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Episode 21: WrestleWar '89
33 Plays5 years ago
It's the start of our new series! It's a time of transition, as in the aftermath of Jim Crockett Promotion's closure the newly-formed WCW attempts to establish its identity. WrestleWar, running from 1989 through 1992, highlights this tumultuous period in WCW history. On this first WrestleWar: Flair. Steamboat. Need I say more? Let's go to the ring!
Music by Michael Gary Brewer at https://www.instantmusicnow.com/
Follow us on Twitter at https://twitter.com/letsgo2thering , or on Facebook at https://www.facebook.com/LetsGo2theRing/
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Transcript
Introduction and Podcast Overview
00:00:00
Speaker
as jr tells us the judges unanimously why is that hurt so hard to say unanimously we can all agree it's a hard word to say yeah i'm just gonna say all okay
00:00:40
Speaker
Hello everyone, and welcome to Let's Go to the Ring, where we take a look at the good old days, and not so good old days, of World Championship Wrestling, series by series. I'm your host, Bob Moore, and I'm joined by the man who won the most bunkhouse stampede matches in the cursed month of January, after every other competitor suffered an accidental injury and had to withdraw, Alec Bridget. It's a proud achievement for me, and you can't prove it because there's no video evidence, so if I say I won more, you can't prove that either.
00:01:11
Speaker
Whatever I say is correct. I can't disprove that, you're right. Exactly. How's it going tonight, Al? Good, how are you? I'm doing okay. The quarantine drags on, but we're all doing okay with it. Good, good. Nights like this help, I think. Absolutely.
00:01:31
Speaker
Tonight we're starting our new series. Starrcade took us all the way from 1983 through 2000, right up close to the end of the company.
WrestleWar Series Introduction
00:01:42
Speaker
For our second series, we've gone for something short and, at least hopefully sweet, WrestleWar.
00:01:50
Speaker
The Wrestle Wars series is a short one, covering only four pay-per-views from 1989 through 1992, but it takes place in a period of significant change for the company. In fact, Wrestle War is sandwiched right between two major events in the history of WCW.
00:02:10
Speaker
In 1988, the year before the start of this series, Jim Crockett Promotions folds, and WCW rises in its place. I'll hail Ted Turner. And in 1993, the year after the end of the series, WCW leaves the NWA for good, leading of course to the infamous WCW International World Heavyweight Championship debacle.
WCW Transition and Event Changes
00:02:34
Speaker
That was a great title though, to be fair. All four people that ever held it were very proud.
00:02:40
Speaker
I'm sure they were. They were internationally renowned. Yes. And the W in WCW definitely doesn't stand for world. No.
00:02:52
Speaker
The Wrestle Wars series actually heralds the decline of that relationship, being held under the NWA name in the first two years, 1989 and 1990, and simply held under the WCW name in the latter two years, 1991 and 1992. There's another interesting even split on this series, too. The first and fourth shows were held in May, and the second and third in February. That's random. Yeah, that's very interesting, isn't it?
00:03:21
Speaker
In 1990, the May slot is taken by Capitol Combat. We will definitely get to that one eventually. Well, see, I understand why they bumped it. You gotta make room for that. Yes. And Super Brawl 1 takes that slot in 1991, only to trade places with Wrestle War in 1992 to give Super Brawl 2 February and Wrestle War May.
00:03:44
Speaker
Yeah. That's weird. Yeah. Yeah. I could see Russell war making sense for that super brawl show. Cause that's the one with the match screen flair and, um, Fujinami, correct? Yes. Which is technically a war between what new Japan and WCW. That is true. That would have been an appropriate title. That's too logical for WCW. I realized that now.
00:04:07
Speaker
So this is clearly a time of transition, with the company trying to figure out its identity and how it wants things to work going forward. It'll be interesting to see if that comes through on the shows themselves. Tonight, we'll take our first look at the series, with WrestleWar 89, Music City Showdown.
00:04:28
Speaker
WrestleWar 89 was held on May 7th, 1989, at the Nashville Municipal Auditorium in Nashville, Tennessee, in front of 5,200 fans, of which 4,000 paid.
WrestleWar 89 Event Details
00:04:42
Speaker
This is actually the fourth show that we've seen in this arena. Starrcades 94, 95, and 96 were held in this same building with 8,200, 8,200, and 9,030 attending respectively. Depending on the arrangement, it looks like the Nashville Municipal Auditorium can hold around 8,000 to 9,500 people, so while the Starrcades do a fair job of filling it up, with this show we're only a bit over half full. It definitely feels like it.
00:05:09
Speaker
On the pay-per-view front, it's a sunnier picture. WrestleWar 89 received 150,000 pay-per-view buys, more than Starrcade 88 and tied with Starrcade 89. Although the debuting Halloween Havoc will be the star of WCW's 1989 with 215,000.
Event Opening and Matches Begin
00:05:28
Speaker
So, a new company? A new show? How will WrestleWar establish itself as a series? Let's go to the ring.
00:05:39
Speaker
We opened with a video set to country music. It just shows pictures of the various participants tonight, including Sting, the Iron Sheik, Ric Flair, Lex Luger, and the Oak Ridge Boys. The last, sadly, were just performing the national anthem and apparently held a mini concert at some point during the evening, though that's not in the network version of the show. Based on WCW's track record, I assume they paid them a million dollars for that.
00:06:06
Speaker
Host Jim Ross and Bob Coddle welcome us to the show and say that this is a night that they've been waiting for. We have nine matches and five of them are championship matches. Coddle says that the odds favor at least some of the championships changing hands tonight. JR throws to ring announcer Gary Capetta who introduces the Oak Ridge Boys to do a pretty nice version of the national anthem. Good bass voice on the one guy and one had an amazing sparkly bolo tie.
00:06:36
Speaker
That purple one he had? Oh, yeah, yeah.
00:06:41
Speaker
I don't know. I look for sparkly things on wrestling shows. It's my thing. Sting has conditioned you for that. Yeah, pretty much. Sting and Flair. Sting and Flair got me looking. Oh yeah. JR says the Oak Ridge Boys will be in concert later in the evening, so apparently it really was a mid-show sometime. Yeah, I don't look confused by that because there's points in the show where I swear they talk about this being in the afternoon. I just think of wrestling shows as being a nighttime thing.
00:07:06
Speaker
It would make sense if they were doing that because of the concert as well. From what I understand, it was like a seven or eight song concert. So while that is a mini concert, it's not tremendously mini. That's still probably talking a half hour to an hour. True. They do actually point out later in the show exactly where the concert would take place. So I'll try and remember to point that out when we get to it. Okay.
00:07:31
Speaker
JR also says that there's been a change of one match's stipulation, the US tag title match is no longer Hair vs Hair, and the NWA board said that Eddie Gilbert and Kevin Sullivan have to settle their personal differences on their own time, not in a title match. Sorry, have they ever watched professional wrestling? Right?
00:07:51
Speaker
JR throws to a video package building up the night's matches, notable really only for the fact that they've oddly chosen to call Michael P.S. Hayes, Mike P.S. Hayes. I've just never seen him call Mike. That was strange. Oh, all his friends call him Mike, so you know. And then it's time for our first match, which as the video package tells us, is The Great Muda vs. The Junkyard Dog. Our referee for this match is Nick Patrick.
00:08:18
Speaker
So there's not direct storyline for these two interacting. The storyline is really just the setup of Great Buddha.
00:08:26
Speaker
So they brought him in, he's been bidding up jobbers on the TV show, he's building up to this. And there's a interesting bit on Pauli dangerous disease talk show, where he's talking to Gary Hart, who's a great windows manager. And he talks about how Buddha reminds him of someone a lot, and he doesn't actually say his name. So Hart sort of goes from that and says, well, of course, of course he reminded the great Kabuki, because he is the son of the great Kabuki.
00:08:51
Speaker
Okay. Going with that eagle, are we? Yeah, he's not the Sunlight Kabuki. Just to be clear. Two people can be from Japan and also spit mist, I guess. Some sort of weird genetic trait, I suppose. Yes, as far as I can tell, there's no storyline between these two. There's just, they're in a match together because it's a show. All right. We cut back to the ring and Doug Gilbert is in the ring.
00:09:20
Speaker
Doug Gilbert is not the junkyard dog. Yeah. Al, any idea what was going on here? Were you able to find out anything about this? I really can't. It's weird. They just say he's not failed to make the show. I couldn't find anything about it. It doesn't seem to affect his standing. It's not like he no shows the event and they fire him or he's punished in some way. I like to think that maybe this is an afternoon show and he was all ready to show up at like six o'clock to be ready for the curtains.
00:09:49
Speaker
gets there and it's half over. He's like three hours away. That would be a good carry forward from last year where they printed the wrong start time on the tickets. Exactly. Oh yeah. Which surprised me if they would accidentally pull that. Yep. So our first match is the Great Muda with Gary Hart versus Doug Gilbert. The referee for this match is Nick Patrick. Doug is already in the ring as we join the match, which is rarely a good sign for your chances.
00:10:17
Speaker
Muda enters with a cool G and a mask, and acrobatically flips into the ring. Heart removes the mask to show Muda's red face paint. We are in the Nick Patrick mustache era, thankfully. We're told that Muda is undefeated thus far, and if you recall Starrcade 89 at all, there may be ever-so-slight spoilers for this match. A little bit. Also, if you recall that Muda is facing Doug Gilbert, there may be ever-so-slight spoilers for this match.
00:10:46
Speaker
If you're from a very civic part of a very civic state, he's a big star to you. Yeah. I'm not from there, though. Yeah, me neither. No. Doug attacks Muda during his ceremonial pose, so Muda knocks him flat with a kick, and I seriously thought that was going to be it right there. Would've been great, actually. That would've.
00:11:05
Speaker
Muda sprays green mist and spin kicks Doug, then beats him up outside and inside the ring. Doug manages a dodge and a really awkward splash, or clothesline, I couldn't actually tell which, before a better second clothesline, but Muda rolls out, gets back in, and rakes his eyes to take back over with his high velocity elbow drop and handspring elbow.
00:11:25
Speaker
Doug manages a shoulder block and face buster, but Muda rakes his eyes again. Moonsault, but Doug dodges, but Muda lands on his feet and dropkicks him out of the ring, then dives out for a body press. Back in, and Muda quickly gets the moonsault for the three count and the win. Eddie Gilbert gets in the ring and faces off with Muda for a moment, then goes and checks on Doug, while Muda celebrates.
Flair vs. Steamboat Promo and Build-Up
00:11:47
Speaker
Thoughts on this one?
00:11:49
Speaker
It's a so-so replacement for me. Granted, I'm not a big JYD fan, and do fair in the course of the series, I've had, what, one match with him, right? Just the one? Yeah, I think we almost got a second one, didn't we? Because he was in the bunkhouse stampede that we didn't get to see.
00:12:04
Speaker
Correct. When they announced, but they went to see, yeah. Yeah. Last time we saw him was someone in an interview position because he's replacing him to hear Koloff in this whole storyline where they've broke up from Russia and he's like defending himself and he's spending his uncle. Except he's just then gone and JYD is also just, I guess his buddies with Ivan Koloff for some reason? I'm not entirely clear on how that's supposed to make sense. They're friendly. Yeah, sure. They both have beards. Yeah, yeah. That's true.
00:12:32
Speaker
That may not the best introduction for him. I'm sure he has good matches places. I'm not going to like discount him as a former because I really don't know enough of his stuff, but. So I'm kind of torn up. I really, how great the match would have been if he had been there, but kind of move point, I suppose. Gilbert's fine. He doesn't really have any, anything special about him at this point. Yeah. He's just a guy and he does some couple of moves that are okay. It's a little weird that he's a good guy and he attacks the bad guy while his back is turned.
00:13:01
Speaker
Yeah, there's a few things strange about this match, and that's definitely one of them. I agree with you in general. I think I'm not sure my assessment of what it would be as far as match quality is concerned, but JYD is a much bigger name, obviously, than Eddie Gilbert, and he has much more personality than Gilbert displayed in the ring. So I think if you did almost the same match with JYD instead of Doug Gilbert, I think it would mean more for Muda. No, for sure, yeah.
00:13:30
Speaker
Because, yeah, the idea is you're going from him beating up no-name guys, you're random people, you throw a mask on five minutes before the show starts and say, you're fighting Grimuda now, to here's his first big match on pay-per-view, you're gonna show how good he can be a real star, and then, eh, not so much.
00:13:46
Speaker
Right. It's really a continuation of that story, not an escalation. Likewise, it's a little weird that they have Gilbert escape the moon salt for like a minute and then just get it anyways. This is a weird choice to have him counter that. I guess maybe the relationship push he did that mood is not
00:14:04
Speaker
Sort of stuck if he misses the moon salt, maybe? I don't know if he's done that spot before that, so he might have wanted to show that he's able to recover. Because it is a neat spot. No, yeah, there's nothing wrong with that. Kind of adjust and land on his feet. That's a cool thing to be able to do. But I suspect that that spot in particular is probably a leftover from when this was a JYD match.
00:14:27
Speaker
Because JYD is the caliber of star, the level, I think, that you would give the, you counter the, the villain's move once spot. Sure. And he could still go down to it then, but he gets to look a little bit better by being able to spot it coming. Right. Where Doug Gilbert, I don't, unless I'm missing something drastic in my wrestling history from this time, he kind of seems like he should just get hit by the first one. Pretty accurate assessment. Doug Gilbert at this point, I would say, yeah.
00:14:57
Speaker
Yeah, no offense to Doug Gilbert, but even as short as this was, it felt like it was longer than it needed to be. Like you said, Muda just kicking the guy in the face and pinning him actually would have been great, and it would have done more for Muda than this did. Muda actually took longer to beat Doug Gilbert than to lose to Rick Flair at Starrcade 89. That is true. That is very true.
00:15:23
Speaker
The repeated eye rakes felt really weird to me. Normally that's a spot that a heal uses when they need to regain the advantage against a strong face, but Muda just kind of did it anytime Doug hit one or two moves, even though he clearly wasn't in any kind of trouble yet. Otherwise the action we got was performed just fine, except for one awkward body press and or clothesline.
00:15:45
Speaker
I don't really have a problem with how things went in the match. It's just that it's simple and there's no real story. Just a collection of Muta's standard spots and some iRakes. It's not a great opener, but they were kind of stuck on this one. It's decent, it's just kind of forgettable. Yeah.
00:16:04
Speaker
So as far as the two of them, there's really nothing going on with this afterwards. Good Words, we've made pretty clear right now, is a villain character for this. Need someone else for the match. So there's not a follow-up story of this at all. Moody's big thing is they definitely have high hopes for him. He ends up in a high-profile match, which I will discuss later.
00:16:24
Speaker
Gilbert's, as far as I can tell, not around in WCW much longer after this. He kind of, he was guys that he tended to jump between smaller territories, even the Wayne days of said territories. So he's not a lot of long-term stories with him.
00:16:48
Speaker
later today rick flair will be going as many people say for the final time for the world heavy weight yeah right five-time right how does this extra pressure affect what i've got the style and profile like never before steve boat let me go on record
00:17:09
Speaker
is telling the whole world you are the greatest wrestler on the face of this earth. But pal, today!
00:17:19
Speaker
Right here, you got to beat Rick Flair one more time. Remember, Steamboat and pal, I'll kiss your boots if you
Butch Reed vs. Ranger Ross Match Dynamics
00:17:29
Speaker
can do it. But to be the man, you got to beat the man. And I'm saying, woo, right here in Nashville, Tennessee, pal, I'm the man. Rick Flair and Steamboat, you're going to be mine. Woo.
00:17:51
Speaker
That's not the name of the show. Lance, get it right. He's new, Bob. He's new. I thought this was a perfectly good flair promo. It's not his wildest, but it hits all the right notes, builds up the importance of the match, and has great energy.
00:18:08
Speaker
As always, I appreciate how hard Flair works to build up his opponent, calling Steamboat the greatest wrestler on the face of the Earth. Flair's one of those guys that just gets how to build up his opponent while building himself up. Because he knows that if you build up a guy and then you beat him, you look stronger for doing that. Right. It's amazing how wrestlers don't get that sometimes. It is surprising.
00:18:32
Speaker
Considering how full of himself his character tends to be, it's always a neat twist how genuine the praise he hands out always sounds too. That's true, yeah. It's that one noble trait, even in his more villainous periods, that he appreciates a rival. I can see that, yeah. He needs someone to challenge him, yeah.
00:18:54
Speaker
I think my only issue with this one is that it doesn't seem to build to angry sort of yelling flair. It just immediately begins at that. Yeah. I guess you can say he's excited. It's a really important match against someone that he's had a rivalry with. So maybe he doesn't need any build. Yeah, I can see that. I just, that's impactful when it goes right to it like that. Yeah. He goes zero to 60 and about a negative 10th of a second, right? So pretty much. Yeah.
00:19:21
Speaker
Our second match is Hacksaw Butch Reed vs. Ranger Ross. The referee for this match is Byron Scott. Second match in a row. There's really not a direct story here between these two people as far as I can be able to tell. Ross is back on Country Dink. He is a legit army guy. His first feud is against the Iron Cheek. They have a match on the Clash champions before the show. Oh, okay.
00:19:46
Speaker
Now, if you want to see that match, it's a little hard because it's one of the three matches that's cut for some reason on the network version of that cost you champions. Oh, interesting. But yeah, there's one thing between these two butch Reed is one of the journeyman wrestlers. He's back again from a smaller territory. He's under the hacksaw butch Reed name, right? Yes. Yeah, he's going by hacksaw at the moment.
00:20:08
Speaker
Because at one point he was the natural blue tree. Such a curious gimmick, too. He shows up with blonde hair and he gets offended if you don't believe it's naturally blonde. I mean, that's the gist of that character. It's interesting I'll give you that, but it's just like, I'm not sure. Is that your whole character? I guess.
00:20:27
Speaker
Reid comes out with a really sparkly gold vest. Nice. I like his music, too. Do you think it was more 1980s detective show or more side-scrolling sci-fi platformer game? Ooh, that's a tricky one. Yeah, I couldn't quite decide. He had probably a little more of the latter. It didn't have that extra CD quality that the Rick Rude original music has. Good point. Yeah, yeah, you need a little bit more of the CD for a detective show.
