Episode 173 - YFCSurself

Transcript

Zach: I'm Zach and I'm recording from my bathroom.

Ben: I'm Ben and I forgot how to do this completely.

Zach: Oh my God. Well, at least you remembered your name.

Ben: It is weird. This is definitely the longest break we've taken. And um

Zach: Five years.

Ben: yeah, I know. It feels like we've never done that. It almost feels like we never even recorded before in a way.

Zach: Right? i mean, um our fifth anniversary of our first upload passed us right on by back in September.

Ben: Oh my god. That's crazy.

Zach: Yeah, because it really doesn't feel like it's been five years.

Ben: No.

Zach: In some ways, it feels like it's been 10 years. In other ways, it feels like it's been a year and a half.

Ben: Yeah. Yeah, I mean, like, the first couple of episodes feel like they happened a long time ago. But then the... You know what's a blur, honestly, with the show is everything from, like, January through April of 2020. Like, pre-COVID 2020 is a... For some reason in my brain, it's like this blank spot.

Zach: We had some guests on and um that's of course the timeline of when we did our very first meetup in San Antonio.

Ben: Everything... Yeah.

Ben: Yeah. Like, um I kind of remember most of the guests. But, and then February was, the meetup was February, right?

Zach: Yeah. Like very end of February going into March.

Ben: Yeah. Okay. That's right.

Zach: Because like it feels like maybe two weeks after ah we all got back home from that trip, the whole world shut down or started shutting down.

Ben: Yeah, i so I went to work. i had I went to Sacramento for work right after that trip. And then when I got back from that work trip on that Thursday, that's when, yeah, but at least for us, that's when it started pretty much.

Ben: the And then like the week after that, everything shut down. We were frozen from travel and well,

Zach: Yeah, we all remember how that went.

Zach: But ah yeah, that was, it's it's it's crazy to be back, and i' I'm glad though. um

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: Last time we recorded was just for for posterity, I guess.

Ben: Especially.

Zach: I don't know. July was our last episode.

Ben: Did it ever. did it ah Did it get uploaded?

Zach: Yes.

Ben: Okay.

Ben: Cause I was trying to remember what.

Zach: But we also were on break basically from March through July.

Ben: Okay. So.

Zach: Because we didn't upload after March until July.

Ben: Okay.

Zach: We uploaded that one time. And here we are.

Ben: Okay. All right. Well, there's a lot of catching up to do, I guess. I was just trying to like get bearings because guess I've already talked about, I've already shared my thoughts on Wrath of Rakshasa then.

Ben: so I don't know if I want to like repeat that. It's also old.

Zach: I think we both did.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: But it was a new for 2025 coaster, so we can tread this covered ground. Retread.

Ben: Yeah. Well, what's funny is like out of all the time that we started recording the show, I rode the most roller coasters and been to the most parks during the time we've recorded the least.

Ben: So I suppose that's how it works when you have a podcast about a specific topic.

Zach: Yeah.

Ben: but

Zach: Well, maybe you needed the break to um reset and kind of go have the experience more to be able to refresh and come back to it.

Ben: Yeah. Okay. So our last episode, we did discuss Wrath of Rakshasa. Okay. That makes sense. Okay.

Zach: Yeah, well, I mean.

Ben: So basically, it was our little California trip and then new for 2025 home park dive coaster. And then basically, that's where we got to pick up from.

Zach: Yeah, yeah. So I guess we'll start off with a quick shout out to our buddy Lance for hanging out with us in Southern California almost a year ago.

Ben: Yep.

Zach: Because that was, a what was that, like early March, late February?

Ben: That was, yeah, that sounds right. I think it was like mayte March 1st or something close.

Zach: Yeah, yeah. That was a blast. It was a great time. Really enjoyed that. um

Zach: Let's see. Yeah, we both got to ride Wrath of Rakshasa, but not at the same time. ah

Zach: On the whole, i would say, yeah.

Ben: And I was.

Ben: Yeah, I was. Well, I what's funny is like I want to talk shit about the new BNM stuff, but I actually didn't experience any roughness on the ride, but I also got stuck either dead center or just left or right of center.

Ben: So I was always above the track. I didn't feel roughness, but I believe that it was rough and I'm on board to believe that new B&Ms are rough.

Ben: so And I fully anticipate that the the Giga Dive is going to produce some Giga Rattles.

Zach: Well, thank you for but not being agnostic about the rattle of wrath of Rakshasa.

Ben: But...

Ben: is it too rough to enjoy the ride? I don't know. But like, is it annoying? Yeah. Like that's why I think that's, what's funny. i never, it will, first of all, I never thought the industry would be at the point where people are are acknowledging an obvious roughness to BNMs, but also people now defending BNMs and being like, Oh, like you're just being negative. Like, um,

Ben: you know, oh, you're weak, you're just being negative, you never have anything nice to say about a park or about a ride. And i think the obvious thing is, well, if it's a 20 plus year old company that's been producing a specific type of ride and experience and suddenly that quality goes down, I think it's fair for everyone to complain about it. So I don't know why our other manufacturers do not have this problem. It's only BNM.

Ben: So,

Zach: Well,

Zach: I don't know. Like,

Zach: they must have, I don't know what the thing is, because like, yeah, I mean, Intamin stuff now, doesn't really it functions differently than the Intamin stuff from like the early 2000s, at least in terms of the lap bars and the placement of the seating and all that.

Ben: Sure.

Ben: Yeah. But I mean, you can ride one of the Ride of Steel clones and it's not um you know compressing the discs in your neck when you go down the bottom of a drop.

Zach: but Yeah, and i'm and I'm also trying to just make the point that Intamin has kind of evolved.

Ben: It's... Yeah.

Zach: Whereas B&M are like, I don't know, Vester Strains.

Ben: Yeah. And the and I, it's still like, I want the company to succeed because obviously like they're doing a giga dive. Like that's a giga dive.

Zach: That's sick in theory.

Ben: Yeah. A giga dive with two Emmelman, no three Emmelmans

Ben: and a cutback. Is it five inversions?

Zach: Uh,

Ben: Oh yeah, there's a giant yeah five giant loop. Three Immelmans, one giant loop, and a cutback.

Ben: So it it looks like it could be I mean, like I guess if you're gonna... That's a thing, like a dive coaster was never... I never was really like that tickled by them. But it's if you're going to do a dive coaster, at least in my mind, it's like, oh, well, it should be 300 feet. like If you're going to have a cool dive coaster, it should be you know it should be a giga.

Zach: Well, to be fair to be fair, I think um Oblivion like looks sick, and that concept of just like having it drop underground for like a good portion of the drop, if it's not super big, is also cool.

Ben: So

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: But Oblivion's the only one ever fucking done that.

Ben: Yeah. I mean, it's and it's also the prototype. So it's, it's, it's, they, it's almost like they, i don't know.

Zach: Ugh.

Ben: I mean, obviously I don't know how the conversation worked, but Alton Towers was like, Hey, we want to do something cool. We want to build like a tall coaster with a drop. And they probably went to BNM and then BNM probably designed that style of coaster around the limitations of Alton Towers.

Ben: And then suddenly parks are like, oh, that's a cool gimmick. And then, you know, copy paste.

Zach: Let's see. Tormenta. Yeah, I mean, fuck. 309. Drop is 285. There's going to be some Kings Island fanboys

Ben: Oh, sure.

Zach: ripping that one for sure.

Ben: Yeah, because it's it's a reverse Orion situation.

Zach: Yeah.

Ben: And I will say, too, that um the looking at the photos, so something that I've always been kind of, don't know what the word is,

Ben: like sensitive to it on dive coasters is if you're going to build a dive coast, you need some really good, midway interaction.

Ben: And it looks like that is the case for the entrance by that parking lot. Um, but looking at the renderings, there's really no part of the midway that gets close to the ride.

Ben: And that's one complaint I have. Because like i the like Shigra and Griffin definitely do it best. Where when you're standing on the midway and the like the angle that you're looking at the drop and the ride run, like it looks like it was very...

Ben: designed and curated for that type of experience. And then Ratharak Shasta doesn't really have that, but it has like the, you know, the the midway goes through the ride, which is cool.

Ben: um

Ben: So yeah, that's my only complaint. Otherwise it looks cool. I mean, I'll be excited to ride it. I don't know how the rattle is going to be. i hope it's not super bad on 300 foot drop, but

Zach: I mean, my experience with Wrath of Rakshasa was like the drop was dope. But it's everything where there's any kind of like banking or, you know, movement on that axis.

Ben: yeah

Ben: yeah which in that case it's good because all the high speed stuff doesn't really have much paint cane it looks like um

Zach: Look.

Ben: Because all the banking and like the Immelman should be happening when the train is weightless. So hopefully that kind of alleviates that. Also, I noticed too, the first Immelman has more of a kind of a elongated inversion. So it looks like there should actually be some decent floater when you come out of it

Zach: Yeah, it looks interesting. It definitely has that like large half loop from RCT3 look to it.

Ben: is

Ben: And then, yeah the cutback at the end.

Ben: i mean, it all also, it's going to have eight across. So yeah, I'm curious. I hope this isn't like the nail in the coffin for BNM because if anything, their quality is going to go down every year.

Ben: It's not like it's going to – like this idea that suddenly they're going to figure something out and it's going to get better I think is a long shot. um But at a certain point, if it there really is an issue with quality or manufacturing that's causing this roughness to new B&Ms, there will be a point where a line is crossed.

Ben: and Because that's kind of like the argument against it Usually people are like, oh, well, like the GP doesn't notice and they'll still ride it and you know no one's like getting injured. It's not a big deal.

Ben: But at a certain at a certain point, at the line will be crossed to where people will be like, that was rough.

Ben: And they're not going to want to get on it again. um So we'll see.

Zach: Yeah, i

Ben: um I might get out next year, give it a try.

Zach: I'm kind of wondering how like Wrath of Rakshasa's Qs are going to be 2026. twenty six

Ben: Yeah, I suppose it's a good test. um Because obviously the first season, it's hard to tell because, you know, I think any new ride is going to pull guests, but yeah, we'll see.

Ben: If it has like a 20 minute wait next year, then it's clear that it's not a, it's not a fan favorite. Although.

Ben: don't know. We'll see.

Ben: i will say though, like when I wrote it the people's reaction around it were actually very positive and people were talking up the ride and they were, they thought it was a good, you know, they thought it was great.

Ben: So

Zach: Same, but that doesn't necessarily translate to re-rides.

Ben: yeah, that's true.

Zach: Because some people would be like, I rode that one last year. I'm good, maybe, or something. You know what i mean

Ben: Yeah. Yeah.

Zach: mean? I remember, it's like my parents, where it would be like my dad would be like, ah that one's okay, but I'd rather ride something else.

Ben: Yeah.

Ben: And it's clear that I think in that park, the big GP draws are still Superman, Max Force, V2, and Raging Bull.

Zach: And Goliath.

Ben: Does Goliath still pull? I guess like, yeah, I guess it has to.

Ben: When I was

Zach: Yeah, I mean, part of that is just like the capacity is not fantastic, you know?

