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114 - Beyond Sport: Teaching Lessons That Last w/ Jim Davis
182 Plays17 days ago
Jim Davis is the founder of the Good Athlete Project and author of Get Steady: Essays at the Foundation of Sustainable High Performance. This conversation was recorded live at New Trier High School the day before we both presented at the Beyond Strength Summit in Chicago.
Grab Jim's Book, Get Steady here: https://amzn.to/4tgb6le
We cover Jim's High Order Performance Framework, from the physiological bedrock of sleep, nutrition, and movement, all the way up to gap capacities like grit, gratitude, and resilience. We also get into the inverted U curve, flow state theory, the three V's of communication, and a decision-making model called AUIRS that every coach needs in their toolkit.
If you believe sports don't teach lessons, coaches do, this one is for you.
Education - Captains & Coaches course, "Why They're Not Listening - Coaching Today's Athlete": http://listen.captainsandcoaches.com
Training - Old Bull Program - 7 Day Free Trial - https://bit.ly/old-bull-train
C&C Merch - shop.captainsandcoaches.com
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Transcript
Coaching Responsibility and Understanding
00:00:00
Speaker
if you The more you say a kid sucks, the worse you are at coaching. Here's why I mean that. Oh, I love it. it's just it's It's a dismissal of responsibility. And it happens. And my guess, here's the forgiving part of it. My guess would be that people, a coach might invest so much and create like an ideal plan. and then plug a kid in who they think can do it, and for whatever reason, it doesn't happen. And they are so frustrated, they're probably hitting the far side of the curve themselves. They don't have the language to actually assess what's going on. That kid sucks, get him out.
00:00:32
Speaker
Not likely. Or maybe the person, like if the person literally has no ability, It's still your fault, coach, for putting the kid in that position and ask them to do something that their talent set did not allow them to do.
00:00:43
Speaker
So I think the more you say this team doesn't have it, this kid doesn't have it, whatever, I think you're just you're missing an opportunity as a coach minimally. but yeah u I have some ethical
Introduction to Captains and Coaches
00:00:54
Speaker
concerns about it too. but If sports don't teach lessons coaches do, then Jim Davis has been teaching the lessons longer than most This is the Captains and Coaches podcast where explore the art and science of leadership through the lens of athletics and beyond.
00:01:08
Speaker
I'm your host, Tex McQuilkin, and today I travel to Chicagoland to sit down with Jim Davis at New Trier High School before we both took the stage at this year's Beyond Strength Summit.
00:01:20
Speaker
Jim is the founder of the Good Athlete Project, and author of the new book, Get Steady. In this episode, we got into his high order performance framework, flow states, and pull out a white board to walk through his decision-making model that I haven't stopped thinking about since.
00:01:38
Speaker
This episode is equal parts theory and practice, exactly the kind of conversation that reminds you why we do this work. I do have a
Engaging the Audience
00:01:48
Speaker
favor to ask you. Before we tune in, I encourage you to subscribe, like, rate, review the show. That will help push it out to people that are like you, looking to improve and raise the game.
00:01:59
Speaker
With that, we'll hand it off to Jim. He helps us raise the game. So ready, steady, and break. I mean, we're... Action. Welcome to New
Beyond Strength Summit Overview
00:02:11
Speaker
Trier High School. New Trier High School. Home of the Newtons. What's your mascot? Home of the Trevians.
00:02:17
Speaker
Okay. Trevians. Yeah. And I mean, I flew up to Chicagoland. I'm excited because I will only do podcasts with you in person. That is the the theme we have it because that it just always turns into such a rich conversation.
00:02:33
Speaker
Our first episode together we recorded live at the and NSCA Coaches Conference, the last ever. That was the last ever probably, yeah. New Orleans. Correct. and With some shenanigans, some adventure tied to it. There is adventure. there I do recall the shenanigans. We got temporary green light to record. We had to hustle in and out, full of gumbo at the time.
00:02:55
Speaker
It was a wonderful experience. Yes, so be sure to check that out. I can't remember the number off the top of my head, but my preparation for this has been elsewhere because Speaking Friday alongside you at the Beyond Strength Summit, that's what I'm doing in town.
00:03:11
Speaker
And this is a bonus. We're really happy to have you here. We'll be hosting here as well, but yeah, seeing this is... We're pretty fortunate. We've got a great facility, good people. Walk us
Key Topics and Speakers at the Summit
00:03:21
Speaker
through the Beyond Strength Summit first. Sure. Annual.
00:03:24
Speaker
Actually, the first, it's a return to the Beyond Strength Summit. Okay. So we hosted a few pre-COVID. And we essentially decided that we, it was probably, there was a space to discuss some of the, I'll just put it in the broad category of life lessons. They say sports teach life lessons. We say, yeah, maybe, but it's like you, it's the coach, it's the culture, it's the atmosphere that actually does the teaching of those lessons. So we decided to get a bunch of dedicated, committed coaches together.
00:03:54
Speaker
and talk about how you could actually go beyond the sport, beyond the weight room, beyond strength to teach lessons that last a lifetime. And we hosted a few. They were fantastic. COVID happened. We sort of shifted our initiatives a little bit more remote work, more video based delivery. And we're like kind of like to your point right now, we got to get back with people.
00:04:17
Speaker
So first time since COVID, we're very happy to have it here. Very grateful for Nutriar to host it. And yeah, we're gonna talk about things like developmental psychology, Performance psychology, development of identity, character development, social emotional learning, all the good stuff, all the connective tissue of sport that goes sometimes unaddressed.
00:04:38
Speaker
Yeah, I'm excited. I'll be social emotional leadership and basically how to integrate this stuff into parts of practice coaches already doing. Yep. So warm up, conditioning, huddles, et cetera.
00:04:50
Speaker
So throwing that in there and I'm excited to to sit and learn from everyone else. We got a good crew. Who else
Jim Davis on 'Get Steady' and Performance Philosophy
00:04:56
Speaker
is good lineup? Right across the gym right now is Brittany Romano. Trying to think of a quick bio for her. She is a fantastic player. Mom.
00:05:06
Speaker
She's a mom. Her son is over there. AJ's guiding some practice, which is amazing. Brittany, don't know, she wins state championships in field hockey fairly regularly, it seems. She led them to, I think they finished this, they were in the top five of the nation this year, a really fantastic coach.
00:05:21
Speaker
She's also been a pioneer of female strength conditioning. So she is she does a great job welcoming all sorts of athletes, namely female athletes, into the weight room. She's fantastic. um Who else do we have? We Andy Milne, who's been a national stage speaker many times over. He's got a TEDx talk. He'll be talking about meaningful physical education.
00:05:41
Speaker
So ultimately, like we have this cool platform. How do we make sure that it is not only open to everyone, but they find true meaning in it with the recognition that probably a public health good to do that. yeah The amount of people who have negative physical education experiences and then go on to unfortunately encounter what could loosely be put in the category of
Communication and Gap Capacities in Coaching
00:06:06
Speaker
preventable disease, ye lifestyle influence preventable disease, is really unfortunate. So we've got this great opportunity, let's make it make it meaningful so that it sticks with folks. Yeah, there's a label in Texas, PE Kids.
00:06:17
Speaker
So it's almost frowned and looked down upon. yeah And you're almost written off and usually a, not a strength coach, usually a sport coach one way or another is leading the physical education.
00:06:30
Speaker
And again, they don't value it. It's not their passion. It's not their, you know, they're there to coach sport. right So then they oftentimes write them off. It becomes an afterthought.
00:06:41
Speaker
They become an afterthought. Yeah, and that that can't happen. So no Andy Milne has led a charge on that. He's, ah great he's I believe he's on the board of directors at Shape America as well. Wonderful guy very smart and good his presentation will be great I'll talk largely about some of the models that we've used to incorporate developmental psychology into a population So developmental psychology is gonna be the focus of mine.
00:07:04
Speaker
We also have Charlie Tilson is coming Former major leaguer now youth baseball coach who does as good a job as I've seen at taking Like, you could not have a better understanding of the game than Charlie and his peers who played in the major leagues.
