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21. Writing your Own Dance Story with Linnea Swarting
93 Plays1 month ago
Linnea Swarting is a professional ballerina currently dancing on tour with the Grand Kyiv Ballet. She previously danced with Los Angeles Ballet, Ballet Project OC, Nashville Ballet, and as a principal with Georgia Dance Theatre. She is also a contributing writer for Pointe Magazine and author of the Ballet Writer Blog.
Linnea’s honesty is incredibly refreshing. She doesn’t shy away from talking about the tough parts of her career, including struggles with body image and the disappointment of not getting the contract. We also chat about how she got started writing for the iconic Pointe Magazine as well as our shared passion for making ballet more accessible to all dancers. I connected to Linnea on so many levels and truly resonated with her story - I know you will too!
Key Moments:
- Early dance training [2:13]
- Her transition to a professional dance career [9:01]
- Linnea’s struggles with body image [14:20]
- Navigating her dance career during a global pandemic [27:33]
- Linnea’s perspective shift as she approaches 30 [34:06]
- How Linnea got started writing for Pointe Magazine [40:10]
- Linnea’s passion for making ballet more accessible to all dancers [45:03]
- Her biggest piece of advice for dancers pursuing a career [1:02:16]
Connect with Linnea:
LINNEA’S WEBSITE: www.linneaswarting.com
INSTAGRAM: instagram.com/lswarting
INSTAGRAM: instagram.com/theballetwriter
Links and Resources:
Get your copy of The Ultimate Audition Guide
Set up ticketing for your next event with DRT (Make sure to mention that The Brainy Ballerina sent you!)
Let’s connect!
My WEBSITE: thebrainyballerina.com
INSTAGRAM: instagram.com/thebrainyballerina
1-1 CAREER MENTORING: book your complimentary career call
Questions/comments? Email me at [email protected]
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Transcript
Introduction and Personal Boundaries
00:00:00
Speaker
now I get to talk with younger dancers and I see how what your priorities are is just so different. I have a good understanding of my boundaries and I have a better understanding of how I need to operate in a workplace. I need to be the example that I wanted to see when I was younger. I want to show up and work hard and be respectful and also be smart.
00:00:28
Speaker
you know know what I'm doing, stay on top of everything. All the stuff that I've already been doing, the things that I value about myself, I'm very comfortable with displaying. And I think when I was younger, I was really shy and really self-conscious because I felt like I didn't have anything to offer. And now I'm starting to realize the value that I do bring to the table.
Podcast Introduction and Guest Introduction
00:00:53
Speaker
I'm Caitlin, a former professional ballerina turned dance educator and career mentor. And this is the brand new ballerina podcast. I am here for the aspiring professional ballerina who wants to learn what it really takes to build a smart and sustainable career in the dance industry. I'm peeling back the curtain of professional dance world with open and honest conversations about the realities of becoming a professional dancer. Come along to gain the knowledge and inspiration you need succeed in a dance career on your terms.
00:01:27
Speaker
Hello and welcome to the Brainy Valerina podcast. I'm your host, Caitlin Sloan, and I am joined today by Linnea Swarding. Linnea is currently dancing on tour with the Grand Cave Ballet.
00:01:38
Speaker
She previously danced with Los Angeles Ballet, Ballet Project OC, Nashville Ballet, and as a principal with the Georgia Dance Theater. She's a contributing writer for Point Magazine and author of the Ballet Rider blog. She is also passionate about making dance more accessible to people with disabilities and has spearheaded multiple programs, which we'll chat about today. Linnea, I am so
Linnea's Dance Beginnings
00:02:00
Speaker
excited to talk to you today, and I want to start from the very beginning of your dance journey. Can you tell us, why did you take your very first dance class?
00:02:08
Speaker
Oh, okay, great, great question to start with. I actually took my very first dance class kind of by accident. I was born in Manhattan and then when my parents moved to Connecticut, we moved into a house that was right next to my first dance studio, New England Academy of Dance in New Canaan, Connecticut. And my mom saw all of these kids going into the dance studio and she was like, well, I guess that's where my kid needs to be. And so I took like a creative movement class, I think,
00:02:38
Speaker
at first and yeah, I was probably three years old or something. Did you take to it right away? Were you like in love or were you just kind of like, this is cool. It's close to my house. No, I um i enjoyed it. I did a lot of activities when I was growing up. I think you said this as well. I played sports.
00:02:56
Speaker
and did a lot of other things but ballet was the activity I kept signing up for every year. Like every year we would reevaluate and my parents would ask if I wanted to keep dancing and I was always like yeah. I really enjoyed being in the Nutcracker once I was old enough to do that. Every year I was so excited to do the Nutcracker and honestly I think that's why I kept dancing probably until I got to middle school and then I was like oh I really love this and then I really decided to get more focused and pursue professional career.
Dance Training and Influences
00:03:30
Speaker
And what was your training like? My first dance studio was mostly ballet based. My teachers actually, I think while I was still training there, they completed the ABT teacher training, but they kind of did a blend. My teacher, Gina Ortiz, danced for Dance Theatre of Harlem.
00:03:50
Speaker
So I had a little bit of like the Balanchine influence because she works for Arthur Mitchell. And then actually another one of my teachers, Ted Thomas, was a dancer for Paul Taylor. So he kind of brought in that like modern aspect. And we did a lot of contemporary choreography, but I think like on their website, they said it was a blend of Shiketi and Viganova. So it was kind of a mix of everything. And we were very close to New York, so I had a lot of guest teachers that would come and I really got to experience a lot of different styles at that school, so it was great. And how cool that was just next to your house, like you just kind of stumbled upon this incredible school. I know. Yeah, it was awesome. And I danced there basically until my junior year of high school. So all the way from three to 16, that's where I did the bulk of my training.
00:04:40
Speaker
Okay. And then you went to University of North Carolina School of the Arts. I did. Yeah. I um graduated from their high school program there. So I only did one year there, but it was so fun. I had a great experience there personally. So I got to dance a lot and met some lifelong friends and yeah, really loved. I was about to say I loved being away from home, but obviously I missed my family very much, but I really enjoyed getting to just immerse myself in dance and be surrounded by other students who were really serious about not just dance but the other art forms that are offered at School
University Experience
00:05:20
Speaker
of the Arts. My roommate was in the drama department. I had a lot of friends in drama and it was so great to be surrounded by people that were passionate about the arts like I was because I feel like in my hometown most people were more driven towards academic pursuits and didn't really understand
00:05:38
Speaker
what dance was or that you could even be a professional dancer. I was told several times by guidance counselors at my public school in Connecticut that dance isn't a career, like you can't do it professionally. So it was just nice to go somewhere where people were more on the same page and really respected the craft.