Ben: Yeah. Yeah. And that's kind of like what I always think though, is like, this is a, like, this is still a pair of fairly like, because when I was there this year, um, it only had like a 20 minute wait.

Ben: Like basically Goliath was a 20 minute wait. And then raging bowl was a 20 minute wait. And so if you think about the capacity per hour or like, you know, people per hour on those two comparisons, like raging bowl, 20 minutes makes sense.

Ben: But for Goliath, that means that there's only like, what, like 150 to maybe 200 people online? mean, it's not that much.

Zach: Like, where was the line visually?

Ben: It was,

Zach: Like in the Q house?

Ben: no, it was in front of the station.

Zach: Okay.

Ben: Like on that flat, like when you come out of the Q house, you know, it's like flat and then you're right next to the, you're like below the station, right in front of the old sign for iron. Like, you know, like when you, if you were standing right in front of the iron wolf sign.

Zach: Yeah.

Ben: Yeah. It was like right there.

Ben: And then Batman was like 30 minutes. Yeah.

Zach: That makes sense.

Ben: for two trains. Um, I don't think, yeah, I don't, I don't think Goliath is unpopular. i I just, I'm curious if that's one of those weird perceptions, but as enthusiasts were like, Oh, of course the RMC is going to be the most popular, but I don't know if RMCs translate to GP popularity.

Zach: and No, I just, it's always seems to have a long line when I've been there.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: Like it's in the queue house.

Ben: But it's, Yeah, but it's but also it's it's like hourly capacity is, i think it's the same as what Deja Vu was. It's in like the mid upper Yeah, yeah.

Zach: Yeah, that's what I was saying. Like, the capacity is not great. So, like, that definitely, like, inflates the queue time, obviously.

Ben: yeah yeah

Zach: But, yeah, so I don't know. But, yeah, it'll be interesting to see if Wrath of Rakshasa becomes one of the, like, heavy hitters of the park lineup, so to speak.

Ben: Yeah. I mean, also it is in the center of the park and because of its beyond vertical drop, I could see it. It'll probably be okay.

Ben: I mean, unless it gets like ungodly rough, but um I think, i think it's a location probably will do it a lot of favors.

Ben: And i guess I guess just from like my perspective, i I already sort of forget the ride is there. like In my mind, it hasn't quite left that impression yet, unlike the other rides.

Ben: um But yeah.

Zach: Well, here, let's see if um I'm checking right now if Sif Gam World has updated their banner.

Zach: Maybe.

Ben: No, that's...

Zach: oh yeah, I guess it is.

Ben: But then where's X-Flight? I think I know what you're talking about. oh wait. Okay, so there's V2.

Ben: Oh, yeah. Yeah, that is it.

Zach: Remember when,

Ben: Wait, are you sure? Wait, are you sure though? That's not X-Flight. cause are are you talking about the one? no that is it because there's the M-M-M-M.

Zach: yep.

Ben: So then X-Flight's missing.

Ben: Right. There's no.

Ben: Cause I see, you see, I see demon.

Ben: Boliath, Batman. Yeah, I don't think there's X-Flight.

Zach: Well, shit.

Ben: Unless X-Flight is underneath the first turnaround on Raging Bull. Kind of above Demon. Where like all that track kind of blends together.

Zach: Yeah, it might be. It's hard to tell in that area because there's like...

Ben: Yeah. Yeah.

Zach: Everything is like shadowed, you know?

Ben: yeah

Zach: I know the exact like angle from the parking lot that that like... angle is from.

Zach: But yeah. um

Zach: Remember when Cedar Point's website had the the little trains going?

Ben: Yeah, that was pretty cool. And you could even, um, there was even settings in like the flash panel and you could turn certain rides on and off and like change the speed of it and stuff.

Ben: I used to, cause, um, don't know if you remember, did you ever have the, the shockwave player on your computer?

Zach: Yeah.

Ben: where you could like download shock like ah Flash games and stuff. um You could download that Cedar Point thing in the like player, and then you could play with like the settings.

Ben: or something It was something like that.

Ben: Good old Flash.

Zach: Wild. I just remember looking at that and being really entertained because that was what the internet was 2002.

Ben: Mm-hmm.

Zach: If were 13.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: if you are thirteen

Ben: Yeah. I mean, I remember that flash shit probably, I think they had it in 2000 when millennium force was built because i remember playing on the website before we went on our first time.

Ben: And then at nighttime, the skyline would change and it'd get dark. And then the millennium force lift hill would change colors.

Zach: the Yeah, the lights.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: Yep.

Ben: Yeah, that was cool.

Zach: Bring it back.

Ben: um But yeah, actually, it was weird. After this summer, i um think I'm going back to being like a Cedar Fair fanboy.

Ben: i think my days of six, I think my stays of Six Flags are numbered.

Zach: Okay.

Ben: Even though it's all we're all Six Flags.

Zach: You know, it's one company now, right?

Ben: No, I know.

Zach: Yeah.

Ben: But...

Zach: hu

Ben: Yeah, we're all Six Flags these days. But... um Because especially, like, i also do think that... I think I've said this before, but Great America definitely should be a Cedar Fair park.

Zach: It is.

Ben: i and I know that. I just mean like in in its like, what do you call it? It's in like the mindset. Like if, I don't know, there was a yeah U-turn in the 80s or 90s and Cedar Fair bought it instead of Six Flags, that park would be in like a much better shape.

Ben: Because the Marriott stuff is closer, more closer aligned with Cedar Fair than Six Flags and you know, Takis and superhero stuff, you know?

Zach: Oh, oh, so it's too good for six legs.

Ben: Well, I mean, think about the whole, well, I guess like the Cedar fair to me is very like, uh, it's very Americana just in that's like general theme and great America is ah an Americana theme park.

Ben: And so it just sort of, there's like a handshake there. Whereas when it was six flags, you're having superhero themed things and like Yankee Harbor. And i don't know. It's just, uh, obviously like we're used to it. And so as a kid, you know, like growing up as kids, they're like be going on Batman and Superman and stuff. And I think that that nostalgic connection is there, but if you take a step back and like, Oh, I've never stepped foot in this park. I think it's better as a Cedar fair park.

Zach: Yes, I guess I can see that.

Ben: which Just my opinion.

Zach: Hey, I need to take a break for one sec.

Zach: We're back. Okay. um Yeah, so i I think I can get on board with what you're saying about Cedar Fair being more aligned culturally with Great America's inherently.

Zach: inherently

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: But I also kind of look at California's Great America. Granted, that had a lot of paramount influence.

Ben: Oh, Paramount ripped everything out of that park pretty much. Like that's what i think that's like what the difference is. And even within King's Dominion and King's Island that and or Carowinds even.

Ben: i always forget that one was Paramount too, is that like the Paramount, like Paramount did a number on those parks. um So it's a little different, whereas at least Six Flags, I think.

Ben: Kept a lot of it. and at least a great America or gurney, great America, like for the most part, things are intact. Like the basic infrastructure is still there.

Ben: Um,

Zach: I mean, ah California's Great America, it's basically like the

Zach: left and know the right side of the park from entry is still kind of intact.

Ben: mm-hmm.

Zach: But everything on the right is funky past Orleans Square or Orleans Place.

Ben: Yeah. Yeah, that's true.

Ben: Yeah, and I think... um

Ben: Yeah, I don't know. I guess so it's hard to say. like Maybe, i don't know, maybe in a way Six Flags preserved it. Because I also remember the Warner Brothers days were actually pretty good at the park. And from what I heard, too, is that um When Warner Brothers owned Six Flags, they definitely put more investment into Great America.

Ben: And then i think over Six Flags' newer management, the park the or the chain was just struggling so much that they weren't able to put the money that they needed to into Great America.

Ben: And then ah now I think Cedar Fair wants to make Great America. It's, you know, one of its more higher tier invested in parks. So hopefully that's the case because I think it deserves it. I mean, it's probably on par with like Kings Island and Cedar Point as far as like attendance and revenue and stuff.

Zach: Yeah, no, it's that's the thing. is like I think

Zach: i can't imagine any of their parks still, even after with Six Flags, anything outperforming Knott.

Ben: No.

Zach: So let's put Knott's to the side. We'll say the other top performer.

Ben: And that's and that's its own thing, too. Like, that's not even like that's a special case, that pork.

Zach: Well, it's just, yeah, it's because it operates 364 days of the year and it's so close to Disneyland.

Zach: So it's, yeah, it's, it's in in its own kind of thing. um so putting that aside, i got to imagine top performers in the full portfolio, probably um Cedar Point, Kings Island,

Zach: Carowinds.

Zach: Great adventure, great America. Maybe Magic Mountain.

Ben: I think Great Adventure and Magic Mountain are kind of at the bottom. like they're i think from what i I mean, I could be wrong, but I think with those parks is that their revenue is high, but their cost of operation is also very high.

Ben: um And then also, magic I think Magic Mountain's problem is that because it's year-round, there's a lot of days where it just doesn't make any money.

Ben: I think great and I think great adventure wasn't really near that. don't know. I could be wrong. I think like what makes Kings Island Cedar point in great America successful is just that they're short seasons and pretty much there's no dead days at that park.

Ben: Like are those three parks like pretty much when it's open between Memorial day and labor day, or, and actually I guess even if you can count fright fest to like, Those parks are pretty much slammed every day they operate.

Zach: Yeah, they're turning the turnstiles for sure. But I mean, that's the thing is like Magic Mountain is weekends only during the offseason, you know.

Zach: It's not like 365 like it used to be.

Ben: Let's see. Um.

Zach: And honestly, i'd be I'd be surprised at this point if they don't maybe close up for January or something.

Ben: I'm trying to use.

Ben: Oh, God damn it.

Ben: Jesus Christ.

Ben: AI strikes again.

Ben: Have you been watching? Have you seen Pluribus?

Zach: No, but Rhian's been watching it.

Ben: Okay, so i don't know if this is net revenue, but apparently... Yeah, this can't be right. Because on this list, in this ranking, Great America is near the bottom and Six Flags Magic Mountain is at the top.

Zach: Yeah, no way.

Ben: i don't maybe just maybe Maybe this list doesn't exist. But either way, i um I just think Great America deserves more love and I think that this new merger is actually going to give it what it needs.

Ben: And unfortunately though, it's gonna come at the cost of losing parks like Six Flags America and the other Great America.

Ben: But think Illinois deserves the better one anyway.

Zach: Well, I mean, i agree. Great America deserves the love. But

Zach: also feel like Six Flags tried because they wanted to develop a whole entertainment district tricked across the highway in the area that became the business park.

Zach: And the Katana Gurney fought them on it.

Ben: Yeah, I mean, annette maybe that just doesn't work there. I think there's enough people who live within day trip drive to where it's probably okay.

Ben: without that. um

Ben: But i also think, yeah, and I think the problem with six Six Flags is that Six Flags just had so many underperforming parks in their portfolio that any excess money that Great America brought in just had to go to the other parks or, you know, it's net losses.

Zach: Well, yeah, for many years, in the Premier Parks era, they added shit to every park every year.

Ben: And so now...