00:07:20
Speaker
But I've watched him in youth camps change tone, kind of organize himself around the situation and the audience, get down on a knee with you know to talk eye to eye with an eight-year-old or whatever it might be. He does a great, great job translating. How tall is he?
00:07:38
Speaker
ah Charlie's got to be 6'1". Oh, yeah. Got to get down on any. Yeah, exactly. good. Yeah, that's right. You're you're good. No count. You're wonderful is what you are. um We also have the people from Play, Move, Thrive.
00:07:52
Speaker
yeah So we have Justin Ludon, Rick Howard, and Gary McCallicker coming in. and their initiative has been fantastic. They had their first ever clinic out in Pennsylvania last year that I was happy to be part of. They've done some fantastic stuff. I know one of the things I'm most excited about is Justin is going to be presenting ah framework that he's put together with the NSCA high school professional development group.
00:08:17
Speaker
um It's essentially a template structure for a workout. How to align it, align it with good programming, and then like what are the key SEL takeaways. i don't want to spoil his surprise, but he's got some nice resources that he'll be able to present on. It's good stuff.
00:08:33
Speaker
You're gonna like it. he's We're gonna have a couple, he's gonna, hit the stage a couple times, because the three of them are going to be really essential in our Q&A portions. okay So we've got some dialogue happening. They're going to facilitate.
00:08:46
Speaker
Then our closer is Ryan Mundy. And Ryan Mundy Ryan's a Super Bowl champion, played with the Steelers. He also played with the Bears. He is, can I so cuss on this?
00:08:57
Speaker
No. Okay, he's a he's a bad
Practical Coaching Challenges and Solutions
00:09:00
Speaker
ace. He is like a fantastic athlete and a tough dude. Also very- We refer to him, he's a dude.
00:09:08
Speaker
He's a dude. This guy's a dude. He's the real deal, but also kind, thoughtful. you know The greater conversation of mental health is on his mind. Wonderful guy.
00:09:19
Speaker
And one of the things that I'm excited to get into with Ryan is he now has a very talented child who's on the tennis circuit and is doing really well. so we're going to talk a little bit of sports parenting.
00:09:32
Speaker
Oh, yeah. So as you can imagine, like this guy's got a Super Bowl champion mindset yeah and he's got a young person in his home who he wants to help excel.
00:09:44
Speaker
He wants to help her excel. And the question is when to really start to drive on it. How long do you stay open to multiple sports, et cetera, et cetera. So he's got some great things to offer.
00:09:56
Speaker
Can't wait. It's going to good. Yeah. I'm in chock full. Chock full. Yeah. Any other move or practical presentations? um Well, if there's time, we'll see.
00:10:08
Speaker
You've seen the what is it one of the Tonight shows where Matt Damon gets cut for time? No. It's a running gag. Never mind. You don't watch TV. that's the I watch HBO. You're right. I don't watch TV. I watch HBO. Fair enough.
00:10:21
Speaker
um You will present one of the most practical applications of all of this. And I really mean that. So after lunch, we're going to get some coaches involved. You're going first up after lunch.
00:10:32
Speaker
And we're gonna, just like you said, we're gonna get some dynamic warmup type things, different things that a lot of folks do within their practices or in a weight room setting. That infused with social emotional learning, social emotional leadership ideas. Yeah, thats so less technical movement, more Essential presence and lesson behind the lesson lesson behind the lesson.
00:10:55
Speaker
Yeah, that's where you fit in. That's where I fit in That's why I'm gonna do my best and I love to just do this at clinics is listen to everybody else's and then just help make the connections for the yeah attendees Totally that's good.
00:11:08
Speaker
We can move you to last if you want. Oh, so
Storytelling and Athlete Alignment in Coaching
00:11:11
Speaker
I can be the closer I don't want to steal Monday's thunder You guys can arm wrestle for it. Okay. yeah We'll see how it goes. Yeah. Well, we can, maybe we'll adjust today. I can put present in with one arm.
00:11:23
Speaker
Of course. That's right. That's perfect. ah No, no, no, no. I'll, no, I'll stick with that. I mean, ah give me the hardest time slots, which are either 8 a.m. m or right after lunch.
00:11:36
Speaker
Both. Yeah. Yeah. So that's what that's what I like to do is make it easy on the clinic or conference, whoever I'm speaking at. I'm like, give me the hard stuff. You know what's good about you? I'll do a practical.
00:11:47
Speaker
For sure. I'm sure you've got slides you could hit right now. If anyone's looking for a great conference speaker, at the drop of a hat, give this man a whiteboard and a marker.
00:11:58
Speaker
Done deal, A plus, high quality. yeah I actually mean that by the way. serious I have a great time. yeah I have too much material. That's good. this Yeah. um Well, you've got a lot of material, so I do want to highlight what you're presenting on and I got ah a tour of this beautiful facility and school.
00:12:17
Speaker
Very interesting, unique place. And we stumbled upon just a whiteboard boardroom. We did. And there was just some models that you had thrown up on there willy-nilly. Yeah. That I feel are very prominent, especially on the cover here of Get Steady.
00:12:35
Speaker
Yeah. The new book you're staring down here. this isn't That's right. Don't read the back. That is, yeah, that's my new book. Get Steady Essays at the Foundation of Sustainable High Performance. It is, the truth is, I've been working on this for a long, long time.
00:12:52
Speaker
And it's finally come to light and I'm really excited to share it. This is, the more I think about it, the more this is like, this is what I needed 20 years ago.
00:13:02
Speaker
it's I really believe this and i don't care if it doesn't sell a freaking copy. It's going to sell at least one, I hope. i hope I got one for free. bri Damn it. I'll pay you back. Okay. ah But I swear I mean this. like I wish I had learned about these concepts earlier.
00:13:19
Speaker
Well, that's why we lead. 100%. I'm getting the chill. like Yeah, that's education. like ah generation goes through it. They learn from it. They pass it back or pass In the length chapter I just flipped to, leading toward a healthier future.
00:13:34
Speaker
That's it. 100%. Individually, on a system level, all of it. Time out. Observation, new coaches getting into the field are really smart and intelligent when it comes to programming or understanding practice plans and their sport, and really bad at people.
00:13:53
Speaker
They have high IQ and low EQ. I spent the past 14 years traveling the world, teaching people how to teach people, lifting weights, understanding sport, but most importantly, connecting with people.
00:14:07
Speaker
I've taken all those lessons from all over the world and put them into a new course,
Top-Down Coaching Approach and Wellness
00:14:11
Speaker
Why They're Not Listening, Coaching Today's Athlete. If you want the first lesson free, head to the website, listen.captainsandcoaches.com to learn more.
00:14:21
Speaker
And now, back to the show. Ready, ready, and break. Take us through, this is this is a lifetime of work and we got a lot of models in here. What is chapter one? What is essential? You see a pyramid here. yeah Much like super training, it starts with a pyramid. So the way that the way that it's organized is I developed in grad school alongside a couple people something called the high order performance framework.
00:14:47
Speaker
And the way that this book is organized is of all these essays and articles that I've been writing and publishing over the years, we took them about 14 per section. i The editor had to really whittle it down. i There's a lot of material.
00:15:01
Speaker
We, instead of creating section flow start to stop beginning and end 300 page book, which nobody would read cover to cover. we one but One person would read it cover to cover. Maybe my mom too.
00:15:14
Speaker
So, but what what we did was we batched out these essays in alignment with stages of the model. the frame So the fundamental, we call it bedrock, the foundational component of the higher-order performance framework is essentially the physiological self, the body. And the three primary components are eat, move, sleep. How are we nourishing ourselves?
00:15:33
Speaker
How active are we? What are we doing in our... active moments and then are we resting and recovering from it? And it's the kind of stuff that it should feel obvious, but we try to frame it in a way that actually aligns with people's motivations. For example, sleep is usually the first to go, especially in driven people.
00:15:52
Speaker
can't tell you how many times I encounter people with really high drive who want to get a couple more emails out or they want to study a little later or add one more personal training session or whatever it might be, and they neglect the rest components.
00:16:04
Speaker
of this framework and they usually are talented enough to perform even so, but they certainly don't maximize their growth potential. So like that's that's one entry point. And the truth is at that level of it, I mean, I wish it was more obvious than it is, but a malnourished, sedentary, sleep deprived version of you, talented as you may be, is going to be limited.
