00:00:00
00:00:01
Hypothetical Questions, Round 2
251 Plays1 month ago
What would you do if …
- Your content is suffering from too much input from too many people?
- You’re conflicted on how to delegate between an agency and your in-house team?
- You need more customer feedback to do your job better?
- Your paid campaign has so many offers and CTAs and there’s no way to test them all?
Back by popular demand, Jess and Susan dive into another round of hypothetical marketing scenarios and challenges—and put their heads together on how to navigate them.
(And be sure to check out Hypothetical Questions, Round 1!)
That's Marketing, Baby is produced by Sweet Fish Media.
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Transcript
00:00:00
Speaker
All right. I have one more for you. Okay. I'm ready. This is a real life scenario. Okay. Susan and I are coming to each other with some hypothetical scenarios that, you know, we feel are pretty common universal. You might get something out of, you've probably experienced in your everyday marketing life and like ask each other, like, how would you handle that?
00:00:29
Speaker
Friends, listeners, fellow marketers, welcome. Hello again to That's Marketing Baby. I'm Jess Cook, and I'm here with my bestie. I was going to try and rhyme that, like sister from another mister bestie with a, I don't know, my marketing bestie. Besties for resties? Yes, besties for resties in marketing, Susan Winograd. Hi, everybody. Thanks for tuning in again.
00:00:58
Speaker
Yes. And we wanted to come back today. We have one episode of That's Marketing Baby that just continues to like knock it out of the park in terms of downloads and listens and feedback that we get on it. It is our most listened episode of all time. We're not expecting that. No. And did you know we have like over 30 episodes at this point, which is... I know.
00:01:26
Speaker
I know. But this is such a good content lesson, right? Like, it's always the one you're like, Oh, this one's gonna be the one. And it's like one that you and I are just like, you know, it'd be fun to do this. And then all of a sudden, that's the one everybody likes. Exactly. And that is hypothetical questions. If you're not familiar with it, definitely go back and give it a listen. It's a fun one. But basically, it's Susan and I are coming to each other with some hypothetical scenarios that we feel are pretty common universal, you might get something out of you've probably experienced in your everyday marketing life and like ask each other, like, how would you handle that? So we've each come today with two hypothetical questions that we're very excited to ask and answer. Yeah. And they' and I think what's fun about these two is a lot of times I really don't know how Jess is going to answer. like its It really is a genuine question. I mean, we worked together for a while, but
00:02:15
Speaker
it was in a startup situation, which might be different than what we normally work in. So it's always kind of interesting to uncover how she would handle different things that I never got to experience with her too. So it's always kind of fun to pick someone's brain that way. Likewise. Yeah. Yeah. I'm always like, I really actually need to ask Susan this because I need a legitimate answer on how this should be handled.
00:02:34
Speaker
Yeah, I think the video is LinkedIn conversions. How would you find this? then i'm like well i and I put it someplace really dumb, which would be right here. Yeah. Backstory, I launched my first ever LinkedIn ad. Yay. Very exciting. It's going well, actually. I'm very proud of it. And I had to like slack Susan and be like, ah How do I actually find out if it's working? I'm spending money. What do I do now? Yeah. not This is not a hypothetical question. I really need an answer. Yeah, exactly. Real question. All right. Do you want to start? Do you want me to start? I'll ask you first. Okay.
00:03:17
Speaker
I'm going to put you in the spot first. OK. So my first one is because I've watched this happen. And I've seen this happen on the ad creative side. So it makes me really curious when it's something that's more like long form copy that's really kind of expertise driven, because it's a little bit of a different situation, is how do you handle situations where there are like a million people giving input on the content?
00:03:44
Speaker
to the point that it makes it really boring or really watered down or it it like just kind of becomes a not necessarily like a compelling piece. It's more just like a watered down how to, you know, or it becomes like so jargony that it doesn't mean anything, which you and I have talked about plenty on here. How do you handle that situation? Like, I'm assuming there's probably things you can do ahead of time to mitigate it. But like, what happens when your knee deep in it and you're like, oh, crap, stick but there's no turning back now. There's like three different C-suite people giving input on this.