Zach: and it was irresponsible as fuck.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: The same year they added V2 and Deja Vu. Isn't that the same year they built, like, five fucking coasters at Geauga Lake to try and compete with Cedar Point?

Ben: Yeah, that sounds right. Because it was X-Flight and... X-Flight was new. Well, I don't know if it was... Was it the same year?

Ben: Maybe it was earlier than that. Because Villain... was 2000 with Superman, Ultimate Escape, and Dominator or Night Flight.

Ben: I think I could just click on this hyperlink on the screen I'm staring at right now, but

Zach: Oh yeah. Okay. So it was 2000. They added the kids coaster, dominator, Batman, whatever it was called at the time, steel venom. Those are Superman and villain.

Zach: And then they added exploit in 2001.

Ben: Yeah, so I think that was probably one of those panic purchase situations of a, like, oh shit, Cedar Point's building a 300-foot coaster. Let's compete with it.

Ben: Which is like a really dumb. It's funny, but like, yeah. When if you could have just, but you could have just probably built a an emergency giga coaster. Like that would actually be kind of funnier.

Ben: If like they went to like instead of building five or arrow,

Zach: Fucking Vekoma in 2000 or 99.

Zach: Can you make the hook design 300 feet tall?

Ben: man, and that,

Ben: actually like that imagine like the alternate universe that would it could have been though or even like togo because i know superman krypton because superman krypton coaster was supposed to be a togo originally um so togo was still probably in the business back then

Zach: Fucking Togo.

Ben: But yeah, dude, that have been so funny if like, Jagger Lake, they were just like, oh shit, let's compete with Millennium Force and they build a 315 foot tall ah Togo as the hook or, you know, maybe it was like a shuttle coaster moonsault scrambled type of ride or something, you know.

Ben: That have been...

Zach: Manhattan Express, but bigger.

Ben: We missed out. But...

Zach: That'd have been crazy. That was such a crazy fucking time to be an enthusiast. Cause also like a fucking son of beast happened.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: And the fact that that ever happened is just wild.

Ben: Especially from that company, which still is, like that's another dumb fucking, like who, like,

Ben: I mean, I would imagine that parks have are a little bit more responsible with companies and purchasing rides from them. But just given the history of... Because what was it? RCCA?

Zach: Yeah.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: And what was what was their pitch? Oh, how much do the other guys want from you? Oh,

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: we'll do it for half that.

Ben: At a certain point, you got to be like... You know, like, I don't know. i was i was just stupid on their part.

Ben: But I'm imagining that these companies have learned since then. And maybe that's why Vekoma is taking a little bit longer to... New Vekoma is taking a little longer to pick up steam.

Zach: Right, or like Mach.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: Because 20 years ago, Vekomas were rough pieces of shit, and Mach made family coasters.

Ben: Which, by the

Ben: the

Ben: by the way though the new Vekomas are it's I was shocked how good it was um also because like um all companies have probably so well I think they all do that but there's the like ride they're like what is it the center line program Where are you on, are you in discord right by chance right now?

Zach: No, but I can pull it up.

Ben: and

Ben: if you scroll up, there's like a screenshot that I posted of some of the thing called V or FVD plus.

Ben: Posted on 1121.

Zach: Discord's opening. Here we go.

Ben: Okay. Cause this shit, I, this is the first time I've ever played around with this program. Um, and I had like a

Ben: like a, know what you call it. it. A change of heart or like a, an epiphany about coaster designs after playing with the software.

Zach: Okay, so what explain what that is.

Ben: Okay, so and it looks and it this thing this thing it looks like a confusing image, but it's not. It's the easiest. It's it's like it's cheating. like Years of playing Roller Coaster Tycoon and early No Limits and like Planet Coaster.

Ben: So basically what you do is you design a ride by controlling. you basically draw the ride forces. so um Okay, so like on the the chart on the bottom where it has like a blue lines, red lines and green lines.

Zach: Yeah.

Ben: um So red, the blue line is positive G's. The green line is lateral G's. And then the red line is banking.

Ben: So basically what you do is you, you like on the blue line, right? You draw a let's say like a 10 second line or into like a 10 second long segment. And you're like, I want this force to start at zero G and end at four G's.

Ben: And then within the 10 seconds, I also want a 180 degree roll And what then what it'll do is it'll the track will design around those forces.

Ben: So you don't have you don't place track pieces. You're literally just drawing um like seconds of forces. And then the ride gets designed automatically for you.

Ben: So what you do is like, you're like, okay, I want a bunny hill. So then what you do is like, okay, I want four seconds of 3.5 Gs. And now I want six seconds of zero G. And then it'll design the perfectly parabolic hill. And then you're like, okay, now the, the oops, like this is a little too long. So now you go to the previous one, you change it to, you know, you shave off a second.

Ben: And now you're like, okay, now you can squeeze in one more half second of air time. it's like It's hard to explain without just like showing it live. um But yeah, it's fucking cheating.

Ben: and this is what all And that's what all of these that's what all these companies are using nowadays.

Zach: Interesting.

Ben: Because you can make perfect zero-G rolls. I guess like the the funny thing about it is... like you can make what looks like a really crazy random kind of track element, but the ride forces are perfectly calculated. So if you were riding it, it would be a super smooth experience.

Ben: And that's like what RMC and new Vekoma is using.

Zach: Hmm.

Ben: um But it kind of takes the soul out of designing coasters. And this is like a kind of boomerant on coaster designing and as a non roller coaster engineer, but,

Zach: Oh, here comes Ben.

Ben: fish but like, you know, but it was kind of, I imagine old designs where you, you basically you think about what, where you're trying to, you're where you want the track to go and then you draw something and then you calculate the forces and make adjustments. Whereas this, you design the ride based off of the forces.

Ben: So it's, and then of course, if you're RMC, you're just like, okay, how do I squeeze absolutely as much airtime into the layout as much as possible? And then that's where you get the kind of like soulless, repetitive um RMC, modern RMCs, kind of like steel vengeance in my opinion.

Ben: You know what I mean Steel Vengeance is like how much air time can you squeeze out of a layout? And then basically you got that.

Ben: Which is why the rides feel like they're missing something.

Zach: I mean, they don't feel like wooden coasters to me.

Ben: No.

Ben: On the flip side though, i think Vekoma has figured out how to use that software to maximize forces in like a good way because i don't know what it is about so about Siren's Curse, but um well what's funny too is like there's the none of the forces on the ride are incredibly forceful.

Ben: I don't think anything really ever exceeds like three G's, but the way that the forces hit your body are very unique to any other manufacturer right now.

Ben: It's almost like you, it's like you, there's always a force on your body and in some direction. It's kind of like you'll go directly from positive G's to laterals, to airtime, to act to positive.

Ben: um It's nonstop. through all the rolls and, you know, the bunny hills and the inversions. It's, um, yeah, I was shocked. Like that ride is so much fun and it is a very sleek, very smooth, very precise ride, but it's precise, like in a good way.

Ben: And it's very, very fun.

Zach: Oh, it's so Vekoma good, RMC bad.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: Okay.

Ben: No, actually the modern, Modern RMCs are actually, because I actually really liked Wildcat's Revenge. and I think that was like a newer one.

Ben: Honestly, I think I figured it out. It's really just the Alan Schilke RMCs I'm not a big fan of. The new ones are fine. Whoever, i don't know who designs those, but isn't it a new guy?

Zach: Yeah, new guy Steve, i don't know.

Ben: Yeah, i don't know. there's a difference and I, you can, I, it's noticeable. Um, no, the new Vekoma is awesome. Like I, I am really excited to see these go elsewhere.

Ben: Um, also cedar point pulled off the perfect theming for like the budget that they clearly had, like the low budget they clearly had. Remember those, um, remember those TLC shows in the early two thousands, like,

Ben: trading spaces or, um, don't know. There's all sorts of different ones where it's like, you know, this couple has a budget of $1,500 to make over a bedroom.

Zach: Yeah.

Ben: It's kind of what the vibe that the theming of sirens curses, but it's pulled off so well that you don't notice it's low budget.

Zach: OK.

Ben: Um, it's like, it's almost like they gave, They gave someone who's like a huge coaster, almost imagine like if Nolan was a like really big planet coaster nerd and they're like, okay, you have 48 hours, you get to design the theming of this new coaster.

Ben: And then like just went completely nuts on planet coaster. And then the real, it's literally when you stand in the queue, It literally feels like you're you're inside of the game of Planet Coaster. It's really funny.

Zach: Interesting. I'm looking at some pictures right now. I'm pulling it up.

Ben: Also, too, the cue line has a really good soundtrack. um It's basically like a radio station that has it just plays basically like...

Zach: Okay.

Ben: you know, summer, like very good nostalgic, like top 40 summer hits from like all different decades. Just like it's the playlist is perfect. Like the music, like the music selection, someone knew what they were doing.

Ben: um And then it has like a, you know, it's like a, there's like a DJ in between the music. um And it sounds just kind of like a local radio station.

Ben: And even the, What's cool too, they have that, um i don't know what you call it. There's like a flat effect on it to make it sound like it actually is from a radio station.

Zach: Okay.

Ben: I don't know how to describe it.

Ben: Also a Planet Coaster thing, which I thought was kind of funny. Because when you play music through speakers on Planet Coaster, it kind of flattens the audio settings and it actually sounds like it's radio kind of that like tingy AM kind of classic, i don't know, sound.

Ben: Um, just little things like that. You could just tell like whoever was in charge did a really good job with the short timeline and the low budget.

Zach: For sure.

Zach: i mean, I really would like to go check it out. Haven't been a Cedar Point in a couple years.

Ben: What's funny too is that the ride has, it's kind of surrounded by water, but the water is like, ah it's like four inch deep water that they just dyed black to make it look deeper.

Zach: Did it work?

Ben: It works. Yeah. You can't tell the difference.

Zach: that's all it needs then.

Ben: Yeah. Also too, the queue line goes like through the ride. um And then at nighttime, the trains have this really cool um kind of like neon LED effect.

Ben: So when it starts getting dark, it it looks like... Um, I mean, I've never seen a siren in real life, but it kind of looks like ah almost like an animal, like the ride, like the, especially the, the motions of the train.

Ben: It looks like just this thing is like, you know, diving in and out of the water and it it like dives up and twists and then it dives back down. It's, it's pretty, it's very, it's like visually very, it's a very fun ride to watch in the queue line.

Ben: Um, Probably like honestly one of my favorite new four i like coasters I've probably been on in a very, very long time.

Zach: Nice.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: Nice. Yeah, no, I know um you went out for lance Lance's meetup at Cedar Point in Kings Island, right?

Ben: Yeah. So that was part of, so I met up with, uh, yeah, Nathan and, Flew to Richmond. And then we hit King's Dominion for a couple hours. Got Pantharion.

Ben: Which is not a new credit, but it was painted. So, yeah.

Zach: New experience, new credit.

Ben: Yeah. So we got on Pantharion. Got on... oh yeah. Also, forgot the new wing coaster. The Raptera. Which...

Ben: was rough. Did you see the videos of the launch? Remember like, the yeah, it what was funny.

Zach: Yeah. Yeah.

