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Golden Age Author Ngaio Marsh
262 Plays1 year ago
In today's episode, Brook and Sarah discuss Ngaio Marsh, one of four Golden Age Queens of Crime, playwright, and artist.
Sources
Laura Lippman Tess Monaghan series (1997-2015)
Force of Nature (2018) Jane Harper
A Man Lay Dead (1934) Ngaio Marsh
Ngaio Marsh: Her Life in Crime (2008) Joanne Drayton
"The Secret Life of Ngaio Marsh" (April 3, 2019) Shedunnit Podcast
"Ngaio Marsh Goes Home" (November 17, 2021) Shedunnit Podcast
Murder of Roger Ackroyd (1926) Agatha Christie
Money in the Morgue (2018) Ngaio Marsh and Stella Duffy
The Golden Age of Murder (2016) Martin Edwards
@NgaioMarshAudiobooks on YouTube
Ngaio Marsh telling a story about her childhood
For more information
Instagram: @cluedinmystery
Contact us: hello@cluedinmystery.com
Music: Signs To Nowhere by Shane Ivers – www.silvermansound.com
Subscribe to the Clued in Chronicle or join the Clued in Cartel at cluedinmystery.com
Transcript
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Transcript
Introduction and Listener Suggestions
00:00:12
Speaker
Welcome to Clued in Mystery. I'm Sarah. And I'm Brooke. And we both love mystery. Hi Brooke. Hi Sarah. Do you mind if I share something special before we start today's topic? No, go ahead.
00:00:26
Speaker
So we recently released a workplace thriller episode. And during our talk, we mentioned that it was harder than we expected to find books in that sub genre. Well, our listener Mary E heard our call and emailed us with some suggestions. So she recommends Laura Lippmann's Tess Monahan series. And this is where the main character Tess is a reporter covering the murder beat for a local newspaper.
00:00:52
Speaker
And her other recommendation is Force of Nature by Jane Harper. And this is a mystery about a coworker team bonding experience gone bad. Oh, those both sound great. Yeah, they really do.
Newsletter Announcement
00:01:08
Speaker
And this is a great example of some of the extra little fun nuggets we'll be sharing in our soon to be released newsletter, Clued in Chronicle. So if you'd like to join the waitlist for that, please visit our website.
00:01:21
Speaker
Thank you for that, Brooke.
Nyah Marsh's Life and Background
00:01:23
Speaker
So today we are going to be speaking about Golden Age author, Nyah Marsh. And I'm so excited to share a little bit about her. I knew virtually nothing about her before I started researching for today's episode.
00:01:40
Speaker
Edith Nile Marsh was born April 23rd, 1895 in Christchurch, New Zealand. She was the only child of Henry and Rose Marsh. There is some confusion surrounding the exact date of her birth as paperwork was not filed for four years and apparently Marsh herself claimed occasionally to have been born in 1899. And I read one place that suggested that she actually chose April 23rd as her birth date because that is William Shakespeare's birth date.
00:02:06
Speaker
Although she is perhaps best known outside New Zealand for her crime fiction, theatre and art were also very important to her and feature extensively in her writing. While she was enrolled at an all-girls school, she started studying art at what is now the University of Canterbury in Christchurch, studying full-time after graduating high school. Art continued to be a focus in March's life, and between 1927 and 1947, she had seven exhibitions as a founding member of a New Zealand art collective that remained influential for 50 years.
00:02:36
Speaker
Marsh's parents met as performers in a theater company, and theater would play a role throughout her life as well. She started writing plays while in high school, and in 1916, she followed in her parents' footsteps and joined a touring theater company. She would continue to write, direct, act in, and produce several productions in the UK and in New Zealand until she died.
00:02:59
Speaker
Her father, Henry, had been one of 10 children. He and his brothers left England for the colonies, scattering to Canada, South Africa, and in her father's case, New Zealand. Accordingly, Marsh felt a strong connection to Britain and in 1928 left New Zealand for the UK to stay with close friends. She split her time between the two countries for the rest of her life.
Nyah Marsh's Literary Contributions
00:03:20
Speaker
In 1931, she was living in London, running a home goods shop with a friend when she started writing her first detective novel. This was, as listeners of earlier episodes will remember, a time when Agatha Christie, Dorothy L. Sayers, and other members of the newly formed detection club were enjoying considerable success with their puzzle mysteries.
