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23. A Holistic Approach to Strength Training with Wendy Reinert
93 Plays29 days ago
Wendy Reinert is a retired professional dancer, aerialist, strength coach, life coach, world traveler, amateur rock climber and toddler mom. Wendy is the founder of Being a Dancer, a platform dedicated to helping dancers navigate the emotional challenges of the dance industry. Her mission is to make the dance world easier and healthier AND to give dancers the tools they need to advocate for and take care of themselves mentally and physically.
Wendy is a wealth of knowledge - our conversation ranged from finding your unique career path based on your values to the importance of strength training for dancers. Her approach is so holistic and always comes back to the human inside the dancer. As you can probably tell, Wendy totally speaks my language and I loved having her on the podcast!
Key Moments:
- Early dance training [2:10]
- What led her to attending college for dance at NYU Tisch [5:28]
- Wendy’s advice to help you figure out what’s right for you as a dancer [9:21]
- Wendy’s transition from student to professional [17:56]
- How Wendy sustained a professional freelance dance career for 20 years [22:19]
- The injuries that jump-started her work as a personal trainer [24:59]
- What dancers need to know about strength training and where they can get started [28:26]
- How dancers can incorporate strength training into their routine [36:10]
- The biggest challenges dancers are currently facing [38:49]
- Her biggest piece of advice for dancers pursuing a career [45:35]
Connect with Wendy:
WENDY’S WEBSITE: Wendyreinert.com
ON BEING A DANCER: Beingadancer.com
INSTAGRAM: https://instagram.com/onbeingadancer
Links and Resources:
Get your copy of The Intentional Career Handbook
Get your copy of The Ultimate Audition Guide
Let’s connect!
My WEBSITE: thebrainyballerina.com
INSTAGRAM: instagram.com/thebrainyballerina
1-1 CAREER MENTORING: book your complimentary career call
Questions/comments? Email me at [email protected]
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Transcript
Introduction to Dance Paths and Personal Values
00:00:00
Speaker
There's no one way to do this thing, especially now more than ever with freelance just being the way you kind of have to make a living. There's so many options. I was really grateful to be shown something else and to be given the opportunity to find another way. It's not just either do this thing or quit. It's pick a path. You know, the the idea that there are infinite paths to being a dancer is for some really, really, really daunting.
00:00:29
Speaker
And for some is really, really liberating, right? It just depends on your personality. It depends on your values. And it depends on how much you're willing to really look at, well, what do I want? What's important to me? And to be able to choose your path based off of what you value.
Introducing 'The Brainy Ballerina' Podcast
00:00:50
Speaker
I'm Caitlin, a former professional ballerina turned dance educator and career mentor. And this is the brand new ballerina podcast. I am here for the aspiring professional ballerina who wants to learn what it really takes to build a smart and sustainable career in the dance industry. I'm peeling back the curtain of professional dance world with open and honest conversations about the realities of becoming a professional dancer. Come along to gain the knowledge and inspiration you need and succeed in a dance career on your turns.
00:01:24
Speaker
Hello and welcome to the Brainy Valorina podcast.
Guest Introduction: Wendy Reinerts
00:01:27
Speaker
I'm your host, Caitlin Sloan, and I am joined today by Wendy Reinerts. Wendy is a retired professional dancer, aerialist, strength coach, life coach, world traveler, amateur rock climber, and toddler mom. Her mission is to make the dance world easier and healthier and to give dancers the tools they need to advocate for and take care of themselves mentally and physically.
00:01:49
Speaker
Wendy is the founder of Being a Dancer, a platform dedicated to helping dancers navigate the emotional challenges of the dance industry. As you can probably tell from this intro, she absolutely speaks my language and I cannot wait to share all of her knowledge
Wendy's Dance Journey Begins
00:02:02
Speaker
with you today. Hi, Wendy. Hi, Caitlin. I'm so excited to be here. I'm thrilled. And I would love to just start from the very beginning. Why did you take your very first dance class? Because my parents put me in class at their racquetball club. There happened to be a class on a day they wanted to go to the gym. And so they put me in a ballet class. I can definitely resonate as a parent of a toddler, or two small children. I really resonate with Yeah, like, okay, I want to do this thing. And this timing works out. And, and here you go. Yeah, I feel really fortunate. It worked out really well. I clearly loved it from the first class. I never stopped. Yes. What was your training like growing up?
00:02:44
Speaker
Pretty classic ah story. I started in a what we affectionately call a Dolly Dingle school. Ballet, tap and jazz, sequins and feathers. ah And mind you, this was back in the 80s, so it was a long time ago. By the time I was eight, I really knew that I was taking to ballet. And by the time I was 13, that's all I wanted to do was ballet. I still took a little jazz here and there. but By 13, I was pretty heavily into the bunhead pink tights and pointe shoes world. And then when you graduated from high school, you chose to go to college for dance and you got your BFA from Tisch.
Expanding Beyond Ballet
00:03:23
Speaker
So how did you decide to take that path? I kind of had a roundabout way going to college because I was such a little bunhead. I did all of the ballet summer programs. I did Joffrey Ballet, I did Boston Ballet.