00:04:14
Speaker
How do you handle that? Yeah. Oh, this is so good because it happens constantly for content people. You'll have three to four SMEs that you need their opinion on a blog post before it can get published because you want to make sure it's accurate. You want to make sure that the expert on this particular topic within your company has had eyes on it, all of those things. So I think a really good place if you find yourself in this situation and you open up your, let's say your copy document and you jump in and they're just oodles of comments that just kind of, oh, okay, let's dive in. How do I parse through all of these? I think one thing to remember is there are obviously people who you really have to pay attention to their opinion, right? There are people in the company who
00:05:08
Speaker
Their opinions really matter. This is usually CEO, your CMO, heads of different departments, leadership, execs, right? And so making sure that you are taking their comments pretty seriously very much into consideration if they are saying,
00:05:26
Speaker
we either shouldn't be talking about this or the way we talk about it is actually this or we should reference this instead of that. Whatever their comment may be, it seems very important to take that into consideration. There are others potentially in your team when you can kind of take their opinions under advisement, but you don't necessarily have to make them. And the way that you will figure that out is by asking your manager typically, you know, hey, this person had this comment, how seriously should I take that?
00:05:59
Speaker
That's a really good question to ask. Sometimes the answer is, o take that very seriously. you know We've gotten in trouble for that before. It's just best if we listen to them or whatever the case may be. But a lot of times you'll hear, try your best to kind of mitigate the situation. And if it's just something that's kind of unavoidable, don't worry about it, right? Or you may even hear,
00:06:21
Speaker
Don't worry about that. That person's extremely conservative. I have no issues with us talking about that. Please move forward. So when in doubt, ask. I think in order to prevent things like that happening, moving forward, a good old RACI model is super helpful. And if you're not familiar, RACI is just an acronym that stands for responsible, accountable,
00:06:47
Speaker
What's the C? Consultant. Yeah, consultant, yeah. And informed. And so those are just kind of different levels of involvement, if you will. So the person writing it would be responsible. Usually the manager of that person would be accountable. The SME would be consulted. And maybe let's say your product marketer would be informed. And so as you move down that list,
00:07:13
Speaker
the comments or the feedback that you receive from those folks at the less involved stages don't have to be as taken as seriously or taken as gospel, I guess, as maybe those higher up. So that's a really good thing to kind of ah good practice to start moving forward if you find yourself in this situation often.
00:07:34
Speaker
And I've had this happen with, like you said, ad creative, with blog posts, with ideas. I mean, just like, hey, we could do a whole campaign around this narrative yeah and too many people get involved. And it gets really difficult. So as much as you can, try to document who is an approver and keep that group small if you can.
00:07:55
Speaker
Yes. God, keep it very small. For sure. All of this is not to say only listen to the highest people in the company and you can kind of ignore anything that someone who's not been around as long or as more junior has to say. There is definitely a delicate balance to whose authority and opinion and feedback should be taken into consideration, should be applied to a certain piece of content. Sometimes the biggest expert on the thing you are talking about is someone in engineering who's been out of school for three years.
00:08:36
Speaker
but they are the end all be all on this topic. And so you should probably listen to them. So it definitely it's not always to do with title. It's not always to do with rank. It is definitely very much to do with the expertise someone has in that area, the understanding they have of the customer and how much this topic relates to them. And that's just something you have to kind of learn over time, right? You started a new company, you're not going to know any of that. You won't have any of that history and understanding of like, who is the go to on this. And so it's something you have to learn as you go. And you you try to keep that group of approvers, the right group and the as small as possible.
00:09:20
Speaker
Okay, I have one for you. Yes. Okay. Imagine this, you are an in-house marketer. In a world where Susan is an in-house marketer. And you have the opportunity and the resources to bring on an agency that can help you with the demand side of things. What does that look like? What are you doing? What are they doing? What's the breakup and kind of the divide of responsibilities? Because I've seen this work very differently in different places. yeah It can get super convoluted. To me, it's not as clear cut as like a content agency, right? Yeah, it's not. Or freelancers, where I'm going to work on strategy as head of content, and I'm going to use my vendors and my contractors for execution. Yes.
