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FF 004 - Manhood in the Church - Part 1
20 Plays9 days ago
Our fatherhood panel welcomes former pastor and friend of the program Mark Blowers as he discusses the importance of masculinity in the church and manhood in general. He also gives a powerful testimony of suffering and his fatherhood journey. The guys discuss church leadership, defining manhood, fear in the body of Christ, and other topics. Enjoy!
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Email us: Jarod@preacherdad.com
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Transcript
Introduction to Fatherhood Friday
00:00:00
Speaker
Hello, everybody. Welcome to the Preacher Dad podcast. My name is Jared, and I am the Preacher Dad. And I'm glad to have you here on our Fatherhood Friday episode. Today, we are discussing manhood and masculinity.
00:00:15
Speaker
And I hope that you are set and ready to go. In this episode, we talk about ah the impact of manhood in the church, the importance of masculinity in the church, a woman's role in the church, a father's role in the home, the dangers of passivity, and we even have a really powerful testimony about the power of suffering to draw us unto Christ. So I hope that you will enjoy this episode, part one of two, and we are going to get started right away. But
Sponsorship and Co-host Introduction
00:00:43
Speaker
I want to remind you that this episode is brought to you by Cornerstone Fellowship. Cornerstone Fellowship is the little church with the big heart.
00:00:51
Speaker
just a little north of Tombsboro, Georgia in the middle of nowhere. But man, we are excited about Jesus. We love him very much. And we would love for you to be a part of that. So come on down and give us a visit.
00:01:02
Speaker
Or you can check us out online at That's cornerstonefellowship-ga.org. We would love to pray for you.
00:01:15
Speaker
Even if you are not ever able to come to our church fellowship, we would love to pray for you. and we do that on a regular basis. So let us know you're out there and God bless you.
00:01:26
Speaker
And now let's get started with Fatherhood Friday.
00:01:40
Speaker
Well, hello, everybody. Welcome to Fatherhood Friday. We are glad you're here. We hope your weekend is starting out well. And we are glad to be with you tonight. I'm Jared and I am the Preacher Dad. I'm the host of the Preacher Dad podcast, which is probably why you found this particular episode.
00:01:59
Speaker
I'm here tonight with my co-host Matt Stewart and Tony Russell. And we are super glad to be here with our friend Mark Blowers. And Mark has had some really unique experiences.
00:02:14
Speaker
in in our friend group. And we are so glad to welcome him today to the Fatherhood Friday podcast. And he's going to be sharing with us today. We're going to talk a little bit about manhood in the church and the importance of biblical masculinity. And we're also going to talk a little bit about maybe some other things if we get to some time.
00:02:38
Speaker
So Mark, we're so glad to have you. Mark is a market researcher in the Richmond area. And we are glad that you're with us tonight. So Mark, tell us a little bit about yourself and your your story.
Mark's Journey to Christianity
00:02:54
Speaker
Yeah, well, um having watched the the the first couple episodes, I know too um to say that I know all of you through the company that shall not be named um as well. I have many...
00:03:10
Speaker
um Many memories with all of you, except for Tony. Tony, I i didn't work as as closely with, but um but Jared, you were you were the one I probably worked ah most closely with there.
00:03:22
Speaker
um and so but But that company um brought us all together in in some form or fashion. Yeah, I meant to mention that, and I forgot. I'm sorry. I slipped my mind.
00:03:34
Speaker
I usually just showed up like a like a phantom of bad news. from time to time at your particular location. it was never a good experience. Not because of you, but just because I had to...
00:03:48
Speaker
Well, we digress. Otherwise, we will never get off that topic, I'm sure. um but We might have to have you back for that episode, Mark. We might have to have back. Yeah. So, Yeah.
00:04:01
Speaker
have a i andher I guess my if I wanted to talk about how I came to ah to know the Lord, um he he saved me and and drew me to himself at a ah at a time in college ah when, you know, he he really didn't use any of the the I guess normal means that you would expect of like, you know, ah ah and evangelist coming to me. It was I said, if I was to ever write a any kind of biography, it would be how.