00:03:35
Speaker
I grew up in Saratoga Springs, too, for anybody who doesn't know that's the summer home of New York City Ballet. And back then, City Ballet would spend a month every summer in Saratoga. So I was exposed to that kind of dance. I was exposed to ballet. My training was very Balanchine growing up. But by the time I was sort of 14, 15, 16 in my home studios, I wasn't a favorite. And I could see all the other girls kind of getting more attention. They had better legs and better feet and I was just starting by age 16 to be like, ah okay, but this is not the right place for me. I need something different. At one of my summer programs at Boston Ballet, I was talking to another girl who went to a boarding school for dance. And I had already checked out all the boarding schools on the East Coast, the Walnut Hill, the North Carolina School of the Arts, all of the ones that were close here. And she went to one in California.
00:04:28
Speaker
And she was like, well, the academics are great. The training is great. You should come. Long story short, I ended up at Idlewild Arts Academy in Southern California on top of a hill in the middle of nowhere. It was the first time that I kind of looked in the mirror and also had teachers that believed in me and supported me and told me that I should be a modern dancer. That I had the storytelling and the stage presence to do something other than classical ballet.
00:04:55
Speaker
And that kind of coincided with a time when I had to realize, okay, I don't have banana feet. I don't have 180 degree turnout. And while those things I feel like are even less of a factor today than they were 20 years ago, that was good for me to hear. And it was good for me to have those teachers who were like, there's another option for you.
00:05:13
Speaker
And I think you could be good at it. Before that, I didn't really have teachers telling me, you're good at this. That year to this day, it was only my senior year of high school that I went to Idlewild. And that year to this day remains the single most life changing year because they're the, the teachers who told me, here's more for you. So that's what kind of led me to going to NYU Tisch. At that same time that I was auditioning for colleges, I was auditioning for companies as well.
00:05:40
Speaker
like you do when you're a ballerina because I wasn't quite ready to just give it up completely. So I auditioned for some companies here and there, but I really quickly realized as soon as I visited NYU, I was like, Oh no, this is where I should be. That's super interesting. I think that a lot of dancers go through that period of discovery and just figuring out that maybe what you thought you wanted.
Challenging Classical Ballet Ideals
00:06:00
Speaker
We put being a classical ballet dancer on this pedestal is like, that is the most elite thing you could do.
00:06:07
Speaker
That's what you should reach for. We get so wrapped up in that, that we don't even stop to ask ourselves if it's what we really do want to do or what we'd be most happy doing. Because we think like, the Coney Modern answer is selling out. You know, we couldn't make it. We couldn't hack it as a ballet dancer. So we're going to go this path when really they're all amazing art forms, all so valid. And it's just finding the one that is the best for you.
00:06:28
Speaker
Yeah, I completely agree. And I think there's no one way to do this thing, especially now more than ever with freelance just being the way you kind of have to make a living. There's so many options. I was really grateful to be shown something else and to be given the opportunity to find another way. It's not just either do this thing or quit. It's pick a path. You know, the the idea that there are infinite paths to being a dancer.
00:06:56
Speaker
is for some really really really daunting and for some is really really liberating right it just depends on your personality it depends on your values and it depends on how much you're willing to really look at well what do i want what's important to me and to be able to choose your path based off of what you value that was a really pivotal moment for me because growing up as a ballerina i had seen so many friends with eating disorders and various other ailments and challenges. And I remember watching them and going, why do they have an eating disorder and not me? Or why do they have challenges with their body image and not me? What's the difference here? And even at age 15, I was already kind of aware that it doesn't have to be this way.
00:07:48
Speaker
And again, you know, that was mid nineties, mid to late nineties, that it was still at a different time than now when no one was kind of asking those questions. Resources were not available. I didn't know how to help my friends with eating disorders, but I remember saying, how can this be different? Just remembering that now for myself and going back and thinking about the reasons that I made the choices that I did at that time of my life, my guiding force was always.
Aligning Career with Personal Values
00:08:15
Speaker
because I wanted to dance. With that one guiding force, I was able to make decisions that kept me dancing, whether that was going to Idlewild or NYU or choosing Modern Over Ballet. I just wanted to keep dancing. That was what meant something to me. I wish for more dancers to be able to do that, right? To use their own voice as their guiding light, rather than what Dance Magazine says as, this is a successful dancer. Yep.
00:08:43
Speaker
I feel like that is some of the biggest questions I get, you know, if I post a question box on Instagram or I put it out there, what questions do you have people always want to know? What are the best summer intensives? Am I good enough to be at answer? What do I need to do? And it's like, there's no way to answer those questions. There is no best summer intensive. Yes, there's probably one that is going to be better for you right now, depending on your goals.
00:09:04
Speaker
But I can't just like give a blanket statement like this is the best summer intensive because that's very subjective. And it's very dependent on what you want to do with your career and what your next step is even. And so it's really easy as a young dancer, a teenager to kind of get so wrapped up in like, I need someone to tell me what I i should do. So I'm curious, what advice do you give to dancers? Because I know you work with dancers in every spectrum. What advice do you give to them to help them start to shift into that brain space of Let's figure out what's right for you versus this is what everyone's telling you you should do. I always, always, always start with values. It's not my place to decide what's best for you, right? And it's not my place to give you advice. I know that that's what dancers want. They want to be told what to do. But I think it's so important to ask the dancer the questions that gets them to their own advice. And so that always, for me, starts with well what's important.