00:10:08
Speaker
it doesn't seem so clear cut to me on the media side. So talk to me about that. That's a great point. And I guess I never really thought about it as much because it's like, I'm so used to it, but you're right. It's not, it's really not as clear cut in engagement. I think that's also kind of why, and I've had discussions with this at some agencies I've worked with. I think that's also why pitching for marketing type work like that is actually very hard.
00:10:29
Speaker
because the scope of work is, to your point, it's kind of like, these are the things we're gonna try. We don't necessarily know if it's gonna work, right? As opposed to like, we are doing this thing, it will be completed by this date, and here's the checklist. You can go down and know that it was done, right? So I think, you know, having been in that situation where they're like, okay, let's hire an agency, usually the first thing is, is you're typically engaging with an agency because there's something that you think they could probably do better than you're able to do in-house.
00:10:57
Speaker
And it's not necessarily always because maybe they'd be better at strategy. Sometimes you're just short-handed, right? Where it's like maybe you just don't have a design department because you're in a startup and you're like, we need someone to help us create visuals faster and test faster, right? So sometimes it's like you're joining with a place that basically gives you kind of like a mini department that you can work with to help with those things. So that's kind of where those responsibilities start to change because it depends on what you're hiring them for, right? And I think the biggest thing that you run into in the,
00:11:26
Speaker
this kind of you know relationship between in-house and agency is, what are the things that I am hiring them for? And then what are the things that I know that I have to keep on my plate? And those are the things that start to form that scope of work.
00:11:41
Speaker
And some agencies are good for different things. there are like For me, I'm a media buyer and I'm a marketing strategist. And I can tell you how things should look, what they should say, because I'm a word nerd. Do not ever ask me to design anything, ever. Don't ever ask me to design an ad. Like, if you show them to me, I can tell you what you'll probably need to change to have it perform well and on a social feed. Just because I know how people think I understand how to market things, but I am not the person that you want coming up with an idea and creating it. It would just, it'd be stick figures, and they wouldn't even be done well. So I'm the wrong person for that. And that's how some agencies are, right? They, they understand algorithms, they understand
00:12:25
Speaker
conceptualizing these things to get in front of the right people, they understand targeting, they understand those pieces of it, but they're not the place you'd want writing your white paper or creating your landing pages necessarily. So some of it depends on the agency's specialty as well. Typically, when you're dealing with a media situation, if you're being given a budget and they're saying hire a media agency, normally you're probably going to be hiring them to have them manage the day-to-day of the media, report to you on what's working, and then they may or may not do the creative. And like I said, some of that's based on their expertise, and some of it depends on in-house. Sometimes companies prefer to control all that themselves. So that's really a business decision.
00:13:00
Speaker
but typically what i find works best is if it's a good agency they've worked with other companies or services somewhat in your area so they understand the challenges or what gets run into normally what i find i have to provide the most especially in something like SaaS where it's really, really nuanced, is I have to give a lot of insight into the product, what it does, why customers want it, because it's not as obvious as something like consumer. You know, consumer
00:13:33
Speaker
And having worked in both worlds, I feel like on the consumer side, sometimes the less input I give, the better it works. Because they're outside of the product, and they see it in angles, and they understand what's working in consumer ads. And they understand how to marry those really, the really good creative shops know how to marry that stuff together really quick.
00:13:51
Speaker
And it's also faster feedback, right? So it's like you can launch it. And if you're either getting e-commerce sales or you're not, and it's kind of like, that's, that's it. The tale is told very quickly. B2B is tougher because it's so much longer. And it's very nuanced. It's you might only be right for one type of platform user. It's just so intricate that carries over even into how the business is conducted because then you're generating leads and how many they're getting to be SQLs. So it's just a much more involved process because it is a human touch sales effort.
00:14:21
Speaker
and I find in those engagements, it's really about keeping the agency looped into why things will or won't work because it's very easy. and I've been on the agency side where something seems very straightforward, and I'll come up with say LinkedIn ad copy and they're going, well, we technically, you know the way that you phrase it, I wouldn't put it that way because people are going to think that means we do X. and It's some thing that I've never heard of and I don't even know what it does, but it implies something that someone in that market would know.