Pre-Professional Choices
00:05:58
Speaker
After you graduated, you went to Boston Valet's pre-pro program, correct? Yes, I did. Yeah. I actually had planned to return to UNCSA for college.
00:06:08
Speaker
Like I left all of my stuff down there in a storage unit and was like ready to move into a college dorm. But I went to Boston Ballet Summer Intensive. That was my second year going to their Summer Intensive and I really loved it. And they offered me to stay for the year. This is where I needed somebody like you because I remember calling my mom and also my coach from Connecticut, Christina Fugundes. I remember calling her up and saying,
00:06:35
Speaker
I don't know what to do. Like, should I go back to college or should I stay at Boston? And everybody I asked, they were like, that's your decision. Like, you have to decide for yourself. I loved Boston so much. The training was so good. And I had some amazing teachers there. The company was just inspiring to watch. And I knew that I would get pushed a lot technically. I was definitely like one of the worst people in my class. So I learned a ton and I think I knew that that was the choice I had to make, but my parents really did want me to go to college, so I'm sure they were a little unhappy at the time. But I was also closer to home, so there's pros and cons, and I think it worked out exactly as it was meant to.
00:07:21
Speaker
That's the stage of life a lot of dancers find themselves at, being torn between going to college or going to a pre-pro program or a company. I think that was good advice that you got that you have to decide for yourself because a lot of times you just have people saying, you really need to do this. You need to do this. And it's like, okay, but what do you really want to do? What's going to help you reach your goals and what feels right, you know, ultimately. And like, that's what I do with dancers. I never say that them you need to do this, yeah but it's like, okay, let's talk through our options and let's kind of figure out what feels right for you. And maybe it's like, okay, if you want to reach this goal, this is going to be the thing that's going to get you closest to this goal. But is that even the goal you really want? Or is the one you think you want? There's so much that goes into it. Yeah, I think at the time, my goal was I want to dance at Boston Valley. So which, you know, was everybody's goal. In terms of
Professional Transition to Nashville Ballet
00:08:10
Speaker
that vision, that was definitely the place I needed to be for that.
00:08:14
Speaker
obviously that was not meant to be. Again, i I really enjoyed my time there. I remember having our like end of the year or like, you know, mid-season meeting with Margaret Tracy, who was the director of the school. And she was like, so where do you want to dance? And I was like, here, obviously. And she was like, no, but like, you know, where are you going to dance? Like we both kind of knew it wasn't going to be.
00:08:40
Speaker
Boston Ballet, of course I was heartbroken, but it was kind of a good question because then I was like, okay, what do I really want in a ballet company? And that ultimately led me to Nashville Ballet. That was actually my first stop after Boston. I had auditioned with the previous artistic director, Paul Vasterling, and had a great class with him. He was actually a classically trained pianist,
00:09:09
Speaker
And he was just super musical and I'm super musical and I feel like we had a lot of like artistic connection. So I ended up going there for the summer. At the time it was set up that if you were being considered for the second company, you had to go for the summer.
00:09:25
Speaker
and so I did that and I actually didn't get second company. I was told a couple things like that my body had changed since I auditioned and I was too stylized from Boston so they felt like they wanted me to focus on my technique. I stayed there as a trainee and it was actually really really a good thing. I did need to work on my technique. It was a difficult moment where I had to like evaluate if I wanted to stay there. or not, but I liked the company. Nashville is a very cool city and I didn't even know that at the time. I just happened to learn that as I lived here. Yeah, I just kind of felt like it was the right thing for me to do. So I stayed in the training program for a year. Then after that, I also did not get promoted to the second company after that season. I guess I was upset and I was doing some auditions. I was offered a traineeship at the Washington Ballet.
00:10:20
Speaker
They ah offered me a scholarship and all of the things, so I took the traineeship at Washington, went there for the summer.
Challenges in Washington Ballet
00:10:27
Speaker
I took that traineeship without meeting the director first, which to anybody that listens to this podcast, I would highly advise against. Even though at the time it was Septim Weber who was a great choreographer and amazing artist, he basically hired me sight unseen because someone else gave me the offer. I went there.
00:10:50
Speaker
He really liked my dancing and liked me as a person, but did not really like my body type, which is is what it is. So after one year there, I danced really great rep. And then I actually ended up going back to Nashville because at that point then in Nashville, they realized that I had some, you know, performance experience. I went and danced for another company. So I went and gained all of that knowledge and then brought it back and I joined Nashville Valley too. So many things that you said stood out to me. First of all, just the transitions you made and going different places and and being okay with being a trainee and saying, okay, I think I do need to get more technique. That's okay. And this will be the next stepping stone for me.
00:11:33
Speaker
And then also that you set about meeting the director and making sure that you have that connection before you go into a company. It can be a little tricky, especially for like the trainee and apprentice years, since there's no like codified ah set of what a trainee is or what an apprentice is. They're all different, different companies. Sometimes it's more part of the school. Sometimes you're more part of the company.
00:11:56
Speaker
it's always a different system. And so going into it, you might be seen by like the school director or something like that. And then you're dancing more at the company and it can be a little bit tricky to decipher all of those different things and figure out what your role is really going to be once you enter in that stage of your career. Yeah. At Washington, the program was more affiliated with the company. Like we basically performed in every company production except for one did the court of ballet in Nashville. It was.
00:12:24
Speaker
more focused on training so after doing all that training for a year I was like man I really miss being on stage that's obviously why I love to dance is to perform and I wanted to do the rep and when I was at Washington Ballet summer intensive a friend of mine and I were standing across the water looking at the Kennedy Center and I think it was that 4th of July we were watching the fireworks over the Kennedy Center and I was like If I get to perform on that stage, I'm gonna be so happy. That was just all I wanted. And I actually think I said when we were standing there, I was like, if I get to perform Swan Lake and Serenade at the Kennedy Center, I think I can retire. And then it happened and I was like, okay, well now I can't retire because that was way too fun. I worked really, really hard to get on stage for those productions. It was not easy for me to get cast by any means.
