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Episode 18: Jason Roop
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Dr. Jason Roop is the founder and CEO of the Center for Trait-Based Transformation and serves as the Vice President of Research and Development for Hometown Health System.
Having experienced 17 years of active addiction, which led to homelessness, Jason entered treatment in 2013 and has been in recovery ever since. An author of several publications on the leadership traits of individuals with substance use disorder, Jason is a frequent speaker at national addiction treatment conferences and is a member of the Kentucky Opioid Abatement Advisory Commission.
Jason's research emphasizes the inherent strengths and qualities of individuals with substance use disorders. His innovative work has redefined the perception of addiction by highlighting how personality and character traits can be harnessed for positive outcomes. He advocates for accessible treatment options for all, comprehensive aftercare support, and the adoption of person-centered, evidence-based practices in behavioral healthcare.
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Transcript
Introduction to Podcast
00:00:10
Speaker
Bye! Welcome to Destination Change, a podcast where we talk recovery, treatment, and more. I'm your host, Angie Fiedler-Sutton, with the National Behavioral Health Association providers, and I use she-her pronouns.
Meet Dr. Jason Rupp
00:00:23
Speaker
Our guest today is Dr. Jason Rupp. Jason is the founder and CEO of the Center for Trade-Based Transformation and serves as the Vice President of Research and Development for Hometown Health
Jason's Personal Recovery Story
00:00:32
Speaker
System. Having experienced 17 years of active addiction, which led to homelessness, Jason entered treatment in 2013 and has been in recovery ever since. and author of several publications on leadership traits of individuals with substance use disorder. Jason is a frequent speaker at National Addiction Treatment Conferences and is a member of the Kentucky Opioid Abatement Advisory Commission.
Strengths in Recovery
00:00:52
Speaker
Jason's research emphasizes the inherent strengths and qualities of individuals with substance use disorders. His innovative work has redefined the perception of addiction by highlighting how personality and character traits can be harnessed for positive
Promoting Accessible Treatment
00:01:04
Speaker
outcomes.
00:01:04
Speaker
He advocates for accessible treatment options for all, comprehensive aftercare support, and the adoption of person-centered, evidence-based practices and behavioral health care. Thanks for joining me, Jason. Yeah, thank you for having me. It's ah it's an honor to be here. Okay, awesome. Well, our first question is is always the same, just kind of how you got into the recovery space, not, I mean, obviously you're you're in recovery yourself, but what made you decide to do that as a job versus all the plethora of other options that are out there?
Career Shift to Recovery Work
00:01:32
Speaker
Yeah, well, it kind of just came about organically. I was working in higher education when I began my doctoral degree program ah in 2019. And of course, the title of my dissertation was the leadership traits of people with substance use disorder.
00:01:48
Speaker
And so as I continued and carried out that research, I was invited to present my research findings at a statewide Chamber of Commerce conference here in Kentucky. So I did that. And then after that, I presented at the RX Summit in Atlanta of April, 2023. And so with those research findings, which ultimately would become the trait-based model of recovery, I found myself firmly etched and implanted within the addiction field so it's kind of one step led to another so therefore that's how I've found myself here now just embedded within the field. Great well let's talk a bit about the trait based model recovery for those who may be unfamiliar if that give me kind of the elevator pitch of what it is about.
Trait-Based Recovery Model
00:02:33
Speaker
So the trait-based model recovery is a revolutionary approach to addiction treatment and recovery that builds upon the leadership traits that people in addiction often possess. And it's not a modality which focuses primarily or exclusively on defects of character. Instead, it's a model of empowerment that considers that evidence-based understanding that people in addiction have these tremendous and dynamic superpower qualities to influence others for good and positive gain. And so the trait-based model recovery is accessible 100% online digitally. It can also be facilitated in person. We are in residential treatment centers, outpatient providers, drug courts, and court systems. So it is very adaptable, very scalable model of empowerment, which builds upon those leadership traits that people in addiction often possess.
