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The Truth Of The Matter is - Episode: 129 Special Guest - Sue Corl
21 Plays11 months ago
This week, we have Sue Corl, an international women’s conference speaker, author, mentor, Bible teacher, Cru missionary, and founder and director of Crown of Beauty International. Her greatest joy is being a wife and mother. Sue served as a missionary for twenty-five years in Asia. Currently, she travels to minister to women throughout Asia, Africa, the Middle East, and the United States. Sue is an author of several books and has her own podcast, His Heartbeat with Sue Corl. Tune to hear her testimony. It was indeed a powerful one, and I believe you will benefit from it.
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Transcript
Introduction and Purpose
00:00:02
Speaker
Welcome to a special edition of the Truth or the Matter is podcast. I am your host, Jonathan, and I'm here with our special guests. But before we introduce and welcome her inappropriately, let's begin by appreciating and recognizing all our new and consistent listeners.
00:00:21
Speaker
We thank you all in advance for continuing to press play at your own convenience. Now, if you're a first time listener, we want you to know that the Truth of the Matter is podcast. It's all about providing an honest, contextual, hysterizing philosophical and psychological view of the Bible.
00:00:36
Speaker
while sharing some personal experiences from myself and Daniel. We believe in applying God's word to everyday life.
Testimony of Sue Correll
00:00:43
Speaker
Today we will praise God for another new testimony that you will hear. We hope after hearing this woman of God and her journey that you will be encouraged and uplifted. We hope that also how an encounter with Jesus Christ will guarantee that your life will not be the same. Now without further ado, let's invite our special guest, Sue Correll. How are you doing this morning?
00:01:05
Speaker
I'm doing great. Thanks so much, Jonathan, for having me. And for all of you listening, I just appreciate y'all being here. Okay, so before we get started, what would you say are the three things that you thought about this morning as you woke up?
00:01:20
Speaker
Well, first thing I thought of is why is it this early that I'm waking up? But the wonderful thing is I think it was God because I had three hours in the Word and that was so encouraging. And he had me really focusing on being his daughter. And he took me to 1 John 3.1 where he just talks about how great it is that he calls me a child of God. Amen. Amen.
00:01:47
Speaker
All right, cool. Anything else that crossed your mind as you woke up this morning? That I was hungry because I just finished the fast. Okay. I'm excited to have breakfast this morning. Got you. I'm like you. I usually wake up and I think reflection is important and prioritizing God is extremely important. I think doing that helps your day.
00:02:11
Speaker
you know, immensely. I think putting God first allows you to go throughout your day with purpose and with a desire to not only give Him all the glory, honor, and praise, but to do all things in the glory of God. So I'm with you
Sue's Background and Calling
00:02:24
Speaker
on that. So for those who don't know who you are, Sue Coro is an international woman conference speaker, author, mentor, Bible teacher.
00:02:33
Speaker
She founded and directed of the Crown and Beauty International. Her greatest joy is being a wife to see women set free to live the powerful truths of who they are in Christ and love of God. She served as a missionary for 25 years in Asia currently. She travels to minister to women throughout Asia, Africa, the Middle East, and the US. She's the author of several books and a
00:02:58
Speaker
and also a host of her own podcast called His Heartbeat with Sue Correll. I think those are some amazing things that you've done. If there's anything I can ask before we get started, was it like living in Asia for that long?
00:03:15
Speaker
You know, I really felt a calling on my life from a very young age. I had relatives that were in China for years until they were kicked out. So they're obviously a lot older. But so then as I got into my 20s, I knew that God was still singing. I want you to go there. And so I finally made it there when I was 31. And I was pretty much there for really 26 years, you know, often on some other places, Philippines, China.
00:03:45
Speaker
Hong Kong and raised my kids there. We just loved it. It was home to us. And I've only been back since 2016. So I feel like I'm still adjusting in some ways to America, believe it or not. I miss Asia, but it was a wonderful experience. Thanks. Okay. Now, before we dive into more of your story and your testimony in regards to how you found Christ and how he has blessed you,
00:04:14
Speaker
and how He's walked with you up until now and how long you've been living. We believe first and foremost in prayer. So if you don't mind, bow your heads, close your eyes. O God in the name of Jesus, we thank you for another day. We give you all the glory, honors, and praise, not because of what you've done, Lord, but because of who you are. Let us not be remiss that your Alpha and Omega beginning in the end, the creator of all things, the first and the last and the one who's still to come.
00:04:45
Speaker
Lord, as we enter into today's discussion, we invite you into our conversation. You said anytime two or three or more gathered, there you are in the midst. So Lord, I ask that you open all eyes to see, all ears to hear, all hearts to receive, and all minds to understand the impact that you can have on our individual journeys. Lord, you said that we should be musically encouraged by one another's faith. So Lord, we are guilty by association.
00:05:15
Speaker
and that association is with you, Lord. Because Sue is a child of God and your Holy Spirit resides in her, I believe that you will speak through her today. So I pray that we all listen carefully and that we learn and that we leave with a different perspective about how your work can impact us on all different levels of our lives. We live our lives to levels, Lord, and we arrive in stages. Lord, I pray that all listeners will be inspired and motivated and encouraged by Sue's testimony.
00:05:44
Speaker
Therefore, Lord, all those in agreement, can you say in Jesus' name we pray. Amen. Amen.
Athletics and Identity
00:05:50
Speaker
Yeah, so let's get started. Where were you born? And where did you grow up? Yeah, I was born in Philadelphia and pretty much, you know, grew up all around there. And so we moved by those more just locally. Okay. And what would you say were some of your passions and desires?
00:06:11
Speaker
What did you want to do with your life at a young age? What were some of your thoughts and ideas that you were leaning towards? I was very into athletics. And so that was my life for years. I had a coach tell me when I was 14, if you work hard, you can be in the Olympics someday. So I worked hard.
00:06:35
Speaker
and even went to college as a PE major and to I was a field hockey player and lacrosse player. I have basketball as well but my biggest sports were field hockey and lacrosse and so I purposely went to college it was the top in the country and sure enough I made the US team and you know kind of had the dream but when I got on the road and I experienced it
00:07:01
Speaker
I have become a Christian two years before and I was drifting honestly from the Lord at that point and you know out there with all the spectators and we we did the whole national anthem thing and I finished and and I realized okay I I reached my dream now what
00:07:23
Speaker
You know, it was weird. It's like, I'm 19 now. And I heard the Lord say, you need to turn back to me. And so that's really a huge reason that I did. My brother was home for the summer after that, which was just like a month later, I think. And he was raising support to go on a mission trip for a year.
00:07:51
Speaker
And he discipled me and he helped another friend continue the work after he left and really got me back on track with the Lord. So what gravitated you to athletics? Did you like the desire to work as a team? Did you like competing? What kind of drove you and what made you explore sports in general?
00:08:15
Speaker
Yeah, I think from a very young age, I just had a lot of that natural talent that God had given me. And I always knew it, it was just in me from him, you know, I didn't take any glory in that, you know, you just know God gave it to you, right. And so even when even though I'm younger than my two brothers,
00:08:39
Speaker
I would be beating them in every sport. And it's not like their spaz is either. So it, I just loved it. I, it, it was so joyful, but yes, I was very much of a team player still am love the team thing. I mean, I would play tennis and stuff with girlfriends, but what I loved is the whole.
00:09:02
Speaker
being a team working together. I was as far as competitiveness. Yeah, I definitely was competitive, but a lot with myself, you know, I mean, I just felt like I want to do my best. And if I did my best, I was happy. So I didn't love if we lost, but
00:09:22
Speaker
I honestly, we rarely lost in the teams I was on, but if we did, I was like, but did we do our best? That was always how I, I think my parents raised me that way, especially my mom. If you, you know, you're just to do your best. It's not the outcome it's in you. Yeah. So last question of regards to the sports. What can you say that you can take out of it that you actually applied to your everyday life now?