Ben: It was like, i loved all the comments of people being like, oh, don't worry. This is, this is just test footage. It's not going to be like that. They're they're still working on it. No, literally that's exactly what the train does when it runs in normal sick circumstances.

Ben: Oops, sorry.

Zach: Well, damn.

Ben: You get, it's like when you're riding, when you're getting the launch, it feels like you're on Magnum's like final bunny hills.

Ben: It's just like, like your legs and you're like your whole body just bounces out of the seat. And then, yeah, every pot, every like bottom kind of trough of the ride.

Zach: Damn.

Ben: it's just the whole thing just bounces like crazy.

Zach: that's that's it That seems similar to what I experienced on Wrath of Rakshasa.

Ben: Yeah. And I mean, I get it. The trains are wide, but also it's like, okay, so if you have this lower quality manufacturing thing that you're doing to save money, then why are you building these coasters with such a wide trains?

Ben: But I mean like the layout was really cool. Like it it could have been a really cool ride. The theming also, they also did a really good job with the theming on it too. um It's just, yeah, just the the roughness of it just wasn't up to par, which was unfortunate.

Ben: And then, um yeah, I got a front row ride on Dominator, and it was a lot better than I remember last year. And then we drove out to a Holiday World.

Ben: And it was hot as fuck. It was like 90... don't know. It was like in the mid-upper 90s. Which... That park, if you're not going to the water park and you're walking along the whole thing, especially if you go way out to Thunderbird, is is it is hellish. But... Yeah.

Zach: Yeah, it's all hills.

Ben: Yeah. But the park was dead, which was good. Also, although it kind of was ah ah downside because it was Nathan's first time there. So, of course, I was like hyping up, you know, Legend and Raven.

Ben: But all the we didn't get any rides on those two coasters where the train was. more than maybe a third of the way full and when the trains are empty it just you know the trains are just shuffling and bouncing more and it doesn't they don't run as fast so um definitely wasn't as good as it was running when we were all last there during hollywood nights in 21

Zach: Yeah, and by the nighttime when it's all warmed up.

Ben: yeah and it's been full of a you know it's been carrying a acers all day and

Zach: Yeah, right?

Ben: Yeah. Um, voyage though, voyage is running really good, way better than it was last time we were there. Um, probably some of the best rides I've had on that coaster since it probably opened.

Ben: Um, because I honestly didn't really remember very good voyage rides and we were there last time. And then Thunderbird was great Especially compared to riding Raptera the day before, like literally the day before, less than 24 hours.

Ben: um Completely night and day comparison. Thunderbird is still smooth. The launch is still good. The element still hit.

Ben: And then we got on Good Gravy, which is actually pretty fun. It's got a little like Thanksgiving theme queue house where you go through this... I guess like grandma's house and you're going through different rooms and there's even a bathroom, which is kind of funny.

Ben: Um, and it's, it it's air conditioned and it smells like food and stuff.

Zach: That's cute. Looks fun.

Ben: Yeah. Um, and then, yeah, then we drove to Kings de Mint or Kings Island and actually had a really fun day at Kings Island, which, um,

Ben: I was telling those guys, like, especially during this, I think Kings Island and Kings or Cedar point are, have like a very def, like a very defined, uh, like summer feel.

Ben: Like there's something about being in those parks when it's miserably hot and humid in the middle of summer. That kind of just like adds to that Midwestern, I don't know, theme park experience, but it was hot, brutally hot and humid.

Ben: Um, So we got on the classics, got on like Diamondback um Banshee and Flight Deck and stuff. And then we came we left the park for a couple hours just because it was so ungodly hot and then came back at night, got really good night rides in had like the best ride I've ever had on the Beast.

Ben: The Beast is running so good. And now I kind of like understand why people love the ride. So i was happy to get I was happy to get like one of those night rides, like summer night rides in to where people kind of always throw it in their top 10.

Ben: So I kind of get it now. I've been converted.

Zach: Oh, shut the fuck up.

Ben: so

Ben: It's so good. Like especially just like a night ride in the hot when it's super hot because i don't know. It's definitely better than anything I've had on it before.

Ben: We also had edibles. i don't know if that helped, but you know, same with, um, same with Orion. We did, we got a good night ride on Orion and same thing. It was like, holy shit. Like I get why people love this right now.

Ben: Um, so yeah, I think that's, I think that's just the key is like, sometimes you just have to ride those rides on a super hot humid day when the park is open from 10 10.

Ben: Just to get those like you know those like what really good, fast kind of rides in.

Ben: um What else happened there?

Ben: Mystic Timbers was still good. Beast, I actually thought the Beast was better, though, after that ride. And then, yeah, and then after that, we had two days at Cedar Point, which was a lot of fun.

Ben: Um, already mentioned sirens curse. Awesome ride. Loved it. And, uh, finally got on top thrill too. Got a couple rides on it, front row, back row.

Ben: And, um, I agree. I think it's a worthy replacement. I was a little skeptical, but, um, I think it's, I think it's good. And it's a better full rounded experience and it's modern and it's been updated.

Ben: The back spike is really cool. The launch on the second time is still, it's not as thrilling, but like it's still going 120 miles an hour. The lap bars are comfortable. Um, yeah, they a good job.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: That's a bummer.

Ben: yeah

Zach: How about Magnum?

Ben: Magnum was Magnum wasn't down. Oh, it did go down actually. Our last day there for a couple hours, but yeah, not as good as I remember.

Zach: Shit, how about Millennium Force?

Ben: force is still fine. Like we got a night ride on it and I still think that that coaster is only really worth to ride at night.

Ben: Um,

Zach: You're such a hater.

Ben: I know. It's like it's not good in the morning. and that's I know it's a harsh opinion. It's just like when you ride that ride in the first hour the park is open, it's just not running that fast.

Ben: And when it's not running fast, the airtime's not as good.

Zach: That's true, but the first drop makes up for it.

Ben: Yeah. But I mean, i think like that, the night ride on millennium force is like, uh, it's still one of those top park experiences, but, um, yeah, it's just, it's, its I don't know how much faster it runs at night once it's warmed up, but it's noticed like the airtime is definitely noticeable on the two bunny Hills.

Ben: Um,

Zach: Yeah, absolutely. It's better. the The bunny hills are better in the front. But the first drops way better in the back.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: But like.

Zach: I don't know. That ride's awesome. Don't be a fucking hater.

Ben: I don't hate the ride at all. I just, um I just, you know, I'm aware of what the ride is. important to, you know, acknowledge what the ride offers.

Ben: um Maverick was and then like you know like the other ones like Maverick was same as it usually is it's still good um interested to see if the roll comes back that's a rumor that people are floating around because apparently the ride is going to be retract as well which is kind of funny to think about being that it's less than 20 years old but

Zach: It's almost 20 years old though.

Ben: Yeah. But I don't know. I'm curious like why the ride has to be retracted. if it just I don't know if it just has that much like stress going on it. Yeah.

Zach: Possibly. It's got really intense forces like in every curve.

Ben: yeah

Ben: But if the roll comes back, that'd be pretty cool. But i've also I've also always wondered why they didn't just... Make a longer drawn out role. Because they kind of have the space.

Ben: But. We'll see. that'd be If that happens that will be sweet.

Zach: Well,

Zach: well fuck, it's been nineteen almost 19 years now, so no time like the present, right?

Ben: Yeah.

Ben: Yeah. And of all. With the new way that management is treating. Their. You know flagship parks. I definitely could see them. giving Cedar Point, you know, God's Park, the special treatment on doing something like that.

Zach: Maverick 2.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: Roll over.

Ben: Oh, we also did get... um So Steel Vengeance, they the crew will send the last train of the night around twice. I think it's on the last two trains.

Ben: um They'll send it around twice, which is kind of cool. um But because this is so well-known... like you know we've We've talked about this so much, about how... you know, the Thuse kind of hobby has gone very mainstream and TikTok and Instagram and all that stuff. So now you get like this basically a group of probably 40 plus people, kind of like Thuse's all waiting out at the entrance, waiting from the close the line.

Ben: just to ensure that they're the last ones in the queue line to get the double ride. um So that was interesting to witness.

Ben: But yeah, we got the double ride on it. It was a lot of fun. And that ride's still good. I don't hate the ride at all. Actually, I had a lot of fun on it, especially a night ride on it. But um I still don't have that... um that Gen z opinion hype on it.

Ben: Like a lot of people do. i think it's still good. I just, I don't, you know, no, I have a few Okay.

Zach: God's Coaster.

Ben: This is, this is, this is a joke and I, I promise it's a joke. I don't actually feel this way, but I was thinking, you know how, like, I think the reason why people love steel vengeance is because it is a it is like a pure dopamine hit of airtime, which makes sense because think about think about this like epidemic of iPad kids who are chronically addicted to phones and like screens and social media and like essentially have that like hijacked dopamine addiction in their brain.

Ben: And it makes sense that they love those types of people love Steel Vengeance because it is just pure airtime, nothing else. It's like a

Ben: it's like you're getting a main line of drug just pumped into you when you ride that ride. And so I think that's why the younger generations love that coaster, the iPad kids.

Ben: Is that theory?

Zach: Okay.

Ben: That's just a theory. But...

Zach: I mean, i guess i can see where you're coming from it at the same time.

Ben: makes makes it, makes it.

Zach: I'm like, what, in contrast to other fucking roller coasters?

Ben: i mean, yeah. Like what other, I mean, what is like, think about seal vengeance as ranked as like the number one coaster by any enthusiast under the age of what? 25, 30.

Ben: twenty five thirty

Ben: Compared to other rides, I don't know. It's just...

Ben: I think that's why RMCs are so popular, though because like airtime is basically like a... It's like if you're like if you're like a junkie for airtime, you know what I mean? like That's basically what that ride offers. It's just pure airtime.

Ben: Nothing else.

Zach: Can I get a hit?

Ben: You go from scrolling TikTok to sitting down on Seal of Engines to getting your airtime hit to then going back to scrolling TikTok.

Zach: Next thing you know, you're sucking dick for an RMC.

Ben: Somewhere in the world that has happened.

Ben: At least once.

Zach: I need to just get up the exit, man.

Ben: And at Cedar Point, that wouldn't surprise me at all.

Ben: But overall, fun time. It was actually really fun to go back into that park during the summer and ah absolutely sweat balls. What's disgusting, though, is anytime you so what what thing, though, that I never forget is when you sit down on a coaster and it has like other people's sweat in it to where when you sit down, you get wet.

Zach: You don't find that comforting?

Ben: disgusting. But also like.

Zach: you know' You don't feel like squish squish. oo Now my ass cheeks are so extra comfy.

Ben: And then like there's people who probably will go home sometime and like not shower. That's like one thing that. Has always been in. biin

Zach: Dude, I assume only about a quarter of the people at any theme park, anytime there, have taken a shower that day.

Ben: Yeah.

Ben: It's just like, like to, there, there should be like a fun little study on this, like a blacklight test or something about how much sweat you accumulate on your body and your clothes at just spending a day in a theme park in august and 95 degrees.

Zach: That's disgusting.

