, I have a three d printer. her Her cast would be like of the office and then it would be like the negative space around it.
johngrimsmo: of the air, so it would be a huge block.
John: And it's, kind of Kind of, but like the way she does it obviously is not just like a dumb, like, oh, I took the block.
johngrimsmo: ah that
John: Like you kind of have to see it to appreciate it.
johngrimsmo: Interesting.
John: But um knowing that your artistic side and even Clara's and then like casting and all that, it's just like a, it's just a very curious thing.
johngrimsmo: then
John: I like.
johngrimsmo: it Well, it is weird making the mold that is a negative of this the part, and you're like, if this looks weird. This doesn't look right.
John: yeah Right. Mm-hmm. Yeah. ah Speaking of art, I'm gearing up to do another of my DIY Donald Judd sculptures um that I've made quite a few of over the years. um And I think I'm going to do this one out of quarter inch aluminum panels. It is um it's about 12 by 12 and 40 inches long on the wall.
John: And has to look perfect. Like the, you need to stroke the aluminum with like set the, set the grain with like sandpaper. So it has that homogenous grain to it.
johngrimsmo: yeah
John: Um, edges all have to be sharp and crisp. And I, but instead of screwing it together, which is how Judd had been made by a company in Switzerland. um And I don't think I want to screw them together because putting like M4 screws on the ends of quarter inch or six millimeter aluminum is, if you're off by like 7 thou, it's, I could, i guess maybe I should, because I'm probably gonna end up machining the edges anyways.
John: um Well, what got me, I was dusting off an old video we did where we use Loctite 8, I believe it was 8008 with the static mixer. And that's like green goopy stuff that glues aluminum together.
John: And we used to glue aluminum blocks together, let them cure, and then you could machine them and you can you can you can see the part line if you know where to look for it, but not not really.
johngrimsmo: No way.
johngrimsmo: Yeah?
John: It's pretty awesome.
johngrimsmo: Interesting.
John: Yeah. So part of me thought, Oh, I'll make, I'll make 3d printed alignment jigs and then just use that glue and like glue this thing together. And, um, that would be pretty, I still like this idea.
johngrimsmo: Oh.
johngrimsmo: Yeah, a bit of a next level, like, let me experiment. Let me learn something new. Let me ah see if I can do this.
John: yeah
johngrimsmo: I have an idea, you know.
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: i respect that.
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: That's fine. it's It's a side project.
John: yeah
johngrimsmo: Do whatever you want.
John: yeah Yeah. Yeah, exactly.
johngrimsmo: All right. So on the foam topic, this is interesting. um After our podcast last week, I got an email from an old friend who I haven't talked to a lot of years, business business owner, kind of successful guy.
johngrimsmo: And he he knew about my business eight years ago.
John: OK.
johngrimsmo: And he's kind of followed it, but we haven't talked. And then he kind of knows about it now, we've been talking again. So he has this like point in time of like, before we hired anybody, and then now um we have 11 employees.
John: Mm-hmm.
johngrimsmo: um and he suggested he's like john if you want to grow your company your time is insanely valuable and you need to make sure that the the tasks you're doing are you know kind of equally proportional to the growth you want from the company um your time needs to be insanely valuable and the things you do need to reflect that value now i'm always going to push back and be like well i like having fun but There's a real truth to this.
johngrimsmo: And so he suggested something which I've heard in in other contexts in different ways. But he said, um take out one of your notebooks and write down every 15 minute block throughout the day and write down what you did that day.
johngrimsmo: This is not a forward looking planner. This is ah an observational study of what happened in every 15 minute chunk of the day.
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: And I've tried it with forward planners. I'm like, today I'm going to do this between three and four. And it never, it always breaks. This is literally just in 15 minute chunks. What did I do that 15 minutes or how many 15 minute chunks in a row did I work on Norseman hard milling or foam or something like that?
johngrimsmo: And so I've been tracking this for the past week. I'll show you a little video.
John: Oh, look at you. oh my God.
johngrimsmo: Yeah. And it's literally, um i found it was easier to go 8.15 to 8.30, 8.30 to 8.45, 8.45 to 9. That way there's no um question if when you write 9, is it up until 9 or is it 9 to 9.15?
johngrimsmo: So i'm I'm writing each block. um Literally from the time I wake up to the time I go to bed. And it's it's work, but I'm actually incredibly enjoying the process.