00:13:21
Speaker
but I showed up every day and really kind of endured a lot from the staff at the time. You know, I've also been back to Washington Valley since I danced there and I worked as the head chaperone at their summer intensive and everybody who's on faculty there is so lovely. The school is amazing. The Amara Reyes and Renaud and Maiev are running the trainee program and the trainees are awesome. So It was really just like not the right fit for me as a dancer at the time but I will say that's a fantastic program. I did have to go through a lot while I was in it but I had some really great experiences and then I got to say okay now I can go to a company that's going to be a better fit where the artistic director and I both have the same understanding of what dance is and what my role is going to be in this company and it was a little bit easier to
00:14:16
Speaker
to go back there after that. Are you willing to talk about some of the difficult experiences that you had? Yes. Sorry, sometimes I i kind of like laugh about it now. So it's definitely not light. So I will say I try not to go too in depth, but I am happy to. Basically, once I signed my trainee contract at Washington one of the staff members, not even artistic staff, but like the front desk person basically told me that I would have to lose weight, like just told me that Sep team wasn't gonna like my body type. He had taught in the school, or like he had taught over the course of the summer intensive and seen me and he saw me perform in the summer showcase and he came up to me and said, he was like, you're a great performer. We were doing this kind of like,
00:15:10
Speaker
cheeky ballet piece and I like winked at him while I was dancing like you know I was just having a good time and he was like I love that about you like you're a great performer and then I went for the year round and most of the faculty just really thought I needed to lose weight and that was not the first time I'd heard that at all of course I'd been dealing with this for a long time but at this point I was 20 and I really was like fighting to get it to a place where I would get a contract. So I just felt like by any means necessary, I needed to lose the weight and I was not eating well. I was exercising a lot. We had a free gym membership was which was amazing and I would be at the gym for like hours a day on top of like our schedule. A good friend of mine and I always joke about this because it was a little bit crazy
00:16:05
Speaker
In retrospect, I look back at photos and all of that, and like I wasn't hardly any bigger than I am now, and now I am a professional dancer. you know So it really was just a matter of like taste, but it changed my perception of myself, and I felt worthless. The good work I was doing, showing up every day, knowing the choreography, being able to go in for anybody who got injured at any time, which is the only reason I got on stage,
00:16:35
Speaker
All of that was meaningless because even after I would go in for someone or do the job I was there to do, which was dance, even if I danced extremely well, they would come to me and say, yeah, your your dancing was great, but you know like it's still your body. We still can't put you on stage and it due to you. Swan Lake was a big debacle. I wrote a piece about this. I was like cast in Swan Lake initially and then uncast right away because I couldn't be put on stage in a tutu, then cast again because so many people got injured, and then uncast again because I was still too fat. Meanwhile, I'm the same size this whole time. It ended up being that we came to the performance, the week of the performance, and I was scheduled to do probably like half the shows, but not opening night because The New York Times was coming to review opening night and I was way, way too big to be at the front of the line, but I was
00:17:32
Speaker
cast to be in the front of the line because I knew the choreography. We come to opening night, or it's like dress rehearsal before opening night and the girl that they hired from outside the company to replace me also got a fat talk that evening of the dress rehearsal and they told her that she was just way too big. And she came to the dressing room and and told me like, yeah, you're gonna do the show tomorrow because they told me that I don't look good in the tutu.
Casting Struggles in Swan Lake
00:17:56
Speaker
And I was like, wow, I'm really sorry, that's that's hard to hear and I totally understand that.
00:18:01
Speaker
She was like, it's okay, I'm like four months pregnant. ah So was like kind of unbothered by it. And I was like, wow, I was a perfectly healthy 20 year old ballet dancer who was replaced by a pregnant woman and still being told I was too big. And then at the end of the day, I did every show. So it was all just kind of like a mental battle. Actually, the first time I got taken out of Swan Lake the same year,
00:18:29
Speaker
I had missed a rehearsal to go to my grandfather's funeral and I told our ballet master, I was like, hey, I have to miss Friday afternoon. I was flying to Sweden and then flying straight back. So I missed half a day of work and she said, that's okay. We don't need you anyway because we were going to take you out because you can't be on stage in a tutu. And I was like, okay, great.
00:18:56
Speaker
Just, I feel like hearing that over and over again, I'm very thankful that I had some good friends while I was there because they were my support system and we would just, again, we would kind of joke about it. It turned into this very dark joke. It was kind of like survival mode. Like we just had to find like some joy in the absurdity of what was going on for all of us. Cause everybody was having their own struggle, especially as trainees or second company, it was like,
00:19:24
Speaker
really hard. Like even at the end of all of that I feel like then when I went on stage and thinking about the times I got to go on stage, Serenad was actually a similar experience for me where I was cast, uncast, cast, uncast, and it got to the point where it was the week of the show. My mom was going to come take the train down and see the show and I was like don't come I'm not going to get to do this because the Stager had cast me but the artistic staff kept on casting me.
00:19:52
Speaker
Someone the day of the show broke their rib in a partnering incident and I was the only understudy who even bothered to show up to the theater. I was the only understudy that came to every rehearsal and knew the choreography because everyone else had given up and I was determined to get on stage for myself but also to prove them wrong and say that I can do this and I can go out there and dance in the core and do it well and my relative weight is unimportant to my dancing.
00:20:22
Speaker
at this moment in time. Like I was healthy and felt strong. And I was, again, one of a very few of that year that didn't get injured. So I knew that I was at the right weight that I needed to be for my body. I feel like every time I went on stage, I was just enjoying it so much because I had to overcome so much to get up there, you know. Yeah, hearing that was really hard because it I could have told that story. Right. I had an incredibly similar experience.
00:20:50
Speaker
my first couple of years dancing professionally, like some of the stories you're telling, I'm like, my gosh, I haven't thought about that in a while, but very similar. No, but I mean, it's just like such the norm, right? And that almost saved me a little bit in the experience because it didn't feel actually personal. Yeah, it just felt like, well, this is just how the ballet world is. And so in that sense, I never went to crazy extremes. like I definitely had some unhealthy habits, but I wasn't pushed to a crazy extreme because I always knew, like you said, like I am healthy. I dance eight hours a day. like right I know that i am I am ready to go on stage and very similar conversations that I had had and costume fittings that were very uncomfortable and I had the same experience of getting cast and like
00:21:40
Speaker
a demi-soloist role by a guest choreographer who came in and cast me. and Then the director of the company didn't realize that I had been cast in that part because she didn't always come to rehearsal a whole lot. and She didn't know until the week of the show and she came to rehearsal and had me in her office to have a fat talk. and It was like, well, what am I supposed to do? The show is in five days.
00:22:03
Speaker
Yeah. you know like ah what At that point, they didn't take me out of it. like They weren't going to recast me. It was a small enough company that that wasn't something that was like easily done. yeah But it was also like, how much weight do you think I'm going to lose in the next five days and still be able to be healthy enough to get on stage and dance? like A pretty challenging, it was like a cardio piece. And like you said, it's like I know so many people that have experienced it.