00:16:27
Speaker
So if you're aiming for high performance in a sustainable way, that those boxes have to be checked. that's the first part of it. Yes. And then stacking on that, we have very valuable tools here. Our whole Friday is going to focus on language, communication, and relationships. That's a big part of it. Yeah. So language, communication, and relationships is ultimately like the first component of language is recognizing that the way that you name your environment influences the way that you experience it. Period. End of story. Yeah. um You know, like I'm trying to think of an easy example, Chicago.
00:17:03
Speaker
Cold Chicago winter, if you are dragging your feet in the morning, say and the inner dialogue is like, oh, it's so freaking cold out there. This is going to be miserable. An easy way to get it would be, well, self-fulfilling prophecy. You're going prove yourself right.
00:17:20
Speaker
youre gonna It's going to be cold if you're if you're dreading the cold. Whereas someone who's able to sort of shift the way that they name and label things might just say, it's cold today, objective, no not laced with anything but that.
00:17:32
Speaker
So I may as well wear a coat or another layer and give it my best. Actually, i mean this, the way language influences the way we engage, like the weight room is like a fantastic proving ground for that. If you were to attempt a max effort back squat and you're gonna say, well, I've never done this before. This looks a little, this looks too heavy. i don't think I can
Optimizing Performance: Strategies and Models
00:17:51
Speaker
do this.
00:17:52
Speaker
you'll approach it in a significantly different way, not just like philosophically or psychologically, physiologically in trackable ways, whether it's like neurochemical or in subtle forms of hormone production.
00:18:05
Speaker
if If you said, like i you know I'm not going to cuss, but like I freaking got this, let's let's go. if you like The way that you label the scenario is shifts the way you engage with the scenario full stop.
00:18:20
Speaker
That's true. So that's the language piece. Go ahead. Well, adding on that, us as leaders outside of this yeah in the environment in which the athlete pyramid we're building, yeah we can help drive and shape that language as well. Big time.
00:18:35
Speaker
You got this. You got this. 100%. Modeling Pygmalion effect. Yeah. Pygmalion effect. There you go. There's something to Google. Well, I did a podcast on it. Oh, okay. Perfect. Refer to the podcast. Yeah, absolutely. If we're watching on YouTube... Right up there.
00:18:51
Speaker
Um... Yeah, absolutely. And belief is massive. But modeling self-talk, so communication, like the way that you engage with people matters so much. that The easiest references would probably come quickly for people. The Pygmalion Effect is a more advanced version of that, but it's absolutely real and true, and we've seen it play out many times.
00:19:14
Speaker
um But modeling matters a lot. In fact, there's a chapter in that, the three Vs of communication. Visual. Vocal, verbal.
00:19:25
Speaker
So verbal is the most obvious. it's like the message, it's the language. It's like pretty specific. The visual is presence. you know if if not If we were having this conversation and you were standing up on that, like saying the exact same things, like it would change the way this communication is happening for sure.
00:19:43
Speaker
And then verbal is like, vocal rather, is tonality. So if I said, Tex, I think you have an awesome podcast and you're doing great work.
00:19:55
Speaker
Thanks. Or if I said Tex, you got an awesome podcast. You're great work. Like, you sort of, layer some sarcasm into it. Laying it on there pretty thick there, Tim. I'm sorry. But... I think the first is the way I would have said it, but the truth is, like if the language, the verbal, is exactly the same, you can shift the interpretation of that through visual and vocal adjustments.
00:20:18
Speaker
And it's something that we should all be in tune with, so communication from that angle. That, getting back to your point, is that the language that we model as coaches and the way that we deliver it, you know you can imagine a baseball coach in the late innings saying like,
00:20:35
Speaker
You know, we might have a chance here still, guys. Like, is that person going to be believed? Or like, you you have to bring energy and juice and be aware of the way that you're communicating because you are modeling for people and how they think.
00:20:49
Speaker
And I have a lot of other examples that are coming up. But yeah. I love it And now, layering up, leveling up here. So gap capacities is next. That is not an acronym. It's actually, if anything, it's an acronym for Good Athlete Project. But we did that intentionally because one of the things the heart of the Good Athlete Project early on was bridging the gap between research and practice in the athletics realm.
00:21:12
Speaker
So how can we how can we take all the fantastic work going on in universities on social emotional learning, character development, all those things that prove out to be what they call longitudinally valuable, like they last.
00:21:26
Speaker
um How can we do that? We're being, sorry, we're being encroached here. I love it. They're good. I know they are. They're awesome. Here we go. I don't know if we can have people in the background without saying without signing something.
00:21:40
Speaker
You're okay. Hi. um So all of that incredible work going on in the universities, do those people ever talk to the folks on the front?
00:21:51
Speaker
The who are actually in the thick of it and practitioners. But the same happens in the inverse as well. Are the practitioners referring to new and advancing research in these areas? Sometimes. And of course- Our circle, will yeah.
00:22:05
Speaker
In our circle, that's right. And we're lucky to be surrounded by thoughtful, dedicated coaches. And if you are a thoughtful, dedicated coach, I think you need to sit in that gap and try to hold on each side and and bridge it.
00:22:16
Speaker
So gap capacities in this context refer to the idea that we feel like if we can help athletes check the boxes in the lower two stages of the framework,
00:22:28
Speaker
physiological wellness, ultimately mental and emotional and social wellness, then we've done something meaningful. When you advance up, now you have an opportunity to install things like growth mindset is probably one of the most common, what we call gap capacities, grit, gratitude, growth, empathy, resilience, any of these sort of hard to name, but studied and real abilities, that's where that starts to fit in.
00:22:51
Speaker
Amazing. Yeah, I spent a lot of time in that space working with teenage boys. Right. I love it. Enough said. They yeah can do it. yeah They just need to believe that they can as well. 100%. So one thing I did recently...
00:23:09
Speaker
was with a junior varsity team again this is like 14 15 16 year olds it introduced in a model i got from ryan davis university of maryland was three h's yep you present your hero you share your hero a hardship that you've been carrying and then a highlight could be within the athletic realms or outside of it that's cool dudes at this stage they're playing different sports they got extracurriculars Does your teammate you're lining up against know all these different things about you? That's really good. What I love about the heroes is now it helps me as coach learn their values because they value this person. They emulate.
00:23:46
Speaker
Could be a parent, could be a brother, could be you know it could be a professional athlete, could be somebody. So now, OK, I got to connect to that, glob on it, and add on, OK, well, I'm trying to teach you values and shape behavior the best yeah I can.
00:24:03
Speaker
Now I have a reference of where your values lie based off the hero you share. It's really good. And I think we may have talked about this the last time we were on the podcast. ah even just that reflection and like they know that they gravitate to this person this hero to have them go do the work of naming why like what are the things that i like about this coach who i respect or whatever it might be that's you're starting to build a toolkit there and that can be really powerful that's good ryan ryan davis university of maryland cousin ryan dude that's right i'm gonna use the three h's that's good
00:24:41
Speaker
I'll cite him. John Gordon, the author. Sure. I don't know where he's in origin. that's yeah That's who I credited it to. Okay. And then Ryan uses it with his University of Maryland guys who, I mean, they come from all walks of life yeah at that Big Ten school, so. That's awesome.
Flow States and Coaching Adjustments
00:24:55
Speaker
He he does that during training camp and each person gets an opportunity to to be listened to so i think that's a a good point uh as well is getting the guys an opportunity to be listened to that's big because you do got some stars that get a lot of attention you got your middle of the bell curve your big bell curve guy and then you got your guys that are a part of the team but maybe not they're skilled or athletically they still get the opportunity from their teammates to be listened to that's really good
00:25:24
Speaker
I like that. I'm serious. I'm going to use that. I'll send you a podcast. Thank you. And I will listen. Well, we're we're continuing to work up our pyramid here. We're not done yet. The hop, the that's high order performance. and um Hop is the top.
00:25:41
Speaker
HOP, high order performance. And that's the top. That's the pinnacle. and That's what we're aiming for. And in order to sort of sit in that place in a sustainable way, ideally, you would have built for lower levels. And that's that's a lot of that's a lot of what it's about. And truthfully, the way that we usually enter this in an athletic sphere is we go top down.
