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10 - Communication in Science with Elizabeth Sherr
7 Plays1 year ago
In this insightful episode of Going Coastal, co-hosts Jon Miller and Deb Fernandes speak with Elizabeth Sherr, a self-taught science communicator and content creator who shares her passion for breaking down complex scientific concepts in relatable and engaging ways.
Join us as Elizabeth takes us through her journey in science communication, from her rise on social media to speaking at conferences, and how she uses her platform to bridge the gap between research and public understanding.
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Transcript
Introduction and Hosts
00:00:10
Speaker
Hello, hello everyone and welcome back to the Going Coastal podcast. The podcast of the students and new professionals hosted by John Miller, Marisa Torres and Deb Fernandez. I am one of your co-hosts, Deb Fernandez. And I'm John Miller, one of your other co
Episode Theme: Storytelling in Science
00:00:24
Speaker
-hosts. And this month's episode is quite special because we are focusing on the power of storytelling in science.
00:00:32
Speaker
and we're going to talk about communication and science.
Guest Introduction: Elizabeth Shearer
00:00:35
Speaker
For this, we have a special guest today, Elizabeth Shearer, who is a science communicator and content creator. She graduated from the University of Florida and has a master's in marine environmental resources from a European Erasmus program. So welcome to the show, Liz. Hello, hello. Thank you for having me.
00:00:54
Speaker
Yes, welcome. Always nice to have a ah gator on the show. Are you a fellow gator as well? and Of course, of course. Oh, I guess I've heard about you.
00:01:07
Speaker
Can't escape us. We're everywhere. no
00:01:11
Speaker
for a little story here, Liz and I did our masters together. And so I'm pretty close to her. And that's probably how she heard about you because I probably talked about you already, John. yeah so Always good things. Always always good things. All right.
Liz Shearer's Background and Journey
00:01:30
Speaker
So the way we like to start our podcast is to get to know our, our guests, usually guests, but this time guests, we want to know a little bit about your background. Tell us a little bit more about yourself. Why did you go into science communication? And yeah.
00:01:47
Speaker
We want to know everything about you. So the floor is yours. Yeah, for sure. Thank you. So I didn't grow up near the ocean, unfortunately, nor did I have a family that was very invested in the ocean either. But when I started learning about plastic pollution in my community, that's when I was wondering, where is this plastic going and how is this affecting our planet? And the more I realized that we live on a blue planet that we know so little about, and more than outer space and our own ocean, I just thought that was absolutely crazy when I was young.
00:02:16
Speaker
And so I kind of relied on stories of ocean scientists like Jacque Cousteau and Sylvia Earle to learn more about the ocean. I remember going even into my library, my local library and getting their books and watching BBC documentaries like Blue Planet. and taking notes on my laptop just to learn more because I didn't have marine science in school or anything like that. So I really, again, had to first pursue this on my own. um And it wasn't until I went to go scuba diving for the first time at the age of 16 in Honduras. My mom is from there. And Honduras, by the way, is part of the second largest barrier reef after the Great Barrier Reef.
00:02:57
Speaker
in Australia. It's part of the Mesoamerican Barrier Reef. And it was just so full of life and color. And it was everything I could have imagined of what a healthy underwater landscape looks like. So after experiencing that, I thought to myself, okay, this ocean you know hobby or interest is so much more than like what
From Marine Science to Conservation Storytelling
00:03:17
Speaker
I thought it was. It's definitely something that I want to commit my life to to work towards protecting. And, um you know, fast forward to University of Florida. I was actually starting with marine science, but I switched to natural resource conservation because I was not a fan of chem and maths. But um I continued with involvement through marine science internships and
00:03:38
Speaker
um different ways to do research, but throughout all those experiences and even throughout my master program in Europe where I studied in France, Spain and Belgium with Deb too, um I was always seeing missed opportunities in the science community to really share what they're learning with the greater public.
00:03:54
Speaker
And I was always thinking about the stories that inspired me from, ah you know, Sylvia Earle and Dr. Cousteau and the documentaries and how those reached me and made me someone who wanted to protect the ocean. And I thought, why are we not doing that more often in the science sphere? So having social media get bigger and bigger as we were younger. This was always something in the back of my mind, but it wasn't something that I thought I could make into a career at all because I really wanted to focus in science. And it was probably until you know COVID when we were all trapped in our own apartments, I was in Spain finishing my thesis.
00:04:31
Speaker
My thesis focused on giving advice for the science and scientific body of the BB&J agreements. So it was very policy and social-based, included lots of surveys and interviews, and it was really interesting. And even with that research, I was thinking, we are currently at a time working on the High Seas Treaty, the BB and&J agreements,
00:04:51
Speaker
working on protecting the marine resources of the biggest parts of our ocean where no country governs. How do people not know about this and how can we get people to care about this? So it just surprised me how people are just very disconnected to the ocean and and
Viral Campaigns and Global Impact
00:05:05
Speaker
fairly so. Everyone's busy with their own lives, but always wondering how can we connect people in ways that they actually care, whether it be through a story or or song or art, there has to be some way. And that's when I got on TikTok and started doing beach cleanups. I've always been a big,
00:05:20
Speaker
glitter picker ah since since my young age. That's how I really got involved in conservation through cleanups. um and And yeah, one one video kicked off and it showed me that you can really get people to care about the ocean through social media. It's not just something to share about beauty or or fitness or or recipes. like There are ways to get people to educate through social media. We can use it as a tool to leverage marine science and that was really inspired me.