00:03:28
Speaker
Awesome. What would you consider your leadership traits in the trait based
Leadership and Resilience
00:03:34
Speaker
model? Well, so the trait based model recovery builds up on 10 leadership traits, which came about by the the research that was carried out over a four year period. Several traits that I can recognize within myself, but primarily the, the top three would be determination, tenacity and resilience. And that goes back in, gee, I can reflect and look back to times when I played sports in school. And and and I wasn't the best athlete. like i I was cut from the baseball team, the basketball team, but I never gave up. I kept trying to to make the cut, to make the team. And that
00:04:10
Speaker
great that's what those three traits can be classified or categorized as great that is kind of led me throughout all of life and it actually was there an active addiction i know i've been arrested eighteen times but never as a result of any of those arrested stop using because i was determined ah to keep getting high and resiliency of course is getting back up after you've been knocked down same thing in active addiction i would i would lose my driver's license i would lose my freedom. I would lose self-respect and even dignity, yet I was able to bounce back and continue down the path of actively using because I was resilient in tenacity, just that ability to stand firm. In spite of the opposition that we face, that was also evident in active addiction when people would say that I needed to get help. I would say, obviously, it's the shadow expression of tenacity is denial. So I would say that you know I didn't need help. And so that not only
00:05:07
Speaker
when i entered into the recovery those traits didn't disappear and that's kind of the philosophy of the trade base model recovery that these ten leadership trades people in active addiction possess them they're just often misunderstood because they come across are represented or expressed in ways which are. I seem to be counter what those traits represent but for me those three traits not only were present in active addiction before active addiction but the most definitely are present in my life now. Currently got four full-time jobs and also you know started the the business, the Center for Trade-Based Transformation. ah Because those traits, tenacity, determination, and resiliency are kind of like my hallmark, which isn't always a good thing if it's unbalanced. So that's another thing that the trade-based model does is promote well-being and balance, emotional and internal balance.
00:05:58
Speaker
So i've always got to be mindful that i can get off the path of of balance easily by focusing on a project and about trying to accomplish a goal so yeah for me great would be the the primary trade qualities that i ah have as a leader.
Authentic Leadership
00:06:13
Speaker
um Great what would you say makes a great leader or are audiences all levels from ceo to regular so what would you think. and that's ah That's a ah great question. and And what's interesting is that there's really not one general accepted definition of leadership, at least when it comes to the but literature or academia. like There's a lot of different approaches, a lot of different philosophies.
00:06:38
Speaker
And i would suggest that today the the most effective style of leadership and and what defines a good leader is someone who is authentic and empathetic inspirational determine considers the individual needs of everyone on the team that they're leading you know back in the. In the day in ah in an era gone by leadership was more authoritarian so if you can imagine maybe like the military with ah these all commanding authority figures that are saying do do what I say and not as ah as I do so much and and that worked for a while and and I'm not saying it doesn't work today.
00:07:18
Speaker
But because of so many ethical and moral lapses from our governmental leaders, religious leaders, ah from celebrities, like I think as a society, we have seen that that's not going to work anymore. it's You can't fool us by saying that you have it all together because we have been there. We know that you don't have it all together. And so I think that people in today's society respond really well to to the leader that says, you know what? I don't have all the answers but together we can get there and so i think that's what marks a very effective later in today's culture and climate. Will your bio says that you advocate for accessible treatment options for all kind of talk a little bit about what that means what does accessible treatment mean to you.