00:26:03
Speaker
So instead of trying to sell the idea of sleep to a driven young person, we have them enter at the top and say, like, what do you what do you want? And then we have them start to articulate what do you think it will take to get you there dispositionally? And this is when they we first start to turn the gears. Positionally for our listeners. For sure. So like in your dispositions, if you wanted to be a championship coach, let's say you want to go win a Super Bowl.
00:26:28
Speaker
Great. I bet that's true for most coaches in the NFL. What do you think it's gonna take from you? How will you have to behave? What are your dispositions and characteristics if you wanna pull that off? like and you can't And you have to sort of massage this, because you can't say things like score more punk points than the opponent.
00:26:46
Speaker
Okay, that would be like a more tactical objective. About hours in the office. maybe And maybe it might just be commitment. you know We would shift it from that. Knowing that sleeping under your desk is not gonna yield any sort of direct outcome. We're violating the That's right, the debate we would be.
00:27:02
Speaker
um Instead, you'd say things like, well, I have to be strategic or meant maybe I have to motivate people or this is a big one. What you find is like, I need some degree of emotion regulation because when the when my decisions matter most is when the stress is probably going be at its peak.
00:27:19
Speaker
So I'm going to need some patience or some emotion regulation. And you get people to start to articulate that. Now we're finding things at the gap level, gap capacities. We
Wellness in High Performance
00:27:30
Speaker
then start to talk about how language, the way we communicate and how we relate to others in situations influences our ability to do those things. yep And then below that, we start to, then we introduce, well, let's say the gap capacity of growth is growth mindset, a super common one for a lot of people, hard to argue against it.
00:27:49
Speaker
okay Well, it takes language to call up your growth mindset. So for example, If you hit, if you stumble, if you hit some kind of hurdle on your path to wherever it is that you're going, you have to own the inner dialogue to some degree, if only to say, aw shucks, ah what's the way around this?
00:28:12
Speaker
Do I go over, do I go under, do I need to tag in some support? what you So language, internal self-talk is key to tagging in any of these gap capacity ideas.
00:28:23
Speaker
One step below, kind like I said before, if you are malnourished, sedentary, and sleep deprived, and we'll cast it out to a group, like, you been on three hours of sleep before? Before you mention that. Yeah.
00:28:35
Speaker
Yeah, Rafael Ruiz, my mentor, yeah we were rucking or training or someday, and he asked me genuinely, have you ever operated on 18 hours?
00:28:47
Speaker
Meaning, like, no sleep. Yeah. So then that was, i guess, one of the weird challenges that he exposed because i mean, we were training in Green Berets at the time and that's often part of their training.
00:28:58
Speaker
We had to do everything. That's one of his major principles. We have to do everything we give to people. So then wow he was dead serious when he asked and thought he was joking. And then he informed me, eighteenth when you're awake for 18 hours, it's the same as operating After three beers.
00:29:14
Speaker
Oh, wow. So then I, of course, at that time time and stage of life. Yeah. i Took that a different route. Yeah. Right. yeah I'll just have three beers. I'll save three beers by staying up 18 hours. There you go. Easy. Look at that. Financially effective as well.
00:29:28
Speaker
Don't do that Don't do that. Don't do that. Well, and that's, that is, um, That's an important component of the whole thing because here's here's the truth. The reason that sort of training for those sort of special populations is important is also because of this recognition. Like we know that if we are depriving people of this bedrock foundational level, um we they're not going to make their best decisions. So we have to find a way to cultivate a mindset and a set of skills that can let them operate well even so. But I think they would also suggest, or at least science would suggest,
00:30:01
Speaker
confirm that you you just can't, that's not a sustainable practice. so So that's really what it comes down to. And by the time we get down, so we enter at the top, we build backwards to the bottom, and then we do layer in like, and look, if if things don't work out perfectly, there's a chapter on anti-perfectionism you saw.
00:30:19
Speaker
If things don't work out perfectly, like, okay, you are tough enough to get through a day without your full eight hours of sleep. And if you hadn't had a drink of water for a while, let's freaking go. Like you you can do this.
00:30:30
Speaker
Yeah. You just don't want build a life around it. no And that's that's a big part of it. And there's there is some trickery behind that. And I've had the opportunity to, um guess' speaking to the operator space, they prove that resilience grit to themselves. yeah But they don't know that it's it's a temporary opportunity. Hey, you can do this. But eventually that window closes for them.
00:30:54
Speaker
yeah And in the same respect, and there's lots of research on this, and I had the foremost um clinical psychiatrist for male eating disorders on the podcast. Oh, wow.
00:31:06
Speaker
And then male eating disorders, our performance increases when we do these different restrictive behaviors. And then that tricks us into, well, I need to restrict more to continue that until right this foundation that you've laid out.
00:31:19
Speaker
Starts to crumble. Really bad. yeah And that's that's where he he steps in. So. Wow, that's that's powerful. Yeah, Dr. Brad. I think that's, man, episode 13. That was one my firsts. He's awesome. That's intense. Yeah, he's based in Austin, so works with a lot of professional and UT guys. And that's real, because it is nice to sort of touch the ceiling every now and then and remind yourself that, like, I can do this if I have to.
00:31:41
Speaker
and But then, like, you then have to also remind yourself that, like, and I don't have to all the time. And I'll add just, like, a little plug. And there are certain populations, there are certain people, certain environmental situations that make this more prevalent, and it's tragic and should be addressed. Like, there are certain, like, low-income areas where this, you know, if it's a co-sleeping environment, for example, if you're sleeping on the couch and there's a new baby in the house, you can't protect the sleep opportunity quite as well. So with full acknowledgement to that, to the idea that situation environment do play a role in this, I would say that it still doesn't change sort of the science of it.
00:32:17
Speaker
And,
Ethics in Performance Models
00:32:19
Speaker
you know, one thing I'll bump into once you get down to the bedrock level is there'll be people like, i you know, I don't need that much sleep. And that is possibly true.
00:32:28
Speaker
It's possible. I think in the studies they do find that there is a certain segment of the population who can not only survive but thrive on five hours of sleep. which is DaVinci. Maybe like DaVinci.
00:32:42
Speaker
Five hours of sleep. But then you take that number, that segment of the population over the denominator of the entire population, round it to the nearest decimal, turn it into percentage, and it's 0%. So like it yes, it's possible, and it's unlikely that it's you.
00:32:58
Speaker
So worth noting. So still connected to the pyramid here, we got two arrows leading up. Oh, yeah. Yeah. So focus and ethics are just sort of supports. We don't dig into them quite as much in the book, although it's definitely alluded to. in fact, there's a chapter on four keys to for the ADHD leader.
00:33:21
Speaker
So there's that kind of a focus component. But those the the suggestions apply to anyone who's trying to improve their focus. um they scaffold the whole thing. And the recognition was like, the deeper you get into this and the more complicated the situations you're in might become, the more training focus, and focus is a trainable skill, despite neurodivergence and all that, is it's still trainable. Might be different starting points, might be different paths to where you want to be, but it's trainable skill.
00:33:50
Speaker
Focus becomes important. And um I want to reach to my phone as a quick example of how, like and there's a lot of challenges to it, but it is but it's trainable and we should. And then ethics, ultimately, we first built it, I think we we were tinkering with the term morality, but it had too much of a had too much weight to it.
00:34:08
Speaker
Ethics meaning more of a conversation of like, how are the decisions I'm making impacting the people around me, which we should be thoughtful of. not like Without judgment as often as possible, if only to like objectively appraise a situation, but we should think about like, okay, I wanna eat well.
00:34:25
Speaker
That doesn't mean I should steal a sandwich from the local place. Or I want to perform at a super high level. Okay, you probably don't have to knife the tires on the other team's bus to get this performance outcome. So like folding in a conversation of ethics and the other truth of that, the reason it sort of moves with the framework is...
00:34:44
Speaker
When life gets fast and there's a lot on your plate and the stakes seem continually higher, to have the ability to
Flexibility and Feedback in Coaching
00:34:51
Speaker
slow down and have a a conversation, an ethical conversation, what am I doing? How am I doing it? How is it impacting others?