00:20:55
Speaker
the jazz sax there for that color to it, yeah. Ranger Ross comes out with the flag and an armed forces color guard. JR builds up Ranger Ross's legitimate military history. Like you said, he's an actual army ranger who became a pro wrestler much like Perry Saturn. I just realized that that's Jim Ross building up Ranger Ross. That's true.
00:21:20
Speaker
Kottle also builds up Ross's military experience, but does note Reed's power advantage before adding that Ross's military training will mean that he can deal with hard hits. Some really good analysis by Kottle there to explain the characters, I thought. Yeah, let's do that. Ross does a little hip swiveling dance and wards Reed off with a quick kick. Anytime Ross tries to match Reed's power, Reed easily pushes him away, so Ross uses his speed and agility to take Reed to the mat for some headlocks.
00:21:50
Speaker
JR and Coddle have a good discussion about Ross neutralizing Reed's power, as long as he can keep him down, but also point out Reed's surprising speed on a leapfrog spot.
00:22:01
Speaker
Reed gets free of the headlocks and surprises Ross with a clothesline to counter a corner whip, as Teddy Long appears at ringside, taking notes. JR mentions that Long was fired by the NWA, and Coddle points out that Long has a visitor's pass. I do wonder why the visitor's pass allows you to walk at ringside during a match, though. Right? Yeah. I mean, I guess it is a visitor's pass, not a ticket. No, yeah, that's a distinction, but you want to see him else walking up there. Yeah, yeah.
00:22:28
Speaker
Reed gets two off a swinging neck breaker as I spot a guy wearing a full trench coat and wide-brimmed hat to a wrestling show. That cannot be a comfortable way to watch the show. Oh my gosh. Wait, she went where he's up to. It's just like, what? What is going on with you?
00:22:46
Speaker
Reed uses big strikes, including a somewhat awkward half knee strike, half kick, a body slam, and multiple elbow drops to get another two count, and grabs a rear chin lock for a while, intermittently using the ropes.
00:22:59
Speaker
Ross briefly gets free, but Reed pulls his tights to take him back into the hold until the ref eventually catches Reed using the ropes and forces a break. Ross evades a closed line and gets a cool takeover throw to counter a headlock before hitting several martial artsy strikes and dropkicks to send Reed out. Ross leaps over the top rope and just kind of lands next to Reed and punches him. Missed opportunity there.
00:23:24
Speaker
This is a weird move, yeah. I totally expected him to at least come down with a fist drop or something, but no such luck. Yeah. I can see that or you jump down and that's where you get counted. Like you jump down and he clotheslines you or kicks you or something. Yeah.
00:23:39
Speaker
Back in, but Reed sneaks in a kick as Ross climbs in and Suplexes Ross in, then goes up
Murdoch vs. Orton Jr. Bull Rope Match
00:23:45
Speaker
top. Ross slowly gets up and turns, and Reed, after a noticeable pause that Ross belatedly covers by acting dazed, hits a diving shoulder block for the three count and the win. Thoughts on this one? It's a decent showcase for Bolton, I thought.
00:24:01
Speaker
Ross doesn't have a lot of character. I mean, he tries a little bit there, like the jump was nice, and a little bit to where he started showing off were nice, but he never has that certain extra special thing for me. And obviously this is early in his career, so you could have 10 Madison like a really good one, so I'm not judging the whole character from this performance, obviously. Yeah.
00:24:22
Speaker
But to read kind of the same way, I liked his heel work in this one, I thought. He does a good job. I like that they point out a commentary, even though he is strong, but we still use his shortcuts to basically make it easy to get advantage. Yeah. He actually could with his strength, for instance, pull Ross over out of a hole he's in, but he decided to grab his hair or pull the trunks. You know, didn't have to, just because it's easier and more fun, I guess.
00:24:45
Speaker
Yeah, I think the announcers did a terrific job getting across some elements of the characters on this match. They had some very good discussions about that point and others.
00:24:55
Speaker
I think Ross did a good job with his sort of flashier offense because the mat definitely needs that. You have the strong heal who want to put you in holes and just sort of knock you down and slow things down. So when the big moments come, they have to actually be impactful. So you have a mat tech that's with someone like for a materia, for instance, you get the nice ebb and flow of the mat because it's slowed down and then suddenly speeds up. But you have someone who's saved not nearly that fast. It's slow and boring and then it's faster but also not interesting.
00:25:25
Speaker
It's a nuanced thing you have to do. You can't be control and doing arm locks and head locks and leg locks for too long, or you just get boring. You can tell him the greatest story in the world, but if no one's away, it doesn't matter. Yeah, fair point. With Ross, there's a lot there I think. In theory, it could be built up with him. He definitely got a good start for his character. I'm curious to see watching the shows where it goes.
00:25:50
Speaker
Read overall obviously, scene is stronger, no XML pun intended there as far as booking goes. Because I definitely book him to control the match, which makes me feel like maybe that's because he's calling the match. That's why it's easier to do that. Put him in a hold and you discuss what he can do the next match and then go forward from there.
00:26:07
Speaker
Because Ross is pretty neat in all this. Yeah. You can joke about that. There's a bit of a delay there when Ross should have known the cold light is coming, but he's still a cane. Can't get out of the way. Very slight mistiming. It's just enough to be noticeable. It's not like a major pause. Oh, no. But it's enough that we're like, oh, he was supposed to jump or he wasn't supposed to be up yet. One of those things happened. Exactly. Yeah. I do like the finish, though. Mostly I'm a big cane fan, so I'm a sucker for a big guy doing a flying clothesline, I guess.
00:26:37
Speaker
I think my only, not necessarily complaint, it's just more befettlement is they give so much fanfare to Ranger Ross here. And it's like you're building up the America, there's a military background, and then he just loses. In a fairly clean fashion. It did feel a little bit strange there, yeah, that he gets such an intro and loses not by particularly cheaty fashion or anything either.
00:27:00
Speaker
No, yeah, he's not holding the rope for a penny or anything. It's just, he gets advantages throughout the match by cheating, but it's never... Well, there's a match we'll see later that's literally defined by how much the heal cheats, and that's it. So it's not one of those spin matches. Yeah, it's just weird that he loses in fairly convincing fashion after all that buildup. Yeah. Yeah, for me, this was a basic but perfectly acceptable little match.
00:27:23
Speaker
I rather liked Ranger Ross's overall style. I thought he had some good quick moves and interesting counters and some unusual strikes that we didn't normally see in a wrestling show. And he manages some good personality in the midst of it. I agree with you that he doesn't have it fully developed, but you can definitely see the things he's trying out for his character. I could have done with a bit longer from this one to get more of a feel for Ross's style.
00:27:49
Speaker
I did feel like there were kind of a lot of holds for quite a short match, though they mostly kept in quick, and given Ross is new, that kind of makes sense that that would be when Reed is calling the next spot and letting him know what to do.
00:28:02
Speaker
This lasts about seven minutes, though, and it feels like it has spots that you'd expect to see in one going around 10 to 12, if that makes any sense. No, I can see that, yeah. It feels like there's the outline of a pretty good match here, but without much filled in. But what we get is performed well, aside from the slightly mistimed ending. And both guys came out of this looking pretty good, and built up in the ways that they needed to be built up. That said, this feels like a TV match, not a pay-per-view match. It's quick and largely forgettable, but fine.
00:28:31
Speaker
Again, good work by the announcers on it. Yeah, where two for two I imagine that you're saying that they don't feel like they built up to be this thing I should be paying money to see necessarily. Right. And the first one, you can excuse them a little bit because that was supposed to be a different match. Sure. But this one was clearly the plan. So they really probably should have done something a little bigger with it in order to make it kind of pay-per-view worthy. But I don't begrudge the new guy getting a tryout on a pay-per-view either. So
00:29:00
Speaker
No, yeah, I don't necessarily mind that. I think it's a little strong overall from the last match, because it feels more like a match, because it gets the length forward, but it's nothing special still. So here's a question for you. Okay. We've had a few military-themed guys in this run so far. We had Sergeant Buddy Lee Parker from that great match with Cactus Jack. And of course, we had the Misfits in action. Yes. Coding just at the mention, General Hugh G. Rection.
00:29:31
Speaker
Where does Ranger Ross fit in that ranking for you so far? Hmm. Golly, those are the only military ones we've seen so far? That's the only thing I can think of. Yeah, it seems right.
00:29:46
Speaker
I think, Gal, I don't want to insult Parker because he did a good job in that match, actually. He did a very good job in that match. It's just you didn't really get to see anything of him other than crawling to the ring and getting pinned. No, yeah. So I guess I probably put the current Ranger Ross right in the middle because I think Rekshin, horrible name aside, is a perfectly good performer and has more of his performance style developed.
00:30:15
Speaker
Ross, I think, could be better than him given time to develop. Okay, fair enough. Now, if we're able to count Perry Saturn, because they do mention his military background on the show, then Perry Saturn's not at the top of the list easy. Oh, for sure, yeah.
00:30:31
Speaker
They never have him really in the military getup. That's why I was including him. I can't count him as a military gimmick, really. They mentioned he had a military background, but that's it. That's like you can't call Sting a basketball gimmick just because he did play basketball in high school. True.
00:30:48
Speaker
This is interesting. So there's not a lot of direct story between these two. Is there sort of two ships passing in the sea, as they say? But there's some connections there that come across. So Ranger Ross would be pretty solid mid-card act for a while just serving through the booking here. His tag partner for a while would be Ron Simmons. Oh, interesting. And they would both end up in the tubing battle royal that would open the next pay-per-use great American bash.
00:31:13
Speaker
Obviously, as we know, historically, Butch Reed would be put under a mask and very badly disguised as one half of Doom with Rhonda Simmons. Right. Oh, that's kind of neat. J.R. throws to Lance Russell, who is with Lex Luger.
00:31:31
Speaker
Michael Hayes, Lex, has been known as unpredictable. He has said he is going to do this challenge for your title all by himself. Are you prepared, though, for all of the things that Hayes has done in the past?
00:31:44
Speaker
Lance, this is what you call a showcase event. This is in front of millions of viewers. This is what makes you as a competitive athlete tick. Now Michael Hayes has been running his mouth for a long time now. Now, Michael Hayes, it is put up or shut up time. You said you could do it on your own. You haven't shown me that. That's not your track record.
00:32:03
Speaker
Well, this is your opportunity in front of millions of viewers to show everybody that you got what it takes to win this U.S. Heavyweight Championship. And Michael Hayes, this means more than anything in this world. It means a lot to a lot of fans who I represent, who I feel I represent. And Michael Hayes, I don't think you got what it takes to take what I got. So Michael Hayes, bring on everything you got because I got your adrenaline flowing, my blood pumping. I'm going to walk out of that ring as a U.S. Heavyweight Champion.
00:32:31
Speaker
Let's go right down to the ring. Still not the right name of the show. Nothing really noteworthy here and it's pretty short, but Luger cuts a good promo here and does a fine job getting across the general storyline, casting doubt on Hayes' sincerity, and doing things on his own.
00:32:50
Speaker
Luker comes off as a fighting champion, facing an untrust for the opponent, but determined to just power through. So this did what it needed to do. And I did really like the line, I don't think you've got what it takes to take what I've got. Yeah, he does seem a little confused as to whether or not he represents people in America. Yes, I noticed that too. That's his biggest problem. He's like, that I represent, and then he's like, oh, maybe that's going too far. Yeah, Luker's never been a bad promo. He's just sometimes an awkward promo. Yeah.
00:33:21
Speaker
Is there a natural out there? Yeah, he will do a decent performance on it most of the time, but it sounds like a performance. Yeah. Where other people will make it sound more legitimate. He sounds more scripted. That's fair. Yeah. But he does a perfectly good job of bringing out the right emotions and gets the right sound for it overall and the right feeling for it overall. But he doesn't quite get it to that level of naturalness that other performers will get it to.
00:33:49
Speaker
Absolutely. Luger cutting a promo sounds pretty much like what I would probably sound like cutting a promo. Yeah. You didn't have to agree that fast. I mean, no, you're great. Sorry. I do like Lex's current state of hair at this point. He is very feathered. Yes. Yes, it is.
00:34:12
Speaker
Our third match is Captain Redneck, Dick Murdock versus Bob Orton Jr. with Gary Hart in a bull rope match. Referee for this one is Dick Patrick. A note first.
00:34:31
Speaker
Multiple wrestlers from this general time period have accused Dick Murdoch of being a member of the KKK, including The Rock's dad, Rocky Johnson, who in fact spoke about being legitimately attacked by Murdoch in the ring and having to knock him out to defend himself. So, as we sometimes have to state, unfortunately, just a reminder that our comments and thoughts regarding this match are about the character Dick Murdoch, not the man Dick Murdoch.
00:34:59
Speaker
and about the match portrayed on the show, not Murdoch's life in general. Membership in a racist organization like the KKK is reprehensible. Racism in general is reprehensible. And our current times show the price our society as a whole and African Americans in particular have paid and continue to pay because of racism. Black lives matter. There you go. Back to the show.
00:35:27
Speaker
Bob Orton Jr. at this point. Alright, I'm supposed to call him Bob Orton because they make a line about him not being Jr. anymore later.
00:35:34
Speaker
But Bob Warren Jr., he's kind of the guy to talk about, they go back and forth in companies. Him, he'd tend to be, he'd go to the WF for a while, then he'd go somewhere else and come back there again. He was definitely a two and fro with them for quite a bit. I found it amusing I was reading research on him. Before he came back to WCW at this point, he went to New Japan, where he teamed up as a masked pirate, typically a hockey masked pirate, okay? For a tag team called the Gaspar Brothers.
00:36:03
Speaker
called the what gaspar gaspar okay like gasparilla yeah i guess so weird yeah i really want to find footage of this because it's gotta be hilarious just inherently but just reading that was just i can't let that tip tick about that pig mentioned it so he was like captain jason voorhees
00:36:24
Speaker
I guess? Yeah. I need to find more on this. I just, I read that I had to write that down before I forget about it. That's strange. Oh, and that's rather appropriate. I don't think we mentioned, but Doug Gilbert actually plays like a ripoff of Freddy Krueger in the ring in New Japan or something.
00:36:39
Speaker
In New Japan and other territories as well. Spooky Mountain Wrestling, he was Nightmare Freddy. Yes, yeah. Actually funny, I read up on that. 1996, W.F. was doing cross motion with the U.S.W.A. They had their mini invasion storyline going with them, among other terrible things. They had a match on U.S.W.A. television, like a battle royale, to determine who would get to be in the 1996 Royal Rumble match that year, as part of that cross motion. It was actually won by Doug Gilbert in his Nightmare Freddy character.
00:37:09
Speaker
He would show up on the 1996 Royal Rumble as Doug Gilbert. Because Vince did not want to be sued. Right, yeah. Vince being much smarter about copyright than other wrestling companies. Yes. I would bet that if he showed up for World War III instead on WCW it would totally be the nightmare for any character still. Oh yeah, I would think so.
00:37:30
Speaker
Orton came back from that interesting stint to go right into that kind of feud with Dick Murdock, who I can't find full confirmation of this, but it feels like they're trying to use him as a replacement Dusty Rhodes. Am I the one that sees that? Kind of, just from the general look they're having him go for. Mm-hmm. It's the timing is what makes you think that. Mm-hmm. Because right off that's Darkade, where Dusty is told not to bleed, and he does anyway, and they fire him, and then suddenly Dick Murdock's here,
00:37:59
Speaker
Dressing like Dusty, acting like Dusty, doing board matches, seeing people with this boot. Yeah. That's not to say Dusty invented all those things, but the timing is way too coincidental for me. Yeah, I can see that definitely. The fans were like, we want Dusty roads. And they're like, well, here's Dusty roads without the H. Is he the RC Cola version of Dusty roads? Yeah, yeah, I think that makes sense.
00:38:27
Speaker
Basically, the story behind these two fighting is they both don't like each other, so they would constantly refer each other to matches. They have a match at the previous clash where I believe Orton wins and serves great typical old-school heel fashion. So, Murdock is coming for revenge, and of course it's his signature match. Which, depending on which one he was in the commentary, is one Bob Warren Jr. is familiar with or never heard of before.
00:38:56
Speaker
Both wrestlers are already in the ring as we come back from the interview. A quick doffing of Orton's cowboy entrance gear, and the two are each hooked to the bull rope with cowbell. And just as I start getting unfortunate flashbacks to Stargate 85, we're off.
00:39:11
Speaker
Murdoch uses the rope to pull Orton around and beat him up, including some rope-wrapped punches, but Orton dodges attempts to hit him with the cowbell. Orton rolls out and tries to pull Murdoch into the ring post, but Murdoch rolls out and punches him. Orton tries to flee, but Murdoch pulls him back with the rope and pulls him into the ring post, then inside. More rope-related striking, but Orton kicks Murdoch and elbows him, and beats him up with the rope. After a punch to the face, JR notes that probably isn't going to hurt Murdoch's looks anyway. Ouch, JR!
00:39:42
Speaker
A few more punches earn Orton a 2 count, but Murdock hits a couple low punches to give him time to retrieve the deadliest of all weapons, his boot. He smacks Orton with it a few times, then puts it on his hand and punches Orton with it in a weird spot.
00:39:58
Speaker
A rope assisted boot shot gets two and three quarters, but Patrick takes the boot away. Horton lands some punches in the big elbow and goes up top, but Murdock uses the rope to pull him down, ties him up, and hits a couple of elbow drops for the three count and the win.
00:40:14
Speaker
Gary Hart stomps on Murdock, and Orton uses the bull rope to stop Murdock from fighting back, but Patrick undoes the rope and Murdock beats up Hart. Orton ambushes Murdock from behind, and Hart holds Patrick back while Orton straps the rope around Murdock's throat and uses it to hang Murdock over the top rope. Ref Byron Scott tries to help, but Orton kicks him, but eventually Scott and Patrick get Hart to get Orton to let Murdock go. Thoughts on this one?
