🎃🔪 EPISODE 170: HALLOWEEN 2026 🔪🎃

Transcript

Speaker: Fri-Gay the 13th Horror Podcast is a proud independent podcast. To learn more about the show, visit Fri-Gay13.com. Okay, so before we start, ah why is there a little symbol drawn on your your wrist in Sharpie?

Speaker: well It's for the committee. What committee? The Neighborhood Harvest Festival committee. I joined. You hate committees. You left a group chat because someone replied with a gif.

Speaker: Yeah, but they have snacks. What kind of snacks? it's It's mostly pumpkin. The meetings are at the old sanitarium, or I guess I should say former sanitarium. It's a wellness center now. You know, lots of robes.

Speaker: Robes? Like a spa? Yeah, like like a spa where everyone stands in a circle and chants. That's not a spa, Andrew. That's ah that's a cult. that's a That's a druid cult. And I've seen this movie. I've seen this movie twice. There's a producer's cut.

Speaker: They asked about you. Why would they ask about me? They need someone for their final sacrifice of innocent blood. Oh, then they've got the wrong gay. I haven't been innocent since the first Bush administration.

Speaker: I told them that. They said it's more of a vibe thing. No, I'm out. I'm faking my death. I'm moving to California, changing my name, running a boarding school. You can't run a boarding school. Jamie Lee Curtis did it. Three glasses of wine deep. I'll be headmistress Carrie Tate. Nobody will ever find me.

Speaker: They already know about the boarding school. How? That's where the next meeting is. Bring a dish. It's episode 170, Halloween 2026. the writing on the wall, the whisper in the classroom.

Speaker: Marjorie Green, and I approve this message. To save America, stop socialism, and stop China. Stay in time, we honor thee from life to death to rise.

Speaker: in real life. Doubters, the doomsters, the gloomsters, they are going to get it wrong. Call up in the movies. Where are you gonna go?

Speaker: Where are you gonna run? Where are you gonna hide? Nowhere. Because there's no one like you left. What do we want? Justice!

Speaker: When do we want it? Now! Let's go! What are you waiting for, huh?

Speaker: I want you to know that the movement we started is only just beginning. Sometimes that better. For several years, Amber Jared and her husband Michael have put up huge Halloween inflatable dragon displays in their front yard for families to enjoy. they say it takes about 12 to 18 hours to set up. It's a lot of work. You know, it's it's not professional, but we put a lot of like heart and care into it.

Speaker: That work was ruined in a matter of minutes when two people disguised in dark clothing and masks walked up in the middle of the night and vandalized the display. The couple were in Leavenworth at the time. They returned to a big mess, then watched what happened on their home surveillance video.

Speaker: At first, it looked like they were trying to just unplug the dragons, but then when we listened to the audio, we could hear the slashing.

Speaker: Big slash here. Yeah, with all of them, they made sure to to get them multiple times. Welcome to another episode of Fry Gay, the 13th Horror Podcast. My name is Maddie.

Speaker: And I'm Andrew. And if this is the first time that you're with us at Fry Gay, the 13th Horror Podcast, welcome to the podcast that talks all about horror, horror in real life and in the movies from an LGBT perspective.

Speaker: And Andrew, this is episode 170. One seven zero. oh my goodness. We're working hard over here. And this is like i like that our Halloween episode is happening not on an even number. It just feels right to me. It seems just like kismet. Yeah. It feels like it's supposed to be. um So it's Halloween 2026, and we do an annual a Halloween episode every year. um Obviously, if we didn't, I think that would just be stupid. And this is sort of perfectly timed to come out right around Halloween. So, ah you know, look, Andrew, i don't mean to speak for you, but...

Speaker: Part of my burp. um Listen, I burp a lot as I've gotten older. Maybe I maybe i always did, but it's happening more now. Anyways, um I hope that you're having a great hall Halloween season. Everybody listening.

Speaker: Like, Andrew, I can tell you one thing that I did to get in the Halloween spirit was I ordered a pumpkin Yankee candle from Amazon. And so that arrived.

Speaker: you You went fancy with that Yankee shit. i should Well, listen, you know over here it's expensive as hell to get that kind of thing. and Even though when I looked at the bottom of the candle, they're apparently made in the Czech Republic here, which is interesting. So it's just just across the pond. Yeah, but just across the pond. It was just funny because we we were just in the Czech Republic. We were just in Prague, um which, Andrew, I got to tell you, not to talk about a trip for this episode, but to talk about a trip for this episode.

Speaker: um Prague is great. if If any of you are ever visiting over here, and you're in Europe for whatever reason, make Prague something that you think about doing. It is a beautiful city. It's like going into fucking Disney World. it' it's It's like a Disney castle everywhere kind of thing. um And there's lots of little like spooky things there too. Like we, we spent some time in the graveyard or cemetery, I should say, where they filmed bits of Nosferatu, um the latest one from Robert Eggers. ah We went to this really great bar called the Nightmare Horror Bar, which was just like one of those like themed bar kind of things. And we thought it was going to be kind of cheesy, to be honest.

Speaker: But we got there and it was great. We had so much fun. It was really, really cool. um There's like a bunch of little ghost tours and stuff you can do, but it was um it was wonderful. So, you know, look, i'm I'm in the Halloween spirit, Andrew. How about you?

Speaker: Fun. I'm so jealous that you get to do those little trips like that and not spend an arm and a leg to get to get there. Well, you know what? I'll tell you what, though. that That is the other thing I'll say, and I won't talk about it too long, but Prague is actually wonderful.

Speaker: really cheap and to give you like like the big mac test kind of thing the first beer that that i had there we went to this place called locale l-o-k-a-l it's sort of like a big beer hall but they've got like traditional czech food like you know sausages and goulash and all that which is delicious and schnitzel and all that the beer that i got which was fantastic It was two euros and 33 cents. Oh, wow.

Speaker: that's like That's like college prices. Exactly. So like it's that kind of place where you can go and not spend all that much money and still have a great time. So it was really cool. Cool. Yeah. For me, it's just, it's quintessential Midwestern Halloween time here. miss the Midwest. I do.

Speaker: You don't, you don't have to do much for get to get into the Halloween spirit around, you know, Illinois, I would say Illinois, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Ohio, Indiana, Michigan, those, those states, if you live in one of those, you just kind of know when it's Halloween time, like the leaves start changing. yeah I miss that. You know,

Speaker: And, you know, we have a really ah good neighborhood for families. So there's a ton of decorations and everyone's putting stuff out. And it's just, it's real easy just to take a stroll through the neighborhood and just feel like, Ooh, yeah, it's Halloween time. So I've just been doing that, taking my nightly walks, getting my knee worked out ah and, uh, and, uh,

Speaker: put up some decorations of our own and nice and just been doing that kind of stuff and watching spooky shit, of course. Hell I'm trying think if there's been any big standouts this year so far. I'll tell you, there's been some good spooky shit out there, Andrew, quite frankly. Yeah, yeah I'm just trying to think there's any like Halloween specials or anything that I hope.

Speaker: Trixie Mattel has a new Halloween special on YouTube. That might be a fun for people to check out. Oh, I will definitely do that. That's And annually, every year, we watch the... The one weird thing that I always have to do every single year is I have to watch the Garfield Halloween special. And thankfully, it's on Disney Plus now, so I can easily watch that. Where's my lasagna?

Speaker: It's so funny because every time ah Michael comes home from the ah yeah from the grocery store, he always like picks a candy like around this time of year. Like and he always comes in and he goes, candy, candy, candy, candy. I can hear Michael doing that right now in my head. Because that's the ah that's the Garf. That's from the Garfield special. So that'll be something that we definitely but we definitely do. That's awesome. might want to revisit that Muppets ah from a couple years ago where they did the Haunted, ah what was that, the Haunted Mansion. fuck yeah. That was a fun, yeah.

Speaker: Yeah. We're just getting into the spirit. That's cool. We're going to, I think we're going to do, um because every time I do Halloween in Dublin, I always end up disappointed. I think I've talked about this before. It's just like, it's like nothing is is right in Dublin. It's funny because that's where Halloween was invented. Yeah. In Ireland, I mean. It was it was invented just a little bit north in in County Meath. And i'll I'll talk about it today at a place called the Hill of the Ward. And right up there, there is a festival that we're going to go to called the Puka Festival, P-U-C-A.

Speaker: And they do it, I think it starts on like the Thursday because Halloween's on a Saturday, I think this year. yeah um So I think it starts on like Wednesday or Thursday in Athboy and Trim, which are two towns right up there by by the hill of the ward. um And this is like a bunch of like, you know, they they have like bands that are scheduled to play and actually some pretty good bands. um for example uh glenn hansard was supposed to play before he died this year oh no um i know right but like the water boys are playing and hothouse flowers and like some other some other pretty cool irish bands and um but they also do like on halloween they do the lighting of the samuel fire and they do this fucking thing where they march up the hill of the ward which is where the Druids first did Halloween back in the day. Cool.

Speaker: Which is, I'm super excited. i've I've been up in that area before. And if y'all ever visit here, anyone listening, um that part of of Ireland is called the Boyne Valley. And it's where a lot of um of of of like the most important sites in ancient Ireland are. It's where they are. So like Newgrange, for example, which is called Bruneboigne. And that's ah it's it's it's the huge passage tomb, which is older than the pyramids, for God's sake.

Speaker: And that tomb, if you were to like weigh it, I think it weighs like four titanics or something like that. oh my God. But like all these really cool ancient sites where, you know, they would have done a lot of rituals and this and that. They're all right there.

Speaker: And I can tell you, like when you go there, I know I'm kind of naturally into this shit anyway, but when you go there, it does feel like you've stepped into somewhere different. It feels a little bit like you've gone over a veil or something. and So it's really, really cool. it's worth your time when whenever you visit. So looking forward to seeing what that festival is all about. Hopefully it doesn't suck because I got drive up there, but it should be fun.

Speaker: Are you guys staying there or just going for like the day? I think we're just going to go for the day. and And I don't want to be out at night because, man, people people be crazy driving around Ireland. I got to tell you.

Speaker: Like people, i don't know what the fuck it is. And maybe I'm just an old man now and I'm cranky. But people don't know how to fucking drive. I don't know what else to say. That's it. I think that's a universal knowledge thing. God almighty. Jesus Christ. I swear to God. But in general, I mean, look, you know, Halloween is um one of our favorite times of the year. We wouldn't have a fucking horror podcast for God's sake.

Speaker: And, you know, look, like I said, by by the time that this comes out, it will be, you know, just into that week of Halloween and hopefully y'all are having a really great time getting ready for it, picking out your costumes, thinking of the candy that you're going to eat and all the people that you're going to murder that, oh, never mind. I didn't, I mean to say that last part. um Andrew, what are you talking about today for our Halloween episode?

Speaker: Yeah, I've got a couple of topics. I figured that we would talk a little bit about kind of the modern war on Halloween. that would interesting. Of course, as the U.S. gets more and more radicalized towards a Christian nation, of course, there's like new things about Halloween that people are complaining about. And then all the while, all the while, can I just interrupt for a moment there? yeah yeah they They'll be cheering on transphobe JK Rowling because she hates trans people.

Speaker: Do you know what I mean? Like, guarantee you they will. Anyways, I'm sorry. just had to say it. No, no, no. You're not you're not alone. You're cheering on all the pedophiles and rapists that are running our country. Exactly. Awesome. exactly um um And then I have a little bit of a throwback to the Halloween mask murders, which are from 1957. And then I figured, you know, because we can't talk about AI enough, I'd talk about some of the new AI ah things that are happening with ghosts and how they are now dead.

Speaker: Basically, it's a new it's a new batch of grifters that are trying to say things are haunted and putting pictures and stuff out there that are just not real. See, you know what sucks about that is like for the people like me, and and I think like you, that believe in this kind of stuff...

Speaker: it just know Or want to. or Or want to. It just makes us look like crackpots and we're not. like we've we had We've had actual experiences before any of this bullshit came about where like you know the things that we experienced, that that was something real for us, whether you believe that or not. And now you've got these people, like you said, just grifting and that just sucks. It's bullshit. Yeah. I think I saw... This is goingnna this is going to really disappoint you, but I think I saw that...

Speaker: I read it in an article this week that it has now tipped the scales of AI over real people on social media. It has now 51% AI and 49% real people that is now posting on social media, which is insane. You know what? It doesn't disappoint me. It it it confirms what I already believed. And um but it does it does make me sad.

