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Episode 70 - Bye Sweet Carole & Nine Witches: Family Disruption
0 Playsin 5 hours
We journey deeper into SPOOKY MONTH, past the thorny brambles, through the crumbling graveyard, over the alien’s house, into the haunted church where we find our two heroes, Matt Aukamp and PushingUpRoses, cowering in the corner, hiding from the goblins and playing video games.
This week, Roses played a harrowing psychological horror game (MORE ON THIS NEXT WEEK), Matt played a cute retro platformer, and then we dive into two spooky games!
First, NINE WITCHES: FAMILY DISRUPTION, a spooky/wacky point-and-click about witches and aliens and curses and Nazis.
Then, BYE SWEET CAROLE, a masterfully animated mesh of adventure genres, that’s like a playable dark fantasy Disney movie.
Games Mentioned:
- Mouthwashing
- Crow Country
- Lust from Beyond
- Pippistrello and the Cursed Yoyo
- Nine Witches: Family Disruption
- Bye Sweet Carole
- Clock Tower
Email us! mattandroses@gmail.com
Join our discord: https://discord.gg/fPv7hRgTeV
Follow us on Instagram: instagram.com/saveyourgamepodcast
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Transcript
The Mystery of Thing's Existence
00:00:00
Speaker
I was out at a bar, think last weekend, and I was talking to some friends about this this concept that I want i need and need your opinion. I need you to weigh in.
00:00:10
Speaker
Moi? Mine? Yes, please. I love giving my opinion. So it's about the Addams Family. Okay. And it's about Thing. Okay. So Thing is just like a little disembodied hand that runs around, right? Cute. Yeah.
00:00:26
Speaker
So... What is that trying to say to us? Like, right. Well, what is the logic behind that? Is that does thing have a brain in his hand? No. or here, here is my favorite theory.
00:00:39
Speaker
Oh boy. Is thing kind of like a half ghost? a most ghost. Mostly ghosts. Right. So he's like... So you think he's being controlled by somewhere, another ghost, by other parts of the body that are somewhere else. Not somewhere else. I'm saying, all right, so there's a guy who's a ghost all but his hand.
00:01:03
Speaker
And... and and Like at first he just started walking around and the hands floating in midair and even weird people, even like weird monster families that he found to be friends with were freaked out by a hand just dangling in midair all the time. and yeah So he started walking it along the floor.
00:01:25
Speaker
So that he could, like, just to make people comfortable. But of course, that means that he, as a ghost, is just kind of, like, creeping around on the floor.
00:01:36
Speaker
Like, he's just, like, scuttling around face down. he like, he has a human hand and he made that his entire identity. That's his personality now, is this hand.
00:01:48
Speaker
It's either that or the other thing is, is he, like, Superman? In the sense of... Okay, so sometimes he'll just like leap up and grab something and then he will be able to manipulate that thing. This is this is my friend Cliff ah but brought this point up. So what credit where credit's due.
00:02:06
Speaker
So he'll he'll like reach up and like he'll like manipulate something. Yes. As if he had an arm behind him. Like he'll be able to create leverage, though he's just a floating hand.
00:02:19
Speaker
And it's like it's like Superman, right? Like Superman can fly and then still be able to like grab things while he's in midair. Uh-huh. Which shouldn't be possible, right?
00:02:32
Speaker
Right. But a thing seemingly can do the same thing. So again, it's either thing is like a like a he clearly has a consciousness. Yeah. And it's got to be stored somewhere. He has feelings.
00:02:44
Speaker
He's got feelings. Yeah. They've got to be stored somewhere. They've got to generate from somewhere. And again, he has these superpowers where he can create leverage without a lever.
00:02:56
Speaker
So ah either you imagine he is an entity in and of himself who defies the rules of physics on not just one level, like he's a disembodied hand, but on every level.
00:03:10
Speaker
Right. Or he's a ghost all but the hand. Right. And there's a real weird guy creeping around like a spider on the floor all the time. I'm going to say no to the mostly ghost theory. Sorry, Matt.
00:03:26
Speaker
My question is, ah what's his sex drive like? What's his sex life like? You're just avoiding the first question. Yeah. Okay, fine. My theory is none of these.
00:03:38
Speaker
My theory is that the hand is actually a costume and there's a rat in there. There's a rat in the hand. That very well. Okay, how does he get the leverage going, though? It's a rat and a bat.
00:03:51
Speaker
It's like one of those horse costumes where one has to be the head and one has to be the butt. The bat would be invisible then. Why is the bat invisible? Bat's not invisible. He's just in the hand costume with the rat.
00:04:03
Speaker
Yeah, but the reason a bat would have leverage if it grabbed grabbed like a a switch and flipped it, right? The reason a bat would have leverage is because it's flapping its wings.
00:04:13
Speaker
Yeah. And using that resistance. Yeah. Like wind resistance to create leverage. If the bat is in the hand, there's no wings interacting with wind.
00:04:29
Speaker
He's just smacking around the rat the whole time with his wings.
00:04:37
Speaker
ah No, he's one of the giant rats from Africa. You know, the ones that they learn to sniff out mines and tuberculosis. They're bigger. So the weight helps with the leverage.
00:04:49
Speaker
It's a rat. Thing is a rat. Okay. Again, the leverage thing. Thing is rat. Yeah.
00:04:59
Speaker
The rat is the rat is creating the lever. You can't just answer every question with the word rat.
00:05:08
Speaker
I'm really tired. I can't think of any other theories.
00:05:45
Speaker
Hey everyone, welcome back to Save Your Game. i am one of your hosts, Pushing Up Roses, 50 rats in a human costume, and with me, as always, ah mostly ghost, Matt Aukamp.
00:05:55
Speaker
Hey Matt! Yeah, that's the thing about me. i am a conjoined twin. um I was the little twin. The big twin died hu and is a ghost.
00:06:07
Speaker
hu ah So still like drags me around all the time. Oh, that's why you were acting so weird. Yeah. At my birthday party. I didn't know, man You should have told me.
00:06:19
Speaker
He'll just, like, walk away. when When I'm talking to somebody, he'll just walk away. and So if you've ever been talking to me and you see me just hover backwards, like, off the ground, and, like, I'm like i'm not happy about it, yeah that's gurgle-glammy.
00:06:35
Speaker
I thought you just didn't want to talk to me about King's Quest and were not so subtly hinting. I learned to hover. I learned to hover. ah ah No, that's Gurglamy, my brother.
00:06:47
Speaker
Hey, Gurglamy, how's it going? He can't respond. Okay. He doesn't have- Is he cute? he's like He's a ghost. You can't see him.
00:06:58
Speaker
I've always wanted to flirt with a ghost, though. Wait, so he can't communicate. he can't i can't see him, but he can he can drag you around and hover? Yeah, because we're connected.
00:07:12
Speaker
The only reason I'm able to do this podcast is I do it letting i do it after his bedtime. So he's sleeping.
00:07:21
Speaker
That's why we always have to record. It's such weird. That's why I call you and I'm like we got to record now, no, no, no, no. no no
00:07:29
Speaker
Does he have like, is he just like a very heavy sleeper? Because we're pretty, we're pretty animated. He's dead. Roses. Well, so the dead don't have to sleep. There's a lot of inconsistencies in your story is what I'm saying.
00:07:42
Speaker
you played any video games this week? Oh, I think your ghost friend is flirting with me. No, that was my voice. Oh, man. Don't take this away from me.
00:07:54
Speaker
He's dead and asleep. You can't talk to him. That's my favorite kind of guy to flirt with. Dead and asleep somehow. ah Yes.
00:08:05
Speaker
Yes, Matt. Today the answer is yes. I have. I know it's weird. I don't think I've said yes to this question in literal months.
Exploring 'Mouthwashing' - A Psychological Horror Game
00:08:14
Speaker
Yeah, months. Yeah.
00:08:16
Speaker
I have played video games this week. chuck Okay, so we we are going to be talking about two video games this week. Have you played anything other than and the two we're talking about this week?
00:08:28
Speaker
Yes. However... It is going to be a game I think we're going to talk about next week. I don't know. I don't quite know how we're squeezing this in. This had been a recommendation that you told me about.
00:08:40
Speaker
um and i did And I don't know. it i think it deserves its own thing, its own episode. But the game is mouthwashing. It's a psychological horror game.
00:08:52
Speaker
It's a lot, and it's it's it's very effective. It's a lot. I think didn't quite quite realize it was psychological horror, and maybe that's why I didn't play it when it came out.
00:09:04
Speaker
The game was extremely popular. ah like Let's Players and Streamers and Video Essayists, they all kind of jumped on this game when it came out. It's very ugly looking, but it makes sense.
00:09:16
Speaker
It's one of those. It's like it's kind of like Hobbs Barrow had some of those ugly cutscenes, but when you play it, it That's just what it is. It just makes total sense. That could be yeah that can be really helpful for horror.
00:09:29
Speaker
I think so. yeah um and with um you know With lower fidelity artwork, it creates a type of um ambiguity that can be really effective. I remember, what was that game I played last year?
00:09:47
Speaker
Crow Country. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. chris Had that like PS1 style graphics. Yeah, it was almost like Final Fantasy 7. Yeah, and it made ah and that made a lot of the horror in it a lot more effective because, again, yeah like you couldn't you had to use your imagination to tell what you were looking at.
00:10:07
Speaker
So is there that sort of thing in mouthwashing? Yeah, it kind of, um except I think the graphics are so hyperbolic and kind of so out there and purposefully ugly, not good looking, that you almost have to accept it instead of like using your imagination. like You have to almost put the personalities into this design because it's so blatant and in your face.
00:10:33
Speaker
Right. um It's so out there. Like everyone's hands are enormous and faces are completely messed up. ah Yeah, very PS1, ah but even worse than that.
00:10:47
Speaker
um It's first person, which I always have a little bit of a problem with ah because I tend to get a little sick. It doesn't matter if I turn off like the head bob. It doesn't matter what settings I put on it. I still like it.
00:11:00
Speaker
kind of ill. ah Fortunately, this is a short game. You can you would beat it in probably two hours. ah That being said, don't think it was... It's scary, but it's scary in the way that psychological horror is scary. okay Scary things are not monsters. They're not ah supernatural elements. They're human elements.
00:11:20
Speaker
they're They're what humans are capable of and they the horrific actions they can do and the... It's bleak. It's very, very bleak.
00:11:31
Speaker
So are is it sort of like what's scary about it is the concepts it's introducing more than... ok So I'll give you just a slight premise because this there is a premise, and but we'll talk about the themes later. The themes are are what's more important, but the premise itself is kind of horrifying. You are on a team of five.
00:11:53
Speaker
There's a team of five characters on a space freight ship. like a freight delivery truck for pony express, which was a real thing. This is not, this is, okay um, you're carting around just these, these huge, um, boxes of mouthwash for whatever reasons, like 14% ethanol mouthwash.