00:34:58
Speaker
We have to be more deliberate about how we create space for that sort of dialogue. even Which I feel leads us to our our next point i want to get into. i love it. Which involves a whiteboard.
00:35:12
Speaker
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Speaker
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00:36:08
Speaker
Old Bull Program. Because the world needs your strength. And now, back to the show. Ready, ready, and break. So let's let's dive into the inverted U. Is this in frame, do you think?
00:36:20
Speaker
We good? Uh-huh. Perfect. Inverted U. right, so this is, I think it's one of the most essential concepts for anyone who's coaching or just in terms of like, and don't want to overstate this.
00:36:39
Speaker
but I do think essential is the right term. Because I think it applies like it applies in your day-to-day. It applies when you're like calling Southwest Airlines group travel and feeling a little frustrated on hold for a long time. like It's important to be in tune with how this works.
00:36:54
Speaker
So inverted U just as refers to the shape of the curve. On one axis, we have performance.
00:37:04
Speaker
And the other axis, I put activation. In literature the Yerkes Dodson study I think it's arousal and in certain populations that term can be giggled at so I just say activation. so wait room that's right So the idea would be though that just think nervous system activation.
00:37:26
Speaker
If you if at the starting point this is like you when you first wake up in the morning. So this would be low activation and the performance depending on the task. is gonna be low. Like, this is you shuffling to the bathroom, eyes half open, low activation, low arousal.
00:37:42
Speaker
On the other side of the curve, the other extreme, would be like overwhelm. And I'm not saying this in any sort of cavalier way, like a panic attack, you push that thing far enough. So let's just say overwhelm.
00:37:54
Speaker
And obviously, let's just pick a sport, baseball, it's baseball season. If you're entering the batter's box, you don't wanna be on either end of the curve. There is an optimal zone and i I like to call it a zone instead of a point because it like it relieves some of that perfectionist tendency. like It can be approximately right.
00:38:16
Speaker
It doesn't have to be spot on perfect every time. And what we try to teach people is catch yourself
00:38:24
Speaker
either coming down or cresting and going over the top of the curve. Aim for optimal zone.
00:38:36
Speaker
And ultimately the idea is if you can find tools to get you there, well, we talked about this. The first component is just self-awareness. So you've gotta be self-aware enough to sort of plot your place on the curve.
00:38:51
Speaker
And in intense sports, you and I both played football, I was convinced at a time that like if i ever if I was ever not performing the way I wanted to, more was better. More intensity, um you know i I didn't drink a lot of Monster Energy drinks, but like onboard something that could hype you up, turn the music louder, whatever it might be.
00:39:11
Speaker
but which is Which can be a fantastic tool. Anger. Demonize your opponent, all these things. If that's the tool you need, maybe if you're here, that might move you toward a better outcome.
00:39:24
Speaker
But if you're already here or over, and this would happen to me more often than not, more is definitely not better. Definitely not better. So I think coaches need to be aware this also. Because I think it is fun as a coach. And here's something that is probably important to recognize.
00:39:40
Speaker
If you're going in to coach a game, you're probably not as far along this axis as the athlete is, who's geared up and about to step on the field. So I think what I see a lot is coaches pushing, becauses partly because it's fun for them. And I want to be really clear, I'm not pointing fingers, I have done this. like It was fun for me back when I was coaching football to get hyped up as though I was going to play football.
00:40:05
Speaker
So it's understandable. And the question then is really just like, is it effective? Is this where we want to take people? And that's, yeah again, this judgment-free appraisal of what we're doing, how we're doing it, really key.
00:40:18
Speaker
And then what we try to do is just give people tools first to self-identify where they are in the curb in a given moment and then move one way or other. So it it might be some visualization or get yourself hyped up or turn the music up.
00:40:34
Speaker
And it might be take a breath or go for a short walk. Like literally extend your trip to the bathroom, young person, and just go for a slightly longer walk, take a few controlled breaths and try to center or get steady before you go out to perform.
00:40:50
Speaker
The critique on this sometimes comes in the form of like, it's an over approximation, it's kind of a a gross approximation of what's actually happening. I think the critique is limited because I think it's then on us to use it in a context specific individualized way.
00:41:06
Speaker
If you have an athlete who is shaking with excitement, like we have to be aware enough to notice. And if you have an athlete who's a little reserved, you have to be aware enough to notice and push appropriately.
00:41:19
Speaker
go ahead and yes our ability skill level it's social awareness totally and then i mean communication then leads to helping guide their self-awareness without a doubt if we have low social awareness we have low tool we have a limited toolkit for self-management we can't hand off said tools to guide their And that is what I've found in in the professional development realm is like, by teaching this to adults, the hope is that it instills in them as well. Hope is not a plan, Jim.
00:41:57
Speaker
Well, we plan for it also. So we combine it. um the But that's exactly right. So if you're super hyped up to recognize that like i'm I might be in a place where I'm not doing an accurate appraisal of of what's going on. So that's really
Maximizing Practice Efficiency
00:42:12
Speaker
important too. We talked about that on the last podcast.
00:42:15
Speaker
I communicate my anger level yeah to them. yeah So they have an aim that I can guide their social awareness yeah so then they can self-manage and make responsible decisions on what comes next right because they continue to talk back or do whatever it is they're doing.
00:42:32
Speaker
Okay, I'm going to a 10 and there is no coming back for you. they're saying Yeah, I like that. Open, honest. Coach Tex is over here. yes the I mean, that's real. that's And you're kind of layering in an important idea, this contextual point as well, which is we just we discussed the fact that like This is task dependent.
00:42:55
Speaker
So if I were going into, you know, there are yeah no units of activation on here, but like there's still an ideal or optimal zone if I'm playing checkers versus if I'm playing linebacker, you know.
00:43:07
Speaker
And we also talked even once you get into a sport, if there are limited inputs, if I'm on the kickoff team and my role is to essentially stay in the lane or keep one landmark, maybe keep the ball carrier inside shoulder or something like that,
00:43:21
Speaker
you can rev the engine pretty high, assuming that person has a degree of experience, compared to a quarterback who might have to assess the field and slow it down a little bit. Yes.
00:43:31
Speaker
And there's certain sports have more options in creativity. Different positions have that in football. Right. But a lot of football positions on the field, it's do your job. This is your assignment. Here's level one.
00:43:45
Speaker
If you make it to through level one, here's level two. Mm-hmm. And that's that's a lot of the extent that I have to remember on this this play, is get to the next level. Totally. so now in lacrosse or basketball, there's one, two, three, four options on each play.
00:44:03
Speaker
And then the defense disrupts it and I'm forced to get creative. yeah And that's where we see the the dudes be dudes, which is awesome. you've got to train that creativity. And this is where I use ball Bloom's taxonomy to teach a lot of skills to get to that creativity point.
00:44:20
Speaker
So good. I mean, I see the the connection here. If um my job is very limited, I know they have one responsibility, I can coach up here. yep But now my quarterback, like you mentioned, we need to be here. morris so ah but Without a doubt. Not only task dependent, position dependent, kind there's there's a lot to it. Totally. so i I feel this layers on. i mean um I'm pessimist against pessimist.
00:44:50
Speaker
So when people attack this, yeah they were just they're yeah they're they're looking for a limitation, unfortunately. I think so. i think and And a lot of really good thought work can fall flat if it's implemented poorly or misapplied, for sure. So fair enough in that regard. But yeah, no, I'm with you 100% on that. i think One of the best coaches I had, it was a gap scheme, gap blocking scheme.
00:45:15
Speaker
Like if you had a direction like on down, you're usually in a
Coaching Models and Frameworks
00:45:19
Speaker
pretty good place. Limited inputs, is there someone on me? No, okay, I'm blocking down. you know and And limit the conditional components. If this, then that. Right, right, a single condition, right.
00:45:30
Speaker
The more conditions you add, the more this is not effective. So recognizing that's really important. and The challenge, and I see this a lot, is when the kid makes the wrong decision based off of a different context. But you told me to do this. Yeah, right.
