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146. Hiking the GR5 Through Europe with Kathy Elkind
160 Plays1 year ago
Ready for a grand adventure? Tune in to learn all about how one couple hiked across several countries in Europe over the course of a few months.
Today’s guest is Kathy Elkind, author of the new book To Walk It Is To See It. In her late fifties, Kathy and her husband took what they call an “adult gap year” and hiked 1,400 miles across Europe’s GR5.
Kathy shares how they prepared for this adventure and what the journey looked like. In our conversation, we discuss the power of self-compassion, how to navigate this type of trip as a couple, advice for those new to hiking, what to pack for a long-distance trek and much more.
If you enjoy this episode, please feel free to rate and review the podcast on whatever app you’re listening on, and share with a friend!
OUR SPONSOR
This episode is brought to you by Vivoo. Use my code VALERIE20 for 20% off your purchase of Vivoo self-tracking sticks.
- Website: Vivoo.io
- Podcast Episode: Optimizing Our Health Through Biohacking with Miray Tayfun
CONNECT WITH KATHY
Website: https://www.kathyelkind.com/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/kathyelkind
Book: https://www.amazon.com/dp/1647425255/
CONNECT WITH THE SHOW
Website: WellnessAndWanderlust.net
Instagram: www.instagram.com/wellnessandwanderlustblog
Facebook: www.facebook.com/wellnessandwanderlustblog
Twitter: www.twitter.com/moses_says
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Transcript
00:00:03
Speaker
Welcome
Introduction to the Podcast and Episode 146
00:00:04
Speaker
to the wellness and wanderlust podcast. We're here to demystify wellness and help you add a little adventure to your life. Tune in for a new episode every week, where we'll hear from incredible guests and talk about ways to be happier and healthier in our new normal. I'm your host, Valerie Moses. Let's get started.
00:00:23
Speaker
Hi everyone, welcome to episode 146 of the wellness and wanderlust podcast. Whether you're brand new here or a long time listener, I'm so glad that you've joined us today. This show is all about creating our best lives through small and actionable steps.
00:00:39
Speaker
and I'm proud to bring on so many amazing experts to share their stories and insights with us.
Kathy Elkind's Hiking Adventure
00:00:44
Speaker
Today's guest is Kathy Elkind, author of the new book, To Walk It Is To See It. In her late 50s, Kathy and her husband took what they call an adult gap year and embarked on a grand adventure, hiking 1,400 miles across Europe's GR5. Kathy shares how they prepared for this adventure and what the journey looked like.
00:01:03
Speaker
In our conversation, we discuss the power of self-compassion and how it ties into a trip like this, how to navigate this type of trip as a couple, advice for those new to hiking, what to pack for a long distance trek, and so much more. You're really going to love this one. It is such a unique story. And she has an amazing book that will accompany it as well. Our sponsor for today's episode is Vevu.
00:01:24
Speaker
Vivu is an at-home wellness tracker that gives you personalized recommendations based on your hydration, ketones, pH levels, white blood cells, liver and kidney function, and more. They've also added some new parameters to the app, like oxidative stress and magnesium. How it works, you'll download the free Vivu app
00:01:41
Speaker
pee on one of the sticks provided, and scan it into the app to receive your tips based on health goals, dietary preferences, and more. The advice is really tailored to our individual needs, so if you include it in your profile that you're gluten free, the app will never tell you to consume gluten. If you want to get into ketosis, the app will notate that.
00:01:59
Speaker
and change up your parameters accordingly. It's such a cool tracker and we actually had Vivu's founder Mirai Typhoon on episode 26 of the show if you'd like to learn more. If you want to try Vivu for yourself, listeners get 20% off your purchase with code VALERIE20. That's V-A-L-E-R-I-E 20. And I've linked everything in the show notes as well. Alright my friends, now let's get into this week's conversation with Kathy Elkind.
00:02:25
Speaker
Hi, Kathy. Welcome to wellness and wanderlust. Hi, Valerie. I'm really excited to be here. Thank you. Well, I'm so excited to have you on the show. You have had such an amazing journey and it really is such a combination of that wellness and wanderlust that we talk about on the show. So I'm very, very excited to get into your story. Before we do that, why don't we take it back a little bit and tell our listeners just a little bit about you. Well,
Background and Decision to Hike
00:02:51
Speaker
let's see. Uh, I'm a long distance Walker now.
00:02:56
Speaker
I'm 63 years old, and I'm very proud of my age, which I didn't used to be, but I am now. I just finished writing my first book, To Walk It Is To See It, so that's really exciting. And over the years, I've been a baker, an elementary school teacher, a reading tutor. I had my own business called Elkind Nourishment, and I was an eating psychology coach
00:03:23
Speaker
As an eating psychology coach, I owned my business, Elkhine Nourishment, but I don't do that anymore. And I also have been a teacher of mindful self-compassion. And I have two adult children, and so I'm still a mom.
00:03:38
Speaker
So I've done many, many things in my life. Well, that's amazing. And I can't wait to really dive in a little bit further into the long distance walking because I think that is so, so cool. I'm a very short distance walker, but I do love my walks and I was really inspired by your story. And just knowing a little bit more of your background, I think definitely have some more questions for you about how some of those things
00:04:02
Speaker
played into your journey, but you became a long distance walker recently and you wrote about that experience in your book that has just come out. Tell us a little bit about that trip that you took and what inspired you to take that journey.