Ben: Oh yeah. Monster mansion or whatever. Boo blasters or whatever it's called now. um That that's closing. So,

Zach: Fuck.

Ben: you know, also what's interesting to see is like, so Kings Island is Cedar point in Kings Island. And I suppose even great America, you know how there's every ride has that local celebrity.

Ben: of the person who always rides the ride.

Zach: What do you mean?

Ben: um There's always, it's always like, Oh, that's millennium force Bob. Oh, that's Raptor Sue. oh that's, you know, chair swing Alice. I don't know.

Ben: Like there's, there's just like those, those like celebrities in the park that everybody knows where they just ride that one coaster over and over and over all season.

Zach: Sure.

Ben: So Kings Island has one of those for the boo blasters.

Zach: know,

Ben: It's, it's just someone that just rides that ride every single day and they know all the secrets and they're able to max out the score. and um, yeah, we witnessed that. It was kind of funny.

Ben: And then of course, like in line, all the, all the like Thuseys are able to clock each other and be like, what's your score? I have 1700.

Ben: Um, but yeah, that's always another, that's another,

Zach: you know It is okay to socialize with individuals at theme parks sometimes.

Ben: I agree. No, I agree. But like there are, but like, i'm just saying, you know what I mean?

Zach: I mean, it is Ohio.

Ben: I'm not talking to, there's 90, 90, ninety

Zach: I, I, and I apologize for nothing.

Ben: I mean, yeah, 90% of the time, it's fine. I just mean, like, there's always... i don't know. this whoever This kid was just, like, bragging, right? Like, he was just looking to brag. It was just kind of annoying. It's like, we get it

Zach: Yeah, that that kid lives in Ohio. That's what he has going on.

Zach: His score on Boo Blasters.

Zach: We get to visit. He has to stay.

Ben: That's true. a good way to put it.

Ben: Yeah, the results.

Zach: Well, I've been thinking about it since you said it makes sense that like Kings Island and Cedar Point exist in Ohio.

Ben: Yeah.

Ben: Because it's Ohio.

Zach: Yeah, because like they need that shit.

Ben: Yeah, I mean, there's not much going on in the summer there.

Ben: But it is it is fun. like i get you know I get it. It was fun to like dip the toe in the water again and relive those those old days.

Ben: and um oh yeah, there's also... Kings Island also has a new Vekoma Junior Boomerang.

Zach: Isn't it the same as good gravy?

Ben: Yeah, I think it's a clone.

Ben: I think. or it's it's It's pretty close. Oh, we also rode the yellow submarine ride.

Ben: The ride op clocked us as Thuzis and convinced us to ride, and so we did. you know, the little, in like the Planet Snoopy, it's like like a yellow submarine that just...

Zach: Hey, you group of men of diverse ages for no inexplicable reason.

Ben: It's like, yeah, it's like we got it we got two young children and a mom riding this. We can need a couple more bodies.

Ben: I forgot what it's called. Basically like the mini version of a Trailblazer. Cam Cartoon Network had one of those too. Real Scooby-Doo bus.

Ben: Yeah, we all crammed in one of those. Yeah.

Ben: Also, what's terrifying is that those kitty rides have locks. like like they're locked They're locked with a key, so you can't open them.

Zach: yeah

Ben: And so you're just trapped in this like metal tube that has no airflow.

Ben: is good sport. I ah wish I could grab his name. He seemed like a cool guy. So props to him. Thanks for the ERT. And then...

Zach: Yeah, it's pretty dead giveaway. What, four dudes in Ohio?

Ben: Yeah. which It's,

Ben: Oh, I did have a, the only bad experience I had with a staff member was on Orion. We were were, we got a night ride on the front row and this ride app was clearly just like, they were just how like having a bad day. You could feel it.

Ben: Also the ride came out of a breakdown And actually, well, this goes in a little side story i thought of when I was there. So first, imagine a ah ah movie about a mechanic at a theme park who, you know, low self-esteem, probably like divorced, you know, just like a Imagine like a typical just sad kind of guy.

Ben: um But as a ride up, he gets a thrill every time he fixes the ride. And then the station, you know, like the ride goes down for 30 minutes. The mechanic comes up. He's like the hero saving the day. Starts to ride back up. Everyone starts cheering for him.

Ben: And he starts getting like super, super arrogant. So then he starts breaking the ride on purpose just to like i get the praise every time the ride comes back up. um Anyway, the. That happened, this guy like came up, the ride is down for 30 minutes, and this guy showed up on the platform and everyone started cheering for him and he was like waving and.

Ben: was like the little celebrity.

Ben: um was like, that'd be a cute movie. um

Zach: I am picturing Sean William Scott for some reason.

Ben: yeah yeah

Ben: and then ah you know maybe he becomes like suicidal and decides to completely break the ride and the ride crashes or something and there's casualties and he lets see his ego gets to his head

Zach: Wow, that got dark as fuck.

Ben: excuse

Ben: But yeah, we got a front row ride on Orion and the ride up was clearly having a bad day. They were arguing with the team lead about something. i think that it was a classic situation, been working all day. They just want to get cut to go home.

Ben: There's still a 30 minute line. hot, you know, I've been there, but, um, I was, ate an edible, of course, and the edible was kicking in and I'm trying to, I'm trying to buckle my seatbelt.

Ben: And, um, I, I took like maybe literally two extra seconds. Like I didn't, cause like I was sitting down and you have to like dig on the side of it to pull the little yellow tab, you know, to pull it across to you.

Ben: Um, I took maybe two extra seconds, um,

Zach: Yeah.

Ben: And this ride up was impatient because she's just trying to like get the lap bars down to get the train out. Um, You know, and then so they they did one of those things where like she started to grab it So then I take my hand off of it. Like, okay, like go for it. Like, you you know, and then like she's like, are you going to buckle?

Ben: And I was like, yeah, okay. And then I grab it and then I wasn't taking long enough. So then she grabs it out of my hand and is trying to like pull it across my waist. um And then then it completely staples the shit out of me. Like, I've never been stapled that hard on a clamshell.

Ben: um But, like, clearly this was, like, full body weight. She just totally gut-punched it down. um

Zach: Wow.

Ben: But it was, it's it's like, what are you going to do? Complain about it? Like, I've been there. I've done that to people. i get it. But it's annoying. Yeah.

Ben: Ryan was still good, though. Either way.

Zach: Yeah, like I lost feeling in my legs.

Ben: But it's like, yeah, what are you going to do? You're a 35-year-old man. You're going to go to guest relations and complain because the overworked ride-op stapled you? Nothing.

Zach: Excuse me, ma'am.

Ben: Nothing.

Zach: It was an extremely enduring situation.

Ben: If it was someone we knew, they would have tried to get some exit passes out of it.

Zach: Right?

Ben: Yeah. um

Zach: It was rather traumatic.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: I demand compensation.

Zach: I would like it in the form of three groups of four exit passes.

Ben: Oh, also Banshee. I got a bit of a redemption ride on bansuit Banshee. Banshee rode it um front row later in the day, in the evening. And um yeah, i I don't know if I loved it. i don't think it's like a God-tier invert, but um yeah, definitely went right shot a little bit higher up on my list compared to previous rides on it.

Zach: Well, look, I'll try it again next time I'm at Kings Island.

Ben: Yeah, it's it's just funny. I don't know if it was just because of the hot weather or something, but yeah, all the B&Ms were running pretty good.

Ben: And obviously the Beast with its new track and um hot weather definitely gave it a pretty wild ride.

Ben: Yeah, i Kings Island was... one of the surprises of the trips of a park that i actually really enjoyed so i was happy to have one of those kind of days there

Zach: Yeah, dude, and Ohio's legal now.

Ben: yeah yeah we we checked out one of the dispensaries there um I don't remember what i had.

Ben: So i had I had these edibles that I bought that at first I thought I got screwed. I got screwed because this dispensary, they had of their whole menu of edibles, but they were also having stuff that would like You know, that it's like, oh, like this is this is a good one if you're looking for CBG and this is a good one if you're looking for, you know, whatever, THCV and stuff like that.

Ben: So at first when we were at the dispensary, i was just like, whatever, I'm just going to like buy the cheapest pack because I'm probably only going to have three out of the 10 anyway. So I ate them and like, I didn't feel shit for probably two and a half hours.

Ben: It was the longest, um, like come up of an edible I think I've ever had to the point where I was like, fuck, like, I think I got sold CBG edibles that have no THC in them.

Ben: And I was kind of like bummed out about it. And then eventually like two and a half hours later, it kicked in. Um, yeah, it was weird.

Zach: Interesting.

Ben: And I mean, it was nothing like normally. Sometimes you get like a slow come up that takes that lingers, but this was like nothing, zero effect, nothing going on two and a half hours.

Ben: um

Ben: But after, after it creeped up, it was

Zach: Like how high did you get?

Ben: um like a normal 30 milligram edible feeling.

Zach: Okay. Yeah, I'm like leery about edibles since Knott's Berry Farm.

Ben: Didn't you do like 100 milligrams or something though?

Zach: Yeah, I had a 100 milligram drink because normally that's about as much as it takes for me to actually feel edible.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: But the problem is you also run the risk of like it hits really fucking hard.

Ben: Yeah.

Ben: um I mean, that joint, that joint we smoked too hit me hard because I had no, had like zero flower tolerance at all then.

Zach: Yeah, and that was like an infused joint or something.

Ben: So like, Yeah. I still like it was I was so high when we because we did front row on accelerator.

Zach: Yeah.

Ben: And I had this like very vivid image of the cable snapping like right before we launched.

Zach: Yeah. Yeah, you kept talking about it. And like, I was just like, yeah, you guys go ahead in the front row. And I was in the second row.

Zach: ah

Ben: Which like like normally, obviously like normally like as an enthusiast, those types of things aren't a big deal. But like when you're too high, like it's just like, ah yeah, it is 80 miles an hour.

Zach: Yeah.

Ben: the giant steel cable that's just out in the open right there.

Zach: Yeah. And it's happened before.

Ben: Yeah, and it's Intamin.

Ben: it was less yeah It was less about the fact... it was like i get yeah It was less of the fact of it of me thinking it was going to happen when we were riding it. But for me, I was just thinking about... i could like envision the super graphic detail of... like Okay, i wasn't there when the cable snapped, but I can imagine exactly like what it looked like, what it sounded like, like what the cable would a mut the cable must have looked like if you were on the ride.

Ben: You know, like the... the way the train would have felt when it rolled back over on top of it, just like those like very detailed, like those very vivid details were just like popping in my brain as we were sitting there.

Ben: was like, oh shit. This could have, this could have even been the exact train too.

Zach: that's That's so awesome.

Zach: Just the entire sequence from ah fucking Final Destination 3.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: But just on Accelerator.

Ben: yeah

Zach: but no, I... I got really high because that joint hit and then we went in and I was already pretty high and then we got in line and that entire drink hit it once.

Zach: And like, you know how you, when you first like get real, like an edible really hits and like your heart starts racing that like happened. And I'm like, is that because of the roller coaster? Holy shit. Yeah.

