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Bergman Island (2021) dir. Mia Hansen-Løve
24 Plays10 months ago
In this episode, we talk about Mia Hansen-Løve's Bergman Island, which follows a creative couple on a retreat to Faro Island where the famous director, Ingmar Bergman, shot his most loved movies.
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Transcript
Iconic Film Quotes and Personal Hollywood Experiences
00:00:00
Speaker
This is a song to all the ladies. I am big. It's the pictures that got small. I am Catwoman. Hear me roar.
00:00:14
Speaker
All this way for my advice, I feel like Oprah. Person your seatbelts. It's going to be a bumpy night. What the hell? I'm not going to worry about if people accept me or not. I'm going to make Hollywood wherever I am at. Oh, that's it. So you know this island? It's kind of special, right? Yeah, it's the island of the director. You and mommy like your life. Yep, that's it.
00:00:44
Speaker
A lot of people come here to work. Students. Writers. Designers. Wow. All is calm and perfection. I find it oppressive. Susan. You know how writing is for me? Since Porsches, self-inflicted agony, it's blood from a stone. Well then, do something else.
00:01:13
Speaker
Yeah, like what? Full-time housewife? Well, it's an honorable profession. Do you think you can create a great body of work and raise a family at the same time? At the age of 42, Berman had directed 25 films. How do you think he would have done that if he was also changing diapers? How's everything going? Pretty good, Ashley. What's it about?
00:01:41
Speaker
It's about how invisible things circulate within a couple. Can I tell you about what I'm writing? Yeah.
Introduction to 'Screen Queens' and 'Bergman Island'
00:01:57
Speaker
Welcome back to the screen, queens, everybody, where we discuss a selection of movies directed by women from the silent era all the way to modern releases today. I'm your host, Topia Laituitibo. I'm here on my co-host, Sherry Kola.
00:02:11
Speaker
Hey, hey, hey. How's it going? It's going. You love your new name change? I do. I do. Should we explain to people why? I think so. She's in Pognito. She's undercover as a film critic. Let me tell you, a bad film critic, because I was like, who the hell is Bergman?
00:02:35
Speaker
Oh child, oh child, we're about to get into it. This is a great introduction because our movie today is Bergman Island, which is, or was directed by Mia Hansen Loewe. I'm going to say Loewe because it's got that little O with the
00:02:55
Speaker
like cross over it. So it's not me a handsome love, but I also haven't heard her pronounce it. So Mia, I apologize in advance. Hopefully this is how you say your name. She is a French director. So I'm giving it some, you know, as I say a little bit, at least it's like French. I mean, I know passable French. Like if you dropped me in France, like I'd be okay.
00:03:22
Speaker
Yeah, see, I trust you then. I definitely was pronouncing it as loves. You added an extra S that doesn't even exist.
00:03:32
Speaker
And, you know, this is actually the first movie I've been wanting to watch this movie for a long time, ever since it dropped in 2021. And I've seen other movies by her. And my thing was like, if I really enjoy this one, I think I might kind of delve into some of her other movies because the topics are just so interesting.
00:03:54
Speaker
Now, before we go further, for those of you who haven't seen it, just know we're about to get into the plot. And so there's going to be some spoilers. Not sorry, but you knew this was happening. You listened to the previous episode. We said it. We said it. OK. Bourbon Island is available in Hulu, which is now merged with Disney, so.
00:04:15
Speaker
Oh, I didn't do that. Yeah, they have a whole suite. I think it's like Disney Hulu, ESPN or something. So you can get a whole suite together, or you can get Hulu by itself. I'm not quite sure how that works, but it's on there in Hulu, so you have a Hulu account, then you can watch it. It's also on the Criterion channel.
00:04:36
Speaker
which is literally one of my favorite, if not my top favorite streaming platforms because they're just about the movies. They don't care about commercials. They don't like, it's all about movies from movie lovers. So you have two places where you can watch it and a criteria channel is like 10 bucks a month. So hopefully, you know, in this economy, I know, I know it's a lot, but hopefully you can,
Summary and Themes of 'Bergman Island'
00:05:00
Speaker
Hopefully you got the money to do it. But Bergman Island is about two filmmakers who go to, and I'm probably going to miss this name, Florida Island. Even though it's spelled F-A-R-O, it's the O and the A switch over, which is how I remember it. I would call it Pharaoh. Continue.
00:05:21
Speaker
Meryl Island actually does exist, but it's literally on the other side of the world. But Florida Island, which is, I think, like off the coast of Sweden, so they go there for the summer, and Florida Island is where the film director, he's a genius film director, Ingman Bergman, who
00:05:45
Speaker
is worshiped in Sweden. He's worshiped around the world. This island is almost like Mecca for filmmakers, right? Particularly if you really love his movies. And so these two filmmakers go to this island for the summer in hopes of getting inspired by this director and the island he lived on where he wrote all of his movies, where he directed a lot of his movies. And as the days go by while they're there,
00:06:14
Speaker
you know, the lines between fantasy and reality start to blur. And so I was really interested in this because it was about two creatives married to each other and they have a child.
00:06:29
Speaker
Not that I'm feeding any of my situation. And I was like, yeah, let's go. Let's go. I want to hear, like, what are the struggles here? So so this is where we start.
Artistic Residencies and Creative Challenges
00:06:40
Speaker
And I, you know, like, what was your how did you feel about it after? Yeah. Well, there was there's always something interesting as a visual artist. Right. For the audience. I make paintings. I make drawings. I make objects that eventually become paintings and drawings.
00:06:58
Speaker
Like a sculpture, right? Like it always ends up being a painting or a drawing in the end. It's like, oh, this would be better as that. So I watch films because I like films. And then when you invited me onto the podcast as co-host, I was like, yeah, why not? You know, I'm in between paintings and drawings.
00:07:17
Speaker
And usually when you're in between things, you attend a residency like Bourbon Island for inspiration or just a space to work and really just focus on the ideas. So I thought I'm always looking for something that accurately describes a residency. And this almost had it. Oh, yeah. Almost had it. What was missing for you?
00:07:43
Speaker
You know, when we get into it, when we get to like the movie within the movie, the Amy experience of a residency was a little bit more accurate to me than our protagonist, Chris and Tommy. So I found Chris, I was laughing at myself last night, cause I was like, I may need to talk to Toby about just scanning my notes and putting them on the website. I found Chris to be miserable.
00:08:16
Speaker
Honestly, I feel the same. I was like, girl, what is wrong with you? But get this, the writers at the residencies, I like this. They are tortured. Everything is horrible. Everything is fantastic. Everything is horrible, right? It's just, you can never, and the painters are just over there like, woo, I got tired of painting.
00:08:42
Speaker
It's a tortured experience for some people. And I think that, you know, before starting this podcast, I was listening to very different interviews with the director. And one of the things that she says is that, you know, she actually went to Fora Island to write. And then at the end, what came out was this movie. So it's something super meta about this whole thing. She's writing about these people who are writing about a movie that they're writing.