00:40:42
Speaker
It's okay. It's one of the matches where nothing actually bad happens. There's not really any botches. There's not like awkward timing. Cause at this point, these guys have fired up so many times they could probably do it in their sleep. You notice they might have, it's probably a story about that somewhere. My summary, initial summary was decent, but dated action. Cause they do everything fine. It's a lot of punching, a lot of rope stuff, as you mentioned. There's not much actual technical wrestling there or nuance or really psychology here.
00:41:12
Speaker
It feels dated. It feels like if we were watching Wrestle Wars 79, this would make sense. Yeah. Watching Wrestle War 83, if that show existed, that would, again, still make sense. It just feels like this kind of thing is on the outs, at least the way it's presented. I would see four matches in various of this are being done into the 2000s and on. So it's not like it's something that fully went away. Like thankfully the scaffold match for the most part.
00:41:39
Speaker
This doesn't feel like it belongs on a show from 1989. Whether it's a combination of Bob Warren Jr., who prefer we last saw on the show in 1983. Yeah. So again, it feels like something coming back from a long time abroad.
00:41:53
Speaker
The thing I think that makes this match at least kind of interesting is Orton's part. Orton plays a good cowardly heal and a sneaky heal. He's going above and beyond, I think, as much as he can, given who he's working with and the time he's working with and the situations he's working with. He does everything he can, I think, to really make it interesting.
00:42:13
Speaker
He does the run away spot so he can get pulled. He does, you know, ends up being pulled into the corner and all this stuff. And he, so it'll be hog tie and all these things. He definitely wants to make this work and wants to make it get a reaction. Yeah. Otherwise it doesn't really feel that interesting. Right. He's definitely the best part for me. I'll give him a little point for at least making the rope really crucial to the finish the whole tying his legs up. Although in the elbow drop is kind of weird. He has two of them, right?
00:42:40
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, yeah, two elbow drops for the three count. I could see like one, like you have a big elbow drop, but just a weird elbow drop then though. Hmm, although he's not down enough yet. And then do it again. Okay, now he's down. Two's a weird number. If it had done a third one, I would have been okay with it. It goes back around, but two is just weird.
00:42:57
Speaker
Yeah, I think I'm of a similar view to you. I didn't really like this one, thought it wasn't very good, but Orton has enough character to make some of this work just through his reactions. There's just not very much to this beyond basic
Hayes vs. Luger Match Build-Up
00:43:12
Speaker
strikes. The only part where it tries to get creative is by using the boot in a fashion that still makes no real sense to me. The match didn't feel very heated, more cartoonish if anything, which made the post-match brutality a real shock.
00:43:26
Speaker
It's a similar post-match to Piper versus Valentine, but in that match it felt like it fit in with the violence and aggression we'd just seen, where in this one it felt really unearned. It's like they had a match here and a much more violent match planned later, but just decided to skip all that and graft the ending of the violent match onto the basic match they had here, and it doesn't fit.
00:43:49
Speaker
I think this one, maybe through Orton's general heroics and his reactions and selling and everything, I think ends up a little bit better than the Starrcade 85 bull rope match. Not the manager one, which I actually liked, but you didn't, but the lead up to that. What was it? Rombass versus Black Bart, I think?
00:44:08
Speaker
I got there by myself. It's been a while. Yeah, it's been a while. Anyway, that that match was plain dull like the entire time. But then for me, at least turn things around a bit with JJ Dillon getting in there. This one was at least had enough of Orton in it to do, like you said, the runaway spot and some other funny things and stuff to add some entertainment value that way. Yeah. But just still was not a good match. No.
00:44:37
Speaker
Like I said, it just feels out of place to me. Yeah, it's a relic of an earlier time, I think. And just again, you know, three for three on this so far, but this is not a pay-per-view match.
00:44:50
Speaker
I feel a little less strongly about this one I'd say in that category because it is a stipulation match and it is to establish, at least in certain areas, stars. So it feels like a pay-per-view match, I think, in that regard, which I didn't find interesting. But it doesn't feel like something that'd be on TV. It's slightly above that. I'm not gonna say it's good, but it feels like it belongs on pay-per-view, just not in something like this one. Conceptually, it might be a pay-per-view match, but they don't bring something really extra. No, I'll agree with that.
00:45:20
Speaker
So I can't go too much into this just yet, because there's a later match, but Orton wouldn't make a lot of appearances at the company. He'd be gone by the end of the year, for sure. I looked, he's not ending the hip review, so he's never in a high profile position. It is notable that they hold a tag team title tournament a bit after the show. He's in it, actually, but it's him and Butch Reed. Just feels a little weird. Butch Reed was kind of directionless, I think, until he found a mask, and Ron Simmons had teamed up with.
00:45:46
Speaker
Same thing with Dick Murdock, he would hang around for a bit, but wouldn't do a whole lot. He would return 1991, however, team up with a fellow Dick. Dick Slater. JR throws to Bob Cottle, but it's actually Lance Russell again, backstage with Michael P.S. Hayes. JR, one of those men is a backstage interviewer, the other is sitting right next to you.
00:46:12
Speaker
He had an issue with space and time, Chloe. Yeah, yeah. Hayes has a very sparkly robe and a feather boa.
00:46:19
Speaker
Michael P.S. Hayes has said he can do it on his own. The founder of the free birds has said by himself. Now, does that mean without brass knucks and everything else, Michael? Let me tell you exactly what it means. Lex Luger comes out here two times United States heavyweight champion and has the audacity to say that Michael P.S. Hayes ain't got what it takes to take what he's got.
00:46:47
Speaker
Let me tell you something, pal. It's too late now. In just a matter of moments, Jack, you're going to find out what I've got and just exactly what I'm going to take from you because I'm going to squelch all the skepticism and all the media like you that say that I don't have the credentials to do it on my own. I did everything in tag team wrestling, but not in singles. Today you'll see no Terry Gordy, nobody robbers.
00:47:16
Speaker
Just Michael PSAs and remember this Lex Luger, if it wasn't for people like you, there wouldn't be people like me. And now back to the ring. Still not getting it right. Yes, over three so far.
00:47:32
Speaker
The delivery felt a little weird, alternating in tone and ferocity, but I kind of liked this promo overall. Hayes comes off as angry and slighted and determined to prove himself to his naysayers, but also had a touch of disingenuousness, where you couldn't quite tell if it was all for real or just a cover. I think that worked well to give the story a bit of intrigue.
00:47:54
Speaker
Will Hayes really face Luger one-on-one, or does he have something up his sparkly sleeves? I kind of liked his ending line, too, though I can't really explain what it means. Yeah, I was gonna say, what does that mean exactly? I don't know, but it's like, it sounds profound. It does, yeah. But yeah, I kind of liked it. I thought it fit well with the aggrieved feel of the rest of the promo. Kind of a, everything I do to you is your fault. Sure, sure.
00:48:20
Speaker
And I also liked that Hayes clearly was listening to Lex Luger's promo because he quotes back that same line. Yeah. Though to be fair, you could have heard Lex prepping for that promo for the last two weeks before the show in his locker room. Have you noticed nobody ever really answers Lance Russell's questions though? That's true. He opens every one of these promos with a question. Nobody actually gives him an answer to what he asks.
00:48:48
Speaker
It's funny because you have to make a point of him actually listening and then he's clearly not listening to someone else. Yeah, yeah. Our fourth match is the Samoan SWAT team, Fatu and Samu, with Paul E. Dangerously, versus the Dynamic Dudes, Johnny Ace and Shane Douglas, with skateboards they will never ever ride despite carrying them out for every entrance ever. Yes. The referee for this match is Tommy Young.
00:49:16
Speaker
So if you recall the Starrcade episode that precedes this one, in far of actual chronology, not our chronology, that is, you'll note that Poly dangerously brought back the original Midnight Express to get back at Jim Cornette and kick them out and show he's better and all that. As I mentioned before, that doesn't really work out, because one of them leaves before the big blow-off match. Oh, right. It's just Jack Victoria wearing a mask as another previous Midnight Express member that I've never mentioned before.
00:49:45
Speaker
So that one didn't work. So his new plan is to bring in the Samoan SWAT team. They actually do take them out at the clash building up to this. So they have some credentials, as he sort of mentions. Yes. As far as dynamic dudes, they have wrestled some matches on TV, but this is like their official like big coming out debut show.
00:50:05
Speaker
So a lot of that in the show. Yeah. For better or for worse. They do have a question about the Samoan SWAT team. Okay. So, obviously, many people know this SWAT stands for Special Opens and Tactics. Yes. So what Special Opens and Tactics do the Samoan SWAT team have? Headbutts. I'm sorry, I think you're saying what the S in SWAT stands for. Because they all have that.
00:50:30
Speaker
I think people just like to say SWAT team. We don't actually think about what SWAT actually means. Yeah. Yeah. It's also funny too, as a side note, that you often see the SMO and SWAT team's name shortened to the SST. Yes. Which is actually confusing because you're, you're, you're sorting an acronym into an acronym. That's true. It's like, it actually would be the S-S-W-A-T-T. Yes. SWAT. Yes.
00:51:00
Speaker
to us is a two T. It kind of works, actually. It actually kind of does, yeah. It's just funny seeing the S.A. team like, wait, the middle force and acronym, that makes no sense. Yeah, that's true. It's like my least favorite thing in the world, recursive acronyms, where the first letter of the acronym is the acronym. Oh, yeah. I just hate that.
00:51:21
Speaker
Dangerously, introduces the Samoan SWAT team as the team that destroyed the Midnight Express. It's funny to hear Paul Heyman basically doing the Brock Lesnar kind of intro even here. Yeah, it's true.
00:51:32
Speaker
The Dynamic Dude's entrance is just so awkward with them just kind of clutching the skateboards by their rear axles and holding them up in a way no skateboarder has ever held a skateboard ever. The dudes wheeled their skateboards to face off against the SWAT team, but thankfully things calmed down before it can come to blows. I guess the Dynamic Dudes had the special weapons this time. That's true.
00:51:54
Speaker
I kind of wish, given that they weren't going to ride them anyways, they would've brought like gimmicks, skateboards. Yeah, so you can at least break them. I'm sure the skateboard is second only to the boot in Deadliness as a Weapon. Oh no, I meant the idea that the small ones would take them and break them to show how tough they were. Yeah. I would do nothing to them. The fact that Johnny Ace is Road Warrior Animal's brother just blows my mind. Yeah. I cannot see it at all.
00:52:21
Speaker
Well, people often forget, too, there is a third brother as well. Oh, yeah? Yeah, he never made it as big as the other two. But from what I've seen him, you can tell he definitely is the Roborary Animal's brother. They're both big, huge guys. He would often wrestle in various territories as the Terminator. Oh, okay. Took you an idea of what he looked like. There's a third one, so you verify that they should look like this, and then he was drawn a yace. Who looks and sounds like Super Dave.
00:52:50
Speaker
Coddle has a very poorly thought-out line about the Samoan SWAT team that I will not repeat here. Unfortunately, the insulting commentary about this team, albeit in different configuration, was not confined to Stargate 89. That's true. Coddle's attempt to sell us on the dudes being cool young folks who like all the cool young folk things all you cool young folks do is wonderfully laughable, though. Yes. Insert Steve Buscemi meme. Yes.
00:53:19
Speaker
Ace starts against Fatu as the crowd hurls abuse at Dangerously. Fatu no sells an early facebuster, but Ace bravely stomps on his barefoot and body slams him. Our hero. Then slams Samu too when he runs in. I will admit that he made the slams look pretty easy considering the SWAT team's size though. Nah, that's true, yeah.
00:53:38
Speaker
Samu tries a strike at Douglas, but Douglas fights him off. Tag to Douglas, and he evades Fatu and dropkicks him from behind, despite Dangerously's best attempts to warn Fatu, who tags Samu. Samu starts off strong with hard blows, but Douglas gets a victory roll, oddly not holding on for a pin attempt, and he and Ace tag in and out, working Samu's arm, until Samu tags Fatu and catapults Ace right into a Fatu sidekick in a nice spot.
00:54:07
Speaker
JR's commentary also gets rather questionable for a bit as the SWAT team double stomps Ace. Fatu and Samu tag in and out using hard strikes, neck holds, and choking, and hurling Ace to the mat anytime he tries to get some offense in. JR tells us the Oak Ridge Boys concert comes after this match. There you go.
00:54:26
Speaker
Fatu and Semu cut Ace off from his corner so he can't tag and get two counts off a side slam, power slam, and a witch bone of all things. Yeah, that was weird. When Semu gets Ace in a Boston crab, Dangerously grabs a mic to tell Johnny he's as useless as a woman from Nashville. Okay? It's very specific but also a very vague insult. Yeah, it's just like, I need something to make the crab boo me.
00:54:53
Speaker
Johnny finally manages a flip and tags Douglas, who runs wild on Fatu and Samu with dropkicks until Samu gets tired of that and clotheslines the heck out of him. Fatu splashes Douglas off the top rope for 2 and 9 tenths, but Ace saves. Fatu tries to slam Douglas, but Ace dropkicks Douglas into Fatu for the 3 count and the win. The crowd goes actually wild for that one, as Cottle has another unfortunate line about the SWAT team. Thoughts on this one?
00:55:22
Speaker
It's okay. It's one of those ones where I think there's good energy to it that sort of compensate for a lot of things, like the commentary among other things. They get by on it being fast and action happening even if it's not the most exciting. There's always something happening basically. Yeah. The dudes are obviously not very believable characters.
00:55:44
Speaker
It's pretty funny. There's a vignette building them up. I came over to before this or after that. I saw it for the research where they show them like at like a surf shop looking at like neon shorts and bright shirts and surfboards and everything. Well, they put like surf guitar in the background and it's so forced. It'd be great if they were there trying to buy skateboards. Well, it's a board and it's yeah, surface.
00:56:12
Speaker
I think my biggest disappointment is that we don't see Johnny Ace do the Ace Crusher. So I really wanted a comparison between that and the Diamond Cutter. True. Yeah. He is the inventor of that move. Yep. People often forget that. He's got one thing for him. I think that compensates for the most part of being part of the dynamic dudes. Yeah, no, yeah, yeah. Giving us a move that led to the Diamond Cutter, I think, is a pretty good contribution. Yeah. But I really wanted him to do it so I could see how it matched up, but it just didn't get anything.
00:56:41
Speaker
Instead they get the most vicious of all moves, the super roll up and counter pin. Yeah. The booking is kind of weird here too, because the Samoans take out a big team like the Minute Express. I guess it's them going to come up because they're too confident that they can be the dude. That's a story, but it feels too early, I think, in that story to have them lose.
00:57:02
Speaker
Yeah, you need to build those threats. I can see the idea of like, OK, we just gave them the rub by having them beat the Midnight Express. Now we can use that to build up the Dynamic Dudes, but they maybe rush it a little bit. Yeah, that's my take on it. You could have taken a few more months to build the Simone SWAT team up further and then use them to build up somebody new. Exactly, yeah.
00:57:24
Speaker
This is one of the ones that's interesting because we talked about matches before that feel like they're in the wrong time period. This is the one where it feels like they're trying to get ahead of things. This is them predicting what they think the nines are going to be like. They just get it so wrong. Yeah. So it's them trying to be pressy and then sort of getting ahead of it and go, you have to be hip for the kids. And it's just, it's somehow worth when you try that. Yeah, true. But it's got, um, they're probably dangerously yelling at people. So that's always good. It's 15 to 20 pound cell phone.
00:57:56
Speaker
Yeah, commentary aside, this was alright. Sure.
00:57:59
Speaker
The Samoan SWAT team have some good, hard-hitting moves, and the dudes did a fair enough job getting the crowd into it with a fast-paced opening. The match keeps moving pretty well, like you said, and while it never really goes beyond being a basic tag formula match, it's at least a perfectly acceptable example of one. I liked how they handled the hot tag and the ending in general. Shane's flurry of offense only succeeds in making Samu angry enough to just knock his head into the fourth row. That was a great clothesline.
00:58:29
Speaker
But the dropkick spot is nicely timed and was pretty surprising here. It's not the first time we've seen something like that, but they just slipped it in very well and it all flowed pretty smoothly. It would have been slightly better if Douglas did an actual pin instead of just laying there though. Yeah. It's just sort of an average tag match here, but there's nothing really wrong with it outside of the commentary bits that we've mentioned. So I enjoyed this one.
00:58:56
Speaker
It's one of the things where you, the dynamic news are so infamous for how this particular the gimmick is. So you're expected to be like truly terrible anytime they appear. And it's like, oh, they're okay. Yeah. They're, they are perfectly good wrestlers. Yeah. They just have a stupid gimmick.
00:59:14
Speaker
the advantage of neither of them being really known for their character work in this period anyway. I know Shane Douglas gets known for it later on. The advantage of that is that neither of them really tries to be the dynamic dude's characters during the match, really. They just fight. So you kind of like see the ridiculous characters when they come out and then they leave that at the ring apron, go on and just have a perfectly acceptable match.
00:59:42
Speaker
Yeah, they don't like stop to do, you know, the surface signal or like, right. So if after anything, they just dress really dumb, not wrestle. This is ironically a match that is drastically improved by the lack of them trying to play their characters.
00:59:59
Speaker
The Samoans would end up as part of the big war games match that we would have. Although, oddly, not the main event of the next pay-per-view. Grimace has a war games match that will enclose the show. It's a little weird. Speaking of, on that same show, the dynamic dude would face a very tall and sort of scary challenge in the form of the skyscrapers. So that would be a pretty match, I'm sure. Not looking forward to that one. After the last skyscrapers match we saw,
01:00:28
Speaker
All they did was mess everything up, Bob, come on. It's like six or seven botches in a minute. Yeah, literally every spot, yeah. JR throws back to Lance Russell, who is with the suit-clad Luthez, suit-clad Pat O'Connor, and tuxedo-clad Terry Funk. Fancy Terry Funk.
01:00:49
Speaker
I think it was about 10 seconds after Pat O'Connor was introduced that I suddenly realized that the Pat O'Connor Memorial Tag Team Tournament is at Starrcade 1990. It's only about a year and a half from this show. Yeah. I will say it's at least nice to have a face to go with that. It is, and he doesn't look bad at this point. No. Their treatment of him was very nice on this show. I have to say, like the former champions, I think they were very respectful, which is nice to see.