John: No, I'm just saying.
johngrimsmo: And the reflection afterwards, I'm of seeing how many chunks in a row I can actually work on a project before getting either pulled away to something else or I have to go or pick up the kids or whatever.
johngrimsmo: And then even I'm writing like chat with Meg, chat with Meg or at work, you know, talk with Gabe, talk with Gabe, talk talk with Gabe.
John: ah
johngrimsmo: I talked with one of my guys for 45 minutes. It was all important. It's it it's like has to get done. But on one hand, I took him away from his job for 45 minutes and I spent 45 minutes of my time and we're having these discussions about technical issues.
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: Has to get done. but i I could not have ended that conversation and known it took me 45 minutes. And like, naturally I'd have been like, Oh yeah, we chatted for a little bit.
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: It's like, no, that was, that was almost an hour. Like, so it's that visibility that I'm giving myself, whether I could keep doing this forever or not, I'm finding it super helpful.
John: Sure.
johngrimsmo: um For example, I've, I've been on the same phone, Samsung S9 for the past seven years. And I'm like,
John: Holy cow.
johngrimsmo: Yeah. like, it's time to get a new phone. So this all happened in the past week and I've been tracking the time I spend researching the phone, looking at different phone plans, looking at different phone cases.
John: Yep.
johngrimsmo: You know, I'm doing the that John technique of like, I'm just going to, I got to wrap my head around this. got figure out what phone do I want? Do i want to stick with Samsung? Do I want whatever? Go to the mall, get the phone, install all the things. and And so I've spent nine and a half hours on this phone project over the past week.
johngrimsmo: And I have that track now. And it's like kind of interesting. I'm like, that sounds like a lot of time, but it's also just what it took.
johngrimsmo: So e that's my 15 minute tracker idea.
John: new Do you, do you,
John: you're happy you, I don't know. um um I'm kind of pushing back here.
johngrimsmo: That's okay. where where
John: Cause I've known you.
johngrimsmo: Let me finish the theory.
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: For very specific projects, like like foam, how much time have I put into this foam project? There is value in knowing that. And I've always been completely allergic to the idea of tracking my time.
John: Okay.
johngrimsmo: which is probably wrong from a business sense, but like, I can't, I can't do it.
John: yeah
johngrimsmo: I can do this. I can actually accomplish this. And in 15 minute chunks, I can see, like, I can look at a couple days ago and I can be like, Oh, i worked on foam for, you know, give or take two hours straight from 10 PM to midnight.
johngrimsmo: Um, and, if If I really wanted to take to the next level, I could attach a dollar value to that time, whether it's my actual dollar value or a perceived dollar value, like John should be worth so much per for the company and his time should be used efficiently, whatever.
John: yeah sure
johngrimsmo: um It does give me that visibility to know, wow, I really wasted 40 hours of my past two weeks on foam only to scrap it or something. I don't know.
johngrimsmo: So i'm i'm I'm running the experiment and I'm enjoying a lot of it. So let me hear your pushback.
John: I don't think it's necessarily pushback because I um give you a ton of risk ah give you a ton of respect for doing it.
johngrimsmo: Just perspective.
John: I just think, you know, that's been a like a continuing theme with you and me over the years is like I have no disillusions in ah in a great way, but in a stubborn way. i'm I'm never going to change you.
John: and i When I say me, I mean both John Tonner's as your friend, but also just like anybody. Like John grinsville john Grimsville is John Grimsville.
johngrimsmo: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
John: Good luck. Like,
johngrimsmo: for
John: You know, people can can add nuggets of sway to this and like influence, but like ah you're not the kind of guy who's going to be like, oh yeah, somebody really said I should stop pursuing side projects.
John: Like whatever.
johngrimsmo: Right.
John: Maybe you have changed your threshold or respect or acknowledgement of like making sure we're not going down a three-week project to build a whatever.
johngrimsmo: And i I think this process is allowing me to see that objectively.
John: yeah That's what I guess I wonder is will that... Will it? And I, in some respects, almost, What don't want you to do is lie to yourself or be disillusioned.
John: Like you're all of a sudden going to change yourself. Like there's an aspect of this of just like, like what do I want out of life or what do i want out of this business or my role?
johngrimsmo: Yeah. Yep.