00:14:47
Speaker
So there's a lot of in-market knowledge that I think any time you engage with an agency, that is going to be primarily what you really, really need to bring. A lot of the other stuff, the agency will learn over time, things like Creative Guidelines or how they want you to phrase stuff or those little nuances about how to position you in the marketplace. All of that is, there's always a learning curve to that. I always expect that.
00:15:11
Speaker
But as the day-to-day contact for the agency, you have to really be the subject matter expert. And I think the other piece that's really important, too, is this sort of ties back into what you were saying about having too many people give input.
00:15:25
Speaker
you have to be a really good buffer between product managers and agencies. Because the product managers will want to edit every single thing that agency makes. And they're going to want to water it down and make it really technical and be very literal about what the thing does. And your job as a marketer is to intercept it and say, I need to make this compelling to the user.
00:15:44
Speaker
So that's the other thing is you've really got to intercept that because otherwise if you're just passing stuff from product marketing over to the media agency, you're really tying their hands. and I've been in that position where I've gotten creative um and I'm going, this creative is terrible. this it's It was obviously written by a product manager. There's no human element to it whatsoever. This is not going to perform.
00:16:02
Speaker
So if you can intercept that, it can be hard for agencies to give that pushback and be heard. So if you can to be an advocate for translating those things so that the agency can be successful with their media, I think that's probably the the most crucial thing that I see lacking in a lot of those relationships.
00:16:17
Speaker
I love that a lot. It's very similar to like a traditional creative agency of kind of being the person who disseminates the information and allowing them to be the experts in what they do best right and kind of learning from each other. Follow-up question, who does the audience building? like That is always really interesting to me.
00:16:38
Speaker
Yeah. So that's usually pretty collaborative, I found. Okay. A lot of times, it's going to vary based on your internal contact, how knowledgeable are they about the ad platforms? That's sort of the first thing that creates a lot of forks in the road. If they just know, hey, we need to be running on LinkedIn, but they don't understand audience filtering, they don't even know all the options for targeting, there's going to be a steeper learning curve for the agency to bridge that gap of like, here's who you're saying you need, but here's how we're actually able to target to find something that's going to work. So the less that the client knows about the platform, the more heavy lifting the agency is probably going to have to do, because they're going to have to do a lot of educating on the front end of that relationship about what can and can't be done. Because there are definitely times
00:17:23
Speaker
And when they don't know, they'll show up and say, well, I want to target this job title at this company. And they'll have a whole list of demands, which is fine. But their budget might be a couple thousand dollars. And the more specific you get, the more that media is going to cost. And so there's a lot of those cost things also that I see in-house not necessarily understand. They might, if they might understand, oh, hey, I've been in the ad platform, and I see we can target this, this, and this. They don't understand the math side of what that does to the dollars you spend.
00:17:48
Speaker
So that's the other area where I see agencies having to do, and even consultants like me, having to do a lot of education is just, yes, it's possible, but here are the drawbacks to that, right? It's not all sunshine and roses just because you think you're reaching the people that you want. So I think that's really the other area that I see that come up a lot. Yeah. So good. Thank you. That clears so much up. yeah You're welcome. Since we're on the topic of sharing information, it it leads pretty seamlessly into my other big question I had for you.
00:18:17
Speaker
hit me. I think this is something that we really all experience as marketers in general, but I'm and so super curious about it on the content side because in the ad side, I have the benefit of data coming in from platforms to be able to do the front part of my job pretty well. And then after after it gets signed, my role as a marketer is kind of out of there because it's with customer success, and I don't have anything to do with that. I'm just about getting people to write the right people through the door. So on your side, in the content world, what is something that you just see not shared back with you that would make your job or your output or anything that you're doing as a content person so much better? What are those things that you're going, why was why won't someone just tell me this? Or like, if I had these pieces of information consistently given to me, I could do better. ah Okay.
00:19:10
Speaker
I have two, I think, that are really good. One is just really great customer quotes, like the really good golden nuggets that come out of a customer's mouth in a discovery call or they've just run ah their first kind of test with the product and they're really excited about it, whatever whatever the case is, wherever it comes from.