00:22:29
Speaker
actually men and women. So like regardless of gender, there's such an extreme standard that everyone's held to. I think what was like kind of frustrating to me or like kind of why I can laugh about it is that it seems like the standard is sometimes subjective. When I look back at photos, there were other dancers who were my size at that time and like they weren't getting the same treatment that I was.
00:22:58
Speaker
I don't know why, but like someone just decided that was gonna be the point they were gonna make to me. The lesson they were trying to teach me is you have to look this certain way and like you have to be unhealthy to do this. I don't know, I guess at a certain point, I was just like, you know someone is gonna look at me and see my strengths. There's gonna be a director out there that will look at me and see what I have to offer instead of just seeing my size.
00:23:28
Speaker
or like something that they think is negative. you know And that's something that when I came back to Nashville, I still definitely struggled. you know Obviously, everybody has an opinion on you as a dancer, so that was hard. But again, my director at the time, he did see my strengths. He appreciated my mind a lot. He appreciated what I had to offer, not everybody else did. So I did still experience the casting and uncasting and Well, I don't know if you'll look good in the costume and, you know, whatever that stuff, but he wasn't really the one saying that to me. So it was a little bit easier for me to like power through and know that I was on the right path artistically. I did two years in National Ballet 2 and then I was promoted to apprentice with the company. Apprentice at National Ballet is like, you're basically in the company, you're just making a little bit less money. So I did two years as an apprentice and I danced
00:24:29
Speaker
a lot of really great rep. I did a lot in Western Symphony. I did Big Swans in Swan Lake. I was featured in Paul's Carmina Verana, Nutcracker, like all of these things. You know, we had our meetings in my second year and he offered me another year as an apprentice and I was like, well, why don't you think I can be in the company? And he was kind of just like, well, you're so young, you're so young, you're so young. He had known me since I was 18 coming straight out of Austin Ballet.
00:24:59
Speaker
So I think he would always look at me and see like that kid that came to Nashville for the first time. And so I just like looked at him and I was like, Paul, I'm 24. So I was like, I can't just like wait around forever. Even though I really, really loved the work we were doing, I'm like, I can't just sit here and wait for you guys to decide that I'm ready to get paid for the job I'm already doing. Because all I was asking for was 200 more dollars a week, essentially. The title was meaningless, we all had the same contract. I think he saw like that some of the artistic staff at the time also was kind of like holding me back because of how I looked and personal vendettas, honestly. Then I decided I wasn't going to sign my contract and he was surprised but he was like, you know, it's time for you to like leave the nest. Maybe there is a better fit out there. And that's when I went to Los Angeles Ballet.
00:25:57
Speaker
which was a ah better fit at the time. And I was having a great time at Los Angeles Ballet and then COVID happened. Does the mere thought of audition season make your palms start to sweat? Do you feel completely overwhelmed with getting everything together on top of your regular dancing schedule? I've been there and I totally get it. As dancers, we spend hundreds of hours honing our technique and artistry. But when it comes to figuring out how to put together a resume or what to expect in a professional audition, we're often left to figure it out ourselves. That's why I put together the ultimate audition guide.
00:26:34
Speaker
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00:26:50
Speaker
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00:27:15
Speaker
Then the pandemic happened. We were furloughed. That's when I started dancing for Ballet Project OC, which was great. And I'm very thankful that they employed us during that time because it was very challenging being in Los Angeles during the pandemic. Everything was closed. It was super strict. LA Ballet, they furloughed us, so we were still getting paid. I still have health insurance, which was amazing. Colleen Neary, who was the director or co-director with her husband, she would teach Zoom classes, and I probably shouldn't say this, but I guess it's past, but we would sometimes do in-person classes. We called them illegal ballet classes. It was not illegal, but, you know, we'd like stand all separated and do ballet class for whoever wanted to come in person. But that was a really challenging, I felt like I had finally found a great fit and then this happened. So I was in kind of a bad place, you know, mentally, and I gained some weight.
00:28:13
Speaker
We came back for the next season and Colleen and Thordal told me that I they needed to lose some
Finding Respect at Georgia Dance Theater
00:28:20
Speaker
weight. I think we were doing a ballet I had already done in Nashville and I wasn't cast in it. And I was like, why wasn't I cast in this? And they were kind of like, because the boys can't part in me. And I was like, okay. I was also cast to learn a part in Apollo. And I was like, why aren't I in Apollo? and they were like, because you can't be in a leotard, like the whole thing again. So then I was like, I can't deal, not I can't deal with this because I was ready to deal with it, but it kind of worked out that the company had lost a lot of money during COVID and they let go of a lot of the senior core, which I was. So I was part of that group. They didn't think I would have a partner the following season. So I was like, all right, I'm just going to go somewhere else. This is how I ended up at Georgia Dance Theater.
00:29:12
Speaker
I went to audit audition with my current director, Sherry Davis. After my class that I took with her, we sat in her office and talked for like an hour. And she just really understood what I was looking for. I feel like I will say Colleen Neary at LA Ballet treated me with a lot of respect. She and I got along really, really well. And I was looking for a boss that would just respect me as a person and treat me like a human being. Having seen that in Colleen, I also saw it in Sherry. It was just such like a breath of fresh air.
00:29:41
Speaker
I was just like, this is exactly what I want. I want to just come and dance and have a good time and just act like normal people and not like be crazy. Yeah. I really loved hearing your evolution from students.
00:29:58
Speaker
and trainee who is not really sure what they went out of a career to getting to a point in your career where you are so sure of yourself and so sure of what you do want and what you don't want and just being able to speak that. I love hearing you say that you would say to your directors, why wasn't I cast in this? Why don't I have the contract? Asking those questions because a lot of dancers are too scared to ask the questions. You know, we're like, it's so drilled into us. Don't ask questions, just accept it. If you question too much,
00:30:26
Speaker
Someone else will just take your place. You just feel almost scared that. And I really love the example you're showing of point blank asking why. Thank you. I appreciate that because it's definitely not easy. Again, I had a good relationship with Paul. I had a good relationship with Colleen and I have a good relationship with Sherry. So it's a little bit easier for me to ask the questions, but I'm a very honest person and I'm very straight up, you know, for better or worse, because Sometimes it's better to just not ask questions and go with the flow and like take the hits. But I was saying this to a ah younger dancer who was about to have a difficult conversation of her own. And she was like, I kind of feel bad for questioning anything because I'm just so grateful to have a job. And she said, but the more I think about it, the more I start seeing discrepancies and here's something I want to ask for. and
00:31:21
Speaker
other people are getting it and I'm not, so I need to know how do I get to this place where I can achieve what I'm trying to achieve? And I don't think there's anything wrong with that, so that's what I was saying, but I was like, you know that phrase, born with your eyes open? I've never heard that. I feel like there's some kind of phrase that's like people who are born with their eyes open, like see what's happening in the world. You know what I mean? And I feel like I'm the kind of person that I see what's happening and I want to understand it.