00:09:10
Speaker
And she also found that for her, writing is just, or creating is such a tortured process. It's so hard. And then you have other people that just, it comes naturally to them. And she tries to depict those two things in the movie. So Tony appears to be a successful,
00:09:40
Speaker
writers, director, I guess. And even while he's at that island riding, he already has a movie that's kind of in the works because he's on the phone as they're driving to the island.
00:09:53
Speaker
talking about casting and production timeline and things like that. So it seems like he's constantly always got something in the works, right? Whereas for Chris, it seems like maybe it's been a while since she had something that she made. And so she's going to this island as a way to get inspiration. And she just seems like...
00:10:18
Speaker
almost, like, frustrated by the fact that she can't produce anything as quickly as her husband. Also, maybe, like, some latent jealousy that her husband is just, you know, because she goes into his office, and he's already, like, in two days just completed the script. He's like, I'm going for a bike ride. I'm done.
00:10:41
Speaker
You know, she's just kind of she's just wandering into the room as he's being creative. Like they've made this decision to write in separate spaces and she just wanders. And I'd be like, I would be pissed. I'd be like, girl, oh, yeah, I'm in my zone. I need you to.
00:10:56
Speaker
you know until we have the time where we're like okay this is the time we spend together like you know yeah for sure i completely agree so from the very beginning when they're on the ferry when they finally get to the island like she's just like already tortured i think one of the first things she says is that do you think this is too nice of a place like too beautiful yeah i find it oppressive
00:11:21
Speaker
This is like six minutes into the movie and he's sitting there and they're looking, they're in like the windmill house and they're looking out at the water and the beach, not a cloud in sight. It's gorgeous there. It's gorgeous, it's quiet.
00:11:38
Speaker
And she immediately starts to set up these parameters, like, OK, we should probably work in separate places. Maybe we should sleep in separate places, right? We'll cross over as we need to. And she's immediately the person to break all of those things, too. Yeah. In like 10 minutes. So I think I actually wrote down on strike one.
00:12:05
Speaker
Strike one. You're fucking miserable. You know, I mean, you know, I think sometimes for creatives, we are our own worst enemy. Like we say, you know, like sometimes we do set up these obstacles and and walls for ourselves that we don't need to. And sometimes that's just kind of coming
Ingmar Bergman's Influence and Marriage Dynamics
00:12:27
Speaker
from a place of and I think you could sense up from the character. Like maybe she felt some imposter syndrome, like she felt like
00:12:32
Speaker
Okay, well, I had this one really good thing, but maybe this is all I have in me, you know? Yeah, for sure. And I love that this is why I'm wearing Lauren Hill's shirt right now. Maybe the white album. I love it, but I'm Lauren this morning. Maybe the white album is all you have in you, and that's okay? Yeah, maybe that's it. It's a great album. Lauren, how many years? 25 years? Since that album was dropped. Although she says she might be coming out with some new stuff, so I won't hug. Is she gonna be outside?
00:13:02
Speaker
It's been 25 years. I'm not holding my breath, girl. I will have gray hair by the time I see anything. But yeah, so I think that maybe that's all kind of, she creates these rules because she needs to feel in control of this process. And that's the thing with creative processes is that it's supposed to flow out of you. It's not a faucet. You can't just,
00:13:31
Speaker
you know, when it comes and comes and you need to kind of go with it, you know, there's almost like a lack of control and giving into it, at least for me, you know, my mind is always so busy. And then there are times where like, I'll sit down in front of a computer in like nothing. So I think that there was a certain
00:13:52
Speaker
need for her to force it because she wanted to prove to herself that she wasn't an imposter. But I think that, you know, when she finally kind of just lets go and enjoys being on the island is when she finds that inspiration for sure. But until then.
00:14:11
Speaker
we go through them, I guess, essentially trying to find it. Right. And from what I understand, this is indicative of the director and Bergman that we spend a lot of time with kind of what we would assume is the mundane or mundane things.
00:14:28
Speaker
So them on a walk, right, them shuffling the papers around. I was struck by how there's no music. Yeah, that's true. Uh huh. No music. And so I was sitting there and I was like, all right, I'm hearing everything. Yeah. I'm here. I'm still there. It's a clock. Oh, my God. That clock. I tell you, I could hear it. And that's one of the things they're really like if I'm in a room and I can hear a clock.
00:14:57
Speaker
Take care. I will take the batteries out. It was really so connected to that moment I was like it drove me crazy and I could hear it and I could tell that it drove her crazy because she eventually takes it off the wall and I was just like Finally we can write
00:15:12
Speaker
So finally, apparently they have access to Bergman's archive to a degree. And so they watch films and then there's this lore around the film scenes from a marriage that it's broken up a whole bunch of marriages. Oh yeah, no. So I actually started watching that movie. So I love Bergman's films and he
00:15:38
Speaker
So here's the thing about Bergman, because you said you didn't know, so we'll just take a step back. I sure don't, yeah. Bergman, you know, and I think they talk about this in the film, that at the age of like 42, he had made 25 films, and he had directed the play. And he'd done all of this stuff, like he, for him, inspiration, it was just coming, it was just coming, like he has made so many films.
00:16:00
Speaker
And, you know, sometimes when you have someone making that many films, there's probably one or two dugs in there. But when you go through his filmography, it's just bangers after bangers after bangers. Like, it's like, Pastona was great. Seven Seal was great. Scenes from Marriage was great. Hour of the Wolf was great. You just go through it. And it's so, you know, I think that it can be very intimidating to be in his space knowing that, like, okay, was it, did it come out of him or did it come out of this location that he's in?
00:16:30
Speaker
and you can really struggle having the, you know, you're almost in his shadow when you're there, particularly if you're there as a writer and you're there with the goal to write, it could be a little oppressive to have, because they stayed in his actual house. Exactly, yeah. They stayed in his house and everything is just dedicated to him. Everything. In this way that- Even the people that live there are like living memories of him, you know? Yes, yeah, and they even talk about like,
00:16:57
Speaker
I wrote it down somewhere, um, that you can't escape Bergman from sunglasses to buses, like the Bergman safari. Um, and that everything is through him. They even talk about the landscape through. Yeah. And I understand it because there are residencies like this, like you have Mitchell residency.
00:17:21
Speaker
The Rauschenberg residency quite a bit is like this, like his house on like an island or some shit like that. Can I get a house on an island, please? Right? Please? So there are a lot of them that are dedicated to this artist, this artist's state, and they're trying to keep it going. Yeah, and that's a good way to do it. Yeah. And I remember thinking, I was like, oh, God, this is so pretentious.
00:17:48
Speaker
It was so pretentious, but that's the art world. That is the art world. It's just like this, I mean, the island's almost like a shrine, you know? Yeah, it's a shrine. And to his memory and, you know, like, I think when the director was there writing it, she was like, there were people, there were people there because there's not a lot of young people there, but there were people there who knew him.