00:05:48
Speaker
That's such a cool story. So I'm the i'm the old man in the room sort of compared to compared to the two of you. And I know it's it's been interesting for people of my generation to even begin to adopt, I'll call it basic social media. So not even TikTok, but like even going through Twitter and Instagram and kind of the, the I guess, precursors, ancient social media. I know like within you know my community, the academic community, there's always been a lot of resistance to it. um And we're trying to like figure out how to how to use it in a positive way. And it's really cool to hear that story, um you know how it can be used for science communication. That's really cool.
00:06:31
Speaker
Yeah, it's definitely a very inspiring story. And for our audience, as you can tell, we're not ah necessarily coastal focused for this episode, but we kind of have like a common denominator, which is the ocean, and we want to protect it. So I think this really still applies to all of us. And the way we communicate science, whether it's marine or coastal, it's just so important. And I have one little question. What's the BBNG agreement?
Communicating Marine Science and Policy
00:06:59
Speaker
Yes, the BB and&J gra agreement is marine biodiversity beyond national jurisdiction, other known as the high seas treaty. It's basically this ongoing negotiations on how to govern the resources in the high seas, which start like 200 nautical miles off the continental shelf. So it's the part of the ocean that is kind of like no man's land. We have to figure out how can we properly govern this in ways that is just and fair um economically and with resources. And it's this huge melting pot of of unknown. So there's negotiations currently on how to best make sure that we don't exploit and that um all resources are going to be used fairly for everyone. Pretty cool. So we're in two policies too. Liz does everything.
00:07:49
Speaker
Yeah, I guess I didn't really explain from my background how I do what I do now. um I can go into a bit of like the the cool story I had with that initial TikTok video. Sure, yeah.
00:08:02
Speaker
Yeah, so again, from cleaning beaches since forever, even like when I was studying at UF, I was ahead of the surf fighter chapter there organizing beach cleanups. And when I moved to Barcelona for a job, I was just so astounded of how much trash there is on the beach there every single day, every morning.
00:08:20
Speaker
and They have city cleaners coming and picking it up. They can't pick up everything. It was all pretty much done by hand. um and It was like this horrible cycle that I would just watch through my window. so Naturally, I decided to go on my own cleanups to raise awareness because litter is a global issue. It's a global coastal and marine issue. and um I created this one challenge that I said, for every follow, I'll pick up a piece of trash. And this was just honestly for fun. It didn't really have much intent, but it kind of went viral. So when I got lots of followers, I thought, let's make this about actual action because it's not about me picking up the beach. I mean, I'm just one person. We want everyone to care about this. So I started saying, hey, if you pick up X amount of pieces of trash and you comment how many pieces, I'll put it towards our collective goal.
00:09:09
Speaker
And people were commenting that they picked up 300 pieces with their friends after school or 500 with their mom. you know it was It was really, really unique and and awesome to see collective action from all over the world, from various countries. And this kind of inspired or I think piqued the interest of the European Parliament who slid through my DMs on Instagram one day. And they were like, hey, we would love you to organize a similar campaign for World's Ocean Day in 2021.
00:09:37
Speaker
And so we did and we ended up having around 11 no 33 countries participating reaching over 700,000 pieces of trash collecting all their comments and data that we received through messages and it was really really awesome to see how social media can leverage positive ocean action. And that kind of showed me, opened this door for me, where I saw an opportunity for social media to educate but also inspire change. um And then I started taking it more seriously. And, you know, over time built an audience because I do have that scientific background, I always
00:10:17
Speaker
hold on to that part of my identity and using um ah scientific articles when it was necessary and teaching people about the ocean through social media. And eventually this led to really cool collaborations as of you know the last few years. I've had the Ocean Conservancy, the Nature Conservancy, Greenpeace, UN Ocean Decade, just really awesome opportunities to share and support campaigns um around the ocean online and also attend in-person events. Like I was invited to be one of the 10 bloggers of the Our Ocean conference that happened last year in Athens. And we had to take interviews and videos and collect lots of content to share what's happening at the conference to our general public and audiences. And that was really awesome for me to see that people are trying to realize the impact and the the necessity to use
00:11:07
Speaker
voices, scientific communicator voices, to share what's going on in the world surrounding our changing planet.
Simplifying Science for Public Engagement
00:11:14
Speaker
That's really impressive. Honestly, like you nailed them all. Like the European Parliament called you. That's really impressive. That's super cool. Yeah, um um I'm honestly a little bit in awe because, you know, i i prior to this discussion, I've never met you. And, you know,
00:11:35
Speaker
Deb said, oh, I've got this great person to jump on the podcast. And honestly, I had no idea what to expect. And like that is crazy to me to think that you were able to take something that was very personal, you know very sort of low key to start, and you know see it kind of explode, go viral, and you know to have these opportunities be generated from you know ah something that you never really intended for it to go.