01:01:19
Speaker
Louis, O'Connor, and Funk will be the judges for the world title match between Flair and Steamboat. Now, I assume they'll have two more judges on standby just in case so they can ignore. I was going to say, they've kept it to three because, you know, that's the only number of votes they can read anyway. Apparently so.
01:01:37
Speaker
It is my pleasure, can I tell you, to be here with three great former champions, Luthez, Pat O'Connor, and Terry Funk. I want to ask you some quick questions, gentlemen. Lou, how, as one of the judges on the Flair Steamboat match, how are you going to judge? Are you going to look for offensive effort or defense going to have anything to do with it or what?
01:01:54
Speaker
Very important, yes. If a man is offensive and he really goes ahead and leaves the parade, of course, he would have to get some points. But we'll watch it very carefully. It'll be takedowns and basic Russian knowledge and so forth. And we'll see what happens. In a track record that these fellows have had in long matches, we may have to make a decision at the end. And so that's where we are. And it's going to be a little tough to do. But these two great athletes, with the most important match probably of the century, it's going to be a pleasure to do it.
01:02:19
Speaker
good point lou and uh... pat i want to ask you this is kind of a precedent setting thing in modern professional wrestling how do you see the role as judges at ringside and uh... professional wrestling well it's a very important role because we got a uh... judge it and we we see it we have to call the shots as uh... the wrestlers make them who's aggressive who's on defense who's a finely conditioned athlete who's uh... moving better and uh... who's able to get the near falls and uh... escapes
01:02:48
Speaker
okay terry i want to ask you something from a wrestler standpoint how is it going to affect strategy when the wrestlers know flair and steamboat know that you three gentlemen are going to be out there to decide it in the event that it should go to the time well i think it's gonna make a definite difference right there because it's gonna make an offensive match out of it because it's gonna push each individual knowing that we're watching them to make them make their moves quicker and uh... much
01:03:15
Speaker
crisper faster they're conscious of us so therefore the pace will be quicker and whenever the pace is quicker you sometimes make a mistake. So I don't think that Pat, Lou and myself will be making a judgment decision on this particular match. Well as Lou pointed out they have a history of going long matches so we very definitely could see it and of course that's the reason why you gentlemen are here. Thank you
01:03:39
Speaker
Thank you very much, and I don't envy your job. We appreciate it. Luthez, Pat O'Connor, and Terry Funk here, former champion. Okay, let's go back right now to the ring. I'm going to have to change the name of the show at this point. Three guys actually answered Lance's questions. That's why you bring them World Champs. They know what to do. Yeah.
01:04:03
Speaker
I really liked this segment. I think all three did a good job talking about the judging and their thought process, and building up the theme of good offense being what they're looking for. I liked Thez's intro a lot as he built up the competitors well, O'Connor did a nice job bringing in some more specifics, and Funk wrapped it all up nicely with a great discussion of the effects the judges have on the match strategy. Honestly, I thought this might have been promo segment of the night for me.
01:04:31
Speaker
Don't get me wrong, I love the big bombastic promos, but this just felt like the sort of conversation you would have with judges if the competition was real. And I love when WCW manages to feel more like an actual sport. No, I can agree with that. I don't know if somebody does affect the story in the match, but it feels like it affects the story of the match we're going to get the player team a match. It doesn't feel like them just saying, you know, like normal wrestling promos were just, I'm going to win, blah, blah, blah. And they say all this stuff.
01:04:58
Speaker
It feels like there's more to it than this. It helps, obviously, you have three people with a lot of experience there. Yeah. It was nice. It's definitely a large improvement over the judges' interview at Starrcade 84. Oh, yes. Yeah.
01:05:13
Speaker
I think Funk in particular does a very nice job of saying because the wrestlers know that we are going to be judging the match, it will change their strategy and that in and of itself may make them make a mistake. I thought that was a really just great storyline element to introduce there. It made the judges matter more.
01:05:36
Speaker
to the storyline where in 84, it just feels like, oh, the judges are there, but you don't get a great sense of what that matters outside of obviously one of them ending up just calling the match. But in this one, it feels like they've put in some extra effort to make the fact that there are judges give the match a different atmosphere.
01:06:01
Speaker
It's interesting that they picked the three people they did, too. I was getting actual numbers in this. So, Pat O'Connor's last title reign with the NWA World Championship ended in 1961. And Lou Thez is actually in 1966. But then you have Terry Funk, who's oddly only won title reign, ends in 1975. Okay.
01:06:25
Speaker
So it feels like there's a generational gap between them. It makes me feel like there's maybe another reason why Terry Funk is here. Like he doesn't quite fit in with the old retired wrestlers here per se. I don't know. It's a hunch I have. I think you can see it as maybe since the company is rather new, this is their, hey, we value the history of Jim Crockett promotions and the NWA. We're still going to continue this forward.
01:06:51
Speaker
and all you fans that might be nervous about where the WCW version of all this is going still watch us, we're still honoring what you liked. Yeah, no, I get that. Yeah. I have no issue with the judges at all. I just meant having Terry Funk be the third judge feels a little out of place.
01:07:09
Speaker
Obviously, he warned to that position, but I don't know. I feel like it was two more recent champions, and Terry Funko would make more sense. Yeah, I mean, the trouble is, if it's two more recent champions, it's like Ric Flair and Dusty Rhodes. Right, right. I guess you could bring back Ron Garvin. That's true. Where's Gene Kandiski at this point? He's hanging around somewhere, right? Yeah, I think so. Yeah.
01:07:35
Speaker
We go back to the ring, as sadly the Oak Ridge Boys concert is not available on the WWE Network version. And here I'd plan to make this a stealth pilot for a music review spin-off show. Let's go to The Sing. Oh, that's nice.
01:07:52
Speaker
Our fifth match is Michael P.S. Hayes versus Lex Luger for Luger's NWA United States Heavyweight Championship. This is the first of our championship matches tonight. Our referee for this match is Nick Patrick.
01:08:08
Speaker
Okay, so as has been mentioned in a previous Darkade, there was some issue with the Forest Men. You know, there's a point in the mid-80s that they're this huge group. They have a world champion, a TV champion, you know, a tech champion. They're solid force. And then things start to happen, unfortunately. The big blow is they lose JJ Dillon, who actually leaves the company for a long period of time, to work backstage at WWF. And the new members they were trying out, like Michael PSAs and Kendall Windham,
01:08:34
Speaker
But there's a weird thing where now that they don't have J.D. Dillon, they are the Yamasaki Corporation. Right here in Matsuda, who was randomly four of just managing Lex Luger in a previous show, is now apparently some Japanese businessman who basically took the four horsemen and turned it into something else. So it's kind of a weird place for them, for sure. They also had recently lost Barry Wyndham, who unfortunately is out of the company and resting in general for a little while after the show before this, where he uses the title too, Lex Luger in fact.
01:09:03
Speaker
Okay. Can I ask you a question? Yes. So, they're led by Hiro Matsuda. Yeah. Why are they not the Matsuda Corporation? Uh, yeah. That's a good question. Right? Mm-hmm. Yeah, so at this point Michael Hayes is technically part of the Four Horsemen, or the Yamazaki Corporation, excuse me.
01:09:24
Speaker
Which is weird that it's not mentioned here. They really focus, I think at this point, they're really pushing away from even that. He has Matsuda with him, doesn't he? Or does he not? I don't think he comes out with him. I can't recall really in his entrance if he comes out with him, but they do note that Matsuda is at ringside and they say as a formality.
01:09:41
Speaker
Oh, okay. So yeah, so they're sort of still leaning into that, but not really. Yeah. Cause of that promos you played, they're really leaning into the, his rather, but the group aspect and not really mentioned this at all. And I don't think about the PSAs is so popular that two groups are fighting over him. It's not like, you know, staying in the late nineties.
01:10:05
Speaker
I feel like there's a bit in Hayes' intro where you can hear a little bit of Freebird before Bad Street USA actually kicks in. Kind of weird. I like Hayes' robe, silver and blue and so shiny you can see it sparkle even in the wide shots. It's a pretty good one. Luger sadly does not have his absurdly catchy theme yet. Hayes goes up to pose and looks shocked as he gets booed. He does some struts and gets yet more boos.
01:10:35
Speaker
Luger's power lets him escape or shrug off everything Hayes tries. J.R.R. spots Teddy Long at ringside again. Luger pushes Hayes into the corner and they break clean, but Hayes poses arrogantly and mocks Luger, so Luger slaps him right in the face. Hayes angrily storms out of the ring.
01:10:53
Speaker
Back in, Luger blocks the cheap shot, slaps Hayes again, wins the slugfest and gets a back body drop to send Hayes fleeing outside again. Back in again, and Hayes has more success, and tries his DDT, but Luger throws himself backwards to escape, and Hayes goes down too, so Hayes stomps around outside again as JR points out Hiro Matsuda at ringside.
01:11:13
Speaker
Back in, Hayes is frustrated, and Luger works his arm with wrist locks and arm drag and arm bars, using his power to stop any comebacks, including a nice catch on a crossbody into a backbreaker. Hayes gets a clothesline in the corner and confidently walks away, only for Luger to no-sell and slug him when he turns around. That was pretty funny. That was, yeah.
01:11:34
Speaker
Eventually Luger tries a crossbody. I can't think when I ever saw Luger try that. It's weird, yeah. Hayes dodges it and Luger spills out over the top rope so maybe that's why he doesn't normally do it. Hayes rams Luger into the ring post and impresses JR and me by suplexing Luger back into the ring for two. The crowd chants for Luger and Hayes is annoyed.
01:11:58
Speaker
Hayes works headlocks and reverse-chin locks on Luger and gets two counts off the Bulldog. Hayes throws Luger outside and Matsu defines a chance to throw Luger into the barricade.
01:12:09
Speaker
Back in, Hayes gets more two counts off a body slam and an elbow drop, but after some fist drops he takes his time to pose before going back to the chinlock. The ref checks the arm, but Luger keeps it up on the third try and fights free. Hayes tries to ram Luger into the turnbuckle, but Luger rams him into it instead several times and demolishes Hayes, including three military presses. He considers throwing Hayes over the ropes, but slams him in the ring instead.
01:12:35
Speaker
Luger tries the torture rack, but Hayes slips behind and nails the DDT in a nice bit. Hayes is two days to cover, however. Luger recovers and shoves Hayes to the ropes, but Patrick, kind of, gets clipped and falls as Luger and Hayes knock heads. Yeah, a little bit.
01:12:50
Speaker
Luger goes down and Hayes falls on the ropes, but Freebird Terry Gordy runs down and shoves him onto Luger as Matsuda wakes up Patrick. Luger gets a foot on the ropes, but Gordy pushes it off as Patrick counts three, giving Hayes the win. Patrick never even looked at the ropes anyway. Gordy and Matsuda wake Hayes up to celebrate as JR decries Hayes' idea of doing it on his own.
01:13:13
Speaker
The instant replay shows that Nick Patrick was barely touched in that bit, if you've been touched at all. I guess you just got to go with it at that point, though. Evo's sympathy pain, is what it is. He's just so caring of a person. Thoughts on this one? That was pretty good, actually. It's weird, because it seemed like every show we watched, Luger alternates between face and heel. Yes.
01:13:33
Speaker
And maybe it's just the way you watch these shows or maybe it's just the way his characters switch. But I don't know, it feels like I just see him less often as a face. I see him more as a heel for the reason. Could be wrong with the actual stats of that. So it's nice seeing him as sort of the strong, powerful baby face here. I don't.
01:13:49
Speaker
really like Hazel that much, just in general. There's something wrong that he does, it just, he never really impressed me on that much. But he does do a good job playing this sort of cocky guy, he wants to get beat up, but Slooger does admirably oblige, which is nice.
01:14:04
Speaker
Yeah, I think Hayes has always been right on the edge of me liking his performances, where I feel like he has a lot of personality, but he doesn't always use his character quite right. I think he has the character right, but he doesn't have its interaction with the story always correct, if that makes any sense.
01:14:27
Speaker
Sometimes his character work can slow a match down too much or introduce an element of something a little bit more ridiculous to it than you'd like. But in this match, I think he really nails it.
01:14:41
Speaker
He makes a good foil for Luger, who, while he presses the ring, is definitely still trying to find his footing as a strong character. Yeah. As we talked about his promo before, where it's good, but it definitely feels like he's citing a promo and not speaking from the heart. Right. Yeah, Hayes fills in the, I don't want to say character deficit. No. Because I think Luger does fine, but Luger has a basic character here, and Hayes fills it in with a much larger one. Mm-hmm. That's pretty accurate, yeah.
01:15:11
Speaker
And yeah, definitely, I mean, Hayes does an excellent job of making you want to see Luger punch him in the face. That's true, yeah. It's interesting the way they, as complicated as that finish got to, because it involves, like, all these people being knocked down, and then one guy pushing another guy onto someone else to pin, and the third person waking up, they're free, and then all this stuff. It's a lot of moving parts. Ultimately, other than Nick Patrick not really being hit, and shouldn't really go down, I think it works pretty well.
01:15:39
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. I think it's just a thing with Nick Patrick and Lex Luger. He has an issue doing certain spots with Lex Luger as we'll cover in a later show. Yeah, as for the match, I'm torn a bit. It had good energy and good character work from both. And I liked how he's pinballing between prideful confidence and insulted frustration. And he interacted very well with the crowd, as did Luger, who did a great job bringing them into his comebacks.
01:16:04
Speaker
Luger looked very strong, and the two turned it up for the ending with fast sequences and a few nice swings of advantage. Like we said, the actual finish has flubbed a little bit in that I think Patrick is just a touch out of position and doesn't get hit how he's supposed to. But you can only really tell that on the replay, so maybe think about not playing the replay.
01:16:24
Speaker
Still, they just went with it and it worked well enough and played well with the storyline they'd set up. All that said, the match gets really repetitive in the middle with repeated wrist locks from Luger and repeated chin locks from Hayes. And Luger even escapes those the same way every time. That's true, yeah. I think the match could lose two or three minutes in the middle and be a lot stronger for it, but they never lose the crowd and the character work helps to keep this very fun all the same. Yeah.
01:16:53
Speaker
I was going to mention the promo. I feel it's more appropriate here. So Luger with his nice blonde feathered hair and his natural physique. Put that way people like.
01:17:07
Speaker
He's at his most He-Man-like, I would say, in this show. Yeah, you and I were joking about that on the show. Totally looks He-Man. I'll find a nice picture of him from this show and a He-Man figure. It is eerily similar. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Total agreement there.
01:17:24
Speaker
And bear in mind, when I was a kid, I loved He-Man. I was at the right demo for that. And I had very little memory of this, exactly, because I was too young. But I remember being somewhere and seeing, like, at a mall, I want to say. And there was someone dressing up like He-Man. I remember being very excited at the kid, but most of the people blocked my memory at this point. I don't know why. I think I was just too young. You have to be a certain age before you really start getting strong memories. Yeah. But I remember being at a mall and seeing guys at the He-Man.
01:17:52
Speaker
I said flashbacks of that seeing Luger coming out and flexing and like posing like a human figure. Maybe secretly that was Lex Luger. Maybe. You can't disprove it. That's true. Next you'll tell me that Captain America guy saw in the 70s was actually Riker from Next Generation. That is an awesome little factoid by the way. It is, yeah.
01:18:17
Speaker
I hope you enjoy Michael Hayes' mentis WCW United States heavyweight championship how to win. It lasts 15 days. Aw. Yeah. At a live event, not even on TV. Oh, geez. Instead of House show, they just put the top back on Luger in the hole that required a while after that. I noted that this is the last ever singles title that Michael Hayes ever held. Wow.
01:18:40
Speaker
That's not to say he didn't hold titles after this. He held a lot of them, but they were all tag titles or six-man tag titles. That's interesting. Yeah. Scouring through Wikipedia anyways, I only found two ever singles tells ever won. That's interesting because this feels like, you know, an experiment of, hey, does Michael Hayes work as a singles wrestler maybe? And I think the answer to that given this match is actually yes.
01:19:02
Speaker
So it's kind of surprising to hear then that, I mean obviously he's known more as a tag wrestler and I wouldn't want to lose that side of him because I think the Freebirds, as confusing as their matches sometimes are, are a good act. But that's actually surprising to hear. My misgivings about a couple bits of repetition aside, I think he did a perfectly good job here. So it's a little surprising that he just doesn't get another run. And that this one's so short.
01:19:32
Speaker
Yeah. He apparently held the NWA United National Championship or the NWA UN Championship, which is just weird. Oh my gosh, these title names. And apparently he held the PPW or Power Pro Wrestling Heavyweight Championship one time, which is a more of a local Memphis affiliate thing. Yeah. But otherwise, yeah, it's World Sixpan titles, World Tag Titles, US Tag Titles. All right. Yeah.
01:20:03
Speaker
It was a short experiment they tried, and I guess they gave up on. On the upside, in a very short amount of time, he goes from winning the U.S. championship to losing the U.S. championship to winning the tag championship. And in fact, he will be in the aforementioned War Games match at the Grimiac and Bash that year. So he'll be defending the tag titles, but he will be going into the show as a tag champion. So that's notable. Yeah. I can see him actually working rather well in a War Games match.
01:20:33
Speaker
from the, uh, the guy you want to see punched in the face perspective. No. Yeah. He, he, he, me, the, like the first guy and you get speed up for five minutes and then you get to see the thing swing back and forth. Yeah. Or maybe the second one that swings it in favor of the heels and be all cocky. And then the third guy comes in and slugs him. There you go. Yeah. That'll work.
Sting vs. Iron Sheik Match and Outcome
01:20:56
Speaker
JR throws to Lance Russell again, who is with Sting. Sting's got a cool white jacket with black patterns and shiny fringe. The face paint looked a little bit strange tonight. I don't know what it was. It's maybe kind of narrower along the eyes and nose than it usually is, I think. Yeah, this thing will have to battle this off for sure. It actually kind of looked to me more like Road Warrior's type of face paint, really. I don't know how to describe the difference exactly.