00:12:14
Speaker
And, uh, you get into a crash. And now you are five members who are just stranded in space ah with really... with real Maybe there's hope, but if the game doesn't present like that. The the game is purposely very bleak.
00:12:31
Speaker
um You know when you play this game that it's not going to be a happy ending. You just know. you know ah And yeah, that concept in itself, I think that the concept of being in an inaccessible place yeah is very frightening.
00:12:46
Speaker
um Wow. That, yeah, I mean, I think already that that makes me want to know what happens, right? Like, i having not met these characters, like, that is an interesting way to start a story, I think.
00:13:04
Speaker
Yeah. Another horrifying aspect, which we'll talk way more in depth. or Don't spoil it. Don't make sure you're not spoiling anything. don't think so. You already sold me on this. I don't think I'm spoiling it because it's in, like, you can see trailers and and screens sketch screen caps of this. I don't watch trailers. There's only one woman among the five members. Okay.
00:13:25
Speaker
And that might not... hit for you but for me being one woman in stuck in space with five men is a horrifying concept yeah right that's scary because you just know where to do they lean into that concept yes okay So I will talk, I will discuss it heavily because talk about it.
00:13:48
Speaker
Cause we are playing, we, one of the two games that we played for this episode also has almost no ah female characters, ah true but it is, it is completely unremarked upon.
00:14:00
Speaker
I think it's just, no, this, this is a theme that is part of the game yeah that you're, it that that is very important. Um, Yeah, it is remarked upon, but within the story. you know Do you know what i mean? like There's no narrator. ah it's ah you You were just playing as a character.
00:14:20
Speaker
Yes, this is this is part of part of the premise is that there's only one woman. Correct. It's not just they couldn't think of another female character to act. Correct, yes, correct. No, it's very integral to the story.
00:14:33
Speaker
Yeah, there's a lot to unpack. that Honestly, it's ah it's a very good game. A psychological horror is always, i think, hopefully meant to be discussed and bring in human yeah you know human tragedy and things like that. So we'll talk about it. excited for it. Yeah, i'm I'm excited for that conversation. I've heard a lot of ah praise for mouth washing, but I've heard very little, almost nothing, i would even say, about like what the game is like what actually happens in the game, what the game's about.
00:15:06
Speaker
So I'm, I'm pretty stoked. I'm pretty stoked. Yeah, it's really good. it's It's definitely up my alley. I really like psychological horror. And it it upset me. It got me.
00:15:18
Speaker
I will say this. it's It's not really a spoiler. It's more rewarding. It's heavy. It will upset you. Okay. Maybe don't play it before bed like I did.
00:15:30
Speaker
I had a struggle getting to sleep after that. It's that it's it's not only overstimulus you know from a game or a screen. It's also upsetting on top of it. So I wouldn't do that if I were you.
00:15:42
Speaker
But, you know, it is spooky season. It is psychological horror. And if you would like to play it and get on board and and know what we're talking about for the next, ah you know, for the next episode, maybe you'll have your own thoughts on it well. And you can be prepared.
00:15:57
Speaker
That's awesome. Yeah, I played like three games in a row, essentially. So, you know, I don't know what happened there. that You know that's how I get. It's like I won't play any games. all or nothing, yeah. Yeah, I won't play any any games, and then I'll be like, man, I just played five games.
00:16:13
Speaker
It's spooky month. It's spooky month revs you up. Don't rev me up. it It really gets you going. It rouses me. Lust from beyond. No, that does not rouse me.
00:16:24
Speaker
I'm kidding. want to say thank you all to all the ah the responses and interactions on our episode 69, which was on lust from beyond. seems like you guys really enjoyed our conversation and you know the discord was going a little crazy for that episode. So thank you so much for tuning in and listening.
00:16:45
Speaker
i'm got Yeah, we I felt weird about that episode. i did too. We both did. Yeah, just like, were we too negative? were we like Did we bum people? like Is this going to bum people out? Are people going to be like are people going to get done episode be like that wasn't fun listen know.
00:17:03
Speaker
And like that game legitimately made me cranky. I don't even just say it's kind of funny, right? Ah, Rose is cranky. But it it was kind of it was kind of bad. I had a headache and I was in a bad mood and I'm glad it didn't come across as, you know, overly negative.
00:17:21
Speaker
Um... Yes, me as me as well. And yeah, again, thank you, everybody, for your feedback. And i not that not that this show always has to be light or, you know, like there's a lot of times we talk about heavy subject matter in the show, probably next week.
Feedback and Philosophy on Sharing Opinions
00:17:39
Speaker
Absolutely.
00:17:40
Speaker
But there's very few times we are as negative about about a thing. We're going to be a little negative today, but I think in more of a fun way. Yeah. Yes, I have some critique, but I actually also have a lot of a lot of positive positive things to say.
00:17:54
Speaker
um Like the majority of the of the art that I talk about, I think. if if If I ever play a game that's like I don't like it, I'm probably not going to talk about it, you know? Because I don't really want to put that out there. and Yeah, this has happened in the course of the show. is One of us has played a game that we just...
00:18:14
Speaker
disliked so much that we we're just like oh let's not talk about this on the show because like what's the point and absolutely I think unless there's something really interesting to be discussed I think it's yeah it's not worth just shitting on something yeah like you know I have the take of like you know not every opinion has to be out there It just doesn't.
00:18:38
Speaker
It just doesn't. Not every opinion even matters. you know So I try to be really intentional with the critique that I put out there. you know I don't want to just talk about anything all the time. that's that's i don't want to say a waste of time, but it is a time sink. And yeah, I try to be intentional. Even on the channel, I try to be intentional about what I choose to talk about.
00:18:59
Speaker
Right. And I hope we're smart about it, too. I think we're very smart in picking topics in games. That's what I think. i thought you were just going to stop that. I think we're very smart.
00:19:09
Speaker
i think we're very smart. All right. So we'll talk to you guys next week. I'm a rat.
00:19:15
Speaker
Very smart. ah Matt, that's what I've been playing. I can't wait to talk to you about, I've been wanting to, but I know I can't. I know I have to to hold it all inside until you at least play some of it.
00:19:28
Speaker
Yeah. yeah And hopefully you'll, it's short. It's like two hours and let, well, it's two hours and a smooth run. Okay. If you get maybe stuck, yes, you could you could potentially take more. But I would say in ah in a fairly smooth run, you know, two, two and a half hours.
00:19:45
Speaker
And I can't wait to talk to you about that. But in the meantime, what have you played? ah Let's see. I played, there's one game that I played, i didn't play that much.
00:19:56
Speaker
Okay. So I don't have a ah ton to say about it, and it's not really an adventure game either, but I do want to mention it because it's very unique and it's a lot of fun. it came out earlier this year. it got a little bit of got a little bit of hype, um but I haven't heard anyone talk about it in a while, so I don't know if that hype died down or...
Adventures in 'Pipistrello and the Cursed Yo-Yo'
00:20:16
Speaker
um I mean, this has just been a ah year of nonstop, either incredible or super interesting games. So, you know, ah I don't want, you know, I don't want any, some of these things to get lost in that shuffle.
00:20:31
Speaker
yeah So anyway, I played a game called Pipistrello and the Cursed Yo-Yo. Yeah, you you mentioned that I think in the last, yes, in the last episode.
00:20:43
Speaker
Mm-hmm. I played it, but I didn't want to talk about it yet because i hadn't I'd played even less at that point. And also and it was episode 69. Yeah. but So Pipistrello and the Cursed Yo-Yo is like a top down like action adventure game.
00:21:04
Speaker
Okay. Like, you know, Zelda style. Yes. And it's got sort of these retro, i guess like Super Nintendo. Yeah. Kind of graphics. Okay.
00:21:14
Speaker
And you play this little, i don't know if you're bunny or a mouse. I don't know what you are. This little blue guy who is, he wants to be a yo-yo champion. And he's just getting home ah from a, he's just getting home from a yo-yo convention a yo-yo competition to and he's like this the heir to this huge estate um and this company that controls the ah electricity in this town and as you get home
00:21:50
Speaker
and start talking to your aunt who actually owns the company, some gangsters bust in and they, they use this experimental battery that her company refused to sell hu on her.
00:22:04
Speaker
And the reason that the company, she refused to sell it is because it, it's powered by the human soul. And so she found it unethical. So like these things, it creates unlimited power, but it costs a human soul.
00:22:18
Speaker
So, um And are you are you playing as a bat? Is it a bat? Well, Pipistreo is ah Italian for bat. Oh, he's a bat.
00:22:30
Speaker
Does that make sense? I haven't seen what it looks like. So is there a bat involved? no you're you're a you're a kind of a yeah like I said, I didn't know if you were like a mouse or ah bunny, but that now that I know he's a bat, it makes a lot of sense.
00:22:45
Speaker
Oh, okay. I guess the things behind him are wings. I thought there were ears. I'm looking at screencaps and like, it is a little bat-like. Yeah, it's bat-like. Yeah, it's bat-like.
00:22:57
Speaker
Now that i know it's a bat, I can see it, but man. You're right. There's a little bit of a disconnect between like the, like ah visually. and It's not like you, you don't yeah use the wings. You don't fly or anything. Oh, you don't fly. Interesting. oh um Pretty much everything you do is the yo-yo.
00:23:13
Speaker
So what, what happens is her soul gets sucked into four of these batteries taken each by one of the gangsters. And then the last, the fifth piece of her soul ends up in your yo-yo.
00:23:27
Speaker
Using that plus your yo-yo skills, you kind of like you keep unlocking. as you go around, you collect coins and you can sort of unlock different abilities in your yo-yo.
00:23:40
Speaker
You can also collect a little like tokens that give you like charms, like in like a Hollow Knight style charms where they give you sort of like special attributes or whatever.
00:23:53
Speaker
there's like There's basically like an overworld kind of thing. And then you go into various buildings and buildings are like levels, right? Or you'll go into, or dungeons maybe.
00:24:05
Speaker
Yeah. Very, very Zelda. Like, like there's, um, there's collectibles to be found in the overworld. There's obstacles in the overworld. There's certain little like mini dungeons where you just sort of perform a skill and get a reward. Um, and little mini games that people are at. Like I found these two guys who,
00:24:25
Speaker
They found two logs and they're very excited about their two logs. yeah So they said they're like, hey, ah we have an idea for like a little competition.
00:24:39
Speaker
Well, let us throw these logs at you. And if you can dodge them all, then they'll give you a prize. And so it's just like you're dodging logs. And yeah, I guess each one of these criminal bosses is kind of like they they own different businesses around town. And so each business you go into is like a dungeon and you're trying to get all the four Pieces of the battery back to reunite your aunt's soul. But again, it's mostly just you're running around with this yo-yo that has these little powers and ah solving little environmental puzzles and doing little arcade-y style combat. It's really fun. It's really cute.
00:25:15
Speaker
Yeah, it's so cute. There's a lot of geometry involved. Okay. And it's got this it's got this retro... look to it. There's even a filter you can put on the game that makes it look like you're playing it on, like, it's called the ah Pocket Trap Game System.