00:10:01
Speaker
Let's dive into your core values. You don't know what core values are. Great. Let's start there. And we do visualizations and questions and journaling and all of that kind of stuff, because if you don't know those things, then it just kind of leads you to fighting against yourself. You accept a job or choose a company and suddenly you're two, three, four, five years in with that company and you're going, wait, why does this not feel right? And then you can kind of step back and go, oh, right. Well.
00:10:31
Speaker
this company's values are not aligned with my values. A really great example of that is if you value in yourself autonomy, artistic license, and freedom, you probably don't want to get a job as a racquet, right? like And again, that's not to say you can't go after racquets if you value autonomy and artistic freedom, but it's just something to keep in mind, right? That if you want the collaboration and creativity and then you take a job that is precision dance where your job is to look like the 20 other people in line with you, then there might be a part of you that leaves that job feeling a little bit unfulfilled. Again, not to say you can't do it, but there's gonna be a reason at the end that you're like, huh, something was missing. And so that's when you have to seek other ways to honor those same values so that you can continue doing those jobs if you want to.
00:11:28
Speaker
or make a different choice for next season. That's a really good point. Your job doesn't have to provide everything that you're looking for. You can decide that I want, like, I want to be a raw cat, but I also need this creative
Balancing Career and Personal Fulfillment
00:11:40
Speaker
outlet. So I'm going to maybe start my own side thing in the off season and get together with friends and choreograph something or whatever it is, like knowing that all the different values, you can find it in different places. It doesn't have to all come from your career. And I think the answers get so wrapped up in having to have everything they want in their career. And that's not to say that you shouldn't be searching for a job that makes you happy and fulfilled. I really believe in that. But it can also leave you feeling lost because ultimately, if you want to be in a company where someone's hiring you, there is going to be a limit to your autonomy. There is going to be a limit to how much of it is yours and what is really just someone telling you that that's what they want to see. And that's part of the job.
00:12:23
Speaker
finding that elsewhere. Like for me, I started my business partially because I was craving some autonomy and I wanted something that was mine that I could have control of and that I could make choices for and decide how I wanted to run it. And then I can go into other environments where I don't have that and I'm okay with it because I know I have it in other places. Yeah, exactly. And I think one thing that I like to remind dancers is your values, your deep core values don't really change all that much over time, but what you need to honor them can change. based on your life circumstances, who's around you, that kind of thing. Just to use the pandemic as an example, if one of your values is movement and you need to move every day, and it used to be pre-pandemic that moving every day meant taking daily ballet class, and then suddenly you're in the pandemic, you can't meet that value in the same way your need changes. And so you have to kind of reassess. There has to be a self-awareness and an understanding of what that means for you and how to Not judge yourself for feeling a certain way, but to get a little curious and to say, okay, I'm not feeling great. What does that mean? What do I need to change right now? And how can I do that and still stay true to myself? Having those conversations with yourself, I think are more important than anything. And as dancers, we just get so set on, I have to do what I'm told. I have to follow this path. My teacher told me to do this. And so I'm going to do this. And we have to just allow space for more.
00:13:49
Speaker
Yeah, and I think that is true. A lot of the way we train, especially in ballet, there is not a lot of room for questioning things or for even making our own choices. As a ballet dancer, Graham, I really thrived in that environment. I thrived in a place where that was like, there is a right and a wrong way to do a time deal.
00:14:07
Speaker
It wasn't kind of wishy washy. It was very straightforward. And I felt like I could achieve that. i'm I'm an achiever. And so to me, that felt really good. And then I remember like when I was getting to college age and I would go to all my college editions, they'd ask for improv. And I was like, Oh, no.
00:14:22
Speaker
No, no, that's not for me, right? Because I wanted someone to tell me what to do. And I still to an extent like that in some scenarios. And I think realizing that there's some scenarios where I do want to have more control over things and somewhere I'm not saying I'm giving away my control, but I'm okay with being like, this is the job and that feels good for me. And so again, I think it's just a lifelong practice of And reassessing, like you said, where you are now and what needs to shift because you can get in this mode of every day starts to feel monotonous and you do the same things. And then something happens
Defining Success through Core Values
00:14:56
Speaker
like the pandemic, where it just shakes you to your core, everything's different all of a sudden. And it doesn't always have to take something as big as that. So even in our daily practice, we have to keep assessing these things, coming back to am I still meeting my values?
00:15:09
Speaker
If I've been feeling kind of off, if something's not feeling right, okay, well, what have I been missing? What am I not doing? What's not aligned in my values right now and what do I need to fulfill? And is it a job shift? Is it making sure I'm actually doing my hobbies or spending time with my family or the things that actually, you know, fill my cup in that way? So that's really something that dancers need to always come back to.