Ben: yeah yeah i know what you mean

Zach: But yeah, i I'm really leery about doing edibles at parks like that now

Ben: i mean i think 30 is a good amount um But also too, like having a positive, like King's Dominion last year um was probably one of my favorites just because it it hit perfectly and like had like all like all the rides we ran on were like perfect.

Ben: um Then same at King's king's Island too. i did It was a little bad. Um, actually, sorry. Do you mind if I take a quick piss break?

Ben: All right.

Zach: Yeah, for sure.

Ben: One second.

Ben: Oh, thank God.

Zach: ah

Ben: Um, yeah. Like, uh, park environments matter because I, uh, I had a pen that time at great America this past summer by myself in June.

Ben: And I just kind of got like a weird vibe when I went in there. I mean, it, um,

Ben: could have just been the fact that it's home park. There's just a lot of memories. Maybe just that adds paranoia to it. I don't know. Um, but I've noticed the less familiar the park is, the more enjoyable, the edible experiences.

Ben: When everything's new and familiar, like especially, especially roller coasters you're not familiar with or you haven't ridden in a long time or it's your first time. i think that's like the best.

Zach: Yeah, I mean,

Zach: can't really remember any other time doing like big edibles at a park.

Zach: I feel like that would be fun at Disneyland for sure.

Ben: Yeah, and that's like a whole thing now. i've ah keep Occasionally I'll see a YouTube video where it's like, watch me eat an edible and walk around Disney.

Zach: Yeah, that seems fun as hell. Not worth making a video of yourself doing, but fun.

Ben: i I encountered this one a while ago. It's like, I ate an edible and run around New York City. And it's just this guy filming himself running around New York City getting higher and higher.

Zach: Okay. even That seems boring.

Ben: Yeah, I mean, I scrubbed through it. it was okay.

Zach: i

Zach: I don't know. I feel like part of the thing is like I'm a flower guy. You know.

Zach: And I'm really now like a dry herb vape guy. Because

Ben: Yeah. Mm-hmm.

Zach: I have a volcano and a mighty. And that's pretty much exclusively what I use.

Zach: So like edibles hit different. Dabs hit different, you know?

Zach: So, but one thing I want to try more of is mushrooms at parks.

Ben: Yeah. And that's, uh, it's, uh, sometimes it's kind of a tight rope walk. It's like, uh,

Ben: I enjoy it, but also it can, you just gotta to like plan your day. Um, we didn't have any problems in March, which was good.

Zach: Yeah, Magic Mountain was a blast.

Ben: Um,

Zach: That said, couple rides I knew were a little too intense for where I was at.

Ben: Yeah. i also kind of just got like, I think for me, i was in a weird bummed out headspace at Magic Mountain.

Ben: Not unlike Knott's Berry Farm. Knott's Berry Farm just had like such a more positive park environment. To me, at least. um

Ben: I don't know what that was about, but

Zach: That's interesting.

Ben: magic mountain

Zach: Because I always like Magic Mountain. I like going there. But I think that's purely nostalgia based.

Ben: yeah and i and that's kind of what i had like um obviously wanting to go there as a kid the excitement of x2 and just you know having all the roller coasters and um I think this past trip, though, I realized i was like I don't really like any of the coasters here.

Ben: um

Zach: Really not even X to

Ben: I mean, i obviously, I like X2, but...

Ben: But, I mean, that's kind of it. And the that, like...

Zach: What about ninja

Ben: Oh, okay. I, I don't hate, I don't dislike any of the coasters. I i just mean like in my brain, like the park, rank the park ranking as a coaster collection was like always super high in my mind and like that nostalgia factor and everything. But then this time around, it's that realization of like, Oh, like the majority of the coasters here, I don't love like, um,

Zach: Okay, but I still think there's some really solid ones. Okay, Tatsu, X2, Ninja, Riddler.

Ben: Yeah.

Ben: Yeah, I know. i I completely agree with you.

Zach: Twisted Colossus is also pretty solid.

Ben: That one i like, but it'd always it's i always kind of forget it's there. i think it's one of my least favorite RMCs.

Ben: And maybe that's just because most of the time it's not dueling. Because I think we got we got one duel on it, right? The first time we...

Zach: I think we got half duel, yeah.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: um

Ben: and then But like, you know, like Goliath and then Scream and then like Apocalypse. Batman was down. I love the era. Like, I love the actual mountain part. Like, i basically like X2, Viper, Tatsu...

Ben: ninja gold rush um like those kind of uh staple those yeah like that part is cool but then that whole other side of the park is kind of like i don't know i guess i guess well i guess it was just a little bit of that and and disappointment of uh oh i like i'm like you know when i was like oh i remember as a kid like this was

Zach: Yeah, Gold Rusher. Yeah, dude.

Ben: you know, like the best fucking park ever. And now I'm kind of like, ah, now I just feel old. And I, some of these rides just don't hit the same way for me anymore.

Ben: And also too, as I mean, that park is just so it's very inversion heavy, which obviously as you get older is a little bit harder to marathon through.

Zach: Well, yeah, we were definitely speaking about that when we were there is that, you know, everything in the entire collection there is pretty intense. And ironically, one of the only rides that's not really intense is X2.

Zach: Despite the gimmick.

Ben: yeah

Zach: It's a very swooshy ride for what it is which makes sense because if it was disorienting and super heavy on the G's, it nobody would have liked it

Ben: and it is also it like for me um and i mean I guess I only rode on the outside, I think, on most of the rides. It is a little... two Two rides in a row, I kind tap out on the roughness of it. I don't think it's like unbearable, but um the like there's diminishing returns for me after like the second consecutive ride on it.

Zach: is that Is that an old fuck I hear talking over there?

Ben: Uh, maybe, but it's not because it's uncomfortable. It's more just like, it's the gimmick is 20 years old. It's kind of like, it's one of those things where riding it,

Zach: Excuse me, it was refreshed in 2009.

Ben: I know that. I guess like when, i mean like the first couple rides you, the first couple of rides you had take on it are like, holy shit, this is absolutely insane.

Ben: And it's like, you know, it's like super exciting and it's new, but now, I mean, the ride is 20 years old. Like the gimmick is it's done. Like it's, you know, like been there. And so after like, I don't know, that was in my lifetime, five magic mountain visits. Yeah.

Ben: been there, done that. The ride is now a fucking walk on, you know, you go on it and you're kind of like, Oh, like I get it. Like I've, I've done this. And then once that, once that excitement wears off, you're kind of just left with the, the like, you know, the head bouncing around and stuff.

Ben: Don't get around. I loved every ride we took on it. I'm just saying like we took, what did we wrote it? Like what? Six or seven times, six times, five times. Um,

Zach: Yeah, at least four or five.

Ben: Yeah. I guess the ride had more of a lasting impact when you were waiting 90 plus minutes for it. And it was newer and that excitement buildup was there. But now the ride is a 20 year old ride. That's a walk on and you can reride, which is crazy to think that like, I mean, like imagine being whatever, a teenager in that park when that line is long and being like, one day you're going to be in this park and the ride is going to be a walk on.

Ben: I think that part is always was like a weird kind of a weird mind fuck to.

Ben: Like that second day we were there is a literal walk on, which is insane to think about mean one train.

Zach: I mean, it was February...

Ben: up No, I i know. But still a one train up walk on for X to.

Ben: The fourth dimension coaster.

Zach: Yeah, that was dope as fuck. Because to me, I'm like, yeah, all the coasters at Magic Mountain are very intense. So it's tough to rewrite anything. Right? And I think they always count on the fact that there's like a big lineup. Right?

Zach: So it's like, and it's a big park, like physically. So it's like, okay, you ride one and then you go to the next one. And in between, you've already walked 10 minutes. So by the time you get off one, get to the entrance of the next one and wait in whatever line, it's been at least like 20, 25 minutes.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: Even if it's a walk on for most of them.

Ben: Mm-hmm.

Zach: Um,

Zach: So like with that in mind, I feel like X2 is one of the only re-ridable coasters in that park.

Ben: Yeah.

Ben: Yeah, that's true. I mean, like, I definitely would ride that more than once versus anything else there. Even maybe Viper, because I think I rode, no, I only rode that one one time each day.

Zach: Which, yeah, I like i want to there soon and just get a ride on that because I have this weird feeling now that Cedar Pairs is in charge. you know

Ben: yeah Yeah, I agree. Yeah, I guess like overall though, there's something about the lineup at Magic Mountain that it's missing something and I can't put my finger on it. And I think it is just a like a airtime focused kind of hyper slash giga coaster.

Ben: And if it had that, then it would be it would go back to being in a solid lineup. And it's kind of weird to think that the park doesn't have, even this like the state of California doesn't even have that.

Ben: Like the state of California doesn't have a single just airtime focused big coaster.

Zach: No, not really.

Ben: NorCal doesn't have one either.

Zach: No, but there's not really any big coasters in Northern California per se.

Ben: really And the only coaster that really fits that spot is Ghost Rider.

Zach: More or less?

Zach: mean, technically, Accelerator, i think, is a hypercoaster.

Ben: True. Yeah. and that's And that's kind of a little different. I mean, yeah. But so then it's, so then when you zoom out again, it's like, all right, the whole state of California, two Cedar Fair parks, two Six Flags parks, and the only real like big kind of airtime coasters are Accelerator.

Ben: And yeah, actually i won't even count Ghost Rider. It's basically Accelerator.

Ben: um

Zach: Because, yeah, I mean...

Ben: That's all. it just Magic Mountain just needs... They just need like a...

Zach: i guess maybe Railblazer... railblazer

Ben: Sort of. But it's such a that's such a like... That's not like a big... like um i know what you mean. and even And even Wonder Woman too. But like it's not ah it's not like a raging bull.

Ben: It's not a like one of those timeless... all around loved, re-ridable, big airtime kind of coasters like a Millennium Force, an Orion, a Raging Bull.

Ben: um

Ben: That's all. that's all so it Six Flags, Magic Mountain just needs one of those coasters in the lineup. That's all. ah It's like something something has always been missing there.

Ben: And I hope, if if like if Viper gets knocked, if Viper gets taken out, and God forbid X2 gets taken out, they have a huge plot with a giant hill right there that they could do something pretty cool with.

Ben: Now are they going to do it? I don't know. I also could see them selling, they like they take out x two and Viper and then they just sell that plot to like real estate developers or something because there's that whole neighborhood behind there now.

Ben: I don't know.

Zach: Yeah, but that wouldn't build a whole community. And they probably wouldn't... Nah. I wouldn't see that happening.

Zach: that's still the entry to the parking lot right there.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: um

Ben: But I mean, does that, but like, that by mean I guess like, but it makes sense though, right?

Zach: I really...

Ben: Like, ah they're you do you think they're missing, like, there is a gap in their lineup somewhere and I don't know what it is, it but it's like.

Zach: Well, I think it's it's like a a a coaster, like you said, something airtime focused that's not like necessarily really intense.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: Because like even Goliath being the the actual hypercoaster, the only traditional style hypercoaster in the entire state, is like it's only got one bunny helm.

Ben: Yeah.

Ben: And also too, like that, the state of California as a whole, their coaster collection is feels very aged at this point.

