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00:00:01
Beyond Client Modes
51 Plays5 days ago
In this episode, host Elias Scultori sits down with leadership coach Joe Miller, ACC, to unpack a challenge many coaches regularly face — what to do when a client shows up in self-doubt.
Joe describes noticing two distinct “modes” in his clients:
✨ Mode One — confident, prepared, full of faith.
🌧️ Mode Two — insecure, resistant, and uncertain.
As the conversation unfolds, they realize that these “modes” may reveal just as much about the coach’s own mindset as they do about the client’s. Together, Elias and Joe explore how to stay genuinely curious, let go of personal definitions of success, and keep believing in the client’s wholeness — no matter what “mode” they’re in.
This is a vulnerable, reflective conversation about the inner work of coaching — and the growth that happens when we’re willing to look inward.
⏱️ Chapters
00:27 – The Coaching Challenge: Two Client Modes
02:58 – When Confidence Fades: Working with “Mode Two” Clients
05:38 – When Coaching Feels Stuck: Referral or Recommitment?
09:17 – Turning the Lens Inward: The Coach’s Growth Opportunity
13:06 – Simplicity, Curiosity, and the Power of Reflection
13:30 – Final Takeaway: Staying Curious with Every Client
💬 Notable Quotes
"...how real are these modes and do they really or as much at least reflect my own growth and learning opportunities and shifting opportunities, thinking opportunities as a coach." [09:17]
"...sometimes you have to start with something simple. Maybe spotting the simplicity of a couple of modes and then letting that drive the curiosity." [13:06]
🎧 Listen now to reflect on your own assumptions, reconnect with curiosity, and rediscover your belief in every client’s potential.
#CoachingPodcast #PrimeSpace #EliasScultori #CoachingMindset #LeadershipCoaching #ICFCoaches #ProfessionalCoaching #CoachDevelopment #SelfReflection #CuriosityInCoaching #JoeMillerACC #MCCCoach #CoachingGrowth #CoachLearning
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Transcript
Introduction to Prime Space Podcast
00:00:03
Speaker
Welcome to Prime Space, a PRIME Coaching Academy podcast with your host, Elias Scultori Coaches, it's wonderful to be here with you. I am not alone today.
Meet Joe Miller: Leadership Coach for Next-Gen Leaders
00:00:19
Speaker
I have Joe Miller. Hello, Joe. How are you?
00:00:25
Speaker
Elias. How are you? I am doing great and thank you for coming here and spending this time with us at PRIME SPACE Joe Miller is an ACC coach.
00:00:37
Speaker
He is a leadership coach focused on next generation leaders.
Joe's Personal Insights and Adventures
00:00:42
Speaker
And he likes to work with our clients that moving from individual contributor to management and leadership. Joe ah lives in Atlanta, Georgia. And he I was asking him, Joe, what is one thing that you personally that you would like to share with the audience? And he said, I love to laugh, but I can't laugh right now.
00:01:06
Speaker
Because I just did this whitewater kayaking and I am all sore all over. So, Joe, thank you for it thank you for your adventurous soul. Thank you. I feel like this is a continuation of that adventure, but it's an honor to be here.
00:01:21
Speaker
It's wonderful to have you here.
Q&A: Client Modes in Coaching
00:01:23
Speaker
Joe is a regular listener of PRIME SPACE and he reached out to me with a question. and I thought that that question was something interesting for us to discuss here at PRIME SPACE So, Joe, what is the question?
00:01:41
Speaker
Thanks, Elias. And yes, a listener from the beginning, and thank you for all that you do in terms of providing this this content to the coaching community. It's very meaningful and helpful.
00:01:53
Speaker
Hopefully today's the same. the So the question is something I've noticed, and it's taken a while for this to come up in my practice, and I feel very lucky. But the thing is, is that it feels as though clients show up in one of a couple of modes, you can almost call them approaches.
00:02:17
Speaker
And this is overly reductive and everyone's on a continuum and everyone can show up differently from day to day. And I'm always open to that and I get it.
Understanding Client Modes: Confident vs. Insecure
00:02:25
Speaker
But in any given day with any given client right now at this moment, I can see someone in mode one who is confident, they're on the stair the spiral staircase going up, they're optimistic,
00:02:38
Speaker
They've got this, yeah you know, faith, a higher faith, faith in themselves. They're capable. They're willing. They're creative. They have a clarity of thought.