00:15:32
Speaker
There is so much dancers need to learn as they pursue a professional dance career. It can be completely overwhelming. Where do you even start? With your intention. To me, this is the first step in defining success on your terms. Once you have an intention for your career based on your core values, you can begin to hone in on a strategy to make your goals a reality. But without it, you will always feel out of alignment, out of control, and ultimately unfulfilled in your career.
00:16:02
Speaker
So how do you figure out what success means to you? With the Brainy Ballerina Intentional Career Handbook. This is not just your ordinary book. The intentional career handbook walks you through it everything you need to think about as you embark on your dance career. With over 50 guided question prompts, you will dive deep into determining what really matters to see you in a dance career based on your individual core values. By the end of this handbook, you will not only be crystal clear on your goals, but in the mindset you need to make it happen. Tap the link in the show notes to download your copy today and start pursuing your dance career with intention.
00:16:41
Speaker
You're absolutely right. I mean, this idea of there's a right and a wrong in ballet, it's kind of a chicken and the egg question. Like, is the perfectionist drawn to ballet or does the ballet make you a perfectionist? it's It's just
Transition to Professional Dance
00:16:52
Speaker
so common. I mean, every single dancer I work with identifies as a perfectionist to some extent. I remember one of my Balanchine teachers, the late Michael Steele, he used to say, tendu front is tendu front and all other 359 options are wrong.
00:17:05
Speaker
And we loved that, right? We wanted to get that precision. And that's not to say you can't do that, right? That's not to say you can't achieve, you can't strive, you can't work to improve, but you also have to know that there's more than just that. And that there is a human under those tendus and that there's a person there who needs to be fulfilled also. And if achievement is something that fulfills you, great, fine, keep achieving, and also recognize there's more. There are values and beliefs and interests that go beyond making those perfect movements, and that's not what makes you a good person. I'm curious what your transition from student to professional was like. Oh, gosh. It was intense, but it was also
00:17:53
Speaker
somehow smooth at the same time. I was preparing myself already in college by, I worked through college. I had a couple of jobs. So I already knew how to work and manage a crazy heavy dance load. When I got into the professional dance world, because I went from and NYU and what we all kind of did from and NYU out into the professional world was you just start freelancing. You know, I had ideas of companies I wanted to get into, but my friends and colleagues from NYU were all making work. And so.
00:18:23
Speaker
It was a pretty seamless transition to say, okay, let me dance for you. Okay. Oh, you have a gig coming up. Great. Cool. You need a dancer? And not that I got paid very much for those sorts of things. For me, I kind of knew that I wanted to do jobs that allowed me to focus my time and energy on dancing. And so within a week of graduating, I was this girl. I went up to every single one of my teachers at and NYU the week before graduation. And I was like,
00:18:53
Speaker
Hey, I'm about to graduate. I need a job. Do you have any jobs for me? And but one of them hooked me up with her husband who worked in catering. So I started catering within a you know a month or so of graduation. Another one said, oh, you know what? I actually know someone who needs a personal assistant. Here's her number. And so I just was able to like work the charm. I don't know if it's charm or if it's desperation.
00:19:23
Speaker
to just jump into jobs pretty quickly. I also knew that I would have my family support, but I wouldn't have 100% financial support. And we'd had that conversation as well. You know, I'd already been working through college, so I already knew that some of the financial responsibility was on me before I graduated. By the time I graduated, I sort of knew like my parents would help me out with a phone bill, but they were not gonna be able to pay my entire rent. They also made it very clear to me when I graduated that I had to have health insurance. I think now kids can stay on their parents plan to 26. That was not the case when I graduated. So my parents basically and I am so thankful for them for making this this clear. They said your health insurance will be paid before your rent. If you pay your health insurance and you can't afford your rent, you can move back home, but you will have health insurance.
00:20:14
Speaker
And I'm so grateful for that because health insurance is super important, especially for dancers. You know, I kind of started piecing all those things together. I i had one teacher tell me that I had an overdeveloped sense of responsibility, um which at the time I wasn't sure if it was a compliment or not. Now I take it as a deep, deep, deep compliment. And she's someone who had such a huge impasse on me, the late Kate Cummings. I knew I wanted to do it. I knew I wanted to be a dancer. And there for me, there was no other option.
00:20:42
Speaker
I knew that I could choose jobs that gave me the flexibility so that I could stay in ballet class four and five days a week and just audition. And, you know, I opted for catering over a restaurant job because catering I worked for three or four or five different catering companies. But if I said no to a job.
00:21:02
Speaker
I had no responsibility to my coworkers. It was the company's responsibility to fill me in, right? So I had a little bit less responsibility to the company itself, but I still got paid really well. I could take jobs whenever I wanted. And so, and I didn't have to worry about covering my own shifts. If I couldn't make it, it was no, like it was just no big deal. And so that was really important to me that at the end of the day, even though I was working 10, 12, sometimes 15 hour catering shifts,
00:21:30
Speaker
It left me the energy to dance the next day. That really worked for me. So I pieced together a whole bunch of different paying jobs like that. I was a personal assistant. I was a babysitter and I took class, you know, and I i just, I knew that that was really important to me. I knew that that was my own grounding as a dancer in my entire career. I was i' loved taking class, bopped around from audition to audition as a freelancer. I worked with friends. I did the hustle and I loved the hustle.