00:04:34
Speaker
how cancer and death metal and an atheist led me to Christ. And that's a book I'm picking up. i' yeah yeah Yeah, it's it it's just essentially.
00:04:49
Speaker
i i was just I called myself a Christian my whole life and friend of mine who who was an atheist and in college just kind of asked what I would tell my parents if I didn't believe everything in the Bible was true.
00:05:02
Speaker
um And i I had been to church enough and remembered enough to know, well, I would i would never say that, right? A Christian would never say that. And so i I was like, well, I wouldn't say that.
00:05:13
Speaker
You know, i I believe that the Bible was is the word of God. And and that question really ticked me off and made me want to maybe like, why did he ask that? You know, and then it's like, oh, wait, it's because I have no fruit in my life and I have no idea who Christ is. And so I just essentially, um you know, like, like Augustine, just pick up and read is what I did with the Bible. And so I picked it up and I read in, in James about controlling your tongue.
00:05:42
Speaker
And I was in a very legalistic manner. I just said, well, this is what I'm going to do. Then I'm going to control my tongue for you, Lord, and not only for you. And, um and, but, but that led me to, to just reading scripture and um essentially just, you still living my my horrible life um and having no conviction over it. But but eventually I um i ah was listening to a a song by a certain death metal band that's really kind of known for their their hatred of of Christianity. um
00:06:21
Speaker
And the song is called Unanswered. And it essentially is just about how Christians pray to a God who is not there.
00:06:32
Speaker
And so all their prayers go unanswered. And, um and the, the, the refrain of the song is, is where is your God? Where's your God? Where is your effing God?
00:06:45
Speaker
And, and as like, it's, it's one of those moments where it's like, as you know, God shows that moment that as I'm saying those words as well,
00:06:57
Speaker
that's when my mind is flooded with all of the prayers that I had seen ah answered in my life and from my parents' life. and um And I was really just overcome with ah the reality of of my own sinfulness. um and And just from that moment, you know, hinted and I was like, well, I need to find some some new people to associate myself with. And and new music.
00:07:27
Speaker
this is and And some new music. That's right. Oh, no, I thought you were starting a death metal evangelism program at a church now. That's right. Yeah, YouTube music is out of control these days. That's right.
00:07:38
Speaker
That's right. no i So that's that's essentially how I was ah led to the Lord. um and And I met my wife shortly after. when On my way to class at VCU, I would just walk by this tiny little sign that said Student Christian Fellowship.
00:07:59
Speaker
It was just a little yard sign and I would walk by it every day to class. And so I was like, well, I need new friends. I still had my old friends, but it was like, I need people I can actually like do things with other than sin.
00:08:14
Speaker
And so i so I went there and and met, ah they were they were having an end of the year bonfire and I met my,
00:08:24
Speaker
My wife there, she was, my wife, Michelle, was invited to that group as well. and And I just came along and was like, hi, I've been a Christian for five days. You know, what's your name? And ah you know I saw Michelle and I was like, hi, you know, you're you're pretty. Like, you know, let's and and like like so many poor college and, ah you know, ministers out there, he ended up getting a text from me looking for her number and she got a text from He got a text from her asking for, you know, who I was and, and we ended up coming together, but, but we actually, we actually worked out and had been married now for 13 years, June 30th.
00:09:06
Speaker
So, the skins yeah, that's, and, and our, our dating was essentially like, I'm going to Bible studies now, you know, you can come along, you know, you, you're nice company. Yeah.
00:09:20
Speaker
Hey, the girl that says yes to that ask, that's a keeper. Yeah, seriously. The one that says, sure, I'll go to Bible study with you. That's like, oh, yeah. ah That's right. And um so that's that is in a very, very tight nutshell um how how i was I was brought to ah to Christ.
00:09:43
Speaker
And yeah, it's been wonderful. That's great. Well, Mark, you have a... um a unique testimony about fatherhood.
00:09:54
Speaker
I wonder if you'd have time to share a little bit about that with us.