00:12:05
Speaker
like to that point, but it's, it's, it's, um again I'm, again, I'm the old man in the room. So I'm like, wow, the the social media can be really cool. I told you she was awesome. You did, you did. And i not but I didn't believe you. but No, yeah. So is it, ah is it a challenge to sort of communicate across levels to people, right? Because you're you have an audience which you know, may have varying degrees of scientific understanding, and yet you want to not just encourage people to pick up trash, but also, you know, communicate a little bit more ah beyond that. Like, is it is it hard? is it Or is it something that you find just sort of a natural ability?
00:12:50
Speaker
It's definitely a challenge, especially across platforms, and that will vary depending on each content creator and who their audience is. um But I always like to try to simplify the science as much as possible. And sometimes I tell myself, okay, here's a really interesting article or finding, how can I translate this is as if I were talking to a sixth grader? Because adults, like, we're not all scientists, we all should be able to understand something if it's you know, a bit more simplified. And that really is helpful because sometimes when we get too technical or too polished, that's when things get boring. And you can even think about it as when you're skimming through news articles on something, you read the first headlines, you choose which ones you want to read based off those headlines, based off those first initial seconds of engagement. So it's really about
00:13:37
Speaker
not only making the science more attractive and easier to understand, breaking down those difficult jargon, but also making it engaging in those first few seconds. Why someone should stop and continue watching that video in the first place? How is it relevant to them? And why should they care? So ah sometimes we think in the science community in academia that it has to be very perfect and polished, but the the truth is people respond to science a lot more when there is emotional connection to it. And that's what I think is really interesting and how we can use that emotional connection with science communication to create those changes in policy and behaviors that we want as a collective community. What would be the example of an emotional connection to a scientific use? Sure, so so um we can even start with you know these
00:14:23
Speaker
natural or not so natural disasters we've had recently with climate change, um specifically in sea level rise, for example. um I know some people are even strangled away from using that term because it is so polarized. And so having terms like flood resilience might make something a bit more stable in terms of reaching different audiences and for them reacting in a way that's focusing more on the issue than around the word itself and making it polarized.
Content Creation and Storytelling Techniques
00:14:51
Speaker
When people share their own experiences to these disasters, such as but flood resilience, such as wildfires, then we can create a more emotional connection to how it affects not just our planet, but how it affects people, their homes, their families, their pets. And that's when people can really understand that maybe there's something bigger happening here.
00:15:12
Speaker
Why are we getting all these issues a lot more than before? um Is it really normal to have snow in Florida at this time? It hasn't happened in the last 80 years and start making people think about um our change in climate more often, um more realistically maybe.
00:15:27
Speaker
Okay, yeah, that's pretty cool. And so you go on and like read articles like on a daily basis, like, how do you produce your content? How do you know that you're going to talk about this or that? I like to stay informed a lot through social media.
00:15:43
Speaker
primarily. And then when I learned about a topic that I want to dive more into, I'll go on my own and see different news articles, media and peer reviewed articles. So I do learn a lot about the ocean from organizations and people that I follow because there is a trusted community online. And then I like to take the time to learn more about those topics on my own through my own research on news and peer reviewed articles. So what I like to post about is something that I think resonates a lot with my own interest because I think if I find it interesting, there has to be someone else that finds it interesting, surely, right? And something, especially if there's something that requires direct action for a petition or for um an immediate change of the thoughts or behavior that we want audiences to get, that's also something that I will push out more than others. But every day is really different. I would say I'm not only looking at
00:16:40
Speaker
Producing content on the news. I have so many of my own experiences that I want to Share with the world and with my with the ocean and with nonprofits and with people I've met during my travels um But collaborations can happen within the week that require deliverables within the next week um If I learned about anything within the ocean space, it's very last-minute even with the UN or anything like that things come and go very quickly and Yeah, I think it's really important to just stay informed and to check in with each other.