00:18:10
Speaker
Yeah. So even there's this connection to him that is that he's still alive. You know, there's this thing I heard a long time ago did you are, you know, your spirit or you are still alive as long as there is one person in the world that still remembers you. And when you have all of these people, he's even more alive than none.
00:18:32
Speaker
than any other artist you might you might think of, you know, like John Ford or whatever. So I could see how that would be like a lot. It almost feels like you probably should visit the island, but go off the island to write, you know, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Some distance. Yeah. Some scenes from a marriage. I think I made it through like 40 minutes before I was like, I cannot.
00:18:58
Speaker
I mean, it's not because it was bad. It's a slow burn because it literally is the slow breaking down of a marriage. And I think that initially when I was watching it was like in the early days of my marriage. And I was like, no.
00:19:20
Speaker
in my life right now. It would be like watching, it'd be like being pregnant and watching a birthing story, you know? You don't want to see it. Yeah, you know, if we just got married, we just bought a house, we got emerging things. I don't want to start picking on the little things. So it's not that the movie was bad. Okay, for anyone who's listening, go watch it, particularly if you're not married.
00:19:42
Speaker
or you've been married, maybe you've been married for 20 years, don't watch it. There's a sweet spot and you'll find it when you watch this movie, it's great. This is what I wonder about.
00:19:55
Speaker
One, I mean, just being married in general, I'm kind of fascinated by the idea. Not that I want it, but I don't. From an experimental perspective. Exactly. You know what? From an experimental, but also like a business perspective is a horrible contract. And so when you get your tax return, you'll see it's not that horrible.
00:20:20
Speaker
Because like buying a house now as a single person is nigh on impossible. Oh, yeah. So like you almost have to go in with somebody else. So again, another benefit. So you have to get married to have stable home.
00:20:36
Speaker
Yeah, sorry. Damn the brakes, girl. Do not marry someone to buy a house. OK, that's my advice to you. Make sure it's for love and also for the tax. Oh, my God. I just spilled my tea.
00:20:52
Speaker
Because I'm spilling the tea. Yes, you are. Yes, you are. Yeah. What's your question about marriage? Maybe I can help you out. I don't know. Again, I think it's a horrible contract. There are benefits, yes, to being able to split expenses. And then there's the idea of companionship, consistent love and affection. All of those things, I think, are interesting ideas. Yeah.
00:21:19
Speaker
But it's like, it's, you know, the foundations are so important for that, I feel, because, you know, and I know it's corny, because everyone says this at their bow, and today I married my best friend. You kind of do, and you have to be best friends with them. It's got to be based on a friendship, because like love is nice, and it's a fluffy feeling,
00:21:49
Speaker
But it takes way more than that, because trust me, when they're leaving their shit on the floor, keeping the toilet seat, love ain't gonna help you out. It really isn't. And how you fight, you know, and how you say sorry, and how you just kind of show up for each other. These are all kind of like emotional, intelligent behavior.
00:22:17
Speaker
that you need to learn anyway, whether it's in a friendship or in a marriage. And so if you haven't learned that, a marriage will be a terrible contract. It will be insufferable. But if you've learned that and you've done the work,
00:22:33
Speaker
then when the tough situations come up or even the annoying situations, there you already have the tools to like. So then it doesn't it doesn't become as tough or as frustrating. But yeah, I do feel like I mean, they even said that the women who are single and not married without kids are living longer than anybody else. And I'm like, I get it. We should. We should. It's like here's one of my questions, or at least for you and Greg and maybe you
00:23:07
Speaker
Like, why not just live together and invest in things together, right? Like, the whole, the actual legal part of it. Why was that necessary for y'all? I mean, I don't know. Now that you ask me, I don't know.
00:23:28
Speaker
because like some days I'm like because I do have I do have a friend you know her you know Katie you know her and her partner have been together for over a decade as far as we're concerned they're practically married sometimes I even call him her husband but they don't have any legal
00:23:49
Speaker
things like that. But, you know, there are times where, you know, we'll we'll talk, you know, and, you know, I'm like, well, if something happened to him, how are you covered? Yes. Right. That is. Yeah. Because I mean, because in a situation when, you know, one of you earns way more than the other.
00:24:10
Speaker
and the properties and their name or whatever, the way that the law works, you could get kicked out of your own home, and we've seen that happen a lot, kicked out of your own home. Also, even with same-sex couples having to adopt their own children so that they don't lose, and there's actually a really great movie directed by a woman about these two lesbian couples who have
00:24:36
Speaker
a child together and one of them dies from cancer and their parents take custody of the child and so there's a court battle of trying to prove that I am the mother, you know, and so there are
00:24:54
Speaker
things where yes, there are things we could share together, but the law doesn't really protect those people, particularly when it comes to if they're in a hospital and a decision has to be made, then you need to go through a whole paperwork for that, but sometimes even though they won't follow that paperwork, they'll default to biological relation. I think a lot of it is about taking control
00:25:26
Speaker
when bad things happen, which is not great. And then, because you can still pull your resources together without a marriage, like I don't think that a marriage is necessary. And I mean, to be honest, maybe we probably just did it for our parents. You know how Nigerians be like, I'm not gonna be out here living with this man without a ring on my finger.
00:25:50
Speaker
I mean, it makes sense when you talk about like, OK, I want I completely understand. I want Greg to have the decision if something happens to me in the hospital. Right. Yeah. I want to go. I want to buy a house and we need two people to do it. We're already talking about living together. This is just simpler and cleaner way versus like trying to split the bills like roommates. Yeah.
00:26:16
Speaker
I mean, you can still do, I mean, you can still combine it together. There's nothing that says, hey, you know, we can't put our money together in the same bank account.
00:26:26
Speaker
Like you have to do it because you're married. Like no, there's like no. But a lot of the institutions and the frameworks that we have right now are built around marriage. So until we create a society that values non-marriage as much as marriage and creates like
00:26:47
Speaker
institutions that recognize and value them and allow you to choose who gets to make a decision about you during the worst moment of your life or who gets to inherit your property or whatever. I think that marriage will still be popular. But I also, I said to him, I was like, if it don't work out, I'm not doing this again.
00:27:10
Speaker
I ticked it off my to-do list and my bucket list, and I was like, you know, hopefully you're in, but if someone comes after you, they're just going to have to be my boyfriend, girlfriend, friend. I tell you, I friend women, cis women in particular, say this all the time. They're like, uh-uh, I did it once, you only have to do it once.
00:27:31
Speaker
People who do it like three, four times, I'm like, you're not good at this. You're not good at this. Why do you need to do it? Do we think our couple is good at this? Do we think Chris and Tony are good at this? I think Tony thinks that he is.