00:09:50
Speaker
from being in the trenches and being competitive. Boy, yeah, a positive and a negative, but I learned from that negative. The positive would be I learned a lot about leadership, and I learned that a leader is a servant. A leader is an encourager. A leader is there for others to really build them up and to help them to be their best.
00:10:19
Speaker
The negative was, although I think God used it, is feeling like this is my whole identity that, you know, I'm a jock, I'm an athlete, I'm the best kind of thing. And, you know, I got to that place where I realized that these kind of things of the world should not be our end all.
00:10:41
Speaker
it should not be you know that I'm famous or that I'm number one in something
Childhood Challenges and Family Dynamics
00:10:47
Speaker
or but it should be God and so I think he used it honestly Jonathan as a starting point for me to prepare me to be a leader for Christ but I I don't think if I had stayed in that place that that would have really been where he wanted me
00:11:07
Speaker
Not to say it's wrong to be an athlete if it's for the glory of God. Definitely not. But for me, I was getting too much of my self-worth from that. Gotcha. So how were you raised? Were you raised Christian? I wasn't growing up.
00:11:23
Speaker
My dad was not a Christian. He is now, but he wasn't. And he didn't become a Christian until he's around 80, I think. But my mom was a Christian, but she worked all the time. If she wasn't in the hospital with me, which is part of the story, you'll probably have me share. And she was a nurse, so she was kind of working when she was helping me as well.
00:11:51
Speaker
But because of that, she had to work on the weekend so that my dad could be with us on the weekend and then when he was working, she was home. And he obviously wouldn't take us to church. I read and hear a lot about God.
00:12:08
Speaker
God, you know, God wasn't a topic talked about just because even though my mom is a Christian, she was raised like this is you live a good life, you love others, you serve others, but she wasn't raised to talk about her faith. It wasn't until I was in college that she really learned that when she switched churches. So that was not a journey I learned from home. It was something that I learned in high school from a friend, teammate, actually.
00:12:38
Speaker
I think what was helpful is just the passage of believing Corinthians chapter seven that speaks about one person in the family being a Christian still sanctifies the child. So you said you were one of two brothers. So it was you and you had two brothers, three in total. So I still think
00:12:56
Speaker
you know, God's mercy and grace was still over the family, because even though she didn't fully embrace the spreading and the importance of what it's like to live the Christian lifestyle, I believe his presence was still there and it was still acknowledgement there. And, you know, yeah, so that sounds pretty interesting. So I think what kind of
00:13:21
Speaker
You know, one of the reasons why I wanted to have you on my show, because I remember reading your bio and it spoke about the amount of surgeries you had. I think I read it was 26. That is a lot. Can you dive into that story? That took a breath of fresh air for me. I'm like, you know, I'm always fascinated by what God does
00:13:42
Speaker
in situations that the average person that looks at that and they'll say, well, how can God be in the midst of something like that, right? So I'm always fascinating and intrigued to hear a story like that. So yeah, I'm really interested to kind of learn about that process and how you got to this point. Yeah, sure. Well, I was born with a very severe cleft palate in which I had no nose, no upper lip, no upper palate.
00:14:11
Speaker
I had all kinds of like heart problems, breathing problems. I had speech therapy for 11 years. But what happened in the beginning is it was such a big hole, Jonathan, that the doctors didn't know how to close it. And I had a weak heart and they thought I would die on the operating table. So they actually couldn't figure out how to get food into me. And they told my mom, take me home to die.
00:14:38
Speaker
that if I stayed in the hospital, I would die there and it's better I die with my family. So mom did take me home. But as I said, she was a Christian and she prayed and God made it clear to her that I was his gift to her and that I would live.
00:14:54
Speaker
And so when she took me home, now she was a pediatric nurse at that hospital, actually. And she, by the grace of God, he just led her in making something out of all kinds of things at home, like a toy mask and all these rubber bands and things from the hospital. And she found a way to put this mask over my face that I could have suction and I could drink from a bottle.
00:15:20
Speaker
even her milk that had been pumped and she built up through that it built up my strength again and when I got to three months I believe it was she felt like I was strong enough took me back to the hospital told the doctor who she actually worked for it's like you need to operate on my baby I know that she's strong enough now and so he agreed he closed
00:15:45
Speaker
the whole the best he could and But it continued I had surgeries for 15 years 26 the Great majority were from zero to five and then once I started school It was every summer and so it was yeah, it was a lot for sure Mm-hmm, cuz I know I complain about I mean the only surgeries that I've ever gotten
00:16:14
Speaker
that I've complained about heavily was just going to the dentist and having anesthesia. I can't stand needles. That's just me. I don't like shots. I don't like anything. So I mean, going through this, were you depressed, were you saddened? Did you cry or were you always tough? Because I know it takes toughness to be an athlete. Did some of this toughness spill off into that? Where did you find your strength in some of these moments as a child that you had to go through it?
00:16:44
Speaker
Yeah, I'm going to say to my mom, in fact, she passed away September 26, this past year. And I did a podcast on his heart on my podcast, his heartbeat, called leaving a legacy. And it's all about how my mom really left the legacy of all that she taught me, you know, through her life, through her devotion to me and then to God.
00:17:10
Speaker
that I now pass on to others. It's a beautiful episode if your listeners want to listen to it, but she was there every minute. It was a Christian hospital at, it's still called Presbyterian University of Pennsylvania, but
00:17:28
Speaker
a part, it's a part of University of Pennsylvania in Philadelphia, but at that time it really was Christian. And so as she was a pediatric nurse, they literally paid her to care for me. And she didn't ever make money, it just paid for the surgeries and all of that. But it allowed us to not
00:17:49
Speaker
go into millions of dollars of debt you know again she never got a paycheck for all those and all the other hours that she worked every weekend she did double shifts but she was an encourager she was by my side the whole time she would buy all these crafts and come up with fun things to do and and she just gave me that strength one of the things that
00:18:15
Speaker
I wasn't allowed to do was cry at the hospital because I would have all these stitches, sometimes up to 150 stitches in my nose, my palate, my lip, even a few of my eyes. And and so they don't want you to cry because then you could get an infection, which would be very serious.
00:18:36
Speaker
So she's she would be okay, honey, we can do this and distract me or, you know, help me to not be afraid. So that was really a godsend for me. So maybe it, I wouldn't say it taught me to be tough. Maybe it's in my genes too, because my mom's thinking of that way as well. What the hospital taught me more was to be
00:19:03
Speaker
compassionate, empathetic, and also to value people no matter what they looked like, what they acted like, what the color of their skin was, what the disfigurement they had, what their mental capacity, whatever. Because I went through so much teasing and judgment just from my outer appearance before they ever give you a chance to know you.
00:19:31
Speaker
That I just swore I'd never do that and I was around children on the children's ward that you know They come in with two legs and they leave with zero legs, you know And I just wanted to love on them that they wouldn't go through what what I went through especially once I started school Yeah, so, you know first up first Samuel chapter 16 verse 7 it talks about how you know God doesn't look out the outward appearances when he looks at the heart and
00:20:01
Speaker
What would you say during this period of time? How did you know God loved you? What was one of the things that validated that when you were going through some of these things?
00:20:13
Speaker
I can honestly say I didn't know that again because it wasn't ever spoken to me. But what I did know is that my mom and dad loved me. My grandparents loved me. My aunts and uncles. My brothers loved me. In fact, if anybody teased me in the neighborhood, my brother beat him up. And my mom usually didn't discipline her for it. She's like, well, they deserved it. But I really learned that.
00:20:43
Speaker
Later in life, you know from teenage years. I started to learn about that. Mm-hmm
00:20:49
Speaker
Because I think a lot of people don't realize in the book of 1 John, it speaks about, let us not love a word or speech, but an action and truth. And getting that love, I think the two most important commandments, love your neighbor as yourself, love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, strength. People don't realize that the first commandment isn't to love ourselves. It's to love God first. And what God tends to do is he can love you through other people. And I can imagine that.
00:21:16
Speaker
Your mom loves you unconditionally. Where was your father in the midst of all this, if you don't mind the accent?
