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Salisha Old Bull
1.1k Plays11 months ago
Salisha Old Bull (Salish/Crow) is an Indigenous artist based in Montana. She creates a diverse array of art genres but has an affinity to beadwork.
"I am motivated by the Salish history and Indigenous place-based knowledge. I have learned that place gives a sense of self and allows a person to grow intellectually and continue to explore their possibilities in life. I feel that cultural preservation is a strong influence in my life, and I enjoy combining imagery that reflects cultural values. I use beadwork as an expression of the nature that reflects my tribal heritage. My craftsmanship cannot be possible without the upbringing and teaching of my grandmother, Rachel Arlee Bowers.
I adore beadworking but, also enjoy integrating other genres such as photography, painting, and hint of digital art.
Artistry has been something of a culmination of my academic studies over the years combined with my love for my Bitterroot Salish cultural values and practices. In my time in higher education one of the best moments was learning about place-based education and its interesting relevance to Indigenous ways of knowing.
The basic idea of place-based education and its connection to traditional ecological knowledge is uncanny. Many Indigenous people once depended solely on their environment in reciprocal manner and this was how people were educated. Each person acquired a strength and skill set and most people had an educated connection to the land. This land is what gives a person a strong sense of self-identity. Being grounded allows a person to go forward in life and continue to grow intellectually and explore beyond their basic needs. By evoking this motivation to solidify personal, tribal self-identity, I feel that artistry can empower individuals and empower and motivate them to seek more land knowledge—traditional ecological knowledge.
My overall vision is to create contemporary art, combining traditional, flat-stitch, two-needle, beadwork, with current photography and photo editing techniques. I want to capture the past, the present, and the significance of places that hold deep-seeded history for the Bitterroot Salish. I think by capturing past images and present images with traditional beadwork I can evoke this emotional response and help people to think of their roots and how they can continue to learn the historical context of our land and its ties to our existence. I hope to motivate people to recapture knowledge that is almost gone and revive it by passing it onto younger generations."
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Transcript
Podcast Introduction
00:00:01
Speaker
You are listening to Something Rather Than Nothing, creator and host Ken Vellante, editor and producer Peter Bauer.
Guest Introduction: Salisha Holcomb
00:00:16
Speaker
Hey everybody, this is Ken Vellante from Something Rather Than Nothing and I have Salisha Holcomb reaching her from Vancouver, British Columbia. Salisha, welcome to the show.
00:00:30
Speaker
Thank you. It's great to have you on. And one of the things I just wanted to introduce folks to you and a couple of things I've read about you is that you're an indigenous artist and you create
00:00:49
Speaker
an array of art genres, but have an affinity to beadwork.
Art and Traditional Ecological Knowledge
00:00:54
Speaker
And I actually learned a lot reading your descriptions of the beadwork by the materials that you use. I've never, in my experience, like was reading particularly like the details of where the beadwork was. So that was really great to see. A comment
00:01:14
Speaker
or a statement that I read that I wanted to ask you about immediately because it really interested me. You wrote that I feel that artistry can empower individuals and empower and motivate them to seek more land knowledge, traditional ecological knowledge. Can you tell me about that statement? Because I talk about art a lot, but the connection that you made right there is not one that I've run into much.
Salisha's Art Journey
00:01:44
Speaker
Yeah, I didn't get to do art when I wanted to. And I was very mindful of my mom's wishes. My mom raised me.
00:02:01
Speaker
I suppose I could have changed the minute that I turned 18, but I was set on being in college. And somehow, through the years that I was in my bachelor's degree, I took a lot of, well, in American terms, it's Native American studies courses.