00:25:36
Speaker
And i think it's supposed to be kind of like an ah a Game Boy? Game Boy Advance. Okay. Yeah, it's a lot of fun. It's called Pipistrello and the Cursed Yo-Yo. It's not spooky. It's not spooky. It's got a bat.
00:25:48
Speaker
But it's got a bat end ah and a cursed yo-yo with a human soul in it. So use your imagination. Make it spookier in head. Great.
00:26:00
Speaker
Well, so that's what I've been playing. Okay. I played two other games, Rose's. What the fuck? I know. Stop padding the podcast with stuff.
00:26:11
Speaker
You also played two other games. ah And we're going to talk about them together. oh okay. Got it. So my bad. Why don't we save the best for last and talk about the game that we were both kind of neutral on.
00:26:24
Speaker
So why don't you play yeah Mouthy Washerino. And then we'll come back and talk about Nine Witches Family Disruption.
00:26:35
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:26:59
Speaker
Hey everybody, welcome back to Save your Game. I'm Matt Allcamp with me, Pushing Up Roses. and and And? I am?
00:27:11
Speaker
ah witch. No, weren't you paying attention? I'm 50 rats in a human costume.
00:27:18
Speaker
Well, 50 rats is more than 9 witches, so I feel like you would win in this contest. I would win. I would win regardless because I'm hashtag winning.
00:27:29
Speaker
who Roses. What the frick is Nine Witches Family Disruption? So, yes, Nine Witches Family Disruption. What an interesting, interesting adventure game.
00:27:42
Speaker
um Yeah. So this is an indie game that came out in 2020. ah It looks modern. You know, it's one of those things where the graphics are that like chonky style graphic. It's more...
00:27:54
Speaker
It's more animated than and detailed than The Last Door, but it's got that little bit of a chonk to it Yeah, pixel. It's pixel graphics. yeah Yeah. And thus, because everything is like just so recognizable and chonky, it ages well.
00:28:08
Speaker
So it's actually hard to put a year on those kind of games, I think. But yeah, 2020. It is Indie Surruption Studios, which I hadn't really heard of. I haven't either. Which appears to just be like three people. Like looking at the credits, it was basically three names that appeared over and over again.
00:28:29
Speaker
ah The plot is a little difficult to describe. it's um it's Would you agree that this is kind of a Nazi Germany situation? That's where all the the story kind of comes from? Yeah, I think explicitly. Right. Yeah. It's in Berlin in 1944. Yeah. Yeah. um that You know, there is a ah Hitler-esque character. There are other, ju you know...
00:28:51
Speaker
Basically, i think it's supposed to be Hitler if they just call him the chancellor. Yeah, they call him the chancellor. I don't know if they were just kind of like avoiding certain imagery or certain names. That's fair. You know, if you want do that. Yeah, there was no there was no actual there. They used the word Nazi, but there was no swastikas and right All the.
00:29:11
Speaker
All the people in charge were either unnamed or fictional names. Yeah. ah there There are the implication of, like, Nazi flags. They've just been torn up. Maybe Captain Bontraff is there tearing them up. ah So hot.
00:29:27
Speaker
ah Anyway, ah so. Killing Nazis is hot. Destroying Nazi shit is hot. It's so fucking hot. And then singing Edelweiss. Yep. I mean, I'm there.
00:29:38
Speaker
ah So the story is such that these um these can I just call them Nazis? Is that fair? Yes. Yeah. um One hundred percent. They are called Nazis in the story. OK. So these Nazis, they want to, you know, inflict essentially further pain on the world by releasing dark energy into the world and like manifesting this energy. And the way they did it is they basically kidnapped a witch and they had her open this portal of dark energy.
00:30:12
Speaker
um And it's it's's a little convoluted, so kind of bear with me. I do like this story. I just think you have to suspend your disbelief a little bit to really be on board with it. Well, let's get into your characters.
00:30:24
Speaker
You are playing two characters. yeah This is one of those games where you can switch between characters, which isn't always my favorite thing, but it's actually pretty fluid and pretty, ah what's the word? Intuitive in this game, I think.
00:30:37
Speaker
So you are playing... um You're playing Akiro Kagasawa. Yes, that's right. And then eventually you take control of his boss also, Professor Alexei Krakowicz.
00:30:51
Speaker
Alexei. Yeah. Alexei. Alexei. Yes. I don't know why. I could not think of their names. Considering Alexei calls us, he just says Akiro all the time. so I don't know why that went out of my brain.
00:31:04
Speaker
But Akiro is a little bit younger. And your boss is, he's old, he is in a wheelchair, and he has the ability to communicate with the dead. He can go into this trance and yeah and see ghosts and communicate with them.
00:31:20
Speaker
And later you'll get other ghostly powers too, but that's your main powers. You can you know you can walk through doors, all that stuff. you can't move anything, but you can definitely go into buildings, which is very helpful in an adventure game.
00:31:32
Speaker
um so word gets out about this this dark energy this portal being opened and you and your boss alexi are sent on this mission essentially to infiltrate as moles as undercover uh you take the place as ah two they're not soldiers but two other people with it who are supporting the nazis one's an actor and i guess the actor's assistant We basically we basically stop the actor from going to this mission and we take their place. We take their passports. We take their invitation and we pose as these people who were invited to this festival. That's going to be, you know, that's going to celebrate all this, this dark energy that these Nazi leaders are working on.
00:32:19
Speaker
It all takes place in ah town called Sunday.
00:32:25
Speaker
Yeah. ah There's also a town called Milkshake. Milkshake. Yeah. Lots over the words and stuff. Yeah. Yeah. This is the level of humor you're dealing with in this game.
00:32:36
Speaker
It's, it's, That's going to be my main critique. it's I think you know that. Kind childish wordplay and then very puerile yeah potty humor.
00:32:48
Speaker
that Yes. it was That's going to be my main – I'll just put it out there right a while talking about that. That is my main critique is that it is potty humor. it's And it's not raunchy. I want to make that clear.
00:33:00
Speaker
It is potty humor. So I'm talking fart jokes and poop jokes and pee jokes. and All right. You know what? why Yeah. Why don't we just talk about it now? Yeah. Why not? It's big part of it.
00:33:11
Speaker
There's parts of this game where you have to like drink piss. Yeah, yeah. Like piss is an inventory item and you don't even control him when he drinks it. He's just like in the middle of doing something else and starts drinking the piss.
00:33:25
Speaker
Like there's multiple scenes where you just have to watch him use the bathroom. yeah Like you don't see it graphically, but it's like fart noises. And so, so okay. So I wrote, I wrote some of these down. I i kept a little track. You ready?
00:33:39
Speaker
Yep, I'm ready. There are 12, well And this is ah this is a like four to five hour game. Should be fucking shorter. That's another thing that we will ah talk about. But yeah um it's it's like ah it's like three hours worth of gameplay stuck in a five hour game.
00:33:57
Speaker
Right. So 12 fart jokes. Oh, dear. And there's one character that's just constantly farting. Yes, there is. And I do have a theory. i do have a theory about that because, you know, this super lowbrow humor, super potty humor, I think the vibe is immature, but what it's going for is maybe that...
00:34:19
Speaker
They're trying to take humor away. Or sorry. That's such a Freudian slip. Yeah, no, they really took, they did really take my humor away for a good five hours.
00:34:32
Speaker
I'm so sorry. They're trying trying to take the power away. Yeah. ah from from the Nazi characters by making them insane and flatulent and goofy and stupid and dumb. It's a very Mel Brooks thing to do is to just make these Nazi characters just absurd and stupid.
00:34:50
Speaker
So that you dislike them. but I would agree if good characters weren't. yeah Yes. Unfortunately, it's not just those characters. Your characters also have flatulence problems and hemorrhoids and...
00:35:03
Speaker
i like Well, we don't have hemorrhoids, but we are per posing as a man who has hemorrhoids that are so big they look like a flower. Yes, and you do see it.
00:35:14
Speaker
So, um, i want okay. I did laugh at some things. It's not completely devoid of humor. And obviously this is going to be subjective. subjective If the devs liked potty humor, there are going to be people out there who appreciate this kind of humor and that find it amusing. and And that's totally fine. It's not for me, but yeah. There was a lot of other humor in this game that it, hold on. Let me finish my, my list.
00:35:38
Speaker
but All right. So 12 fart jokes, eight jokes about toilets. Three jokes about vi ah vomit. Five jokes about shit.
00:35:48
Speaker
And a a whopping... i couldn't even count the amount of times they referred to hemorrhoids. The amount of times that they... the The amount of jokes about penises or testicles was a whopping...
00:36:02
Speaker
13. wow Outdone only by jokes about the game being a game or the... Meta, yeah. the The world being made of pixels.
00:36:13
Speaker
Yeah. 16. sixteen Yeah. and And as we're kind of recalling, these are some of my least favorite things. I really and I'll say it like even even when Ron Gilbert does it, I don't like it.
00:36:27
Speaker
and don't like meta things unless you're the monkeys. The monkeys are the only ones who are allowed to break the fourth wall. Anybody else who does it, I just get cranky. um But yeah, like I said, it's not completely devoid of humor, and I'm not judging you if you like this type of humor.
00:36:44
Speaker
ah i don't. So it was difficult for me to enjoy the vibe. However, it does make up for a lot of that in other things, such as Would you like to take it?
00:36:57
Speaker
Yeah, no i I liked the art a lot. Yeah. I liked, i think I think the art was really great. Like the background, like it's it's got a cool spooky vibe, right? Like, does especially for this season, right? Like it's got, you're in this, these dark kind of woods. There's weird little worm things on the ground all the time.
00:37:20
Speaker
It's like a sound effect that keeps going off and you're not quite sure what it is. You're fighting at points, these weird zombie things. The fights is another thing I'll complain about. But um there's there's witches, there's ghosts, there's this guy who can turn himself into a ghost and use kind of ghost... Well, he astrally projects, right? But he can use sort of ghost powers to help you solve puzzles.
00:37:42
Speaker
Like, there's a kind of like a cult thing's going on, yeah. Cult stuff. There's even, like... you don't really know what's happening, but there something or somebody or some things or somebody's just slaughtering and dismembering living things around yeah the town.
00:38:06
Speaker
Some of that legit got to me too. This game is really not afraid to take away beloved characters. ah Yeah, basically everybody in this game dies. I was actually surprised at how much death there really was and kind of impressed that they were willing to do that.
00:38:24
Speaker
There's a couple townspeople who don't die and the people from the the the the resistance group. the group that's resisting the Nazis, yeah they all survive. Yeah. and But I guess it's a spoiler, but also like, I don't, that, that's not going to affect the, that's not going to affect your, don't think knowing that is going to affect your enjoyment of this story. No, it won't. I think it'll even still be a little surprising.