Faith Journey and Challenges
00:21:23
Speaker
Sure. So my dad had to take care of my brothers, because I was really in the hospital a lot. But sometimes he's at work, so my grandmother took care of them. So on weekends, I was mostly with dad. His mom was working at the hospital. And he's fun. Dad's really fun.
00:21:46
Speaker
he's athletic in those crazy kind of daring sports now he taught me to ski and um you know he flew airplanes i've flown an airplane you know that kind of thing so uh unfortunately though the stress on my family
00:22:04
Speaker
financially, uh, he didn't make a lot of money at a good job. He's owned his own photography business, but didn't make a lot of money. And the bills were still coming in, even though some things were covered by mom working at the hospital. That was a big strain, I think. And you can imagine with mom being so often having to tend and care for me that, that I'm sure had somewhat of an impact on their marriage.
00:22:33
Speaker
Then on top of it, my mom got a rare, well, somewhat rare disease. It's called aplastic anemia in which she had no red, white blood cells being produced or platelets. So she for seven years had to get blood transfusions every day. When she gets to the hospital, they do it and at times she'd be too weak and wouldn't make it. And so she'd have to stop at a hospital halfway and get that. And so that had a big impact on their marriage.
00:23:02
Speaker
And so in the end, my father left her. I felt like at the time he was leaving me. I didn't, you know, as a little girl, you don't quite understand it. And we still saw him on weekends. He still was wonderful, but it was, it had a big impact on me. I think how I viewed, it affected how I even viewed men. It affected how I viewed God for a little while.
00:23:27
Speaker
And that fear that maybe god could leave me, but we know in scripture He says I will never leave you in hebrews 13 5 nor will I ever forsake you but I didn't really Come to understand that until I began to be discipled Okay, so tell me a little about tell me a little bit about this friendship that you You came across and how much he's been a blessing to you and how she kind of led you to christ Yeah, tell us a little bit about that
00:23:55
Speaker
Yeah, so there were two gals on my teams. They played every sport like me in high school, and they were a year older, so you know how you are. You always look up to the kids that are older on the team, and the one gal was actually always a captain of every sport, very good. So we all went to hockey camp in the summer, and up in the Poconos,
00:24:20
Speaker
this gal the two gals came into our cabin and they shared the gospel to all the kids in the cabin and I was in there I was taking a quick nap before he had to go out in the field again and I that was very brave of them because we had a lot of Jewish girls on our team and they were
00:24:42
Speaker
they admired these two gals so it was fine so it's the first time that i heard the gospel but i for some reason i
00:24:52
Speaker
I didn't really, I pretended that I wasn't listening. I'm not sure why. I can't really tell you. I just remember I heard it from afar. I wasn't really processing it. But a couple months later, I was studying advanced biology and learning about the complexity of the human body. And even though they were talking about evolution and all this, I'm like, no, I am quiet. I mean, there's no way that
00:25:19
Speaker
we all originated from this one cell and the tree and the monkey and me have no difference. And I knew that somehow innately that I was uniquely made somehow and I was outside and I'm, you know, only prayers that I'd ever said was at the dinner table and before I went to bed, I had like a set prayer. But at that point I did, I was thinking, I wasn't really praying, I was thinking, I wonder,
00:25:49
Speaker
what it's all about like I must be different than this tree that I'm looking at and I heard the Lord for the first time speak to me saying the answer is God the answer is me and I was like whoa I was so profound it was not in my own thinking
00:26:05
Speaker
that i hopped on my bike and i rode up to my friend's house and knew where she lived and and i said tell me about god and so kathy shared the whole gospel she used to track the four spiritual laws that campus crusade for christ put out that i ended up becoming my who i worked for for 41 years now um but it was
00:26:30
Speaker
really eye opening, you know, and I didn't mention this, but actually, my mom is a preacher's kid. My grandfather and grandmother, grandpa was a pastor for 45 years in a church in Philadelphia in Lansdowne. And
00:26:49
Speaker
That had an impact on me. Again, I don't know that they ever clearly talked about how I could receive Christ in a personal way. I feel like that came about in the 70s. People started to understand that and teach that. And at this point, this was in 75, right? So it was right at the time, the movie that just came out, the Jesus revolution. I was like, oh, I relate to this because I think I was impacted by that whole
00:27:19
Speaker
Movement of God, you know, it was this because there's two girls that shared with us They were touched by that movement and then they shared with us
00:27:30
Speaker
So not to blame there for my parents, but like you said, the Bible lets us know that, you know, God has this blessing on families, you know, that know God. And definitely I, as a six year old would line up all my stuffed animals and preach to them. I didn't know how to do it. I didn't know anything, but my grandfather had given me a Bible.
00:27:54
Speaker
No one ever read it to me, but I open up the first page to Genesis 1, the creation story, and I would read it to all my stuffed animals. And I did it a lot. It was like God was preparing me to be a preacher of the Word. Okay. So talk a little bit about once you heard the Gospel message, I know you mentioned, was it an audible voice or was something within you that told you that it was God at the time when you heard it?
00:28:24
Speaker
It was not audible. I don't know. Maybe that happens for people. But it's in your mind and it really is the spirit of God. And it's so strong and it's not where your mind was going. You know what I mean? It wasn't something that you would, a natural progression of your thoughts. I was thinking about science and what my teacher told me. And it literally, the Lord literally, literally interrupted my thoughts and said, it's me, it's God.
00:28:54
Speaker
Okay. I want to ask that and I always try to get the distinction because I know some people get this feeling that when a person says that they heard God, they think of some spooky mystical experience, but sometimes innately it's something, it's their conscience, it's your heart. There's something that utters, you know, a portion of truth to you that makes you want to go and seek Him in some fashion, right?
00:29:18
Speaker
And always to mention the Matthew 7, 7 verse, right? Acts and you say, I receive, seek and you will find, knock and the door will be open for you. Or, you know, delight yourself in the Lord and he will give you the desires of your heart, right? There's always this need and this desire. And the NLT talks about keep on acting, keep on seeking, keep on, which kind of points to this need of continuation, which means that if you don't think you've heard anything or have
00:29:47
Speaker
listened and responded in one fashion. It doesn't happen at the first try. It's this desire that you have to continue to pursue in order for something to happen. So I'm glad that you were able to expand upon that a little bit more.
00:30:03
Speaker
So talk about some of the things you've done once you became a believer. Were you into wanting to fellowship with other believers, your church? Did you go to Bible college? You had talked a little bit about that. Yeah, so I did get into a youth group for two years and just because some friends have been in one and that
00:30:27
Speaker
I mean, it was good. It really was. But I went off to college and they had told me that there was
00:30:35
Speaker
they kind of lie to you when you're on those interviews because they want you to come and they pretty much did that. They lied. So they told me that they're, Oh yeah, we have Christian groups and all that. And there really was very little Christian presence on the college. And I did go, I tried out one group, but I had like eight people in it and I just didn't click with them. You know what I mean?
00:31:00
Speaker
yeah very different from me and so I stopped going I just kind of tried on my own but I didn't I didn't really know much I hadn't been discipled yet I had you know just from the youth group you learn some things here and there but
00:31:15
Speaker
and basically I drifted away because I became very lonely to not go to the campus parties and everybody went to the parties on the weekend so there I am all by myself doing homework every weekend and after three months of that I'm very extroverted so I was like okay I'll go to a party and I just won't party you know what I mean I'll just be with people but as soon as I went
00:31:43
Speaker
the sky greeted me at the door and I had experienced so much rejection from boys growing up like teasing mean very mean things said to me I was called dog face ugly all these things for years that I had a real
00:32:02
Speaker
fear, number one, of men, but also a longing to be loved by a guy, to be accepted by a guy, not to mention having my dad leave us didn't help, even though I knew he loved me, that's for sure.
00:32:18
Speaker
but just the act of leaving your family has a big impact. So when this guy who is good looking, senior, pre-med, starts talking to me and he's like, oh, come on, come on, just have a beer. I was so afraid if I didn't, he would leave. And I just had that deep longing in my heart.