01:21:24
Speaker
I mean, we're a couple of minutes away from it, and this man right here will be defending the World TV title. It won't be long you'll be in the ring, Sting. I can't wait. You know the way I get every time I see the lights and the cameras and all kinds of people running around with paint on their face, acting weird, jumping through the stands, running in place, beating on their chest, doing all that kind of weird stuff that I do. Whoo! I just can't wait to get in the ring, the iron chic. You are going to love this just as much as I am. Whoo!
01:21:54
Speaker
later is he ready or is he ready the stinger heading to the ring if we're going to keep up with it let's go i guess i'm a little point lance russell didn't say the stinger going to the ringer that would work that would work missed opportunity
01:22:14
Speaker
This one was short and a little bit oddly phrased at times. It seems like Sting doesn't quite have his style down yet, pausing and seeming a little unsure of himself during his bit about the fans. But all the same, he's definitely got the energy we're used to seeing from him. It's unpolished, but you can see what he's going to become. Yeah, I can see that for sure.
01:22:33
Speaker
He actually runs off right from the promo to start his entrance, and I loved Lance Russell's reaction to that. It helped build that sense of energy. Oh, yeah. I have to say, Lance Russell is really growing on me as this show goes on, actually. In the early interviews, he seems like just a guy to hold a microphone, but starting with the judge's interview, it feels like there's more interaction with him and the people he's interviewing. So I'm kind of liking him as an interviewer.
01:23:00
Speaker
Yeah, he has a lot of experience before this in smaller territories, especially in Memphis. He worked a lot with those companies there. It is notable to St. Wikipedia in ways that being on Andy Wade TV was his first nationwide exposure though. Okay. So he was a real big face of Memphis Pro Wrestling, but that was on UHF channels and the like. It wasn't on TBS. Okay. Interesting. Any thoughts on the promo?
01:23:24
Speaker
It was good. I feel like we're at the point where we're talking before about this transition period. We have matches that feel too old and then gimmicks that feel like they're trying to be too new. And this is sort of pulled back the other way. It feels like Hulk Hogan, Macho Man, already Savage promo. It's the energy level and it goes from zero to 60 in less than a second. Yes. Everyone seems very amped up backstage. It's like drinking Red Bull.
01:23:51
Speaker
other things to be this excited. I don't know. It's so contagious throughout them. The exception of Luger, who was up all night studying his promo to get it right, so he couldn't party with the guys. I was going to say, the Sting promo feels like a contrast to the Luger one, where the Luger one is delivered fine, but
01:24:12
Speaker
feels a bit mechanical, and the Sting One has a couple flubs or uncertainties in it here and there, but is delivered with super energy. For sure, yeah. The Sting One feels legitimate, even if it's not quite as polished. No, absolutely, yeah. I'm looking forward to someone being really calm and serene backstage in a promo, though I don't think I'll get it. Yeah, no, I don't like the look of that in the future. Yeah, I don't have a favor.
01:24:41
Speaker
So, our sixth match is Sting versus the Iron Sheik with Rip Morgan for Sting's NWA World Television Championship. The referee for this match is Byron Scott. So, the Iron Sheik, which is kind of up here out of nowhere.
01:24:58
Speaker
showing up on TV, and he put an open challenge to all the champions. At the time it was Luger and Steamboat. Yes. Because shortly after his appearance, Sting would actually win the TV title for Mike Rotunda at a TV taping. Curiously, that taping would air on April 1st. He actually did win it. It's just also on April 4th of the day. As soon as that happens, Iron Sheik sort of seems to focus immediately to Sting. I really feel like he should have gone after Luger.
01:25:28
Speaker
You know, the whole US championship thing, but I understand why they, they have the match that they have, which is funny that it's like, you have a US champion, you're the, I hate America. I want to destroy them and you don't want to take the US title. Yeah. Feels a little weird. There was an amusing bit about a week before this show. The Iron Sheik comes out, he's going to show off how strong he is. He's challenge, sting to a Persian club challenge. That's the thing. We have to swing those Persian clubs and like show how strong you are. Yeah. Which looks legitimately tough. I don't know how good those things actually are, but it looks tough.
01:25:58
Speaker
talking about things being four other times or ahead of their times. Sting sort of events trolling in this segment. He sees the Iron Sheik do the exhibition, looks tough, comes out and says he needs to do it one more time so he can really get a feel for it. So he can see how he'd do it. Cause he'd never done it before. So he's Iron Sheik to do it again. And then he acts all flustered and he goes, I just need you one more time to show me one more time that you can do it. So he does the third time and he's clearly exhausted himself. Wherever on Sting decides to just leave.
01:26:29
Speaker
Yeah, he just trolls him, just outright. Oh, man, that's pretty fun. That sarcastic sting was always deep inside, wasn't he? It really was, yeah. Yeah. It's a dope, weird segment. That sounds great, actually. That sounds awesome. Yeah, it's pretty funny. Yeah. See, I have 100% genuine. He's like, it's just gonna be one more time. I just, I think I got it. He's gonna say one more time and I'll do it. And then he walks off. Yeah.
01:27:00
Speaker
We cut right to Sting's entrance as Iron Sheik is already in the ring with his iranium flag and Rip Morgan. A bunch of kids run out with Sting's sign, summon face paint, and Sting marches out behind, slapping hands with the crowd as everybody cheers. Nice shot of the happy kids at ringside. Iron Sheik yells at Kepeta during his intro, making sure Kepeta announces that he's a former world champion.
01:27:22
Speaker
which would be a reference to his lone WWF world title run. There are monster cheers for Sting's intro. Oddly, Kepeta says, here is Sting, rather than this is Sting. So I guess that's not solidly established yet. You can't quite get the phrases right here. Between Lance Russell and this, I just can't quite get it straight.
01:27:44
Speaker
The camera's focused on the kid, so it misses a Morgan Cheepshot. While Scott is getting Morgan out of the ring, Sheik attacks Sting with the Iranian flag. Sheik chokes Sting with his belt, but the ref notices, so Sheik resorts to clubbing blows instead, but Sting no-sells and fires back, gets Sheik's turban and chokes and clotheslines him with it, before covering Sheik's face with his own robe for a punch. I guess Scott's just giving them each a few, huh? Yeah, I don't know. It's even there now, yeah.
01:28:11
Speaker
Sting gives a stinger call. Sheik gets a nice side-saltow suplex. Sheik clothesline and chokes, and Sting chokes him in reply, but J.R. miscalls it as Sheik retaliating. That was really weird. Like, how are you not telling them apart? Sting whips Sheik to the corner and suddenly hits the stinger splash, then slaps on the scorpion deathlock for the submission and the win. That was brisk. The crowd erupts for Sting's win, and he celebrates with the belt as a dejected Sheik paces around the ring.
01:28:41
Speaker
Thoughts on this one? It's a pretty basic squash match here. I was waiting for this match to mention it. That's part of the thing we were talking about. It seemed like they were going for this idea that they were going to use Stars of the Past to put over the Stars of the Future. Yeah. That was the idea with GYD. It was presumably going to be the use of the Great Muda. I getcha. And you have Sheik and Sting here. It's still a lot harder because they didn't have Orton and Murdock and thematic against each other and no one gets put over really.
01:29:07
Speaker
I feel like it's kind of this opportunity to keep that theme going somehow. No non-cheating offense from the Sheik, basically. Well, I guess the one-side suplex. Yeah, yeah. Which was nice. No, yeah, it's true.
01:29:20
Speaker
But in general, which basically, he attacks him, beats him up for a bit, then once that wears off, he gets kicked. Pretty much. And then that's about it. It is good to see Sting look dominant here, but there's really not a whole lot here other than the just bizarre clash of time and styles here where the Iron Sheikah is challenging Sting of all people in 1989 for this title.
01:29:42
Speaker
Yeah, there was a lot of energy, I guess, but this wasn't really much of a match. Just the two having a bit of a fight with Sheik's wardrobe, then having the start of a match before Sting just suddenly wins. Yeah, basically. Sting beat the Iron Sheik almost a minute faster than the great mood of beat Doug Gilbert. Mm-hmm, yeah.
01:30:03
Speaker
I'm guessing the idea, like you said, was to give Sting an impressive victory over the other company's former world champion. Yeah. But the brawling, opening, questionable refereeing and loads of choking kind of just made it too strange to feel like anything. I don't really object to the quick win here. I just think they could have restrained themselves to just one flag strike or two minor cheaty things and then gone right into the match proper rather than having Sheik and Sting use weapons repeatedly. Yeah. Good stinger splash, though.
01:30:33
Speaker
And if you caught this, I only caught this in the replay when they're doing the intro for the match. They say the match is a 45 minute time limit.
01:30:43
Speaker
Did not need it. No. And also that goes against the story that comes much later with the TV title where it's 15 minutes. And if you don't do it, can imagine if they kept the 45 minute time limit all along those shows would be. Well, maybe, maybe, uh, it actually goes back to that club demonstration and Sheik earned 15 minutes for the match with each time that he successfully demonstrated the clubs. Oh, I could be. Yeah.
01:31:12
Speaker
I kind of have to comment, I don't know what you two mean, but I have to comment on the Iron Sheik's general look here. It's very strange to me. I remember that moment when I sees that. There's a weird effect with him where, especially when he's trying to flex and show off, he'll flex and he has his big belly. And when he flexes, his abs sort of push through, but you don't see them until he flexes. So it's like they're trying to force their way out the front. It's like the creature's an alien trying to push their way out. It's bizarre.
01:31:42
Speaker
Cause he doesn't have abs, he's like just... Yeah, he's not actually in bad shape, but it's just he has an interesting shape. Yes. The visual of abs suddenly appearing and like trying to push their way out the front of his chest is bizarre. Sting would go on to the Great American Bash, true challenge. Buddha. Oh, okay. That's the match that Buddha has coming up for that. I bet that one's fun.
01:32:08
Speaker
funny side note with the Iron Sheik, he was signed to a one-year contract, so he'd be using TV to put over people like Sting or other people like that. Otherwise, they had no long-term plan for the Iron Sheik. He's a name so you can use it for house shows and certain territories to draw for live events and everything. However, in true WSAB fashion, they forgot to make sure to cancel his one-year contract near the end. So they rolled over to the next month and now we get a two-year contract.
Steamboat vs. Flair Final Match Build-Up
01:32:38
Speaker
Oh my gosh. He got an extra year of pay from this company because someone in accounting didn't go, well, your contractor's bar is on this day. He let it go over like a week past and like, oops. Good for him. Good for him. Absolutely. That's hilarious.
01:32:58
Speaker
JR tells us the world title match will be next and throws to Lance Russell, who is with world champion Ricky Steamboat. Steamboat's wearing a red G. The outfit ended up highlighting the big gold belt really well. It looked really cool with that outfit. You can see that, yeah.
01:33:14
Speaker
Three minutes away from going to the ring in what could be the most important match in the life of Ricky Steamboat. Could we get some final thoughts, Ricky? You know something Lance, this without a doubt is going to be my most important match. Being a world champion these last several weeks has brought a lot of different thoughts to my mind in the fact that there are a lot of other contenders out there. And that's why that stipulation was put in Rick Flair's last chance.
01:33:38
Speaker
We've got three ex-world champions around the ring acting as judges to eliminate any kind of controversial one, two, threes that might happen when this match ends. But I will say this, Ric Flair, you are probably the greatest of all the world champions ever. Whoever comes out the winner tonight, I will shake your hand, tip my hat.
01:34:01
Speaker
But I will say this, I'm in the best shape of my life. I've heard through the grapevine that you have trained for hours to be in the best shape of yours. Let there be no excuses.
01:34:12
Speaker
Let the reigning world champion come out in this Nashville show. I'll see you there in a squared circle, Flair. Okay, that's it. By golly, I'll tell you, let's follow it right now to the ring for this most important match. That is like the most complicated outro that he's given thus far. Good promo here from Steamboat.
01:34:33
Speaker
He takes a hard story point for a face, the heel being hit with the last chance stipulation, and nicely explains it as Steamboat being a fighting champion and wanting to give others their shot. He does get a little bit muddled on his explanation of the judges, seeming to say that they're there to judge if a pinfall was appropriate when they're actually there to decide the match if there isn't a pinfall. Yeah. But he turns things around by praising Flare like Flare praised him, making clear his respect for his challenger. Steamboat, as well, really gets it.
01:35:03
Speaker
Flare and Steamboat both worked well to build up each other and by doing so elevate their match and give it a really epic feel. Yeah, it's good. It's an interesting balance between the measured and sort of unreal as we sort of hammer down poor Luger about his promo and the just shouting and yelling and being really fast and running off.
01:35:27
Speaker
He's not fully either of those, because he's very measured, but he feels natural, because he's done enough promos. He feels like he speaks from the heart, and I think that. He feels determined. Yeah, absolutely. I think, because, yeah, he doesn't feel aggressive like some of the other ones, or over the top about it. But he feels very determined. Obviously, we're doing an audio show. You can't see the video. But that's the look that he gives off during it as well. It's just very, I'm going to do this.
01:35:56
Speaker
And he doesn't need to shout it or anything. He just, he can say it and you know that he means what he says. Absolutely. Our seventh match is Rick Flair versus Ricky the Dragon Steamboat for Steamboat's NWA World Heavyweight Championship. The referee for this match is Tommy Young. On a previous show, Rick Flair would lose the world title and was considered to be one of the greatest matches ever. So no pressure.
01:36:26
Speaker
He would of course not take the line down and go right back after the title. They would have a two out of three falls match at the aforementioned class of champions back in April where he would win one fall but lose two but on the third fall his foot would be under the rope.
01:36:42
Speaker
So that was sort of the wiggle room they needed to say, well, yeah, he lost, but clearly he shouldn't have lost. We should have kept match going or something. So that's why this one comes about. Okay. But they had to add on the last chance simulation as well. Cause he's already had his big match. And as I mentioned in the promo after this match, there's a, some sort of ranking system to determine the challengers. So you can't even flair just challenge every time a little over again. Right. Yeah.
01:37:06
Speaker
Yep, this one has a lot to live up to from the earlier matches in this feud, as I understand. It feels a little weird that we're coming into this with the last match in the feud. But that's just how it's worked out with our schedule of covering these. We'll definitely loop back around. Oh, absolutely. There's no way that we're not watching the other the other matches, even one of them's on Clash of the Champions. But that is what we will definitely do because I don't want to see that match. Oh, yeah.
01:37:34
Speaker
Flair comes to the ring in his blue and silver robe, accompanied by women in sparkly outfits and with more women in sparkly outfits lining the aisle on the way. JR gets rather distracted by all this. Steamboat, in contrast, comes to the ring accompanied by his wife and young son, the latter of which is adorably dressed as a cowboy or I guess a country music star because he's got a sparkly little guitar too, and riding a pony. It is absolutely adorable.
01:38:02
Speaker
And it immediately tells you who's the good guy in the match. I will say I have certain trauma of people with cowboy hats and guitars after a previous Dark Age show. Really gone belabored promo explaining what bunkhouse matches are. Thankfully the little kid did not try to do that. Did this redeem cowboy hats and guitars slightly for you, Al? It definitely helps, yeah. That and cowboy Curtis, so.
01:38:26
Speaker
I like Steamboat's theme song for this show. It's not the one we've normally heard for him. It's a very martial arts superhero. It was just a cool sound. Definitely felt like a champion theme. And this is before the point where martial arts and like Mortal Kombat and Street Fighter got huge and that was a much more common thing. So it's nice to hear that in 89.
01:38:50
Speaker
Ring Announcer Gary Kepeta introduces the judges, Luthez, Pet O'Connor, and Terry Funk. Interestingly, Luthez is a six-time champ at this point, and Flare is a five-time champ, so if Flare wins here, he'll match this.
Steamboat vs. Flair Match Highlights
01:39:07
Speaker
Beautiful Steamboat arm drags, but Flare alleges hair-pulling.
01:39:11
Speaker
Flair slaps Steamboat, but Steamboat fires back and Flair stumbles back and falls. Flair cheap shots Steamboat and they fight around the ring with chops and punches until Steamboat catches Flair with a back body drop and Flair rolls out. Back in, Steamboat starts working Flair's arm with holds and strikes, preparing for the double chicken wing hold, the hold that made Flair submit in I believe the second fall of that 2 out of 3 falls match. I believe that is correct, yes.
01:39:37
Speaker
Flare tries to fight back, but Steamboat just keeps arm-dragging him down. Steamboat gets a one-count pin at one point, and JR says, if this was amateur wrestling, that'd be it. But in the NWA, we wrestle. So it takes a three-count. Huh? Also, you guys had an amateur wrestling match on the first closet. Yes! In fact, that very first match we technically talked about. Yes, that was so weird. Yeah, never guessed that'd be the first match in the first show.
01:40:05
Speaker
Flair fights back with some vicious forearm strikes, but Steamboat's chops earn a Flair flop. Steamboat locks on a hammerlock and flips over Flair to apply more pressure in a cool spot. Young asks if Flair wants to give up. No, I don't d*** Flair shouts. Simple no one suffice, mister.
01:40:24
Speaker
Flair scoops Steamboat up on his shoulders with ease and sets him on the top turnbuckle and fakes walking away, but suddenly lunges. But Steamboat leaps over him and dropkicks him out of the ring. Caudal says that Steamboat's ahead in his score. Back in, Steamboat keeps working the arm. Flair hits a cheap shot shoulder block that Steamboat Luger sells.
01:40:45
Speaker
As JR tells us, the judges all aborted the first 15 minutes to steamboat. That does give me an idea. Yeah. Apparently, so they have a ref that's going between the judges and the commentators. Is that how it's supposed to work? I think Tommy Young is reffing the match. I think that Byron Scott guy goes back and forth.
01:41:02
Speaker
I feel like I could probably just take a really old notepad. I have a, you know, a drawer from my parents' house, scribble a bunch of nonsense about Rick Flayer and Ricky Steamboat on it, and just say I have Pat O'Connor's notepad from... Just say Luthas. They actually have several shots of him taking studio students. Oh, good point. Okay, yeah. I'll have Luthas' notepad and sell an eBay for lots of money. Yeah, there you go. Yeah. Thank you, Lord Byron Scott. Geez, wow. I waited for that one to be fair. Yeah, yeah, too.