Removing Financial Barriers in Treatment
00:08:00
Speaker
For me, it means that all the barriers to treatment are either removed or mitigated as much as possible. And so some of those barriers are financial or economic. So obviously, promoting coverage for treatment from insurance companies would be one form of creating accessibility, kind of leveling the field where currently, or at least previously, it's been to the effect that those that have the most resources are those that can afford the best quality care. And I just don't think that that's the way that things should be. And it's not a Pollyanna-ish type of view. I think it's something that we can really achieve as a society to kind of level that playing field and allow people in spite of the resources that they have
00:08:47
Speaker
to seek and to obtain high quality care for all of the behavioral health care issues, disorders or or diseases, what have you, or addiction that that people may may be facing. And additionally, I would say that cost of care would be one of the primary ah issues when we're talking about accessibility, but also things such as transportation. Unfortunately, there's people that are ready to go to treatment, but they just don't have a way to get there. And so that's another form or method that can be taken or launched to kind of mitigate those barriers. And so accessibility would be opening the front door to treatment and recovery to everyone that wants it. And so any measure, any legislation that achieves that purpose or moves us forward towards that goal is a move in the right direction, I would say.
00:09:38
Speaker
Definitely. We here at the podcast, why we call it destination changes, we figure that recovery is a journey and like any other journey, there are barriers and it's not a straight line. What does it mean for you to go through treatment and recovery?
Recovery as a Lifelong Process
00:09:51
Speaker
Yeah, that's another good question. And I think that typically we've got pretty hardly defined and determined silos or categories when it comes to treatment and recovery, meaning that we perceive treatment to be kind of the inpatient hospitalization type of residential care. And then on the back end of that, recovery begins. But for me, I would say that the entire experience or environment or ecosystem is recovery.
00:10:22
Speaker
and And I do believe that that's kind of a direction that that we will be going and when it comes to behavioral health care and as a society that that we're not going to have these segments of treatment and stages that are clearly defined which separate treatment and recovery, but we will have a more holistic view that that recovery begins you know from from day one that someone decides that they want to make a change in their lifestyle and their thought patterns and behavioral patterns. And so that can include things such as employability. It it includes advancing your education. It includes establishing a meaningful connection to community. And all of those areas are aspects of recovery and also of recovery are those acute
00:11:10
Speaker
Yeah kind of maybe residential or acute stages of withdrawal that that typically clients or people will will go to to either residential treatment centers or some type of intensive care to begin that process i would also even though that may be. more clearly defined as treatment it's also recovery and so i believe that the recovery ecosystem the general overarching life experience from when a person decides to make a change in their life all the way up through the very end that that's all considered recovery and treatment would be a more specific part or phase of that entire experience.
00:11:53
Speaker
Definitely. Let's talk a little bit about your advocacy work and your work with the Kentucky Opioid Abatement Advisory Commission. Kind of how did you get involved with them? What exactly does it do? That kind of thing.
Kentucky Opioid Abatement Commission Involvement
00:12:04
Speaker
Yeah. So obviously with the, the opioid abatement settlement funds here in Kentucky, we were awarded $864 million dollars to be used in drug treatment, drug prevention legislation. And so we established here in Kentucky, ah a commission, a nine member commission that would oversee the allotment or distribution of half of that funding. The other half.
00:12:29
Speaker
I was allocated to local counties and municipalities but the other half that the commission overseas is for us to determine as a body the best ah usage for those funds and so i was appointed to that role a couple years ago i was invited by the kentucky attorney general. to apply to submit my whatever my my CV, my my qualifications, my history with personal addiction. And so I was appointed, accepted and appointed to that commission. And I really hold that in high honor, Angie, because I don't believe, and maybe it is, but at least I'm not sure if it's in every state, but here in Kentucky, each member represents a certain area of interest from all the citizens of Kentucky. And and those that I represent,
00:13:18
Speaker
Are victims of the opioid epidemic and when i think about that all the people that have lost their lives and all the parents that have lost children or children that have lost parents like where those are all victims and and and that term is applicable to entire communities that have just been. devastated by the opioid epidemic. So I hold in high regard and I hold it as a high honor to serve the the state of Kentucky in that capacity. And so over the past two years, what we have been doing, we've done when we first started and formed the commission, we did 12 town halls.