Struggles with Infertility and Theology
00:09:57
Speaker
Yeah, of course. So Michelle and i ah Michelle was, you know, ready to be a mom, like, you know, right after the honeymoon, it's like, all right, let's, you know, and, and that is, and that's wonderful. And we were, you know, being in college, we, we had kind of agreed like, okay, well, let's,
00:10:18
Speaker
let's try to start our family um once we can, you know, kind of have our house. Like like we were we were living with their grandmother in college, and then we lived with my sister in an apartment for a year. And then we we were able to, after I you know started at the the company that shall not be named, um i was able to, ah you know, afford ah building a house out in Bumpus in some land that was gifted to us. And so like after we after three years um of that kind of nomadic marriage living we we were like okay well let's let's start and we really um and and it just wasn't happening you know just like and and really like that really opened up my my eyes to like how much infertility was was just like a thing um and not only that but um but how much you know miscarriages is also just a reality um and how frequently that happens it was really eye-opening to to my
00:11:16
Speaker
24 year old self or whatever it was. And, um, and that was, that was really hard. Uh, that was a really hard time to, to watch my wife have to have to deal with, you know, just this, this burning desire and, ah and I believe a good desire, you know, to, to be a mom and, um, and, and just to not see that happen.
00:11:41
Speaker
And then, um, Lo and behold, you know, we we were we were getting tested and found out, okay, well, the issue was was with me. And, um you know, we even had the the statement of, you know, you may never get pregnant. And, um you know, that's just a thing that could be a reality.
00:12:02
Speaker
and um And then shortly after that, we got pregnant and, you know, celebrated all the the joy of that. um and And the church that we were at at the time, you know, we were talking about, we we were going there and we shared it with all of them and um never really understood why people would would want to hide that, um you know, that that wonderful news. And then, you know, like I said, you don't ever realize the reality of of infertility. Well, then we learned about how frequent miscarriages are as well.
00:12:37
Speaker
and um And at our first ultrasound, we went and it was, you know, but supposed to be this big joyful time and you know just a very unfortunate bedside manner of of the nurse just being like yeah well this is there's no heartbeat you know there's gonna be a miscarriage so you know you might want to just. Chris Wacker, Be able to take care of it very quickly, you know and like just started going into what do you do next, and what are the solutions and we were just you know just kind of just like get by a truck in that and. Chris Wacker, give that go right up right goodness.
00:13:08
Speaker
I know. And, and you do, you know, you understand that sometimes, sometimes that can be good, right? That frankness but with a doctor, it's like, just tell me how it is, right? You know, but, but in that situation, she just did not, she just didn't read the room, you know, and just did not see what's going on. And, um and so that was really unfortunate, but, but, you know, that really helped.
00:13:32
Speaker
It's, it's one of those things where, you know, God works all things together for the good of those who love him Right. and And you can't see it in the moment of how that kind of thing could be worked for good.
00:13:44
Speaker
You can't kind of see you can't see how you can be thankful in that. You can't see anything out of that other than, you know, a blessing that was that was taken. Right. um And, you know, hope for and then and then taken. But, you know, one of the really important things that helped that that God did use that.
00:14:04
Speaker
ah that miscarriage for was shaping, was really shaping and refining our theology around suffering and around God's sovereignty. um That was, because the church that we were going at, I i have, you know, I love, i I love those people and I love all that, but that that's theology was, it did not allow for suffering in a Christian's life.
00:14:28
Speaker
um And it it would not, and And as much as it wanted to to fight against suffering, it kept people in bondage to it.
00:14:39
Speaker
and um and And our miscarriage was really kind of an eye opener to me where where they you know the pastor had asked, like, can I can i talk about this um you know this Sunday? And I said, yeah, that's fine.
00:14:51
Speaker
but But his sermon was very much about how Satan um was exclusively to blame for all of this. and And I remember I listened to it and I just thought, but you know, God does not, one, God does not need a a PR person, but two, like, don't do that to me, right? Like, ah if God is not in this, then I am truly helpless, hopeless, right? Like, then I'm just in the dark alone.