01:41:32
Speaker
The two trade brutal strikes, including some nasty forearms by Flair, until Steamboat flings Flair into the corner and he's caught upside down by his legs. Steamboat slugs him. With Flair freed, Steamboat keeps up the offense but Flair dodges a charge and shoves him out over the top rope. Young rules that it wasn't deliberate. It totally was.
01:41:53
Speaker
Yeah. It's a rule until it's not. Yeah. Flare flings Steamboat over the barricade, but Young takes away a chair before Flare can use it. Nasty elbow to Steamboat's throat. Flare gives Steamboat too long to recover, and Steamboat chases Flare around the ring, leaps inside after him with a big chop, and hits a facebuster. Another Flare flip, and Flare runs along the apron, but Steamboat double-chops him down and back to working on the arm. Flare dodges a flying crossbody, and Steamboat spills back to the floor.
01:42:23
Speaker
Flare flips Steamboat back in and continually knocks Steamboat down. Young nearly gets caught in the crossfire as they trade blows, but Flare gets a belly-to-back suplex for multiple two counts on Steamboat, as he can barely get his shoulder up on those. A great Flare underhook suplex and big elbow drop get more two counts, and Flare accuses Young of slow counting.
01:42:44
Speaker
Flare catches the Steamboat crossbody and dumps him on the top rope, but Young won't count as Steamboat's foot is on the ropes, so Flare argues with Young and leans his knee on Steamboat's face. Young tells him he can see what he's doing.
01:43:05
Speaker
Flair suplexes Steamboat on the floor as we get the next set of scores. Funk and O'Connor have awarded it to Flair, and Thez has still stuck with Steamboat. Flair tries to suplex Steamboat back in the ring, but Steamboat flips over him and rolls him up for two. The crowd gives a great reaction as they clearly thought that might be it. A Flair crossbody sends Boat to the floor hard, and JR clarifies that on a countout we'll go to the judges.
01:43:31
Speaker
back in, and a Flair top rope move goes as Flair top rope moves go. Well, no. Steamboat gets a second wind, so Flair begs for mercy, then boots Steamboat in the gut, but Steamboat rolls him up on a back suplex attempt for two and a half. Superplex by Steamboat, and he goes for the double chicken wing, but Flair immediately gets the ropes.
01:43:55
Speaker
Steamboat hits a top rope, high angle flying chop, and tries another, but Flare slumps on the ropes and Steamboat spills outside and injures his knee. Flare boots Steamboat in the leg and suplexes him back in, impressive stall on that one, and puts on the figure four leg lock.
01:44:12
Speaker
Flair really wrenches on the hold and earns a few one and two counts off of it. Steamboat eventually shifts position enough to reach the ropes as JR takes a jab at the WWF, saying Flair and Steamboat aren't just out here posing to rock and roll music. Flair works Steamboat's leg more, but eats an enzigiri. But when Steamboat tries a slam, Flair rolls through into a pin for the three count and the win. Shocking ending there.
01:44:40
Speaker
Flare has gained the World Heavyweight title for the sixth time. Flare and Steamboat shake hands, showing respect, and Steamboat holds Flare's hand high. Steamboat waves to the crowd as he exits, and JR gets in the ring to talk to Flare as he holds the big gold belt. Now there's more coming up here, but let's discuss the match before we move to the aftermath. Kinda figured that, yeah. So, thoughts on this one?
01:45:05
Speaker
I mean, it's a classic match. There's really not much people you can say about that. I mean, obviously I'm going to say more, but it's the simplest way to describe it.
01:45:16
Speaker
They do a really good job of keeping the pacing strong. They ought to keep both in control for certain amounts of time without it being boring. They have a good chemistry so they can work these holds just the right amount of pace. They were discussing with the Luger-Hays match, maybe they worked these holds a little too long to reach a certain amount of time, whereas I don't really have that issue with this match. No, no.
01:45:37
Speaker
There's a thing I've been talking about before on this show. There's little things you can do. I think maybe the last one mentioned this. Little things you can do when you're in a hold. Like you're constantly trying to fight your way out. You're trying to roll out of it. When you're not just taking a hold as just like an actual rest to sit there and go, Oh, I'm hurt and hurt.
01:45:51
Speaker
You can do longer holds and do these sort of things well. That's sort of the key to it. I was a good flare steamboat, so it was really not a botch anywhere, which is always nice to see. The thing they do really well is obviously work in the crowd. They do a good job of keeping the crowd thinking that flare can lose any minute now. As soon as anything that looks like it's the end for flare, like two counts, the crowd really is so excited. I think it's going to happen. It's just a really good match. There's no much we can say about it.
01:46:19
Speaker
That one bit where Steamboat gets the roll-up off of the attempt to suplex him back in, the crowd is totally buying into it and actually starts a cheer before they realize, oh my gosh, that didn't actually happen. It's one of the best crowd reactions we've yet seen on the show. Yeah, I mean, absolutely brilliant match.
01:46:43
Speaker
There's an intensity to this one that is rarely seen. Two competitors who know each other well and know that they have to fight their hardest to win, amplified by the fact that they know they're being scored and have to keep on offense constantly. That element of the story was used very well. Everything looks like it hurts.
01:47:01
Speaker
The chops send them reeling, they wrench hard on every hold, they crash hard from ring to floor multiple times, and they keep up a fast pace through the entire match never lingering long in one position. Even on holds, they'll transition between moves often, or wrench on them and really fight to get free.
01:47:19
Speaker
They do get a little repetitive with the armbars and hammerlocks during one segment, but they're all performed with such ferocity that I never got bored of them. No. And it helps that they're building to a clear point as well, with Steamboat trying to prepare for the way he beat Flare before, only for Flare to be ready for him to try it and find a way to force a break fast.
01:47:39
Speaker
If there's one real flaw, it's that Flare never really goes for Steamboat's leg until it happens to be injured on a fall. Unlike Steamboat, who's working towards his hold for the entire match, Flare seems to maybe luck into his opportunity rather than set it up. At the same time, it totally works. And Flare quickly and viciously works the knee once that opening arrives.
01:48:01
Speaker
I can see you making the case that if this wasn't a fierce fast-paced match, that he'd have the chance to do that. But because Steamboat's constantly getting the pressure on him, constantly hitting him, constantly throwing the ring, he just doesn't have a chance to stop and reset his game plan to worth a leg. So when it happens, he goes, oh, great. So that's why I need that. Yeah. I can see you also saying, like, Steamboat might be watching for that as well. Right. Yeah, it's just the one thing that I can maybe point as even a little nitpick about this one.
01:48:28
Speaker
I had the same issue with the previous show. The Luger flare match had the same thing. Flare wreck works the arm and the neck and then suddenly he hacks the knee and then it's like, ah, it's my whole thing the whole time.
01:48:42
Speaker
The ending is an absolute shocker. Once they'd each tried their big holds and escaped, I was fully expecting this to go longer, maybe get close to needing the judges. It really came fast right during what felt like a comeback for Steamboat, so it totally caught me off guard, but I loved it. Absolutely brilliant match with two guys at the top of their game who know exactly what the other can do, telling a story as only they can tell. Exceptional and legendary for a reason.
01:49:11
Speaker
Watching and talking about this match makes me think of matches where I can see what this match did and that one didn't. It's one of those little things. But I'm thinking back to, I think it's Darkade 92, I believe, where Tamuda and Chono. Yes.
01:49:26
Speaker
which if you're in a technical wrestling, it's 100% sound. They work all these holds, there's no botches, they plus things, but there's just no ferocity, there's no intensity to the match. It's just these guys pointing to their own holds and fighting a hold and they never really seem to get energized or angry or anything. We had gotten Buddha in bits like we see in that short match we have with Doug Gilbert. Earlier in that same match we have with Shono, it would be more like this one.
01:49:56
Speaker
That's interesting, matching anything with other matches like that. And maybe it's not fair to compare players to even matches to other matches, but it's gonna happen. But yeah, I see exactly what you're getting at, that that one was just about as technically sound as this one, but just didn't have
01:50:14
Speaker
the ferocity and the intensity and the drive to win yeah portrayed by the competitors where this one they both want this yes that's the feeling that you get one hundred percent of the time in this match is both of them want this that's a necessary thing for it for a match at this level which correct me if i'm wrong the chono and muda match i think was also a world title match right it was it was an individual title match yeah so for a match that's meant to be at this level especially
01:50:43
Speaker
you need that ferocity and that intensity. Sure. And flair and steamboat know exactly how to bring that out and exactly how to help each other bring it out
Terry Funk's Attack and New Feud
01:50:54
Speaker
as well. Where I think Chono and Muda just couldn't do that for some reason. I still remember like I described that match as the match that I really should like, but no, exactly. Yeah, this is absolutely terrific. No question.
01:51:13
Speaker
So JR gets in the ring to talk to Flair as he holds the big gold belt. Ladies and gentlemen, we have seen history in the making here this afternoon in Nashville for the sixth time. I want to present, ladies and gentlemen, number six, the heavyweight champion of the world, Nature Boy, Ric Flair.
01:51:42
Speaker
you can hear that crowd reaction. We have to give credit where credit is due. Ricky the Dragon Steamboat and Ric Flair both competed in one of the greatest matches that any of us I think have ever witnessed. Chance, congratulations. Thank you very much. Not in character for Ric Flair, but Ric Steamboat
01:52:06
Speaker
is the greatest champion I've ever faced. And I'm proud to be here for a sixth time. Hey, Rick, I want to be the first to congratulate you on being the new world's champion. Terry, thank you very much. We do appreciate the judges being here. Hey, Rick, I also want to say that if it would have gone 60 minutes that I would have liked to have
01:52:30
Speaker
I would have voted for Ric Flair because I think that you're the greatest wrestler in the world today. Very nice. Thank you very much, Terry. Thank you very much. Thank you very much, Terry. You know, champ, it went past 35, 40 minutes. It was nip and tuck both. You know, I would also like to go ahead, and I'd also like to go ahead and be the first one to challenge Ric Flair to that new championship.
01:53:01
Speaker
Terry, I'm honored that you'd like to get in the picture, but as a wrestling fan, I know you've been an active, you've been a Hollywood Sylvester Stallone while I've been being the world champion, and we got a top 10. We got a top 10 that the world champion is obligated to wrestle, and that's why we are number one. Wait a minute. Are you really saying that I'm not a contender?
01:53:30
Speaker
No, what I'm saying, Terry, is that you are a great wrestler, but right now, you're rubbing shoulders with Sylvester Stallone and not the world champion. No, no, no, no. I was just asking. You think that... You're... I'm not good enough. You're saying that I'm not good enough, aren't you, Rick? I say that at all, Terry.
01:53:49
Speaker
If you want me to look you in the eye and tell you that I got a problem with wrestling a guy that's been out in Hollywood for five years, it's the bottom line, bud. I'm looking at the top 10, and you're not in the top 10. No, Rick. Rick. Rick. Let me conclude this by saying thank you. I'm honored, everybody. Win, loser, draw, Rick Flair.
01:54:09
Speaker
Rick, please, please, let me just say one more thing. I was, I was just kidding you about going ahead and wanting to challenge you. I didn't want to really challenge you. I was just kidding you. So, Ed Gummitt, let's go ahead. That was beefy out. Thanks, Kevin. Hey!
01:54:32
Speaker
Funk offers a hand and Flair takes it, but Funk slugs him to the ground and viciously stomps him on the apron, beating him up in a fury by the barricades. Funk yells wildly at the crowd and drags Flair to the judges table, slamming his face into it, then picks him up and hits a pile driver on it.
01:54:51
Speaker
That looked incredibly dangerous. And the table does not break as we're used to with modern wrestling tables. Flair slumps sideways off the table and it pitches over, dumping Funk to the floor against the steps. Funk throws the table onto Flair and smashes him with a chair hard and screams at the crowd bellowing, and I'm not good enough?
01:55:15
Speaker
He attacks JR and grabs his mic, saying that Flair said he wasn't good enough, but look at him now, the horsetooth, banana-nosed jerk. Funk storms away as Doug Dillinger walks alongside to protect everybody from him, and Byron Scott comes down to check on Flair. Holy crap. What an amazing segment that was, huh?
01:55:40
Speaker
Yeah. Funk clearly sucks up to Flair, but when Flair won't give him what he wants, he feels insulted and just goes into an absolute insane rage. We've seen a lot of sudden brawls in wrestling or unprovoked attacks by heals, that sort of thing. It's a pretty common spot. This one though felt different to me. More dangerous and unpredictable. That pile driver on the table was one of the scariest things I have ever seen, and 100% looks like the sort of move that you would do if you were trying to put someone out of competition for good. Yeah.
01:56:10
Speaker
There was a legitimate feel to this injury angle. It was easy to take it seriously, and boy do I want to see the feud it'll lead to now. We went from an intense match between respectful rivals straight to lunatic assault. Yeah, pretty much. I'm looking forward to when we cover the shows that this one leads to. Yeah, it's interesting seeing Funk. He's so mild-mannered in the previous promo we backstage, just talking about how judges work.
01:56:37
Speaker
and then as soon as you can't get what he wants, he just, yeah, goes crazy. Yeah, it's a neat thing, because you can tell that something's up as he keeps coming back during the interview, but it's still so unexpected how far he goes with it. Yeah. You kind of expect when he goes for the handshake, like, okay, he's fake and he's gonna attack him maybe. Still, I was thinking, oh, like, he'll punch him.
01:57:03
Speaker
not, he'll beat him around the entire ring and outside it and do one of the most insane looking pile drivers on a table ever. Just like go completely lunatic fringe on him. It's to another level. For sure, yeah.
01:57:21
Speaker
So one of the key points in Flair's promo was he's, he's mocking Terry Funk for being away from the ring for five years and you are making sure it's the fastest loan. So first off, he actually hasn't been away from wrestling. Most of the time he spent wrestling just in the WWF. Ah, okay. Well, judging from JR's earlier line, that is away from wrestling. That's true. Flair's one about living number one is a little jab at that as well. Yep. However, we did have some Hollywood work. It's got on the 90B page. It's some pretty interesting stuff.
01:57:52
Speaker
He was on a short-lived Western show called Wild Side, in which he plays the character of, and I'm not kidding, Prometheus Jones. That's an awesome name. It is. Holy crap, that's great. He would also be in a lovely little film called Time Stalkers, which has time travel, I think that's probably time travel and Western. Okay. He plays the character of Bearded Cowboy, so I'm sure it's a rich, nuanced role. Aww. And he, of course, is in the classic, just a sloan film, as they mentioned, Over the Top.
01:58:22
Speaker
Yep. About two weeks after this show is the official US premiere of Roadhouse, also with Terry Funk. Okay. And he has a name in this one. He plays Morgan, so he's a real character in Roadhouse. All right. His next credit, acting wise, after Roadhouse, is he gets to start an episode of Swamp Thing. My favorite shows back in the day on the USA Network. There you go. Saturday mornings watching Swamp Thing. So he plays a character named JJ Dax.
01:58:53
Speaker
And the episode he's on, I swear, is called the Prometheus Parabola. Interesting coincidence. Very. He's also in Quantum Leap as well. Yes. I think I remember seeing that one. Yeah. He plays a pro wrestler. Yeah. Yeah. Cause Sam leaps into a pro wrestler in that one. I forget everything else that that episode is about actually, but I just, I do remember seeing Terry von Kahn in Quantum Leap. Oh yeah. I'm looking right now. He's got a big white cowboy hat on and pretty funny.
01:59:23
Speaker
Flare with his retirement. Pause for laughter. But what ultimately defends this title against Terry Funk at the Great American Bash in the main event? Okay. So that is the match that supersedes Wargames as being the main event. You know, after this build, I can see that Wargames normally should be on top. If something can be over, it is the world title match. And this was like a really epic setup. Right. So I can see them thinking, yeah, let's go ahead and make it last.
01:59:54
Speaker
team up. Thanks. Interesting. So Ricky steamboat would have a magic history funk at the next class of champions when building up towards Greg and bash the match would end. Controversially where funk would beat him up and get his qualified. And then a very strange thing won't happen where of all people, let's do a run out to chase terry funk off and safe for Ricky steamboat only to immediately turn heel and attack him. Okay.
02:00:22
Speaker
And that leads to Rigorstein voting against life suger for the US title, which he's since won back at this point at American Bash. Okay. So I think this show is doing it out making us want to watch the next American Bash show. I'll tell you what, yeah, we may end up doing that next. Who knows? We'll see. Oh, there's more. Yeah, apparently I wasn't in the other show.
02:00:43
Speaker
We suddenly go backstage to interviewer Joe Pedicino, I think it's pronounced. I'm not sure why Lance Russell is not there. Maybe Lance Russell's going to check on Ric Flair. Yeah, you know, that's possible. They're close friends, you know. He's with Nikita Koloff in Referee Garb. Interestingly, Koloff is wearing a striped shirt, but the refs on the show have not worn stripes. Huh. Yeah, it's true.
02:01:06
Speaker
Wrestling fans, whether it be the NWA, the NBA, the NFL, whatever professional sport in a championship situation, the officials always seem to be on the hot seat. And right now, here's a man who is making his return to the NWA in that capacity today, Nikita Koloff. And you will be in a world tag team situation, a championship situation, the referee, with two teams who have made a career, it seems, of intimidating officials.
02:01:30
Speaker
Well, I have been in the ring before with all these men, both with and against. So when it comes to intimidation, the Varsity Club is not going to intimidate Nikita Korov.
02:01:43
Speaker
or the Road Warriors. I will not be intimidated by anybody. I am going to call it the win-the-ketter call-off season. I am going to be impartial, and I am going to be referee to the best of my ability. Right now, I see the colony for the ring. Alright, fans, we are going to the arena for this big World Tag Team title match. Not a word about Flair and Funk.
02:02:13
Speaker
not a single word. No. I love Nikita Koloff, and he does a perfectly fine interview about his upcoming refereeing job here. But seriously, you just had one of the most epic matches in wrestling history, and one of the most brutal attacks we've yet seen. And Koloff has been Flair's opponent before, and there's no comments from him on that situation. Not even a, I can't think about that comrade, I have to referee. Yeah, sure.
