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00:00:01
Automation vs Agents, Gamma's Rise, and Tools That Will Change Everything
715 Plays18 days ago
In this AI marketing podcast episode, Dan Sanchez and his brother Travis dive into the latest AI updates for marketers, including exciting upgrades to ChatGPT’s API, the evolution of AI image generation, and how automation, AI, and agents will reshape marketing workflows. They also break down the ongoing drama between Elon Musk and OpenAI, discuss why Apple's AI struggles are critical to watch, and highlight new tools like Gamma.app that are revolutionizing design for marketers.
My Favorite AI Tools
- ChatGPT - https://openai.com/
- High Level Marketing Platform - https://danchez.com/highlevel
- AI Podcasting Tools - https://danchez.com/podtools
- n8n AI Automation Platform - https://danchez.com/n8n
Resources Mentioned
- Gamma App - https://gamma.app/
- Make.com (Automation Tool) - https://www.make.com/
- Alexandre Conchas’ Automation vs. AI Agent Framework - https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:7318265649863045120/
- Social Media Examiner (for the masterclass event) - https://danchez.com/session
Timestamps
- 00:00 - Introduction: Bot Bros segment and overview
- 00:30 - ChatGPT API and Image Generator Updates Explained
- 02:30 - What is an API and Why It Matters for Marketers
- 05:00 - OpenAI's For-Profit Controversy and Elon Musk's Drama
- 08:00 - Apple's AI Struggles and Market Implications
- 10:00 - Grok’s Progress and Political Bias in AI Tools
- 15:00 - Gamma.app Revolutionizing AI Design and Social Content Creation
- 22:00 - Poll Results: Why Marketers Aren’t Using AI More
- 30:00 - Automation vs AI vs Agents: How to Think About Future Workflows
- 41:30 - Announcement: Danchez’s Free Masterclass on May 1st
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction to Bot Bros Segment
00:00:01
Danchez
Welcome back to Bot Bros, the segment of the AI Driven Marketer, where we separate the help from the hype that is going on with AI all the time. I'm Dan Sanchez, and I'm joined by my brother, Travis Sanchez.
00:00:12
Travis
What's good?
00:00:14
Danchez
And we're going to be diving into the news, a poll, and some viral posts to better uncover what's going on with AI for marketers. So let's dive into it.
ChatGPT's New API Features
00:00:23
Danchez
First off is ChatGPT had a few smaller upgrades.
00:00:27
Danchez
It's a lighter AI news week with that avalanche from the week before.
00:00:31
Travis
I know.
00:00:32
Danchez
This week, we you know we got some reprieve. There wasn't as much going on, but there's still news. There's news every week because everything's changing very quickly. And the first bit of news I have is from ChatGPT because they had a few small upgrades.
00:00:46
Danchez
Normally we would be big upgrades, but because there's been some really bigger ones lately, they're considered small. ChatGPT's new image generator is now in the API, which is very exciting because...
00:00:59
Travis
can i Can I be honest? Every time you say API, I go I don't know what you're talking about.
00:01:08
Danchez
Really? api
00:01:09
Travis
I just, i and then I look it up, and then I'm like, I still don't understand. but
00:01:15
Danchez
Yeah.
00:01:15
Travis
API, that it just, you know, what a the the that acronym API, it really hasn't like planted itself in my soul to where you say it and I go, yeah, I know exactly what. but I'm like, i what the?
00:01:26
Travis
So if I think that someone listening surely goes, what the heck is API?
00:01:31
Danchez
API. Well, anytime you see the word integration, it's from between tech tools, it's through an API.
Apple's AI Challenges and Controversies
00:01:41
Danchez
It's a protocol for tools to be able to talk to each other.
00:01:45
Danchez
I actually don't even remember what the acronym stands for, but it's not even worth saying because if you looked it up, it would only confuse you more.
00:01:52
Travis
Which is what happens every time.
00:01:52
Danchez
It's one of those acronyms.
00:01:53
Travis
It's happened three times now.
00:01:54
Danchez
Yeah.
00:01:55
Travis
and i And I'm telling you, it's not the American Petroleum Institute.
00:01:55
Danchez
But.
00:01:58
Travis
That is not what we're talking about. that was That was the second hit on Google.
00:02:01
Danchez
That is not it.
00:02:06
Danchez
Yeah, if if you're new to API, the API is important because as you're looking at all these different tech tools that are now AI first or whatever, they're only really AI first because they're tapping into ChatGPT's API, as in they can hook up their tool to ChatGPT on the backend so that they can pull from either the text chat or their vision tool so they can send an image, have it analyzed by ChatGPT, put it back in their tool.
00:02:06
Travis
Just keeping it real. just I'm just...
00:02:26
Travis
I see.
00:02:35
Danchez
Or now, and that's that's the news for this week, is that their image creating tool can now be available for other apps out there. But it's also helpful because you can be you don't have to be a developer to use the...
00:02:45
Travis
a
00:02:50
Danchez
api but you do need to be a little bit more technical because you can Google ChatGPT API, set up an account, and they have a nice little user interface where you can grab the like a few lines of code and then hook it up to an automation tool like make.com so that when you set up a basic automation like, hey, user fills out a form, I send that user data to ChatGPT, get my response back, as if you're using you know the ChatGPT app.
00:03:16
Travis
Uh-huh.
00:03:18
Travis
Uh-huh.
00:03:18
Danchez
it gets collected and make, and then maybe sends an email with that back to you, but now it happens automatically and that's cool.
00:03:24
Danchez
Right. don't have to even log into your, it can happen while you're sleeping.
00:03:25
Travis
I see.
00:03:28
Danchez
It can happen 50 times. It can happen hundred, like hundreds of times.
00:03:32
Travis
This is what Apple did.
00:03:32
Danchez
And that's the power of automation.
00:03:34
Travis
This is what Apple did with their intelligence because it it just wasn't intelligent. So they started using ChatGPT. When Siri couldn't figure out an answer, they would push it to chat. to chat
00:03:47
Danchez
Yeah, so Apple isn't just using the API. Apple has a special partnership with them to the point where they might actually be loading.