00:27:48
Speaker
I think Tony thinks that he's doing enough, but I think that Chris Hess is, as she's on that island, because they talk about this, they talk about it in the context of Bergman, and this is what I wish they had done more of in the film, because when you have two creative couples and you share things together, and you share a child together, you know, there's also, even if you do have the money to get help,
Impact of Family on Creativity
00:28:13
Speaker
There is the emotional labor. And they talk about Bergman who, he had like nine kids by several women. And he never raised any of them. He didn't raise any of them. He wasn't involved. And because he wasn't involved and he wasn't changing diapers or whatever, he was able to make all of these, he was able to be creative and do all of these things. Whereas the women were doing the child wearing. And if they had any goals or ambitions or things like that,
00:28:41
Speaker
You know, and I wanted to see more of that because I feel like it was more like here is my creative process and I'm gone and I and I and I wish like the child situation to enter the picture because it happened at the end. Corinne.
00:28:56
Speaker
And I didn't I didn't hear the conversations or the discussions between the couple about how, yeah, you're able to go off and be the successful director and have these ideas flow out of you because I'm taking care.
00:29:12
Speaker
of our kid or she's relying on me emotionally. And, you know, you get to kind of step away in your studio and do whatever. And I wanted when I picked this movie, I wanted to see more of that, not her dalliances with Hampus, who. Yeah.
00:29:29
Speaker
Well, they vary to your point. They very lightly touch on it at the table one night. Yeah. Where she's upset. Yeah. Yeah. Right. And she why is she upset? I'm thinking about it. I'm trying to remember, too.
00:29:46
Speaker
I think it probably has to do with the writing, right? I think so. I think she's just like frustrated. Yeah. Yeah. She's just frustrated and she feels stuck and she's explaining again how torturous this is, you know, how it is for me. And he is trying to be encouraging as much as possible. Yeah. He's like, well, you don't have to do this.
00:30:09
Speaker
Right. Yeah. No. And she's like, what do you want me to stay at home and be like a housewife? Yeah. I'm like, they didn't say that, though. He was like, you don't have to say that if you want to go run a photo from 500 company. Yeah. He's like, you can do whatever it is that you want to do. And so it was which she does at one point. Right. Instead of going on the safari with him, he stays hanging around with that grad student or whatever.
00:30:36
Speaker
And he doesn't say anything about it, right? Yeah. He's just like, are you OK? Yeah. I'm just like, oh, yeah. Not bad. I know I was supposed to show up to that thing, but whatever. I wonder if that's just because they've been together for a really, really long time and they respect each other's space. And like, you know, if if, you know, she's like, oh, you're alive. OK, so it must be one of these other reasons that I know of because
00:30:59
Speaker
We've been together a long time, but there's also like an age difference between them. And I think that that might be part of the reason maybe why he doesn't fuss. He's like an older guy. He's used to kind of just being by himself and maybe there's less of a possessiveness there. You see this in the art world all the time. I don't need to know where you are, what you're doing all the time. Are you fine in your life? Yeah, cool.
00:31:26
Speaker
You see this all the time. You see some older dudes. It happens with cis women too, but we're talking about cis men. You see it less with cis women, more with cis men, obviously, that they
00:31:42
Speaker
they are off and they are creating and they're doing the thing. And their wife, who's usually a little bit younger, that they met at a time where they were, impressionable isn't the word, but in awe of them, you see that a lot. The cis men in the art world will pick the woman who,
00:32:05
Speaker
who's just like, Oh yeah, he's like worship some worship. When I tell you something, I probably never call a man is fucking brilliant or a visionary. I think that just, just
00:32:22
Speaker
You know, just get a funnel and blow the smoke directly in his ass. And they choose this woman because she will give everything to his creative practice, something that he's doing.
00:32:43
Speaker
and neglect their own creativity or their own practices. It's not like their own just day-to-day shit and the hopes of making sure that he's happy. And then he's like, oh, well, you know, I know you're struggling a little bit, but it's okay. You see this dynamic a lot. I also think that
00:33:05
Speaker
I think he missed her, you know, because there are moments where he's like stuck with these nerds. Yeah. And he almost coupled. Yeah. And everyone's coupled and he's in this threesome with three other guys and two other guys. And they are obsessed with Bergman. And I can tell like obviously he likes Bergman. He's interested in his work, but he's not. He's doing the tour as a break because he finished the script.
00:33:31
Speaker
And then I think there was a moment where he just seemed like he wished she was there, and she's off on her dalliance with Hampus. Also, what a name, Hampus. What a name, that's our problem, the grad student. And I kind of wished he had explored that a little bit, like why did you, you left me hanging.
00:33:54
Speaker
So I don't know, maybe this is their relationship that they're used to kind of just going off and doing their own thing. And so they don't worry about being, you know, the person doesn't show up. But, you know, it's really interesting about that because I was just like, first of all, if I met some random dude, I don't care how cute he is, I ain't getting in his car.
00:34:15
Speaker
I'm not getting a car on a remote island. I've watched way too many Scandinavian crime shows for this, okay? Like, I know how it ends. And then you'd be like, oh, do you want some cider? I'm like, yeah, sure. I was like, darling, you have a child. Not that this just stopped me from enjoying your life, but I just, there was definitely not a survival.
00:34:36
Speaker
like, trigger going on in her mind. I was just like, no, because he was all like, let's go to these dudes. And I was like, oh, girl. Now, so something interesting about this for me, I was like, oh, you're on a date. You know, you're basically on a date. Like, you know, she was she was my team. Yeah. They go to the beach.
00:34:58
Speaker
and they do all of this, they throw jellyfish at each other, which I would never, but they throw jellyfish at each other. It's that date that we all wish would happen where it just keeps going. Like you get food, you have an activity, you get more food. Yeah. But it's kind of like what you were saying that, you know, you said it happened less with Sis Women, but he was someone who had watched her films and loved her film.
00:35:21
Speaker
And so I think she was getting the same thing that probably she's given her husband that, like, reverence from a younger film student, film lover who makes her feel like, oh, maybe I'm not an imposter. Oh, my God. Like, you know, he took his girlfriends in this movie and she hated it and then they broke up. Oh, that was me. I did that. You know, they kind of she I think, you know,
00:35:46
Speaker
I don't think that she was like, oh, I'm falling out of love with my husband and in love with a student. But I think she was feeding off of his just admiration. And maybe that helped with her inspiration because I think right after that date is when she was like, I have an idea.
00:36:06
Speaker
Yeah, she has an idea. And let me tell you, that little boy could stand to do a push-up or two. Or two. A one-twenty-half kettlebell will work differently. I felt like a stiff breeze would have pushed someone.
00:36:24
Speaker
But here's an interesting thing I found out is that like, so when the director was on the island doing her research, that was the same guy she met. And she had, so he's playing himself in that movie. And I thought that was interesting that, you know, she was like, yeah, I was so glad that he agreed to play himself and basically just do the same thing he did for me, which was like, show me around the island. I don't know the jellyfish thing happened between them.