00:02:28
Speaker
And the catch term now that everybody uses is indigenous. And I don't know how long it's going to take for that to get into academia. But everything was defined for me for a historical context once I got to college. So when I was in below college, high school and elementary years, all of my
00:02:58
Speaker
teachings on traditional knowledge came from my family and I didn't get any of that in our school. We did have Native Studies teachers that came in that would try to teach us the language but we weren't exposed to the language enough and consistently enough to pick up
00:03:18
Speaker
anything but like kind of how it is with Spanish like you just pick up a few words here and there and and you remember those words but not enough to get fluent and so in college
00:03:35
Speaker
through the Native Studies courses, the way that they talk about the knowledge that you learn from the land is ecological, it's the ecology, it's the land, ecological knowledge, T-E-K, traditional ecological knowledge. And that's the catch term, the catch phrase for that type of knowledge.
00:04:02
Speaker
And I'd say over the years, while Indigenous people have gotten into academia, whether they were raised with that, whether they were fortunate enough to have that or not, they were able to
00:04:25
Speaker
learn more about it in a formal sense at a college
Experiencing the Santa Fe Art Market
00:04:30
Speaker
level. So if you want to incorporate that into your studies after you start getting permissions to use those topics, it's really hard to do that for some reason. In academia, they discredit that type of knowledge. So I think there was a lot of effort to create labels and terms for
00:04:56
Speaker
the way that we learn as Indigenous people, the way that we would have learned before a school system would have came, the practicality of it.
00:05:11
Speaker
What I mean by my information is, well, for one, I didn't get to really invest in my time with art until the last four or five years. And that was a super traumatic transition for me. And for two,
00:05:39
Speaker
because I do practice my spirituality and I do practice my cultural upbringing. That's where I go with my art and that's what I mean is the things that I learn, I want to express it. And I'm glad that I did get a formal education and so I just put it in those formal terms because also in
00:06:05
Speaker
in art in college it's like there's that expectation of them to for you to define everything in a really in a really formal way and so that I was lucky to have all that like the education before I finally was able to circle back around the art so then I could define it and
00:06:28
Speaker
And so it's just a real fancy way of saying I want to focus on our cultural upbringing and the things that we learn from the land. And I want to use my art to empower our people to be motivated to continue to learn our ways.
Art and Indigenous Identity
00:06:47
Speaker
And that's what that's kind of what I meant by that. Yeah, I know. And thank you. I am, you know, you mentioned like
00:06:58
Speaker
You know, the university and in college structure and one of the things in talking to indigenous guests and exploring say art or even science ecology.
00:07:11
Speaker
is that there's, when you mentioned the discretting or the discounting of the types of knowledge, it's one thing that I learned over the last few years, right? That there's this kind of set, like, can you fit what you're saying into this Western block model of science, art, and et cetera. And I think the vocabulary at times is difficult with your approach to kind of
00:07:40
Speaker
translate or fit into that. One of the areas of science, I was reading a lot of different ways of viewing science, different ways of viewing plants and the language to talk about that and their meaning, their meaning being different. So it's always this like a translation part, but I love what you said there because my brain in looking at like even the materials of your beadwork
00:08:10
Speaker
just at least on the surface understood some of the materials and where they came from. I wanted to ask you about the Santa Fe market. I know you got some recognition there. And I have been down that way to Albuquerque. I've never been to the market. I've read so much about it. Can you tell us what that was like, your recent experience there in the recognition you received?
00:08:41
Speaker
Yeah, there's like no words. I think for myself, I've known about that market since I was a little kid. But growing up, it was always something that was out of reach. So for me, experiencing it was a pretty big deal.
00:09:02
Speaker
I think there's there's some lucky people who their family were already in art and had already participated down there and they grew up attending that market and so they don't look at it the same way but for me it's it's pretty special
00:09:24
Speaker
Just going down
Artistic Process and Challenges
00:09:26
Speaker
there, there was hundreds of artists that they have to jury in. You know, it's an art competition. They have to jury in, and then you don't have to submit a piece, but if you get accepted, you can... I think the point of some people's goal is to be able to table, so they have their...