00:03:59
Danchez
It depends on how their partnership is set up. Like they might be going through the API. Chances are they worked out a really special deal and they probably got hands-on to the model itself and loaded it onto their own servers.
00:04:06
Travis
Okay.
00:04:10
Travis
Wow.
00:04:11
Danchez
Who knows? That's what Microsoft does. Microsoft, because they own like almost half of OpenAI, Microsoft does. Did you not know this?
00:04:21
Travis
No.
00:04:23
Danchez
Yeah.
00:04:23
Travis
How do they own half
00:04:23
Danchez
No, Microsoft early on, early on was like, we love what you're doing. We want you. OpenAI was like, well, you can't own us, but we need some money. so Microsoft's like, we'll buy as much as we can freaking get.
00:04:38
Danchez
And they offered them like $10 billion dollars for half of their company or almost half. I think it's like 49%. But they also, OpenAI i had a weird legal model where it's like, it's it it started, and this is the big debate between them and Elon because they raised money from Elon as a nonprofit first.
00:04:57
Danchez
But now if you know OpenAI, they're very, very for-profit. And that's been a huge controversy of like, wait, so you can fundraise as a nonprofit and then switch to a for-profit? Why wouldn't every startup do that?
00:05:09
Travis
Wow.
00:05:11
Danchez
Yeah, so Elon's throwing lawsuit after lawsuit at them for that.
00:05:13
Travis
Because he gave a lot of money and didn't get a piece of the pie.
00:05:18
Danchez
Yeah. He's like, well, I gave it to a research institute called OpenAI, which Elon actually named it OpenAI. He's the one who came up with the name because it was a nonprofit creating ai that was supposed to be open source, hence OpenAI, as in the code was supposed to be available for everybody.
00:05:38
Travis
Yeah, because that's Elon way.
00:05:38
Danchez
Ended up being closed, being one of the most closed of all time and not nonprofit at all.
00:05:40
Travis
Uh-huh.
00:05:45
Danchez
So Elon's Mad about that. And yeah, that's the drama.
00:05:49
Travis
Wow, I didn't know that.
00:05:52
Danchez
There's tons of drama related to open AI and how it got started and them switching to a for profit. They're still trying to deal with the legalities of having this weird for profit nonprofit combo.
00:06:03
Danchez
Uh, but yeah, that's all backstory origin story stuff.
00:06:07
Travis
Wow. All right. Good to know.
00:06:10
Danchez
but Elon's also kind of a jerk and they have all the email receipts from their conversations and open AI has published to a lot of them showing like, Nope, Elon, you're in the wrong.
00:06:18
Travis
Yikes.
00:06:21
Danchez
And they, they're not wrong. If you look at the conversations, you're like, okay, yeah, Elon can be, uh, a bit jerky, but that's Elon. So API.
00:06:32
Danchez
Yes. Apple might be working through the API, but they might also just have like literally like the code that powers chat TPT loaded up on their server.
00:06:35
Travis
Right.
00:06:39
Travis
Okay, so.
00:06:42
Travis
Right, that's not a good that's not a good example.
00:06:42
Danchez
It depends. I don't know.
00:06:46
Travis
if if they were using it If they were using just API, you wouldn't know they have a partnership with ChadGBT.
00:06:46
Danchez
But yes, so
00:06:50
Travis
You would think it's their own system.
00:06:54
Danchez
Yeah, and they do have their own AI system called Apple Intelligence. It just sucks.
00:06:59
Travis
Yeah, it's terrible.
00:07:00
Danchez
And nobody's, everybody who's at all the Apple fans who are in the AI space are like, man, I feel so depressed that Apple's so late to the game to where they're now predicting that it's going to be until like 2027 before they have something like workable.
00:07:14
Travis
a
00:07:16
Danchez
Yeah.
ChatGPT Upgrades and Future Expectations
00:07:16
Danchez
So we'll see what they announce at the next June developer thing. Because you and I watched the last one last June when they announced Apple Intelligence. They made a big deal out of it.
00:07:23
Travis
I know. This is how companies is how companies lose their number one most valuable seat, you know?
00:07:33
Danchez
Their stock price is doing just fine. and Because it's Apple and they still have massive hardware, software moat. But this this is This is going to be major. They're starting to put their best people on it, but they've it's been like chaos over there. As far as all the news, they're very but buttoned up.
00:07:52
Travis
Yeah, yeah.
00:07:52
Danchez
So like everybody's trying to figure out what's going on over there.
00:07:53
Travis
You don't hear them talking about it.
00:07:55
Danchez
So you have to read between the lines all the time. But yeah, Apple is a hot mess, which is too bad because you and I are both Apple fans. so And I don't, I just distrust Google. So I'm like, I don't want to move to Android. Don't make me move to Android, Apple.
00:08:09
Danchez
I will forever resent you if I have to move to Android.
00:08:14
Danchez
I'll move to some one-off dumb phone again.
00:08:18
Travis
Shout out to my friend who always was on the Google Pixel and just was bragging about how much better it was. Yeah, he's on the iPhone now.
00:08:30
Danchez
Yeah.
00:08:33
Travis
Great. Well.
00:08:34
Danchez
So API. it's a big deal because i think a lot of marketers would love to automate some of the image creation stuff i would did i'm like i'm trying to think of like how to the hardest thing for me still is coming up with the thumbnails for this very show i still can't figure out a smooth way to do it quick and easily especially since my audience on linkedin said like yeah stop using the tv hit character like we want photos of you was like okay
00:08:40
Travis
Yeah, of course.
00:08:59
Danchez
Problem is creating cool thumbnails with photos of you in it is just way harder. Unless you're doing the like cutouts of you pointing to the screen. Fucking gosh.
00:09:07
Travis
It's what they want, dude.
00:09:10
Travis
Open mouth, hands to face. It's what they want, dude. They want expression.