00:45:46
Speaker
And then the context changed, they get yelled at. Yeah. And it's not used as a teaching moment. It's used as an MFN moment. Yeah, 100%. I've been there as an athlete.
00:45:57
Speaker
So this is his coach. So I'm sure I've done it as coach. There was a gap in understanding. I probably have done it as a coach, too, though I didn't need to. So I'm sorry if I did. If anyone out there is listening, I started to lean as I got better and better at coaching. Or I think I did.
00:46:12
Speaker
When someone would come off the field is that I was coaching DBS at one point, too, which was a blast. Worked some great people. But it was usually what was the assignment? What did you see?
00:46:24
Speaker
And like I wouldn't even start a dialogue until I had those two components. So like what was the assignment? Sometimes it's a miscommunication. The DB may have gotten the wrong signal from the linebacker. I can't chew the kid out if he he was told it was cover three, and he ran cover three. it's not what we called, but there was a breakdown in communication somewhere along the way.
00:46:42
Speaker
Address the communication breakdown. um And then what did you see? You know, so we can talk about like, you know, i thought I saw the guy flip his hips and he was about to start this route or whatever.
00:46:53
Speaker
At that point, we can start to create dialogue and cue reminders based on what they saw. Yes. And what do you see that I can gauge their level of competency and conditioning for the most part. Yeah. Because if they were like, I don't know. Totally. What were you aiming at? I don't know. Right.
00:47:15
Speaker
Right. Well, you're in this unconscious incompetence. Any feedback I give you is not going to do it now. I can focus on the next play. That's right. If they tell me, well, I tried to do this, but then I don't have the ability to. Sure. Right. Now that by now you can help them get strategic right now we can take a different angle. Now we can who knows what or we can't call that. But if I'm yelling at them and they're in this unconscious incompetence, you could lose the kid. Nothing's happening. The game or ever. Yeah, nothing's happening.
00:47:42
Speaker
Minimal. Best case scenario, they're not hearing you. Yeah. Like, yeah. Well, that yeah they're not understanding. They've blocked it off. Not hearing you because you're muffs.
00:47:54
Speaker
Right. ah Or they just don't understand the feedback of them. Yeah. Right. They don't have enough experience. Exactly right. Which. hey So I love it. I don't know what the naysayers are naying.
00:48:07
Speaker
Naysayers, nay. In general. So that's, ah yeah, that that sits behind a lot of the strategies
Role of Character and Ethics in Sports
00:48:15
Speaker
that you probably have heard of. like Most preparation goes into readying people to find an optimal zone.
00:48:22
Speaker
south Yes. And I mean, speaking of zones, let's talk flow. Flow. So this is Csikszentmihalyi's model.
00:48:38
Speaker
Spelling? Couldn't you. tell Couldn't I've written it many times. I don't mean to be rude about that. A wonderful human. So he talks about, know, people have heard of a flow state.
00:48:50
Speaker
And he's done a nice job of mapping this in a way that I think is pretty usable. And that is, and I might have the axes wrong, but it's essentially challenge and ability on one or the other.
00:49:05
Speaker
With the recognition that If the challenge is say up here, but the ability is here, they're not gonna be able to pull it off. That's probably overwhelmed, anxious, all that kind of stuff.
00:49:18
Speaker
If, ability is high and the challenge is very minimal, that's when you risk boredom, apathy, not lack of engagement. So like either of these zones, I would say that they happen for sure for all of us, athlete or professional over the course of time.
00:49:37
Speaker
um we can find ourselves there and it's and this is a nice place to help redirect. If you can stay with like a pretty even keel, a nice balance of both challenge and ability, build it it escalates or it moves upward um under the recognition that these are both these can both move in a positive direction. As you increase your ability, it is right to also increase the challenge. Again, the weight room's a great model of that. You don't get a response if you're 100 pound back squats anymore. Yes, and so this this is a teach strength and skill. Yeah. like
00:50:15
Speaker
weight room to a t i get it i know the progress the flow i know where people will fail right a lot of times why yep and then have solutions a lot of the warm-up movements we'll be talking about friday And then the sports skill, that's that's why I love still coaching sport, yeah is because that the depth of skill of what cue, direction, what movement, what drill will complement.
00:50:39
Speaker
um Totally. And the flow of a team. Because you've got 20-plus dudes. yeah Some dudes are down here, but we all have to do the same stuff. That's hard. that's keep going. But i that's what I love about the challenge.
00:50:52
Speaker
That's right. So it's... aiming to to push up here. but this is where I can lean in. Hey, this is the drill we're doing. Yeah. But lean into the guy that needs the challenge up here.
00:51:04
Speaker
So were we're getting reps for the first time developing this yep unconscious incompetence into conscious incompetence. Now you know you suck. And into this is where my question is, like what did you see out there?
00:51:20
Speaker
i asked them, hey, how did how did that feel? How it feel? Yeah. How did it feel? So what what are you aiming for is down here. If I know they're not trying to aim and they're just shooting as hard as they can. Yeah, right.
00:51:31
Speaker
All right. Well, we're low ability. It's still a high challenge, but now, it what are you aiming at? How did that shot feel? Right. Or what, hey, what were you thinking on that play? Mm-hmm.
00:51:43
Speaker
What did you see? Yeah. And where you mentioned what do you see, now we're up here, and if he's he's talking about, gives me I don't know or keeps it internally on the eye. Yeah, right. look That's where we're at. Right. But now if you're thinking two passes ahead, that's a different conversation. Totally. And if he's not thinking two passes ahead, that's where a lot of my feedback goes. Well, he was cutting on the backside. Right. Did you see that guy? OK, we need to be aware of and you shouldn't should is also a dirty word.
00:52:12
Speaker
You can anticipate this. Yeah. I need you to anticipate. Yeah. Right. If he's not worried. he needs to be. Now my expectation is you got to communicate to this kid right go to go there.
00:52:23
Speaker
Really good. Yeah. that' so And that's what, ah even as you explain it, yeah coaching is hard. Yeah. And we're we are leveling up through leadership and communication here. But this is this down here is still predominantly physical. Yeah. for Now we're layering on language communication. Yeah. I mean, I'm still shaping low ability language because it's like, i suck at this. I'll never get this.
00:52:48
Speaker
You don't suck. Gotta get that out of the language. All I allow them to. You suck now. Remember when this kid started? Let's just call him number 26. Yeah. Well, you don't remember. I remember when 26 started. Yeah. he sucked too. Yeah. i Guess what he did?
00:53:05
Speaker
Yeah. i gotta I'm going to push back on you on this. i don't know if this is the coachmans captains coaches first, but I would never, ever so tell a kid they sucked. You're not wrong. I'm with you there. I'm just. Yeah, I'm with you. No, your point is very clear and real. And I know and that should be clear. Like, yeah dude, I remember when 26 just started. That's right.
00:53:23
Speaker
Well, and and and one quick reframe would be like a world of opportunity for improvement.
Feedback and Adaptation in Coaching
00:53:28
Speaker
You know, like like we're not that, we're not elite at this yet, but like it's hard to say like, does my kid suck at walking?
00:53:36
Speaker
Like no, she's a year and a half old. She's learning to walk. um' um telling I think the language matters. You you read that and tell me what you think It's the same way in baseball. um You never say you're in a slump.
00:53:49
Speaker
It is goofy. It is a self-fulfilling prophecy. If you can swing a bat and make contact with the ball on a Tuesday, you can do it on a Thursday, even though you didn't do it on Wednesday. like Just get that stuff out of your mind. it's But that's my opinion.
00:54:03
Speaker
It's just an opinion. But all the stuff that you were mentioning before, I think is so spot on. And I think like you mentioned one thing, like high physical ability. like You mentioned that kid taking a shot. What i think I see pretty often is high ability people, it's almost like assessing like where is the ability. High physical ability, maybe we have to recognize there are other components to success in this dynamic forum that your shot speed cannot override.
00:54:32
Speaker
So like you can you can, a pitcher can throw a ball at 93 miles an hour. That's incredible. Cannot hit the strike zone, can't find the strike zone, not as cool. You know, maybe you have to dial it back and find a more appropriate thing. Or maybe you can rocket a ball to the net, but you can't find it and you don't yet have the ability to assess the field and anticipate that the dump off pass like you mentioned.