00:09:52
Speaker
things that they've been making for who knows how long maybe all year maybe just a month worth of work or whatever but some people
00:10:01
Speaker
I've been told they show up down there and that's their income for the whole year. They're going down there with all their work and with a point to make a lot of money. The experience is really drawn out compared to some other Indian art markets that I've been to because it
00:10:23
Speaker
there's like a day when you turn in your work, then there's a day where they judge the work. Then there's a day where they do just, um, celebrating just like, um, award winners. And then also there's a reception and then the market starts the next day. When you're exhausted, when you're exhausted, you'll be like, okay, let's start. Yeah. And, uh,
00:10:52
Speaker
kind of everybody that submits is I mean they're trying really hard it's not even about it's not even about the money well for myself I'm so new but I think once you get into the like really high tiered ribbons I think you can get a little bit of more money but I like those lower tiers like
00:11:16
Speaker
a regular ribbon like a first or a second place. I think there's like judges choices and things like that but they come with less award money so it's not about that it's just about like the competition of it I think is what it is is you submitted something your work is in there there's this gigantic ballroom where they hold all the work for the judging and then that's where
00:11:40
Speaker
they will also show it so they'll open up that room when they're done and like all these people come in and they get to see your ribbon they get to see your work or if you ribboned. The cool thing is they don't separate your work from
00:11:59
Speaker
the other work, which is not true at other shows. Like other shows, they'll separate the award winners from the rest of the work. And the cool thing about this work is you get to see all of the work that was submitted. And so it's not
00:12:15
Speaker
in that way is not discriminatory, which I think is really nice because then you still get that special moment of everybody comes in to see your work that was submitted. And that feels nice. You know, it feels good to be able to participate in that part because other shows that I've gone to, they've done this where they separated. So then they have a reception. And then when you go,
00:12:40
Speaker
Um, it's only award winners. And so you already go knowing, Oh, I didn't win. Yeah. Yeah. Just kind of bopping around looking at people. What am I supposed to do? You're like eating the orders. You're like, Hmm, what do I eat next? And, uh, then.
00:12:59
Speaker
The market is so many people. The first year I went was last, not this year, but the year before last. And it rained. I was so cold. And they opened up a new section of the plaza area this year. So it kind of extended past where I was set up this year. And it got really, really hot.
00:13:26
Speaker
and I don't live there so I don't live in that climate region so I was kind of dying like about 3 p.m. and they have they have it set up all over that plaza area and it extends out like on the different streets and and oh man it's just a really good experience to do and then they have a lot of other things going on but
00:13:59
Speaker
It's a pretty good thing to experience as an Indigenous artist for those who like to participate in art markets. There's just a lot going on and there's so many people that you can meet, like other artists that you can meet in. It is really awesome.
00:14:18
Speaker
I knew before I asked that I maybe shouldn't ask because I get like really excited where I want to go now. So thank you so much for the description. I thought about it a whole bunch and I've just made my way down there traveling, but I'm coming in contact with
00:14:38
Speaker
that are in hearing about that market is going to make it special for me to see some time. I wanted to ask you this. We've been banding about the term art, but Silesia, what do you think art is? What's art for you? What is art?
00:15:04
Speaker
I guess I sort of see it as two things. For me, I think it's always been, you know, just being really skilled in a craft. Gosh, I am so, I have like no vocabulary most of the time. I like to say stuff a lot. I feel like it's like when you
00:15:32
Speaker
You're just so skilled at a craft and you have a passion to continue to do it, you know, and it makes you happy. Like those are the type of things, or maybe it's like for myself, like with beadwork, it's that. It's like the thing that was given to me by my grandmother. And it's so invaluable and
00:16:02
Speaker
It's also something that's not easy. I think art is not easy. I think people think that, but it's not easy. It takes so much thought and so much before you're even doing it. You're kind of thinking about it for a long time before you do it, and you could be working on other things, but it's always healing. It's a healing process.
00:16:31
Speaker
The funny thing is I think that there's too much emphasis for myself. This is the unpopular opinion as people say, oh, you have to do this with a good heart. Oh, you have to, you know, you have to be in a good mindset. But for me, it's like, well,
00:16:50
Speaker
We're not always like that. I mean, human beings are not always happy. We're not always happy. And a lot of time, you know, we're going through something and a lot of time, not your time to be able to sit and reflect. And if I
00:17:10
Speaker
If I didn't bead every single time I was feeling down or bad or whatever, man, I would get nothing done. I would get nothing. Like you need to go through that and work it through that way. Yeah. Like I need it to be able to go on with life. Like I feel like.