00:32:37
Speaker
And so I talked with him, but I wasn't a drinker. So it was didn't take long. Maybe one beer. I don't know that I was like, I need to go home. So on he said, Oh, I'll walk you home and on the way home.
00:32:50
Speaker
he raped me and that obviously had a huge impact on me. I became very depressed. I felt like you blame yourself. You know, I shouldn't have gone with them. I shouldn't have had that beer. People who go through sexual abuse
00:33:12
Speaker
Unfortunately, the normal behavior is that you take some responsibility and say something that you did wrong. That's why that happened. And so they live in so much shame. And so I had so much shame, I wouldn't tell anybody, I became highly depressed, eating disorder, gained weight, everything which affected my sports, that was not good. So that was a really bad time in my life. I
00:33:42
Speaker
I began to drink as well to cover up the pain. I had put my Bible away because I thought I had messed up too bad. God could never accept me. So that was a false teaching, right? That we think we have, you know, in Ephesians 2.8-9, it says that we're saved by grace through faith, not of ourselves, not of our words that we cannot boast, right? But yet I did not understand that yet. I hadn't had that teaching.
00:34:10
Speaker
And so I just thought I really messed up. And so God surely can't love me. And later, you know, I learned from Romans that Romans eight that, you know, that I'm a conqueror in Christ, Christ Jesus, and nothing can separate, separate me from his love. But I didn't know that yet.
00:34:31
Speaker
So I, it was just a really hard time. I fell away pretty bad. And I went home in the summer. So this is after sophomore
Ministry and Mission Work
00:34:41
Speaker
year. And that's when my brother was home, you know, and he brought me back to the Lord. And the thing that he taught me, Jonathan, that to talk about when you're saying wasn't an audible voice and all that.
00:34:57
Speaker
He taught me about the third part of the Trinity, the Holy Spirit. And I really oddly hadn't been taught that in those two years I went to church in high school. I never heard about the fact that when we receive Christ, the Holy Spirit comes within us. And in Acts 1a it says, you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit comes upon you and you shall be my witnesses.
00:35:21
Speaker
And then in Galatians 5, 22, 23, talks about how we're filled with the Holy Spirit, and so we will have the fruit of the Spirit. And it also talks in that section that we can live by the Spirit, right? And then we won't follow the deeds of the flesh.
00:35:43
Speaker
and it lists them all out and I've been doing those deeds of the flesh you know but now I could see oh my goodness I can rely on the Holy Spirit and I'm asking my brother like how do I do that and he says you just pray you know and I'll pray for you too that you just surrender yourself to Christ and you say fill me with your Holy Spirit and Holy Spirit guide me and direct me
00:36:07
Speaker
Lord Jesus be Lord in my life and so I prayed a prayer similar to that and boy did he answer that one and I go back to college and I actually had to go early because our U.S. team happened to rent out our college
00:36:27
Speaker
to have a camp for high school girls, you know, in the cross camp, even though it was summer. But anyway, so I go back and have this camp and they put me in charge of the talent show. And I also was what you call it a dorm.
00:36:43
Speaker
At the end, you know, all of us in the team, we got assigned a hallway and we had to check in on the girls, make sure they went to bed. So at that talent show, the Holy Spirit just gave me courage. And I ended up writing a song. I played guitar at that point, uh, of my testimony and I shared it with the whole camp of 800 girls.
00:37:05
Speaker
And then that night when I went to every room and put people to bed, every single room was talking about God. It was so cool. And my roommate talked to me that night and she received Christ with me. And that's how it took off from there. My two years in college, I started a ministry that a guy on the football team that I used to party with, he had recommitted his life to Christ.
00:37:30
Speaker
And we saw like 50 kids come to Christ, had this amazing fellowship. Even though it was a small school, we talked to over 600 of the students on some level about the Lord. So it's a very exciting time. And in that time, I went on a mission trip in the summer in between junior, senior year to Philippines.
00:37:52
Speaker
And I showed the Jesus film. So even though Jonathan, I didn't know a lot about the Bible. I was a really young Christian still. I've been getting discipled by phone from these girls that were up at Penn State involved with Campus Crusade for Christ. And they did a great job helping me. But I go on this project and I'm just the one that's running the video. What do you call the one of these movie camera?
00:38:19
Speaker
with this other guy and then on the breaks when we're changing reels we'd share our testimony you know we have four reels I think for the Jesus film in the old days and I was amazed at how many people I got to personally share the gospel with and then as a group we saw hundreds and hundreds and hundreds come to Christ that summer
00:38:44
Speaker
And I was amazed I thought oh my goodness like I don't even know that much about Jesus But already he's using my life and that's why I decided when I graduated to go into full-time Christian work I think some people don't realize that as Immediately when you become a follower of Christ God can use you even in your lowest points, right? We look at David
00:39:08
Speaker
And we look at, I think what's so beautiful about the Bible is that there are different characters within the Bible that have flaws and that have sinned, but that doesn't stop God from using them in order to have people be drawn to him. So I'm actually fascinated by that. And also points to the value and the importance of reading your Bible and getting to know his word, because once you know who you are, no one can stop you. No one can stop you for what God wants to use you.
00:39:36
Speaker
And I think about the pastors in Matthew where it says, let your light shine before others so that they may glorify your father in heaven. And it seems like the more and more opportunities that was given to you to step into a space, to represent him as an ambassador for Christ, it allowed God to utilize you and you were able to see so many different things happen in regards to the changing and them giving their life to him. So that's a fascinating.
00:40:05
Speaker
Story hearing that and now so what would you what drove you to want to go? Let's talk about a little bit about this What drove you at these experiences to want you to go to Bible seminary? So I want to learn a little bit about that
00:40:19
Speaker
Yeah, so in college, even though, you know, at that point, I was already on the US team, I'm playing for my college team, which did well, had this ministry going on, and I had options when I graduated, right? I could go to grad school, I was thinking about recreational therapy, or I could be a coach at a university, which is kind of what I was leaning towards.
00:40:43
Speaker
But I realized that the thing that I enjoyed the most and it was most fulfilling was being involved, leading fellowship of Christian athletes on my campus. And so, and then that mission trip as well and experiencing that, I thought, wow, there's just no greater thing than we can do than to introduce somebody to Christ and to begin to help them to grow. Now, you know, Matthew 28,
00:41:11
Speaker
18 through 20 not only says you know go there for you know preach the gospel to all nations but it also says to make disciples right and so I was really enjoying the girls and guys in our ministry who I was not only were we sharing the gospel with them but we were then
00:41:33
Speaker
Building them up in the faith and training them and teaching them to walk with Christ and then to help them to tell others right that whole multiplication and so I really had a desire to Continue that and by joining the staff of campus crusade for Christ. I was then assigned to a campus and
00:41:56
Speaker
Now, I wanted, believe it or not, Jonathan, I wanted to go to China first, right off the bat. But at that time, the doors had just opened, like just opened. And so there really wasn't anything going on yet, you know, and it wasn't terribly safe either if things were
00:42:18
Speaker
still under a lot of security surveillance. So the organization said, well, in the future, you can do that, you know, got to open that door. But for now, we're going to send you to University of Hawaii, which I'm playing about. Because it's all Asian.
00:42:37
Speaker
you know and there is a white population there but it's predominantly military but the university is predominantly asian culture and it was perfect training god knows what he's doing right you follow his will uh you pray you ask him and he'll reveal his will you probably can rat off that scripture i think it's in first john 5 but i'm not sure and uh he did show me and and through that i learned about all different
00:43:07
Speaker
countries in Asia and their cultures. I learned to eat tofu. I learned to use chopsticks. I learned to take my shoes off at the door. I learned to understand to speak more indirectly. Just a lot of things I learned that when the time came in 1990, when God said, okay, it's time. I want you to move to Asia. I was
00:43:33
Speaker
very much equipped, not only culturally, but spiritually. I had all another 10 years to be in ministry where I was growing. I'm in the Word every day. I'm leading conferences. I'm in conferences. Campus Crusade did a great job of training us and really making sure that we continued to be developed. And I saw a ministry grow. And so when I went to Asia, I really knew
00:44:02
Speaker
what I could do to really help people there. Yeah, I think it's important because, you know, this passes in Colossians, it says, let your speech be seasoned with salt. So you know how you want to answer people. It just seemed like God was shaping and molding you to the person he needs you to be. And sometimes, you know, going through experiences and learning is part of the process so that you can be good ambassador and representation of him. Yeah.