John: Because like, you know, you can do the whole, like my time is worth a hundred dollars or, you know, Mike being like my boy time is worth $250 an hour. It's like, well, I spent 10 hours on this mold project. um No one's paying me 2,500 bucks.
John: So like, it's just me saying that, like it doesn't mean anything.
johngrimsmo: Yep.
John: It's just like end of conversation.
johngrimsmo: Yep.
John: um
johngrimsmo: I think the other thing is this has given me the accountability of and the visibility of what I did that day, like in a very total observation thing. Um, and I could be like, for better worse, wow, I wasted that whole day on nothing important.
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: Um, and what I'm finding is because I'm now accountable for myself and this schedule or this schedule, this tracker, um,
John: Yeah, yeah.
johngrimsmo: Every next thing I work on, it's like, okay, i wrapped up that, what's next? It's really getting me to like, make sure it's relatively important or super fun. That's okay too.
John: Yeah, sure.
johngrimsmo: but But not just like floating around, you know, talking to people, play with a machine that doesn't matter anymore. Like, you know, like, it it's actually focused me quite a bit to be like nope these are the three things that absolutely critically have to get done and i've tried all kinds of methods in the past to like you know to-do lists and trackers and daily things and all that stuff and it's gonna hit everybody differently and you really gotta find the one that works for you and just maximize it um yeah yeah
John: yeah
John: yeah Amen to that. Like, that's what's funny. Cause like, this seems like the, this seems like ultra strict, ultra disciplined and you're not, you're like, uh, I do what i want and make it work and blah, blah, blah. And so like,
johngrimsmo: That's why this being a tracker, not a planner, i'm ah I'm observing what my natural tendencies are with the slight focus of accountability of like, no, no, I should really be doing this today.
John: interesting.
John: Kind a, yeah.
johngrimsmo: Okay, I feel good. I spent three hours on this project because I had to get done. And then I also spent three hours on foam because I want that to get done. I'm okay with that day, you know?
John: Well, and that's ultimately the other kind of question, which you don't owe anybody an answer on, certainly me, but like you're doing this as if you need to change. Who says you need to change, Sean?
John: Like, is this, what problem are you solving?
johngrimsmo: Yeah, I want to grow. I want to make sure that I focus myself in the right directions because I'm very, i float around, I do whatever I want sometimes, and that's not always the right answer.
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: And I don't always see that. And yeah, so i'm I'm playing and I definitely, the change I want is growth.
John: yeah
johngrimsmo: I like, like personal development. I want to be better, stronger, faster, smarter, and in the right ways. Um,
John: yes I agree, I think, and I've had some kind of like offline conversations with peers and and frankly myself that are interesting. And they relate to the fact that, you know, you and I aren't 20 anymore. We're 42.
johngrimsmo: Yep.
John: And, um, I, I enjoy having problems to solve. I enjoy being relevant.
johngrimsmo: Me too.
John: I enjoy, frankly, if I'm being honest, I enjoy being important. Um, and. i never in a way that's the like, kind of like,
John: oh, don't get involved with that guy on a project because like he needs like, like, it's not like that. It's just more like, uh, look, anyone who's listening to this podcast probably has similar-ish tendencies of like they like to work, they like to apply themselves, they like to get better.
johngrimsmo: Absolutely.
John: I've also, I've also really been more okay at recognizing like, hey, ah a lot of the guys in the shop know more about Fusion than I do these days. It's one reason why I don't do the YouTube anymore and I'm not an industry expert and I'm okay with that.
John: It got me to where I need to be and, um,
johngrimsmo: well
John: Even applying, sorry, I'm steering this to to myself, which not quite the point, but like I,
johngrimsmo: That's good. Yeah.
John: most of now what I do at Saunders isn't even, isn't even involved in the day to day. Like it's just not, yeah.
johngrimsmo: same Yeah,
John: Well, but like, okay. Yeah.
John: So, keep being you. I don't know. Let's keep the conversation going. Sorry.
johngrimsmo: yeah absolutely. yeah Let's see where it goes. Let's see if I keep it up for weeks or years or whatever. but um yeah I mean, over the years, I've definitely tried many different things that I've kept up for months or even years of of tracking various things.
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: I'm going to show you my... this.