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00:16:14
Speaker
But if God is the sovereign God who lead who led me here, right, as the Holy Spirit led Jesus into the wilderness, then then i can... I can have hope and I can trust. right maybe know i can there's There's going to be light.
00:16:30
Speaker
And and that's you know that's for any trial that anyone's going through. right If it's solely demons or Satan that's under some rock, then then you're just you're just alone. you know And it's like, well, where is God? But no, if God is there, even though I can't see him or or anything else, then then i can I can rest in that.
00:16:53
Speaker
and and but and And that really helped refine just my understanding of, of God's will in suffering. um and And that, and it ultimately um was, was really the, the, the shift in that whole mountain that caused the avalanche in my, my theology to, to change.
00:17:18
Speaker
Yeah. um And some of you, I mean, like, you know, y'all have, witnessed that some of you witnessed that very very closely um and and it's um but but where where you are you today i'm sorry yeah yeah so fatherhood so let me get get there so eventually we were just kind of resting in this and um and it was like okay my wife wants to be a ah mother i need to uh i was was teaching in james at at my church um
00:17:49
Speaker
And I just read that true religion is this, that you care for the widows and the orphans in their time of need. And
Becoming Foster Parents and Adoption
00:17:54
Speaker
it was like, just a light bulb went off of like, well, maybe I can, maybe we can do that, right? Like maybe we can just care for orphans and, you know, my wife will have this fulfillment of a mother for these children who need a mother in this time.
00:18:11
Speaker
And so we go out and we we apply to be ah foster parents and, you know, You we were like, were literally like the second family in Louisa County to like apply to be foster parents. So they were like, yeah, you know, go get your fingerprints and, you know, we'll, you know, we'll do this background check and you'll go through this five week course or 10 week course whatever it was on how to be foster parents. And then we'll, we'll give you a call when we need it. And we got our fingerprints. And then like that weekend, they were like, we're bringing four kids to your house, you know?
00:18:46
Speaker
It like, oh, okay. And so we, you know, you're you're scrambling to find bunk beds and you're texting everyone for clothes. And, um and yeah sure enough ah you know, you know, up comes a three-year-old, a five-year-old, a seven-year-old and a nine-year-old at that time, think. I think that was, or maybe he was 11, but they were all kind of like that staggered.
00:19:12
Speaker
um And we just became foster parents. And, ah you know, and so we're going to this class that they promised us. And it's like, oh, OK, so this is what's happening. You know, like now I get it.
00:19:25
Speaker
Right. Right. Now I get it as I'm drowning. um But it's but it is it was. It was wonderful. um And it was the kind of thing where it was like, OK, you know, Lord wants us to take care of orphans.
00:19:40
Speaker
You know, my wife wants to be ah ah mother, you know, where like how can we be obedient in this season? You know, that's just kind of what you got to ask at that time.
00:19:53
Speaker
And so that started us, we we fostered a series of kids um until we were um and so we we were able to adopt one of them.
00:20:04
Speaker
um and And honestly, foster care is not a great thing for, ah it's in hopes to, you know, adopt a a newborn baby. Like it's just not, it's not super common.
00:20:16
Speaker
Um, but our child was, uh, we, we got a call for one kid, uh, that was born right at COVID a month before COVID hit and, um, and, you know, born at four pounds and, uh, just in the NICU for a month and a half.
00:20:33
Speaker
And we, you know, it was hard to kind of not let your hopes get up that you might be able to adopt him. And, um, and the mom was, was going to want to try to get clean and and come and, um,
00:20:46
Speaker
and be able to come back into his life. and And we had him for two years before the mom eventually just said, you know, if I take him away, I'd be taking him away from his mom and dad.
00:20:59
Speaker
So I'm going to let y'all adopt him. And I want y'all to adopt him. And that was a ah huge relief to everyone involved, lawyers and judges and, you know, foster care workers, everybody.
00:21:12
Speaker
And we have a great relationship with her. Praise God. She's She's gotten, you know, her life is great. and um But then a month after that, we were pregnant.