00:04:18
Speaker
Well, what inspired I so I walked with my husband and my husband and I back in 2018 had been married for 27 years and our kids who had left the nest and we were moving from Massachusetts up to Vermont and before
00:04:35
Speaker
we settled into a new community, we decided to take a gap year, just the way kids take gap years. And it didn't end up being a whole year. And I had always personally wanted to do a grand adventure like the Appalachian Trail or the Pacific Crest Trail. But in my late 50s, at 57, I didn't really want to carry a heavy backpack anymore. And I didn't want to
00:05:00
Speaker
really camp that much. I don't mind going for a few days, but I really, the Pacific Crest Trail and the Appalachian Trail just seemed too much for me at that point. And my husband would have been happy to do anything. He's pretty hardcore. So we had to find a middle ground where we would both be happy. And we looked, we kept asking people, what, what have you done? You know, what's some cool adventures? So we asked lots and lots of people
00:05:25
Speaker
And we had met this Frenchman who had traveled all over the world and was really into adventure. And he talked about the GR5, and I had never heard of the GR5, and it stands for Grand Rondenet Sink, the 5th one. In Europe, there are many
00:05:43
Speaker
grand rendezvous, which means grand walk. So I actually googled it. He had walked across the Alps. When I googled GR5, what came up was a walk from
00:05:56
Speaker
the Netherlands, Hoek Van Holland in the Netherlands, through Belgium, Luxembourg, and the whole length of France. And I'm like, well, let's do that. That sounds like a great, great trip.
Preparation and Daily Routine on the GR5 Trail
00:06:06
Speaker
And I read as many books and blogs as I could, and guide books. And Jim, actually, Jim was a little, he wasn't sure he really wanted to do it. He wasn't sure if it was going to be hardcore enough for him.
00:06:20
Speaker
We found out that it's very well, the Netherlands obviously are very flat with the canals and just flat area and I was a little worried he was going to get bored. So we decided to bike the first week, which would have been three weeks of walking. So we biked the first week.
00:06:37
Speaker
down to Spa, Belgium. And then we walked the rest of the way. So that was what we did. That's so, so amazing. And this trip is 1400 miles as well. And how do you prepare for something like that? Had you been doing semi long walks before that or hikes or anything like that? Or what does the preparation look like for a trip like that?
00:07:03
Speaker
So I had always been a runner, but that's kind of near a metapause. I just stopped running for a while and just walked, which, you know, so I love walking, but it was like an hour walk, not super long. And as we, when we moved up to Vermont, I, because when we started to get ready for the trip, I, for let's see, January and February. So I walked in the cold for up to about four hours on the dirt roads. And it was a great way to get to know
00:07:31
Speaker
this new place that we had moved to starting to walk in the green mountains and Jim skied and skinned. I don't know if you know what skinning is, it's like climbing up a mountain with your skis on and you have these skins and so he got an exercise by climbing up the mountains and skiing down and I just walked and then we actually decided to go to southern Italy beforehand for six weeks and we just
00:07:59
Speaker
we did day walks. So we got used to the slower life of living in Europe and eating a little bit later and got used to the Euro and things like that and just enjoyed our time. So lots of day hikes in Sicily. And then we took a flight up to the Netherlands and started. Wow.
00:08:24
Speaker
I mean, that is so cool. And it really is, you know, when you talk about grand adventure, I mean, the title of your book to walk it is to see it. I mean, that really is so true. And you are getting such a unique perspective of several countries and different cultures and people and ways of life. And I'd love to know what those 90 eighties looked like for you. I'm sure they had the highs and the lows. Yeah, well,
00:08:51
Speaker
The really unique thing about the GR5 is that it does start flat, and then you go through the Ardennes, which are smaller mountains, very small mountains in Belgium, and then rolling hills in Luxembourg and northern France, and then eventually you get to the Jura for two weeks, or the Vosges first for two weeks, then the Jura, and finally the Alps. So it builds and builds and builds, and you get
00:09:19
Speaker
you get stronger and stronger. I got stronger and stronger as it went along. But an average day, we'd wake up, we were staying in very small hotels or they're called Jeets, which is, sometimes they were dorm rooms and things like that. Sometimes we also stayed in mountain refuges. So the whole variety of
00:09:40
Speaker
places that we stayed but almost all of them serve breakfast which usually wasn't too big it was coffee and a croissant which sometimes we would buy a little bit extra to eat a little bit more because we would be hungry and then we'd stop again usually we were sleeping in villages and we would stop at the bakery and buy bread for
00:09:58
Speaker
lunch and cheese and trying to get as many vegetables in as we could, go to the little grocery store and buy tomatoes and cucumbers and carrots and apples and chocolate, of course, and then start walking. Once we got into the rolling hills and the mountains, you end up walking uphill first.