00:44:28
Speaker
Now, there's something I was curious to ask. While being in Asia, did you ever experience some resistance to those who didn't accept Christ? And how did you handle that?
00:44:39
Speaker
Yeah, I did. I realized I didn't answer your last question. I was finished it up. But I did go in the summers. We were encouraged to take seminary courses. So I did that several summers. And then after I got married, my husband and I went to the Philippines to seminary for two years.
00:45:00
Speaker
And then in my 40s, I came back in the summers to Philadelphia and got a master's in Christian counseling. Okay, a little bit, my little bit. That's still good. Basically, I've been a student for over 32 years. I added it up.
00:45:16
Speaker
But I think we should always be a student of the word, whether you're in a formal setting or informal. Yes, I just wanted to clear that up. But yes, I had, it was pretty intense. When I moved there, I was single. And I was in China. And it was actually a foreigner.
00:45:37
Speaker
who was an atheist, and she really had a thing about Christians coming and talking about their faith to others. Now, we could not openly preach. I was respectful to when I taught my English quarter classes. I did not. We were told not to talk about God, so I honored that.
00:46:03
Speaker
Um, I did let them know in the beginning that I was a Christian, which I believe we were allowed to do, but people, the Lord just brought people to me. They were initiated that right.
Spiritual Warfare and Growth
00:46:16
Speaker
And so, um, you know, I would, and we were definitely seeing people come to Christ and we were discipling them. So this, this one woman went to, she could tell that we were Christian. There was a group of us, small group of us.
00:46:33
Speaker
And it was obvious because we didn't.
00:46:36
Speaker
We didn't curse. We didn't complain. We were joyful. We had clean fun. We didn't drink. All the other teachers would drink. They would sleep together. They were cursing. They were complaining about the culture. We were loving the people there. It was very obvious. We did shine what that verse you said. We did shine like a light.
00:47:03
Speaker
And so she went to the authorities and lied about it. And she said, Oh, at that point, I was a single so different name. My last name was Darwin. So Sue Darwin is teaching all the freshmen that they must become a Christian or they're all going to go to hell, which I never did ever.
00:47:24
Speaker
You know, and I didn't even preach the gospel that way. Period. You know, I talked a lot about God's love and his eternal life. He offers us, but I did that one on one. So they began to investigate me without me knowing it at first. So they held all my mail and my mom, she wrote to me every day. And so I suddenly didn't get any mail from her.
00:47:48
Speaker
And there were just signs that were weird. People seem more timid or afraid to engage with me. And so finally a student came to me and said, they came to our whole class and told us, don't engage one-on-one with you.
00:48:12
Speaker
don't have conversations about Christianity or you'll get in trouble. So they were very bold to tell me that, you know, but interesting people still were knocking on my door, but only those that were intentionally wanting to know about God. The others were not.
00:48:34
Speaker
And so we're still seeing people come to Christ. But then I realized I was being investigated. So we started meeting every day at lunch, our team. And we always, we already had two meetings a week where we were praying, but now we met every lunch and we.
00:48:50
Speaker
prayed together against spiritual warfare, against the enemy coming against us like Ephesians 6 tells you to put on the armor of God, right? And at the end of it, it talks about praying for those of us who are sharing the gospel because, you know, the enemies want to come against us. So we're praying and that actually was after we started praying that way that people started knocking on our door.
00:49:14
Speaker
Want to know about Christ before that they weren't I was aware that what's going on, you know people aren't hanging out with us So we're actually seeing more come to Christ But we had to be incredibly careful, but the stress was high You know, I loved it there and I didn't want to leave and I didn't want to get arrested you know, and so Yeah, I was definitely feeling that Anxiety, I guess I should say
00:49:43
Speaker
And the Lord was just faithful to bring peace to my heart and guide me. And so I did feel from a guidance from the Spirit within me that the wise thing to do was to talk to one of the Chinese professors who I was working for. I was editing his book. He was writing a book.
00:50:05
Speaker
and in English and I was editing for him and he's actually was kind of a famous guy there and that's why the university was you know they boasted about having this writer and so I told him that I was unjustly being investigated that I had never done what
00:50:26
Speaker
was said of me that I wouldn't do that. I said, you know, I'm a Christian, but I haven't preached to you. I don't do that. You know, if I don't go up to people and do that, I know I should do that here. And so he went to the school and he said, leave her alone.
00:50:43
Speaker
Well, he had that authority and power to do that. And that was it. The investigation dropped. So I know that was just the work of the Lord in answer to prayer. The enemy was defeated, right? We can pray in Jesus name, right? He says we can cast out demons even, right? You know, and I think that's in Mark 16, 17, I believe.
00:51:09
Speaker
And and so that's really what happened when we start praying against it Then all the enemy's grip was taken off and then suddenly this secular Teacher who was part of the Communist Party I might add goes to the authority and tell them to leave me alone and they do and I started getting mail again from my mom one month in mail though
00:51:37
Speaker
Yes, sir. So many things come to mind. I think people don't realize that in the gospel of John chapter 15, when it speaks about, you know, they will know you on my disciples based upon how you love one another. And the fact that you're
00:51:52
Speaker
expression of love was immediately reflective on the people around you. And even when there was, you know, a person that sowed the seed, we understand that the farmer who went out to sow seed and how the tarry attaches itself
00:52:08
Speaker
the root attaches itself to the terry as a disguise to know that you know no lie comes from the truth but it only hinges itself because that's the only way that it actually exists right and just just thinking about what you're saying you know I thought about Jesus and one of the things when Jesus was on trial
00:52:30
Speaker
was that he didn't speak because the conflicting stories never lined up, right? In order for a testimony to be validated, you need two or three witnesses. So just the idea of sowing that seed and them thinking that they will give victory over it.
00:52:46
Speaker
It didn't change the fact that God maneuvered through the incident and you sat there patiently. And we waited on the Lord and allowed him to work things out. You didn't, you know, the scripture in Romans tells us revenge is his, it's not yours. So you taking your time out in lab mutations 325, waiting patiently on the Lord allowed him to work things. Let him fight your battles and you letting him do that. And like you said, it's interesting. I know you know the story.
00:53:16
Speaker
with the unjust ruler, when the woman said, give me victory over my adversaries. And in the midst of that, him who was unjust still gave victory over for her. And here you have a secular individual that has no say in regards to whether or not he believes it or not, but spoke up for you. So you start to see how God can maneuver things and settle things.
00:53:40
Speaker
and it still didn't taint the reality that people still drifted towards you and still felt that they had some sort of life and having a conversation with you so devil can try all that he wants but we know in the end
00:53:54
Speaker
Because all things work together, the love of the Lord will call upon His purpose, Romans 8, 28. It may not appear on first glance, but as things continue to unfold, God is working things out. He's preparing ways to destroy the devil and his wicked ways.
00:54:15
Speaker
grant you success and all that you do. So I'm just fascinated by the story because I hear so many different things about people having resistance towards what it is that they believe God has called them to do. And so often people take it upon themselves to go do things. And interesting enough, in the Bible study that I've been having with my friend, we've been discussing Joseph.
00:54:41
Speaker
And one of the things that I laughed about was that Joseph, who was able to interpret dreams once he's in the jail, he meets, you know, the two officials that belong to Pharaoh. And he immediately himself tried to insert what has happened to him to them so that they can tell Pharaoh to get him out of there. But guess what? It took two years.