John: ah Maybe a long time ago.
johngrimsmo: ah Okay.
John: Kind of rings a bell.
johngrimsmo: Yeah, I've been doing this for about six months, basically tracking my daily habits, my my sleep, when I went to sleep, when I woke up and how much sleep I got.
John: Ooh.
johngrimsmo: A section for cool things that happened today. And then just kind of a quick checkbox for, you know, um did I work out?
John: no
johngrimsmo: How long did I work out for? What do I weigh? Did I have breakfast? Did I compliment somebody? Was I a technician? Did I work on business development?
John: o
johngrimsmo: Did I work on marketing? Did I work late? Did I go for a night walk? And then some fun things. Did I work on watchmaking? Did I work on my interferometer? Did I work on foam? Kind of things like that. So it's like like a snapshot of a two-week period um using the Grimsmall pocketbooks.
John: I love that, John. So you don't that every day. That gets logged.
johngrimsmo: I do this every day.
John: You do. Okay.
johngrimsmo: This, what I showed you, is a two-week snapshot.
John: I see. I see. there There's part of me that is being driven nuts, the fact that that's not digitized, but that's also...
johngrimsmo: Yeah. No, I, I have become so analog with this kind of stuff.
John: but
johngrimsmo: I don't want anything to do with my phone when I'm tracking these things.
John: No, totally agree. i just... I'm about to be a hypocrite. Part of me wants to be able to process that data via computer stuff.
johngrimsmo: Yep.
John: But then part of me also is like, wait minute here, like, what are you logging stuff for? Like don't collect data for the sake of data. Same thing with your time study stuff. Like what do what are you trying to do?
John: Well, you are trying to grow, grow some knives.
johngrimsmo: Yeah, for sure.
John: Are trying to grow revenue? Are you trying to grow profitability? trying to grow productivity? Are you trying to just say, Hey John, I need to be better about not letting myself spend 50, 60 hours on something that gets deep sixed.
johngrimsmo: Yeah, all of the above exactly. um but But but being more focused and purposeful with which of those 10 items are you actually going for, you know, which are the one of the two or three of what you just said are like, truly important.
John: Yeah.
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: I can say I want everything but like, you can't have everything.
John: Sure. Right. Right.
johngrimsmo: Yeah.
John: No, I love the I love the journalistic side of that the journaling aspect of it.
johngrimsmo: Yep. Mm hmm.
John: um I do it monthly um around. My life works great that way. i have a I have a ah sheet that tracks the monthly stuff I need to do. It then also has quarterly, biannual and annual stuff.
johngrimsmo: Okay.
John: And a lot of that is more like tax, business, state stuff, personal stuff. It tracks like I keep a list of all of the various like identifications and like concealed carry permits or or so passports or car registrations.
johngrimsmo: Nice.
John: And it's just like, then it's like not in my head. I don't have to worry.
johngrimsmo: That's really good.
John: knowing that like I need to renew my kids passport in three years like that dates there. I check that list once a month and then I'm just not worrying about it. It works. I'm very pleased with that.
johngrimsmo: And do you do you naturally check that once a month?
John: um so
johngrimsmo: You're like, oh, it's the first. to check my list. Or do you have a calendar reminder?
John: So i I have a calendar reminder that says, hey, process month end stuff. And the month end stuff includes everything from Saunders sales tax to some personal stuff and um stuff that relates to month end, like whatever.
John: <unk> it works great and it also ties into the whole like there's a personal side of it or like hey are you being the person you want to be is this um although the reason i wanted to bring that up was because i have found the process oriented side of processing those tasks of like hey closing out the books for the month or reconciliations is i'm very good at that and i actually enjoy that that is a very different
johngrimsmo: Mm-hmm.
John: person or very different John than the person who's willing to be reflective. And so what I wanted to do, I've actually asked ChatGPT this a few times, i haven't found a good solution. I'll figure it out or whatever is that I want a random like email thing.
John: Like I want to be notified in a random, at a random point in time, like, Hey, this email here inbox, you need to just turn your monitor off and spend 15 minutes looking at these things. Um, cause I'm in that task mode at the end of the month.