02:02:39
Speaker
The interviewer doesn't even ask him, doesn't even mention it. It just feels wrong. That moment should have an impact beyond itself. It shouldn't just be brushed aside. Yeah, for sure. Otherwise, I think the promo's fine. It's just, it feels so strange that we just suddenly move on. Yeah, it's like they taped these shows and just stuck them back together. Yeah. They didn't, but it's just that it feels... through a disconnect area.
02:03:08
Speaker
That's one of the stronger points of some of the earlier shows. People will talk about each other's matches. And we're clearly getting into the era where that's just not the case
Varsity Club vs. Road Warriors Match
02:03:19
Speaker
anymore. That everything's independent of everything else. A lot of the time I can ignore that, but in cases like this, I just feel like there should have been a comment.
02:03:28
Speaker
I'm not putting that on Nikita or on Joe, but just whoever was saying, hey, here's what you should be prepared to talk about, should have included. Also, we're going to have a very, very, very huge angle, approximately three seconds before we put you on. So interviewer guy, ask him a question about it. Yeah, it's hard to explain why does it disconnect there if they can't figure it out.
02:03:56
Speaker
I've definitely missed Nikita Koloff's voice. Oh man. I have missed him. I have very much missed him. And suddenly we're back to the ring for another match. There are other matches on this card. Following Flair versus Steamboat. Yeah. What in the world was WCW thinking? How did they not close the show with that moment?
02:04:23
Speaker
It's like they thought they couldn't end the show with flair like beaten down and in danger. I don't know Yeah at this point watching the show. I was completely drained I didn't have the capacity to pay attention to more matches. I've been overloaded by flair versus steamboat It is mind-boggling that they thought something could follow that yeah But they did
02:04:48
Speaker
So our eighth match is the varsity club, Mike Rotunda and Dr. Death, Steve Williams, with their coach, Games Master, Kevin Sullivan, versus the Road Warriors, Hawken Animal, with Paul Ellering, for the varsity clubs and WA World Tag Team Championship. The referees are Nikita Koloff on the inside and Nick Patrick on the outside. Two Knicks. Yep.
02:05:12
Speaker
The heated rivalry was between the Varsity Club and the Road Warriors at this point on the now very much mentioned Classic Champions show leading up to this. Yes. They have a tag team title match between the two. They do a bit where Teddy Long is sort of accidentally pushed away by Road Warrior Animal.
02:05:31
Speaker
as he was one to do, you know, to sort of shove you away if you're in there. And he acted upset, but then the second that Retanda went for pinfall, he ran around fast-counted. So now the World Warriors are former tag team champions. This led to Tae Long being fired because they found he was bribed. That's why he was walking around earlier on the show, okay? Correct, yes. Since they had the issue with the rep before, they figured bringing an outside person like Nikita Koloff
02:05:58
Speaker
So when they couldn't be pushed around and would be easily swayed, it would be the way to do it.
02:06:03
Speaker
Apparently it was a feeling backstage and inside in the booking committee that with the forest men not being as strong as they were and sort of falling apart into something else, they needed a replacement. So the thought process was at one point, let's make the varsity club in this big faction that's going to take over everything. So that's why varsity club are all these tag titles and one that's like, there's several members over this period of time. They're testing the water to see if they can be the next big thing, basically.
02:06:31
Speaker
Obviously historic history is pointed at, no, they will not be. But it's interesting that's why they're so all over this and it might explain why they're all over this match and the one after this. This basically made them into the show for no clear reason otherwise. They're getting the credibility.
02:06:49
Speaker
The Varsity Club are in the ring as we come back to it, watching as fireworks go off and a group of cheerleaders perform. They missed a bit of an opportunity here by not having the cheerleaders wear the colors of the various colleges the Varsity Club members attended. That's true, yeah. JR blessedly finally mentions poor Ric Flair again as the Road Warriors come out.
02:07:09
Speaker
I barely get any time to notice if they have Iron Man as their theme song or not before they charge and start beating up the Varsity Club, driving them from the ring. The Road Warriors get their spikes off as the Varsity Club comes back in, and win a second brawl as well as the Varsity Club flees. Finally, everyone gets in their corners and we get started with Animal and Doctor Death.
02:07:29
Speaker
Dr. Death pushes Animal into the corner and goes for a cheap shot, but Koloff catches his arm. Sullivan gets on the apron to yell at Koloff, so he orders Sullivan to go to the back. That was sudden. He's very strict.
02:07:41
Speaker
Animal takes control with a shoulder block and clothesline, but Dr. Death boots him in the gut and throws him into the corner, only for Koloff to block another cheap shot. Koloff threatens to send Dr. Death to the locker room too, so Dr. Death backs off and tags Rotunda. Rotunda manages a dropkick but quickly eats a power slam and clothesline for two, as Koloff and Dr. Death argue some more. Tags to Dr. Death and Hawk, and Hawk drives Dr. Death outside but misses a clothesline and hits the ring post.
02:08:09
Speaker
Rotunda sneaks out to run Hawk's shoulder into the post again, and Dr. Death wrenches it around the barricade, but once they're back in, a somewhat wispy double clothesline sends Hawk and Dr. Death down. Both tag out. Animal fights off both heels but goes for a pin off a flying shoulder block while Dr. Death is still in the ring, so that gets broken fast. Not the best tactic, Animal.
02:08:33
Speaker
Everyone brawls until Animal dodges a rotunda clothesline to send him spilling over the ropes, and the Road Warriors hit the doomsday device on Dr. Death. But, Dan Spivey and Kevin Sullivan of the Varsity Club run down and pull Koloff out of the ring and attack him. Nick Patrick tries ineffectually to rescue Koloff instead of, you know, counting the pin!
02:08:54
Speaker
The fighting goes on for a while, and the Road Warriors dominate an in-ring brawl, but finally the referees disqualify the Varsity Club, awarding the match to the Road Warriors. JR decries the fact that the Varsity Club will keep the belts after all of this. We get to actually hear the Road Warriors song as Koloff holds their hands high, and yeah, it's Iron Man. Oh yeah. 100%. Thoughts on this?
02:09:17
Speaker
Like any Warriors match, it is very hard hitting. Yes. You would go into those matches as their competitor just hoping to survive and hoping to make it out with more peace. The other word I have for it is impactful. Yes. Every move just has extra oomph to it. Nice rotation like power slams. Everything has an extra sort of feel to it. And the third word to describe it is abrupt. Yes. We're about six minutes in and suddenly, nope, match is over. Yep.
02:09:45
Speaker
It's longer than two of the matches tonight, at least. True. I'm not sure that's our bar. No, no, yeah. Like the 1990 Star Cave, where it has all those really short tournament matches. Oh, hell yeah. Some of them were good, but they're all really short. Yeah. The non-finished feels like they're stalling. Mm-hmm. It's disappointing that you build... But at first, you take this match, you put it after Steamboat Player for their world title. Mm-hmm. And mind you, in this point, 1989, there's a real feel that...
02:10:14
Speaker
Flare and Steamboat are this classic feud and their matches are legendary. It's not like something happened much later. So them putting matches on after that just feels like sacrilege even at that point in time. It just feels even worse now. Like, why is this happening? Granted, the World Warriors are a huge team and they are challenging the tag titles, so obviously I'm not saying they shouldn't be on the show, but it should be before Flare and Steamboat.
02:10:37
Speaker
Especially with it being such a short match. Yes, it's fun. But yeah, why why does this go on after an epic? I Will say on my rewatch when I was taking the notes I intentionally stopped after flare versus steamboat to watch this another night So I could make sure I could get my energy back and give this its due. Yeah
02:10:58
Speaker
And it's pretty fun. It's a short match, but it's packed full of action. The guys are clearly aware that they're only out there for a few minutes, so they just go full tilt the whole time. The match is not very complex, but it is exciting.
02:11:11
Speaker
I like Koloff's early interactions, and if the match has a notable flaw, it's probably that that part of the story isn't consistent. He asserts himself early on, but we get a few points where everybody's in there brawling later, and Koloff just kind of yells at them like any other normal ref rather than hauling them bodily away like Nikita Koloff. Obviously I'll forgive him for not breaking things up when multiple people were actually fighting him in the late match.
02:11:36
Speaker
Sure. The non-finish is unfortunate. I would have liked for Koloff and the Road Warriors to just be able to dispose of the Varsity Club and get the Road Warriors an actual win, or for Patrick to just sneak in and count the pin while Koloff was fighting the Varsity Club. But it is somewhat forgivable for reasons that we'll discuss later.
02:11:57
Speaker
good fun, but I really suggest doing as I did and watching this on a different night. I had a totally different reaction when we watched the show straight through, and the match is much better watched separately. I do think it's a little funny mentioning JR's sort of disdain and the idea that they be a DQ and he'll retain the titles like that. Because Darkgate 88, the show we watched chronologically before this, the World Warriors are healed and do exactly that. That's true.
02:12:27
Speaker
Didn't think about that. So, I mean, I guess they had it coming, but it's not good. We also, we also didn't mention Ella Ring's interesting attire. The road warriors are in their typical black angry spikes and face paint. Paul Ella Ring is dressed like some sort of jungle explorer. Yes. That's right. This beige, um, like it's like a jungle outfit. It's just weird. This jackets and everything. He doesn't seem like he's managing the same team. Yeah.
02:12:53
Speaker
He has done a couple of shows. He actually has it on the flash match, which is a thing he was doing for a while. I mean, it was like a special match attire, but no, it's just dressing like he's going to go big game hunting, I guess.
02:13:04
Speaker
When I said it was like a promo, he'd make a joke about that. Like, you know, we're, we're hunting for the title and we're going to take down, you know, if you can make it work in the wrestling promo, comparing the varsity club to, you know, tigers you're hunting or something, but no, just dress up weirdly. Perhaps rare white Bengal tigers. Oh yeah. That's true. Did you like, uh, Koloff's haircut by the way? Yes. Crazy Koloff flat top with the streaks in the sides. Yes.
02:13:32
Speaker
That's only matched by Dan Spivey, so we've got a similar look as well. Yeah. Oh, he has, like, weird coloring. He has, like, a flag or something on his. I can't even make that out. Yeah, yeah, there was something odd about it. Just, like, a streak of color. Speaking of hair, I don't think we've mentioned as well that Sting has this nice blonde flat top and a black rat tail.
02:13:52
Speaker
That's right. Yes. Yes.
Steiner and Gilbert vs. Varsity Club Feud
02:13:54
Speaker
This is the odd rat tail period of Sting's hair. I mean, I don't get the rat tail in general, but coloring a different color feels weird. Yeah. Even by rat tail standards. Like why would you want to highlight that you've got that? Yeah. In a way it kind of foreshadows Scott Steiner's look when he'd dye his goatee blonde and then he'd just the wrong side of the head. Exactly. He exhausts things from that.
02:14:17
Speaker
Later on in the same show, they would announce that the tag titles are being vacated due to controversy. Yeah. That I think is the thing that makes it a little bit forgivable that they're doing this. They like wait through the next match. And then during JR's wrap up, he tells us that the board of directors has met and they are stripping the varsity club of the world tag titles. I would ask why they haven't just given back to the road warriors since they lost via cheating the first time. Yeah.
02:14:44
Speaker
They can see that. The first episode was stripped of the World Tag titles, and so it's WWE, so naturally they start a tournament. Of course. Yeah. Ranger Ross and Ron Simmons are in it, as well as the odd pairing of Butch Reed and Bob Wharton Jr. Interestingly, the team that, as I probably said before, the team that wins it is not either one of these teams that's fighting for the title here. Okay. Ends up being the Palace Freebirds. Oh, there you go.
02:15:11
Speaker
As a bonus, they would do an angle where they would actually break Dr. Death away from the varsity club, which I think it was sort of them going, okay, this varsity club is our top peel faction. It's not going to work. Yeah. So he'd have a blow off match at the next clash against Micro Tunde. And in fact, he would be on the face team alongside the robo warriors against the someone's team and the free birds. Okay. In the war games match, the semi-made event of Great American Bash.
02:15:38
Speaker
Okay. Dr. Death in a War Games match. That could be interesting. Yeah. Dr. Death teamed up with the Road Warriors. Yeah. I hope he does the face paint. I really do. Now the Nikita thing is a little weird here. So as you mentioned, Nikita Koloff due time away from wrestling right around the time of the end of the year because his wife was sick and things unfortunately did not end up well for that. That happened between Starrcade and now.
02:16:03
Speaker
So he sort of wanted to make a comeback in wrestling, but he wasn't sure his heart was ending. All stuff's happening.
02:16:09
Speaker
So they basically got a degree to this as like sort of a one-off appearance. See if you like it and see if you come back. The idea was that they could build more stuff off of this if he wanted to. It didn't really go that way. The anyway at this point had a talent sharing agreement with the AWA. So he worked there for a bit. He also took the sweet easy money working Herb Abrams, UWF in 1990, which is a subject of another thing we'll cover at some point. UWF is a vast source of bizarreness.
02:16:37
Speaker
He would eventually make a full return to WCW in 1991. We go right to our next match as JR reminds us that due to the severe animosity between Eddie Gilbert and Kevin Sullivan, the hair versus hair stipulation has been removed. It's just such a weird thing. Did neither of them actually want a haircut?
02:16:57
Speaker
Yeah. Wait, so they're so angry that you're taking the situation away? Well, they're angry, but the NWA feels that that is devaluing the title, I guess is the idea. Oh, okay. It's strange. It's a little weird, yeah. So our ninth match is The First Family. That's hot stuff Eddie Gobert and Rick Steiner with the First Lady of Professional Wrestling, Missy Hyatt.
02:17:19
Speaker
versus the Varsity Club, Dangerous Danny Spivey and Games Master Kevin Sullivan for the First Families NWA United States Tag Team Championship. Referee for this match is Tommy Young. So the US Tag Team title match is on last. Yes. After the World Tag Team title match and the World Heavyweight title match. Correct. Okay. Well, who is more important, the US or everybody else?
02:17:47
Speaker
Rick Steiner was part of the Varsity Club, but eventually broke away from it, leading to, I believe, Bob's match of the night against Micro Tunde. I think John liked that as well. I liked it too, which is not as much. Yeah. So that was the start of this. There's a lot of bad blood here. Eddie Gober comes in. He came in as part of the actual UWF, not the Abrams UWF, when they were brought out.
02:18:11
Speaker
The feud over the TV title segues nicely to this one, since Mike Ritanda actually wins the TV title back from Rick Donner, and of course loses his ding, because figuring out he's a champion.
02:18:22
Speaker
So what happens is Rick Steiner and Eddie Gilbert win the U.S. tag titles off the Varsity Club. Shots and words are thrown, so the match was made, but then they take the extra stipulation away from it to really make it more exciting, I guess. Yeah, that's such a strange storyline element that they actually remove a stip. Mm-hmm. Very weird. The First Family is out first, despite being the Champs. Maybe because of their name? Yeah.
02:18:52
Speaker
Though actually, the Varsity Club did that too, last match. Weird. As the Varsity Club makes their entrance, JR tells us that the NWA board of directors is meeting regarding the actions of the Varsity Club in the last match, and obviously we know how that works out. Yes. Spivey makes excellent crazy eyes on the way to the ring. Oh yeah. Sullivan and Gilbert shove each other around before the introductions, and Sullivan floors Gilbert with a punch.
02:19:19
Speaker
brawling to start. Spivey and Steiner end up outside, and Gilbert intercepts when Sullivan goes after Hyatt. The camera watches Sullivan getting back into the ring and misses Spivey beating up Steiner, but thankfully J.R. insistently calls that, so the director switches in time to see Spivey ram Steiner into the ring post shoulder first and slam him on the floor. Good work J.R.! Yeah. Apparently he did it like three or four times and he's got the last one. Yeah.
02:19:44
Speaker
Gilbert tries to come help, but Sullivan catches him. Gilbert fights him off, but Sullivan tags Spivey. Gilbert takes a moment to check on Steiner with Hyatt, then goes back to fight Spivey. But Sullivan goes and slugs Steiner in the arm. Gilbert isn't doing well against Spivey and slips out to check Steiner again, but Spivey follows him and Sullivan rams Steiner's shoulder into the post again. Nikita, you want to come back out here maybe? This is like the angriest game of punch bug you've ever seen.
02:20:14
Speaker
Back in, Spivey and Sullivan trade off beating Gilbert up, Sullivan cackling as he does, with Gilbert's lone real counter a nice flip down from an elevated backbreaker into a back body drop.
02:20:25
Speaker
Steiner climbs to the apron and cheers for Gilbert. Spivey hits almost a rock bottom on Gilbert. Sullivan tags in and slaps Gilbert, but Gilbert escapes and tags Steiner, but Young didn't see it and orders him out as Sullivan sets up for a pile driver. Spivey, though, runs in after Steiner, so Young turns around and orders him out, and Steiner whips around and clotheslines Sullivan to bull him over, leaving Gilbert on top for the three count and the win.
02:20:50
Speaker
Sullivan gets a chair, and Spivey uses it to batter Steiner's injured arm as Sullivan stomps Gilbert. Sullivan gets Hyatt in the ring, but Gilbert makes the save with the chair. Spivey attacks Steiner's arm a little more, and he and Sullivan retreat. JR throws to a replay of Spivey's early match attack on Steiner, but it cuts off before anything really happens. Great job, guys. Eventually they come back to it and show it for real. Thoughts on this one?
02:21:18
Speaker
It's an interesting one because it's so one-sided because they booked it that way. And then they wrote it in this weird way where Rick Stein was just taken out and can't ever do anything. So other than being a distraction, it's all Eddie Gilbert here. It's the weird rub to give Eddie Gilbert.
02:21:32
Speaker
of all people closing the show, which again, has Rick Flair and Ricky Steamboat on it. Yes. I feel like I'm watching a Memphis wrestling show or something at the end of a way show. That makes sense. The action itself is good. I can't make complaints about it. The big thing is just that it's so short. Yeah. I mean, if you were in both these main event matches,
02:21:53
Speaker
in the middle of Ric Flair and Steamboat, it would end in this match to keep going. That match is 30 plus minutes long. Yeah. These are like six minutes long. Yeah, you could basically fit the combination of these matches three times in the middle of Flair versus Steamboat. Yeah. I feel like if this match was anywhere else on this show, because these were the build-up to the main event, it could view them differently, but it's just you can't. They're decent matches, nothing wrong with them.