00:36:49
Speaker
on the DL, but it ends the script. Part of me feels this is a bit of an autobiographical movie. She says it's not, but here's why. Because the year she wrote this movie is when she divorced her husband, who is also a filmmaker, a very celebrated filmmaker, and she was struggling to find inspiration to write a movie, and she'd only had one or two couple of stuff that were good.
00:37:18
Speaker
So, you know, as I was listening to her interview and I was like, so you just wrote about yourself? And I don't know. I kind of.
00:37:27
Speaker
It kind of affected how I felt about the movie because when I think of people creating something, and this is because I love sci-fi, I love fantasy, I love things that seem new, that's never been done before. And so if something seems very close to someone's life instead of their life inspiring certain events, it doesn't feel as much of a stretch
00:37:56
Speaker
Right. If you're just like, I just copied the same route that I took with this kid and I put it in the script. Yeah. You know, and, you know, I don't want to, you know, clearly if she was dealing with impostor syndrome, I don't want to make it worse. But I do feel like.
00:38:15
Speaker
I feel like maybe we should have kind of stepped a little further away from the this was my experience and I'll put it in the movie. I feel like it should have been more because the only I feel like the only thing that made it different was that movie within a movie. But in a way, that's what she was doing. You know, and so I think it's cool.
00:38:36
Speaker
It is cool. I love the movie we did movie and I actually seen what was it called? It was an Audrey Hepburn movie that had Paris in the title and they did the same thing. And she was she was helping this writer who basically had he promised he'd been delaying the script for so long that his producer or the director was like, where are we going to get the script? And
00:39:00
Speaker
the director was like, okay, it's Friday. I'm going to be here on Sunday and I want a script. So he had literally 48 hours to write this script. And as they're writing the script, you see it play out in real time, kind of like what she did with a movie. And it's super fun because you see the movie take different turns. Like first it's like an action movie and then it turns into like a vampire movie. And then it turns into like, it just,
00:39:26
Speaker
And that, for me, was way more interesting and way more fun because I saw the creative process of trying to build this script because he was like, all he had was, we're in Paris, and it's this two people. And from there, it was like, well, we could go here. And then they're like, oh, no, that doesn't work. We're going to cancel that. And so they, you know, and you see it in real time as the actors, because I think Tony Curtis is in it. Jimmy Curtis' dad.
00:39:54
Speaker
you know, I'll find it. But yeah, so that was, that would be my major criticism about this because yeah, I just, I just felt like you had this, I understand that you're using your life to influence this script, but I just wish it had, like if she had focused more and dug deep on the relationship between her and her husband,
00:40:24
Speaker
in the midst of creating that and how that influenced what she was doing, I feel like I probably would have been more on board. Yeah, it feels like all of the things that we want, maybe that we want played out in more dialogue, were played out through other things, right? Yeah. It's played out in her not showing up to the burden of Safari. Yeah. It's played out in her picking fights. Yeah.
00:40:51
Speaker
and him trying to settle those fights. And him trying to settle them, right? It's played out in his ability to just sit there and bust out a script in a day and a half with little drawings, no less. Yeah. Also, let's talk about them bondage drawings, buddy. I know.
00:41:08
Speaker
I know. I saw that too. And I was like, oh, interesting. And when she found them, I wondered if she was going to say anything about it, but she didn't say anything. So that was another thing when I was like, I would have said something. I was like, what in the world? Or at least like.
00:41:26
Speaker
Ask him his like, hey, so, you know, what are you been doing on your script? Like, you know, kind of a fishing expedition, even if she didn't want to say something like, oh, I've been looking through your book and I found this stuff. Yeah. And I need to understand where that's where they argue, where they don't argue at the table. But that's where they're going back to that conversation of this is a torturous process for me. Yeah. She's trying to get him to say something. Yeah. He's like, I don't want to jinx it. I just want to come to myself for a little while. Yeah.
00:41:55
Speaker
Yeah, then she's like, well, what about this? And he goes, I don't want to tell you that. And then finally he tries to offer up a title and she's like, keep it. I don't want to know.
00:42:05
Speaker
I didn't get anywhere with her to be so damn miserable that it made me ask. I actually wrote it down. If this is a romance, are we supposed to find these people attractive? You know what's funny? I said, I said, it's not scenes from a marriage. It's more like scenes from the end of a marriage.
00:42:30
Speaker
I was just like, what is this? You know, in this beautiful, OK, like a little island, I am not fighting with my husband. Let me tell you, I am sitting by the pool. I am going to age.
00:42:45
Speaker
You know, but yeah, it was it's so like the movie within the movie was really interesting because like we get thrown into it. And now we're looking at Amy, the protagonist. You know, let's just preface it a little bit. So after they argued after she's gone to bed and she's had a date with Hampus. Yeah, Hampus would hate.
00:43:09
Speaker
It's not your hard name for such a skinny dude, you know? You said a stiff breeze could have blown him over.
Creative Breakthroughs and Personal Growth
00:43:18
Speaker
So after she'd just gone through all of this torture, right, that is consistently referenced in the first half of the movie, I would say like 30, 40 minutes, you get a breakthrough and on a walk with Tony, she's like, I've got an idea. And she's talking him through the movie.
00:43:35
Speaker
And as she's explaining it, we, the audience, are actually seeing it play out. So we kind of pivot to a movie and a movie that starts with a protagonist named Amy visiting Bourbon Island. Which is funny because the actress that plays Amy is also called Mia.
00:43:55
Speaker
So it's Amy and Joseph, I guess, is the is the guy that he is. Well, I've seen some other movies and I got to say, you know, yeah, I got to say he's a he's a cutie. I believe him. I believe you know what I mean? I believe him. It's like, how dare you show up to this window without your shirt on? How? Yes, I know. I got something out of that movie within a movie. Let me tell you.
00:44:26
Speaker
But it was, we saw all aspects of Joseph, like, you know, I'm gonna stop now. We did, we did, we did. Thank you Mia for gifting us with this perspective. But he, so I think the story is that these two used to be, they were like each other's first love when they were teenagers. And obviously they went off and had lives and she got married and had a kid and he has a girlfriend.
00:44:52
Speaker
And they get invited to a wedding that their friend is having, and they go with two other friends. But those two friends don't know that they used to be a thing, and they don't tell them, which is very sneaky, because it seems like y'all intended to go to this island for some nook-nook-y when you guys are partners.
00:45:11
Speaker
And they're actually like, no, we're not. But, you know, they get to the island and she sets this movie on Fora, which is where the Bergman and he Joseph is staying at Bergman's house. And so, you know, it's kind of.