00:13:54
Speaker
from ah pikeville to paduca that's the eastern most part of the state all the way to the western most part of the state and we just went around into local towns and and ask people like what do you see what do you need the most what are your concerns what are your challenges what are your opportunities and as a commission, We advocated for grassroots organizations to be formed for ah some very innovative measures and approaches to addiction recovery to be launched and and to be carried out. And so we encouraged our citizens, our our community members to come up with those ideas. And and so as the process unfolds, of course, organizations can submit an application to receive a requested amount of funding for their their purpose, their mission.
00:14:40
Speaker
And it's been a very, not only informative, but a transformative process because we get to see all the efforts that are taking place. and And I'll say this, I don't believe we're to a place to where we want to be, ideally. I think that we are seeing results in Kentucky. And in fact, a report just came out last week that drug overdose deaths are down 25% from last year. So that's really, really encouraging. That's really, really promising. Yet there's work to be done. And so ah it's just an honor for me to be able to serve alongside some some great people on that commission to help inspire hope and instill change across the state.
00:15:21
Speaker
As your bio said, you're a frequent speaker at National Addiction Treatment Conferences. I know you spoke at CCAP's Addiction Leadership Conference. Is it always on the trait-based model or do you talk on different topics?
Conferences and Advocacy
00:15:31
Speaker
On the national stage, it's primarily been either about the trait-based model recovery or the positive qualities that people in substance use disorder possess. And so that's kind of the the wheelhouse. I have spoken on a lot of different topics regionally across the state, you know, at rallies, at public events, at fundraisers, taking different angles when it comes to to substance use disorder, like sharing my personal story. I've done that very, very often.
00:16:00
Speaker
And it's always, I enjoy every minute of it. I really, really love it. So I would say, Angie, primarily it's so it's on the trait-based model recovery and and those leadership traits that people in addiction possess, but that's not the totality of it. There's certainly a lot of other aspects and angles, and we've already discussed some of them, treatment, accessibility, and the meaning of recovery. And so I made a promise, Angie, to myself in 2014, when I was Nearing the end of treatment, I would be asked to share my my story publicly. I just made a commitment and wrote it down in a journal that I'll never turn down an opportunity to share my story. And so I've pretty much I've i've held true to that commitment. And regardless, if it's three to four people or three to 400, I'll always walk through the open door to to share my story and to help give other people hope.
00:16:53
Speaker
MBHAP is a, you know, one of the many resources we obviously promote to people in the Addiction Committee. What kind of resources do you typically go to to learn more about what you're doing and how you, you know, to do your job? You know, I try to stay as informed and up to date as possible. So, so I read peer reviewed articles. Also, I'm on LinkedIn quite a bit because it's very active when it comes to ah addiction recovery and some of the research that's taken place and i find myself engaged in conversations not only through social media and three viewing those journals those academic journals but also through networking and personal relationships obviously serving on the commission allows me the opportunity to to meet some really fascinating people all across the country and so,
00:17:41
Speaker
I really enjoy learning what are the latest measures and in the latest methods that organizations or people are doing to help people recover from a lifestyle of active addiction. and And so it's kind of this holistic approach that includes reading, it includes interacting, it includes social media. And in fact, I was down in Nashville, Tennessee. ah last week visiting a treatment center there that will soon be launching ah the trait-based model recovery. and and They're doing some really creative things in Tennessee, and it's Hustle Recovery, by the way, is the name of the treatment center. But there's a shortage of open beds in Tennessee currently, and what this organization is doing is creating a ah level of respite care for when people say that they need help. They're ready to go to treatment, that they don't have to wait until a bed becomes open. This organization will actually go and pick them up,
00:18:32
Speaker
and bring them back to a sober living community until they can get into treatment somewhere so it's through those that that cultivation of relationships through meeting new people and just staying informed and apprised of what people are doing because a lot of great work is being carried out all across the country and so maintaining that connection. allows me to stay not only informed, but kind of on the cutting edge of of of what is determined to be through the data and through the evidence to be some of the most effective measures and efforts that are taking place.