00:55:04
Speaker
before Pharaoh saw the dream again, which means God didn't prepare his exit yet. So sometimes when you're in the midst of, you know, dealing with struggles or periods and times, they're only there temporarily. But when God has a plan, these things are fashioning and developing your character and honing your skills and everything that's going on until God is making a way and opening a door that no man can shut and closing the door and no man can open.
00:55:31
Speaker
So I commend you for being able to not get aggressive, be quick to listen slow to speak, slow to become angry, and allow whatever happened to you. We were still kind to the teacher. That's amazing, right? We were cautious, but we were kind to her. In fact, I'd say that we became friendlier to her. Wow.
00:55:55
Speaker
You know Because we we knew God would be at work and you know when you're when you're sharing like it doesn't happen in your timing or you know right away that Definitely was my experience because I went over to Asia as a teacher right because you know, I Found a group that was you know, you can apply through organizations to go as a teacher and
00:56:23
Speaker
And I was 31 already. And the reason I had dated various guys in my 20s, but none of them wanted to go to China. And I knew that I was called to go there. And so in the end, we'd break up, you know, because it's like, no, I got to go. This is God's calling on my life. So I was convinced, Jonathan, that since God had not given me that person in Hawaii,
00:56:50
Speaker
that he must have them for me in China. So when I got there, sure enough, there were teachers in that group who were Christians. I knew I heard that. So I thought, Oh, great, must be my husband to be right. And so I arrive
00:57:10
Speaker
And there were two single guys that were Christian background, but they were 10 years younger than me. I'm like, there's no way right out of college, you know, as immature as you are at that age compared to me, I've been working for 10 years.
00:57:26
Speaker
and so I'm like that's okay Lord I understand because I need to learn this language and I'm teaching and it's a lot so I need to really focus so I understand your your timing on this so I was really patient
00:57:42
Speaker
whole year and then we're gonna get a new batch of teachers the next year and I was like okay great here comes my husband and we get a new batch but it was two girls and a married guy Wow and I was gonna be 33 by the end of that year that means and I wanna have three kids
00:58:02
Speaker
And I'd have to wait another year. And usually when teachers came, they only came for a year and then they left. And so I'm like this revolving door of friendships.
00:58:13
Speaker
And I got really depressed. What happens is when we have wounds from our childhood, like in my case, my dad, the one man I can trust leaving me, or as I perceived it anyway, even though in his mind he used to sleep with my mom, but in my mind it was leaving me.
00:58:34
Speaker
And at that moment I just thought like God had abandoned me. And even though the scripture and I knew it, said He'll never leave me nor will He forsake me. I literally taught that hundreds of times as I shared the four spiritual laws. It's in the four spiritual laws. So I had shared the gospel hundreds of times by then. Knew that verse.
00:58:55
Speaker
But still the enemy takes those wounds and he just starts speaking into your spirit, you know, and I and I just was like convinced that God told me to come here and now he left me and I'm stuck. And so I got really depressed.
00:59:12
Speaker
And I could not understand what God was doing. So I began to experience spiritual warfare and learn what that was that I had never experienced before. I couldn't sleep. I lost my appetite. I got really depressed. I started to hear, not hear voices, but in my spirit, just, you know, these thoughts, thoughts that I don't normally think
00:59:38
Speaker
Yeah, you know really negative bad thoughts even thoughts of you should and it wouldn't even be Like me saying well, maybe I should kill myself It was like you should kill yourself and I'll tell you how and then you'll end this pain. Yeah, and I I knew at that point when it spoke that way that it was demonic. Mm-hmm
01:00:00
Speaker
Even though I hadn't, believe it or not, I hadn't learned much about that. I just, sadly, I don't think the church talks a lot about that. In America, it's like we're afraid to talk about, even though for Jesus, he talks about it a lot. And the apostles talk about it a lot. But for some reason, we don't, right? So I didn't know much, but I knew this wasn't me.
01:00:22
Speaker
And my whole team could see me deteriorating in a team of teachers that were Christians and they're praying for me. And they couldn't seem to snap me out of it. My best friend at that point started dating the one of the guys that was so much younger than me. That just made it worse for me because I lost her friendship.
01:00:44
Speaker
I didn't know the language that well to have super close relationships with local people. So it was really a tough time, and I just plummeted and finally one night.
01:00:58
Speaker
literally feel the presence of darkness in the room and I was terrified so ran out of the room into the connecting room to my roommate fell on her at that point I couldn't even speak I was in such terror of the presence of these things and and she just began to pray and she's like Lord I don't even know how to pray will you lead me in how to pray and he did and she just it's like he just told her what to pray and she just prayed against spirits of fear
01:01:28
Speaker
to leave in Jesus name through you know it's always got to be in Jesus name through the blood of Christ and the authority that he's given us and boom it left and there's peace this beautiful peace and love that just came over us
01:01:46
Speaker
And I felt it. I'm getting the chills even talking about it. I just felt the power of God, the presence of the Lord, the love of Christ. And I knew that he'd been there all along, but that I needed to learn this lesson, that I needed to know that there's an enemy.
01:02:06
Speaker
And he's very real and that Christ has given us authority because we know that the disciples first went out and tried to cast out a demon and they couldn't do it because they didn't do it in the authority in the name of Christ.
Ministry Focus and Overcoming Struggles
01:02:20
Speaker
And God had to teach me that so that I could have a ministry in very dark places like Uganda, like Lebanon, like, you know, all these places that I go where
01:02:35
Speaker
There's such a demonic presence and even here in the States, right, even when you're praying for somebody who's trying to get free from drugs, you know, or whatever it is, you know, the enemy can really
01:02:53
Speaker
take havoc in their mind and to know that in the authority of Christ I can silence that and I can command all those spirits to leave and for God's wonderful love and his Holy Spirit to come in and just really fill them with that peace.
01:03:16
Speaker
And so as a result, I launched a ministry, you know, after that, where I now teach through Crown of Beauty International as a ministry. I started where we help women understand and guys understand about the word, the power of the word to replace his lies, as well as through prayer and the authority Christ gives us to find that work in the enemy and to reject those lies.
01:03:45
Speaker
and to take the truth of what God's word says and be healed. Amen. Amen. I agree with you, man. I know exactly what you're talking about, those moments and those time periods when you're fighting against your flesh, you're warring against your flesh. And the devil is, you give him a foothold, he comes right through. You're in some deep trouble then if you're not
01:04:11
Speaker
If you're not reading God's Word and you're not replenishing and renewing your spirit every day and repentance and, you know, fellowshiping and those sort of things, you start to drift away from that or you start to, doubt starts to creep in and you start to, you know, lose faith and you have nothing fueling you. It's definitely a tough period. And I've had some of those sleepless nights, right? I think sometimes we don't think about the past as a dulcilonian is where it says, come to me.
01:04:40
Speaker
And I'll give you rest. Come to me and cast your anxieties upon me. And I'll give you rest because this spiritual warfare that you're speaking about is very true. It's very realistic. And we have to learn that sometimes it's a war of words, right? The quality you're thinking determines the quality of your life. A lot of people don't realize the battle starts up here, starts in your mind. And the devil's attacking your mind. And I used to say this, and I used to tell this to a friend,
01:05:10
Speaker
One of the reasons why I had such a passion for studying God's Word is I visualized this idea that I came up with, that if I were put in a coma, but I was well aware of everything that was going on around me, I was just paralyzed.
01:05:28
Speaker
The only thing that's going to inspire me is what have I done or what have I read to encourage me in that period of time. And what you mentioned about the Holy Spirit is that the Holy Spirit brings things back to your remembrance.
01:05:42
Speaker
And one of the things I spoke about in my podcast is filling up, you know, fill up your jar. And what I meant is scriptures, you know, stories in the Bible, I would read them over and over. I would memorize them. And one of the reasons is because I believe the Holy Spirit would bring it back to me when I needed the most.
01:06:01
Speaker
But how can the Holy Spirit bring things back if you're not reading anything? Right. If you're not fueling that space where God can speak to you through these stories and these testimonies. And that's the real importance of understanding these stories, you know. John 832, one of my theme verses, you shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free. Amen. And it was Jesus who said that. Yeah.