00:17:36
Speaker
It's just a part of my, I wouldn't say my worth, but something about that. It's something about being able to move forward and take steps in my own life. And even if I wasn't trying to sell any of those things that I made, it would still feel that way because those things are connected to
00:18:02
Speaker
who I want to be as a Salish woman or a Crow woman. I want to be able to have that skill and I want to be able to provide those things for my family and I want to be able to
00:18:20
Speaker
be there if my family needs to know those things. I don't want to put it down and let it go and then say, oh, I used to be a long time ago. I hear people say that and I'm thinking, why don't you still be? You want to watch Netflix and you don't want to be.
00:18:37
Speaker
why? Yeah, you got it. It's kind of like the things that breathing or something. Yeah, it's like, that's like a
Art, Land, and Identity
00:18:47
Speaker
part of the day, like you should be able to have something to do during the day, even if you weren't selling those things. And to me, that's, that's what it is, you know, and, and, um, I really do enjoy learning other forms, but my heart always goes back to
00:19:04
Speaker
trying to incorporate beadwork into everything. And so for me, that's art is having that skill that sort of helps you get through life. And it's a part of it. It's tied into it. It's part of the balance of just being during the day, during a daily basis.
00:19:27
Speaker
Yeah, well, thank you for your for your beautiful artwork. I enjoy the photography and painting as well. When you're talking about going to beadwork and that I love that when you're talking about like need that and
00:19:41
Speaker
whatever you're going through that, that's for you in creation. But what's the process? I mean, do you ever, let me ask this question. I mean, like, you ever in a, like thinking about painting, is there something that, at least the process for you to go through that that's different? Because you're skilled in different areas of beadwork being primary. What does say either the photography or the painting are for you and your art process do for you?
00:20:13
Speaker
Well, for me, the photography is something that I wanted to have. I wanted to learn it. I don't practice it enough, but I wanted to learn it because I think that it helps with framing imagery. Like a photographer knows ratios, they know how much of something needs to be within a frame.
00:20:35
Speaker
And I use that with everything that I do. Like it's not just photography, it's like painting or drawing or beading too. Like I use those tips and everything. And so also I wish that I had more time so that I could do that. But then the painting, why do I like,
00:21:05
Speaker
the painting is not more about.
00:21:07
Speaker
that if I can paint, it's more about the color. I really like color theory. I like the color theory and I like the ability to be able to produce a color. And I didn't really get as much teaching on that either as I would have liked. And I think that's why with the other things that I like to do, I don't do them as much because I didn't have enough training in them to
00:21:37
Speaker
to feel like a spark to keep going back to it. And I will do it if somebody asks me. And if it's something that I haven't done, I'll study a process like the formal process. But for me, it's like the
00:21:59
Speaker
being able to focus and I relate a lot of things to non-indigenous techniques, I don't know what to call them formal techniques. I relate a lot of those things to what I know from my own background, like the things that we do and I like to see how to substitute those things or how to
00:22:26
Speaker
frame it into my own perspective and so I think that for myself it's important to learn what non-indigenous artists and teachers do because I don't know I've been asked about it before and I found and this is an unpopular thing too but to me it's the most helpful thing in my whole life
00:22:54
Speaker
is I found that being non-discriminatory about everything in the learning process is far more beneficial than trying to just segregate, you know, is it a native teaching? Is it not a native teaching? Is this our ways? This is not our ways, you know, and trying to include the best of everything into what I do seems to be
00:23:21
Speaker
It seems to work best, you know, it seems to be able to, where I'm not separating things. I don't like doing that. I like to be able to bring in best practices of people and try out new things. And probably like a lot of artists, you know, I don't get to try everything that I want to try, but, you know, I have hopes.