00:19:08
Speaker
Great. Now you started treatment in 2013, believe it or not, that's over 10 years ago. yeah I'm still one of those people that the 90s were last decade.
Progress in Addiction Treatment
00:19:19
Speaker
i'm with yeah In your opinion, what has been the biggest changes in the addiction treatment community or the biggest progress? Yeah, I've seen a lot of growth and compassion and and obviously there's still pockets of communities I believe that kind of look down on people with substance use disorder, at least suspicious. And that's not me being judgmental. It's just kind of like understanding the scenario, but I can remember
00:19:45
Speaker
In 2013, that first of all, insurance didn't typically cover treatment at least here in Kentucky or the insurance that I was afforded back then. And there were things that were really diametrically opposed at the time, like in 2014 and 2015, when I began serving in public relations for a treatment center or working in public relations, things such as needle exchange was, it was a contentious topic. in Kentucky. And after some years, like it's pretty much generally accepted that that's that's a very appropriate response to the opioid epidemic and the way that it reduces disease, the spread of disease, that it allows and affords people an opportunity for intervention for people to go to treatment. So I've seen a growth in compassionate measures
00:20:35
Speaker
harm reduction, for instance, these these efforts which are really moving towards being person-centered and away from a very rigid idea, expectation, and understanding of what recovery means. So I've seen that kind of take shape, where before it was very rigid, there was only one way, for example, to get better, to recover, which typically included 12 steps and abstinence, but now it seems that more approaches are more generally accepted. And I think that's a very, very good thing. I do believe that we'll continue to see growth in those areas, growth in understanding. And I think that's where the trait-based model recovery also lends a hand because we've we've typically misunderstood the behavior of people in active addiction. And I know that for myself, I once felt like I was just a problem that needed to be dealt with or that
00:21:29
Speaker
i can only rise so far but i think that this understanding not only about the leadership trades that people in addiction possess but that we need to treat people compassionately equitably i know honesty and fairness and and giving them decency right because by the time someone goes to treatment we we so devalue ourselves that we can't put forward an ounce of commitment because we cannot imagine a positive outcome from our negative shape of life. And so when we surround others, when we surround those who are suffering with with real hope, with real love and care, then we we we begin to see change. And it's not looking at the world through rose-colored glasses. It's an evidence-based approach that when we lend someone self-respect and decency through the words that we choose to say, that it actually begins the transformation process.
00:22:25
Speaker
And so i'm incredibly inspired and encouraged but by what i see taking place just about everywhere what would you say is the current biggest barrier for people in addiction.
Challenges in Healthcare and Treatment
00:22:36
Speaker
The biggest barrier for people in addiction, I think it's hard to name just one. Of course, we still have a disparity between those that have good health care coverage and those that do not. And so that's a consideration or a barrier or a hurdle also for people who are in active addiction. And I can speak to this from personal experience.
00:23:00
Speaker
When we talk about treatment specifically it often means that we've got to give up our life for a certain amount of time and that's trip a day just that's that's terrifying for some people and and even for me by the time i went to treatment in two thousand and thirteen angie like i had nothing left. I didn't have a possession i didn't have any self respect i had no relationship that were ongoing the only thing that i had was the love of a mother and she never gave up on me and because of that you know i was able to get help but even being in spite of me being suicidal like i i wanted to die i just didn't have the courage to make it happen myself for at least the
00:23:44
Speaker
I could not live and I could not die. I'll just leave it at that. But even in that state, the thought of going away to treatment for a year scared the bejesus out of me, right? But fortunately, an intervention occurred at the right time and I was taken to treatment and I was convinced to stay there. And I was convinced to stay there and by the staff, yes, but most importantly, by the other clients that put their arm around me. and and tell me that it was going to be okay and so that that marked the beginning of a tremendous not only experience but a transformative experience in my life. So in addition to the external barriers such as insurance coverage, transportation, the willingness to walk away from like family a family unit or or an employment, it's this deep down fear
00:24:35
Speaker
that we're going to lose everything that we're going to lose comfort that we're going to lose our escapism that we have to face our monsters that we have to face our own giants so to speak and our own shadows I think that feels a lot of people with with fear and with terror and just in case anyone is listening i do want to throw this out there with i've been in that shape i've been in that boat and i understand that it can seem so overwhelmingly terrifying.