00:38:51
Speaker
Yeah. Oh, definitely. 100%. But yeah, but it Also, the puzzles weren't bad. Here's my big issue with the puzzles here. They were perfectly fine. It was, you know, the sort of point-and-click normal shit where you're finding objects that you need in an unconventional way or using objects in an unconventional way or...
00:39:15
Speaker
yeah Thinking just like either it's slightly outside the box at all times. Yeah. um Which I like, right? Like it's nothing like mind blowing. It's nothing new or innovative, but it is. Right.
00:39:26
Speaker
But it is. it's the stuff that we enjoy, right? It's genre tropes. I agree. I, I did like the puzzle design. i didn't get stuck very many times.
00:39:39
Speaker
um And another thing I like about the mechanic, you know, it's a lot of fetch quests. Like you said, it's a lot of inventory object puzzles and, you know, do the thing to get to the thing. Another thing I like that's kind of supported the puzzles was the,
00:39:53
Speaker
The setting is alive. Like, people are moving around, things are changing, you will have to go back and look at things. And even sometimes you don't have to go back, but you can to see what's changed, to see if a character has died.
00:40:06
Speaker
um I like that in a video game. I like it when it's alive. And things are actively moving around. And again, I think that supports the puzzle. And there was a good span where I just was really on top of the puzzles. I felt real good about it.
00:40:20
Speaker
Just like being all breezy. But yeah, nothing innovative, but it doesn't need to be. It just has to be good, you know, within within the story and within the genre. um The thing that I didn't like about those puzzles is there's a lot of... and I don't say this lightly because I know games get accused of this all the time and I don't i don't think it's always fair. And it's not necessarily a nice thing to say about a game.
00:40:46
Speaker
But I think they were... artificially increasing the length of this game in some pretty obnoxious ways. Okay. They, one thing that they would do is there's a pretty big map that you're running around. Right. and Yeah. It's more expansive than you even think. It's pretty large.
00:41:07
Speaker
And there's just so many rooms too. yeah um And I got that from a, like a ah art artwork design perspective, right? Like the, the every room and every map looked great, even though i was, you know, even though I was running across a bunch of empty space a lot of times.
00:41:25
Speaker
Yeah. I didn't feel like that was a problem until this basically entire map opened up and,
00:41:36
Speaker
basically every puzzle from this is there's nine chapters in this game so basically every puzzle from like act five on like like the dependency chart would be like one thing would be on one end of the map then the next thing you need the thing that like that solves so basically ah If you have to, this isn't in the game, but if you have to use a magnet to get a key out of the grate to unlock a door, you would find the magnet on one end of the map. The grate would be on the entire other end of the map.
00:42:12
Speaker
yeah You might even have to go to that grate and get something to unlock the ability to get a string and third location in the map, come back, get the key, and then the key would be to a door right next to where you got the magnet.
00:42:26
Speaker
Yes. um So, yeah, I just felt like I was just running around needlessly. Yeah. It needed, needed, needed a quick travel option.
00:42:38
Speaker
With a map that's going to be like that, Like, I don't mind. So the way, you know, the way that Monkey Island does it, been- it wasn't a map you click on. It was a map that you had to physically run around yeah with. Like, I used a controller to play the game. I think you could also use keyboard and mouse. used keyboard, yep.
00:42:53
Speaker
ah know Maybe you can't use mouse, just keyboard. There's no mouse control. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Which was a very interesting mechanic, by the way. I was using WASD to walk, and then the arrow keys for, like, interact and inventory. Yeah.
00:43:07
Speaker
i Once I got used to it, it was fine, but I was struggling a little bit at first. I was, you know quote, misclicking. But like the way that Monkey Island would do this kind of map right is they would have ah map with hotspots on it, which is this. like yeah You have this big map and you walk to the spot, to the hotspot you want to go.
00:43:27
Speaker
In Monkey Island, you travel there once. Like, it'll plot you. You click on it, it'll plot you going there, like, once, I think, at least. And then if you double-click, you're just there. And then you're just there.
00:43:38
Speaker
Yeah. No. there This needed a fast travel mechanic so bad. And, again and like again I think they didn't – the only – I think they didn't – they wouldn't have put that in because the reason they kept these things so far apart was – to lengthen the game, maybe to make you forget that something existed or where something was. So you visit a bunch of more locations to try and solve a puzzle. Cause you're like, ah, I think I saw a watering can somewhere, but I don't know where, or you forget at all that you ever saw a book of matches anywhere. Cause everything's so far away. that's That's one of the only times I got majorly stuck and majorly frustrated.
00:44:19
Speaker
I wasn't stuck at any point, but I pulled up a walkthrough anyway because I just didn't want to have to keep oh man checking things. I was like, this is not, it's not fun yeah to explore anymore. I've seen everything I'm just going back to the same places over and over and they're all so far apart.
00:44:41
Speaker
Yes. Again, that's why I'm saying this was like a three-hour game and that took five hours. Yeah, yeah. And there was like yeah about three hours worth of content and half of it was fart jokes.
00:44:52
Speaker
You're right. There's really no way around the traveling. You got to do it and it is purposefully everything is very far away. So we should say you are physically running around these spaces and then interaction is based on proximity.
Critiquing 'Nine Witches' - Mechanics and Humor
00:45:08
Speaker
Yeah. If you are close to something, then opportunity options to look at it or interact with it will pop up and you just hit the button. And then again, you're switching between two characters. There's a button for that. And then there there are individual buttons for the various powers that this guy has when he is astrally projecting, which I won't give them all away because they change throughout the game. But yeah like from the very beginning, the things that you can do or you can go through,
00:45:40
Speaker
You can pass through doors. You can use this sort of like, what is it? Ghostly perception to yeah highlight hotspots. Highlight hotspots to see what you might need to interact with. Yeah. and I can't remember what the other one's called, but you can talk to ghosts. You can see when you are in this sort of astral form, you can see ghosts and talk to ghosts. So if somebody died in a place recently, it's worth checking out to see if there's a ghost there.
00:46:10
Speaker
Yeah. And I do want to reiterate, it's a very fluid mechanic. And this is coming from, again, somebody who does not like switching. I do not like switching between characters. it it really overwhelms me.
00:46:22
Speaker
But i think what helps is that this is not like Maniac Mansion, where a character once you're not playing a character, they're stuck in that place. The characters follow each other around.
00:46:34
Speaker
Yes, they're always right there. so And they they both can move, but so you can just... You can just switch back and forth at any time and you'll still be making progress. Oh, and we should say Professor Krakowicz has no use of his arms or legs.
00:46:51
Speaker
Correct. He's in a wheelchair. he can't so So if you need somebody to interact with something, it has to be Akiro. Yeah. The other thing. and So Akiro has another power that you find out, I think, somewhere during Chapter 2 or 3, which he carries a gun.
00:47:05
Speaker
Yeah. A little pistol. And this game has combat. This game has gun combat that is just a bunch of people running around the screen firing guns at each other. And your pistol...
00:47:23
Speaker
can run ah can't run out of ammo, but it does get jammed occasionally. Right. You can find other guns on the ground, like a machine gun or a rifle or whatever, and they each have their own special abilities.
00:47:34
Speaker
But when they run out of bullets... Like, you have to go find another gun, and you have to put yours on the ground to pick one of them up. Right. So if you are on one... These aren't these all don't all take place on, like, a static screen, right? They're they're scrolling involved. there's Yeah, yeah, correct.
00:47:55
Speaker
you might be on the way, way other end of this whole, like, scrolling, like, several screens... When you drop your pistol to pick up a rifle and the combat takes you to the other end, you run out of rifle ammo.
00:48:11
Speaker
You got to run all the way back to that pistol. Yeah. We did play this two different ways, which I'm kind of glad about and I thought might happen. So you played with combat on. This is an adventure game. The devs clearly knew that.
00:48:26
Speaker
And they do give the, this is actually really nice and really thoughtful. They they do give the players an option to sell your soul to the devil. And if you do that, the devil will help you in combat and make it a lot easier.
00:48:40
Speaker
I did that and thought it was hilarious. I loved it every single time. I thought it was so funny. i saw that and I just like, I kept dying. it kept like the combat isn't, it's not all skill based. Sometimes it's just, you're just mobbed on every side. It's that's true. Yeah. It's hard, but not in a fun way is what I guess I'll say.
00:49:00
Speaker
Sure. And So at some point I was like, fuck it. I'm going to, I'm going to tell the devil I'm ready to sell my soul and I want the easy combat.
00:49:11
Speaker
But I didn't like, so the way that they easy mode isn't just your ammo doesn't run out. Your gun doesn't jam or health is lower. Yeah.
00:49:22
Speaker
Or your health is higher. It's none of that. It is that the devil follows you around and strikes guys with lightning. Yeah, he smites them. I didn't didn't like that.
00:49:34
Speaker
I liked it. don't know why. I just was like amused every single time. Just like, ah, ha, ha, ha. Yeah, i take that. Yeah, I don't know. it just like something about it It felt like it took all the agency away from me or something. i don't know. I didn't enjoy it. I guess it didn't for me because I chose that immediately with the intention of like, I want this to be more of an adventure game. I don't really want combat in here.
00:49:59
Speaker
i noticed you do. I don't know Sorry, I don't know if you said this already. um You do have to shoot people at least once. Like you have to do something. Oh, okay. To get the ball rolling. I didn't know that. Yeah, and then like the devil comes in and smites the villain characters. and I liked it. um And I'm glad, at least even even if you don't like that on easy mode, I am at least glad that there's an an option for people who don't want combat in their point and click, you know?
00:50:26
Speaker
Yes, I agree. I agree. And I like that it was done sort of within the story. Yeah. I think that's kind of funny. should say there's also no voice acting. Right.
00:50:38
Speaker
these Which I like about it. The music is all right. It's fine. The sounds are horrible. Oh, you don't like the sounds? No, I mean... I don't know if it really stood out to me either way.
00:50:49
Speaker
I think it was, to you know, poor sound effects. it's I think just kind of like the sound effects you download from a free sounds website, right? Okay. um Yeah, sure. Granted, a lot of video games do that.
00:51:03
Speaker
Yeah. But this was just, it was just apparently low quality. Okay. And i think that is also made worse by the fact that there's just so many farts.
00:51:14
Speaker
Yeah. I know, I know. I couldn't... And, like, look, we are of the Leisure Suit Larry ah year era, right? ah We all like a little bit of it.
00:51:24
Speaker
I think everybody likes just a little bit. If it's done round really clever... it's done really cleverly, almost nothing about the humor in this game was clever.
00:51:37
Speaker
Right. Some of the puzzles were clever. It's not clever humor. It is potty humor. Yes. And, I mean, even, like, There's a clown at one point who you have to sit and watch and make a bunch of jokes. yeah You also can't skip cutscenes. know. I was in pain, Matt.
00:51:53
Speaker
was in And you can't let them run by themselves. So if you like die in one of the combat things, and you have to like you have to not just watch the entire cutscene, you have to so manually advance lines of dialogue through it.