00:23:46
Speaker
Yeah. I have hopes to try it. It's like, one day I want to try oil painting. And then I think, I don't know when I'm ever going to do that. Oh my god. Yeah. That seems, hey, we should all be open to different art forms. And I certainly am. I painted, but somebody, please, please, please help with the application of oil paint. And I have no patience. I need help. Because I have no patience either. I'm like, this thing should be dried. I want to do something with it.
00:24:16
Speaker
I really loved listening to your different types of integration and knowledge. One of the things, I started the podcast four years ago, and I just thought art. And I probably thought about art in traditional ways, maybe from the university. But then the show
00:24:35
Speaker
just really develop in a different direction based on my guests and my curiosity and learning. And I learned so much from indigenous guests. I'll tell you one, I was talking to Steph Littlebird, painter-designer.
00:24:51
Speaker
and she was describing to me like color because I was like asking about the color she used and she was describing about pow wow and the motion and color and I gotta tell you like at that point I was able to see I was able to see things
00:25:10
Speaker
that I didn't see the magnificent fluorescence in the flow. It was there, but something in my brain needed to be able to open up and see it. And another piece too, as far as me thinking about the integration of
00:25:28
Speaker
of the land and art. I'm a big fan of the music artist, musical artists, Black Belt Eagle Scout. And in her last, in her last album is the land, the sky, and the sea.
Cultural Heritage and Identity
00:25:42
Speaker
And there's these
00:25:44
Speaker
There's these beautiful elements of nature and running river and songs about salmon. I was so influenced by it. When I'm in the water or in a river, I'll listen to it in the river. And that was one of these art experiences of learning where I don't know what my experience was exactly, but I understood more deeply
00:26:10
Speaker
something that I didn't understand before, didn't think about it. There's an aspect where art sometimes seems, the way we talk about it, that it's so separate, right? Like, am I seeing it at the Guggenheim in a perfectly lighted type thing? And I think we think about it that way sometimes. So what I also wanted to ask is,
00:26:37
Speaker
And you've gotten at this a bit, but I do want to formally ask you, the role of art in creation, or is there something about being an artist right now that you feel is more important, just in the sense of the role of the artist in the world?
00:27:00
Speaker
Yeah, I think right now it is it is really important. I don't think I don't think it's more or less important than what it was. I think I think there is like this this urgency right now, though, like an indigenous nations to get back to their ways. And right now there's so much politics going on about identity and
00:27:29
Speaker
I think as artists, we have that agency to be able to help people to really grasp onto something that's tangible because there's so many skills within different tribes that you can learn that would result in some type of adornment.
00:27:55
Speaker
that being able to have a commitment to learning is a huge part of identity and I think
00:28:09
Speaker
I think people who want to be more forgiving of what it is to be indigenous, they'll say it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. Like they'll say things like that, but it does matter because because we are putting we're putting some I mean, how do you measure something? You know, how do you measure like
00:28:29
Speaker
what it is to be indigenous, like it does matter. And part of that is having a tie to your culture, you know, or in my mind, it's a commitment. I think it's a commitment to the culture.
00:28:44
Speaker
But for me, I have three daughters that I didn't give birth to, but I raised them. And I make sure to tell them things, including our craftsmanship. I'm like, you need to learn how to do this. And when they were younger, it was even more so like, if somebody's showing this, you need to pay attention. You need to help. You need to learn how to put application to it because
00:29:14
Speaker
In the end, there's always this one phase of life in your 20s. People think it's like when you have a midlife crisis, it's like when you get older. That actually happens. It happens in your 20s when you get older. Here's a note to listeners. It can happen a few times. Don't feel you're going to wait for the midlife. Who knows if it was that way, but it ain't that way.
00:29:43
Speaker
I know, and it's like you cry from 21 to 29. You just cry all the time. And so I think it's important to have taught them as kids or younger people to grasp onto something. And for me, because I've learned how much everything is tied to our stories, which is tied to our land,
00:30:10
Speaker
That gives such a strong tie to identity. So knowing where you are, knowing where you are.