00:25:05
Speaker
To think that you need to go to treatment or enter into recovery but i can promise you that was the best decision i made in my life hands down and for anyone listening or anyone that has considered this like the same. would be true for for them as well for you as well that although it's terrifying it is most definitely worth it it's not easy but it's tremendously empowering and beneficial to to move forward and to begin that recovery process what would you say is your favorite part of your job oh man.
00:25:44
Speaker
I love it, Angie. I absolutely love it when I began sharing evidence-based findings that say that people in active addiction are more than who they thought they were. And part of my job is to go into treatment centers. And and while the trait-based model recovery is accessible 100% online, It also has that in-person component it can be facilitated by peer support or clinicians but here in kentucky often will go around every chance i get i'll go to one of the treatment centers that are that has incorporated trade base and i'll meet with our clients and to see the spark of light that comes on in their eyes i mean i've had people just cry.
00:26:31
Speaker
because they'll share that I've never considered myself to not only be a leader, but to be someone worthy of love and to just hear those personal stories. It's so moving and I get the fortunate opportunity. I get the tremendous honor of walking into these treatment centers and sharing with clients the science That suggest that they have superpowers if you will that they have these leadership qualities that they are not just a problem that they're not just ah a screw up or a mess up and that they're not made to just rise rise so far and that's it but that anything is possible that.
00:27:13
Speaker
they are more than who they thought they were and that's actually the the name of module number one in the trade base model recovery that the title is who am i and so sharing with people who they really are that they are leaders that they are over comers that they have tremendous creativity that they have tremendous resiliency and determination, It's a game changer. It is an absolute game changer because, unfortunately, we've been told that we're none of those things that were just a nuisance or a plague on society. So to could be the bearer of that evidence based news, man, it just for me, it doesn't get any better than that. That sounds great. As I mentioned, our audience is all levels from from, you know, those counselors to CEOs. What kind of advice would you want to give for someone who wanted to become a be a better leader?
00:28:06
Speaker
be transparent with your weaknesses. I think that is is probably one of the most advantageous traits or tools that a leader can possess. is And it's easy for us to to hit the default mode of putting on a mask and saying, well, I've got all the answers since I've got the title of leader to impress others with our our knowledge or our expertise or skills, but That's not the way, that's not the the path that will only last for so long until we don't have the answers because that's always going to happen. And so for any executive, for for any student, for for anyone, I would say when it comes to leadership, which leadership, the way that I define it, leadership is influence.
00:28:51
Speaker
And we all have that that capability. And another way that leadership is defined, at least the way I've defined it, is that it's the ability to help someone else achieve an outcome that they could not achieve themselves. And so as a leader, in order to carry out that process, it requires collaboration from your team. It requires trust from your team. It requires a level of commitment and dedication from your team That cannot just be fabricated or manufactured it's gotta be initiated from within and people will initiate and generate that trust and commitment when they see leaders who have open hands and open doors right sand.
00:29:36
Speaker
I don't have all the answers, but together we can get there. And so that transparency would be number one. And number two is that is right behind it is authenticity. Just be authentic. Be your true self. you We don't have to impress anyone. We don't have to please anyone. We just need to be who we were born to be and just to live our lives with that posture, with that approach, with that understanding. And when we don't know what to do, let's ask somebody and give that open invitation to those around us to to help us move forward together. Because, of course, and I don't know who ah said this originally, it's not my quote, but we can get farther. We can get to the go farther if we do it together. Maybe we can get there faster alone, but we can go farther together. And so transparency and authenticity, in my opinion, Angie, are are the key.