00:54:55
Speaker
So there are different levels of ability, different kinds of ability for sure. so Yes. And a lot of the the character drivenness that we believe sport can do. Right.
00:55:07
Speaker
Sometimes these guys lose faith in their teammates. So now they turns into me ball versus we ball because they have the ability. Sure. And dude, I see this at at the middle school level because some kids hit a spurt early. Of course. Yeah. So now they can dip, dive, duck dodge, dodge around people.
00:55:25
Speaker
So their ability is there, but they're not necessarily learning how to play the game. That's right. Whatever the game may be. So now that will catch up to them when the rest of their peers that's right catch up to them physically. Totally. And if you are getting into those middle schoolers and find the ability to say, what's the point?
00:55:42
Speaker
The point is not to show us how fast you can shoot a lacrosse ball. point is to get it in the net. And part of your task now, a part of the ability that you need to build might be helping that guy out.
00:55:53
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Bringing other people up around you. This this is where I feel constraints are important. Yeah. So they're right handed. They're really good. You're only playing left today. Oh, cool. Hey, no goals today. You're only focused on assists at practice. We're still trying to win games.
00:56:07
Speaker
So now the helping put constraints on this increases the challenge and then. Yeah. I mean, we're forced think. A different sort of ability grows. Exactly. yeah And the behavior and the mindset, the resilience, we're aiming to define this flow strike zone. Yeah, right.
00:56:28
Speaker
ah With them mentally and emotionally. and I'm thinking of dudes right now that I'm not keeping this model in mind, but lean into this naturally, but now have a intentionality I can attribute. That's right. a tribute Intentionality is huge. To this and then hand it off to others. so I love that.
00:56:46
Speaker
That's really good. And and you just I want to give a nod to one of the things that you mentioned, which is real. The challenge of doing this at scale. It's like you think you've got a practice plan or a drill that kind of balances this for the bulk of people.
00:57:01
Speaker
but then you got two or three on the bottom end of that spectrum, two or three at the top, it's hard to find a real sweet spot, but that's another challenge of coaching. Well, this is where I would structure the practice and the skills and the drills. So how I do it is there's a conductor, he's got a whistle, and he's just focused next rep, next rep, next rep, and then there's a coach.
00:57:23
Speaker
So you finish your rep, you go off to the side to get back in line or whatever it may be, and you get one cue, one fix, one direction, one form of feedback, and then you need to go apply it next. yeah So that that's contained.
00:57:39
Speaker
what i My biggest pet peeve in all of the sport is when the coach who's blowing the whistle, or excuse me, the conductor, want can't resist the urge and they want to coach. So then they kill the drill. yeah Drill stops. if we're If we are moving, we're learning. yeah So now he tries to make one point to one individual, and we just wasted three reps at practice. yeah Compounded interest, over 100 practices in a season, we just missed out on 300 reps. yeah
00:58:10
Speaker
Oh my god. It makes my skin crawl yeah when the conductor. i often take that role because yeah I can manage. You conduct, yes. and So, but that that's also perfectionism.
00:58:22
Speaker
Like, well, I need to get better at giving the conductor at that drill feedback on like, dude, I understand you want to save it for afterwards yeah or communicate to coach. Hey, this is what this is one I'm seeing and you fix it. Next try. Yeah. Hey, Brian, make sure that he holds the finish or whatever the cue is. Which then I do. And then as...
00:58:42
Speaker
I guess a head coach communicating to coordinators. That's what it's like because you still got to operate the the the the flow of the game and you're communicating to What your expectation is of the defense or you see something they need to fix I'm not going and telling kid. I'm down in coordinator. Hey, I'm seeing this right when you do this if there's something schematically that needs to be fixed like a matchup mm-hmm yeah Three doesn't have it today. yeah that's right Three sucks. yeah Let's get him out of there, but I need you to communicate.
00:59:14
Speaker
I'm going to say this to everyone in your audience. if you The more you say a kid sucks, the worse you are at coaching. Here's why I mean that. It's a dismissal of responsibility. And it happens. And my guess, here's the forgiving part of it. My guess would be that people, a coach might invest so much and create like an ideal plan and then plug a kid in who they think can do it. And for whatever reason, it doesn't happen. And they are so frustrated. They're probably hitting the far side of the curve themselves. They don't have the language to actually assess what's going on. That kid sucks. Get him out.
00:59:48
Speaker
Like, not likely. Um, Or maybe the person, like if the person literally has no ability, it's still your fault, coach, for putting the kid in that position and ask them to do something that their talent set did not allow them to do.
01:00:05
Speaker
So I think the more you say this team doesn't have it, this kid doesn't have it, whatever, I think you're just, you're missing an opportunity as a coach, minimally. but ahhu I have some ethical concerns about it too.
01:00:17
Speaker
Coach needs coach. All coaches need coaches. That is a freaking fact. And... Yeah. I mean, I feel that way about myself for sure.
01:00:28
Speaker
Like I need guidance. I need support. I think I know a lot. I think I do. i I might be wrong about some of it, but I think I know a lot. And i wouldn't have access to the full set of things that I know if I wasn't bumping it off other people and helping guide me along the way.
01:00:43
Speaker
Yeah. And getting pushback and challenge. and you Right. and
AUIRS Model for Decision-Making
01:00:47
Speaker
really form And having to, exactly. There's a, thank you for pointing to the book again. Just kidding, kind of.
01:00:54
Speaker
um there's There's a chapter in there about feedback. It doesn't go into all the nuance of what it takes to deliver and receive feedback well, but we have a model in this room where we say all feedback is good feedback.
01:01:07
Speaker
Doesn't mean it's all accurate. Minimally though, we have to relieve our hesitation in the presence of feedback. So if like a coach gave us feedback on our training models, we might think that we know more about training than a sport coach and we might be right.
01:01:20
Speaker
But first we have to listen. We have to at least listen to feedback. If all that does is start a ripple of self-reflection and in like doubling down on what we think we know so that we can relay it well to the coach, like here's what we're up to.
01:01:34
Speaker
um then great instead of like taking it personally and and that's uh oh yeah i think i still battle that and then sure i think everybody does yeah so then structured this past lacrosse season structured middle school middle school's practice plans yeah super proud and then what i installed that i was super proud of was uh Inter practice competitions. So I disguised conditioning as like races and competitions. love it And I just done a podcast with Jeremy Frisch, who's a phenomenal yeah long term development.
01:02:12
Speaker
I've heard of him for sure. He's amazing. You definitely are following him or or plugged into him. It's just the name. So he's he's an incredible coach up in Massachusetts area. So just did a podcast with him on how he integrates like speed training and games into his training sessions with with the kids. And i was like, dude, I'm all in.
01:02:35
Speaker
So then ran two weeks of practices like this. And then head coach gets a complaint from a parent who's observing practice. Cool. Worst practices he's ever seen perfect.
01:02:45
Speaker
So I was like, what are you talking about? like These are awesome. Yeah, I'm having a great time. Yeah, right, right. Redirect it, reform and shape them and then receive different feedback following ah following that about practice and connectivity.
01:03:03
Speaker
And I guess. ah Optimal zone, flow for his son, et cetera. it was like, but I had to you had to yeah be professional and make the adjustments. be Like listen to the feedback versus like dismissing. You got to listen to it at least. Yeah, right.
01:03:21
Speaker
And it could be that this person was sort of the stereotype. But I don't know who it was. It was anonymous feedback. yeah And I don't know his history and sure performance or sport or anything. And I think one of the things that has come up a lot as I myself try to do this and try to help other people do it is that to create visibility, like to have open, honest dialogue and create visibility,
01:03:45
Speaker
soothes a lot of concerns. So like it is very possible that this well-structured, very thoughtful plan that you had when rolled out looked unfamiliar to this person who probably just didn't understand why it was being done.
01:04:01
Speaker
And maybe if they had greater visibility into why it was being done, they would change their mind. And if they're, and maybe not, but yeah that ah that but that at least gives people a chance.