00:31:49
Speaker
So that's really why I ask all these questions and why I point out a lot of discrepancies and also inequities in some of the systems that I encounter. There's nothing wrong with asking a question. I'm not going to demand someone to change or anything. I just feel like if you don't have an answer for why didn't I get cast in this ballet, that tells me everything I need to know. Yeah.
00:32:12
Speaker
And questions are not disrespectful. I think you can go to your director and to have a respectful conversation. yeah And like you said, ask questions and then you have an information you can decide where to go from there. Because if you don't know, maybe it's just like there was somebody else who thought was better. So you know, okay, it's not really me. Maybe I just next time will be my chance or whatever. like that kind of thing. But if it's something like very personal to you, where you're kind of realizing, this might never change, yeah I'm just gonna be here in this situation where they're never gonna really give me my full chance.
00:32:44
Speaker
Then you can make a change. and It's scary and hard to do that. I think a lot of times people don't ask questions because they don't want to know the answer. Right. Right. Because the answer might be something they don't want to hear and then it's going to force them to have to reckon with that. But how much better is it to have the information and and have the power back to be able to make an empowered decision? Totally. And I 100% agree. I feel like.
00:33:03
Speaker
what you're saying about having the power should make people feel better about asking the questions. Especially as a young dancer, like you're trying to set up your whole career and your whole life. You need to have that information. I was gonna say like make some mistakes along the way and like you know you have to pick and choose what you're gonna respond to. I think you have to get as much information as possible in order to have an informed response. Yeah, exactly.
00:33:29
Speaker
How do you feel now as you're you know approaching 30 as a dancer? How do you feel now about your dance scene and about where you're at just as a whole person versus when you're in your early 20s and starting out? Yeah, I know. 30 is a big one for me. I feel like it's a big milestone for a lot of dancers. People start to wind down at that stage. It can feel like this milestone where it's like, this is a big change. In regards to my body, I'm feeling really good, knock on wood. I think actually even though the pandemic was a huge challenge I think having some time where I was dancing a little bit less gave my body some rest because I'm very much the kind of person that shows up every single day of the week and I want to be dancing all the time. So being forced to like pause I think was probably really good for my body. It is interesting because when I was dancing in Nashville I was one of the younger people in the company
00:34:29
Speaker
most of the company had been well established in their careers and had been dancing for a long time. They always kind of gave me that like ah you know you're so young like you don't even know that kind of like energy. I really hated that to be honest but I kind of understand where it's coming from because like I said now I get to talk with younger dancers and I see how what your priorities are is just so different. I have a good understanding of my boundaries and I have a better understanding of how I need to operate in a workplace. I need to be the example that I wanted to see when I was younger. I want to show up and work hard and be respectful and also be smart, you know, know what I'm doing, stay on top of everything, all the stuff that I've already been doing, the things that I value about myself. I'm very comfortable with
00:35:26
Speaker
displaying. And I think when I was younger, I was really shy and really self-conscious because I felt like I didn't have anything to offer. And now I'm starting to realize the value that I do bring to the table when I'm an employee and also when I'm on stage and all of that stuff. And that's so important for dancers because I think a lot of times we do get fixated on the things we hear about ourselves that people don't like or that we don't like. and just knowing, like you said, what your skills are and what you really bring to a workplace is really huge. And all the things you said before, like you're showing up all the time, you're ready to go. You know the choreography and getting opportunities because you're the one who is there and ready to go in and being smart. These things are all so huge for like your longevity and just being able to place yourself in the right place at the right time and being prepared, it opens a lot of doors.
00:36:21
Speaker
It's something, actually this is another thing I learned at Boston Ballet to quote Margaret Tracy again, showing up is 90%. She would always say that showing up is really 90%. I've seen so many dancers who are way, way, way better than me, who did not have a career because they just like wouldn't come to class or they, or they're mentally not showing up, you know.
00:36:45
Speaker
I've had to do so many like self-assessments and like the one thing I can consistently say about myself is like I might not be able to turn but I can show up. You know what I mean? Like I can be there and learn the choreography and be consistent. That is a big strength that I'm very grateful for. And again as you get older I feel like it's even more important because I was about to say who at 30 is really out here doing tricks, but that's not true. You still have to be able to do the tricks. And I actually should say to you that I think making the move to Georgia, I've
00:37:21
Speaker
gotten a lot stronger in my technique. I don't know if it's because I'm also teaching and that helps me see it in a different way or getting the opportunity to do principal roles now instead of just being in the core. It's giving me back artistic freedom, which I had when I was younger. I remember working with my coach in New Canaan. She also, she danced for ABT in San Francisco and had a little bit of that, like,
00:37:49
Speaker
Balanchine Flair, she like taught me, I was gonna say how to be musical, but like how to play with the music and taught me about how musicality can really make you stand out and be such a source of joy when you're dancing. Really within the last like two years, I've allowed myself to take that back because musicality is another strength that I have.
00:38:17
Speaker
I'm just like every single day is an opportunity for me to dance. I'm getting older. I'm going to have less of them. So I need to take advantage of the skills that I have and enjoy them while I can do it. Letting myself have play in the studio, like not being afraid to mess up. And when you're a soloist or a principal, it's a lot easier because you're not just like all trying to do the arabesque on the same count.
00:38:45
Speaker
you can actually express yourself. So that's been really, really great. I also have a coach in Georgia who I met at National Ballet many years ago, but she has her own studio in Georgia, Mania Barato, who is absolutely lovely. And she was actually the first Filipina prima ballerina, which is a very cool fact about her.
00:39:11
Speaker
But she danced into her 40s and I told her you know that I was nervous about turning 30 and she was like, oh, 30 is the best. Being in your 30s is the best because you can finally physically understand what's happening in your body and then you're unblocking a new side of your mind and you have maturity and you have intellect that you didn't have when you were 20. That gave me some hope and I'm really excited about it.
Dancing in Her 30s
00:39:38
Speaker
I love that. Yeah, exciting things still to come. Yes, absolutely. I love to shift into talking about your writing and working as a writer for Point Magazine and how did you get started in this role? Oh my gosh, it is a crazy story. Actually, my dad gets a lot of credit for this because I had just started dancing at LA Ballet. We had like a long layoff where I came home and he was like, you need to get another job.