00:09:16
Danchez
I need to do a photo shoot again and just do the cutouts because that's easy enough, I guess. All right. So, but with the images and API, you can now automate the image creation, which I think is going to be fun because now you can, before a lot of people have been automating social post creation, but now you can create the graphics that go with those social posts and maybe like automate a whole comic strip or automate a whole infographic thing.
00:09:36
Travis
and
00:09:42
Danchez
I'm like, these these things are going to pop up and they're gonna be cool. another little side note about chat gpt sam altman just announced yesterday that chat gpt 4.0 got another upgrade they've upgraded it like so many times over would the last year that it's like almost unrecognizable from the model we were using a year ago when they first announced it and nobody everyone's like uh okay so it's more intelligent what does that mean i don't know i just know 4.0 is way better than it used to be
00:10:00
Travis
Jeez. Jeez.
00:10:14
Danchez
Have you noticed?
00:10:16
Travis
I mean, i think it's incredible, but that's only because you told me to upgrade its
Competitive AI Development Landscape
00:10:22
Travis
personality and behave in a certain way. So I'm just waiting for that personality to switch over to the voice mode.
00:10:29
Travis
That's like, I'm waiting for that upgrade to come.
00:10:30
Danchez
oh yeah. Yeah.
00:10:31
Travis
It probably will I'm guessing in the next three months that it the way that it writes, it will talk to me that way.
00:10:39
Danchez
Yeah, Google has another big conference at the end of May. So I imagine we'll see some action there and see maybe voice mode because now everybody's starting to catch up to voice mode or at least little experiment things like we have Sesame and something from Korea that just popped around like hyper intelligent voice.
00:10:56
Travis
Oh, really?
00:10:59
Danchez
Yeah, and and the Korea thing was like text to voice where you could like type in a text and give it a script and it would act out the script in a really dramatic way.
00:11:07
Travis
wow
00:11:07
Danchez
Like, I forgot, like, they had an example of someone yelling, like, there's a monster or a bear or something coming at them. They're like, there's a bear! There's a bear! And then some other voice was like, hold on. Like, I don't know what he said, but it was something, it was something, like, it was, like, almost comical. Like, well, hold on, I gotta finish my Doritos.
00:11:26
Danchez
Oh, well, did you save some for me? but But there's a bear! You know?
00:11:29
Travis
Oh, wow.
00:11:30
Danchez
something a voice mode would never be able to pick up on.
00:11:32
Travis
No, I haven't.
00:11:33
Danchez
Like the comedic timing of like the reaction to it and the reading of it, of the two different voice characters. I'm like, like that's pretty good.
00:11:41
Travis
Wow.
00:11:42
Danchez
We don't have access to it to be able to play with it yet. Neither do we have Sesame really. other Unless you're going through the demo they have.
00:11:48
Travis
Five-minute demo.
00:11:50
Danchez
So chat GPTs is still the one everybody's using.
00:11:50
Travis
Fifteen. Fifteen minutes.
00:11:52
Danchez
Cause it's actually like accessible, but I'm sure they'll roll out an update to stay competitive there. in other news, Grok voice just dropped with images now.
00:12:04
Danchez
So Grok, man, they keep like every week they're like, Oh, now we've cloned this chat GPT feature.
00:12:04
Travis
Wow. Right.
00:12:09
Danchez
Now we've cloned this chat GPT feature.
00:12:10
Travis
wow
00:12:11
Danchez
They're like quickly catching up with the whole ecosystem. Uh, because they added personalization, they added voice, they added voice now with video. that's a lot like adding video is no small deal.
00:12:22
Danchez
Like it's a big jump to be able to add video for it, to be able to understand what it's seeing.
00:12:22
Travis
right
00:12:27
Danchez
And they're just quietly being like, oh, here's another one. Oh, here's another one. Lay up, lay up. They're making so much progress that you're like, man, where's Google?
00:12:38
Danchez
I know they're adding like lots of updates too, but I'm like, it seems like Grok is a lot smaller and that Google's massive and also very focused on it, but yet they don't do as much with it.
00:12:46
Travis
right
00:12:50
Danchez
So
00:12:51
Travis
As I continue walking around my office and asking different people, hey, first of all, I say, are you using AI? And they always say, most of them say yes. If they're over the age of...
00:13:00
Danchez
It's
00:13:03
Travis
50 it's like 50% yes or no. But even my creative director, I said, are you using ai He goes, Oh yeah. I'm like, which one are you using? He goes, well, I won't touch jet chat GBT. It's too woke.
00:13:16
Travis
like, Oh,
00:13:17
Danchez
not. it's not
00:13:20
Travis
he's, so he's a grok, he's a grok user. And I don't think he touched chat GBT since it was, you know, three O was out.
00:13:29
Danchez
It's funny, the political bias.
00:13:30
Danchez
They haven't actually tested it, though.
00:13:32
Travis
I saw a test of political bias between Grok and chat GPT and they had a scale Grok.
00:13:37
Danchez
And Grok was more.
00:13:39
Travis
No, no. I think chat.
00:13:40
Danchez
No.
00:13:40
Travis
I think chat GPT was more, it was more liberal.
00:13:44
Danchez
Really?
00:13:45
Travis
Yeah. I mean, that was the, that was the graph.
00:13:45
Danchez
Because I've seen Tess, at least ChatGPT, Grok doesn't even hold back because they don't even try to steer it. So, which is why everybody's using it to like make Elon look like a jerk. Like who's the worst person in the world? Grok be like Elon.
00:14:00
Danchez
You know what I'm saying?
00:14:01
Travis
Oh my gosh. Well, I say, I say all that to say that, you know, people aren't just using Chachabuti.
00:14:03
Danchez
Yeah.
00:14:07
Travis
There's a few out there that have said, Oh, I just use Google, Gemini, whatever.
00:14:11
Danchez
Yeah.
00:14:14
Travis
i just feel like Gemini is so unorganized from where your image generation is to where they're, everything is with Grok.