Speaker: i think it makes me sad. And this is look, this is not an AI episode, but... It makes me sad because i think like a lot of people, and maybe you, I don't know, but like there was once a time that I really believed that social media could be something really, really good for all of us.

Speaker: Yeah, something that could could literally connect the world. Yes, connect us and help us learn and help us teach and help us do great things. and we've just decided to use it for...

Speaker: bullshit and for robots to talk to each other, you know? um Andrew, what I'll be talking about is exactly what I was talking about just a minute ago, which is the hill of the ward. I'll give everyone... Why don't you start with that? Because I'm interested to hear like actually like like some of the actual like things behind it.

Speaker: Got it. So ah so Hill of the War, like I said, is in County Meath. So when you come to Ireland, it is likely that you will probably fly into one of two places, either Shannon if you arrive in the west or Dublin if you arrive in the east. It is unlikely that you would fly to Belfast because why on earth would you do that? That would be...

Speaker: Kind of silly. Anyways, if you fly into Dublin and you're in That's a little local humor for you right there. Yeah, you can just avoid that. Anyways, um if you if if you if you arrive in Dublin and you stay in Dublin for a couple of days, which you should because Dublin is fun. It's the capital and there's lots of stuff to do here. ah But if you go north, found in... Maybe an hour, hour and a half, basically, you'll be in County Meath. And County Meath is fairly ah rural. that there's There's a lot of farmland out there. So a lot of the people that live there would, would you know, own a farm or live adjacent to a farm.

Speaker: um And it is a really beautiful part of the country. It's not quite as like big mountains or like big cliffs over the sea, but it's sort of like rolling beautiful hills.

Speaker: And, ah you know, and especially in the summer and in the fall, like you know lots of nice colors and foliage. And like I said, lots of ancient sites that you can go and visit. So um one of them that I mentioned before was Bruna Bojna or Newgrange. That is something that if you visit, you need to get tickets for like as soon as you think about it kind of thing, because the tickets are always gone for it. And it is an incredible experience. Like you must, you must, you must do it. It's so worth your time. um But then there's also other things around there, like for example, the Hill of Tara and the Hill of Tara.

Speaker: is uh it's on a hill go figure and the hill of tara is where the ancient kings of ireland had to go to be crowned as king and there are also passage tombs there and there's interesting things to look at and all this other stuff there's another site called lock crew l-o-u-g-h-c-r-e-w manuel and i went there in the summer it is fucking cool as fuck that place it's so, so interesting. You have to climb a pretty steep hill to get there. But once you're up there, like I was saying, it really does feel like you have entered another world, like something spiritual, something in another realm.

Speaker: And when you're up there, you can see all around Ireland. It's so, so cool. um And unfortunately, all the ancient sites on La Crewe, which for some reason, Andrew, are not protected by anything.

Speaker: It's... It's bizarre. There's no fences around them. There's no like gates around them. Whereas like if you go if you go to Newgrange, it is very protected. Like there's no way that you can get to it. Everything is sort of cordoned off, all that kind of stuff. La Creu is ancient, very, very ancient. There there are beautiful cave, like that not cave, but like there are beautiful like ah carvings in the stone of like spirals and suns and rainbows.

Speaker: You know, all the stuff that we don't know what those ancient people meant. It's just there for us to you know try to try to figure out and try to try to wrestle with now in the modern era. And unfortunately, about a month and a half ago, those sites were desecrated by somebody. So, of course, really sad news. I think it was probably some kooky Christians, if I'm being completely honest, but who knows. So right by Hill of Tara and all that, though, is a place called the Hill of the Ward. It is an athboy, A-T-H-B-O-Y.

Speaker: um And I've been right by it before. When I went to Hill of Tara this summer, I drove over to the Hill of the Ward. But like it's just like the hill of the ward is just on someone's farm.

Speaker: Like it's just there. And so I couldn't figure out where to park and like where to leave the car to actually take the trail up there. So I was like, you know what, I'm at least I'm over here that that even that's kind of cool. When Halloween comes around, I'll do the big tour, which I'll do, of course, next ah whenever Halloween comes around in in a couple of weeks.

Speaker: So a little bit about it. um And this is from a website called VoicesOfTheDawn.com. And Voices of the Dawn, and it's a pretty cool website. I've never seen it before, but it's a lot about just like Irish history and stuff like that. So give it a shot. um And this little article that they had on there,

Speaker: ah is coming from multiple sources. It's in the Creative Commons, but a lot of interesting stuff. And so, ah first of all, the Gwelga for Hill of hill of Ward, i keep saying Hill of the Ward, it's the Hill of Ward, is, I believe it's Tlatchka, which is T-L-A-C-H-T-G-A in English. Y'all can't spell over there. I don't know what's happening. No, just joking. Listen, when when you when you guys When you guys come over, I'll do my favorite test for people who arrive here, which is just giving you some words on a paper and making you pronounce them. It it will be hilarious. ah But Tlotska is a low hill near Athboy. And in medieval tradition, it is said to be the place where the first Samhain, and this is what people commonly say Samhain, got some news, folks. It's a Gwailga word, and it is pronounced Samhain. So where the first Samhain fire of the Celtic New Year was lit. The tradition is why it's often called the birthplace of Halloween. And archeology now shows that it was a major ritual and gathering site for well over 2000 years. So first, just a little bit about the site.

Speaker: It's modest looking. Like I said, i could barely even find it myself, if I'm being honest. um It's about 40 meters above the surrounding field. And like I said, it's in somebody's farm field and about 119 meters above sea level. So it's not too far up. um On a clear day from there, just like I was saying from from Hill of Tara and La Crewe, you can see the other big ritual sites from the top.

Speaker: um And that's really interesting to think about because you know if you think about the way that they would have lit fires back in the day, seeing fires on those big hills would have been a form of communication for one thing.

Speaker: ah The summit of the Hill of Ward has four rings of banks and ditches. They're each about 140 to 150 meters across. um It's roughly about 170 meters, including the outer ditch. And underneath is an older three-walled hill fort. And it's about 195 meters wide. And that is from the late Bronze Age. So the last big archaeology bit that was done there, i think, was in 2016. So it's been a while, um but that that's where they would have gotten a lot of this information. ah LIDAR scans, which is a form of radar, ah they found more features around the hill, including a large saucer enclosure, burial mounds, ring ditches, and traces of a medieval sentiment. So some really cool stuff there.

Speaker: Now, when it comes to the Samhain fire legend, according to Geoffrey Keating, a 17th century historian, every hearth in Ireland was put out on the eve of November 1st, or All Saints Day.

Speaker: They were then relit from one great bonfire on Tlatska, and torches carried the new flame out to Tara, La Creu, and beyond. Samhain marked the end of the old year and the start of the new one. Livestock were slaughtered, the fields were bare, and the boundary but between the living and the dead was thought to be at its thinnest. Or, as we say in Hocus Pocus, it's the one night of the year where the spirits of the dead can come back to Earth.

Speaker: People use offerings, disguises, and fortune telling to deal with the wandering dead. And these are the roots of modern costumes, jack-o'-lanterns, and ghost stories. Of course, if you've never seen one of the original jack-o'-lanterns, which is basically a turnip with a face in it, you should look it up because it's terrifying when you see it. is spooky dookie. Like any any fucking orange-ass pumpkin you got out there, it ain't got shit on this. um Anyways, the myth of Tlotka herself, because that is actually someone's name, that she was the daughter of the powerful druid Muckruth.

Speaker: ah She traveled east with her father to learn every kind of magic in the world. And with Muckruth and the heretic sorcerer Simon Magus, she made three magical objects. The Rothramach or the rowing wheel, a wheel of doom. And anyone who saw it went blind. Anyone who heard it went deaf. And anyone who touched it died.

Speaker: oh not God. Not a great object. You know, I don't know. Don't don't put that in your fucking stocking. a imagine maybe let's maybe Let's maybe bury that somewhere. right Yeah, ah she ah of else ah I can tell you one major political leader who who we could give that to. I'll leave their name out of it. ah The other two magical objects that she made were a magic stone and a magic pillar. How about that? One medieval twist claims that Mark Ruth was the man who beheaded John the Baptist.

Speaker: I sort of don't think that's true. Scholars disagree about what the wheel was. Some compare it to a bull roarer, a spinning instrument used in initiation rites. Later Christian versions turn it into a doomsday ship that will crush heretics. Her reputation, Slotka, exactly. Her reputation, Slotka, changes from version to version.

Speaker: In some, she heroically breaks the wheel. In others, she is Simon Magus' ally. And later, texts blame her, once again, for John the Baptist's death. I don't know how John the Baptist got involved in this, but I just want to say, ancient biblical era and the medieval era,

Speaker: Those are two different eras, people. right Maybe there's a disconnection. Anyways, how the hill got its name. In two versions, Simon Magus's three sons raped her as punishment for her magic.

Speaker: There we go. Men fucking it up as always. She returned to Ireland pregnant and gave birth on the hill to triplets. Dorb, or in this because i think would be Dorv, or Derv, maybe. Derv, Kuma, and Mwak. Okay. each by a different father. She died after the birth and a fortress was built on her grave. According to the lore, as long as the sons' names are remembered, no foreign disaster will strike Ireland.

Speaker: Keep that in mind. She belongs to a group of mythic women whose deaths are tied to sacred sites. Taya at Tara, Taltchu at Taltown, and Maka at Eamon Maka. I had to get my guelga going there. Christian writers were noticeably more hostile to her than the others, possibly because she sat uncomfortably between native religious power and forbidden magic. So a little bit about what the archaeologists actually found at the Hill of ah at the hill Ward. ah So once again, the site was built in at least three major phases. The first was a late Bronze Age hill fort, exactly what it sounds like. and then the four ring enclosure built in the in the Iron Age, or the early medieval period, then it was rebuilt several times.

Speaker: Further remodeling in the 11th to the 13th centuries, possibly including a central mound that may have been an early moat with a timber structure on top. All phases show heavy burning and lots of animal bone, so that points to big fires and feasting, and some of the burning may have also come from metalworking, pottery, or glass making. There's no sign of everyday living, so it was most likely a very sacred place for occasional gatherings and rituals.

Speaker: And one striking find was an infant of about seven to 10 months who was buried around the fifth century AD next to a ritual deposit of cow bones.

Speaker: Isn't that interesting? And a similar child burial is known from Tara. The Drisog Horde, or a set of gold objects, was found in 1953, about three kilometers east of the hill.

Speaker: So... um That's a little history for you on where Halloween first really took place in Ireland, which I think is really cool. And like I said, you know, it's it's I'm going to the Puka Festival there in just a couple of weeks. And it's kind of cool that, you know, there is still the celebration of of Halloween taking place right where it was born all those centuries ago.

Speaker: That's really, really fun and very interesting. I had never heard any of that before. Happy Halloween, Andrew. Yeah. I hate that it... Or as we say here in Ireland, happy Halloween.

Speaker: I hate that it involved rape and death and killing, but what else doesn't in this year? and that This year of our world. That's it. um All right. Let's talk a little bit about the war on Halloween. oh this This is going to piss me off, isn't it? It's going to piss me off. Yeah. Believe it or not, the war on Halloween is alive and well in 2026. And one of the latest battlegrounds is the elementary school.

Speaker: ah This is not shocking to me because it's always about fucking kids and how we have to protect the children. and God forbid the children. about But but but ah but let's let's let's not protect the children from guns, though.

Speaker: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Not from the real threats. We need it from Halloween. Exactly, right. all right. um In Falmouth, Massachusetts, school officials announced in September 2026 that they were canceling their traditional elementary school Halloween parades. Oh, my God. The district cited concerns about inclusion, student behavior, and the unusually high absenteeism during Halloween celebrations.

Speaker: Parents weren't having it. ah After a considerable backlash, the district reversed its decision on September 30th, allowing the parades to proceed this year. At an October 13th school committee meeting, Superintendent Lori Dewar acknowledged that officials hadn't adequately involved the community and Falmouth isn't alone. Schools in Melrose, Needham, and Nuroboro, um Massachusetts, i need to put on my my accent for those for those towns, sorry about that, Northboro have faced similar controversies over costumes and celebrations. What's interesting is that this isn't necessarily the old religious argument that Halloween promotes Satanism. Today's disagreements increasingly involve how schools balance tradition, religious differences, student needs, and inclusivity.

Speaker: ah But the controversy goes beyond whether little Timmy can wear his Spider-Man costume ah to school. and so In October of 2025, teachers at Cienega High School in Arizona wore fake blood-covered shirts reading, Problem Solved, a math-themed costume that they also had worn the previous year. After photos circulated online, people falsely accused them of mocking the assassination of conservative activist Charlie Earth.