02:22:20
Speaker
They're both four titles, so they're important. They're just not as important as the world title. It's just weird that they're like this. Yeah. Yeah. Pretty good match here. I thought, again, I watched this on a different night from flare versus steamboat to give it proper attention. I just felt like that was really necessary. Sure.
02:22:36
Speaker
They gave it a good story with Steiner being injured so Gilbert has to find a way to survive against the varsity club on his own. And it's actually kind of a nice twist on the usual face imperil slash hot tag formula with Gilbert playing face imperil in the ring but just actually not having anyone to go for. Spivey and Sullivan did some nice brutal looking shots and Gilbert looked like a really good guy whose concern for his partner was distracting him from his own danger.
02:23:02
Speaker
The ending I really loved. It was a nice turn on the usual missed tag spot that turned it around on the heels. Really good idea there. Again, my reaction watching this after Flare versus Steamboat wasn't near as interested. Watching this on a separate night made it a much more entertaining match, and that's how I would suggest that you watch it too. There's definitely, you got to disconnect it.
WCW Event Critique and Match Order
02:23:25
Speaker
If you watch the show as it is, the show peaks and then there's just two more matches afterwards. It's like if you
02:23:32
Speaker
would go to live event shows or TV tapings and they have dark matches afterwards. But they treated them like they're important, not just, you know, senior comes back out and beats up right back for five minutes. Yeah. Like, oh, these are important title matches.
02:23:46
Speaker
on that same Clash show that I've talked about many times now. First off, the WWE Network version is missing three matches on it, which is weird, including the tag title match where there were losing titles to Varsity Club. That's just cut from the airing of all the matches to cut. They cut that one. I gotta know why, figure out why it's probably something with the master tape, maybe? I don't know. It's very strange. But also in that same show, they have a dark US title match and a dark TV title match.
02:24:14
Speaker
Meanwhile, Ranger Ross makes it on the main show. Somewhere in the WWE archives, there's a tape that has the Road Warriors Varsity Club match, the Sting match before the Bunkhouse Stampede and the Oak Ridge Boys concert. There you go. I mean, they literally just found a tape from 1995 of them interviewing Sting for DVD they never made, so it's very possible.
02:24:36
Speaker
But yeah, if you watch this as a show intends, it's just sort of weird anti-climax following these big events. If you watch them separately, they're decent matches, but they're still not the same importance. Even if I just don't think about Steamboat Flare, it doesn't feel like a main event of a show. Yeah. Like you said, if you did the order US tag title match, world tag title match, Flare versus Steamboat, it's fine. Absolutely. Yeah.
02:25:03
Speaker
Or I could see you maybe needing to switch the world tag title and the US tag title just to get the whole storyline with the, we're considering what to do about their actions during the world tag title match. If you felt like that was necessary, okay. But it's just so weird with this being at the end. Yeah. Cause you wouldn't want to interrupt Flair Steamboat to announce that, but you could maybe announce it as a separating point after US title match, announce what the mission decided and then go to Flair Steamboat. Yeah.
02:25:31
Speaker
So six days after this show, we have the view of Scottsdiner. Weirdly dressed like Hulk Hogan in his plain yellow tights and boots.
02:25:43
Speaker
He would actually lose his first match, which was to Kevin Sullivan, but then they would beat him up after the match ended, and then reverse the decision. Even though that makes no sense. Okay. So that's the beginning of Scott Steiner's winning streak in WCW, is losing clean to Kevin Sullivan, then having to reverse a pity, I guess. This is where it gets weird. So, Lautig would tell you that they did this big injury angle on Rick Steiner to write him out TV for a while or something.
02:26:12
Speaker
But that's actually not what happens. I mean, at least not in a major way. What they ultimately decided to do, once Scott is around, is they decide we should have this time to team up together because they're so good and we should have Rick who has experience to help Scott and Scott has this raw power and intensity and everything. Make a great team.
02:26:27
Speaker
And after they did. Pretty good plan. Yeah. Yeah. So they actually found a way to write Eddie Gilbert off of TV. And so because of that, they vacated the US tag titles. Okay. And in fact, the tag titles would not be seen again until February of 1990. For my pay-per-view, they would have the finals of the tournament to declare the new US tag champions.
02:26:47
Speaker
So we did this whole show where we we've bookended it with Gilberts. Yes. And Eddie gets this gets a pretty great kind of build here fighting heroically against the odds and caring for his friend Rick Steiner and everything. And then they just write him off. Yeah.
02:27:05
Speaker
So that's weird. They wanted the Steiner Brothers together and Eddie Gilbert was in the way of looking at that, yeah. I mean, I get that, but it's just like, you can keep him around still. Yeah. Wasn't that he disappeared because of that, but they split the team up completely for that. Interesting. And they got a lot of miles out of them the rest of 1989 with Steiner Brothers. Yeah, I have no objection to them teaming up the Steiner Brothers. It just feels weird that you've just built up Eddie Gilbert here and then you apparently don't use him.
02:27:33
Speaker
And in fact, during the time between this show and Grimric and Bash, Kevin Sullivan and Michael Tunde would face the Tyner Brothers at that show. And Eddie Gilbert would be part of the Tubering Battle Royal that opens the show. Okay. So to be clear, Eddie Gilbert is promoted to main event of Russell War and then demoted to opening Battle Royal of Grimric and Bash. All right. That's one show to the next.
02:27:59
Speaker
I did find some interesting stuff about A. Gilbert out though. At this point in time, he was actually married to Missy Hyatt. Okay. Unfortunately, they got divorced late 1989, but just around the time he left the NWA, a couple years later, he would actually marry Medusa. Okay. I guess hot stuff indeed.
02:28:18
Speaker
I mean, not counting Japanese wrestlers, that's like the only women we've actually, unfortunately, featured on this show, basically. Medusa and Missy Hyatt, and he was married to both of them. Fair point, yep. That's a little weird. A little bit, yeah.
02:28:32
Speaker
We go to JR, who tells us that they're still helping Steiner out of the ring and credits Gilbert for his courage in that match. Caudal comes back over and JR informs us that due to Sullivan and Spivey's attack on Koloff during the World Warriors match, Rotunda and Dr. Death have been stripped of the World Tag Team titles. Caudal is very much in favor of that, and JR agrees wholeheartedly. I will say, at least in this case, they make a distinction between the Road Warriors, for instance, you know, just having Paul Alwaring attack Sting or Howard Wren in that match.
02:29:01
Speaker
Another one is like that, whereas the varsity club have Dan Spivey and Kevin Sullivan attack the referee directly. So there's definitely an escalation of things. Yeah, and they also emphasize that this wasn't a heat of the moment thing. Sullivan was thrown out entirely and willfully came back to attack. So it wasn't heat of the moment, it was premeditated.
02:29:25
Speaker
I kind of like that as like, because you need an explanation for why you stripped someone of the title in one case, and it's okay to just get DQ'd in another case. Yeah. Or it's not okay, but it's like, why one is a different level of villainy. Yeah. That gets a different impact. And I think they did a fair job actually of establishing that here, when they really say, look, he came back out, he knew he'd already been kicked out. So now we need a different level of punishment.
02:29:51
Speaker
No, I mean, it definitely is. It's a different level for sure, yeah. I've shown that clear why they weren't stripped of tiles when they realized they had bribed Teddy Long and fired Teddy Long for doing the fast count. Yeah, yeah. You know, nothing ever quite fits together, does it? No. K-faber is a very tenuous thing. Yeah. The commentators discuss Funk's attack on Flare and throw to a replay of the pile driver on the table again. Still terrifying.
02:30:18
Speaker
JR calls Funk a deranged, crazed individual and says Flair was not disrespectful. Coddle says Flair was very nice and polite to Funk. I'm not sure, I kind of did feel like he was mocking him a little. It was clearly like a Kanye moment. If he comes on stage, he won't leave. And Flair gets kind of annoyed that he's asked him like different times why it's not a competitor.
02:30:38
Speaker
Yeah, it's not like him intentionally trying to insult the guy. No. It's him saying, look, man, this is the explanation. I mean, in no way am I saying that, like, Flair's actions deserve what Funk did whatsoever. No, no, of course, obviously, yeah. But yeah, I feel like they're going a little bit too far by saying, oh, he was very polite. Yeah, for sure.
02:30:58
Speaker
JR signs off and we get some photos of the events throughout the night set to Country Rock. Oddly, the photos only take up a quarter of the screen, like there's supposed to be credits rolling too, but there aren't. I'm not sure what was going on there. Yeah, there's a weird aspect ratio of that for sure. Yeah. They're like off to the side, kind of tilted diagonally off to the side, leaving a perfect amount of space for credits to scroll by, except no credits scroll by. I wonder if they just forgot to put those in. It's very possible, yeah. At least they're not in the middle of the show.
02:31:28
Speaker
That's true. And Wrestle War 89 is done, so overall thoughts on Wrestle War 89.
02:31:35
Speaker
It's a strong show in parts, for sure. It starts off kind of slow. I wouldn't say it starts off bad. It just starts off unremarkable, I guess, is probably the bright word for it. You have matches that are decent, but we're not clear why they're on the show. We have ones that are decent, but they feel anachronistic, I would say. And then ones that just feel incomplete because they're early start-up characters like the SWAT team and then dude's bit.
02:32:01
Speaker
They definitely pick up a bit though, I will say that. Other than the sort of non-event that is Iron Sheik Luke and his ding so quickly. The Luger Haze match feels as good as it should, and obviously Flair Octavo does an amazing match. And just as I far up on, sure way too much at this point, the show ends and then we have title matches that have no drama because the audience is just spent. And it's just entirely in the wrong place in the show.
02:32:28
Speaker
If you watch Up to Flare Steamboat, I think it's an amazing inclusion for the show. You have this dramatic release of tension. You have this big moment with the wind, then you have the aftermath and you're shocked and you want to see what comes next. If you end on Flare being like, stretched out, like this was a modern day WWE show. That's how this would end. Flare has been stretched out and you know, what's going to happen? Future of the world title. And then go to commercials. Yeah. But they have two tagline matches after it for no reason that are decent, but they're hampered dramatically by either
02:32:57
Speaker
the idea that they have to be non-starters instead of a tag turtle tournament for some reason, or just the wrong place a long time.
02:33:07
Speaker
If you watch Up to Player's Team, I would say it's a really good show. It builds on you. There's not a bad match, I would say. Some shows will have really strong matches and really bad matches. The worst you can say with the opening part is underwhelming. Yeah, this is not a one-match show. No. It's just that even though it's not a one-match show, it still has one match that's just so good that it stands head and shoulders above the rest. True. You wouldn't call this a one-match show, but you'll really describe one match. Yeah, that's true, yeah.
02:33:37
Speaker
Yeah, WrestleWar 89 is a pretty good start to the series. It's just rather oddly put together. The early matches are pretty variable but mostly acceptable at worst, with only the bullrope match falling into the actively bad category for me. And that's quite short.
02:33:54
Speaker
Once we hit the title matches, I had quite a bit of fun with them. Although Sting's super short match, I agree, was just weird. There's not really any kind of quality issue on this show. Promo-wise, I thought things went pretty well. No one seemed quite on their A-game promo-wise, except I think Terry Funk. But everyone did what they needed to do to bring out their stories, and for once I felt like we had almost exactly the right number of promos. Yeah.
02:34:20
Speaker
The one thing I would have liked to see is a comment from Ricky Steamboat after the attack on Ric Flair. That might have helped build up how awful Funk's attack was. And I think it just would have made sense. The only way his absence makes any sense is if this was designed to be his last match and leaving the company going out on his horse. Yeah, if you don't want an extra Steamboat comment, yeah. I can see you explaining it, too. It's like he doesn't comment because he's literally helping look after Rick at some point or something, too. Yeah, or he's calling the wife or something, yeah. Yeah, it's just weird that
02:34:49
Speaker
You don't hear anything from him with the respectful atmosphere they built up. Yeah. And of course, it would have been nice to have Coloff even mention that attack during his promo since it was immediately after it. Right. Overall, though, a fine night for promos. Yeah. The commentary team does good work for the most part, save some problematic comments during the Samoan SWAT teams match. It's just unfortunately something we're going to keep hearing on shows during this era, I guess. And I know it's the gimmick and all, but that doesn't make it right. No. Yeah.
02:35:17
Speaker
Otherwise, J.R. and Coddle again had good discussions and helped build the night's storylines quite well. The show's real problem, you've hit it and we've all commented on it multiple times, is just in the wrong order. There is absolutely no reason, no reason to end the show with anything other than Flair versus Steamboat. Not only does it dampen one of the most shocking moments we've yet seen on a show, as things just sort of move on beyond it so quickly, but it leaves the viewer so drained they don't
02:35:45
Speaker
They can't pay attention to the two matches with the misfortune to be placed after such an epic. I have no earthly idea why WCW thought they should put two matches following the world title match on this night in particular, but it was very much the wrong decision. Nothing happens to the tag title matches that justifies that or needs that positioning.
02:36:04
Speaker
It's also just plain strange to have the US tag title match follow the world tag title match, though that's perhaps a tad justified by wanting to have some suspenseful delay about the board of directors ruling on the world tag titles. So I get that one, it's just that combined with positioning both after Flare vs. Steamboat, it just makes things feel stranger. The match order hurts both the tag title matches and it distracts from Flare vs. Steamboat and the funk storyline, so it's just a bad move.
02:36:30
Speaker
But despite all that, WrestleWar 89 is fun. It's a pretty easy watch and it has one of the greatest matches in wrestling history, so it's an easy recommendation. Just consider changing up the match order yourself or splitting your watch across a couple nights. It'll make those last two matches better. There's one thing that is promised to us by the marketing materials that is sadly never delivered.
02:36:52
Speaker
Wikipedia has the VHS box for Wrestle War 89 on there. But the bottom logo is a banjo with spikes around it covered in blood and chains. And not once is there a bloody banjo used at all as a weapon. Did you want Ricky Steamboat's kid to bring that out? Ooh, now I do, yes. No, I really do, yeah. All right, Match of the Night and MVP. Start us off with Match of the Night. There's really no drama here, right? It's Steamboat flair.
02:37:23
Speaker
Yeah. There's no question. Yeah. I mean, it's, it's exceptional, right? I mean, absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. There's some shows where this is a hard choice for good reasons and some shows where this is an easy choice for bad reasons, but this is an easy choice for good reasons without any question match of the night steamboat flare.
02:37:40
Speaker
It's the final match of a legendary 1989 series, capping off one of the most famous feuds in wrestling history and doing it in style. Brilliant performances by both, managing to play their diametrically opposed characters to their fullest while still showing respect for each other as worthy opponents. I very much look forward to us taking a look at the other matches in the feud someday, even if we're doing it in the wrong order. Yeah, that's fine. MVP?
02:38:07
Speaker
That one was a little trickier to side because, I mean, it's a hard choice between Steamboat and Flare. Obviously, they live with such a great match. There is a Dark Horse pick, though, obviously, that being Terry Funk, because he does just go batshit in Zane. Pardon the swearing there, but it's deserved, honestly.
02:38:26
Speaker
But um, because he goes from cordial sort of butt kissing to incense to the crazy and yelling and doing that pile driver. So I really want to lean towards him, but I think as some of the parts, I had to lean slightly towards Flare. Okay.
02:38:44
Speaker
Because obviously Flair won half of that match and he's a very strong half of that match. No question. But he also has the promo afterwards, whereas Steamboat is sort of ushered out and never seen again. He was turned to his home planet like Pucci, I guess. So he has that promo where he's doing a slow turn back to being a face, which is pretty impressive. He's being respectful of everything towards Steamboat. And then he has the slow turn where he's being polite and then getting more annoyed and getting angrier at Terry Funk.
02:39:14
Speaker
The final nail in the coffin for this is the fact that he takes that pile driver. Yep. All the things I'm buying, I think Flair's MVP for me. All right. You have laid out exactly my pick and reasoning. Wow.
02:39:29
Speaker
It had to be someone connected to Steamboat versus Flare, just like you. I was between Steamboat, Flare, and Funk. Flare is the connective thread between the two things that I called Epic on the show. Sure. He's the guy that was part of both the Steamboat versus Flare match, which was amazing, and the Flare and Funk angle, which was amazing.
02:39:50
Speaker
The other two are great in their segments, but Flair is great in both. So definitely runner-ups for the other two, but combining Flair's great performances with his willingness to even take that pile driver, it puts him just that extra bit above them and gives him my MVP. Fair enough. I didn't work that with the story they're planning, but say instead of Terry Funk just being a judge, he was starting wrestling again. That's the story you're running off, so he didn't actually quit wrestling.
Conclusion and Listener Engagement
02:40:17
Speaker
So you have him beat someone on the show, filling in one of these matches, kind of forgettable, like the Ross, which rematch. So I'm acting like normal, and maybe with the hair trigger, so you can show that he can go crazy. Then he comes back over the judge and does all that. I think he could have pulled ahead that way. Yeah, if you had a little bit more of a performance from him. Yes. Because he was very good in the judge's interview as well. For sure. I really liked his part there. Yeah. So it's a great performance. It's just that
02:40:43
Speaker
I can't really justify giving it to him over one of the actual participants in one of the greatest matches of all time. Absolutely. No question. And that wraps up our review of Wrestle War 89. If you've enjoyed listening to us tonight, you can find us on Twitter or Facebook as Let's Go to the Ring. Links will be available in the episode description. Follow us for episode announcements and other show details, and share your own thoughts about the Wrestle Wars as we go through.
02:41:11
Speaker
You can subscribe to our show on Apple Podcasts, Google Play Podcasts, iHeartRadio, Spotify, Stitcher Radio, or TuneIn. And please, if you've enjoyed this show, give us a rating or review and share the show through your favorite social media platforms to help others discover us. Many thanks to OSW Review for attendance and pay-per-view figures, and to Gina Trujillo for our logo. This is Bob Moore for Alec Pridgen, signing off. Good night, everybody. Happy wrestling.
02:41:50
Speaker
So I'll really get to see him in an arguably in an envial position where he's replacing Nikolai Volkov at properly in his angle. Oh, sorry. Sorry. Yeah, I'm sorry. There's too many ends and all offs and everything.