01:06:24
Speaker
So I agree with you, man. Those are some hard yeahs and people don't realize just because you're saved doesn't mean you're safe. You're protected, your salvation is protected, but that doesn't mean that you're not on fire and that the devil doesn't think that he can turn you or that he can get you to doubt God, right? And those who don't know, read the story of Job, right? Everything around him was being taken away and we learned
01:06:49
Speaker
I believe in verse 18 or chapter 18, that what he does is he tears his clothes and he doesn't resent. In spite of all that's happening around him and the bad news that's coming in trolls, not just in one instance, but every bad news that's came, multiple things happened at the same time. So we have to understand that in life, we're going to be tested.
01:07:12
Speaker
you know we're going to experience you know tribulation we're going to experience these things but we have to be a good cheer for God who's overcome the world and we have to know that if he came for Christ in the wilderness he's going to come for us in a period of weakness and a period of thinking that you know we're thinking low of ourselves but we have to stick together we have to stay in prayer we got to be musically encouraged by one another's faith too so sometimes that even means
01:07:40
Speaker
going to a friend and asking them to pray for you. The prayer of a righteous person is powerful and effective. And we have to believe that prayer doesn't just change things, but it's one of the weapons that we have to elevate our minds in periods in time when we think that what's going on is permanent. No, it's just temporary. And it's trying to create doubt. And we got to know that faith has to overcome
01:08:05
Speaker
You know, your faith has to be utilized so that you can overcome those moments and times where we think that there's no hope. Right? Yeah. Yeah. My most recent book is called Broken But Undefeated. And it's a study of Hebrews 11. Nice. It's an abortion study of all the characters because you brought that up earlier, including Joseph, all these guys, right?
01:08:29
Speaker
And and what we learn from each one about faith, it's like a unique lesson that we can learn. So that might be a devotional that you pick up on. You might want to pick up on Amazon broken, but undefeated. That's that that's great because I was thinking of of Romans five, three, five rejoicing your suffering because it produces perseverance. It produces character. It produces hope. Hope doesn't push the shame because the Holy Spirit's been poured out onto us.
01:08:57
Speaker
So that's amazing. I always, I love that text in Hebrews 11, especially from verses 32 to 40. And people don't realize like, hey,
01:09:07
Speaker
I call it the Hall of Faith because you have all these individuals that go through things. And some people don't realize, God didn't promise that because you have faith, things won't happen. I always say faith, you have to be in a conviction of your faith, not in a preference of your faith. Conviction is something you believe no matter what. A preference is something that changes based upon new information.
01:09:31
Speaker
And here you have individuals that understand that they're going to be tortured, that they're going to be so into too, that these things are going to happen, right? And I think we're so...
01:09:42
Speaker
And I think having you on is so amazing because we're so caught up, some of us, on what's going on in America that we don't see that, hey, you're protected in the United States here. But when you go out, it has to be a conviction that you might die for what you believe, right? Exactly. And I think we have to remember what Jesus said, fear not the one who can take your body, but fear the one who could take your soul and your body.
01:10:11
Speaker
right? And sometimes the circumstance, the question is going to be under those dire circumstances that you might be under, is your belief and proclamation in Christ going to remain a conviction or is the circumstance going to change how you feel about your Lord and your Savior? So, yeah, so speak a little bit about your
01:10:35
Speaker
your ministry and where they can find you and your books and all those great things regardless of what you've been able to do. So I have a non-profit called Crown of Beauty International so our website is crownofbeautyinternational.com
01:10:52
Speaker
and on everything is that the instagram everything is that uh email gmail with that facebook uh so you can go on amazon see all my books so i have uh eight i think but six are uh six different books and then our 12-week bible study it's my favorite discipleship book really uh called crown of beauty that's where we're learning from
01:11:20
Speaker
It's a 12-week study that really helps people to dig out what are those lies that they believe about themselves and God and what does God's word say is true about them and true about Him. And it's very transformational and so we have it now in
01:11:39
Speaker
Seven languages on Amazon. It's in English Spanish French, but if you need Arabic or Bengali or Chinese or Korean You can email me at crown of beauty international At gmail.com and I can send you a digital copy of that. But yeah, it's been very
01:12:02
Speaker
amazing to see how God has used that around the world and our men's version of that is called More Than Conquerors taken from Romans 8 you know that Romans 8 I'm blanking on the verse but anyway 28 yeah yeah thank you so yeah go online and love to have you be touched in this way by these materials
01:12:30
Speaker
So I think I didn't ask you this. How many languages do you speak? I only speak English and Chinese.
01:12:36
Speaker
Okay, so Chinese I was like yeah going to these places, you know, it's Translators. Yeah, I'm actually I mean I had to work hard To learn Chinese it took me years. So I'm a natural language learner But you know God can use you wherever you go people can you know have translators I take people on mission strips if you're interested to go with us will train you to
01:13:03
Speaker
be a small group leader at these. And we'll have a translator there with you. We we reach out to Syrian refugees all over the place. So feel free to contact us go on our website, and you'll see a contact button to be the international.com. And also a podcast. So it's called his heartbeat podcast comes out every week. So love to have you on there.
01:13:30
Speaker
Okay, thanks. I would most welcomely take the invitation. So where can these people find the podcasts? Everywhere. Everywhere in this podcast? Yeah, it's usually what I try to say. All the main ones it's on. Yeah.
01:13:47
Speaker
Yeah, I was just talking to a friend the other day about the Chinese writing. He was like, man, the strokes. Yeah. I never got too far with that. I got up to 3000 characters. And then if you don't use them, it's gone. Wow. And you can't get very far with 3000. So the average Chinese person learns
01:14:09
Speaker
What is it? It's like 50,000 characters. You need over 20,000 to be somewhat literate. So I just more learned the speaking of it. We learned the romanization of the characters, like the sounds. And so I would write that way. Yeah. Let me bring up one more thing also. You know, I'm a big proponent of Herman Newick's and studying God's wording. One of the things that I, you know,
Biblical Languages and Personal Growth
01:14:36
Speaker
emphasize here on this podcast is the importance of the original language. And I know you spoke about a particular passage in Psalms 131, I believe. Can you touch a little bit about that and share with my audience why it's important? Because I encourage them sometimes, some translations are great when it comes to speaking and sharing it to the masses. So I'm a proponent of the Amplified. We're really an English standard version here, but we also look at the NIV, the King James.
01:15:03
Speaker
understanding how those translations and also understanding the original arrangements was Arabic and Hebrew. Talk about the importance of that and why it's important to understand it when you're reading God's Word.
01:15:14
Speaker
Well, I'll first tell you a cheat sheet. You download the app, Blue Letter Bible. I learned that through my kids' school and I was on it today. I'm on it every day. So if you get to a passage so that one
01:15:34
Speaker
example I'll give that was completely transformational in my life is Psalm 139 14 and it's where David says I praise you Lord from fearfully and wonderfully made and I was reading through Psalm 139 I was already in my 30s and
01:15:52
Speaker
And I realized that one through 12, yeah, I was excited. You know, he's always there with me when I get my eyes off, when I sit down, whatever, he's there. And I was super encouraged. And then I got to 13 and 14 where he knit me in my mother's womb and I'm fearfully, wonderfully made. And I realized that I didn't believe it.
01:16:12
Speaker
And by that point, I are even the seminary. I've been serving God for years. And I thought, I can't just not believe this. You know, all of God's word is inspired and true. And I know that. And yet,
01:16:32
Speaker
Lot of times what you know in your head versus what you know in your heart are two different things and I realized that head knowledge hadn't gotten in my heart and that I still on many levels was rejecting Myself my physical beauty right that I'm not fearfully one for me that God had made a mistake perhaps Wow
01:16:54
Speaker
that was the awful revelation, but helpful. And so I pulled out that blue letter Bible on my app. And I
01:17:06
Speaker
pulled up the word fearfully and wonderfully. Because for one thing, I thought that's sort of weird. I'm fearfully made. You could think that's a negative thing. Like, am I scary? You know that kind of thing. And so when I look at the Hebrew, because what it'll do is you click on the verse, and then there's a choice.