Speaker: The teachers received hundreds of threats, according to school officials. And just this week, New York City lawmakers demanded that Amazon remove a Halloween witch decoration featuring the Star of David on its spell book.

Speaker: ah arguing that the imagery could reinforce anti-Semitism stereotypes. these are all These are all very different controversies, but together they illustrate how Halloween has become a flashpoint for debates about religion, identity, offensive imagery, and public expression.

Speaker: ah The frightening part isn't necessarily that people disagree about Halloween, it's how quickly a costume or decoration can escalate into threats, public outrage, or accusations of malicious intent.

Speaker: What do you think about that? I mean, i i think it's as usual. It's just selective um outrage. And I think that the the the I don't want to say the dawn of that that that's the phrase coming to my head because that that's not true.

Speaker: I was going to say say the dawn of Christian nationalism, but but the reality is that Christian nationalism has been a part of the American ethos from the very beginning. um And so, and and I think it's important, you know, like I don't i don't need to keep like defending, um you know, as I might call them real Christians, but because I don't have to. But I think it's important to to remind everyone that there are different types of Christians out there and that there are Christian nationalists who are relying on a completely bonehead, made-up,

Speaker: psychopathic, murderous, racist, terrible theology that it is a false theology. It is the same kind of theology that would have defended slavery. it is the same kind of theology that would defend genocide.

Speaker: And it's the same theology that is practiced by our vice president who claims to be a Catholic, though he is not. um It is the same theology practiced by the secretary of defense. I'm not saying secretary of war in America. Um, he is, is absolutely part of a church that believes that black people shouldn't like exist and that gay people should be murdered. could go on and on and on. None of that should surprise you. Um, so the selective outrage that they have with things like Halloween or making sure that people say Merry Christmas and not happy holidays, or, you know, I could go on and on and on with different examples. It's just selective outrage. And yeah what I think is something that, that,

Speaker: Christians should be more um concerned with is are you feeding the poor? Are you helping the the the sick? are you Are you healing the sick? Are you are you visiting ah the the prisoner Are you welcoming the stranger or the immigrant? Are you doing those things that we are meant to do to make this world better? And the answer is no. All they care about is what's coming, what they believe is coming after death, which is some crazy paradise where their wives are you know attached to them for eternity and that they get seven more wives. I don't know. If you think about it, Andrew, that sort of theology is not that different from what terrorists believe.

Speaker: Right. Yeah. so the same terrorist who attacked America on 9 11, the same terrorist, frankly, who attacked, you know, people in Israel on October 7th, they all believe the same kind of thing.

Speaker: ah And you know what? Christian nationalists, you do, too. You're just like them. You're the exact same. You may not be bombing people in the same kind of way, but you're equally as terrorizing in so many ways. And um I think that's just it. So here it is. You know, here's something that they can blab about before the midterm elections. ah There's some, they're selling a witch on Amazon. Okay. Like, yeah who who gives a fuck? Who gives a flying fuck? Like, this is what you're, this is the hill that you're going to die on just to keep a culture war going.

Speaker: It's very, it's very sad. Yeah, well, I mean, we have a 24-hour news cycle that perpetuates these things. So it's not surprising. Yeah, I mean, look, you know, you're not going to have another episode from us before Election Day, right? So, you know, ah hopefully none of you are out there thinking you're not going to vote. Or hopefully none of you are out there thinking my vote doesn't count, my vote doesn't matter. ah Just go fucking do it. or if If you haven't done it already, like, what are you waiting for? Like, that that is...

Speaker: there's nothing else you can do right now. So if that's the one thing that you can give a shot so that we can get rid of this bullshit and stop the war on Halloween, Andrew, maybe you should try it. Yeah, I completely agree. If anything, these midterm elections are when your vote does count even more, especially when people are trying to steal it away from you. So agree, my dude. Make sure don't care who you're voting for. You just need to go out there and vote. I'll tell you what, I do. If you are voting for any of his fucking cronies or any of his fucking crump wads,

Speaker: ah that's a new What is crump wad, Andrew? I don't even know what that is. I don't know what a crump wad is. Why have I said word? If you're voting for them, you should stop listening to our show. We don't want you.

Speaker: Yeah. All right. Let's get back on track before we we die on our own hill here. ah Our own Hill of Ward. Yeah. um The Halloween mask murders. um So have you ever heard of this? I had never heard of this. I found it on accident. It doesn't sound familiar to me. So this sounds ah sounds a new.

Speaker: yeah On Halloween night in 1957, 35-year-old Peter Fabiano was relaxing at his home in Sun Valley, California with his wife, Betty, when the doorbell rang about 11 p.m.

Speaker: Most trick-or-treaters had long since gone home. Yeah, I'm not answering my door for trick-or-treaters at 11. I'm so sorry. Hell no. That's too late. Go home. ah But Peter figured someone was making one last attempt to score some candy. So he put on his robe and slippers and answered the door, repeatedly, reportedly joking about how his late late visitor had arrived.

Speaker: And seconds later, he was shot in the chest. His wife he rushed downstairs to find him bleeding on the floor, and he died shortly afterward. The killer had disguised herself in men's clothing, makeup, and a mask.

Speaker: Exploiting the one night of the year when approaching someone's front door in a strange costume wouldn't necessarily raise suspicion. suspicion But this wasn't a random Halloween attack. It was a carefully planned murder involving jealousy, manipulation, and a complicated relationship between three women. Yikes.

Speaker: Investigators eventually discovered that the killer was Golden Pizer, a laboratory technician who had been persuaded to commit the murder by her close companion, Joan Rabel. Rabel had ah previously become close to Betty Fabiano, his wife, during a separation from Peter.

Speaker: So their marriage was kind of out on the rocks, it seems. And accounts of the case suggested their relationship may have been romantic. although the precise nature of it remains uncertain.

Speaker: When Betty reconciled with her husband, Rabble became resentful and allegedly manipulated Pizer into believing Peter was abusive and needed to die.

Speaker: The women deliberately selected Halloween because the costume would provide a convenient disguise. Pizer pulled the trigger trigger while Rabble waited in the nearby car.

Speaker: Both women eventually pleaded guilty to second-degree murder in nineteen in March of 1958 and received sentences of five years to life. It's a fascinating piece of queer-adjacent true crime history, although the possible same-sex relationship shouldn't be confused with the motive itself.

Speaker: Wow, that's crazy. Yeah, I'm waiting for the true crime documentary on this one. Let's go, baby. is that? Come on. I want to know more about ah these two women and how they manipulated each other into basically talking themselves into murder. That's insane. How have you not heard of that before?

Speaker: i know, right? Jeez. All right. And then let's let's end it with this. I think that we kind of all saw this coming, right? With with AI and everything.

Speaker: um forget you blu do you Do you mean certain death and the end of the world? Is that it? I think I met more like people faking like ghosts and hauntings and stuff. Oh, gotcha. Okay. Not necessarily instant death, but... Damn, almost there.

Speaker: um Forget blurry photographs of supposed ghosts or grainy security camera footage of things going bump in the night. In 2026, artificial intelligence has made it a paranormal hoaxes more convincing and easier to create.

Speaker: In June, police in Palembang, Indonesia, questioned a 24-year-old man named Fabrianto, also known as Ibi, after he created and circulated an AI-generated photograph of a polkong, I hope I'm saying that right, a ghost from Indonesian folklore depicted as a corpse wrapped in a burial shroud. The image spread through social media and ah messaging groups, alarming residents who believed supernatural figure had appeared in their back in their neighborhood.

Speaker: ah Police eventually established the photograph was fabricated, the creator admitting to use using AI. Then in August of 2026, another video circulated online supposedly of a woman in Egypt being violently thrown down a staircase by an invisible supernatural force after a cat walked past her.

Speaker: The footage was shared with claims of possession and paranormal activity despite carrying an AI-generated content label. Fact checkers at Lead Stories confirmed the video was not genuine. The incidents demonstrate that AI-generated supernatural imagery is no longer just entertainment. It can create genuine fear, spread misinformation, and even require police intervention. oh my Lord. Jesus. um And the implications go far beyond just fake ghosts. In October of 2026, Reachers were reporting that AI-manipulated image could influence people's memories.

Speaker: ah sometimes causing them to confidently recall events that had never occurred. So, ah you know, remember when we probably like 10 years ago discovered the Mandela effect, this is like now shaping that new effect. um And then meanwhile, in October, on October 15th, Reuters reported that representatives from OpenAI and Meta had warned that A federal judicial advisory committee about the increasingly difficult ah difficulty of distinguishing authentic audio and video evidence from sophisticated deepfakes. Even courts are now confronting the possibility ah that convincing visual evidence may be entirely manufactured.

Speaker: ah consider what it might is Consider what that means for paranormal investigators, amateur ghost hunters, and the millions of people who consume supposedly unexplained footage on TikTok, YouTube, and Instagram.

Speaker: For decades, skeptics could point to the finish line. a Clever editing or an obvious person in a bed sheet. Now someone can manufacture an entire haunting without a ghost, a camera, or even a physical location. Mm-hmm.

Speaker: That is some sad state of affairs, especially like you said before, for people that are interested in this field and want to know more or just, you know, kind of interested in any part of it, because now we never are going to know what's real and what's fake. um It's just a shame. And and and it's... um ah I mean, without once again making this into an AI episode, like, isn't that just sort of what it is now for everything?

Speaker: You know, it's like, um it's it's not it's not just this. It's people just sort of giving everything over to AI and then they just let it think for them in every single way. And if we have a generation of people who are now coming up on AI, and learning on a AI and everything else. And like, look, i I still believe that there are some good uses of it. Like, you know, there are ways that it can help you and, you know, get rid of the dumb mundane shit that you have to do. But as soon as you give over to it thinking for you and writing everything for you and doing everything for you, you're just, you're giving yourself over to...

Speaker: I don't know how else to say it. like a it's It's almost like a cult of AI in that case. And it can make up whatever it wants to make up and it will hallucinate as we all know it does. And if you're not going to fact check it or do anything about it, you're just going to believe it. So i it's it's a real shame because you know part of part of the interesting thing about you know ghosts and UFOs and all of this stuff is that it does require a bit of...

Speaker: searching on your side and yeah you know seeking out stories and talking to people and relationships and you know figuring out you know whether whether this person seems believable to you or not and hearing their experiences and their stories. It's sort of like you know like the the stories that I've told over and over again on this podcast about my mom and I seeing a ah UFO.

Speaker: like you know People can believe that or not, but that's a thing that actually happened to us. And so like, I don't need AI to make that up for me. And I don't need anyone to sit on AI to make it true. um And that' ah that that worries me for this whole um this whole field.

Speaker: I don't want to say genre because it's it's not just a bunch of like fiction. It worries me for the whole field because, well, just like everything else, it's it's kind of ruining everything, isn't it? Yeah. it's's i I just don't know like...

Speaker: yeah I, you know, we'll we'll be dead probably before this happens, but I just don't know, like, where is where is personality going to go Like, it's just, it's, everything is just going to be this. i just, I don't know. it's It's a very strange world to think of. And um it's, that And it sucks for people that really want to be curious because curiosity is being killed.

Speaker: and Yeah, I mean, so I think personality is an interesting aspect of it to look at, isn't it? i think so many people are afraid to have ah a personality in the first place today. yeah and And if you have one, you're you're labeled as cringe. Do you know what i mean? um and And I'm not sure that people... that I shouldn't say people, but I...

Speaker: I guess I'll focus it on young people. I don't mean to sound once again like a grandpa, but it's true. Like where are young people getting their personalities from? Like how is it even occurring now? um I think that's that's pretty terrifying that people, especially our young people, aren't developing one. And i mean, there's even studies now about how people are talking like AI.

Speaker: And so the way that that the language itself within these huge models is then influencing the language of the people who are reading it and using it. Right. Right. So now now you've got all these people who are you know constantly like speaking in lists and saying, it's not this, it's that, and but but bla blah, blah, all that kind of bullshit, which is just bizarre.

Speaker: It's bizarre. This is where we are in our lives now. You know, I i don't know. I hope ah at the Halloween season... Quite frankly, I hope the spirits of the dead do return to Earth, Andrew. i hope they haunt everybody. hope i hope they come and teach us all a big lesson. Yeah, I think maybe we we need a good a good haunting and that might shake us out of it all um because we're just heading for bad things, aren't we? We really are. Yeah.