John: I'm in go, go, but I can't stop and think. Uh, and it has to just be random. Like if I put it a calendar reminder, it just doesn't work for me anyway. Yeah.
johngrimsmo: has but if it's random can you truly detach and get it done
John: I don't know. That's my design for some reason.
johngrimsmo: yeah Yeah, I mean, either in in the moment or you can just leave the email unread for hours or days until you're like, okay, now's the time to do that thing, you know?
John: Um,
John: What I don't, yeah, I clearly don't have the the answer, but I know it doesn't work. What doesn't work is if I tell them, like if i have a calendar reminder that says at 7.30 a.m., m you need to do this. It's just like, eh, being told to do it, it's like,
johngrimsmo: Yeah. Yeah.
John: um i don't know. I need to figure something out on that.
johngrimsmo: Yeah, I mean, yeah, at 7.30, stop everything and reflect on life. like
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: that's
John: yeah
johngrimsmo: That's tricky. I mean, what I've done is going on my night walks, it is my chance to, you know, no phone, no internet, no nothing. I'm just out for a walk for 30 minutes.
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: Claire's at the park swinging. She's doing her own thing. She's got her music in, and that's her chance to reflect, and she naturally wants to do that.
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: So I take her to the park, and we I mean, she's almost 16, and she still goes and swings for 45 minutes.
John: That's awesome. That's all awesome.
johngrimsmo: it's It's amazing.
John: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
johngrimsmo: mean, she loves the quiet time, just... just listen to her music and then get to think and plan. And she said she wrote like write stories or draws pictures in her head kind of thing. And I walk around the neighborhood and I process business thing, full ideas, next thing. It's just time to myself to process and do it every day. It's amazing.
John: That's, I think you, I think you're, i think you've got the, that figured out. And maybe that's what I need to do. Cause it's like the whole, like, literally you can't start doing yoga. Like you warm up.
John: I don't know if you ever do yoga, but I did it.
johngrimsmo: No.
John: Oh, it's, it's great. i love it. um
johngrimsmo: Good.
John: I don't do it. I did it years ago. I just did it again last week for the first time randomly. And I'm like, no, I should do this again.
johngrimsmo: Yeah.
John: Also because at the end of a yoga class is a great time to pick up
johngrimsmo: Good. Okay.
John: your journal come back to this and and then like then you can you're being that right mindset the phone's still in the truck like you don't need to worry about it life will go on if you don't check your messages like ah um that's
johngrimsmo: so okay
John: I'm glad we're having this conversation. seat That's probably actually better than trying to figure out. Part of me, like the Grimso Saunders part of me became obsessed with like, I want to figure out a way to write. Like the best thing I could come up with, like you saw create your own mail server via chat GPT on a Linux box. And then it creates some randomness thing that can create a reminder. Like, why does it have to be so hard to just send yourself a random reminder?
johngrimsmo: Yeah.
John: Yeah.
John: Well, can I change the conversation?
johngrimsmo: Please, yeah.
John: Two boxes sitting for me here today when I came into the office. And one is pretty fun. I got to give a shout and a thank you to Mr. Adam Booth. He, Adam Booth, um yeah sent me one of his machined and anodized drill indexes.
johngrimsmo: Nice. Nice.
John: And I can't imagine anyone who's listening doesn't know who Adam is, but he's been really excited to... um to start his own first product launch, use his machines, you know, kind of apply his trade, show this off.
John: And just seeing his enthusiasm is kind of fun. And I had the chance to swing by his shop when we were in Florida for vacation earlier this year and saw some of the prototypes. And he's really proud of it. And he includes, i believe, i he sent this one to us on the house, but I believe when you buy these, they include a nice drill index. And Adam was like one of those like, hey, buy quality tools. And um yeah, just want to give a shout out and thank you to Adam for that.
johngrimsmo: Good.
John: The other box that I had is my pack of
johngrimsmo: Nice.
John: Grim's Mo Saga notebooks, notepads. I had somebody here.
johngrimsmo: This episode of the Business of Machining brought to you by...
John: Bought to Grinz and I. So you gave me some, to be totally fair, I don't know what I did with them. i used one, but i don't you gave me more than one, I don't know that where I put them.
johngrimsmo: yep
John: And like, no, this is exactly what I want. I want something that I can just jot down willy nilly on. And so I logged on your website, bought pack, and they just showed up. So I'm looking forward to using these.
johngrimsmo: Yeah. Good. i'm glad I'm glad you do. um Quick clarification on that. I know you you texted me later and you're like, have they shipped yet? Because I ordered them like a week ago.
johngrimsmo: So with this whole shipping customs and all that stuff, um customs broker and things like that, it's become basically too expensive for us to ship small items.