Ben: Um,

Ben: Cause that's the other thing too. Like what I, what I honestly think that what Cedar fair does better, because Kings Island and Cedar point both have arguably the same aging coaster collection, but for some reason, in my opinion, the coasters at Kings Island and Cedar point feel a little bit more timeless than they do at magic mountain.

Zach: Wow, that's such a Midwestern bias. Sounds like you worked at Cedar Point at some point in your life.

Ben: I know. I'm just saying I went to both Magic Mountain and Cedar Point in the same season and they had very different feels.

Zach: Oh, oh, oh, okay.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: This guy knows what he's talking about.

Ben: I think it, but also, I also, but I also will fully give it to, to what,

Zach: It's all about the feels, the vibes of the park.

Ben: It's probably just the chain not giving. i don't think Magic Mountain gets enough money it gets as much money as it needs to be to sustain to sustain it sustain itself. like You know what i mean? The park needs more money to be nicer.

Ben: And it's very clear that Cedar Point is the favorite park in the chain. God's Park is going to get all that and Magic Mountain probably isn't.

Zach: I don't know.

Zach: i think Magic Mountain...

Zach: has a good market share in the LA area.

Ben: That's true. That's why they deserve it needs more investment.

Zach: And I don't think, I really think if you think about how big the greater LA Metro is, Knott's and Magic Mountain will probably both be a little bit better positioned

Zach: In under a singular corporate umbrella rather than competitors.

Zach: Because like.

Zach: If you were going to buy a knots pass because you live in the knots area and it only costs you 50 more bucks to add on magic mountain. Which is the same as a one day ticket there.

Zach: then you might go just add on Magic Mountain.

Ben: Yeah.

Ben: I'm also curious just what the cross, like what the previous crossover was, like how many, how many folks were already getting a six flags and a Cedar fair pass? Um,

Ben: like, I, I just be curious, like what percentage of Cedar fair pass holders also have a six flags pass or vice versa?

Zach: I don't know. It's definitely not like a

Zach: I got to imagine it's not he a huge number.

Zach: But that's why I'm feeling like it's probably going to work to both bark parks' benefit.

Ben: Yeah.

Ben: Well, and and also too, throwing in the, if Discovery Kingdom and California's Great America closes, which

Ben: seems very likely.

Ben: i have a whole other side theory on tech cities being just full of NBCs who don't like to have fun. Um, with like wild waves closing now in Seattle, Portland area is missing a theme park. The Bay area clearly doesn't care about theme parks.

Ben: It's all that tech bullshit. Killing the fun.

Zach: I mean, you're not necessarily wrong, but

Zach: a lot of that shit moved to Texas.

Ben: Yeah.

Ben: Which at Texas kind of seems like it's in the same boat as like Ohio and Florida. Just people appreciate theme parks. It's like part of the part of the culture. No.

Zach: Well, i mean, Florida is kind of on its own because it doesn't need the locals to support the parks in terms of patronage.

Ben: no But i do I do think, though, that Florida had... Well, because... I mean, I always thought that California sort of had that. people like People from California were more likely to be a Fousey-adjacent person just based on the amount of theme parks that were adjacent to them.

Ben: but now it doesn't seem like the case, but Florida seems like it's like that where, cause I mean, my sister lived there, just people that when you talk to people, people do like, they're like, Oh yeah. Like we go to SeaWorld in February and we go to universal when there's like, when it's like locals discount day or whatever, you know, there are like Florida state resident discount things every once in a while.

Ben: um

Ben: Theme parks are like in the vernacular of people in Florida, even if they don't necessarily go to Disney. They're more likely to go to probably Universal or SeaWorld, one of the SeaWorlds.

Ben: Or nevermind, SeaWorld and Bush.

Zach: Yeah.

Zach: I mean, it's, yeah, definitely California and the Bay Area in particular. It's not,

Zach: it was like at Great America when I went, granted it was opening day, but it was definitely like, not It wasn't like opening day at Great America and Gurney.

Ben: Right.

Ben: It's because tech people look down on theme parks. They think they're gross.

Ben: They think they're better than theme parks.

Ben: Because they've got that Google money.

Zach: I'm pretty sure Intel is right in here. Great America.

Ben: yeah i like Yeah, that sounds right. There's a couple of um yeah there's a couple of like big headquarters right over there.

Ben: San Jose. as saying tech Tech just like ruins things, which which is really unfortunate.

Ben: and I was...

Zach: as someone who lives in San Francisco... ah

Ben: Yeah. It just...

Zach: Where just recently a Waymo killed a cat that lived on our street.

Ben: Yeah, i saw that.

Zach: That literally was on our street.

Ben: Oh, shit.

Zach: I walked by the liquor store that that cat lived at like every day i'm to get to the train.

Zach: That sweet cat named Kit Kat.

Zach: He sat outside and shit. He'd patrol

Ben: Oh.

Ben: Yeah. I, I, um, Seattle is adjacent to that. It's pretty close because of Amazon. It's like a different flavor of the text bullshit. Um, when we were there reaches recently, um, and I haven't been in a couple of years and I've, it's only been, it's only my second trip there since I moved away from there in 2020. Um,

Ben: um

Zach: Did you hear the blues is calling? Toss salad and scrambled eggs.

Ben: Sure did. They were all over my face. um Yeah, the it was a little sad because like we were I was like showing Craig around and walking around my old neighborhood and stuff. and Nothing felt that different, but we also stayed in South Lake Union, which is where Amazon owns 90% of the real estate.

Zach: Oh.

Ben: because Because what they do is they basically bought... up the and basically bought the entire neighborhood 2008, 2009 after the, you know, the housing market bust.

Ben: And then what they, what happens is they own so much of the real estate that a, they're able to influence local elections, but B they're able to artificially like,

Ben: like restrict the housing supply so it artificially raises the value. you know It's like if there's 10 rare baseball cards that are printed and you own nine of them, right you're basically able to manipulate the market because you own the supply. So it kind of just fucks up the real estate and the rest of the city.

Ben: And then what they do is then they lease out the land that they own to franchises that they then own so it'd be like if it's like the so basically they own the land they own the building and then they will open a franchise like restaurant that they own that's also amazon but they're not paying rent because it's also because it's ant because they're i don't know if that makes sense like

Ben: Normally, if you're like, I want to open up a subway, you find some commercial real estate you find a commercial space and then you pay rent in that commercial space and then you pay a franchise fee and then whatever is left is your profit.

Ben: So in this case, Amazon is like, we're going to open up a subway, but we're going to put it inside of the building that we already own and that we're also leasing out to other companies and they're paying us rent.

Ben: That goes directly into our pocket. It's just, it's basically they're just able to manipulate an entire neighborhood and they've completely jacked it up. Anyway, we've stayed there.

Ben: We stayed in a hotel there and everyone felt like an NPC. Like everyone walking around, it looked was like the classic joke of NPCs. Like just, it's like, what do people do here? Like there's thousands of people who live in this neighborhood, but like,

Ben: And yet it seems like no one actually is doing anything. No one's interacting with each other. There's no real like neighborhood feel.

Zach: Hey, there's a Chipotle.

Ben: guess just.

Ben: Yeah, it's like.

Ben: People work from home and then they sit at home and then they get their groceries delivered. And think that's how people do that everywhere, but. don't know.

Ben: This is weird. if It had a spooky vibe.

Ben: but yeah, tech is literally ruining everything and it's going to kill us all and we are fucked.

Ben: So...

Zach: I, for one, welcome our new ant overlords.

Zach: No, I and do you think ai is fucking, it's like being used for the stupidest shit.

Ben: So this is, yeah, and that's why I,

Ben: especially in what's really sad is AI and porn is going to get really really bad. um It's terrifying.

Ben: Even if it's not like chatbots, like sex chatbots and stuff, or like AI image porn, it'll be, the AI will,

Ben: be able to influence your algorithm in like your newsfeed for things to the point where, i mean, like, let's be honest, like news, scrolling through news feeds and scrolling through like reels and all that shit, like is already pretty addictive, but the AI is going to eventually be used to further enhance the addictive nature of those things. So like,

Ben: it will be able to figure out like, um i was i was just i was watching this YouTube video about it where, anyway, the algorithm will just get more and more advanced and become more and more addictive. And it'll use these like very,

Ben: don't what he called it. Like, yeah okay, like we're all naturally, we we all have like a sexual attraction, right? To certain things. that we don't even really fully understand. And it will use those kinds of patterns, shapes and recognitions in apps and news feeds to become more addictive, if that makes sense.

Zach: Sure. Yeah. It made me think of like a bit you could do or you like or be like. OK. AI porn is getting ridiculous.

Zach: I wanted to look up. You know, a guy who looks like me. Fucking hot lady. And I was like, this is crazy. That guy looks like me so much.

Zach: Except my thing's not that big. And I only have one of them.

Ben: Nice. Yeah.

Ben: Yeah. it will, it's kind of true. Like the, and so what'll happen is so like ads right now are not really dynamic. Um, but eventually they will be. So like, um, eventually you, like your phone or your user will have a learned profile.

Ben: So, when you scroll through ad when you scroll through a newsfeed and it's showing you ads, you might be seeing an ad for like, um, fucking allergy medication.

Ben: But in the ad, it'll show, it might show someone that resembles you and another person that resembles someone that you're attracted to. when,

Zach: And just flesh tits.

Ben: which is That would be hilarious.

Zach: Do you sneeze sometimes? boobs

Ben: um But kind of like that's, but ah like in know in in a way where like if someone just showed you that image and like, do you like this image? You might be like, ah yeah, that's a cool image. And you won't know why you like it, but it'll figure out those types of weird details and it'll just get more and more and more refined.

Ben: um Because that's kind of the next thing is dynamic advertising. So like we, right now we have curated ads to where showing you topics that you're interested in but eventually it'll be topics that you're interested in. And also the image that you see for that ad in that company will be also curated to what your preferences are.

Ben: Um,

Ben: And it's just going to keep learning and get more and more advanced. So if you are a serial, I guess, newsfeed, scroller, reels, shorts, tech talk, and on your phone, you might want to relearn some of those habits before the algorithm shit gets more and more intense, because that's the problem. These AI companies, they can't figure out a way to make money.

Ben: um No one's going to pay. They're not going to be able to become profitable by people paying subscriptions to use, you know, like chat GPT seven or any specialized AI bot or something. So their only way these companies are going to make money is literally through porn and through like these advanced um advertising kind of applications.

Ben: So it's a getting it spooky.

Zach: Yeah, wild. All right, I need a pay break real quick.

Ben: Okay.

Zach: AI and tech are going to ruin us all.

Ben: I know.

Ben: What sucks too is like imagine like I feel thankful that I grew up in an era where

Ben: you didn't just get like instant

Ben: porn on your phone.

Ben: Our days it was pixelated. You had to use your imagination.

Zach: Yeah, I remember when porn on the internet was just pictures.

Ben: feel bad for the young ones.

Ben: Especially, especially like going back to the just general addiction thing. Like, The economy is fucked. Cost of living is fucked.

Ben: But you got a phone. got a phone with limited access to everything.