00:19:35
Speaker
They just saw the first demo. A lot of that now can get captured in like a GONG or an Avoma or something of that nature. But not everyone has that. Like at Island, we don't have that. Island is pretty heavy on the cybersecurity side. We have big Fortune 500, Fortune 100, Fortune 50 customers. They don't want all of that captured in a recording. So we kind of lose out on that. But what we do have is a Slack channel called Customer Quotes.
00:20:03
Speaker
And that channel has at least three quotes dropped into it every day that just helps marketers kind of see the value of the product through a customer's eyes. So that I love. If you can find ways to get at those things, start your own customer quotes channel in Slack or, you know, at Marpipe, we had a couple really good sales folks who were amazing at sharing Oh yeah. They were so good about that. Yeah. Snippets from Bong. They forward emails and you know that we always had that input. It was so helpful. Oh, it was so great. like A salesperson at the end of the week would be like, here are the five like the five best calls I had this week. Specifically, these five moments were so helpful. So that's one.
00:20:49
Speaker
The other one is, you know I think a lot of companies have a wind wire. They'll have some sort of Slack integration that tells the whole company that a contract has been signed and company XYZ is now a customer. And it's super exciting and everyone does their little Slack reaction emoji and then crickets. And then we hear nothing. So true.
00:21:16
Speaker
and so I think that's kind of the disconnect is once a company has become a customer, what happens after that? What are those first few months look like for them? What value are they realizing the fastest? What are some of the surprises that they have along the way? What are some of the quotes that we've heard from them in our customer success calls of how things are going and how did deployment go? and What are the end users thinking? How has adoption been? Those are the kinds of things right that after the initial celebration of them being a customer, there's no real follow-up. and That is just solid gold for a content marketer.
00:22:00
Speaker
not only for case studies, but just for the insights that can be used to bolster current content or create something new around, oh, that value was recognized really quickly from this use case, and we can build something around that that can be used in all of these places and all of these ways. so You can get to that from just regular talks with your sales team, but that's also something that can be automated as well. So that's something we're kind of working toward a bit more at Island. It's not an easy task, but just kind of regular check-ins with your sales team, and with your customer success leader. That's another big one for me. I biweekly meeting with our head of customer success just to kind of ask him like, who's happy with us right now? who What's going on? you know I know, hey, we won this customer. i I remember seeing that pop up last quarter. How are they doing? Just to kind of get a beat on what's going well. Follow up question to that. Yeah. How would you use if something bad happened? like What if the feedback wasn't good or if there was the answer was, oh, it didn't go well and they left? Or do you just not use that stuff? Is it just the good stuff? Or do you have you found other instances where you would use the negative for something?
00:23:14
Speaker
It's a really good question, a hard one. I think it depends on the feedback, obviously. I think that should absolutely be relayed to product team because most likely it has something to do with, and the sales team, honestly, because it probably has something to do with the expectations of the product and the product itself were not aligned. yeah And somewhere in there, what sales is telling this customer and what was actually in there was not there.
00:23:40
Speaker
that to me feels like big sales and product feedback. If it is indeed something to do with marketing, hey, on the website it said it did this and like we did not see that at all. yeah Oh my gosh, we need to go back and completely revamp what's being said there, right? If it feels like something that's false advertising, perhaps it's a new objection to overcome. Hey, we just didn't feel like it was,
00:24:06
Speaker
providing value for us because we're this kind of company and whatever. Hey, maybe that kind of company isn't the best customer for us then. So let's go back and let's make sure that it's very clear that who we are for and who we are not for is very clear in our marketing. So that is a great question. It's just as valuable as the good stuff. You just have to kind of do some different things with it to make sure that you're bolstering your content with the negative feedback as well.
00:24:36
Speaker
Yeah, that's a great answer. All right, I have one more for you. OK, I'm ready. This is a real life scenario. OK. So you are doing a campaign, paid campaign. And you have you know a handful of assets and calls to action, a bunch of offers that you can kind of give someone through these ads, right? You want to test them all out.