00:14:18
Danchez
Yeah.
00:14:21
Travis
Everything is in one place with Chachabuti. Everything's in one place with Gemini.
00:14:24
Danchez
Yeah.
00:14:24
Travis
It's like, it's kind of sprinkled out through their ecosystem, which is confusing.
00:14:29
Danchez
And not in a good way.
00:14:30
Travis
No.
00:14:31
Danchez
It's kind of the same thing with like Copilot, Microsoft's Copilot. They both have the same problem of just being not unified enough.
00:14:39
Travis
ah
00:14:40
Danchez
And that's where ChatGPT is still...
00:14:43
Travis
Right.
00:14:43
Danchez
crushing it and now grok is quickly catching up to the same thing but of course they don't have as much to integrate on those two sides but yeah know we'll see so grok is still making gains not enough to make steal me away from chat gpt but i'm i'm noticing i'm like damn by this rate it might be the end of the year when i'm so i'm like i don't want to move my whole chat gpt account because i feel like it's finally getting to know me and it's got the personalization thing i'm like maybe we hopefully we can have integrations to move all that data over grok at some point but
00:14:44
Travis
Right. Yeah.
00:14:57
Travis
No.
00:15:13
Danchez
we'll see in other news a design tool that's finally gotten good to the point where i'm like i'm probably going to start using this a lot is gamma yeah gamma.app
00:15:23
Travis
Really? Damn, I've never heard of it
00:15:27
Danchez
G-A-M-M-A dot app is it was kind of, I saw it as a presentation tool though. I'd seen people make landing pages with it. Cause like you can pick like, do you want a presentation? Do you want a landing page? Or do I think it gives you some other options and you essentially load in you can just use AI, like build it with AI. You're like, sure.
00:15:44
Danchez
And you give it, maybe, maybe you have chat GPT come up with the Prez deck outline and then it will build the outline. And the cool thing about it is it's not building you images. It'll use AI images in it.
00:15:55
Danchez
But it'll actually write the script and actually build out the whole layout intelligently. Before I would say it was rough and it'd probably get you 50% of the way there, but you'd really have to go in as a designer.
00:16:06
Danchez
I'm like, I'd rather just do this in keynote by hand myself because I'm particular about the design.
00:16:11
Travis
and
00:16:12
Danchez
But for most people, it was, it was nice because it would actually give you some more sophisticated layouts rather than like image bullet point. I'd use it in a pinch for like team stuff or like when I needed to create a Christmas slideshow, or like a Christmas trivia slideshow game for like a team thing.
00:16:32
Danchez
Like I'd do it for stuff like that, but but they just recently updated it and it's actually good now. Like, and it's a full on design tool.
00:16:37
Travis
wow
00:16:38
Danchez
So if you want to edit it afterwards and change out the icons, you want to switch out the photos it did or move the layout around a little bit, the texts, like it's a full design tool, like a Prez Deck would or for its landing page module.
00:16:49
Danchez
But it's actually picking better pictures. it's It's actually intelligently navigating the content and a lot better now to the point where I'm saying it's probably getting like 75% of the way there.
00:17:01
Danchez
And I think the thing that's the most exciting for me is that you can now export social decks because there wasn't a good tool for create.
00:17:08
Travis
Interesting.
00:17:10
Danchez
There was AI carousels.com was okay for making like LinkedIn or Instagram carousels, you know?
00:17:18
Travis
Okay. Yep.
00:17:19
Danchez
But now Gamma does it and it's amazing. I'm like, dude, like I'm going to start doing this every single week for this very show because I can give it that I can give chat GBT the transcript to our stuff and be like, hey, turn this into a pres deck for a curacao for LinkedIn and then it'll export that.
00:17:26
Travis
Wow.
00:17:34
Danchez
I could post it now into Gamma and almost take exactly what Gamma gives me and just run that as a LinkedIn deck now.
00:17:39
Travis
Wow. Wow.
00:17:41
Danchez
which is, I'm going to do it after the show. We'll see how it looks. If you want to find it, you know, come connect with me on LinkedIn, link in the show notes, so and then you can see the deck for yourself.
00:17:50
Travis
Man, user face is really good too.
00:17:53
Danchez
Yeah, it's smooth. always It always has had a good UI, but its outputs were like, eh, that's still going to take a lot of work to make this look good. But now if it's getting 75% of the way there, and I'd say the carousels, the carousel I tested last week was like 90% of the way there. i was like, ooh, this is actually getting good.
00:18:12
Danchez
Remember just a few months ago, we were saying like, AI can't do design. I'm like, I can now.
00:18:17
Travis
Yeah.
00:18:17
Danchez
Let's make it really good decks.
00:18:17
Travis
Right.
00:18:18
Danchez
And you know, landing pages and decks are really hard to make. Because you have to organize a lot of images, layouts, and text. It's a lot to think through.
00:18:28
Travis
right
00:18:29
Danchez
i recently have had to come up with a few different landing pages, and they take a long time, like days worth of work to make one good landing page. Because it's it's just a lot to think through with the creative, of the text, the offer, the design, the code. There's so many elements to it that landing pages are kind of just really difficult, in my opinion.
00:18:49
Danchez
But now, like marketers now have access to be able to make some pretty cool looking designs for things that are pretty common, whether it's a single one-off webpage or deck or social graphics that are carousels. These were considered things that marketers couldn't touch before. And now I'm like, now they can.
00:19:07
Danchez
I'm sure you're going try it this week because this is probably, a use this is useful tool it for a lot of things,
AI's Impact on Marketing
00:19:11
Danchez
right?
00:19:11
Travis
Yeah, it and it was fast. I just like clicked through the prompts and said, generate something for me. And it pushed it out quick.
00:19:17
Danchez
Yeah.
00:19:20
Danchez
Gives you some cool options. You're like, you want it to be more concise in the middle? Or do you want it be very verbose and you use lots of words?
00:19:26
Travis
Right.