00:10:22
Speaker
and then you're walking along ridges or different things and stop and have lunch halfway along the way. And we didn't push ourselves. Some days definitely were hard, but we didn't push ourselves. I don't know. We always saved enough energy to explore the towns and villages that we were in because part of the whole
00:10:42
Speaker
Was seeing the culture and getting to know the people and things like that So that was that was the best part and then dinner a later dinner seven or eight o'clock eating dinner and then bed Reading about the next day and then bed basically. So that was it
00:10:58
Speaker
That's amazing. And I will say reading the book, I have such an appreciation for the for the love for chocolate and chocolate. Yes, both Jim and I love chocolate. I mean, that's, that's so important. And that's another I mean, you know, Belgium, obviously you have to have. Yeah, yes.
00:11:21
Speaker
Yeah well that's that is incredible and it is so important to still get to experience the places that you're that you're seeing rather than just kind of powering through because you you're going on this adventure because it's something you want to enjoy and you want to learn and grow and
00:11:37
Speaker
Yeah, to really get to experience that by getting to know the people. And that was something I really loved in the book was that you guys did run into people from all over Europe, all over the world, people that lived in the town that you had lived in and finding out, you know, we live in such a big world, but it can be so small sometimes too. And
00:11:55
Speaker
connecting with others. I mean, that had to be such a huge part of this journey for you. Yeah, yes. And again, what was neat about it is in the very beginning, the first probably six weeks, we didn't run into that many other walkers. There's not too many people that do the whole trail. Many Europeans do two weeks at a time or three weeks at a time. But there aren't that many people that do the whole trail at one shot. And so we didn't run into we ran into walkers, day walkers.
00:12:25
Speaker
you
00:12:25
Speaker
in the beginning. And as it built up more into the summertime, we started at the end of April, and then, and so May, people, it's still not the holiday time. And even June, we did run into walkers in the Vosges Mountains and the Jura people starting to do, we ran into other walkers. And it really wasn't until the Alps that we started seeing people day after day. And that was really fun to run into people. There's, you know, like a walking culture, similar, I've read books about the
00:12:55
Speaker
Appalachian Trail and the PCT Trail where people run into each other.
00:13:00
Speaker
there's the whole community. And the European walking community, I think is slightly different. It's more older people doing this kind of walking, but still just as much fun. So yeah, it was great. That's amazing. And something you touched on at the beginning was that you used to teach mindful self-compassion.
Mindfulness and Relationship Management on the Trail
00:13:20
Speaker
And I'd love to know how that played into a trip like this because you are really challenging yourself
00:13:27
Speaker
mentally and physically through something like this. And I'm sure unexpected things pop up. How did the mindful self-compassion play into your journey?
00:13:39
Speaker
Well, so even before I left, I wrote down mindfulness on a piece of paper and I wrote down self-compassion. I wrote down one other thing. I can't remember what the other one was. And I physically, well, I took pictures of them and even posted it on Instagram just to
00:13:59
Speaker
show that I was intentionally bringing these mindfulness and self-compassion along with me, even though they didn't weigh anything, they were probably the hardest to use. Because we all know that there's always, yes, unexpected things. You get into town and you realize that the hotel that you had booked is another three or four kilometers across town and maybe even out of town.
00:14:24
Speaker
And so you have another four kilometers that you didn't quite realize that you have to walk to, or it turns out they're not even serving food that night. That didn't happen too many times, but a few times it did. So I've gotten better and better as I get older and older and using self-compassion and mindfulness. And so mindfulness, it's basically realizing that, man, this is hard and I'm hangry.
00:14:51
Speaker
I'm tired and I just want to get there. And the other thing is you're also dealing with a spouse who you know very well and it's easy to get mad at them and blame them. But taking a step back and breathing and giving yourself compassion, which again is not an easy thing to do, but because I've taught it, it's helped me to bring up this gentle voice with myself and the self-compassion.
00:15:17
Speaker
You give someone compassion, and we're all very good at giving other people compassion, but you usually give compassion to someone when they're suffering. So we could say having to walk another unexpected four kilometers is a form of suffering. And so you say, oh, this is hard, Kathy. And you speak to yourself in this tone of voice that at first sounds a little hokey, and you're just saying it in your mind.
00:15:42
Speaker
you know, oh, this is hard, you got four more kilometers to go and your feet are tired and you're just acknowledging, you're being like, you're being kind to yourself and acknowledging it that you're not trying to fix anything or even you could give yourself a little bit of a pep talk, but it's more just acknowledging that you are exhausted and you may be a little bit angry at your spouse
00:16:09
Speaker
or whatever. And but you know, we're trying to make the best of it and things like that. So that's what mindful self compassion and yes, I used it many times. And there were probably other times when I should have been using it too. But that's, that's life.
00:16:24
Speaker
You know, I know that sometimes people, whether they go with a spouse or significant other, or they're traveling with a friend or roommate or what have you, spending time in that close proximity for a couple of days, sometimes we can snap and lose patience. So over the course of, you know, 98 days, talk to me about what that was like, you know, as a couple, how just spending that much time together, how you were able to make that work and come out the other side.
00:16:54
Speaker
Yeah. Well, one thing that was kind of interesting, and then by the third day, we had really kind of fallen into a pattern in the morning where we walked separately. We could always see each other because we didn't want to lose each other. But we could always see each other. But we walked either he would walk ahead or I would walk ahead. And we also had these little things that just sort of came about. The person up ahead would be looking for the way markers.