Speaker: Jesus. Well, happy Halloween, everybody. Another hopeful episode from the guys at Friday the 13th Horror Podcast. Whatever. one ones star review. i came to i came to listen to comedy. Go fuck yourself. Guess what? We're depressing like everybody else.

Speaker: um Yeah, listen, ah maybe we'll end it here, Andrew, on on on on um horror in real life. what do you think? Yeah, let's take a break and come right back with what you've been watching, bitch.

Speaker: Let's all go to the lobby. Let's all go to the lobby. Let's all go to the lobby to get ourselves a treat.

Speaker: It's that time, that time again, where we say, what you been watching, bitch? What you been watching, you Halloween bitch? Ooh, spooky. This is the part of the show where we talk all about what we've been watching. And we know we we've we've done some decisiveness here over at Frygate the 13th Horror Podcast. And from now on, we're just going to do three.

Speaker: We're going to do three What You've Been Watching's. Listen, you need to check these things out and we're going to bring them to you. So, Maddie, let's save our shared one until the end, if that is cool with you. yeah But please tell me What You've Been Watching. Bitch. I'll start off with Resident Evil that we just saw in the cinema. um And it was fun. You know, it was it's it's a it's a it's a big old crazy zombie movie. um It's the same guy. What's his name? Zach Kragers. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That is his name, right? Kragers. Yep.

Speaker: Yep. Yep. Zach Kragers did the movie. um So there are, you know, stylistic things that will bring you back to weapons, for example. Um, and, and it's good, you know, look, I didn't really play resident evil, so I don't know, like I know about it, of course, but I don't know like a lot of the story or anything like that. So I went into it, you kind of blind a little bit, I would say I i knew what it was going to be. Um, but I didn't know like the ins and outs. i I don't have any sort of like, attachment to the games or anything like that.

Speaker: um So I'm not sure if people who do have those attachments feel differently. um But I liked it. You know, it's it's not um it's not my my style of zombie movie or creature movie where like, you know, 28 days later, for example, or 28 years later for that for that matter. But this isn't really zombies, is it? And although it kind of is. And um I don't know, I still had a great time. I thought it was creative and inventive and the the main protagonist is sort of, you know, like a lovable dope. um And and the effects are insane. There are some genuinely funny parts. um The end is definitely a cliffhanger.

Speaker: And yeah, I think it's definitely worth seeing in the cinema because it is a pretty big old movie. And so that's it. Have you have you seen it yet? I didn't. I i i want to. i don't know if it's still in the theaters here or not. I have to take a look. This came out when I was in ah my recovery, so do I didn't have a chance to go to the theater. But I'm excited to see it. But I think like... I think that you're like the ideal audience for this kind of movie though, because like, I think that the, the, the, but from whatever, everything that I've heard, this director wasn't going in making a video game, and like movie adaptation. He went in, yeah he went in with like an idea of like, Oh, I'm going to take this from the games and just, well, there you go. My own, my own universe around it. So I think that, you know, you not having any attachment to the game is probably not a detriment to your enjoyment. Gotcha. Cool. so That's good. Yeah.

Speaker: yeah I'm excited to see it, though. I heard it's ah an action-packed, mile-a-minute type of movie. so It is. It sounds fun me. It totally is. All right. My first one is I've been catching up on the the horror movies that I missed this year, you know getting ready for Halloween, but also just getting ready for the end of the year and kind of like ranking the horror movies of the year and all that stuff. and so I watched Backrooms, finally.

Speaker: the back rooms. Have you watched this? I wasn't sure if you had seen this yet. Yeah, no, I talked about this whenever it came out. We saw it in the theater and I would have done this. Like May time. Somewhere in there. So I mentioned on the episode and I recently bought it actually too so I could watch it again.

Speaker: This was an interesting one. I didn't, I don't have any, like, like you just said with Resident Evil, I don't have any knowledge of like the YouTube sensation. It was, it was the same for me too. Yeah.

Speaker: That was backroom. So I kind of went in pretty blind except for watching the preview that was in theaters, you know, during around this time. Um, and, You know, for the most part, I was i was but happy with it. i'm I'm going to tell you, i i liked the front half better than the back half. That makes sense.

Speaker: Just because I liked like the building of the lore and stuff, and I liked all the stuff that they were doing with the characters and you know, the one guy goes into the back rooms and he's kind of mapping it out. And I'm not giving anything away. This is all like in the preview, but like, and then the, you know, the one woman that goes in there too. And I i liked that part. I think I got a little discombobulated towards the end and didn't really quite understand some of the things that they were trying to say. Yeah, sure. I don't know for you, but like this movie ends so abruptly that I was like, wait, wait, wait, wait wait wait wait like go back. No, what just happened? Yeah, yeah, I get it. I get it.

Speaker: And so like I'm intrigued to know more. like If they make another one, i'll I'll totally see it. I just, I feel like I maybe was like, if I, I guess like maybe, let me think about this way. If I, and people tell me, you know, write in or whatever, fraggy13.com, you can find us all there at social media, blah, blah, blah, blah. ah Maybe if I went back and watched more of like the YouTube stuff, I would understand more but i don't and what I don't think that you would, to be honest. Is it meant to not be understood?

Speaker: Well, ah maybe. I mean, what I would say is after I was just like you, I didn't really know any of the lore either. i i knew a little bit about where it came from, but I had never watched any of the YouTubes before. So I went in in the same way, sort of blind. And um and then when I got out of it, I was like, um okay, fine.

Speaker: Maybe I'll watch some of those. And so I have watched, you know, not like a ton or anything, but I've watched a good few of them. um You don't really learn anymore. And, and, ah but, but also like that, that's kind of okay though. don't mean to, I don't mean to talk about your experience here, but for me, it was kind of okay because, um,

Speaker: Like it it it it is interesting to think about and it's interesting to like kind of put your brain into it and let yourself get a little bit lost in this thing that you don't know why it exists or why it's there or why it keeps building itself or even if it is building itself.

Speaker: i don't I don't know if it can make sense to be honest. and And maybe that's the point. but Maybe. It's possible. You know, I was at dinner this week with some um with some some colleagues. And and ah Paul, this guy that I work with, he's a ah ah really good guy. he was he was We were talking about horror movies and he was asking me about the podcast and this and that, whatever. And he said, you know, i was going to watch Back Rooms on the plane, actually. And i I didn't get around to it. And so we were talking about it And I said, you know...

Speaker: Like something interesting that happened to me after I watched it is, i think it might've been like two days after, i was coming up in the elevator to to my floor to go to my apartment. And when I got off, the lights flicked on and there was nobody there and it was quiet and it was silent and it was just, you know, the lights there and just this hallway.

Speaker: And it did make me feel, feel a little bit like I was in the back rooms. And I thought that was an interesting sort of like domino effect of watching the movie. You start to look at spaces in a little bit of a different way. That's kind of interesting.

Speaker: Yeah, no, i like I said, it did not hint... my un ah My not understanding of the movie did not hinder my enjoyment of the movie. That's fair. It was just like, It was one of those movies where I was like, huh, at the end. I agree. so yeah Yeah, same. So I'll definitely give it a rewatch. I need a little bit of time to like just you know get a time to rewatch it, but i I definitely want to rewatch it again. And you know maybe I'll dive into a little bit of the YouTube stuff. I don't know. But ah overall, pretty fun movie. It just...

Speaker: What are you doing over here? What's this little corner of the world that I don't know really that much about? So fun. So crazy. So crazy. Andrew, my next one is East of Eden. And this has just come out on Netflix. East of Eden is based off of the novel by John Steinbeck. Have you ever read the novel before?

Speaker: Not this one, but I've read some Steinbeck before. Okay, gotcha. Yeah, but but but I think like a lot of people, they usually read Of Mice and Men when they're in yeah high school. um They might read Grapes of Wrath as well, or they might read it in college. um I read East of Eden in college, and... um uh it really stuck with me it's one of my favorite novels of all time it's it's a big ass it's huge um and it is about uh it's about family at the end of the day is what east of eden is about but it is sort of based on like biblical stories in one way or another and so um it starts it's it's really about two sets of brothers the first set set set of brothers is adam and char charles adam and charles trask um And then later on, Caleb and Aaron Trask. And if you think about those initials, C and A, that relates back to Cain and Abel in in the ah ah in the Bible.

Speaker: And ah this is an adaptation that stars Florence Pugh as Kathy, ah Christopher Abbott as Adam, Hoon Lee as Lee, who is out of the world amazing in this. He's so fucking good. And Kieran Hines as Samuel Hamilton, who is just a wonder. And that I love Kieran Hines in general, but he's really, really good in this. And then a whole bunch of other people are in it too, including, um oh, ah the playwright who wrote Bug. He's married to Carrie Coon.

Speaker: I can't think of his name right now. He's from Chicago. he's Anyways, I'll think of it later. Anyways, um this is a beautiful masterpiece of an adaptation. It looks really pretty from the previews that I've watched.

Speaker: It's wonderful. it's it's um I think it's seven episodes total. I could be wrong. Maybe it's, maybe it's yeah, seven episodes. um Each one is about an hour long, basically. So this is not a short one, just like the book. um But it is well worth your time. Tracy Letts, that was his name.

Speaker: Tracy Letts. Anyways, I loved it. I absolutely adored it. ah It is a really heart-wrenching story. um I wept at the end because it was so good. And um it's it's all based around, ah but like I said, the Bible, but it's based around this Hebrew word um called timshel, T-I-M-S-H-E-L. And timshel in Hebrew means thou mayest. And so it it it sort of pops up in a number of different ways in the story. But what it basically means at the end of the day is that no matter what you've done, no matter who you are, you can always choose a better way. You can always choose redemption no matter what.

Speaker: And that's sort of what you see play out and what you see tragically sort of not play out over and over and over again. And only if they had actually understood that they had the power to act, how could things have been different?

Speaker: So um I'll leave it at that. um If you've never you know read the book before or anything else, it's absolutely still worth seeing. you You don't have to have read the book. And I loved it. So I hope everyone else who watches it loves it too. It really, really well done.

Speaker: Yeah, I mean, i saw Florence Pugh and I was like, well, I'll definitely check this out in some way. And this is probably the best she's ever been before. Truly. She is incredible. Especially her character. Because this character is so complicated. So complicated and nuanced. And I think that Florence Pugh really gets it. Which is not a surprise.

Speaker: one of our I think one of our best actresses actresses of today. agree. could go from being fucking in Midsommar to a Marvel movie to yeah this and do it all. Truly, truly, truly, truly.

Speaker: All right, my next one ah is a hard right turn to Evil Dead Burn. Yeah. This is currently on HBO. That's where you can watch it. ah this is like ah If I had to say, this is kind of like a side quest from Evil Dead Rise. Yeah. So it very much ties into Evil Dead Rise, but it's not like a continuation necessarily. okay Because it's it's about a family who have just experienced a death in the family, and they're all gathered for a funeral and for a celebration of life. And wouldn't you know, those damn demons are back, and they are going to terrorize this shit out of this family. God, there's so the Evil Dead demons are just so fucking evil.

Speaker: and like They're truly evil. It's fucked up, man. It's in the name, Maddie. I know, but if like get they're too evil. They're too mean. But this is very much in the same style as Evil Dead Rise. I will say, I feel like Evil Dead Burn is...

Speaker: ah The way that it's very stylized, like everything is very like pale and rotting and like everything is like the house that they're in is just falling apart. And it's just to be honest, it doesn't make a ton of sense that people would even have to take this house yeah if I'm being totally honest. But listen, does it make for a damn...

Speaker: fun time with, you know, the, the evil dead demons. Sure. ah is it really, really Uh, yeah, this is, this is, I go back and forth between evil dead rise and evil dead burn on which one's the meanest, uh, or maybe the evil dead remake 2013 rise twenty thirteen rise is pretty damn mean.

Speaker: Yeah. Well, have you seen this one yet? Because this one is... Oh, Jesus. God almighty. um But what I will say is they they do... i think that the Evil Dead movies, I i kind of i like enjoy them, but at some points I'm like, pick a lane. Are you trying to either be funny are you trying to be like a scary, gross movie? Because like there's sometimes where like the comedy comes in and I'm like, now is not the time. There's someone with hole in their face. like Get over it. i mean i think that's fair i think sometimes with with these movies like sometimes they can just go like it's like okay i get it do you know what i mean like yeah yeah got it all right there's another crazy thing that this fucking thing is doing gotcha what's the what's the weirdest most grossest way we can find to kill someone i agreed it's like what we're gonna do okay got it perfect yes um overall i i think it's kind of

Speaker: It's an okay movie. okay i I had fun with it, but it's it's not like... This is a one and done for me. like i I could go back to Evil Dead Rise probably and watch that again or the Evil Dead remake from 2013 or any of the originals. This one, I don't know if I'll revisit again because it just is like it's not a very good feel-good movie. and it's I mean, none of them are, but like um I don't know. This one was complicated for me.