00:03:39
Speaker
A man lay dead is set in a country house at a weekend party where the guests were invited to solve a fictional murder, a popular pastime that Marsha Self had participated in. Only at this weekend, someone, of course, is really murdered.
00:03:54
Speaker
She submitted her novel to publishers in 1932, but shortly afterward returned to New Zealand to care for her ailing mother. It was published in 1934 and she ultimately published 32 novels between then and 1982 with a 33rd novel published in 2018. Stella Duffy finished it based on three chapters that Marsh had written and her notes.
00:04:17
Speaker
All of her novels feature Detective Roderick Allen, who, like Sayers, Lord Peter Whimsy, attended Eaton, and is aristocratic, but unlike many detectives of the time, is employed as a policeman rather than detecting as a hobby. And he's far more recognizable as an everyman.
00:04:33
Speaker
Most of Marsh's books take place in the UK, although five, including Money in the Morgue, the one that was published in 2018, are set in New Zealand. Through these, she also explores colonialism and the Maori culture, although it's through the lens of a settler.
00:04:51
Speaker
Marsh also wrote several short stories and wrote a column for New Zealand publication on life in London during her first stint in the UK. When she was in Christchurch, she would often give talks on London life, and a few of them were broadcast on radio, which led to her reading one of her novels to radio listeners. A sure fit of lampreys was, she read it in 20, 20 minute segments
00:05:13
Speaker
Her voice was considered to be quite deep, but I found a YouTube clip and it sounded really rich and warm to me, so it would have been, I'm sure, lovely to hear her reading her own work. Marsh was named to the Order of the British Empire in 1948 and then appointed a Dame in 1966. She celebrated in New Zealand for her contributions to art and theatre, but less so for her crime writing, despite her international fame.
00:05:39
Speaker
On one return to London, her publisher arranged for 100,000 copies of 10 of her novels to be printed at the same time, so put a million copies of her books into the market. Little is known about her private life, and she destroyed most of her personal papers before she died. According to her biographer Joanne Drayton, Marsh regretted not being a mother. However, she developed close relationships with her cousin's children.
00:06:06
Speaker
So she never married, although she had a fiance who was killed in the First World War.
Legacy and Impact of Nyah Marsh
00:06:13
Speaker
Naiomarish died in 1982 at the age of 86 in Christchurch, but continues to be celebrated for her contributions to art, theater, and crime writing.
00:06:24
Speaker
Thank you, Sarah. That was wonderful. And I'm like you, I knew zero about Nio Marsh before our research this week and found her to be such a fascinating, like, well-rounded woman.
00:06:44
Speaker
Totally. Yeah. Like she was, she was always doing multiple things, right? She, she wrote, what did I say? 33 books, but was while she was writing her books, she was directing plays or writing plays, painting. Yeah. Just really fascinating.
00:07:04
Speaker
Very active. Because I was such a novice about her, I started by listening to a couple of episodes of She Done It, which is Carolyn Crampton's fantastic podcast about mystery.
00:07:19
Speaker
And she has two episodes about Nile Marsh, if anyone's interested, that are a great overview, I would say. And she refers to the four queens of crime, which Agatha Christie, Dorothy L. Sayers, Nile Marsh, and Marjorie Allingham. So now we're covering up to three, Sarah. We've got one more to go. But I was thinking that in that group,
00:07:44
Speaker
at least we still have to learn about Marjorie Ellingham. But the other two ladies, I would say that writing and authoring was their prime artistry. But with Nile Marsh, like we just said, she was doing so many different creative endeavors. She was just creative in so many different ways, which I think added a certain layer and richness to her mysteries.
00:08:14
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, I think, I get that Christie, she definitely wrote some plays, but I think the impression that I get is that theater was like just a part of Nile Marsh's life, right? Her parents met in the theater. Um, in one of the biographies that I was reading, it said that, you know, she made sure that there was a place for her father in a lot of the plays that she was producing. So even as he was aging, because it was such an important
00:08:42
Speaker
thing to him, she made sure that there was an opportunity for him, even if it was just to be on stage for one scene. Which, you know, I think that just speaks to how important it was to her and to her father.
