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Anya Culling | Runna
2.7k Plays11 months ago
Anya Culling is a Runna coach and has represented England over the marathon distance. Anya took up running in lockdown which saw her go from a marathon time of 4hrs 34 mins in 2019 to a current PB of 2hrs 34 mins knocking off 2hrs. Anya has her sights set on The 2026 Commonwealth Games. Michelle chats to Anya about her whirlwind journey into elite running and her tips for getting the best out of yourself at the marathon distance.
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Transcript
Introduction to Anya Culling
00:00:01
Speaker
Hi Anya, thank you so much for joining us on the UK Run Chat podcast today. Would you just like to give a brief introduction for all our listeners out there? Yeah, of course. Thank you for having me. As you said, my name is Anya Culling and I am now an elite marathon runner and I represented England over the marathon distance.
00:00:22
Speaker
That's incredible. So you've had quite a journey into elite running, haven't you? It's been quite a whirlwind by all
Running Journey Begins
00:00:29
Speaker
accounts. So can you tell us a little bit about your journey into running to start with? Like when, when did you start running and how did you enjoy it at first?
00:00:40
Speaker
Of course. Yeah. Um, I'm actually back home at my parents' house now where it all started. Um, so yeah, it's been a complete whirlwind and I still kind of can't believe it every day. Um, but I did what a lot of people do and picked up running in the COVID lockdown just as a means of getting out the house. And I just fell totally head over heels in love with it. And I kept it up. You know, everyone says like consistency is key.
00:01:09
Speaker
Um, but that felt easy and I've kept it up now. So I've been running for three or so years and I've just been like progressing leaps and bounds. And I never ever thought I would be here now, like doing podcasts about running. Um, I never even saw this on my horizon, but yeah, I literally started just from mental health miles, um, back in 2019. Yeah. So you were doing lots of running around the beautiful Norfolk countryside.
00:01:38
Speaker
Yeah, I would just go out with the dogs or with my brother or my mum. My mum was doing couch to 5K. My brother thought he was far too quick for me and he'd wear like a weights vest or fill a rucksack with dog food and he'd try and run next to me but get so fed up with how slow I was running and like stop at every corner to do push-ups or chin-ups until I caught up and now the tables have turned.
First Marathon Experience
00:02:06
Speaker
So you've, just to give our listeners some context here, your first marathon was four and a half hours or thereabouts, is that right? Yes, that was just before lockdown in 2019 London Marathon. And I would say I didn't pick up running from that point. That was the most painful marathon I've ever done. It was obviously an amazing experience, but I didn't get the buzz then and continue running from then on out. I very much
00:02:34
Speaker
Yeah. I wasn't prepared and I didn't know what I was doing. And, um, so yeah, I didn't actually pick it up till lockdown really. Yeah. And then you've, so you've gone from that to a very impressive two hours and 34 minutes and that's in such a short space of time. So I think today I'd love to just really explore what's changed and you know, what you, what your training looks like and what you've implemented.
00:03:01
Speaker
that led to such a massive improvement. I mean, that's huge, isn't it? It is mental. Yeah, I actually still kind of can't believe it. So let's just go back to that first marathon then. So you'd not been running very long before you did that marathon, is that right? No, I hardly trained to be honest. I yeah, was I've always been into team sports and I played hockey and cricket to like a competitive county level.
00:03:29
Speaker
And I just thought I'd try my hand at marathon running. I wanted to get fitter like a lot of people do when they start marathon running. And it was just a mental challenge, really, to see if I could do it. I remember, yeah, not turning up without a clue. Like, I didn't have any of the carbon-plated shoes. I didn't have a watch. I didn't have a pace to run at. I had done, I'd never run anywhere close to the marathon distance. I'd never followed a plan or anything.
00:03:57
Speaker
And I mean, yeah, four hours and a half is still a pretty respectable marathon tie. So I was over the moon with that. Yeah.
Mental Health and Consistency
00:04:03
Speaker
So talk us through like how that first marathon went kind of, I mean, were you, what was your recovery like after it?