Speaker: I didn't love it, but I... i i'm sorry Have you seen it? Sorry, I didn't even ask. Did you see this? No, I've i've seen i've seen Evil Dead Rise. Actually, I saw the premiere in Dublin of that one, but Evil Dead Burn... Yeah, for we did it for the show. Exactly right, but I i have not seen Evil Dead Burn.

Speaker: I'd say check it out. There is a fun um way that they tie the two movies together. Okay. And what I'll say for people that do check out this movie, make sure you stay through the credits because there's a pretty good end of credits sequence that really does put a bow on Evil Dead Rise and this movie and where they're going in the future okay that's fair love the ah of of everything. So i'm I'm intrigued where they're going to go.

Speaker: um Are these movies that I'm going to run to the theater and see? It's less and less these days, but will I check them out when they're on streaming services? Yes. Yeah, that can i out I sort of feel the same way. Like um when when it comes and like just like you said, like really any of these, these are not going to be in my rotation for further watching to be honest. Yeah, unless it's like Army of Darkness kind of thing like because it's just because it's a fucking classic.

Speaker: But the other ones honestly like they're just they're so gross most of the time and so brutal that like I just I really don't want to watch it again. I'm being honest, it's sort of like um i I talked about Lee Cronin's The Mummy recently.

Speaker: Like, I like mummy stories. I really do. i either fucking ever wrote movie i never want to see that again. And look, I like Lee Cronin. he's He's a good director, all the rest of it. But like, it's just, okay, I get it.

Speaker: Like, I get it. It's disgusting and gross and weird. Thank you. You know, like, i I just, I don't need to see it again. um Anyways, Andrew, our final one is one that we share. ah We are both... and ah I think that we should we should should premise or we should ah preface this conversation with saying we haven't talked about if we both agree on this or not. Fair. I will also say I haven't finished it yet. I do because it only just came out over here so we haven't had a chance to to watch it in full yet. We just finished episode six so I still have two more episodes.

Speaker: And... um Yeah. So this is Carrie, the the series on Amazon Prime um from our one of our faves, Mike Flanagan.

Speaker: um Andrew, I got to tell you, I'm loving it. I'm loving it. i know i know I'm not done yet, but it is fan fantastic so far. Yeah, call me a super fan again because I think Flanagan hits it out of the park again. Sorry. but It's the truth. it's It's like he... I texted my brother this morning. i was like, you got to watch this. And he said that they they they've already watched it. But I was like, Flanagan can do no wrong.

Speaker: he just it's like It's like everything he makes is just... it's ah It's golden. i can't believe how good this one is now. I truly can't believe it. i It's funny because we actually, we were at where you were last night. We finished it last night. And so i'm excited to see what you think about how they tie everything up. because I can't wait.

Speaker: um I think there's some bigger stuff ah involving Stephen King on the horizon but on based upon this adaptation. And I think it's going exciting for Stephen King people. i think that the online discourse is completely wrong on this ah on this ah thing. what are Are people saying that they don't like it?

Speaker: Yeah, a lot of people are saying they don't like it. um But you know what? Go fuck your... Do you know who does who you know who does like it? Stephen King. um No, the and the online discourse is like that they feel like this isn't a true adaptation. Shut to you your daughter That's why it's called an adaptation. Shut the fuck up.

Speaker: and like And like, I keep seeing people being like, when are we going to get a real book adaptation? i'm like, you all complained about when this... So here's here's the series of things that I've seen online about Carrie. Carrie. When it first was announced, everyone said, why do we need another Carrie? There's ah there's three other Carrie movies and a sequel. Why do we need it? Then Flanagan surprises us and gives us something that is completely new and completely different. And then you all complain that it's not like the book. like What the fuck are you guys doing? it's I think, um you know, look carrie Carrie is... It's a complicated story. And I like that we got a lot more deeper with so many more characters. Yes. like and i've I've never read the book before. i'm i'm going i have that i've've I've ordered the book because i now I do want to read it.

Speaker: um So I'm looking forward to that. But of course I've seen you know the the original with Sissy Spacek and I saw the the remake. When did that one come out? um Like 2013-ish? 2012? I think we might have talked about it actually at I think we saw it together. Something like that. And you know that that was what it was. But you mean look, the Sissy Spacek one obviously lives in infamy in all of our heads for so many different reasons. your you know Dirty pillows and plug it up and all the rest of it.

Speaker: um But this one, i yeah you know if you watch the OG Carrie and you don't feel things like shame and guilt and and sadness, you might not be a human. And this one is um this one is equally as upsetting. Look, I know I haven't finished it yet, but, you know, watching and but you know and Manuel is watching this and he he doesn't you know know ah a ton about Stephen King. He knows a little bit, but like this is all new to him because he's never seen Carrie before ever. Right. And he doesn't know the story of it. And so he doesn't know what's going to happen at the end. And of course, I'm keeping that a secret.

Speaker: And I don't know what happened at the end of this series, but I have an idea. um But in this one, I was watching it today and I really felt quite sad watching it yeah um because it's so cruel. And it's so cruel because obviously it is about kids today and how terrible and awful...

Speaker: ah How terrible and awful they can be and how terrible and awful it is to be a kid right now in this ridiculous era of human history. How how but how backwards and how scary it is and how terrifying it is.

Speaker: ah ah how cruelty How cruelty is popularity now. Exactly. like that you know Back to your personality thing earlier, no one has a personality anymore. They just want to be mean. They just want to be cruel. and that's what we're seeing play out in this. And there were, I mean, once again, I haven't finished, but there I was almost crying at some point. It was so sad. Truly. So I mean, I think this is a fantastic adaptation. ah If you don't like Mike Flanagan, I i just, I don't understand it. i i really, i don't get what has happened to you in your life that you don't have any empathy.

Speaker: That's what I would say to you. And ah the one thing that I will say about this is the nuanced way that he has recreated a new Margaret White for like this generation is outstanding. interesting.

Speaker: outstanding so And like and then actress at that actress, give her all the fucking Emmys. Jesus Christ. She's fantastic. What a powerhouse. i I was thinking about that today, too. how you know Once again, OG film. She's kind of a cartoon in in a bit in in many ways. Well, she thought she was she thought she was making a comedy a dark comedy the whole time. Well, fair. But you know with with this one, it's far more nuanced. Fair.

Speaker: far more nuanced and we learn more about about mrs white than we ever knew and far darker and far darker now tell me is the book that way do you learn more about mrs white in the book and in that style um yeah you You do, but it's... but Here's what I'll say about the book. ah The book is very... It's a very simple story. Like, it's not... We we have we have taken a very simple story, and it's probably the truest in De Palma's film to the book. yeah But we have taken that story, and we've kind of added on a lot of shit to it, you know, including Mike Flanagan. Like, there's nothing about the dad, really, in the book. There's nothing about, like...

Speaker: the life at home with any of the other characters with like Sue or with, uh, with any of the other characters. And it is, it is really kind of a jumbled book because the book is mostly told in flashbacks. It's mostly told in, I've heard that police, police interviews, I will say.

Speaker: um and so it's just a different take, but like, that's what I love about like when somebody does a true adaptation, they take the work and, And they make it better. You don't just tell the same story. That's why it's an adaptation. And I think that given Flanagan's track record, I think even with Stephen King, you know, ah things like Doctor Sleep, which y'all are fucking sleeping on because it's one of the best movies I've ever seen. Love Doctor Sleep with all of my heart.

Speaker: i think that it's I think that we're in good hands with Mike Flanagan and Stephen King. And I think that they're going to work together. And I think it's going to really give Amazon, unfortunately, a great fucking series of things. So, yeah, more i on i it's ah I hate having to support Amazon, but you know here we are. it's It's sort of like, you know, it's one of those evil corporations we we are forced to do business with all the time. um But if this is how Mike Flanagan has to get his work done, this is how he has to get his work done.

Speaker: Because it's also making so many, it's also saying so many important things, I think, so far in in this series um and ah in an updated and and great way. and You know, it's um it's an adaptation, but it's also a reimagining, you know, in the same way that like ah ah Luca Guadagnino reimagined Suspiria back in 2019 or whenever that was. Here he goes again, bringing up Suspiria. But I'm just saying, you know, like, I mean, that that also got a lot of flack from people. But like, you know, it's not supposed to be some sort of like gospel. It's it's supposed to be another artistic interpretation on it. And that's yeah exactly what this is. And for the 50th anniversary of Carrie, which it is, I think this is something really cool. And as usual from Mike Flanagan, bold and wonderful. Once again, Stephen King approved, baby. And, and on top of it, it's full of the sort of empathy that we know and love from Flanagan, because like a lot of other people, I believe that that is what horror is really about is extreme empathy in extreme circumstances. So I think it's just a marvelous thing so far.

Speaker: Yeah, agreed, agreed, agreed across the board. Well, that does it for what you've been watching, bitch. Maddie brought us Resident Evil, which you can currently see in theaters East of Eden, currently on Netflix. And we both brought Carrie from Amazon.

Speaker: And in addition to Carrie, ah Andrew brought us Backrooms, which you can see on HBO. And um you can also just buy it if you want to. um And Evil Dead Burn, which is also on HBO. So folks, that does it for what you've been watching, bitch. We'll be right back with our first film of the episode, perfect for Halloween. It's Halloween 6, The Curse of Michael Myers.

Speaker: you know why we celebrate Halloween? A long, long time ago, it was a night of great power. When the days grew short, all across the land, huge bonfires were lit.

Speaker: Oh, there was a marvelous celebration. And they dressed up in costumes, hoping to ward off the evil spirits, um especially The Boogeyman.

Speaker: Boo. Did I get you? Because it's time to watch Halloween 6, The Curse of Michael Myers. Maddie, tell us all about Halloween 6, The Curse of Michael Myers.

Speaker: Terror never rests in peace. Six years after vanishing from Haddonfield, Michael Myers resurfaces to hunt the newborn child of his niece, Jamie Lloyd.

Speaker: As the town revives its long-banned Halloween celebrations, a grown-up Tommy Doyle uncovers the ancient curse of Thorn, driving Michael's rampage, and the shadowy cult that has been pulling his strings all along. With Dr. Loomis by his side, Tommy must protect the last of the Strode bloodline before the ritual is complete.

Speaker: This Halloween, evil finally has a reason. Directed by Joe Chappelle, written by Daniel Farrins, produced by Nightfall, Trancas International, and Halloween 6 Productions, distributed by Dimension Films. Dr. Sam Loomis played by Donald Pleasance in his last role. Tommy Doyle played by, i was actually introducing, believe it or not, Paul Rudd, who was credited as Paul Stephen Rudd in this film, his very first. Kara Strode played by Marianne Hagen. Dr. Wynn played by Mitchell Ryan.

Speaker: And Michael Myers or The Shape played by George Wilbur, amongst a bunch of other people. ah Rated R, filmed Salt Lake City and in LA. Budget was a measly $5 million, but it brought in $15.1 million. Made in the U.S. of A., of course, released on September 29th of 1995, just in time for Halloween, and it ran for 88 minutes. It's surprisingly short, to given the...

Speaker: given a lot of it stuff way they have to go over in this movie. But yeah, it's 88 minutes apparently. um It is not a first time watch for either of us. Andrew, how did you feel about Halloween 6, The Curse of Michael Myers on this watch?

Speaker: Yeah, this was ah fun to go back to because usually in my rewatch of the Halloween movies, I, to be honest, I usually skip four, five and six. So it's so, you know, amongst others, like I, I rarely watch a term, know, there's a couple in there that I just skip. Well, if you don't mind my asking, why do you skip this film in particular? What'd you say?

Speaker: i just I'm not necessarily like the biggest lover of the Jamie Lloyd trilogy of like that story because I feel like um they don't ever like give you a completion to it. like And we'll talk about it in this movie. So there's like no like payoff to it. So it kind of just... Falls flat for me. So um even though I think a four is a lot of people's favorites for, you know, for ah many reasons, but and we know we're not talking about those We're talking about this one. Fair. um But ah this one was interesting to go back to. I watched the theatrical cut, I should say, and preface before we talk about this. I don't know if you watched the theatrical cut.