00:45:28
Speaker
I don't want to say the word incestuous, but it's kind of just meta. It's all kind of looped in, all the experiences. And so then it's about this wedding that takes place over the weekend and the interaction between these two characters and how they struggle with
00:45:48
Speaker
what to do with the feelings that they still have. And you know, she's narrating over it because Amy still thinks about him and still pines after him and she doesn't know what he's feeling. So it's almost like this weekend was a way to discover is there something there, you know? Yeah. And, um,
00:46:10
Speaker
What I found interesting about it, like I said, for one, this is kind of closer to the idea of a residency, that I've experienced where you all come together, everybody's in a cohort, you're partying, you're drinking, you're eating, you're laughing, right? But there's actual socialization.
00:46:27
Speaker
people are generally positive about the experience. I thought it was interesting that the Amy character, who is the movie within the movie, is still just as self-centered as Chris. So much so that she's trying to wear a white dress to a wedding and trying to convince everyone else that it's not white. That it's off white and beige. Or beige. I saw that dress.
00:46:57
Speaker
It was a white dress. It was a white dress girl. But the fact that you're trying to convince people and you actually go to the bride, there we go, and say, would it be bad if I wore...
00:47:12
Speaker
a white dress. So let me ask you this. I mean, you've been to weddings. I've been to weddings. I've been to my own wedding, obviously, because I was there. I was there too. I was like, is it not a universal thing? I mean, I know that some cultures, obviously, non-Western cultures, let's just remove them out of there, probably different rules. But my understanding is that it is almost like a universal Western rule. The bride wears white.
00:47:41
Speaker
Everybody else find another color in a rainbow that ain't white. Right. Yeah. Unless the bride says this is an all white party. Correct. Which happens. You know, you have your island beach wedding and sometimes you wear all white. That was not the.
00:47:58
Speaker
the plot here, like correct. Yeah. The bride is also like, how white is it? Like, she's also kind of like uncomfortable by this conversation. And, you know, Amy's just like, well, you know, whatever. And then this is the. See, this is the part that I was like, yeah.
00:48:18
Speaker
I literally thogged Al and Brad was like, remember, she's not a real character. The bride was like, is it beige or is it white? And she was like, well, non-nuanced minds. Yeah, exactly. Almost like if you think it's not, if you think it's white, then you're not sophisticated.
00:48:41
Speaker
Exactly. You're already testing out the bride. So if she sees the dress, it has to go one or two ways. She either says it's white, in which case she's not sophisticated, or she lies and says it's not white. You really paint her in a corner. And I think after that, I was just like, Emmy, you and I are done. Yeah, this non-character character.
00:49:04
Speaker
is annoying, right? She wants her cake and eat it too. So she wants Joseph. She doesn't have an issue with them having this affair, this like short lived affair. She also loves her husband and wants him too, which is cool. But do that in an ethical way. Yes. You know, where Joseph is also having these feelings. He's like, yo, I like you. You know, I love you. Let's get it in.
00:49:31
Speaker
while I'm here, but then also he is overcome with guilt. Yeah, I think, you know, it's like, you know, when you have like a relationship early on, like your first love, and sometimes I talk about this with Greg about, you know, the guys that I've had in my lives and some of them that make a really lasting impression. And, you know, if it never had a conclusion
00:49:57
Speaker
A wrap up it's always lingering in there and it almost feels like every year it goes by you create.
00:50:05
Speaker
It becomes a mythology. It becomes a fantasy that's not rooted in how it actually was, you know, because where you were when you were 16, 17 is not who you are when you're in the thirties. And, you know, you kind of make it this bigger thing than what it was, which I think maybe they both did, except for Joseph, that we can that island made him really see her.
00:50:32
Speaker
and who she was. And even though he's like, I have love for you, I can't love this person, you know? And he, it was, you know, and not to fast forward, but he almost has to kind of leave without saying goodbye because he knows that if he
00:50:52
Speaker
even sees her, she's gonna find a way, as she's done throughout the weekend, to pull him to her. And, you know, he's very ethical about it. He's, I mean, he's not ethical when he has sex with her, but he's ethical in the sense that he actually feels remorse
00:51:10
Speaker
And she actually says, you know, I'm not gonna be looking at my girlfriend in the eye. How are you so chill about this? How are you just kind of, she's laughing. She's like, oh, you're not mad, are you? Why are you upset? Like I just cheated on my girlfriend. Like any person who is human would feel some sort of way about it. And you are just, you know, and the one thing that apparently upsets her is when, you know, he says, yeah, there've been other women after you. It was like, of course we haven't seen each other. And she gets upset.
00:51:40
Speaker
And she's like, he's like, well, you got married. She was like, it's different. I love two men. Yeah, this is what I mean. And this is, I was like, shut up, girl. Amy. Bye. Yes. And so in many ways I could believe Joseph's Joseph's rack with guilt. Yes. I would
00:52:03
Speaker
maybe be a little bit more sympathetic or empathetic. I'm not too sure which one. If that was after the first time that they had sex. Yeah. Yeah. They have sex multiple times. Right. And so it's only after like the third or fourth time where he's like, oh, shit.
00:52:18
Speaker
I probably shouldn't have done that. I think there are moments where, you know, like when you have that passion, it's like, it's fresh, it's new, it's exciting. And you get carried away with it, you know, like it's such a powerful feeling that it's hard for reason to make its way in there. And, you know, it kind of takes him saying, I'm going to go
00:52:44
Speaker
I'm going to go to my place for a couple of hours, just clear my head and have that separation for, you know, even if you weren't cheating on anybody, like when you're, when you're in the throes of passion of like a new relationship or someone you just met.
00:53:02
Speaker
you're all kind of engrossed in this bubble. And so it takes kind of stepping out of it to be like, okay, wait a second. Is this real? Is this lust? Is this something that I can build on? You know, like you really have to step away from it. And I think that that's what he had to do in order for him to be like,
00:53:21
Speaker
Yeah, no, this is not good. So let me ask you a couple of questions. One, just a second ago, we were talking about the mythology that you create around relationships. And you and I have known each other for a long time. Yes. Interestingly enough, we've known each other for about 15 years now. Oh, OK, yeah. It's been great. I was just shocked. And the majority of that has been long distance, because I left after a couple of years. Yeah. So that's interesting.
00:53:51
Speaker
All to say, I've seen us go through some changes. We have talked through some changes. We've talked about our men, our need for, our frustration with. Yes, living in a little bitty apartment, living in a shitty apartment, living in a better apartment, buying a house, right? All of these things. Do you recognize those past versions of yourself or do they seem like a weird mirage in this mythology of the past?
00:54:20
Speaker
I do like even when I was watching it and I was saying to Greg, it was like I actually understand what she's feeling like because, you know, I I've been there like there are, you know, I had my young love. I'll just put his name out there. Halft and Brock do who's Norwegian blonde hair, green eyes.
00:54:41
Speaker
Is this when you were back in the UK? Yes. And I met him like this was like I was 12, 13 and I was. Oh, that's cute. I read him every Valentine's Day. I wrote him a letter. I would put it in his locker. So one time I put it in his hands and I ran away. I didn't stop running for 10 minutes. I just ran nonstop until I couldn't run anymore.