00:25:06
Speaker
What do you do? How many is too many? When do you know if it's working or not? would know like okay these I'm making this up. These three are doing the best. Let's really put all our money toward those. like What's your thought process like for testing multiple offers?
00:25:22
Speaker
i love this question because i I really believe this is where I see so many places stumble out of the gate because everyone wants to test all of the things and very rarely do they have a budget that's going to support that. and Or they don't have an audience size that's going to support it depending on what it is they're doing. so If someone comes to me and says, we have $5,000 to spend on LinkedIn this month and we have 30 pieces of creative, the answer is no.
00:25:53
Speaker
but You're not. The math is not mathing. Correct. You will not get enough information unless you run it for about eight months. You're not going to get enough information to understand. The advice that I normally give places is you want to fail as fast as possible. And I don't mean that in a negative way. It's more like figure out what's not working and just cut as aggressively as you can so that you can focus faster on what's working.
00:26:20
Speaker
I typically, in the ad platforms, I don't tend to run more than about three creatives at a time just because I find they don't really handle it well. And depending on the platform, for something like Facebook, Facebook picks its winner so fast. I mean, the other creatives will never even have a shot.
00:26:39
Speaker
So that's one of the downsides with it, where you end up having each creative in its own ad set, typically with the same budget distributed to each. You can't do that across 30 creatives, so right? So you have to make some decisions about, let's put these in groups. So a lot of times, I'm not necessarily testing all of them at once.
00:26:59
Speaker
I'm creating sort of like the playoffs, right? Or there's like, there's groups of three that all compete against each other. And then the winners ascend to the next level, and then they get put in together. So I have to do this process of elimination. I think the other piece of it is that I totally get people's hang up with statistical significance. I completely get it.
00:27:18
Speaker
And I would never make decisions unless you were getting close to it. But there have certainly been times where it is very clear. There is a creative that is just not working. It is not working. It's not getting clicks. It's not getting watched. There is nothing good about that is happening with that creative at that moment, yeah where you can feel pretty confident this isn't a targeting problem, especially if another creative is doing well and it's running to the same target.
00:27:42
Speaker
This is not a target problem. This is just not resonating. I tend to be fairly aggressive in cutting those things just because it has been so rare that I said, no, let's let it reach stat seg and it magically changed. It's very rare that happens. So if after a couple weeks, usually you're seeing a pretty clear pattern, it's probably not going to change much in my experience.
00:28:04
Speaker
I think sometimes companies, they get really hung up on that stat-sig thing. And they're like, oh, we've got to be like 90% stat. I'm like, yeah that's true if if there're if they're competing neck and neck. And if you're looking each day and the winner is bouncing back and forth, yeah, you're going to need all the data you can get. But there's some where it's just, it is clearly not working. I mean, it's just it's just not moving the needle at all.
00:28:23
Speaker
i am okay with cutting things pretty aggressively at that point, especially if you know you've got 28 other offers to test. You're not heading for content, right? So let's just, like, get over it, hold a funeral for it, and move on. Keep going, people. A lot of it really depends on what is your budget that you're you're going to be distributing. That usually decides. But like I said, I mean, there are some where i I'll maybe run five at a time.
00:28:47
Speaker
But it's rare. It's usually just the systems kind of and the targeting will only handle about three fairly effectively. Facebook's a little different because the audience side is is enormous and they have Instagram and everything else. LinkedIn really can't handle it well. The other thing is with LinkedIn, if you are rotating and creative to something that's already been in there and it has history, it prefers the thing with the history. So you'll rotate in new stuff and you had one that was doing well is very reluctant to distribute spend to something new. So it's going to take a lot longer. So the more of those you put in there, the the more prominent that's going to be. And anybody that's run, you know, three to five ads in LinkedIn, they're like, Yeah, they're really three. They just did never, they got two impressions, right? They just didn't, they didn't do anything. And a lot of times, I think, too, that's just a function of the fact that audiences in LinkedIn tend to be smaller, more narrowly focused.