Speaker: I'm pretty sure that I did. Okay. Well, it would have been labeled as the the production cut or whatever they whatever they call it. I watched it on on HBO. Then you watched the theatrical. Gotcha. Okay. So there is another version of this. I know I've seen it in the past, but I don't remember. And I think that there's some stuff in there that they add in. but you know I kind of vaguely remember that, yeah.

Speaker: Yeah, of today, we're speaking of the theatrical cut of the movie. um And so like this time around, i i reset my brain. i said, let's go on a journey and just like let's have fun with this. Let's see where it goes. And honestly, up until...

Speaker: They go back to Smith's Grove. that Up until that point, I was kind of having a good time with it. I was kind of like okay with it. Do I think that the opening is like over gluttonous and overdone and like we kill Jamie Lloyd for no reason?

Speaker: Hell yes. Because why? Because now we have no conclusion of like, yeah oh, Jamie Lloyd was his niece and then they were and then they were ah telepathically tied and now she just... And now she's maybe having his baby, we think. yeah I'm not really sure. someone's um I just think that like this one, i feel like they like were like, we have an idea, and here's a bunch of... ah they They put them on a board. They put a bunch of ideas on a board, and then they just like made lines of like how they could connect to them without ever really thinking how they get there. like There's no...

Speaker: There's no tie to how like how we get to the places we go. It's just like, oh, you should know this. You should know about like the cult of Thorne. Duh, you didn't know about this? We've talked about this before. That's how the movie treats its audience. And whereas we've never heard of this before, we need a little bit more background on like what's going on. um What I do think is funny...

Speaker: is that this kind of echoes back to Halloween 3 in a weird way. Because if you remember in Halloween 3, that was a coven of warlocks, and they stole Stonehenge. And they also, which Stonehenge is also kind of tied back to the Druids. And so it's kind of interesting that they would bring back this idea for 6.

Speaker: um Obviously, 3 doesn't have anything to do with Michael Myers, but it's just an idea of like, huh, that's kind of fun. And I kind of had fun like making my own inferences like into why this is happening to Michael Myers and like why he's trying to kill his bloodline and all this stuff. I like i kind of like it. And then...

Speaker: We do this weird thing where where we we have this balance between Dany, who is the son of ah Kara, right? Is that correct? Yeah. Yes, correct. um And we have this moment where we think that he's maybe going to be the new evil, but they never go there with that.

Speaker: and there's And then there's a part where they're at Smith's Grove and there's like a there's like a group of doctors and they're all doing something. But the baby's not involved, Danny's not involved, and Michael Myers is not involved. So what are they doing?

Speaker: And i just, I feel like there's there's too many ideas and not, and there's there's not a period on any of the sentences that they do in this movie. yeah And I just feel like it kind of turns into a mess by the end. And by the end, when Paul Rudd looks at Donald Pleasance says, you should come with us.

Speaker: And Dylan Pleasant says, no, I've got some work to do. And he goes back in and all you hear is his yell at the end. And Michael Myers is like not where his body was. I was like, what the fuck are we doing? Because yeah guess what? Like spoiler alert, we're going to do the next movie too. And there's not any talk of this at all. It was complete reset. So this is the end of your trilogy or of your, I guess, five ology, if you really want to tie it into Halloween one and two.

Speaker: lame, lame, lame, lame sauce. And so like, cool idea. You didn't really fucking think it through. i don't know. That's kind of where I'm at with it. What about you?

Speaker: ah I agree with you on all of these things. Um, so I have a distinct memory of seeing this movie in the cinema with my sister Lisa. Oh, wow. When I was 13 and I would have been newly 13. And so I think there was a part of me that, um, has always held on to this as sort of just like a special one that like I really liked because obviously when I was 13, I didn't know all that much about this stuff. And, um, and I, I probably just had a really fun time getting scared in the, in the cinema. You what i mean um So I think that's why I always liked it. And this time watching it, I thought for sure that I would like it again.

Speaker: And I've seen it in in obviously in in between me being 13 and 44. have seen it ah again and again and again. This time around, I really didn't like it, Andrew. I really did not like it. And you know that I... And if it's not it's not a terrible didn't like it, but I just wasn't into it. And like you know that I like the Halloween movies quite a bit. I love Michael Myers.

Speaker: Yeah, this is like you this is like your franchise. like Yeah, this one, I watched it, and I gotta tell you, I almost felt a bit embarrassed for liking it so much before. um It's just... There's the... the There's just so much in this that is not very good.

Speaker: And there's just no other way to say it. The script is terrible. A lot of the acting is dumb. The the Halloween festival with the the radio guy who's supposed to be a bit like Howard Stern-ish kind of thing. Yeah, like the Is just stupid. It's it's dumb. um and yeah and and And I agree with you on all of the Thorn Cult stuff. like So first of all, one thing I did ah ah put together the the different chronologies just so we we have those clear, right? So the Thorn chronology would be 1, 2, 4, 5, and you follow H2O, that chronology would be 1, 2, H2O, and Resurrection. The Rob Zombies are the 2007 and 2009. The Blumhouse chronology would be the number 1 in 1978, of course, and then 2018, and then Halloween Kills and Halloween Ends. And then totally standalone would be part 3, Season of the Witch. So there you go. um So the Thorne films, like...

Speaker: ah I don't need there to be a reason for why Michael Myers is evil. I don't even need there to be a reason for why he keeps coming back.

Speaker: And in fact, the story of Michael Myers is so much more terrifying if there is no reason. The story of Michael Myers is so much more terrifying if there is nothing behind it and he just keeps reappearing. And I think that's where the whole thorn thing just goes wrong. It's just it's looking for some sort of reason to give of why this evil is there and why the ritual needs to take place and blah, blah, blah, blah. And it's just putting lipstick on a pig. like you You don't need to do that. I think, you know, once again, the the reason why the first one is so incredibly important still scary to this day and still so effective, if the 1978 version, of course, is because he is just the shape.

Speaker: And you know he is Michael Myers but you know as as a child, but then he just becomes the shape and he never says a word and he somehow just keeps coming and coming and coming and coming. And whether you attack him or whether you shoot him, it just doesn't seem to stop him.

Speaker: And that is the thing that that haunts us in our brains, especially at the end of that film when you know they win Dr. Loomis and and Jamie Lee Curtis look down, a laurie ah when when Dr. Loomis and Lori look down off the balcony and and his body is gone. And shot him six times. Six times. at times Yeah. And the camera you know goes to this corner and to that corner and to this house and to that house because you don't know where he is. And so if there's ah suddenly a reason why Michael is doing this, because he has to kill off his bloodline, that takes away all of that scare, all of it.

Speaker: And it just doesn't really matter. I don't know. I just, I feel the same, ah all the things that you said, i i feel the same way. And plus, I think all the things that I just said too. And, you know, like I said, it wasn't that I didn't, you know, enjoy watching it again. i I'll always enjoy watching a Halloween film. But I think looking at it now with, I haven't seen it, and I can't remember the last time i watched it, but looking at it now with much fresher eyes in my as an old man in my 40s, I definitely don't, um i I just don't, I don't know if i need to watch it again. I'll be perfectly honest with you. I really don't. it's It's one of those weird things where like, I don't know, like we're supposed to be cheering for Kara and her son Danny, but

Speaker: But are we? Yeah. But are we? I mean, like like and and if we are, I don't really understand why. And, you know, this film makes the mistake that a lot of the um ah what's the guy who made the the Blumhouse ones. His name was Green. What's his first name?

Speaker: Do you Oh, I don't remember right now. what Whatever that guy is, right? that This movie makes the same mistake that that guy made with those films, which is making a bunch of archetypal characters in Haddonfield. And so you've got... Yeah, we got the drunk, abusive stepdad. Exactly. like and you've And you've got those the submissive, weird mom who...

Speaker: what's thing to be perfect and she's clearly dealing with you know i just it's like come on it's so it's so ridiculous that like you don't want to root for anybody in this town and and um and that that just kind of sucks you know you know speaking of flanagan i'd almost love mike flanagan to make a halloween movie You know, like it might it might actually be something really, really different. And it might be something that actually draws us in and gives us people to root for other than Michael Myers, because I'm almost rooting for him in this one.

Speaker: Yeah. um should say it was an interesting callback to have Tommy Doyle come back. Sure. Paul Rudd. ah But they also make him like a weird conspiracy theorist, like loner type. And I'm just like, would that really be what Tommy Doyle turns into? Like, don't know.

Speaker: But but but we we we see it we see it we see it happen again with Laurie Stroh later on in in the Blumhouse films, right? I think yet again, it's it's another it's another um characterization mistake of of pushing things so far that they just become cartoons. And I think that it happens to Laurie Strode in the later movies. I think it happened to Tommy Doyle in this one.

Speaker: And yeah. And, and like, so I was supposed to believe that he just like sits in this house and Haddonfield all year long making clippings about Halloween. Like, come on. right It seems a little ridiculous.

Speaker: um i did I did write down one of the one of the clippings that he had. It literally just said, Local tot kills older sister. and I was like, oh, so that's the level of writing that we're dealing with this in this movie. Tater tot casserole over here. my God.

Speaker: um A couple of little things that I jotted down that were fun that um you know I just made a little ah made a little note about is they do make a joke about Michael Myers in space. I don't know if you caught that or they were like, oh. No, I didn't catch that, actually. Yeah, there's like a little one-liner about Michael Myers in space. And it's funny because this only comes five years ah before Jason would go to space. Oh, it's crazy.

Speaker: what did the what but What was the reference? What was it? They were just talking about like, well, for all we know, Michael Myers is in space at this point. Like it was one of those things. That's funny. weird. That's so weird.

Speaker: Another thing that I noticed is that when they are at Smith's Grove, the the sanitarium, which i did I did like that they brought that back. I think it's kind of soiled. That is fair. yeah like ah Because like it doesn't really pay off in any way, shape, or form. like Because, I don't know, this movie's a mess anyway. But the the cell that Kara is held in, did you notice anything about that cell specifically?

Speaker: ah Not that I can recall right now. What was it? She is held in room 237. Is she really? Yeah. Which is oh The Shining. Of course. Andrew, I will say one thing, by the way, back to back to the ah to Carrie, just really quick. Did you notice that the store where the mom works is S-Mart?

Speaker: Yes, yes, yes, yes. Which I thought was very funny. Very, very funny. Also, a little bit of Evil Dead in there, too. Anyways, back to Halloween. Sorry, back to Halloween. um I just think that, like... That's cool. but that That is interesting. So, I think there was some, like...

Speaker: I don't know, maybe these were accidental things, but like maybe it was some little nods that the director tried to throw in there because, you know, at the end of the day, this isn't a COD movie. You know, the, the, the ACAD family was in charge essentially of, you know, with Deborah Hill and, and John Carpenter. They were, they've been in on this, you know, since the beginning. And so like he had to put a stamp of approval on this and he did. I don't know what the vision was here, But there are certain things that... For instance, when the dad is killed, so abusive dad, horrible, we want him to die, he gets shoved up against a breaker, an electric breaker. And it goes off. And they showed earlier in the movie that this breaker's unreliable, blah, blah, blah. And so Michael Myers throws him into it

Speaker: And he electrocutes so much that he literally explodes. Yeah, it's it's a little, come on. like And I was like, whoa whoa whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Because in all of, and this is what i appreciate about the Halloween series, is that all of the deaths are very...

Speaker: uh, visceral. Like they're all something that you could see happening in real life. Like it's, it's a knife to the back or a knife to the chest or like, you know, something along those lines. And then to throw in this fantastical way of dying is just so bizarre to me. And, and it's another thing that I don't like about, about how, what they do with Michael Myers is it's the same reason why I don't like the Rob Zombie ones. It's like Michael Myers kills with a kitchen knife.

Speaker: That's what makes him terrifying also. That is, it's just such a normal thing. it's It's always around. Like anyone's house you go to has one. Any restaurant you go to has one. They're all over the place. It makes it scarier. You don't have to fucking a circuit breaker. You just don't.

Speaker: Yeah. And, and there's like one other thing that I just was like so puzzled about, about this movie um amongst many things, because I, I do think that there are some strong points in this. I think that like the brother and his girlfriend and that whole sequence is kind of interesting and like what they're trying to do to bring back Halloween for the town. um i think that's kind of fun. i don't mind the DJ bit. I think it's kind of stupid, but like, I don't mind because definitely stupid for sure.

Speaker: um i I like that it leads up to that moment, though, where the little girl's like, Mommy, it's raining red. It's raining blood. It's raining red. red red ah Because I do think that's kind of creepy. Yeah. um But there is a part in this movie where I was so baffled because we are meant to believe that the cult of Thorne control Michael Myers in a way, correct?