00:09:00
Speaker
Absolutely. And we've learned that she had a really close, wonderful relationship with her father. I think that she was, you know, to use cliche kind of a daddy's girl. So that is very sweet that she continued to do that. And, you know, that was what she was known for in New Zealand was her theater work, her directing plays, especially, you know, Shakespearean plays much more so than her crime fiction.
00:09:30
Speaker
Yeah, I got the impression that in New Zealand, her writing is almost considered an afterthought, where she really is a celebrity for her theater work. And I think the National Theater is named after her. And she established a theater school, I think. I think I read somewhere that Sam Neill, so he was one of the scientists in Jurassic Park. He studied with her.
00:09:59
Speaker
which is, you know, really neat. Yeah, that's a good point because Nio Marsh lived until 1982. So, you know, you and I were around Sarah. It's very fun to know that this person who, you know, was born in the late 1800s had such a nice long life that people who are still around to contribute to all sorts of creative endeavors knew her and met her.
00:10:25
Speaker
In one of the Carolyn Crampton episodes, one of her interviewees had spent time with Nio Marsh. Her family were friends of that family, and so she could give some first-hand references, and I thought that that was just so great. That's incredible, yeah. I think it's really interesting that she almost had these kind of
00:10:49
Speaker
dual lives, right? Internationally, she was Queen of Crime, and she was a member of the detection club, though not until the 1970s. She attended a meeting in I think the late 1930s, I think it was 1937. She attended one of the ceremonies, and I think it had a lasting impact on her, but she didn't actually get to become a member herself until 1974.
00:11:17
Speaker
Yeah. And I liked the idea that we know that that was the era when Agatha Christie was the president. So she was probably conducting the ceremony that inducted Nio Marsh into the detection club. So I just love that visual. So that meeting that she attended in 1937, I don't think she knew Agatha Christie at the time. I'd like to think that the two of them did develop a relationship after that as Marsh's crime writing became more popular.
00:11:47
Speaker
Yes, I hope so too. That would be such a neat thing to know what kind of relationship those two fantastic women had. I found some fun similarities between the two of them in my research. It was mentioned that Niyomarsh had a similar type of freedom in her childhood where she could run around the grounds of their large
00:12:11
Speaker
estate, and that was similar. Agatha Christie also had that and got to have their imaginary worlds. She also taught herself to read at age four or five, which we know Agatha did as well. And they both
00:12:28
Speaker
had like this impetus to try out crime writing by reading a novel and then saying, oh, I think I could do that. So they gave it a shot. And it's suspected that Nile Marsh actually had read a Christie and wanted to try her hand at it.
00:12:46
Speaker
Well, I would I would believe that because it was the early 1930s and, you know, several of Christie's books had been released by then. So including the murder of Roger Aykroyd. I read a few of her books or listened to a few of her books to prepare for this and actually only just learned. And I'm really kicking myself for not having looked this up earlier. But there are
00:13:15
Speaker
audio versions of several of her stories available on YouTube, including versions that are read by Benedict Cumberbatch. And so he pronounces her detective as Alain, but Wikipedia lists his name as being pronounced as Alan. So I'm not sure who to believe there. Is it Alan or Alain? I would probably read it as Alain just because of the way that it's spelled.
00:13:44
Speaker
But yeah, I will include links to a couple of those, as well as a link to the audio clip that I found of her recounting a story from her childhood. And yeah, she just had this really rich, warm voice.