John: Yeah, I thought about that.
johngrimsmo: it's kind of It's kind of silly. um So for the present second in time, we're kind of choosing not to ship anything under like 50 bucks.
johngrimsmo: um
John: Yeah, right.
johngrimsmo: you know If you buy a big product, you can get as many small things as you want. But yeah, so I don't feel good about that solution at all because I want to be able to support our customers with more notebooks, more inks, more t-shirts, more things like that.
johngrimsmo: um So we're we're playing with other things, but
John: You could, i don't know if it feels very full Grimsoe-Doo-E, but um you could use a 3PL. It actually could work great for this stuff, John.
johngrimsmo: third party something which is basically how you got yours I um buddy and buddy and Buffalo still had a bunch yeah
John: Yeah, so um you would... but Yes. Shout out shout out to Tuck. No. So we did this when, to be honest, it was when strike marks started to fall apart.
johngrimsmo: okay
John: My partner and I were arguing and fighting about responsibilities and who was making how much money or like, wasn't about the money, but it was more about like who was doing what. And I was machining these things. I was ship i packaging them up. i was shipping them every day.
John: And i was, you know, we weren't paying ourselves, so to speak. I was like, man, I'm doing a lot of work here, blah, blah, blah. And so this was 15 years ago. We found a third-party logistics provider of which there are plethora of options.
John: And you could, obviously it doesn't work for your knives because they're more custom and unique, like you could ship even sagas or certainly this type of stuff. You could ship 5,000 of them to a US 3PL to handle the customs once.
johngrimsmo: Yeah, once.
John: And then they will ship these things for you for, you know, low fee. I mean, it costs money, but not that much.
johngrimsmo: Maybe it is worth looking into um because I was talking with our team and I was like, remind me what is the totality of all these little items? Like, tell tell me the list.
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: And it's basically ink replacements, pocketbooks, t-shirts, hoodies, and various little extra screw packs or double thumb stud or things like that, which are more smaller and bespoke.
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: And there's not a lot of things.
John: Yeah.
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: three
John: but There's downsides to 3PLs for sure of cost and hassle, but on the flip side, it's also kind of reminds me of the whole like Jiffy Lube franchise, like to use one, it forces you to have your stuff together.
John: Like you need to have SKUs, you have inventory, you need to have replenishment queue quantities.
johngrimsmo: Yeah.
John: um And, you know, that was good for us at the time to go through that and be forced. You can't just like get an order and be like, okay, i need to like put this thing together. It's 10, like you got to have, um,
johngrimsmo: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: yeah
John: But it'd be easy easy with stuff like this.
johngrimsmo: ah One thought that did actually occur to me, and I don't know if this is worth pursuing or not, but our buddy, ah Andrew Henry from Henry Holsters has definitely gotten a local shipping down pat and he's become a fulfillment center for his own connections.
John: Yeah, you should talk to him because I believe he has a like products and services side business of offering both manufacturing, but also assembly and fulfillment.
johngrimsmo: hello
johngrimsmo: Yep.
John: I know he does because he's doing it work at the Modus guys.
johngrimsmo: Exactly. Exactly.
John: Okay, there you go.
johngrimsmo: So yeah, maybe. I'm so
John: Yep.
John: What else?
johngrimsmo: doing good on time. Okay, real quick. I was thinking about our our invented theory of buying a paving company.
John: ah Yeah.
johngrimsmo: and And the the way you've always mentioned it is like, if we buy a paving company, i don't want to know anything about paving. I would be you know the owner and hire managers and hire pavers and all that stuff.
johngrimsmo: And I was thinking about that and I was like, even if I was in that top role and just ran the company, I would still want to know how roads are paved. I would want to know as much as I could about how technically roads are paved.
johngrimsmo: That's like what my default nature would want to do. I couldn't just be this, you know, faceless CEO that's like, oh, manager will handle everything.
John: Sure.
johngrimsmo: Now, I wouldn't want to operate the equipment. Like, I don't want to be the guy on the boots on the floor, like doing the thing. But I would want to know as much as I could about it. That's just who I am. You know, what do think?