Combating Misinformation in Science
00:17:13
Speaker
It's great to be part of these niche ocean circles, whether it be through podcasts, through group chats, through colleagues, and to continue sharing about things happening in our own communities so that we can just stay more informed. Do you ever encounter haters or critics? Because you you mentioned that you also rely on other content creators and there's this community of trusted sort of sources, but
00:17:39
Speaker
you know Do you have to battle sort of misinformation or people that may have counter viewpoints to some of what you put out? and how does that How does that go? 100%. Misinformation is a big challenge. Political leaders, corporations, social media, all these factors amplify misleading narratives and that makes it harder to cut through the noise sometimes. um So people are more likely to trust sources that align with their existing beliefs. So breaking through those echo chambers can be tough and that's where
00:18:11
Speaker
your trusted audiences is really really powerful in helping share your message and also within your network. Not just like my message but helping share other people that I trust as well and their messages. um Again, unfortunately, marine science and climate change has these negative connotations in terms of political polarization or party affiliation. so This means that even when the data is clear, such as rising emissions causing global warming, um it can still reject this again negative connotation with science because it conflicts with world views or financial interests instead, which really, really bothers me and I hope that can change in the future. but
00:18:52
Speaker
Again, I think if we change our narratives to make it easier for everyone to understand, maybe even change the kinds of words we use, we can make our stories more impactful. It's interesting, particularly around something like climate change and sea level rise. And I'm just going to ah share a story. So New Jersey Sea Grant provides some of my funding and I remember God, it must have been 15 years ago now. um There was a ah huge push within Sea Grant to really begin to to almost force-feed climate change to people. um You know, we we work a lot with communities along coastlines, and we talk to them about coastal hazards and storms and sea level rise. And we think about, like, how do you become more resilient, whether it's coastal protection, beach nourishment, raising of structures, kind of all those kind of things that just kind of help us live along the coast in ah in a better way
00:19:46
Speaker
And I remember there was there was basically ah two different camps within the Sea Grant. There was sort of one group that was you know very adamant that we must talk about sea level rise, we must talk about climate change, and we must get people to change their behavior because of climate change. And then there was another group of us that, and I was kind of in the second camp, that was kind of like, yeah, well, that's great. and We know sea level rise is happening and we agree with all the sciences there.
00:20:13
Speaker
But if our ultimate goal is to make people change their behavior and we have an audience, which is, you know, for a variety of reasons, political, otherwise adamantly opposed, climate change doesn't exist, sea level rise is not happening, but they're impacted by coastal storms and they want to change their behavior so that they just, their house doesn't get destroyed in the next storm. We were kind of like, well, do we have to feed everything through that lens of climate change? Or can we simply say,
00:20:42
Speaker
Hey, your concern is that the next storm is going to get you. So the behavior that you should take is you should either do a beach nourishment project or raise your house or, you know, adapt. And at the end of the day, we were kind of saying, do the same things, right? We were kind of saying like, all right, let's take these measures to make yourself more safe. But it was interesting to be.
00:21:06
Speaker
in a place where there was kind of these two points of view. My point of view was the second, which was like, all right, let's get people to change their behavior and you know continue to work on them like over time and you know not to shy away from the climate change or sea level
Adapting Science Communication for Audiences
00:21:19
Speaker
rise argument, but you know let's focus on, like in my mind, the most important thing, which was let's become more resilient and more safe and let's try to get there on the sea level rise, but almost sort of recognizing that because of these other forces, political, religious, whatever, it was going to be really difficult. And we didn't want people to resist and not do the right thing because of this like inherent resistance to ah the message of sea level rise to climate change.
00:21:49
Speaker
I love that example so much. I think it resonates with a lot of scientists as well and how they have to work with communities to to teach them about their findings and to hopefully engage in thoughts and behavior change. And i I think it really depends on your audience. Who are you talking to and what is the best way to effectively communicate the science to them? Maybe that means going more to that emotional connection part than the scientific evidence-based part, because at the end of the day, it is, but you said, the same the same goal.
00:22:19
Speaker
and maybe save those other terms and topics for, you know, your own science community. Um, like while scientists present this evident based arguments, people who oppose climate change are often relying on fear or economic anxiety or even cultural identity to sway their opinions. So that means that we as scientists have to go beyond the facts to actually get people to care and to connect with people's values. And that's where storytelling can be a really powerful tool.
Media for Science Storytelling
00:22:49
Speaker
through use of visuals or writing or videos, there are so many different mediums we can reach people. um and That's becoming this really interesting hurdle to go over that political bias that is unfortunately associated with the ocean. Since you brought it up, right as a videos, etc. If a picture is worth a thousand words, how many words is a TikTok? Well, TikToks could be now 10 minutes. so Things are changing. um Yeah, I think every every scientist can find a way to tell their story, whether it be through word of mouth, more at in-person events or photography, poetry. There are so many ways we can express our findings and ways that can relate to the public more easily. And there's also organizations like UNESCO IOC, the Intergovernmental Oceanographic Commission, I believe,
00:23:46
Speaker
They have a great ocean literacy program and they're always looking for different stories. um The U.N. Ocean Decade, one of their major pillars is connecting people to the ocean. So it's a big opportunity for scientists to find ways that that do inspire others through their own work.
00:24:01
Speaker
I mean, I think what's happening now a lot in social media too is that people want to see the behind the scenes. We don't really want to see just the research and just what you succeeded in, but how did you get there? What does it look like to be someone like you in your lab or out on the field? Take us through your story. Take us through your adventure. You want to know how scientists navigate through life. And that is a lot more interesting to see or to learn about than just hearing the success story. So um yeah, I think it's a lot more open in that way where people are are eager to share their personal experiences, not just their academic experiences.
00:24:39
Speaker
So I was wondering, so regardless of the type of thing you're going to post, like either to the picture or video and on whatever platform, LinkedIn, TikTok or Instagram, how do you manage making content that's both entertaining and educational? Cause you said that you need to like kind of also entertain. yes They want to get engaged to have that emotional connection. So it's kind of an entertainment in a way. And how do you balance entertainment and educational
The Art of Relatable and Engaging Content
00:25:07
Speaker
content?