00:21:59
Speaker
It really worked for me. And you danced for 20 years as a freelance dancer in New York city. So I'm curious, how did you sustain your career for so long?
00:22:11
Speaker
I don't know. I don't know. I like to think it was passion. I like to think it was maybe just dumb luck. I don't know. I went in and out of loving my career, right? I had a lot of self-doubt. I had a lot of the perfectionistic, I'm not good enough with every single audition cut. I had my dream companies and it was definitely hard, but it was also really wonderful.
00:22:35
Speaker
I danced with a lot of small companies that people may or may not have heard of, like Peridance Ensemble, I danced with Sherilyn Lavignino, I danced with Kun Young Lin, who's now based in Philadelphia. I danced with the Metropolitan Opera for 10 seasons. I was a supplementary dancer for six seasons with Mark Morris Dance Group, so I had a lot of really wonderful jobs, and I was always surrounded with really wonderful dancers.
The Supportive Freelance Dance Community
00:22:57
Speaker
And I think that in the freelance scene in New York City, just by taking classes, you feel like you're a part of something. You see the same people, a lot of dancers teach different classes. And so it just always felt like a community that I was very much a part of, even if I wasn't actively performing in anything. There were definitely times that I very self-deprecatingly said ah things like, well, I'm perpetually in between jobs or I'm a professional class taker. when I had those months of downtime, when I wasn't performing a lot. But I wouldn't change it, you know, because I learned so much. It's hard and it's also wonderful. I feel really fortunate that I allowed my choices to fuel me, and like we talked about before, and not just as a dancer. After a few years of catering, I realized that I just couldn't cater anymore. I was diagnosed with my first two injuries in the same day that were really affecting my ability to stand on my feet.
00:23:56
Speaker
for all my catering shifts and kind of serendipitously within about two or three weeks of getting those injury diagnoses. I ran into a friend who said, Hey, the Equinox I work at is looking for personal trainers. Like I was able to just kind of allow my career both in the studio and out of the studio to ebb and flow.
00:24:22
Speaker
with the people that I met and just being a part of the New York City dance community and staying completely open-minded, not being so specific on a goal that I put the blinders on. And so I was able to kind of listen to the things that were happening around me to help point me towards a direction and start setting myself up back then for what I
Becoming a Strength Coach
00:24:46
Speaker
do now. And I think that that really made a big difference for me.
00:24:49
Speaker
Yeah, I want to hear more about that, about your transition into being a straight trainer. And I know you do lots of things, but specifically that, you know, one area of your work, was that what started your journey was those injuries? Yeah, growing up, I was always the strong one, the one who jumped in when someone else was injured. I would, you know, I remember learning pieces within a day to be on stage that night, because someone else got injured. So I was always the strong, strong, strong one. When these first two injuries happened, it was a tibial stress fracture and a labral tear in my hip were diagnosed in the same doctor's appointment the same day. I think that was 2007. And that was the same time that I transitioned to being a personal trainer. It was really great. It was really good timing for me to have a job like that, to be surrounded all the time by non-dancers who were also really smart, really talented, really athletic, really good at what they did.
00:25:42
Speaker
Because these are the things that we we are with dancers all the time and we get so used to being around really smart, really driven people. And it can feel like, well, only dancers are like that. And so being in a gym setting with these other really awesome, intelligent people really changed my world and changed my perspective on life and being a dancer. And I was still very heavily embedded in my dance career at the time. So I wasn't necessarily at that point thinking about How can strength training help dancers? It was, I'm a strength trainer for non-dancers so that I can be a dancer. I had these things very, very separate actually for many, many years, probably for a good eight years. I really kept them very separate from each other. As a trainer, I was i worked at a gym for about four years, maybe just under four years.
00:26:34
Speaker
And when I left the gym, I trained privately and I worked with non dancers only, and I held a private personal training business since 2011. And it was like a kind of a slow burn to realize, right, I should do this for dancers. We need this too. I would have benefited from this. Cause that's the other piece of my story is that those first two injuries weren't my only ones. I've had so many other injuries since then. I've had three orthopedic surgeries. And so, you know, my entire path through my dance career and
00:27:10
Speaker
my professional career as as a person. It was all fueled by the things that happened to me with injuries and with auditions and you know jobs and everything. and It's all a part of the story, right? I feel like a lot of dancers are nervous about strength training. Personally, as a dancer, I didn't know what to do. and I was told pretty consistently throughout my career that I needed to lose weight. and so Strength training made me very scared. People always say, oh, if you strength train, you're gonna get bulky. And I was like, well, I'm already getting this feedback, so I can't do that. I would just be like, I'm gonna go walk on the treadmill. I don't know what to do. Nothing that was helpful for me, really. At that time, right, I was getting a good amount of cardio. Like it was not something that was really helping me achieve the goals I wanted to achieve and actually be strong.
Strength Training for Dancers: Myths and Realities
00:27:56
Speaker
What do the answers need to know about strength training and where can they start? Yeah, that's a great question. It frustrates me.
