Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
The Practical Path to Authority: How Real Experts Earn Influence
0 Plays2 seconds ago
Should you start a podcast? Find out: https://aidrivenmarketer.com/pod
In this AI marketing podcast episode, Dan Sanchez unveils his "30-30-30" blueprint for becoming a thought leader. If you've ever wondered how to actually grow your authority in a niche without spending years doing it, this episode breaks it down into a simple (not necessarily easy) system: read 30 books, interview 30 experts, and publish 30 content pieces on a single topic. Dan and co-host Ken Freire talk through the step-by-step approach and why it works so well, especially for marketers looking to stand out.
My Favorite AI Tools:
- Tella - https://danchez.com/tella
- High Level - https://danchez.com/highlevel
- Zencastr - https://danchez.com/podtools
- n8n - https://danchez.com/n8n
Resources Mentioned:
- ChatGPT Deep Research Mode – https://chat.openai.com/
- AIDrivenMarketer.com/pod Assessment – https://aidrivenmarketer.com/pod
- Google Alphabet Soup Keyword Method – https://www.google.com/
- Reddit – https://www.reddit.com/
- Quora – https://www.quora.com/
Timestamps:
- 00:00 – Why everyone secretly wants to be a thought leader
- 01:55 – The case for becoming a student before becoming a teacher
- 03:00 – What is the 30-30-30 plan?
- 04:30 – How to pick a niche topic (and why it matters)
- 05:48 – Why reading all the books is the first step
- 07:26 – How Dan accidentally became an authority using this method
- 10:00 – Alternatives to reading (and why books still matter most)
- 14:00 – Skimming smarter: how to speed up your book intake
- 16:30 – What to do if you don’t like reading
- 18:00 – What counts as a "niche"? Defining the right scope
- 19:22 – Sequencing: reading, interviews, then content
- 20:00 – Why interviews are key to deepening expertise
- 21:43 – The low bar of becoming an expert (and why few people reach it)
- 25:15 – When to start sharing: Day 1
- 27:00 – Should you podcast or write? (Pick your medium)
- 28:46 – How to interview without starting
Recommended
Transcript
Intro
The Path to Thought Leadership
00:00:05
Dan Sanchez
Everybody wants to become an authority. Everybody wants to become a thought leader. Even if they don't say they do, we all secretly do because it's kind of the best thing in marketing, right? If people know, like, and trust your expertise, well, it's just a lot easier to do marketing.
00:00:22
Dan Sanchez
And I, couple of years ago, I went on a journey. I went on a hunt to find the best path to becoming said thought leader. I'm like, i'm going to figure out this process. Maybe I can help myself and maybe I can help help other people.
00:00:33
Dan Sanchez
actually went and read every single book there was on the topic and I couldn't really still find a clear path. So in this episode, i actually want to share the exact...
00:00:44
Dan Sanchez
plan that developed for myself have implemented a few times and have helped other people implement in order to help you become that authority. And it seems like it would take a long time. It doesn't take as long as you would think. And most people actually don't take the time to take these few tiny steps that you could probably get done in six months and walk out the other side with more authority than you've had in the last five
Introduction to 'Own the Show' Podcast
00:01:07
Dan Sanchez
years.
00:01:08
Dan Sanchez
So Welcome back to the AIGervarMarketer. This is the Own the Show segment where we're actually doing a whole podcast to book around Own the Show.
Building Authority Through Learning
00:01:20
Dan Sanchez
I'm Dan Sanchez. I'm joined by my co-host, Ken Frere.
00:01:24
Ken Freire
What's up, bro?
00:01:26
Dan Sanchez
And I want to just dive right into it because this framework has been fire. It's so simple. It isn't necessarily easy, Ken, but I find that every time I do it, it's just kind of like, yep, this is the path. This is, this is, these are the drills. These are the things that I need to do in order to gain some influence on this particular topic.
00:01:47
Dan Sanchez
So in the last couple of episodes, we've talked about the importance of becoming an authority. In the last one, we talked about the importance of becoming a student and kind of taking the low road in order to actually pull down people's BS meters, you know, their skepticism, pull it down,
00:02:02
Dan Sanchez
become an authority, teach them just what we're learning on our path of of being a student. But there's a particular order in which you can actually be a student
The 30-30-30 Plan Explained
00:02:11
Dan Sanchez
that's very practical. It's actually really, it's simple, not easy. It's simple.
00:02:17
Dan Sanchez
But when I explain it to people, they get a little lost on it because it seems like it can be like overwhelming. But it's actually much simpler and way more straightforward than I would ever, ever
00:02:27
Dan Sanchez
It's six in the morning.
00:02:28
Ken Freire
Haha.
00:02:31
Dan Sanchez
But I promise it's way more straightforward than it first sounds. But first, let me give you the overview, Ken. And you've heard me say this before, that the best path to being a student to building authority is to do what I call the 30-30-30 plan, which is to find a niche topic that And then read 30 books on that topic.
00:02:52
Dan Sanchez
Interview 30 experts on that topic in a podcast. And then write 30 blog posts on that topic, answering the most frequently asked questions when it comes to that particular
Choosing and Committing to a Niche
00:03:04
Dan Sanchez
niche.
00:03:04
Dan Sanchez
So that's the plan. It seems like a lot. It's actually very doable in a six-month period. Maybe a year-long period. Depends. And the numbers, the 30 part, that's just kind of like wishy-washy. Like there's some niches that only have like 12 books written on the topic.
00:03:23
Dan Sanchez
if you If the niche has more than 30 books, then it's not niche enough. That's kind of how I define how big a niche should be. Like if you try to do marketing, well, marketing has well over 30 books written on the topic.
00:03:34
Dan Sanchez
Go down. You might have to go down two more times for marketing in order to find a topic that really only has, you know, 15 to 30 books written ever on that topic. or at least that are credible. I'm sure with AI, this gets harder because the book scene is going to blow up.
00:03:50
Dan Sanchez
And then do the 30 interviews. And then even I've come to, I've loosened up on the blog posts because I kind of created this plan back when I was in the SEO blog posts, you know, and usually write SEO blog posts to answer frequently asked questions.
00:03:58
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:04:01
Dan Sanchez
I'd say you could also just record 30 unique episodes on a podcast these days. so The whole point of the plan is to grow in your expertise. Remember, we're being a student.