00:02:50
Speaker
Doesn't mean they're not without a problem to solve or something deeper on their mind. And in fact, they usually come more prepared. That's this mode one. Then there's mode two.
00:03:04
Speaker
which I'm really just starting to encounter and notice lately. i've I've had one or two clients who've shown up with more of an insecurity, a lacking mindset. therere They're kind of marching down the spiral staircase. They're not having the success. And so the lack of success is breeding doubt.
00:03:23
Speaker
It might be something very specific they're focused on, like a job search, and they're just not having luck yet. And so... they are losing or lacking faith and they're retreating to old habits and things that they know, even though those things aren't working, they tend to show up as a victim or a villain or a hero, kind of this, that, that, that triad that we've, we've heard of.
00:03:47
Speaker
And so it's very difficult to get them creative and empowered towards their own success and and and moving towards new ways of being. And so, I'm just wondering how we can lean on the prime model and the core competencies and think about these two modes, especially that second one, which is just more challenging for me right now.
Curiosity and Reflective Practice in Coaching
00:04:09
Speaker
yeah Well, think of thank you for the question and thank you for this for noticing and reflecting. So first of all, you're showing reflective practice, which is so beautiful for all of us to think about this idea of what is truly happening with my clients?
00:04:25
Speaker
How are my clients showing up? what is happening in the in the sessions and the relationship that we are building with the client. And you are noticing that there is this distinction between a client that comes ready, full of energy, direction, focus, and a client that it is lacking a little bit of that energy, lacking a little bit of that faith in themselves or even the motivation.
00:04:52
Speaker
But what is interesting is that that client still shows up. and it' still coming to the coaching session. So somehow they haven't lost their hope. It's fair. And I think it also provides a pathway to something that is always an answer to a coaching question, which is how can we stay curious longer?
00:05:14
Speaker
So getting curious about what is bringing them to that coaching session each week. In curiosity, i always say curiosity is the fuel of coaching. Whatever is happening in the coaching conversation, whether if it's coming from the client or if it's coming from us, how can we look at this that is coming up ah with curiosity? Because there is always something there for us to investigate. And it is in that investigation that we are going to learn and that the client is going to learn.
Client Engagement in the Coaching Process
00:05:47
Speaker
When do we know that coaching just isn't working? Maybe it's time for a referral to a different type of coach or or mode of support for this person, or maybe it's just time to let go of the client altogether.
00:06:03
Speaker
Yeah. So many kind of points to consider here. There is this aspect of coachability. Is the client really ready ah to engage in the coaching conversation?
00:06:14
Speaker
One of the definitions of coaching that I like the most is starts, it's a long definition, but it starts with ah a phrase, coaching is a thought-provoking process with a willing individual. You know, we say in coaching,
00:06:29
Speaker
The client does the work. The client is the one who does the work. So if the client is not willing to do the work, there isn't anything that we can do. And this is not in coaching.
00:06:40
Speaker
It can be coaching, therapy, consulting, mentoring, teaching, facilitating, whatever it is. We need to be very mindful that we don't have the power over this other individual. This other individual will do whatever they want to do.
00:06:53
Speaker
In coaching, and even more so, ah because coaching is the moment for the client to to process, to think things through. If they are not willing and ready to do it, I don't have a magic wand to go and make them make them do that.
The Role of Curiosity in Coaching Effectiveness
00:07:10
Speaker
However, especially the this situation, the client keeps coming back. So I am like, what is bringing this client back? What is what is it that the client is looking for here?
00:07:25
Speaker
what is What makes the client show up this way? They are paying for this time. They are hiring us. What is it that they really want out of the coaching conversation?
00:07:39
Speaker
And this is something for me to, a moment for me to reflect on, on the idea. Yes, I may have a preference to work with clients that are ready and ready to go and and and direct.
00:07:50
Speaker
I may have a tendency to prefer that. However, if I take a step back, if I pay attention What is about that preference in me?
00:08:03
Speaker
What is happening with me that perhaps some judgment or some labeling of either one of these modes that prevents me from really embracing this individual as whole, resourceful, and capable?
00:08:19
Speaker
And this is the the primary point for me here in this conversation, regardless of the mode that the client shows up, mode one, mode two, or mode 150, because there are so many modes, right?
00:08:33
Speaker
What is my mindset?
Perceptions of Clients: Deficient vs. Capable
00:08:36
Speaker
Am I looking at this client as there is a deficiency here or the client is not doing the job that they are supposed to do?