00:40:07
Speaker
I you know had been just like kind of doing odd jobs and he was like you need to get like a remote job or you know something else that you can do during your layoffs that you can focus on. I didn't go to college so I was explaining to him that you know at this time it's 2020 you have to have a college degree to like get any kind of job that's meaningful and he was like well What if you just sent emails to people? What if you just sent emails to jobs that you were interested in? Maybe they'd give you a chance. And I was like, it is not the 80s. It doesn't work like that anymore. Anyway, I sent an email to Amy Brandt.
00:40:42
Speaker
my editor now, and I was like, hey, I really wanna write for Point Magazine. And she was like, great, can you send me some writing samples? I wrote a fake article, just came up with a concept and like made up fake quotes. And I was like, hey, I haven't done this before, but I've been reading Point since I was a kid. I know the tone really well. So I was like, here's an example of something I might write for Point. And she was like, okay, great, like that sounds good. That was, again, it was like January of 2020.
00:41:13
Speaker
So my first assignment was in March writing about how the shutdowns were impacting dancers. I usually write a piece like every two months. Right now with my schedule it's a little bit intense because I'm teaching and doing a lot of other admin work in addition to my dancing so my time is pretty limited but I do have Thursdays off and that's the day that I usually spend focusing on sending emails, interviewing people,
00:41:39
Speaker
writing all the stuff, making the edits. And I really owe a lot to Amy because she's taught me a lot on the job. And I'm so thankful for that. And it's an opportunity that I can't even believe that it happened. And it's been so fun. And I love it. That's so cool. And what a good example of if you don't ask, the answer is always no. So send the email. Yeah, that's my approach in ballet for sure. Like I'm that person that goes to every audition just to see what happens.
00:42:06
Speaker
i don't know why I didn't apply that to just like normal life, but that was a wild turn of events, but it's been good. And now my parents are back on the train that they want me to go back to school and get a degree for like writing or journalism. And they're like, this could be your next career. And they're not wrong. That might be something that I do when I retire. Yeah, there's so many options. Yeah. What's been one of your favorite pieces that you've worked on? Oh, that's tough. Sometimes I get to pitch Like I pitch my own ideas too, so those pieces are usually really interesting to me. I did a piece a year or two ago that was kind of like tips for how to have a successful partnership that's safe and professional and effective, which was really great. My sources for that article were so cool. I don't know. I feel like every time I'm working on something, I get really excited about it. One of my most recent interviews was for a recurring segment that I'm writing on PointPlus, which
00:43:03
Speaker
is called My Daily Routine, which is fun because I just get to listen to a dancer and describe their daily routine. And that's been really cool too. My most recent one was with Megan Fairchild. You know, she's iconic. So hearing her daily routine, I was just like, man, this woman is...
00:43:20
Speaker
a powerhouse, not only as a dancer, but as a mom and as an author and all of the other things that she does. I get really, really inspired by the people I get to talk to. To answer your question, I don't think I have a favorite piece. I think I've just been kind of taking each one as it comes and learning a ton from each person that I talk to, which is really, really cool.
00:43:41
Speaker
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Speaker
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Speaker
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00:44:36
Speaker
Okay. The last thing I really want to pick your brain about before we wrap up is your background in adaptive dance.
Journey into Adaptive Dance
00:44:42
Speaker
And I actually really love this because I also went to the Boston, LA adaptive dance teacher training program, oh my yeah and I taught adaptive dance for like five or six years. And I don't currently, but I adored it. I loved it. And I have such a passion for it as well. So I'd love to hear how you got started in that.
00:44:57
Speaker
I also love it and it's been a really cool journey because it's something I'm really passionate about is making ballet specifically more accessible to all dancers and all audiences. I think this idea started for me when I was still living at home. My older brother has autism and is very into music, like classical music. So he would always be listening to classical music and I would always be going to the ballet studio and I was kind of like,
00:45:25
Speaker
I wonder if he'd be interested in dancing at all. I was also a Girl Scout when I was a kid. So when I thought about what I might do for my Gold Award, that was a project. Starting an adapted dance class for students with disabilities was something that was on my list. But then I ended up going to North Carolina and didn't really have time. So the thought kind of left my brain until I went to Boston. And then I saw their adaptive dance program.
00:45:51
Speaker
which was started by a physical therapist and then also Sarah Roth, who was dancing in the company at the time that I was in school. And I remember talking with her about it. She was really inspiring to me also. She was a dancer that was so smart and showed up all the time. And she turned down a promotion so she could focus on Boston's adaptive dance program. And I was just like, wow, this is someone who's really passionate about this. That always kind of stayed with me.
00:46:18
Speaker
So then when I saw that they offered the teacher training at Boston Valley School, I think it was the summer before my first year as an apprentice in Nashville, I went and did it. Nashville Valley had the resources to create a program like that. And while I was at the teacher training, I met a physical therapist who wanted to start a program like this in Nashville. We instantly connected, we were like same age, and we were like on the same flight back to Nashville or something. We were like, this is just like fate, you know?
00:46:47
Speaker
We launched our pilot in like the spring of 2018. Then the following year we were able to get funding so all of our students could be on scholarship. We had 40 students at that time and we were able to, through a grant from the Predators Foundation, we were able to get them all on scholarship which was awesome. And then I left to go to LA Ballet and I was like so heartbroken that I was leaving behind this program that I started because It was really fun. And I also saw the path at National Ballet from how that program could expand and not just be a separate class for students with disabilities, but to maybe train other staff members of the school in how they could better accommodate students with disabilities kind of across the board.
00:47:36
Speaker
And now the adaptive dance program in Nashville performs in the spring showcase and they're kind of trying to bridge the gap. And it's something I still kind of advise on. I was bummed to leave at a time where I saw that there was so much potential for growth. And I knew that my co-founder, Hannah, she could not make that growth happen alone. She was starting a family and like, I was kind of the dance person that would like pick the battles with the dance stuff. She was the science person.
00:48:04
Speaker
So I knew that leaving at that time was going to be difficult, but then when I got offered my job in Georgia, my boss saw that I taught this class in Nashville and she was like, oh, you know, we started a program like that and then COVID happened, so we haven't got it back up and running. Is that something you'd want to take on? And I was like, absolutely. So now I teach our Dance Without Limits program. I will also say that doing that kind of teaching in the South is really different.