00:21:24
Speaker
Just to quickly jump to it. we We got the adoption papers in Christmas and then our our ah our son Shane was, ah he we were pregnant with him and and he was he was born. And then a few months after that, um we were pregnant again with with Lucy.
00:21:45
Speaker
who is a year and a half now. And, and now we. Good name, Mark. Yes, it is. do too. yeah but Well, you know, with as many kids are represented in this podcast, like it's like a 50% chance. i we have one of dog's names um yeah But, and, and we are actually expecting our fourth now. yeah Congratulations.
00:22:13
Speaker
yeah And so it, we, we became one of those statistics where it's like, well, you know, after you adopt, you're just going to get pregnant. And we were like, yeah, very well, whatever. And then that has just truly been the reality.
00:22:26
Speaker
What a wonderful, what a wonderful story though. I mean, and man God really used that in your life to teach you some really valuable lessons. That's yes really, really awesome story. Thank you,
Masculine Christianity and Church Leadership
00:22:38
Speaker
Mark, so much for sharing that.
00:22:40
Speaker
Um, Well, Mark, tell us a little bit about your perspective on, um, Matt, masculine Christianity, manhood in the church and the way the church has either helped or hindered. I know that there's a lot of things that, um, a lot of opinions that I have and and done a little bit of, of reading on the subject, but, um, I really would like to know your perspective. I know you have wrestled with this a lot, especially when it comes to, um,
00:23:11
Speaker
women in leadership within the church and ah issues like that, that you have had to wrestle through in a very practical way, ah very challenging way. You know, I've wrestled with those issues without having to look across the table at a woman who is in leadership in the church. And I think you've had to do that. So give us a little bit about your thoughts on this very important subject that all men really need to be thinking about.
00:23:38
Speaker
Yeah. um Well, it, it really is just about, you know, it comes down to the authority of, of scripture and, and where, you know, are we able to just kind of let the Bible dictate how his church should look?
00:24:03
Speaker
um And, and, you know, when I was talking about my theology being shaped around suffering, um I really just wanted to get into like, you know, how the answering that question, like what should a church look like? And, and Alistair Begg's teaching through first Corinthians really helped shape a lot of that theology. um And when he got to the part on elders and what elders should be um and, and who elders ah shouldn't be um that it made me just kind of look and be like, we are in error here. And, and,
00:24:40
Speaker
I wanted and I wanted to bring that up, you know, in terms of just women um speaking, you know, at at the pulpit teaching, having this authority over men, um being elders over men. um And.
00:24:57
Speaker
And, you know, that that was hard, you know, talking to them, talking through that, but. But essentially, it's it's just like scripture is is very clear, know,
00:25:10
Speaker
that a a church is is to be very masculine, um I believe, in terms of, it and and as the bride of Christ, it is the most ah feminine when it is the most ah led by men.
00:25:29
Speaker
um and And I think that that you just see this this pattern in all of the different spheres that God has has given in in authority from, um you know, from the family to the the church um and and even beyond. I think that it really just goes back to the garden where, um you know, it's all it's all in Genesis where where God gives dominion um to
00:26:02
Speaker
to Adam and gives Adam a, you know, Williamsburg Library, Norcal exercising that dominion Adam is is naming and naming all the animals as they come and and that naming is a is a way of of just exercising that that dominion that isn't supposed to be in a ah yeah know tyrannical way at all, but is to be Andrew Roth, Williamsburg Library,
00:26:30
Speaker
In the nature of the one who gave him that authority. and And then yeah pinnacle of creation comes forth and he and he takes her as his helper and even names her as well.
00:26:42
Speaker
um and and And from that point, the the whole trajectory of of history and in Israel, into the church and and beyond just shows this, that God has made the world to be, um I would say, patriarchal.
00:27:01
Speaker
right, where it's where it is best led by men if they are if if they will take that um and that they will.
00:27:14
Speaker
and And the curse on Adam is to be lazy, right, to get tangled up thorns and the thistles and to and to just get get bogged down in that.