00:19:26
Danchez
You could give it like a one sentence prompt of like, make me a deck about selling Pokemon cards and it'll make it for you. Or you can give it a full outline or a full transcript. Like you can plug in a lot of text and it'll navigate it.
00:19:36
Travis
Right.
00:19:40
Danchez
So it's a fun tool and I'm really looking forward to using that one more. And I think that'll just be more and more of a thing.
00:19:44
Travis
That's cool.
00:19:46
Danchez
Like AI and design will start to become more integrated, which is why I think about like your designer or conversation from a week or two ago. And I'm like, yeah, designers really need to get on the ball with learning this stuff because with it, they become powerhouses. But if they don't, then you're going to be in trouble.
00:20:04
Danchez
And I continue to see posts of people saying like, it's just not as good.
00:20:04
Travis
yeah
00:20:07
Danchez
It's just not as good. I'm like, Not yet, but like if you don't start building the skills, you're going to be in trouble.
00:20:17
Travis
It's the romanticizers that are going to get really hurt when their pocketbook is crushed. But honestly, I've heard romanticizers early on who didn't even like the writing function. It just felt disingenuous to them. And now they're fully on board. So I think it just takes time.
00:20:34
Danchez
just takes time.
00:20:37
Danchez
I also think This is just an opportunity for young, for not younger necessarily at all, but like people to like jump ahead of others.
00:20:47
Danchez
I did this in my career with digital marketing because all the marketing directors didn't want to touch digital. It was too complicated. And back in 2009, 2010, it was kind of complicated. Like and if you were making an email, you still had to get to the HTML to make a good new email newsletter. Like you were coding it.
00:21:05
Danchez
text SMS, early SMS marketing, freaking pain. Any website changes, pain. But I was the kid who learned how to do all of it.
00:21:16
Danchez
And then I jumped ahead of all those guys because that became marketing.
00:21:19
Travis
Right.
00:21:21
Danchez
Like and when you think of marketing now, it's almost all digital.
00:21:24
Travis
Yeah.
00:21:25
Danchez
Like when do you ever do anything like, oh, I made a brochure. Maybe, maybe.
00:21:30
Travis
Right.
00:21:32
Danchez
It's almost all that now. Maybe you do a mailer if you're a nonprofit and you're sending out mails.
00:21:36
Travis
Uh-huh.
00:21:37
Danchez
But even then, it's almost, it's like 90% digital, still only 10% traditional.
00:21:37
Travis
Or you go a trade show.
00:21:42
Travis
Right. Or you go to a trade show and you have a booth and a backdrop and what, yeah.
00:21:43
Danchez
Yeah. Yep. Yeah. that that same thing's going to happen. Like the old guard will get dethroned and a new guard will come in with the new skills.
00:21:54
Travis
Yep. Yep.
00:21:55
Travis
ye
00:21:55
Danchez
It happens every every once in a while.
00:21:57
Danchez
So it's happening now, and it's just happening faster.
Audience Insights on AI Usage
00:22:02
Danchez
Poll of the week. I asked people, what's stopping you from using AI more in your workflow? And I had the options of not enough time to learn, not sure which tools to trust, too many options, overwhelmed, and already using a ton of them.
00:22:21
Danchez
And it kind of shocked me a little bit how people voted.
00:22:24
Travis
overwhelmed. People said overwhelmed.
00:22:27
Danchez
That was the second highest.
00:22:28
Travis
Oh,
00:22:30
Travis
I'm already using them.
00:22:32
Danchez
I'm already using a ton of them. was 42%.
00:22:36
Danchez
Now, you have to remember, like, my LinkedIn audience is a lot of AI people. And a lot of people follow me because they're already interested in AI. Like, this is what I've become known for. So, like, I attract the people who are already using it and want to continue learning about it. So, there's that.
00:22:52
Danchez
I wish I could do a poll of, like, just... normal marketers who are just like, have a good representation, but then I'd have to be a polling company to go and find them and make sure I'm getting a good representation, but I ain't doing that.
00:23:04
Travis
Right, right.
00:23:04
Danchez
So, but in my LinkedIn audience, 42% are already using a ton of them. 26% say there's too many options and they're overwhelmed. 23% said just not enough time to learn, something i I do hear a lot when I actually talk to them.
00:23:20
Danchez
And then 8% said not sure which tools to trust. So it's not a trust issue. It's more of a too many options, not enough time to go and evaluate them all problem.
00:23:28
Travis
Right, right.
00:23:32
Danchez
But of course, there's always an aggressive group diving into many of them and experimenting aggressively.
00:23:37
Travis
100%. Uh-huh.
00:23:38
Danchez
yeah And this audience listening to it right now, you're probably in that 42%. Maybe you voted on this poll,
00:23:46
Danchez
which is good. It is overwhelming with the amount of tools that are out there. But I'd say like most tools, aren't ready for the light of day. They're like previews more than they are tools, but they build a lot of hype around as if they're tools, but they're not, they're just, they're just not ready.
00:24:02
Danchez
some tools are just kind of niche or one-off use cases.
00:24:05
Danchez
And I, I ignore those two because it's kind of like, eh, like
Deep Research Capabilities in ChatGPT
00:24:07
Danchez
i don't really care that it could do the one thing.
00:24:07
Travis
feel like that's that's the majority.
00:24:10
Travis
That's the majority of niche.
00:24:12
Danchez
The ones I care about the most are the updates of tools I'm already literally paying for, like ChatGPT. That's why, like if ChatGPT even makes a small update, I'm including it because it's the most useful to me because I'm already using it. I'm already in that ecosystem. So when they add a new feature, I'm diving in to see if it's useful now. And every once in a while, ChatGPT launches something too that's not useful, operator.
00:24:33
Danchez
I mean, you got to have the pro subscription in order to access operator. But right now, that's more of a preview tool than it is something useful. Deep research, amazingly useful. which some news I probably should have included for the chat GPT updates is they just upgraded two things.