00:48:34
Speaker
at Boston, I feel like, I mean, that program had so much support from the very beginning and people were so excited about it. And starting both of these programs in the South, I don't mean this in a controversial way, but it's just a different mentality around disability and what it means and providing access to people. There's still a lot of stigma around that in the South. It's kind of baffling to me, to be honest. I guess doing all that work down here has led me to meet a lot of disabled advocates and other people who work in disability access based nonprofits. That is really cool because it's a very close knit network. All of this is to say that I'm really, really happy that I have had the opportunity to kind of like start some of these programs up. But my ultimate goal would be that this program is a stepping stone for increased access
00:49:33
Speaker
to a dance studio or a dance school as a whole and then a dance career as a whole. You can't just have one inclusive class and then there's no growth. Right now I'm working at GAD with kind of like more of a pathway to, you know, get performance opportunities and take more structured and intense ballet training, but make it accessible to people that want it.
00:49:58
Speaker
No, I totally get it. um like Adaptive dance programming is so new. It's not really that new, but like it's slow to spread because I think people feel nervous because they want to do it right. right If you don't have someone like you who's like, I've got this, schools or companies feel nervous about starting a program and not being able to like see it through. Classes, like you said, are very much like once a week. We come in and we do our class, which is really cool and amazing for a lot of dancers, but there are definitely dancers who might want to take it further. And there isn't as much of a transition period there because I have seen dancers who I've taught in an adaptive dance setting, who I've been kind of recommended go into a different class, like go further. Yeah. And then struggle in that class because the teacher maybe just isn't trained on ways to support them the best way they can. And so then they get frustrated and then they quit. I totally agree that while it's nice to have this just one class, if we could train teachers to be able to work with dancers
00:50:54
Speaker
across the board, then we could see more growth. As far as the dance education field goes to begin with, most of us aren't trained in best education practices, childhood development, let alone working with a dancer who has a different need and needs more support in a certain way. yeah A lot of us just know dance. I've had a lot of similar experiences to what you're describing and it is really frustrating because I'm like, man, if this teacher just like,
00:51:21
Speaker
gave a warning that they were going to play loud music. This whole experience would have been totally different. Yeah, it is something that could be solved with more teacher training just for everybody across the board. And honestly, I think that's going to happen. I think that people are realizing that it's a need now. Like I said, I think being in the South It's a little bit different, because I'm seeing that it's more delayed here than it is where my parents are. My brother has so many programs that he goes to, and there's dance classes he can go to, and there's all this stuff. And in Georgia, it's a little bit slower to catch on. But it's still needed. like Every parent that I talk to, every student that I have that wants to dance, there's nowhere else for them to go. So they're all you know excited. like They want to be there. As with many problems in dance, it's more of a societal issue.
00:52:12
Speaker
that I'm like, I can't teach people to be accepting as a whole, but I can teach my dance studio that we can accept dancers of all abilities. You know what I'm saying? Yeah.
Making Dance Accessible
00:52:24
Speaker
Yeah. You have to start somewhere. And I do think learning to teach an active dance and working with therapists, because our program was similar. We worked hand in hand with physical therapists and then other teachers from the local schools. I like learned so much from them and everything I learned, I was like, this applies to everyone. The strategies that we use, I'm like, I also like to have a schedule. I also like to have warning when things are gonna happen or like, I also get nervous I'm going to a new place, I don't know what's gonna happen. So like, I like a social story. I like being able to go online and be like, this is what it looks like and things like that that we use, we all could benefit from them.
00:52:59
Speaker
Absolutely. This makes you just a better educator, a better person as you go throughout the world and just realizing like what people are going through. And some of us just mask it better than others. But we're all having these issues that we need help with. There's so many strategies we can use in whatever setting we're in. Yeah, absolutely. I guess that kind of goes back to being able to ask difficult questions and being honest about what you need. I feel like if someone comes to me as a teacher and asks for an accommodation, I'm more than happy to do it.
00:53:28
Speaker
But as a teacher, it's my responsibility to notice when somebody needs an accommodation. In ballet, since it's just such a traditional setting, people are masking what they need. They're afraid to ask for what they need. They're just doing their best to blend in with everybody else, and not everybody has the same needs. I'm happy when my students ask for me to repeat a combination or to do it with the music or something because I'm like,
00:53:54
Speaker
I'm so proud. I think as a student, I never asked for anything. And I'm like, I'm so happy that you guys can just ask for help when you need it. That's just a universal thing. I am super passionate about all of the accessibility work that I'm trying to do. I'm really happy that so many companies have made progress. Like you're saying, it's definitely slow, but I'm seeing that it's it's happening. Also, I guess with social media, I've been really thankful to see a lot of disabled artists and different, again, I guess like advocates that talk about their experience. That's been really cool. And I think that everybody should go and find all of those artists and dancers who have disabilities and just have a totally different perspective on the dance world. Well, like you're saying, it's different, but it's the same because we're all struggling with a lot of aspects of it. But with the stigma around disability,
00:54:50
Speaker
slowly coming down depending on where you are. A lot of people are being honest about their life as a teacher and as someone that wants more people to experience dance. It's very helpful to hear that because I'll never truly understand what the disabled experience is like except from for my perspective. So the more input that I have from like the students that I teach in that realm and like their families and all of that, the better.
00:55:18
Speaker
Yeah. And like you said, the more people talk about it, the more the stigma breaks down and the more we start to come into this next generation of people who are not going to sit there and say, Oh, well, you have a disability. We can't work with that immediately. There's definitely things we can do to make sure that you can be successful and you could have a career in this. This doesn't like automatically disqualify you, but it is wonderful to hear you and and just knowing that you're creating the safe space for your students.
00:55:45
Speaker
like you said they are comfortable talking to you and telling you what they need and I feel the same way like I also have that same sense of just joy when I know my students are comfortable with me and they can tell me things like I actually had this semester a really good experience with my advanced class because I haven't had them since they were little, right? So I'm like going into this class and I'm giving them, you know, a more advanced class. And at some point I had a combination with beats in it. And they, one of my students was like, I don't know how to do beats. It's something people just say to do. And I'm like, Oh my gosh. Okay. Yeah. Like let's go back to the beginning of course. But I know that that's hard to say because you want to fake it till you make it and just try to do it. And I was just so proud that I was like, Oh, I feel so good that you were able to say to me, I don't know what I'm doing.
00:56:27
Speaker
Yes, I teach our company levels. We have like a student company as well. I guess the youngest of that group is probably like 12, 11 and 12, like up through high school. I've been teaching kind of the same group of kids for two years. So this year they knew a little bit better. But last year I remember every time I give a combination, I'm like, okay, do we have it? Do we have it? Like, are there any questions? If it was too advanced, they would try to do it and fake it. And I'm like, no, you just are not understanding what I'm asking you.