00:25:07
Speaker
Right. So I think number one is relatability, trying to see how my story can connect to someone else in a way that can relate to their everyday life or potential concerns of our changing planet. Number two is a hook. You only have a few seconds, whether it be a LinkedIn post or a video for someone to read or listen to what you're saying for them to stay engaged. So what are the hooks that we're saying? Not just, hi, I'm Elizabeth Cher and I'm a science communicator and I want to talk about this.
00:25:37
Speaker
they're already scrolling like yeah maybe start starting with the actual facts like recently we just discovered the largest deep sea coral reef off the coast of Chile and that is a huge news so that's a much more interesting to say than scientists went down in a yeah no I get it like yeah so a question that I was gonna ask and it kind of relates because of kind of how you were saying how you tell the story and kind of leading with the you know, important information or something that's going to catch your audience's attention. Like I think as academics in particular, in my particular field, we do a bad job of that. um And, you know, we actually, you know, do you do any sort of like training for for people? Or do you just like have these pieces of advice that obviously, you know, and you apply in your every day,
00:26:33
Speaker
you know, life, but I'm just curious because because academics could definitely benefit from some of this information. I would love to reach academics in that way and to offer workshops. I think that would be really fun for me and for other creators who have that communication skills to share. um I have more experience doing that with younger scientists or early career professionals through nonprofits that I've been connected with since I was young. So those connections have continue and they reached out to me to ask if I can offer a workshop on communication or storytelling with impact, which has been really cool in conferences or online like this. But yeah, I think we need to blend our skills a lot more. We're all connected to science one way or another.
00:27:19
Speaker
and how we communicate that is going to help shape our policy today and in the future. So there is some sort of perfect recipe, basically, to be able to communicate um effectively. It's that information that you need to hook the the person, you need to connect with them and be quite succinct.
00:27:40
Speaker
that the hook should be short, but the actual content doesn't need to be short. And you can always have a short video, a short post, and then bring somewhere else, bring a reader somewhere else, like a fuller article or video to get more in depth on the topic. It depends what your goal is, but I would say relatability, the hook. And also I love to end with some positivity because if we're always feeding our audiences negative stuff about our findings, then it's just going to continue feeding this ah really deep dark hole of the climate and our blue planet when there is so much resilience and there is so much positive work going on. So I do always try to end with hope and inspire people to to continue educating or taking action or supporting so and so organization. um Because it helps me with my mental health
Collaboration in Science Communication
00:28:30
Speaker
as well. And I believe we can change, you know, change that out, not the algorithm, but change people's feeds in that way.
00:28:38
Speaker
it's It's interesting. so i've I just want sort to get your thoughts on something and then I'll maybe follow up with how I feel about it. so I've been at a number of events where recently where it's been brought up that there are communicators and there are scientists and everybody should stay in their own lane. How do you feel about that? If that's still going on in 2025, I feel very angry about that. and like That was a concern for me when I was going to my first conferences 10, 15 years ago. So I hope that's not still the case. I think we still have a long way to go, but there has been lots of improvements, not just with social media, but with science communicators in general. um I think journalists
00:29:25
Speaker
content creators and scientists need to form this beautiful trio for that recipe more often. But again, what is the point of what we do if it's not really shared or making impact with the rest of the world? And I think sometimes we forget what brought us to what we're doing today because we get so caught up in maybe being the only university or lab that got published.
00:29:48
Speaker
But at the end of the day, what does that really mean if we don't have our ocean networks and our impact? There are so many more ways we can not just produce research, but also collaborate, whether it be through content creators, communicators, and within our own science community, asking your peers, asking NGOs, asking different governmental bodies, hey, we have this new research, it would be great if you can help share it. Do you have any other research that you we can share for you as well and open those doors? We should always be asking how we can help leverage our findings in creating these partnerships because that's when I see the farthest action actually happen. Does that make sense? Yeah, no. So i asked the I asked the question because I feel very similarly, I think, to you.
00:30:35
Speaker
in the fact that, but you know, and this conversation has been great, because, you know, I've always felt that as a scientist, researcher, academic, you know, it's part of my responsibility to communicate my results, both to scientific and non scientific audiences, with the recognition that there are certainly people that are communicators that have the the small details like leading or having that hook or or the emotional connection like those are the things is that you as somebody who's embedded more deeply on the in the communication like those are like tips that I can take away from you but by the same token like
00:31:18
Speaker
I would hate to think that my job you know begins and ends with the research and then I drop it and hand it to somebody like you and you have to do all the work because I've i've always felt that as the scientist that has created the work,
00:31:30
Speaker
you know the most about it, right? And so if you don't want it to be misinterpreted, right, you want it to be to find the appropriate place for it, then it is part of your responsibility to be able to communicate it again to the scientific audiences, but also break it down in a way that you can communicate it to the general public. And I think sometimes I might take it for granted, because again, a part of what I do is for Sea Grant and that' that is literally a part of our jobs is to be able to communicate at a level you know with a broad audience. um But I've always been shocked when I've heard academics.