00:24:49
Danchez
They gave you more uses for deep research. And now I think you have like 20, I should probably Google it. You have like way more. You used to have only had 10 deep research uses a month for chat GPT, but now you have more.
00:25:04
Danchez
Have you used it yet?
00:25:06
Travis
deep research.
00:25:08
Danchez
Yeah. Yeah.
00:25:08
Travis
Yeah, of course. I haven't used the new updated version though.
00:25:14
Danchez
Yeah, they gave it a light version or some, they they upgraded to make it easier to do.
00:25:21
Danchez
But how often do you use it?
00:25:23
Travis
Uh, probably once a week.
00:25:26
Danchez
Yeah, I'm using it probably once or twice a week. Oftentimes I find I'm using it like multiple times or I'll use it in conjunction with a conversation I'm already having with ChatGPT.
00:25:36
Danchez
Like I'll have a conversation, be like, hey,
Automation vs. AI Agents
00:25:38
Danchez
help me do a re deep help me craft this deep research prompt. Here's what I'm jo going for. Ask me some questions and then we'll set up the deep research prompt together. I'm finding it. And then after the deep research report, I continued the conversation and then be like, okay, now based on this deep research report, help me set up this next thing.
00:25:51
Travis
Wow.
00:25:53
Danchez
It's like a one, two punch with chat GPT.
00:25:56
Travis
wow
00:25:57
Danchez
I'm having a hard time finding how many they upgraded it to.
00:26:03
Danchez
25, they've upgraded it to 25 uses a month, not just 10. And then pro users went from like 125 to 250. So that is nice.
00:26:10
Travis
Oh, that's nice.
00:26:13
Danchez
The other thing they upgraded was the 03 reasoning model. You had a 25 a week limit for that. And I ran into it. So I just, I'm like, okay, I'll just use 04 mini high until I get my uses back because 03 is the better one.
00:26:27
Danchez
but now it's up to 50. I'm like 50 a week. Yeah. I probably ain't going run it to that limit that often as much as I use it. I'm not pushing 50 a week usually because I still like using four Oh quite often. So, but I'm starting to use Oh three more and more, even though it doesn't feel like it knows me as much.
00:26:45
Travis
Right.
00:26:45
Danchez
It's, it's ability to reason through things is actually pretty remarkable. And it's less of a yes, man, way more. So,
00:26:53
Travis
It's good.
00:26:54
Danchez
4.0 is so approving and affirming.
00:26:54
Travis
It's good.
00:26:56
Danchez
Like, oh, that's an amazing idea. So good. You know, it's a little dramatic. You're like, it's not that good. Like, calm down.
00:27:03
Travis
The only wall I hit into is the image generation for ChadGBT. I hit that wall frequently.
00:27:10
Danchez
Really? How many images you put now, bro?
00:27:11
Travis
Yeah. Well, when I'm trying to just get an idea for a logo or something, I just keep doing reiterative like, I'm like, do it again.
00:27:17
Danchez
Uh-huh. Uh-huh.
00:27:22
Travis
Do it. Give me change this, change that.
00:27:23
Danchez
Yeah.
00:27:23
Travis
And then it's like, I'll hit it quick.
00:27:26
Danchez
Interesting. I don't even know what the image, I've never hit the limit for that because I don't use it. When I'm doing a lot of iterations of something, I'm generally just not using ChatGPT. I'm using Google's image effects still.
00:27:36
Travis
I made, let's see, one, too for eight twelve eighteen twenty two, 12, 18, 22.
00:27:43
Danchez
Holy cow.
00:27:44
Travis
Yeah, like 24. So I made about 24 images in probably 30 minutes.
00:27:51
Danchez
You just open up multiple tabs.
00:27:51
Travis
And it,
00:27:54
Travis
no, I didn't do it all at the same time. This was like over the course of 30 minutes, I was, you know, change this, adjust that. And then after 24 images, it was like, oh, you're going to have to wait 10 minutes before you get another one.
00:28:06
Travis
I was like, okay.
00:28:07
Danchez
Oh, that's not too bad. and It's not like, hey, you ran your you hit your limit for the week, you're at to to seven days, or going hit your limit for the month.
00:28:11
Travis
No. Yeah. It's like you, it's like you only get a few every 10 minutes. i don't know.
00:28:21
Travis
I was creating stuff for our Airbnb and I hit my limit.
00:28:26
Danchez
There you go. It's just exciting to get more uses of it because these are like the most helpful tools. Deep research is a totally underutilized tool. If you haven't started using this in chat GPT yet, you need to start doing it or Grok or Google.
00:28:39
Danchez
They all have deep research now. And
AI Agents as Personalized Assistants
00:28:41
Travis
Yeah.
00:28:41
Danchez
I feel like it's one of those things people just don't use nearly enough in order to power their conversations, their prompts, their research.
00:28:47
Danchez
There's just so much you could be doing with this as a marketer that it's pretty much become one of the normal things I'm using regularly now. In other news, viral post of the week comes from Alexandre Conchas.
00:29:03
Danchez
Where are you from, Alexandre? He is from Berlin.
00:29:09
Danchez
but He put together a fantastic post and it kind of starts off with automation, AI workflow or AI agent to always know which one to build, follow this framework. And he put together an awesome little framework. There's a little graphic at the bottom of this post.
00:29:23
Danchez
What i love about it is like there's going to be times in the future where you need just the normal automation. So don't even incorporate AI into it. There's going to be times where you want AI and automation. And there's just going to be times in the future where you want just an agent.
00:29:38
Danchez
And so he put together a fantastic little framework on how to evaluate the three and which ones you want. And i'm gonna we're going to talk about it a little bit because he kind of put like, do you want full decision-making? you need decision-making ability? How consistent do you need it to be?
00:29:53
Danchez
How reliable do you need it to be? Do you need to have... data How much data do you need it to have? And so he kind of uses these questions in order to navigate and explain and think through which one you need.