00:29:34
Speaker
you're going after much more specific people. And LinkedIn is not as much of a conversion-driven environment as something like Facebook. Facebook has so much data. Google has so much data. It's creepy how well they can predict who's likely to do the thing you want. LinkedIn doesn't do that as well, typically. And I mean, we could bag on the algorithm all we want, but I think also it's just a function of there's a lot less data for it to work with. It's just smaller audiences. People don't convert as much. And it's all the reasons that B2B is harder, right? It's a longer cycle. Yeah. People are on LinkedIn not to buy your thing today. Yeah. If they see something that resonates with them, it's something they're going to get more information on. Yes. Right. And so I think that's just another piece of it of the kind of
00:30:19
Speaker
difference between B2B and B2C, the expectation needs to be it's going to take a little while. Yes. and And when you talk about which ones are working and how you want to hone in on stuff, the other piece that I see places struggle with is, you and I have talked about this before, is what does success look like?
00:30:39
Speaker
That's actually reasonable because what I run into on the media side is I swear 99% of the time we've been running on Google and it's going well We want to run on LinkedIn. Okay, not at all the same thing Yeah, well everything that you love about pay me on the Google side control alt delete that but it does not exist on LinkedIn You're starting from nothing. It's gonna take 60 to 90 days to have anything come from it and There's a lot of adjustment expectation that I don't see done very often. So they'll be running a headline on Google that's killing it, and then they'll drop it into LinkedIn and go, we're not getting conversions. You're not going to convert. They're not searching for you. it's Yeah, they're a completely different intent. So when you're running these offers on different channels, what success looks like needs to be very clearly defined. And sometimes it's not going to be on things that are in-platform.
00:31:27
Speaker
you and I have discussed before, when you consistently run the right content on LinkedIn, 60 to 90 days out, you're going to start to see more direct traffic. You're going to start to start to see more brand searches. You don't measure it necessarily. There's there's obviously indicators in platforms, click-through rate, go, that kind of thing. But the way that you measure which one of those is working isn't necessarily always going to be in platform data either.
00:31:46
Speaker
So that's the other thing that I think so many places don't look at, that they just throw it in and they go, oh, no one downloaded our white paper. LinkedIn sucks. It doesn't work. All these offers are terrible. It was a failure. Yeah, it was a fail. But i I would say that's probably the other area that I see not well-defined. So they'll decide to double down on something that it's just based on wobbly metrics. It's not based on anything that's been established internally is what success clearly looks like.
00:32:14
Speaker
Yeah. So interesting. It's funny, i'm I'm running a few things right now in LinkedIn and initially we have some video ads running and initially they were kind of the underperformers and we had some image ads that were running that were doing really well. And then I checked again today and the engagement rate of the video is far and above the other two ye at this point. And so it's like you really do have to give it some time. yeah You can't make split second decisions on things like this because you will lose the opportunity to learn before all of the data was brought to you.
00:32:55
Speaker
especially in those smaller audience sizes because if you can only afford a thousand impressions a day and you know you get 10 clicks, it's going to make your click-through look amazing. It's like over time as you have more and more days and that data pool gets bigger, all that's going to get diluted down and you'll have a much ah much more accurate picture of what's actually going on. Absolutely.
00:33:16
Speaker
Well, I think that brings us to the end of our hypothetical questions for now. I'm, I'm so super curious to see if the numbers on this one keeps up with the first one. Just I know was such a shocker. We're going, nothing is topping that episode. So it doesn't even have good like marketing keywords in it. It just says,
00:33:33
Speaker
I know. See? It just will resonated with the people. That's right. they Give the people what they want. Y'all wanted more hypothetical questions. You got them. That's right. Well, thanks y'all for tuning in and we will see you next time. That's Marketing Baby. Bye-bye. Bye. Thanks for listening to That's Marketing Baby. If you dig what we're putting down, be sure to subscribe and share with your marketing besties because hot marketers don't gatekeep.
00:33:57
Speaker
And if you're like, this is not enough. I need more. We got you. Ranson raves is the official newsletter of that's marketing baby. Every week, Susan and I share one thing we love and loathe in the world of marketing. Get on the list at that's marketing baby.com. Okay. Bye.