00:30:20
Speaker
helps you to know who you are. And so that role, it's pretty important, you know, it's pretty important to have a commitment to tell yourself, well, I'm going to continue to learn this skill. I'm going to continue to do it. And then it's like any skill that was like, you have to practice it. And I think, I think that's where people sort of
00:30:50
Speaker
I suppose there's a lot of other opinions, but that's my opinion. I feel like if you're not going to put the commitment into that and then try to come around and tell me that it doesn't matter, I don't believe that. It's like it does matter because I work real hard to
00:31:09
Speaker
to do those things. And those things are sometimes tied to my cultural or my spiritual beliefs. And those spiritual beliefs help me in my daily life. So I'm not just going to take it lightly or
00:31:32
Speaker
I'm not gonna be super empathetic to a person who doesn't wanna make a commitment to who they are and their way of life and the things that, the hard work, it's hard work, that's what it is. It's the hard work that goes into it and yeah, and it's tied to identity. So as an indigenous person, yeah, I get real philosophical about it, but I feel like that's the expectation and that's what I,
00:32:01
Speaker
I want to make sure that I am clear about it for myself so you know I'm not going to get lost in it and just trying to be you know good about it and just trying to make sure that because I am responsible for kids I want to make sure that they understand it and yeah so things like
00:32:25
Speaker
the craftsmen, I think about a lot of other craftsmanship. It's not just beadwork. There's a lot of things that go into producing some of the things that we use to dress ourselves in, like tanning hides. That's a whole thing.
00:32:44
Speaker
What is the word everybody uses now? I say gathering, but it makes me laugh when people say harvesting. We're going to go harvest and like, no, just you're going to go gather. Just go get it.
Philosophy of Art and Personal Experience
00:32:58
Speaker
Just get it. You don't have to say harvest. They're like, gather, you know, items for dyes or and that's like a whole thing. You know, there's all this knowledge that you have to know or there's
00:33:13
Speaker
What was the one that's, oh, quill work. That's a whole nother thing. And, uh, God, there's so much, there's so many things and it depends on where you're from. There's weaving. There's all types of weaving. I mean, I don't know that there's just so much in it and it is tied so strongly to identity. So that's the role. That's where I put it. That's where I hold it at. Yeah. Yeah.
00:33:40
Speaker
Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. I ask a lot of questions, like, you know, looking for answers in philosophy. And I kind of know that as heavy as it gets, sometimes it drops down. One of the pieces for me is that, like, I ask these questions, but I know for me, art sometimes is complete mystery. And I'll give you one example. It was an artist, Raven Juarez, and it was during the, she does some painting.
00:34:08
Speaker
And it was during the wildfires are out here in the Pacific Northwest scared the shit out of me. It was like, is it going to like blow all the way across the side? I've never seen or heard anything like it before. Um, I'm an East coaster. So, but, uh, uh, so, so that was in, um, Raven did a painting that I bumped into later. That was from my dream. That was like a dream that I had of like, um,
00:34:36
Speaker
fire trees, animals, and I was just startled. Like I was just startled. And it was the type of thing where within philosophy, right? Like, oh, we're talking. We want to explain things. And what's the answer? Knowing full well, I can't explain anything about me seeing a painting from another artist who I've never met in person. And I saw something that was in my head.
00:35:04
Speaker
like in how do you explain that? And I think even in this like investigation and inquiry, I know that a lot of times art just kind of seems to be like, how did that happen? Like how did that occur? Yeah, that's like, what do they say when you see something that means you're doing something you were meant to do? Yeah.
00:35:30
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I don't, I think, I don't know, like, I think that's the thing too is I feel like within indigenous art, like, there's a lot of expression of that. And I get surprised when, when people share that, you know, because it's a pretty personal thing. Yeah. Yeah.
00:35:55
Speaker
But I guess if, if you feel like you want to share something super personal, I guess that that's what it can be, you know, and, uh, I don't know. I think it just depends on what the purpose is of, of, you know, what it is. And sometime you're doing it because it was like that situation, like she had to do it because probably it was meant to be seen, you know? Yeah. Yeah.