00:17:23
Speaker
and look at checking, we used Gaia for our GPS and looking for the signs and things like that. So that person would be paying attention and the other person could just daydream and follow along. So that helped a lot. And then in the afternoon, we tended to talk more and things like that. And we definitely, what I found the most interesting is when we
00:17:46
Speaker
got to Lake Geneva after basically two months of walking together. We had two and a half days off and it was at that point that we kind of really started arguing and fighting more because I think we had let our guard down when we're
00:18:04
Speaker
When we were out walking and adventuring, you're kind of like a unit and you're watching out for each other and the two of you were taking on the world and you're both helping each other out and you're a team, you're a team united. But then when we had those two and a half days off, it was like we had let down our guard and simple little things were driving each other. We were driving each other crazy.
00:18:29
Speaker
So yeah, and luckily I and humor Jim is my husband is very good at using humor. And I, you know, once he brings up the humor, then I can dive into it too. So that helps. Absolutely. I'd also love to know for something like this, and now you experienced this at the beginning of the trip getting sick, what are your tips for someone doing a trip like this to take care of themselves and to know when it's time to
00:18:57
Speaker
slow down or take that break or really just how do we really do that when we're in a state of, you know, you're traveling throughout the trip. You're not in that one place. Yeah. Well, obviously I didn't do it wrong, but I kept pushing and thinking, well, my excitement for the trip kept me going and I would sort of push through my sickness. I think I basically caught something on the plane and
00:19:25
Speaker
because we were go, go, go, and I was excited and I wasn't sleeping because again, I was wound up. I was really just so excited about the trip. So I think it's being able to, again, their mindfulness, realizing, oh, maybe I just need to calm myself down a little bit more.
00:19:42
Speaker
and pay attention to the signs that my body is telling me and stop a little suit. I probably should have stopped five days before, but I kept pushing and thinking I would get better. So yeah, listening to your body. And in some ways, I think having that experience happen in the beginning of the trip really helped me pay attention the rest of the trip to my body and not pushing and following along and finding your own strength and your own pace and things like that. Does that make sense?
00:20:12
Speaker
Absolutely. Yeah. So with that too, as you're going through a journey like this, where you are stopping in different places and there is an end destination site, but you have a lot of stops along the way,
00:20:28
Speaker
How do you plan for something like that? And how do you know where you're going to stay and where you're going to be on what day? I'm sure there's plenty of planning at the front end before the walk even starts, but what did that look like? Did that change a lot on your path or were there any surprises that came up? Yes. In the very beginning, because it was May, hotels weren't busy, so we could
00:20:54
Speaker
We booked out maybe two or three days ahead, but we also realized there's a lot of different holidays and you had to pay attention to different holidays, long weekends that we didn't really know about until it happened. Then we'd realize, oh, it's hard to find a hotel for that night. So most of the time, so in the beginning we did that. As it got more into June and July, we started, we spent some of our days off.
00:21:22
Speaker
about once a week or once every 10 days, we took a day off and rested our bodies. And that was the time that we would make reservations ahead of time. And by the time we got to the Alps, we had made sort of reservations almost three weeks ahead of time. But we did know our pace, so that was good because it would have been a pain to re-change all of our reservations.
00:21:47
Speaker
It's really hard to know. I know some people like to be more spontaneous and make the reservations. Even that morning, I want to walk this far, but both Jim and I are happy to know exactly where we're going to end up and not spend time looking for a place to stay.
00:22:04
Speaker
when you get into a village. So yes, it was a huge learning curve. We got better. It certainly helps these days with email and WhatsApp. And we actually started asking, you know, again, more of the what we asked a Dutch woman and she shared a whole website that about all the different place, hotels that
00:22:26
Speaker
are on along the GR5. It was all in Dutch, but we could figure it out. So yeah, we learned along the way. Yeah. And I think that's so important too, just to, you know, you have the flexibility, but at the same time you're, I don't know, for me, I really do like to have at least somewhat of a plan, but knowing that the plan can change, especially with something like this where, yeah, you do have holiday. I mean,
00:22:53
Speaker
Yeah, it's almost at the time of recording, it's almost this deal day and I'm sure, you know, certainly having to deal with any kind of holiday, travel, traffic, crowds, things like that. I mean, that can definitely like, so having some of that plan ahead of time, but being able to learn and having some of that flexibility because then you did have some places that you got to stay where you met really incredible people and have these impactful conversations.
00:23:20
Speaker
Yes. Yeah. Yeah. That was the one where we couldn't find a place to stay. And eventually it took a while. Eventually they, somebody who used to own an auberg, put us up for the night. So it was a, it was a couple that, you know, it was just their house. And at that point we also didn't even know whether they were going to serve us dinner or whether we should just bring extra cheese and bread. So yeah, it's all a surprise. Much of it is a surprise.
00:23:46
Speaker
Absolutely. Now, I guess, you know, it's 98 days, so I'm sure there are plenty, but what would you say were some of the highlights in terms of the places you went and what you saw during that time? Let's
Exploration of Cultural Sites and Natural Beauty
00:24:00
Speaker
see, definitely the cultural sites. So the GR5, my understanding of the way the trail, it's constantly, the trail is constantly changing and different organizations in the different parts of France rerouted in different ways.