00:04:12
Dan Sanchez
But it also paves the way for other things. Because if you do the 30-30-30 plan and you read all the books, you're essentially learning everything that's been said on the topic, on a niche topic.
00:04:26
Dan Sanchez
And it mirrors a lot like what students do as in a PhD program, right? They got to read all the information in order to find the spot that doesn't have the contributions yet. But you don't know what those blind spots are until you actually like take inventory of all the other published ideas people have had on the topic.
Creating Content and Gaining Authority
00:04:44
Dan Sanchez
you could do the same thing. It's like the foundation you have to do. It's important to read all the books and then actually talk to all the experts because chances are the books are the summaries. The books are the main nuggets, but there's always nuanced questions or misunderstandings you have, which is why it's important to actually read the books and then talk to the experts, get a different, whole different level of expertise, learn the material farther Socratically.
00:05:09
Dan Sanchez
But this is where it starts to phase into you actually becoming an authority. Even if you already know all the information, even if you're already an authority, even if you've already read most of the books, going through and making sure you've read all the books always ensures that you can then start publishing information and about what you're learning from new books, what you're doing with these experts.
00:05:29
Dan Sanchez
Also, interviewing the experts gives you a chance to kind of be associated with said people.
00:05:35
Ken Freire
Thank
00:05:35
Dan Sanchez
People will start to be like, oh, he's hanging out with so-and-so. he's hanging out with her, with him. And you start to build that association. It's part of building authority. And then writing about it, of course, i don't know.
00:05:48
Dan Sanchez
There's something about writing, right, specifically. i mean, I like podcasting, but writing about it in particular is very helpful because it really cements what you're actually thinking, what you're actually learning in the process of teaching it and communicating it.
00:06:01
Dan Sanchez
And that's why colleges have you write papers. But you don't have to write academic papers, you know, those college papers that your professor even hated reading.
00:06:07
Ken Freire
bore you to death. yeah
00:06:11
Dan Sanchez
where you were like regurgitating stuff. No, you can actually write in the way that humans actually read. You're not going to be forced to stick to APA or whatever format you were sticking to. Just write like a human and communicate the idea to answer the question.
Success Stories with the 30-30-30 Plan
00:06:23
Dan Sanchez
And that's the 30-30 plan in a nutshell. I've used it multiple times. Like again, i i think I said this on the last episode. I figured it out an accident doing it for a particular topic, not thinking I would become an authority on it. But then people started coming to me with questions and started acting as if I had expertise on the topic, even though I'd sprint sprinted through the 30-30 plan in like a 30-day period, more like a six-week period, but still.
00:06:50
Dan Sanchez
and since then I've done it multiple times on multiple topics and it's worked pretty well every time. And now I'm here at the AI driven marketer and I'm two years in to be really trying to master. That's my journey, trying to master AI
00:07:06
Dan Sanchez
it's worked well. Like people invite me to come up on stage. I get invited to events and speak on podcasts, contribute to books. and And some people might say that i I've become an authority on it.
00:07:17
Dan Sanchez
I'll let other people say it though. It's to me, I'm still on a journey of masterings. I still have
The Lifelong Learning Journey
00:07:21
Dan Sanchez
so much more to learn. So many more books are being written on the topic now than when I first started that I'm still reading and catching up with. So can I've been talking for a while now?
00:07:28
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:07:31
Dan Sanchez
How does that hit you?
00:07:32
Ken Freire
Well, you know, what what I find super interesting is that true experts, I have found, have always been doing something like this.
00:07:32
Dan Sanchez
Yeah.
00:07:43
Ken Freire
They don't get stagnant. They don't get stuck. They don't be like, oh, I've mastered this one part and then I'm done. It's like, no, how do I keep growing in this area? And like with AI, I love that you just said that, right? You're like, I'm constantly growing because the field is so new still.
00:07:57
Ken Freire
So you're like, okay, let me keep reading. Let me figure out what's what's going on out there. And I think this is why a lot of people even follow you on LinkedIn because they see, oh i can't they can't keep up with all the new tech stacks, all the new tools, everything else that's going on.
00:08:12
Ken Freire
And it's fun to just have someone who's paved the path forward a little bit. And they're like, oh, you already did the research. A greatest example is like when Atlas came out, you know, you texted me like literally the day after you're like, download Atlas, go try it out.
00:08:26
Ken Freire
So I'm like, sweet. i didn't even have to think about should I do it? Should I not? You just said, go do it. I'm like, okay. Right. Like it was easy for me to do that. And I saw other people who who chimed in when you posted it on LinkedIn. So that's that's the beauty of it.
00:08:39
Ken Freire
One, being a student and two, just constantly like figuring out how do I learn? And I think that's ultimately what you're trying to say to everybody is like, be a learner, stay focused and stay diligent.
00:08:51
Ken Freire
You don't have to do it in a six week sprint like you did. Right. But like find a way to constantly be learning. And I think that's what we're going to talk about today throughout the whole session is like, how do you actually master this process of the thirty thirty plan?
00:09:05
Dan Sanchez
I almost wonder, when some people first hear about it, they they look at the book list and they're like, oh my gosh, that is way too many books.
00:09:12
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:09:13
Dan Sanchez
i And I will say, like, yeah challenge me on this if you think I'm wrong. But in my mind, I'm like, if if learning a lot of information is just kind of like a no-go for you, then probably being a thought leader and and being an authority probably isn't for you.
00:09:34
Dan Sanchez
There's many other ways to win. There's many other ways to succeed when it comes to standing out and being an authority. But if you actually want to lead people's thinking, you can't do that unless you're an aggressive
Books as a Tool for Influence
00:09:43
Dan Sanchez
learner. Like, I don't know a way around it.
00:09:44
Ken Freire
yeah
00:09:45
Dan Sanchez
Would you would you would you say there's exceptions to that?
00:09:49
Ken Freire
No, I think the only exception is that like, people can learn in different modalities, right? So if, and and by the 30 books, you're not saying, hey, gonna read all 30 books.
00:10:01
Ken Freire
You might be listening to all 30 books or or something like that.
00:10:04
Dan Sanchez
Yeah.
00:10:05
Ken Freire
Or you might watch a hundred videos or or on YouTube, deep content on it.
00:10:05
Dan Sanchez
Yep.
00:10:11
Ken Freire
Like that that's fine, as long as you're learning is the key thing.
00:10:14
Dan Sanchez
right.
00:10:14
Ken Freire
But there is something powerful about books.