00:52:08
Speaker
So died... i would i died like you know my fourth time and and then there's minute long cut scene that I have to watch and I like I wanted to just walk away and let it just run yeah but yeah you couldn't you had to just sit there and press a every couple seconds so Yeah, no, I'm with you there. It was too much for me.
00:52:34
Speaker
Like I said, no judgment if you like that type of humor. In fact, if you do, this is the game for you. You found it. so one of the things I want to say, you had to go, you had to talk to a clown and hear a bunch of his jokes.
00:52:47
Speaker
Yeah. and they were like, so even when this game is not doing potty humor, it's doing this kind of joke where it's like, where it's like the setup is something like, hey, what do you call a cat with four heads?
00:53:00
Speaker
What? I don't know. That's why I asked you. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And like, that's how all of the jokes were this sort of like attempting to subvert the setup punchline.
00:53:13
Speaker
Yes. But doing it just so in such an uninteresting way, doing it in such like a what's funny about that way. Yes. it I think it is trying to do that. I think it's trying to be like, ah clowns are really not funny. We all know it. And yet here's the, you know, it's definitely trying to do that. It's just too.
00:53:32
Speaker
I just don't like it. I do. you think I mean, they had everybody laughing at it. I think that's on purpose. I agree. Yeah.
00:53:43
Speaker
But my my point is that I think they they're like, oh, these are corny. But it's supposed to be funny that it's corny. It's not even that. um I think the characters truly find it funny. And we're supposed to note that um that they are not funny, though.
00:54:04
Speaker
Because the baby says, oh, clowns, aren't they just great? Aren't they just so funny? Yeah. But why – so – but they want us to find it funny that it's not funny. They want us to find the lack of it being funny funny because otherwise why make us sit through so many?
00:54:20
Speaker
Yeah. um So on some level, they thought that they were writing something funny. Yeah. They weren't. No, I agree. I agree with that. I just think it's, it's also like a commentary of how there's, we laugh at absurd things and when they're not funny and.
00:54:35
Speaker
they They try to do a lot of this kind of like anti-humor or, or yeah but there's another scene. There's another toilet joke where if you just press a near the toilet, you have to sit through a full two minutes.
00:54:53
Speaker
of the guy shitting. And it's like that kind of like, is it over yet? Is it like, that's the joke. Family guy knee thing, but it doesn't go on long enough for it to circle back.
00:55:03
Speaker
So it's just obnoxious and long. right yeah I think even if it had gone, I think like, I wasn't finding it funny even a little bit. So it didn't even, I don't think there was a time if they had done it for 10 minutes, it still wouldn't have. like Yeah.
00:55:16
Speaker
Yeah. And I guess that's, you know, difference between the knee thing and like somebody pooping is like, you don't, don't want to see somebody pooping for, guess you could call it maybe some of it kind of cringe humor.
00:55:29
Speaker
um And it it also kind of goes into that. We've mentioned this before, almost like millennial writing, millennial humor. um There's just this style that he goes into this kind of humor that...
00:55:42
Speaker
is very millennial to me. I think if it's that, though, they're bad at it. There's another, i guess, joke that me and you talked about that we were both confused about, which is there's a scene where a guy is like,
00:55:58
Speaker
but like he makes you go get a bunch of ingredients for healing ointment. And he's like, now I'll go do my secret thing to yeah he goes to make the ointment. And he goes into his house and there's a bunch of noises.
00:56:12
Speaker
yeah And then one by one, ah the the well the two characters walk over to the window and start looking in. then... then representations of all the game developers walk on the screen.
00:56:27
Speaker
Yeah. I didn't i understand that. And it's before the joke where they introduced that those people are of the game developers. Yeah. I didn't even know who the characters were. And they're all just looking in the window as this guy's making his ointment and it takes so long and I couldn't understand why that was supposed to be funny.
00:56:44
Speaker
Yeah. It's funny that they're looking in the way they're curious about how he makes the ointment. That's what's funny. i don't know i really don't know i was really unsure on that one yeah it's just it's just stuff like that there's either there's either jokes that don't don't make any sense or jokes that make so much sense because you've heard them a million times or you've heard things like them a million times just yeah Anyway, yeah I won't keep harping on it. i just Yeah, we just we didn't like the writing. We didn't like the humor style.
00:57:19
Speaker
Very, very frustrating. And the game is nonstop jokes, too. yeah and It's like Lori and Corey Cole with their puns. Only this time it's, you know, fart jokes.
00:57:31
Speaker
Fart jokes and this kind of like humor attempt attempts at anti-humor. Yeah. And I think they're trying to, at some points, replicate the so the style of humor of like the LucasArts games.
00:57:43
Speaker
And yeah it's again, it's it's it's almost like following a formula without substance yeah like technically that's a joke i guess technically and it's really too bad because the game is not bad this is ah absolutely not a bad game i would say i had fun playing this game i did like the story i mean despite these kind of more frustrating elements um and the backtracking i liked the story i thought the story was fine i was engaged with it
00:58:14
Speaker
um And if the atmosphere is really, really fantastic. Every scene you're on. Yeah, it's it's got a vibe, man. And it's got a vibe I like a whole lot.
00:58:25
Speaker
And if the humor was more aligned with what I typically go for, which is more wholesome, I guess, little more wholesome humor or whatever Grim Fandango is, then I would like it even more.
00:58:38
Speaker
i mean, I don't mind ah profane or, you know, I don't, I don't. As long as the jokes are good, I'm fine with any kind of joke. Yeah. The other thing I'll complain about real quick, it's a game with like a hundred characters in it.
00:58:53
Speaker
True. Yeah. and not A lot of characters. ah Besides the nine ghosts, which are all women, there's only five other women characters.
00:59:05
Speaker
Yeah. Um, there's the lady that runs the Nazi resistance, who I guess is, is a fine character. Yeah. Doesn't do much. We don't get to know her very well, ah but that's because there's so many, so many characters. You can't really get to know them very well because there's so many.
00:59:20
Speaker
There's an actress that everyone wants to date who has giant boobs. Yeah. There is. right Yes. Yeah. Oh, Gerda, Gerda von Udder, I think is her name.
00:59:32
Speaker
there's a waitress right there's a girl who exists to just be naked on a bed because somebody's gonna have sex with her there is excuse me her name is ruth some respect please there is a nun who is crazy and again the other and then ah like witches there's only one real character you get to know in any in any way that is a witch but it's like It's a game where they only give traditionally female roles to their very few female characters, which is a little frustrating.
01:00:09
Speaker
I guess so. I think I didn't clock it. Just even speaking as a woman who cares about that kind of representation, i guess it kind of made sense to me in a way because of the the storyline they were going for, because it is such this um this this Nazi Germany where all the dudes are problematic and toxic and awful and you're supposed to hate them.
01:00:29
Speaker
I'm kind of glad that, yeah, it's just the for me, it's just like, yeah, all these guys suck. I hate them and we're against them. So don't know if I clocked it as much as you did. I'm not sure.
01:00:40
Speaker
We met a lot of villagers and farmers and stuff, though. That's true. All men. All men. Yeah, that's true. That is true. um Like, even all the all the helpful characters, all the characters supposed to like are all men, and all characters you're supposed to hate are all men, and the yeah you know and the women have, again, like, these servant-style or lusted-after roles.
01:01:00
Speaker
Yeah, except for the resistance woman, which I think is... Except for the resistance woman. Yeah, i don't even care. guess don't even really care that... Gerda was portrayed that way because I think we're supposed to hate her too.
01:01:12
Speaker
Like she's just kind of this vapid because she's in line with the Nazis. i don't like anyone who's in line yeah with the Nazis. So she's that kind of pick me girl, I think is maybe what they were going for there.
01:01:22
Speaker
But yeah, no, it's not, it's not great representation. There are more dead characters than female characters, which is interesting. The plot basically is that this witch character,
01:01:35
Speaker
coven from very long ago. Their town was attacked by Vikings, so they unleashed some curse on the Vikings. The curse was indiscriminate, and so it just started killing everybody.
01:01:47
Speaker
And it's this curse that, like, these these worms infest you, and you turn into basically, like, this black zombie. Yeah. um And just kill anything you see. Or whatever, yeah.
01:02:02
Speaker
So they... locked the curse away behind some big stone or whatever. Then the Nazis uncover that to try and, ah guess, take over the world. What it says is that they want to unleash it to destroy all the strong men of the world so that they can conquer whoever's left.
01:02:24
Speaker
yeah um And there's something, i guess, to be said about like the dynamics of you know the Nazis were these... There's some sort of parallel here between the Nazis being sort of the, you know, ethnocentric race supremacists and that the initial curse was used to exterminate a culture that was oppressing these people.
01:02:54
Speaker
Yeah. um Again, I don't know if it was just an excuse for to see a bunch of dead Nazis. Yeah. I think it was. Yeah. yeah I don't know. I think we could go deeper, but I don't think it is. think I really do think it's just a, you know, Mel Brooks ish.
01:03:12
Speaker
Let's make these Nazis stupid. oh Let's kill them. um Yeah, there's another storyline going on, but i don't I really don't think it's deeper than that. It's just like Blues Brothers, like we gotta stop some Nazis. That's what we're doing here.
01:03:28
Speaker
um And also witches, i guess. it I think it can be perceived as a little convoluted because these two things are... ah You don't expect to see like... a witch coven story plus a Nazi Germany story together. i think that's a little mismatched, but I also, again, I don't think it's deeper than that. I think it is like, we got to overcome the Nazis. well But that's why I was wondering.
01:03:52
Speaker
I, I didn't, I, when you say convoluted, like I, I thought it all held together pretty well where I'll say it gets convoluted there is,
01:04:04
Speaker
there is the The reason it's called Nine Witches is because it took Nine Witches to seal the curse away and eventually you have to find kind of the Nine Witches, right?
01:04:15
Speaker
The reason it's called Family Disruption is literally like a two minute scene at the very end. Yeah. that it's kind of just like stuck in there.
01:04:28
Speaker
Yeah. That a character you've known this whole time and sort of led the, na it turned out he led the Nazis to this curse to intentionally ah unleash it ah on the world for some reason to profit or something. Yeah. and also he was the adopted son of one of the witches.
01:04:50
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. That felt a little convoluted. was just like, okay, well, or at least not convoluted so much as, why is this here? why is Why is this here? And why is it the title of the game?
01:05:01
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I don't know. what else Do you have anything else to say about this game? I feel like we've gotten it all out. No, I think we have. I don't... We've probably been a little bit harsh because it's... One of the main mechanics on an adventure game are is dialogue.
01:05:20
Speaker
Or dialogue trees. So... i Even though I don't like these dialogue trees, I don't like this humor. It's not a bad game by any means. It's well done.
01:05:31
Speaker
It's really pretty. You might like it or you might not based on our critique. ah Do you have any final thoughts? and Just like the art is good and the puzzles are good. It's just the the I think it is they get in their own way with trying to center all the dialogue around jokes when they're not good joke writers. And yeah again, what I feel like is artificially lengthening the game by making you just constantly backtrack.