00:27:27
Speaker
And the curse on the woman is to desire that authority. Um, and, and like all so much of the issues in the world is this, this, that tension, right. And that budding of heads of just men not taking that and women and looking for a way out. And then women saying, I'll take that, you know, I'll take that authority and men being like, okay, we're good.
00:27:58
Speaker
And, um, And I think that that is just so much, I just, it just is, is true on the face of it. When I look at myself, when I look at how, you know, how other churches work and, and the influence of, of feminism in the church is just, is great.
00:28:20
Speaker
And I think it's greater than even i would have, you know, I thought that I was, I was pretty
00:28:26
Speaker
pretty well on pretty good on this subject until i I really examined my life. And I was like, wow, like I am i and don't lead my wife very well in certain areas.
00:28:40
Speaker
And so i that that only brings up a lot of questions and puts you in a certain corner. But that's essentially what I think is is best for the churches is when it's most led by by So that's I was gonna that's kind of what I was going to. um Sort of push back a little bit on is that you know you said the church needs to be masculine. Well, I think you're trying to say that the church needs to be led.
00:29:12
Speaker
By the men you're not trying to say that there is no femininity in the church or there shouldn't be. so it taxendi I'm not saying that no Mark said it was in the kitchen. That's what I heard.
00:29:28
Speaker
Yes, thank you, Donnie. I'm glad to have that confirmation.
00:29:33
Speaker
So I think that feminism is very, very poisonous. And it just shocks me.
00:29:42
Speaker
I don't know if you guys have seen illustrations of that. but i To expound on Mark's general observation about the the depleted masculinity in churches, it's not just that men aren't in leadership.
00:29:55
Speaker
It's a very often the case that one, the ones that do remain in leadership are highly feminized men. And the, the capacity to discern what they're going to preach to their church, how they're going to feed their flock, how they're going to apply discipline to the church family, if necessary, is a hundred percent of the time in conjunction to what's going to make the sweetest church lady in the back, the most capable of complying with my leadership in this case.
00:30:23
Speaker
And there's, There are times when to be masculine is to be confrontational. And sometimes to be masculine is to be what is going to be perceived by the weak as vulgar.
00:30:38
Speaker
And that's the part of the reason why the leadership infrastructure inside of the church, like what you're saying, Mark, is meant to be a masculine identifying organization is because the role that is applied to leadership inside of the church is the keeper of the bride.
00:30:57
Speaker
You are the sheepdog. the The flock itself is the bride of Christ. The leadership of that flock has a specifically different illustrative role. And you can you can lose the illustration when you mix the two together.
00:31:11
Speaker
the The shepherds and the sheepdogs that stand before um the gates of the church to try to to vanguard the information that comes to the church, the influence that comes to the church,
00:31:23
Speaker
um how it will be led, how the spirit is leading in that particular church is not meant to be a feminine identifying infrastructure. the only reason why I can say that with which absolute certainty is because you won't be able to find any passage in scripture that depicts how a man and leadership in the church ought to behave that describes feminine qualities and feminine characteristics and and doesn't explicitly limit it to masculine style leadership and masculine influence within their own homes within the ways they operate outside of the church but also within the church um and the functions of the of the of the church leaders have to be masculine functions but is this i i i hear often that you know whenever you start to break down what does it mean to be a good christian man you'll get a huge list of generalities
00:32:22
Speaker
that will just as easily apply to your own grandmother as they will to you. You know, they got to be a reader of the word and faithful in prayer and love Jesus. And, um you know, always try to do the right thing and have moral courage. Like, yes, those are all fantastic, wonderful things that men must have.
00:32:38
Speaker
Yes, be nice. But those are not masculine things. those are Those are just simply aspects of human Christianity. Some of the things that are uniquely men are,
00:32:49
Speaker
a little more abre ah more abrasive, more confrontational, ready for war, ready for provision, ready for sacrifice. A lot of those things are not qualities I want for my wife.
00:33:01
Speaker
I don't want her to lay down her life for my family. I want to be on the grenade. you know it's And that's the same kind of relationship that the the pastor should be having towards the bride of Christ.