00:10:18
Dan Sanchez
Yes.
00:10:19
Ken Freire
So I don't want people to miss that. There is something powerful that like, if you're not reading, you're you're missing out on the ability to influence other people. And ultimately, think about it this way, throughout all millennia, right, the thing that has stood the time, right, is books.
00:10:37
Ken Freire
As soon as the printing press came out, like people keep buying books. You would think in this digital age of blogs and and everything else and video that book books would would not be selling, they still sell.
00:10:48
Ken Freire
right Because there's something powerful about when you have a physical book and you're reading it, you're highlighting it, you're processing through that information. So I think that if you're not reading, it's going to really dilute your your ability to to grow as an authority.
00:11:04
Ken Freire
And if you don't like to read, I get it. Try to find another modality. But at the end of the day, be a learner. That is huge. And if you're not learning, you're you're actually not being an expert. You're just trying to ride the wave of something new and in the hype of it all.
00:11:18
Dan Sanchez
I highly recommend books. I think if if the topic calls for YouTube videos because there are no books or because the topic is best learned through YouTube, like let's say AI automation, that that's your thing.
00:11:27
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:11:30
Dan Sanchez
There are hard, like you're probably still gonna have to read all the AI books, but like... YouTube is the path for that. There's no way to do it outside of YouTube.
00:11:37
Ken Freire
yeah
00:11:39
Dan Sanchez
That's where all the information is on that topic. As it becauls, it's still super new. so and But YouTube the place where it's at.
00:11:45
Ken Freire
yeah
00:11:47
Dan Sanchez
But for the most part, I highly recommend using books. The reason is, you can like it could there's blogs, there's so many modalities, but there's something different about a book because people have to take all those things they've done before and condense it down into the best package.
00:12:03
Dan Sanchez
That's what a book is. A book is a package of ideas on a particular topic. Some are good, some are bad, some are loose, some are very specific, some are long, some are short. there's But they're particularly well thought through little packages of information.
00:12:17
Dan Sanchez
They're usually highly edited and streamed down. If they've gone through a publisher and they go through many rounds of it being edited, but even the self-published ones, I find some some of the most unknown books on niche topics end up having the best nuggets in them, which is why you have to read them all.
00:12:31
Dan Sanchez
Even the ones that are obscure, the ones that were self-published that probably suck
00:12:36
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:12:36
Dan Sanchez
They're only five or 10 bucks a piece. Just buy it. Oh, Ken, this is the other thing. When I say 30 books, people are like, I haven't read more than 30 books since college or high school.
00:12:47
Dan Sanchez
I'm like, look, reading 30 books on a very niche topic is very different than reading 30 random books.
00:12:54
Ken Freire
Yeah, it's true
Deep Dive into Learning Strategies
00:12:55
Dan Sanchez
Because... If it's all on the exact same topic, they all have to repeat the same information. They have to because they don't know what the context of the reader is. So they have to repeat the same basic context for them to be able to sink in their new ideas, which is why an author told me once he's like, most nonfiction business books are really only worth two chapters.
00:13:16
Dan Sanchez
One to hit the price point of that, like 200 page marker, you know, 15 bucks ish. he's like, you got to pad it out a little bit. So most books aren't like end to end reads. They like really only have two chapters worth of unique, good vetted ideas.
00:13:28
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:13:29
Dan Sanchez
The rest is like context and then some filler and then some extras. so most books aren't really that much. some books are some books you will have to read cover to cover on the topic because they're written by someone who's done exhaustive research, life's work kind of stuff.
00:13:45
Dan Sanchez
They're out there, but most of them, especially in the business world, they're fluffy. So you read it and the first three you have to read, probably straight through. But then after that, you're kind of skimming.
00:13:55
Ken Freire
yeah
00:13:56
Dan Sanchez
And you don't have to read it word for word. You can just look at a page and know you already know that information. So I'm just like moving through pages. I'm like scanning. I'm hunting for the new information. And the more you read, the less of each book you have to read.
00:14:10
Dan Sanchez
Because again, you're just scanning it. You're looking for the new contribution this author has made into it. So again, you're going to have to like book 15. You're like, oh, this one's dense. going to have to read this whole one. Or book 16, you're like, man, there's only like two pages in here that are worth anything.
00:14:24
Dan Sanchez
So you read those two pages, you highlight them up, and then you move on. But reading 30 books on the same topic feels more like seven or eight. that's That's provided there's 30. Most of these niche topics, like when I did account-based marketing, only had like 13 or 12 or something like that.
00:14:42
Dan Sanchez
And it felt more like reading five books, which wasn't that bad.
00:14:44
Ken Freire
Yeah. Yeah. And that that's the that's the beauty of it. Like I have certain topics that for the last 15 years, I've always been reading on, right? Like theology books, leadership books, business books, that for the most part, I could read really fast because it's like, they're not saying a lot of new information.
00:14:57
Dan Sanchez
Yeah. Yeah.
00:15:00
Dan Sanchez
yeah
00:15:05
Ken Freire
And that's what I encourage all of you guys, if you're listening to this, is be like, ooh, just pick a niche, right? And whatever that niche is, start to find as many books as possible, videos as possible, and just start going down the rabbit hole.
00:15:17
Dan Sanchez
yeah
00:15:19
Dan Sanchez
like it just happened recently, you read Ryan Dice's book, right? On business operations.
00:15:19
Ken Freire
So, yeah.
00:15:24
Ken Freire
Oh, yeah.
00:15:24
Dan Sanchez
But by the time you get to his book, you're like, I've already read E-Myth. i've already read Execution Premium. We'd already read Scaling Up, Traction. Like they're all the same kind of book.
00:15:34
Ken Freire
Yeah, package it for me.
00:15:34
Dan Sanchez
So by the time you get to his book, which is probably book five on the list, at least for me, you're like, okay, like, oh, he's approaching it this way. Everybody else kind of did it this way. And you're kind of like, just looking for like, what's his angle on the topic of strategic planning, which is what the book's about.
00:15:47
Ken Freire
yeah i've read probably like 10 or 15 books on strategic planning and then when i read that one i read it in a day because i'm like oh cool the first two chapters are the go the nuggets and then everything else i'm like okay like it's not anything new yeah so
00:15:50
Dan Sanchez
Yeah.
00:15:54
Dan Sanchez
Yeah. It just doesn't take that long.