00:36:24
Speaker
I want to ask you a couple more questions, the big one speaking of philosophical questions. Why is there something rather than nothing? There's always something.
00:36:41
Speaker
There's always something and it's just, oh. That's what I feel when I hear that question. There's always something. It almost sounds like a complaint at a certain point. Jesus, always something. So much. So I think where I take that is like in trying to have
00:37:07
Speaker
peaceful life or like a good situation or I guess really where I take that isn't my sobriety. There's always something like
00:37:25
Speaker
sort of the way it was put to me is like if being good was so easy, then everybody would do it. And if making good choices was so easy, everybody would do it. And so it comes down to it's not. And so that's where that went for me is there's always something
00:37:48
Speaker
that will test you like all the time. Like you, you have to go through some weird thing. And then I feel like it's like you have like this, this baby graduation that nobody knows about. Like, Oh, I did that in life.
Beadwork and Personal Growth
00:38:02
Speaker
And now I know how to go through that. Uh, that's why there's, that's why there's not nothing is because nothing is like the bad. It's like the bad is like, uh,
00:38:17
Speaker
blowing off your responsibilities and never having to go through the consequences.
00:38:27
Speaker
God, there's people like that and I don't know how they get through life like that. They somehow always get away with everything. They make a bad decision and maybe it's just that I'm not seeing the bad things that they go through, but they seem to always have, they get to travel, they get money, they get to go all these places and do all these things and never have to, they never have to pay for living this lavish, easy life or whatever. But it's like doing
00:38:58
Speaker
Just trying to have a good life and trying to get through it and you have your ugly cry moments and you have your, I don't know, that's where I take it is. There's always something and it's that thing that makes you stronger. Whatever it is, it's going through something hardcore and it makes you stronger. And then all of a sudden, one day you get to say,
00:39:25
Speaker
You're adopted. You're adopted. I made it. I made it through. I made it through. Leveled up. Made it through. Yeah. And there's something about that too, like the private part of, like you said, where you know, like as an individual or an artist, as far as like that piece. And yeah, it's a silent, a silent part of, um, silent part of it. All right. Uh, I have to, uh, before, before I let you go, Silesh, I want to,
00:39:52
Speaker
Here's the frustration of the audio. Wonderful talking to you, but I need to point the listeners to where they can see, see your beautiful artwork. Can you, can you tell us where to find your artwork? Yeah. Uh, so like I have this little portfolio that I have trouble keeping up with. Um, but it's at say the shop or dot com, but then I have, um, Instagram.
00:40:19
Speaker
And I have two profiles. One has nothing on it because that profile got hacked and I never went back to it, but it functions. That one's nothing. The other one's something. The other one has a whole bunch of stuff on it. And that one is, uh, say Leisha bull. It's like part of my, I took part of my last name out because, um, now I have two accounts. Anyway, that's my life. Um, and then I have a Facebook page because I'm old school like that.
00:40:49
Speaker
Old school. Yeah, say we show a board. Well, thank you so much. I really enjoy your artwork. And I want to thank you, too, for, like I said at the beginning, too, on the beadwork. I'm very curious. And being able to read and understand a bit more, like that my brain not as knowledgeable of beadwork, but being able to understand composition.
Podcast Conclusion
00:41:18
Speaker
It's a real thrill for me and kind of helps propel me to look and understand more.
00:41:26
Speaker
I want to thank you so much for coming on to the show, um, in, in sharing your thoughts, uh, in, in your artwork and about the Santa Fe experience. That was a, that was a, that was a thrill for me. Um, you know, being newer to visiting that era, not getting over to Santa Fe, but hearing about something so big, so grand that a lot of people talk about him reference, um, was really exciting, um, uh, to see. So, um,
00:41:54
Speaker
Yeah, thanks again, and I hope we get the chance to talk again in the future. Yeah, that'd be awesome. Yeah, thank you for having me. I'm excited. Thanks, Alicia. Alright, thank you. This is something rather than nothing.
00:42:23
Speaker
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00:42:44
Speaker
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00:43:12
Speaker
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