00:24:16
Speaker
over the years. And it definitely goes by a lot of different cultural sites, castles, rundown castles, World War II and World War I relics, and even we walked by two
00:24:32
Speaker
a World War I cemetery that I actually didn't write about in the book. It was so moving. It was hard to write about it. And the World War II cemetery is a smaller one. And you just realize
00:24:49
Speaker
You learn so much of the history by walking through these. We walked also by a convent that had a long history. And so the history and the culture was really neat that the GR5 led you right by. It was pretty neat. Let's see what else. Well, the food, I've talked about that a little bit, was pretty amazing.
00:25:08
Speaker
And then I haven't really, the Alps at the end were, you know, the wildflowers, the snow was melting up high. The wildflowers were spectacular. You know, you felt like you were walking through, you know, the Julie Andrews was going to come around the corner and felt like the sound of music. It was just.
00:25:27
Speaker
you know, spectacular scenery. And we kind of lucked out in weather. We didn't get any of those heat waves that much of Europe has gotten over the last couple of years. And I think this summer right now, I think they're in a heat wave. So we were really lucky. We finished August 1st. So we missed the heat waves and we had some rain, but
00:25:50
Speaker
Nothing terrible. So the Alps are just spectacular. If you ever have a chance, go walk in the Alps. You can do it for a week, you know. I mean, obviously you have to get in shape, but, you know, spectacular. That's amazing. And I mean, what an incredible destination to end at. It's such a beautiful place and to get there and I mean, the wildflowers that has to be.
00:26:14
Speaker
just so, so beautiful. But I think that's such an incredible journey again, and really getting to know a country by and a continent by so many different things because you're experiencing the nature, but you are experiencing the culture and the history and seeing everything from that different perspective, something that you might not get off of a tour bus or flying into one particular airport, you really get to see so much more. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah.
00:26:43
Speaker
Now something that you talk about in the book, when there was a mantra that you repeated to yourself, this is something I struggle with a lot, but one day at a time.
00:26:52
Speaker
And I would imagine we have about 85, 90% of our listeners are female. So we are juggling so many different things. And I think a lot of us and the men listening too will struggle with this. But a lot of us struggle with that one day at a time mentality. How did you start to embody that? And how can we all embody that more in our lives?
00:27:13
Speaker
Yeah, that's a great question. What noticed was that I really wasn't thinking about what was too many days ahead because I would just worry. And I'm not sure whether I noticed it more because I was walking and you're just really more in tune with your body. But I did notice that if I thought too far ahead, I would get depressed and worried and it just wasn't worth it. So I knew enough about mindfulness to say, all right, we're just not going to worry about that.
00:27:43
Speaker
And I did use it as a mantra as I walk, one day at a time. And I even shifted it to one step at a time, some of the time, especially when you're climbing, just one step at a time, one step at a time. And let's see, how would you do... Again, it all comes down to mindfulness. I would say if you're either busy with your kids or busy with work,
00:28:07
Speaker
make your list. Yes, you have to think ahead, obviously at work or dealing with kids, you have to plan things out, but make your list. And then whatever you decide to do, work on that task and stay focused. And if you notice that your mind is beginning to worry about
00:28:24
Speaker
the future or you're worried about the past or something like that, then again, using mindfulness. Ooh, look at that. I'm worried. I'm worrying. And don't beat yourself up, which again, all this stuff, it takes time. It takes practice to not notice that critical voice of, oh, you're looking here.
00:28:45
Speaker
you're worrying again, stop worrying. Well, that's not going to help. You have to do it with a gentle voice and bring in some self compassion. I don't know, maybe put your hand on your heart and just say, Oh, look at that. You know, it's not worth worrying right now. Let's just focus on this task and work on this task. And it's a practice, you know, well, we all, you know, we're human. We do the best we can. So that's, that's what I would say. And I do, I really do believe in mantras, find the thing that helps you and
00:29:14
Speaker
Write it down on a card and take it with you on a walk and keep repeating it. And then you can notice that maybe it'll help you when you're actually working and things like that. Does that make sense? Does that?
00:29:26
Speaker
I love that. Yeah. Because I do think you're so right that that critical voice pops up so often when we're doing something with the best of intentions. And it's so counterintuitive that, I mean, I've definitely said something not so nice to myself. And then I'm criticizing my, like, that's so stupid. That's horrible that you would say that to yourself. Like, and then criticizing and I was like, wait a second. Yeah.
00:29:53
Speaker
like you're being so mean and it's like okay well maybe there's a better way to deal with that and to notice and yeah and to care for ourselves and to yeah so I really do think that's so important and I would have met you know you learn a lot in nature and like anytime that you're challenging yourself challenging your body any of that I'd love to know what you learned about you when you were when you were on this trip
00:30:19
Speaker
Well, I definitely learned that I'm strong and I sort of, I called it a, it's a wise strength. You know how many languages have many different, we need more words for strong because, you know, strong has this, it has many different connotations, but we need some more words. I call it wise strength.
00:30:40
Speaker
So, you know, knowing your pace and following your own pace and figuring out what your pace, I figured out what my pace was to walk all day and to walk day after day after day. And again, listening, you know, listening to your body. I listened to my body and knew when to slow down and also to really be joyous of the pace that you have and the strength that you have, because we all are stronger than we think.