00:15:59
Dan Sanchez
He's borrowing from here. He refined this one a little bit. Yeah. That's how, that's how it is. Once you've read so many books on one topic.
00:16:06
Ken Freire
Yeah. Okay. So Dan, as we, as we walk through this, people are like, they might catch the vision on the 30, 30 plan. How do you actually execute it? What's the the first step of it?
00:16:16
Dan Sanchez
The first step is picking the topic. This is one of the harder steps. Like it's, I don't know why, but we always want to like stay broad, but narrowing down the expertise just makes it so much easier to stand out in that expertise.
00:16:30
Dan Sanchez
So you have to actually make the hard choice. You have to pick a topic. It is possible for you to pick it read about it, and then find out you don't want to do it. But Generally, yeah hopefully you're already starting as a professional. So you're like, you're already playing with these ideas. You're already dabbling. You're already experimenting. You're already working. You've already read some books on this topic. This shouldn't be your first foray into it.
00:16:51
Dan Sanchez
I found out on accident by diving into ABM, not having understood anything about account-based marketing was when I figured this idea out.
00:16:56
Ken Freire
Thank
00:16:58
Dan Sanchez
And I wasn't really planning on being an authority on that account-based marketing, nor did I become one because I left it after that. I did it. And then I started sensing that people were feeling like that. And then I dropp i dropped it. i I went in a different direction because, again, I didn't intend to do that.
00:17:12
Dan Sanchez
But you as a professional, you should already be kind of this shouldn't be a new topic to you. You're kind of already using this topic and now you're planning on becoming an authority in this topic. you probably already, even if you're already an expert on this topic, like you're already making unique contributions to this topic.
00:17:28
Dan Sanchez
You're probably not listening to this book. If you're already an authority, because you already got that game, you already i figured out this path on your own, but you might be an expert that wants to become an authority. I want to challenge you as an expert.
00:17:39
Dan Sanchez
Have you read every single book on your topic of expertise? Every single one, even the obscure ones. If you have, then great. Go back through them, re-index them, and start sharing about what you youre just start sharing your favorite books that you've learned things from on social media. Because again, you still want to be the student. You still want to go low and mark some kind of journey that you're on to master nuance of it, to accomplish something maybe that you haven't accomplished as an expert yet. but you want to go low in order to do that, like we talked about in the last episode.
00:18:10
Dan Sanchez
But the path forward is to begin, if you're starting as a professional and you want to start becoming an expert is to actually define the scope of that expertise. Again, it needs to have it needs to be a topic with less than 30 books.
00:18:22
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:18:22
Dan Sanchez
30 is the maximum. It can be less. I think I'd say like the minimum is probably, unless it's an emerging technology technology field like I did with AI, like there needs to be at least five books on the topic.
00:18:34
Dan Sanchez
If there's not five books on the topic, go up a level. So that's kind of the range.
00:18:38
Ken Freire
Yeah. Okay. So the the first part, clarify the the strategy or the niche, right? Some of the things that people might be thinking about right now is, hey, do I do i start with reading first? Do I interview? Do I do a mix? Like, is it all a sequential order?
00:18:53
Ken Freire
What's the best process through this?
00:18:55
Dan Sanchez
They're in order of read first, interview next, write last.
Interviewing Experts and Asking Questions
00:19:01
Dan Sanchez
But they overlap. Like you don't have to read all the books before you move into the interviews. You don't have to do all the interviews before you start writing the blog post or recording your solo podcast episodes where you're answering questions.
00:19:16
Dan Sanchez
So you can be in you can start reading multiple books and then start scheduling interviews with the authors. The authors are some of the people that you probably want to interview. if you start And you could start writing blog posts like halfway through your interview process. So these things, they overlap. But generally, yeah, you read and then you interview and then you start answering questions via blog podcast.
00:19:39
Ken Freire
Yeah, i I have found that if I have read the book and i tell I tell the guy or gal, hey, I just read your book.
00:19:45
Dan Sanchez
I read your book.
00:19:46
Ken Freire
I'd love to interview you.
00:19:46
Dan Sanchez
Yeah.
00:19:47
Ken Freire
They are so much more likely to come in because I'm writing, you know, reading the book and I have questions like, what did you mean by this?
00:19:53
Dan Sanchez
Yeah.
00:19:54
Ken Freire
Or how do you like process this?
00:19:55
Dan Sanchez
Yeah.
00:19:56
Ken Freire
What's a practical step that wasn't in the book that now I could ask the person and they they love it because it's like their hobby, the thing they love and they could go more in depth with it.
00:20:01
Dan Sanchez
yeah
00:20:05
Dan Sanchez
Oh, they, it's the best thing ever. And even as somebody who's written a book and I've been told this, they're like, man, nobody ever takes the time to read the book. And so I can always go surface level.
00:20:12
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:20:14
Dan Sanchez
i have to actually explain the basic concepts of the book, but they love, the authors love getting the, The questions that go deeper or even better, if you can compare and contrast their ideas to another author's ideas and ask for it, they love going on like, oh, yeah, let's talk about that. This is why I take this dance versus so-and-so, you know, like they that that'll be some of the best interviews they've ever had because you've actually taken the time. time to learn it, wrestle with it, and then actually go and ask them good questions.
00:20:42
Dan Sanchez
But that's really, that's where the Socratic method works so well, but so few people ever take the time. Like very few people ever read a cup, like even people in the profession. That's amazing to me how many marketers I've met don't haven't read any hardly any books on marketing.
00:20:57
Dan Sanchez
outside of college if they went to college for it.
00:20:57
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:21:00
Dan Sanchez
And then very few actually read a lot of books on it. Very few even do interviews. like it So it's like it gets you get a smaller and smaller percentage, which is why the 30-30 plan actually works so well, because so few people even implement this. it' You don't even have to have a PhD in these fields in order to be an expert.
00:21:15
Dan Sanchez
So few people even get to the level of having read all the basic books on the topic and then interviewed you know a dozen or two people on the topic. So it's like, the barrier to being an authority is actually really low, lower than you would think.
00:21:30
Dan Sanchez
Because how long, like if someone has assigned you 30 books to read Ken and you're like, oh, I need to read these.
00:21:30
Ken Freire
yeah
00:21:34
Dan Sanchez
These are my next 30 books. How long would that take you?
00:21:37
Ken Freire
If they're all within the same category?
00:21:39
Dan Sanchez
Yeah.
00:21:40
Ken Freire
a Well, I have kids now, so that that slows me down a little bit.