John: Yeah. Yeah. um
johngrimsmo: Especially with a technical business, like road paving is fairly tech. It can be technical. I don't know
John: Oh no, 100%. It's like, what's the grade and quality of the asphalt and what are the were reporting standards?
johngrimsmo: You got to know what you're doing.
John: Who are we bidding for? What are our... Yeah, absolutely. But I think the difference would be like, in the scenario that this is envisioned in my head is like, okay, you purchased this company, you come into it, you have a team of managers in place, et cetera, versus you and I that started the equivalent of like, hey, I bought a used paver on Craigslist and I was doing golf cart golf cart path repairs and built it up built it up myself where I was the guy, you know, I was going to the asphalt yard and picking it up, ah the mill or whatever and like testing it myself.
johngrimsmo: yeah
John: And and then you, you know, you just are, are plagued by your own sweat, equity and labor of having built it up from nothing that is cool, but also burdens you.
johngrimsmo: that's an interesting distinction that i didn't think about is is buying an established company say they're looking to sell but still operate I didn't use that as a variable in my thought process, um but that might change things.
johngrimsmo: If you bought an established company that already knew what they were doing, I would obviously want to acknowledge what they're doing and like have them teach me and wrap my head around it, but I might not go nearly as deep as if you and I hadd said, we're going to start a paving company.
John: Yeah. Yeah.
John: Exactly.
johngrimsmo: We're going to hire professional pavers who've done this for 20 years. We're going to do this. I don't know. It's interesting.
John: Well, think about Kern now that Kern's an American company, it's like, okay, um you know, yes, there's probably deep resources, Amatek, I think like deep resources and in different silos of manufacturing and engineering that they have.
johngrimsmo: yeah
John: And maybe there's some consolidation of that sort of tribalish, I mean, there's a super, super technical stuff across many different fronts and that's a huge asset and and so forth on the flip side, like,
John: Like they're not going to sit there and step in and be like, Hey, we need to understand every like current is an operating company that has its own standalone ability to operate, et etc cetera, et cetera.
johngrimsmo: yeah
johngrimsmo: Yeah. Yeah. Let them cook kind of thing. Hmm.
John: Yeah.
John: Yeah. I always, the the cynical part of me always laughs and kind of harkens back to my first job at a college of, of working as an investment banker of like, okay, there's all these BS sales pitches from bankers or from law firms or from, from stock market guys about like, oh, we need to do this merger. You know, the sum of the parts, these synergies and we can combine things and cross sell and all that.
John: And, you know, seven out of ten go horribly wrong and like they don't mix the culture and there's problems and over-promised expectations and cost-cutting fail well it's all these reasons they so often fail and then all of a sudden it's like no we can extract more value by severing off these businesses allowing them to flourish on their own and there's such a like it's one reason why i like so glad i chose to not spend my life in that world it's like it's so bs-y around like no like It's just, you know they sell it both ways.
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: Yeah. yeah so um
John: ah Yeah. Yeah. yeah Let's here as you see. What else do we have enough time to go through Norseman Blade Heat Tree?
John: We will save it.
johngrimsmo: Let's save it for next week.
John: Okay. I got on my list.
johngrimsmo: it's not ah It's not a big one, but yeah, I might know more next week, actually.
John: Okay. Good.
johngrimsmo: it So that'll be good.
John: okay good
John: um
johngrimsmo: Yeah.
John: I had a couple more things I added that I'm going to save as well.
johngrimsmo: Go for it.
John: No, no, it's fine. Well, this one is quick. I'll throw it out there now so we don't let it linger. um I'm still trying to figure out what to do with our water system. We finally had a ah but a professional water company, not a big deal.
John: It's like Colligan or um like there's franchises these in every probably city in the country.
johngrimsmo: Yeah.
John: And... and yeah it kind of s sinks. It's like the only two options are really RO or DI. Our RO would be fed off of water that has approximately 250 million, 250 parts per million total dissolved solids. that's,
johngrimsmo: Yeah.
John: ah total dissolved solid
johngrimsmo: Ours is like 150, so that's not much worse.
John: and that's Yeah, it's a little high, but it's like not crazy.
johngrimsmo: Yep.