00:30:29
Speaker
Great. Let's talk a little bit about your work with the hometown health system, your vice president of research and development, kind of what, what are they and what that does that do?
Role in Hometown Health System
00:30:39
Speaker
So hometown health system here in Kentucky, it's a full conglomerate in terms of the different arms of the organization. There's a nonprofit arm, which, uh, offers community based resources. to those that are struggling and it can be to those that are in active addiction or those that are just disadvantaged in some way. So we have a ah soup kitchen where every week we we feed those in the community. We're helping with like ah things such as electric bills or light bills, helping others like helping people find jobs. We're working with local agencies and hometown also has a specialty pharmacy. So in the medications that
00:31:21
Speaker
are provided through the specialty pharmacy are typically those injectables for MAT, right? So sublocade, Vivitrol would be included in that. And so as an organization, Hometown has these multiple pillars and also they have a retail pharmacy and a healthcare care clinic that for anyone in the community, it's almost a one-stop shop when it comes to all things related to healthcare. care And additionally, Hometown is involved in a lot of treatment centers in terms of providing that whole person care, medical care, biological care, pharmaceuticals to those people in those treatment centers. And they've just been kind of a a great partner as as well. They're very supportive of the Center for Trait-Based Transformation and the Center for Trait-Based Transformation is ah supportive for hometown. And so my role at hometown
00:32:12
Speaker
is vp of research and development so what we're doing is looking at creating a standardized level of care that addresses the whole person beginning at day one as they enter treatment and then not stopping when treatment quote unquote is over it actually continues throughout the rest of their lives so creating this platform of aftercare that helps people whenever they go back to their communities help them to find jobs help them to to keep their doctor's appointments help them to advance their their education so it's really exciting work that's taking place here in kentucky and you know it's trade based where we're in new mexico kentucky soon to be tennessee and and hopefully california bornian and and my vision is to have it all across the nation and ultimately all across the globe. I think hometown also carries that same vision to provide that standardized level of care for the whole person from the very beginning of the recovery process all the way through to the very end. Now before we're getting close to the end, before we talk about where people can find you, was there something that you thought I was going to ask but didn't or that you wanted to talk about but we haven't?
00:33:19
Speaker
Oh, it's a great question. Thank you. I don't think so. I mean, you've asked some great questions and this has been a dynamic conversation. I really, this has been solid, super, super solid. I can't really think of anything. If I did, I'd have to make it up. yeah It might ruin it. So yeah, I don't think so, Angie. Great. Now, if people wanted to learn more about you or get in contact with you, where can they find you?
Contact and Further Information
00:33:41
Speaker
Yep, so you can visit our website at www.startfromstrength.org. You can also email me at jgroot, that's R-O-O-P, at startfromstrength.org. Then of course, I'm also very active on LinkedIn.
00:34:00
Speaker
Facebook, Instagram, and so through those channels, just so you can look up my name, Jason Root, or Dr. Jason Root. And I encourage people as they listen to this to connect with me because it's just exciting. I really love meeting new people and and learning stories. And so again, startfromstrength.org or via email at jgroot at startfromstrength.org. Awesome. Well, thank you very much. You've been listening to Destination Change. Our guest today was Jason Roop. Thank you for being here. Our theme song was Sun Nation by Pizza and used via Creative Commons license by the Free Music Archive. Please consider rating and reviewing the podcast on Apple Podcast so we can get more listeners. In the meantime, you can always see more about the podcast, including show notes and where else to listen to on our website, www.mbhap.org. If you have questions for the podcast, please email us at info at nbhap.org. Thanks for listening.