01:05:58
Speaker
Yeah. And like really long distances and the combat's not great. So but um yeah, so it's just, it's, it it it's like a, again, a good three hour game locked inside a bad five hour game. Yeah, yeah.
01:06:15
Speaker
I'd agree with you there. Well, thankfully, Roses. Yes. We did play another game this week. It's convoluted in a different way.
01:06:27
Speaker
So do you want to put convolutarino? Yeah. And we will come right back and we're going to talk about a game that kind of came out of nowhere and surprised us. It's called By Sweet Carols.
01:06:51
Speaker
Yeah.
01:07:00
Speaker
Everyone, welcome back to Save Your Game. I am one of your hosts. Man, I can't. My cogs are still going, Matt.
'By Sweet Carols' - A Blend of Fairy Tale and Horror
01:07:08
Speaker
I think I'm still thinking about mouthwashing. Mouthwashing just really fucked you up.
01:07:12
Speaker
It really did. i can't even brain right now. I'm Pushing Up Roses. This is my co-host, Matt Aukamp. And we have one more game to talk about today. Yes.
01:07:23
Speaker
And this game It kind of rules. i I'm really digging it. So this is a game that just came out, as as of recording it, just came out today.
01:07:35
Speaker
um It's called By Sweet Carol. It's by Little Sewing Machine, the developer. And it's sort of like it is a cross between like ah like a kind of a light horror story and like a Disney princess story.
01:07:53
Speaker
Mm-hmm. Right? If a Disney princess found herself faced with like ah like ah like a little bit of a horror scenario, right? Yeah. You play a little girl named Lana Benton.
01:08:06
Speaker
And she is studying at this academy or she's living at this academy. I think it's some sort of combination orphanage prep school. Yeah, like a boarding school. A boarding school, right. Yeah. and your friend, Carol, has... It's called Bunny Hall.
01:08:24
Speaker
That's important. um Your friend, Carol... went missing a few days ago. She just kind of disappeared. The school assumes that she eloped.
01:08:35
Speaker
She ran off with some dude. Yeah. um Because that's basically, this is this takes place during the Industrial Revolution, the turn of the century. And they keep sort of hammering home this idea that that is what little girls are preparing for. They're preparing to find a person to marry.
01:08:55
Speaker
Yeah. i So they assume that's what Carol ran off and did, but you're not so sure. At the same time, you keep experiencing these sort of like daytime hallucinations, maybe? You may be traveling to another dimension? Yes.
01:09:13
Speaker
in On the Steam page, since it is since you mentioned it is out now, I wanted to see like kind of what they were saying. It does say um that this path of Bunny Hall leads her to the mysterious kingdom of Karola. Yes.
01:09:28
Speaker
Well, and I think that's... might be trying to be literal. Right. I don't think that so much matters. I think what matters is that you don't know in the game ah whether she's going... Because they they're trying to make that ambiguous.
01:09:42
Speaker
Yes. You... Pretty much every time you visit Corolla or you are visited by people from Corolla, you... The scene ends with you waking up in bed.
01:09:56
Speaker
The true, yes. So you don't know if you are... Yeah, you're kind of caught between two worlds, right? You've got the real-life world in Bunny Hall, which is an orphanage where your friend has gone missing and everyone's now gossiping.
01:10:10
Speaker
And you're also a princess in this fantasy world of Corolla. And... Yes. Could that be a survival tactic where we're trying to find Carol and we're, maybe you know, this is kind of an all brain mental thing. Sure, it could be.
01:10:24
Speaker
ah Or it could be very fairy tale-esque. Could be pure fantasy. um Yeah, it's it could go either way. And there's there's some things you should know about this story, which is 90% of it is p trying to find a letter.
01:10:39
Speaker
Yes. like So much of this game is just chasing letters. Like you open on like your tutorial scene is you are, you see a letter. you see Carol's name on it.
01:10:52
Speaker
Yeah. So you think it'll give you some clue as to where she went. And so you go chase the letter, wind blows it away. You go get it again, and the wind blows away. Wind blows it away. Then a bunny with glasses takes it. Paper in adventure games.
01:11:04
Speaker
It's impossible. Yeah, yeah. And this will happen a dozen more times in the game is you will find... either this letter or another letter it's it's sometimes hard to tell whether you're you're constantly chasing the same letter in different scenarios or whether you are finding new letters yeah that are from or to carol i think it's the second i think you're finding multiple letters often to carol and you're trying to grab them because you think they'll give you clues as to where she's gone
01:11:39
Speaker
yeah I mean that criticism in sort of the silliest of ways. sure Because yeah this game is a lot of, is really magical, right? um I was going to say it's a lot of fun.
01:11:53
Speaker
That, I think, is partially true. I'm having a lot of fun playing it. I don't necessarily think the gameplay mechanics are, like, super fun. Sure. Yeah. um Well, but yeah, I mean, let's talk about the mechanic because it's it is an adventure game, but it's an adventure game in the way that Little Nightmares is an adventure game.
01:12:15
Speaker
It's an adventure game with also survival horror tactics, you know, in the way that you would find in Clock Tower, right? So there's no, we have an inventory. We do have an inventory.
01:12:26
Speaker
We do use items, but the majority of these puzzles are just kind of these like in the moment logic puzzles. How do we connect this battery to this battery? How do we get water going through this pipe? You know how do we get electricity?
01:12:39
Speaker
Like I kept joking, you know, as we were playing it, that it's like, are we just trying to fix the electric? Yeah. Yeah. yeah just so and yeah Yeah, there's a lot of puzzles about turning on electricity and making electricity go to the right place.
01:12:54
Speaker
yeah um But there's some like light platforming involved. Yeah. you Is this a spoiler? I don't think this is a spoiler. go for it. It happened so early on. You get the power to turn into a buddy.
01:13:07
Speaker
Yeah. um And the bunny can platform can bounce off walls and jump really high and fit in small spaces and you can manipulate objects.
01:13:20
Speaker
Yeah. So you can do the inventory puzzles. The bunny can jump around and get you to other places. Yeah. Yeah. Because you are the bunny, so you... Wherever the bunny ends up is where you are. I've made it sound like you were two different characters.
01:13:34
Speaker
ah No, no. you You were the bunny. You turn into a bunny as ah yourself. ah Yes. Very cute. yeah And you can you can turn back and forth at will as long as there's enough space to it. You also do eventually meet some two characters from Corolla.
01:13:50
Speaker
First is Mr. Keen. Mm-hmm. KYN, also known as the man with the tar hat. Yeah, he is his his motivations aren't entirely clear to me, but he is chasing you and he is trying to use you as the princess to help him gain control over Corolla.
01:14:14
Speaker
And something about stopping time and something about you being like the bridge between these two worlds. Yeah.
01:14:26
Speaker
Not entirely certain I fully... And they might, it might just be, i we have, i haven't beaten the game. We both played some of this. We actually screen shared because we only had one code for it at the, and it wasn't out yet. It's a fun game to play with someone else. I'll give it that. It's kind of, it's kind of one of those. It's not, you know, multiplayer or it's not co-op, but it is kind of fun because i mean, I'm going to, I'm going to credit that too, that it's tense, a little exciting, and it's beautiful to watch.
01:14:58
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It appears to be 10 chapters just based on the achievements. and ah we had just gotten to chapter six when we wrapped up.
01:15:10
Speaker
Yeah. And... So there could still be plenty of story coming that's going to reveal it. But at the moment, I'm not entirely sure what Mr. Keene is fucking talking about. Yeah, it's it's, you know, it's written the way it's drawn. and And I mean that to say that it's very artistic and writerly. it's It's a little poetic. So I think some of the storytelling is a little veering into the abstract.
01:15:38
Speaker
You know what I mean? It's not and like definitively abstract, but kind of veering into this. ah kind of dark fantasy ah fairy tale where you just have a narrator being like, and then the little girl found the letter of the dark seal. Like it's, it's a lot of stuff that I, I'm not really sure what they're talking about, but the narrator is narrating it with like such conviction that I think supposed yeah But yeah, it's very artistic and it kind of matches the beautiful art style.
01:16:11
Speaker
Yeah, and it's all familiar fairy tale kind of stuff, right? It's very classical story tropes. And not all tropes are, you know, tropes. Trope doesn't necessarily mean negative, right? Nope, just term. Just a word.
01:16:26
Speaker
sort sort of A lot of fairytale tropes going on here. Yeah. and so ah so okay I said you meet two people from Corolla. So one is Mr. Keene. He's chasing you. ah Not entirely sure what his goals are, but he's bad.
01:16:41
Speaker
And then there's ah the silver gentleman, otherwise known as Mr. Basie. Otherwise known as string cheese, string cheese. what We call him string cheese. affectionly call it um He looks like a bunch of string cheese in a big tall coat.
01:16:56
Speaker
The thing about Mr. Keene and Mr. Basie is they look kind of like each other. They kind of look like yeah the good and evil versions of each other. sure yeah They both have this tall, crooked posture with... They're floppy.
01:17:16
Speaker
They're yeah very floppy. They're both floppy. yeah And they both very magical, right? like they like yeah The way Mr. Keen chases you is very... magical and ah he's also ah constantly like taking the forms of people you know and trying to trick you into getting close to him yeah there's some jump scares that's kind of the spooky horror element of it again a kind of survival horror you know yes yeah and mr basie can pop his head off it's cute i promise
01:17:52
Speaker
He talks with his hands, not with his not with his mouth, by the way. So when he's just a head, he can't talk. um So he ah pops his head off and it can he can like walk around with his head. His head can also get like take punishment. So...
01:18:08
Speaker
I'm saying all this to say you not only do you change back and forth between Lana's human form and bunny form, you also can switch characters in certain scenes between you and Mr. Basie.
01:18:21
Speaker
And Mr. Basie can pop his head off his head, can fit through small spaces. You can also get crushed. um And be perfectly fine. yeah So if there's, say, um like one of those crushing obstacles you see in platform games ah that is moving too fast for you to get through, you might need to send Mr. Basie's head through, let him get crushed, and when he's on the other side, and he might be able to turn it off with a switch. A lot of switches in this game. yeah um Yes, there are.
01:18:52
Speaker
Oh my gosh. He can also like his head will also absorb certain elements without pain. So like you can, he can just like catch on fire yeah and then you can use him to light other stuff on fire or you, he can, you know, get himself electrocuted and then he's electrified and you can use that electricity elsewhere.
01:19:10
Speaker
um It's a little silly. It's silly. But also fun. It rules. He's an awesome little character. we also really don't know his motivations. No.
01:19:21
Speaker
Not quite yet. He says he's... In a very recent chapter, he said he was trying to, your goals aligned because he was trying to save Corolla, but we don't exactly know how Corolla's under threat. It's all a little.