00:04:09
Speaker
It was so, so painful, that marathon. I think every part of my body was chafing, every part of me had blisters. I don't think I was the biggest word of mouth evangelist for running like I am now after that. And I think I just went back to normal life, to be honest. And then, yeah, locked down here, I needed to exert some energy. And I remember how tired I was at that marathon and thought, let's give it another shot, I think.
00:04:39
Speaker
Okay, so lockdown, so what changed then? You were obviously running for different reasons to get out and just have some time away from the family, a bit of headspace. Exactly. So what then led into this improvement in your running? Everybody always asks me that, but I do honestly think it was
00:05:03
Speaker
Yeah, the process over the outcome, like I really never intended to do this or to get to this level, like never in a million years I think running could ever be a job. I really genuinely just kept consistent because I loved it. I think if I, I'm an all or nothing person, like if I had got into it as a child, I don't know whether I'd still have that love for it now.
00:05:30
Speaker
I think I've only got positive connotations when it comes to running now, which are feeling this euphoria after getting out of the house when you're meant to be, you know, locked in that one hour of a day. Yeah, I would go on these runs and I wouldn't remember where I'd even run because I was just so totally like lost. And so I did go all in really with running. People ask me what I listened to on my runs and it would be a running podcast, what I watched on TV, it's all the running,
00:06:00
Speaker
documentaries, like I have gone full ham. But I really did just enjoy the process. Like, because I never had this one big main goal, every single run was an achievement. And I think, yeah, valuing that process over the outcome has been the one thing that I think has kept me running for this long and still keep making progress.
00:06:24
Speaker
Yeah. And that's something I think a lot of us often overlook, isn't it? That you've just got to get out there and keep on doing it, haven't you? Exactly. Yeah. I say sometimes, um, if I don't feel like running, because yeah, you've got to be motivated and I'm a very motivated person, but when motivation runs out, discipline needs to step in and you need to be like, I should be going for this run. Like it is going to help me in the longterm. Um, you know, train hard, race easy.
00:06:54
Speaker
But I always say like, if you go out, just get out your front door and run for five minutes. And if then you still want to turn around and you still want to go home, then yes, do it. You've given it a good go. But at that point, most of the time, you will keep going. And yeah, I think in my head, I've got to get this run done, so I might as well do it now, even if it's lashing with rain, because my alternative is not running, and I'm definitely going to run.
00:07:21
Speaker
Do you enjoy running in the rain? I don't mind it personally. I quite enjoy it. Yeah. When I'm in a group and it's completely like heavy rain, dark, I feel really cool. Like I'm in a movie running in the rain, but when it's just a little bit miserable and you're by yourself, it's not quite as enjoyable. Yeah. So you've represented England over the marathon distance.
Joining Best Aesthetics
00:07:43
Speaker
So tell us how you went from lockdown running to, you know, running in England. How does that happen?
00:07:50
Speaker
So, yeah, as I say, I was just enjoying running every day. I didn't know what I was doing. I would run, yeah, most days around Norfolk and then I moved back to London and ran around Battersea Park. And I then found Best Aesthetics, which is the group I still train with and my coach.
00:08:09
Speaker
And then I started associating running with friendship and the whole running community. And I had no idea that existed. And that was a new, very exciting thing because of my background in team sports. I'd always kind of dismissed running because it was a very individual activity and I need
00:08:29
Speaker
people around me to keep me motivated and so finding them was so helpful as well and then Nick told me I should be doing some marathons or booking some races to see see what I can really do because the reason I was running was to make myself proud and after every run I was feeling yeah prouder and prouder and achieving more than I ever thought like I could every single run so to then start monitoring that progress with like race times really helped keep my motivation up
00:08:58
Speaker
So yeah, I booked into a few races, only the ones I wanted to do with the people from the run club I wanted to run with. And then I ran Manchester Marathon, I think it was, in about three, just over three hours.
00:09:12
Speaker
And I didn't have a pace target for that. I literally just went out with a group of people I knew and I actually ended up pushing on and yeah, ran that really good time. And that's when I was like, wow, that was hard. And I loved that. Like I really owned that pain. And
00:09:33
Speaker
I think I could really push that. So I think at that point, I started taking it all a bit more seriously and got Nick as a coach. And yeah, and then it wasn't until London Marathon, the London Marathon after COVID. So I think it was 2022 last year. Yeah, it was last year.