00:31:09
Speaker
We really are. And the other thing that I noticed, this is kind of a cool thing, I noticed when I walked uphill, I would get like more ideas in my head.
Creative Insights and Advice for Hikers
00:31:20
Speaker
And one of the things I was doing as I was, I made some short, I made some videos, I tried to make one
00:31:27
Speaker
YouTube video once every two weeks about the trip and I noticed I would get more ideas and I would make the videos as I was walking along and I called them breathless Kathy videos because I was breathing of course I'm breathing hard as I'm walking uphill but that's when I was getting my ideas so yeah I mean there was so much that I learned about myself but those were those are the ones I
00:31:50
Speaker
I think that that's amazing and I really think that listening to your body is something that we don't do enough of. I think so many of us are of that power through mentality and then you're sore, you're sick, you're whatever it is because we didn't and then maybe we don't want to do the thing again when if we were to listen to ourselves and know where we need to stop and how we can pace ourselves.
00:32:14
Speaker
that we would still be able to enjoy it and experience it even more. And I'm definitely going to have to try that walking uphill, see if that does anything for my creative juices. I'm in the state of Florida, which is very, very flat, but yeah.
00:32:29
Speaker
So I don't get to experience, you know, my, my hikes are really just very flat walks, but at the same time, you know, there are some hilly areas. So I totally want to try that and see if, uh, if the uphill does anything for, for my state of mind, but that's, that's so cool. And for those who are listening who either don't have a lot of experience hiking, maybe they have no experience hiking, what tips do you have for them to maybe not necessarily start with, you know, a 98 day?
00:32:59
Speaker
1400 mile trek, but for getting into hiking and experiencing nature in this way and exerting themselves in a way that they haven't, where do we start? Definitely start slow, you know, or in short, pick ones that you know, you know, you can do. And obviously it depends where you are in the country or the world, you know, you'll have to all trails. There's a lot of different apps that give suggestions and things like that that you can find.
00:33:25
Speaker
So definitely start out small and might as well do well and then you'll want to do it again. And it is important to have a first aid kit, especially if you're going out all day long. If you're just going for an hour walk, you don't need your first aid kit. But for an all-day hike, you definitely need a first aid kit.
00:33:42
Speaker
You need warm clothes, clothes that'll keep the rain or the snow off, depending, water, food, some way to communicate people with, and a map, some sort of map, either on an iPhone, GPS, or something like that. And then the most important thing is to make sure your shoes, you've broken in your shoes. Well, that's how you get better at hiking, is breaking in your shoes.
00:34:06
Speaker
because you really you know blisters are a pain in the neck and Jim and I were very good about taking care of our feet in the very beginning so that we did not get blisters and we had used our shoes our walking shoes a lot before so we knew what worked and I would say go with a friend too it's much more fun.
00:34:26
Speaker
a couple of friends there and I'm sure there are many places also have white walking groups. Yeah, I've definitely seen especially in a lot of cities like some of the larger areas I've seen that and I think the shoes I've ruined many a trip some of my shorter trips even city walking because I decided to wear dumb shoes on an early day because it looked great for Instagram and
00:34:52
Speaker
The blisters are pretty miserable. And so I don't joke around with my shoes anymore. I will wear whatever is comfortable. Yeah, and socks to the socks to match. I'm a big believer in double socks, you have thin layer and then heavier layer, because then the
00:35:09
Speaker
friction is between the two pairs of socks instead of your skin and the socks. So that works out well. Yeah, that's huge. I'd also I'd love to know for now for this trip, because I truly admire the minimalism I strive to be a minimalist, but just looking in my space right now as we speak.
00:35:30
Speaker
It's maybe not quite there, but I'd love to know for a trip like this. I, I mean, I pack an insane amount of stuff for a weekend. How do you pack for something like this that you're going to be carrying with you and what are the essentials of a trip of this magnitude? So we had the walking clothes that we wore, um, you know, shorts, shirt, sports bra, underwear. I had four pairs of underwear, I think, wearing one.
00:35:59
Speaker
and one other sports bra. We called them our evening clothes. So we had one set of clothes to wear and we wore the same thing every night. I had one skirt, one shirt, one nice shirt and a sweater. So you always could put on called it our evening wear. And then we also had, obviously a pair of long pants in case it was raining or cold, one pair of, I call it long winter,
00:36:28
Speaker
long winter underwear because through the Alps it was cold we had a light hat light gloves
00:36:35
Speaker
What else do we have? You know, raincoat, rain pants. I think we had four pairs of socks. Well, the thin, two pairs of thin, two pairs of heavy, and then socks for the, again, evening wear socks because it's nice to put on a different kind of sock. And we brought too much in the beginning and we kept leaving things along the way because our packs got lighter and lighter as we went along because
00:37:03
Speaker
It was much nicer to have a lighter pack. I keep meaning to do a Pinterest post of our list of what we carried, but yeah, you want to go as light as possible because you're, and I used walking poles. Jim didn't use, he eventually bought walking poles in the Alps just to do something different, but I used them definitely on the downhill because I had had knee issues and I liked them on the downhill.