00:55:08
Speaker
You know, even before I met Greg, there were times where like, I think we met again in New York. We just happened to be there at the same time and we reconnected with Facebook because he moved to the US and he moved like he moved around and he does like a lot of
00:55:24
Speaker
relief work and he works in like war-torn countries and things like that. So we like met up and you know in that moment I was like yeah he's really cute and everything but you kind of realize in that moment that I created something more than what he was you know like
00:55:43
Speaker
I had kind of had this idealized version of him. And he wasn't a horrible person. He was really nice. He was funny. He was interesting. Like, none of that had really changed. But, you know, when you're, like I said, when you're young and you haven't had a time to really wrap those things up, like have a fight, break up, or really just say, you know, it's cool, but I'm moving on. And maybe you're separated prematurely for whatever reason.
00:56:07
Speaker
like, you know, if your family moves away, you hold on to it and you keep it in this little glass container and you just eat it. But the thing is you're feeding it with a moment in time. And that moment in time was who you were then. And so, like, you know, I can't remember who it was I was telling. I found my live journal.
00:56:32
Speaker
from when I was 19. I was like, I don't know who this bitch is, but she's delusional. See, that's what I mean, right? It's like, you remember it, but you're also like, what? But now I actually have written details of it. And I was just like, there is something wrong when you go like, first of all, I thought I was going to have six kids.
00:56:54
Speaker
It's like, I cackled out loud when I read that. And just like, you know, your thoughts are not fully formed. Like, you don't know the world, you haven't been out in the world, and maybe you have, but like, you know, because everyone has different experiences. Some people have more intense experiences, very young, and so they mature very quickly and can reach that level of emotional maturity.
00:57:18
Speaker
But yeah, I feel like even if I go 10 years back, 15 years back when I met you, still a mirage. I think we're constantly evolving. So it's so important to see people as they are now, not as you wish them or you dreamt about them.
00:57:38
Speaker
because I feel like in some way she was projecting on him. For sure. And then whenever he would say something that would break that mirage, she would get upset, you know? Yeah. So, yeah. That's interesting. I would say I don't recognize
00:57:58
Speaker
for me 15 years ago. Like I understand I was bigger, of course. I was a bigger person. I was there. It was an animal experience. Unfortunately, yes. But looking back, I'm like, I can't believe I went through so much shit over me. Or that I gave that much space to a person or time and loyalty to a person. Whenever they're like, what would you say to your youngest self? This is it. Be like, girl, no.
00:58:25
Speaker
That's what I would say to myself. Yeah. But we all have to go through it. I wouldn't be the person I am today who I really enjoy and admire, quite frankly, versus that person then. So I had to go through it. But I wish I would have stood up for myself in certain circumstances.
00:58:47
Speaker
I tend to, as one friend said, she's like, you know, I stay too long. I try to give it too many chances. Yeah. And up until I can almost pinpoint, actually, I know when I turn 30, that's the way because I'm not going to say it online, but you remember what happened when on my 30th birthday, I can't remember. That I was like, oh, no, I've been doing this wrong.
00:59:14
Speaker
I mean, I've been giving you too much. No, yeah, too soon. Yeah. So that's something I thought was interesting. So if we pull out of the movie within the movie or back in the reality of Chris and Tony. Yeah. And she's telling him about this, you know, that walking. Yeah. Like you said, she says, are you even paying attention? He's like, yeah, I just had a drink of water or whatever.
00:59:40
Speaker
She asked him to help her wrap up the story. Yeah. He for the first time throughout the whole movie, he says no. Yeah. He's just like, he's like for himself, but also for her too. It's like, yeah, this is your movie. You have to find the ending. You know, exactly. You know where the story came from and how
01:00:03
Speaker
like what it is about. So me giving you an ending is not going to fit, you know, because I don't know. You know, I just heard it. Like, you know, yeah, I just heard it. And but do we think that I mean, if she is Amy, Chris is Amy. Yeah. And Tony is Joseph. Is that why he couldn't help her finish the story?
01:00:26
Speaker
I don't even think that Tony is a Joseph. I almost feel like Joseph might be campus. There we go. Yes. So it's so Tony is the husband with the kid back at the house. Well, exactly. Yeah. So is that why he couldn't help her finish the story?
01:00:43
Speaker
I mean, I think it's that and I think that like, you know, you could give people the same script and they will interpret it differently. Right. And someone might see romance, someone might see tragedy, like even at the end when she's like, oh, well, I could just do it where like she just hangs herself from the
01:01:06
Speaker
You know, there's so many ways who as you read a story with the same prompt, you're putting a bit of yourself in it. And I think that what he was like, I don't want to put myself in this. This is yours. Like I could tell this is coming out of you and it's flowing and it's good. So you have to find what's natural for this story.
01:01:30
Speaker
And what's interesting is we never see the ending of that story or how it ends. We see Joseph leaving the island. And no, we don't see him leave the island. We hear that he's left the island and we see her break down and cry. To the bride, she almost wore a white dress to her wedding, by the way. And then the bride is like, oh, were y'all together? Is this happening again?
01:01:59
Speaker
Right. Even she was just my girl. Why are you doing this? So it's interesting. I thought that the ending was Chris's actual ending, that she goes back to her husband. Yeah. The Amy character also goes back to her her husband, like Chris. Yeah. And they have their kid and they have their lives. Yeah. I mean, she kind of has to, because it takes two in the jokes of his life.
01:02:25
Speaker
that he does not, you know, and, you know, for whatever reason, Joseph might be going back to his girlfriend to confess his sins and hope that she forgives him. But, you know, without Joseph, she doesn't really have another option. So she has to make
01:02:44
Speaker
good with what she has. And I think it's almost like, you know, that's really why it's really important to have closed chapters, you know, because then you're always sort of looking at all the grass is always greener. This is this something better out there. And this is a problem with many marriages that you see is like
01:03:06
Speaker
If you don't find what you need or make what you need where you are, you're always gonna be looking out there for something else. And we don't know anything about her husband. Her husband could be completely dedicated to her. Her husband is like, yeah, you wanna go for a wedding by yourself? You know, without any idea who she's going with with your friends? Like, he's at home with the kid. Like, we don't know anything about the husband, how supportive he is, how loving he is, how everything.
01:03:32
Speaker
And, you know, if we knew, like, how would that change how we feel about her? But there's something to be said about, you know, if you're unhappy in your choice, that's fine. I'm not saying stay in an unhappy marriage. But it seems like she loves her husband. So I feel like the work would need to be on her part. It seems like this is a journey in herself that she needs to make to let go of Joseph.
01:04:03
Speaker
and really put in all that love she has for Joseph into the world she's already built with her husband and her child. And I think that maybe Chris also figures that out because of the way that the movie ends. Yeah, and the movie ends with Chris in the windmill house. Tony had left like the day or two before to have a meeting about a film.