00:21:44
Dan Sanchez
Yeah.
00:21:45
Ken Freire
But I would say three months.
00:21:48
Dan Sanchez
Yeah.
00:21:49
Ken Freire
you know if i'm If I'm clicking through it.
00:21:51
Dan Sanchez
Pushing through.
00:21:52
Ken Freire
If I didn't have kids, I could probably not get out in six to eight weeks.
00:21:52
Dan Sanchez
Yeah.
00:21:57
Dan Sanchez
Sure, for sure. boy It definitely slows things down in the best way possible.
00:22:02
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:22:03
Dan Sanchez
If you're not a reader, again, this being an authority and a thought leader, you might want to reconsider it because but part of staying in authority is actually staying on top of the new ideas of which there's always going to be new ideas coming out on your topic.
00:22:17
Dan Sanchez
Always.
00:22:17
Ken Freire
yeah
00:22:18
Dan Sanchez
So you have to continue learning. You can't, you become one of those people who had been and they're just regurgitating the same ideas from long ago, you know?
00:22:28
Ken Freire
Yeah. let me Let me share a quick story here.
00:22:29
Dan Sanchez
Yeah.
00:22:30
Ken Freire
i remember Dan, you and I were working at at a nonprofit together, a university together, and you left and they said, hey, Ken, I need you to lead the marketing team.
00:22:42
Ken Freire
And at this time i have been overseeing the sales and operations of the university. so I was like, oh, I could kind of lead the marketing team because through osmosis, ive I've learned a lot through you. But I was like, I got really nervous because there's some really great people who knew marketing really well.
00:22:58
Ken Freire
And everybody knows they hate the leader who comes in and wants to change a bunch of stuff or do a bunch of stuff that doesn't actually know the the the expertise, right? of that world.
00:23:07
Dan Sanchez
Yeah.
00:23:07
Ken Freire
So I remember I just asked you, I'm like, hey, what are the best books I need to read on this topic? And literally, for six months, I just read every marketing book I could get my hands on.
00:23:18
Ken Freire
And then on my team, at that point, I was like, hey, what other books should I learn? What stuff do I need to get my hands dirty on? I didn't want to become a marketer. But if I'm leading a marketing team, I better know how they think and how they process stuff.
00:23:31
Ken Freire
And the beauty was that because I knew sales, I knew how both of them come together.
00:23:36
Dan Sanchez
Mm-hmm.
00:23:36
Ken Freire
Right. So it was just like, I remember one time a good friend of ours, Brooks, he yeah we were sitting, we were done with a meeting and he comes to me and he said, Hey, Ken, I need to talk to you about something. And I was like, Oh my gosh, I probably said something stupid in that meeting about marketing.
00:23:50
Ken Freire
And he was going to like, correct me. He's like, you did a fantastic job. I'm so impressed how far you've grown in the last six months in your marketing capabilities. He's like, you you you can lead a marketing team and no one would bat an eye.
00:24:06
Ken Freire
And I was just like, whoa, like it was a huge compliment.
00:24:08
Dan Sanchez
You've read more marketing books than most marketers.
00:24:10
Ken Freire
yeah So i i I say that to everybody who's listening to this to just encourage them like, man, this is possible even if you wanted to go into a new field, right?
00:24:21
Ken Freire
Like you just start learning and and implementing and going.
00:24:22
Dan Sanchez
Yep. Yep.
00:24:25
Ken Freire
And that's what the the reading phase is all about. Like you just trying to pick up those golden nuggets. For you, Dan, I think a big question when I talk about implementing is should people publicly share their notes or summaries or what does that look like?
00:24:42
Ken Freire
When when should you wait to do that, to start sharing?
00:24:45
Dan Sanchez
You should start right away. It starts from the very beginning. Even before you read your first book, just declare your journey on social media and say, man, I think I'm going to set out to really learn as much as I can about this topic.
00:25:00
Dan Sanchez
It doesn't have to be flashy.
00:25:00
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:25:02
Dan Sanchez
That's all I did with AI. I'm like, you know, I've seen the writing on the wall. I'm to start trying to master AI. Here's the plan. I'm to start with these things. I'm reading this book first.
00:25:14
Dan Sanchez
And then you post it, people glance at it. Are they being influenced by it? No. But there's nothing about it that says, hey, I need to think critically and be skeptical about what they're saying. They're just kind of like, oh, look, Dan's on a learning journey. Good for him.
00:25:27
Dan Sanchez
And then they see your post reviewing said book.
00:25:27
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:25:29
Dan Sanchez
And they're like, oh, interesting. He read the book. They probably don't even remember. They won't remember even what you say, what you learned. It doesn't matter. They're taking notes now about, oh, this person's on a journey to learn the thing.
Sharing Knowledge and Building Credibility
00:25:42
Dan Sanchez
And then when they see it over and over and over again for like six months, Even if they're not even reading your post, but they're just noticing like, oh, he's posting this. Oh, now he's interviewing this person. Oh, now he's doing this. They don't even have to know who the people are.
00:25:56
Dan Sanchez
They take note. Like they know you're learning a lot and they're seeing the frequency of it.
00:25:59
Ken Freire
yeah
00:26:00
Dan Sanchez
They're seeing even sometimes the depth of it. Once in a while, you catch their attention. They actually read what you're learning. They're like, oh, that's really insightful. But they don't even have to read it. They just have to be like, it's like a ping in their head to remind them that you're on a journey and that you're going broad and that you're going deep.
00:26:15
Dan Sanchez
So you want to start sharing that right away.
00:26:18
Ken Freire
yeah okay so in the 30 30 plan we're talking about clarifying the strat the niche Then you start with the reading phase, right? We've kind of talked about that.
00:26:26
Dan Sanchez
Yep.
00:26:27
Ken Freire
The next phase is the interview phase. And we talk a lot about podcasting here. But what some people might be like, ooh, I don't know if I'm ready to podcast. how do how do How can people find out if podcasting is right for them?
00:26:41
Dan Sanchez
If you want to learn if podcasting is right for you, we conveniently made an assessment just for you. If you go to AIDrivenMarketer.com slash pod, you can see if a podcast is right for you and your business or just right for you and the style of just communication that you want to go after.
00:26:59
Dan Sanchez
So again, it's AIDrivenMarketer.com slash pod. take the assessment and you can actually have an opportunity to book some time with Ken to see if it's right for you. We'll actually sit down and talk with you to see if a podcast would be a good tool in your arsenal in order to become an authority in your industry.