00:56:57
Speaker
if the combination is has something in it that you can't do, I would much rather just talk about it before we try it. Yeah, I feel like it's been interesting. I talk about this with another friend of mine who is also a dance teacher. I mean, she teaches more contemporary dance, but we both kind of teach that high school age and we both went to UNCSA together. I see like what I thought as a student of my teachers. you know I thought that I could never ask them any questions.
00:57:25
Speaker
you know, yeah, I wanted to look like I knew what I was doing. And we both as teachers are like the ones who ask the question beforehand. They know what they're doing. Like I have so much respect for that. Just like the honesty and the vulnerability that comes sometimes when you're in a room full of people and you are the one that raises your hand and you're like,
00:57:46
Speaker
You know what, Miss Linnea? I actually need to hear that with the music because what did you just say? And knowing that, probably everyone else is thinking the same thing. Yeah. They're all thankful that you asked the question, but it can be hard to be the brave one and raise your hands. Yeah, because that's how I am as a dancer. And again, maybe it's, you know, being on the older side of my company and all of that stuff that I'm like, if we're working on choreography, and we all have the same question, like, I will ask it because We're all there to do what the choreographer is saying, and it's just better to clarify. And there's nothing, absolutely no shame in asking a question.
00:58:21
Speaker
I've never heard a student ask a question that I'm like, you should be embarrassed, you know? I mean, sometimes I get questions like, do you have a cat or something like that? And then I'll be like, well, this is a question for later. Yeah, but i I agree. I feel like when I was at school, we would always ask questions to try to like derail the teacher. Like we start out their career or something. And my students don't do that. But obviously they should because I can sit here and talk for an hour about it.
00:58:51
Speaker
Mine too, and then you'll just ask yeah, and then I'm like, wait, I know what you're doing. I did this. Like, wait, wait, wait, now we're doing Adagio. Yeah. It's so funny, though, because I'm like, yep, it's not so different from when we were training, you know, we all do the same, we go through the same stuff. And, but I do see so much growth in the industry and everyone I talked to,
00:59:12
Speaker
and having these conversations for the podcast. like Every time I talk to someone, I'm just filled with so much hope for the future of our industry because I just know what's coming yeah and where we're where we're going within. Yeah, I totally agree. I feel like I'm getting to the point in my career where my friends are, again, they're teaching, they're running studios, they're running ballet companies, like seeing people that I danced with starting to be the leadership that I wanted. Every time one of my friends gets a promotion or gets to a place where they get to kind of make a change, that we wanted to see. I am so proud of them and I'm so happy that we are not going to be the generation of people that inflicts the same trauma onto the dancers of today. We know that we can do better and we're actively trying to do better. Yeah, and we're still going to make mistakes, but we're yeah really trying. and I feel like social media and the internet kind of forces you to be honest because anybody can fact check you at any time.
01:00:12
Speaker
I feel like maybe this generation will have more of a sense of there's no point in trying to pretend that you know what you're doing or like there's no point in trying to pretend that you have it all together. And when you make a mistake, you can apologize and own up to it and learn from it, but it's not worth staying in the same cycles over and over and over again. And just doing things because you're a teacher did it or doing things just out of routine instead of actively choosing what's going to be best for a room full of students or a room full of dancers. Yeah, it's cool. Sorry, I could talk about that forever too, because yeah it's... My friend Paige and I, we always have these like really long phone conversations where we talk about the future of dance and like teaching and all that stuff. And at the end of all of it, it's like, we could talk about this forever, but it's more of a systemic, we all gotta be on the same page and like work to make this art form inclusive and relevant.
01:01:12
Speaker
adjusting our teaching style with the times, you know? Yeah. And as we know more and we learn more about best practices and all those things, we're just and incorporating those things. And it's really cool to see an eye with you. I could talk about this forever, yeah but yeah maybe we need another episode to like go even more into it. But before we wrap up, I just want to ask you one last question. I would love to hear the most important piece of advice you would give to dancers who are pursuing a professional career.
01:01:42
Speaker
Wow. Big question. Best for last.
Advice for Dancers
01:01:46
Speaker
Okay. This is something that my teachers said to me. And like we talked about before, it is relevant to a lot of different areas of life. But my teachers told me, take advantage of every opportunity. They were referencing, go to every single audition. Like, even if you don't think you're going to get it, just go. If you have the chance to take a masterclass with someone, just go and do it.
01:02:10
Speaker
And they said that to me before I went to UNCSA and I showed up at UNCSA and I took incredible master classes and auditioned for every company and every show. And I learned so much from that. Like we did like a Cirque du Soleil master class. I did like Gaga. I feel like you don't want to put yourself in a box and just say, okay, well I'm trying to dance.
01:02:35
Speaker
at ABT, so I'm like only going to do ballet and all this stuff because the art form is ever changing and you as a human are ever changing. It's important to stay curious and to stay open to new experiences when an opportunity presents itself. If you're in a position to take it, you should take it. And every challenge and every audition or every scary thing that comes up is an opportunity. So I guess not to be afraid of what might happen, but be curious about what might happen. Yeah, that's really good advice. I love that. Can you tell us where to find you? If anyone would like to get in touch with you or read some of your work, where can we find you? Yeah, okay. So I do have a website. It's w www.linneaswarding.com. My blog is up there on Instagram.
01:03:26
Speaker
My username is Elle Swarding. I also have an Instagram page for my writing specifically, so you can just go there and find all the articles that I've written. And that's called The Ballet Writer. Perfect. Thank you so much for taking the time today. And for all of your insight, it's always so refreshing to talk to somebody who, like I said, is really just going to be the future of this art form and hearing it all of your stories and being so honest and transparent is really helpful for dancers. And I just really appreciate it of you.
01:03:56
Speaker
Thank you. I'm appreciative of you too. A lot of my students who are pursuing professional careers look at your work and the work that you're doing to help dancers with navigating this field is so important. And I think this podcast is amazing and it's going to be so helpful. So I appreciate you having me on and I'm really humbled, honestly. Of course. Of course. You're the best. Thank you so much. Thank you.
01:04:23
Speaker
Thank you for tuning into the Brainy Ballerina podcast. If you found this episode insightful, entertaining, or maybe a bit of both, I would so appreciate you taking a moment to leave a rating and hit subscribe. By subscribing, you'll never miss an episode. And you'll join our community of dancers passionate about building a smart and sustainable career in the dance industry. Plus, your ratings help others discover the show too.
01:04:49
Speaker
I'll be back with a new episode next week. In the meantime, be sure to follow along on Instagram at The Brainy Valorina for your daily dose of dance career guidance.