00:09:51
Speaker
Nick actually ran it with me just to keep me mentally there so that I could perform to my best because I was so used to running with people, I was really scared to run it alone. So he ran it with me and I didn't know that that would get me an England vest but I literally got a message
00:10:09
Speaker
and after being like would you like to be considered for the england team and i couldn't believe it i just remember like bringing my parents kind of thinking maybe it was a hoax as well um but that was yeah genuinely the proudest moment of my running career yeah that was incredible i mean what's going through your head then when you get contacted to run for your country like what an amazing
00:10:29
Speaker
Yeah, it was very much like, would you like to be considered? So I was like, yes, of course. But even then, I didn't think I'd actually be chosen.
Racing for England
00:10:39
Speaker
And my mum kept telling people that, oh, Annie is like on England's running radar. And I kept telling her off for telling people that because I thought it might jinx me.
00:10:47
Speaker
and I was like no we can't celebrate until my name's on like a team sheet and even then when I went out to run that marathon I think my naivety got me through it because I was by far the most naive in that England team or in the whole race hotel I didn't know what to expect. There was so much about that weekend which I learned and had never even considered about elite racing and hotels and
00:11:15
Speaker
your drinks and having a team alongside you. And yeah, it blew my mind. Yeah. So tell us a bit about that. I'm really interested to hear, because that's an insight we very rarely get as kind of, you know, hobbyist runners, really. Yeah. So we got flown out to Copenhagen for Copenhagen marathon. And there was, yeah, there's so many things that I'd never even thought of, like packing particular race kits. And I remember being told off at breakfast, my first breakfast coming down,
00:11:45
Speaker
because I wasn't wearing my England kit, and I think I was just wearing basically pyjamas, and I was like, oh, sorry, I genuinely didn't realise that was the done thing. But I think I was just in... Yeah, it was a crazy experience because I went to my hotel room the night before, so we flew in quite late, and I remember walking in, and all the lights were off, and I... Yeah, like...
00:12:06
Speaker
bombarded into this hotel room and I was like oh gosh someone's asleep in the bed and I remember being like uh is this the wrong hotel room and I put a message on the group chat to the team and I was like are we meant to be sharing rooms and they're like oh yeah didn't you know and I had no idea until the morning who it was and it was um actually Philly Bowden who's now one of my best running mates we've just been on an altitude training camp together
00:12:29
Speaker
but she's actually taught me a lot about this pro environment, but we're around all the Africans, like all the teams, all the nations. I remember thinking it was a bit like a computer game where you can select your character and they'd all select their country or they've selected their sponsor like Adidas or Nike or Great Britain and you'd be wearing that and that was like your character like selecting the green monopoly man or something.
00:12:57
Speaker
But yeah, being around those Africans as well, I learnt so much. I've never seen anyone eat more than people like two days out from a marathon, like it was mental.
00:13:08
Speaker
Yeah, it does sound quite surreal. So how did the race itself go? How was that? Yeah, that was amazing. So, yeah, Nick paced me, my coach again. I am so grateful for him doing these things for me. Yeah, so I went out with a time in mind and I was just like, all I have to do is stick on Nick's heels, basically. I had my family all around the course. My parents brought out 30
00:13:37
Speaker
friends and family to support and they all had these matching bucket hats. There's a mania Copenhagen marathon with the England flag on which was just crazy. So I'd see them a mile off in these reds bucket hats. But I didn't want to get overexcited by any of that. I
00:13:55
Speaker
was happy to be excited by all of my training and that was the bit like absolutely loved. I loved the marathon training as I say like the process over the outcome and this race was like the cherry on the top of the cake and my mental attitude was very much like don't get overexcited and yeah get bored before you get tired so just keep mentally checked in and one step in front of the other the more you run the less you've got to run and
00:14:22
Speaker
I kind of didn't give myself an option because I am going to run this time. I know I can run this time. I've done all the work and just keep that self-belief. And I think as everyone does, I found it very hard from the wall at about 30K. But I remember still overtaking quite a few people and quite a few girls and overtaking some of the elites. And I was like, wow, I really, really am doing this.