00:28:04
Speaker
to hear stories like that. I mean, it still happens that dancers are told they need to lose weight. And I know you just had the discussion about the the and now infamous article about how it's the female dancer's responsibility to maintain her weight. Strength training does not make you bulk up, period. Strength training makes a person bulk up only in tandem with a very, very, very specific strength training schedule and routine.
00:28:34
Speaker
and a very, very, very specific nutrition plan. So if you don't have the very specific strength training routine and the very specific nutrition plan, you are not going to bulk up when you strength train period like that. I just want to say that, that black and white, because I want dancers to really hear it.
00:28:55
Speaker
I grew up doing Pilates. I started doing Pilates when I was 13 years old as injury prevention. This was long before it was trendy. This was the mid nineties. There was one person who was doing Pilates in my town. And I credit that for my earlier years of not getting injured and sticking to Pilates and it was really great. But there comes a point when Pilates and bands are just not enough because they don't build strength in the same way that lifting weight does.
00:29:24
Speaker
Again, that's something that I think is harder for dancers to hear because a modality like Pilates or gyrotonic or yoga, that the shapes are more familiar to a dancer's body, right? You get to point your leg, you get to reach an arabesque and do lots of beautiful lines and extensions, which is wonderful. I don't want anybody to think I'm knocking on Pilates. I love Pilates, but part of the fear is, okay, let's take a squat. Let's parallel your legs. Let's bend your knees. Let's stick your butt out and squat to the ground, not stay perfectly upright like you do in a grand plie. No, we're not going to lift our leg in extension with our toes pointed. In fact, I'm going to make you flex your foot and bend your knee. I'm asking you to do things that you wouldn't do in the dance studio.
00:30:08
Speaker
because the shapes in functional strength training, the shapes that our body makes are the shapes that our skeleton is built to make. And our skeleton is not built to do dance shapes. So if you want to get stronger in a dance shape, your foundation has to be stronger. And the way that you strengthen your foundation is in your functional movement patterns, your squat, your deadlift, your pushing and your pulling.
00:30:36
Speaker
And then once you're stronger there, it automatically translates into your dancing. And you don't have to think about it, right? If you can lift a certain amount of weight when you're on two feet, your skeleton is ready for it, your body is ready for it. Then when you go to jump and land on one leg, you're that much stronger.
00:30:58
Speaker
If you haven't done strength training, it's hard to realize like, well, I don't understand how that would translate but because it does feel just so different. I find that it's hard to get dancers to start it, but once they do, they're like, Oh, I get it. I get it. I had a dancer who we were working on an overhead press and she came back to me, I don't know, a week or two later and said, you know, ever since we started overhead pressing,
00:31:28
Speaker
I feel my core in a way that I never have felt before because that's how your core is meant to engage, right? Lifting weight over your head. Then you can actually feel those muscles and you know you can do all the Pilates in the world and you might be able to feel that, but it works in a different way. And when you feel it, you realize, oh, this is really important. This is really important.
00:31:51
Speaker
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00:32:19
Speaker
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00:32:36
Speaker
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00:33:00
Speaker
Yeah, and I think as dancers, we are so trained to look at the aesthetics, right? We're looking in the mirror all day. We're looking at our lines. We want everything to look good. And we are not very comfortable with something, how something feels. We don't always think about how it feels. And if we're doing strength training, and we might look in the mirror and be like, this doesn't look pretty. If you ever are doing core work, you maybe are looking for a specific look of your core. Like you want a six pack instead of how functional it is and how it's going to help you do your dancing. And I think that is,
00:33:31
Speaker
definitely a bridge that can be tough to cross because you're like, well, what if I do this move and it doesn't look pretty? And then it ruins my lines. And like you said, that's not going to happen. That's another misconception too, about any exercise modality. You know, we talk about in ballet class and in, I've even had Pilates instructors say things like, if you do this exercise this way, it'll lengthen your muscles. so But actually that's not the way the muscles work. Your muscles are the shape that they are.
00:34:00
Speaker
through genetics, through structure, through various other things. And we can't actually, just by stretching, make our muscles get longer. like they just doesn't It doesn't work, right? And I think dancers are after a certain aesthetic and a certain line, but there has to be an understanding of what we can actually change about our body and what we simply can't.
00:34:24
Speaker
The gym that I work out of actually doesn't have any mirrors on the strength floor and I'm so grateful that it doesn't because I don't want that to be a part of it. And I do a lot of queuing that is what are you noticing here? What do you feel working? Where in your body are you experiencing this? And I think that that's the thing that is more important. I wish more dance studios would get rid of their mirrors. Wouldn't that be so lovely?
00:34:46
Speaker
ah I also want us to come away from this idea that dance is an aesthetic art. When we use that word, it automatically implies you have to be skinny to do this. I actually don't care what you look like at all. and I say this to my my dancers all the time, your body shape, your body size, your proportionate, I do not care about any of that. What matters to me is that you feel strong, you feel healthy, you feel safe in your body and in your movements.