00:14:03
Speaker
Oh, that sounds great. I definitely want to hear her voice because that's something that comes up again and again is that she had, like you said, this deep, nearly, they describe it as like nearly a masculine voice. So I would love to hear her actual, her actual tone. That would be great. And that's what I, where I found something to listen to of her work. I listened to A Man Laid Dead, which is the first
00:14:27
Speaker
of the Roderick Allen books via YouTube. So that was a great find. And I found her story to be like, like I could tell the influence of the theater. I felt like the dialogue, you know, the dialogue was really believable. And she had great interplay between characters. And I think that that's something that she's known for is
00:14:50
Speaker
better characterization and better use of setting than maybe some of the other Golden Age writers. I have heard it said that her plots aren't as strong as Christy, but come on, whose are? But I really liked the description and the narrative
00:15:12
Speaker
I would agree. I mean, I saw the same kind of, um, suggestion that her work is perhaps a little bit more literary than, uh, some of her contemporaries. I actually listened to, um, Money in the morgue, which is the one that was published after her death. Uh, so, you know, published in 2018, um, Stella Duffy wrote it based on, um,
00:15:39
Speaker
Marsh had written the first three chapters and I guess left some notes in the title of the book and Stella Duffy finished it. And, uh, I, I thought it was great. I really, really liked it. Um, and I would say that I like Nya Marsh's work more than I like Sayers. Hmm.
00:16:05
Speaker
I think I would have to read or listen to more to be able to make that decision because I do really like Dorothy L. Sayers.
00:16:17
Speaker
I see where you were coming from because it is more, I think literary is a great description. I think that her observations about life and people are really astute and I enjoyed that. She can sum up a character in a very succinct way. And I think that that probably comes from her knowledge about drama and theater.
00:16:43
Speaker
she could just in a turn of phrase and you would just know exactly, okay, I have a picture of who that person is and who they're going to be in this story. So I really liked that.
00:16:55
Speaker
Although I didn't get a chance to read Money in the Morgue, I did find a great interview. It's a podcast interview with Stella Duffy, so we can link that as well. And it was about her experience in being chosen to co-author. That's the way it's billed on the book, the book with Nya Marsh. And it's a great interview.
00:17:20
Speaker
kind of talking about that process of what that was like, taking these notes and then trying to fill in the blanks and create the rest of the story. But I also enjoyed it because Stella Duffy is a kiwi, so she really could tell the listeners a lot about what life was like, perhaps in New Zealand when Niall was writing and
00:17:44
Speaker
some of the prejudice I guess that she experienced against being a genre fiction author because we you mentioned earlier that she was really known well for her theater work but commercial fiction just kind of wasn't the thing for New Zealanders and so that was something that she wasn't
00:18:07
Speaker
honored for during her life. And Stella Duffy had a way of really describing that because, of course, she is a New Zealander herself. So that was a great interview. And I think Stella Duffy's background is in theater as well. And so she's got that connection with with Nio Marsh and can really draw on that. I picked that up in in the book as well. Wonderful.
00:18:37
Speaker
There are also on YouTube, although I didn't watch any of them, but I did find them when I was searching, there are some of the TV adaptations of her work. And there hasn't been a lot of screen adaptations of her work, but there was a series in the 1960s and then another one in the early 1990s. And there were some radio adaptations in the 1990s and in 2010, I believe.
00:19:04
Speaker
When we've said this about some of the other authors that we've talked about, I think there is opportunity there for some more screen adaptation of... I really liked her detective.
00:19:17
Speaker
Yes. I completely agree. And I would love to see the, um, because they're adaptations, they don't have to be verbatim of stories as we've, you know, definitely discovered like, let's just have this whole New Zealand thing because I love,
00:19:34
Speaker
You know, I love that to learn more about that culture and that setting would be so fun and something that we don't see a lot, I think in films and television, or enough, maybe we don't see it enough. So I agree. Let's, let's get some adaptations of some Naiomarsh going.
00:19:52
Speaker
Yeah, no, I think, I think it would be great.
Conclusion and Social Media Info
00:19:55
Speaker
Thank you, Brooke. This was really fun to talk about Nio Marsh, one of the four queens of crime. Now we've done profiles on three of them. We still have Marjorie Ellingham to do, uh, which I think will be great as well. Yes. Thanks, Sarah. This was wonderful as usual. And thank you all for listening today to Clued in Mystery. I'm Brooke. And I'm Sarah, and we both love mystery.
00:20:20
Speaker
Clued In Mystery is written and produced by Brooke Peterson and Sarah M. Stephen. Music is by Shane Ivers. If you liked what you heard, please consider telling a friend, leaving a review, or subscribing with your favorite podcast listening app. Visit our website at cluedinmystery.com to sign up for our newsletter, The Clued In Chronicle, or to join our paid membership, The Clued In Cartel. We're on social media at Clued In Mystery.