00:32:06
Speaker
try to offlay that responsibility and project it onto somebody else. And I'm like, yeah, I don't think so. I think you should be communicating. And the whole time, you know, working with science communicators and certainly looking to expand like the impact of your work, take tips where necessary, learn how to do it better. But I don't know, that's always been my that's always been my feeling that there needs to be more of a kind of blending of skills and talents and kind of Learning from each other. That's my soapbox. so I was just curious how you thought about it and so
00:32:41
Speaker
kind of refreshing to hear you say, we don't do it like that anymore. It shouldn't be like that anymore. Yeah, I would love to see scientists, NGOs and communicators working together a lot more rather than in silos to make ocean or science knowledge more mainstream, because it's true that even if it is communicated through the news media, it could be interpreted incorrectly, or they could maybe get insights that were not supported more important. um So We can have science as this tool for empowerment, not gatekeeping, you know um but that means working together and it has to come from the interests of the scientists as well. If they are not super interested in that, then that's totally okay to hand it over to communicators, but at least get that connection to happen in the first place because then you kind of are just gatekeeping it within the science sphere. and To make policy change through science, we have to get it to the public in the
Science and Policy: The Influential Connection
00:33:35
Speaker
first place. so
00:33:37
Speaker
I think this is probably a stupid example. This is a not a stupid example, but it's the one that just immediately pops into my head. And it's it's the whole idea behind you know the the paper straws that people use nowadays. right And so my awareness of like the paper straws and the reason that people started to do that was based off of a social media post, I think, that was a turtle and a plastic straw. and like again that emotional connection that people felt really touched by an image and I don't know if it was an image or a video but to me like that you know I went you go to McDonald's now and you get a paper straw and and you know I you know that's something that you know I don't I i would never imagine a major corporation like you know McDonald's moving to do something like that especially
00:34:34
Speaker
I mean, most people that I know that drink out of paper straws don't find it enjoyable. It doesn't, like the straws, to sit they get wet and sloppy over time. You know, it's not the same, but there's a reason to do it. And like, there was a change that was, you know, well brought about by, ah you know, at least in part, you know, by ah by a social media post.
00:34:57
Speaker
Yeah, if I remember, wasn't it like this turtle, which is straws in her nose or something? ah Yeah, it was a turtle with one straw out of the nose and it was horrible. And they pulled it? Yeah, it didn't make people really aware about straws, which is only one plastic to really worry about. But it's true, it did help lead to many businesses taking action on that.
00:35:19
Speaker
and Now there's even more discussions on those paper straws, the best kind are biodegradable straws better than plastic straws, because they don't actually degrade. And there's been science that shows that too. But at least it steps in a better direction, for sure. At least they raise awareness. You know, I think the you know awareness too, right? So it's it's about straws. But as you said, it also brings just awareness to to other types of plastic pollution too. So right, it's not it doesn't necessarily begin and end with the straws. It it also kind of opens people's eyes more broadly to the topic of marine pollution. right So again, it just kind of shows how you know one, I'll call it unintentional you know it post or how it can lead to, if it goes viral, right it just can lead to increasing awareness.
00:36:14
Speaker
you know broadly and and ultimately impacting change. Yeah, I think we're seeing that a lot right now currently actually with deep sea mining. It's this very destructive activity that could basically take up these nodules on the sea floor containing numerous minerals that lots of companies want. However, we know so little about the deep sea environment and A lot of scientists, advocates, NGOs are now coming together to say, hey, we don't know enough about the deep ocean, but we know it absorbs so much of our carbon and ruining its environment can have significant effects on our future. So that's where I think science has been a very interesting role. or Science is helping inform policy to stop permits for deep sea mining because
00:37:05
Speaker
The deep sea is governed by the International Seabed Authority, which is under the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea, but they are really the ones that can say yes or no. So having scientists and NGOs and advocates come together to say, hey, this is way too dangerous. We've seen the machines. They don't just take the nodules. They swipe away everything on the sea floor.
00:37:29
Speaker
from deep sea corals to animals to hydrothermic vents and depleting these ecosystems will have adverse effects on our planet. So having the science say like even though we don't have enough, it's still powerful as well to stop to stop destruction and exploitation of our ocean.
00:37:46
Speaker
It's really cool. So there is definitely the power of yeah communication basically, whatever the subject is. If you deliver it correctly, then you can reach a bigger audience and change can be made. Very inspiring. Whether it be through evidence we currently have or evidence we still need. So precautionary principle can also be really helpful here.
00:38:07
Speaker
so I'm going to go backwards and this is going to make for a terrible podcast because now we're going to go completely in a different direction, but back to something you said earlier, but that's okay because but it's fine. So where exactly did you grow up? I grew up in the suburbs of New York. Suburbs of New York. what do you nes Outside of Manhattan. Yeah. So the nearest beach, you can go to Orchard Beach in the Bronx. It's like 40 minutes from here or more. The nicer ones are in Long Island or New Jersey two hours an hour.