01:17:27
Speaker
that you can choose the original language and it'll give you like a dictionary basically for that word of the Hebrew. In that case it's Hebrew and obviously New Testament's Greek. And so I looked up the fearfully and what I discovered is it's talking more about God that I'm a reflection of God, of his attributes and his character.
01:17:55
Speaker
And so it ties it to Genesis 1.26, that I'm creating the image of God. And so in that sense, I am beautiful because God is beautiful. And I'm talented. Creative. Yeah, all these things, creative, all the things, right? Because God is that. And that's what cheerful means. And then I looked at wonderfully, expecting it just to say wonderful,
01:18:22
Speaker
Like hippie, but it did say that but it also said That I'm unique. It also has the meaning in Hebrew of unique So why it's important is because these languages were written to Old Testament to people that spoke Hebrew the Jews who spoke Hebrew and the New Testament in Greek Okay, and Aramaic. So when they're hearing what the Apostle Paul's writing or
01:18:52
Speaker
what Moses is writing, you know, whoever David's writing, whoever's writing it, when they're hearing it, they're hearing it in that language. So though I hear it, oh, I'm fearfully, wonderfully made, when it was written,
01:19:07
Speaker
right by David he's trying to say you're created in the image of God you're unique there's no one else like you and it's an amazing wonderful thing that's what he's hearing when he reads that so when he hears that he gets all this revelation that he's creating the image of God that I never got by just reading fearfully wonderfully me all I ever thought that man is
01:19:35
Speaker
Yeah, God did a good job, you know, but but I but everybody else from my childhood told me he did a bad job, you know, and so I believe that an enemy told me that for years. So that's an example. And there are many, many scriptures. So today, as I was doing my study on being his daughter,
01:19:57
Speaker
And I think I went to about 20 different verses using the Blue Letter Bible that app going to. And what it also has is it has multiple translations. So I also would look at how it's described in different translations. And a new translation now is called The Passion.
01:20:21
Speaker
And if you look at it, it's not even all complete yet. So right now it has the whole New Testament psalm proverbs and they're now releasing one by one as they get it done. And if you read the preface before, it points out the writers really try to go to that original language.
01:20:41
Speaker
But they also describe it like how I just did in modern language. You know what I mean? So, so yeah, they would give the original language.
01:20:54
Speaker
Idea in how we would say it today. And so it's very intimate I'm really loving it and you don't have just use that you know, you can I still pull out my an IV and you know With it, but it just helps you to get a much bigger picture of the meaning of that scripture yeah, there's this to that changed my life and
01:21:19
Speaker
in province where it says, the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom. I was like fear the Lord, beginning of wisdom. And then you look up the word, fear is reverence, is to have respect towards someone or something. So he's like, okay, that clears things up. And there was one that I was reading that a while ago and I talk about, you know,
01:21:39
Speaker
all the time on the podcast when Jesus said, we owe the lot of the world the soul to the earth. Salt means prudence. Prudence means godly wisdom, godly discernment, and godly judgment. So you have to understand that who we are in Christ, one of the reasons why salt is used to preserve something. So us as believers within the world, we are to preserve God's message and who God is in a society that's obviously counter to what God
01:22:07
Speaker
originally ordained at once. So we have to understand our value and that changed my perspective as a believer. My job is not to convert the world, but it's to be alternative to society, which means that when society is prepared, they should be able to come to me or whoever the individual is to be able to come to me when prepared and my life should be a living example of how Christ like I strive to live and therefore eventually that they will come.
01:22:35
Speaker
and seek to learn and understand. So once you understand that your perspective as a believer shifts in terms of your approach to life and how you intend to win souls for Christ, but you do it gently, you do it respectfully, you're doing in a manner that's not aggressive, right? What we've learned in history about how, you know, Christians in the Catholic Church have operated in terms of slavery, you know, what's happened to Africans,
01:23:03
Speaker
That's not the message of the gospel. It's never been about that. And it's not, you know, one side is for all who accept and believe him, you know. So those things, you know, those things start to change and that's the opening and understanding these, you know, the original language.
01:23:21
Speaker
it gives you instant understanding. It gives you, I call it public revelation and personal revelation, right? The Bible is public revelation and a personal revelation is the understanding and clarity. So thank you so much for sharing that, right? I want people to know it's not just me that's saying this. No, you don't have to learn. I don't speak Hebrew or Greek. You don't have to go through all that. In fact, a lot of semesters like the one my husband and I went to, they didn't make us
01:23:49
Speaker
learn Hebrew and Greek to get a master's in biblical studies, they had us learn to use the tools. Yeah, you know, so I, a quickie last example, I was, I learned the hard way that when I prepare
01:24:04
Speaker
to teach the word to go back to those languages, because I was in China is teaching Zephaniah 317. And, and I look, you know, in my Bible, it says that God sings a love song over me. And but in, in the Chinese Bible, it says they cheer, he cheers loudly over you. And I was kind of
01:24:30
Speaker
bummed out because I'm like, no, I love the thought of him singing, you know, and they're all telling me, no, he cheers. Yeah. Like a football game, you know. And so I was like, what in the world is the Bible not accurate? I didn't really think that I knew the Bible was accurate, but I was like, why are they thinking that? So I went back the original language and it actually means both.
01:24:54
Speaker
wow so when he was both so now so when i started teaching now i teach both you know and i say he sings this love song love song over us and and he's cheering yay so i love you you know and so even your teaching can become more uh complete
01:25:16
Speaker
you know and it'll help if if you do happen to go teach to somebody even your neighborhood but maybe they're a Spanish speaker you know and they have a Spanish Bible for example well understand that their translation might have a little different meaning and they might get confused so just
01:25:35
Speaker
pop up that blue letter Bible look at that originally and you'll probably find out that oh wow okay we put our two languages together because Hebrew is a very comprehensive language it's so much more meaningful and in the script than our English language
01:25:55
Speaker
Right? Love is five different meanings. So even when you learn that. So we think we got it. There's always more to explore and to find out. And I want to say thank you so much for coming on. It's been an honor. I learned a lot. I hope my audience
01:26:15
Speaker
has learned a lot. And I'm just excited and thankful for your perseverance, man. That's something that needs to be applauded. And I'm glad God has brought you a mighty long way from where you were and thinking about the potential to not even exist. And we've seen that in the Bible as well, whether it was Samuel who
01:26:42
Speaker
didn't know if he was going to be born or Samson. We didn't know he was going to be born. And we find out that you're a miracle baby and God had a plan for you and your impact on other people. And sometimes we have to look at the value of
01:26:58
Speaker
people that haven't been born yet and what God has planned for them. They knew you in your mother's womb, Jeremiah 1.5. We have to understand that we're all created for God's purpose and use as instruments of righteousness, not wickedness. So I want to thank you so much for coming on. You're never too old. I'm starting a nonprofit and traveling to seven countries this year and I'm 63. So there you go. You're never too old.
01:27:27
Speaker
Right? Moses was what? 81? Right? God can still use you. God can spray you on the way. So the Truth of the Matters podcast will keep you in prayer. So if you don't mind, can you pray us out?
01:27:44
Speaker
Absolutely. Lord God, thank you so much for today. Thank you, Heavenly Father, how much you do call us your children and all that comes with that, that you're with us, that you protect us, that you provide for us, that you dump your love and that you lavishly love us, that you pour your grace on us, that you've forgiven us, that you've given us eternal life, that you've given us every spiritual blessing.
01:28:08
Speaker
that you've given us the word of God so that we can go deeper and deeper with you and you fill us with your Holy Spirit that empowers us to live the Christ-filled life and empowers us to make you known to others and to disciple others. So thank you for today and I pray just your spirit to go forth in this message to just encourage and help every single person listening to know how much you love them and how much you desire
01:28:36
Speaker
To continue to transform them for your glory and and for their good as well. And we thank you in Jesus name. Amen. Amen.