00:33:12
Speaker
It shouldn't be the bride's sacrifice. It should be me. It should be me to to take whatever the cost. to be able to maintain their health, their provision, growth. um that's Those are not qualities I want my grandmother to have. I want ah want Grandpa to have.
00:33:29
Speaker
I want Grandpa to show me how to to stand up and defend and fight for my family. I want Grandpa to be the one that's showing me how to to face fear in a way that ah can lead to victory.
00:33:43
Speaker
And it's, I'm kind of probably rambling more so than I should at this point, but ah Mark, what you're saying there, kind of it speaks to me in ah in ah in a great personal way because I've been in so many ministries that are that are, they seem like great ministries, but they start to weaken over time and don't weather the storm very well and they don't produce depth in the flock because they are so focused on the light, fluffy feeling aspect of what it means to be appealing to everybody all the time, to be the mother nurturer of the church. And that's not what
00:34:17
Speaker
The church needs. The church needs to have those those rough disciplinary conversations that are typically more found within the father and kids. you know it's but those Those tough confrontational instructional things. The Bible is a tough confrontational book.
00:34:34
Speaker
The Bible doesn't align itself with our sensibilities. The Bible doesn't conform to things that we find appealing. ah The Bible confronts our humanity and gives us and an opportunity to be able to to fight back and destroy it.
00:34:47
Speaker
And that's, you've got to face some very tough conversations head on, full of courage, filled with the spirit ah to be have be able to be successful in those things.
00:34:59
Speaker
Mark, do you think the church is afraid of confrontation?
00:35:06
Speaker
Yeah.
Gender Dynamics in Church Sermons
00:35:07
Speaker
that right I think. Confrontation with who? Confrontation with the world or confrontation with themselves? And that's the question.
00:35:17
Speaker
It's, I think, honestly, like, and and I can see it even with myself, it's confrontation with, like, like the women in the church a lot of times.
00:35:29
Speaker
And it's just, like, you can see it with with how with how sermons are are preached, right? Like, we don't we don't have problems, you know, dragging men over broken glass on Father's Day sermons, right, about how terrible they are, know? But then, like, what about the sins of women?
00:35:47
Speaker
you know, like, are we, are we able to call that out as well? um You know, that, that that women are and can be, art that, okay, men are, men sin with their eyes open, right? Like we, we sin blatantly and we, and we know it, you know, but I think women have a propensity to manipulate, you know, and that's,
00:36:12
Speaker
and And that is, and that can be through emotion and that can be through tears and that can be through, you know, all different kinds of things. And it's like, do we give them a chance to see that sin, right? To even like ask themselves if they have it, right?
00:36:32
Speaker
and And there's like with everything, there's this pendulum to swing where you can focus too much on one or the other. And it's like, certain you know, I don't think we should do that. I think that it should just be, we should Like, let's just start with accepting that women can sin and then move from there.
00:36:48
Speaker
um That's that's ah just a baseline we need to establish. so Just baseline, please. You know, um Robert Lewis has a great definition of masculinity.
00:37:03
Speaker
It's not general, it's specific. It's really solid. And he says that a godly man rejects passivity, accepts responsibility,
00:37:14
Speaker
leads courageously and expects a greater reward is eternally minded. And I just have come back to that so many times in my life and in my study of scripture, that is a definition of biblical masculinity.
00:37:32
Speaker
And I think that there is a lot to cover here and we don't have enough time in this one episode to hit it all.
Conclusion and Teaser for Next Episode
00:37:39
Speaker
So I think that we're going to call it quits for today.
00:37:43
Speaker
And on the next episode of Fatherhood Friday, we're going to touch on passivity and its impact upon a man. And we might even get into some other subjects with Mark, possibly.
00:37:58
Speaker
But I hope that all of you listening out there will tune in next time for part two of our discussion of masculinity in the church. And we probably touch on some of the arguments against the arguments against what we've been saying.
00:38:15
Speaker
So tune in next time. Thank you so much. And we look forward to seeing everybody um the next episode.