01:04:32
Speaker
And he surprises her by returning with their kid. So here's the thing about that is because remember did it.
01:04:40
Speaker
In between, they make the movie. So we see the cast and crew and everybody, they're leaving the island. So I'm just like, was there a time jump? And then they're returning to the island and she's made the movie. And then he brings the kid, so he's been looking after the kid while she makes this movie. Because it suddenly jumps, you know, because she went back to Bergman's house and she's lying on the couch. And then suddenly, Joseph, the actor, shows up.
01:05:09
Speaker
Yes. In the movie and he's called Andis now. Yes. And they're talking and everybody's left, but they have this moment where she's like, aren't you going to say goodbye? And they have this like connection. So it's almost like maybe there was some sort of something that went on between them while the movie was taking place. This makes sense. I was confused. I didn't know if that was
01:05:33
Speaker
if that was like the reality of their situation or the fantasy or the fantasy. I wasn't sure which one. And I was leaning more towards it being the fantasy of it. Yeah. Yeah. I forgot about the crew leaving the island. Yeah. Right. So if that's the crew leaving the island makes it steeps it in their reality. Yeah. I feel like it was either and this was what I struggled with. I was like, even this was a time jump.
01:06:00
Speaker
Or this was her dreaming while asleep in that room, saying that she's fallen in love with the character that she made. So like you were talking about, her and Amy are the same, right? And so by letting Joseph leave or seeing Joseph leaves, she can finally accept that her life is with her husband and her child. So it's almost like her and Amy switch places in this fantasy
01:06:30
Speaker
reality blur or it's a time jump. They make the movie and. You know, she explores some things with the actor while they're filming on this island that I'm sure is nothing new director there. Well, it is not. I think for the listeners out there, they need to watch it and tell us which one do they think it is. I think so. And so if any if anything, I'm going to give
01:07:00
Speaker
Mia had a little bit of credit for is that part because I do feel like depending on who you are and what you were reading out of that, you might think it's something else. You might think the ending is something else. Yeah, I definitely thought it was something else because overall, this movie
01:07:27
Speaker
It's slow burn was almost a little too slow for me because everything was mediated through something else. So like the quietness of the island, the people on the island, like everything is just mediated through something else. And I was like, my God, the pace of this.
01:07:45
Speaker
It was a struggle for me. That's why I was like, uh, you know, we need to talk about that other movie at a time. And then I was talking about the wrong movie because I had to break this up. I had to like break it up into pieces because I'm a busy lady. I was like, um, I can take a nap.
01:08:08
Speaker
When I chose the movie, there were certain expectations that I had of it that I feel like I was very unsatisfied by the end because I really thought that I would get something out of it.
01:08:25
Speaker
related to, like I said, more about the marriage, the dynamics of the marriage, particularly as it relates to the child. Because we make this offhand comment or this really short side conversation about
01:08:41
Speaker
about Bergman and about being a father and what that means. And I felt like we really- Responsibility. Yeah, responsibility. And I really felt like we should dig into that a little bit and then we didn't. So, you know, it is one of those things where I feel like, oh gosh, there was stuff missing and, you know, maybe she did write it and then she kind of decided to like cut it out. But to me, that was,
01:09:09
Speaker
I feel like we would have told a really interesting story there as opposed to like, so I was on the island writing. And so I just decided to make that into, I mean, this is oversimplifying. The movie is good. I gave it three and a half stars, but I think it's a good movie. And I think other people would take something else out of it, particularly if you love Bergman. But for me, I think that I wanted a little bit more. Yeah, I want a little bit more, but it also made me question, Mike,
01:09:38
Speaker
I am growing into my grandmother. I was in the bath and I typically am. And, um, I've been looking at weights again. Well, I'm always lifting weights, but I'm going heavier. I'm intentionally trying to go heavier. So I'm just going to be sore for the rest of my life. Yes. Um, so I was laying in an Epsom salt bath just like thinking. And I thought about, I was like, I'm old as hell.
01:10:07
Speaker
I have been here before. I am closer as one of my ex-boyfriends told me once. He said, you oscillate between being like 10 years old and 50. So I feel ancient in many ways. Just like I'm starting to feel what people would say when they called me an old soul. All to say old souls don't sit around for slow ass movies. And we're like,
01:10:35
Speaker
OK, can I fast forward this and still understand what's happening? Yeah. And I was questioning myself, like, well, why do you need it to move so fast? Like, why do you need there? Do you need there to be music? Do you need for the I guess, like the climax of the story to be conflict? I think it's just because that's what we're used to, you know, like whenever there's like because I had questioned myself about that, too. I was like, you know,
01:11:06
Speaker
Am I unsatisfied because I'm so used to seeing movies about relationships exploding? You know, like if you compare this to marriage story, I don't know if you ever saw that. I refused, but I heard about it. No, me too. I refused to watch it. Again, one of those things where it was just like
01:11:24
Speaker
I don't know that I won this knocking around in my head, you know, but that was very explosive. And that was also like two people with a kid. And you know, I think that maybe just maybe we're just used to seeing that so much that when we don't see something where it's
01:11:42
Speaker
bam, bam, bam, bam, bam all the time. Then we're just like, oh man, this is really slow. But I almost feel like every step in that process was purposeful because it really was putting us in the shoes of Chris, be like, this is kind of what's going through Chris.
01:12:00
Speaker
her right now in trying to get to this point. So by the time she gets inspired, that's when things start to move because, and that is the process. Sometimes it's like you said, it's just empty spaces, just walking. You can't write if you don't live. And living is where all of those ideas come from. So I think we have to live with Chris, with Tony,
01:12:25
Speaker
in order for us to get to the point where we have something or she has something that we can see moving quicker. And that's why we're able to jump into making the film and finishing the film and things like that.
01:12:37
Speaker
That's beautiful. That's beautiful. I think we did a I think we did an episode. We did. So what's coming up next? Let me tell you. Yes, tell me wrong. Tell me wrong. Our next movie is called Lingua Franca, and it's directed by Isabel Sandoval, who I believe is Filipino.
01:13:02
Speaker
She lives and works in the U.S. And the story is basically about a trans woman without legal documentation. She's looking to establish residency in the U.S. And she develops a romantic relationship with the grandson of the elderly woman that she provides care for because she's a nurse.
01:13:21
Speaker
And it is such a beautiful story and I can't wait to talk about it with you and just kind of what Isabelle did with this role and with this story. And you know, Pride Month is nearly upon us and so it felt kind of appropriate to have something like this. So that's the next one. It is available on the Criterion Channel.
01:13:44
Speaker
So go watch a day, you can also rent it, but this is, it's a very short film. I think it's like 95 minutes or something like that, very short. But that will be our next one. So until next time, y'all, thank you so much for joining us and listening to us and hearing some of the tea from our past. You're welcome. And that's it from us from the Screen Queens. Thank you. Bye.
01:14:18
Speaker
woman walking down the street woman walking down the street