00:35:15
Speaker
And so whatever you're doing, if you have a crazy partnering skill that involves you having one leg bent and one leg straight and a person over your head or hand behind your head, I want you to feel safe and confident in those extreme shapes so that you're not going to hurt yourself. That's what's important to me. And if you feel safe and confident and healthy in making those positions,
00:35:37
Speaker
That's all that matters. Ideally, a dancer who wants to start strength training would hopefully be able to work with someone like you or another strength trainer, especially someone who understands dancers and what we specifically need. But I also know that a lot of dancers, I experience this myself. Our salaries are not super high, and I don't think I could have afforded work when I'm on with someone necessarily when I was professionally dancing. Not everyone has access to that. So for a dancer who's like, I really want to incorporate some strength training safely on my own. Is there a way they can do that? Yeah, it's starting with the basics. It's thinking about the four main functional movement patterns, squat, hinge, push, pull, you can get into lunging and things like that too. But starting with the absolute basics, and there's so many resources out there. Now I know there's plenty of apps and and people who have apps and various other online programs that are really great. I do think that if you're just
00:36:35
Speaker
Starting with strength training, having eyes on you at least once or twice is super, super, super important. I'm not one of those trainers who wants you to work with me three days a week for the rest of your life. I really work in my sessions to educate you to be able to do this on your own. Learn just enough that you can apply this to your dancing. I also don't think that dancers need to drop everything else and only strength training.
00:37:05
Speaker
Right. One or two or three exercises really well placed each week that actually are specifically chosen to help you reach your goals. That's all you need. You don't need to suddenly become a gym rat and be at the gym three and four days a week. It's not the case, but I do think that the intention of the exercises you're choosing is what's really important.
00:37:25
Speaker
What are your goals? What do you want to get stronger at? you know If that's something that you can do on your own, by all means, there are tons of resources out there. Learn how to squat. This is the other thing about dancers. Dancers are really great at mimicking movement, I like to say. right You can see someone doing a movement and you can mimic that in your own body. Most of us are really great at that.
00:37:46
Speaker
Find someone who looks like they're doing a really good squat. Watch them squat and see if you can feel that in your own body. And if you can't, if something feels off, then, you know, seek the help of someone. Get those one-on-one eyes on you, especially if you want to progress it and do so safely. You have to make sure your form is really good, but there are plenty of ways to do that.
00:38:03
Speaker
That's a really good point. you know It's not black and white. It's not like do it all on your own or completely go all in and have, like you said, a strength trainer one-on-one session three times a week. You could maybe schedule a few introductory sessions, outline your goals, and get a plan moving forward that you can do. And I think that it's more accessible for a lot of dancers. So I like that you said that. I know you work with so many dancers in so many different areas.
00:38:26
Speaker
emotionally, physically, mentally, all the things. What do you notice are the biggest hurdles that dancers are facing today? Gosh, that the dance world is just hard. The dance world is not set up for us to succeed. And i I'm using air quotes around that right now. It's all of it. You're not just a mind and you're not just a body.
Integrating Coaching for Mind and Body
00:38:46
Speaker
And you have to take care of both your mind and your body and you have to recognize when one is starting to take over. And this is something that I learned as I was going to coaching school actually, that felt a little like a, an aha moment for me when I was going through that program was that I always assumed I'm a dancer. Of course I know my body. Of course I pay attention to my body. Of course I, I'm listening to my body and what it's telling me. And I had a really big aha moment where I went, Oh no, no, you're not at all Wendy.
00:39:22
Speaker
Your mind is telling your body what it thinks your body should be able to do. And your mind is saying, Hey, come on, body work harder. Come on, body. Keep pushing. Come on. That doesn't hurt that much. Keep going. Keep pushing. And it was a real like, Oh, I'm not listening to my body at all. And I think that that for me was really huge.
00:39:46
Speaker
And that's a part of why I've brought my coaching work and my training work so much closer together with the work that I do with dancers. And a lot of people ask me how I differentiate the coaching and the training and really the answer is I don't anymore. The work that I do as a trainer, I'm addressing all of those things. And I'm addressing it in the way that I hear dancers say, well, am I doing this wrong? What am I doing wrong here? Am I sticking my rib cage out? What am I doing? What do I need to fix?
00:40:14
Speaker
Right? This idea that we're constantly trying to fix ourselves, that there's something wrong with us because that's how we've been trained since we were five years old to fix, to change, to shift, to improve, to give corrections. I need all the corrections. My teacher gives me corrections. Whenever I hear that kind of language coming out, I have to stop and say, listen, there's nothing wrong with you. You're not doing anything wrong here. We can make this slight adjustment and it's going to feel more efficient. It's going to feel healthier and safer in your body. Doesn't mean you were doing wrong before.
00:40:43
Speaker
But there's little things in our language and in the way we talk to ourselves that make such a huge difference. There's things that are just so deeply embedded into our ballet culture of the way we do things. It's starting to change now. I just had a dancer recently in ah in a workshop ask about how she can make sure that she's not doing that for her students. And I was like,
00:41:07
Speaker
Yes, yes, absolutely. So, you know, it's already starting, right? I've heard you talk about this with other folks. With Jennifer Milner, I've been listening to your podcast about how we have become the person we needed when we're that age. and I mean, that's why I got into this. That's why I started being a dancer in the first place. That's why I decided to start training dancers. I don't want dancers to leave this industry feeling harmed in any way, mentally or physically. And that's really the bottom line.