00:30:08
Danchez
And I think it's probably worth looking at because as we're starting to prepare for agents, you're going to have to start thinking about what's kind of like in your mind, like what's good for automation, what's good for automation with AI, what's good for agents.
00:30:23
Danchez
Now this is getting like really technical. So when you look at this, how do you react to it?
00:30:31
Travis
I think it's it looks like a useful kind of diagram for people to... I was just reading through it.
00:30:40
Travis
funny. I think his graphic was created by AI, which is fun, but maybe not. Let Let me zoom in here.
00:30:47
Danchez
I don't think so.
00:30:49
Travis
No? It feels like it a little bit, Maybe it's so he's so it's so clean that you can't tell.
00:30:58
Danchez
Yeah. ChatGPT would have messed that up somewhere.
00:31:02
Travis
Yeah, you're right.
00:31:02
Danchez
ChatGPT is the only one that would have been able to do it.
00:31:03
Travis
Too many words. Too many boxes.
00:31:05
Danchez
It's too consistent. ChatGPT will like leave a line off randomly of some place.
00:31:11
Travis
Yeah, true.
00:31:12
Danchez
You're like, no, it'll screw up somewhere. It's too detailed.
00:31:16
Travis
i this My first impression is that, man, people go really, people are really intelligent. Like, to break this down and actually create this graph for people to analyze what their next step is,
00:31:31
Travis
for what trying just trying to maximize what they're trying to accomplish, this is amazing.
00:31:38
Danchez
The graph is a little overwhelming. It's probably too much information in it, in my opinion. But I do like the general organization of the three different frameworks. I've kind of put it into five thinking about the difference between automation and agent because I think there there's more steps in between them.
00:31:53
Danchez
But it is helpful to know. The funny thing about an agent, a lot of people will use agents in the future when when a work when a just a normal automation would have been better.
00:32:04
Danchez
Because sometimes you don't need AI to think like, oh, every time this lead comes in, I need it to update Slack with the fact that a new lead came in and I need it to send me a notification email.
00:32:04
Travis
Mm-mm.
00:32:15
Danchez
I'm like, yeah, you don't need AI for that. That's just an automation. Like it just pings it. Do you need AI to analyze it? Because then that's just, that's not an agent. That's just automation with AI analyzing the message and then putting that and that slightly customized brief in Slack.
00:32:35
Danchez
Like these aren't hard things to do. These are things you could do already. Yeah. So you have to, i always default to like, if if automation can get it done, then let automation do it. Only use an agent when it's, you actually are giving it something that actually has to navigate some fairly complex requirements in order to get it done every single time.
00:32:53
Danchez
Like book a reservation at a hotel would be one of those because there's so many different factors to consider. You can't automate that because there's a lot of decisions that need to be made. And the agent might have access to your calendar and know, oh, like, oh, but book it for my anniversary.
00:33:11
Danchez
You're like, okay, well, there's so many decisions to think through. It's like, I know they have a preference for this hotel because they have this membership loyalty. It looks like they have enough points for it. So probably gonna want to use the points for this. It looks like the anniversary is coming up based on this calendar thing. So you you can see it's like checking all the different things like an executive assistant would in order to actually book it and get it ready for you. And then think about all the other things that might need to move around because of it.
00:33:34
Danchez
Yeah. That's an agent.
00:33:35
Travis
Bro, processing agents the way you were just describing, I can feel my brain trying to reorder it re reorient and connect different neurons of like pathways. i'm like, okay, how would that actually work? And it's such a new that's such a new technology if it actually works that way because surely that agent would have to circle back and go, hey, we we got some decisions to make.
00:34:01
Travis
Here's the price for a balcony room. Here's a price for a view room. Here's a price for a, I know you typically like this on your, you've traveled here before and you've, like when does it make the decision for you? And when does it have to get confirmation of your decision making?
00:34:15
Travis
Or do you just tell it, hey, make the best decision that you possibly can based on what you know about me, the decisions I've made in the past and just book it.
00:34:24
Danchez
Well, that's the decision you get to make. I mean, like here's, here's a few different scenarios you can run into with agents and let's just keep going with this like hotel booking thing. maybe planning like a weekend vacation or something.
00:34:36
Danchez
You can, you can say like, Hey, go build a plan for me and I'll approve the whole plan. But don't ask me one yet. Like a good planner or executive assistant wouldn't go in and be like, Hey, Oh, well what, where do you want to go?
00:34:49
Danchez
Okay. okay, now I'm back. What kind of hotel do you like to stay at? Because that's currently how operator works and it's annoying as heck. What a good executive assistant would do and what agents will be doing very soon is they'll be like, okay, I did all the work for you and I recommend doing this plan.
00:35:06
Danchez
It's going to be here, these dates, this much, doing this. I know you had a preference for this, so I'm planning on this. Do you approve the plan? And it'll just make a whole plan.
00:35:17
Danchez
And then you'll be like, yes, but change this one thing. And then it'll go off and execute it all. It's a lot of steps, but chances are we're going to be using agents like that a lot. And it'll be like, we're using a personal example, but we'll be doing this for work too.
00:35:31
Danchez
We'll be like, Hey, like we need a campaign to go and reactivate that one segment out of our list. Can you come up with some options for me? And it'll come back, build a plan and you will tweak the plan and then it will go and execute the plan.
00:35:42
Danchez
This is the future. Okay. but there will be times where you're like, Hey, like I need to get away this weekend. It's Thursday night. I can leave after 3 PM tomorrow.
00:35:53
Danchez
Like, I don't, I don't want to think about anything. Surprise me.
00:35:58
Travis
Right.
00:35:59
Danchez
And it using your preferences, it will just go and book it all. And then just come back to you and tell you what you need to know when you need to know it.
00:36:06
Travis
Which, after some experience...
00:36:06
Danchez
And you might even be like, I don't want even want to know where I'm going. I just want to get in an Uber right here. And then I just want to be surprised about what happens next.
00:36:13
Travis
Right. Right.