00:37:28
Speaker
Oh, absolutely. Yeah, that's so important. And yeah, I would definitely love to see that packing list for sure. I love that. I love the evening wear there too. But yeah, and I was laughing at the beginning of the book, I think it was it was it a camera tripod that you left it when they followed you and brought it back to you. Yeah, I still have that because I feel like I
00:37:56
Speaker
I couldn't get rid of it after I tried to and then just came back to me. They're all too nice. They look after you. I had not put a note. I got better at putting it. If we wanted to leave things, we use Google Translate a lot because our French was not all that good and I would write a note and put, we're leaving this and hopefully it finds a good home. But yes, we got lighter and lighter.
00:38:21
Speaker
Oh, I'm sure. And any other tips for preparing for a trip like this that anyone should know, whether it's for, you know, 98 days or whether they're doing maybe a week or two weeks of maybe a shorter leg of the GR5 or of another type of trail or anything like that. This is not, I'm not sponsored by these people. Cicerone Press is a British press that prints guidebooks
00:38:50
Speaker
And if you go on their website, it's just wonderful because you get so excited. They have guidebooks all over Europe, all over the world, not necessarily the US. And some of them are day hikes. Some of them are week long.
00:39:08
Speaker
great place to get excited of places to go you know obviously get in shape keep talking to people too and the other thing i found is once i had guidebooks or if i found blogs about the walk you know just email people the writers they are all happy to answer any questions you have i found the walking community so helpful that i've become good friends i've never met them in person but you know with some of the one of the person that
00:39:36
Speaker
wrote one of the guidebooks so yeah people are very helpful reach out ask questions it's helpful it's helpful to read blogs just google blogs about certain walks and because blocks are also a little more interesting you know a guidebook tells you how far from one place to the other it tells you where there's food and things like that and water
00:39:57
Speaker
but it doesn't tell you sort of the emotional part of it. And blogs help you with that. Like, oh, that, you know, that was a ton of road walking and that, you know, that kind of thing. So blogs are much more books and read my book and then you can go off and do the GR5.
00:40:16
Speaker
Yes. And your book is truly amazing. And I definitely am going to ask a little more about the book as well, because I think that, again, first of all, the book is now out when the listeners are tuning in. So they don't even have to pre-order. They can go ahead and order. But I would love to dive in a little bit more. In general, what inspired you to then write the book when you got back?
Writing and Personal Growth
00:40:42
Speaker
Um, it was interesting. So moving up to Vermont, I kept trying to restart my business and it just wasn't working. I would offer, I would offer workshops and I'd get two or three people in there and I'd realize it was the wrong time and it just wasn't working. And I was, I think I was really sad. I missed the GR5. I missed the walk.
00:41:04
Speaker
And so I realized I was thinking about it so much. And I have, I've, you know, I think there was a little pebble of thought in my mind, I always wanted to write a book and I
00:41:14
Speaker
have written, you know, I wrote blogs for my business and things like that. But I actually have dyslexia. So I didn't learn to read until seventh grade. And writing has always been a struggle. But I have now I've gotten to be a pretty good writer. And I have was in a writing group. And I like, I'm just going to write this, that's I'm going to spend my time writing it. And it kind of worked out because then
00:41:37
Speaker
COVID came and what else is there to do but sit right during COVID. So that worked out well. And I didn't find a traditional publisher. I ended up with She Writes Press, which is a hybrid publisher. And it's been wonderful. It's a great press. And they're very supportive of new writers. And I've gotten to know so many other authors through them. It's been great. It's been really wonderful.
00:42:03
Speaker
That's amazing. I mean, what a great way to create even more community. And I think it's so inspiring that not only did you walk the GR5 and do this thing that most people have never done it to its full capacity or even parts of, you know, and so you're
00:42:22
Speaker
getting to share this really unique experience and empower others to do the same. But you're also getting to connect with other writers and they're sharing their own stories and be able to empower each other in that way. And so I think, you know, that really is inspiring. It's an amazing book and I highly encourage the listeners to read it and to check it out because, you know, as somebody who
00:42:47
Speaker
was not familiar with the GR5 before. I mean, I am so amazed by everything that you've got to do there. Yeah. I do hope people will read it and then go off and walk a week or two weeks or three weeks, whatever you can. Because walking is just such a great way to vacation. It's called
00:43:09
Speaker
In Italy, I think they call it slow travel. It's the whole idea of going at a human pace and instead of running around from six countries in six days, you're just specializing in one little corner of a country, but really getting to know it really well. So I highly recommend it and it's definitely costs money to get there. But once you're there, it's not much more than living expenses at home.
00:43:34
Speaker
And we were very lucky and fortunate, privileged to be able to go off for such a long time. I do acknowledge that. Well, it's truly amazing. And again, just so inspiring. I'd love to ask you as well, we have some rapid fire questions that we have all of our guests answer on the show, just so we can get to know you more. May I ask you some rapid fires?
00:43:58
Speaker
sure yeah awesome well my first one for you and this may have been part of your journey it may be something that you do more at home but what would you say is your favorite self-care practice right now let's see i think
00:44:13
Speaker
I think it would be just writing a little bit every day, even if it's just three sentences. To me, it helps me, it helps ground me and it helps me. I tend to write about my emotions, what I'm feeling right now, or just what I'm doing. And it just helps me, grounds me for the day. So just a little bit of writing, even it doesn't have to be flowery. It's just getting it down on the page. So that's what works for me these days.