00:27:17
Dan Sanchez
If not, podcasting is not the only way I've seen other. In fact, I even just made a contribution. Someone interviewed me recently, but they're not, it's not even a podcast. They just sent, emailed me the questions.
00:27:29
Dan Sanchez
I just sent them back a video answering the questions. They're going to take the transcript, but they're, they're writing an article. So they did the interview via, it was asynchronous.
00:27:34
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:27:36
Dan Sanchez
They sent me the questions. I sent them back the answer. And now they're take as a writer, they're taking my answers with a few other people's to write an article. You could do that too. it You can, of course, just have a Zoom or a Google Meets interview, talk to them, take their answers, not record it.
00:27:52
Dan Sanchez
I still like, you're probably still go to want to record it, which is why I'm like, if you're go to record it, you might as well publish it as a podcast. But some people just don't like being on camera. Get it. take Interview them anyway.
00:28:02
Dan Sanchez
And it's, it's a lot easier to get their answers if you meet with them in person versus asynchronously, like I just mentioned, but you could still do it that way and get their answers and then craft it up into an article.
00:28:13
Dan Sanchez
If the written word is your jam. And for many, I know there's many marketer marketers that like, they just like writing, they stick to writing and they like the focus of only having that one thing.
00:28:26
Dan Sanchez
And for those people love it. Yeah. hit it. If you're strong with that, just stay in that lane because it's going to go well for you to having that focus. But for everybody else, if you're going do the interview, I might as well make a podcast out of it.
00:28:40
Ken Freire
Yeah, yeah're you're doing all of the steps.
00:28:41
Dan Sanchez
You can still do the article.
00:28:43
Ken Freire
You got like maybe one or two extra steps of just using a different platform to record and then distribute all that stuff.
00:28:43
Dan Sanchez
Yeah.
00:28:49
Dan Sanchez
Yeah.
00:28:50
Ken Freire
But like I have found interestingly enough that if you tell me to do something asynchronous, and this is just me personally, right? If you're like, oh man, go answer these questions, I'm always going to put it off, right?
00:29:01
Ken Freire
Because there's other priorities that come up and different things that that I have to do.
00:29:02
Dan Sanchez
Yep. Yep. They it.
00:29:07
Ken Freire
But people actually like to be interviewed, especially if you tell them, hey, I have a podcast.
00:29:09
Dan Sanchez
they love it
00:29:12
Ken Freire
Would you like to be a guest on it? People like just get excited. they're like, oh, my gosh, I'm a guest on a podcast. Right. I remember the first time I brought in someone to be on my podcast.
00:29:23
Ken Freire
They were like, oh, my gosh, this is the first time someone's ever invited me to be a podcast. They were like super nervous, but excited. And they had a wealth of knowledge, dude. Yeah.
00:29:31
Dan Sanchez
Yeah. Yeah.
00:29:33
Ken Freire
But like it brought something up in their own heart of like, oh, I want to do more of this. How do I get in front of more people? And we just started chatting about it, right? And this was years ago. And now I see him on LinkedIn and he's blown up way more than I have. i'm like, this is like, don i don't want to say it's just me, right?
00:29:49
Ken Freire
But he he just put in the work and it's fantastic to watch, you know? And i I always joke around with him via comments. I'm like, remember, i was your first one. and like this little bitty guy.
00:30:00
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:30:02
Dan Sanchez
Oh man, I, most people will say yes to being in on a podcast. I hardly ever get no's. And if they are no, it's because they're extremely busy. Maybe it's because they're a CMO of a pretty fast and growing company and they get, they get asked a lot to be on podcasts.
00:30:16
Ken Freire
Yeah. Yeah.
00:30:16
Dan Sanchez
Those people are either, i don't know, they have to be pretty famous to say no, which I've, I've been rejected before. It's, it's, it can happen. But most of the time, if you're going after a niche and you start with the authors that you're reading, chances are,
00:30:33
Dan Sanchez
They're not that famous yet.
00:30:35
Ken Freire
yeah
00:30:35
Dan Sanchez
If you go after Gary Vee, like, yeah, he's, you're not going to get him. It's really hard to get someone like him because he's got a huge social following and clout and he's also really busy. So he's very strategic in the interviews that he does give. You have to kind of have a good size audience to get on it.
00:30:49
Dan Sanchez
And I've certainly come across people that will like, oh, like i only do episodes if I you have to have 50 episodes before I'll say, even consider saying yes. You know, I think Michael Hyatt's one of those people, right?
00:30:57
Ken Freire
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:30:59
Dan Sanchez
He's like, I think 50 is his marker.
00:30:59
Ken Freire
yeah
00:31:01
Dan Sanchez
James Carberry, his marker is 50. and remember I interviewed a pretty prominent CMO and he wanted to see you at least have a few hundred downloads per episode for him to say yes.
00:31:12
Dan Sanchez
I was like, okay. So like so for some people there's a barrier and some people are like way hard really hard to reach like the Gary V's of the world or, you know, obviously celebrities are hard to reach, but for the most part, most people say yes, unless they're a really crazy busy season.
00:31:22
Ken Freire
yeah
00:31:27
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:31:27
Dan Sanchez
So it's just not that hard.
00:31:29
Ken Freire
and And which another little hack that I found is if they work in a company, right, if they're solo, it's a little, this is, this doesn't really apply. But if they work in a company and they have several staff members, like say you, you try to go after the CMO and that doesn't work out.
Engaging with Others and Networking
00:31:42
Ken Freire
You'd be like, Hey, I know you're busy. Do you have anybody directly under you who can speak into this topic? And now I've made the reason I do that is because now I've made a connection with that company.
00:31:54
Ken Freire
If that if I want to use them as a client in the future or again, I'm i'm just building up my my network. So if I have a great conversation with, say, one of the the CMO's directors, the director is going to go back and be like, hey, look what I just did with this podcast.
00:32:07
Ken Freire
Look at all this stuff.
00:32:07
Dan Sanchez
Yeah.
00:32:07
Ken Freire
Like now you have a referral. So the CMO might be interested later on to do it. That's worked for me in a ton of different ways. I can't even, we don't even have time to explain how often that's worked for me.
00:32:19
Dan Sanchez
yeah yeah
00:32:21
Ken Freire
But it's a great strategy. so So Dan, we got, once we're in the interview phase, what have you found to be the most effective way to repurpose each of these interviews?