00:38:38
Speaker
Yeah, so it's interesting because you obviously said that you you grew up and you know You weren't an ocean girl or a beach girl and it was it was more Well, I find it fascinating that your inspiration came through media right like traditional media old-school media old-fashioned videos and TV shows and documentaries and things like that and it's kind of really cool that like full circle right like you know here you are you know in inspiring a new generation of coastal ocean scientists advocates you know using obviously the modern version of media so here's a here's a question actually i just it's an interesting and so
00:39:28
Speaker
you're in the social media realm and so you've got the the TikTok and Instagram and all of that kind of stuff down.
Traditional and New Media in Education
00:39:36
Speaker
Do you think there's still a place for the traditional means of communication that you kind of grew up watching or do you think that's a dinosaur that's gone and forever and never coming back? For sure, not just with documentaries, but also books, like people are really getting into reading again. I think that's becoming good another trend of this year, which is great. But yeah, there's so many different streaming companies now with Netflix and Hulu and Disney and different ways that people can
00:40:06
Speaker
learn about the ocean, especially with National Geographic. um I love the WaterBear Network, which is a completely free online tool to access ah documentaries about wildlife or research. And this is and for anyone to access online. Going to the old school, i think I think people really do appreciate that because not everyone wants to spend time scrolling on their phone to educate. Sometimes we want something a bit more traditional, a bit more meaningful, a bit more um down to earth, per se.
00:40:36
Speaker
So yeah, like, writing books, making videos more entertaining through long-form content, even in YouTube, this is becoming a lot more popular this year, and just continuing sharing these stories. Is it something that you would want to pursue?
00:40:52
Speaker
I personally do want to pursue going onto YouTube this year. I was one of the Jackson Wild um Media Lab Fellows last year, where it's this really cool program um that kind of convenes scientists and videographers and photographers together. I was one of the few content creators there, so everyone was already really skilled in high technology videos and photo photos, but it was so cool to actually learn from each other and see that we have so many similarities in our skill sets and getting those hugs and seeing what works to engage an audience for a long time. um So yeah, that's something that I'm personally interested in. And Liz, I have one last question for you. um How can you make ah science more engaging on and social media in general?
00:41:45
Speaker
Right, so aside from knowing first your audience and the different platforms you want to use, I think scientists need to be using the different effects of social media that currently exist. For example, on X or Twitter, you can create threads, you can create polls. On Instagram, you can also create polls. And I think if we keep asking our audiences more questions and asking, hey, was this insight surprising to you, which insight did you find the most interesting? Or what do you think we can, how do you think we can make policy change from these findings and try to open the floor for dialogue, not just being a voice of sharing, but a voice of connecting. I think that's something that we are currently locking and we have the tools to use it. We're just not doing it to the extent. So yeah, we don't need to create the wheel, but prioritize storytelling in a way that engages the audience and maybe even ask a question to them.
00:42:40
Speaker
So it's also a way to kind of go beyond the social media platforms to kind of also physically connect with the people, like meet them, have events. like that works best. Opening the floor for dialogue creates that community, creates those conversations, which eventually will create trust. And yeah, if there are opportunities to meet more people in person, whether it be you know having an after work happy hour on ocean and getting different ocean people together, even if it's not only coastal, but ocean artists and and people who just want to learn more, ah that would be something really fun.
Advice for Aspiring Science Communicators
00:43:17
Speaker
I wish we can see that more often. Of course, everything
00:43:20
Speaker
as a time commitment, but if we get people together, even starting with a small group, it eventually will grow. I'm a big and believer in that. I love the enthusiasm. But what I do want to share on this podcast as we come to this interesting full circle is that I really want people to think about the stories that first connected them to the ocean, what brought you to the ocean, whether it was your childhood there in person or something a little bit more unconventional like me learning through external resources and how you can transcend those experiences to others because I believe that if it worked on you to care surely it will work on someone else to have that same effect because without that initial connection I think it is really hard to peak interest or action in the ocean um even though we do live on a blue planet so
00:44:12
Speaker
Yeah, make that maybe a little bit of your homework today and see how we can inspire. I love how you just jumped into our last segment of the podcast. Liz doesn't even need us. I love this. Because we always end with a little discussion about what advice you would give to a student or a new professional if they're interested to pursue a career or a position that's similar to yours.
00:44:40
Speaker
Yeah, so if you're still a student interested in communications, I would ask yourself, what interests you more? Is it the science or communications? Because if that's what you want to study and spend time in your classes, make sure you choose one that opens your heart more. For me, that was science. But going through the science, I really wanted to make communication more applicable and um accessible. And so I created my own portfolio through the social media videos and through really cool collaborations with high-level networks.
00:45:12
Speaker
so Without having you know the the background experience in communications or marketing, I kind of developed it on my own and was able to present something that shows that I can do this kind of work, and I'm passionate about that kind of work. so If you want to study more communications or videography or media, but you really want to focus it in the science field, in marine science,
00:45:37
Speaker
You know, you can choose to study that, but make sure you also get experiences with maybe internships or NGOs or even diving if you want to go underwater. um It can really go both ways, I think, because both will serve as your own portfolio. Your passions can become your portfolios is what I'm trying to say.