John: and But it depends on what those... You could get a softener, but it's going to be the same TDS. It's just going to swap out certain ah ah of the... Certain dissolved solids for others. um So it doesn't actually change the TDS. It's easier on your ah RO filters, which is nice.
John: And I don't have a problem with ah RO, except that I don't necessarily want to be in the business of storing water in perpetuity because of the risk of um biological growth. And so I wanted to look at DI. They're going to get back to me on a DI.
John: system um exchange quote, which the nice thing about DI is you maintain your water pressure from the city or from your water source. So you don't need to store it because it just flows through the DI and then through the PEX lines in our shop to the machines.
johngrimsmo: no ro at all because a lot of times it's both diro
John: No RO at all. Yeah. And DI water is cool. ah ye I think the way to say that is that a lot of our RO systems have a DI add-on, but true...
johngrimsmo: yeah oh interesting
John: DI, like I've seen this in other bigger shops, like you just have two or more tanks and that are DI and um it produces perfect water, like end of conversation. The caveat is, number one, it's not cheap.
John: And number two, if you don't exchange the tank out, it quickly starts creating salt water in your system, which is like really bad.
johngrimsmo: Wow. Yeah.
John: um But the other point worth sharing is QualiChem, with whom I've been having a lot of conversations, they're sort of saying like, hey, the whole like you need to do your initial fill with with, uh, imperfect water that has some minerals to help the coolant emulsify. They're like, not true.
John: Like you can start from day one with like lab grade DI water, perfectly fine, even better to do that.
johngrimsmo: Very interesting.
John: Like do not whatever. Um, because some of the other options sink. Like I don't necessarily want to put it a software for our whole facility and then get salt delivered every month and have picking up bags of salt filling. It's kind of a pain in the butt.
johngrimsmo: the
John: Um, but need to figure something out. So keep everybody posted.
johngrimsmo: Interesting.
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: Yeah, a while ago I went on a whole deep dive into ion exchange resins, which is what a DI system does. like
John: Yeah.
johngrimsmo: Like how they work. They're literally exchanging you know the ion of iron or whatever, and they're they're they're giving off an oxygen atom or whatever, and it's exchanging.
John: Trading. yeah her
johngrimsmo: It's really cool. And then you can actually reverse the function by soaking the ion exchange resins in ah in a specific acid, which will reverse...
John: Yes. Yeah.
johngrimsmo: the reaction and will drop out the solid and now you have and and will leach the ass from the acid and make a a new ion exchange present like it's pretty cool
John: Yeah. Yeah.
John: And I quickly looked into that. Like there is no DIY solution of like, Hey, I want to buy the tanks and like, just kind of recharge the DI beads on my own.
John: Like not like you gotta have the professionals do this.
johngrimsmo: right yep
John: um I don't know DI water swap out is going to be couple hundred bucks a month or it's going to be like 1500 month.
johngrimsmo: Yeah, big deal.
John: um the other thing I don't hate about r RO though is it has a huge waste bypass. Like you're, you waste two to three gallons for every gallon of water you make or more even.
johngrimsmo: Yeah,
John: So that, that's,
johngrimsmo: isn't it like 90% sometimes or something? Or, don't know.
John: you sweet You can adjust it. And part what I'm thinking, because we don't need perfect water. I mean, it's not bad, but we just don't need it. So it's like, wait a minute here. If we're filling RO into an IBC tote and it's dripping in, what I might consider doing is a separate straight tap drip line where I can adjust the ratio of drippy drips so that we're blending it in, which means the RO system will shut off way earlier because the tank fills up, which means we're in effect making our own blended water without having to create so much RO waste.
johngrimsmo: oh
johngrimsmo: Got it. If you're okay with a higher PPM final product.
John: Make sense?
John: Yeah, which which we are. like
johngrimsmo: Yeah.
John: you What you don't want to do is take 250 ppm tt TDS and keep keep topping off that way forever. But if you get it to like 75, I'm pretty sure that's going to be fine.
johngrimsmo: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, maybe that's the 90 I'm thinking of. It'll remove 90%. So if you add 250 times 90% is whatever that is, you know, 25 or something.
John: Yeah. Yeah.
johngrimsmo: yeah
John: Cool.
johngrimsmo: Cool.
John: See you next week.
johngrimsmo: All right. All right. See you next week, buddy.
John: All right. Sounds good. Take care.
johngrimsmo: Bye.