00:32:34
Ken Freire
Because I think a lot of people, when it comes to podcasting, they just get nervous. They're like, what's the tech stack? How do we do this? They get overwhelmed because of the, I don't know, the unknown.
00:32:44
Dan Sanchez
so many different pieces of conversation. There's like the tech stack, what questions should you ask? How do you frame it? So let's start with the tech stack. Generally, i always recommend everyone, if you're if you're going to do a podcast, I recommend using Zencaster because it's the easiest solution, in my opinion.
00:33:02
Dan Sanchez
of Because we're even here in Zencaster now, we can record, and then there's some editing features that make it really easy to edit with AI or just transcript-based editing. And then you just publish in the same platform. There's no recording and then downloading and then uploading and editing. and it's It's all this craziness.
00:33:18
Dan Sanchez
But if you want to do it for free, even you can actually do it for free with Spotify has this creators.spotify.com. You can upload stuff there and then take just zoom, zoom. you or You have to record the zoom video and then just upload it. There is a video or audio and you can get started to simply using that.
00:33:35
Dan Sanchez
I just went on a podcast this week and he recorded via Google meets and then uploaded it to Spotify. And that was the episode. And it was, it was simple. it was nice. And it worked. Yeah. So it doesn't have to be fancy to start.
00:33:47
Dan Sanchez
I think you can even get away with just using a Google meets record for free and then publish for free. I like to me, simplifying the process is the biggest game. So I like Zencaster.
00:33:58
Dan Sanchez
That's the t tech stack. As far as what questions to ask, you should always ask the questions that you're the most curious to learn about. So you read the book. What are the questions that you still have from the book?
00:34:09
Dan Sanchez
If you're interviewing the author, Or what are questions that still plague you about the the topic in general? As you start to read, this is where you start to become, and we'll cover this in another chapter, but you start to find the gaps in the topic, but you can't know what the gaps are. You can't put it unique contributions forward until you've actually read everything.
00:34:35
Dan Sanchez
So you'll start to discover gaps. Even as you're reading, you're like, huh, I've had questions about this and I'm gonna keep reading books and no one's answering. No one's answering it. No one's answering it. So you jump on an interview and you start asking people and then you start to find, oh, they're answering it, but they're still not, they're not giving me what I want.
00:34:51
Dan Sanchez
and they're not I still have this like problem that I'm wrestling with. You're like, oh, that's where the gold that's where the gold is. that's that That's the piece of ground no one's dug in yet. So you're starting to look for that, and you're starting to look for it in the interviews. But like the fallback that I always go into the interview, if you don't know what to ask, then take a topic they've talked about and then go through the what, why, how framework.
00:35:13
Dan Sanchez
What is it? What's the idea you put forward? Why is it important? Then how do you make it practical? How do you implement it? It's kind of like the fallback if I get stuck that works for almost every interview. What's the idea?
00:35:24
Dan Sanchez
why is it important? How do you do it? And then that usually gets me through.
00:35:29
Ken Freire
Yeah. and And then from there, you you know if you do those types of interviews, the tech stack, then you start writing about it. Now, this is where i have found a lot of people get stuck because they're trying to do too much at the same time.
00:35:43
Dan Sanchez
Yep.
00:35:44
Ken Freire
So what would you recommend is the best way to start writing? We've kind of fleshed it out a little bit. If you're a writer, do this. But for someone who may not be a writer, what's the best step?
00:35:55
Dan Sanchez
And this is for the the last segment of the 30, 30, 30 process.
00:35:59
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:36:01
Dan Sanchez
So the last step is you could start, before you start contributing unique ideas, you really need to master the fundamentals.
Creating Content from FAQs
00:36:08
Dan Sanchez
And there's no better way to master the fundamentals than to teach the fundamentals.
00:36:12
Dan Sanchez
But how do you know what the fundamentals are? What are the most basic questions people are asking about the topic? And there's two different ways that I recommend. i used to have just one, but now i actually have, because of AI, I have two different ways to find what this is.
00:36:28
Dan Sanchez
You want to find the most frequently asked questions on the topic. The first way i like recommending to do this is doing what we call Google alphabet soup. So you open up google.com and you put in whatever the phrase is for your topic into Google.
00:36:44
Dan Sanchez
For me, it's AI marketing, right? So I put in AI space marketing and Google always has this thing called auto complete. It's all the recommendations of where they think your search might go underneath it.
00:36:57
Dan Sanchez
This is goldmine because it's recommending all the things people ask related to that keyword, related to that, the way people are phrasing your topic of expertise.
00:37:08
Dan Sanchez
So if I go in there now and put in, just go to Google, let's just actually open up and see what it says. I put in AI marketing. Oops. Don't commit.
00:37:20
Dan Sanchez
You got to actually not search it. I get AI marketing summit, AI marketing tools, AI marketing certification, academy, agency, courses, jobs, world, companies.
00:37:31
Dan Sanchez
Some of these are very specific things, but some of them are general AI marketing tools, AI marketing certification. Those are frequently asked questions related to AI marketing. Those would be blog posts or individual podcast episodes that I need to record in order to answer the question.
00:37:47
Dan Sanchez
What are the best AI marketing tools? What are the best AI marketing certifications? Again, it doesn't have to be a blog post these days. It could be a video. It could be a podcast episode, whatever whatever it is in the medium you're doing it. but The point is you're creating and answering the question yourself.
00:38:04
Dan Sanchez
So taking all the things you've learned and answering the question better, hopefully better than anybody else has on the internet, go and see how other people have answered the question. You do you try to shoot for it being the best. Another way to get even more if you want to go even further with this, because again, if you do it, even Google only gives me like, I don't know, a dozen different options and some of them aren't good.
00:38:24
Dan Sanchez
You can get more out of Google by just saying AI marketing space, And then you put the letter A. And then, of course, it starts auto-completing with AI marketing, academy, agency, agent, app, automation. It's all A words.
00:38:37
Dan Sanchez
And then I see which ones are out of that, and then I take back A, and I put B, and I get all the B words. you know After AI marketing, got AI marketing, bots, books, business, bootcamp, business ideas. I'm looking for all the different ones.
00:38:49
Dan Sanchez
And these are the most frequently asked questions, or or at least the most frequently asked questions of people going to Google and answer asking the questions so that show you what people are asking. But there's another way. That's the way I used to do it and and still do it because people are going to Google.