01:04:11
Speaker
Yeah. i I hear that, and I just laughed because Jeremy, on the podcast interview that I had with him, yeah he joked that he doesn't know anything about lacrosse. So when he had to sub for a lacrosse strength conditioning session, he just had everybody do everything that he normally would do yeah with sticks in their hands.
01:04:31
Speaker
Perfect. And then his feedback from the parents, that was the best so good yeah yeah right lacrosse training session that they've ever seen. was like, okay, we'll just do all these games with sticks in our hands. Perfect.
01:04:42
Speaker
Brilliant. no Give the people what they want. No, I'm with you. Yes. Well, one more model that I did want to cover that you'll be covering Friday that we talked about on our whiteboard, in which I thought it was awesome and very, yeah I mean, summed this up so well and and n is visual.
01:05:03
Speaker
I mean, we can we can make room. I'm not afraid. I come home with blue hands most days, so I'll just do this. Perfect. Time out. Tex here at Train Heroic headquarters meeting with the team to talk about the coaching experience that I'm able to provide for my athletes. So if you're a coach and want to put your program out there on an app that athletes actually enjoy using, Train Heroics for you. I've been using it since 2014. delivering literally over tens of thousands of workouts to athletes.
01:05:35
Speaker
And Train Heroic allows me to provide the unique coaching experience that I want to. Uploading video, providing coaching feedback, directions, and building a community. That's why I love Train Heroic. And if you want to take your athletes where they can't take themselves, that they want to go, head to trainheroic.com slash captains and check out how you can deliver programming to them.
01:05:57
Speaker
And now, back to the show. Ready, ready, and we're in.
01:06:04
Speaker
Like nature intended. Done. Don't erase that. That's staying. Just remember that. the ball this is This is like the ultimate performance architecture.
01:06:19
Speaker
And I say ultimate because it works even if you're not all that interested in performing at high level. I think it's just really valuable to keep in mind for a general human interaction. A-U-I-R-S.
01:06:32
Speaker
Awareness.
01:06:35
Speaker
Understanding,
01:06:40
Speaker
Intention, Review, Synthesis. i don't know if anyone can read my writing, but Awareness, Understanding, Intention, Review, Synthesis. And we move through this progression we're when we're making good decisions.
01:06:56
Speaker
We move through it sometimes automatically, but it's always good to have terms and language for it so that you can catch if you ever miss a step. Intention actually has two components to it.
01:07:08
Speaker
Intentional decision has to lead to an intentional behavior. Oftentimes in coaching, people talk about the difference between being reactive or being responsive.
01:07:19
Speaker
And if you are responding to the needs of a situation, then you are, then you're on it. And if you're just being reactive, then you are left to your default settings and it might not be the ideal. So awareness, understanding, intention, review, synthesis. Awareness, easy enough, we mentioned it. Some self-awareness is key. Without good awareness, how could you possibly be responsive?
01:07:42
Speaker
Then working to understand a situation, its components, the people involved, etc. Really important. Then the intention stage, this is really the crux of it all. Let's make a thoughtful, intentional decision in the presence of our understanding.
01:07:56
Speaker
Then we have to move on it. We have to act on it. So the decision has to lead to a behavior. The behavior might be even a decision not to engage, that's possible, but more often than not, behavior requires you to get into the arena and fricking try something.
01:08:12
Speaker
Only once you try something can you accurately or give yourself even a chance to review whether it worked or not. It's no longer an opinion or a good idea, it's a practice. Did it work or did it not?
01:08:24
Speaker
synthesize this sort of miniature experiment back into your understanding and awareness and let the cycle go on repeat. You deepen your level of awareness, you enhance conditional understanding, you can make more intentional decisions in the presence of it, then you act on it, review, synthesis, repeat. It's just it's a constant cycle.
01:08:43
Speaker
And it's key. In the arena. Get in the arena. And I think the difference, you know, we talked about some of the truisms or the coachisms of like, yeah Can I say it? like like okay any Whatever it might be. ah Which might have a place, given its context or whatever.
01:09:02
Speaker
But ultimately, without awareness and understanding and a thoughtful decision, then this this drive to be proactive is just super limited. There's a lot of people who just bump into things more often than they have to. And they ultimately do more work because their decisions are more reactive than responsive. So they think they're being...
01:09:21
Speaker
maybe time efficient. Let's just go. Let's do that. Yeah, that sounds fine. Go. um Maybe, but probably not effective in the long haul. Yes. And mean, there is a ah state of avoidance of conflict, of hard work, yeah of the the difficult decision or the difficult conversation.
01:09:45
Speaker
And I mean, having it is a hell of a lot more easier than the loops you have to go through after the consequences of avoiding it or... Smoothing out the issue that didn't have to be in there in the first place. That's right. so And then honestly, I say this is like through the background architecture because all of the things that we've talked about and many more frameworks, like it's hard to make an intentional decision if you're over here.
01:10:09
Speaker
So maybe the intentional decision when you feel like your head's clouded is chill. regroup, relax before you go on to enlist the behavior. And then like you say, a lot of the work that I do with people is once we have this architecture in place, figuring out what the limitations to the behavior might be.
01:10:29
Speaker
So where are my hesitations coming from? Why do I, I'm just gonna do a cheesy one for like a professional realm, but everyone's been there to some degree. Why when i make this sales call, I know everything I'm supposed to say, I think. Why do I clam up and hesitate? or You know, things like that. So trying to identify the individualized hurdles to the enlisting of the behavior is key.
01:10:55
Speaker
I love it. And it all comes from a steady place. gets Hence the title, yeah Get Steady. yeah Well, Jim, I mean, this is where we've got wrap it up because we could talk for hours. True.
01:11:07
Speaker
And I mean, I'm excited for Friday. I'm grateful for the opportunity to come up and I mean, help people move, make some make some fun connections. yeah Pun intended, because I'll be making people connections. I like it. And connections between what is shared and applied. yeah So good. You're bridging the gap. application gap.
01:11:27
Speaker
You are. Bridging the gap. Which is, I mean, we were talking about my doctorate earlier. That's that's the aim. It's sitting in that space. is a apply. Right. Because all I do is apply all day. so then it's And then the guidance that I received was read one study a day.
01:11:42
Speaker
So that way it becomes a habit, your continued education and how that our research is structured so that I can apply, i can research. But then it's applying it in real time with my dudes and seeing sticks and doesn't. That's right.
01:11:59
Speaker
We're all running little experiments all the time. Yes, and now we got some more thought models to apply. That's right. To then reflect and shape our decision making, which keep it responsible. That's what we're doing. You know, SEL. It all comes full circle. So, dude, thank you.
01:12:19
Speaker
I mean, once a year we're going to make this conversation happen. love Because all we're doing is just layering Yeah, that's right. That's right. and Well, where can people go to get this? By the time this comes out, this is actually a draft copy. So by the time this is published, I think you can just find out on Amazon. can find on goodathleteproject.com, bedrockedu.com, or just look it up on Amazon search bar.
01:12:44
Speaker
Sweet. Where can people learn, continue to learn from you? I think at goodathleteproject on Instagram is where we're most active. But I mean, those are just vehicles to try to get me in person with people.
01:12:58
Speaker
I get it. Come to the Beyond Strength
Beyond Strength Journal Discussion
01:13:00
Speaker
Summit. That's where you can learn. Yes. And be Beyond Strength Journal. We have a Beyond Strength Journal. Psychology of and Strength. be yeah what um ah Beyond Strength Journal.
01:13:13
Speaker
Strength and psychology. That's where it tries to bridge those that gap. And we've been publishing that annually. We're thinking of going twice a year. We've had a lot of great contributors, yourself included, who sit in that intersection that you've talked about. They're bridging i got a lot more to give there.
01:13:28
Speaker
Let's go. Yeah. I mean, I was i was just scratching the surface. Let's go. bo Okay. Well, I mean, my wheels are spinning. I can't wait for Friday. And yeah, this is this
Conclusion and Gratitude
01:13:39
Speaker
is awesome. So people, pay attention.
01:13:41
Speaker
Well, that does it for another episode. Thank you for helping us raise the game. Appreciate you, man. Thank you all. And scene. Doing good? Amazing. Yeah, great job. I mean, we can keep going. I know. But time. Time.