00:08:44
Speaker
Or am I seeing them as whatever way they show up, it's who they are and it's how they are right now in the moment that they are in their lives.
00:08:59
Speaker
What can I do here to support them where they are and what are my expectations that they are supposed to be a or Z? Can I accept them for who they are in the moment?
00:09:14
Speaker
What do you think?
00:09:17
Speaker
No, it's beautiful. And I think it comes back to part of the notes that I sent you about this topic, which is ah how to how real are these modes and do they really, or as much at least, reflect my own growth and learning opportunities and and and shifting opportunities, thinking opportunities as a coach, right? And i think i think both are true.
00:09:39
Speaker
um I think both are are definitely true. I will say this at the end of the day, just like we say, it's not coaching without movement or action.
00:09:51
Speaker
um Well, OK,
Aligning Coaching with Client's Definition of Success
00:09:55
Speaker
that gives us some hope and something to cling to with someone who doesn't show up as motivated or seemingly as capable, even in their own mind. Speaking of meeting someone where they're at,
00:10:08
Speaker
ah But, or i maybe I should say, and. yeah Thank you. so so so So then how does success factor in, really? And I think this is, you know, their definition of success and whether they're experiencing any or not. And how does that factor in to our our approach and our overall view of what's happening with a client in these modes?
00:10:37
Speaker
And you arrived at a wonderful place here ah because we may have our own definition of success. We may have our own definition of what is action, what is movement, what is success, what is value.
00:10:52
Speaker
And this particular client may have a different definition of action, movement, value, success, etc. So who is the one setting the definition for that particular process with that particular client?
00:11:09
Speaker
And it's not that we are simply going to accept whatever, but perhaps even as a as an agreement that we are setting with the client to find out what is success for that particular client. And it may not be the one that resonates the most with us.
00:11:28
Speaker
We may have a tendency to prefer well ah other clients with other modes. But can I help this client to move forward based on their definition of moving forward, not my definition of moving forward?
00:11:48
Speaker
Yes, and I think this is the ultimate path for curiosity. And also um the the it's the beginning of the coaching relationship and it's the beginning of the coaching call. And it's also the middle and the end in many cases, right? So and so as I think about one particular client right now, which I'm relating back to, it's get that agreement, get that focus as as quickly as you can.
00:12:14
Speaker
But it's as long as it takes, right, Elias? Yeah,
Adapting Coaching Styles to Client Needs
00:12:18
Speaker
absolutely. in and and understand what is the the client's approach, the client's expectation, right?
00:12:26
Speaker
and then be able to flex our own style to support this individual to move in the direction that they are moving. It's not that we are not going to challenge them, that we are not going to ask questions. They're clarifying questions to support them in seeing different paradigms.
00:12:48
Speaker
But is it that I am expecting that the coaching process will we go in a certain way that I want it to go, or is it that I am there to support the coaching process to go in a way that suits the client?
00:13:02
Speaker
I think that that is a core point to
Navigating Complexities in Client Modes
00:13:06
Speaker
think about here. So, Joe, as we close our conversation here, what but what are the takeaways? That there's so much nuance here as as I knew there was, but um sometimes you have to start with something simple, ah maybe spotting the simplicity of a couple of modes and then letting that drive the curiosity and then staying really diligent about the overarching agreement
00:13:36
Speaker
what the client expects, needs, where they are. And I think in that nuance, in that curiosity, in that exploration and excavation, there can also be excitement, challenge, and an interest on the coach's part that maybe, for me at least, comes a little more naturally when someone's more in mode one. Yeah.
00:14:01
Speaker
But ah still makes me want to genuinely be there and support and and coach yeah someone who might be in mode two at the moment.
00:14:12
Speaker
Oh, Joe, thank you so much for this question. And thank you so much for this conversation. We did not cover like one fifth of this topic because there is so much here.
00:14:23
Speaker
But I hope that this was helpful to you. And I hope that this was helpful to the listeners.
Listener Engagement and Future Topics
00:14:28
Speaker
And listeners here, Joe just sent me an email and he had a question and we are here having this podcast. So perhaps you have a question and you have or a thought or a topic that you would like to answer.
00:14:42
Speaker
talk about and maybe you can come and become um a guest here at at PRIME SPACE as well. So reach out and let me know and we can record a session with you
Closing and Calls to Action
00:14:52
Speaker
as well. Thank you so much for listening.
00:14:54
Speaker
Please share this episode with other coaches and don't forget to subscribe yourself. Don't forget our YouTube channel and we'll talk to you next time.