00:44:40
Speaker
I love that. I think that's such a great way to move that energy and it gets the creative it gets your creativity flowing it just or it can you know, there's so much that that can come from that. So I love that practice. Now, if you had a one word theme for whether it's this year, this time in life, what would your one word theme be?
00:45:02
Speaker
Oh, that's that's easy. My one word theme for this year, I like picking a one word theme is collaboration. And for me, it's more fun to do things with other people, you just learn so much more. And so here, you know, we're collaborating right now. We're exactly. So yeah, I love collaboration. That's, that's my word for the
00:45:22
Speaker
for the year. I love that. It's funny you say that because on the podcasting side for me, I know that when I first started, I thought it would be maybe half solos, half interviews and the collaborative aspect with the interviews. I mean, I don't remember the last time I did a solo episode. I love getting to actually talk to people. It's so much more fun. I feel kind of awkward just talking to my microphone on my own. Yeah.
00:45:47
Speaker
Yeah, I love I love the idea of that collaboration as that theme. No, that's that's awesome. And what are you most looking forward to right now?
Future Plans and Book Promotion
00:45:56
Speaker
Oh, definitely bringing my book out into the world. I'm really looking forward to the book events. I'm so glad COVID is over. And I'm really glad to be able to do book events and and meet, you know, meet people at the events and talk about walking and things like that. So I think
00:46:13
Speaker
That's definitely, that's definitely what I'm excited for. Well, it's huge. And do you have any other adventures or any travels planned in the coming months or anything on the horizon right now?
00:46:27
Speaker
Well, this year, I've told Jim that I'm focusing on the book and things like that. Our kids live in Denver, so we're going to go out there and do some book events there. So some of the traveling is to do with book events. We don't have any big, big trips planned right now, but someday in the future, we'd like to go down to Patagonia sometime and hike there.
00:46:53
Speaker
Japan is on the list. We have a long list, but we'll see if and when we get to them right now.
00:47:03
Speaker
you know, more local travel. Sure. Well, I do think that the book, I mean, a book launch is a pretty grand adventure as well. It's something certainly on my bucket list. So I'm really excited for you to be bringing this book out into the world and get to get to share. And how can listeners connect with you? How can listeners find the book? What all should they know if they want to learn more?
00:47:28
Speaker
Well, my website is KathyLKind, E-L-K-I-N-D, KathyWithAK.com. And you can buy my book anywhere. You know, I promote independent bookstores. I'm a big proponent of independent bookstores. So go to your local bookstore and if they don't have it, ask them to order it and ask them to stock it.
00:47:49
Speaker
Or Barnes and Nobles and Amazon also have it any place you get books. You should be able to get it. And on my website also are some events I'll be speaking around in September and October around New England. I'll have more up
00:48:05
Speaker
soon too, and I'll be in California. So I have, you know, a couple events listed on the website. So that's, yeah, that's about it. And you know what, I would really appreciate it. If you read it and you love it, please tell a friend. What I've been told is that the way books, it's still word of mouth. So if you read it and love it, please pass it on to a, tell a friend. And I will thank you from the bottom of my heart.
00:48:35
Speaker
Well, that sounds awesome. And I will definitely be sharing this with my friends. And, you know, hey, for those who use Goodreads, share on Goodreads as well. Get your reviews out there. That is so huge. I absolutely love that. And that has given me a lot of ideas for what I'm going to read, even if a friend hasn't actually mentioned the book to me, but I see that they posted that they just read something and they
00:49:00
Speaker
gave it five stars. I think, okay, well, she's a pretty cool person and she likes this book. So I think I'm going to, I'm going to check it out and try to learn a little more. And I think, you know, yeah, anything we can do to support and it really is a fantastic book. So I encourage listeners, um, check it out and let us know what you think. And Kathy, I want to thank you so much for coming on the show, for sharing this amazing journey with us. It makes me want to
00:49:25
Speaker
take a walk and start to build up my own endurance so that I could go on an adventure of my own. But I want to, yeah, thank you for empowering your readers and for sharing such incredible wisdom with us and sharing such a cool adventure with us. Well, thank you Valerie. It's been a lot of fun to talk about it and talk with you and thank you for sharing.
00:49:49
Speaker
What an incredible conversation with Kathy! I loved reading her book, To Walk It Is To See It, and enjoyed following along on Kathy and Jim's adventures across the GR5. The book has so many fascinating takeaways and excellent tips for anyone looking to take on a grand trip of their own, and I was truly inspired by their story. The book is out now, everywhere books are sold, so make sure you order a copy for yourself to learn more
00:50:12
Speaker
leave a review online. It helps authors to get the word out about their books. And I have linked everything in the show notes as well, but truly an amazing book and a fascinating conversation. As always, I want to thank you for joining me here today. If you have any questions or suggestions for the show, you can drop me a line at Valerie B-A-L-E-R-I-E at wellnessandwonderlust.net or at wellnessandwonderlustblog on Instagram.
00:50:37
Speaker
If this episode resonated with you, consider leaving us a review on your favorite podcast app. I appreciate each and every one of you for being a part of this incredible community and I cannot wait to see you next time.