Speaker: Yes. So why, when we get to Smith's Grove, does he go in and dispatch of all of the cult members? Does it make any sense?

Speaker: Out of nowhere. That's just it is that it doesn't make any sense. Yeah. it It just doesn't. i'm I'm trying to shine a turd here, but I think it might just be a turd. don't think we have to. ah Some trivia about this film. Donald Pleasant died on February 2nd of 1995, seven months before the release.

Speaker: ah Good old Donald Pleasance. After a disastrous test screening, the ending was rewritten and reshot without him. And the film is dedicated to his memory.

Speaker: Danielle Harris was cast to return as Jamie Lloyd and even got legally emancipated to shoot it, but walked away after Dimension offered her a scale fee of about $1,000. Oh my God. Less than her emancipation had cost.

Speaker: Paul Rudd's first starring role shot before Clueless came out that same year. Farrens, the director, also named John and Deborah Strode after John Carpenter and Deborah Hill, of course. And apparently he modeled the um the the character of Danny after ah Danny Torrance in The Shining.

Speaker: Well, that there's 237 again right there. but you go that's it Andrew, what did you think, how did you rate, what did you think about it? How did you rate Halloween, The Curse of Michael Myers? You know, coming into this conversation, I had it at a four, but I think that's being a little generous. Yeah. I think it's just a 3.5 movie. I think this is just an average... ah It's in just an average horror movie and an average Halloween movie. I said, i don't hate this one i just think it feels uneven i like giving some nods to halloween three and the supernatural but it never sticks to landing and the expanded cast is just misused

Speaker: Yeah, I feel the same way. I give it a three and a half. And I said, I love Michael Myers and I love Halloween. I used to really like this one, which makes me almost embarrassed. But this is just uneven and silly.

Speaker: So, folks, that does it for Halloween six. The Curse of Michael Myers will be right back after the break with our second film of the episode. Another Halloween Halloween 20 years later.

Speaker: It's 1998 in a remote California town at a secluded private school. We could have a Halloween party just the four of us. We could have a roaming orgy. I love the way this man thinks. No booze, no drugs, no kidding.

Speaker: One teacher is living in fear. I'm not who you think am. I changed my name when went into hiding.

Speaker: My brother killed my sister. How'd he do that? With a really big kitchen knife. That's enough. I can't take it, Mom.

Speaker: He's dead. It's been 20 years. What's he waiting for? Don't you think he would've shown up by now? What's going on, baby?

Speaker: I don't know. This is sick joke. What was that? Now.

Speaker: The face of good and the face of evil will meet one last time.

Speaker: But this time, it's going to be a fight to the finish.

Speaker: This summer, Terror won't be taking a vacation.

Speaker: Halloween H2O. It's Halloween. I guess everyone's entitled to one good scare. I've had my share. 20 years later, he's back at it again. Get ready for more Michael Myers in Halloween H2O. Andrew, tell us all about Halloween H2O.

Speaker: This summer, terror won't be taking a vacation. 20 years after surviving her brother's Halloween massacre, Laurie Strode has faked her own death and rebuilt her life in Northern California as Carrie Tate, headmistress of an ex ah exclusive boarding school.

Speaker: But the nightmares never stopped, and neither did Michael. When he tracks her down on Halloween night with her teenage son and his friends alone on a nearly deserted campus, Lori makes a choice she's avoided for two decades. This time, she's done running.

Speaker: This is directed by Steve Miner, written by Robert Zappia and Matt Greenberg, story by Robert Zappia. Production and distribution were handled by Nightfall, Trankus International Distributors, was Dimension Films. Laurie Strode slash Carrie Tate played by Jamie Lee Curtis.

Speaker: John Tate by Josh Hartnett. Molly Cartwell as Michelle, not as, is Michelle Williams. Ronnie Jones is LL Cool j And Norma Watson is played. by none other than janet lee we'll get into that in a little bit og scream queen this movie is rated r it was released on august 5th of 1998 it comes in at 86 minutes 86 efficient minutes i will say very very much just reviewed ah the filming locations are a lot and they're just basically in and around los angeles uh including many places in california The budget on this was $17 million, and this one brought in $75 million worldwide. I'm actually surprised that it only brought in $75 million, to be honest. remember this movie being a lot bigger than that for some reason. i mean is it It was absolutely huge when that movie came out.

Speaker: I in the theater. I don't know about you. I can spoil that right now. um I was 16. That was when like you you had to be 18 to see this kind of shit, which was weird back then. um But yeah, I remember i remember going. it was It was awesome. And I actually have a very... ah Another distinct memory about this. I'll tell you about it right now. um I was so excited for this to come out.

Speaker: And me and a guy who was my best friend that his name was Kevin. And Kevin was like really into like electronic music back then and all the rest of it. And like he his his mom, very sweet, sweet lady would just kind of buy Kevin whatever he wanted kind of thing. And so like she bought him turntables and he had a bunch of records. And like we thought that like he was a DJ and we thought that Would you say he had two turntables and a microphone? Yes, actually he did. And they were really expensive, my dad. They were Technics SL 1200s. Anyways, ah um like we thought we were like absolute ravers back then. It's actually really funny and cute looking back on it. Anyways, um he would sometimes do remixes. So I was like, Kevin, let's do a remix of the Halloween theme for H2O.

Speaker: And so I sampled the original Halloween movie using a microphone and my mom's TV to get like like all the like the little bits out of out of part one.

Speaker: And he took all of them and he made it into like this like Halloween dance remix. It was hilarious and awesome looking back at it. And we debuted that my senior year of high school when I had a huge Halloween party in my backyard. And he played it for everybody and they danced. It was kind of funny. But we made that for we made that for for when H2O came out. H2O,

Speaker: I mean, this is obviously not a first watch for either of us. No. yeah I still love H2O in a lot of ways. H2O doesn't get too lost in itself. like Unlike the last one that we just talked about did. And I i i have to i have to imagine...

Speaker: And this is only three years after, right? Halloween is 695, this is 98. And it's not even three years because obviously like they they would have you know after um after the the audience reactions in the box office, they would have been already thinking about what the next you know installment in the franchise is. so It's a very short amount of time following, and I think that they probably took a lot of lessons from from part six and applied them to part seven, which is H2O, 20 years later. And number one just the whole 20 years later thing, it just happened to coincide so easily with a new story. I think that the story here actually is inventive and it's worth it's worth the inventiveness, if that makes sense. Like, I do think it's interesting that Laurie Strode fakes her own death, starts a new life somewhere so she can get away from it all. um I think that's actually kind of compelling. um I think that the length of the movie lends well to them not getting, once again, too lost in the story, too many plot lines, too much this, too much that.

Speaker: um So I think it's an incredibly effective film. I think that it doesn't use humor too much, which I appreciate. Like, you know, some of the LL Cool J stuff, like, is, you know, it's just like mildly funny. It doesn't like go too far into being stupid.

Speaker: It's not too distracting. A hundred percent. And like, actually LL Cool J in this is kind of lovable. Like you yeah kind of you you can't imagine him not being in this almost. Yeah.

Speaker: unlike Resurrection where, what is a Coolio is in Resurrection, right? yeah No, is it it's Busta Rhymes. Busta Rhymes. So yeah unlike Busta Rhymes, for example, in Resurrection, who is like, you could hear Busta Rhymes. Trick or treat, motherfucker. Yeah, you could hear Busta Rhymes from like 1,800 miles away, you know, like like if he's just like, you know, hitting a triangle, like, come on, like it's completely different inclusion here of of a rap star in the Halloween films.

Speaker: um And I think that the um the the love interest between ah Laurie and, or I should say Carrie and the guy that she, whatever the guy's name that she's in love with, that's kind of interesting. I think Josh Hartnett is just peak Josh Hartnett, you know, hair all over the place kind of thing. Michelle Williams, I think does a great job on this too. Like ah there's there's a lot good about this. The only thing that I i don't, that I don't like as much is, ah this is where we start to see the, um, a bit of the hysterical Laurie Strode come out. Yeah. And, I think before I used to be okay with it and now I'm kind of Yeah.

Speaker: And ah the reason why I'm not, I want to explain that, is because I just think it's too easy. And I think it's so easy to just like play the polemic of her just kind of being crazy a little bit and like being too much about it and everything else. I think once again, like would this have been more compelling? Yeah.

Speaker: If like when she's see like, for example, when she finds her son and and the friend, whatever his name was in town because they're getting lunch, you know, outside of campus or whatever. And remember, she sends the friend to the car because she's going to bring them back.

Speaker: And then like, John, what the fuck do you think you're doing? Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I just think it would have been... Even the people in the background are like, whoa, lady. Yeah. I think it's just too much. It's just too much. And I love Jamie Lee Curtis. Do not get me wrong on this. But if I'm being honest, that's kind of pattern for her in general. And like, it's a little bit of why like on the bear, for example, I got kind of tired of her because that's kind of easy for her to do. it's where she constantly goes is the extreme of that. And I just don't think that's always interesting. I think there could be a lot more interesting ways to do it. Now, does that mean I hate this? Does that mean that I hate her in this? No, it does not. But I just think there could have been some more interesting choices that she could have made in this. if I'm being honest. And I think... I don't like that they make her a weird, a functional alcoholic. I'm like, this serves nothing to the movie. I don't really understand.

Speaker: Well, I mean, like i I could almost understand that if it's just sort of a nuance that she has instead of like, I don't know, a driver once again towards that that ah that tendency to be so so over the top. But then again, don't those two just kind of go together, i suppose. So those are my general feelings about it. How about you?

Speaker: Yeah. So like you, I saw this in the theater when, uh, when I was a teenager, I remember being very excited because like, ah you know, it literally was 20 years later. Like, yeah, sure. Whoa. That's so cool that they're doing this. And I do think it's funny that we've all been deduced to calling it Halloween H2O. Halloween Yeah.

Speaker: um and But, you know, that's that's good advertising for you right there from the late 90s. And, you know, this one, I have fun with this one. i think it's like ah it was a needed refresh for the franchise to just be like, okay, like, we're done. we under We hear you. We understand that's not really working out. We're going to do something different. And so I think that was it was the right move to make. I think that ah spicing it up with Kevin Williamson was the right move. Fair. True.

Speaker: Given where we're at with the the screen culture of this time, like for God's sakes, they're watching Scream 2 on TV when the when the yeah one rate when the guidance counselor breaks in and you know checks on them. um And I have some other cool things that tie back to Scream 2 that we can talk about later. but like this just like fits in so perfect with that time of, you know, like 1998. And it just like sits there and it just like, whenever you watch it, it's like watching scream for the first time. You just were are reminded of like, ah, this is what we were doing in 1998. So like, like overall, I just have fun with it. Cause it's almost like a nostalgia piece. Do I think it's like the best movie? No, not really. It's not even really that gory apart from like one part. It's really not.

Speaker: One part really always sticks with me and that's the dumbwaiter part. Oh yeah, word for sure. That girl's leg ah has always stuck with me. Terrible. but But other than that, we don't really see like that much like blood or gore. It's kind of more like, you know, when the, when the guidance counselor gets killed, he gets like lifted up by the knife and, but it it mostly is just showing him being like, oh agreed.

Speaker: And like dying. And so like, and you know, like when LL Cool J gets shot, you don't really see it because it's in shadow. Like there's a lot of things that are just like, huh, I wonder why this is rated R to be honest. You know what i mean? Like it's not even like. That's an interesting take on it. That's fair.

Speaker: it It reads to me more like a PG-13 movie. because there's There's not even really that much like profanity in it or anything else actually. Yeah. There's no sex. Like it's kind of neither here nor there. But like.

Speaker: um I don't think it hurts the movie. I just think it's kind of funny that it's still rated Yeah. um I now, now looking back on this movie, I appreciate all of the little things that they did to kind of like, ah, ha, ha, ha. Like the, the nurse at the beginning, that's like the same actress that played the nurse in the movie.

Speaker: um I like that Janet Lee plays her secretary and there's a moment where they're talking and she's like, can I give you a little maternal advice? And you're like, oh, if I could just be maternal.

Speaker: because that's her mom it's cute it's it's really cute actually there's even a part where uh i think it's ll cool j where he's letting them out of the school and he's like comb your hair to to josh hartnett could not agree more because i don't know if anybody remembers but right around this time we got this movie and the faculty and in both those movies josh hartnett's hair is insane Well, I mean, there there was a time when his hair was just like never normal. It was always, it was always crazy. Always. It was like always untamed colics or something. Yes. can't, like it's very weird. it somehow made him hotter. It just did. We all loved it.