00:14:50
Speaker
I'm almost there. And yeah, like this is the time to enjoy. So I just wanted to like, yeah, save every single moment of it. Yeah. Wow. So I mean, why the marathon specifically? I mean, have you tried other distances? I actually have never tried the other distances. I mean, I've dipped my toe into a bit of 10K, yeah, half marathon, but I,
00:15:18
Speaker
I like to say I'm like a one trick pony with one speed, but I'm trying to work on that because I now am starting to understand.
00:15:25
Speaker
the importance of like speed work for your marathon. But because I didn't grow up running, I never really did cross country. I never really did track work. And that I think is a whole different, I guess I've finished, but I think because I run for that mental, that like mental headspace
00:15:50
Speaker
I need to check out on my runs, whereas a shorter distance run, you've got to be very focused and yeah, you've got to keep mentally checked in for what, like a, you know, yeah, like a six, five, four minute mile. But a marathon, you're in it for the long haul and it's all about those months long builds, which as I say, the build is my favorite bit. Yeah. And it's, it's quite a different.
00:16:13
Speaker
kind of environment, I guess. So the team sports that you grew up playing, it's quite a solo activity. How much of that training are you doing with others at the moment? So I try to train with others as much as I can. So all the easy runs, actually, I do take myself off and listen to a podcast and back to like my running roots. But I run all my sessions with people as much as I can. So whether that's training camps, which is quite a new thing for me, which has been very exciting.
00:16:43
Speaker
or running with the guys for any speed work because they push me. I think that's very important. But yeah, running is, yeah, it is a team sport though, because you're all helping each other out. I don't think you're really up against each other. You all want each other to do well.
00:17:01
Speaker
is an individual display of toughness and strength, which I do like. You're responsible for your own outcome, ultimately, but you can use each other to help you along the way and keep you motivated and help keep yourself accountable. Yeah, I love that. And that is the benefit of having a group of people to train with, isn't it? It's that you do 100%, you would on your own.
00:17:25
Speaker
So you're now looking ahead to the 2026 Commonwealth Games, I believe. So tell us a little bit about what that process will involve and what you're working on at the moment. Yeah, of course. So I managed to get to this kind of level with a full-time job.
Becoming a Full-Time Runner and Coach
00:17:41
Speaker
and that was very difficult. That involved a lot of 5am wake-ups. I was totally knackered throughout a lot of the day and I think that next level up is me being able to recover better, eat better, sleep better, which will hopefully help. So Lululemon are now my sponsor and I'm a full-time runner
00:18:05
Speaker
and run coach, which is going to be amazing to take me to that next level. So yeah, the pipe goal is obviously the Olympics and Commonwealth Games, but there's so many amazing female runners at the moment that
00:18:18
Speaker
Yeah, the Olympics will just continue to be like a star, a light at the end of the tunnel, like we'll keep aiming over there. But yeah, for now, I would really like to work on the England vests and the Commonwealth Games. So I am trying to absorb as much information and
00:18:37
Speaker
um advice from all the other runners like osmosis that i'm hanging around with now and basically follow and copy what they do and yeah a few things that i'm going to implement yeah is training with more quick girls working on my form a lot more some training camps and just being a little bit more focused um and not letting the life uh again overtake me i'm very good at saying yes to everything so
00:19:05
Speaker
I am going to take a little bit more seriously in the hope, yeah, to get to the next Commonwealth Games. Yeah, there's quite a big change in kind of mental attitude, I guess, because this is kind of your job now almost, isn't it? You know, it's a big change. So you are a coach at Runner, aren't you? So just tell us a little bit about the coaching that you do.
00:19:26
Speaker
Yes, so I am now employed by Runner, which is amazing. They are a running training app, which is, yeah, everybody seems to be on it. Everyone's loving it. My mom's doing her first 10K on it, but I help to influence what goes in the plans. And if you have any questions or how to adapt your plan,
00:19:46
Speaker
I'm there to answer it. But it really is the most amazing community that running, that runner community with the run clubs, with the events that they host, with the personalized coaching. Like it really is the new way of being coached without having a one-to-one, yeah, really dedicated coach. It's more on your own back, but you've still got that community, which is great.