00:39:03
Dan Sanchez
The other way to do it is with AI. you can actually go into chat GPT and have it run a deep research report for you, which means it's going to go and scour the internet, think about it, and then go and verify, or not verify, but like double check everything before giving you back a report.
00:39:19
Dan Sanchez
And I like asking AI, and I'll put the prompt in the show notes. So there's a very specific prompt I run, but you can actually go and ask it like, hey, go and do research and scrape Reddit, get Quora, get social media sites and go and ask them.
00:39:35
Dan Sanchez
use ChatGPT's deep research mode in order to scrape all the most frequently asked questions of those sites and then rank stack them for you. So you see what the most frequently asked questions are that people are actually asking on social. So that way you get what people are asking on search. You get what people are asking on social sites like Reddit and
Indicators of Growing Authority
00:39:52
Dan Sanchez
Quora.
00:39:52
Dan Sanchez
in order to compile a list of the most frequently asked questions, and then you just do your best to answer those. Don't use AI to answer them. Answer them yourself. Answer them based on all the reading. Answer them based on all the questions and interviews you've done, and then actually put together your best response on every single question.
00:40:10
Dan Sanchez
It will force you to think through them all and force you to actually articulate everything you've learned, giving you like an extra step of learning, but, but, It also begins helping you on your your journey of becoming an authority because now you're publishing stuff. It's not like the ground shattering new contributions, but you're answering all the basics.
00:40:32
Dan Sanchez
Sharing them on social, putting them out on blog posts or on a podcast episode. Again, each one is a building block for people learning is seeing that you actually know what you're talking about.
00:40:44
Ken Freire
Yeah. So, so Dan, if everybody starts doing all this stuff, right, they might get excited about it. How do they know, or like, what's a great way to measure it so that they see this plan is actually working? Is it like they get more followers? Is it they get more opportunity to speak?
00:40:59
Ken Freire
What's a good measurement?
00:41:01
Dan Sanchez
A good measure a way to know if this is working, if people are starting to come to you for questions. so
00:41:06
Ken Freire
Hmm.
00:41:07
Dan Sanchez
This could take a while too. This process of becoming an authority is not a short path. It's a long game, but it's it's a game that you ultimately control the time on. Like if you sprint through all the books, and I don't mean sprint through them as in like you're half doing it.
00:41:23
Dan Sanchez
I mean like you're doing it. You're just doing it rapidly. You're just putting way more time into it every day. You can knock out every single phase of a 30-30 plan in a much faster way. You could get it all done in six weeks.
00:41:35
Dan Sanchez
And I mean like all 30 interviews, all 30 books. Like you could, you could, you wouldn't be doing much else, but you could, I've done it. Like it, it is possible to do. I didn't do much else during those 30 days, but I did get it done with kids.
00:41:51
Dan Sanchez
So when people start reaching out to you with questions is the beginning of knowing it's working. They might be DMs. It might be even just your friends and family if you're sharing all this stuff on Facebook, which is a good place to share it too, and more than just LinkedIn, to share it everywhere.
00:42:05
Dan Sanchez
The more people are reaching out to you, the better it is an indicator of you becoming an authority.
00:42:14
Ken Freire
Yeah. and And the beauty about that is like, I'll give you a great example. When we've been, when we started doing like helping people grow a podcast or but start a podcast, I was like, ooh, am I, do I have authority to speak in this topic? Right. Cause I normally go to you or James Carver. Like there's so many people that I would go to.
00:42:34
Ken Freire
And then I started posting about it. And a bunch of people started texting me or like texting me or DMing me. And they're like, hey, I want to know about podcasting. I've always wanted to start a podcast. How did you start?
00:42:45
Ken Freire
I see now that you were working with Michael Hyatt and they've just seen me over the last five or six years years progress in my ability to podcast. So I even was kind of caught off guard because people started reaching out to me about podcasting.
00:42:59
Ken Freire
And I was like, oh, well, just do this.
00:43:00
Dan Sanchez
Yep. Yep. Yep.
00:43:01
Ken Freire
Just do that. And they're like, wait a minute, back up, back up. And I i realized I'm like, oh, I got to treat them like babies. Right. Like step one, use this tech stack.
00:43:07
Dan Sanchez
yeah
00:43:09
Ken Freire
Step two, don't worry about, you know, X, Y and z And it's been fun to watch because it's just I've been in the game long enough now that people are like, oh, yeah, I trust what Ken is saying when it comes to podcasting.
00:43:22
Ken Freire
So that that's the measurement that I've used as well as like, are people asking me about it?
00:43:28
Dan Sanchez
yeah
00:43:28
Ken Freire
And it's super helpful.
00:43:30
Dan Sanchez
The next level is people start reaching out to you for interviews.
00:43:33
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:43:34
Dan Sanchez
And then you can just kind of measure it by the authority of the people asking you for essentially earned media. You measure your authority by the amount of free earned media or publications that are coming after you.
00:43:45
Ken Freire
Hmm.
00:43:46
Dan Sanchez
you start to get asked to be speak on stage. And it's like no name events first. And then it's names, industry events, and then it's big names. And then the bigger, the bigger, the, the, the podcast, the event, the, whatever it is, the, the publishers, whatever, like the more authority they have and they're inviting you, that's kind of how you measure.
00:44:06
Dan Sanchez
In my opinion, that's how you measure authority. When the earned media world is starting to come after you, you're not pitching them. They're pitching you on why you should be part of their thing. That's the best measure of all time.
00:44:18
Dan Sanchez
That's because people, you're creating demand so much so that they feel like if they get you on their thing, they' that's going to help them and their audience.
Upcoming Segment Preview
00:44:27
Dan Sanchez
That's how you know you have authority.
00:44:29
Dan Sanchez
That's when other people start asking you stuff.
00:44:32
Ken Freire
That's a good way to wrap us up, man. In our next episode, what are we talking about, Dan?
00:44:36
Dan Sanchez
In the next episode, we're going to talk more about learning in the light. This process of like being a student, like how does it actually look in the day to day as you're posting about it and sharing about it? We're going get into the nitty gritty a little bit more of social because I find that a lot of people have questions about how to how to actually do more of that practically.
00:44:55
Dan Sanchez
So we're going to about learning in the light, what it means to be a student as you're going through the 30-30 plan, what it looks to start sharing this online with others.