00:36:14
Danchez
Tell me, just tell me what steps, where I need to go and where, where I need to be. I want to be surprised with the whole weekend. I don't know. Like, and it'll, it'll just do that. Like think about what a human could do and it just replicate that.
00:36:24
Travis
It'll be the best executive assistant because it'll have its memory. It'll know what you liked last time. it will remember feedback that you gave it on its last plans. Because an executive assistant that's been with you for two years and you tell them to do that, they'll know exactly what to do.
00:36:33
Danchez
yep yep
00:36:39
Danchez
ye
00:36:40
Travis
Except it won't cost, you know, $68,000 year.
00:36:42
Danchez
ye
00:36:45
Danchez
I remember Ramit Sethi from i Will Teach You To Be Rich was talking about his thing because he's big into using his executive assistant. And every time he traveled, there was a certain way that he wanted to travel. Like he get you flew this type of airline, this type of seat, big into first class, staying at this kind of hotel.
00:37:05
Danchez
making sure there was always healthy food available in his room before he got there so that he was never tempted to like go off diet. But he said, he's like, he's got the the thing. He's got the the set operating system for what it means for him to travel to another city.
00:37:19
Danchez
And his executive assistant was well-trained on what that was. And he'd be like, hey, just run the plan.
00:37:22
Travis
Yeah.
00:37:25
Danchez
And so the executive assistant would pull up the standard operating procedure of what the plan was and just execute it like clockwork. And he didn't have to think about it.
00:37:32
Travis
Right.
00:37:33
Danchez
He'd just be like, execute the plan.
00:37:33
Travis
This new. Yeah.
00:37:35
Danchez
I'm like, that's exactly how we're going to be doing agents or at least people who are smart.
00:37:36
Travis
Wow. Wow. Yes. Yes.
00:37:39
Danchez
But like like, we'll be doing that within work. We'll be doing that within marketing.
Live Masterclass Announcement
00:37:42
Danchez
We'll be like, hey, execute this playbook. And it will go and execute that playbook. And sometimes, you know, playbooks change over time, right?
00:37:49
Danchez
But a smart employee will be like, oh, we'll accommodate for it. Maybe update the playbook because the way you check into this hotel has changed or whatever. And you need to update the playbook because there's a the the standard operating procedures out of date.
00:37:57
Travis
Right.
00:38:02
Danchez
Something's changed and you need to update it.
00:38:02
Travis
Right.
00:38:04
Danchez
The agents will do that too.
00:38:06
Travis
Wow.
00:38:06
Danchez
So that's why it's good to start thinking about what needs to be automated, what needs to be automation with ai and what just what what are things that it's just going to take a full agent to execute every time.
00:38:18
Danchez
And it's going to be a blend of all three of those things. But you don't want to use an agent when automation will do. Though we might have agents build automations, right?
00:38:25
Travis
Right. Right.
00:38:26
Danchez
There are still things that our computers are really good at that AI is not good at. which is why like more and more of the tools for math are just not... instead of the agent Instead of AI trying to calculate it, what the AI agents are now doing, what ChatGPT is now doing, is they're just using a calculator themselves.
00:38:45
Danchez
I don't know if you've seen that yet, but I've seen it. It goes into code, and you can see it processing it with code, which essentially means it's using a calculator.
00:38:54
Danchez
AI is like, yeah, I ain't going to try to do that. Let me go to my calculator and process that number real quick.
00:38:58
Travis
That's funny.
00:38:59
Danchez
It's a smart way to get around it because AI is good at some things, not good at other things, where a computer or code is actually really good at calculating math. So it just goes and uses the tools that it needs to now.
00:39:10
Travis
Wow.
00:39:12
Danchez
So that is the future.
00:39:16
Danchez
And if you're listening to this and you're like, man i Don't know if I can navigate. If you haven't been heavy in automation already, highly recommend going to the link in the show notes. Go look at his post. Read it very thoroughly.
00:39:29
Danchez
The diagram's a little intimidating. Just read it and look at it very closely. Read it very slowly and just become familiar with it. It's not like you're going to take a test on it, but you want to start familiarizing yourself with these. So take five minutes to read the post carefully. Look at this graphic because you're going to have to be able to start building systems in the future.
00:39:48
Danchez
more than do the work of the campaigns.
00:39:49
Travis
Yep.
00:39:51
Danchez
You're going to be an architect more than an operator in the future.
00:39:54
Travis
Yep.
00:39:55
Danchez
The agents will be the operators.
00:39:55
Travis
Yep.
00:39:56
Danchez
so
00:39:57
Danchez
So if you want to stay competitive, you have to think systematically. And that this is one of those pieces that I'm like, this is a good systems framework to analyze which one's which or what to do what with what.
00:40:08
Danchez
And to wrap up this episode, one final piece of news is that I am doing a live masterclass on May 1st at 1 p.m. Eastern time, noon central, 10 a.m.
00:40:20
Danchez
Pacific time. It is my session from Social Media Marketing World. And it was actually the top rated session, which I was blown away because like I don't spend a lot of time on stages. I spend more time in front of video, but I was nervous. So sorry I rehearsed the heck out of it. ended up being like the top rated session of Social Media Marketing World.
00:40:38
Danchez
The session is called 25 tools and workflows that will change how you create content forever. And I had a blast doing it. A ton of people got a lot of value out of it. After I read all the feedback from, from it, people freaking love this session.
00:40:55
Danchez
I was, I was amazed. I would have never picked the title, but again, I inherited it from Matt Wolf. So that man knew exactly what to do in order to make a good session. cause I went off of that title.
00:41:06
Danchez
we're doing an encore. We're going to have it live for free. You can come and watch this session. I'm going doing it virtually, just one time. So if you don't register for it, this is going to go away and it's not going to come back.
00:41:17
Danchez
But if you want to register for it, see it live next week on May 1st, go to danchez.com slash session, and it will take you to the page where you can register. It is a social media examiner event.
00:41:30
Travis
Thank you.
00:41:30
Danchez
Looking forward to seeing a lot of people there.