00:20:10
Speaker
Yeah. And you're there kind of in the background if people need help. Exactly. Yes. Yeah, that's great. If listeners do want to find out more about Renner, we did do an episode with Ben. So that's on there. So just search that for the podcast with Renner and you can find out lots more. So Anya, how, you know, why did you get into coaching as well is, you know, you've obviously been influenced by your own coach during your
00:20:35
Speaker
Exactly. I don't want to gate keep this feeling and this progression that I've been on. So I want to help as many people out as I can. I do some personal coaching as well on the sides and I love coaching anybody who has the right mindset, but particularly girls that I can really relate to and I can hopefully share some wisdom and things I've learned along the way to them and help
00:21:00
Speaker
them make this kind of upwards trajectory that I have. But I think with running, you're all trying as hard as each other. You're all trying your best. As I say, like that first marathon that I did in four and a half hours, I worked just as hard and it was just as painful as a two and a half hour marathon because yeah, you are just pushing yourself and seeing what you can achieve and seeing some of my athletes and seeing other people
00:21:27
Speaker
get, smash their goals. It makes me think like, ah, I need to do that. Like they can do it. I can do it. It's all relative to your training. And yeah, I'm inspired so much by everybody I coach. Yeah. Oh, that's lovely. Yeah. So that's another kind of source of motivation for you really. Definitely. Yeah, definitely. Yeah. So let's just chat a little bit about marathon training then because lots of people will be getting ready to start their spring marathon training cycles very soon.
00:21:55
Speaker
Yeah. Let's talk first of all about what recommendations you'd make for people who are really looking to improve their time over the marathon. Yeah, so I think you've got to
00:22:10
Speaker
Yeah you've got to enjoy the process as I keep saying I don't want to sound like a broken record but I think so much about running is you're aiming for this huge goal and you can so easily feel like a failure if you're not hitting your marathon time even though you're months out from your marathon or you've got to always remember once you do a race and you finish it you then change your next goal and the goal post change to an even higher PB so at that point I think
Coaching Philosophy and Inspiration
00:22:39
Speaker
you can if you if you have that attitude of always looking for the long-term goal you kind of can never be happy because you're always gonna be changing the goal post so I think you've got to reward yourself regularly so constantly check in so just take each marathon session like session by session and make sure you look back on it and be like wow that was great that was a great improvement and then next week we'll come round and you've got to have that same
00:23:05
Speaker
attitude of, let's just see what I can do today, rather than worrying about the long term future. And that way you still enjoy it as well. And yeah, your motivation stays high because it's these little stepping stones that will get you there in the long term.
00:23:19
Speaker
Yeah, that's really great advice actually. So just kind of keep, you know, regular small little rewards. I like that. Exactly. Yeah. So what are your favourite marathon training sessions then? What do you feel that you get the most progress from? Yeah, I think, so I would say you should keep your speed work up in the marathon training. I think a lot of people
00:23:45
Speaker
I think, yeah, maybe you've heard of this before, but they get stuck in this gray zone where their easy runs are a little bit too hard and their fast workouts are a little bit too slow. So because they're just building up fatigue, um, run after run by running slightly too fast over maybe the same routes, the same distance, the same pace that you can't really perform in the speed workouts and you need
00:24:12
Speaker
You need to run faster to ultimately get a faster time. So your speed work will one, help your like lactate clearance. So a differentiation of speeds in like interval works will help your body become more efficient at clearing your lactic. So you can run for further at a faster pace for in that marathon. Um, but it's all about raising that lactic threshold.
00:24:36
Speaker
ceilings. So pushing above that will help raise it. So yeah, keeping up speed works really important. But my go to marathon sessions is a hard one, but four by 5k, I think is a really good indicator of where your fitness is at. If you can hold your marathon pace for yeah, four by 5k. And whether you have a kilometer float in between each one or three minutes, two minutes,
00:25:04
Speaker
And if you can hold that pace, I think that's a really good indicator that that is a realistic target for you. The other one I really like is six kilometers, five kilometers, four kilometers, two kilometers, one kilometer, like that's downwards intervals.
00:25:21
Speaker
Uh, that is a tough one, but I always like to fit that in people try and do the three by 10 K. And if you smash it like amazing, I have never done that successfully. Um, but I think that's another thing. Like you've just got to do the running. You like, I think I'm far less about the end goal and more about enjoying the training. And as long as I.