01:19:34
Speaker
yeah that's a little vague as of right now. um And we're not, again, we're it's that it's that stuck between two worlds thing. So we don't even know. If the threats are real or what the threat looks like in reality versus what the threat looks like in fantasy world.
01:19:52
Speaker
um It's very Alice in Wonderland that way. Right. Well, yeah this whole thing. So it looks the style again, besides being dark, being being a lot darker than this, um the style and scarier. The style is very much like classic Disney.
01:20:08
Speaker
God, it's gorgeous. It's so good. And we'll talk about that in more in a second. But the... the The way I'm experiencing the story is also very much like I experienced classic Disney stories as a kid.
01:20:22
Speaker
Yes. I yeah didn't fully understand the details, but I understood the stakes of every scene. Yeah. Right. I knew in any scene in a Disney movie when I was a little kid, knew who's the bad guy, who's the good guy, what they were trying to achieve right now.
01:20:39
Speaker
It was a girl. She was trying to get a boy's attention. It was a dude, and he was trying to run away from the bad guys. it was ah There was a villain, and he's trying to con somebody, and the good guy's trying to stop him. I understood all that, and i in this game, I understand all those things.
01:20:56
Speaker
I always know what the goal of a scene is. Yeah. But... I don't understand what the overarching story is. No. and so and And maybe that will come to light.
01:21:09
Speaker
Right. Yeah. As we play it. Yeah. that being said, right. Like the Disney stories made sense. I was just too young to understand them. and Yeah. This story, I am older now and understand stories and I don't understand it. So I think why, why I'm able to tolerate that is again, cause it's giving me sort of this nostalgia for when I was a kid and how I would experience these.
01:21:33
Speaker
But I don't know if that it resonates with you at all roses. Yeah, no, it definitely does. Uh, And it's it's very, yes, Disney-esque. Disney-esque in the way of like Alice in Wonderland was adapted by Disney.
01:21:50
Speaker
um Disney and also Alice in Wonderland ah in themes as well. There's an emphasis on time. There's an emphasis on bunnies. Bunnies. Yeah. Bunnies. yeah There's a lot of falling down holes. yeah Falling down these kind of portally looking holes that are going to another another world.
01:22:07
Speaker
Bridge between two worlds. yeah Yeah. It's also very Grimm's fairy tales. um And you know what else it kind of gives? Yeah, because it's dark. Yeah. It's yes dark and scary and the threats are really. Yeah.
01:22:19
Speaker
of Real. Yeah. Yeah, it it's also kind of giving kind of Labyrinth or the Dark Crystal. Those are dark fantasy. So it's kind of like that. It also ah highly reminds me of Clocktower, the game Clocktower, the one that came out on the Super Famicom. Okay. um Because it is it does have those survival elements. It has this this girl, this beautifully animated ah girl who is like, as we kind of described her, kind of fragile, a little damsel-y. She's <unk>s definitely in distress.
01:22:48
Speaker
Okay. Yeah, when she runs, she puts her hands right, like, like, yeah, limp wristed in front of her chest and swaying, swaying back and forth. Right. Like that just classic damsel in distress run.
01:23:00
Speaker
Yeah, you know, and it may be a little bit of Don Bluth in there too. but Yeah, I think so. Yeah, but what I'll say is like, man, this is the most beautifully seamless animation I've seen in gameplay. It is seamless.
01:23:14
Speaker
That's why I could just watch you play it because, you know, we just played another animated game. We play Toonstruck. And that's not, that's not seamless. No, no, no, no. The cut scenes in the yeah and the game are two like separate entities um yeah where this, they flow back and forth. And i had been concerned when we, when i when I started, when I, when I first heard about this game, um because sometimes you will see games that are this beautiful.
01:23:44
Speaker
And it'll be like beautiful cut scenes and there's really well-designed character art and really beautiful backgrounds. And then it's mostly just a person running back and forth ah in front of those static backgrounds without much animation. and this there is a lot of character animation.
01:24:08
Speaker
The backgrounds sometimes our datic but a lot of times are alive in some way. Yeah. At And ton of lighting effects, which is crucial.
01:24:22
Speaker
And also a lot of like foreground background work that yeah makes the game feel, like makes it feel like, again, like you said, seamless. Yeah. um Think of like Sleeping Beauty, where you had animated characters and then this beautiful painted background and they're both integrated into each other. But like just just the seamlessness, I think, comes from...
01:24:46
Speaker
you the running animation looks like a cut scene like that's how that's how beautiful that's how wonderfully done it's animated and the bunny you know the bunny hopping and doing flips and stuff i agree with that beautiful i agree with that but i also think like the i think you can't discount what the foreground background is doing yeah because that makes it feel like there's there's often animations happening Right up by the screen in the foreground. That's true. Yeah. Like people, so like somebody maybe stalking around in the bushes. Yeah. In front of, like in between the camera Lana.
01:25:27
Speaker
um Or ah like an animal scurrying around or or spying on her. Yeah. Yeah. From behind her like out a window or get or up in a tree and that the backgrounds are constantly sort of moving and shifting and telling the story as you go as much as your character and the things that you are controlling are telling the story really really helps make it feel like you are
01:26:04
Speaker
within this cartoon world yes yes gosh it just didn't really i'm i'm just re-watching you know some of the trailer now and it because of that background foreground it does look very cinematic just like don bluth movie would do or or a disney movie would do you have the painterly stuff and the background foreground and the animation like it's yeah Gosh, it's so good. It's so beautiful. I can't get over it, honestly. I can't get over it.
01:26:34
Speaker
There's a couple other things we have to mention here. um Number one, like we should describe what the actual gameplay is like. Not only... So you're shifting between these things. Oftentimes, you are... It is like...
01:26:47
Speaker
two-dimensional planes yes so even though i said this pejoratively i don't this i like i was trying to say this transcends this but you are basically running back and forth on a 2d plane yes to solve puzzles or to solve like very light platforming challenges often the platforming challenges aren't about like your reflexes sometimes they are but rarely rarely yeah maybe more so when you're the bunny which makes sense yeah yeah They're more like atmospheric puzzle challenges, right? Or like like spatial ah puzzles ah that you're you're solving with your platforming.
01:27:30
Speaker
um Right. Like Little Nightmares. so um yeah Yeah. it's Like I said, it's it's very similar to Little Nightmares, except this is Disney. ah the ah Very different aesthetic.
01:27:41
Speaker
The other thing you're doing a lot is running from monsters, villains, bad guys, and hiding. And that is what...
01:27:52
Speaker
Roses means when she brings up, I think, clock tower and survival horror. Survival horror. Like, yeah, in clock tower, there are, it struck me immediately, like you find places to hide.
01:28:04
Speaker
Yes. That is what you do. And that's what you're doing here too. You find little alcoves to hide in or you, or you platform a bit, you know, you crawl over a bookshelf or something like that. And then you have to, there's a holding your breath mechanic.
01:28:18
Speaker
yeah Like in survival horror. yeah. Got to be quiet. You got to be quiet. Yeah. When, you know, the monsters looking, looking for you and you're hidden in the little wardrobe.
01:28:31
Speaker
this is Yeah. You got to hold your breath so they can't hear you. They also can hide. They can hide too. So just like in Clock Tower, which, you know, the main villain of that is the Scissorman.
01:28:43
Speaker
ah Sometimes you'll go into a room and you'll feel tense because you know, you just know. He's somewhere in there. He's somewhere. And then he like pops out of a box. Same thing. ah That kind of same survival horror mechanic that kind of started out in Alone in the Dark, you know, which is the survival horror game.
01:29:00
Speaker
ah Yeah, very similar to that, just with different aesthetic. The jump scares aren't terrible, but they are there. There are jump scares. They're just not that bad. um Yes, I agree. And it's the same with a lot of the horror here. It's spooky.
01:29:14
Speaker
It's definitely, it'll give you that nice Halloween-y feeling. Yeah. um But it's not it's not terrifying. It's not super scary. Yeah. No, I definitely think it in terms of it's definitely horror, but it's it's comparable, again, to dark fantasies like Labyrinth.
01:29:32
Speaker
Right. The Dark Crystal. um maybe Maybe it can even veer into gothic horror a little bit. um But yeah, spooky doesn't necessarily mean scary. ah So but it does have that. I would play it for Halloween. This is a ah spooky game to me.
01:29:48
Speaker
I think it's a spooky horror game, but it yeah, but it hasn't, it hasn't like scared me besides a couple jump scares where I got a little like, um and there were some, there's some creatures in this game that ah like I didn't find scary, but would be horrifying to me. Maybe if I were a child or if I were more um sensitive to those sorts of things.
01:30:08
Speaker
ah Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like some inhuman creatures. Yes. The other thing we should talk about, Is there are some, while we're not, while we're having a lot of, we were having a lot of trouble sort of decoding the fantasy story yeah in this game.
01:30:31
Speaker
There seems to be a bit more of a straightforward story happening in the real world. I imagine the two parallel each other and complement each other thematically, but we haven't seen them fully tie in together yet.
01:30:44
Speaker
Right. But, Part of the real world story appears to be about the role of women at the turn of the century.
01:30:58
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. um There's a lot of mention of... different characters attitudes towards women's liberation or women's emancipation. It was a, was very rightfully called at the time.
01:31:11
Speaker
Yeah. and people with differing views or people such as Lana who are faced with a challenge to their views. Yeah. So that, that seems to be a theme.
01:31:23
Speaker
Yeah. and again And if I may, I've got another theme ready to go. Sure. Yeah. And I just want to say also, like, again, there's like this idea of everybody is trying to get married. They're trying to make Lana into the perfect woman so that she can grow up and marry a nice gentleman. um And her friend Carol appears to, in flashbacks, not want that for her.
01:31:50
Speaker
Correct. Um, so like you're a little girl, you're at an orphanage and they even, you know, the head mistress calls you, you're a woman now. Yeah. We were making, we were making jokes about it when we were playing together. Cause it was just like, she's so clearly. And so obviously a little girl, yeah yet they're calling her a woman and talking about her getting married. Right. Like, so we were, you know, so we were making jokes about that because it's so anathema to the way, you know,
01:32:21
Speaker
We view little girls now. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So what was your other theme? This is a more heavy handed one. i I mean, that's very heavy handed. I would say i would say that theme that about, you know, ah women's roles, gender roles, that's very explicit.
01:32:37
Speaker
um This theme is a little bit more heavy handed. And that's environmentalism. Right. Agreed. yeah it's Imagine kind of your david's David the Gnome scenario where animals' homes are being taken over by you know industrial machines and and apartment complexes.
01:32:56
Speaker
It's definitely got that going for themselves. Like you have monsters and animals made out of tar. You know, to they're even on the description on the page, they're called tar bunnies, you know. and Yeah. um So it it is definitely touching on that. If it's not on purpose, then I don't know what we're doing here. It definitely is.
01:33:14
Speaker
It definitely is because, again, the Mr. Keen, who wants to take over and destroy the land of Corolla, which you are introduced to in a beautiful garden at the beginning of the game. and He tells wants to destroy Corolla, but he's called the man with the tar hat.