Zach: Damn straight.

Ben: But you also have RMCs.

Zach: And let's talk about this, right? The talk the price to go to lake Magic Mountain or Cedar Point is, I think, pretty much the same as it was 25 years ago, dollar amount-wise.

Ben: Yeah. Yeah. Like a ticket is at the gate is like, yeah.

Zach: 60 bucks, 50, 60 bucks, which is like the same as it was 2003. How fucking crazy is that?

Zach: how fucking crazy is that

Ben: Yeah. Cause adjusted for inflation that should be like at a minimum, at least double.

Zach: Right, and we talked about it them at and in Southern California when we had our meetup that lake food at a theme park now is the same as like fast food places outside the gates.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: So it's not, the value proposition is the same to just eat inside and not lose the time.

Ben: Yeah, because a burger and fries and the...

Ben: Like that Moose Burger place or Moose Jaw, whatever the hell it was in Great America was probably 14 fourteen bucks

Ben: if I had to guess in the mid two thousands

Ben: and to the point where as a high school driving down to six flags for the day, anything over 10 bucks was like too much. $10 was like the budget for the day.

Zach: Yeah, well, at that time, like $12 could get you an insane amount of food at like Taco Bell.

Ben: Yeah.

Ben: Yeah, like I'd probably, there were there were probably days where once I filled up the car, I had maybe a 20 that would have to get through the whole day. And that was usually like a pack of tourneys,

Ben: an energy drink, which brings you up to probably seven bucks, maybe a roller dog and a soda for like two something.

Ben: And then at the when the park closed, about $10 to then get a couple things at Taco Bell, which was usually a $2 meal deal, which got you a half-pound burrito, bag of Doritos, and cheesy Fiesta potatoes.

Ben: Or no, sorry, and a drink. And then like get cheesy Fiesta potatoes, maybe a quesadilla. You're just under $10.

Zach: Yeah, I remember like that or like White Castle, which I guess you could still get some sliders for a decent price.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: There like yeah it seemed like it's like there was plenty more options for cheaper food than inside a park.

Ben: Yeah. Even a, yeah. Cause even like a Burger King meal was seven bucks usually. Yeah.

Zach: Yeah, whereas that's like $12 on the cheap end now.

Ben: yeah

Zach: Where it's like, if it's $12 for a Burger King meal, might as well just pay the $13 or $14 in the park.

Ben: Yeah.

Ben: And maybe that's, and maybe that's got to adjust.

Zach: so yeah it's like

Ben: I don't know. Like

Ben: I'm curious what the market research was telling six flags about that right now. You know, like if they raise prices, is it really going to cut into, um, their revenue? I also, but because I also, my, my other fear was, i remember we talked about this before, was that the chain was trying to go towards a like higher cost model. So like basically less guests, but higher revenue through raising ticket prices and raising the price of like flash pass and all that stuff.

Ben: um But I don't know if they're going to go that way with the merger now.

Ben: That seemed to be a was that guy, Salim?

Zach: Yeah.

Ben: That's kind of like what his direction was, where his direction was going. And then the merger happened. And now it seems like they're going back more towards the, the model of get everyone a pass, like get as many people a pass as possible.

Ben: And then try to keep people into the park as long as possible.

Zach: I mean, that's a pretty good model post-merger.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: Because of the fact that like

Zach: they now have like a park within probably like 70 plus percent of the entire population, like within a day's drive.

Ben: Right.

Zach: And possibly more.

Ben: Yeah. Oh, for sure.

Zach: I feel like... ah You know, think about like...

Zach: When we were kids. If you could get a pass at Great America that worked at Kings Island and Cedar Point.

Zach: Bless you.

Ben: Thanks.

Ben: Yeah, I mean, and even.

Zach: But like, if that was the case...

Zach: have been like, fuck, we have to make up an excuse to just like get to Cedar Point.

Ben: Yeah, that's true.

Zach: And like, or like Valley Fair or whatever, you know what i mean?

Zach: Like, if you know your past is good at all these parks that you can get to,

Ben: Well,

Zach: when we were kids like that would have been like all the more incentive to get to the parks.

Ben: yeah, I'm curious.

Ben: This is probably a terrible business idea, but imagine if they started to to offer like um transportation between parks and You know what i mean? Like, I don't know, like get a bus ticket from Great America to Kings Island to Cedar Point on a three day weekend and get a deal on two hotel stays.

Ben: Something like that.

Ben: To like encourage the multi, um, the multi park visits.

Zach: That could be genius if they tied it with their heart hotels.

Ben: Yeah. Yeah.

Ben: I don't know what... That's the thing, though. like i don't You probably wouldn't be able to offer that every day or even every weekend to make it profitable because who would actually do that?

Ben: I don't know. Unless they partnered with Megabus or some shit. or Yeah, I don't think there's a viable way to do that as a bit you know to make it profitable, but it'd be something kind of cool. Or even if they just did hotels.

Ben: They got to find, they got to be creative and figure out a way to get people to besides enthusiasts to then, you know, visit other parks in the chain. It's like, Hey, you got this pass. You got this whole portfolio of parks at your disposal now.

Zach: I would love to do another Cedar Point trip and stay at Breakers.

Ben: Yeah.

Ben: Yeah. We say that we stayed at an item breakers and it was actually pretty cool. Um,

Zach: It's not like the hotel super nice or anything.

Ben: No.

Zach: It's just the location is so optimal.

Ben: Yeah. Also that pavilion and boardwalk thing was, um it was executed pretty well. It was nice because it was nice to be able to eat food and not have to wait it in a super long line because they had two different options or like two different restaurants inside of the pavilion Like one had barbecue stuff and then the other one had like classic burgers and you know tenders and stuff.

Ben: um you know and There's like four separate lines. It moves quick. There's plenty of open seating. You're right on the lake. They pulled that off one pretty well.

Ben: And also too, just being able to walk from there to breakers on the boardwalk and

Zach: Yeah, that boardwalk is fantastic.

Ben: They also had a lot of live entertainment also, which was kind of cool. So they had, there was like different, like there was like an acrobatic performer thing and they had synchronized kites and there were just like various kind of like acts and stuff at nighttime. It was a really good, good vibe. Definitely something that that park never had before.

Ben: And now it's like, has more of that kind of resort feel, which is, which is cool.

Zach: Yeah, that's what I'd like to do there because like Breakers is just such a good location for that park.

Ben: is

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: Because it's like can do the early entry.

Ben: Also, too, we we got we're able to get to go drinks at that bar and then we hung out on the beach. After the park closed.

Zach: Yeah, dude, and now it's legal in Ohio, so you could just smoke out there probably.

Ben: Mm hmm.

Zach: Like... Yeah, that's even better.

Zach: I find that now... In my like mid 30s, I'm big on taking a midday break on a long park day.

Ben: Yeah.

Zach: So like anytime the hotel is walking distance from the park.

Zach: That's like a huge bonus.

Ben: Yeah, for sure.

Zach: You mean I can sit for an hour and take my shoes off without really worrying about missing too much during the busiest part of the day? Fuck yeah.

Ben: Yeah.

Ben: I think the only downside of Cedar point is that, um, there's no convenience store. And this was like, this was like peak of my Zen phase this summer. Cause, um, I took, I did this trip in the middle of, um staying in Duluth for the month of August.

Ben: Cause we were up there for a couple of weeks and, um, which was a fucking nightmare. Oh my God, i totally forgot about that already. had to take a shuttle from Duluth to Minneapolis, which is a three-hour drive.

Zach: Oh my God.

Ben: And the shuttle runs at the worst times. So my flight to Richmond, I had to leave Duluth at 11.45 p.m.,

Ben: eleven forty five p m

Zach: Good Lord.

Ben: So I got on the shuttle and then I got to Minneapolis airport at like three 30 in the morning and my flight wasn't until six 30. So just like having to sit and also this is terminal. So there's terminal one and terminal two terminal two is like, or terminal, yeah. Terminal two is their non-international hub. So there's like nothing really open and nowhere to really like, you know, hang out.

Ben: Um, And then a bar opened at 4 a.m. And I sat down, ate breakfast. the bartender's like, hey, we got a special, get a free shot if you order a tall beer or whatever it was.

Ben: And I'm like, dude, it's 4 a.m. second i was like, i I didn't sleep last night. And then, of course, there was these like you know typical...

Ben: minute like Minnesotans next to me. They were going to Vegas. They're on like a 6 a.m. Vegas flight. So of course they were getting hammered. um

Ben: Yeah, and flew to Richmond, connected through Chicago. or no, connected through Baltimore. Nevermind. And then on the flight back, I flew from...

Ben: Toledo? No. Dayton. think it was Dayton.

Ben: Dayton to Midway to Minneapolis. I got stuck in Midway for seven hours because of a thunderstorm. And I closed out the bar.

Ben: It closed at 10 and then our flight didn't board until 1.45 a.m.

Zach: Oh, damn.

Ben: Yeah. And Midway is also, it's not O'Hare, so there's literally nothing open after 10 p.m. in that airport. um So yeah, get on the board this fucking flight, land in Minneapolis at 3 a.m., and then I had to wait until 7 a.m. to take the shuttle from Minneapolis back up to Duluth.

Ben: So it was miserable. Miserable. Anyway, what I was saying is there was nowhere to get Zins on the peninsula.

Ben: which was kind of a bummer.

Zach: No, you got to bring all your alcohol and shit with you and weed and all that and snacks and all that shit.

Ben: Yeah.

Ben: Yeah.

Ben: So that's the only downside, but um otherwise, yeah it's lovely.

Zach: Not really a downside, though. You just got to plan ahead.

Ben: Yeah.

Ben: I know. Also that breakers cough that that's so that Starbucks inside of the Breakers made the mistake of trying to get it a drink there at 8.45 a.m.

Ben: and there was literally 25 people in line.

Zach: Oh, God.

Ben: and there's like yeah And there's like two poor people like working only and you're just like, oh my God, I feel so bad.

Zach: Yeah, you got to go at like 6

Ben: like And then there is and there is a Starbucks inside of the park that was that was ah a lot nicer. so

Ben: um Well, shit. i

Ben: need to hop off soon-ish.

Zach: I mean, it has been almost two and a half hours.

Ben: What's up? Yeah, but I'm glad that we got... um Yeah, glad we got one in.

Zach: Same, same. It feels right to close out the year with an episode. Maybe we can do a couple more.

Ben: Yeah, I got my, I mean, I'm going to Wisconsin next week for a couple days, but I'm around that whole week between Christmas and new Year's. So I've got time.

Zach: For sure, yeah. um

Zach: I might be in Vegas.

Zach: We'll see.

Zach: We shall see. um But yeah, I think i'll I'll let you know. Hopefully we can record something.

Ben: Cool. Nah, I'm

Zach: Or whatever. But this, yeah, this has been an awesome. And I'm glad we're able to do it. It's been a good time.

Zach: Shit, you got anything else?

Ben: yeah i'm all good

Zach: All right. Well, ah for the first time in a long while, thank you all for listening so much. And until next time, your favorite coasters sucks.

Ben: Your favorite coaster sucks.