00:25:45
Speaker
rack up the training, it's all consecutive and even accumulative miles over months and months of training, that's going to be better you than one amazing training session. So always aim for like a good consistent block of B plus training rather than one half marathon race in your buildup, which is a star because that doesn't always necessarily lead into a really amazing marathon time. Like before Berlin marathon, which is my latest marathon, I,
00:26:14
Speaker
kind of blew up a little bit at the big half, but I was very, very sure like not to let that affect me and just use that as it wasn't a failure. As long as you learn from it, it's not a failure. And I now know what not to do on race day. Yeah. And that's so important as well in training, isn't it? We find out what doesn't work for us as well as what does. Exactly. You've got to enjoy it. You've got to do what works for you and see what will keep you motivated and keep you at it. Yeah.
00:26:42
Speaker
Yeah. And do you do any other kind of cross training activities as part of your marathon training or are you slowly running? Yeah. As I say, I just want to keep enjoying exercise and running. I never want it to feel like a chore.
00:26:55
Speaker
I really love cycling. I've recently got into that. So instead of easy running, I quite often go out for a long bike ride. I think as a rule of thumb, you get the same training benefits if you do double the amount of cross training. So instead of a 30 minute run, you could do an hour on the bike and you get a similar training benefit as long as your heart rate zones are the same as what you were meant to be doing.
00:27:24
Speaker
an easy run and an easy cycle um yeah you should gain a similar amount of um yeah training benefit from that but i again love training up my training stimulus so i still do play a little bit of hockey i still love cycling i even love swimming i recently did a triathlon just because i just like doing it i love just pushing myself and pushing my body like i'm not
00:27:48
Speaker
I will never be a runner that can just run, sleep, eat, run, sleep, eat. Like I've got to have some variety in my life. Yeah, I think that's, it's so important, isn't it? You know, yeah, it's got to be varied and we've got to enjoy it.
00:28:03
Speaker
Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. So you've obviously got a lot more time now to train, but what would you say to those people who are kind of juggling, you know, full-time jobs with marathon training? How, how can they best prioritize what training they do if they can't fit in?
Training Focus and Tips
00:28:20
Speaker
Yeah, it is really hard, but I think you've just got to be intentional with that training. So it's less about just ticking them off. You've got to go into each session knowing
00:28:31
Speaker
what you want to achieve from it. Um, because otherwise you can get a bit lost. So say it's a tempo run or a threshold run. There's a reason that's in your plan rather than a speed workout or an easy run. So it's important to know that you've got to do it at that pace because you're working a different energy system. So, um, I think, yeah, going into each run with the intention of what you're going to achieve. So,
00:28:59
Speaker
If you're really tired, there is kind of no point in doing it because you're going to become unproductive. It would be better for you and you'd get more training benefits if you let yourself recover and give it your all like the next day. Um, because you've got to, yeah, perform well on your training runs and work hard to get that progressive overload to keep your training and your fitness going up.
00:29:24
Speaker
Um, otherwise you will just stagnate. So I think it's listening to your body and, um, yeah, getting as much recovery in as possible and getting the most out of the sessions you do do. Um, I know a lot of amazing runners that yeah, work crazy hour jobs. Um, but yeah, it is about getting it done. And as I say, sometimes when the motivation does run out, you need to, um, yeah, discipline does need to kick in and you need to, yeah, having a coach following a training plan does really help.
Promotions and Social Media
00:29:55
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. And I think I should probably mention that there is a two weeks extended free trial at runner if you use the code UKwinchat, so people can give that a go as well. So thank you so much Anya for coming on and chatting to us. So where can people find you on social media if they want to learn more about you?
00:30:16
Speaker
That's great. Thank you so much. Yeah. I'm just on Instagram as a dot culling. And I also have a YouTube channel, which is Anya culling. So I'd love to have you guys over there. Yeah. And maybe some will find you over at runner as well. Yeah. If you ever need to speak to a coach on the app, I will be the other side of the app typing away. Yeah. Oh, well, thank you so much for joining us. That's been fascinating. So do get in touch with Anya via her social media if you do want to know more.
00:30:45
Speaker
Thank you for having me. It's great to chat.