00:41:36
Speaker
There's no reason for this world to damage us.
Critiquing Traditional Dance Practices
00:41:40
Speaker
Yeah, it's very hard. I think for those of us who love the art forum and also see the harm and the frustration I feel all the time with a lot of people still believe it has to be this way. It's just an inherent, it's just part of it. And if you want to be a great artist, if you want to be a high achiever, if you want to reach top of your career, there's going to be a certain amount of harm.
00:42:00
Speaker
Yes, we're all going to face things that are hard. That's real, but we don't have to make it harder on people just to prove a point or just because it was hard for us. And I think you see it kind of going one of two ways. People kind of go to the spectrum of like, it was how I was trained and it worked for me. And even though it was maybe harmful, I'm going to keep doing that. And then there's other people who are going in this other direction of like, that wasn't okay. And I want to do something different.
00:42:26
Speaker
I know personally when I first started teaching, I definitely trended toward that this is how I was trained because that's all I knew and I had great training and I have a lot of really great experiences for my training that I do still keep. And then there are some things that I do not abide by anymore because you start actually thinking about to wrap back around to the beginning, does this align with my values? Do I believe this? Do I think this is actually helpful or true and realizing that you you can decide which things you want to keep and which things were helpful and good and which things are not and make a change. I keep meeting more and more people like you out there. We don't want to see the art form die because it's so harmful. We want our form to thrive and survive and keep going into the future. So what can we do to make it better? Yeah.
00:43:10
Speaker
It's hard because those years, you know, when we're 12 to 16 are really, really, really formative. And so the things that people tell us when we're 13, 14, 15, it sticks with you for your entire life. And it takes effort when that voice pops into your head, when you're 20, 25, 30, 35 to say, wait, wait, that was something that was told to me when I was 15. And I no longer need to believe that.
00:43:39
Speaker
And I see it in so many of my students now that I work with that are still listening to that voice. That's the first thing that we identify is like, hey, what's that voice telling you? Is that relevant now? Absolutely not. but Cool. Thank you for teaching me that then. I no longer need you. ah Bye-bye.
00:43:57
Speaker
And that takes effort and you have to continually do it because there are things that just get stuck in our brains, right? And we have to just keep having those conversations. And again, I said it earlier, without the self judgment, right? We can't judge ourselves for these things. We can't turn it in on our self worth. We have to just be able to say, Oh, oh, I hear you. I'm not listening to you today. Thanks. Yeah.
00:44:22
Speaker
easier said than done. of course Exactly. Like we've said, this is ah a lifelong in practice. And it is easy to like as dancers to where we go back to those perfectionist tendencies, and we want to be good at everything. And so if I'm having a bad self talk day, it's like, oh, you're so bad at good self talk, you know, you can just like we just ah and i'm I totally agree. It's like that practice has really helped to me as well of learning that skill of I know why you're doing this and you're trying to keep me safe brain and this baby was something I needed to know before but it's not helping me now and verbalizing that is a really powerful tool all for dancers to use and for everyone to use. Absolutely. I would love to hear if you could give aspiring professional dancers one piece of advice. What would you tell them? Oh gosh, what are you doing it for? You got to know what you're doing it for.
00:45:12
Speaker
I think that everything comes back to who you are under the dancing. And the more you can honor yourself as a human and dance for that person, whoever that person is, the more fulfilling and happy and joyful your career is going to be. Yeah, that's good advice. And very true. yeah If anyone wants to reach out to you or get in touch with you, how can we find you?
00:45:38
Speaker
Instagram app on being a dancer. I have two separate websites as of right now. Wendy Reiner calm is primarily devoted to training and being a dancer calm is all of my more coaching heavy work, but they kind of link to each other. So find me on social media. Find me online. I'm very easily accessible. And do you work with dancers virtually? or Are you only in person?
00:46:00
Speaker
No, I do virtual and in person. I also do personalized programming. So I do a session and then a program for you to go out and do on your own. So there's a lot of ways that you can work with me. Okay. Perfect.
00:46:13
Speaker
well dancers definitely go check that out. So much like wisdom. i My head's kind of exploding right now with everything that you've shared and said. and One thing I love about doing this podcast is that I am learning just as much as anyone listening. like It's been really great for me to get to learn from all the amazing people like you. So thank you so much, Wendy, for coming on today. I really appreciate it. Thank you for having me. This was awesome.
00:46:37
Speaker
Thank you for tuning into the Brainy Ballerina podcast. If you found this episode insightful, entertaining, or maybe a bit of both, I would so appreciate you taking a moment to leave a rating and hit subscribe. By subscribing, you'll never miss an episode. And you'll join our community of dancers passionate about building a smart and sustainable career in the dance industry. Plus, your ratings help others discover the show too.
00:47:03
Speaker
I'll be back with a new episode next week. In the meantime, be sure to follow along on Instagram at The Brainy Valorina for your daily dose of dance career guidance.