01:33:30
Speaker
Yes. so And he's clearly like a Fern Gully style. You know, like he's a monster made of smog and gook.
01:33:43
Speaker
Yeah. so Yeah, I was thinking that too. So I think ah but it's definitely an intentional theme. Yeah. And I think that will...
01:33:58
Speaker
play very heavily into the way that the fantastical theme and the real world theme tie together. i also think the feminism theme is going to come through in the fact that they keep calling Lana Benton a princess.
01:34:16
Speaker
Yes. yeah And we get some hints, and I could be wrong about this, but we get some hints that maybe where Carol ran away to was the kingdom of Corolla. Yes.
01:34:30
Speaker
thats the Yeah, I would agree that that's kind of the implication. And now that you're now that you're saying all that together, i think it's really interesting and pertinent that... In the game, we're both a little girl at the, you know, during women's lib and also ah bunny.
01:34:47
Speaker
And, you know, we can turn between each other two kind of ah characters, two kind of living beings that are prey almost in this particular time. Prey to, yeah, pray to humanity, you know, um it's just I just think that's really interesting. But also, as we know about bunnies and women, ah both extremely strong and resilient and fierce.
01:35:09
Speaker
And I just thought that was interesting. I thought that's interesting that we play as both. that That is interesting. I hadn't put that together. Yeah. that yeah Something that's yeah strong and fierce, but also but seen as gentle and non-threatening.
01:35:28
Speaker
Yeah. um That's interesting. i you. I think that's, I think that's gotta be on purpose. And I do think, I think this game is aiming for some big themes.
01:35:40
Speaker
Definitely. And I am really excited to see how those come together. And even though the puzzles haven't been amazing, the platforming is not incredible. Like the actual playing, like the, gameplay just on a gameplay level isn't amazing.
01:36:01
Speaker
fine. It can even be a little repetitive and and tedious in and yeah parts, I would say. yeah Yeah, I think that's true. And so it's not it's not it's not amazing gameplay, but I'm really enjoying kind of every moment because it's so beautiful.
01:36:19
Speaker
Yeah. And again, the story's kind of kind compelling i think so too i think the themes are compelling i think the the fairy tale-esque dark fantasy aesthetic is compelling ah even again i just like watching it even just liked watching i didn't need to play it um and matt had to uh tolerate every reaction to a cute animal that i had for like four hours so good job everyone tell matt good job
01:36:50
Speaker
third what is What are friends for not tolerating each other's fucking obnoxiousness? No, it wasn't that obnoxious. I'm kidding. but But no, I, yeah, I'm really impressed.
01:37:05
Speaker
This game, again, it's called Bye Sweet Carol. There is a loose crank. course there is there's always a loose crank real early on chapter two yep was there think it was there was there was one in like five or like five four or five too was there's just so many cranks you guys there's loose crank in nine witches I don't recall offhand, but I would say there probably is somewhere.
01:37:31
Speaker
yeah but their But this is interesting, though. ah Very strange. This is the only time ever where I've played two games back-to-back where there's a character named Marcel.
01:37:42
Speaker
What? So there's that. Oh, speaking of Marcel, i also... Yeah, how is Marcel doing?
01:37:55
Speaker
Look, i'm going to I'm going to take a big swing here. Okay. And at the risk of embarrassing myself, could be wrong. and i So Marcel appears to be the person, appears to have something to do with Carol's running away.
01:38:12
Speaker
Yes. It is assumed throughout the game by every character. both when reading the letters and when seeing this this happens in I think chapter two so this is really early on so i don't think I'm spoiling anything um seeing this character that you think might be Marcel running around and destroying these letters yeah is referred to as a boy yeah i I'm thinking there's a good chance that Marcel is a woman or is a girl.
01:38:48
Speaker
Yeah. And i I have a hunch that there is a sort of sapphic love story happening behind the scenes here. Yes.
01:38:59
Speaker
And I could see that happening just based on the game is emphasizing what it's like to be a woman at that time. You are basically prepping yourself to be property, you know, to be the perfect woman for a guy, for a husband specifically.
01:39:14
Speaker
You're training for that. And if Carol ran away maybe she ran away because she had different romantic preferences. Yeah, I have a strong suspicion.
01:39:29
Speaker
that that is an aspect of the story could be yes again i could be totally wrong this is folks this is your chance to completely humiliate me and be like no matt you are so fucking wrong what an idiot he's so dumb guys oh come look at this dumb dumb podcast guy dummy um no i i Please don't do that to me. I'm so fragile. I'm i'm like a bunny.
01:39:58
Speaker
He's very fragile, you guys. Don't do it. I'm like a little i'm like a little bunny princess. He's going to call me at 2 a.m. m crying, so please don't. So, anyway, that's all I want to say now. about i think I imagine we will talk about this in some intros coming up.
01:40:16
Speaker
Yeah, I think so. Now that the game's out, we're probably going to be playing it separately. Yeah, probably. um Because I don't want to i don't i don't want to wait. And I'm sure you don't either.
01:40:28
Speaker
And we we keep very different schedules. and This podcast is the one time our schedules overlap.
01:40:37
Speaker
ah Yeah, again, I think this game will come back up. I also think this game, hey, might come back up in some discussions we have in January. Yeah, I think so. Yeah. Spoiler alert. Yeah. any Anything else? Any wrap up thoughts about Goodbye or about Bye Sweet Carol?
01:40:53
Speaker
No, I just, I'm just very impressed. I want people to play it. And man, even if you don't like the gameplay, the artistry is over the top to me.
01:41:04
Speaker
And I just admire that. I recognize the hard work that went into it. So well done. Yeah, I'm i'm really
Concluding Thoughts and Humorous Banter
01:41:11
Speaker
i'm also yeah really impressed with this game. Man, I'm an artist. I can't do shit. I just keep sculpting bears all day. What's wrong with me?
01:41:19
Speaker
Do ah do an invent ah a stop motion animation adventure game about the bears you sculpt. Oh, good. Yeah, that'll take 20 years. Just me. it'll just 20 years later, I'll come back and be like, the game is done, everyone. And they'll be like, we don't have computers anymore. Oh, no.
01:41:37
Speaker
and didn't make a port for this new thingy. Yeah, that would be terrible. But if somebody else wants to make that idea about my beautiful little bears, you go ahead.
01:41:50
Speaker
Well, then they need you to make the bears. Free idea. Yeah, okay. I mean, that is all I'm making. So maybe I can't make it. Right, so maybe you guys can collab. you Hey, some some enterprising young game designer.
01:42:05
Speaker
i don't know why I said young. Have to be young. have to be young. like You have to be young. i have to be young, otherwise she's not going to pick up your calls. True. Not going to pick up. You know what's really interesting? I started sculpting in my clay class. I started sculpting a hair, actually.
01:42:20
Speaker
Like a little bunny. Before we even talked about this game, i that's what I chose to do. i That's interesting. Interesting. Yeah. I foresaw it, you know? The game, yeah, the game is...
01:42:35
Speaker
yeah was has been invading your mind and your dreams. I mean, right now, all I can think about is mouth-washing. so I can't wait to play it. i I have to prepare for ah my next for a next Mutant Menace episode tonight and tomorrow, but i man, I'm like champing at the bit to fucking get back get my hands on mouth-washing. Probably because you like woke up to text being like, ah that's all I can think about.
01:43:03
Speaker
I'm also excited about the other game. we are, we're jamming these two games together into an episode. So it might also be another long episode. I'm excited to talk about clock tower or to play clock tower. Your time playing it, right?
01:43:17
Speaker
Yes. And then hear, not only experience it, but then hear your feelings about it. So yeah. One of the scariest games I've ever played. Hands down. I fucking love spooky month. Spooky month. I love spooky month.
01:43:32
Speaker
Let's just be a spooky podcast from now on Because I also like playing the uns spooky games. Okay. I mean, it's always at least 50% spooky since I'm here. That's true.
01:43:43
Speaker
It's always a little bit spooky. Yeah. Always a little bit spooky, yeah which is our motto here and Save Your Game. ah True eggheads, no.
01:43:54
Speaker
Always a little bit spooky. little bit spooky. C8, your partners. what's ah What are some other injurks? ah Bow down to Hanson Swanson.
01:44:06
Speaker
Hanson Swanson. ah I jump really well. i'm a yeah I'm a special boy. Very fast. Very good very good jumper. ah I'm an artist. I am from Chicago. You're an artist you're an artist and you're from Chicago.
01:44:18
Speaker
i haven't said that one before, though. That's probably new. to We're not allowed to talk about the cheese in the machine puzzle. That's not my decision. do.
01:44:31
Speaker
uh c8 ag heads that's such a funny if you if you said that to somebody that's such nonsense it's makes but if you said that to any of the you know hey two thousand people that listen to the show they would immediately be like i know exactly what you meant you've just said gibberish c8 ag heads
01:44:56
Speaker
think I think, ah well, before we sign off, I just want to say i already mentioned the Discord. Definitely join it, though, if you haven't. I think we mentioned it. We'll mention it in the show notes. It's on our Instagram as well, which you can also go follow.
01:45:11
Speaker
I'll have some new artwork up there for you guys. And ah there is there is going to be a picture of me and Homerd eventually. Please don't call him Homerd. It'll be up by the time this episode comes out.
01:45:23
Speaker
Yeah. but So go check out Homerd. word um If you have any questions, suggestions, ah you can email at us. Matt, I'm telling you. mom Email at us. Oh, that's a good that's a good turn of phrase. Email at us.
01:45:38
Speaker
Email at us at mattandroses at gmail.com. ah Instagram, saveyourgamepodcast. And also, i about the Discord, I didn't realize that Discord invites expire, so I will be updating the links.
01:45:54
Speaker
Oh. um Can you make it not expire? I don't know. ah I don't know. But if you come across an expired link, just let me know on through, you know, let us know through email or yeah through or let me know in blue sky or something. And and um we can <unk> we'll we'll fix them.
01:46:17
Speaker
Yeah, well we got you. We got you. I apologize for that. Yeah, it's your fault. Well, I didn't know. didn't know. boy. At least he's a good jumper, you guys. I don't know. Don't sacrifice me to the man with the tar hat.
01:46:33
Speaker
All right. Well. Thank you, everybody, for listening. And come back next week for some really, really spooky discussions.
01:46:43
Speaker
Yes, please. And what what what do we have left to tell the people? Well, i think I think this is only appropriate because I'm an artist. As I just told you, as you just found out five minutes ago.
01:46:56
Speaker
I didn't know that. Hold on. have to update my Rolodex. I know. You have to put like occupation artist. ah And since I am an artist, can- I had vagrant. That's also true. Okay.
01:47:13
Speaker
But yeah, that being said, I think it's only appropriate that I say, you know, podcasts is art. Yeah, but you know, artists suffer. But not today because this art was very pleasant today. It was very pleasant. Well, half it was suffer.