00:45:55
Speaker
which I think is really cool in this time and age. And, um you know, we are researchers, right? We're all scientists here. So don't really wait for opportunities to just come to you. There are so many that already exist. I recommend to take the time and effort to see what's out there if you want to learn more about science communication or about wildlife videography. There's really so many opportunities. There's a surplus, in fact, of different organizations and networks that have grants that have open up positions that are really eager to get new voices and perspectives in this field. Next, I would say to really check in with our own network. I think it's really cool being in the ocean community because I'm pretty sure we all have maybe multiple one or second degree connections. You can check on LinkedIn or just from word of mouth.
00:46:51
Speaker
that we live on a blue planet, but the ocean community is quite small. So we're all very well connected. And if you do have a passion or an interest or an idea to share your story or to share your research in ways that hasn't been done before, then don't be afraid to talk about it. And you'll be surprised how far it can get you and how people can be like, oh, I know this perfect organization. They're working on something similar, and it would be a great connection, things like that. One thing that comes across, and I think it's it's it's a consistent It's a consistent piece of advice that I think regardless of the specific direction of the individuals that we we speak to, it's the passion piece, right? Like you can clearly tell from the moment we started speaking with you, the the the passion that you have for what you do. And I think that's something that we speak to a lot on this show is, you know, if you have that passion, don't be afraid to go that path. And I think
00:47:49
Speaker
we struggled in this coastal field sometimes because people don't necessarily know that the field is there or know that this is something they know it's something they're passionate about, but they don't know that they can make a career in it. And sometimes like for myself, it took me sort of not listening to people that I ah were around me that I respected, that may have tried to steer me away from something I was passionate about because it was more practical.
00:48:15
Speaker
And I really had to fight that and say, no, this is what I'm passionate about. I really want to do coastal engineering. I don't want to do civil engineering. I don't want to do environmental engineering. I don't want to do water resources. Coastal engineering is what I want to do. And so when I said I was going to go to the University of Florida to study that, some people said that was a bad idea. But you know, now this year I will be celebrating my 20th anniversary at Stevens as a professor.
00:48:45
Speaker
And so for me, it was like all about that passion. And hopefully now I'm helping students younger next generation find their passion and continue. So passion, passion, passion. That's my plea.
00:49:00
Speaker
I love that. Congratulations on the 20 year mark, by the way. And yeah, Passion is what keeps us going, especially as scientists is why we do what we do. And I think there really truly is an audience for everything. If you found something super interesting, 100%, there's someone else that did too. So always share your interests and your thoughts out loud.
00:49:21
Speaker
you'll you'll be surprised. And if you want a community that you don't find within your existing area, then you can build it too. Even if you start with two or three people, sure, it'll start small, but you can build a community on coastal engineering if it's not something that's currently available for you.
00:49:41
Speaker
i um When I was in Barcelona, there were already some beach cleanup organizations, but we weren't really reaching public in the ways
Celebrating Creativity in Science Communication
00:49:50
Speaker
I wanted to. I i wanted to beach cleanup to be something more fun, something that people would want to actually get up for on the weekend to do, so I started making these events called Together Living Blue where we would connect with bars or DJs or um even meditation to make beach cleanups more fun and that was so cool. It was a community that didn't currently exist and it did in a different way just focusing on the cleanup part but it wanted it to focus in it focus in a different way and so you can build your own communities as as well and surely and slowly you'll find people who want to support you.
00:50:25
Speaker
I love the creativity that you have in your passion too. You're very creative about everything. That's really awesome. Need to make science more fun. Make it sexy. I love that. That's the key takeaway. Make science sexy. Exactly. I love that.
00:50:42
Speaker
Thank you so much, Liz. And final thing before we close this episode, maybe tell us where we can find you in that, that we know all of these things about you. Of course. um So across all my social platforms, my username is LizLivingBlue. My full name is Elizabeth Share, and please feel free to reach out to me on any platform. I'll be happy to connect and to answer any questions and yeah, make our community in the ocean bigger.
00:51:10
Speaker
And what are those platforms? Sorry, those platforms and include TikTok, Instagram, YouTube, X. And I'm going to go off X honestly and go towards Blue Sky today. so All right. Good to know. Well, thank you so much, Liz. It was really, really truly great to have you today. Thanks for an amazing talk. Yeah. Thank you for having me. I was so happy to be on this podcast and to share science communication with everyone today. Yay. Yay.
00:51:40
Speaker
Thank you for listening again, and we would like to thank the New Jersey Sea Grant for sponsoring today's episode. And we have a little reminder about the ASBBA Coastal Summit that's coming up in March. It's going to to 27th in Washington, DC. Registration is still open, so if you plan on attending, you can go to their website, asbba.art.
00:52:04
Speaker
And lastly, if you have any idea for a future topic or if you would be interested in sponsoring a future episode of Going Coastal, please contact us at podcastgoingcoastal at gmail.com. Thank you. Bye. Thanks for listening. Bye.