Speaker: Josh, it's never been my thing, but that's fine. I think I'm better with age. Yeah. But, ah yeah, overall, I have fun with this movie. I think it's kind of a dumb movie, if I'm being honest. brain-turner offer. like it's nothing like One thing I think, I don't disagree with you necessarily on that, but like I do think it was an attempt to breathe new life into the franchise. Yeah, totally. and And I think that it did. And I was just thinking to myself, like how did they lose that?

Speaker: Like, how did they lose it? And like, and think about it. Like the next film doesn't come out until four years later with Resurrection. And Resurrection, I'm not a fan. You can hear on a full review on reality television. There you go. Right. And then, and then if you think about it, then after that, there's not another one until Rob Zombie in 07 and then 09. And then not another one for nine years, 2018 and then 2021 and then 2022 with Halloween So I do sort of wonder, like, you know, they look, they have the 20th anniversary. get it.

Speaker: But like, they didn't, like, there was nothing else planned after that. Nothing else like that they thought to do That does kind of strike me as as a bit weird. Yeah. And, you know, not to get too much into the next one, but the next one just completely like pretty much negates this whole entire movie. So a hundred percent. Yeah. So it it is kind of a shame because there could have been, i don't know. I just wonder in some alternate reality, could there, could there have been another one after h two o that would have, you know, supplanted resurrection, maybe would have changed the direction of Rob Zombie in general. Maybe David Gordon's Green's David Gordon Green's films would have been a lot.

Speaker: better although i did kind of like halloween ends um but i don't know it's it's just it's it's a bit strange to me that that breath that they put into it just suddenly went away as soon as the movie ended 86 minutes later yeah um a couple of things that i had in here of course janet lee is uh jamie lee curtis's mom we talked about that a little bit but did you notice another little nod to psycho in this movie as well tell me When Janet Leigh exits the film, she gets in a certain car from a certain Psycho.

Speaker: Ooh, yeah, she does. The same getaway car. it's it's That's the same version of the car. I love Psycho so much. So good. i Already brought up ah that they're watching Scream 2 in their dormitory, which was a fun little nod. And then also one more nod to Scream. Did you notice that when Jamie Lee Curtis is sending away Michelle Williams and Josh Hartnett, she says, drive down to the Beckers.

Speaker: Oh, that's I didn't catch that. That's interesting. Now, who's at the beginning of Scream? Casey Becker. Oh, wow. And what does the dad tell the mom to go do? Drive down to the Mackenzie's, which is a reference. It's it's it's all references, which is I think is hilarious. But i I appreciate that this movie took a little time to like put in some of those nuances, which is that's really fun. That's really interesting.

Speaker: Yeah. So those are just a couple of things that I had pulled out. And a couple of trivia things on this too. John Carpenter agreed to direct, but wanted a $10 million dollars fee. And see, this is interesting. a three picture deal. Three picture deal. this is there I wonder if if that's more ideas.

Speaker: I wonder if that would have meant three more hall like three Halloween movies or three movies in general. Because if he had an idea for a trilogy, that would have been interesting. Unfortunately, we'll never know. But I really wish that they would have... I mean, look, I'm not saying that that Steve Miner did anything wrong here, but...

Speaker: I don't know. John Carpenter coming back to this could have been really cool. I'm just saying. You have just paid him. For God's sakes, he made $75 million. dollars ah Screams Kevin Williamson did did the uncredited rewrites and devised the paramedic mask switch that explains how Michael survived a scene filmed the day after H2O wrapped and saved for Halloween Resurrection.

Speaker: Interesting. I didn't realize they they did that right after. yep Just like in the last film that was Paul Rudd's introduction, this was Josh Hartnett's film debut with early turns also from Michelle Williams and Joseph Gordon-Levitt. Good old JGL.

Speaker: Loomis' voiceover is a sound alike done by Tom Kane. And the credits the credits tribute misspells Pleasance's name. god Oh, come on. It was the franchise's top grocer until 2018.

Speaker: Yeah, that makes sense. I thought this movie i thought his movie made a lot more money than it said it did. but i thought it did too, but here we are. here we are um i'm trying to think what else that I had.

Speaker: um i do You know, it's one of the things is that it's honestly, it's so short. It's kind of hard to have a lot. If I'm being honest, it really is. I will say this, this movie did make me hungry because when they pull out all those oven treats, when they're going to do their little feast, I was like, there you go. True. Very true. God.

Speaker: love an oven treat. It's true. God. It's true. But yeah, I think that's H2O. I mean, you know, it's I think that this is a lot of people's favorite in the franchise. And like you know and and i I get why. I really do. Because I think that that breath in the franchise is probably what what is what what gives that energy that people like, I would imagine. Well, and we get back Laurie Strode.

Speaker: You know what i mean? Even if it is in a new form of, you know, Carrie Tate or whatever. But i mean to be fair, if if part one isn't your favorite, I'm sort of a little skeptical of you, to be honest. Right. um I'd have to rank these weirdly, but that's for another day. Yeah, fair.

Speaker: But like I just think that like this was a this was, unlike the last idea, this was a good idea. And they put period on a sentence. um I do think it's kind of hilarious, the premise that Michael Myers would wait 20 years to track Laurie Strode down, but we'll let them have that. so Exactly.

Speaker: Andrew, what did you rate Halloween H2O? Yeah. And I forgot to say before here at Freigate, the 13th Horror Podcast, we judge any seven stripe scale for the seven stripes of the grand grand old rainbow. I give Halloween H2O a five. I said, what a fun return to form, even if it is Scream's version of Halloween.

Speaker: Fantastic. I also gave it a five and I said H2O holds super nostalgia for me. It's a great entry in the franchise, but it's also unfortunately where the huge reactions from Jamie Lee Curtis started, which should have been nuanced from the start.

Speaker: Well, that will do it for our horror in the movies. We'll be right back for a little game called Trick or Treat, Bitch.

Speaker: Well, folks, that was episode 170 of the 13th Horror Podcast. But before we go, Andrew, as always, has a game for us. Andrew, tell us about Trick or Treat, bitch.

Speaker: Yes, I'm going to read you some how some bizarre Halloween facts, and you have to decide whether the statement is a trick, which it would be completely made up, or a treat, which is true. So kind of true or false, but trick or treat. all right, let's go.

Speaker: The first one is the pumpkin spice conspiracy. In 2017, New Jersey town briefly banned pumpkin spice products at its annual Halloween festival after complaints that the smell was attracting swarms of bees.

Speaker: You said that was New Jersey. is that correct? Yeah. That's a trick. Yeah, you're correct. It was a trick. This is completely made up. While sugary foods and drinks can attract insects, there's no documented New Jersey Halloween festival that banned pumpkin spice. Yeah, listen. Ain't no one in New Jersey banning pumpkin spice. like that's That's not happening anytime soon. No way.

Speaker: All right, the next one is titled Clowning Around. During the creepy clown panic of 2016, several schools across the United States went into lockdown or increased security because reports of threatening clowns.

Speaker: I'm going to say treat. That is a treat. In 2016, creepy clown sightings and online threats caused widespread panic. um so Some schools saw increased security and others went into lockdown after reported threats. The phenomenon even prompted police investigations and warnings.

Speaker: God. believe I believe we talked about this at length in our um Clowns Are Terrifying episode. So if you want to back and listen to that. That's it. Round three is called Candy from a Killer. In 1974, a Texas father poisoned his own son's Halloween candy and attempted to blame the murder on a mysterious stranger handing out poison threats.

Speaker: I mean, that sounds real enough that I'll say treat, honestly. It's such a treat that we talked about it in our first Halloween special. Oh, no way! Ronald Clark O'Brien poisoned his eight-year-old son, Timothy, with cyanide-laced pixie sticks in 1974. God, I used to love a pixie stick, too. Damn.

Speaker: Right. Round four. Ghosts need shoes. New Orleans once passed an ordinance. These titles are so ridiculous. I know. I'm sorry. um New Orleans once passed an ordinance requiring anyone wearing a ghost costume in public to keep their feet visible so police could distinguish between actual people from supposed supernatural spirits.

Speaker: Oh, that's got to be a trick. Come on. That's a trick. No such law exists in the documented history of New Orleans, unfortunately. kind of want that to be a treat, though, to be honest. Like, that's And honestly, that's probably a good law to have. I'm just putting that out there. Just saying. All right. Two more. The next one is titled Halloween Hellraisers.

Speaker: During the early 20th century, Halloween pranks became so destructive in some of American communities that towns began organizing parties of supervised trick-or-treating to discourage vandalism.

Speaker: What year was that again? early 20th century.

Speaker: um I mean, it sounds real enough that I would say treat. Sure, I'll say treat. That is indeed a treat. During the 1920s and 1930s, Halloween mischief sometimes escalated into vandalism, including broken windows and damaged properties. So communities respond by encouraging organized celebrations and children activities.

Speaker: Lovely. Your last one is ah titled, and we're going back to our our previous episode, a Corn Identity Crisis. In the 1950s, a small wit Midwestern town banned candy corn from trick-or-treat bags after officials mistakenly classified the candy as livestock feed rather than something intended for human consumption.

Speaker: You said this was the 50s, you said? Yes.

Speaker: This is the hardest one. um Because that story doesn't actually sound all that far-fetched. But...

Speaker: I'm going to say it's a trick. I completely made it up. It's completely fabricated. Candy corn has been around since the eighteen eighty s and was originally marketed as a seasonal confection. Although it resembles actual corn kernels, nobody has officially reclassified it as livestock feed. Also, love candy corn. i'm just putting that out there. I love candy corn. And I specifically love Brock's candy corn. Thank you very much.

Speaker: Cool. All right. Well, that does it for trick or treat, bitch. And I believe you just batted a hundred. I think you got all those right. whoa on you Andrew, as always, thank you for putting together such a wonderful game and listeners out there. Thank you for being with us for yet another episode, episode 170, wonderful. So folks, listen, ah you were just with us for, I think, probably ah just over two hours.

Speaker: um And in those two hours, did you hear one advertisement? You did not. And that is because we are a proud, independent podcast. And that means that we rely on you. you We rely on you to tell other people about us. We rely on you to um help us out to break even as well. And that's something that you can do really easily by going to our website, which is freigay13.com slash support. And you can buy merch there or you can become a patron on Patreon. I say this every episode. We don't want you to become a patron at any other level than $1 month. And that $12 a year is scaled out with everyone else doing it. That helps us break even. It's a lovely thing. ah You also get to join a really cool community of other people um who are probably the same as you and in a lot of ways. And we we love talking with you all and and hanging out with you all. So if that's something that you're interested in we hope that you'll give it a shot.

Speaker: Yeah. And a special shout out to Nathan Buck. He sent us a very nice message on Instagram. So thank you so much, Nathan. Thank you, Nathan. He not only praised the show, but he also sent a follow-up message just saying how much he enjoyed Marshmallow, which I recommend. oh Marshmallow was great, by the way. It was so, so good.

Speaker: So that thank you thank you so much, Nathan. um When people reach out to us, that's... We love it. Honestly, if as long as you're not reaching out to promote something, that's like, it's it's like the one thing that keeps us going. So thank you so much. so Andrew, I'll tell you, the funny thing about the things that we get now to promote is they are literally all written by AI. Oh, I know.

Speaker: ah And if if I don't know if anyone's listening out there, don't send us any AI things for promotion. It's stupid. like we're we're that All we're going to do is delete it. that That's it. So a trick or treat.

Speaker: Don't do that, please. Just save your time. I don't know how else to say it. There you go. If you want to reach out in earnest and, you know, actually want to communicate with us, we definitely encourage that. However, that would be cool. We love that.

Speaker: And other ways to support the show, if you could please leave a review. We say it every single episode, but it really does help the show stay at the top of the charts so people more people see us, more people tune in, more people hear like ah you know become patrons, all the stuff. So just like, if you could just leave a review, i think that's the gift that you could give this Halloween season. And if you're going to give anything, don't give a trick, give a treat to Friday the 13th Horror Podcast.

Speaker: Andrew, more than anything else, we really do wish all of you a very happy Halloween. We know it's you know probably one of your favorite days of the year and favorite seasons of the year. So truly hope it is a very special and fun and spooky and weird Halloween for all of you. And when you then turn around and go vote. Exactly. but also please vote. And when you go out there to trick or treat, just want you to get one thing in your little...

Speaker: your little bag of treats. And that is for each one of you to go out there and get